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我們政府的團隊已經在美東時間5月1號結束在華府就對等關稅等經貿議題和美國已經完成首輪的實體磋商 對吧\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 268.803, \"end\": 268.943, \"score\": 0.837}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 268.943, \"end\": 269.303, \"score\": 0.804}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 269.303, \"end\": 269.603, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"過\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 269.603, \"end\": 269.904, \"score\": 0.847}, {\"word\": \"歡\"}, {\"word\": \"迎\", \"start\": 269.904, \"end\": 269.984, \"score\": 0.749}, {\"word\": \"您\", \"start\": 269.984, \"end\": 270.104, \"score\": 0.824}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 270.104, \"end\": 270.264, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"金\", \"start\": 270.264, \"end\": 270.504, \"score\": 0.816}, {\"word\": \"門\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 270.504, \"end\": 271.325, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"際\"}, {\"word\": \"考\", \"start\": 271.325, \"end\": 271.485, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"察\", \"start\": 271.485, \"end\": 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\"start\": 704.527, \"end\": 704.547, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 705.487, \"end\": 728.235, \"text\": \"原來的一樣東西搬到離島街條裡頭我們就可以適用嘛那如果你們認為我們是國際港我們連修都不用修我們就適用就好我們就直接適用國際港的自由貿易港的辦法就好了嘛所以我也想知道我們明確定位是什麼既然賴總統我非常尊重賴總統而且我相信我們的總統既然賴總統您剛剛好 院長您剛剛也說了廈門是中華人民共和國金門是中華民國而且賴總統說兩邊互不隸屬嘛\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"原\", \"start\": 705.487, \"end\": 705.847, \"score\": 0.863}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 705.847, \"end\": 705.947, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 705.947, \"end\": 706.187, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"東\"}, {\"word\": \"西\", \"start\": 706.187, \"end\": 706.407, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"搬\", \"start\": 706.407, \"end\": 706.567, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 706.567, \"end\": 706.948, \"score\": 0.731}, {\"word\": \"離\"}, {\"word\": \"島\"}, {\"word\": \"街\", \"start\": 706.948, \"end\": 707.488, \"score\": 0.737}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"裡\"}, {\"word\": \"頭\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 707.488, 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00:00:01,771\n謝謝主席,請這個院長請卓院長\n\n2\n00:00:15,862 --> 00:00:30,932\n因為是戰地嘛所以很多的這個基礎建設都是國防部幫我們做的那海岸線因為受這個軍事管制所以都是比如說我們就不能下海然後很多沿海海岸線的這個相關產業就不發達了因為是\n\n3\n00:00:31,552 --> 00:00:47,960\n軍事管制區散入者格殺勿論我小時候海邊都是有這支所以我們真正的漁港不多到現在來講大概只有三個地方新湖復國敦跟羅柱所以海上觀光也不大發達現在我們漁船的數量金門漁船數量總共的數量是兩百多艘\n\n4\n00:00:52,662 --> 00:01:07,454\n那可以停的這個漁船的這個博位也是大概現在只有170個那當然最近這幾年在我們向中央爭取之下也有逐漸增加那大概也會到200多個但是呢200多個以後接著最近金門縣政府要開放這個\n\n5\n00:01:10,076 --> 00:01:28,938\n台灣的漁船入籍到金門所以第一個漁船的博位會不足那更重要的是還有當然漁船這是經濟部漁業署那邊那更重要的是還有交通部管轄的自用小船金門的這個自用小船大概現在有400多艘那現在自用小船的停泊的這個博位有多少呢大概只有大概\n\n6\n00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:54,438\n今年如果這個金門遊艇基地那個完成以後今年提竣工以後大概可以提供55個位置那九宮碼頭提供15個位置那大概就是70個位置那事實上金門的自用小船大概有400個位置所以我想請問院長是不是支持也請這個部長這邊是不是支持我們金門這個部分你們是不是應該做規劃因為現在的確已經不足了\n\n7\n00:01:54,878 --> 00:02:22,935\n現在自用小船的泊位不足的情況下讓他們跟漁船的停泊常常發生糾紛就漁船的位置也不夠嘛那自用小船的位置非常不夠那當然自用小船是發展海上觀光的一個要點而且因為金門的大陸距現在有時候小三中介往來有時開始有大陸員因為廈門那邊有香山遊艇啊什麼有時候也願意到坐遊艇到我們金門旅遊坐正常的客輪以外所以這個部分的話是不是我們行政院這邊有沒有什麼做法\n\n8\n00:02:23,916 --> 00:02:35,434\n興建這個相關的這個國委請部長回答但是我跟委員報告一件事情行政院對於離島地區能夠發揮離島在地的特色文化的任何的構想我們都願意很\n\n9\n00:02:36,278 --> 00:02:57,436\n節省的跟大家來討論這個有助於觀光事業那至於說海港船舶的管理請部長來說明但是不夠席位啦碼頭博位不夠報告委員在111年到115年的這個計畫裡面我們已經補助金門縣政府2.47億元來建設這個博區來興建55席的博位對我知道55以後再加15那個我應該算給你\n\n10\n00:03:01,139 --> 00:03:26,737\n那現在聽起來是狀況來看還是可能不夠還是差很多啊差好幾百個博文所以我們還是會繼續跟縣政府這邊來溝通有沒有可能我們再增加這樣子的建制跟建設現在這個我們原來原來水頭跟九宮那個地方事實上我們有實際去看所以交通部也找時間可以請航空局看就原來大小金門現在有金門大小原來那個在坐船的那個地方也就沒有需要大小金門的船嘛\n\n11\n00:03:27,057 --> 00:03:39,124\n那邊就可以在偵測很簡單的就可以很快的偵測一些博位出來讓這個自用小船有停的地方才不會在金門常常有糾紛發生不管自用小船跟漁船就會常常為了搶博位這個東西縣政府也是一定支持只是說\n\n12\n00:03:44,187 --> 00:04:12,410\n可能是不是動作要快一點這個經費的部分那事實上也不一定需要非常多錢因為做這個碼頭而已嘛做這個可以停靠的國衛而已是不是這個規劃是不是可以快一點啊我知道110年代110年有這個規劃但是55席和15席太少了現在的海上觀光因為小三通開始以後現在海上觀光也越來越蓬勃發展這是五一的時候就是剛過去這個到五一的年假我們一天就來了四五千個入客啦所以\n\n13\n00:04:12,910 --> 00:04:27,302\n所以這個觀光發展是現在比較蓬勃發展但是就是說漁船還有這個交通自用小船的博位是遠遠不夠啊這個會引起很大的治安糾紛一直發生你盡快找時間是不是我也歡迎您過去啊\n\n14\n00:04:28,803 --> 00:04:36,187\n跟部長還沒過去歡迎您到金門去實際考察看看好謝謝您那接著我想請教自由貿易港區的問題行政院經貿談判辦公室5月3號有發布新聞稿說我們的團隊我們政府的團隊已經在美東時間5月1號結束在華府就對等關稅等經貿議題和美國已經完成首輪的實體磋商對吧\n\n15\n00:04:54,598 --> 00:05:16,574\n這個新聞稿有寫嘛是由我們副院長鄭麗君副院長還有我們談判總代表楊正麗帶隊會談氣氛坦誠榮恰雙方都表達對強化台美經貿合作的共同期待是這樣吧是的好那我想請教您就是談判裡頭當然就是gifttake我給你什麼你給我什麼在第一回合談判裡頭我們有沒有獲得具體的降稅承諾\n\n16\n00:05:18,604 --> 00:05:40,637\n降稅現在不是要32%嗎原來我們只有很少你既然談判會談氣氛樓下嘛那大家都有共同強化合作的期待那有沒有什麼具體的承諾報告委員談判是一個整體的過程開始的第一次談判雙方把自己的立場充分交涉之後一定會有下一次更具體的但是有沒有具體的承諾我沒有要你告訴我什麼承諾有沒有獲得什麼具體的承諾\n\n17\n00:05:43,138 --> 00:05:44,298\n談判一定到最後才能夠依照國際慣例跟雙方的默契我們在過程當中\n\n18\n00:06:05,646 --> 00:06:20,876\n都不能說我們有過...沒有我沒有叫你告訴我談判的內容是什麼或具體的承諾有沒有在過程中他們有說具體說好你沒有叫我告訴你可是你問的就是這樣子沒有你不用告訴我內容有沒有具體的承諾沒有就對了好沒有沒關係談判第一次的過程是交換我們的方案是很具體的\n\n19\n00:06:25,058 --> 00:06:31,926\n對方還沒有承諾還在一個過程還沒有承諾但是有過程而已談判是一個過程過程當中我們已經在相當優先的位置就是還沒有到後面還在來來回回還沒有什麼具體的結果應該這樣講就還沒有承諾\n\n20\n00:06:40,615 --> 00:06:42,296\n這幾天我們看到新台幣不停的升值這個是不是我們給美國的承諾\n\n21\n00:06:56,932 --> 00:07:18,901\n談判的過程沒有涉及任何匯率相關議題所以我們沒有給美國這個承諾說我們這個新台幣沒有談到任何匯率的相關議題沒有談給你機會講清楚因為這兩天這個升值實在是太嚴重了我們行政院的新聞稿對外也甚至講了總統在昨天的講話當中也講了談判過程沒有涉及到任何匯率的相關議題\n\n22\n00:07:19,781 --> 00:07:47,288\n那如果沒有這樣的話這兩天的這個新台幣匯率這個升值對國內的這個出口產業很多產業影響太大了那你們就既然我們也沒有給美方承諾說我們一定要新台幣升值嘛那你們就應該要有你們的做法出來你們應該就是要看看國內產業受衝擊有多大影響太大很多產業再下去如果繼續這樣往下走的話已經很多產業受不了了這個你也不會比我不了解齁那我想你這個可能要相當注意啦齁\n\n23\n00:07:48,328 --> 00:08:17,247\n下去就會帶來失業潮很多事情很多工廠可能就沒有辦法往下移然後接著會帶來的後續的很多反應連鎖反應會更大這一點你們要特別注意那當然不管你們有沒有承諾我們反正現在就是相信政府吧謝謝來接著我想請問民進黨委員之前一直在講說我所提的那個離島的自由貿易港區那我想請問美國貿易代表有沒有在這次會議中有沒有談到我們金門不能成立離島自由貿易港區\n\n24\n00:08:18,681 --> 00:08:32,016\n這又是談判內容我怎麼會說有沒有呢所以你也不知道對不對你心裡應該知道不可能談到這個細節嘛你不知道細節喔這樣很嚴重喔你心裡應該知道不可能談到這種細節不可能有嘛所以不可能有談到嘛對不對\n\n25\n00:08:33,678 --> 00:08:56,955\n我以為你不知道細節反正不可能談到啊不可能談到什麼金門成立自由貿易港區吧那也所以說或者說他關切息產地嘛因為金門還沒有成立嘛所以他關切息產地這個議題嘛之前說的那就是指那如果關切息產地現在如果自由貿易港區對趙民進黨立委的說法是一個可能息產地的地方那我們就要考慮說是現在有的這個自由貿易港區現在有自由貿易港區有幾個您知道嗎\n\n26\n00:08:58,776 --> 00:09:13,106\n七個七個齁那自由貿易港區成立的先決條件是什麼這個部長知道嗎應該是要去國際港要去國際港對非常正確要去國際港齁那我想請問一下自由貿易港區成立後交通費要不要管理啊\n\n27\n00:09:14,204 --> 00:09:33,397\n自由貿易港區那個地方都是交通部管理的要不要管理?要嘛,對不對?要不要進行業務查核啊?還是就放任他?我們配合經濟部跟財政部都有在做查核每年都要進行一次查核啦那我想請問,你說要自由貿易港又要是國際港嘛那安平港那時候不是國際港,為什麼也可以成立自由貿易港區?台南安平港台南安平港我們這資料有,我們有去查了\n\n28\n00:09:38,752 --> 00:09:44,018\n後來港務公司投入後來才升現在是啦現在升級啦所以我想請問啦那我們今天港現在是什麼港國內商港那我們也可以提升為國際港吧\n\n29\n00:09:56,492 --> 00:10:21,205\n目前沒有這個討論怎麼會沒有這個討論呢金門現在你認為金門現在沒有這個需求嗎目前沒有討論金門成為國際商港那我想請問金門現在是什麼港院長金門現在是什麼港那都是國內商港是國內商港嗎國際商港一定有他的量先不要講量還有重要是航線的安全跟穩定這些都要考慮的我說國際港是國際之間的往來嘛對不對是不是國際之間的往來嘛廈門屬於哪一國\n\n30\n00:10:25,831 --> 00:10:27,833\n中華人民共和國中華民國互不隸屬金門已經在走國際航線\n\n31\n00:10:37,076 --> 00:10:57,256\n不是嗎走國際航線不一定完全就是一個國際港走國際航線不是國際港所以他沒有成立國際航線要見我們都在走國際航線了咧他必須要有安全的航道安全航道要注意是你們後來應該那是管理上的問題小三通或是其他的行為這個都是我們雙方在現在這個機制底下去面對\n\n32\n00:10:58,377 --> 00:11:21,013\n我要講一下我們這個自由貿易港區的申請為什麼要去離島建設條例修這個東西齁這個原因是這樣子如果我們是一個兩岸港或是你說的國內港小山東港不然還有什麼不叫國際港我們就只好修離島建設條例比照自由貿易港區來做自由貿易港好那如果我們不是我們是國際港的話我們就變成國際港我們就可以直接試用我們不用修離島建設條例啊你這個邏輯錯不是修\n\n33\n00:11:24,958 --> 00:11:44,547\n離島條例讓他成為國際港是在必須國際港的條件我們才來做配套我們修離島階段就是一個還不足以成為一個我們所謂的我們修離島階段條例就是要修一個特別法讓他適用因為我們既然被你們認為不是交通部認為基本不是國際港所以我們就要修一個特別法在離島階段條例以後比照自貿港的條例\n\n34\n00:11:45,487 --> 00:12:08,235\n原來的一樣東西搬到離島街條裡頭我們就可以適用嘛那如果你們認為我們是國際港我們連修都不用修我們就適用就好我們就直接適用國際港的自由貿易港的辦法就好了嘛所以我也想知道我們明確定位是什麼既然賴總統我非常尊重賴總統而且我相信我們的總統既然賴總統您剛剛好院長您剛剛也說了廈門是中華人民共和國金門是中華民國而且賴總統說兩邊互不隸屬嘛\n\n35\n00:12:11,656 --> 00:12:30,021\n那不就兩國與國之間的關係就是國際港國和國之間不叫國際叫什麼咧所以我們這邊也是一個國際港啊所以就是基於這種地位的特殊當初設立的小山東等等就是跑這個地位特殊關係特殊的狀況之下沒有你剛才也說啦既然中華人民共和國和中華民國是互不隸屬嘛對不對\n\n36\n00:12:31,121 --> 00:12:47,747\n我也說了國際港它必須要安全穩定的安全是後來的事情安全是管理的問題現在金門是不是在對方艦機經常侵擾的情況之下它是不是安全穩定的它除了中華人民共和國跟中華民國來往之外它會不會有其他第三國家來參與呢軍機更常侵擾台灣本島啊那這些港口都不能變成國際港港本島有很多第三國家會來參與會來進出你了解我的意思嗎我們也可以變國際港香港的船也可以過來那個過來來我講到這個我舉例\n\n37\n00:13:00,771 --> 00:13:16,643\n金門的機場就有國際包機啊日本飛機也來飛啊越南也來飛啊我們都飛去越南的啊你不是先想說我們要先有這個條件成為嘛然後後面的管理是後面的事情嘛對不對你要先給我們這個機會嘛要循序漸進安撫就班好那你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進我們要爭取這個你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進我可以不要在離老街的條例修啊但是你要讓我變成國際法會你幫我升格啊安平港就是升格的啊\n\n38\n00:13:25,550 --> 00:13:50,740\n或者你就把我認為現在就是國際港委員提出的領導建制條例其中並不只有這個重點對可以討論所有的法令都是可以討論的好不好修法就是一個討論民主就是討論的過程我的意思就是說如果這樣子因為按照賴總統的意思我們現在就是國際港了啊你剛剛有回答我啊中華民國和中華人民共和國那國和國之間往來怎麼不叫國際呢就是因為修法提出來就是一個討論的過程就很多委員討論是反對的\n\n39\n00:13:53,154 --> 00:14:06,492\n民進黨委員討論反對吧當然民進黨委員反對因為他們就說會洗產地啊或怎麼樣他們就抹黑我們離島的發展嘛那安平港就不會洗產地高雄港就不會洗產地那所謂洗產地怎麼越南泰國離中國大陸越南先聽我講\n\n40\n00:14:09,636 --> 00:14:33,309\n你聽我講當然要管制啊越南跟泰國離中國道很遠啊不是被洗產地你不會因為我們地理位置比較近就說我們會洗產地那高雄安平基隆台北港我都有去看過啊他們就不會洗產地只有我們金門會洗產地我跟你講金門才不會洗產地因為金門地方很小每個人都幾乎彼此認識只要有人做洗產地馬上今天做明天就會被抓啦我跟你講金門就是這種很小的地方啊做不了什麼壞事的地方啊\n\n41\n00:14:33,809 --> 00:14:59,925\n所以金門反而是一個很好管制的地方真的金門就是一個這樣的地方我認識你三代你認識我五代這種地方所以很容易管制我也不反對本來就要管制我也剛說最後馬上要江湖每一年都每個月都要去查核我們支持啊我們只是想祈求跟台灣本島這些港口有一樣的地位而已我們不是想要特別做什麼你知道嗎我們只是祈求你給我們金門這樣的機會而已對於離島的特色文化行政院都願意支持\n\n42\n00:15:00,746 --> 00:15:12,659\n所以這個發揮觀光發揮商業活動的可能性我們都願意支持那這個要循序漸進按部就班的討論在國家安全情況底下我們要列為優先重點這個要循序漸進按部就班的討論\n\n43\n00:15:22,559 --> 00:15:29,806\n好,謝謝陳委員也謝謝卓院長報告院會休息十分鐘休息之後繼續進行質問\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n787\t1771\t謝謝主席,請這個院長請卓院長\n15862\t30932\t因為是戰地嘛所以很多的這個基礎建設都是國防部幫我們做的那海岸線因為受這個軍事管制所以都是比如說我們就不能下海然後很多沿海海岸線的這個相關產業就不發達了因為是\n31552\t47960\t軍事管制區 散入者格殺勿論我小時候海邊都是有這支所以我們真正的漁港不多到現在來講大概只有三個地方新湖 復國敦跟羅柱所以海上觀光也不大發達現在我們漁船的數量 金門漁船數量總共的數量是兩百多艘\n52662\t67454\t那可以停的這個漁船的這個博位也是大概現在只有170個那當然最近這幾年在我們向中央爭取之下也有逐漸增加那大概也會到200多個但是呢200多個以後接著最近金門縣政府要開放這個\n70076\t88938\t台灣的漁船入籍到金門所以第一個漁船的博位會不足那更重要的是還有當然漁船這是經濟部漁業署那邊那更重要的是還有交通部管轄的自用小船金門的這個自用小船大概現在有400多艘那現在自用小船的停泊的這個博位有多少呢大概只有大概\n90319\t114438\t今年如果這個金門遊艇基地那個完成以後今年提竣工以後大概可以提供55個位置那九宮碼頭提供15個位置那大概就是70個位置那事實上金門的自用小船大概有400個位置所以我想請問院長是不是支持也請這個部長這邊是不是支持我們金門這個部分你們是不是應該做規劃因為現在的確已經不足了\n114878\t142935\t現在自用小船的泊位不足的情況下讓他們跟漁船的停泊常常發生糾紛就漁船的位置也不夠嘛那自用小船的位置非常不夠那當然自用小船是發展海上觀光的一個要點而且因為金門的大陸距現在有時候小三中介往來有時開始有大陸員因為廈門那邊有香山遊艇啊什麼有時候也願意到坐遊艇到我們金門旅遊坐正常的客輪以外所以這個部分的話是不是我們行政院這邊有沒有什麼做法\n143916\t155434\t興建這個相關的這個國委請部長回答 但是我跟委員報告一件事情行政院對於離島地區能夠發揮離島在地的特色文化的任何的構想我們都願意很\n156278\t177436\t節省的跟大家來討論 這個有助於觀光事業那至於說 海港船舶的管理 請部長來說明但是不夠席位啦 碼頭博位不夠報告委員 在111年到115年的這個計畫裡面我們已經補助金門縣政府2.47億元來建設這個博區 來興建55席的博位對我知道 55以後再加15 那個我應該算給你\n181139\t206737\t那現在聽起來是狀況來看還是可能不夠還是差很多啊 差好幾百個博文所以我們還是會繼續跟縣政府這邊來溝通有沒有可能我們再增加這樣子的建制跟建設現在這個我們原來原來水頭跟九宮那個地方 事實上我們有實際去看所以交通部也找時間可以請航空局看就原來大小金門 現在有金門大小原來那個在坐船的那個地方也就沒有需要大小金門的船嘛\n207057\t219124\t那邊就可以在偵測很簡單的就可以很快的偵測一些博位出來讓這個自用小船有停的地方才不會在金門常常有糾紛發生不管自用小船跟漁船就會常常為了搶博位這個東西縣政府也是一定支持只是說\n224187\t252410\t可能是不是動作要快一點 這個經費的部分那事實上也不一定需要非常多錢 因為做這個碼頭而已嘛做這個可以停靠的國衛而已是不是這個規劃是不是可以快一點啊我知道110年代110年有這個規劃 但是55席和15席太少了現在的海上觀光 因為小三通開始以後現在海上觀光也越來越蓬勃發展這是五一的時候 就是剛過去這個到五一的年假我們一天就來了四五千個 入客啦 所以\n252910\t267302\t所以這個觀光發展是現在比較蓬勃發展但是就是說漁船還有這個交通自用小船的博位是遠遠不夠啊這個會引起很大的治安糾紛一直發生你盡快找時間是不是我也歡迎您過去啊\n268803\t276187\t跟部長還沒過去 歡迎您到金門去實際考察看看好 謝謝您那接著我想請教自由貿易港區的問題行政院經貿談判辦公室5月3號有發布新聞稿說我們的團隊 我們政府的團隊已經在美東時間5月1號結束在華府就對等關稅等經貿議題和美國已經完成首輪的實體磋商 對吧\n294598\t316574\t這個新聞稿有寫嘛是由我們副院長鄭麗君副院長還有我們談判總代表楊正麗帶隊會談氣氛坦誠榮恰雙方都表達對強化台美經貿合作的共同期待是這樣吧是的好 那我想請教您就是談判裡頭當然就是gift take我給你什麼你給我什麼在第一回合談判裡頭我們有沒有獲得具體的降稅承諾\n318604\t340637\t降稅 現在不是要32%嗎原來我們只有很少 你既然談判會談氣氛樓下嘛那大家都有共同強化合作的期待那有沒有什麼具體的承諾報告委員 談判是一個整體的過程開始的第一次談判 雙方把自己的立場充分交涉之後一定會有下一次更具體的但是有沒有具體的承諾 我沒有要你告訴我什麼承諾有沒有獲得什麼具體的承諾\n343138\t344298\t談判一定到最後才能夠依照國際慣例跟雙方的默契我們在過程當中\n365646\t380876\t都不能說我們有過...沒有我沒有叫你告訴我談判的內容是什麼或具體的承諾有沒有在過程中他們有說具體說好你沒有叫我告訴你可是你問的就是這樣子沒有你不用告訴我內容有沒有具體的承諾沒有就對了好沒有沒關係談判第一次的過程是交換我們的方案是很具體的\n385058\t391926\t對方還沒有承諾還在一個過程還沒有承諾但是有過程而已談判是一個過程過程當中我們已經在相當優先的位置就是還沒有到後面還在來來回回還沒有什麼具體的結果應該這樣講就還沒有承諾\n400615\t402296\t這幾天我們看到新台幣不停的升值這個是不是我們給美國的承諾\n416932\t438901\t談判的過程沒有涉及任何匯率相關議題所以我們沒有給美國這個承諾說我們這個新台幣沒有談到任何匯率的相關議題沒有談 給你機會講清楚因為這兩天這個升值實在是太嚴重了我們行政院的新聞稿對外也甚至講了總統在昨天的講話當中也講了談判過程沒有涉及到任何匯率的相關議題\n439781\t467288\t那如果沒有這樣的話這兩天的這個新台幣匯率這個升值對國內的這個出口產業很多產業影響太大了那你們就 既然我們也沒有給美方承諾說我們一定要新台幣升值嘛那你們就應該要有你們的做法出來你們應該就是要看看國內產業受衝擊有多大影響太大很多產業再下去如果繼續這樣往下走的話已經很多產業受不了了這個你也不會比我不了解齁那我想你這個可能要相當注意啦齁\n468328\t497247\t下去就會帶來失業潮很多事情很多工廠可能就沒有辦法往下移然後接著會帶來的後續的很多反應連鎖反應會更大這一點你們要特別注意那當然不管你們有沒有承諾我們反正現在就是相信政府吧謝謝來 接著我想請問民進黨委員之前一直在講說我所提的那個離島的自由貿易港區那我想請問美國貿易代表有沒有在這次會議中有沒有談到我們金門不能成立離島自由貿易港區\n498681\t512016\t這又是談判內容 我怎麼會說有沒有呢所以你也不知道對不對你心裡應該知道不可能談到這個細節嘛你不知道細節喔 這樣很嚴重喔你心裡應該知道不可能談到這種細節不可能有嘛 所以不可能有談到嘛 對不對\n513678\t536955\t我以為你不知道細節 反正不可能談到啊 不可能談到什麼金門成立自由貿易港區吧那也 所以說 或者說他關切息產地嘛因為金門還沒有成立嘛所以他關切息產地這個議題嘛 之前說的那就是指 那如果關切息產地 現在如果自由貿易港區對趙民進黨立委的說法是一個可能息產地的地方那我們就要考慮說是現在有的這個自由貿易港區現在有自由貿易港區有幾個 您知道嗎\n538776\t553106\t七個 七個齁 那自由貿易港區成立的先決條件是什麼這個部長知道嗎應該是要去國際港要去國際港 對 非常正確 要去國際港齁那我想請問一下 自由貿易港區成立後交通費要不要管理啊\n554204\t573397\t自由貿易港區那個地方都是交通部管理的要不要管理?要嘛,對不對?要不要進行業務查核啊?還是就放任他?我們配合經濟部跟財政部都有在做查核每年都要進行一次查核啦那我想請問,你說要自由貿易港又要是國際港嘛那安平港那時候不是國際港,為什麼也可以成立自由貿易港區?台南安平港台南安平港我們這資料有,我們有去查了\n578752\t584018\t後來港務公司投入 後來才升現在是啦 現在升級啦所以我想請問啦 那我們今天港現在是什麼港國內商港 那我們也可以提升為國際港吧\n596492\t621205\t目前沒有這個討論怎麼會沒有這個討論呢金門現在你認為金門現在沒有這個需求嗎目前沒有討論金門成為國際商港那我想請問金門現在是什麼港院長金門現在是什麼港那都是國內商港是國內商港嗎國際商港一定有他的量先不要講量還有重要是航線的安全跟穩定這些都要考慮的我說國際港是國際之間的往來嘛對不對是不是國際之間的往來嘛廈門屬於哪一國\n625831\t627833\t中華人民共和國 中華民國 互不隸屬金門已經在走國際航線\n637076\t657256\t不是嗎走國際航線不一定完全就是一個國際港走國際航線不是國際港所以他沒有成立國際航線要見我們都在走國際航線了咧他必須要有安全的航道安全航道要注意是你們後來應該那是管理上的問題小三通或是其他的行為這個都是我們雙方在現在這個機制底下去面對\n658377\t681013\t我要講一下我們這個自由貿易港區的申請為什麼要去離島建設條例修這個東西齁這個原因是這樣子如果我們是一個兩岸港或是你說的國內港小山東港不然還有什麼不叫國際港我們就只好修離島建設條例比照自由貿易港區來做自由貿易港好那如果我們不是我們是國際港的話我們就變成國際港我們就可以直接試用我們不用修離島建設條例啊你這個邏輯錯不是修\n684958\t704547\t離島條例讓他成為國際港是在必須國際港的條件我們才來做配套我們修離島階段就是一個還不足以成為一個我們所謂的我們修離島階段條例就是要修一個特別法讓他適用因為我們既然被你們認為不是 交通部認為基本不是國際港所以我們就要修一個特別法在離島階段條例以後比照自貿港的條例\n705487\t728235\t原來的一樣東西搬到離島街條裡頭我們就可以適用嘛那如果你們認為我們是國際港我們連修都不用修我們就適用就好我們就直接適用國際港的自由貿易港的辦法就好了嘛所以我也想知道我們明確定位是什麼既然賴總統我非常尊重賴總統而且我相信我們的總統既然賴總統您剛剛好 院長您剛剛也說了廈門是中華人民共和國金門是中華民國而且賴總統說兩邊互不隸屬嘛\n731656\t750021\t那不就兩國與國之間的關係就是國際港國和國之間不叫國際叫什麼咧所以我們這邊也是一個國際港啊所以就是基於這種地位的特殊當初設立的小山東等等就是跑這個地位特殊關係特殊的狀況之下沒有 你剛才也說啦 既然中華人民共和國和中華民國是互不隸屬嘛 對不對\n751121\t767747\t我也說了國際港它必須要安全穩定的安全是後來的事情安全是管理的問題現在金門是不是在對方艦機經常侵擾的情況之下它是不是安全穩定的它除了中華人民共和國跟中華民國來往之外它會不會有其他第三國家來參與呢軍機更常侵擾台灣本島啊那這些港口都不能變成國際港港本島有很多第三國家會來參與會來進出你了解我的意思嗎我們也可以變國際港香港的船也可以過來那個過來來我講到這個我舉例\n780771\t796643\t金門的機場就有國際包機啊 日本飛機也來飛啊越南也來飛啊 我們都飛去越南的啊你不是先想說 我們要先有這個條件成為嘛然後後面的管理是後面的事情嘛 對不對你要先給我們這個機會嘛要循序漸進 安撫就班好 那你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進我們要爭取這個 你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進我可以不要在離老街的條例修啊但是你要讓我變成國際法會 你幫我升格啊安平港就是升格的啊\n805550\t830740\t或者你就把我認為現在就是國際港委員提出的領導建制條例 其中並不只有這個重點對 可以討論 所有的法令都是可以討論的 好不好修法就是一個討論 民主就是討論的過程我的意思就是說 如果這樣子 因為按照賴總統的意思我們現在就是國際港了啊 你剛剛有回答我啊中華民國和中華人民共和國 那國和國之間往來怎麼不叫國際呢就是因為 修法提出來就是一個討論的過程就很多委員討論是反對的\n833154\t846492\t民進黨委員討論反對吧當然民進黨委員反對因為他們就說會洗產地啊或怎麼樣他們就抹黑我們離島的發展嘛那安平港就不會洗產地高雄港就不會洗產地那所謂洗產地怎麼越南泰國離中國大陸越南先聽我講\n849636\t873309\t你聽我講 當然要管制啊越南跟泰國離中國道很遠啊不是被洗產地你不會因為我們地理位置比較近就說我們會洗產地那高雄 安平 基隆 台北港我都有去看過啊他們就不會洗產地只有我們金門會洗產地我跟你講金門才不會洗產地因為金門地方很小每個人都幾乎彼此認識只要有人做洗產地馬上今天做明天就會被抓啦我跟你講金門就是這種很小的地方啊做不了什麼壞事的地方啊\n873809\t899925\t所以金門反而是一個很好管制的地方真的 金門就是一個這樣的地方我認識你三代 你認識我五代這種地方所以很容易管制我也不反對 本來就要管制我也剛說最後馬上要江湖每一年都每個月都要去查核我們支持啊我們只是想祈求跟台灣本島這些港口有一樣的地位而已我們不是想要特別做什麼你知道嗎我們只是祈求你給我們金門這樣的機會而已對於離島的特色文化行政院都願意支持\n900746\t912659\t所以這個 發揮觀光 發揮商業活動的可能性我們都願意支持那這個要循序漸進 按部就班的討論在國家安全情況底下 我們要列為優先重點這個要循序漸進 按部就班的討論\n922559\t929806\t好,謝謝陳委員也謝謝卓院長報告院會休息十分鐘休息之後繼續進行質問\n","txt":"謝謝主席,請這個院長請卓院長\n因為是戰地嘛所以很多的這個基礎建設都是國防部幫我們做的那海岸線因為受這個軍事管制所以都是比如說我們就不能下海然後很多沿海海岸線的這個相關產業就不發達了因為是\n軍事管制區 散入者格殺勿論我小時候海邊都是有這支所以我們真正的漁港不多到現在來講大概只有三個地方新湖 復國敦跟羅柱所以海上觀光也不大發達現在我們漁船的數量 金門漁船數量總共的數量是兩百多艘\n那可以停的這個漁船的這個博位也是大概現在只有170個那當然最近這幾年在我們向中央爭取之下也有逐漸增加那大概也會到200多個但是呢200多個以後接著最近金門縣政府要開放這個\n台灣的漁船入籍到金門所以第一個漁船的博位會不足那更重要的是還有當然漁船這是經濟部漁業署那邊那更重要的是還有交通部管轄的自用小船金門的這個自用小船大概現在有400多艘那現在自用小船的停泊的這個博位有多少呢大概只有大概\n今年如果這個金門遊艇基地那個完成以後今年提竣工以後大概可以提供55個位置那九宮碼頭提供15個位置那大概就是70個位置那事實上金門的自用小船大概有400個位置所以我想請問院長是不是支持也請這個部長這邊是不是支持我們金門這個部分你們是不是應該做規劃因為現在的確已經不足了\n現在自用小船的泊位不足的情況下讓他們跟漁船的停泊常常發生糾紛就漁船的位置也不夠嘛那自用小船的位置非常不夠那當然自用小船是發展海上觀光的一個要點而且因為金門的大陸距現在有時候小三中介往來有時開始有大陸員因為廈門那邊有香山遊艇啊什麼有時候也願意到坐遊艇到我們金門旅遊坐正常的客輪以外所以這個部分的話是不是我們行政院這邊有沒有什麼做法\n興建這個相關的這個國委請部長回答 但是我跟委員報告一件事情行政院對於離島地區能夠發揮離島在地的特色文化的任何的構想我們都願意很\n節省的跟大家來討論 這個有助於觀光事業那至於說 海港船舶的管理 請部長來說明但是不夠席位啦 碼頭博位不夠報告委員 在111年到115年的這個計畫裡面我們已經補助金門縣政府2.47億元來建設這個博區 來興建55席的博位對我知道 55以後再加15 那個我應該算給你\n那現在聽起來是狀況來看還是可能不夠還是差很多啊 差好幾百個博文所以我們還是會繼續跟縣政府這邊來溝通有沒有可能我們再增加這樣子的建制跟建設現在這個我們原來原來水頭跟九宮那個地方 事實上我們有實際去看所以交通部也找時間可以請航空局看就原來大小金門 現在有金門大小原來那個在坐船的那個地方也就沒有需要大小金門的船嘛\n那邊就可以在偵測很簡單的就可以很快的偵測一些博位出來讓這個自用小船有停的地方才不會在金門常常有糾紛發生不管自用小船跟漁船就會常常為了搶博位這個東西縣政府也是一定支持只是說\n可能是不是動作要快一點 這個經費的部分那事實上也不一定需要非常多錢 因為做這個碼頭而已嘛做這個可以停靠的國衛而已是不是這個規劃是不是可以快一點啊我知道110年代110年有這個規劃 但是55席和15席太少了現在的海上觀光 因為小三通開始以後現在海上觀光也越來越蓬勃發展這是五一的時候 就是剛過去這個到五一的年假我們一天就來了四五千個 入客啦 所以\n所以這個觀光發展是現在比較蓬勃發展但是就是說漁船還有這個交通自用小船的博位是遠遠不夠啊這個會引起很大的治安糾紛一直發生你盡快找時間是不是我也歡迎您過去啊\n跟部長還沒過去 歡迎您到金門去實際考察看看好 謝謝您那接著我想請教自由貿易港區的問題行政院經貿談判辦公室5月3號有發布新聞稿說我們的團隊 我們政府的團隊已經在美東時間5月1號結束在華府就對等關稅等經貿議題和美國已經完成首輪的實體磋商 對吧\n這個新聞稿有寫嘛是由我們副院長鄭麗君副院長還有我們談判總代表楊正麗帶隊會談氣氛坦誠榮恰雙方都表達對強化台美經貿合作的共同期待是這樣吧是的好 那我想請教您就是談判裡頭當然就是gift take我給你什麼你給我什麼在第一回合談判裡頭我們有沒有獲得具體的降稅承諾\n降稅 現在不是要32%嗎原來我們只有很少 你既然談判會談氣氛樓下嘛那大家都有共同強化合作的期待那有沒有什麼具體的承諾報告委員 談判是一個整體的過程開始的第一次談判 雙方把自己的立場充分交涉之後一定會有下一次更具體的但是有沒有具體的承諾 我沒有要你告訴我什麼承諾有沒有獲得什麼具體的承諾\n談判一定到最後才能夠依照國際慣例跟雙方的默契我們在過程當中\n都不能說我們有過...沒有我沒有叫你告訴我談判的內容是什麼或具體的承諾有沒有在過程中他們有說具體說好你沒有叫我告訴你可是你問的就是這樣子沒有你不用告訴我內容有沒有具體的承諾沒有就對了好沒有沒關係談判第一次的過程是交換我們的方案是很具體的\n對方還沒有承諾還在一個過程還沒有承諾但是有過程而已談判是一個過程過程當中我們已經在相當優先的位置就是還沒有到後面還在來來回回還沒有什麼具體的結果應該這樣講就還沒有承諾\n這幾天我們看到新台幣不停的升值這個是不是我們給美國的承諾\n談判的過程沒有涉及任何匯率相關議題所以我們沒有給美國這個承諾說我們這個新台幣沒有談到任何匯率的相關議題沒有談 給你機會講清楚因為這兩天這個升值實在是太嚴重了我們行政院的新聞稿對外也甚至講了總統在昨天的講話當中也講了談判過程沒有涉及到任何匯率的相關議題\n那如果沒有這樣的話這兩天的這個新台幣匯率這個升值對國內的這個出口產業很多產業影響太大了那你們就 既然我們也沒有給美方承諾說我們一定要新台幣升值嘛那你們就應該要有你們的做法出來你們應該就是要看看國內產業受衝擊有多大影響太大很多產業再下去如果繼續這樣往下走的話已經很多產業受不了了這個你也不會比我不了解齁那我想你這個可能要相當注意啦齁\n下去就會帶來失業潮很多事情很多工廠可能就沒有辦法往下移然後接著會帶來的後續的很多反應連鎖反應會更大這一點你們要特別注意那當然不管你們有沒有承諾我們反正現在就是相信政府吧謝謝來 接著我想請問民進黨委員之前一直在講說我所提的那個離島的自由貿易港區那我想請問美國貿易代表有沒有在這次會議中有沒有談到我們金門不能成立離島自由貿易港區\n這又是談判內容 我怎麼會說有沒有呢所以你也不知道對不對你心裡應該知道不可能談到這個細節嘛你不知道細節喔 這樣很嚴重喔你心裡應該知道不可能談到這種細節不可能有嘛 所以不可能有談到嘛 對不對\n我以為你不知道細節 反正不可能談到啊 不可能談到什麼金門成立自由貿易港區吧那也 所以說 或者說他關切息產地嘛因為金門還沒有成立嘛所以他關切息產地這個議題嘛 之前說的那就是指 那如果關切息產地 現在如果自由貿易港區對趙民進黨立委的說法是一個可能息產地的地方那我們就要考慮說是現在有的這個自由貿易港區現在有自由貿易港區有幾個 您知道嗎\n七個 七個齁 那自由貿易港區成立的先決條件是什麼這個部長知道嗎應該是要去國際港要去國際港 對 非常正確 要去國際港齁那我想請問一下 自由貿易港區成立後交通費要不要管理啊\n自由貿易港區那個地方都是交通部管理的要不要管理?要嘛,對不對?要不要進行業務查核啊?還是就放任他?我們配合經濟部跟財政部都有在做查核每年都要進行一次查核啦那我想請問,你說要自由貿易港又要是國際港嘛那安平港那時候不是國際港,為什麼也可以成立自由貿易港區?台南安平港台南安平港我們這資料有,我們有去查了\n後來港務公司投入 後來才升現在是啦 現在升級啦所以我想請問啦 那我們今天港現在是什麼港國內商港 那我們也可以提升為國際港吧\n目前沒有這個討論怎麼會沒有這個討論呢金門現在你認為金門現在沒有這個需求嗎目前沒有討論金門成為國際商港那我想請問金門現在是什麼港院長金門現在是什麼港那都是國內商港是國內商港嗎國際商港一定有他的量先不要講量還有重要是航線的安全跟穩定這些都要考慮的我說國際港是國際之間的往來嘛對不對是不是國際之間的往來嘛廈門屬於哪一國\n中華人民共和國 中華民國 互不隸屬金門已經在走國際航線\n不是嗎走國際航線不一定完全就是一個國際港走國際航線不是國際港所以他沒有成立國際航線要見我們都在走國際航線了咧他必須要有安全的航道安全航道要注意是你們後來應該那是管理上的問題小三通或是其他的行為這個都是我們雙方在現在這個機制底下去面對\n我要講一下我們這個自由貿易港區的申請為什麼要去離島建設條例修這個東西齁這個原因是這樣子如果我們是一個兩岸港或是你說的國內港小山東港不然還有什麼不叫國際港我們就只好修離島建設條例比照自由貿易港區來做自由貿易港好那如果我們不是我們是國際港的話我們就變成國際港我們就可以直接試用我們不用修離島建設條例啊你這個邏輯錯不是修\n離島條例讓他成為國際港是在必須國際港的條件我們才來做配套我們修離島階段就是一個還不足以成為一個我們所謂的我們修離島階段條例就是要修一個特別法讓他適用因為我們既然被你們認為不是 交通部認為基本不是國際港所以我們就要修一個特別法在離島階段條例以後比照自貿港的條例\n原來的一樣東西搬到離島街條裡頭我們就可以適用嘛那如果你們認為我們是國際港我們連修都不用修我們就適用就好我們就直接適用國際港的自由貿易港的辦法就好了嘛所以我也想知道我們明確定位是什麼既然賴總統我非常尊重賴總統而且我相信我們的總統既然賴總統您剛剛好 院長您剛剛也說了廈門是中華人民共和國金門是中華民國而且賴總統說兩邊互不隸屬嘛\n那不就兩國與國之間的關係就是國際港國和國之間不叫國際叫什麼咧所以我們這邊也是一個國際港啊所以就是基於這種地位的特殊當初設立的小山東等等就是跑這個地位特殊關係特殊的狀況之下沒有 你剛才也說啦 既然中華人民共和國和中華民國是互不隸屬嘛 對不對\n我也說了國際港它必須要安全穩定的安全是後來的事情安全是管理的問題現在金門是不是在對方艦機經常侵擾的情況之下它是不是安全穩定的它除了中華人民共和國跟中華民國來往之外它會不會有其他第三國家來參與呢軍機更常侵擾台灣本島啊那這些港口都不能變成國際港港本島有很多第三國家會來參與會來進出你了解我的意思嗎我們也可以變國際港香港的船也可以過來那個過來來我講到這個我舉例\n金門的機場就有國際包機啊 日本飛機也來飛啊越南也來飛啊 我們都飛去越南的啊你不是先想說 我們要先有這個條件成為嘛然後後面的管理是後面的事情嘛 對不對你要先給我們這個機會嘛要循序漸進 安撫就班好 那你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進我們要爭取這個 你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進我可以不要在離老街的條例修啊但是你要讓我變成國際法會 你幫我升格啊安平港就是升格的啊\n或者你就把我認為現在就是國際港委員提出的領導建制條例 其中並不只有這個重點對 可以討論 所有的法令都是可以討論的 好不好修法就是一個討論 民主就是討論的過程我的意思就是說 如果這樣子 因為按照賴總統的意思我們現在就是國際港了啊 你剛剛有回答我啊中華民國和中華人民共和國 那國和國之間往來怎麼不叫國際呢就是因為 修法提出來就是一個討論的過程就很多委員討論是反對的\n民進黨委員討論反對吧當然民進黨委員反對因為他們就說會洗產地啊或怎麼樣他們就抹黑我們離島的發展嘛那安平港就不會洗產地高雄港就不會洗產地那所謂洗產地怎麼越南泰國離中國大陸越南先聽我講\n你聽我講 當然要管制啊越南跟泰國離中國道很遠啊不是被洗產地你不會因為我們地理位置比較近就說我們會洗產地那高雄 安平 基隆 台北港我都有去看過啊他們就不會洗產地只有我們金門會洗產地我跟你講金門才不會洗產地因為金門地方很小每個人都幾乎彼此認識只要有人做洗產地馬上今天做明天就會被抓啦我跟你講金門就是這種很小的地方啊做不了什麼壞事的地方啊\n所以金門反而是一個很好管制的地方真的 金門就是一個這樣的地方我認識你三代 你認識我五代這種地方所以很容易管制我也不反對 本來就要管制我也剛說最後馬上要江湖每一年都每個月都要去查核我們支持啊我們只是想祈求跟台灣本島這些港口有一樣的地位而已我們不是想要特別做什麼你知道嗎我們只是祈求你給我們金門這樣的機會而已對於離島的特色文化行政院都願意支持\n所以這個 發揮觀光 發揮商業活動的可能性我們都願意支持那這個要循序漸進 按部就班的討論在國家安全情況底下 我們要列為優先重點這個要循序漸進 按部就班的討論\n好,謝謝陳委員也謝謝卓院長報告院會休息十分鐘休息之後繼續進行質問\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.787 --> 00:01.771\n謝謝主席,請這個院長請卓院長\n\n00:15.862 --> 00:30.932\n因為是戰地嘛所以很多的這個基礎建設都是國防部幫我們做的那海岸線因為受這個軍事管制所以都是比如說我們就不能下海然後很多沿海海岸線的這個相關產業就不發達了因為是\n\n00:31.552 --> 00:47.960\n軍事管制區散入者格殺勿論我小時候海邊都是有這支所以我們真正的漁港不多到現在來講大概只有三個地方新湖復國敦跟羅柱所以海上觀光也不大發達現在我們漁船的數量金門漁船數量總共的數量是兩百多艘\n\n00:52.662 --> 01:07.454\n那可以停的這個漁船的這個博位也是大概現在只有170個那當然最近這幾年在我們向中央爭取之下也有逐漸增加那大概也會到200多個但是呢200多個以後接著最近金門縣政府要開放這個\n\n01:10.076 --> 01:28.938\n台灣的漁船入籍到金門所以第一個漁船的博位會不足那更重要的是還有當然漁船這是經濟部漁業署那邊那更重要的是還有交通部管轄的自用小船金門的這個自用小船大概現在有400多艘那現在自用小船的停泊的這個博位有多少呢大概只有大概\n\n01:30.319 --> 01:54.438\n今年如果這個金門遊艇基地那個完成以後今年提竣工以後大概可以提供55個位置那九宮碼頭提供15個位置那大概就是70個位置那事實上金門的自用小船大概有400個位置所以我想請問院長是不是支持也請這個部長這邊是不是支持我們金門這個部分你們是不是應該做規劃因為現在的確已經不足了\n\n01:54.878 --> 02:22.935\n現在自用小船的泊位不足的情況下讓他們跟漁船的停泊常常發生糾紛就漁船的位置也不夠嘛那自用小船的位置非常不夠那當然自用小船是發展海上觀光的一個要點而且因為金門的大陸距現在有時候小三中介往來有時開始有大陸員因為廈門那邊有香山遊艇啊什麼有時候也願意到坐遊艇到我們金門旅遊坐正常的客輪以外所以這個部分的話是不是我們行政院這邊有沒有什麼做法\n\n02:23.916 --> 02:35.434\n興建這個相關的這個國委請部長回答但是我跟委員報告一件事情行政院對於離島地區能夠發揮離島在地的特色文化的任何的構想我們都願意很\n\n02:36.278 --> 02:57.436\n節省的跟大家來討論這個有助於觀光事業那至於說海港船舶的管理請部長來說明但是不夠席位啦碼頭博位不夠報告委員在111年到115年的這個計畫裡面我們已經補助金門縣政府2.47億元來建設這個博區來興建55席的博位對我知道55以後再加15那個我應該算給你\n\n03:01.139 --> 03:26.737\n那現在聽起來是狀況來看還是可能不夠還是差很多啊差好幾百個博文所以我們還是會繼續跟縣政府這邊來溝通有沒有可能我們再增加這樣子的建制跟建設現在這個我們原來原來水頭跟九宮那個地方事實上我們有實際去看所以交通部也找時間可以請航空局看就原來大小金門現在有金門大小原來那個在坐船的那個地方也就沒有需要大小金門的船嘛\n\n03:27.057 --> 03:39.124\n那邊就可以在偵測很簡單的就可以很快的偵測一些博位出來讓這個自用小船有停的地方才不會在金門常常有糾紛發生不管自用小船跟漁船就會常常為了搶博位這個東西縣政府也是一定支持只是說\n\n03:44.187 --> 04:12.410\n可能是不是動作要快一點這個經費的部分那事實上也不一定需要非常多錢因為做這個碼頭而已嘛做這個可以停靠的國衛而已是不是這個規劃是不是可以快一點啊我知道110年代110年有這個規劃但是55席和15席太少了現在的海上觀光因為小三通開始以後現在海上觀光也越來越蓬勃發展這是五一的時候就是剛過去這個到五一的年假我們一天就來了四五千個入客啦所以\n\n04:12.910 --> 04:27.302\n所以這個觀光發展是現在比較蓬勃發展但是就是說漁船還有這個交通自用小船的博位是遠遠不夠啊這個會引起很大的治安糾紛一直發生你盡快找時間是不是我也歡迎您過去啊\n\n04:28.803 --> 04:36.187\n跟部長還沒過去歡迎您到金門去實際考察看看好謝謝您那接著我想請教自由貿易港區的問題行政院經貿談判辦公室5月3號有發布新聞稿說我們的團隊我們政府的團隊已經在美東時間5月1號結束在華府就對等關稅等經貿議題和美國已經完成首輪的實體磋商對吧\n\n04:54.598 --> 05:16.574\n這個新聞稿有寫嘛是由我們副院長鄭麗君副院長還有我們談判總代表楊正麗帶隊會談氣氛坦誠榮恰雙方都表達對強化台美經貿合作的共同期待是這樣吧是的好那我想請教您就是談判裡頭當然就是gifttake我給你什麼你給我什麼在第一回合談判裡頭我們有沒有獲得具體的降稅承諾\n\n05:18.604 --> 05:40.637\n降稅現在不是要32%嗎原來我們只有很少你既然談判會談氣氛樓下嘛那大家都有共同強化合作的期待那有沒有什麼具體的承諾報告委員談判是一個整體的過程開始的第一次談判雙方把自己的立場充分交涉之後一定會有下一次更具體的但是有沒有具體的承諾我沒有要你告訴我什麼承諾有沒有獲得什麼具體的承諾\n\n05:43.138 --> 05:44.298\n談判一定到最後才能夠依照國際慣例跟雙方的默契我們在過程當中\n\n06:05.646 --> 06:20.876\n都不能說我們有過...沒有我沒有叫你告訴我談判的內容是什麼或具體的承諾有沒有在過程中他們有說具體說好你沒有叫我告訴你可是你問的就是這樣子沒有你不用告訴我內容有沒有具體的承諾沒有就對了好沒有沒關係談判第一次的過程是交換我們的方案是很具體的\n\n06:25.058 --> 06:31.926\n對方還沒有承諾還在一個過程還沒有承諾但是有過程而已談判是一個過程過程當中我們已經在相當優先的位置就是還沒有到後面還在來來回回還沒有什麼具體的結果應該這樣講就還沒有承諾\n\n06:40.615 --> 06:42.296\n這幾天我們看到新台幣不停的升值這個是不是我們給美國的承諾\n\n06:56.932 --> 07:18.901\n談判的過程沒有涉及任何匯率相關議題所以我們沒有給美國這個承諾說我們這個新台幣沒有談到任何匯率的相關議題沒有談給你機會講清楚因為這兩天這個升值實在是太嚴重了我們行政院的新聞稿對外也甚至講了總統在昨天的講話當中也講了談判過程沒有涉及到任何匯率的相關議題\n\n07:19.781 --> 07:47.288\n那如果沒有這樣的話這兩天的這個新台幣匯率這個升值對國內的這個出口產業很多產業影響太大了那你們就既然我們也沒有給美方承諾說我們一定要新台幣升值嘛那你們就應該要有你們的做法出來你們應該就是要看看國內產業受衝擊有多大影響太大很多產業再下去如果繼續這樣往下走的話已經很多產業受不了了這個你也不會比我不了解齁那我想你這個可能要相當注意啦齁\n\n07:48.328 --> 08:17.247\n下去就會帶來失業潮很多事情很多工廠可能就沒有辦法往下移然後接著會帶來的後續的很多反應連鎖反應會更大這一點你們要特別注意那當然不管你們有沒有承諾我們反正現在就是相信政府吧謝謝來接著我想請問民進黨委員之前一直在講說我所提的那個離島的自由貿易港區那我想請問美國貿易代表有沒有在這次會議中有沒有談到我們金門不能成立離島自由貿易港區\n\n08:18.681 --> 08:32.016\n這又是談判內容我怎麼會說有沒有呢所以你也不知道對不對你心裡應該知道不可能談到這個細節嘛你不知道細節喔這樣很嚴重喔你心裡應該知道不可能談到這種細節不可能有嘛所以不可能有談到嘛對不對\n\n08:33.678 --> 08:56.955\n我以為你不知道細節反正不可能談到啊不可能談到什麼金門成立自由貿易港區吧那也所以說或者說他關切息產地嘛因為金門還沒有成立嘛所以他關切息產地這個議題嘛之前說的那就是指那如果關切息產地現在如果自由貿易港區對趙民進黨立委的說法是一個可能息產地的地方那我們就要考慮說是現在有的這個自由貿易港區現在有自由貿易港區有幾個您知道嗎\n\n08:58.776 --> 09:13.106\n七個七個齁那自由貿易港區成立的先決條件是什麼這個部長知道嗎應該是要去國際港要去國際港對非常正確要去國際港齁那我想請問一下自由貿易港區成立後交通費要不要管理啊\n\n09:14.204 --> 09:33.397\n自由貿易港區那個地方都是交通部管理的要不要管理?要嘛,對不對?要不要進行業務查核啊?還是就放任他?我們配合經濟部跟財政部都有在做查核每年都要進行一次查核啦那我想請問,你說要自由貿易港又要是國際港嘛那安平港那時候不是國際港,為什麼也可以成立自由貿易港區?台南安平港台南安平港我們這資料有,我們有去查了\n\n09:38.752 --> 09:44.018\n後來港務公司投入後來才升現在是啦現在升級啦所以我想請問啦那我們今天港現在是什麼港國內商港那我們也可以提升為國際港吧\n\n09:56.492 --> 10:21.205\n目前沒有這個討論怎麼會沒有這個討論呢金門現在你認為金門現在沒有這個需求嗎目前沒有討論金門成為國際商港那我想請問金門現在是什麼港院長金門現在是什麼港那都是國內商港是國內商港嗎國際商港一定有他的量先不要講量還有重要是航線的安全跟穩定這些都要考慮的我說國際港是國際之間的往來嘛對不對是不是國際之間的往來嘛廈門屬於哪一國\n\n10:25.831 --> 10:27.833\n中華人民共和國中華民國互不隸屬金門已經在走國際航線\n\n10:37.076 --> 10:57.256\n不是嗎走國際航線不一定完全就是一個國際港走國際航線不是國際港所以他沒有成立國際航線要見我們都在走國際航線了咧他必須要有安全的航道安全航道要注意是你們後來應該那是管理上的問題小三通或是其他的行為這個都是我們雙方在現在這個機制底下去面對\n\n10:58.377 --> 11:21.013\n我要講一下我們這個自由貿易港區的申請為什麼要去離島建設條例修這個東西齁這個原因是這樣子如果我們是一個兩岸港或是你說的國內港小山東港不然還有什麼不叫國際港我們就只好修離島建設條例比照自由貿易港區來做自由貿易港好那如果我們不是我們是國際港的話我們就變成國際港我們就可以直接試用我們不用修離島建設條例啊你這個邏輯錯不是修\n\n11:24.958 --> 11:44.547\n離島條例讓他成為國際港是在必須國際港的條件我們才來做配套我們修離島階段就是一個還不足以成為一個我們所謂的我們修離島階段條例就是要修一個特別法讓他適用因為我們既然被你們認為不是交通部認為基本不是國際港所以我們就要修一個特別法在離島階段條例以後比照自貿港的條例\n\n11:45.487 --> 12:08.235\n原來的一樣東西搬到離島街條裡頭我們就可以適用嘛那如果你們認為我們是國際港我們連修都不用修我們就適用就好我們就直接適用國際港的自由貿易港的辦法就好了嘛所以我也想知道我們明確定位是什麼既然賴總統我非常尊重賴總統而且我相信我們的總統既然賴總統您剛剛好院長您剛剛也說了廈門是中華人民共和國金門是中華民國而且賴總統說兩邊互不隸屬嘛\n\n12:11.656 --> 12:30.021\n那不就兩國與國之間的關係就是國際港國和國之間不叫國際叫什麼咧所以我們這邊也是一個國際港啊所以就是基於這種地位的特殊當初設立的小山東等等就是跑這個地位特殊關係特殊的狀況之下沒有你剛才也說啦既然中華人民共和國和中華民國是互不隸屬嘛對不對\n\n12:31.121 --> 12:47.747\n我也說了國際港它必須要安全穩定的安全是後來的事情安全是管理的問題現在金門是不是在對方艦機經常侵擾的情況之下它是不是安全穩定的它除了中華人民共和國跟中華民國來往之外它會不會有其他第三國家來參與呢軍機更常侵擾台灣本島啊那這些港口都不能變成國際港港本島有很多第三國家會來參與會來進出你了解我的意思嗎我們也可以變國際港香港的船也可以過來那個過來來我講到這個我舉例\n\n13:00.771 --> 13:16.643\n金門的機場就有國際包機啊日本飛機也來飛啊越南也來飛啊我們都飛去越南的啊你不是先想說我們要先有這個條件成為嘛然後後面的管理是後面的事情嘛對不對你要先給我們這個機會嘛要循序漸進安撫就班好那你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進我們要爭取這個你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進我可以不要在離老街的條例修啊但是你要讓我變成國際法會你幫我升格啊安平港就是升格的啊\n\n13:25.550 --> 13:50.740\n或者你就把我認為現在就是國際港委員提出的領導建制條例其中並不只有這個重點對可以討論所有的法令都是可以討論的好不好修法就是一個討論民主就是討論的過程我的意思就是說如果這樣子因為按照賴總統的意思我們現在就是國際港了啊你剛剛有回答我啊中華民國和中華人民共和國那國和國之間往來怎麼不叫國際呢就是因為修法提出來就是一個討論的過程就很多委員討論是反對的\n\n13:53.154 --> 14:06.492\n民進黨委員討論反對吧當然民進黨委員反對因為他們就說會洗產地啊或怎麼樣他們就抹黑我們離島的發展嘛那安平港就不會洗產地高雄港就不會洗產地那所謂洗產地怎麼越南泰國離中國大陸越南先聽我講\n\n14:09.636 --> 14:33.309\n你聽我講當然要管制啊越南跟泰國離中國道很遠啊不是被洗產地你不會因為我們地理位置比較近就說我們會洗產地那高雄安平基隆台北港我都有去看過啊他們就不會洗產地只有我們金門會洗產地我跟你講金門才不會洗產地因為金門地方很小每個人都幾乎彼此認識只要有人做洗產地馬上今天做明天就會被抓啦我跟你講金門就是這種很小的地方啊做不了什麼壞事的地方啊\n\n14:33.809 --> 14:59.925\n所以金門反而是一個很好管制的地方真的金門就是一個這樣的地方我認識你三代你認識我五代這種地方所以很容易管制我也不反對本來就要管制我也剛說最後馬上要江湖每一年都每個月都要去查核我們支持啊我們只是想祈求跟台灣本島這些港口有一樣的地位而已我們不是想要特別做什麼你知道嗎我們只是祈求你給我們金門這樣的機會而已對於離島的特色文化行政院都願意支持\n\n15:00.746 --> 15:12.659\n所以這個發揮觀光發揮商業活動的可能性我們都願意支持那這個要循序漸進按部就班的討論在國家安全情況底下我們要列為優先重點這個要循序漸進按部就班的討論\n\n15:22.559 --> 15:29.806\n好,謝謝陳委員也謝謝卓院長報告院會休息十分鐘休息之後繼續進行質問\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.787,"end":1.771,"text":"謝謝主席,請這個院長請卓院長"},{"start":15.862,"end":30.932,"text":"因為是戰地嘛所以很多的這個基礎建設都是國防部幫我們做的那海岸線因為受這個軍事管制所以都是比如說我們就不能下海然後很多沿海海岸線的這個相關產業就不發達了因為是"},{"start":31.552,"end":47.96,"text":"軍事管制區 散入者格殺勿論我小時候海邊都是有這支所以我們真正的漁港不多到現在來講大概只有三個地方新湖 復國敦跟羅柱所以海上觀光也不大發達現在我們漁船的數量 金門漁船數量總共的數量是兩百多艘"},{"start":52.662,"end":67.454,"text":"那可以停的這個漁船的這個博位也是大概現在只有170個那當然最近這幾年在我們向中央爭取之下也有逐漸增加那大概也會到200多個但是呢200多個以後接著最近金門縣政府要開放這個"},{"start":70.076,"end":88.938,"text":"台灣的漁船入籍到金門所以第一個漁船的博位會不足那更重要的是還有當然漁船這是經濟部漁業署那邊那更重要的是還有交通部管轄的自用小船金門的這個自用小船大概現在有400多艘那現在自用小船的停泊的這個博位有多少呢大概只有大概"},{"start":90.319,"end":114.438,"text":"今年如果這個金門遊艇基地那個完成以後今年提竣工以後大概可以提供55個位置那九宮碼頭提供15個位置那大概就是70個位置那事實上金門的自用小船大概有400個位置所以我想請問院長是不是支持也請這個部長這邊是不是支持我們金門這個部分你們是不是應該做規劃因為現在的確已經不足了"},{"start":114.878,"end":142.935,"text":"現在自用小船的泊位不足的情況下讓他們跟漁船的停泊常常發生糾紛就漁船的位置也不夠嘛那自用小船的位置非常不夠那當然自用小船是發展海上觀光的一個要點而且因為金門的大陸距現在有時候小三中介往來有時開始有大陸員因為廈門那邊有香山遊艇啊什麼有時候也願意到坐遊艇到我們金門旅遊坐正常的客輪以外所以這個部分的話是不是我們行政院這邊有沒有什麼做法"},{"start":143.916,"end":155.434,"text":"興建這個相關的這個國委請部長回答 但是我跟委員報告一件事情行政院對於離島地區能夠發揮離島在地的特色文化的任何的構想我們都願意很"},{"start":156.278,"end":177.436,"text":"節省的跟大家來討論 這個有助於觀光事業那至於說 海港船舶的管理 請部長來說明但是不夠席位啦 碼頭博位不夠報告委員 在111年到115年的這個計畫裡面我們已經補助金門縣政府2.47億元來建設這個博區 來興建55席的博位對我知道 55以後再加15 那個我應該算給你"},{"start":181.139,"end":206.737,"text":"那現在聽起來是狀況來看還是可能不夠還是差很多啊 差好幾百個博文所以我們還是會繼續跟縣政府這邊來溝通有沒有可能我們再增加這樣子的建制跟建設現在這個我們原來原來水頭跟九宮那個地方 事實上我們有實際去看所以交通部也找時間可以請航空局看就原來大小金門 現在有金門大小原來那個在坐船的那個地方也就沒有需要大小金門的船嘛"},{"start":207.057,"end":219.124,"text":"那邊就可以在偵測很簡單的就可以很快的偵測一些博位出來讓這個自用小船有停的地方才不會在金門常常有糾紛發生不管自用小船跟漁船就會常常為了搶博位這個東西縣政府也是一定支持只是說"},{"start":224.187,"end":252.41,"text":"可能是不是動作要快一點 這個經費的部分那事實上也不一定需要非常多錢 因為做這個碼頭而已嘛做這個可以停靠的國衛而已是不是這個規劃是不是可以快一點啊我知道110年代110年有這個規劃 但是55席和15席太少了現在的海上觀光 因為小三通開始以後現在海上觀光也越來越蓬勃發展這是五一的時候 就是剛過去這個到五一的年假我們一天就來了四五千個 入客啦 所以"},{"start":252.91,"end":267.302,"text":"所以這個觀光發展是現在比較蓬勃發展但是就是說漁船還有這個交通自用小船的博位是遠遠不夠啊這個會引起很大的治安糾紛一直發生你盡快找時間是不是我也歡迎您過去啊"},{"start":268.803,"end":276.187,"text":"跟部長還沒過去 歡迎您到金門去實際考察看看好 謝謝您那接著我想請教自由貿易港區的問題行政院經貿談判辦公室5月3號有發布新聞稿說我們的團隊 我們政府的團隊已經在美東時間5月1號結束在華府就對等關稅等經貿議題和美國已經完成首輪的實體磋商 對吧"},{"start":294.598,"end":316.574,"text":"這個新聞稿有寫嘛是由我們副院長鄭麗君副院長還有我們談判總代表楊正麗帶隊會談氣氛坦誠榮恰雙方都表達對強化台美經貿合作的共同期待是這樣吧是的好 那我想請教您就是談判裡頭當然就是gift take我給你什麼你給我什麼在第一回合談判裡頭我們有沒有獲得具體的降稅承諾"},{"start":318.604,"end":340.637,"text":"降稅 現在不是要32%嗎原來我們只有很少 你既然談判會談氣氛樓下嘛那大家都有共同強化合作的期待那有沒有什麼具體的承諾報告委員 談判是一個整體的過程開始的第一次談判 雙方把自己的立場充分交涉之後一定會有下一次更具體的但是有沒有具體的承諾 我沒有要你告訴我什麼承諾有沒有獲得什麼具體的承諾"},{"start":343.138,"end":344.298,"text":"談判一定到最後才能夠依照國際慣例跟雙方的默契我們在過程當中"},{"start":365.646,"end":380.876,"text":"都不能說我們有過...沒有我沒有叫你告訴我談判的內容是什麼或具體的承諾有沒有在過程中他們有說具體說好你沒有叫我告訴你可是你問的就是這樣子沒有你不用告訴我內容有沒有具體的承諾沒有就對了好沒有沒關係談判第一次的過程是交換我們的方案是很具體的"},{"start":385.058,"end":391.926,"text":"對方還沒有承諾還在一個過程還沒有承諾但是有過程而已談判是一個過程過程當中我們已經在相當優先的位置就是還沒有到後面還在來來回回還沒有什麼具體的結果應該這樣講就還沒有承諾"},{"start":400.615,"end":402.296,"text":"這幾天我們看到新台幣不停的升值這個是不是我們給美國的承諾"},{"start":416.932,"end":438.901,"text":"談判的過程沒有涉及任何匯率相關議題所以我們沒有給美國這個承諾說我們這個新台幣沒有談到任何匯率的相關議題沒有談 給你機會講清楚因為這兩天這個升值實在是太嚴重了我們行政院的新聞稿對外也甚至講了總統在昨天的講話當中也講了談判過程沒有涉及到任何匯率的相關議題"},{"start":439.781,"end":467.288,"text":"那如果沒有這樣的話這兩天的這個新台幣匯率這個升值對國內的這個出口產業很多產業影響太大了那你們就 既然我們也沒有給美方承諾說我們一定要新台幣升值嘛那你們就應該要有你們的做法出來你們應該就是要看看國內產業受衝擊有多大影響太大很多產業再下去如果繼續這樣往下走的話已經很多產業受不了了這個你也不會比我不了解齁那我想你這個可能要相當注意啦齁"},{"start":468.328,"end":497.247,"text":"下去就會帶來失業潮很多事情很多工廠可能就沒有辦法往下移然後接著會帶來的後續的很多反應連鎖反應會更大這一點你們要特別注意那當然不管你們有沒有承諾我們反正現在就是相信政府吧謝謝來 接著我想請問民進黨委員之前一直在講說我所提的那個離島的自由貿易港區那我想請問美國貿易代表有沒有在這次會議中有沒有談到我們金門不能成立離島自由貿易港區"},{"start":498.681,"end":512.016,"text":"這又是談判內容 我怎麼會說有沒有呢所以你也不知道對不對你心裡應該知道不可能談到這個細節嘛你不知道細節喔 這樣很嚴重喔你心裡應該知道不可能談到這種細節不可能有嘛 所以不可能有談到嘛 對不對"},{"start":513.678,"end":536.955,"text":"我以為你不知道細節 反正不可能談到啊 不可能談到什麼金門成立自由貿易港區吧那也 所以說 或者說他關切息產地嘛因為金門還沒有成立嘛所以他關切息產地這個議題嘛 之前說的那就是指 那如果關切息產地 現在如果自由貿易港區對趙民進黨立委的說法是一個可能息產地的地方那我們就要考慮說是現在有的這個自由貿易港區現在有自由貿易港區有幾個 您知道嗎"},{"start":538.776,"end":553.106,"text":"七個 七個齁 那自由貿易港區成立的先決條件是什麼這個部長知道嗎應該是要去國際港要去國際港 對 非常正確 要去國際港齁那我想請問一下 自由貿易港區成立後交通費要不要管理啊"},{"start":554.204,"end":573.397,"text":"自由貿易港區那個地方都是交通部管理的要不要管理?要嘛,對不對?要不要進行業務查核啊?還是就放任他?我們配合經濟部跟財政部都有在做查核每年都要進行一次查核啦那我想請問,你說要自由貿易港又要是國際港嘛那安平港那時候不是國際港,為什麼也可以成立自由貿易港區?台南安平港台南安平港我們這資料有,我們有去查了"},{"start":578.752,"end":584.018,"text":"後來港務公司投入 後來才升現在是啦 現在升級啦所以我想請問啦 那我們今天港現在是什麼港國內商港 那我們也可以提升為國際港吧"},{"start":596.492,"end":621.205,"text":"目前沒有這個討論怎麼會沒有這個討論呢金門現在你認為金門現在沒有這個需求嗎目前沒有討論金門成為國際商港那我想請問金門現在是什麼港院長金門現在是什麼港那都是國內商港是國內商港嗎國際商港一定有他的量先不要講量還有重要是航線的安全跟穩定這些都要考慮的我說國際港是國際之間的往來嘛對不對是不是國際之間的往來嘛廈門屬於哪一國"},{"start":625.831,"end":627.833,"text":"中華人民共和國 中華民國 互不隸屬金門已經在走國際航線"},{"start":637.076,"end":657.256,"text":"不是嗎走國際航線不一定完全就是一個國際港走國際航線不是國際港所以他沒有成立國際航線要見我們都在走國際航線了咧他必須要有安全的航道安全航道要注意是你們後來應該那是管理上的問題小三通或是其他的行為這個都是我們雙方在現在這個機制底下去面對"},{"start":658.377,"end":681.013,"text":"我要講一下我們這個自由貿易港區的申請為什麼要去離島建設條例修這個東西齁這個原因是這樣子如果我們是一個兩岸港或是你說的國內港小山東港不然還有什麼不叫國際港我們就只好修離島建設條例比照自由貿易港區來做自由貿易港好那如果我們不是我們是國際港的話我們就變成國際港我們就可以直接試用我們不用修離島建設條例啊你這個邏輯錯不是修"},{"start":684.958,"end":704.547,"text":"離島條例讓他成為國際港是在必須國際港的條件我們才來做配套我們修離島階段就是一個還不足以成為一個我們所謂的我們修離島階段條例就是要修一個特別法讓他適用因為我們既然被你們認為不是 交通部認為基本不是國際港所以我們就要修一個特別法在離島階段條例以後比照自貿港的條例"},{"start":705.487,"end":728.235,"text":"原來的一樣東西搬到離島街條裡頭我們就可以適用嘛那如果你們認為我們是國際港我們連修都不用修我們就適用就好我們就直接適用國際港的自由貿易港的辦法就好了嘛所以我也想知道我們明確定位是什麼既然賴總統我非常尊重賴總統而且我相信我們的總統既然賴總統您剛剛好 院長您剛剛也說了廈門是中華人民共和國金門是中華民國而且賴總統說兩邊互不隸屬嘛"},{"start":731.656,"end":750.021,"text":"那不就兩國與國之間的關係就是國際港國和國之間不叫國際叫什麼咧所以我們這邊也是一個國際港啊所以就是基於這種地位的特殊當初設立的小山東等等就是跑這個地位特殊關係特殊的狀況之下沒有 你剛才也說啦 既然中華人民共和國和中華民國是互不隸屬嘛 對不對"},{"start":751.121,"end":767.747,"text":"我也說了國際港它必須要安全穩定的安全是後來的事情安全是管理的問題現在金門是不是在對方艦機經常侵擾的情況之下它是不是安全穩定的它除了中華人民共和國跟中華民國來往之外它會不會有其他第三國家來參與呢軍機更常侵擾台灣本島啊那這些港口都不能變成國際港港本島有很多第三國家會來參與會來進出你了解我的意思嗎我們也可以變國際港香港的船也可以過來那個過來來我講到這個我舉例"},{"start":780.771,"end":796.643,"text":"金門的機場就有國際包機啊 日本飛機也來飛啊越南也來飛啊 我們都飛去越南的啊你不是先想說 我們要先有這個條件成為嘛然後後面的管理是後面的事情嘛 對不對你要先給我們這個機會嘛要循序漸進 安撫就班好 那你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進我們要爭取這個 你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進我可以不要在離老街的條例修啊但是你要讓我變成國際法會 你幫我升格啊安平港就是升格的啊"},{"start":805.55,"end":830.74,"text":"或者你就把我認為現在就是國際港委員提出的領導建制條例 其中並不只有這個重點對 可以討論 所有的法令都是可以討論的 好不好修法就是一個討論 民主就是討論的過程我的意思就是說 如果這樣子 因為按照賴總統的意思我們現在就是國際港了啊 你剛剛有回答我啊中華民國和中華人民共和國 那國和國之間往來怎麼不叫國際呢就是因為 修法提出來就是一個討論的過程就很多委員討論是反對的"},{"start":833.154,"end":846.492,"text":"民進黨委員討論反對吧當然民進黨委員反對因為他們就說會洗產地啊或怎麼樣他們就抹黑我們離島的發展嘛那安平港就不會洗產地高雄港就不會洗產地那所謂洗產地怎麼越南泰國離中國大陸越南先聽我講"},{"start":849.636,"end":873.309,"text":"你聽我講 當然要管制啊越南跟泰國離中國道很遠啊不是被洗產地你不會因為我們地理位置比較近就說我們會洗產地那高雄 安平 基隆 台北港我都有去看過啊他們就不會洗產地只有我們金門會洗產地我跟你講金門才不會洗產地因為金門地方很小每個人都幾乎彼此認識只要有人做洗產地馬上今天做明天就會被抓啦我跟你講金門就是這種很小的地方啊做不了什麼壞事的地方啊"},{"start":873.809,"end":899.925,"text":"所以金門反而是一個很好管制的地方真的 金門就是一個這樣的地方我認識你三代 你認識我五代這種地方所以很容易管制我也不反對 本來就要管制我也剛說最後馬上要江湖每一年都每個月都要去查核我們支持啊我們只是想祈求跟台灣本島這些港口有一樣的地位而已我們不是想要特別做什麼你知道嗎我們只是祈求你給我們金門這樣的機會而已對於離島的特色文化行政院都願意支持"},{"start":900.746,"end":912.659,"text":"所以這個 發揮觀光 發揮商業活動的可能性我們都願意支持那這個要循序漸進 按部就班的討論在國家安全情況底下 我們要列為優先重點這個要循序漸進 按部就班的討論"},{"start":922.559,"end":929.806,"text":"好,謝謝陳委員也謝謝卓院長報告院會休息十分鐘休息之後繼續進行質問"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":224,"blocks":[["陳委員玉珍：（10時21分）謝謝主席，請院長。"],["主席：請卓院長備詢。"],["陳委員玉珍：院長早。"],["卓院長榮泰：陳委員好。"],["陳委員玉珍：因為金門早期是戰地，所以很多基礎建設都是國防部幫我們做的，海岸線也因為受軍事管制，所以都是……比如說，我們不能下海，很多沿海的海岸線相關產業就不發達，因為「軍事管制區，擅入者格殺勿論」，我小時候看到海邊都有這些字，因此我們真正的漁港不多，到現在大概只有三個地方，新湖、復國墩跟羅厝，海上觀光也不太發達。","現在我們金門漁船數量總共是兩百多艘，可以停漁船的泊位也大概只有170個，最近這幾年在我們向中央爭取之下有逐漸增加，大概也會到兩百多個，但是兩百多個以後，最近金門縣政府又要開放臺灣的漁船入籍到金門，所以漁船的泊位會不足，當然漁船是經濟部漁業署那邊負責，但更重要的還有交通部管轄的自用小船，現在金門的自用小船大概有四百多艘，那現在自用小船的停泊泊位有多少呢？如果今年金門遊艇基地完成，今年底竣工以後大概可以提供55個位置，九宮碼頭提供15個位置，那就是70個位置。事實上，金門的自用小船要400個位置，所以我想請問院長和部長，對於我們金門這部分，你們是不是應該做規劃？因為現在的確已經不足了，在自用小船泊位不足的情況下，使他們跟漁船之間的停泊常常發生糾紛，漁船的位置不夠，自用小船的位置是非常不夠。自用小船是發展海上觀光的要點，而且因為金門離大陸近，現在有小三通的自由往來，大陸廈門那邊開始有香山遊艇，他們有時候除了坐正常客輪以外，也願意坐遊艇到我們金門旅遊，關於這個部分，行政院這邊有沒有什麼做法？針對興建相關的泊位。"],["卓院長榮泰：好，請部長回答。但是我跟委員報告一件事情，行政院對於離島地區能夠發揮離島在地特色文化的任何構想，我們都願意很竭誠的跟大家討論，這個有助於觀光事業……"],["陳委員玉珍：是，但是沒有……"],["卓院長榮泰：至於海港船舶的管理，我請部長來說明。"],["陳委員玉珍：但是碼頭的泊位不夠。"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，在111年到115年的計畫裡面，我們已經補助金門縣政府2.47億元來建設泊區，興建55席的泊位……"],["陳委員玉珍：對，我知道……"],["陳部長世凱：這樣聽起來……"],["陳委員玉珍：55以後再加15，我一樣算給你是70嘛！"],["陳部長世凱：現在聽起來，以這個狀況來看，可能還是不夠……"],["陳委員玉珍：還是差很多啊！差好幾百個泊位。"],["陳部長世凱：我們交通部還是會繼續跟縣政府溝通，看有沒有可能再增加這樣子的建置跟建設，有可能的話，我們會來協助。"],["陳委員玉珍：原來水頭跟九宮那個地方，事實上我們有實際去看，交通部也可以找時間請航港局去看，大、小金門現在有金門大橋，原來坐船的地方沒有需要大、小金門的船，那邊可以很簡單的再增設一些泊位出來，讓自用小船有停的地方，才不會常常在金門有糾紛發生，自用小船跟漁船常常為了搶泊位……"],["陳部長世凱：我們來跟縣政府溝通，看那個地方可不可以空出來使用。"],["陳委員玉珍：這東西縣政府一定支持，只是動作可能要快一點，尤其是經費部分。事實上不一定需要非常多錢，因為只是做碼頭而已、做可以停靠的泊位而已。"],["陳部長世凱：對，泊位而已。"],["陳委員玉珍：規劃是不是可以快一點？我知道110年到115年有這個規劃，但55席、15席實在太少了。尤其小三通開始後，現在海上觀光越來越蓬勃發展。像大陸剛過去的五一連假，金門一天就來了四、五千名陸客，所以現在觀光是比較蓬勃發展的，但漁船和交通自用小船的泊位卻遠遠不夠，這會引起很大的治安糾紛，而且是一直一直發生。部長是不是儘快找時間來？我也歡迎你到金門來。"],["陳部長世凱：我們會跟縣政府溝通。"],["陳委員玉珍：部長還沒去過金門，歡迎你帶著航港局長到金門實地考察看看。謝謝部長。","接下來我想請教自由貿易港區的問題。院長，行政院經貿談判辦公室5月3日發布新聞稿說，我們的政府團隊已經在美東時間5月1日結束在華府就對等關稅等經貿議題和美國完成首輪的實體磋商，對吧？"],["卓院長榮泰：是的。"],["陳委員玉珍：這點新聞稿有寫，由副院長鄭麗君及談判總代表楊珍妮帶隊，會談氣氛坦誠融洽，雙方都表達對強化臺美經貿合作有共同期待，是這樣嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：是的。"],["陳委員玉珍：我想請教你，所謂談判當然就是give & take，我給你什麼，你給我什麼。請問在第一輪談判裡，我們有沒有獲得具體的降稅承諾？"],["卓院長榮泰：具體的什麼？"],["陳委員玉珍：降稅，現在它不是要32%嗎？原來我們只課很少。既然說會談氣氛融洽，且大家都有共同強化合作的期待，所以有沒有什麼具體承諾？"],["卓院長榮泰：報告委員，談判是一個整體過程，開始的第一次談判，雙方把自己的立場充分交涉之後，下一次一定會有更具體的談判。"],["陳委員玉珍：對，但是有沒有具體的承諾？我沒有要你告訴我什麼承諾，但有沒有獲得什麼具體的承諾？有沒有？"],["卓院長榮泰：談判還不到……"],["陳委員玉珍：有沒有承諾？至於內容是什麼，因為還在談判，你可以不用告訴我。但是有沒有獲得什麼具體的承諾？"],["卓院長榮泰：談判一定要到最後才能依照國際慣例跟雙方的默契……"],["陳委員玉珍：所以現在還沒有什麼具體的承諾？好，我們有沒有給它什麼具體的承諾？我方有沒有給美方什麼具體的承諾？"],["卓院長榮泰：還是那句話，談判一定要依照國際慣例跟雙方的默契，在過程當中不能說我們有……"],["陳委員玉珍：我沒有要你告訴我談判的內容是什麼，或具體承諾什麼！但在過程中他們有沒有具體說……"],["卓院長榮泰：委員雖然說不用告訴你，可是你問的就是這樣子。"],["陳委員玉珍：沒有、沒有，你不用告訴我內容。我只問有沒有具體承諾？沒有就對了？沒有沒關係，因為還在過程中，我理解。"],["卓院長榮泰：第一次談判的過程是交換……我們的方案是有，我們的方案是很具體的。"],["陳委員玉珍：但是對方還沒有承諾，就是還在過程中，還沒有承諾，但是有過程而已。"],["卓院長榮泰：談判是一個過程，現在還在過程當中。"],["陳委員玉珍：就是過程，還沒到後面？"],["卓院長榮泰：我們已經在相當優先的位置。"],["陳委員玉珍：就是還沒到後面……"],["卓院長榮泰：當然還沒有。"],["陳委員玉珍：還在來來回回，還沒有什麼具體的結果。應該這樣講，還沒有承諾，就是沒有結果。"],["卓院長榮泰：為下一次的談判奠定良好基礎……"],["陳委員玉珍：也就是說還在談判過程，還沒有完全有什麼承諾產生，但還在繼續談，至少是一個氣氛融洽的談判，這樣講沒錯吧？"],["卓院長榮泰：是的。"],["陳委員玉珍：我想請問，這幾天我們看到新臺幣不停升值，這是不是我們給美國的承諾？"],["卓院長榮泰：談判過程沒有涉及任何匯率相關的議題。"],["陳委員玉珍：所以我們沒有承諾美國說新臺幣……"],["卓院長榮泰：沒有談到任何匯率相關的議題。"],["陳委員玉珍：沒有談？我是給你機會講清楚，因為這兩天新臺幣升值得實在太嚴重了。"],["卓院長榮泰：楊總裁講了，行政院新聞稿也對外講了，甚至昨天總統在講話當中也講了，談判過程沒有涉及到任何匯率的相關議題。"],["陳委員玉珍：如果沒有的話……但這兩天新臺幣匯率升值對國內很多出口產業影響太大了！"],["卓院長榮泰：是的。"],["陳委員玉珍：既然我們沒有給美方承諾說一定讓新臺幣升值，那麼你們就應該要有你們的作法出來，你們要看看國內產業受衝擊有多大！因為影響實在太大，如果再繼續這樣往下走，會有很多產業……現在已經有很多產業受不了，這點你不會比我不了解，所以要相當注意。我擔心這樣下去會帶來失業潮……"],["卓院長榮泰：這點我們的觀察是一樣的。"],["陳委員玉珍：很多事情、很多工廠可能就沒有辦法下去，後續會帶來很多反應，且連鎖反應會更大，這點請特別注意。"],["卓院長榮泰：我們非常謹慎。"],["陳委員玉珍：當然不管你們有沒有承諾，我們現在反正就是相信政府。"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝。"],["陳委員玉珍：接著我想請問，民進黨委員之前一直說我所提的離島自由貿易港區的問題，請問美國貿易代表有沒有在這次會議中談到金門不能成立離島自由貿易港區？"],["卓院長榮泰：這又是談判內容，我怎麼能說有或沒有？"],["陳委員玉珍：所以你也不知道，對不對？有沒有把金門成立自由貿易港區……"],["卓院長榮泰：你心裡應該知道不可能談到這種細節嘛！"],["陳委員玉珍：你不知道細節？這樣很嚴重喔！"],["卓院長榮泰：你心裡應該知道不可能談到這種細節！"],["陳委員玉珍：不可能有、不可能有談到，對不對？我以為你不知道細節。反正不可能談到啦，不可能談到什麼金門成立自由貿易港區嘛。或者說他關切洗產地吧，因為金門還沒有成立嘛……"],["卓院長榮泰：是的。"],["陳委員玉珍：所以他關切洗產地這個議題嘛，對不對？"],["卓院長榮泰：洗產地、違規轉運、出口管制。"],["陳委員玉珍：好，他關切洗產地，現在如果自由貿易港區，照民進黨立委的說法，是一個可能洗產地的地方，那我們就要考慮現有的自由貿易港區。現有的自由貿易港區有幾個，您知道嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：7個。"],["陳委員玉珍：7個？好。那自由貿易港區成立的先決條件是什麼？部長知道嗎？院長知道嗎？"],["陳部長世凱：應該要是國際港。"],["陳委員玉珍：要是國際港，對，非常正確，要是國際港。我想請問，自由貿易港區成立以後，交通部要不要管理？"],["陳部長世凱：自由貿易港區那個地方都是交通部管理。"],["陳委員玉珍：要不要管理？要嘛，對不對？要不要進行業務查核？還是就放任它？"],["陳部長世凱：我們配合經濟部跟財政部都有在做查核，最近都有在加強。"],["陳委員玉珍：每年都要進行一次查核啦。我想請問，你說自由貿易港要是國際港，臺南安平港那時候不是國際港，為什麼也可以成立自由貿易港區？"],["陳部長世凱：臺南安平港？"],["陳委員玉珍：對，我們這個資料有，我有去查了，後來港務公司投入……"],["陳部長世凱：應該是可以……"],["陳委員玉珍：後來才升……它成立，還沒有升自由貿易港，但後來才……"],["陳部長世凱：它可以做國際的商港，沒有錯。"],["陳委員玉珍：現在是啊，現在升級啦。"],["陳部長世凱：是啊，是啊。"],["陳委員玉珍：所以我想請問，那我們金門港現在是什麼港？"],["陳部長世凱：國內商港。"],["陳委員玉珍：國內商港嘛，那我們也可以提升為國際港吧？"],["陳部長世凱：看需求，目前沒有這個討論。"],["陳委員玉珍：怎麼會沒有這個討論咧，難道你認為金門現在沒有這個需求嗎？"],["陳部長世凱：目前沒有討論金門成為國際商港。"],["陳委員玉珍：那我想請問金門現在是什麼港，院長，金門現在是什麼港？"],["卓院長榮泰：剛剛說是國內商港……"],["陳委員玉珍：是國內商港嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：委員，國際商港一定有它的量，還有整個航線的……"],["陳委員玉珍：先不要講量，讓它成立，安平港以前沒有……"],["卓院長榮泰：還有重要的是航線的安全跟穩定。"],["陳委員玉珍：對、對、對，這些都要考慮的，我是說國際港就是國際之間的往來嘛，對不對？是不是？"],["卓院長榮泰：是。"],["陳委員玉珍：國際之間的往來嘛，廈門屬於哪一國？"],["卓院長榮泰：中華人民共和國。"],["陳委員玉珍：金門咧？"],["卓院長榮泰：中華民國。"],["陳委員玉珍：這兩個賴總統說……"],["卓院長榮泰：互不隸屬。"],["陳委員玉珍：賴總統說什麼？"],["卓院長榮泰：互不隸屬。"],["陳委員玉珍：對啊！賴總統說兩國互不隸屬啊。"],["卓院長榮泰：是。"],["陳委員玉珍：那金門已經在走國際航線了啊，不是嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：走國際航線不一定完全就是一個國際港，我剛剛說的，它本來必須要有安全的……"],["陳委員玉珍：走國際航線不是國際港，所以它沒有成立國際港的要件喔？我們都在走國際航線了咧！"],["卓院長榮泰：它必須要有一個安全的航道，安全的……"],["陳委員玉珍：不是，安全航道要注意是你們後來應該……那是管理上的問題……"],["卓院長榮泰：小三通或是其他的行為，這個都是我們雙方在現在這個基礎底下去面對的。"],["陳委員玉珍：是，我要講一下，我們要申請成為自由貿易港區為什麼要去修離島建設條例這個東西？原因是這樣子，如果我們是一個兩岸港或是你說的國內港、小三通港，不管叫什麼也不叫國際港，我們就只好修離島建設條例，比照自由貿易港區來做自由貿易港。好，那如果我們是國際港的話，我們就變成國際港，我們就可以直接適用，我們不用修離島建設條例啊！"],["卓院長榮泰：不是、不是，委員，你這個邏輯錯了，不是修離島條例讓它成為國際港，是它必須是國際港的條件，我們才來做配套……"],["陳委員玉珍：不是、不是，沒錯，我們修離島建設條例就是一個……"],["卓院長榮泰：現在它應該還不足以成為一個我們所謂的安全、穩定的國際航線的國際港。"],["陳委員玉珍：不是，院長，我們修離島建設條例就是要修一個特別法讓它適用，因為我們既然被你們認為不是、交通部認為金門不是國際港，所以我們就修一個特別法，在離島建設條例裡面比照自貿港的條例，原來一樣的東西搬到離島建設條例裡頭，我們就可以適用嘛。那如果你們認為我們是國際港，我們連修都不用修，我們就適用就好了，我們就直接適用自由貿易港的辦法就好了嘛，所以我很想知道我們明確的定位是什麼？我非常尊重賴總統，而且我相信我們的總統，既然賴總統還有院長您剛剛也說了，廈門是中華人民共和國，金門是中華民國，而且賴總統說兩邊互不隸屬，那不就是國與國之間的關係，就是國際港，國和國之間不叫國際叫什麼咧？所以我們金門也是一個國際港啊！"],["卓院長榮泰：所以就是基於這種地位的特殊……"],["陳委員玉珍：所以我們不用修法，那我們……"],["卓院長榮泰：當初設立了小三通等等，就是要處理這種地位特殊、關係特殊的狀況。"],["陳委員玉珍：沒有，你剛剛也說了，既然中華人民共和國和中華民國是互不隸屬，對不對？"],["卓院長榮泰：不是，我也說了，國際港必須有安全穩定的航線……"],["陳委員玉珍：安全是後來的事情、安全是管理的問題。"],["卓院長榮泰：不是、不是，現在金門在對方艦、機經常侵擾的情況底下，它是不是安全穩定？除了中華人民共和國跟中華民國來往之外，它會不會有其他第三國家來參與呢？"],["陳委員玉珍：不要跟我講軍機，軍機更常侵擾臺灣本島，那這些港口都不能變成國際港囉？"],["卓院長榮泰：但是臺灣本島的港口有很多第三國家的船隻會進出，金門是有可能嗎？"],["陳委員玉珍：我們也可以變國際港，香港的船也可以過來，日本的船也可以過來……"],["卓院長榮泰：它必須要成為……"],["陳委員玉珍：來，講到這個我舉例，金門的機場就有國際包機──日本飛機也來飛，越南也來飛，我們都飛去越南了。你不是想說我們要先有這個條件成為，然後後面的管理是後面的事情嘛，對不對？你要先給我們這個機會嘛。"],["卓院長榮泰：所以要循序漸進、按部就班。"],["陳委員玉珍：好，那你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進？我們要爭取之後，你要怎麼樣讓我們循序漸進？也可以不要在離島建設條例修啊，但是你要讓我變成國際港或者你幫我升格啊，安平港就是升格的啊，要不然你就把金門認為現在就是國際港。"],["卓院長榮泰：委員提出的離島建設條例其中並不只有這個重點，有非常非常的多。"],["陳委員玉珍：對！可以討論，所有的法令都是可以討論的，好不好？修法就是一個討論，民主就是討論的過程，我的意思就是說，如果這樣子，因為按照賴總統的意思，我們現在就是國際港了，你剛剛有回答我，中華民國和中華人民共和國，那國和國之間往來怎麼不叫國際呢？international……"],["卓院長榮泰：報告委員，就是因為修法提出來就是一個討論的過程，有很多委員討論是反對的。"],["陳委員玉珍：那是民進黨委員討論反對吧！當然民進黨委員反對，因為他們就說會洗產地或怎麼樣的，他們就抹黑我們離島的發展嘛，那安平港就不會洗產地？高雄港就不會洗產地？所謂的洗產地，越南、泰國離中國大陸……"],["卓院長榮泰：對於有可能違規轉運的地方，我們都會強力的管制。"],["陳委員玉珍：先聽我講，你聽我講，當然要管制啊！越南跟泰國離中國大陸很遠啊！還不是被洗產地，你不能因為我們地理位置比較近就說我們會洗產地，那高雄、安平、基隆、臺北港，我都有去看過了，他們就不會洗產地？只有我們金門會洗產地？我跟你講，金門才不會洗產地，因為金門地方很小，每個人幾乎都彼此認識，只要有人做洗產地，今天做，明天馬上就會被抓了，我跟你講，金門就是這種很小的地方，做不了什麼壞事的地方，所以金門反而是一個很好管制的地方，真的，金門就是一個這樣的地方，我認識你三代，你認識我五代這種地方，所以很容易管制，我也不反對，本來就要管制，我剛剛說自由貿易港區，交通部每一年、每個月都要去查核，我們支持啊！我們只是想祈求跟臺灣本島這些港口有一樣的地位而已，我們不是想要特別做什麼，你知道嗎？我們只是請你給我們金門這樣的機會而已。"],["卓院長榮泰：對於離島的特色文化，行政院都願意支持。"],["陳委員玉珍：對啊！那所以……"],["卓院長榮泰：所有它發揮觀光、發揮商業活動的可能性，我們都願意支持。"],["陳委員玉珍：是，那是不是幫我們升格？"],["卓院長榮泰：要循序漸進、按部就班的討論，在國家安全的情況底下，我們要列為優先重點。"],["陳委員玉珍：那幫我們升格為國際港好嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：這個要循序漸進、按部就班的討論。"],["陳委員玉珍：可以吧！提一個計畫好不好？"],["卓院長榮泰：繼續討論，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝陳委員、謝謝卓院長。報告院會，休息10分鐘，休息之後繼續進行質詢。現在休息。","休息（10時36分）","繼續開會（10時47分）"]],"agenda":{"page_end":218,"meet_id":"院會-11-3-10","speakers":["韓國瑜","江啟臣","陳超明","黃建賓","魯明哲","顏寬恒","陳玉珍","林倩綺","林沛祥","黃國昌","林國成","李昆澤","林月琴","賴士葆","黃秀芳","王正旭","盧縣一","李彥秀","楊曜","麥玉珍","廖偉翔","陳菁徽","林淑芬","馬文君","邱若華","蘇巧慧"],"page_start":117,"meetingDate":["2025-05-06"],"gazette_id":"1144201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144201_00004","1144201_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期第10次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢─ 詢答完畢─","agenda_id":"1144201_00004"}}}