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{\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 80.956, \"end\": 80.996, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"天\", \"start\": 80.996, \"end\": 81.196, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"五\", \"start\": 81.196, \"end\": 81.336, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"月\", \"start\": 81.336, \"end\": 81.456, \"score\": 0.844}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 81.456, \"end\": 81.956, \"score\": 0.896}, {\"word\": \"號\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 81.956, \"end\": 82.056, \"score\": 0.82}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 82.056, \"end\": 82.236, \"score\": 0.893}, {\"word\": \"四\", \"start\": 82.236, \"end\": 82.376, \"score\": 0.858}, {\"word\": \"月\", \"start\": 82.376, \"end\": 82.537, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"份\", \"start\": 82.537, \"end\": 83.077, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 83.077, \"end\": 83.277, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"概\", \"start\": 83.277, \"end\": 83.537, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 83.537, \"end\": 83.677, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 83.677, 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{\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 106.03, \"end\": 107.151, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 107.151, \"end\": 107.591, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"難\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 107.591, \"end\": 108.011, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 108.011, \"end\": 108.171, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 108.171, \"end\": 108.511, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"預\"}, {\"word\": \"定\", \"start\": 108.511, \"end\": 108.731, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"談\"}, {\"word\": \"判\", \"start\": 108.731, \"end\": 108.891, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 108.891, \"end\": 109.132, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 109.132, \"end\": 109.252, \"score\": 0.742}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 109.252, \"end\": 109.392, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 109.392, \"end\": 109.492, 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364.483, \"end\": 364.783, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"具\", \"start\": 364.783, \"end\": 365.083, \"score\": 0.696}, {\"word\": \"體\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 365.083, \"end\": 365.243, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 365.243, \"end\": 365.363, \"score\": 0.768}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 365.363, \"end\": 365.483, \"score\": 0.831}, {\"word\": \"源\", \"start\": 365.483, \"end\": 365.623, \"score\": 0.842}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 365.623, \"end\": 365.783, \"score\": 0.747}, {\"word\": \"治\", \"start\": 365.783, \"end\": 365.803, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 365.803, \"end\": 365.903, \"score\": 0.79}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 365.903, \"end\": 366.344, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 366.344, \"end\": 366.464, \"score\": 0.731}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 366.464, \"end\": 366.604, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 366.604, \"end\": 367.184, \"score\": 0.837}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 367.184, \"end\": 367.304, \"score\": 0.853}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 367.304, \"end\": 367.464, \"score\": 0.724}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 367.464, \"end\": 367.724, \"score\": 0.745}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 367.724, \"end\": 367.804, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"定\", \"start\": 367.804, \"end\": 367.824, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 367.824, \"end\": 388.462, \"text\": \"一定會澄清啦我非常擔心三人成虎講了一百遍有可能講到後來就變成好像就是三人成虎嘛我想成語故事上面的三人成虎很擔心這樣子台灣講台灣獨裁講一百遍好像台灣真的變成獨裁的一樣就是我覺得這個是一個很錯誤的同樣的一直講好像是能源政策好像\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 367.824, \"end\": 367.844, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"定\", \"start\": 367.844, \"end\": 368.144, \"score\": 0.853}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"澄\", \"start\": 368.144, \"end\": 368.364, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"清\", \"start\": 368.364, \"end\": 368.565, 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\"部\", \"start\": 624.6, \"end\": 624.74, \"score\": 0.816}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 624.74, \"end\": 624.76, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 624.76, \"end\": 624.88, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 624.88, \"end\": 624.9, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"請\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:06,482 --> 00:00:30,208\n好謝謝主席請郭部長先請教一下主席總署有公布了今年第一季的GDP的成長率5.37當然大家對這個數字上也有很多不同的解讀部長怎麼看這樣的一個數字\n\n2\n00:00:31,408 --> 00:00:54,338\n這個我想這個本來就是大家預期這個川普總統這個上來以後可能會對關稅有一些要求所以大家可能在原來的這個比較低關稅的時候趕快出貨美國的buyer也會有這種想法所以這造成我們大概所以這個數字上第一季會有這樣的一個現象\n\n3\n00:00:56,079 --> 00:01:24,278\n對但全年度的部分應該還是努力在以保三為目標啦我們現在大概看喔第二季大概也會有比較高的這個部分啦那第三季以後就不知道了就真正的這個關稅落零以後要看談判最後的結果啦對對對但是如果以目前的狀態我們應該還是努力維持在三以上嘛我們希望是這樣目前的這個現在四月嘛四月結束了嘛今天五月一號我想四月份大概也都是三以上\n\n4\n00:01:24,758 --> 00:01:49,892\n都是這樣以上對那如果加入政府的投入4100億的特別預算的話這個我想這個機會應該是相當的有機會的我們希望說今年還是能夠保持原來這個估計的這個這樣的一個部分去努力但是真正的這個最後談判的結果會造成什麼樣的影響現在目前還是這個很難去部長那預定談判時候什麼會出來什麼時候會出來預定\n\n5\n00:01:51,713 --> 00:02:15,448\n如果按照進度來講就是說第一批的這個75國應該都會在7月前談了一個大致啦因為他也不可能每一個國家都跟你談嘛那他大概是全面的幾個標竿的國家先談嘛談完以後後面就比照辦理我看川普應該也很急啦也希望盡快的談底定因為看到內部的\n\n6\n00:02:15,848 --> 00:02:38,616\n他太久的話大概對他的這個內部的影響也很大啦就看他美國今年第一季也是不好嘛對對所以談太久了恐怕對他也有相當大的一個壓力所以我想這個應該會盡快來談完那我也請教一下因為我們的製造業的景氣其實2月3月也有了變動其實有段時間像2月幾乎爬到的是這個\n\n7\n00:02:41,118 --> 00:02:55,188\n黃紅燈其實相當不錯但是到了3月降到了黃藍燈這個當然我認為當然跟川普這些都有相關的一些連動部長怎麼看是確實台灣的這個經濟受到美國的美國的這個關稅的影響確實是非常的大\n\n8\n00:02:56,224 --> 00:03:15,628\n所以這個燈號的部分也會受到景氣上的影響因為這個是所謂外部來的外部環境的變異所以我想這個是我們都會高度的關注這樣的變異未來的發展會造成什麼樣的現象我們期盼在跟美國的談判有一些好的結果之後對我們的景氣對我們的經濟成長力都有好的一些幫助跟影響\n\n9\n00:03:18,849 --> 00:03:30,859\n那再請教一下今天好像有人到經濟部去甚至有立委去那批評螃蟹騙局部長怎麼看?是這樣嗎?這個我早上一大早就在這裡沒有進經濟部沒有看到這個現象那這個包圍經濟部啊這個這樣的一個活動如果是合法的\n\n10\n00:03:48,240 --> 00:04:08,723\n我們都尊重所有的這個國人的這個合法的行動如果是不合法的我們就要檢討為什麼他會採取不合法的這個行動那是不是龐氏騙局我對這個沒有研究那我問一下他裡面講的是他認為政府的現在能源政策是錯誤的部長認同這樣的看法嗎\n\n11\n00:04:10,827 --> 00:04:35,529\n這個就是我一直在講啦所謂正確或者錯誤是用什麼時間點來回顧那個情境啦不能講說你不喜歡的你就講他是錯誤啦那每一個時期都有那個時期的一些決策啦當然你現在來看我是不是想請教他說那你對流辮子清朝流辮子這件事情你認為是正確或者錯誤\n\n12\n00:04:36,778 --> 00:04:52,537\n是不是所以我們不能夠用現在來評論過去的這個這個是對的或者錯的不過我還是要強調在當下這樣的狀況下的時候非核家園還是入法的還是在朝野的一個共識下的所以政府當然依照相關的法令必須來執行嘛對不對\n\n13\n00:04:55,379 --> 00:05:21,168\n這個包括核能的部分核廢料處理也沒有達成共識嘛很多的那甚至於燃煤的部分大家也覺得燃煤空污要改善所以燃煤很多的很多縣市也都希望不要所以發展綠能這個方向是國家的趨勢也是正確的方向嘛所以我覺得不能夠把這些東西全部倒到最後來全部用簡單的一句說你現在是一個錯誤的能源政策我看不出來講那些錯誤能源政策你的能源政策是什麼\n\n14\n00:05:22,048 --> 00:05:44,977\n非核加鹽是一個國家的基因這也是朝野的共識然後核廢料無法處理確實也是個事實然後核能安全怎麼樣國人安心確實目前沒辦法提出一個所以在當下這個階段這個就是目前的狀態那發展綠電也是目前的整個國家的政策也是世界各國的政策啊所以我看不懂這樣的批評跟這樣的評斷的時候你是用什麼樣的利潤基礎來談的\n\n15\n00:05:46,557 --> 00:06:07,824\n每個人就像每個人吃東西一樣有他的口味一樣啦那要講出一番的那個就像講的這個黑的講久了不會變成白的啦那我也擔心的是這樣子不斷的去攻擊不斷的去攻擊能源政治好像就變成國家能源政治錯誤的那也請提出來那你具體可行能源政治是什麼這個我們會報告委員這個部分我們一定\n\n16\n00:06:07,824 --> 00:06:28,462\n一定會澄清啦我非常擔心三人成虎講了一百遍有可能講到後來就變成好像就是三人成虎嘛我想成語故事上面的三人成虎很擔心這樣子台灣講台灣獨裁講一百遍好像台灣真的變成獨裁的一樣就是我覺得這個是一個很錯誤的同樣的一直講好像是能源政策好像\n\n17\n00:06:29,803 --> 00:06:47,053\n圖利什麼什麼綠電圖利什麼什麼好像講久了講到後來變成好像是真的一樣全世界都在發展綠電如果哪邊有違法就抓出來嘛我們認為就是大家依照法令的規定你認為違法就去提告我們就是按照這個法的規範下去處理嘛\n\n18\n00:06:48,113 --> 00:07:14,632\n講一百遍有可能就變成讓大家模糊掉了啦所以我這個希望還是能源部要不斷的大力的去說明成績包括台電這幾年我們其實努力下空汙大幅的改善這也是很多人重視我很重視的啦從以前的時候我記得我90年代我一直盯著空汙的數字因為發展綠電因為我們減少了這個燃煤所以我們的這個空汙大幅的改善這對於南部對中部都很大很大的幫助\n\n19\n00:07:15,012 --> 00:07:34,351\n這些絕對都是貢獻所以我覺得這些東西應該要去正面給予肯定那也有很多人不斷地在造謠說台電是因為非核政策而導致虧損部長要不要再澄清一次我們一定會再次澄清是因為核能的這個能源政策而造成台電的虧損的嗎\n\n20\n00:07:35,552 --> 00:07:53,837\n完全不是啦我想這個裡面在這個邏輯上面有需要再導正的部分這個要持續的澄清因為核能最多的時候大概占台灣的發電大概10%這個10%到現在剩下3%你說3%我現在拿掉然後就會多大的影響這個我想這個3%會影響97%多少我真的就是無法想像\n\n21\n00:08:05,060 --> 00:08:24,714\n怎麼會用這樣來虧損部長要大力的不斷的去澄清好不好虧損的問題不是這個造成虧損虧損是因為我們過去的買的這個原料比較貴在因為戰爭的時候買的不是只有台灣買比較貴日本也貴這個韓國也貴這個我們鄰近的國家他們都買很貴而且他們的電價事實上\n\n22\n00:08:30,959 --> 00:08:56,521\n都比我們貴對所以這才是根本的原因嘛你買進來的價格變貴了那但是我們又不讓台電漲價我們政治上希望不要漲價所以導致台電承受了這些嘛齁那我接下來問了接下來我們也提出特別預算了齁在地方講的時候很多人都講說希望支持台電齁不管是立委或者地方的民代甚至很多企業都希望支持台電我們現在又再次提出來一千億的一個嗯撥補的部分部長\n\n23\n00:08:57,662 --> 00:09:14,380\n那如果最後一樣沒有在野黨或者在野黨的支持一樣沒辦法在立法院得到這個一千億的撥補的話會不會影響到接下來這個我們的電價的調漲的壓力報告委員我想電價調漲還是由電價審議委員會他們做決定啦\n\n24\n00:09:18,644 --> 00:09:35,452\n但會參考這個目前的這個狀況如果台電能夠忍受多久的財務的負債比已經達到九成了如果我們要馬兒不吃草又要馬兒好這個其實是有困難的所以我希望是\n\n25\n00:09:36,292 --> 00:09:56,066\n台電要穩健的經營如果是因為這樣而造成的那當然國家財政這幾年經濟成長力不錯有盈餘的時候由他來撥補我認為是最好的方案因為穩定電價也穩定物價是最好的方案對全民的影響是最低的也不會造成整個經濟上大的波動那如果遲遲的不給的時候台電當然勢必虧損會持續加大你又不給他漲電價他持續虧損持續會加大所以我們希望\n\n26\n00:10:00,729 --> 00:10:24,900\n部長強力的持續的去說明那我們希望朝野大家一起努力這個台電是台灣的台電也是大家的台電那電力大家都希望穩定的工業剛講過的缺電沒有這樣的問題的時候我們希望更多人支持台電讓台電穩定的供電穩定的發電讓台灣的產業民生都能夠持續的有好的一個電力好不好希望持續加強溝通說明是是好謝謝謝謝部長好謝謝我們現在請\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n6482\t30208\t好 謝謝主席 請郭部長先請教一下 主席總署有公布了今年第一季的GDP的成長率5.37當然大家對這個數字上也有很多不同的解讀部長怎麼看這樣的一個數字\n31408\t54338\t這個我想這個本來就是大家預期這個川普總統這個上來以後可能會對關稅有一些要求所以大家可能在原來的這個比較低關稅的時候趕快出貨美國的buyer也會有這種想法所以這造成我們大概所以這個數字上第一季會有這樣的一個現象\n56079\t84278\t對 但全年度的部分應該還是努力在以保三為目標啦我們現在大概看喔第二季大概也會有比較高的這個部分啦那第三季以後就不知道了就真正的這個關稅落零以後要看談判最後的結果啦對對對但是如果以目前的狀態我們應該還是努力維持在三以上嘛我們希望是這樣目前的這個現在四月嘛四月結束了嘛今天五月一號我想四月份大概也都是三以上\n84758\t109892\t都是這樣以上 對那如果加入政府的投入4100億的特別預算的話這個我想這個機會應該是相當的有機會的我們希望說今年還是能夠保持原來這個估計的這個這樣的一個部分去努力但是真正的這個最後談判的結果會造成什麼樣的影響現在目前還是這個很難去部長那預定談判時候什麼會出來什麼時候會出來預定\n111713\t135448\t如果按照進度來講就是說第一批的這個75國應該都會在7月前談了一個大致啦因為他也不可能每一個國家都跟你談嘛那他大概是全面的幾個標竿的國家先談嘛談完以後後面就比照辦理我看川普應該也很急啦也希望盡快的談底定因為看到內部的\n135848\t158616\t他太久的話大概對他的這個內部的影響也很大啦就看他美國今年第一季也是不好嘛對對所以談太久了恐怕對他也有相當大的一個壓力所以我想這個應該會盡快來談完那我也請教一下因為我們的製造業的景氣其實2月3月也有了變動其實有段時間像2月幾乎爬到的是這個\n161118\t175188\t黃紅燈其實相當不錯但是到了3月降到了黃藍燈這個當然我認為當然跟川普這些都有相關的一些連動部長怎麼看是確實台灣的這個經濟受到美國的美國的這個關稅的影響確實是非常的大\n176224\t195628\t所以這個燈號的部分也會受到景氣上的影響因為這個是所謂外部來的外部環境的變異所以我想這個是我們都會高度的關注這樣的變異未來的發展會造成什麼樣的現象我們期盼在跟美國的談判有一些好的結果之後對我們的景氣對我們的經濟成長力都有好的一些幫助跟影響\n198849\t210859\t那再請教一下今天好像有人到經濟部去甚至有立委去那批評螃蟹騙局部長怎麼看?是這樣嗎?這個我早上一大早就在這裡沒有進經濟部沒有看到這個現象那這個包圍經濟部啊這個這樣的一個活動如果是合法的\n228240\t248723\t我們都尊重所有的這個國人的這個合法的行動如果是不合法的我們就要檢討為什麼他會採取不合法的這個行動那是不是龐氏騙局我對這個沒有研究那我問一下他裡面講的是他認為政府的現在能源政策是錯誤的部長認同這樣的看法嗎\n250827\t275529\t這個就是我一直在講啦所謂正確或者錯誤是用什麼時間點來回顧那個情境啦不能講說你不喜歡的你就講他是錯誤啦那每一個時期都有那個時期的一些決策啦當然你現在來看我是不是想請教他說那你對流辮子清朝流辮子這件事情你認為是正確或者錯誤\n276778\t292537\t是不是所以我們不能夠用現在來評論過去的這個這個是對的或者錯的不過我還是要強調在當下這樣的狀況下的時候非核家園還是入法的還是在朝野的一個共識下的所以政府當然依照相關的法令必須來執行嘛對不對\n295379\t321168\t這個包括核能的部分核廢料處理也沒有達成共識嘛很多的那甚至於燃煤的部分大家也覺得燃煤空污要改善所以燃煤很多的很多縣市也都希望不要所以發展綠能這個方向是國家的趨勢也是正確的方向嘛所以我覺得不能夠把這些東西全部倒到最後來全部用簡單的一句說你現在是一個錯誤的能源政策我看不出來講那些錯誤能源政策你的能源政策是什麼\n322048\t344977\t非核加鹽是一個國家的基因這也是朝野的共識然後核廢料無法處理確實也是個事實然後核能安全怎麼樣國人安心確實目前沒辦法提出一個所以在當下這個階段這個就是目前的狀態那發展綠電也是目前的整個國家的政策也是世界各國的政策啊所以我看不懂這樣的批評跟這樣的評斷的時候你是用什麼樣的利潤基礎來談的\n346557\t367824\t每個人就像每個人吃東西一樣有他的口味一樣啦那要講出一番的那個就像講的這個黑的講久了不會變成白的啦那我也擔心的是這樣子不斷的去攻擊不斷的去攻擊能源政治好像就變成國家能源政治錯誤的那也請提出來那你具體可行能源政治是什麼這個我們會報告委員 這個部分我們一定\n367824\t388462\t一定會澄清啦我非常擔心三人成虎講了一百遍有可能講到後來就變成好像就是三人成虎嘛我想成語故事上面的三人成虎很擔心這樣子台灣講台灣獨裁講一百遍好像台灣真的變成獨裁的一樣就是我覺得這個是一個很錯誤的同樣的一直講好像是能源政策好像\n389803\t407053\t圖利什麼什麼綠電圖利什麼什麼好像講久了講到後來變成好像是真的一樣全世界都在發展綠電如果哪邊有違法就抓出來嘛我們認為就是大家依照法令的規定你認為違法就去提告我們就是按照這個法的規範下去處理嘛\n408113\t434632\t講一百遍有可能就變成讓大家模糊掉了啦所以我這個希望還是能源部要不斷的大力的去說明成績包括台電這幾年我們其實努力下空汙大幅的改善這也是很多人重視我很重視的啦從以前的時候我記得我90年代我一直盯著空汙的數字因為發展綠電因為我們減少了這個燃煤所以我們的這個空汙大幅的改善這對於南部對中部都很大很大的幫助\n435012\t454351\t這些絕對都是貢獻所以我覺得這些東西應該要去正面給予肯定那也有很多人不斷地在造謠說台電是因為非核政策而導致虧損部長要不要再澄清一次我們一定會再次澄清是因為核能的這個能源政策而造成台電的虧損的嗎\n455552\t473837\t完全不是啦我想這個裡面在這個邏輯上面有需要再導正的部分這個要持續的澄清因為核能最多的時候大概占台灣的發電大概10%這個10%到現在剩下3%你說3%我現在拿掉然後就會多大的影響這個我想這個3%會影響97%多少我真的就是無法想像\n485060\t504714\t怎麼會用這樣來虧損部長要大力的不斷的去澄清好不好虧損的問題不是這個造成虧損虧損是因為我們過去的買的這個原料比較貴在因為戰爭的時候買的不是只有台灣買比較貴日本也貴這個韓國也貴這個我們鄰近的國家他們都買很貴而且他們的電價事實上\n510959\t536521\t都比我們貴對所以這才是根本的原因嘛你買進來的價格變貴了那但是我們又不讓台電漲價我們政治上希望不要漲價所以導致台電承受了這些嘛齁那我接下來問了接下來我們也提出特別預算了齁在地方講的時候很多人都講說希望支持台電齁不管是立委或者地方的民代甚至很多企業都希望支持台電我們現在又再次提出來一千億的一個嗯撥補的部分部長\n537662\t554380\t那如果最後一樣沒有在野黨或者在野黨的支持一樣沒辦法在立法院得到這個一千億的撥補的話會不會影響到接下來這個我們的電價的調漲的壓力報告委員我想電價調漲還是由電價審議委員會他們做決定啦\n558644\t575452\t但會參考這個目前的這個狀況如果台電能夠忍受多久的財務的負債比已經達到九成了如果我們要馬兒不吃草又要馬兒好這個其實是有困難的所以我希望是\n576292\t596066\t台電要穩健的經營如果是因為這樣而造成的那當然國家財政這幾年經濟成長力不錯有盈餘的時候由他來撥補我認為是最好的方案因為穩定電價也穩定物價是最好的方案對全民的影響是最低的也不會造成整個經濟上大的波動那如果遲遲的不給的時候台電當然勢必虧損會持續加大你又不給他漲電價他持續虧損持續會加大所以我們希望\n600729\t624900\t部長強力的持續的去說明那我們希望朝野大家一起努力這個台電是台灣的台電也是大家的台電那電力大家都希望穩定的工業剛講過的缺電沒有這樣的問題的時候我們希望更多人支持台電讓台電穩定的供電穩定的發電讓台灣的產業民生都能夠持續的有好的一個電力好不好 希望持續加強溝通說明是是好 謝謝 謝謝部長好 謝謝我們現在請\n","txt":"好 謝謝主席 請郭部長先請教一下 主席總署有公布了今年第一季的GDP的成長率5.37當然大家對這個數字上也有很多不同的解讀部長怎麼看這樣的一個數字\n這個我想這個本來就是大家預期這個川普總統這個上來以後可能會對關稅有一些要求所以大家可能在原來的這個比較低關稅的時候趕快出貨美國的buyer也會有這種想法所以這造成我們大概所以這個數字上第一季會有這樣的一個現象\n對 但全年度的部分應該還是努力在以保三為目標啦我們現在大概看喔第二季大概也會有比較高的這個部分啦那第三季以後就不知道了就真正的這個關稅落零以後要看談判最後的結果啦對對對但是如果以目前的狀態我們應該還是努力維持在三以上嘛我們希望是這樣目前的這個現在四月嘛四月結束了嘛今天五月一號我想四月份大概也都是三以上\n都是這樣以上 對那如果加入政府的投入4100億的特別預算的話這個我想這個機會應該是相當的有機會的我們希望說今年還是能夠保持原來這個估計的這個這樣的一個部分去努力但是真正的這個最後談判的結果會造成什麼樣的影響現在目前還是這個很難去部長那預定談判時候什麼會出來什麼時候會出來預定\n如果按照進度來講就是說第一批的這個75國應該都會在7月前談了一個大致啦因為他也不可能每一個國家都跟你談嘛那他大概是全面的幾個標竿的國家先談嘛談完以後後面就比照辦理我看川普應該也很急啦也希望盡快的談底定因為看到內部的\n他太久的話大概對他的這個內部的影響也很大啦就看他美國今年第一季也是不好嘛對對所以談太久了恐怕對他也有相當大的一個壓力所以我想這個應該會盡快來談完那我也請教一下因為我們的製造業的景氣其實2月3月也有了變動其實有段時間像2月幾乎爬到的是這個\n黃紅燈其實相當不錯但是到了3月降到了黃藍燈這個當然我認為當然跟川普這些都有相關的一些連動部長怎麼看是確實台灣的這個經濟受到美國的美國的這個關稅的影響確實是非常的大\n所以這個燈號的部分也會受到景氣上的影響因為這個是所謂外部來的外部環境的變異所以我想這個是我們都會高度的關注這樣的變異未來的發展會造成什麼樣的現象我們期盼在跟美國的談判有一些好的結果之後對我們的景氣對我們的經濟成長力都有好的一些幫助跟影響\n那再請教一下今天好像有人到經濟部去甚至有立委去那批評螃蟹騙局部長怎麼看?是這樣嗎?這個我早上一大早就在這裡沒有進經濟部沒有看到這個現象那這個包圍經濟部啊這個這樣的一個活動如果是合法的\n我們都尊重所有的這個國人的這個合法的行動如果是不合法的我們就要檢討為什麼他會採取不合法的這個行動那是不是龐氏騙局我對這個沒有研究那我問一下他裡面講的是他認為政府的現在能源政策是錯誤的部長認同這樣的看法嗎\n這個就是我一直在講啦所謂正確或者錯誤是用什麼時間點來回顧那個情境啦不能講說你不喜歡的你就講他是錯誤啦那每一個時期都有那個時期的一些決策啦當然你現在來看我是不是想請教他說那你對流辮子清朝流辮子這件事情你認為是正確或者錯誤\n是不是所以我們不能夠用現在來評論過去的這個這個是對的或者錯的不過我還是要強調在當下這樣的狀況下的時候非核家園還是入法的還是在朝野的一個共識下的所以政府當然依照相關的法令必須來執行嘛對不對\n這個包括核能的部分核廢料處理也沒有達成共識嘛很多的那甚至於燃煤的部分大家也覺得燃煤空污要改善所以燃煤很多的很多縣市也都希望不要所以發展綠能這個方向是國家的趨勢也是正確的方向嘛所以我覺得不能夠把這些東西全部倒到最後來全部用簡單的一句說你現在是一個錯誤的能源政策我看不出來講那些錯誤能源政策你的能源政策是什麼\n非核加鹽是一個國家的基因這也是朝野的共識然後核廢料無法處理確實也是個事實然後核能安全怎麼樣國人安心確實目前沒辦法提出一個所以在當下這個階段這個就是目前的狀態那發展綠電也是目前的整個國家的政策也是世界各國的政策啊所以我看不懂這樣的批評跟這樣的評斷的時候你是用什麼樣的利潤基礎來談的\n每個人就像每個人吃東西一樣有他的口味一樣啦那要講出一番的那個就像講的這個黑的講久了不會變成白的啦那我也擔心的是這樣子不斷的去攻擊不斷的去攻擊能源政治好像就變成國家能源政治錯誤的那也請提出來那你具體可行能源政治是什麼這個我們會報告委員 這個部分我們一定\n一定會澄清啦我非常擔心三人成虎講了一百遍有可能講到後來就變成好像就是三人成虎嘛我想成語故事上面的三人成虎很擔心這樣子台灣講台灣獨裁講一百遍好像台灣真的變成獨裁的一樣就是我覺得這個是一個很錯誤的同樣的一直講好像是能源政策好像\n圖利什麼什麼綠電圖利什麼什麼好像講久了講到後來變成好像是真的一樣全世界都在發展綠電如果哪邊有違法就抓出來嘛我們認為就是大家依照法令的規定你認為違法就去提告我們就是按照這個法的規範下去處理嘛\n講一百遍有可能就變成讓大家模糊掉了啦所以我這個希望還是能源部要不斷的大力的去說明成績包括台電這幾年我們其實努力下空汙大幅的改善這也是很多人重視我很重視的啦從以前的時候我記得我90年代我一直盯著空汙的數字因為發展綠電因為我們減少了這個燃煤所以我們的這個空汙大幅的改善這對於南部對中部都很大很大的幫助\n這些絕對都是貢獻所以我覺得這些東西應該要去正面給予肯定那也有很多人不斷地在造謠說台電是因為非核政策而導致虧損部長要不要再澄清一次我們一定會再次澄清是因為核能的這個能源政策而造成台電的虧損的嗎\n完全不是啦我想這個裡面在這個邏輯上面有需要再導正的部分這個要持續的澄清因為核能最多的時候大概占台灣的發電大概10%這個10%到現在剩下3%你說3%我現在拿掉然後就會多大的影響這個我想這個3%會影響97%多少我真的就是無法想像\n怎麼會用這樣來虧損部長要大力的不斷的去澄清好不好虧損的問題不是這個造成虧損虧損是因為我們過去的買的這個原料比較貴在因為戰爭的時候買的不是只有台灣買比較貴日本也貴這個韓國也貴這個我們鄰近的國家他們都買很貴而且他們的電價事實上\n都比我們貴對所以這才是根本的原因嘛你買進來的價格變貴了那但是我們又不讓台電漲價我們政治上希望不要漲價所以導致台電承受了這些嘛齁那我接下來問了接下來我們也提出特別預算了齁在地方講的時候很多人都講說希望支持台電齁不管是立委或者地方的民代甚至很多企業都希望支持台電我們現在又再次提出來一千億的一個嗯撥補的部分部長\n那如果最後一樣沒有在野黨或者在野黨的支持一樣沒辦法在立法院得到這個一千億的撥補的話會不會影響到接下來這個我們的電價的調漲的壓力報告委員我想電價調漲還是由電價審議委員會他們做決定啦\n但會參考這個目前的這個狀況如果台電能夠忍受多久的財務的負債比已經達到九成了如果我們要馬兒不吃草又要馬兒好這個其實是有困難的所以我希望是\n台電要穩健的經營如果是因為這樣而造成的那當然國家財政這幾年經濟成長力不錯有盈餘的時候由他來撥補我認為是最好的方案因為穩定電價也穩定物價是最好的方案對全民的影響是最低的也不會造成整個經濟上大的波動那如果遲遲的不給的時候台電當然勢必虧損會持續加大你又不給他漲電價他持續虧損持續會加大所以我們希望\n部長強力的持續的去說明那我們希望朝野大家一起努力這個台電是台灣的台電也是大家的台電那電力大家都希望穩定的工業剛講過的缺電沒有這樣的問題的時候我們希望更多人支持台電讓台電穩定的供電穩定的發電讓台灣的產業民生都能夠持續的有好的一個電力好不好 希望持續加強溝通說明是是好 謝謝 謝謝部長好 謝謝我們現在請\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:06.482 --> 00:30.208\n好謝謝主席請郭部長先請教一下主席總署有公布了今年第一季的GDP的成長率5.37當然大家對這個數字上也有很多不同的解讀部長怎麼看這樣的一個數字\n\n00:31.408 --> 00:54.338\n這個我想這個本來就是大家預期這個川普總統這個上來以後可能會對關稅有一些要求所以大家可能在原來的這個比較低關稅的時候趕快出貨美國的buyer也會有這種想法所以這造成我們大概所以這個數字上第一季會有這樣的一個現象\n\n00:56.079 --> 01:24.278\n對但全年度的部分應該還是努力在以保三為目標啦我們現在大概看喔第二季大概也會有比較高的這個部分啦那第三季以後就不知道了就真正的這個關稅落零以後要看談判最後的結果啦對對對但是如果以目前的狀態我們應該還是努力維持在三以上嘛我們希望是這樣目前的這個現在四月嘛四月結束了嘛今天五月一號我想四月份大概也都是三以上\n\n01:24.758 --> 01:49.892\n都是這樣以上對那如果加入政府的投入4100億的特別預算的話這個我想這個機會應該是相當的有機會的我們希望說今年還是能夠保持原來這個估計的這個這樣的一個部分去努力但是真正的這個最後談判的結果會造成什麼樣的影響現在目前還是這個很難去部長那預定談判時候什麼會出來什麼時候會出來預定\n\n01:51.713 --> 02:15.448\n如果按照進度來講就是說第一批的這個75國應該都會在7月前談了一個大致啦因為他也不可能每一個國家都跟你談嘛那他大概是全面的幾個標竿的國家先談嘛談完以後後面就比照辦理我看川普應該也很急啦也希望盡快的談底定因為看到內部的\n\n02:15.848 --> 02:38.616\n他太久的話大概對他的這個內部的影響也很大啦就看他美國今年第一季也是不好嘛對對所以談太久了恐怕對他也有相當大的一個壓力所以我想這個應該會盡快來談完那我也請教一下因為我們的製造業的景氣其實2月3月也有了變動其實有段時間像2月幾乎爬到的是這個\n\n02:41.118 --> 02:55.188\n黃紅燈其實相當不錯但是到了3月降到了黃藍燈這個當然我認為當然跟川普這些都有相關的一些連動部長怎麼看是確實台灣的這個經濟受到美國的美國的這個關稅的影響確實是非常的大\n\n02:56.224 --> 03:15.628\n所以這個燈號的部分也會受到景氣上的影響因為這個是所謂外部來的外部環境的變異所以我想這個是我們都會高度的關注這樣的變異未來的發展會造成什麼樣的現象我們期盼在跟美國的談判有一些好的結果之後對我們的景氣對我們的經濟成長力都有好的一些幫助跟影響\n\n03:18.849 --> 03:30.859\n那再請教一下今天好像有人到經濟部去甚至有立委去那批評螃蟹騙局部長怎麼看?是這樣嗎?這個我早上一大早就在這裡沒有進經濟部沒有看到這個現象那這個包圍經濟部啊這個這樣的一個活動如果是合法的\n\n03:48.240 --> 04:08.723\n我們都尊重所有的這個國人的這個合法的行動如果是不合法的我們就要檢討為什麼他會採取不合法的這個行動那是不是龐氏騙局我對這個沒有研究那我問一下他裡面講的是他認為政府的現在能源政策是錯誤的部長認同這樣的看法嗎\n\n04:10.827 --> 04:35.529\n這個就是我一直在講啦所謂正確或者錯誤是用什麼時間點來回顧那個情境啦不能講說你不喜歡的你就講他是錯誤啦那每一個時期都有那個時期的一些決策啦當然你現在來看我是不是想請教他說那你對流辮子清朝流辮子這件事情你認為是正確或者錯誤\n\n04:36.778 --> 04:52.537\n是不是所以我們不能夠用現在來評論過去的這個這個是對的或者錯的不過我還是要強調在當下這樣的狀況下的時候非核家園還是入法的還是在朝野的一個共識下的所以政府當然依照相關的法令必須來執行嘛對不對\n\n04:55.379 --> 05:21.168\n這個包括核能的部分核廢料處理也沒有達成共識嘛很多的那甚至於燃煤的部分大家也覺得燃煤空污要改善所以燃煤很多的很多縣市也都希望不要所以發展綠能這個方向是國家的趨勢也是正確的方向嘛所以我覺得不能夠把這些東西全部倒到最後來全部用簡單的一句說你現在是一個錯誤的能源政策我看不出來講那些錯誤能源政策你的能源政策是什麼\n\n05:22.048 --> 05:44.977\n非核加鹽是一個國家的基因這也是朝野的共識然後核廢料無法處理確實也是個事實然後核能安全怎麼樣國人安心確實目前沒辦法提出一個所以在當下這個階段這個就是目前的狀態那發展綠電也是目前的整個國家的政策也是世界各國的政策啊所以我看不懂這樣的批評跟這樣的評斷的時候你是用什麼樣的利潤基礎來談的\n\n05:46.557 --> 06:07.824\n每個人就像每個人吃東西一樣有他的口味一樣啦那要講出一番的那個就像講的這個黑的講久了不會變成白的啦那我也擔心的是這樣子不斷的去攻擊不斷的去攻擊能源政治好像就變成國家能源政治錯誤的那也請提出來那你具體可行能源政治是什麼這個我們會報告委員這個部分我們一定\n\n06:07.824 --> 06:28.462\n一定會澄清啦我非常擔心三人成虎講了一百遍有可能講到後來就變成好像就是三人成虎嘛我想成語故事上面的三人成虎很擔心這樣子台灣講台灣獨裁講一百遍好像台灣真的變成獨裁的一樣就是我覺得這個是一個很錯誤的同樣的一直講好像是能源政策好像\n\n06:29.803 --> 06:47.053\n圖利什麼什麼綠電圖利什麼什麼好像講久了講到後來變成好像是真的一樣全世界都在發展綠電如果哪邊有違法就抓出來嘛我們認為就是大家依照法令的規定你認為違法就去提告我們就是按照這個法的規範下去處理嘛\n\n06:48.113 --> 07:14.632\n講一百遍有可能就變成讓大家模糊掉了啦所以我這個希望還是能源部要不斷的大力的去說明成績包括台電這幾年我們其實努力下空汙大幅的改善這也是很多人重視我很重視的啦從以前的時候我記得我90年代我一直盯著空汙的數字因為發展綠電因為我們減少了這個燃煤所以我們的這個空汙大幅的改善這對於南部對中部都很大很大的幫助\n\n07:15.012 --> 07:34.351\n這些絕對都是貢獻所以我覺得這些東西應該要去正面給予肯定那也有很多人不斷地在造謠說台電是因為非核政策而導致虧損部長要不要再澄清一次我們一定會再次澄清是因為核能的這個能源政策而造成台電的虧損的嗎\n\n07:35.552 --> 07:53.837\n完全不是啦我想這個裡面在這個邏輯上面有需要再導正的部分這個要持續的澄清因為核能最多的時候大概占台灣的發電大概10%這個10%到現在剩下3%你說3%我現在拿掉然後就會多大的影響這個我想這個3%會影響97%多少我真的就是無法想像\n\n08:05.060 --> 08:24.714\n怎麼會用這樣來虧損部長要大力的不斷的去澄清好不好虧損的問題不是這個造成虧損虧損是因為我們過去的買的這個原料比較貴在因為戰爭的時候買的不是只有台灣買比較貴日本也貴這個韓國也貴這個我們鄰近的國家他們都買很貴而且他們的電價事實上\n\n08:30.959 --> 08:56.521\n都比我們貴對所以這才是根本的原因嘛你買進來的價格變貴了那但是我們又不讓台電漲價我們政治上希望不要漲價所以導致台電承受了這些嘛齁那我接下來問了接下來我們也提出特別預算了齁在地方講的時候很多人都講說希望支持台電齁不管是立委或者地方的民代甚至很多企業都希望支持台電我們現在又再次提出來一千億的一個嗯撥補的部分部長\n\n08:57.662 --> 09:14.380\n那如果最後一樣沒有在野黨或者在野黨的支持一樣沒辦法在立法院得到這個一千億的撥補的話會不會影響到接下來這個我們的電價的調漲的壓力報告委員我想電價調漲還是由電價審議委員會他們做決定啦\n\n09:18.644 --> 09:35.452\n但會參考這個目前的這個狀況如果台電能夠忍受多久的財務的負債比已經達到九成了如果我們要馬兒不吃草又要馬兒好這個其實是有困難的所以我希望是\n\n09:36.292 --> 09:56.066\n台電要穩健的經營如果是因為這樣而造成的那當然國家財政這幾年經濟成長力不錯有盈餘的時候由他來撥補我認為是最好的方案因為穩定電價也穩定物價是最好的方案對全民的影響是最低的也不會造成整個經濟上大的波動那如果遲遲的不給的時候台電當然勢必虧損會持續加大你又不給他漲電價他持續虧損持續會加大所以我們希望\n\n10:00.729 --> 10:24.900\n部長強力的持續的去說明那我們希望朝野大家一起努力這個台電是台灣的台電也是大家的台電那電力大家都希望穩定的工業剛講過的缺電沒有這樣的問題的時候我們希望更多人支持台電讓台電穩定的供電穩定的發電讓台灣的產業民生都能夠持續的有好的一個電力好不好希望持續加強溝通說明是是好謝謝謝謝部長好謝謝我們現在請\n\n","segments":[{"start":6.482,"end":30.208,"text":"好 謝謝主席 請郭部長先請教一下 主席總署有公布了今年第一季的GDP的成長率5.37當然大家對這個數字上也有很多不同的解讀部長怎麼看這樣的一個數字"},{"start":31.408,"end":54.338,"text":"這個我想這個本來就是大家預期這個川普總統這個上來以後可能會對關稅有一些要求所以大家可能在原來的這個比較低關稅的時候趕快出貨美國的buyer也會有這種想法所以這造成我們大概所以這個數字上第一季會有這樣的一個現象"},{"start":56.079,"end":84.278,"text":"對 但全年度的部分應該還是努力在以保三為目標啦我們現在大概看喔第二季大概也會有比較高的這個部分啦那第三季以後就不知道了就真正的這個關稅落零以後要看談判最後的結果啦對對對但是如果以目前的狀態我們應該還是努力維持在三以上嘛我們希望是這樣目前的這個現在四月嘛四月結束了嘛今天五月一號我想四月份大概也都是三以上"},{"start":84.758,"end":109.892,"text":"都是這樣以上 對那如果加入政府的投入4100億的特別預算的話這個我想這個機會應該是相當的有機會的我們希望說今年還是能夠保持原來這個估計的這個這樣的一個部分去努力但是真正的這個最後談判的結果會造成什麼樣的影響現在目前還是這個很難去部長那預定談判時候什麼會出來什麼時候會出來預定"},{"start":111.713,"end":135.448,"text":"如果按照進度來講就是說第一批的這個75國應該都會在7月前談了一個大致啦因為他也不可能每一個國家都跟你談嘛那他大概是全面的幾個標竿的國家先談嘛談完以後後面就比照辦理我看川普應該也很急啦也希望盡快的談底定因為看到內部的"},{"start":135.848,"end":158.616,"text":"他太久的話大概對他的這個內部的影響也很大啦就看他美國今年第一季也是不好嘛對對所以談太久了恐怕對他也有相當大的一個壓力所以我想這個應該會盡快來談完那我也請教一下因為我們的製造業的景氣其實2月3月也有了變動其實有段時間像2月幾乎爬到的是這個"},{"start":161.118,"end":175.188,"text":"黃紅燈其實相當不錯但是到了3月降到了黃藍燈這個當然我認為當然跟川普這些都有相關的一些連動部長怎麼看是確實台灣的這個經濟受到美國的美國的這個關稅的影響確實是非常的大"},{"start":176.224,"end":195.628,"text":"所以這個燈號的部分也會受到景氣上的影響因為這個是所謂外部來的外部環境的變異所以我想這個是我們都會高度的關注這樣的變異未來的發展會造成什麼樣的現象我們期盼在跟美國的談判有一些好的結果之後對我們的景氣對我們的經濟成長力都有好的一些幫助跟影響"},{"start":198.849,"end":210.859,"text":"那再請教一下今天好像有人到經濟部去甚至有立委去那批評螃蟹騙局部長怎麼看?是這樣嗎?這個我早上一大早就在這裡沒有進經濟部沒有看到這個現象那這個包圍經濟部啊這個這樣的一個活動如果是合法的"},{"start":228.24,"end":248.723,"text":"我們都尊重所有的這個國人的這個合法的行動如果是不合法的我們就要檢討為什麼他會採取不合法的這個行動那是不是龐氏騙局我對這個沒有研究那我問一下他裡面講的是他認為政府的現在能源政策是錯誤的部長認同這樣的看法嗎"},{"start":250.827,"end":275.529,"text":"這個就是我一直在講啦所謂正確或者錯誤是用什麼時間點來回顧那個情境啦不能講說你不喜歡的你就講他是錯誤啦那每一個時期都有那個時期的一些決策啦當然你現在來看我是不是想請教他說那你對流辮子清朝流辮子這件事情你認為是正確或者錯誤"},{"start":276.778,"end":292.537,"text":"是不是所以我們不能夠用現在來評論過去的這個這個是對的或者錯的不過我還是要強調在當下這樣的狀況下的時候非核家園還是入法的還是在朝野的一個共識下的所以政府當然依照相關的法令必須來執行嘛對不對"},{"start":295.379,"end":321.168,"text":"這個包括核能的部分核廢料處理也沒有達成共識嘛很多的那甚至於燃煤的部分大家也覺得燃煤空污要改善所以燃煤很多的很多縣市也都希望不要所以發展綠能這個方向是國家的趨勢也是正確的方向嘛所以我覺得不能夠把這些東西全部倒到最後來全部用簡單的一句說你現在是一個錯誤的能源政策我看不出來講那些錯誤能源政策你的能源政策是什麼"},{"start":322.048,"end":344.977,"text":"非核加鹽是一個國家的基因這也是朝野的共識然後核廢料無法處理確實也是個事實然後核能安全怎麼樣國人安心確實目前沒辦法提出一個所以在當下這個階段這個就是目前的狀態那發展綠電也是目前的整個國家的政策也是世界各國的政策啊所以我看不懂這樣的批評跟這樣的評斷的時候你是用什麼樣的利潤基礎來談的"},{"start":346.557,"end":367.824,"text":"每個人就像每個人吃東西一樣有他的口味一樣啦那要講出一番的那個就像講的這個黑的講久了不會變成白的啦那我也擔心的是這樣子不斷的去攻擊不斷的去攻擊能源政治好像就變成國家能源政治錯誤的那也請提出來那你具體可行能源政治是什麼這個我們會報告委員 這個部分我們一定"},{"start":367.824,"end":388.462,"text":"一定會澄清啦我非常擔心三人成虎講了一百遍有可能講到後來就變成好像就是三人成虎嘛我想成語故事上面的三人成虎很擔心這樣子台灣講台灣獨裁講一百遍好像台灣真的變成獨裁的一樣就是我覺得這個是一個很錯誤的同樣的一直講好像是能源政策好像"},{"start":389.803,"end":407.053,"text":"圖利什麼什麼綠電圖利什麼什麼好像講久了講到後來變成好像是真的一樣全世界都在發展綠電如果哪邊有違法就抓出來嘛我們認為就是大家依照法令的規定你認為違法就去提告我們就是按照這個法的規範下去處理嘛"},{"start":408.113,"end":434.632,"text":"講一百遍有可能就變成讓大家模糊掉了啦所以我這個希望還是能源部要不斷的大力的去說明成績包括台電這幾年我們其實努力下空汙大幅的改善這也是很多人重視我很重視的啦從以前的時候我記得我90年代我一直盯著空汙的數字因為發展綠電因為我們減少了這個燃煤所以我們的這個空汙大幅的改善這對於南部對中部都很大很大的幫助"},{"start":435.012,"end":454.351,"text":"這些絕對都是貢獻所以我覺得這些東西應該要去正面給予肯定那也有很多人不斷地在造謠說台電是因為非核政策而導致虧損部長要不要再澄清一次我們一定會再次澄清是因為核能的這個能源政策而造成台電的虧損的嗎"},{"start":455.552,"end":473.837,"text":"完全不是啦我想這個裡面在這個邏輯上面有需要再導正的部分這個要持續的澄清因為核能最多的時候大概占台灣的發電大概10%這個10%到現在剩下3%你說3%我現在拿掉然後就會多大的影響這個我想這個3%會影響97%多少我真的就是無法想像"},{"start":485.06,"end":504.714,"text":"怎麼會用這樣來虧損部長要大力的不斷的去澄清好不好虧損的問題不是這個造成虧損虧損是因為我們過去的買的這個原料比較貴在因為戰爭的時候買的不是只有台灣買比較貴日本也貴這個韓國也貴這個我們鄰近的國家他們都買很貴而且他們的電價事實上"},{"start":510.959,"end":536.521,"text":"都比我們貴對所以這才是根本的原因嘛你買進來的價格變貴了那但是我們又不讓台電漲價我們政治上希望不要漲價所以導致台電承受了這些嘛齁那我接下來問了接下來我們也提出特別預算了齁在地方講的時候很多人都講說希望支持台電齁不管是立委或者地方的民代甚至很多企業都希望支持台電我們現在又再次提出來一千億的一個嗯撥補的部分部長"},{"start":537.662,"end":554.38,"text":"那如果最後一樣沒有在野黨或者在野黨的支持一樣沒辦法在立法院得到這個一千億的撥補的話會不會影響到接下來這個我們的電價的調漲的壓力報告委員我想電價調漲還是由電價審議委員會他們做決定啦"},{"start":558.644,"end":575.452,"text":"但會參考這個目前的這個狀況如果台電能夠忍受多久的財務的負債比已經達到九成了如果我們要馬兒不吃草又要馬兒好這個其實是有困難的所以我希望是"},{"start":576.292,"end":596.066,"text":"台電要穩健的經營如果是因為這樣而造成的那當然國家財政這幾年經濟成長力不錯有盈餘的時候由他來撥補我認為是最好的方案因為穩定電價也穩定物價是最好的方案對全民的影響是最低的也不會造成整個經濟上大的波動那如果遲遲的不給的時候台電當然勢必虧損會持續加大你又不給他漲電價他持續虧損持續會加大所以我們希望"},{"start":600.729,"end":624.9,"text":"部長強力的持續的去說明那我們希望朝野大家一起努力這個台電是台灣的台電也是大家的台電那電力大家都希望穩定的工業剛講過的缺電沒有這樣的問題的時候我們希望更多人支持台電讓台電穩定的供電穩定的發電讓台灣的產業民生都能夠持續的有好的一個電力好不好 希望持續加強溝通說明是是好 謝謝 謝謝部長好 謝謝我們現在請"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":534,"blocks":[["賴委員瑞隆：（10時47分）謝謝主席。請郭部長。"],["主席：郭部長。"],["賴委員瑞隆：郭部長好。"],["郭部長智輝：委員好。"],["賴委員瑞隆：先請教一下，主計總處有公布了今年第一季GDP的成長率5.37%，當然大家對這個數字有很多不同的解讀，部長怎麼看這樣的數字？"],["郭部長智輝：本來大家就預期川普總統上來以後，可能會對關稅有一些要求，所以大家可能在原來比較低關稅的時候趕快出貨，美國的buyer也會有這種想法，所以造成第一季會有這樣的現象。"],["賴委員瑞隆：但全年度應該還是努力以保3為目標？"],["郭部長智輝：我們現在看第二季大概也會有比較高的數字，第三季以後就不知道，真正的關稅落了以後……"],["賴委員瑞隆：要看最後談判的結果？"],["郭部長智輝：對。"],["賴委員瑞隆：如果以目前的狀態，我們應該還是努力在維持在3以上？"],["郭部長智輝：我們希望是這樣，目前4月結束了，今天5月1號，我想4月份大概也都是3以上。"],["賴委員瑞隆：如果加入政府投入的4,100億特別預算，我想應該是相當有機會的。"],["郭部長智輝：我們希望今年還是能夠保持原來所估計這樣的部分去努力，但是最後真正的談判結果會造成什麼樣的影響目前還是很難去……"],["賴委員瑞隆：部長，預定談判結果什麼時候會出來？"],["郭部長智輝：如果按照進度來講，第一批的75國應該都會在7月前談了一個大致，因為他也不可能跟每一個國家都談嘛，那大概就是全面的……"],["賴委員瑞隆：是，所以7月前會談完嘛？"],["郭部長智輝：就是幾個標竿的國家先談，談完以後，後面就比照辦理。"],["賴委員瑞隆：我看川普應該很急，他也希望儘快的談好並底定，因為看起來他內部的也……"],["郭部長智輝：如果談太久的話，大概對他們內部的影響也很大，像美國今年第一季也是不好嘛！"],["賴委員瑞隆：對，所以談太久恐怕對他也有相當大的壓力，所以我想應該會儘快來談完。"],["郭部長智輝：是。"],["賴委員瑞隆：那我也要請教一下，因為我們製造業的景氣在2月、3月也有了變動，像在2月幾乎爬到了黃紅燈，其實相當不錯，但是到3月降到了黃藍燈，我認為這當然跟川普這些政策也都有相關的連動，部長怎麼看？"],["郭部長智輝：是，臺灣的經濟確實受到美國這個關稅政策的影響非常大。"],["賴委員瑞隆：所以這個燈號的部分也會受到景氣的影響？"],["郭部長智輝：因為這個是所謂外部環境的變異嘛，所以我想我們都會高度的關注這樣的變異，看未來的發展會造成什麼樣的現象。"],["賴委員瑞隆：好，我們也期盼在跟美國的談判有一些好的結果之後，對我們的景氣、對我們的經濟成長率都有一些好的幫助跟影響。"],["郭部長智輝：是。"],["賴委員瑞隆：再來請教一下，今天好像有人到經濟部去，甚至有立委去批評電力補貼是龐氏騙局，部長怎麼看？是這樣嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：因為我今天一大早就在這裡了，還沒有進經濟部，所以沒有看到這個現象，這個包圍經濟部的活動如果是合法的，我們都尊重國人所有合法的行動；可是如果是不合法的，我們就要檢討為什麼他會採取這個不合法的行動。至於是不是龐氏騙局，我對這個沒有研究，所以我就不予評論。"],["賴委員瑞隆：那我問一下，他在這裡面講的是他認為政府現在的能源政策是錯誤的，部長認同這樣的看法嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：這個就是我一直在講的，所謂正確或者錯誤是用什麼時間點來回顧那個情境，不能說你不喜歡的，你就講它是錯誤，在每一個時期都有那個時期的一些決策，當然你現在來看，我是比較想請教他：你對清朝留辮子這件事情認為是正確或者錯誤？所以我們不能夠用現在來評論過去這個是對的或者是錯的。"],["賴委員瑞隆：不過我還是要強調，在當下這樣的狀況之下，非核家園還是入法的，還是在朝野的共識下的……"],["郭部長智輝：對，我們就是要依……"],["賴委員瑞隆：所以政府當然必須依照相關的法令來進行嘛，對不對？"],["郭部長智輝：對，沒錯。"],["賴委員瑞隆：包括核能的部分、核廢料處理也沒有達成共識，甚至於燃煤的部分，大家也覺得燃煤的空污要改善，所以很多縣市也都希望不要燃煤。發展綠能這個方向是國家的趨勢，也是正確的方向，所以我覺得不能夠把這些東西最後就全部導到一句很簡單的話，說現在是一個錯誤的能源政策，講那些是錯誤的能源政策的人，可是我看不出來你的能源政策是什麼。非核家園是國家一個既定的政策，也是朝野的共識，然後核廢料無法處理確實也是一個事實，然後核能安全要怎麼樣讓國人安心，確實目前也沒辦法提出來，所以在當下這個階段，這就是目前的狀態，發展綠電也是目前整個國家的政策，也是世界各國的政策啊！所以我看不懂這些人提出這樣的批評跟這樣的評斷時是用什麼樣的立論基礎來談的。"],["郭部長智輝：沒有，就像每一個人吃東西有他的口味，都一樣啦！"],["賴委員瑞隆：對，那就要講出一番道理，就像有人講的，黑的講久了也不會變成白的，我也擔心像這樣不斷的去攻擊能源政策，好像就變成國家的能源政策是錯誤的，那也請提出來你認為具體可行的能源政策是什麼。"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，對這個部分我們一定會澄清。"],["賴委員瑞隆：要不斷的講啦！"],["郭部長智輝：我非常擔心三人成虎。"],["賴委員瑞隆：如果講了100遍，有可能講到後來就變成好像……"],["郭部長智輝：對，就是三人成虎嘛！我想就是成語故事裡面的三人成虎。"],["賴委員瑞隆：我很擔心這樣子啊！講臺灣獨裁講了100遍，好像臺灣就真的變成獨裁一樣，我覺得這是很錯誤的。"],["郭部長智輝：這個部分我們台電一定會出來澄清。"],["賴委員瑞隆：同樣的，一直講能源政策好像是圖利什麼、綠電是圖利什麼，講久了到後來就變成好像是真的一樣，全世界都在發展綠電，如果哪邊有違法就抓出來嘛！那你不能夠攻擊跟污衊整個能源政策。"],["郭部長智輝：我們認為大家就是依照法令的規定，你認為違法就去提告，我們就是按照法規範下去處理。"],["賴委員瑞隆：講100遍有可能就變成讓大家模糊掉了，所以我真的希望經濟部、能源署還是要不斷的大力說明、澄清，包括這幾年在台電的努力下空污其實有大幅的改善，這是很多人重視的，也是我很重視的，我記得在9年前擔任立委的時候就一直盯著空污的數字，因為發展綠電，因為我們減少了燃煤，所以我們的空污大幅的改善，這對於南部、對中部都有很大、很大的幫助，這些絕對都是貢獻，所以我覺得對這些東西應該要正面給予肯定。那也有很多人不斷在造謠說台電是因為非核政策而導致虧損，部長要不要再澄清一次？"],["郭部長智輝：我們一定會再次澄清。"],["賴委員瑞隆：是因為這個能源政策而造成台電的虧損嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：完全不是，我想在這個邏輯上面有需要再導正的部分。"],["賴委員瑞隆：好，這個要持續的澄清。"],["郭部長智輝：因為核能最多的時候大概是占臺灣發電的10%，到現在剩下3%，你說現在我把這3%拿掉就會有多大的影響，我想3%會影響97%的這種說法，我真的就是無法想像怎麼會這樣說這樣子以後就有多嚴重。"],["賴委員瑞隆：我要請部長不斷的大力去澄清，好不好？要澄清虧損的問題不是這個所造成的。"],["郭部長智輝：虧損是因為我們過去買的原料比較貴，就是在戰爭的時候，並不是只有臺灣買的價格比較貴，日本也貴、韓國也貴，我們鄰近的國家也都買很貴，而且他們的電價事實上都比我們貴。"],["賴委員瑞隆：對，所以這才是根本的原因，你買進來的價格變貴了，但是我們又不讓台電漲價，我們政策上希望不要漲價，所以導致台電承受了這些嘛！","我接下來要問，我們也提出特別預算了，在地方講的時候，很多人都說希望支持台電，不管是立委或者地方的民代，甚至於很多企業都希望支持台電，我們現在又再次提出來1,000億撥補的部分，部長，如果最後沒有獲得在野黨的支持，一樣沒辦法在立法院得到這1,000億的撥補，接下來我們的電價會不會有調漲的壓力？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，我想電價調漲還是由電價審議委員會來做決定，他們會參考目前的這個狀況，看台電能夠忍受多久的財務危機……"],["賴委員瑞隆：負債比已經達到九成了，我們要馬兒不吃草、又要馬兒好，這個其實是有困難的啦！所以我希望台電要穩健的經營，如果是因為這樣而造成的，那國家財政這幾年的經濟成長率不錯，在有盈餘的時候由國家來撥補，我認為是最好的方案，可以穩定電價，也穩定物價，這是最好的方案，對全民的影響是最低的，也不會造成整個經濟上很大的波動。如果遲遲不給的話，台電當然虧損勢必持續加大，你又不給它漲電價，它的虧損就會持續加大嘛！所以我們希望部長強力、持續的去說明，也希望朝野大家一起來努力，臺灣的台電也是大家的台電，大家都希望電力可以穩定的供應，剛剛也講過，在沒有缺電這樣的問題時，我們希望更多人支持台電，讓台電穩定的供電、穩定的發電，讓臺灣的產業、民生都能夠持續的有好的電力，好不好？我希望你們持續加強溝通、說明。"],["郭部長智輝：是。"],["賴委員瑞隆：好，謝謝部長。"],["主席：好，謝謝。","我們現在請鍾佳濱委員做詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":290,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-19-11","speakers":["謝衣鳯","陳亭妃","張嘉郡","張啓楷","鄭正鈐","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","呂玉玲","蔡易餘","邱志偉","賴瑞隆","鍾佳濱","楊瓊瓔","黃國昌","羅廷瑋","林岱樺"],"page_start":243,"meetingDate":["2025-05-01"],"gazette_id":"1144501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144501_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第11次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"審查：一、本院委員魯明哲等19人擬具「再生能源發展條例第十三條條文修正草案」案；二、本\n院委員謝衣鳯等17人擬具「再生能源發展條例第十三條條文修正草案」案","agenda_id":"1144501_00005"}}}