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675.041, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"席\", \"start\": 675.041, \"end\": 675.061, \"score\": 0.001}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,290 --> 00:00:03,037\n謝謝主席有請黃部長蘇發部黃部長蘇發部我們黃部長\n\n2\n00:00:09,984 --> 00:00:29,261\n黃部長好我想健全的新聞報導環境有助於民主社會的發展這是之前速發部召集大型跨境數位平台與新聞業對話會議中那數位平台跟新聞媒體業者都認為的具體共識\n\n3\n00:00:30,262 --> 00:00:45,360\n那我想健全的新聞報導媒體要怎麼塑造那本席認為最重要的就是要保障新聞的自由跟基層的媒體從業人員的權益那本席上一屆跟這一屆我們都有提出喔\n\n4\n00:00:45,640 --> 00:01:03,550\n就是所謂的數位新聞發展與民主任性法草案那這個草案我們期盼透過新聞有價的這個基本價值來提振台灣的這個媒體環境那本席之前有提過新聞媒體面對的三大困境第一個\n\n5\n00:01:04,711 --> 00:01:30,599\n新聞依賴這個網路平台導引流量而網路的流量又受到大型的跨國數位平台的載制第二個困境是新聞產製的方式受到跨國平台的制約所以它報導的內容標題會受到演算法被牽著鼻子走導致有很多大家所詬病的內容農場啊調標這種亂象\n\n6\n00:01:33,860 --> 00:01:54,976\n那第三演算法也被大型的跨國平台掌握所以這個演算法到底是如何的運作我們也無從得知可是它已經造成媒體產製內容的矛盾那我想世界各國大概也有都面臨到這樣的困境那台灣在這樣的困境底下受到威脅我想是更加的危急\n\n7\n00:01:56,451 --> 00:02:14,957\n前META全球公共政策總監他前陣子就有公開指控說META跟中國政府的密切聯繫有內容審查相關制度而台港的用戶的熱門內容就是受到審查的一部分那有內容審查\n\n8\n00:02:18,668 --> 00:02:45,468\n我們媒體就是最怕說沒有流量那如果說發了一個讓中國不開心的新聞或貼文那有可能就導致被消失或限制流量等等那發了新聞必須躲東躲西喔那不僅影響那個新聞自由那我想中國也更可能藉這個手段來控制台灣的輿論在這個灰色地帶來侵蝕台灣的民主社會\n\n9\n00:02:46,429 --> 00:03:00,583\n所以本席就想要問個直接的問題面對這種大型跨境的數位平台可能的內容審查那台灣要怎麼樣因應那上週蔡其昌委員質詢的時候他有速發布是說希望美國能強迫他們公開內容審核的機制\n\n10\n00:03:07,210 --> 00:03:22,451\n那我想請教抒發部你是否有辦法在我國來促成審核機制的公開另外就是說促成審核機制公開後那抒發部的規劃要如何具體著手處理這些問題部長\n\n11\n00:03:24,153 --> 00:03:40,182\n那個報告委員那個確實是剛剛講Meta這個因為這個有這樣的一個新聞我們很關注那我們也知道說事實上這個是在2017年以前那後來2019年Facebook就放棄了中國大陸的市場\n\n12\n00:03:40,842 --> 00:03:57,021\n所以現在就是說如果中國對MetaFacebook有影響力我們還需要再關注那至於說現在這個因為這個美國公聽會現在在對這個議題在進行偵查所以我們當然持續跟Meta溝通我們也希望\n\n13\n00:03:57,782 --> 00:04:22,626\n在這裡面他也要對我們公開所以我們這邊在同時進行就是我們同時看美國在這個公聽會的一個結果同時看台灣的這些目前的審查的方式他要對我們公開然後我們也會接受申訴然後看看怎麼樣再跟Meta那他就至少這個演算法怎麼樣的貼文要被下架必須要透明公開這個是我們會跟Meta去要求\n\n14\n00:04:23,183 --> 00:04:40,161\n好那我想目前速發部它針對所謂的媒體議價法的態度看起來是支持新聞有價您剛也一直在強調可是對立的專法似乎好像就不那麼明朗那從上屆本席提出到現在也差不多兩個年\n\n15\n00:04:41,562 --> 00:04:55,996\n那這部法的推行的過程我想最主要面臨到的困境您剛在那個口頭報告的時候也有稍微提及喔那如果說暫時推不成那我們到底有什麼樣的替代方案可以回應媒體界對這個法的期待\n\n16\n00:04:57,998 --> 00:05:27,124\n什麼時候再找這些大型的平台業者媒體學者再次來討論同時也想請教NCC跟文化部你們認為媒體業低薪高工時的這種窘境有沒有辦法來扭轉還是可以再做些什麼樣的努力來提升基層媒體從業人員的薪資跟勞動條件先請速發部回應再請NCC或勞動部\n\n17\n00:05:29,315 --> 00:05:31,106\n我們的那個策略我再請次長先補充說明\n\n18\n00:05:33,432 --> 00:05:50,995\n目前我們在想辦法提升台灣媒體的收入我們是跟現在最配合的公司之一是GoogleGoogle他做了兩件事情第一個他是捐了三年三億台幣的基金現在交由DTA台灣數位產業計經濟協會由他們來讓這個基金然後想辦法來幫助我們\n\n19\n00:05:58,837 --> 00:06:26,283\n台灣的那個媒體業就是改善他們的狀況另外就是說Google他們也成立一個所謂的北極星計畫就是要輔導各家媒體改為收費制因為現在大部分台灣媒體都是不收費的那美國的那個FinancialTimes因為他們的收費機制做得很好所以FinancialTimes他現在會在全世界幫各國的媒體做這個方面的就是轉為收費機制的輔導工作\n\n20\n00:06:28,823 --> 00:06:45,737\n那所有這些費用會由那個Google來支付謝謝是那我再補充一下就是說其實除了這個以外還有技術面我們希望是說幫助媒體做數位轉型提供一些AI的工具這個能夠找到新的商業模式所以這個也是我們還在努力那其他問題是不是請\n\n21\n00:06:48,038 --> 00:07:06,096\n通常會這邊跟委員補充報告兩點第一點NG所管的廣電媒體他們會有一些營運計畫我們要邀請他說營運計畫理由涉及到公司內部治理的一定要相關的法律事項相關法規比方說勞動的相關條件那些一定要符合法律事項這是第一點第二點補充是\n\n22\n00:07:07,737 --> 00:07:20,227\n由於媒體競爭激烈包括網路媒體一般傳統媒體我們希望他在流財引財方面要有吸引力說必須要請他們要行政次長他們這方面要特別要提升他們的一些待遇以上\n\n23\n00:07:21,138 --> 00:07:46,480\n好那除了前述我們提到的這個媒體業勞動條件需要提升以外本席認為其實相關的部會我們都要去追蹤了解就是新聞媒體的創作跟轉型創新跟轉型我們看到數位經濟暨這個產業發展協會與Google有達成協議喔就是說要協助Google管理並執行這個台灣新聞數位共融基金的計畫\n\n24\n00:07:47,381 --> 00:08:12,137\n那協助台灣新聞的媒體做創新跟轉型只是說要內容具原創性又具公益性的新聞媒體都可以適用那不過我想有一個疑問的地方是說那這個是一個短期的計畫那如何轉換成長期的機制那來回應說新聞內容產製的付出以及它應該要怎麼樣跟大的這個平台來斡旋合理\n\n25\n00:08:13,859 --> 00:08:39,255\n來斡旋合理的方案那似乎這好像都還有待商榷那在這個同時我們應該要保障所謂的這個撰寫地方的新聞或促進那個媒體多元化以及這個服務特定社群的小型的媒體業者或大型的媒體公平的競爭的權利所以有關這個台灣新聞數位共同基金這個討論的運用以及小型媒體的保障那不曉得部長你怎麼看\n\n26\n00:08:40,698 --> 00:08:45,026\n我們素材署跟Google有不斷的溝通我請素材署補充回答\n\n27\n00:08:46,338 --> 00:09:11,943\n跟委員報告我們跟委員一樣關心這個的長期性所以我們跟Google來推出督促一下是不是將來永續性的一個做法不過Google說因為它這個三年還有一年多它需要觀察一下這個的成效雖然目前已經補助40個案子了但是它還要持續觀察這個成效再來決定下一步以上當然它有新的剛剛市長報告過的北基新的計畫對這個也是它會有新的其他的措施一直出來\n\n28\n00:09:12,483 --> 00:09:40,240\n至於這個共榮基金他還要觀察這三年的執行的狀況以上好那最後30秒我想跟部長請教說有關於這個文本與資料探勘就是所謂的TDM的這個議題速發部要如何設計我國規範的架構簡單來講就是說TDM這個技術是巨量的資料的蒐集為基礎那將這些資料進行擷取重置或編譯然後\n\n29\n00:09:42,853 --> 00:10:07,311\n變成可進行開採分析的資料庫來便於這個分析利用那我想在這個人工智慧的應用上是個普遍的應用可是TDM的過程也牽涉到著作權侵害的這個疑慮所以很多國家其實都嘗試著TDM的相關法規的調適那一方面也放寬TDM技術應用的這個限制二方面我們也要著重\n\n30\n00:10:07,931 --> 00:10:29,307\n註作權人的權益所以像歐盟的數位單一市場註作權指令的修改這樣他就為了註作權法設計了例外規定那請教部長說那我們組長AI監管的訴發部要怎麼樣跟經濟部制裁局來溝通來因應TDM技術的發展那目前不曉得我們\n\n31\n00:10:29,907 --> 00:10:56,347\n市長的規劃報告委員我們是在進行那這個因為我們資料創新室就是在處理這個這個資料分享的議題我請那個市長說好委員好有關於這個TDM的這件事情因為我們在做這個AI訓練語要的時候呢涉及如果說這個著作權保護的這個議題的如果機器訓練的時候需要拿到這些資料來訓練的話那就涉及這個\n\n32\n00:10:57,731 --> 00:11:15,061\n助索權重置的問題但是為了解決這個問題以及現在尚未立法所以我們這個速發部就訂定了一個台灣主權A壓訓練語料授權條款第一版那這個版本呢還要跟這個制裁局一起來協調內容之後我們就會釋出讓各界來運用喔好好時間關係謝謝謝謝主席\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n290\t3037\t謝謝主席 有請黃部長 蘇發部黃部長蘇發部我們黃部長\n9984\t29261\t黃部長好我想健全的新聞報導環境有助於民主社會的發展這是之前速發部召集大型跨境數位平台與新聞業對話會議中那數位平台跟新聞媒體業者都認為的具體共識\n30262\t45360\t那我想健全的新聞報導媒體要怎麼塑造那本席認為最重要的就是要保障新聞的自由跟基層的媒體從業人員的權益那本席上一屆跟這一屆我們都有提出喔\n45640\t63550\t就是所謂的數位新聞發展與民主任性法草案那這個草案我們期盼透過新聞有價的這個基本價值來提振台灣的這個媒體環境那本席之前有提過新聞媒體面對的三大困境第一個\n64711\t90599\t新聞依賴這個網路平台導引流量而網路的流量又受到大型的跨國數位平台的載制第二個困境是新聞產製的方式受到跨國平台的制約所以它報導的內容 標題會受到演算法被牽著鼻子走導致有很多大家所詬病的內容農場啊 調標這種亂象\n93860\t114976\t那第三演算法也被大型的跨國平台掌握所以這個演算法到底是如何的運作我們也無從得知可是它已經造成媒體產製內容的矛盾那我想世界各國大概也有都面臨到這樣的困境那台灣在這樣的困境底下受到威脅我想是更加的危急\n116451\t134957\t前META全球公共政策總監他前陣子就有公開指控說META跟中國政府的密切聯繫有內容審查相關制度而台港的用戶的熱門內容就是受到審查的一部分那有內容審查\n138668\t165468\t我們媒體就是最怕說沒有流量那如果說發了一個讓中國不開心的新聞或貼文那有可能就導致被消失或限制流量等等那發了新聞必須躲東躲西喔那不僅影響那個新聞自由那我想中國也更可能藉這個手段來控制台灣的輿論在這個灰色地帶來侵蝕台灣的民主社會\n166429\t180583\t所以本席就想要問個直接的問題面對這種大型跨境的數位平台可能的內容審查那台灣要怎麼樣因應那上週蔡其昌委員質詢的時候他有速發布是說希望美國能強迫他們公開內容審核的機制\n187210\t202451\t那我想請教抒發部你是否有辦法在我國來促成審核機制的公開另外就是說促成審核機制公開後那抒發部的規劃要如何具體著手處理這些問題 部長\n204153\t220182\t那個報告委員那個確實是剛剛講Meta這個因為這個有這樣的一個新聞我們很關注那我們也知道說事實上這個是在2017年以前那後來2019年Facebook就放棄了中國大陸的市場\n220842\t237021\t所以現在就是說如果中國對Meta Facebook有影響力我們還需要再關注那至於說現在這個因為這個美國公聽會現在在對這個議題在進行偵查所以我們當然持續跟Meta溝通我們也希望\n237782\t262626\t在這裡面他也要對我們公開所以我們這邊在同時進行就是我們同時看美國在這個公聽會的一個結果同時看台灣的這些目前的審查的方式他要對我們公開然後我們也會接受申訴然後看看怎麼樣再跟Meta那他就至少這個演算法怎麼樣的貼文要被下架必須要透明公開這個是我們會跟Meta去要求\n263183\t280161\t好 那我想目前速發部它針對所謂的媒體議價法的態度看起來是支持新聞有價您剛也一直在強調可是對立的專法似乎好像就不那麼明朗那從上屆本席提出到現在也差不多兩個年\n281562\t295996\t那這部法的推行的過程我想最主要面臨到的困境您剛在那個口頭報告的時候也有稍微提及喔那如果說暫時推不成那我們到底有什麼樣的替代方案可以回應媒體界對這個法的期待\n297998\t327124\t什麼時候再找這些大型的平台業者媒體學者再次來討論同時也想請教NCC跟文化部你們認為媒體業低薪高工時的這種窘境有沒有辦法來扭轉還是可以再做些什麼樣的努力來提升基層媒體從業人員的薪資跟勞動條件先請速發部回應再請NCC或勞動部\n329315\t331106\t我們的那個策略我再請次長先補充說明\n333432\t350995\t目前我們在想辦法提升台灣媒體的收入我們是跟現在最配合的公司之一是GoogleGoogle他做了兩件事情第一個他是捐了三年三億台幣的基金現在交由DTA台灣數位產業計經濟協會由他們來讓這個基金然後想辦法來幫助我們\n358837\t386283\t台灣的那個媒體業就是改善他們的狀況另外就是說Google他們也成立一個所謂的北極星計畫就是要輔導各家媒體改為收費制因為現在大部分台灣媒體都是不收費的那美國的那個Financial Times因為他們的收費機制做得很好所以Financial Times他現在會在全世界幫各國的媒體做這個方面的就是轉為收費機制的輔導工作\n388823\t405737\t那所有這些費用會由那個Google來支付謝謝是那我再補充一下就是說其實除了這個以外還有技術面我們希望是說幫助媒體做數位轉型提供一些AI的工具這個能夠找到新的商業模式所以這個也是我們還在努力那其他問題是不是請\n408038\t426096\t通常會這邊跟委員補充報告兩點第一點NG所管的廣電媒體他們會有一些營運計畫我們要邀請他說營運計畫理由涉及到公司內部治理的一定要相關的法律事項相關法規比方說勞動的相關條件那些一定要符合法律事項這是第一點第二點補充是\n427737\t440227\t由於媒體競爭激烈包括網路媒體一般傳統媒體我們希望他在流財引財方面要有吸引力說必須要請他們要行政次長他們這方面要特別要提升他們的一些待遇以上\n441138\t466480\t好 那除了前述我們提到的這個媒體業勞動條件需要提升以外本席認為其實相關的部會我們都要去追蹤了解就是新聞媒體的創作跟轉型創新跟轉型我們看到數位經濟暨這個產業發展協會與Google有達成協議喔就是說要協助Google管理並執行這個台灣新聞數位共融基金的計畫\n467381\t492137\t那協助台灣新聞的媒體做創新跟轉型只是說要內容具原創性又具公益性的新聞媒體都可以適用那不過我想有一個疑問的地方是說那這個是一個短期的計畫那如何轉換成長期的機制那來回應說新聞內容產製的付出以及它應該要怎麼樣跟大的這個平台來斡旋合理\n493859\t519255\t來斡旋合理的方案那似乎這好像都還有待商榷那在這個同時我們應該要保障所謂的這個撰寫地方的新聞或促進那個媒體多元化以及這個服務特定社群的小型的媒體業者或大型的媒體公平的競爭的權利所以有關這個台灣新聞數位共同基金這個討論的運用以及小型媒體的保障那不曉得部長你怎麼看\n520698\t525026\t我們素材署跟Google有不斷的溝通我請素材署補充回答\n526338\t551943\t跟委員報告 我們跟委員一樣關心這個的長期性所以我們跟Google來推出 督促一下是不是將來永續性的一個做法不過Google說因為它這個三年還有一年多它需要觀察一下這個的成效雖然目前已經補助40個案子了但是它還要持續觀察這個成效再來決定下一步 以上當然它有新的 剛剛市長報告過的北基新的計畫對 這個也是它會有新的其他的措施一直出來\n552483\t580240\t至於這個共榮基金他還要觀察這三年的執行的狀況 以上好 那最後30秒我想跟部長請教說有關於這個文本與資料探勘就是所謂的TDM的這個議題速發部要如何設計我國規範的架構簡單來講就是說TDM這個技術是巨量的資料的蒐集為基礎那將這些資料進行擷取 重置或編譯 然後\n582853\t607311\t變成可進行開採分析的資料庫來便於這個分析利用那我想在這個人工智慧的應用上是個普遍的應用可是TDM的過程也牽涉到著作權侵害的這個疑慮所以很多國家其實都嘗試著TDM的相關法規的調適那一方面也放寬TDM技術應用的這個限制二方面我們也要著重\n607931\t629307\t註作權人的權益所以像歐盟的數位單一市場註作權指令的修改這樣他就為了註作權法設計了例外規定那請教部長說那我們組長AI監管的訴發部要怎麼樣跟經濟部制裁局來溝通來因應TDM技術的發展那目前不曉得我們\n629907\t656347\t市長的規劃 報告委員我們是在進行那這個因為我們資料創新室就是在處理這個這個資料分享的議題我請那個市長說好委員好有關於這個TDM的這件事情因為我們在做這個AI訓練語要的時候呢涉及如果說這個著作權保護的這個議題的如果機器訓練的時候需要拿到這些資料來訓練的話那就涉及這個\n657731\t675061\t助索權重置的問題但是為了解決這個問題以及現在尚未立法所以我們這個速發部就訂定了一個台灣主權A壓訓練語料授權條款第一版那這個版本呢還要跟這個制裁局一起來協調內容之後我們就會釋出讓各界來運用喔好好時間關係謝謝謝謝主席\n","txt":"謝謝主席 有請黃部長 蘇發部黃部長蘇發部我們黃部長\n黃部長好我想健全的新聞報導環境有助於民主社會的發展這是之前速發部召集大型跨境數位平台與新聞業對話會議中那數位平台跟新聞媒體業者都認為的具體共識\n那我想健全的新聞報導媒體要怎麼塑造那本席認為最重要的就是要保障新聞的自由跟基層的媒體從業人員的權益那本席上一屆跟這一屆我們都有提出喔\n就是所謂的數位新聞發展與民主任性法草案那這個草案我們期盼透過新聞有價的這個基本價值來提振台灣的這個媒體環境那本席之前有提過新聞媒體面對的三大困境第一個\n新聞依賴這個網路平台導引流量而網路的流量又受到大型的跨國數位平台的載制第二個困境是新聞產製的方式受到跨國平台的制約所以它報導的內容 標題會受到演算法被牽著鼻子走導致有很多大家所詬病的內容農場啊 調標這種亂象\n那第三演算法也被大型的跨國平台掌握所以這個演算法到底是如何的運作我們也無從得知可是它已經造成媒體產製內容的矛盾那我想世界各國大概也有都面臨到這樣的困境那台灣在這樣的困境底下受到威脅我想是更加的危急\n前META全球公共政策總監他前陣子就有公開指控說META跟中國政府的密切聯繫有內容審查相關制度而台港的用戶的熱門內容就是受到審查的一部分那有內容審查\n我們媒體就是最怕說沒有流量那如果說發了一個讓中國不開心的新聞或貼文那有可能就導致被消失或限制流量等等那發了新聞必須躲東躲西喔那不僅影響那個新聞自由那我想中國也更可能藉這個手段來控制台灣的輿論在這個灰色地帶來侵蝕台灣的民主社會\n所以本席就想要問個直接的問題面對這種大型跨境的數位平台可能的內容審查那台灣要怎麼樣因應那上週蔡其昌委員質詢的時候他有速發布是說希望美國能強迫他們公開內容審核的機制\n那我想請教抒發部你是否有辦法在我國來促成審核機制的公開另外就是說促成審核機制公開後那抒發部的規劃要如何具體著手處理這些問題 部長\n那個報告委員那個確實是剛剛講Meta這個因為這個有這樣的一個新聞我們很關注那我們也知道說事實上這個是在2017年以前那後來2019年Facebook就放棄了中國大陸的市場\n所以現在就是說如果中國對Meta Facebook有影響力我們還需要再關注那至於說現在這個因為這個美國公聽會現在在對這個議題在進行偵查所以我們當然持續跟Meta溝通我們也希望\n在這裡面他也要對我們公開所以我們這邊在同時進行就是我們同時看美國在這個公聽會的一個結果同時看台灣的這些目前的審查的方式他要對我們公開然後我們也會接受申訴然後看看怎麼樣再跟Meta那他就至少這個演算法怎麼樣的貼文要被下架必須要透明公開這個是我們會跟Meta去要求\n好 那我想目前速發部它針對所謂的媒體議價法的態度看起來是支持新聞有價您剛也一直在強調可是對立的專法似乎好像就不那麼明朗那從上屆本席提出到現在也差不多兩個年\n那這部法的推行的過程我想最主要面臨到的困境您剛在那個口頭報告的時候也有稍微提及喔那如果說暫時推不成那我們到底有什麼樣的替代方案可以回應媒體界對這個法的期待\n什麼時候再找這些大型的平台業者媒體學者再次來討論同時也想請教NCC跟文化部你們認為媒體業低薪高工時的這種窘境有沒有辦法來扭轉還是可以再做些什麼樣的努力來提升基層媒體從業人員的薪資跟勞動條件先請速發部回應再請NCC或勞動部\n我們的那個策略我再請次長先補充說明\n目前我們在想辦法提升台灣媒體的收入我們是跟現在最配合的公司之一是GoogleGoogle他做了兩件事情第一個他是捐了三年三億台幣的基金現在交由DTA台灣數位產業計經濟協會由他們來讓這個基金然後想辦法來幫助我們\n台灣的那個媒體業就是改善他們的狀況另外就是說Google他們也成立一個所謂的北極星計畫就是要輔導各家媒體改為收費制因為現在大部分台灣媒體都是不收費的那美國的那個Financial Times因為他們的收費機制做得很好所以Financial Times他現在會在全世界幫各國的媒體做這個方面的就是轉為收費機制的輔導工作\n那所有這些費用會由那個Google來支付謝謝是那我再補充一下就是說其實除了這個以外還有技術面我們希望是說幫助媒體做數位轉型提供一些AI的工具這個能夠找到新的商業模式所以這個也是我們還在努力那其他問題是不是請\n通常會這邊跟委員補充報告兩點第一點NG所管的廣電媒體他們會有一些營運計畫我們要邀請他說營運計畫理由涉及到公司內部治理的一定要相關的法律事項相關法規比方說勞動的相關條件那些一定要符合法律事項這是第一點第二點補充是\n由於媒體競爭激烈包括網路媒體一般傳統媒體我們希望他在流財引財方面要有吸引力說必須要請他們要行政次長他們這方面要特別要提升他們的一些待遇以上\n好 那除了前述我們提到的這個媒體業勞動條件需要提升以外本席認為其實相關的部會我們都要去追蹤了解就是新聞媒體的創作跟轉型創新跟轉型我們看到數位經濟暨這個產業發展協會與Google有達成協議喔就是說要協助Google管理並執行這個台灣新聞數位共融基金的計畫\n那協助台灣新聞的媒體做創新跟轉型只是說要內容具原創性又具公益性的新聞媒體都可以適用那不過我想有一個疑問的地方是說那這個是一個短期的計畫那如何轉換成長期的機制那來回應說新聞內容產製的付出以及它應該要怎麼樣跟大的這個平台來斡旋合理\n來斡旋合理的方案那似乎這好像都還有待商榷那在這個同時我們應該要保障所謂的這個撰寫地方的新聞或促進那個媒體多元化以及這個服務特定社群的小型的媒體業者或大型的媒體公平的競爭的權利所以有關這個台灣新聞數位共同基金這個討論的運用以及小型媒體的保障那不曉得部長你怎麼看\n我們素材署跟Google有不斷的溝通我請素材署補充回答\n跟委員報告 我們跟委員一樣關心這個的長期性所以我們跟Google來推出 督促一下是不是將來永續性的一個做法不過Google說因為它這個三年還有一年多它需要觀察一下這個的成效雖然目前已經補助40個案子了但是它還要持續觀察這個成效再來決定下一步 以上當然它有新的 剛剛市長報告過的北基新的計畫對 這個也是它會有新的其他的措施一直出來\n至於這個共榮基金他還要觀察這三年的執行的狀況 以上好 那最後30秒我想跟部長請教說有關於這個文本與資料探勘就是所謂的TDM的這個議題速發部要如何設計我國規範的架構簡單來講就是說TDM這個技術是巨量的資料的蒐集為基礎那將這些資料進行擷取 重置或編譯 然後\n變成可進行開採分析的資料庫來便於這個分析利用那我想在這個人工智慧的應用上是個普遍的應用可是TDM的過程也牽涉到著作權侵害的這個疑慮所以很多國家其實都嘗試著TDM的相關法規的調適那一方面也放寬TDM技術應用的這個限制二方面我們也要著重\n註作權人的權益所以像歐盟的數位單一市場註作權指令的修改這樣他就為了註作權法設計了例外規定那請教部長說那我們組長AI監管的訴發部要怎麼樣跟經濟部制裁局來溝通來因應TDM技術的發展那目前不曉得我們\n市長的規劃 報告委員我們是在進行那這個因為我們資料創新室就是在處理這個這個資料分享的議題我請那個市長說好委員好有關於這個TDM的這件事情因為我們在做這個AI訓練語要的時候呢涉及如果說這個著作權保護的這個議題的如果機器訓練的時候需要拿到這些資料來訓練的話那就涉及這個\n助索權重置的問題但是為了解決這個問題以及現在尚未立法所以我們這個速發部就訂定了一個台灣主權A壓訓練語料授權條款第一版那這個版本呢還要跟這個制裁局一起來協調內容之後我們就會釋出讓各界來運用喔好好時間關係謝謝謝謝主席\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.290 --> 00:03.037\n謝謝主席有請黃部長蘇發部黃部長蘇發部我們黃部長\n\n00:09.984 --> 00:29.261\n黃部長好我想健全的新聞報導環境有助於民主社會的發展這是之前速發部召集大型跨境數位平台與新聞業對話會議中那數位平台跟新聞媒體業者都認為的具體共識\n\n00:30.262 --> 00:45.360\n那我想健全的新聞報導媒體要怎麼塑造那本席認為最重要的就是要保障新聞的自由跟基層的媒體從業人員的權益那本席上一屆跟這一屆我們都有提出喔\n\n00:45.640 --> 01:03.550\n就是所謂的數位新聞發展與民主任性法草案那這個草案我們期盼透過新聞有價的這個基本價值來提振台灣的這個媒體環境那本席之前有提過新聞媒體面對的三大困境第一個\n\n01:04.711 --> 01:30.599\n新聞依賴這個網路平台導引流量而網路的流量又受到大型的跨國數位平台的載制第二個困境是新聞產製的方式受到跨國平台的制約所以它報導的內容標題會受到演算法被牽著鼻子走導致有很多大家所詬病的內容農場啊調標這種亂象\n\n01:33.860 --> 01:54.976\n那第三演算法也被大型的跨國平台掌握所以這個演算法到底是如何的運作我們也無從得知可是它已經造成媒體產製內容的矛盾那我想世界各國大概也有都面臨到這樣的困境那台灣在這樣的困境底下受到威脅我想是更加的危急\n\n01:56.451 --> 02:14.957\n前META全球公共政策總監他前陣子就有公開指控說META跟中國政府的密切聯繫有內容審查相關制度而台港的用戶的熱門內容就是受到審查的一部分那有內容審查\n\n02:18.668 --> 02:45.468\n我們媒體就是最怕說沒有流量那如果說發了一個讓中國不開心的新聞或貼文那有可能就導致被消失或限制流量等等那發了新聞必須躲東躲西喔那不僅影響那個新聞自由那我想中國也更可能藉這個手段來控制台灣的輿論在這個灰色地帶來侵蝕台灣的民主社會\n\n02:46.429 --> 03:00.583\n所以本席就想要問個直接的問題面對這種大型跨境的數位平台可能的內容審查那台灣要怎麼樣因應那上週蔡其昌委員質詢的時候他有速發布是說希望美國能強迫他們公開內容審核的機制\n\n03:07.210 --> 03:22.451\n那我想請教抒發部你是否有辦法在我國來促成審核機制的公開另外就是說促成審核機制公開後那抒發部的規劃要如何具體著手處理這些問題部長\n\n03:24.153 --> 03:40.182\n那個報告委員那個確實是剛剛講Meta這個因為這個有這樣的一個新聞我們很關注那我們也知道說事實上這個是在2017年以前那後來2019年Facebook就放棄了中國大陸的市場\n\n03:40.842 --> 03:57.021\n所以現在就是說如果中國對MetaFacebook有影響力我們還需要再關注那至於說現在這個因為這個美國公聽會現在在對這個議題在進行偵查所以我們當然持續跟Meta溝通我們也希望\n\n03:57.782 --> 04:22.626\n在這裡面他也要對我們公開所以我們這邊在同時進行就是我們同時看美國在這個公聽會的一個結果同時看台灣的這些目前的審查的方式他要對我們公開然後我們也會接受申訴然後看看怎麼樣再跟Meta那他就至少這個演算法怎麼樣的貼文要被下架必須要透明公開這個是我們會跟Meta去要求\n\n04:23.183 --> 04:40.161\n好那我想目前速發部它針對所謂的媒體議價法的態度看起來是支持新聞有價您剛也一直在強調可是對立的專法似乎好像就不那麼明朗那從上屆本席提出到現在也差不多兩個年\n\n04:41.562 --> 04:55.996\n那這部法的推行的過程我想最主要面臨到的困境您剛在那個口頭報告的時候也有稍微提及喔那如果說暫時推不成那我們到底有什麼樣的替代方案可以回應媒體界對這個法的期待\n\n04:57.998 --> 05:27.124\n什麼時候再找這些大型的平台業者媒體學者再次來討論同時也想請教NCC跟文化部你們認為媒體業低薪高工時的這種窘境有沒有辦法來扭轉還是可以再做些什麼樣的努力來提升基層媒體從業人員的薪資跟勞動條件先請速發部回應再請NCC或勞動部\n\n05:29.315 --> 05:31.106\n我們的那個策略我再請次長先補充說明\n\n05:33.432 --> 05:50.995\n目前我們在想辦法提升台灣媒體的收入我們是跟現在最配合的公司之一是GoogleGoogle他做了兩件事情第一個他是捐了三年三億台幣的基金現在交由DTA台灣數位產業計經濟協會由他們來讓這個基金然後想辦法來幫助我們\n\n05:58.837 --> 06:26.283\n台灣的那個媒體業就是改善他們的狀況另外就是說Google他們也成立一個所謂的北極星計畫就是要輔導各家媒體改為收費制因為現在大部分台灣媒體都是不收費的那美國的那個FinancialTimes因為他們的收費機制做得很好所以FinancialTimes他現在會在全世界幫各國的媒體做這個方面的就是轉為收費機制的輔導工作\n\n06:28.823 --> 06:45.737\n那所有這些費用會由那個Google來支付謝謝是那我再補充一下就是說其實除了這個以外還有技術面我們希望是說幫助媒體做數位轉型提供一些AI的工具這個能夠找到新的商業模式所以這個也是我們還在努力那其他問題是不是請\n\n06:48.038 --> 07:06.096\n通常會這邊跟委員補充報告兩點第一點NG所管的廣電媒體他們會有一些營運計畫我們要邀請他說營運計畫理由涉及到公司內部治理的一定要相關的法律事項相關法規比方說勞動的相關條件那些一定要符合法律事項這是第一點第二點補充是\n\n07:07.737 --> 07:20.227\n由於媒體競爭激烈包括網路媒體一般傳統媒體我們希望他在流財引財方面要有吸引力說必須要請他們要行政次長他們這方面要特別要提升他們的一些待遇以上\n\n07:21.138 --> 07:46.480\n好那除了前述我們提到的這個媒體業勞動條件需要提升以外本席認為其實相關的部會我們都要去追蹤了解就是新聞媒體的創作跟轉型創新跟轉型我們看到數位經濟暨這個產業發展協會與Google有達成協議喔就是說要協助Google管理並執行這個台灣新聞數位共融基金的計畫\n\n07:47.381 --> 08:12.137\n那協助台灣新聞的媒體做創新跟轉型只是說要內容具原創性又具公益性的新聞媒體都可以適用那不過我想有一個疑問的地方是說那這個是一個短期的計畫那如何轉換成長期的機制那來回應說新聞內容產製的付出以及它應該要怎麼樣跟大的這個平台來斡旋合理\n\n08:13.859 --> 08:39.255\n來斡旋合理的方案那似乎這好像都還有待商榷那在這個同時我們應該要保障所謂的這個撰寫地方的新聞或促進那個媒體多元化以及這個服務特定社群的小型的媒體業者或大型的媒體公平的競爭的權利所以有關這個台灣新聞數位共同基金這個討論的運用以及小型媒體的保障那不曉得部長你怎麼看\n\n08:40.698 --> 08:45.026\n我們素材署跟Google有不斷的溝通我請素材署補充回答\n\n08:46.338 --> 09:11.943\n跟委員報告我們跟委員一樣關心這個的長期性所以我們跟Google來推出督促一下是不是將來永續性的一個做法不過Google說因為它這個三年還有一年多它需要觀察一下這個的成效雖然目前已經補助40個案子了但是它還要持續觀察這個成效再來決定下一步以上當然它有新的剛剛市長報告過的北基新的計畫對這個也是它會有新的其他的措施一直出來\n\n09:12.483 --> 09:40.240\n至於這個共榮基金他還要觀察這三年的執行的狀況以上好那最後30秒我想跟部長請教說有關於這個文本與資料探勘就是所謂的TDM的這個議題速發部要如何設計我國規範的架構簡單來講就是說TDM這個技術是巨量的資料的蒐集為基礎那將這些資料進行擷取重置或編譯然後\n\n09:42.853 --> 10:07.311\n變成可進行開採分析的資料庫來便於這個分析利用那我想在這個人工智慧的應用上是個普遍的應用可是TDM的過程也牽涉到著作權侵害的這個疑慮所以很多國家其實都嘗試著TDM的相關法規的調適那一方面也放寬TDM技術應用的這個限制二方面我們也要著重\n\n10:07.931 --> 10:29.307\n註作權人的權益所以像歐盟的數位單一市場註作權指令的修改這樣他就為了註作權法設計了例外規定那請教部長說那我們組長AI監管的訴發部要怎麼樣跟經濟部制裁局來溝通來因應TDM技術的發展那目前不曉得我們\n\n10:29.907 --> 10:56.347\n市長的規劃報告委員我們是在進行那這個因為我們資料創新室就是在處理這個這個資料分享的議題我請那個市長說好委員好有關於這個TDM的這件事情因為我們在做這個AI訓練語要的時候呢涉及如果說這個著作權保護的這個議題的如果機器訓練的時候需要拿到這些資料來訓練的話那就涉及這個\n\n10:57.731 --> 11:15.061\n助索權重置的問題但是為了解決這個問題以及現在尚未立法所以我們這個速發部就訂定了一個台灣主權A壓訓練語料授權條款第一版那這個版本呢還要跟這個制裁局一起來協調內容之後我們就會釋出讓各界來運用喔好好時間關係謝謝謝謝主席\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.29,"end":3.037,"text":"謝謝主席 有請黃部長 蘇發部黃部長蘇發部我們黃部長"},{"start":9.984,"end":29.261,"text":"黃部長好我想健全的新聞報導環境有助於民主社會的發展這是之前速發部召集大型跨境數位平台與新聞業對話會議中那數位平台跟新聞媒體業者都認為的具體共識"},{"start":30.262,"end":45.36,"text":"那我想健全的新聞報導媒體要怎麼塑造那本席認為最重要的就是要保障新聞的自由跟基層的媒體從業人員的權益那本席上一屆跟這一屆我們都有提出喔"},{"start":45.64,"end":63.55,"text":"就是所謂的數位新聞發展與民主任性法草案那這個草案我們期盼透過新聞有價的這個基本價值來提振台灣的這個媒體環境那本席之前有提過新聞媒體面對的三大困境第一個"},{"start":64.711,"end":90.599,"text":"新聞依賴這個網路平台導引流量而網路的流量又受到大型的跨國數位平台的載制第二個困境是新聞產製的方式受到跨國平台的制約所以它報導的內容 標題會受到演算法被牽著鼻子走導致有很多大家所詬病的內容農場啊 調標這種亂象"},{"start":93.86,"end":114.976,"text":"那第三演算法也被大型的跨國平台掌握所以這個演算法到底是如何的運作我們也無從得知可是它已經造成媒體產製內容的矛盾那我想世界各國大概也有都面臨到這樣的困境那台灣在這樣的困境底下受到威脅我想是更加的危急"},{"start":116.451,"end":134.957,"text":"前META全球公共政策總監他前陣子就有公開指控說META跟中國政府的密切聯繫有內容審查相關制度而台港的用戶的熱門內容就是受到審查的一部分那有內容審查"},{"start":138.668,"end":165.468,"text":"我們媒體就是最怕說沒有流量那如果說發了一個讓中國不開心的新聞或貼文那有可能就導致被消失或限制流量等等那發了新聞必須躲東躲西喔那不僅影響那個新聞自由那我想中國也更可能藉這個手段來控制台灣的輿論在這個灰色地帶來侵蝕台灣的民主社會"},{"start":166.429,"end":180.583,"text":"所以本席就想要問個直接的問題面對這種大型跨境的數位平台可能的內容審查那台灣要怎麼樣因應那上週蔡其昌委員質詢的時候他有速發布是說希望美國能強迫他們公開內容審核的機制"},{"start":187.21,"end":202.451,"text":"那我想請教抒發部你是否有辦法在我國來促成審核機制的公開另外就是說促成審核機制公開後那抒發部的規劃要如何具體著手處理這些問題 部長"},{"start":204.153,"end":220.182,"text":"那個報告委員那個確實是剛剛講Meta這個因為這個有這樣的一個新聞我們很關注那我們也知道說事實上這個是在2017年以前那後來2019年Facebook就放棄了中國大陸的市場"},{"start":220.842,"end":237.021,"text":"所以現在就是說如果中國對Meta Facebook有影響力我們還需要再關注那至於說現在這個因為這個美國公聽會現在在對這個議題在進行偵查所以我們當然持續跟Meta溝通我們也希望"},{"start":237.782,"end":262.626,"text":"在這裡面他也要對我們公開所以我們這邊在同時進行就是我們同時看美國在這個公聽會的一個結果同時看台灣的這些目前的審查的方式他要對我們公開然後我們也會接受申訴然後看看怎麼樣再跟Meta那他就至少這個演算法怎麼樣的貼文要被下架必須要透明公開這個是我們會跟Meta去要求"},{"start":263.183,"end":280.161,"text":"好 那我想目前速發部它針對所謂的媒體議價法的態度看起來是支持新聞有價您剛也一直在強調可是對立的專法似乎好像就不那麼明朗那從上屆本席提出到現在也差不多兩個年"},{"start":281.562,"end":295.996,"text":"那這部法的推行的過程我想最主要面臨到的困境您剛在那個口頭報告的時候也有稍微提及喔那如果說暫時推不成那我們到底有什麼樣的替代方案可以回應媒體界對這個法的期待"},{"start":297.998,"end":327.124,"text":"什麼時候再找這些大型的平台業者媒體學者再次來討論同時也想請教NCC跟文化部你們認為媒體業低薪高工時的這種窘境有沒有辦法來扭轉還是可以再做些什麼樣的努力來提升基層媒體從業人員的薪資跟勞動條件先請速發部回應再請NCC或勞動部"},{"start":329.315,"end":331.106,"text":"我們的那個策略我再請次長先補充說明"},{"start":333.432,"end":350.995,"text":"目前我們在想辦法提升台灣媒體的收入我們是跟現在最配合的公司之一是GoogleGoogle他做了兩件事情第一個他是捐了三年三億台幣的基金現在交由DTA台灣數位產業計經濟協會由他們來讓這個基金然後想辦法來幫助我們"},{"start":358.837,"end":386.283,"text":"台灣的那個媒體業就是改善他們的狀況另外就是說Google他們也成立一個所謂的北極星計畫就是要輔導各家媒體改為收費制因為現在大部分台灣媒體都是不收費的那美國的那個Financial Times因為他們的收費機制做得很好所以Financial Times他現在會在全世界幫各國的媒體做這個方面的就是轉為收費機制的輔導工作"},{"start":388.823,"end":405.737,"text":"那所有這些費用會由那個Google來支付謝謝是那我再補充一下就是說其實除了這個以外還有技術面我們希望是說幫助媒體做數位轉型提供一些AI的工具這個能夠找到新的商業模式所以這個也是我們還在努力那其他問題是不是請"},{"start":408.038,"end":426.096,"text":"通常會這邊跟委員補充報告兩點第一點NG所管的廣電媒體他們會有一些營運計畫我們要邀請他說營運計畫理由涉及到公司內部治理的一定要相關的法律事項相關法規比方說勞動的相關條件那些一定要符合法律事項這是第一點第二點補充是"},{"start":427.737,"end":440.227,"text":"由於媒體競爭激烈包括網路媒體一般傳統媒體我們希望他在流財引財方面要有吸引力說必須要請他們要行政次長他們這方面要特別要提升他們的一些待遇以上"},{"start":441.138,"end":466.48,"text":"好 那除了前述我們提到的這個媒體業勞動條件需要提升以外本席認為其實相關的部會我們都要去追蹤了解就是新聞媒體的創作跟轉型創新跟轉型我們看到數位經濟暨這個產業發展協會與Google有達成協議喔就是說要協助Google管理並執行這個台灣新聞數位共融基金的計畫"},{"start":467.381,"end":492.137,"text":"那協助台灣新聞的媒體做創新跟轉型只是說要內容具原創性又具公益性的新聞媒體都可以適用那不過我想有一個疑問的地方是說那這個是一個短期的計畫那如何轉換成長期的機制那來回應說新聞內容產製的付出以及它應該要怎麼樣跟大的這個平台來斡旋合理"},{"start":493.859,"end":519.255,"text":"來斡旋合理的方案那似乎這好像都還有待商榷那在這個同時我們應該要保障所謂的這個撰寫地方的新聞或促進那個媒體多元化以及這個服務特定社群的小型的媒體業者或大型的媒體公平的競爭的權利所以有關這個台灣新聞數位共同基金這個討論的運用以及小型媒體的保障那不曉得部長你怎麼看"},{"start":520.698,"end":525.026,"text":"我們素材署跟Google有不斷的溝通我請素材署補充回答"},{"start":526.338,"end":551.943,"text":"跟委員報告 我們跟委員一樣關心這個的長期性所以我們跟Google來推出 督促一下是不是將來永續性的一個做法不過Google說因為它這個三年還有一年多它需要觀察一下這個的成效雖然目前已經補助40個案子了但是它還要持續觀察這個成效再來決定下一步 以上當然它有新的 剛剛市長報告過的北基新的計畫對 這個也是它會有新的其他的措施一直出來"},{"start":552.483,"end":580.24,"text":"至於這個共榮基金他還要觀察這三年的執行的狀況 以上好 那最後30秒我想跟部長請教說有關於這個文本與資料探勘就是所謂的TDM的這個議題速發部要如何設計我國規範的架構簡單來講就是說TDM這個技術是巨量的資料的蒐集為基礎那將這些資料進行擷取 重置或編譯 然後"},{"start":582.853,"end":607.311,"text":"變成可進行開採分析的資料庫來便於這個分析利用那我想在這個人工智慧的應用上是個普遍的應用可是TDM的過程也牽涉到著作權侵害的這個疑慮所以很多國家其實都嘗試著TDM的相關法規的調適那一方面也放寬TDM技術應用的這個限制二方面我們也要著重"},{"start":607.931,"end":629.307,"text":"註作權人的權益所以像歐盟的數位單一市場註作權指令的修改這樣他就為了註作權法設計了例外規定那請教部長說那我們組長AI監管的訴發部要怎麼樣跟經濟部制裁局來溝通來因應TDM技術的發展那目前不曉得我們"},{"start":629.907,"end":656.347,"text":"市長的規劃 報告委員我們是在進行那這個因為我們資料創新室就是在處理這個這個資料分享的議題我請那個市長說好委員好有關於這個TDM的這件事情因為我們在做這個AI訓練語要的時候呢涉及如果說這個著作權保護的這個議題的如果機器訓練的時候需要拿到這些資料來訓練的話那就涉及這個"},{"start":657.731,"end":675.061,"text":"助索權重置的問題但是為了解決這個問題以及現在尚未立法所以我們這個速發部就訂定了一個台灣主權A壓訓練語料授權條款第一版那這個版本呢還要跟這個制裁局一起來協調內容之後我們就會釋出讓各界來運用喔好好時間關係謝謝謝謝主席"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":305,"blocks":[["林委員宜瑾：（9時40分）謝謝主席，有請數發部黃部長。"],["主席：好，數發部黃部長。"],["黃部長彥男：委員好。"],["林委員宜瑾：黃部長好。我想健全的新聞報導環境有助於民主社會的發展，這是之前數發部召集大型跨境數位平臺與新聞業的對話會議中，數位平臺與新聞媒體業者都認為的具體共識，而健全的新聞報導，媒體要怎麼塑造？本席認為最重要的就是要保障新聞的自由以及基層媒體從業人員的權益。本席上一屆跟這一屆都有提出，就是所謂的「數位新聞發展與民主韌性法草案」，這個草案我們期盼透過新聞有價的基本價值來提振臺灣的媒體環境。","本席之前有提過新聞媒體面對了三大困境，第一個，新聞依賴網路平臺導引流量，而網路的流量又受到大型跨國數位平臺的宰制。第二個困境是新聞產製的方式受到跨國平臺的制約，所以報導的內容、標題會被演算法牽著鼻子走，導致有很多大家所詬病的內容農場、釣魚式的標題這種亂象。第三，演算法也被大型的跨國平臺掌握，這個演算法到底是如何運作我們也無從得知，可是它已經造成媒體產製內容的矛盾。我想世界各國大概也都面臨到這樣的困境，臺灣在這樣的困境底下受到的威脅我想是更加危急，前Meta全球公共政策總監前陣子就有公開指控，說Meta跟中國政府密切聯繫，有內容審查相關制度，而臺、港用戶的熱門內容就是受到審查的一部分，有內容審查，媒體最怕的就是沒有流量，如果發了一個讓中國不開心的新聞或貼文，就有可能導致被消失或限制流量等等，發了新聞必須躲東躲西，不僅影響新聞自由，中國也更可能藉這個手段來控制臺灣的輿論，在這個灰色地帶侵蝕臺灣的民主社會。","所以本席想要問一個直接的問題，面對這種大型跨境數位平臺可能的內容審查，臺灣要怎麼樣因應？上週蔡其昌委員質詢的時候，數發部是說希望美國能強迫他們公開內容審核的機制。我想請教數發部，你是否有辦法在我國促成審核機制的公開？另外就是，促成審核機制公開後，數發部規劃要如何具體著手處理這些問題？部長。"],["黃部長彥男：報告委員，剛剛提到因為Meta有這樣的新聞，我們很關注，我們也知道事實上這個是在2017年以前，後來2019年Facebook就放棄了中國大陸的市場，所以現在就是說如果中國對Meta、Facebook有影響力，我們還需要再關注。至於現在，因為美國公聽會現在在對這個議題進行偵查，所以我們當然持續跟Meta溝通，我們也希望在這裡面它也要對我們公開，所以我們這邊在同時進行的就是，我們同時看美國在這個公聽會的結果，同時它也要對臺灣公開目前的審查方式，並且我們也會接受申訴，看看怎麼樣再跟Meta……至少有關這個演算法是什麼樣的貼文要被下架，這部分必須要透明公開，這是我們會跟Meta去要求的。"],["林委員宜瑾：目前數發部針對所謂媒體議價法的態度看起來是支持新聞有價，您剛剛也一直在強調，可是對於立專法似乎好像就不那麼明朗。"],["黃部長彥男：對。"],["林委員宜瑾：從上屆本席提出到現在也差不多兩年，這部法在推行過程中最主要面臨到的困境，您剛剛在口頭報告的時候也有稍微提及。好，如果暫時推不成，我們到底有什麼樣的替代方案可以回應媒體界對這個法的期待？什麼時候再找這些大型的平臺業者、媒體、學者再次來討論？同時也想請教NCC跟文化部，你們認為媒體業低薪、高工時的這種窘境有沒有辦法扭轉？可以再做些什麼樣的努力來提升基層媒體從業人員的薪資跟勞動條件？先請數發部回應，然後再請NCC或勞動部。"],["黃部長彥男：有關我們的策略，我請次長先補充說明。"],["林次長宜敬：目前我們在想辦法提升臺灣媒體的收入，現在最配合的公司之一是Google，Google做了兩件事情，第一個是它捐了3年3億臺幣的基金，現在交由DTA（社團法人數位經濟暨產業發展協會），由它們run這個基金，然後想辦法來幫助我們臺灣的媒體業，就是改善他們的狀況。另外就是Google也成立一個所謂的北極星計畫，就是要輔導各家媒體改為收費制，因為現在大部分臺灣媒體都是不收費的，美國的Financial Times的收費機制做得很好，所以Financial Times現在會在全世界幫各國媒體做轉為收費機制的輔導工作，所有這些費用會由Google來支付。謝謝。"],["黃部長彥男：我再補充一下，其實除了這個以外，還有技術面，我們希望幫助媒體做數位轉型，提供一些AI的工具，希望能夠找到新的商業模式，這個也是我們還在努力的。至於其他問題，就請其他單位說明。"],["陳代理主任委員崇樹：通傳會跟委員補充報告兩點，第一點，我們NCC所管的廣電媒體會有一些營運計畫，我們也要求如果營運計畫涉及到公司內部治理的相關法遵事項、相關法規，比方說勞動的相關條件等一定要符合法遵事項，這是第一點。第二點補充，由於媒體競爭激烈，包括網路媒體、一般傳統媒體，我們希望在留才、引才方面要有吸引力，所以要行政指導他們，在這方面特別要提升他們的待遇。以上。"],["林委員宜瑾：好，除了前述我們提到的媒體業勞動條件需要提升以外，本席認為相關的部會都要去追蹤了解，就是新聞媒體的創新跟轉型。我們看到數位經濟暨產業發展協會與Google有達成協議，就是要協助Google管理並執行「台灣新聞數位共榮基金」的計畫，協助臺灣新聞的媒體做創新跟轉型，只要是內容具原創性又具公益性的新聞媒體都可以適用。不過我有疑問的地方是說，這是一個短期的計畫，如何轉換成長期的機制來回應新聞內容產製的付出，以及應該要怎麼樣跟大的平臺來斡旋合理的方案，這似乎好像都還有待商榷。在這個同時，我們應該要保障所謂撰寫地方新聞或促進媒體多元化及服務特定社群的小型媒體業者與大型媒體公平競爭的權利，所以有關台灣新聞數位共榮基金的討論、運用以及小型媒體的保障，不曉得部長怎麼看？"],["黃部長彥男：有關這個部分，因為我們數產署跟Google有不斷的溝通協調，我請數產署補充回答。"],["林署長俊秀：跟委員報告，我們跟委員一樣關心這個的長期性，所以我們跟Google來溝通是不是以此作為將來永續性的一個作法。不過Google表示，這個三年的部分還有一年多，它希望觀察一下這個的成效，雖然目前已經補助40個案子了，但是它還要持續觀察成效後再來決定下一步。當然，它也有新的，剛剛次長報告過的北極星計畫，也就是它會有新的其他措施一直出來。至於這個共榮基金，它還要觀察這三年的執行狀況。以上。"],["林委員宜瑾：最後30秒，我想跟部長請教有關於文字與資料探勘，就是所謂的TDM這個議題，數發部要如何設計我國規範的架構？簡單來講就是說，TDM這個技術是以巨量資料的蒐集為基礎，將這些資料進行擷取、重製或編譯成可進行開採分析的資料庫，以便於分析利用。我想在人工智慧應用上是一個普遍的應用，可是TDM的過程也牽涉到著作權侵害的疑慮，所以很多國家其實都嘗試著去做TDM相關法規的調適，一方面要放寬TDM技術應用的限制，二方面也要著重著作權人的權益，像歐盟的數位化單一市場著作權指令的修改就為了著作權法設計了例外規定。請教部長，我們主掌AI監管的數發部要怎麼樣跟經濟部智財局溝通來因應TDM技術的發展？目前不曉得我們有怎麼樣的規劃？"],["黃部長彥男：報告委員，我們是有在進行，我們的資料創新司就是在處理資料共享的議題，我請司長來說明。"],["林委員宜瑾：好。"],["莊司長明芬：委員好。有關於TDM的這件事情，因為我們在做AI訓練語料的時候，涉及著作權保護的議題部分，如果機器訓練的時候需要拿這些資料來訓練的話，當然就涉及到著作權重製的問題，但是為了解決這個問題，因為現在尚未立法，所以我們數發部就訂定了一個臺灣主權AI訓練語料授權條款第一版，這個版本還要跟智財局一起協調內容，確定之後就會釋出讓各界來運用。"],["林委員宜瑾：好，因為時間關係，謝謝。謝謝主席。"],["主席：謝謝林宜瑾召委。","現在請伍麗華委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":148,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-3-23,22-1","speakers":["林國成","王鴻薇","張啓楷","洪孟楷","林宜瑾","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","葛如鈞","范雲","林俊憲","蔡其昌","許智傑","郭昱晴","徐富癸","李昆澤","何欣純","陳素月","邱若華","廖先翔","魯明哲","陳培瑜","黃國昌","楊瓊瓔","羅廷瑋","吳沛憶","葉元之","游顥","林楚茵","蔡易餘","張雅琳","柯志恩","萬美玲","黃健豪","劉書彬","翁曉玲"],"page_start":61,"meetingDate":["2025-05-01"],"gazette_id":"1144501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144501_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期交通、教育及文化委員會第1次聯席會議紀錄","content":"一、審查委員林楚茵等17人擬具「新聞媒體與數位平台議價法草案」案；二、審查委員羅廷瑋等\n16人擬具「新聞媒體與數位平臺強制議價法草案」案；三、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具「新聞媒\n體與數位平臺強制議價法草案」案；四、審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「新聞媒體與數位科技平台公\n平發展法草案」案；五、審查委員林宜瑾等21 人擬具「數位新聞發展與民主韌性法草案」案；\n六、審查委員范雲等21人擬具「數位新聞發展與民主韌性法草案」案【僅進行詢答】","agenda_id":"1144501_00002"}}}