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\"科技執法其實警政署跟地方政府已經有在執行執行看起來成效也都還不錯另外針對教育的層面我們也在做努力工程的層面我們也在做努力本席其實有做一個提案就是把交通安全的教育列到我們很基本的教育裡面讓大家對於空間開始慢慢有一些感覺跟看法\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"科\", \"start\": 497.161, \"end\": 497.321, \"score\": 0.961}, {\"word\": \"技\", \"start\": 497.321, \"end\": 497.682, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"執\"}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 497.682, \"end\": 497.822, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 497.822, \"end\": 498.102, \"score\": 0.822}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"警\", \"start\": 498.102, \"end\": 498.282, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 498.282, \"end\": 498.542, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"署\", \"start\": 498.542, \"end\": 498.782, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 498.782, \"end\": 498.962, \"score\": 0.831}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 498.962, \"end\": 499.083, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 499.083, \"end\": 499.263, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 499.263, \"end\": 499.463, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": 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0.991}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"左\", \"start\": 999.305, \"end\": 999.345, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 999.345, \"end\": 999.365, \"score\": 0.001}, {\"word\": \"長\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:15,013 --> 00:00:21,600\n主席福音同仁大家好我們事先請我們卓院長跟陳部長請卓院長跟陳部長備詢\n\n2\n00:00:34,628 --> 00:00:43,978\n本席今天針對交通安全跟觀光的議題來跟你們做個討論我們現在已經邁入了高齡社會根據內政部的資料統計目前65歲以上的老人已經達到了429萬\n\n3\n00:00:54,212 --> 00:01:11,324\n六千九百八十五人那佔全國總人口的18%那以這樣的速度我們應該很快的就會進入超高齡社會20%的這個比例我想很快就會到了所以今天本席想要針對高齡族群的交通事故來跟您做個討論\n\n4\n00:01:12,685 --> 00:01:38,406\n高齡者一直是交通事故的高風險群我們在人行步道、公車站牌跟失能老人的接送基本上很不友善老人的視力跟體能所以我們在高齡化的社會老人的人數不斷地成長當然我們應該要有更符合高齡人口生活的環境比如建置完善的人行道或者是適合老人行動的公共設施\n\n5\n00:01:39,187 --> 00:01:54,559\n那麼本席這邊要提醒一下整個交通部在老人設施的這個部分目前的一個做法所以依據數據我們看到高齡機車騎士的死傷案件比前一年增加了2574件\n\n6\n00:01:56,280 --> 00:02:17,634\n高齡者在路口的交通事故也比前一年增加了2005件整體高齡者死傷的人數年增2981人已經快3000了行人總死傷的人數總共17000多件但是高齡者就佔了6195件比例是非常高的將近三分之一\n\n7\n00:02:18,434 --> 00:02:45,309\n這樣子的數字背後呈現了整個趨勢的成長但是這不是偶然的那交通部目前的狀況呢依本席所知道是以宣導跟增設標誌來處理問題那這樣子似乎有點消極那長者現在已經是一個高風險群那也由於他們的整個機能的問題呢我們交通環境好像沒有跟上人口結構的改變那院長您的看法呢\n\n8\n00:02:46,226 --> 00:02:56,101\n非常謝謝委員為我們這種族群65歲以上的高齡者的安全來設想那其實我們在討論過程當中年輕的族群\n\n9\n00:02:56,960 --> 00:03:22,907\n在騎機車跟高齡的在交通事故上面都有呈現很高的一個數字那高齡的尤其在清晨去運動的時候發生的狀況也非常多那他騎車的時候有些自己本身的條件或是疏離住也很多所以我們就從各方面來討論過我們在路口安全行人安全跟改善路口計畫當中我們多次都討論到這樣相關的議題那是不是部長能夠再仔細的說明一下\n\n10\n00:03:24,987 --> 00:03:44,013\n所以你們現在比較具體的一個做法是您所提到的這個人行的空間這個相當的重要所以我們在永續提升人行安全計畫裡面我們四年其實會投入400億的這個經費我們希望讓人行道的建置能夠更加的完整在過馬路行穿線的部分也要更加的完整至少你們現在在經費上有投入\n\n11\n00:03:44,693 --> 00:04:13,068\n那本席這邊還是提醒在高齡的部分要更加的做一個規劃像我們的整個行人道的高低不平這個問題我想大家都知道那常常走路的時候就阻礙重重那另外有一個很重要的就是說我們的耗制燈高齡者平均每秒的速度是0.8公尺到1公尺但是我們的整個設計大概都是1.2公尺的一個耗制秒數所以這個部分應該更具體的來做一個改善\n\n12\n00:04:13,948 --> 00:04:37,654\n那另外呢目前的自行車道規劃感覺還是以汽機車為規劃的主體所以在日常的這個通行跟休閒的安全需求也是非常高你們有沒有可能針對這個高齡友善的交通來把它置放在一個國家戰略的這個一個核心然後進行部會系統性的改造來跨部會來做一個處理跟整理有沒有這個可能我們多年前就有透過一個高齡駕駛\n\n13\n00:04:43,550 --> 00:04:56,003\n健康檢查跟評估制度從他本身的條件來做起那我們希望高齡比方說我們曾經討論過除了耗資標示之外的這個加強之外如果早晨要不要給他身上有一個什麼樣的標示\n\n14\n00:04:57,332 --> 00:05:21,598\n地方政府執行多年這個成效都不好所以必須要找出其他的方式所以本席這邊建議在那個道安長照社福跟都市規劃的相關單位應該做一個跨部會的處理跟整合因為這些地方是高齡人口經常會去走動的那您剛才講的是時間上的問題那但是有沒有可能做一個高齡人口活動熱區的道路安全總體的一個檢討\n\n15\n00:05:24,099 --> 00:05:50,033\n然後至少我們讓它在生活上跟交通安全上能夠扣連在一起去減低高齡人口交通事故的一個比例這個部分可以嗎您的這個建議其實非常好我可以請運輸研究所來做這方面的研究如果在高齡者比較有在行動的熱區的部分我們對於當區的整體的交通該怎麼做改善我覺得這個應該會相當有意義\n\n16\n00:05:51,494 --> 00:06:18,695\n是不是應該定一個改善的期程比如說哪一年你要做到高齡事故的減半計畫因為您剛才也投入了一些經費或者是仿效國外的VisionZero這樣子的一個零事故死亡的政策那可能期程要比較具體的訂定出來您如果投入的是四年的經費那短中長期大概每一段時間要進行到哪裡\n\n17\n00:06:19,275 --> 00:06:48,440\n那我想比較具體這個部分我們其實是針對整體的行人安全跟整體的交通安全在做改善那您剛剛所提醒的就是說針對高齡者要不要再做更特別的規劃那這個部分我們會再規劃道安的比例也是非常高就是他們碰到事故的比例非常高就是機車老人跟酒駕都是相當高的一個造勢的狀態那這個部分其實這幾年的改善\n\n18\n00:06:48,840 --> 00:07:11,973\n已經有看到一些成效也確實都在下降當中數據看起來都在下降當中但是您所提醒的高齡者的部分我們會另外再來做研究看怎麼樣再來提升他們的安全對就針對這個部分可能要有一個具體的時程所以道路不只是移動的空間也是生活的延伸所以剛才本席才針對高齡者會活動的這些場域希望你們做一個總檢討跟整體的設計\n\n19\n00:07:13,954 --> 00:07:34,131\n好那您剛才其實也提到酒駕或者是我們未來要探討的一個危險駕駛的這個部分那111年警察交通執法與事故處理的滿意度調查其中很多人對於這個危險駕車有一些怨言那大概100人當中會有40人那依照警政署去年的一個\n\n20\n00:07:35,993 --> 00:07:58,307\n通報的統計危險駕車的汽車違規佔比有7乘5那麼不遵行方向行駛的機車違規佔比有8乘4那另外呢汽車佔比這個高項目的是危險駕車有75.32然後超出速限的有40公里以下的佔了72.79這一些數據其實代表了危險駕駛\n\n21\n00:07:59,628 --> 00:08:14,245\n跟危險駕車是民眾一直所在意的也凸顯了我們的交通環境中危險車型的一個制度性問題那是不是目前你們有沒有在研議科技執法上以及提高刑責來產生嚇阻的一個作用呢\n\n22\n00:08:17,161 --> 00:08:39,817\n科技執法其實警政署跟地方政府已經有在執行執行看起來成效也都還不錯另外針對教育的層面我們也在做努力工程的層面我們也在做努力本席其實有做一個提案就是把交通安全的教育列到我們很基本的教育裡面讓大家對於空間開始慢慢有一些感覺跟看法\n\n23\n00:08:40,618 --> 00:09:07,891\n好那我引用一下交通部你們大灣司的這個相關的數據大型車的這個案件比去年同時期增加了137件那整體來講有13736件那這個的例子就跟去年東海大學的那個女大學生被輾過被大型車輾過的狀況一樣因為大型車有很多的死角那去年這個事故最主要是大型車沒有看到她又輾了一次結果\n\n24\n00:09:08,991 --> 00:09:29,505\n一條美麗的生命就這樣子沒有了所以大型客車的事故的致死率比一般汽車機車都來得高所以我們有沒有思考現行大型車輛駕駛訓練的標準能不能應付很多元的道路的狀況尤其是在繁忙的時間跟路段比較複雜行駛時的一個挑戰呢\n\n25\n00:09:32,058 --> 00:10:00,288\n報告委員我們針對這個小型車跟大型車都一樣我們現在正在做這個整體駕訓的檢討駕訓機制所以也可能駕訓的這個部分會有一些調整當你駕訓的機制做檢討跟調整之後他之後的這個客運的司機駕駛啦他的整體的訓練就會不一樣那這是一方面那二方面我們針對公司也就是在監理的層面針對客運公司的要求也希望他們能夠落實到要求我們的客運的駕駛\n\n26\n00:10:01,268 --> 00:10:18,414\n對於一些我們新的規則的要求要落實那還有他們的開車習慣我們從司機的職開始做一個整體的調整跟改變那當然你們在外部的環境像你們要針對駕駛行為然後另外制度也是有一些需要改進的嘛\n\n27\n00:10:18,934 --> 00:10:34,707\n那道路的設計還有交通文化的這個部分我覺得這樣比較治本而不是只有治標所以你們是不是有制定長期的計畫特別是針對青少年跟新駕駛人的這個交通安全的宣導活動不知道你們有沒有這個短中長期的計畫\n\n28\n00:10:35,527 --> 00:11:03,918\n報告委員這個計畫我們都有運研所前一陣子才做出一套系統我們針對國小跟國中跟高中用一種沉浸式的一個模式透過平板讓他學習在道路上包含走路要怎麼走怎麼樣過馬路然後怎麼樣才會安全謝謝部長您剛才有提到包含騎摩托車也都有全部都有融入到教育的層面您有提到平板不過本席認為真正在實地空間的這樣一個模擬跟訓練是重要的\n\n29\n00:11:04,158 --> 00:11:32,338\n要不然有些東西我們看了但是碰到了實際的狀況那個反應是不一樣的我們在各個縣市其實也盡量在建設這個交通安全的這個學習的園區啦這個學習的園區就是要讓我們的年輕人或者是小朋友在那個園區可以學習到實際在道路上可能會遇到的狀況所以這一點把本席的建議納入進去那對於空間的實際感覺是很重要的是沒有錯好謝謝\n\n30\n00:11:36,124 --> 00:12:04,943\n那接下來呢本席要為地方來請命因為過去本席在嘉義工作那本席就發現因為常常有這樣子走動的機會所以呢嘉義市是目前全國唯一沒有跟高鐵連接的軌道城市那這個問題很久了那這個問題很奇怪的不是單純只有行政的問題喔而是中央對於區域交通的這個正義跟公義還有產業平衡的這個發展還有對歷史的承諾其實都有一點點狀況\n\n31\n00:12:06,324 --> 00:12:29,334\n所以高鐵嘉義市線是唯一沒有軌道連結的運輸系統你可以想像一個每年超過630萬人次的高鐵站竟然沒有一個軌道系統來連結不是很奇怪嗎這樣的斷點如果依照我們的了解是中央規劃有一些缺失還有長年政策的失衡的結果\n\n32\n00:12:30,094 --> 00:12:53,235\n其實交通部在民國88年就已經完成嘉義高鐵聯外道路的可行性評估那也明確的表示呢當時高鐵局長明確的表示那個運量達到的之後呢就要進行鋪設結果行政院在94年更直接合附交通部來辦理BRT的階段性方案這就是我們目前在搭的\n\n33\n00:12:53,775 --> 00:13:19,458\n那這個BRT呢其實現在運量已經每一年都達到130萬人次尖峰時段還常常都客滿那本席也常常搭不到所以這個部分呢本席因為問了所以才發現那中央竟然說在這個軌道的部分要地方政府來分擔這似乎有一點奇怪不知道部長您對這個事情的看法如何報告委員輕軌系統跟捷運系統都是地方辦理事項所以各個縣市都一樣\n\n34\n00:13:19,878 --> 00:13:38,446\n本席這邊可能先提醒全國的高鐵的軌道系統應該大部分都是由中央這邊全額來負擔的這是依照大眾捷運法的第13條的這樣一個規定你們卻應該用這樣子的一個高度來看全國的一個軌道的網絡\n\n35\n00:13:42,107 --> 00:14:00,143\n但是BRT現在的運量已經足夠了嘛結果你們現在竟然叫他們用一個下位的審查作業要點的規範叫地方政府來做負擔我想這個部分針對所有的高鐵與連外的軌道似乎對嘉義縣市有一些不公平您的看法呢\n\n36\n00:14:01,442 --> 00:14:14,571\n報告委員這個其實各縣市都一樣只要是輕軌跟捷運系統但是它這個輕軌是從是高鐵延伸出去的一個網絡從高鐵嘉義站到台鐵嘉義站我想這個部分中央應該難辭其咎吧\n\n37\n00:14:15,933 --> 00:14:29,929\n您的看法呢報告委員這個部分當然嘉義縣市自己也要有共識啦因為目前我聽起來嘉義縣政府他們當然是樂觀其成但是對於經費上面他們也是有一些意見所以本席這邊提醒您\n\n38\n00:14:31,291 --> 00:14:31,591\n一個癥結這個工程款是374億\n\n39\n00:14:53,700 --> 00:15:09,973\n如果中央可以負擔的話是工程款本身的372億地方只負責用地費用的0.66億跟嘉義縣的0.94億他們都不注意中央可以負擔372億但是連這樣都談不攏都要中央全額負擔\n\n40\n00:15:11,155 --> 00:15:36,009\n所以中央有沒有可能跟嘉義市這邊再來共同研議一方院又要把財政收支發放法全部移給地方等一下院長財發法是今年的事情那我們剛才談的其實是好幾年前的事好不好做一個研議好嗎不要拿現在的變數把過去的東西都全部抹滅掉這我給你們一個建議啦大家再來談談看好不好好最後一個\n\n41\n00:15:56,476 --> 00:16:07,071\n在這個部分跟地方業者再多談一下然後不要讓他們你們利益良好的東西結果地方業者不接受反倒有一些部內的事物你們不知道是不是可以再管\n\n42\n00:16:08,920 --> 00:16:35,007\n然後第二個很重要一點我上禮拜參加了聖父蘭基獨特首席的開幕我要跟你們提醒的是雖然你們未來在公共藝術的意象上有原住民但是不要忘了原先的原住民的意象是非常明顯的本期在這邊跟你們討論跟建議原住民的意象不能小於之前的原住民的意象那是我們共同的記憶有沒有可能\n\n43\n00:16:39,043 --> 00:16:39,365\n謝謝林委員謝謝左院長\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n15013\t21600\t主席福音同仁大家好我們事先請我們卓院長跟陳部長請卓院長跟陳部長備詢\n34628\t43978\t本席今天針對交通安全跟觀光的議題來跟你們做個討論我們現在已經邁入了高齡社會根據內政部的資料統計目前65歲以上的老人已經達到了429萬\n54212\t71324\t六千九百八十五人那佔全國總人口的18%那以這樣的速度我們應該很快的就會進入超高齡社會20%的這個比例我想很快就會到了所以今天本席想要針對高齡族群的交通事故來跟您做個討論\n72685\t98406\t高齡者一直是交通事故的高風險群我們在人行步道、公車站牌跟失能老人的接送基本上很不友善老人的視力跟體能所以我們在高齡化的社會老人的人數不斷地成長當然我們應該要有更符合高齡人口生活的環境比如建置完善的人行道或者是適合老人行動的公共設施\n99187\t114559\t那麼本席這邊要提醒一下整個交通部在老人設施的這個部分目前的一個做法所以依據數據我們看到高齡機車騎士的死傷案件比前一年增加了2574件\n116280\t137634\t高齡者在路口的交通事故也比前一年增加了2005件整體高齡者死傷的人數年增2981人已經快3000了行人總死傷的人數總共17000多件但是高齡者就佔了6195件比例是非常高的將近三分之一\n138434\t165309\t這樣子的數字背後呈現了整個趨勢的成長但是這不是偶然的那交通部目前的狀況呢依本席所知道是以宣導跟增設標誌來處理問題那這樣子似乎有點消極那長者現在已經是一個高風險群那也由於他們的整個機能的問題呢我們交通環境好像沒有跟上人口結構的改變那院長您的看法呢\n166226\t176101\t非常謝謝委員為我們這種族群65歲以上的高齡者的安全來設想那其實我們在討論過程當中年輕的族群\n176960\t202907\t在騎機車跟高齡的在交通事故上面都有呈現很高的一個數字那高齡的尤其在清晨去運動的時候發生的狀況也非常多那他騎車的時候有些自己本身的條件或是疏離住也很多所以我們就從各方面來討論過我們在路口安全行人安全跟改善路口計畫當中我們多次都討論到這樣相關的議題那是不是部長能夠再仔細的說明一下\n204987\t224013\t所以你們現在比較具體的一個做法是您所提到的這個人行的空間這個相當的重要所以我們在永續提升人行安全計畫裡面我們四年其實會投入400億的這個經費我們希望讓人行道的建置能夠更加的完整在過馬路行穿線的部分也要更加的完整至少你們現在在經費上有投入\n224693\t253068\t那本席這邊還是提醒在高齡的部分要更加的做一個規劃像我們的整個行人道的高低不平這個問題我想大家都知道那常常走路的時候就阻礙重重那另外有一個很重要的就是說我們的耗制燈高齡者平均每秒的速度是0.8公尺到1公尺但是我們的整個設計大概都是1.2公尺的一個耗制秒數所以這個部分應該更具體的來做一個改善\n253948\t277654\t那另外呢目前的自行車道規劃感覺還是以汽機車為規劃的主體所以在日常的這個通行跟休閒的安全需求也是非常高你們有沒有可能針對這個高齡友善的交通來把它置放在一個國家戰略的這個一個核心然後進行部會系統性的改造來跨部會來做一個處理跟整理有沒有這個可能我們多年前就有透過一個高齡駕駛\n283550\t296003\t健康檢查跟評估制度從他本身的條件來做起那我們希望高齡 比方說我們曾經討論過除了耗資標示之外的這個加強之外如果早晨要不要給他身上有一個什麼樣的標示\n297332\t321598\t地方政府執行多年這個成效都不好所以必須要找出其他的方式所以本席這邊建議在那個道安長照社福跟都市規劃的相關單位應該做一個跨部會的處理跟整合因為這些地方是高齡人口經常會去走動的那您剛才講的是時間上的問題那但是有沒有可能做一個高齡人口活動熱區的道路安全總體的一個檢討\n324099\t350033\t然後至少我們讓它在生活上跟交通安全上能夠扣連在一起去減低高齡人口交通事故的一個比例這個部分可以嗎您的這個建議其實非常好我可以請運輸研究所來做這方面的研究如果在高齡者比較有在行動的熱區的部分我們對於當區的整體的交通該怎麼做改善我覺得這個應該會相當有意義\n351494\t378695\t是不是應該定一個改善的期程比如說哪一年你要做到高齡事故的減半計畫因為您剛才也投入了一些經費或者是仿效國外的Vision Zero這樣子的一個零事故死亡的政策那可能期程要比較具體的訂定出來您如果投入的是四年的經費那短中長期大概每一段時間要進行到哪裡\n379275\t408440\t那我想比較具體這個部分我們其實是針對整體的行人安全跟整體的交通安全在做改善那您剛剛所提醒的就是說針對高齡者要不要再做更特別的規劃那這個部分我們會再規劃道安的比例也是非常高就是他們碰到事故的比例非常高就是機車老人跟酒駕都是相當高的一個造勢的狀態那這個部分其實這幾年的改善\n408840\t431973\t已經有看到一些成效也確實都在下降當中數據看起來都在下降當中但是您所提醒的高齡者的部分我們會另外再來做研究看怎麼樣再來提升他們的安全對 就針對這個部分可能要有一個具體的時程所以道路不只是移動的空間也是生活的延伸所以剛才本席才針對高齡者會活動的這些場域希望你們做一個總檢討跟整體的設計\n433954\t454131\t好那您剛才其實也提到酒駕或者是我們未來要探討的一個危險駕駛的這個部分那111年警察交通執法與事故處理的滿意度調查其中很多人對於這個危險駕車有一些怨言那大概100人當中會有40人那依照警政署去年的一個\n455993\t478307\t通報的統計危險駕車的汽車違規佔比有7乘5那麼不遵行方向行駛的機車違規佔比有8乘4那另外呢汽車佔比這個高項目的是危險駕車有75.32然後超出速限的有40公里以下的佔了72.79這一些數據其實代表了危險駕駛\n479628\t494245\t跟危險駕車是民眾一直所在意的也凸顯了我們的交通環境中危險車型的一個制度性問題那是不是目前你們有沒有在研議科技執法上以及提高刑責來產生嚇阻的一個作用呢\n497161\t519817\t科技執法其實警政署跟地方政府已經有在執行執行看起來成效也都還不錯另外針對教育的層面我們也在做努力工程的層面我們也在做努力本席其實有做一個提案就是把交通安全的教育列到我們很基本的教育裡面讓大家對於空間開始慢慢有一些感覺跟看法\n520618\t547891\t好那我引用一下交通部你們大灣司的這個相關的數據大型車的這個案件比去年同時期增加了137件那整體來講有13736件那這個的例子就跟去年東海大學的那個女大學生被輾過被大型車輾過的狀況一樣因為大型車有很多的死角那去年這個事故最主要是大型車沒有看到她又輾了一次結果\n548991\t569505\t一條美麗的生命就這樣子沒有了所以大型客車的事故的致死率比一般汽車機車都來得高所以我們有沒有思考現行大型車輛駕駛訓練的標準能不能應付很多元的道路的狀況尤其是在繁忙的時間跟路段比較複雜行駛時的一個挑戰呢\n572058\t600288\t報告委員我們針對這個小型車跟大型車都一樣我們現在正在做這個整體駕訓的檢討駕訓機制所以也可能駕訓的這個部分會有一些調整當你駕訓的機制做檢討跟調整之後他之後的這個客運的司機駕駛啦他的整體的訓練就會不一樣那這是一方面那二方面我們針對公司也就是在監理的層面針對客運公司的要求也希望他們能夠落實到要求我們的客運的駕駛\n601268\t618414\t對於一些我們新的規則的要求要落實那還有他們的開車習慣我們從司機的職開始做一個整體的調整跟改變那當然你們在外部的環境像你們要針對駕駛行為然後另外制度也是有一些需要改進的嘛\n618934\t634707\t那道路的設計還有交通文化的這個部分我覺得這樣比較治本而不是只有治標所以你們是不是有制定長期的計畫特別是針對青少年跟新駕駛人的這個交通安全的宣導活動不知道你們有沒有這個短中長期的計畫\n635527\t663918\t報告委員 這個計畫我們都有運研所前一陣子才做出一套系統我們針對國小跟國中跟高中用一種沉浸式的一個模式透過平板讓他學習在道路上包含走路要怎麼走 怎麼樣過馬路然後怎麼樣才會安全謝謝部長您剛才有提到包含騎摩托車也都有全部都有融入到教育的層面您有提到平板不過本席認為真正在實地空間的這樣一個模擬跟訓練是重要的\n664158\t692338\t要不然有些東西我們看了但是碰到了實際的狀況那個反應是不一樣的我們在各個縣市其實也盡量在建設這個交通安全的這個學習的園區啦這個學習的園區就是要讓我們的年輕人或者是小朋友在那個園區可以學習到實際在道路上可能會遇到的狀況所以這一點把本席的建議納入進去那對於空間的實際感覺是很重要的是 沒有錯好 謝謝\n696124\t724943\t那接下來呢本席要為地方來請命因為過去本席在嘉義工作那本席就發現因為常常有這樣子走動的機會所以呢嘉義市是目前全國唯一沒有跟高鐵連接的軌道城市那這個問題很久了那這個問題很奇怪的不是單純只有行政的問題喔而是中央對於區域交通的這個正義跟公義還有產業平衡的這個發展還有對歷史的承諾其實都有一點點狀況\n726324\t749334\t所以高鐵嘉義市線是唯一沒有軌道連結的運輸系統你可以想像一個每年超過630萬人次的高鐵站竟然沒有一個軌道系統來連結不是很奇怪嗎這樣的斷點如果依照我們的了解是中央規劃有一些缺失還有長年政策的失衡的結果\n750094\t773235\t其實交通部在民國88年就已經完成嘉義高鐵聯外道路的可行性評估那也明確的表示呢當時高鐵局長明確的表示那個運量達到的之後呢就要進行鋪設結果行政院在94年更直接合附交通部來辦理BRT的階段性方案這就是我們目前在搭的\n773775\t799458\t那這個BRT呢其實現在運量已經每一年都達到130萬人次尖峰時段還常常都客滿那本席也常常搭不到所以這個部分呢本席因為問了所以才發現那中央竟然說在這個軌道的部分要地方政府來分擔這似乎有一點奇怪不知道部長您對這個事情的看法如何報告委員輕軌系統跟捷運系統都是地方辦理事項所以各個縣市都一樣\n799878\t818446\t本席這邊可能先提醒全國的高鐵的軌道系統應該大部分都是由中央這邊全額來負擔的這是依照大眾捷運法的第13條的這樣一個規定你們卻應該用這樣子的一個高度來看全國的一個軌道的網絡\n822107\t840143\t但是BRT現在的運量已經足夠了嘛結果你們現在竟然叫他們用一個下位的審查作業要點的規範叫地方政府來做負擔我想這個部分針對所有的高鐵與連外的軌道似乎對嘉義縣市有一些不公平 您的看法呢\n841442\t854571\t報告委員 這個其實各縣市都一樣只要是輕軌跟捷運系統但是它這個輕軌是從是高鐵延伸出去的一個網絡從高鐵嘉義站到台鐵嘉義站我想這個部分中央應該難辭其咎吧\n855933\t869929\t您的看法呢報告委員這個部分當然嘉義縣市自己也要有共識啦因為目前我聽起來嘉義縣政府他們當然是樂觀其成但是對於經費上面他們也是有一些意見所以本席這邊提醒您\n871291\t871591\t一個癥結 這個工程款是374億\n893700\t909973\t如果中央可以負擔的話是工程款本身的372億地方只負責用地費用的0.66億跟嘉義縣的0.94億他們都不注意中央可以負擔372億但是連這樣都談不攏都要中央全額負擔\n911155\t936009\t所以中央有沒有可能跟嘉義市這邊再來共同研議一方院又要把財政收支發放法全部移給地方等一下 院長 財發法是今年的事情那我們剛才談的其實是好幾年前的事好不好 做一個研議好嗎不要拿現在的變數把過去的東西都全部抹滅掉這我給你們一個建議啦 大家再來談談看好不好好 最後一個\n956476\t967071\t在這個部分跟地方業者再多談一下然後不要讓他們你們利益良好的東西結果地方業者不接受反倒有一些部內的事物你們不知道是不是可以再管\n968920\t995007\t然後第二個很重要一點我上禮拜參加了聖父蘭基獨特首席的開幕我要跟你們提醒的是雖然你們未來在公共藝術的意象上有原住民但是不要忘了原先的原住民的意象是非常明顯的本期在這邊跟你們討論跟建議原住民的意象不能小於之前的原住民的意象那是我們共同的記憶有沒有可能\n999043\t999365\t謝謝林委員謝謝左院長\n","txt":"主席福音同仁大家好我們事先請我們卓院長跟陳部長請卓院長跟陳部長備詢\n本席今天針對交通安全跟觀光的議題來跟你們做個討論我們現在已經邁入了高齡社會根據內政部的資料統計目前65歲以上的老人已經達到了429萬\n六千九百八十五人那佔全國總人口的18%那以這樣的速度我們應該很快的就會進入超高齡社會20%的這個比例我想很快就會到了所以今天本席想要針對高齡族群的交通事故來跟您做個討論\n高齡者一直是交通事故的高風險群我們在人行步道、公車站牌跟失能老人的接送基本上很不友善老人的視力跟體能所以我們在高齡化的社會老人的人數不斷地成長當然我們應該要有更符合高齡人口生活的環境比如建置完善的人行道或者是適合老人行動的公共設施\n那麼本席這邊要提醒一下整個交通部在老人設施的這個部分目前的一個做法所以依據數據我們看到高齡機車騎士的死傷案件比前一年增加了2574件\n高齡者在路口的交通事故也比前一年增加了2005件整體高齡者死傷的人數年增2981人已經快3000了行人總死傷的人數總共17000多件但是高齡者就佔了6195件比例是非常高的將近三分之一\n這樣子的數字背後呈現了整個趨勢的成長但是這不是偶然的那交通部目前的狀況呢依本席所知道是以宣導跟增設標誌來處理問題那這樣子似乎有點消極那長者現在已經是一個高風險群那也由於他們的整個機能的問題呢我們交通環境好像沒有跟上人口結構的改變那院長您的看法呢\n非常謝謝委員為我們這種族群65歲以上的高齡者的安全來設想那其實我們在討論過程當中年輕的族群\n在騎機車跟高齡的在交通事故上面都有呈現很高的一個數字那高齡的尤其在清晨去運動的時候發生的狀況也非常多那他騎車的時候有些自己本身的條件或是疏離住也很多所以我們就從各方面來討論過我們在路口安全行人安全跟改善路口計畫當中我們多次都討論到這樣相關的議題那是不是部長能夠再仔細的說明一下\n所以你們現在比較具體的一個做法是您所提到的這個人行的空間這個相當的重要所以我們在永續提升人行安全計畫裡面我們四年其實會投入400億的這個經費我們希望讓人行道的建置能夠更加的完整在過馬路行穿線的部分也要更加的完整至少你們現在在經費上有投入\n那本席這邊還是提醒在高齡的部分要更加的做一個規劃像我們的整個行人道的高低不平這個問題我想大家都知道那常常走路的時候就阻礙重重那另外有一個很重要的就是說我們的耗制燈高齡者平均每秒的速度是0.8公尺到1公尺但是我們的整個設計大概都是1.2公尺的一個耗制秒數所以這個部分應該更具體的來做一個改善\n那另外呢目前的自行車道規劃感覺還是以汽機車為規劃的主體所以在日常的這個通行跟休閒的安全需求也是非常高你們有沒有可能針對這個高齡友善的交通來把它置放在一個國家戰略的這個一個核心然後進行部會系統性的改造來跨部會來做一個處理跟整理有沒有這個可能我們多年前就有透過一個高齡駕駛\n健康檢查跟評估制度從他本身的條件來做起那我們希望高齡 比方說我們曾經討論過除了耗資標示之外的這個加強之外如果早晨要不要給他身上有一個什麼樣的標示\n地方政府執行多年這個成效都不好所以必須要找出其他的方式所以本席這邊建議在那個道安長照社福跟都市規劃的相關單位應該做一個跨部會的處理跟整合因為這些地方是高齡人口經常會去走動的那您剛才講的是時間上的問題那但是有沒有可能做一個高齡人口活動熱區的道路安全總體的一個檢討\n然後至少我們讓它在生活上跟交通安全上能夠扣連在一起去減低高齡人口交通事故的一個比例這個部分可以嗎您的這個建議其實非常好我可以請運輸研究所來做這方面的研究如果在高齡者比較有在行動的熱區的部分我們對於當區的整體的交通該怎麼做改善我覺得這個應該會相當有意義\n是不是應該定一個改善的期程比如說哪一年你要做到高齡事故的減半計畫因為您剛才也投入了一些經費或者是仿效國外的Vision Zero這樣子的一個零事故死亡的政策那可能期程要比較具體的訂定出來您如果投入的是四年的經費那短中長期大概每一段時間要進行到哪裡\n那我想比較具體這個部分我們其實是針對整體的行人安全跟整體的交通安全在做改善那您剛剛所提醒的就是說針對高齡者要不要再做更特別的規劃那這個部分我們會再規劃道安的比例也是非常高就是他們碰到事故的比例非常高就是機車老人跟酒駕都是相當高的一個造勢的狀態那這個部分其實這幾年的改善\n已經有看到一些成效也確實都在下降當中數據看起來都在下降當中但是您所提醒的高齡者的部分我們會另外再來做研究看怎麼樣再來提升他們的安全對 就針對這個部分可能要有一個具體的時程所以道路不只是移動的空間也是生活的延伸所以剛才本席才針對高齡者會活動的這些場域希望你們做一個總檢討跟整體的設計\n好那您剛才其實也提到酒駕或者是我們未來要探討的一個危險駕駛的這個部分那111年警察交通執法與事故處理的滿意度調查其中很多人對於這個危險駕車有一些怨言那大概100人當中會有40人那依照警政署去年的一個\n通報的統計危險駕車的汽車違規佔比有7乘5那麼不遵行方向行駛的機車違規佔比有8乘4那另外呢汽車佔比這個高項目的是危險駕車有75.32然後超出速限的有40公里以下的佔了72.79這一些數據其實代表了危險駕駛\n跟危險駕車是民眾一直所在意的也凸顯了我們的交通環境中危險車型的一個制度性問題那是不是目前你們有沒有在研議科技執法上以及提高刑責來產生嚇阻的一個作用呢\n科技執法其實警政署跟地方政府已經有在執行執行看起來成效也都還不錯另外針對教育的層面我們也在做努力工程的層面我們也在做努力本席其實有做一個提案就是把交通安全的教育列到我們很基本的教育裡面讓大家對於空間開始慢慢有一些感覺跟看法\n好那我引用一下交通部你們大灣司的這個相關的數據大型車的這個案件比去年同時期增加了137件那整體來講有13736件那這個的例子就跟去年東海大學的那個女大學生被輾過被大型車輾過的狀況一樣因為大型車有很多的死角那去年這個事故最主要是大型車沒有看到她又輾了一次結果\n一條美麗的生命就這樣子沒有了所以大型客車的事故的致死率比一般汽車機車都來得高所以我們有沒有思考現行大型車輛駕駛訓練的標準能不能應付很多元的道路的狀況尤其是在繁忙的時間跟路段比較複雜行駛時的一個挑戰呢\n報告委員我們針對這個小型車跟大型車都一樣我們現在正在做這個整體駕訓的檢討駕訓機制所以也可能駕訓的這個部分會有一些調整當你駕訓的機制做檢討跟調整之後他之後的這個客運的司機駕駛啦他的整體的訓練就會不一樣那這是一方面那二方面我們針對公司也就是在監理的層面針對客運公司的要求也希望他們能夠落實到要求我們的客運的駕駛\n對於一些我們新的規則的要求要落實那還有他們的開車習慣我們從司機的職開始做一個整體的調整跟改變那當然你們在外部的環境像你們要針對駕駛行為然後另外制度也是有一些需要改進的嘛\n那道路的設計還有交通文化的這個部分我覺得這樣比較治本而不是只有治標所以你們是不是有制定長期的計畫特別是針對青少年跟新駕駛人的這個交通安全的宣導活動不知道你們有沒有這個短中長期的計畫\n報告委員 這個計畫我們都有運研所前一陣子才做出一套系統我們針對國小跟國中跟高中用一種沉浸式的一個模式透過平板讓他學習在道路上包含走路要怎麼走 怎麼樣過馬路然後怎麼樣才會安全謝謝部長您剛才有提到包含騎摩托車也都有全部都有融入到教育的層面您有提到平板不過本席認為真正在實地空間的這樣一個模擬跟訓練是重要的\n要不然有些東西我們看了但是碰到了實際的狀況那個反應是不一樣的我們在各個縣市其實也盡量在建設這個交通安全的這個學習的園區啦這個學習的園區就是要讓我們的年輕人或者是小朋友在那個園區可以學習到實際在道路上可能會遇到的狀況所以這一點把本席的建議納入進去那對於空間的實際感覺是很重要的是 沒有錯好 謝謝\n那接下來呢本席要為地方來請命因為過去本席在嘉義工作那本席就發現因為常常有這樣子走動的機會所以呢嘉義市是目前全國唯一沒有跟高鐵連接的軌道城市那這個問題很久了那這個問題很奇怪的不是單純只有行政的問題喔而是中央對於區域交通的這個正義跟公義還有產業平衡的這個發展還有對歷史的承諾其實都有一點點狀況\n所以高鐵嘉義市線是唯一沒有軌道連結的運輸系統你可以想像一個每年超過630萬人次的高鐵站竟然沒有一個軌道系統來連結不是很奇怪嗎這樣的斷點如果依照我們的了解是中央規劃有一些缺失還有長年政策的失衡的結果\n其實交通部在民國88年就已經完成嘉義高鐵聯外道路的可行性評估那也明確的表示呢當時高鐵局長明確的表示那個運量達到的之後呢就要進行鋪設結果行政院在94年更直接合附交通部來辦理BRT的階段性方案這就是我們目前在搭的\n那這個BRT呢其實現在運量已經每一年都達到130萬人次尖峰時段還常常都客滿那本席也常常搭不到所以這個部分呢本席因為問了所以才發現那中央竟然說在這個軌道的部分要地方政府來分擔這似乎有一點奇怪不知道部長您對這個事情的看法如何報告委員輕軌系統跟捷運系統都是地方辦理事項所以各個縣市都一樣\n本席這邊可能先提醒全國的高鐵的軌道系統應該大部分都是由中央這邊全額來負擔的這是依照大眾捷運法的第13條的這樣一個規定你們卻應該用這樣子的一個高度來看全國的一個軌道的網絡\n但是BRT現在的運量已經足夠了嘛結果你們現在竟然叫他們用一個下位的審查作業要點的規範叫地方政府來做負擔我想這個部分針對所有的高鐵與連外的軌道似乎對嘉義縣市有一些不公平 您的看法呢\n報告委員 這個其實各縣市都一樣只要是輕軌跟捷運系統但是它這個輕軌是從是高鐵延伸出去的一個網絡從高鐵嘉義站到台鐵嘉義站我想這個部分中央應該難辭其咎吧\n您的看法呢報告委員這個部分當然嘉義縣市自己也要有共識啦因為目前我聽起來嘉義縣政府他們當然是樂觀其成但是對於經費上面他們也是有一些意見所以本席這邊提醒您\n一個癥結 這個工程款是374億\n如果中央可以負擔的話是工程款本身的372億地方只負責用地費用的0.66億跟嘉義縣的0.94億他們都不注意中央可以負擔372億但是連這樣都談不攏都要中央全額負擔\n所以中央有沒有可能跟嘉義市這邊再來共同研議一方院又要把財政收支發放法全部移給地方等一下 院長 財發法是今年的事情那我們剛才談的其實是好幾年前的事好不好 做一個研議好嗎不要拿現在的變數把過去的東西都全部抹滅掉這我給你們一個建議啦 大家再來談談看好不好好 最後一個\n在這個部分跟地方業者再多談一下然後不要讓他們你們利益良好的東西結果地方業者不接受反倒有一些部內的事物你們不知道是不是可以再管\n然後第二個很重要一點我上禮拜參加了聖父蘭基獨特首席的開幕我要跟你們提醒的是雖然你們未來在公共藝術的意象上有原住民但是不要忘了原先的原住民的意象是非常明顯的本期在這邊跟你們討論跟建議原住民的意象不能小於之前的原住民的意象那是我們共同的記憶有沒有可能\n謝謝林委員謝謝左院長\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:15.013 --> 00:21.600\n主席福音同仁大家好我們事先請我們卓院長跟陳部長請卓院長跟陳部長備詢\n\n00:34.628 --> 00:43.978\n本席今天針對交通安全跟觀光的議題來跟你們做個討論我們現在已經邁入了高齡社會根據內政部的資料統計目前65歲以上的老人已經達到了429萬\n\n00:54.212 --> 01:11.324\n六千九百八十五人那佔全國總人口的18%那以這樣的速度我們應該很快的就會進入超高齡社會20%的這個比例我想很快就會到了所以今天本席想要針對高齡族群的交通事故來跟您做個討論\n\n01:12.685 --> 01:38.406\n高齡者一直是交通事故的高風險群我們在人行步道、公車站牌跟失能老人的接送基本上很不友善老人的視力跟體能所以我們在高齡化的社會老人的人數不斷地成長當然我們應該要有更符合高齡人口生活的環境比如建置完善的人行道或者是適合老人行動的公共設施\n\n01:39.187 --> 01:54.559\n那麼本席這邊要提醒一下整個交通部在老人設施的這個部分目前的一個做法所以依據數據我們看到高齡機車騎士的死傷案件比前一年增加了2574件\n\n01:56.280 --> 02:17.634\n高齡者在路口的交通事故也比前一年增加了2005件整體高齡者死傷的人數年增2981人已經快3000了行人總死傷的人數總共17000多件但是高齡者就佔了6195件比例是非常高的將近三分之一\n\n02:18.434 --> 02:45.309\n這樣子的數字背後呈現了整個趨勢的成長但是這不是偶然的那交通部目前的狀況呢依本席所知道是以宣導跟增設標誌來處理問題那這樣子似乎有點消極那長者現在已經是一個高風險群那也由於他們的整個機能的問題呢我們交通環境好像沒有跟上人口結構的改變那院長您的看法呢\n\n02:46.226 --> 02:56.101\n非常謝謝委員為我們這種族群65歲以上的高齡者的安全來設想那其實我們在討論過程當中年輕的族群\n\n02:56.960 --> 03:22.907\n在騎機車跟高齡的在交通事故上面都有呈現很高的一個數字那高齡的尤其在清晨去運動的時候發生的狀況也非常多那他騎車的時候有些自己本身的條件或是疏離住也很多所以我們就從各方面來討論過我們在路口安全行人安全跟改善路口計畫當中我們多次都討論到這樣相關的議題那是不是部長能夠再仔細的說明一下\n\n03:24.987 --> 03:44.013\n所以你們現在比較具體的一個做法是您所提到的這個人行的空間這個相當的重要所以我們在永續提升人行安全計畫裡面我們四年其實會投入400億的這個經費我們希望讓人行道的建置能夠更加的完整在過馬路行穿線的部分也要更加的完整至少你們現在在經費上有投入\n\n03:44.693 --> 04:13.068\n那本席這邊還是提醒在高齡的部分要更加的做一個規劃像我們的整個行人道的高低不平這個問題我想大家都知道那常常走路的時候就阻礙重重那另外有一個很重要的就是說我們的耗制燈高齡者平均每秒的速度是0.8公尺到1公尺但是我們的整個設計大概都是1.2公尺的一個耗制秒數所以這個部分應該更具體的來做一個改善\n\n04:13.948 --> 04:37.654\n那另外呢目前的自行車道規劃感覺還是以汽機車為規劃的主體所以在日常的這個通行跟休閒的安全需求也是非常高你們有沒有可能針對這個高齡友善的交通來把它置放在一個國家戰略的這個一個核心然後進行部會系統性的改造來跨部會來做一個處理跟整理有沒有這個可能我們多年前就有透過一個高齡駕駛\n\n04:43.550 --> 04:56.003\n健康檢查跟評估制度從他本身的條件來做起那我們希望高齡比方說我們曾經討論過除了耗資標示之外的這個加強之外如果早晨要不要給他身上有一個什麼樣的標示\n\n04:57.332 --> 05:21.598\n地方政府執行多年這個成效都不好所以必須要找出其他的方式所以本席這邊建議在那個道安長照社福跟都市規劃的相關單位應該做一個跨部會的處理跟整合因為這些地方是高齡人口經常會去走動的那您剛才講的是時間上的問題那但是有沒有可能做一個高齡人口活動熱區的道路安全總體的一個檢討\n\n05:24.099 --> 05:50.033\n然後至少我們讓它在生活上跟交通安全上能夠扣連在一起去減低高齡人口交通事故的一個比例這個部分可以嗎您的這個建議其實非常好我可以請運輸研究所來做這方面的研究如果在高齡者比較有在行動的熱區的部分我們對於當區的整體的交通該怎麼做改善我覺得這個應該會相當有意義\n\n05:51.494 --> 06:18.695\n是不是應該定一個改善的期程比如說哪一年你要做到高齡事故的減半計畫因為您剛才也投入了一些經費或者是仿效國外的VisionZero這樣子的一個零事故死亡的政策那可能期程要比較具體的訂定出來您如果投入的是四年的經費那短中長期大概每一段時間要進行到哪裡\n\n06:19.275 --> 06:48.440\n那我想比較具體這個部分我們其實是針對整體的行人安全跟整體的交通安全在做改善那您剛剛所提醒的就是說針對高齡者要不要再做更特別的規劃那這個部分我們會再規劃道安的比例也是非常高就是他們碰到事故的比例非常高就是機車老人跟酒駕都是相當高的一個造勢的狀態那這個部分其實這幾年的改善\n\n06:48.840 --> 07:11.973\n已經有看到一些成效也確實都在下降當中數據看起來都在下降當中但是您所提醒的高齡者的部分我們會另外再來做研究看怎麼樣再來提升他們的安全對就針對這個部分可能要有一個具體的時程所以道路不只是移動的空間也是生活的延伸所以剛才本席才針對高齡者會活動的這些場域希望你們做一個總檢討跟整體的設計\n\n07:13.954 --> 07:34.131\n好那您剛才其實也提到酒駕或者是我們未來要探討的一個危險駕駛的這個部分那111年警察交通執法與事故處理的滿意度調查其中很多人對於這個危險駕車有一些怨言那大概100人當中會有40人那依照警政署去年的一個\n\n07:35.993 --> 07:58.307\n通報的統計危險駕車的汽車違規佔比有7乘5那麼不遵行方向行駛的機車違規佔比有8乘4那另外呢汽車佔比這個高項目的是危險駕車有75.32然後超出速限的有40公里以下的佔了72.79這一些數據其實代表了危險駕駛\n\n07:59.628 --> 08:14.245\n跟危險駕車是民眾一直所在意的也凸顯了我們的交通環境中危險車型的一個制度性問題那是不是目前你們有沒有在研議科技執法上以及提高刑責來產生嚇阻的一個作用呢\n\n08:17.161 --> 08:39.817\n科技執法其實警政署跟地方政府已經有在執行執行看起來成效也都還不錯另外針對教育的層面我們也在做努力工程的層面我們也在做努力本席其實有做一個提案就是把交通安全的教育列到我們很基本的教育裡面讓大家對於空間開始慢慢有一些感覺跟看法\n\n08:40.618 --> 09:07.891\n好那我引用一下交通部你們大灣司的這個相關的數據大型車的這個案件比去年同時期增加了137件那整體來講有13736件那這個的例子就跟去年東海大學的那個女大學生被輾過被大型車輾過的狀況一樣因為大型車有很多的死角那去年這個事故最主要是大型車沒有看到她又輾了一次結果\n\n09:08.991 --> 09:29.505\n一條美麗的生命就這樣子沒有了所以大型客車的事故的致死率比一般汽車機車都來得高所以我們有沒有思考現行大型車輛駕駛訓練的標準能不能應付很多元的道路的狀況尤其是在繁忙的時間跟路段比較複雜行駛時的一個挑戰呢\n\n09:32.058 --> 10:00.288\n報告委員我們針對這個小型車跟大型車都一樣我們現在正在做這個整體駕訓的檢討駕訓機制所以也可能駕訓的這個部分會有一些調整當你駕訓的機制做檢討跟調整之後他之後的這個客運的司機駕駛啦他的整體的訓練就會不一樣那這是一方面那二方面我們針對公司也就是在監理的層面針對客運公司的要求也希望他們能夠落實到要求我們的客運的駕駛\n\n10:01.268 --> 10:18.414\n對於一些我們新的規則的要求要落實那還有他們的開車習慣我們從司機的職開始做一個整體的調整跟改變那當然你們在外部的環境像你們要針對駕駛行為然後另外制度也是有一些需要改進的嘛\n\n10:18.934 --> 10:34.707\n那道路的設計還有交通文化的這個部分我覺得這樣比較治本而不是只有治標所以你們是不是有制定長期的計畫特別是針對青少年跟新駕駛人的這個交通安全的宣導活動不知道你們有沒有這個短中長期的計畫\n\n10:35.527 --> 11:03.918\n報告委員這個計畫我們都有運研所前一陣子才做出一套系統我們針對國小跟國中跟高中用一種沉浸式的一個模式透過平板讓他學習在道路上包含走路要怎麼走怎麼樣過馬路然後怎麼樣才會安全謝謝部長您剛才有提到包含騎摩托車也都有全部都有融入到教育的層面您有提到平板不過本席認為真正在實地空間的這樣一個模擬跟訓練是重要的\n\n11:04.158 --> 11:32.338\n要不然有些東西我們看了但是碰到了實際的狀況那個反應是不一樣的我們在各個縣市其實也盡量在建設這個交通安全的這個學習的園區啦這個學習的園區就是要讓我們的年輕人或者是小朋友在那個園區可以學習到實際在道路上可能會遇到的狀況所以這一點把本席的建議納入進去那對於空間的實際感覺是很重要的是沒有錯好謝謝\n\n11:36.124 --> 12:04.943\n那接下來呢本席要為地方來請命因為過去本席在嘉義工作那本席就發現因為常常有這樣子走動的機會所以呢嘉義市是目前全國唯一沒有跟高鐵連接的軌道城市那這個問題很久了那這個問題很奇怪的不是單純只有行政的問題喔而是中央對於區域交通的這個正義跟公義還有產業平衡的這個發展還有對歷史的承諾其實都有一點點狀況\n\n12:06.324 --> 12:29.334\n所以高鐵嘉義市線是唯一沒有軌道連結的運輸系統你可以想像一個每年超過630萬人次的高鐵站竟然沒有一個軌道系統來連結不是很奇怪嗎這樣的斷點如果依照我們的了解是中央規劃有一些缺失還有長年政策的失衡的結果\n\n12:30.094 --> 12:53.235\n其實交通部在民國88年就已經完成嘉義高鐵聯外道路的可行性評估那也明確的表示呢當時高鐵局長明確的表示那個運量達到的之後呢就要進行鋪設結果行政院在94年更直接合附交通部來辦理BRT的階段性方案這就是我們目前在搭的\n\n12:53.775 --> 13:19.458\n那這個BRT呢其實現在運量已經每一年都達到130萬人次尖峰時段還常常都客滿那本席也常常搭不到所以這個部分呢本席因為問了所以才發現那中央竟然說在這個軌道的部分要地方政府來分擔這似乎有一點奇怪不知道部長您對這個事情的看法如何報告委員輕軌系統跟捷運系統都是地方辦理事項所以各個縣市都一樣\n\n13:19.878 --> 13:38.446\n本席這邊可能先提醒全國的高鐵的軌道系統應該大部分都是由中央這邊全額來負擔的這是依照大眾捷運法的第13條的這樣一個規定你們卻應該用這樣子的一個高度來看全國的一個軌道的網絡\n\n13:42.107 --> 14:00.143\n但是BRT現在的運量已經足夠了嘛結果你們現在竟然叫他們用一個下位的審查作業要點的規範叫地方政府來做負擔我想這個部分針對所有的高鐵與連外的軌道似乎對嘉義縣市有一些不公平您的看法呢\n\n14:01.442 --> 14:14.571\n報告委員這個其實各縣市都一樣只要是輕軌跟捷運系統但是它這個輕軌是從是高鐵延伸出去的一個網絡從高鐵嘉義站到台鐵嘉義站我想這個部分中央應該難辭其咎吧\n\n14:15.933 --> 14:29.929\n您的看法呢報告委員這個部分當然嘉義縣市自己也要有共識啦因為目前我聽起來嘉義縣政府他們當然是樂觀其成但是對於經費上面他們也是有一些意見所以本席這邊提醒您\n\n14:31.291 --> 14:31.591\n一個癥結這個工程款是374億\n\n14:53.700 --> 15:09.973\n如果中央可以負擔的話是工程款本身的372億地方只負責用地費用的0.66億跟嘉義縣的0.94億他們都不注意中央可以負擔372億但是連這樣都談不攏都要中央全額負擔\n\n15:11.155 --> 15:36.009\n所以中央有沒有可能跟嘉義市這邊再來共同研議一方院又要把財政收支發放法全部移給地方等一下院長財發法是今年的事情那我們剛才談的其實是好幾年前的事好不好做一個研議好嗎不要拿現在的變數把過去的東西都全部抹滅掉這我給你們一個建議啦大家再來談談看好不好好最後一個\n\n15:56.476 --> 16:07.071\n在這個部分跟地方業者再多談一下然後不要讓他們你們利益良好的東西結果地方業者不接受反倒有一些部內的事物你們不知道是不是可以再管\n\n16:08.920 --> 16:35.007\n然後第二個很重要一點我上禮拜參加了聖父蘭基獨特首席的開幕我要跟你們提醒的是雖然你們未來在公共藝術的意象上有原住民但是不要忘了原先的原住民的意象是非常明顯的本期在這邊跟你們討論跟建議原住民的意象不能小於之前的原住民的意象那是我們共同的記憶有沒有可能\n\n16:39.043 --> 16:39.365\n謝謝林委員謝謝左院長\n\n","segments":[{"start":15.013,"end":21.6,"text":"主席福音同仁大家好我們事先請我們卓院長跟陳部長請卓院長跟陳部長備詢"},{"start":34.628,"end":43.978,"text":"本席今天針對交通安全跟觀光的議題來跟你們做個討論我們現在已經邁入了高齡社會根據內政部的資料統計目前65歲以上的老人已經達到了429萬"},{"start":54.212,"end":71.324,"text":"六千九百八十五人那佔全國總人口的18%那以這樣的速度我們應該很快的就會進入超高齡社會20%的這個比例我想很快就會到了所以今天本席想要針對高齡族群的交通事故來跟您做個討論"},{"start":72.685,"end":98.406,"text":"高齡者一直是交通事故的高風險群我們在人行步道、公車站牌跟失能老人的接送基本上很不友善老人的視力跟體能所以我們在高齡化的社會老人的人數不斷地成長當然我們應該要有更符合高齡人口生活的環境比如建置完善的人行道或者是適合老人行動的公共設施"},{"start":99.187,"end":114.559,"text":"那麼本席這邊要提醒一下整個交通部在老人設施的這個部分目前的一個做法所以依據數據我們看到高齡機車騎士的死傷案件比前一年增加了2574件"},{"start":116.28,"end":137.634,"text":"高齡者在路口的交通事故也比前一年增加了2005件整體高齡者死傷的人數年增2981人已經快3000了行人總死傷的人數總共17000多件但是高齡者就佔了6195件比例是非常高的將近三分之一"},{"start":138.434,"end":165.309,"text":"這樣子的數字背後呈現了整個趨勢的成長但是這不是偶然的那交通部目前的狀況呢依本席所知道是以宣導跟增設標誌來處理問題那這樣子似乎有點消極那長者現在已經是一個高風險群那也由於他們的整個機能的問題呢我們交通環境好像沒有跟上人口結構的改變那院長您的看法呢"},{"start":166.226,"end":176.101,"text":"非常謝謝委員為我們這種族群65歲以上的高齡者的安全來設想那其實我們在討論過程當中年輕的族群"},{"start":176.96,"end":202.907,"text":"在騎機車跟高齡的在交通事故上面都有呈現很高的一個數字那高齡的尤其在清晨去運動的時候發生的狀況也非常多那他騎車的時候有些自己本身的條件或是疏離住也很多所以我們就從各方面來討論過我們在路口安全行人安全跟改善路口計畫當中我們多次都討論到這樣相關的議題那是不是部長能夠再仔細的說明一下"},{"start":204.987,"end":224.013,"text":"所以你們現在比較具體的一個做法是您所提到的這個人行的空間這個相當的重要所以我們在永續提升人行安全計畫裡面我們四年其實會投入400億的這個經費我們希望讓人行道的建置能夠更加的完整在過馬路行穿線的部分也要更加的完整至少你們現在在經費上有投入"},{"start":224.693,"end":253.068,"text":"那本席這邊還是提醒在高齡的部分要更加的做一個規劃像我們的整個行人道的高低不平這個問題我想大家都知道那常常走路的時候就阻礙重重那另外有一個很重要的就是說我們的耗制燈高齡者平均每秒的速度是0.8公尺到1公尺但是我們的整個設計大概都是1.2公尺的一個耗制秒數所以這個部分應該更具體的來做一個改善"},{"start":253.948,"end":277.654,"text":"那另外呢目前的自行車道規劃感覺還是以汽機車為規劃的主體所以在日常的這個通行跟休閒的安全需求也是非常高你們有沒有可能針對這個高齡友善的交通來把它置放在一個國家戰略的這個一個核心然後進行部會系統性的改造來跨部會來做一個處理跟整理有沒有這個可能我們多年前就有透過一個高齡駕駛"},{"start":283.55,"end":296.003,"text":"健康檢查跟評估制度從他本身的條件來做起那我們希望高齡 比方說我們曾經討論過除了耗資標示之外的這個加強之外如果早晨要不要給他身上有一個什麼樣的標示"},{"start":297.332,"end":321.598,"text":"地方政府執行多年這個成效都不好所以必須要找出其他的方式所以本席這邊建議在那個道安長照社福跟都市規劃的相關單位應該做一個跨部會的處理跟整合因為這些地方是高齡人口經常會去走動的那您剛才講的是時間上的問題那但是有沒有可能做一個高齡人口活動熱區的道路安全總體的一個檢討"},{"start":324.099,"end":350.033,"text":"然後至少我們讓它在生活上跟交通安全上能夠扣連在一起去減低高齡人口交通事故的一個比例這個部分可以嗎您的這個建議其實非常好我可以請運輸研究所來做這方面的研究如果在高齡者比較有在行動的熱區的部分我們對於當區的整體的交通該怎麼做改善我覺得這個應該會相當有意義"},{"start":351.494,"end":378.695,"text":"是不是應該定一個改善的期程比如說哪一年你要做到高齡事故的減半計畫因為您剛才也投入了一些經費或者是仿效國外的Vision Zero這樣子的一個零事故死亡的政策那可能期程要比較具體的訂定出來您如果投入的是四年的經費那短中長期大概每一段時間要進行到哪裡"},{"start":379.275,"end":408.44,"text":"那我想比較具體這個部分我們其實是針對整體的行人安全跟整體的交通安全在做改善那您剛剛所提醒的就是說針對高齡者要不要再做更特別的規劃那這個部分我們會再規劃道安的比例也是非常高就是他們碰到事故的比例非常高就是機車老人跟酒駕都是相當高的一個造勢的狀態那這個部分其實這幾年的改善"},{"start":408.84,"end":431.973,"text":"已經有看到一些成效也確實都在下降當中數據看起來都在下降當中但是您所提醒的高齡者的部分我們會另外再來做研究看怎麼樣再來提升他們的安全對 就針對這個部分可能要有一個具體的時程所以道路不只是移動的空間也是生活的延伸所以剛才本席才針對高齡者會活動的這些場域希望你們做一個總檢討跟整體的設計"},{"start":433.954,"end":454.131,"text":"好那您剛才其實也提到酒駕或者是我們未來要探討的一個危險駕駛的這個部分那111年警察交通執法與事故處理的滿意度調查其中很多人對於這個危險駕車有一些怨言那大概100人當中會有40人那依照警政署去年的一個"},{"start":455.993,"end":478.307,"text":"通報的統計危險駕車的汽車違規佔比有7乘5那麼不遵行方向行駛的機車違規佔比有8乘4那另外呢汽車佔比這個高項目的是危險駕車有75.32然後超出速限的有40公里以下的佔了72.79這一些數據其實代表了危險駕駛"},{"start":479.628,"end":494.245,"text":"跟危險駕車是民眾一直所在意的也凸顯了我們的交通環境中危險車型的一個制度性問題那是不是目前你們有沒有在研議科技執法上以及提高刑責來產生嚇阻的一個作用呢"},{"start":497.161,"end":519.817,"text":"科技執法其實警政署跟地方政府已經有在執行執行看起來成效也都還不錯另外針對教育的層面我們也在做努力工程的層面我們也在做努力本席其實有做一個提案就是把交通安全的教育列到我們很基本的教育裡面讓大家對於空間開始慢慢有一些感覺跟看法"},{"start":520.618,"end":547.891,"text":"好那我引用一下交通部你們大灣司的這個相關的數據大型車的這個案件比去年同時期增加了137件那整體來講有13736件那這個的例子就跟去年東海大學的那個女大學生被輾過被大型車輾過的狀況一樣因為大型車有很多的死角那去年這個事故最主要是大型車沒有看到她又輾了一次結果"},{"start":548.991,"end":569.505,"text":"一條美麗的生命就這樣子沒有了所以大型客車的事故的致死率比一般汽車機車都來得高所以我們有沒有思考現行大型車輛駕駛訓練的標準能不能應付很多元的道路的狀況尤其是在繁忙的時間跟路段比較複雜行駛時的一個挑戰呢"},{"start":572.058,"end":600.288,"text":"報告委員我們針對這個小型車跟大型車都一樣我們現在正在做這個整體駕訓的檢討駕訓機制所以也可能駕訓的這個部分會有一些調整當你駕訓的機制做檢討跟調整之後他之後的這個客運的司機駕駛啦他的整體的訓練就會不一樣那這是一方面那二方面我們針對公司也就是在監理的層面針對客運公司的要求也希望他們能夠落實到要求我們的客運的駕駛"},{"start":601.268,"end":618.414,"text":"對於一些我們新的規則的要求要落實那還有他們的開車習慣我們從司機的職開始做一個整體的調整跟改變那當然你們在外部的環境像你們要針對駕駛行為然後另外制度也是有一些需要改進的嘛"},{"start":618.934,"end":634.707,"text":"那道路的設計還有交通文化的這個部分我覺得這樣比較治本而不是只有治標所以你們是不是有制定長期的計畫特別是針對青少年跟新駕駛人的這個交通安全的宣導活動不知道你們有沒有這個短中長期的計畫"},{"start":635.527,"end":663.918,"text":"報告委員 這個計畫我們都有運研所前一陣子才做出一套系統我們針對國小跟國中跟高中用一種沉浸式的一個模式透過平板讓他學習在道路上包含走路要怎麼走 怎麼樣過馬路然後怎麼樣才會安全謝謝部長您剛才有提到包含騎摩托車也都有全部都有融入到教育的層面您有提到平板不過本席認為真正在實地空間的這樣一個模擬跟訓練是重要的"},{"start":664.158,"end":692.338,"text":"要不然有些東西我們看了但是碰到了實際的狀況那個反應是不一樣的我們在各個縣市其實也盡量在建設這個交通安全的這個學習的園區啦這個學習的園區就是要讓我們的年輕人或者是小朋友在那個園區可以學習到實際在道路上可能會遇到的狀況所以這一點把本席的建議納入進去那對於空間的實際感覺是很重要的是 沒有錯好 謝謝"},{"start":696.124,"end":724.943,"text":"那接下來呢本席要為地方來請命因為過去本席在嘉義工作那本席就發現因為常常有這樣子走動的機會所以呢嘉義市是目前全國唯一沒有跟高鐵連接的軌道城市那這個問題很久了那這個問題很奇怪的不是單純只有行政的問題喔而是中央對於區域交通的這個正義跟公義還有產業平衡的這個發展還有對歷史的承諾其實都有一點點狀況"},{"start":726.324,"end":749.334,"text":"所以高鐵嘉義市線是唯一沒有軌道連結的運輸系統你可以想像一個每年超過630萬人次的高鐵站竟然沒有一個軌道系統來連結不是很奇怪嗎這樣的斷點如果依照我們的了解是中央規劃有一些缺失還有長年政策的失衡的結果"},{"start":750.094,"end":773.235,"text":"其實交通部在民國88年就已經完成嘉義高鐵聯外道路的可行性評估那也明確的表示呢當時高鐵局長明確的表示那個運量達到的之後呢就要進行鋪設結果行政院在94年更直接合附交通部來辦理BRT的階段性方案這就是我們目前在搭的"},{"start":773.775,"end":799.458,"text":"那這個BRT呢其實現在運量已經每一年都達到130萬人次尖峰時段還常常都客滿那本席也常常搭不到所以這個部分呢本席因為問了所以才發現那中央竟然說在這個軌道的部分要地方政府來分擔這似乎有一點奇怪不知道部長您對這個事情的看法如何報告委員輕軌系統跟捷運系統都是地方辦理事項所以各個縣市都一樣"},{"start":799.878,"end":818.446,"text":"本席這邊可能先提醒全國的高鐵的軌道系統應該大部分都是由中央這邊全額來負擔的這是依照大眾捷運法的第13條的這樣一個規定你們卻應該用這樣子的一個高度來看全國的一個軌道的網絡"},{"start":822.107,"end":840.143,"text":"但是BRT現在的運量已經足夠了嘛結果你們現在竟然叫他們用一個下位的審查作業要點的規範叫地方政府來做負擔我想這個部分針對所有的高鐵與連外的軌道似乎對嘉義縣市有一些不公平 您的看法呢"},{"start":841.442,"end":854.571,"text":"報告委員 這個其實各縣市都一樣只要是輕軌跟捷運系統但是它這個輕軌是從是高鐵延伸出去的一個網絡從高鐵嘉義站到台鐵嘉義站我想這個部分中央應該難辭其咎吧"},{"start":855.933,"end":869.929,"text":"您的看法呢報告委員這個部分當然嘉義縣市自己也要有共識啦因為目前我聽起來嘉義縣政府他們當然是樂觀其成但是對於經費上面他們也是有一些意見所以本席這邊提醒您"},{"start":871.291,"end":871.591,"text":"一個癥結 這個工程款是374億"},{"start":893.7,"end":909.973,"text":"如果中央可以負擔的話是工程款本身的372億地方只負責用地費用的0.66億跟嘉義縣的0.94億他們都不注意中央可以負擔372億但是連這樣都談不攏都要中央全額負擔"},{"start":911.155,"end":936.009,"text":"所以中央有沒有可能跟嘉義市這邊再來共同研議一方院又要把財政收支發放法全部移給地方等一下 院長 財發法是今年的事情那我們剛才談的其實是好幾年前的事好不好 做一個研議好嗎不要拿現在的變數把過去的東西都全部抹滅掉這我給你們一個建議啦 大家再來談談看好不好好 最後一個"},{"start":956.476,"end":967.071,"text":"在這個部分跟地方業者再多談一下然後不要讓他們你們利益良好的東西結果地方業者不接受反倒有一些部內的事物你們不知道是不是可以再管"},{"start":968.92,"end":995.007,"text":"然後第二個很重要一點我上禮拜參加了聖父蘭基獨特首席的開幕我要跟你們提醒的是雖然你們未來在公共藝術的意象上有原住民但是不要忘了原先的原住民的意象是非常明顯的本期在這邊跟你們討論跟建議原住民的意象不能小於之前的原住民的意象那是我們共同的記憶有沒有可能"},{"start":999.043,"end":999.365,"text":"謝謝林委員謝謝左院長"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":385,"blocks":[["林委員倩綺：（10時48分）主席、府院同仁，大家好。我們是不是先請卓院長跟陳部長。"],["主席：請卓院長跟陳部長備詢。"],["卓院長榮泰：林委員好。"],["林委員倩綺：院長、部長好。本席今天針對交通安全跟觀光的議題來跟你們做個討論，院長，我們現在已經邁入了高齡社會，根據內政部的資料統計，我們目前65歲以上的老人已經達到了429萬6,985人，占全國總人口的18%，以這樣的速度，我們應該很快就會進入超高齡社會，20%的比例我想很快就會到了，所以今天本席想要針對高齡族群的交通事故來跟您做個討論。高齡者一直是交通事故的高風險群，我們在人行步道、公車站牌跟失能老人的接送，基本上很不友善老人的視力跟體能。在這個高齡化的社會，老人的人數不斷地成長，當然我們應該要有更符合高齡人口生活的環境，比如說，建置完善的人行道或者是適合老人行動的公共設施。本席這邊要提醒一下整個交通部，在老人設施這個部分目前的作法，依據數據，我們看到高齡機車騎士的死傷案件比前一年增加了2,574件，高齡者在路口的交通事故也比前一年增加了2,005件，整體高齡者死傷人數年增2,981人，已經快3,000人了，行人總死傷人數一萬七千多件，但是高齡者就占了6,195件，比例是非常高的，將近三分之一，這樣的數字背後呈現整個趨勢的成長，但是這不是偶然的。交通部目前的狀況，依本席所知道是以宣導跟增設標誌來處理問題，這樣似乎有點消極，長者現在已經是高風險群，也由於他們整個機能的問題，交通環境好像沒有跟上人口結構的改變。院長，您的看法呢？"],["卓院長榮泰：非常謝謝委員，為65歲以上高齡者的安全來設想，其實我們在討論過程當中，年輕族群在騎機車跟高齡族群在交通事故上都有呈現很高的數字。高齡族群，尤其在清晨去運動的時候發生狀況也非常多；當他騎車的時候，有些是自己本身的條件或疏於注意也很多，所以我們從各方面討論過，在路口安全、行人安全跟改善路口計畫當中，我們多次都有討論到這樣相關的議題，是不是請部長能夠再仔細地說明一下？"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，您剛剛所提到的……"],["林委員倩綺：所以你們現在比較具體的作法是？"],["陳部長世凱：您所提到人行的空間相當重要，所以在永續提升人行安全計畫裡面，4年會投入400億的經費，希望讓人行道的建置能夠更加完整，在過馬路行穿線的部分也要更加的完整，所以我們整體的……"],["林委員倩綺：謝謝，至少你們現在在經費上有投入嘛！"],["陳部長世凱：有投入。"],["卓院長榮泰：有計畫在進行。"],["林委員倩綺：本席還是提醒在高齡的部分要更加做一個規劃，像整個行人道高低不平的問題，我想大家都知道，常常走路的時候就阻礙重重；還有一個很重要的就是號誌燈，高齡者平均每秒的速度是0.8公尺到1公尺，但是我們整個設計大概都是1.2公尺的號誌秒數，所以這個部分應該更具體的來做改善；另外目前自行車道的規劃，感覺還是以汽、機車為規劃主體，所以在日常的通勤跟休閒的安全需求也是非常高，你們有沒有可能針對高齡友善交通置放在國家戰略的核心，進行部會系統性的改造，跨部會來做處理跟整理，有沒有這個可能？"],["卓院長榮泰：是，我們多年前就有透過高齡駕駛健康檢查跟評估制度，從他本身的條件來做起，比方說我們曾經討論過，除了號誌、標線的加強之外，早晨要不要給他身上有一個什麼樣的標示，但是地方政府執行多年成效都不好，所以必須要找出其他的方式才能……"],["林委員倩綺：所以本席建議，在道安、長照、社福跟都市規劃的相關單位，應該做一個跨部會的處理跟整合，因為這些地方是高齡人口經常會去走動的，您剛才講的是時間上的問題，但是有沒有可能做一個高齡人口活動熱區的道路安全總體檢討，至少讓他在生活上跟交通安全上能夠扣連在一起，去減低高齡人口交通事故的比例，這個部分可以嗎？"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，您的建議其實非常好，我可以請運輸研究所來做這方面的研究，如果在高齡者比較有行動的熱區部分，我們對於當區的整體交通該怎麼做改善，我覺得這個應該會相當有意義，這個部分我們回去再來做研究。"],["林委員倩綺：是！我也提醒您是不是應該訂一個改善的期程？比如哪一年要進做到高齡事故的減半計畫？因為您剛剛也說投入了一些經費，或者是仿效國外的Vision Zero零事故死亡的政策，可能期程要比較具體的訂定出來，您如果投入的是4年經費。短、中、長期大概每一段時間要進行到哪裡，我想這樣會比較具體。"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，這個部分我們其實是針對整體的行人安全跟整體的交通安全在做改善，您剛剛所提醒的就是針對高齡者要不要再做更特別的規劃，這個部分我們會再規劃，但是一般行人的改善跟……"],["林委員倩綺：因為高齡者碰到事故的比例非常高。"],["陳部長世凱：當然，就是機車、老人跟酒駕都是相當高的肇事狀態，其實這個部分在這幾年的改善已經有看到一些成效，也確實都在下降當中，數據看起來都在下降當中，但是您所提醒的高齡者的部分……"],["林委員倩綺：是有一點在提高。"],["陳部長世凱：我們會另外再研究，看怎麼樣再來提升他們的安全。"],["林委員倩綺：對，就針對這個部分，可能要一個具體的時程。道路不只是移動的空間也是生活的延伸，所以剛才本席才針對高齡者活動的場域，希望你們做一個總檢討跟整體的設計。","您剛才其實也提到酒駕或者是我們未來要探討的危險駕駛的部分，111年警察交通執法與事故處理的滿意度調查，其中很多人對於危險駕車有一些怨言，大概100人當中會有40人，依照警政署去年通報的統計，危險駕車的汽車違規占比有七成五，不遵行方向行駛的機車違規占比有八成四，另外汽車占比高的項目是危險駕車有75.32%，然後超出速限40公里以下的占了72.79%。這一些數據其實代表危險駕駛跟危險駕車是民眾一直在意的，也凸顯我們交通環境中危險車行的制度性問題，目前你們有沒有在研議科技執法以及提高刑責來產生嚇阻的作用呢？"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，這個部分科技執法其實警政署跟地方政府已經有在執行，執行看起來成效也都還不錯，另外針對教育的層面我們也在做努力，工程的層面我們也在做努力。"],["林委員倩綺：對，本席其實有做一個提案，其實就是把交通安全的教育列到我們很基本的教育裡面。"],["陳部長世凱：是。"],["林委員倩綺：讓大家對於空間開始慢慢有一些感覺跟看法。我引用一下交通部道安司相關的數據，大型車的案件比去年同時期增加137件，整體來講有1萬3,736件，這個例子就跟去年東海大學女大學生被大型車輾過的狀況一樣，因為大型車有很多的死角，去年的事故最主要是大型車沒有看到他又輾了一次，結果一條美麗的生命就這樣子沒有了。大型客車事故的致死率比一般汽車、機車都來得高，你們有沒有思考現行大型車輛駕駛訓練的標準，能不能應付很多元的道路狀況，尤其是在繁忙的時間跟路段比較複雜行駛時的挑戰？"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，針對小型車跟大型車都一樣，我們現在正在做整體駕訓機制的檢討。"],["林委員倩綺：所以也可能駕訓的部分會有一些調整？"],["陳部長世凱：當你駕訓的機制做檢討跟調整之後，客運的司機駕駛整體的訓練就會不一樣，這是一方面。二方面，我們針對公司，也就是在監理層面針對客運公司的要求，也希望他們能夠落實我們的要求到客運駕駛，對於一些我們新的規則的要求要落實，還有他們的開車習慣……"],["林委員倩綺：剛才講的也是不錯啦，我們從司機的質開始做整體的調整跟改變，當然你們在外部的環境，像你們要針對駕駛行為，另外制度也是有一些需要改進的，包括道路的設計還有交通文化的部分，我覺得這樣比較治本而不是只有治標，你們是不是有制定長期的計畫？特別是針對青少年跟新駕駛人的交通安全宣導活動，不知道你們有沒有短、中、長期的計畫。"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，計畫我們都有，運研所前一陣子才做出一套系統，我們針對國小、國中跟高中，用一種沉浸式的模式透過平板讓他學習在道路上，包含走路要怎麼走，怎麼樣過馬路，然後怎麼樣才會安全，包含騎腳踏車、包含騎摩托車也都有，全部都有融入到教育的層面。"],["林委員倩綺：您剛才有提到平板，不過本席認為真正在實地空間的模擬跟訓練是重要的，要不然有些東西我們看了，但是碰到實際狀況的反應是不一樣的，本席在這邊做個提醒。"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，我們在各個縣市其實也儘量在建置交通安全的學習園區，這個學習園區就是要讓我們的年輕人或者是小朋友，在園區可以學習到實際在道路上可能會遇到的狀況，這個部分我們正在處置。"],["林委員倩綺：所以這一點把本席的建議納入進去，對於空間的實際感覺是很重要的。"],["陳部長世凱：是，沒有錯。"],["林委員倩綺：好，謝謝。接下來本席要為地方請命，因為過去本席在嘉義工作，常常有走動的機會，本席發現嘉義市是目前全國唯一沒有跟高鐵連接軌道的城市，這個問題很久了，這個問題很奇怪的不單純只有行政問題，而是中央對於區域交通的正義、公益、產業平衡的發展，還有對歷史的承諾，都有一點狀況。高鐵嘉義市站是唯一沒有軌道連結的運輸系統，你可以想像一個每一年超過630萬人次的高鐵站，竟然沒有一個軌道系統來連結，不是很奇怪嗎？這樣的斷點，如果依照我們瞭解是中央規劃有一些缺失，還有長年政策失衡的結果。","交通部在民國88年就已經完成嘉義高鐵聯外道路的可行性評估，當時高鐵局長明確的表示運量達到了之後就要進行鋪設，而行政院也在94年直接核復交通部辦理BRT的階段性方案，這就是我們目前在搭的。這個BRT現在運量每一年已經達到130萬人次，尖峰時段還常常會客滿，本席也常常搭不到，本席因為問了這個部分才發現中央竟然說在軌道的部分要地方政府來分擔，這似乎有點奇怪，不知道部長您對這個事情的看法如何？"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，輕軌系統跟捷運系統都是地方辦理事項，所以各個縣市都一樣，都是地方政府在主導。"],["林委員倩綺：本席這邊先提醒，全國高鐵的軌道系統應該大部分都是由中央全額負擔的，這是依照大眾捷運法第十三條的規定，你們應該用這樣的高度來看全國軌道的網絡。"],["陳部長世凱：當時的決議就是做BRT。"],["林委員倩綺：但是BRT現在的運量已經足夠了，結果你們現在卻叫他們用下位的審查作業要點規範，叫地方政府來負擔，我想針對所有的高鐵與聯外的軌道，似乎對嘉義縣市有些不公平，您的看法呢？"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，其實各縣市都一樣，只要是輕軌跟捷運系統，全部都是地方……"],["林委員倩綺：但是這個輕軌系統是從高鐵延伸出去的網絡，從高鐵嘉義站到臺鐵嘉義站，這個部分中央應該難辭其咎吧！您的看法呢？"],["陳部長世凱：報告委員，這個部分嘉義縣市自己也要有共識，因為目前我聽起來嘉義縣政府當然是樂觀其成，但是對於經費上面，他們也是有一些意見，那嘉義市政府也是希望中央全額……"],["林委員倩綺：對啊，所以本席今天提醒您，其他的軌道像新竹的六家支線、臺中的捷運路線、臺南的沙崙支線，還有機場線，這些都是中央出資來興建的，把嘉義縣市排除在外有點不公平，是不是可以請你們再努力討論、規劃及研議呢？"],["卓院長榮泰：報告委員，有一個癥結點，這個工程款是374億，如果中央可以負擔的話是工程款本身的372億，地方只負責用地費用的0.66億跟嘉義縣的0.94億，他們要負擔的都不足1億，中央可以負擔372億，但是連這樣都談不攏，都要中央全額負擔。"],["林委員倩綺：中央有沒有可能跟嘉義市這邊再來共同研議這樣的可能性？"],["卓院長榮泰：一方面又要依財政收支劃分法全部移給地方，又要讓中央全部……地方連這個1億都不負擔，這個太為難中央了。"],["林委員倩綺：等一下，院長，財劃法是今年的事情，而我們剛才談的是好幾年前的事，好不好？"],["卓院長榮泰：對啊，現在就是這個狀況，地方連1億都不負擔。"],["林委員倩綺：做一個研議好嗎？不要拿現在的變數把過去的東西都全部抹滅掉，這是我給你們的建議，大家再來談談看，好不好？"],["卓院長榮泰：我再強調，372億是中央付，地方1億而已，他們也不要負擔。"],["林委員倩綺：我最後很快的講兩點。第一個，最近有關花東的觀光巴士，交通部觀光署有一個補助，補助的立意良好，可是卻引起地方業者的反彈，是不是有可能你們跟地方業者再多談一下？你們立意良好的東西，結果地方業者不接受，是否有些負面的衝擊你們可能不知道，是不是可以再……"],["陳部長世凱：看是什麼樣的反彈，我們再跟委員請示。"],["林委員倩綺：好的。第二個，很重要的一點，我上個禮拜參加秀姑巒溪遊客中心的開幕，我要提醒的是，雖然你們未來在公共藝術的意象上有原住民，但是不要忘了，原先的原住民意象是非常明顯的，本席在此跟你們討論跟建議，原住民的意象不能小於之前的那個原住民意象，那是我們共同的記憶，有沒有可能？"],["陳部長世凱：好。"],["卓院長榮泰：好，我們會注意。"],["林委員倩綺：好，謝謝。"],["委員林倩綺書面補充資料：","案由：本院林委員倩綺，針對高鐵嘉義站聯外軌道運輸建設之規劃與進度、觀光署推動「台灣觀巴」補助專案衍生之地方產業問題、秀姑巒溪遊客中心地景再造等議題，特向行政院提出質詢。","說明：","敦請中央履行承諾啟動嘉義輕軌建設","交通部於民國88年即完成高鐵嘉義站聯外輕軌運輸系統可行性評估報告，並於94年3月24日獲行政院核復同意所報之「高鐵嘉義站聯外BRT執行方案」，該核復文件明確指示請交通部參考路廊運量之成長情形，適時提出輕軌建設計畫。目前高鐵嘉義站113年度進出站旅客人次已達635萬，台鐵嘉義站推估旅次亦達756萬人次，顯示高鐵與台鐵間聯外運輸路廊運量已臻高峰，亟需以軌道運輸系統進行強化整合，方能紓解旅運壓力並提升整體運輸效率。惟目前全國高鐵各站聯外軌道運輸皆由中央主政推動，唯獨嘉義站雖已規劃，卻遲遲未見實質進度，形成區域發展明顯落差，亦不符中央推動高鐵軌道連網政策一體貫徹之精神。高鐵嘉義站聯外輕軌建設係屬中央責任，行政院核復文件明載應視運量適時提出建設計畫，如今條件已成熟，中央有責續辦推動，嘉義地方首長與議員發起連署敦促中央，本席亦高度關注。","具體詢問事項如下：","一、行政院94年核復文件明示「請交通部參考路廊運量再適時提出輕軌計畫」，請問交通部是否已就此進一步規劃與報請行政院？若尚未執行，請說明原因與時程規劃。","二、請交通部具體說明是否願依據原核復文件與現況條件，啟動高鐵嘉義站聯外輕軌計畫，並提出明確推動期程與中央支持機制？","觀巴補助專案再檢討","觀光署推動之「台灣觀巴」補助專案，原意在於促進觀光旅遊與國人出遊意願。然而，本席接獲多位宜花東地區地方業者反映，該專案實施前缺乏與在地旅遊業者的充分溝通，導致政策內容未能兼顧地方產業實況，產生嚴重負面效應。特別是在實施免費或半價優惠之後，觀光型態似乎出現明顯變化，旅客多以當天往返為主，平均停留時間縮短約三成，直接衝擊當地旅宿業，導致整體地方消費下滑，與政策原先促進觀光之目標背道而馳。","質詢事項如下：","一、請問觀光署，推動「台灣觀巴」專案時是否有事前預估其對地方產業（特別是住宿與餐飲）可能造成的衝擊？對於地方反映停留時間縮短、消費降低的情形，觀光署是否已掌握其真實狀況？後續是否有因應與調整作為？","二、本席具體提出以下四項建議，請觀光署逐項說明是否同意納入政策規劃，並請具體說明可行性與推動時程：","1.檢討補助設計原則：未來補助方案應以提升旅客停留時間與地方實質消費為目標，避免補助設計造成觀光型態失衡。觀光署是否認同此原則？是否願意納入未來補助政策規劃？","2.建立地方溝通機制：未來涉及地方觀光市場之政策措施，應先與地方政府及在地業者充分溝通協調，達成共識後方可實施。請問觀光署是否同意此原則並願建立制度化機制？","3.公開補助成效：建議觀光署定期公布補助對住宿率、餐飲消費等具體經濟指標之影響，並依據成效滾動式檢討政策方向。觀光署是否願意承諾資訊公開與政策透明化？","4.保障中小型業者參與機會：未來補助設計應納入中小型業者參與保障機制，避免資源集中於大型旅行社，並維持地方旅遊產業生態多元健全。觀光署是否願意採納並提出具體作法？","秀姑巒溪遊客中心地景再造","本席提醒觀光署，目前規劃中的「花蓮瑞穗秀姑巒溪泛舟遊客中心改建案」，不應僅視為一般基礎設施更新工程，而應審慎認知此案實質上為一項關乎地方空間記憶重構與文化地景再造的空間治理工程。該遊客中心自1982年啟用以來，四十餘年間作為花東縱谷門戶意象的關鍵地標。其中尤以「大頭目塔樓」為代表，其已成為地方文化象徵。惟於2022年918地震後，因結構安全疑慮而決議拆除，並於2023年4月完成。儘管安全考量無可厚非，但其所引發之地方居民反應，已清楚反映地景所承載的，遠不僅是建築機能，而是社群記憶、生活節奏與地景認同的具體體現。未來新設施之設計與興建，應嚴肅面對地方居民的期待、體察原住民族文化傳統在地景中的精神延續，充分與在地部落、居民溝通，避免僅以單一視覺高度或符號造形草率象徵原住民意象，並應參酌原地景，以不小於原有建築規模的方案，展現在地原住民文化。此案的推動，攸關地方與中央對空間正義、文化治理與永續觀光的真正理解與實踐。"],["主席：謝謝林委員，謝謝卓院長。","下一位請林沛祥委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":218,"meet_id":"院會-11-3-10","speakers":["韓國瑜","江啟臣","陳超明","黃建賓","魯明哲","顏寬恒","陳玉珍","林倩綺","林沛祥","黃國昌","林國成","李昆澤","林月琴","賴士葆","黃秀芳","王正旭","盧縣一","李彥秀","楊曜","麥玉珍","廖偉翔","陳菁徽","林淑芬","馬文君","邱若華","蘇巧慧"],"page_start":117,"meetingDate":["2025-05-06"],"gazette_id":"1144201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144201_00004","1144201_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期第10次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢─ 詢答完畢─","agenda_id":"1144201_00004"}}}