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294.842, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 294.842, \"end\": 294.962, \"score\": 0.741}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"它\", \"start\": 294.962, \"end\": 295.122, \"score\": 0.618}, {\"word\": \"本\", \"start\": 295.122, \"end\": 295.362, \"score\": 0.533}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 295.362, \"end\": 295.503, \"score\": 0.588}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 295.503, \"end\": 295.583, \"score\": 0.797}, {\"word\": \"太\", \"start\": 295.583, \"end\": 295.603, \"score\": 0.211}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}]}, {\"start\": 296.784, \"end\": 302.148, \"text\": \"就像委員剛剛講它是不夠的我們隨著時間的推移需要我們修上維護的會越來越多經費也越來越龐大所以這個部分我也一再的在每次質詢的時候我會提到說希望對於文資的修復這個部分我們可以更重視可以爭取到更多的預算當然有一些民眾怕人不理解他們以為他說那今年的預算煽動之後不是跟以前的規模一樣嗎但是其實我們對預算的需求是越來越高的我們必須逐年去增加逐年去編列\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 296.784, \"end\": 296.804, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"像\", \"start\": 296.804, \"end\": 296.824, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 296.824, \"end\": 296.844, \"score\": 0.0}, 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\"邊\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 694.198, \"end\": 694.298, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 694.298, \"end\": 694.678, \"score\": 0.7}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"教\", \"start\": 694.678, \"end\": 694.859, \"score\": 0.703}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 694.859, \"end\": 695.299, \"score\": 0.843}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"您\", \"start\": 695.299, \"end\": 695.479, \"score\": 0.661}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 695.479, \"end\": 695.619, \"score\": 0.465}, {\"word\": \"前\", \"start\": 695.619, \"end\": 695.739, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 695.739, \"end\": 696.18, \"score\": 0.824}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 696.18, \"end\": 696.36, \"score\": 0.692}, {\"word\": \"更\", \"start\": 696.36, \"end\": 696.74, \"score\": 0.765}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"管\", \"start\": 696.74, \"end\": 696.84, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": \"家\", \"start\": 696.84, \"end\": 697.981, \"score\": 0.736}, {\"word\": \"洽\"}, {\"word\": \"談\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"名\", \"start\": 697.981, \"end\": 698.262, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"制\", \"start\": 698.262, \"end\": 698.402, \"score\": 0.768}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 698.402, \"end\": 698.922, \"score\": 0.72}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"優\"}, {\"word\": \"惠\", \"start\": 698.922, \"end\": 699.223, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 699.223, \"end\": 699.483, \"score\": 0.578}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 699.483, \"end\": 699.983, \"score\": 0.801}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 699.983, \"end\": 700.083, \"score\": 0.692}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 700.083, \"end\": 700.283, \"score\": 0.816}, {\"word\": \"知\", \"start\": 700.283, \"end\": 700.384, \"score\": 0.823}, {\"word\": \"道\", \"start\": 700.384, \"end\": 700.404, \"score\": 0.671}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 700.404, \"end\": 700.504, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", 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\"的\", \"start\": 770.517, \"end\": 770.577, \"score\": 0.184}, {\"word\": \"太\", \"start\": 770.577, \"end\": 770.617, \"score\": 0.498}, {\"word\": \"陽\", \"start\": 770.617, \"end\": 770.917, \"score\": 0.859}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"考\", \"start\": 770.917, \"end\": 771.158, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"量\", \"start\": 771.158, \"end\": 771.178, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"才\", \"start\": 771.178, \"end\": 771.318, \"score\": 0.823}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 771.318, \"end\": 771.378, \"score\": 0.366}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"真\", \"start\": 771.378, \"end\": 771.418, \"score\": 0.487}, {\"word\": \"正\", \"start\": 771.418, \"end\": 771.618, \"score\": 0.7}, {\"word\": \"落\", \"start\": 771.618, \"end\": 771.638, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"查\", \"start\": 771.638, \"end\": 771.658, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 771.658, \"end\": 771.678, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"黃\"}, {\"word\": \"牛\", \"start\": 771.678, \"end\": 771.958, \"score\": 0.717}, {\"word\": \"票\", \"start\": 771.958, \"end\": 771.978, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 771.978, \"end\": 772.118, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 772.118, \"end\": 772.138, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 772.138, \"end\": 772.158, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 772.158, \"end\": 772.178, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 787.042, \"end\": 787.944, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"陳\"}, {\"word\": \"秀\", \"start\": 787.944, \"end\": 788.426, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"寶\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 788.426, \"end\": 789.007, \"score\": 0.957}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 789.007, \"end\": 789.629, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"回\", \"start\": 789.629, \"end\": 790.491, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 790.491, \"end\": 790.652, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 790.652, \"end\": 790.732, \"score\": 0.609}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"接\", \"start\": 790.732, \"end\": 790.872, \"score\": 0.733}, {\"word\": \"下\", \"start\": 790.872, \"end\": 791.193, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"休\", \"start\": 791.193, \"end\": 791.434, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"息\", \"start\": 791.434, \"end\": 792.035, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"五\", \"start\": 792.035, \"end\": 792.156, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 792.156, \"end\": 792.176, \"score\": 0.631}, {\"word\": \"鐘\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:02,659 --> 00:00:06,201\n謝主席請文化部李海部長好有請李部長陳委員你好部長好在本席質詢之前呢針對我們這些又多又繁雜的這是近乎是刁難的解凍報告呢本席這邊要先肯認文化部同仁進行來撰寫解凍報告因為其實文化部的預算呢在我們\n\n2\n00:00:30,816 --> 00:00:48,659\n委員會的山洞之外呢還有被大會山洞的還有被捅山捅洞之後你們分配到的所以這可以說是史上規模最大最複雜的這個預算的山洞那同仁呢真的文化部的同仁已經非常的努力所以我希望在野的同仁可以一起來支持文化部的解凍\n\n3\n00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:53,804\n好那接下來呢這邊要先關心小公視的經費的這個狀況預算案中文化部對公視的這個補助呢是減列了2300萬並且凍結了25%那再加上呢影視及流行音樂與輔導呢凍結了5000萬文化部的報告裡面有提到說因為預算會影響到小公視那本席這邊先請教說對小公視的影響以及目前節目直播有沒有延宕或是停擺的狀況\n\n4\n00:01:18,067 --> 00:01:26,220\n我想一定會吧我想請董事長報告因為這個部分我們固定的預算如果不能給的話那董事長這邊您先簡單的報告一下\n\n5\n00:01:29,209 --> 00:01:53,525\n謝謝委員的關心目前對小公司的影響是還蠻大的3的部分當然我們就必須要做一點項目的調整那也使得有些計畫沒辦法繼續但最主要是因為動的部分也蠻大的數字那這個部分我們目前有13個新的創的計畫目前為止都必須先暫停然後其他有些在進行中的項目我們都必須要做斟酌的修剪\n\n6\n00:01:54,345 --> 00:02:16,926\n或者是做一些调整这块我们还是蛮希望能够立法院赶快解冻因为这对国家的儿少教育的发展对儿少的这个成长影响很大是是好那这个部分呢因为今天是解冻案我们都希望说可以顺利今天会提到小公事是因为近期有不少的家长跟我分享也且称赞我们有个节目叫做欢迎光临我的牧场\n\n7\n00:02:17,626 --> 00:02:33,398\n裡面就是帶孩子們去認識養殖動物的辛苦以及相關的工作內容很有趣那孩子很喜歡看我們家的小子子也很喜歡但是家長就會擔心啊這麼優質的節目如果相關經費沒有順利解凍是不是就影響相關的這些節目的製播那部長你有看過相關這個影片嗎\n\n8\n00:02:36,380 --> 00:02:54,303\n有你自己有看過其實那個文化的那個節目的製作是很長一段時間他不是臨時要做所以那個山跟洞對我們來講傷害很大因為我們做一半做不下其實這個節目在youtube可以看到所以家長非常的喜歡他可以重複的播放給孩子們看\n\n9\n00:02:55,504 --> 00:03:19,522\n那我想部長你一定了解家長的憂心啦所以我在這邊還是要呼籲說在野黨真的你們要放下這個砍預算的屠刀我們要回歸我們審查預算的專業不要讓這麼優質的兒少節目受到影響影響到兒少的權益喔謝謝那再來我要針對文資修復的部分本席也非常關心本席的選區鹿港是我國著名的古蹟聚落所以對文資修復的這個需求量非常的大\n\n10\n00:03:21,604 --> 00:03:36,331\n那本席在週一的時候也才到我們鹿港的三三國廟以及西安宮來考察修繕的成果那我相信部長也一定很支持文資修復再利用但是現在目前文資局的文化資產業務被凍結了500萬業務費被凍結了30%那這個都會影響到文資局推動相關的有形的無形的這些文化資產保存的維護的工作\n\n11\n00:03:46,275 --> 00:04:12,524\n這次的考察裡面其實地方的文書工作者以及相關的古蹟的管理者都提出了可以再協助的相關的事項因為你修繕之後古蹟修繕之後就會有彩繪泥作等相關的這個後續的維護需求那當然我們文資的這個修復跟再利用不會有終點所以我希望說替我們鹿港大大小小的文資來爭取我們一定要先支持文資局的解凍這個預算的解凍但是我會希望說\n\n12\n00:04:13,524 --> 00:04:37,540\n以後我們在編列預算的時候是不是可以逐年的來增加對於文資方面這些相關的預算呢請部長您說一下您的想法其實我們始終不夠因為剛剛我在前面報告的時候就是台灣的災情隨時發生各地方上的宮廟也好還有一些古蹟也好他隨時需要我們幫忙\n\n13\n00:04:38,641 --> 00:04:55,603\n然後所以文資局所承擔的那個業務跟修繕是很重的所以這個部分的預算當然是一定要增加所以我剛才一直強調其實文化部的預算為什麼有時候我被刪或者被動會覺得很難過是因為它本來就不太夠\n\n14\n00:04:56,784 --> 00:05:02,148\n就像委員剛剛講它是不夠的我們隨著時間的推移需要我們修上維護的會越來越多經費也越來越龐大所以這個部分我也一再的在每次質詢的時候我會提到說希望對於文資的修復這個部分我們可以更重視可以爭取到更多的預算當然有一些民眾怕人不理解他們以為他說那今年的預算煽動之後不是跟以前的規模一樣嗎但是其實我們對預算的需求是越來越高的我們必須逐年去增加逐年去編列\n\n15\n00:05:26,405 --> 00:05:42,759\n那這個部分也請將來就是我們在編預算的時候在這一塊呢我們能夠多注意然後能夠多支持好那這個部分呢我先就在預算的部分先這樣子我要先講一下現在民眾非常關心而且網路上很熱議的就是關於黃牛茶黃牛泡茶器的問題\n\n16\n00:05:44,921 --> 00:06:09,795\n這是攸關民眾的權益那如果說我們在黃牛票的查緝有擾民的話是不是我們應該改善檢舉的資訊在日前有媒體指出有民眾在社群平台原價讓售演唱會的票卷去遭到文化局要求說明的這樣的事件那衍生出來就是有大家很熱烈的討論那其中有討論到的就是說文化部的這個黃牛檢舉專區資訊填寫的問題\n\n17\n00:06:14,478 --> 00:06:34,077\n這個部分我們資訊體檢要求要寫包含座位等詳細的訊息就是提升檢舉的難度因為現在很多黃牛他在賣票的時候是透過LINE的群組的方式來賣但是他不會透過真正的座位的訊息他會提供一個大概的區間大家自己排自己幾個座位這樣\n\n18\n00:06:34,757 --> 00:06:44,875\n那如果民眾他發現有這樣的情勢他沒有辦法檢討因為他沒有買到票啊他還沒買票的時候他就不知道真正的座位的這個訊息所以這個部分我們文化部是不是可以來研議檢討這個改善這樣的機制\n\n19\n00:06:47,742 --> 00:07:15,715\n其實這個真的是兩難因為如果我們的資訊不足的話我們無法確定他這個檢舉是不是本人然後我們要如何去把它確定資料所以剛剛講的真的是對我們文化部來講是兩難因為資訊不足我們官司把它找到這個確定是坐在哪裡哪個位置我們都沒有辦法但是你會變成說如果你要貼這樣的訊息你沒有拿到票你不知道真正的訊息的話你明明知道有黃牛的情勢你卻沒有辦法去追啊\n\n20\n00:07:16,823 --> 00:07:28,673\n所以這點我們再來改進我來了解一下那你們再研議一下這個如何來改善那當然也有民眾他有反映出說只要在網路上有加價販售這個認定你們現在已經擴及到只要有上架的行為就處罰\n\n21\n00:07:34,778 --> 00:07:43,583\n就票卷沒有賣出也是一樣所以這樣子的做法是不是會延伸催生出檢舉黃牛這個產業的這個隱憂所以對於我們文化部來追這個黃牛票有擾民的這個部分部長您說你們可以來研議看有什麼比較周全一點的方法\n\n22\n00:07:53,749 --> 00:08:09,535\n昨天內政委員會他們有出審設違法對於運輸遊樂票券黃牛票的罰款有提高來打擊黃牛大午化部這邊是不是也可以跟內政部這邊加強合作我們來提升打擊黃牛票這個效率以及精準度\n\n23\n00:08:10,965 --> 00:08:34,854\n是剛剛講到那個販售的那個定義是善價陳列多售多算但是剛剛講到老民跟我們的效率的確是我們未來要討論的一個部分就是在不老民的情況下又要很有效率的抓到這個黃牛然後抓到黃牛之後他本身要罰多少錢譬如最近抓到之後罰太重的話他就訴訟\n\n24\n00:08:36,374 --> 00:09:01,547\n他還是跟文化部疏遠所以這一套機制其實是因為其實黃劉漂說真的他可以有這樣的手法去販售他就是可以鑽這些漏洞那我們如果去補這些洞就變成說我們可能要多費心那這邊我還要請教部長關於剛才有很多委員非常關心的粉絲見面會是不是屬於藝文表演的一種型態\n\n25\n00:09:02,881 --> 00:09:28,541\n您覺得我剛才其實一再強調當年我們的文創法裡面加了這一條黃流的票是界定表演藝術音樂表演一定要正式的有一個表演售票但是屬於剛剛您講的那個粉絲見面會它這個情況是各式各樣會一直變化我們要是把它界定成是表演的話那這個將來是量量是非常大而且是一個灰色地帶\n\n26\n00:09:30,502 --> 00:09:41,152\n因為影視產業的內容是非常多元它有各種的太陽如果我們很狹隘的去認定粉絲見面會不屬於藝文表演不屬於文創法的規範我們要如何去抑制黃牛票四處的串行\n\n27\n00:09:53,863 --> 00:10:15,691\n任何應該以民眾來講他們會認為說任何的藝文表演有關的都會可以是適用文創法那部長您現在以你們的想法是覺得說這樣子它不算是表演所以它就不適用文創法嗎是它不算表演因為我剛剛有特別提到這個灰色地帶將來會一直蔓延譬如說見面簽名\n\n28\n00:10:17,412 --> 00:10:40,211\n唱一首歌算不算唱兩首歌算不算它實在是一個商業行為在圈粉絲的過程中是一個商業行為它要賣票跟表演是不太一樣文化部當年會把黃牛拉進我們的文創法裡面其實已經給我們帶來無限的麻煩我們整個文化部為了抓黃牛這件事情我剛才講過從抓到\n\n29\n00:10:42,153 --> 00:10:57,682\n地方上警察抓到之後他訴怨等等我覺得我們如果再加進這一項其實我可以理解部長您現在講這樣子的文化部的困擾對一個文化推動者一個產業的推動者協助者那在\n\n30\n00:10:58,903 --> 00:11:01,886\n無話推動跟商業行為跟黃牛票之間你們要如何在這個中間找到一個平衡而且又能夠扶植到產業也不會讓這些黃牛有機可乘而傷害到我們產業或傷害到我們民眾的熱情這個部分\n\n31\n00:11:17,883 --> 00:11:40,584\n取捨或者說這個斟酌這個部分當然也需要說文化部的同仁來費心但是其實如果你沒有一個相關的規範相關的一個制度去遏止黃牛票的話其實對產業的傷害也是很大的那這邊我再請教部長您之前有說跟更長管家洽談這個實名制的這個優惠方案我想知道說相關的進度如何\n\n32\n00:11:42,045 --> 00:11:59,296\n我覺得還不錯就是像小巨蛋他就願意如果你願意實名制他就八五折這個部分可能是我們最有進度的部分就是我們不斷的跟這些最大型的產款去談實名制我們文化部也編了預算鼓勵實名制\n\n33\n00:11:59,656 --> 00:12:22,152\n其實已經有願意開始配合你過去好很多而且各場館也知道這個環遊的問題之後他們會主動編列那個優惠像剛剛講小巨蛋就編了85折如果你願意用實名制的話我的租賃給你是85折像這個就算是很大的進步這就很成功了對因為我們如果不從源頭去解決的話我剛剛講到一方面又要維護這些\n\n34\n00:12:24,033 --> 00:12:34,823\n他個人的個資有沒有然後一方面要去抓他抓到之後他又宿院我們整個文化部真的是為了這個黃牛我們的同仁真的很辛苦所以我們必須從源頭把他杜絕那源頭杜絕就是拜託這些場館\n\n35\n00:12:39,787 --> 00:12:52,178\n市民誌對這個真的是好那我也希望文化部這邊繼續努力啦那也是還有就是說我剛剛提到的這個部分就是說關於粉絲見面會握手會還是簽唱會或是相關這樣的它都有各種的名稱啦那也希望說你們要通盤檢討相關的這個機制我們要納入各種的太陽來考量才能夠真正落實說查其黃牛票好以上謝謝好謝謝\n\n36\n00:13:07,042 --> 00:13:12,176\n好謝謝陳秀寶委員部長請回那我們接下來休息五分鐘\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n2659\t6201\t謝主席 請文化部李海部長好 有請李部長陳委員你好部長好 在本席質詢之前呢針對我們這些又多又繁雜的這是近乎是刁難的解凍報告呢本席這邊要先肯認文化部同仁進行來撰寫解凍報告因為其實文化部的預算呢在我們\n30816\t48659\t委員會的山洞之外呢還有被大會山洞的還有被捅山捅洞之後你們分配到的所以這可以說是史上規模最大最複雜的這個預算的山洞那同仁呢真的文化部的同仁已經非常的努力所以我希望在野的同仁可以一起來支持文化部的解凍\n49400\t53804\t好 那接下來呢這邊要先關心小公視的經費的這個狀況預算案中文化部對公視的這個補助呢是減列了2300萬並且凍結了25%那再加上呢影視及流行音樂與輔導呢凍結了5000萬文化部的報告裡面有提到說因為預算會影響到小公視那本席這邊先請教說對小公視的影響以及目前節目直播有沒有延宕或是停擺的狀況\n78067\t86220\t我想一定會吧我想請董事長報告因為這個部分我們固定的預算如果不能給的話那董事長這邊您先簡單的報告一下\n89209\t113525\t謝謝委員的關心目前對小公司的影響是還蠻大的3的部分當然我們就必須要做一點項目的調整那也使得有些計畫沒辦法繼續但最主要是因為動的部分也蠻大的數字那這個部分我們目前有13個新的創的計畫目前為止都必須先暫停然後其他有些在進行中的項目我們都必須要做斟酌的修剪\n114345\t136926\t或者是做一些调整这块我们还是蛮希望能够立法院赶快解冻因为这对国家的儿少教育的发展对儿少的这个成长影响很大是是好那这个部分呢因为今天是解冻案我们都希望说可以顺利今天会提到小公事是因为近期有不少的家长跟我分享也且称赞我们有个节目叫做欢迎光临我的牧场\n137626\t153398\t裡面就是帶孩子們去認識養殖動物的辛苦以及相關的工作內容很有趣那孩子很喜歡看我們家的小子子也很喜歡但是家長就會擔心啊這麼優質的節目如果相關經費沒有順利解凍是不是就影響相關的這些節目的製播那部長你有看過相關這個影片嗎\n156380\t174303\t有你自己有看過其實那個文化的那個節目的製作是很長一段時間他不是臨時要做所以那個山跟洞對我們來講傷害很大因為我們做一半做不下其實這個節目在youtube可以看到所以家長非常的喜歡他可以重複的播放給孩子們看\n175504\t199522\t那我想部長你一定了解家長的憂心啦所以我在這邊還是要呼籲說在野黨真的你們要放下這個砍預算的屠刀我們要回歸我們審查預算的專業不要讓這麼優質的兒少節目受到影響影響到兒少的權益喔 謝謝那再來我要針對文資修復的部分本席也非常關心本席的選區鹿港是我國著名的古蹟聚落所以對文資修復的這個需求量非常的大\n201604\t216331\t那本席在週一的時候也才到我們鹿港的三三國廟以及西安宮來考察修繕的成果那我相信部長也一定很支持文資修復再利用但是現在目前文資局的文化資產業務被凍結了500萬業務費被凍結了30%那這個都會影響到文資局推動相關的有形的無形的這些文化資產保存的維護的工作\n226275\t252524\t這次的考察裡面其實地方的文書工作者以及相關的古蹟的管理者都提出了可以再協助的相關的事項因為你修繕之後古蹟修繕之後就會有彩繪泥作等相關的這個後續的維護需求那當然我們文資的這個修復跟再利用不會有終點所以我希望說替我們鹿港大大小小的文資來爭取我們一定要先支持文資局的解凍這個預算的解凍但是我會希望說\n253524\t277540\t以後我們在編列預算的時候是不是可以逐年的來增加對於文資方面這些相關的預算呢請部長您說一下您的想法其實我們始終不夠因為剛剛我在前面報告的時候就是台灣的災情隨時發生各地方上的宮廟也好還有一些古蹟也好他隨時需要我們幫忙\n278641\t295603\t然後所以文資局所承擔的那個業務跟修繕是很重的所以這個部分的預算當然是一定要增加所以我剛才一直強調其實文化部的預算為什麼有時候我被刪或者被動會覺得很難過是因為它本來就不太夠\n296784\t302148\t就像委員剛剛講它是不夠的我們隨著時間的推移需要我們修上維護的會越來越多經費也越來越龐大所以這個部分我也一再的在每次質詢的時候我會提到說希望對於文資的修復這個部分我們可以更重視可以爭取到更多的預算當然有一些民眾怕人不理解他們以為他說那今年的預算煽動之後不是跟以前的規模一樣嗎但是其實我們對預算的需求是越來越高的我們必須逐年去增加逐年去編列\n326405\t342759\t那這個部分也請將來就是我們在編預算的時候在這一塊呢我們能夠多注意然後能夠多支持好那這個部分呢我先就在預算的部分先這樣子我要先講一下現在民眾非常關心而且網路上很熱議的就是關於黃牛茶黃牛泡茶器的問題\n344921\t369795\t這是攸關民眾的權益那如果說我們在黃牛票的查緝有擾民的話是不是我們應該改善檢舉的資訊在日前有媒體指出有民眾在社群平台原價讓售演唱會的票卷去遭到文化局要求說明的這樣的事件那衍生出來就是有大家很熱烈的討論那其中有討論到的就是說文化部的這個黃牛檢舉專區資訊填寫的問題\n374478\t394077\t這個部分我們資訊體檢要求要寫包含座位等詳細的訊息就是提升檢舉的難度因為現在很多黃牛他在賣票的時候是透過LINE的群組的方式來賣但是他不會透過真正的座位的訊息他會提供一個大概的區間大家自己排自己幾個座位這樣\n394757\t404875\t那如果民眾他發現有這樣的情勢他沒有辦法檢討因為他沒有買到票啊他還沒買票的時候他就不知道真正的座位的這個訊息所以這個部分我們文化部是不是可以來研議檢討這個改善這樣的機制\n407742\t435715\t其實這個真的是兩難因為如果我們的資訊不足的話我們無法確定他這個檢舉是不是本人然後我們要如何去把它確定資料所以剛剛講的真的是對我們文化部來講是兩難因為資訊不足我們官司把它找到這個確定是坐在哪裡哪個位置我們都沒有辦法但是你會變成說如果你要貼這樣的訊息你沒有拿到票你不知道真正的訊息的話你明明知道有黃牛的情勢你卻沒有辦法去追啊\n436823\t448673\t所以這點我們再來改進我來了解一下那你們再研議一下這個如何來改善那當然也有民眾他有反映出說只要在網路上有加價販售這個認定你們現在已經擴及到只要有上架的行為就處罰\n454778\t463583\t就票卷沒有賣出也是一樣所以這樣子的做法是不是會延伸催生出檢舉黃牛這個產業的這個隱憂所以對於我們文化部來追這個黃牛票有擾民的這個部分部長您說你們可以來研議看有什麼比較周全一點的方法\n473749\t489535\t昨天內政委員會他們有出審設違法對於運輸遊樂票券黃牛票的罰款有提高來打擊黃牛大午化部這邊是不是也可以跟內政部這邊加強合作我們來提升打擊黃牛票這個效率以及精準度\n490965\t514854\t是 剛剛講到那個販售的那個定義是 善價陳列 多售多算但是剛剛講到老民跟我們的效率 的確是我們未來要討論的一個部分就是在不老民的情況下 又要很有效率的抓到這個黃牛然後抓到黃牛之後 他本身要罰多少錢譬如最近抓到之後 罰太重的話 他就訴訟\n516374\t541547\t他還是跟文化部疏遠所以這一套機制其實是因為其實黃劉漂說真的他可以有這樣的手法去販售他就是可以鑽這些漏洞那我們如果去補這些洞就變成說我們可能要多費心那這邊我還要請教部長關於剛才有很多委員非常關心的粉絲見面會是不是屬於藝文表演的一種型態\n542881\t568541\t您覺得我剛才其實一再強調當年我們的文創法裡面加了這一條黃流的票是界定表演藝術 音樂表演一定要正式的有一個表演售票但是屬於剛剛您講的那個粉絲見面會它這個情況是各式各樣會一直變化我們要是把它界定成是表演的話那這個將來是量量是非常大而且是一個灰色地帶\n570502\t581152\t因為影視產業的內容是非常多元 它有各種的太陽如果我們很狹隘的去認定 粉絲見面會不屬於藝文表演不屬於文創法的規範我們要如何去抑制黃牛票四處的串行\n593863\t615691\t任何應該以民眾來講他們會認為說任何的藝文表演有關的都會可以是適用文創法那部長您現在以你們的想法是覺得說這樣子它不算是表演所以它就不適用文創法嗎是它不算表演因為我剛剛有特別提到這個灰色地帶將來會一直蔓延譬如說見面簽名\n617412\t640211\t唱一首歌算不算 唱兩首歌算不算它實在是一個商業行為在圈粉絲的過程中是一個商業行為它要賣票跟表演是不太一樣文化部當年會把黃牛拉進我們的文創法裡面其實已經給我們帶來無限的麻煩我們整個文化部為了抓黃牛這件事情我剛才講過從抓到\n642153\t657682\t地方上警察抓到之後他訴怨等等我覺得我們如果再加進這一項其實我可以理解部長您現在講這樣子的文化部的困擾對一個文化推動者一個產業的推動者協助者那在\n658903\t661886\t無話推動跟商業行為跟黃牛票之間你們要如何在這個中間找到一個平衡而且又能夠扶植到產業也不會讓這些黃牛有機可乘而傷害到我們產業或傷害到我們民眾的熱情這個部分\n677883\t700584\t取捨或者說這個斟酌這個部分當然也需要說文化部的同仁來費心但是其實如果你沒有一個相關的規範相關的一個制度去遏止黃牛票的話其實對產業的傷害也是很大的那這邊我再請教部長您之前有說跟更長管家洽談這個實名制的這個優惠方案我想知道說相關的進度如何\n702045\t719296\t我覺得還不錯就是像小巨蛋他就願意如果你願意實名制他就八五折這個部分可能是我們最有進度的部分就是我們不斷的跟這些最大型的產款去談實名制我們文化部也編了預算鼓勵實名制\n719656\t742152\t其實已經有願意開始配合你過去好很多而且各場館也知道這個環遊的問題之後他們會主動編列那個優惠像剛剛講小巨蛋就編了85折如果你願意用實名制的話我的租賃給你是85折像這個就算是很大的進步這就很成功了對 因為我們如果不從源頭去解決的話我剛剛講到一方面又要維護這些\n744033\t754823\t他個人的個資有沒有然後一方面要去抓他抓到之後他又宿院我們整個文化部真的是為了這個黃牛我們的同仁真的很辛苦所以我們必須從源頭把他杜絕那源頭杜絕就是拜託這些場館\n759787\t772178\t市民誌對 這個真的是好 那我也希望文化部這邊繼續努力啦那也是還有就是說我剛剛提到的這個部分就是說關於粉絲見面會 握手會還是簽唱會或是相關這樣的它都有各種的名稱啦那也希望說你們要通盤檢討相關的這個機制我們要納入各種的太陽來考量才能夠真正落實說查其黃牛票好 以上謝謝好 謝謝\n787042\t792176\t好 謝謝陳秀寶委員 部長請回那我們接下來休息五分鐘\n","txt":"謝主席 請文化部李海部長好 有請李部長陳委員你好部長好 在本席質詢之前呢針對我們這些又多又繁雜的這是近乎是刁難的解凍報告呢本席這邊要先肯認文化部同仁進行來撰寫解凍報告因為其實文化部的預算呢在我們\n委員會的山洞之外呢還有被大會山洞的還有被捅山捅洞之後你們分配到的所以這可以說是史上規模最大最複雜的這個預算的山洞那同仁呢真的文化部的同仁已經非常的努力所以我希望在野的同仁可以一起來支持文化部的解凍\n好 那接下來呢這邊要先關心小公視的經費的這個狀況預算案中文化部對公視的這個補助呢是減列了2300萬並且凍結了25%那再加上呢影視及流行音樂與輔導呢凍結了5000萬文化部的報告裡面有提到說因為預算會影響到小公視那本席這邊先請教說對小公視的影響以及目前節目直播有沒有延宕或是停擺的狀況\n我想一定會吧我想請董事長報告因為這個部分我們固定的預算如果不能給的話那董事長這邊您先簡單的報告一下\n謝謝委員的關心目前對小公司的影響是還蠻大的3的部分當然我們就必須要做一點項目的調整那也使得有些計畫沒辦法繼續但最主要是因為動的部分也蠻大的數字那這個部分我們目前有13個新的創的計畫目前為止都必須先暫停然後其他有些在進行中的項目我們都必須要做斟酌的修剪\n或者是做一些调整这块我们还是蛮希望能够立法院赶快解冻因为这对国家的儿少教育的发展对儿少的这个成长影响很大是是好那这个部分呢因为今天是解冻案我们都希望说可以顺利今天会提到小公事是因为近期有不少的家长跟我分享也且称赞我们有个节目叫做欢迎光临我的牧场\n裡面就是帶孩子們去認識養殖動物的辛苦以及相關的工作內容很有趣那孩子很喜歡看我們家的小子子也很喜歡但是家長就會擔心啊這麼優質的節目如果相關經費沒有順利解凍是不是就影響相關的這些節目的製播那部長你有看過相關這個影片嗎\n有你自己有看過其實那個文化的那個節目的製作是很長一段時間他不是臨時要做所以那個山跟洞對我們來講傷害很大因為我們做一半做不下其實這個節目在youtube可以看到所以家長非常的喜歡他可以重複的播放給孩子們看\n那我想部長你一定了解家長的憂心啦所以我在這邊還是要呼籲說在野黨真的你們要放下這個砍預算的屠刀我們要回歸我們審查預算的專業不要讓這麼優質的兒少節目受到影響影響到兒少的權益喔 謝謝那再來我要針對文資修復的部分本席也非常關心本席的選區鹿港是我國著名的古蹟聚落所以對文資修復的這個需求量非常的大\n那本席在週一的時候也才到我們鹿港的三三國廟以及西安宮來考察修繕的成果那我相信部長也一定很支持文資修復再利用但是現在目前文資局的文化資產業務被凍結了500萬業務費被凍結了30%那這個都會影響到文資局推動相關的有形的無形的這些文化資產保存的維護的工作\n這次的考察裡面其實地方的文書工作者以及相關的古蹟的管理者都提出了可以再協助的相關的事項因為你修繕之後古蹟修繕之後就會有彩繪泥作等相關的這個後續的維護需求那當然我們文資的這個修復跟再利用不會有終點所以我希望說替我們鹿港大大小小的文資來爭取我們一定要先支持文資局的解凍這個預算的解凍但是我會希望說\n以後我們在編列預算的時候是不是可以逐年的來增加對於文資方面這些相關的預算呢請部長您說一下您的想法其實我們始終不夠因為剛剛我在前面報告的時候就是台灣的災情隨時發生各地方上的宮廟也好還有一些古蹟也好他隨時需要我們幫忙\n然後所以文資局所承擔的那個業務跟修繕是很重的所以這個部分的預算當然是一定要增加所以我剛才一直強調其實文化部的預算為什麼有時候我被刪或者被動會覺得很難過是因為它本來就不太夠\n就像委員剛剛講它是不夠的我們隨著時間的推移需要我們修上維護的會越來越多經費也越來越龐大所以這個部分我也一再的在每次質詢的時候我會提到說希望對於文資的修復這個部分我們可以更重視可以爭取到更多的預算當然有一些民眾怕人不理解他們以為他說那今年的預算煽動之後不是跟以前的規模一樣嗎但是其實我們對預算的需求是越來越高的我們必須逐年去增加逐年去編列\n那這個部分也請將來就是我們在編預算的時候在這一塊呢我們能夠多注意然後能夠多支持好那這個部分呢我先就在預算的部分先這樣子我要先講一下現在民眾非常關心而且網路上很熱議的就是關於黃牛茶黃牛泡茶器的問題\n這是攸關民眾的權益那如果說我們在黃牛票的查緝有擾民的話是不是我們應該改善檢舉的資訊在日前有媒體指出有民眾在社群平台原價讓售演唱會的票卷去遭到文化局要求說明的這樣的事件那衍生出來就是有大家很熱烈的討論那其中有討論到的就是說文化部的這個黃牛檢舉專區資訊填寫的問題\n這個部分我們資訊體檢要求要寫包含座位等詳細的訊息就是提升檢舉的難度因為現在很多黃牛他在賣票的時候是透過LINE的群組的方式來賣但是他不會透過真正的座位的訊息他會提供一個大概的區間大家自己排自己幾個座位這樣\n那如果民眾他發現有這樣的情勢他沒有辦法檢討因為他沒有買到票啊他還沒買票的時候他就不知道真正的座位的這個訊息所以這個部分我們文化部是不是可以來研議檢討這個改善這樣的機制\n其實這個真的是兩難因為如果我們的資訊不足的話我們無法確定他這個檢舉是不是本人然後我們要如何去把它確定資料所以剛剛講的真的是對我們文化部來講是兩難因為資訊不足我們官司把它找到這個確定是坐在哪裡哪個位置我們都沒有辦法但是你會變成說如果你要貼這樣的訊息你沒有拿到票你不知道真正的訊息的話你明明知道有黃牛的情勢你卻沒有辦法去追啊\n所以這點我們再來改進我來了解一下那你們再研議一下這個如何來改善那當然也有民眾他有反映出說只要在網路上有加價販售這個認定你們現在已經擴及到只要有上架的行為就處罰\n就票卷沒有賣出也是一樣所以這樣子的做法是不是會延伸催生出檢舉黃牛這個產業的這個隱憂所以對於我們文化部來追這個黃牛票有擾民的這個部分部長您說你們可以來研議看有什麼比較周全一點的方法\n昨天內政委員會他們有出審設違法對於運輸遊樂票券黃牛票的罰款有提高來打擊黃牛大午化部這邊是不是也可以跟內政部這邊加強合作我們來提升打擊黃牛票這個效率以及精準度\n是 剛剛講到那個販售的那個定義是 善價陳列 多售多算但是剛剛講到老民跟我們的效率 的確是我們未來要討論的一個部分就是在不老民的情況下 又要很有效率的抓到這個黃牛然後抓到黃牛之後 他本身要罰多少錢譬如最近抓到之後 罰太重的話 他就訴訟\n他還是跟文化部疏遠所以這一套機制其實是因為其實黃劉漂說真的他可以有這樣的手法去販售他就是可以鑽這些漏洞那我們如果去補這些洞就變成說我們可能要多費心那這邊我還要請教部長關於剛才有很多委員非常關心的粉絲見面會是不是屬於藝文表演的一種型態\n您覺得我剛才其實一再強調當年我們的文創法裡面加了這一條黃流的票是界定表演藝術 音樂表演一定要正式的有一個表演售票但是屬於剛剛您講的那個粉絲見面會它這個情況是各式各樣會一直變化我們要是把它界定成是表演的話那這個將來是量量是非常大而且是一個灰色地帶\n因為影視產業的內容是非常多元 它有各種的太陽如果我們很狹隘的去認定 粉絲見面會不屬於藝文表演不屬於文創法的規範我們要如何去抑制黃牛票四處的串行\n任何應該以民眾來講他們會認為說任何的藝文表演有關的都會可以是適用文創法那部長您現在以你們的想法是覺得說這樣子它不算是表演所以它就不適用文創法嗎是它不算表演因為我剛剛有特別提到這個灰色地帶將來會一直蔓延譬如說見面簽名\n唱一首歌算不算 唱兩首歌算不算它實在是一個商業行為在圈粉絲的過程中是一個商業行為它要賣票跟表演是不太一樣文化部當年會把黃牛拉進我們的文創法裡面其實已經給我們帶來無限的麻煩我們整個文化部為了抓黃牛這件事情我剛才講過從抓到\n地方上警察抓到之後他訴怨等等我覺得我們如果再加進這一項其實我可以理解部長您現在講這樣子的文化部的困擾對一個文化推動者一個產業的推動者協助者那在\n無話推動跟商業行為跟黃牛票之間你們要如何在這個中間找到一個平衡而且又能夠扶植到產業也不會讓這些黃牛有機可乘而傷害到我們產業或傷害到我們民眾的熱情這個部分\n取捨或者說這個斟酌這個部分當然也需要說文化部的同仁來費心但是其實如果你沒有一個相關的規範相關的一個制度去遏止黃牛票的話其實對產業的傷害也是很大的那這邊我再請教部長您之前有說跟更長管家洽談這個實名制的這個優惠方案我想知道說相關的進度如何\n我覺得還不錯就是像小巨蛋他就願意如果你願意實名制他就八五折這個部分可能是我們最有進度的部分就是我們不斷的跟這些最大型的產款去談實名制我們文化部也編了預算鼓勵實名制\n其實已經有願意開始配合你過去好很多而且各場館也知道這個環遊的問題之後他們會主動編列那個優惠像剛剛講小巨蛋就編了85折如果你願意用實名制的話我的租賃給你是85折像這個就算是很大的進步這就很成功了對 因為我們如果不從源頭去解決的話我剛剛講到一方面又要維護這些\n他個人的個資有沒有然後一方面要去抓他抓到之後他又宿院我們整個文化部真的是為了這個黃牛我們的同仁真的很辛苦所以我們必須從源頭把他杜絕那源頭杜絕就是拜託這些場館\n市民誌對 這個真的是好 那我也希望文化部這邊繼續努力啦那也是還有就是說我剛剛提到的這個部分就是說關於粉絲見面會 握手會還是簽唱會或是相關這樣的它都有各種的名稱啦那也希望說你們要通盤檢討相關的這個機制我們要納入各種的太陽來考量才能夠真正落實說查其黃牛票好 以上謝謝好 謝謝\n好 謝謝陳秀寶委員 部長請回那我們接下來休息五分鐘\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:02.659 --> 00:06.201\n謝主席請文化部李海部長好有請李部長陳委員你好部長好在本席質詢之前呢針對我們這些又多又繁雜的這是近乎是刁難的解凍報告呢本席這邊要先肯認文化部同仁進行來撰寫解凍報告因為其實文化部的預算呢在我們\n\n00:30.816 --> 00:48.659\n委員會的山洞之外呢還有被大會山洞的還有被捅山捅洞之後你們分配到的所以這可以說是史上規模最大最複雜的這個預算的山洞那同仁呢真的文化部的同仁已經非常的努力所以我希望在野的同仁可以一起來支持文化部的解凍\n\n00:49.400 --> 00:53.804\n好那接下來呢這邊要先關心小公視的經費的這個狀況預算案中文化部對公視的這個補助呢是減列了2300萬並且凍結了25%那再加上呢影視及流行音樂與輔導呢凍結了5000萬文化部的報告裡面有提到說因為預算會影響到小公視那本席這邊先請教說對小公視的影響以及目前節目直播有沒有延宕或是停擺的狀況\n\n01:18.067 --> 01:26.220\n我想一定會吧我想請董事長報告因為這個部分我們固定的預算如果不能給的話那董事長這邊您先簡單的報告一下\n\n01:29.209 --> 01:53.525\n謝謝委員的關心目前對小公司的影響是還蠻大的3的部分當然我們就必須要做一點項目的調整那也使得有些計畫沒辦法繼續但最主要是因為動的部分也蠻大的數字那這個部分我們目前有13個新的創的計畫目前為止都必須先暫停然後其他有些在進行中的項目我們都必須要做斟酌的修剪\n\n01:54.345 --> 02:16.926\n或者是做一些调整这块我们还是蛮希望能够立法院赶快解冻因为这对国家的儿少教育的发展对儿少的这个成长影响很大是是好那这个部分呢因为今天是解冻案我们都希望说可以顺利今天会提到小公事是因为近期有不少的家长跟我分享也且称赞我们有个节目叫做欢迎光临我的牧场\n\n02:17.626 --> 02:33.398\n裡面就是帶孩子們去認識養殖動物的辛苦以及相關的工作內容很有趣那孩子很喜歡看我們家的小子子也很喜歡但是家長就會擔心啊這麼優質的節目如果相關經費沒有順利解凍是不是就影響相關的這些節目的製播那部長你有看過相關這個影片嗎\n\n02:36.380 --> 02:54.303\n有你自己有看過其實那個文化的那個節目的製作是很長一段時間他不是臨時要做所以那個山跟洞對我們來講傷害很大因為我們做一半做不下其實這個節目在youtube可以看到所以家長非常的喜歡他可以重複的播放給孩子們看\n\n02:55.504 --> 03:19.522\n那我想部長你一定了解家長的憂心啦所以我在這邊還是要呼籲說在野黨真的你們要放下這個砍預算的屠刀我們要回歸我們審查預算的專業不要讓這麼優質的兒少節目受到影響影響到兒少的權益喔謝謝那再來我要針對文資修復的部分本席也非常關心本席的選區鹿港是我國著名的古蹟聚落所以對文資修復的這個需求量非常的大\n\n03:21.604 --> 03:36.331\n那本席在週一的時候也才到我們鹿港的三三國廟以及西安宮來考察修繕的成果那我相信部長也一定很支持文資修復再利用但是現在目前文資局的文化資產業務被凍結了500萬業務費被凍結了30%那這個都會影響到文資局推動相關的有形的無形的這些文化資產保存的維護的工作\n\n03:46.275 --> 04:12.524\n這次的考察裡面其實地方的文書工作者以及相關的古蹟的管理者都提出了可以再協助的相關的事項因為你修繕之後古蹟修繕之後就會有彩繪泥作等相關的這個後續的維護需求那當然我們文資的這個修復跟再利用不會有終點所以我希望說替我們鹿港大大小小的文資來爭取我們一定要先支持文資局的解凍這個預算的解凍但是我會希望說\n\n04:13.524 --> 04:37.540\n以後我們在編列預算的時候是不是可以逐年的來增加對於文資方面這些相關的預算呢請部長您說一下您的想法其實我們始終不夠因為剛剛我在前面報告的時候就是台灣的災情隨時發生各地方上的宮廟也好還有一些古蹟也好他隨時需要我們幫忙\n\n04:38.641 --> 04:55.603\n然後所以文資局所承擔的那個業務跟修繕是很重的所以這個部分的預算當然是一定要增加所以我剛才一直強調其實文化部的預算為什麼有時候我被刪或者被動會覺得很難過是因為它本來就不太夠\n\n04:56.784 --> 05:02.148\n就像委員剛剛講它是不夠的我們隨著時間的推移需要我們修上維護的會越來越多經費也越來越龐大所以這個部分我也一再的在每次質詢的時候我會提到說希望對於文資的修復這個部分我們可以更重視可以爭取到更多的預算當然有一些民眾怕人不理解他們以為他說那今年的預算煽動之後不是跟以前的規模一樣嗎但是其實我們對預算的需求是越來越高的我們必須逐年去增加逐年去編列\n\n05:26.405 --> 05:42.759\n那這個部分也請將來就是我們在編預算的時候在這一塊呢我們能夠多注意然後能夠多支持好那這個部分呢我先就在預算的部分先這樣子我要先講一下現在民眾非常關心而且網路上很熱議的就是關於黃牛茶黃牛泡茶器的問題\n\n05:44.921 --> 06:09.795\n這是攸關民眾的權益那如果說我們在黃牛票的查緝有擾民的話是不是我們應該改善檢舉的資訊在日前有媒體指出有民眾在社群平台原價讓售演唱會的票卷去遭到文化局要求說明的這樣的事件那衍生出來就是有大家很熱烈的討論那其中有討論到的就是說文化部的這個黃牛檢舉專區資訊填寫的問題\n\n06:14.478 --> 06:34.077\n這個部分我們資訊體檢要求要寫包含座位等詳細的訊息就是提升檢舉的難度因為現在很多黃牛他在賣票的時候是透過LINE的群組的方式來賣但是他不會透過真正的座位的訊息他會提供一個大概的區間大家自己排自己幾個座位這樣\n\n06:34.757 --> 06:44.875\n那如果民眾他發現有這樣的情勢他沒有辦法檢討因為他沒有買到票啊他還沒買票的時候他就不知道真正的座位的這個訊息所以這個部分我們文化部是不是可以來研議檢討這個改善這樣的機制\n\n06:47.742 --> 07:15.715\n其實這個真的是兩難因為如果我們的資訊不足的話我們無法確定他這個檢舉是不是本人然後我們要如何去把它確定資料所以剛剛講的真的是對我們文化部來講是兩難因為資訊不足我們官司把它找到這個確定是坐在哪裡哪個位置我們都沒有辦法但是你會變成說如果你要貼這樣的訊息你沒有拿到票你不知道真正的訊息的話你明明知道有黃牛的情勢你卻沒有辦法去追啊\n\n07:16.823 --> 07:28.673\n所以這點我們再來改進我來了解一下那你們再研議一下這個如何來改善那當然也有民眾他有反映出說只要在網路上有加價販售這個認定你們現在已經擴及到只要有上架的行為就處罰\n\n07:34.778 --> 07:43.583\n就票卷沒有賣出也是一樣所以這樣子的做法是不是會延伸催生出檢舉黃牛這個產業的這個隱憂所以對於我們文化部來追這個黃牛票有擾民的這個部分部長您說你們可以來研議看有什麼比較周全一點的方法\n\n07:53.749 --> 08:09.535\n昨天內政委員會他們有出審設違法對於運輸遊樂票券黃牛票的罰款有提高來打擊黃牛大午化部這邊是不是也可以跟內政部這邊加強合作我們來提升打擊黃牛票這個效率以及精準度\n\n08:10.965 --> 08:34.854\n是剛剛講到那個販售的那個定義是善價陳列多售多算但是剛剛講到老民跟我們的效率的確是我們未來要討論的一個部分就是在不老民的情況下又要很有效率的抓到這個黃牛然後抓到黃牛之後他本身要罰多少錢譬如最近抓到之後罰太重的話他就訴訟\n\n08:36.374 --> 09:01.547\n他還是跟文化部疏遠所以這一套機制其實是因為其實黃劉漂說真的他可以有這樣的手法去販售他就是可以鑽這些漏洞那我們如果去補這些洞就變成說我們可能要多費心那這邊我還要請教部長關於剛才有很多委員非常關心的粉絲見面會是不是屬於藝文表演的一種型態\n\n09:02.881 --> 09:28.541\n您覺得我剛才其實一再強調當年我們的文創法裡面加了這一條黃流的票是界定表演藝術音樂表演一定要正式的有一個表演售票但是屬於剛剛您講的那個粉絲見面會它這個情況是各式各樣會一直變化我們要是把它界定成是表演的話那這個將來是量量是非常大而且是一個灰色地帶\n\n09:30.502 --> 09:41.152\n因為影視產業的內容是非常多元它有各種的太陽如果我們很狹隘的去認定粉絲見面會不屬於藝文表演不屬於文創法的規範我們要如何去抑制黃牛票四處的串行\n\n09:53.863 --> 10:15.691\n任何應該以民眾來講他們會認為說任何的藝文表演有關的都會可以是適用文創法那部長您現在以你們的想法是覺得說這樣子它不算是表演所以它就不適用文創法嗎是它不算表演因為我剛剛有特別提到這個灰色地帶將來會一直蔓延譬如說見面簽名\n\n10:17.412 --> 10:40.211\n唱一首歌算不算唱兩首歌算不算它實在是一個商業行為在圈粉絲的過程中是一個商業行為它要賣票跟表演是不太一樣文化部當年會把黃牛拉進我們的文創法裡面其實已經給我們帶來無限的麻煩我們整個文化部為了抓黃牛這件事情我剛才講過從抓到\n\n10:42.153 --> 10:57.682\n地方上警察抓到之後他訴怨等等我覺得我們如果再加進這一項其實我可以理解部長您現在講這樣子的文化部的困擾對一個文化推動者一個產業的推動者協助者那在\n\n10:58.903 --> 11:01.886\n無話推動跟商業行為跟黃牛票之間你們要如何在這個中間找到一個平衡而且又能夠扶植到產業也不會讓這些黃牛有機可乘而傷害到我們產業或傷害到我們民眾的熱情這個部分\n\n11:17.883 --> 11:40.584\n取捨或者說這個斟酌這個部分當然也需要說文化部的同仁來費心但是其實如果你沒有一個相關的規範相關的一個制度去遏止黃牛票的話其實對產業的傷害也是很大的那這邊我再請教部長您之前有說跟更長管家洽談這個實名制的這個優惠方案我想知道說相關的進度如何\n\n11:42.045 --> 11:59.296\n我覺得還不錯就是像小巨蛋他就願意如果你願意實名制他就八五折這個部分可能是我們最有進度的部分就是我們不斷的跟這些最大型的產款去談實名制我們文化部也編了預算鼓勵實名制\n\n11:59.656 --> 12:22.152\n其實已經有願意開始配合你過去好很多而且各場館也知道這個環遊的問題之後他們會主動編列那個優惠像剛剛講小巨蛋就編了85折如果你願意用實名制的話我的租賃給你是85折像這個就算是很大的進步這就很成功了對因為我們如果不從源頭去解決的話我剛剛講到一方面又要維護這些\n\n12:24.033 --> 12:34.823\n他個人的個資有沒有然後一方面要去抓他抓到之後他又宿院我們整個文化部真的是為了這個黃牛我們的同仁真的很辛苦所以我們必須從源頭把他杜絕那源頭杜絕就是拜託這些場館\n\n12:39.787 --> 12:52.178\n市民誌對這個真的是好那我也希望文化部這邊繼續努力啦那也是還有就是說我剛剛提到的這個部分就是說關於粉絲見面會握手會還是簽唱會或是相關這樣的它都有各種的名稱啦那也希望說你們要通盤檢討相關的這個機制我們要納入各種的太陽來考量才能夠真正落實說查其黃牛票好以上謝謝好謝謝\n\n13:07.042 --> 13:12.176\n好謝謝陳秀寶委員部長請回那我們接下來休息五分鐘\n\n","segments":[{"start":2.659,"end":6.201,"text":"謝主席 請文化部李海部長好 有請李部長陳委員你好部長好 在本席質詢之前呢針對我們這些又多又繁雜的這是近乎是刁難的解凍報告呢本席這邊要先肯認文化部同仁進行來撰寫解凍報告因為其實文化部的預算呢在我們"},{"start":30.816,"end":48.659,"text":"委員會的山洞之外呢還有被大會山洞的還有被捅山捅洞之後你們分配到的所以這可以說是史上規模最大最複雜的這個預算的山洞那同仁呢真的文化部的同仁已經非常的努力所以我希望在野的同仁可以一起來支持文化部的解凍"},{"start":49.4,"end":53.804,"text":"好 那接下來呢這邊要先關心小公視的經費的這個狀況預算案中文化部對公視的這個補助呢是減列了2300萬並且凍結了25%那再加上呢影視及流行音樂與輔導呢凍結了5000萬文化部的報告裡面有提到說因為預算會影響到小公視那本席這邊先請教說對小公視的影響以及目前節目直播有沒有延宕或是停擺的狀況"},{"start":78.067,"end":86.22,"text":"我想一定會吧我想請董事長報告因為這個部分我們固定的預算如果不能給的話那董事長這邊您先簡單的報告一下"},{"start":89.209,"end":113.525,"text":"謝謝委員的關心目前對小公司的影響是還蠻大的3的部分當然我們就必須要做一點項目的調整那也使得有些計畫沒辦法繼續但最主要是因為動的部分也蠻大的數字那這個部分我們目前有13個新的創的計畫目前為止都必須先暫停然後其他有些在進行中的項目我們都必須要做斟酌的修剪"},{"start":114.345,"end":136.926,"text":"或者是做一些调整这块我们还是蛮希望能够立法院赶快解冻因为这对国家的儿少教育的发展对儿少的这个成长影响很大是是好那这个部分呢因为今天是解冻案我们都希望说可以顺利今天会提到小公事是因为近期有不少的家长跟我分享也且称赞我们有个节目叫做欢迎光临我的牧场"},{"start":137.626,"end":153.398,"text":"裡面就是帶孩子們去認識養殖動物的辛苦以及相關的工作內容很有趣那孩子很喜歡看我們家的小子子也很喜歡但是家長就會擔心啊這麼優質的節目如果相關經費沒有順利解凍是不是就影響相關的這些節目的製播那部長你有看過相關這個影片嗎"},{"start":156.38,"end":174.303,"text":"有你自己有看過其實那個文化的那個節目的製作是很長一段時間他不是臨時要做所以那個山跟洞對我們來講傷害很大因為我們做一半做不下其實這個節目在youtube可以看到所以家長非常的喜歡他可以重複的播放給孩子們看"},{"start":175.504,"end":199.522,"text":"那我想部長你一定了解家長的憂心啦所以我在這邊還是要呼籲說在野黨真的你們要放下這個砍預算的屠刀我們要回歸我們審查預算的專業不要讓這麼優質的兒少節目受到影響影響到兒少的權益喔 謝謝那再來我要針對文資修復的部分本席也非常關心本席的選區鹿港是我國著名的古蹟聚落所以對文資修復的這個需求量非常的大"},{"start":201.604,"end":216.331,"text":"那本席在週一的時候也才到我們鹿港的三三國廟以及西安宮來考察修繕的成果那我相信部長也一定很支持文資修復再利用但是現在目前文資局的文化資產業務被凍結了500萬業務費被凍結了30%那這個都會影響到文資局推動相關的有形的無形的這些文化資產保存的維護的工作"},{"start":226.275,"end":252.524,"text":"這次的考察裡面其實地方的文書工作者以及相關的古蹟的管理者都提出了可以再協助的相關的事項因為你修繕之後古蹟修繕之後就會有彩繪泥作等相關的這個後續的維護需求那當然我們文資的這個修復跟再利用不會有終點所以我希望說替我們鹿港大大小小的文資來爭取我們一定要先支持文資局的解凍這個預算的解凍但是我會希望說"},{"start":253.524,"end":277.54,"text":"以後我們在編列預算的時候是不是可以逐年的來增加對於文資方面這些相關的預算呢請部長您說一下您的想法其實我們始終不夠因為剛剛我在前面報告的時候就是台灣的災情隨時發生各地方上的宮廟也好還有一些古蹟也好他隨時需要我們幫忙"},{"start":278.641,"end":295.603,"text":"然後所以文資局所承擔的那個業務跟修繕是很重的所以這個部分的預算當然是一定要增加所以我剛才一直強調其實文化部的預算為什麼有時候我被刪或者被動會覺得很難過是因為它本來就不太夠"},{"start":296.784,"end":302.148,"text":"就像委員剛剛講它是不夠的我們隨著時間的推移需要我們修上維護的會越來越多經費也越來越龐大所以這個部分我也一再的在每次質詢的時候我會提到說希望對於文資的修復這個部分我們可以更重視可以爭取到更多的預算當然有一些民眾怕人不理解他們以為他說那今年的預算煽動之後不是跟以前的規模一樣嗎但是其實我們對預算的需求是越來越高的我們必須逐年去增加逐年去編列"},{"start":326.405,"end":342.759,"text":"那這個部分也請將來就是我們在編預算的時候在這一塊呢我們能夠多注意然後能夠多支持好那這個部分呢我先就在預算的部分先這樣子我要先講一下現在民眾非常關心而且網路上很熱議的就是關於黃牛茶黃牛泡茶器的問題"},{"start":344.921,"end":369.795,"text":"這是攸關民眾的權益那如果說我們在黃牛票的查緝有擾民的話是不是我們應該改善檢舉的資訊在日前有媒體指出有民眾在社群平台原價讓售演唱會的票卷去遭到文化局要求說明的這樣的事件那衍生出來就是有大家很熱烈的討論那其中有討論到的就是說文化部的這個黃牛檢舉專區資訊填寫的問題"},{"start":374.478,"end":394.077,"text":"這個部分我們資訊體檢要求要寫包含座位等詳細的訊息就是提升檢舉的難度因為現在很多黃牛他在賣票的時候是透過LINE的群組的方式來賣但是他不會透過真正的座位的訊息他會提供一個大概的區間大家自己排自己幾個座位這樣"},{"start":394.757,"end":404.875,"text":"那如果民眾他發現有這樣的情勢他沒有辦法檢討因為他沒有買到票啊他還沒買票的時候他就不知道真正的座位的這個訊息所以這個部分我們文化部是不是可以來研議檢討這個改善這樣的機制"},{"start":407.742,"end":435.715,"text":"其實這個真的是兩難因為如果我們的資訊不足的話我們無法確定他這個檢舉是不是本人然後我們要如何去把它確定資料所以剛剛講的真的是對我們文化部來講是兩難因為資訊不足我們官司把它找到這個確定是坐在哪裡哪個位置我們都沒有辦法但是你會變成說如果你要貼這樣的訊息你沒有拿到票你不知道真正的訊息的話你明明知道有黃牛的情勢你卻沒有辦法去追啊"},{"start":436.823,"end":448.673,"text":"所以這點我們再來改進我來了解一下那你們再研議一下這個如何來改善那當然也有民眾他有反映出說只要在網路上有加價販售這個認定你們現在已經擴及到只要有上架的行為就處罰"},{"start":454.778,"end":463.583,"text":"就票卷沒有賣出也是一樣所以這樣子的做法是不是會延伸催生出檢舉黃牛這個產業的這個隱憂所以對於我們文化部來追這個黃牛票有擾民的這個部分部長您說你們可以來研議看有什麼比較周全一點的方法"},{"start":473.749,"end":489.535,"text":"昨天內政委員會他們有出審設違法對於運輸遊樂票券黃牛票的罰款有提高來打擊黃牛大午化部這邊是不是也可以跟內政部這邊加強合作我們來提升打擊黃牛票這個效率以及精準度"},{"start":490.965,"end":514.854,"text":"是 剛剛講到那個販售的那個定義是 善價陳列 多售多算但是剛剛講到老民跟我們的效率 的確是我們未來要討論的一個部分就是在不老民的情況下 又要很有效率的抓到這個黃牛然後抓到黃牛之後 他本身要罰多少錢譬如最近抓到之後 罰太重的話 他就訴訟"},{"start":516.374,"end":541.547,"text":"他還是跟文化部疏遠所以這一套機制其實是因為其實黃劉漂說真的他可以有這樣的手法去販售他就是可以鑽這些漏洞那我們如果去補這些洞就變成說我們可能要多費心那這邊我還要請教部長關於剛才有很多委員非常關心的粉絲見面會是不是屬於藝文表演的一種型態"},{"start":542.881,"end":568.541,"text":"您覺得我剛才其實一再強調當年我們的文創法裡面加了這一條黃流的票是界定表演藝術 音樂表演一定要正式的有一個表演售票但是屬於剛剛您講的那個粉絲見面會它這個情況是各式各樣會一直變化我們要是把它界定成是表演的話那這個將來是量量是非常大而且是一個灰色地帶"},{"start":570.502,"end":581.152,"text":"因為影視產業的內容是非常多元 它有各種的太陽如果我們很狹隘的去認定 粉絲見面會不屬於藝文表演不屬於文創法的規範我們要如何去抑制黃牛票四處的串行"},{"start":593.863,"end":615.691,"text":"任何應該以民眾來講他們會認為說任何的藝文表演有關的都會可以是適用文創法那部長您現在以你們的想法是覺得說這樣子它不算是表演所以它就不適用文創法嗎是它不算表演因為我剛剛有特別提到這個灰色地帶將來會一直蔓延譬如說見面簽名"},{"start":617.412,"end":640.211,"text":"唱一首歌算不算 唱兩首歌算不算它實在是一個商業行為在圈粉絲的過程中是一個商業行為它要賣票跟表演是不太一樣文化部當年會把黃牛拉進我們的文創法裡面其實已經給我們帶來無限的麻煩我們整個文化部為了抓黃牛這件事情我剛才講過從抓到"},{"start":642.153,"end":657.682,"text":"地方上警察抓到之後他訴怨等等我覺得我們如果再加進這一項其實我可以理解部長您現在講這樣子的文化部的困擾對一個文化推動者一個產業的推動者協助者那在"},{"start":658.903,"end":661.886,"text":"無話推動跟商業行為跟黃牛票之間你們要如何在這個中間找到一個平衡而且又能夠扶植到產業也不會讓這些黃牛有機可乘而傷害到我們產業或傷害到我們民眾的熱情這個部分"},{"start":677.883,"end":700.584,"text":"取捨或者說這個斟酌這個部分當然也需要說文化部的同仁來費心但是其實如果你沒有一個相關的規範相關的一個制度去遏止黃牛票的話其實對產業的傷害也是很大的那這邊我再請教部長您之前有說跟更長管家洽談這個實名制的這個優惠方案我想知道說相關的進度如何"},{"start":702.045,"end":719.296,"text":"我覺得還不錯就是像小巨蛋他就願意如果你願意實名制他就八五折這個部分可能是我們最有進度的部分就是我們不斷的跟這些最大型的產款去談實名制我們文化部也編了預算鼓勵實名制"},{"start":719.656,"end":742.152,"text":"其實已經有願意開始配合你過去好很多而且各場館也知道這個環遊的問題之後他們會主動編列那個優惠像剛剛講小巨蛋就編了85折如果你願意用實名制的話我的租賃給你是85折像這個就算是很大的進步這就很成功了對 因為我們如果不從源頭去解決的話我剛剛講到一方面又要維護這些"},{"start":744.033,"end":754.823,"text":"他個人的個資有沒有然後一方面要去抓他抓到之後他又宿院我們整個文化部真的是為了這個黃牛我們的同仁真的很辛苦所以我們必須從源頭把他杜絕那源頭杜絕就是拜託這些場館"},{"start":759.787,"end":772.178,"text":"市民誌對 這個真的是好 那我也希望文化部這邊繼續努力啦那也是還有就是說我剛剛提到的這個部分就是說關於粉絲見面會 握手會還是簽唱會或是相關這樣的它都有各種的名稱啦那也希望說你們要通盤檢討相關的這個機制我們要納入各種的太陽來考量才能夠真正落實說查其黃牛票好 以上謝謝好 謝謝"},{"start":787.042,"end":792.176,"text":"好 謝謝陳秀寶委員 部長請回那我們接下來休息五分鐘"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":392,"blocks":[["陳委員秀寳：（10時38分）謝謝主席，請文化部李遠部長。"],["主席：有請李部長。"],["李部長遠：陳委員你好。"],["陳委員秀寳：部長好。在本席質詢之前，針對你們這些又多又繁雜，近乎是刁難的解凍報告，本席在這邊要先肯認文化部同仁盡心來撰寫解凍報告。因為其實文化部的預算在我們委員會的刪凍之外，還有被大會刪凍的，還有被統刪、統凍之後你們分配到的，所以這可以說是史上規模最大、最複雜的預算刪凍。文化部同仁真的已經非常的努力了，所以我希望在野的同仁可以一起來支持文化部的解凍。","接下來我要先關心小公視的經費狀況，預算案中文化部對公視的補助是減列2,300萬，並且凍結了25%，再加上影視及流行音樂與輔導凍結了5,000萬。文化部的報告裡面有提到預算刪凍會影響到小公視，本席這邊先請教對於小公視的影響，以及目前節目製播有沒有延宕或是停擺的狀況？"],["李部長遠：我想一定會吧！請董事長報告，因為這部分我們固定預算如果不能給的話，節目的……"],["陳委員秀寳：請董事長先簡單報告一下。"],["胡董事長元輝：謝謝委員的關心。目前對小公視的影響還滿大的，刪的部分我們當然必須做一點項目調整，也使得有些計畫沒辦法繼續。最主要是被凍結的數字滿大的，以致目前十三個新創計畫都必須先暫停。至於其他在進行中的項目，有些必須斟酌修減或做一些調整，所以我們滿希望立法院能儘快解凍，因為這對國家兒少教育的發展，對兒少的成長……"],["陳委員秀寳：影響很大？"],["胡董事長元輝：是、是。"],["陳委員秀寳：好。因為今天是處理解凍案，我們都希望審查可以順利。今天之所以會提到小公視，是因為近期有不少家長跟我分享、也稱讚「歡迎光臨我的牧場」這個節目，也就是帶孩子去認識養殖動物的辛苦與相關工作，內容很有趣，孩子很喜歡看，像我們家的小姪子就很喜歡。不過家長會擔心，這麼優質的節目如果相關經費沒有順利解凍，是不是就會影響節目的製播？部長，你有看過節目影片嗎？"],["李部長遠：有。"],["陳委員秀寳：你自己有看過？"],["李部長遠：其實文化節目的製播需要一段很長的時間，並不是臨時做的，所以預算的刪凍對我們來講傷害很大，因為會做到一半做不下去。"],["陳委員秀寳：這個節目在YouTube可以看到，所以家長非常喜歡，可以重複播放給孩子們看。我想部長你一定了解家長的憂心，而我在這邊也要呼籲在野黨，真的要放下砍預算的屠刀，回歸審查預算的專業，不要讓這麼優質的兒少節目受到影響，從而影響到兒少的權益，謝謝。","再來我要針對文資修復的部分，這點本席也非常關心。本席的選區鹿港是我國著名的古蹟聚落，對文資修復的需求量非常大！本席在週一才到鹿港三山國王廟及興安宮考察修繕的成果，相信部長一定也很支持文資的修復與再利用。但目前文資局的文化資產業務被凍結了500萬，業務費被凍結了30%，這些都會影響到文資局所推動有形、無形的與文化資產保存相關的維護工作。這次考察時，地方文史工作者及古蹟管理者都提出了需要再協助的事項，因為古蹟修繕之後會有彩繪、泥作等後續的維護需求。當然，文資的修復與再利用不會有終點，所以我希望能替鹿港大大小小的文資來爭取，並支持文資局的預算解凍。不過我也希望以後在編列預算時，是不是可以逐年增加與文資有關的預算呢？請部長說一下想法。"],["李部長遠：其實我們的預算始終不夠！剛剛我在報告時說過，臺灣隨時會有災情發生，地方上的宮廟或古蹟隨時需要我們的幫忙，因此文資局所承擔的業務跟修繕工作是很重要的，所以這部分的預算當然一定要增加。我剛剛一直強調，為什麼文化部的預算被刪或者被凍，我會覺得很難過？是因為本來就不太夠，就像委員剛才講的，是不夠的！"],["陳委員秀寳：隨著時間推移，需要修繕與維護的會越來越多，經費會越來越龐大，所以在每次質詢時我會一再提到，希望對於文資的修復可以更重視，可以爭取到更多的預算。當然，有些民眾不理解，以為就算今年的預算被刪凍，但規模不是跟以前一樣嗎？其實我們對預算的需求只會越來越高，甚至必須逐年增加，逐年編列。因此，將來在編預算時就這一塊能多注意、多支持。預算部分就先這樣子，我現在要講民眾非常關心，且網路上很熱議的查緝黃牛票的問題，畢竟攸關民眾權益。","在查緝黃牛票時如果擾民的話，是不是應該改善檢舉資訊？日前有媒體指出，有民眾在社群平臺原價讓售演唱會票券，卻遭到文化局要求說明，引起大家熱烈的討論，其中有討論到文化部黃牛檢舉專區資訊填寫的問題。據悉，資訊填寫包含座位等詳細訊息，這提升了檢舉難度，因為現在很多黃牛透過LINE群組賣票，並不會透露真正的座位訊息，只會提供大概的區間，大概第幾排第幾個座位之類的。一旦民眾發現有這樣的情事時，其實是無法檢舉的，因為沒有買到票！既然沒有買到票，就不知道真正的座位訊息！所以文化部是不是可以研議、檢討並改善這樣的機制？"],["李部長遠：其實這真的是兩難！因為如果資訊不足的話，我們就無法確定是不是由本人所檢舉的，以及如何去確定資料，所以這對我們文化部來講真的是兩難，畢竟資訊不足，甚至光確定坐在哪裡、在哪個位置都沒有辦法。"],["陳委員秀寳：但如果要填寫這樣的訊息，在沒有拿到票的情況下，就不知道真正的訊息為何。明明知道有黃牛票，卻沒有辦法去追！"],["李部長遠：是，這點我們再來改進，我來了解一下，因為……"],["陳委員秀寳：拜託研議一下看如何來改善。"],["李部長遠：好，是。"],["陳委員秀寳：也有民眾反映說，只要在網路上有加價販售的……因為你們現在已經擴及到只要有上架的行為就算觸法，即使票券沒有賣出也一樣。所以這樣的做法是不是會衍生出檢舉黃牛產業的隱憂？對於文化部追黃牛票.擾民這點，部長說可以研議看有什麼比較周全的方法，日前內政委員會初審社維法修正草案，提高運輸、有料票券的黃牛票罰鍰，以打擊黃牛，文化部是不是可以跟內政部加強合作，提升打擊黃牛票的效率及精準度？"],["李部長遠：是，講到販售定義，凡上架、陳列、兜售都算；至於擾民跟效率，這的確是我們未來需要討論的，也就是在不擾民的情況下，又要很有效率抓到黃牛，且在抓到黃牛之後要罰多少錢？譬如以最近抓到的來說，如果黃牛覺得罰太重就會提起訴訟，甚至向文化部提起訴願，所以這一套機制其實是……"],["陳委員秀寳：其實黃牛之所以有這樣的販售手法就在於鑽漏洞！所以我們如何去補這些漏洞？我想可能要多費心……"],["李部長遠：是，對。"],["陳委員秀寳：我還想請教部長，這是剛才很多委員都非常關心的，也就是粉絲見面會是不是屬於藝文表演的一種型態？您覺得呢？"],["李部長遠：我剛才一再強調，當年文化部把黃牛拉進文創法，並界定表演藝術、音樂表演一定要有正式的表演與售票。至於您講到的粉絲見面會的情況則各式各樣，且會一直變化，若將其界定為表演，那麼將來的量會非常大，而且這是一個灰色地帶！"],["陳委員秀寳：部長，影視產業的內容非常多元，有各種態樣，如果很狹隘地認定粉絲見面會不屬於藝文表演，不在文創法規範的話，試問我們要如何抑制黃牛票的四處竄行？以民眾來講，會認為任何與藝文表演有關的都適用文創法，但現在部長的想法卻覺得不算表演，所以不適用文創法？"],["李部長遠：是，不算表演！我剛才有特別提到，這是一個灰色地帶，將來會一直蔓延。譬如見面、簽名、唱一首歌算不算？唱兩首歌算不算？這其實是一種商業行為，在圈粉絲過程中的商業行為，跟賣票表演不太一樣。文化部當年把黃牛拉進文創法規範，其實已經給我們帶來無限的麻煩，整個文化部為了抓黃牛……我剛才講過，地方警察抓到黃牛之後，他可以提訴願等等，如果再加進這一項……"],["陳委員秀寳：部長講到文化部的困擾，我可以理解。對於一個文化推動者，一個產業的推動者、協助者來說，在文化推動、商業行為跟黃牛票之間，你們要如何在中間找到平衡且能夠扶植到產業，也不會讓黃牛有機可趁，進而傷害到產業或民眾的熱情。其中的取捨或者說斟酌，當然也需要文化部同仁來費心，但是如果你沒有一個相關的規範、制度去遏止黃牛票的話，對產業的傷害也是很大的。","我再請教部長，您之前說跟各場館洽談實名制的優惠方案，我想知道相關的進度如何？"],["李部長遠：我覺得還不錯，像小巨蛋，如果你願意實名制就給八五折，這可能是我們最有進度的部分，不斷地跟最大型的場館去談實名制，文化部也編了預算鼓勵實名制。"],["陳委員秀寳：其實已經有願意開始配合的場館。"],["李部長遠：比過去好很多，而且各場館也知道黃牛的問題之後，他們會主動編列優惠，像剛剛講的小巨蛋，如果你願意用實名制的話，租賃是給你八五折，像這個就算是很大的進步。"],["陳委員秀寳：這就很成功啦！"],["李部長遠：對，因為我們如果不從源頭去解決的話，我剛剛講到，一方面又要維護個人的個資，一方面要去抓他，抓到之後他又訴願，整個文化部真的是為了黃牛，我們的同仁真的很辛苦，所以必須從源頭把它杜絕，源頭杜絕就是拜託這些場館他們在……"],["陳委員秀寳：實名制。"],["李部長遠：對，這個真的是……"],["陳委員秀寳：我也希望文化部繼續努力。還有我剛剛提到關於粉絲見面會、握手會、簽唱會或是相關各種名稱的活動，希望你們要通盤檢討相關的機制，要納入各種的態樣來考量，才能真正的落實查緝黃牛票。"],["李部長遠：是。"],["陳委員秀寳：以上，謝謝。"],["李部長遠：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝陳秀寳委員，部長請回座。","接下來休息5分鐘。","休息（10時51分）","繼續開會（11時00分）"],["主席：我們現在繼續開會。","現在邀請張雅琳委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":310,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-22-10","speakers":["林宜瑾","郭昱晴","劉書彬","吳沛憶","葛如鈞","柯志恩","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","陳秀寳","張雅琳","羅廷瑋","萬美玲","葉元之","范雲","蘇巧慧","黃捷","陳培瑜","邱志偉"],"page_start":235,"meetingDate":["2025-05-07"],"gazette_id":"1144601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144601_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期教育及文化委員會第10次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"處理114年度中央政府總預算有關文化部主管預算解凍案49案","agenda_id":"1144601_00005"}}}