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\"沒\", \"start\": 560.079, \"end\": 560.179, \"score\": 0.64}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 560.179, \"end\": 560.26, \"score\": 0.746}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"討\"}, {\"word\": \"論\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 560.26, \"end\": 560.28, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:01,331 --> 00:00:13,706\n謝謝張偉謝謝主席我們有請速發部黃彥南部長好黃部長部長好資料資料資料\n\n2\n00:00:15,458 --> 00:00:42,937\n沒有資料我們可能就沒有文化沒有主權也不會有AI那我們現在又面臨了這個美國中國他們也持續的在發展那我們現在談到這個媒體溢價法的時候其實我們也看到了速發部的報告裡面很清楚寫了倘若我國未來實施類似媒體溢價法不排除美國採取關稅報復措施其實剛剛的質詢你也提到\n\n3\n00:00:43,777 --> 00:01:08,945\n那我們也可以看到川普當時拿出這個小板板上面有台灣這個64%其實底下有一行小字啦就說這個非關稅壁壘包含在內所以如果我們這個媒體溢價法放進去很顯然的非關稅壁壘對美國來說就是提高的我想請教一下部長關於這件事情還有這個媒體溢價法可能造成的風險有沒有跟我們的關稅談判的團隊來同步過\n\n4\n00:01:12,657 --> 00:01:31,490\n那個報告委員我們現在是我們會有做這樣判斷是根據美國對澳洲跟加拿大事實上也有談判過所以我們是根據這樣判斷然後這個市長有去談判斷關稅談判的團隊知不知道知道\n\n5\n00:01:32,711 --> 00:01:54,446\n是報告過了有報告過了我想這個訊息很重要大家要同步一下那我想速發部這裡在這個部分也做了很多功課也非常感謝也希望我們的政府各部會也都非常清楚那另外我們也看到中國大陸現在發展AI它因為它的政治體制非常特殊所以它可以無所不用其極地取得各種資料\n\n6\n00:01:55,026 --> 00:02:23,455\n那台灣在發展AI的時候呢因為台灣的著作權法可以說是舉世嚴格啦這個甚至還有刑法的罰則所以導致呢我們台灣的大語言模型的團隊在訓練的時候資料不足那當然我們知道資料是有價的可是現在就卡在這裡嘛人家有很多資料啊他可以拼命的訓練啊越多資料的AI可能就越聰明那台灣如果沒有資料已經不夠了我們又用了這樣子的一個媒體溢價法\n\n7\n00:02:24,375 --> 00:02:43,341\n當然我們還是認為資料有價可是我們如果卡在這裡不能進也不能退會不會造成我們的AI沒有辦法往前進所以我一直在行政院的院會質詢當中我都不斷的請教各個部會那現在書發部也是這塊的專業你們讚不讚成由行政院\n\n8\n00:02:44,221 --> 00:03:02,631\n可能其中的部會甚至也許就是速發部來建立國家層級的AI訓練資料庫來提供AI訓練所需要的這些資料當然也提供誘因因為其實媒體提供的這些新聞內容說不定也可以放進來做這個資料庫的一部分\n\n9\n00:03:03,791 --> 00:03:22,628\n這個部分有沒有可能來支持一下報告委員這個方向跟我想這個是沒有錯啦因為在AI的發展一定需要資料那台灣我們所謂的主權AI我們必須要有自己的資料所以我們在蘇發部資料創新師對這個議題有嚴定的一些條例跟一些方法我是不是請那個市長來這邊做個說明\n\n10\n00:03:25,372 --> 00:03:40,209\n報告委員就是有關於AI語料庫的訓練我們的做法是這樣子在過去我來講其實政府已經有5萬多筆的開放資料只要是標準授權的資料都可以讓各界來做運用包括語料的訓練當然大家可能會覺得說我們現在訓練的資料必須要是語譯連貫的自然語彙的方式\n\n11\n00:03:45,615 --> 00:04:03,988\n所以這個大量這些文本的政治家可能是涉及著作權的保護的議題那我們國家的著作權目前沒有對這個AI訓練語調做一個額外的一個條例的一個這樣子的一個修改但是在此之前我們也不會就是坐著等我們現在就是訂定了一個就是台灣主權AI訓練語調庫的授權條款那這個授權條款我們會再跟那個制裁局一起研議之後如果這個妥適性可以的話我們就會對外來公佈什麼時候會有結果預計時間表\n\n12\n00:04:14,815 --> 00:04:40,572\n我們在五月初的時候就會找制裁局先來學者大家先來研議那如果合理的話我們就可以把這樣子的一個授權條款釋出希望加速啦但因為這個資料庫也需要誘因那部長其實你也很了解區塊鏈的技術如何保存如何加解密如何做這個所謂的剛剛也有提到像分潤這種機制我覺得像資料點子資料經濟的做法我們希望要有一個國家級的訓練資料庫這個可不可以請部長來研議一下\n\n13\n00:04:45,936 --> 00:05:08,389\n那當然我想速發部自己作為這個軟體還有數位產業的這個部會我想近期呢衛福部有委託工研院來進行一個平台的計畫那預算呢是高達上億啦這個去年大概是4億今年可能還會追加2點多億那但是呢發生了有這個挪用美國的這個開源軟體來做修改\n\n14\n00:05:08,849 --> 00:05:23,918\n但沒有清楚標示的這個狀況所以我們還是想要來請教一下速發部有沒有掌握部會在這個採購案上面對於開源條文的落實的情況這個速發部有沒有做一個全面的盤點跟理解\n\n15\n00:05:24,358 --> 00:05:53,433\n否則我們的政府部會這個很高的預算左手發給右手結果呢是用開源的軟體比例根本就不清楚也不知道怎麼查核這一塊有沒有在進行委員講得沒錯開源軟體現在是一個使用開源軟體是一個趨勢那怎麼去做規範我是不是請那個蘇貞淑跟委員報告我們有一個政府軟體採購的共同供應契約我們會講Expo那有沒有推到各個部會對那個是我們幫各個部會去訂約的那他們有沒有一定要用\n\n16\n00:05:54,642 --> 00:06:20,900\n有没有看一下他们用的情况他们很多都有用好这个部分要持续了解不然的话为什么我们今天会不会出现这个状况那开源授权的教育跟合规的这个协助我们也希望抒发部可以来协助那我们个人是认为说政府应该要有一个开源办公室那抒发部有没有机会来考虑作为一个开源制度化的一个示范部门来成立一个开源办公室还是已经有了\n\n17\n00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:47,450\n我們請國際市他在這個開源方面有很多很多的過去的一些計畫跟努力請他做個市長做個說明是先跟委員報告一下感謝委員的支持那有關於開源由數位發展部來當零頭示範的部分跟委員報告的確我們目前在推動的數位評測品牆它整體就是走開源模式我們是希望透過這個方式來引導各部位在開源就是有非常多的效益的是\n\n18\n00:06:47,870 --> 00:07:00,437\n好謝謝這個開源數位皮夾專案我也有安裝你們也一直有說有開放程式碼但是開放程式碼跟開源其他人可以使用你們這次應該兩個都有公開程式碼跟開源都有\n\n19\n00:07:04,159 --> 00:07:18,553\n那我想作為一個示範我覺得很重要那其實我也非常支持速發部在推動的這個公共城市的平台但是其他部會在做公共的城市的時候好像沒有串聯的很好因為像衛福部跟公研院委託的這個專案他們有用到開源的軟體\n\n20\n00:07:19,614 --> 00:07:34,620\n可是卻在上面沒有辦法查得出來我希望書發部能不能有這樣的一個公共城市的平台跟其他的部會可以更積極的協調有相關運用到開源碼的專案就應該要在這裡可以查詢得到這個機制能不能再深化一下\n\n21\n00:07:36,036 --> 00:07:58,076\n是跟委員報告這個開園的整個政策我們在去年其實在全台各地都有召開相關的說明會那我們也積極鼓勵各個部會能夠參與整個開園的推動那這個部分我們數位發展部也正在擬定相關看有沒有一些相關的行政的指引能夠協助各個部會推動以上說明\n\n22\n00:07:58,456 --> 00:08:16,645\n所以我想希望這個速發部我們是不是一起來爭取一下從行政院的陳傑也好還是速發部也好我們來成立一個開源的辦公室這個是人工智慧學校基金會的秘書長也是很多人的共同朋友他所貼出來的就是這很可能不是一個個案現在政府內部很可能有一大堆的專案左手發給右手\n\n23\n00:08:17,805 --> 00:08:44,523\n右手挪用開源的軟體卻沒有清楚的標示跟這個左右手互相領錢左右手互相查核其實現在有一些工具可以來查核到底有沒有使用開源的程式碼其實速發部在這個部分可能有一些知識也可以來協助所以我們的具體訴求希望成立開源辦公室另外一個具體訴求我們也希望這個數位皮匣的專案可以大順利大成功那也希望能夠作為一個範本讓未來我們政府的這個專案publicmoney\n\n24\n00:08:48,846 --> 00:09:14,447\n公眾的錢我們納稅人出來的錢就不應該是被特定的單位挪用開源城市碼改了兩三行之後變成自己的這個所謂的公眾出資公共的城市我想也應該是符合速發部在推動的方向尤其最後一句話也是重點歐盟也在推動之外也說可以提高資安韌性因為城市碼可以公開審查與改進我想這應該是符合我們台灣中華民國發展的方向\n\n25\n00:09:14,887 --> 00:09:20,280\n所以我想抒發部還有相關的同仁是不是近期我們可以一起來針對這個再做更多的討論好這沒問題我們討論好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n1331\t13706\t謝謝張偉 謝謝主席我們有請速發部黃彥南部長好 黃部長部長好資料 資料 資料\n15458\t42937\t沒有資料我們可能就沒有文化沒有主權也不會有AI那我們現在又面臨了這個美國中國他們也持續的在發展那我們現在談到這個媒體溢價法的時候其實我們也看到了速發部的報告裡面很清楚寫了倘若我國未來實施類似媒體溢價法不排除美國採取關稅報復措施其實剛剛的質詢你也提到\n43777\t68945\t那我們也可以看到川普當時拿出這個小板板上面有台灣這個64%其實底下有一行小字啦就說這個非關稅壁壘包含在內所以如果我們這個媒體溢價法放進去很顯然的非關稅壁壘對美國來說就是提高的我想請教一下部長關於這件事情還有這個媒體溢價法可能造成的風險有沒有跟我們的關稅談判的團隊來同步過\n72657\t91490\t那個報告委員我們現在是我們會有做這樣判斷是根據美國對澳洲跟加拿大事實上也有談判過所以我們是根據這樣判斷然後這個市長有去談判斷關稅談判的團隊知不知道知道\n92711\t114446\t是 報告過了有報告過了我想這個訊息很重要大家要同步一下那我想速發部這裡在這個部分也做了很多功課也非常感謝也希望我們的政府各部會也都非常清楚那另外我們也看到中國大陸現在發展AI它因為它的政治體制非常特殊所以它可以無所不用其極地取得各種資料\n115026\t143455\t那台灣在發展AI的時候呢因為台灣的著作權法可以說是舉世嚴格啦這個甚至還有刑法的罰則所以導致呢我們台灣的大語言模型的團隊在訓練的時候資料不足那當然我們知道資料是有價的可是現在就卡在這裡嘛人家有很多資料啊他可以拼命的訓練啊越多資料的AI可能就越聰明那台灣如果沒有資料已經不夠了我們又用了這樣子的一個媒體溢價法\n144375\t163341\t當然我們還是認為資料有價可是我們如果卡在這裡不能進也不能退會不會造成我們的AI沒有辦法往前進所以我一直在行政院的院會質詢當中我都不斷的請教各個部會那現在書發部也是這塊的專業你們讚不讚成由行政院\n164221\t182631\t可能其中的部會甚至也許就是速發部來建立國家層級的AI訓練資料庫來提供AI訓練所需要的這些資料當然也提供誘因因為其實媒體提供的這些新聞內容說不定也可以放進來做這個資料庫的一部分\n183791\t202628\t這個部分有沒有可能來支持一下報告委員這個方向跟我想這個是沒有錯啦因為在AI的發展一定需要資料那台灣我們所謂的主權AI我們必須要有自己的資料所以我們在蘇發部資料創新師對這個議題有嚴定的一些條例跟一些方法我是不是請那個市長來這邊做個說明\n205372\t220209\t報告委員就是有關於AI語料庫的訓練我們的做法是這樣子在過去我來講其實政府已經有5萬多筆的開放資料只要是標準授權的資料都可以讓各界來做運用包括語料的訓練當然大家可能會覺得說我們現在訓練的資料必須要是語譯連貫的自然語彙的方式\n225615\t243988\t所以這個大量這些文本的政治家可能是涉及著作權的保護的議題那我們國家的著作權目前沒有對這個AI訓練語調做一個額外的一個條例的一個這樣子的一個修改但是在此之前我們也不會就是坐著等我們現在就是訂定了一個就是台灣主權AI訓練語調庫的授權條款那這個授權條款我們會再跟那個制裁局一起研議之後如果這個妥適性可以的話我們就會對外來公佈什麼時候會有結果預計時間表\n254815\t280572\t我們在五月初的時候就會找制裁局先來學者大家先來研議那如果合理的話我們就可以把這樣子的一個授權條款釋出希望加速啦但因為這個資料庫也需要誘因那部長其實你也很了解區塊鏈的技術如何保存如何加解密如何做這個所謂的剛剛也有提到像分潤這種機制我覺得像資料點子資料經濟的做法我們希望要有一個國家級的訓練資料庫這個可不可以請部長來研議一下\n285936\t308389\t那當然我想速發部自己作為這個軟體還有數位產業的這個部會我想近期呢衛福部有委託工研院來進行一個平台的計畫那預算呢是高達上億啦這個去年大概是4億今年可能還會追加2點多億那但是呢發生了有這個挪用美國的這個開源軟體來做修改\n308849\t323918\t但沒有清楚標示的這個狀況所以我們還是想要來請教一下速發部有沒有掌握部會在這個採購案上面對於開源條文的落實的情況這個速發部有沒有做一個全面的盤點跟理解\n324358\t353433\t否則我們的政府部會這個很高的預算左手發給右手結果呢是用開源的軟體比例根本就不清楚也不知道怎麼查核這一塊有沒有在進行委員講得沒錯開源軟體現在是一個使用開源軟體是一個趨勢那怎麼去做規範我是不是請那個蘇貞淑跟委員報告我們有一個政府軟體採購的共同供應契約我們會講Expo那有沒有推到各個部會對那個是我們幫各個部會去訂約的那他們有沒有一定要用\n354642\t380900\t有没有看一下他们用的情况他们很多都有用好 这个部分要持续了解不然的话为什么我们今天会不会出现这个状况那开源授权的教育跟合规的这个协助我们也希望抒发部可以来协助那我们个人是认为说政府应该要有一个开源办公室那抒发部有没有机会来考虑作为一个开源制度化的一个示范部门来成立一个开源办公室还是已经有了\n381360\t407450\t我們請國際市他在這個開源方面有很多很多的過去的一些計畫跟努力請他做個市長做個說明是先跟委員報告一下感謝委員的支持那有關於開源由數位發展部來當零頭示範的部分跟委員報告的確我們目前在推動的數位評測品牆它整體就是走開源模式我們是希望透過這個方式來引導各部位在開源就是有非常多的效益的是\n407870\t420437\t好 謝謝這個開源數位皮夾專案我也有安裝你們也一直有說有開放程式碼但是開放程式碼跟開源其他人可以使用你們這次應該兩個都有公開程式碼跟開源都有\n424159\t438553\t那我想作為一個示範我覺得很重要那其實我也非常支持速發部在推動的這個公共城市的平台但是其他部會在做公共的城市的時候好像沒有串聯的很好因為像衛福部跟公研院委託的這個專案他們有用到開源的軟體\n439614\t454620\t可是卻在上面沒有辦法查得出來我希望書發部能不能有這樣的一個公共城市的平台跟其他的部會可以更積極的協調有相關運用到開源碼的專案就應該要在這裡可以查詢得到這個機制能不能再深化一下\n456036\t478076\t是 跟委員報告這個開園的整個政策我們在去年其實在全台各地都有召開相關的說明會那我們也積極鼓勵各個部會能夠參與整個開園的推動那這個部分我們數位發展部也正在擬定相關看有沒有一些相關的行政的指引能夠協助各個部會推動 以上說明\n478456\t496645\t所以我想希望這個速發部我們是不是一起來爭取一下從行政院的陳傑也好還是速發部也好我們來成立一個開源的辦公室這個是人工智慧學校基金會的秘書長也是很多人的共同朋友他所貼出來的就是這很可能不是一個個案現在政府內部很可能有一大堆的專案左手發給右手\n497805\t524523\t右手挪用開源的軟體卻沒有清楚的標示跟這個左右手互相領錢左右手互相查核其實現在有一些工具可以來查核到底有沒有使用開源的程式碼其實速發部在這個部分可能有一些知識也可以來協助所以我們的具體訴求希望成立開源辦公室另外一個具體訴求我們也希望這個數位皮匣的專案可以大順利大成功那也希望能夠作為一個範本讓未來我們政府的這個專案public money\n528846\t554447\t公眾的錢我們納稅人出來的錢就不應該是被特定的單位挪用開源城市碼改了兩三行之後變成自己的這個所謂的公眾出資公共的城市我想也應該是符合速發部在推動的方向尤其最後一句話也是重點歐盟也在推動之外也說可以提高資安韌性因為城市碼可以公開審查與改進我想這應該是符合我們台灣中華民國發展的方向\n554887\t560280\t所以我想抒發部還有相關的同仁是不是近期我們可以一起來針對這個再做更多的討論好這沒問題我們討論好謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝張偉 謝謝主席我們有請速發部黃彥南部長好 黃部長部長好資料 資料 資料\n沒有資料我們可能就沒有文化沒有主權也不會有AI那我們現在又面臨了這個美國中國他們也持續的在發展那我們現在談到這個媒體溢價法的時候其實我們也看到了速發部的報告裡面很清楚寫了倘若我國未來實施類似媒體溢價法不排除美國採取關稅報復措施其實剛剛的質詢你也提到\n那我們也可以看到川普當時拿出這個小板板上面有台灣這個64%其實底下有一行小字啦就說這個非關稅壁壘包含在內所以如果我們這個媒體溢價法放進去很顯然的非關稅壁壘對美國來說就是提高的我想請教一下部長關於這件事情還有這個媒體溢價法可能造成的風險有沒有跟我們的關稅談判的團隊來同步過\n那個報告委員我們現在是我們會有做這樣判斷是根據美國對澳洲跟加拿大事實上也有談判過所以我們是根據這樣判斷然後這個市長有去談判斷關稅談判的團隊知不知道知道\n是 報告過了有報告過了我想這個訊息很重要大家要同步一下那我想速發部這裡在這個部分也做了很多功課也非常感謝也希望我們的政府各部會也都非常清楚那另外我們也看到中國大陸現在發展AI它因為它的政治體制非常特殊所以它可以無所不用其極地取得各種資料\n那台灣在發展AI的時候呢因為台灣的著作權法可以說是舉世嚴格啦這個甚至還有刑法的罰則所以導致呢我們台灣的大語言模型的團隊在訓練的時候資料不足那當然我們知道資料是有價的可是現在就卡在這裡嘛人家有很多資料啊他可以拼命的訓練啊越多資料的AI可能就越聰明那台灣如果沒有資料已經不夠了我們又用了這樣子的一個媒體溢價法\n當然我們還是認為資料有價可是我們如果卡在這裡不能進也不能退會不會造成我們的AI沒有辦法往前進所以我一直在行政院的院會質詢當中我都不斷的請教各個部會那現在書發部也是這塊的專業你們讚不讚成由行政院\n可能其中的部會甚至也許就是速發部來建立國家層級的AI訓練資料庫來提供AI訓練所需要的這些資料當然也提供誘因因為其實媒體提供的這些新聞內容說不定也可以放進來做這個資料庫的一部分\n這個部分有沒有可能來支持一下報告委員這個方向跟我想這個是沒有錯啦因為在AI的發展一定需要資料那台灣我們所謂的主權AI我們必須要有自己的資料所以我們在蘇發部資料創新師對這個議題有嚴定的一些條例跟一些方法我是不是請那個市長來這邊做個說明\n報告委員就是有關於AI語料庫的訓練我們的做法是這樣子在過去我來講其實政府已經有5萬多筆的開放資料只要是標準授權的資料都可以讓各界來做運用包括語料的訓練當然大家可能會覺得說我們現在訓練的資料必須要是語譯連貫的自然語彙的方式\n所以這個大量這些文本的政治家可能是涉及著作權的保護的議題那我們國家的著作權目前沒有對這個AI訓練語調做一個額外的一個條例的一個這樣子的一個修改但是在此之前我們也不會就是坐著等我們現在就是訂定了一個就是台灣主權AI訓練語調庫的授權條款那這個授權條款我們會再跟那個制裁局一起研議之後如果這個妥適性可以的話我們就會對外來公佈什麼時候會有結果預計時間表\n我們在五月初的時候就會找制裁局先來學者大家先來研議那如果合理的話我們就可以把這樣子的一個授權條款釋出希望加速啦但因為這個資料庫也需要誘因那部長其實你也很了解區塊鏈的技術如何保存如何加解密如何做這個所謂的剛剛也有提到像分潤這種機制我覺得像資料點子資料經濟的做法我們希望要有一個國家級的訓練資料庫這個可不可以請部長來研議一下\n那當然我想速發部自己作為這個軟體還有數位產業的這個部會我想近期呢衛福部有委託工研院來進行一個平台的計畫那預算呢是高達上億啦這個去年大概是4億今年可能還會追加2點多億那但是呢發生了有這個挪用美國的這個開源軟體來做修改\n但沒有清楚標示的這個狀況所以我們還是想要來請教一下速發部有沒有掌握部會在這個採購案上面對於開源條文的落實的情況這個速發部有沒有做一個全面的盤點跟理解\n否則我們的政府部會這個很高的預算左手發給右手結果呢是用開源的軟體比例根本就不清楚也不知道怎麼查核這一塊有沒有在進行委員講得沒錯開源軟體現在是一個使用開源軟體是一個趨勢那怎麼去做規範我是不是請那個蘇貞淑跟委員報告我們有一個政府軟體採購的共同供應契約我們會講Expo那有沒有推到各個部會對那個是我們幫各個部會去訂約的那他們有沒有一定要用\n有没有看一下他们用的情况他们很多都有用好 这个部分要持续了解不然的话为什么我们今天会不会出现这个状况那开源授权的教育跟合规的这个协助我们也希望抒发部可以来协助那我们个人是认为说政府应该要有一个开源办公室那抒发部有没有机会来考虑作为一个开源制度化的一个示范部门来成立一个开源办公室还是已经有了\n我們請國際市他在這個開源方面有很多很多的過去的一些計畫跟努力請他做個市長做個說明是先跟委員報告一下感謝委員的支持那有關於開源由數位發展部來當零頭示範的部分跟委員報告的確我們目前在推動的數位評測品牆它整體就是走開源模式我們是希望透過這個方式來引導各部位在開源就是有非常多的效益的是\n好 謝謝這個開源數位皮夾專案我也有安裝你們也一直有說有開放程式碼但是開放程式碼跟開源其他人可以使用你們這次應該兩個都有公開程式碼跟開源都有\n那我想作為一個示範我覺得很重要那其實我也非常支持速發部在推動的這個公共城市的平台但是其他部會在做公共的城市的時候好像沒有串聯的很好因為像衛福部跟公研院委託的這個專案他們有用到開源的軟體\n可是卻在上面沒有辦法查得出來我希望書發部能不能有這樣的一個公共城市的平台跟其他的部會可以更積極的協調有相關運用到開源碼的專案就應該要在這裡可以查詢得到這個機制能不能再深化一下\n是 跟委員報告這個開園的整個政策我們在去年其實在全台各地都有召開相關的說明會那我們也積極鼓勵各個部會能夠參與整個開園的推動那這個部分我們數位發展部也正在擬定相關看有沒有一些相關的行政的指引能夠協助各個部會推動 以上說明\n所以我想希望這個速發部我們是不是一起來爭取一下從行政院的陳傑也好還是速發部也好我們來成立一個開源的辦公室這個是人工智慧學校基金會的秘書長也是很多人的共同朋友他所貼出來的就是這很可能不是一個個案現在政府內部很可能有一大堆的專案左手發給右手\n右手挪用開源的軟體卻沒有清楚的標示跟這個左右手互相領錢左右手互相查核其實現在有一些工具可以來查核到底有沒有使用開源的程式碼其實速發部在這個部分可能有一些知識也可以來協助所以我們的具體訴求希望成立開源辦公室另外一個具體訴求我們也希望這個數位皮匣的專案可以大順利大成功那也希望能夠作為一個範本讓未來我們政府的這個專案public money\n公眾的錢我們納稅人出來的錢就不應該是被特定的單位挪用開源城市碼改了兩三行之後變成自己的這個所謂的公眾出資公共的城市我想也應該是符合速發部在推動的方向尤其最後一句話也是重點歐盟也在推動之外也說可以提高資安韌性因為城市碼可以公開審查與改進我想這應該是符合我們台灣中華民國發展的方向\n所以我想抒發部還有相關的同仁是不是近期我們可以一起來針對這個再做更多的討論好這沒問題我們討論好謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:01.331 --> 00:13.706\n謝謝張偉謝謝主席我們有請速發部黃彥南部長好黃部長部長好資料資料資料\n\n00:15.458 --> 00:42.937\n沒有資料我們可能就沒有文化沒有主權也不會有AI那我們現在又面臨了這個美國中國他們也持續的在發展那我們現在談到這個媒體溢價法的時候其實我們也看到了速發部的報告裡面很清楚寫了倘若我國未來實施類似媒體溢價法不排除美國採取關稅報復措施其實剛剛的質詢你也提到\n\n00:43.777 --> 01:08.945\n那我們也可以看到川普當時拿出這個小板板上面有台灣這個64%其實底下有一行小字啦就說這個非關稅壁壘包含在內所以如果我們這個媒體溢價法放進去很顯然的非關稅壁壘對美國來說就是提高的我想請教一下部長關於這件事情還有這個媒體溢價法可能造成的風險有沒有跟我們的關稅談判的團隊來同步過\n\n01:12.657 --> 01:31.490\n那個報告委員我們現在是我們會有做這樣判斷是根據美國對澳洲跟加拿大事實上也有談判過所以我們是根據這樣判斷然後這個市長有去談判斷關稅談判的團隊知不知道知道\n\n01:32.711 --> 01:54.446\n是報告過了有報告過了我想這個訊息很重要大家要同步一下那我想速發部這裡在這個部分也做了很多功課也非常感謝也希望我們的政府各部會也都非常清楚那另外我們也看到中國大陸現在發展AI它因為它的政治體制非常特殊所以它可以無所不用其極地取得各種資料\n\n01:55.026 --> 02:23.455\n那台灣在發展AI的時候呢因為台灣的著作權法可以說是舉世嚴格啦這個甚至還有刑法的罰則所以導致呢我們台灣的大語言模型的團隊在訓練的時候資料不足那當然我們知道資料是有價的可是現在就卡在這裡嘛人家有很多資料啊他可以拼命的訓練啊越多資料的AI可能就越聰明那台灣如果沒有資料已經不夠了我們又用了這樣子的一個媒體溢價法\n\n02:24.375 --> 02:43.341\n當然我們還是認為資料有價可是我們如果卡在這裡不能進也不能退會不會造成我們的AI沒有辦法往前進所以我一直在行政院的院會質詢當中我都不斷的請教各個部會那現在書發部也是這塊的專業你們讚不讚成由行政院\n\n02:44.221 --> 03:02.631\n可能其中的部會甚至也許就是速發部來建立國家層級的AI訓練資料庫來提供AI訓練所需要的這些資料當然也提供誘因因為其實媒體提供的這些新聞內容說不定也可以放進來做這個資料庫的一部分\n\n03:03.791 --> 03:22.628\n這個部分有沒有可能來支持一下報告委員這個方向跟我想這個是沒有錯啦因為在AI的發展一定需要資料那台灣我們所謂的主權AI我們必須要有自己的資料所以我們在蘇發部資料創新師對這個議題有嚴定的一些條例跟一些方法我是不是請那個市長來這邊做個說明\n\n03:25.372 --> 03:40.209\n報告委員就是有關於AI語料庫的訓練我們的做法是這樣子在過去我來講其實政府已經有5萬多筆的開放資料只要是標準授權的資料都可以讓各界來做運用包括語料的訓練當然大家可能會覺得說我們現在訓練的資料必須要是語譯連貫的自然語彙的方式\n\n03:45.615 --> 04:03.988\n所以這個大量這些文本的政治家可能是涉及著作權的保護的議題那我們國家的著作權目前沒有對這個AI訓練語調做一個額外的一個條例的一個這樣子的一個修改但是在此之前我們也不會就是坐著等我們現在就是訂定了一個就是台灣主權AI訓練語調庫的授權條款那這個授權條款我們會再跟那個制裁局一起研議之後如果這個妥適性可以的話我們就會對外來公佈什麼時候會有結果預計時間表\n\n04:14.815 --> 04:40.572\n我們在五月初的時候就會找制裁局先來學者大家先來研議那如果合理的話我們就可以把這樣子的一個授權條款釋出希望加速啦但因為這個資料庫也需要誘因那部長其實你也很了解區塊鏈的技術如何保存如何加解密如何做這個所謂的剛剛也有提到像分潤這種機制我覺得像資料點子資料經濟的做法我們希望要有一個國家級的訓練資料庫這個可不可以請部長來研議一下\n\n04:45.936 --> 05:08.389\n那當然我想速發部自己作為這個軟體還有數位產業的這個部會我想近期呢衛福部有委託工研院來進行一個平台的計畫那預算呢是高達上億啦這個去年大概是4億今年可能還會追加2點多億那但是呢發生了有這個挪用美國的這個開源軟體來做修改\n\n05:08.849 --> 05:23.918\n但沒有清楚標示的這個狀況所以我們還是想要來請教一下速發部有沒有掌握部會在這個採購案上面對於開源條文的落實的情況這個速發部有沒有做一個全面的盤點跟理解\n\n05:24.358 --> 05:53.433\n否則我們的政府部會這個很高的預算左手發給右手結果呢是用開源的軟體比例根本就不清楚也不知道怎麼查核這一塊有沒有在進行委員講得沒錯開源軟體現在是一個使用開源軟體是一個趨勢那怎麼去做規範我是不是請那個蘇貞淑跟委員報告我們有一個政府軟體採購的共同供應契約我們會講Expo那有沒有推到各個部會對那個是我們幫各個部會去訂約的那他們有沒有一定要用\n\n05:54.642 --> 06:20.900\n有没有看一下他们用的情况他们很多都有用好这个部分要持续了解不然的话为什么我们今天会不会出现这个状况那开源授权的教育跟合规的这个协助我们也希望抒发部可以来协助那我们个人是认为说政府应该要有一个开源办公室那抒发部有没有机会来考虑作为一个开源制度化的一个示范部门来成立一个开源办公室还是已经有了\n\n06:21.360 --> 06:47.450\n我們請國際市他在這個開源方面有很多很多的過去的一些計畫跟努力請他做個市長做個說明是先跟委員報告一下感謝委員的支持那有關於開源由數位發展部來當零頭示範的部分跟委員報告的確我們目前在推動的數位評測品牆它整體就是走開源模式我們是希望透過這個方式來引導各部位在開源就是有非常多的效益的是\n\n06:47.870 --> 07:00.437\n好謝謝這個開源數位皮夾專案我也有安裝你們也一直有說有開放程式碼但是開放程式碼跟開源其他人可以使用你們這次應該兩個都有公開程式碼跟開源都有\n\n07:04.159 --> 07:18.553\n那我想作為一個示範我覺得很重要那其實我也非常支持速發部在推動的這個公共城市的平台但是其他部會在做公共的城市的時候好像沒有串聯的很好因為像衛福部跟公研院委託的這個專案他們有用到開源的軟體\n\n07:19.614 --> 07:34.620\n可是卻在上面沒有辦法查得出來我希望書發部能不能有這樣的一個公共城市的平台跟其他的部會可以更積極的協調有相關運用到開源碼的專案就應該要在這裡可以查詢得到這個機制能不能再深化一下\n\n07:36.036 --> 07:58.076\n是跟委員報告這個開園的整個政策我們在去年其實在全台各地都有召開相關的說明會那我們也積極鼓勵各個部會能夠參與整個開園的推動那這個部分我們數位發展部也正在擬定相關看有沒有一些相關的行政的指引能夠協助各個部會推動以上說明\n\n07:58.456 --> 08:16.645\n所以我想希望這個速發部我們是不是一起來爭取一下從行政院的陳傑也好還是速發部也好我們來成立一個開源的辦公室這個是人工智慧學校基金會的秘書長也是很多人的共同朋友他所貼出來的就是這很可能不是一個個案現在政府內部很可能有一大堆的專案左手發給右手\n\n08:17.805 --> 08:44.523\n右手挪用開源的軟體卻沒有清楚的標示跟這個左右手互相領錢左右手互相查核其實現在有一些工具可以來查核到底有沒有使用開源的程式碼其實速發部在這個部分可能有一些知識也可以來協助所以我們的具體訴求希望成立開源辦公室另外一個具體訴求我們也希望這個數位皮匣的專案可以大順利大成功那也希望能夠作為一個範本讓未來我們政府的這個專案publicmoney\n\n08:48.846 --> 09:14.447\n公眾的錢我們納稅人出來的錢就不應該是被特定的單位挪用開源城市碼改了兩三行之後變成自己的這個所謂的公眾出資公共的城市我想也應該是符合速發部在推動的方向尤其最後一句話也是重點歐盟也在推動之外也說可以提高資安韌性因為城市碼可以公開審查與改進我想這應該是符合我們台灣中華民國發展的方向\n\n09:14.887 --> 09:20.280\n所以我想抒發部還有相關的同仁是不是近期我們可以一起來針對這個再做更多的討論好這沒問題我們討論好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":1.331,"end":13.706,"text":"謝謝張偉 謝謝主席我們有請速發部黃彥南部長好 黃部長部長好資料 資料 資料"},{"start":15.458,"end":42.937,"text":"沒有資料我們可能就沒有文化沒有主權也不會有AI那我們現在又面臨了這個美國中國他們也持續的在發展那我們現在談到這個媒體溢價法的時候其實我們也看到了速發部的報告裡面很清楚寫了倘若我國未來實施類似媒體溢價法不排除美國採取關稅報復措施其實剛剛的質詢你也提到"},{"start":43.777,"end":68.945,"text":"那我們也可以看到川普當時拿出這個小板板上面有台灣這個64%其實底下有一行小字啦就說這個非關稅壁壘包含在內所以如果我們這個媒體溢價法放進去很顯然的非關稅壁壘對美國來說就是提高的我想請教一下部長關於這件事情還有這個媒體溢價法可能造成的風險有沒有跟我們的關稅談判的團隊來同步過"},{"start":72.657,"end":91.49,"text":"那個報告委員我們現在是我們會有做這樣判斷是根據美國對澳洲跟加拿大事實上也有談判過所以我們是根據這樣判斷然後這個市長有去談判斷關稅談判的團隊知不知道知道"},{"start":92.711,"end":114.446,"text":"是 報告過了有報告過了我想這個訊息很重要大家要同步一下那我想速發部這裡在這個部分也做了很多功課也非常感謝也希望我們的政府各部會也都非常清楚那另外我們也看到中國大陸現在發展AI它因為它的政治體制非常特殊所以它可以無所不用其極地取得各種資料"},{"start":115.026,"end":143.455,"text":"那台灣在發展AI的時候呢因為台灣的著作權法可以說是舉世嚴格啦這個甚至還有刑法的罰則所以導致呢我們台灣的大語言模型的團隊在訓練的時候資料不足那當然我們知道資料是有價的可是現在就卡在這裡嘛人家有很多資料啊他可以拼命的訓練啊越多資料的AI可能就越聰明那台灣如果沒有資料已經不夠了我們又用了這樣子的一個媒體溢價法"},{"start":144.375,"end":163.341,"text":"當然我們還是認為資料有價可是我們如果卡在這裡不能進也不能退會不會造成我們的AI沒有辦法往前進所以我一直在行政院的院會質詢當中我都不斷的請教各個部會那現在書發部也是這塊的專業你們讚不讚成由行政院"},{"start":164.221,"end":182.631,"text":"可能其中的部會甚至也許就是速發部來建立國家層級的AI訓練資料庫來提供AI訓練所需要的這些資料當然也提供誘因因為其實媒體提供的這些新聞內容說不定也可以放進來做這個資料庫的一部分"},{"start":183.791,"end":202.628,"text":"這個部分有沒有可能來支持一下報告委員這個方向跟我想這個是沒有錯啦因為在AI的發展一定需要資料那台灣我們所謂的主權AI我們必須要有自己的資料所以我們在蘇發部資料創新師對這個議題有嚴定的一些條例跟一些方法我是不是請那個市長來這邊做個說明"},{"start":205.372,"end":220.209,"text":"報告委員就是有關於AI語料庫的訓練我們的做法是這樣子在過去我來講其實政府已經有5萬多筆的開放資料只要是標準授權的資料都可以讓各界來做運用包括語料的訓練當然大家可能會覺得說我們現在訓練的資料必須要是語譯連貫的自然語彙的方式"},{"start":225.615,"end":243.988,"text":"所以這個大量這些文本的政治家可能是涉及著作權的保護的議題那我們國家的著作權目前沒有對這個AI訓練語調做一個額外的一個條例的一個這樣子的一個修改但是在此之前我們也不會就是坐著等我們現在就是訂定了一個就是台灣主權AI訓練語調庫的授權條款那這個授權條款我們會再跟那個制裁局一起研議之後如果這個妥適性可以的話我們就會對外來公佈什麼時候會有結果預計時間表"},{"start":254.815,"end":280.572,"text":"我們在五月初的時候就會找制裁局先來學者大家先來研議那如果合理的話我們就可以把這樣子的一個授權條款釋出希望加速啦但因為這個資料庫也需要誘因那部長其實你也很了解區塊鏈的技術如何保存如何加解密如何做這個所謂的剛剛也有提到像分潤這種機制我覺得像資料點子資料經濟的做法我們希望要有一個國家級的訓練資料庫這個可不可以請部長來研議一下"},{"start":285.936,"end":308.389,"text":"那當然我想速發部自己作為這個軟體還有數位產業的這個部會我想近期呢衛福部有委託工研院來進行一個平台的計畫那預算呢是高達上億啦這個去年大概是4億今年可能還會追加2點多億那但是呢發生了有這個挪用美國的這個開源軟體來做修改"},{"start":308.849,"end":323.918,"text":"但沒有清楚標示的這個狀況所以我們還是想要來請教一下速發部有沒有掌握部會在這個採購案上面對於開源條文的落實的情況這個速發部有沒有做一個全面的盤點跟理解"},{"start":324.358,"end":353.433,"text":"否則我們的政府部會這個很高的預算左手發給右手結果呢是用開源的軟體比例根本就不清楚也不知道怎麼查核這一塊有沒有在進行委員講得沒錯開源軟體現在是一個使用開源軟體是一個趨勢那怎麼去做規範我是不是請那個蘇貞淑跟委員報告我們有一個政府軟體採購的共同供應契約我們會講Expo那有沒有推到各個部會對那個是我們幫各個部會去訂約的那他們有沒有一定要用"},{"start":354.642,"end":380.9,"text":"有没有看一下他们用的情况他们很多都有用好 这个部分要持续了解不然的话为什么我们今天会不会出现这个状况那开源授权的教育跟合规的这个协助我们也希望抒发部可以来协助那我们个人是认为说政府应该要有一个开源办公室那抒发部有没有机会来考虑作为一个开源制度化的一个示范部门来成立一个开源办公室还是已经有了"},{"start":381.36,"end":407.45,"text":"我們請國際市他在這個開源方面有很多很多的過去的一些計畫跟努力請他做個市長做個說明是先跟委員報告一下感謝委員的支持那有關於開源由數位發展部來當零頭示範的部分跟委員報告的確我們目前在推動的數位評測品牆它整體就是走開源模式我們是希望透過這個方式來引導各部位在開源就是有非常多的效益的是"},{"start":407.87,"end":420.437,"text":"好 謝謝這個開源數位皮夾專案我也有安裝你們也一直有說有開放程式碼但是開放程式碼跟開源其他人可以使用你們這次應該兩個都有公開程式碼跟開源都有"},{"start":424.159,"end":438.553,"text":"那我想作為一個示範我覺得很重要那其實我也非常支持速發部在推動的這個公共城市的平台但是其他部會在做公共的城市的時候好像沒有串聯的很好因為像衛福部跟公研院委託的這個專案他們有用到開源的軟體"},{"start":439.614,"end":454.62,"text":"可是卻在上面沒有辦法查得出來我希望書發部能不能有這樣的一個公共城市的平台跟其他的部會可以更積極的協調有相關運用到開源碼的專案就應該要在這裡可以查詢得到這個機制能不能再深化一下"},{"start":456.036,"end":478.076,"text":"是 跟委員報告這個開園的整個政策我們在去年其實在全台各地都有召開相關的說明會那我們也積極鼓勵各個部會能夠參與整個開園的推動那這個部分我們數位發展部也正在擬定相關看有沒有一些相關的行政的指引能夠協助各個部會推動 以上說明"},{"start":478.456,"end":496.645,"text":"所以我想希望這個速發部我們是不是一起來爭取一下從行政院的陳傑也好還是速發部也好我們來成立一個開源的辦公室這個是人工智慧學校基金會的秘書長也是很多人的共同朋友他所貼出來的就是這很可能不是一個個案現在政府內部很可能有一大堆的專案左手發給右手"},{"start":497.805,"end":524.523,"text":"右手挪用開源的軟體卻沒有清楚的標示跟這個左右手互相領錢左右手互相查核其實現在有一些工具可以來查核到底有沒有使用開源的程式碼其實速發部在這個部分可能有一些知識也可以來協助所以我們的具體訴求希望成立開源辦公室另外一個具體訴求我們也希望這個數位皮匣的專案可以大順利大成功那也希望能夠作為一個範本讓未來我們政府的這個專案public money"},{"start":528.846,"end":554.447,"text":"公眾的錢我們納稅人出來的錢就不應該是被特定的單位挪用開源城市碼改了兩三行之後變成自己的這個所謂的公眾出資公共的城市我想也應該是符合速發部在推動的方向尤其最後一句話也是重點歐盟也在推動之外也說可以提高資安韌性因為城市碼可以公開審查與改進我想這應該是符合我們台灣中華民國發展的方向"},{"start":554.887,"end":560.28,"text":"所以我想抒發部還有相關的同仁是不是近期我們可以一起來針對這個再做更多的討論好這沒問題我們討論好謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":366,"blocks":[["葛委員如鈞：（10時2分）謝謝召委，謝謝主席，我們有請數發部黃彥男部長。"],["主席：好，黃部長。"],["黃部長彥男：委員好。"],["葛委員如鈞：部長好。資料、資料、資料，沒有資料我們可能就沒有文化，沒有主權，也不會有AI，我們現在又面臨了美國、中國他們也持續的在發展。我們現在談到媒體議價法的時候，其實我們也看到了數發部的報告裡面也很清楚地寫了，倘若我國未來實施類似媒體議價法，不排除美國採取關稅報復措施。其實剛剛的質詢你也有提到，我們也可以看到川普當時拿出這個小板板，上面有臺灣64%，底下有一行小字說非關稅壁壘包含在內，所以如果這個媒體議價法放進去，很顯然地對美國來說非關稅壁壘就是提高的。我想請教一下部長，關於這件事情還有媒體議價法可能造成的風險，有沒有跟我們關稅談判團隊同步過？"],["黃部長彥男：報告委員，我們會做這樣的判斷是根據美國對澳洲跟加拿大，事實上也有談判過，所以我們是根據這樣做判斷，然後次長有去談……"],["葛委員如鈞：關稅談判團隊知不知道？"],["林次長宜敬：知道。"],["黃部長彥男：有報告過了。"],["葛委員如鈞：有報告過了？這個訊息很重要，大家要同步一下。數發部在這個部分也做了很多功課，也非常感謝，也希望我們政府各部會都非常清楚。","另外，我們也看到中國大陸現在發展AI，因為它的政治體制非常特殊，可以無所不用其極地取得各種資料，臺灣在發展AI的時候，因為我們的著作權法可以說是舉世嚴格，甚至還有刑法的罰責，導致我們臺灣大語言模型的團隊在訓練的時候資料不足。當然，我們知道資料是有價的，可是現在就卡在這裡，人家有很多資料，可以拼命訓練，越多資料的AI可能就越聰明，臺灣的資料已經不夠了，我們又要制定這樣子的一個媒體議價法！當然，我們還是認為資料有價，可是我們如果卡在這裡，不能進也不能退，會不會造成我們的AI沒有辦法往前進？所以我一直在院會的質詢當中，不斷請教各個部會，現在數發部也是這一塊的專業，你們贊不贊成由行政院當中的部會，甚至也許就是數發部，來建立國家層級的AI訓練資料庫，提供AI訓練所需要的資料，當然也提供誘因？因為其實媒體提供的新聞內容說不定也可以放進來做資料庫的一部分啊！請問這個部分你們有沒有可能來支持一下？"],["黃部長彥男：這個方向是沒有錯啦，因為AI的發展一定需要資料，而臺灣的主權AI也必須要有自己的資料，所以我們數發部的資料創新司對這個議題有研訂一些條款和方法，我是不是請司長來做個說明？"],["莊司長明芬：報告委員，有關AI語料庫的訓練，我們的做法是這樣子：過去其實政府已經有五萬多筆的開放資料，只要是標準授權的資料，都可以讓各界來做運用，包括語料的訓練。當然，大家可能會覺得我們現在訓練的資料必須是語意連貫的自然語彙的方式，所以大量文本的資料可能就涉及著作權保護的議題，我們國家的著作權目前並沒有對AI訓練語料做額外的條例的修改，但是在此之前我們也不會坐著等，我們現在訂定了一個臺灣主權AI訓練語料庫的授權條款，針對這個授權條款，我們會在跟智財局一起研議之後，如果妥適性可以的話，就會對外公布。"],["葛委員如鈞：好，預計什麼時候會有結果？時間表呢？"],["莊司長明芬：我們5月初就會找智財局及學者專家先來研議，如果合理的話，我們就可以把這樣的授權條款釋出。"],["葛委員如鈞：希望加速啦！因為這個資料庫也需要誘因，部長，其實您也很瞭解區塊鏈的技術，有關如何保存、如何加（解）密、如何分潤的機制，像資料點值、資料經濟的做法，我們希望能有一個國家級的訓練資料庫。這個部分可不可以請部長來研議一下？"],["黃部長彥男：好，我們來研議，再跟委員報告。"],["葛委員如鈞：數發部自己做為軟體還有數位產業的主管部會，近期衛福部有委託工研院進行一個平臺的計畫，預算非常高，去年大概是4億，今年可能還會追加二點多億，但是發生了挪用美國的開源軟體來做修改卻沒有清楚標示的狀況，所以我們還是想請教一下數發部，你們有沒有掌握部會在採購案上對於開源條文落實的情況？數發部有沒有針對這個部分做一個全面的盤點和瞭解？否則我們的政府部會把很高的預算左手發給右手，結果是用開源的軟體，比例根本就不清楚，也不知道怎麼查核！這一塊有沒有在進行？"],["黃部長彥男：委員講得沒錯，使用開源軟體是一個趨勢，至於怎麼去做規範，我是不是請署長來說明？"],["林署長俊秀：跟委員報告，我們有一個政府軟體採購的共同供應契約，我們會講SBOM……"],["葛委員如鈞：有沒有推到各個部會？"],["林署長俊秀：那個是我們幫各部會去訂約。"],["葛委員如鈞：他們有沒有一定要用？有沒有看一下他們用的情況？"],["林署長俊秀：很多都有用。"],["葛委員如鈞：好，這個部分要持續瞭解，不然為什麼今天衛福部會出現這個狀況？開源授權的教育和合規的支援，我們也希望數發部可以來協助，個人是認為政府應該要有一個開源辦公室，數發部有沒有機會考慮以開源制度化的示範部門來成立一個開源辦公室，還是已經有了？"],["黃部長彥男：我們的國際司過去在開源方面做了很多計畫和努力，我請司長做個說明。"],["莊司長盈志：先跟委員報告一下，感謝委員的支持。有關開源由數位發展部來做領頭示範的部分，跟委員報告，的確我們目前在推動的「數位憑證皮夾」整體就是走開源模式，我們是希望透過這個方式來引導各部會在開源方面具有非常多效益。"],["葛委員如鈞：好，謝謝，這個數位皮夾的專案我非常支持，而且我也有安裝，你們一直說有開放程式碼，可是開放程式碼和開源給其他人使用你們這次應該是兩個都有，公開程式碼跟開源都有，做為一個示範我覺得很重要。其實我也非常支持數發部在推動的公共程式平臺，但是其他部會在做公共程式的時候好像沒有串連得很好，因為像衛福部委託工研院的這個專案就有用到開源的軟體，可是在上面卻沒有辦法查出來，我希望數發部能設置一個公共程式的平臺，和其他部會做更積極的協調，有運用到開源碼的專案，就應該在這裡可以查詢得到，這個機制能不能再深化一下？"],["莊司長盈志：跟委員報告，整個開源的政策我們去年在全臺各地都有召開相關的說明會，我們也積極鼓勵各部會能夠參與整個開源的推動。這個部分我們數位發展部也正在擬訂相關的行政指引來協助各部會推動。以上說明。"],["葛委員如鈞：希望數發部一起來爭取一下，從行政院的層級也好，或是數發部也好，我們來成立一個開源辦公室。各位可以看一下人工智慧學校基金會秘書長的貼文，他也是很多人共同的朋友。也就是說，這很可能不是一個個案，現在政府內部很可能有一大堆專案是左手發給右手，右手挪用開源的軟體卻沒有清楚的標示，左右手互相領錢、左右手互相查核。其實現在有一些工具可以查核到底有沒有使用開源的程式碼，數發部在這個部分可能有一些知識，也可以提供協助，所以我們的具體訴求是希望成立開源辦公室。另外一個具體訴求是我們也期望數位皮夾的專案可以大順利、大成功！也希望能夠做為一個範本，讓未來政府的專案Public Money, Public Code！公眾的錢、從我們納稅人手裡出來的錢就不應該被特定的單位挪用開源程式碼，改了兩、三行之後變成自己的！所謂的「公眾出資、公共程式」，我想應該也符合數發部在推動的方向。除了歐盟也在推動之外，尤其最後一句話（這也是重點）是：這也可以提高資安韌性，因為程式碼可以公開審查與改進。我想這應該是符合我們臺灣中華民國發展的方向。所以數發部以及相關的同仁近期是不是可以一起來針對這個部分進行更多的討論？"],["黃部長彥男：好的，這沒問題，我們可以來討論。謝謝委員。"],["葛委員如鈞：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝葛如鈞召委。","現在請范雲委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":148,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-3-23,22-1","speakers":["林國成","王鴻薇","張啓楷","洪孟楷","林宜瑾","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","葛如鈞","范雲","林俊憲","蔡其昌","許智傑","郭昱晴","徐富癸","李昆澤","何欣純","陳素月","邱若華","廖先翔","魯明哲","陳培瑜","黃國昌","楊瓊瓔","羅廷瑋","吳沛憶","葉元之","游顥","林楚茵","蔡易餘","張雅琳","柯志恩","萬美玲","黃健豪","劉書彬","翁曉玲"],"page_start":61,"meetingDate":["2025-05-01"],"gazette_id":"1144501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144501_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期交通、教育及文化委員會第1次聯席會議紀錄","content":"一、審查委員林楚茵等17人擬具「新聞媒體與數位平台議價法草案」案；二、審查委員羅廷瑋等\n16人擬具「新聞媒體與數位平臺強制議價法草案」案；三、審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具「新聞媒\n體與數位平臺強制議價法草案」案；四、審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「新聞媒體與數位科技平台公\n平發展法草案」案；五、審查委員林宜瑾等21 人擬具「數位新聞發展與民主韌性法草案」案；\n六、審查委員范雲等21人擬具「數位新聞發展與民主韌性法草案」案【僅進行詢答】","agenda_id":"1144501_00002"}}}