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\"先\", \"start\": 519.54, \"end\": 519.88, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 519.88, \"end\": 520.2, \"score\": 0.891}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"李\", \"start\": 520.2, \"end\": 520.321, \"score\": 0.776}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 520.321, \"end\": 520.341, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 520.341, \"end\": 520.361, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"長\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:05,705 --> 00:00:07,966\n我們今天會通過這個兒童托育服務法\n\n2\n00:00:32,905 --> 00:00:55,897\n有報告應該會核定那這個我有看到就是說這個就是專為0到2歲的托育利益的專訪然後其中有一項就是說我們保留監視的影像這個儲存30天然後上傳雲端特別是針對我們的托育機構嘛對不對其中是不是有這一項那這一項之前是不是也有在做\n\n3\n00:00:58,427 --> 00:01:25,720\n我們之前有一個這個拖音中心監視錄影設備設置及資訊管理利用辦法我們之前是不是有這個辦法我們之前就有可是它是儲存在拖音中心裡面沒有上傳雲端所以我們現在有一個監管雲對我們日後就是我們希望是能夠上傳在地方政府的雲端那現在就是說各個這一個不管是公托私托也有對不對應該是全面性的\n\n4\n00:01:26,862 --> 00:01:50,755\n目前公司立在自己的通運中心都有都有嘛對不對但是他們就是自己保存沒有上傳到雲端所以我們現在是要求是各個縣市政府都要設立這個監管雲嗎那經費就是各個縣市政府自己在處理嗎中央我們補助他們中央會補助中央會補助這個地方政府那是指針對這個通運機構公共的通運機構嗎\n\n5\n00:01:54,298 --> 00:02:08,535\n我們法令通過之後我們就會補助他就是公司裡都要上雲端都要上雲端就對了然後就是保存30天30日因為其實其實我們也擔心其實很多這個案件就是說發現說保存在自己的這一個這個脫肉機構裡面你萬一啦\n\n6\n00:02:12,439 --> 00:02:36,213\n發生事情的時候那通常不知道為什麼這個影片就會找不到所以我們就上場運動當然就是說怎麼去使用它要有相關的配套的措施這個也要兼顧到這一個兒童他們的人權那也包含這個教保員他們的人權我覺得這個就是說這個相關的配套措施要來做好那我再請教一下\n\n7\n00:02:36,693 --> 00:02:44,524\n因為現在今天是討論這個長照3.0那我們這一個長期照護師的師長也有來嘛那現在我再討論一個就是獨老的問題獨老獨老的問題那現在就是說按照數據來講的話我這裡有2024年的一個數據新北市是全台灣獨老\n\n8\n00:02:54,457 --> 00:03:10,797\n最多的縣市總計有18.9萬人然後其實包含這個台北市高雄市也有那我不知道這個衛福部有沒有去統計就是說那到底我們現在這個獨老的狀況是怎麼樣就是說你超過65歲然後在家裡面只有你一個這個長者在有沒有這個數據\n\n9\n00:03:12,813 --> 00:03:33,004\n那請那個理事長非常感謝委員的關心我跟委員報告我們現在對於所謂獨老我們事實上是有一定的定義就主要指的就是說你的譬如你的這一個子女就兩人兩人都65歲以上這是第一個情況第二個情況可能就是說你有子女可是他不在你所居住的這一個縣市縣市喔就是那個\n\n10\n00:03:38,712 --> 00:03:54,822\n在你現在目前的縣市之外就是你的那個照管的那一個區域以這個定義來說的話我們現在目前全台有五萬五千一百二十九人這是有列冊的是不是有列冊關懷\n\n11\n00:03:57,203 --> 00:04:11,090\n但是我看這個數據也不一樣啊審計部是說五萬多但是你們自己的這個數據是39萬然後內政部更高內政部是六十幾萬報告委員這個事實上是那個定義的問題內政部他們那邊是指就是說你那個是指那個戶是指那個戶數\n\n12\n00:04:14,051 --> 00:04:43,366\n那我們的定義比方就是說虛關懷者虛關懷就是我剛剛說的嘛就是說你要符合這兩個要件那其實範圍滿大你們是以縣市譬如說好那今天在我三重對然後如果說家裡面有一個65歲自己一個人居住的然後呢可是他子女呢一定要在這一個台北才算嗎那如果說他是在在蘆洲那蘆洲可能稍微近一點啦那在板橋那邊那這樣就這樣就不算了是不是\n\n13\n00:04:45,083 --> 00:04:48,779\n那個我們主要的事大概是第一個當然他是自己一個人住\n\n14\n00:04:49,431 --> 00:05:16,282\n然後第二個是說他的子女沒有辦法就近的協助他對可是你們的範圍太大了是跨縣市喔如果跨峽的話大概在鄰近的我們應該是有縣市就是鄰近的部分我們其實是應該是會第一個是他的這個縣市政府可能會評估啦他的子女是不是能夠照顧他如果不能關懷他那他也可以跟我們提出來我們也會列入在我們的獨老的名冊上我意思就是說你們在用跨縣市\n\n15\n00:05:17,703 --> 00:05:34,044\n那如果是在不是在是同樣的縣市但是不同區那多少人數應該會更多應該這樣講就是說當然戶籍裡面單獨一戶的人就是剛剛提到的那個大概是戶政的資料他的人數是多的\n\n16\n00:05:34,505 --> 00:06:00,281\n可是我們各地方政府在做獨老的這個關懷方式第一個是他可以表達他有需要關懷那這個叫做我們所謂的列冊那我們到今年底大概去年的六月大概是五萬六千人那今年又增加了大概有六萬人那大概我們目前的定義是這個樣子我是討論定義啦我就是說你們現在定義是放的就是說比較寬啦就是說你是要跨縣市捏\n\n17\n00:06:01,741 --> 00:06:27,208\n是不是比如說你在新北三重你要跨到基隆跨到台北然後家裡面只有一個人這才算是獨老那我意思就是說如果他是住三重但是子女可能在板橋這樣就不算沒有他也可以說他有需求我們也會列入第三個條款就是他認為他有需要我們就會把他列進來好那現在就是說那你們現在對於這種獨老的照顧有沒有列在你們這一個長照3.0裡面\n\n18\n00:06:30,269 --> 00:06:58,289\n報告委員我先做兩個回覆第一個就是說剛剛說的你現在說的這一個39萬跟這一個我們6萬中間有相差28萬那我必須要承認這個我們可能有低估所以我們現在目前其實賴清德總統他也非常關心這個問題所以我們現在目前會有一個我們現在目前會有一個計畫跟地方政府這邊大家共同我們必須要來做一次全國性的一個設備然後把這一個人數我想就是說真的需要關心的我們會把它\n\n19\n00:06:59,169 --> 00:07:19,705\n我覺得需要做一個調查啦這個部分也跟委員報告我們跟內政部那邊已經開過幾次會了我們這個部分計畫會最近會來推出這是第一個重點第二個重點就是說我們現在目前如果說你有這一個其實跟委員報告其實你雖然是獨老可是也不見得就一定會需要受到照顧\n\n20\n00:07:20,946 --> 00:07:38,472\n有些長輩可能我覺得他覺得LiveAlong可能他自己就想要這樣他也不想要受到人家的打擾所以我們現在最重要是有關懷需求者那有關懷需求的話我們現在目前就是說3號3.0這邊會把他列入那這個列入的話就是除了擴大我們現在目前的1966那部分之外另外我們會加強有關於這剛剛說的獨老的訪視\n\n21\n00:07:43,206 --> 00:07:58,543\n就是說這獨老房子現在是各個縣市政府他們自己社會局在做是他們社會局但是我有一些都是民間自己團體在做像一些獨老送餐那些都是民間團體自己在做的包圍那些有一些是他自己其實因為我在台中當過社會局長\n\n22\n00:07:59,784 --> 00:08:11,116\n有很多事實上是我們社會局我們委託我們用那個我們我們有委辦的方式就是說我們那個名冊給他之後然後呢我們來由他來做送餐我是希望說你們長照3.0把這個獨老這個這個這個有需要照顧的要把它列進去那有時候他他\n\n23\n00:08:19,484 --> 00:08:40,361\n有時候老人家會覺得說我不需要你的照顧但實際上他可能有需要啊所以不是說我不需要你的照顧那你就不用照顧但實際上他可能老人家有說面子或是怎麼樣我覺得這個東西你們自己要去除了他主觀的意願之外一些客觀的一些條件你們也要去做評估啊OK好吧今天就先這樣好謝謝李委員謝謝部長\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n5705\t7966\t我們今天會通過這個兒童托育服務法\n32905\t55897\t有報告 應該會核定那這個我有看到就是說這個就是專為0到2歲的托育利益的專訪然後其中有一項就是說我們保留監視的影像這個儲存30天 然後上傳雲端特別是針對我們的托育機構嘛 對不對其中是不是有這一項那這一項之前是不是也有在做\n58427\t85720\t我們之前有一個這個拖音中心監視錄影設備設置及資訊管理利用辦法我們之前是不是有這個辦法我們之前就有可是它是儲存在拖音中心裡面沒有上傳雲端所以我們現在有一個監管雲對我們日後就是我們希望是能夠上傳在地方政府的雲端那現在就是說各個這一個不管是公托私托也有對不對應該是全面性的\n86862\t110755\t目前公司立在自己的通運中心都有都有嘛對不對但是他們就是自己保存沒有上傳到雲端所以我們現在是要求是各個縣市政府都要設立這個監管雲嗎那經費就是各個縣市政府自己在處理嗎中央我們補助他們中央會補助中央會補助這個地方政府那是指針對這個通運機構公共的通運機構嗎\n114298\t128535\t我們法令通過之後我們就會補助他就是公司裡都要上雲端都要上雲端就對了然後就是保存30天30日因為其實其實我們也擔心其實很多這個案件就是說發現說保存在自己的這一個這個脫肉機構裡面你萬一啦\n132439\t156213\t發生事情的時候那通常不知道為什麼這個影片就會找不到所以我們就上場運動當然就是說怎麼去使用它要有相關的配套的措施這個也要兼顧到這一個兒童他們的人權那也包含這個教保員他們的人權我覺得這個就是說這個相關的配套措施要來做好那我再請教一下\n156693\t164524\t因為現在今天是討論這個長照3.0那我們這一個長期照護師的師長也有來嘛那現在我再討論一個就是獨老的問題獨老 獨老的問題那現在就是說按照數據來講的話我這裡有2024年的一個數據新北市是全台灣獨老\n174457\t190797\t最多的縣市總計有18.9萬人然後其實包含這個台北市高雄市也有那我不知道這個衛福部有沒有去統計就是說那到底我們現在這個獨老的狀況是怎麼樣就是說你超過65歲然後在家裡面只有你一個這個長者在有沒有這個數據\n192813\t213004\t那請那個理事長非常感謝委員的關心我跟委員報告我們現在對於所謂獨老我們事實上是有一定的定義就主要指的就是說你的譬如你的這一個子女就兩人兩人都65歲以上這是第一個情況第二個情況可能就是說你有子女可是他不在你所居住的這一個縣市縣市喔就是那個\n218712\t234822\t在你現在目前的縣市之外就是你的那個照管的那一個區域以這個定義來說的話我們現在目前全台有五萬五千一百二十九人這是有列冊的是不是有列冊關懷\n237203\t251090\t但是我看這個數據也不一樣啊審計部是說五萬多但是你們自己的這個數據是39萬然後內政部更高內政部是六十幾萬報告委員這個事實上是那個定義的問題內政部他們那邊是指就是說你那個是指那個戶是指那個戶數\n254051\t283366\t那我們的定義比方就是說虛關懷者虛關懷就是我剛剛說的嘛就是說你要符合這兩個要件那其實範圍滿大你們是以縣市譬如說好那今天在我三重對然後如果說家裡面有一個65歲自己一個人居住的然後呢可是他子女呢一定要在這一個台北才算嗎那如果說他是在在蘆洲那蘆洲可能稍微近一點啦那在板橋那邊那這樣就這樣就不算了是不是\n285083\t288779\t那個我們主要的事大概是第一個當然他是自己一個人住\n289431\t316282\t然後第二個是說他的子女沒有辦法就近的協助他對 可是你們的範圍太大了是跨縣市喔如果跨峽的話大概在鄰近的我們應該是有縣市就是鄰近的部分我們其實是應該是會第一個是他的這個縣市政府可能會評估啦他的子女是不是能夠照顧他如果不能關懷他那他也可以跟我們提出來我們也會列入在我們的獨老的名冊上我意思就是說你們在用跨縣市\n317703\t334044\t那如果是在不是在是同樣的縣市但是不同區那多少人數應該會更多應該這樣講就是說當然戶籍裡面單獨一戶的人就是剛剛提到的那個大概是戶政的資料他的人數是多的\n334505\t360281\t可是我們各地方政府在做獨老的這個關懷方式第一個是他可以表達他有需要關懷那這個叫做我們所謂的列冊那我們到今年底大概去年的六月大概是五萬六千人那今年又增加了大概有六萬人那大概我們目前的定義是這個樣子我是討論定義啦我就是說你們現在定義是放的就是說比較寬啦就是說你是要跨縣市捏\n361741\t387208\t是不是 比如說你在新北 三重你要跨到基隆 跨到台北然後家裡面只有一個人 這才算是獨老那我意思就是說如果他是住三重但是子女可能在板橋 這樣就不算沒有 他也可以說他有需求我們也會列入第三個條款就是他認為他有需要我們就會把他列進來好 那現在就是說那你們現在對於這種獨老的照顧有沒有列在你們這一個長照3.0裡面\n390269\t418289\t報告委員我先做兩個回覆第一個就是說剛剛說的你現在說的這一個39萬跟這一個我們6萬中間有相差28萬那我必須要承認這個我們可能有低估所以我們現在目前其實賴清德總統他也非常關心這個問題所以我們現在目前會有一個我們現在目前會有一個計畫跟地方政府這邊大家共同我們必須要來做一次全國性的一個設備然後把這一個人數我想就是說真的需要關心的我們會把它\n419169\t439705\t我覺得需要做一個調查啦這個部分也跟委員報告我們跟內政部那邊已經開過幾次會了我們這個部分計畫會最近會來推出這是第一個重點第二個重點就是說我們現在目前如果說你有這一個其實跟委員報告其實你雖然是獨老可是也不見得就一定會需要受到照顧\n440946\t458472\t有些長輩可能我覺得他覺得Live Along可能他自己就想要這樣他也不想要受到人家的打擾所以我們現在最重要是有關懷需求者那有關懷需求的話我們現在目前就是說3號3.0這邊會把他列入那這個列入的話就是除了擴大我們現在目前的1966那部分之外另外我們會加強有關於這剛剛說的獨老的訪視\n463206\t478543\t就是說這獨老房子現在是各個縣市政府他們自己社會局在做是他們社會局但是我有一些都是民間自己團體在做像一些獨老送餐那些都是民間團體自己在做的包圍那些有一些是他自己其實因為我在台中當過社會局長\n479784\t491116\t有很多事實上是我們社會局我們委託我們用那個我們我們有委辦的方式就是說我們那個名冊給他之後然後呢我們來由他來做送餐我是希望說你們長照3.0把這個獨老這個這個這個有需要照顧的要把它列進去那有時候他他\n499484\t520361\t有時候老人家會覺得說我不需要你的照顧但實際上他可能有需要啊所以不是說我不需要你的照顧那你就不用照顧但實際上他可能老人家有說面子或是怎麼樣我覺得這個東西你們自己要去除了他主觀的意願之外一些客觀的一些條件你們也要去做評估啊OK 好吧今天就先這樣好 謝謝李委員 謝謝部長\n","txt":"我們今天會通過這個兒童托育服務法\n有報告 應該會核定那這個我有看到就是說這個就是專為0到2歲的托育利益的專訪然後其中有一項就是說我們保留監視的影像這個儲存30天 然後上傳雲端特別是針對我們的托育機構嘛 對不對其中是不是有這一項那這一項之前是不是也有在做\n我們之前有一個這個拖音中心監視錄影設備設置及資訊管理利用辦法我們之前是不是有這個辦法我們之前就有可是它是儲存在拖音中心裡面沒有上傳雲端所以我們現在有一個監管雲對我們日後就是我們希望是能夠上傳在地方政府的雲端那現在就是說各個這一個不管是公托私托也有對不對應該是全面性的\n目前公司立在自己的通運中心都有都有嘛對不對但是他們就是自己保存沒有上傳到雲端所以我們現在是要求是各個縣市政府都要設立這個監管雲嗎那經費就是各個縣市政府自己在處理嗎中央我們補助他們中央會補助中央會補助這個地方政府那是指針對這個通運機構公共的通運機構嗎\n我們法令通過之後我們就會補助他就是公司裡都要上雲端都要上雲端就對了然後就是保存30天30日因為其實其實我們也擔心其實很多這個案件就是說發現說保存在自己的這一個這個脫肉機構裡面你萬一啦\n發生事情的時候那通常不知道為什麼這個影片就會找不到所以我們就上場運動當然就是說怎麼去使用它要有相關的配套的措施這個也要兼顧到這一個兒童他們的人權那也包含這個教保員他們的人權我覺得這個就是說這個相關的配套措施要來做好那我再請教一下\n因為現在今天是討論這個長照3.0那我們這一個長期照護師的師長也有來嘛那現在我再討論一個就是獨老的問題獨老 獨老的問題那現在就是說按照數據來講的話我這裡有2024年的一個數據新北市是全台灣獨老\n最多的縣市總計有18.9萬人然後其實包含這個台北市高雄市也有那我不知道這個衛福部有沒有去統計就是說那到底我們現在這個獨老的狀況是怎麼樣就是說你超過65歲然後在家裡面只有你一個這個長者在有沒有這個數據\n那請那個理事長非常感謝委員的關心我跟委員報告我們現在對於所謂獨老我們事實上是有一定的定義就主要指的就是說你的譬如你的這一個子女就兩人兩人都65歲以上這是第一個情況第二個情況可能就是說你有子女可是他不在你所居住的這一個縣市縣市喔就是那個\n在你現在目前的縣市之外就是你的那個照管的那一個區域以這個定義來說的話我們現在目前全台有五萬五千一百二十九人這是有列冊的是不是有列冊關懷\n但是我看這個數據也不一樣啊審計部是說五萬多但是你們自己的這個數據是39萬然後內政部更高內政部是六十幾萬報告委員這個事實上是那個定義的問題內政部他們那邊是指就是說你那個是指那個戶是指那個戶數\n那我們的定義比方就是說虛關懷者虛關懷就是我剛剛說的嘛就是說你要符合這兩個要件那其實範圍滿大你們是以縣市譬如說好那今天在我三重對然後如果說家裡面有一個65歲自己一個人居住的然後呢可是他子女呢一定要在這一個台北才算嗎那如果說他是在在蘆洲那蘆洲可能稍微近一點啦那在板橋那邊那這樣就這樣就不算了是不是\n那個我們主要的事大概是第一個當然他是自己一個人住\n然後第二個是說他的子女沒有辦法就近的協助他對 可是你們的範圍太大了是跨縣市喔如果跨峽的話大概在鄰近的我們應該是有縣市就是鄰近的部分我們其實是應該是會第一個是他的這個縣市政府可能會評估啦他的子女是不是能夠照顧他如果不能關懷他那他也可以跟我們提出來我們也會列入在我們的獨老的名冊上我意思就是說你們在用跨縣市\n那如果是在不是在是同樣的縣市但是不同區那多少人數應該會更多應該這樣講就是說當然戶籍裡面單獨一戶的人就是剛剛提到的那個大概是戶政的資料他的人數是多的\n可是我們各地方政府在做獨老的這個關懷方式第一個是他可以表達他有需要關懷那這個叫做我們所謂的列冊那我們到今年底大概去年的六月大概是五萬六千人那今年又增加了大概有六萬人那大概我們目前的定義是這個樣子我是討論定義啦我就是說你們現在定義是放的就是說比較寬啦就是說你是要跨縣市捏\n是不是 比如說你在新北 三重你要跨到基隆 跨到台北然後家裡面只有一個人 這才算是獨老那我意思就是說如果他是住三重但是子女可能在板橋 這樣就不算沒有 他也可以說他有需求我們也會列入第三個條款就是他認為他有需要我們就會把他列進來好 那現在就是說那你們現在對於這種獨老的照顧有沒有列在你們這一個長照3.0裡面\n報告委員我先做兩個回覆第一個就是說剛剛說的你現在說的這一個39萬跟這一個我們6萬中間有相差28萬那我必須要承認這個我們可能有低估所以我們現在目前其實賴清德總統他也非常關心這個問題所以我們現在目前會有一個我們現在目前會有一個計畫跟地方政府這邊大家共同我們必須要來做一次全國性的一個設備然後把這一個人數我想就是說真的需要關心的我們會把它\n我覺得需要做一個調查啦這個部分也跟委員報告我們跟內政部那邊已經開過幾次會了我們這個部分計畫會最近會來推出這是第一個重點第二個重點就是說我們現在目前如果說你有這一個其實跟委員報告其實你雖然是獨老可是也不見得就一定會需要受到照顧\n有些長輩可能我覺得他覺得Live Along可能他自己就想要這樣他也不想要受到人家的打擾所以我們現在最重要是有關懷需求者那有關懷需求的話我們現在目前就是說3號3.0這邊會把他列入那這個列入的話就是除了擴大我們現在目前的1966那部分之外另外我們會加強有關於這剛剛說的獨老的訪視\n就是說這獨老房子現在是各個縣市政府他們自己社會局在做是他們社會局但是我有一些都是民間自己團體在做像一些獨老送餐那些都是民間團體自己在做的包圍那些有一些是他自己其實因為我在台中當過社會局長\n有很多事實上是我們社會局我們委託我們用那個我們我們有委辦的方式就是說我們那個名冊給他之後然後呢我們來由他來做送餐我是希望說你們長照3.0把這個獨老這個這個這個有需要照顧的要把它列進去那有時候他他\n有時候老人家會覺得說我不需要你的照顧但實際上他可能有需要啊所以不是說我不需要你的照顧那你就不用照顧但實際上他可能老人家有說面子或是怎麼樣我覺得這個東西你們自己要去除了他主觀的意願之外一些客觀的一些條件你們也要去做評估啊OK 好吧今天就先這樣好 謝謝李委員 謝謝部長\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:05.705 --> 00:07.966\n我們今天會通過這個兒童托育服務法\n\n00:32.905 --> 00:55.897\n有報告應該會核定那這個我有看到就是說這個就是專為0到2歲的托育利益的專訪然後其中有一項就是說我們保留監視的影像這個儲存30天然後上傳雲端特別是針對我們的托育機構嘛對不對其中是不是有這一項那這一項之前是不是也有在做\n\n00:58.427 --> 01:25.720\n我們之前有一個這個拖音中心監視錄影設備設置及資訊管理利用辦法我們之前是不是有這個辦法我們之前就有可是它是儲存在拖音中心裡面沒有上傳雲端所以我們現在有一個監管雲對我們日後就是我們希望是能夠上傳在地方政府的雲端那現在就是說各個這一個不管是公托私托也有對不對應該是全面性的\n\n01:26.862 --> 01:50.755\n目前公司立在自己的通運中心都有都有嘛對不對但是他們就是自己保存沒有上傳到雲端所以我們現在是要求是各個縣市政府都要設立這個監管雲嗎那經費就是各個縣市政府自己在處理嗎中央我們補助他們中央會補助中央會補助這個地方政府那是指針對這個通運機構公共的通運機構嗎\n\n01:54.298 --> 02:08.535\n我們法令通過之後我們就會補助他就是公司裡都要上雲端都要上雲端就對了然後就是保存30天30日因為其實其實我們也擔心其實很多這個案件就是說發現說保存在自己的這一個這個脫肉機構裡面你萬一啦\n\n02:12.439 --> 02:36.213\n發生事情的時候那通常不知道為什麼這個影片就會找不到所以我們就上場運動當然就是說怎麼去使用它要有相關的配套的措施這個也要兼顧到這一個兒童他們的人權那也包含這個教保員他們的人權我覺得這個就是說這個相關的配套措施要來做好那我再請教一下\n\n02:36.693 --> 02:44.524\n因為現在今天是討論這個長照3.0那我們這一個長期照護師的師長也有來嘛那現在我再討論一個就是獨老的問題獨老獨老的問題那現在就是說按照數據來講的話我這裡有2024年的一個數據新北市是全台灣獨老\n\n02:54.457 --> 03:10.797\n最多的縣市總計有18.9萬人然後其實包含這個台北市高雄市也有那我不知道這個衛福部有沒有去統計就是說那到底我們現在這個獨老的狀況是怎麼樣就是說你超過65歲然後在家裡面只有你一個這個長者在有沒有這個數據\n\n03:12.813 --> 03:33.004\n那請那個理事長非常感謝委員的關心我跟委員報告我們現在對於所謂獨老我們事實上是有一定的定義就主要指的就是說你的譬如你的這一個子女就兩人兩人都65歲以上這是第一個情況第二個情況可能就是說你有子女可是他不在你所居住的這一個縣市縣市喔就是那個\n\n03:38.712 --> 03:54.822\n在你現在目前的縣市之外就是你的那個照管的那一個區域以這個定義來說的話我們現在目前全台有五萬五千一百二十九人這是有列冊的是不是有列冊關懷\n\n03:57.203 --> 04:11.090\n但是我看這個數據也不一樣啊審計部是說五萬多但是你們自己的這個數據是39萬然後內政部更高內政部是六十幾萬報告委員這個事實上是那個定義的問題內政部他們那邊是指就是說你那個是指那個戶是指那個戶數\n\n04:14.051 --> 04:43.366\n那我們的定義比方就是說虛關懷者虛關懷就是我剛剛說的嘛就是說你要符合這兩個要件那其實範圍滿大你們是以縣市譬如說好那今天在我三重對然後如果說家裡面有一個65歲自己一個人居住的然後呢可是他子女呢一定要在這一個台北才算嗎那如果說他是在在蘆洲那蘆洲可能稍微近一點啦那在板橋那邊那這樣就這樣就不算了是不是\n\n04:45.083 --> 04:48.779\n那個我們主要的事大概是第一個當然他是自己一個人住\n\n04:49.431 --> 05:16.282\n然後第二個是說他的子女沒有辦法就近的協助他對可是你們的範圍太大了是跨縣市喔如果跨峽的話大概在鄰近的我們應該是有縣市就是鄰近的部分我們其實是應該是會第一個是他的這個縣市政府可能會評估啦他的子女是不是能夠照顧他如果不能關懷他那他也可以跟我們提出來我們也會列入在我們的獨老的名冊上我意思就是說你們在用跨縣市\n\n05:17.703 --> 05:34.044\n那如果是在不是在是同樣的縣市但是不同區那多少人數應該會更多應該這樣講就是說當然戶籍裡面單獨一戶的人就是剛剛提到的那個大概是戶政的資料他的人數是多的\n\n05:34.505 --> 06:00.281\n可是我們各地方政府在做獨老的這個關懷方式第一個是他可以表達他有需要關懷那這個叫做我們所謂的列冊那我們到今年底大概去年的六月大概是五萬六千人那今年又增加了大概有六萬人那大概我們目前的定義是這個樣子我是討論定義啦我就是說你們現在定義是放的就是說比較寬啦就是說你是要跨縣市捏\n\n06:01.741 --> 06:27.208\n是不是比如說你在新北三重你要跨到基隆跨到台北然後家裡面只有一個人這才算是獨老那我意思就是說如果他是住三重但是子女可能在板橋這樣就不算沒有他也可以說他有需求我們也會列入第三個條款就是他認為他有需要我們就會把他列進來好那現在就是說那你們現在對於這種獨老的照顧有沒有列在你們這一個長照3.0裡面\n\n06:30.269 --> 06:58.289\n報告委員我先做兩個回覆第一個就是說剛剛說的你現在說的這一個39萬跟這一個我們6萬中間有相差28萬那我必須要承認這個我們可能有低估所以我們現在目前其實賴清德總統他也非常關心這個問題所以我們現在目前會有一個我們現在目前會有一個計畫跟地方政府這邊大家共同我們必須要來做一次全國性的一個設備然後把這一個人數我想就是說真的需要關心的我們會把它\n\n06:59.169 --> 07:19.705\n我覺得需要做一個調查啦這個部分也跟委員報告我們跟內政部那邊已經開過幾次會了我們這個部分計畫會最近會來推出這是第一個重點第二個重點就是說我們現在目前如果說你有這一個其實跟委員報告其實你雖然是獨老可是也不見得就一定會需要受到照顧\n\n07:20.946 --> 07:38.472\n有些長輩可能我覺得他覺得LiveAlong可能他自己就想要這樣他也不想要受到人家的打擾所以我們現在最重要是有關懷需求者那有關懷需求的話我們現在目前就是說3號3.0這邊會把他列入那這個列入的話就是除了擴大我們現在目前的1966那部分之外另外我們會加強有關於這剛剛說的獨老的訪視\n\n07:43.206 --> 07:58.543\n就是說這獨老房子現在是各個縣市政府他們自己社會局在做是他們社會局但是我有一些都是民間自己團體在做像一些獨老送餐那些都是民間團體自己在做的包圍那些有一些是他自己其實因為我在台中當過社會局長\n\n07:59.784 --> 08:11.116\n有很多事實上是我們社會局我們委託我們用那個我們我們有委辦的方式就是說我們那個名冊給他之後然後呢我們來由他來做送餐我是希望說你們長照3.0把這個獨老這個這個這個有需要照顧的要把它列進去那有時候他他\n\n08:19.484 --> 08:40.361\n有時候老人家會覺得說我不需要你的照顧但實際上他可能有需要啊所以不是說我不需要你的照顧那你就不用照顧但實際上他可能老人家有說面子或是怎麼樣我覺得這個東西你們自己要去除了他主觀的意願之外一些客觀的一些條件你們也要去做評估啊OK好吧今天就先這樣好謝謝李委員謝謝部長\n\n","segments":[{"start":5.705,"end":7.966,"text":"我們今天會通過這個兒童托育服務法"},{"start":32.905,"end":55.897,"text":"有報告 應該會核定那這個我有看到就是說這個就是專為0到2歲的托育利益的專訪然後其中有一項就是說我們保留監視的影像這個儲存30天 然後上傳雲端特別是針對我們的托育機構嘛 對不對其中是不是有這一項那這一項之前是不是也有在做"},{"start":58.427,"end":85.72,"text":"我們之前有一個這個拖音中心監視錄影設備設置及資訊管理利用辦法我們之前是不是有這個辦法我們之前就有可是它是儲存在拖音中心裡面沒有上傳雲端所以我們現在有一個監管雲對我們日後就是我們希望是能夠上傳在地方政府的雲端那現在就是說各個這一個不管是公托私托也有對不對應該是全面性的"},{"start":86.862,"end":110.755,"text":"目前公司立在自己的通運中心都有都有嘛對不對但是他們就是自己保存沒有上傳到雲端所以我們現在是要求是各個縣市政府都要設立這個監管雲嗎那經費就是各個縣市政府自己在處理嗎中央我們補助他們中央會補助中央會補助這個地方政府那是指針對這個通運機構公共的通運機構嗎"},{"start":114.298,"end":128.535,"text":"我們法令通過之後我們就會補助他就是公司裡都要上雲端都要上雲端就對了然後就是保存30天30日因為其實其實我們也擔心其實很多這個案件就是說發現說保存在自己的這一個這個脫肉機構裡面你萬一啦"},{"start":132.439,"end":156.213,"text":"發生事情的時候那通常不知道為什麼這個影片就會找不到所以我們就上場運動當然就是說怎麼去使用它要有相關的配套的措施這個也要兼顧到這一個兒童他們的人權那也包含這個教保員他們的人權我覺得這個就是說這個相關的配套措施要來做好那我再請教一下"},{"start":156.693,"end":164.524,"text":"因為現在今天是討論這個長照3.0那我們這一個長期照護師的師長也有來嘛那現在我再討論一個就是獨老的問題獨老 獨老的問題那現在就是說按照數據來講的話我這裡有2024年的一個數據新北市是全台灣獨老"},{"start":174.457,"end":190.797,"text":"最多的縣市總計有18.9萬人然後其實包含這個台北市高雄市也有那我不知道這個衛福部有沒有去統計就是說那到底我們現在這個獨老的狀況是怎麼樣就是說你超過65歲然後在家裡面只有你一個這個長者在有沒有這個數據"},{"start":192.813,"end":213.004,"text":"那請那個理事長非常感謝委員的關心我跟委員報告我們現在對於所謂獨老我們事實上是有一定的定義就主要指的就是說你的譬如你的這一個子女就兩人兩人都65歲以上這是第一個情況第二個情況可能就是說你有子女可是他不在你所居住的這一個縣市縣市喔就是那個"},{"start":218.712,"end":234.822,"text":"在你現在目前的縣市之外就是你的那個照管的那一個區域以這個定義來說的話我們現在目前全台有五萬五千一百二十九人這是有列冊的是不是有列冊關懷"},{"start":237.203,"end":251.09,"text":"但是我看這個數據也不一樣啊審計部是說五萬多但是你們自己的這個數據是39萬然後內政部更高內政部是六十幾萬報告委員這個事實上是那個定義的問題內政部他們那邊是指就是說你那個是指那個戶是指那個戶數"},{"start":254.051,"end":283.366,"text":"那我們的定義比方就是說虛關懷者虛關懷就是我剛剛說的嘛就是說你要符合這兩個要件那其實範圍滿大你們是以縣市譬如說好那今天在我三重對然後如果說家裡面有一個65歲自己一個人居住的然後呢可是他子女呢一定要在這一個台北才算嗎那如果說他是在在蘆洲那蘆洲可能稍微近一點啦那在板橋那邊那這樣就這樣就不算了是不是"},{"start":285.083,"end":288.779,"text":"那個我們主要的事大概是第一個當然他是自己一個人住"},{"start":289.431,"end":316.282,"text":"然後第二個是說他的子女沒有辦法就近的協助他對 可是你們的範圍太大了是跨縣市喔如果跨峽的話大概在鄰近的我們應該是有縣市就是鄰近的部分我們其實是應該是會第一個是他的這個縣市政府可能會評估啦他的子女是不是能夠照顧他如果不能關懷他那他也可以跟我們提出來我們也會列入在我們的獨老的名冊上我意思就是說你們在用跨縣市"},{"start":317.703,"end":334.044,"text":"那如果是在不是在是同樣的縣市但是不同區那多少人數應該會更多應該這樣講就是說當然戶籍裡面單獨一戶的人就是剛剛提到的那個大概是戶政的資料他的人數是多的"},{"start":334.505,"end":360.281,"text":"可是我們各地方政府在做獨老的這個關懷方式第一個是他可以表達他有需要關懷那這個叫做我們所謂的列冊那我們到今年底大概去年的六月大概是五萬六千人那今年又增加了大概有六萬人那大概我們目前的定義是這個樣子我是討論定義啦我就是說你們現在定義是放的就是說比較寬啦就是說你是要跨縣市捏"},{"start":361.741,"end":387.208,"text":"是不是 比如說你在新北 三重你要跨到基隆 跨到台北然後家裡面只有一個人 這才算是獨老那我意思就是說如果他是住三重但是子女可能在板橋 這樣就不算沒有 他也可以說他有需求我們也會列入第三個條款就是他認為他有需要我們就會把他列進來好 那現在就是說那你們現在對於這種獨老的照顧有沒有列在你們這一個長照3.0裡面"},{"start":390.269,"end":418.289,"text":"報告委員我先做兩個回覆第一個就是說剛剛說的你現在說的這一個39萬跟這一個我們6萬中間有相差28萬那我必須要承認這個我們可能有低估所以我們現在目前其實賴清德總統他也非常關心這個問題所以我們現在目前會有一個我們現在目前會有一個計畫跟地方政府這邊大家共同我們必須要來做一次全國性的一個設備然後把這一個人數我想就是說真的需要關心的我們會把它"},{"start":419.169,"end":439.705,"text":"我覺得需要做一個調查啦這個部分也跟委員報告我們跟內政部那邊已經開過幾次會了我們這個部分計畫會最近會來推出這是第一個重點第二個重點就是說我們現在目前如果說你有這一個其實跟委員報告其實你雖然是獨老可是也不見得就一定會需要受到照顧"},{"start":440.946,"end":458.472,"text":"有些長輩可能我覺得他覺得Live Along可能他自己就想要這樣他也不想要受到人家的打擾所以我們現在最重要是有關懷需求者那有關懷需求的話我們現在目前就是說3號3.0這邊會把他列入那這個列入的話就是除了擴大我們現在目前的1966那部分之外另外我們會加強有關於這剛剛說的獨老的訪視"},{"start":463.206,"end":478.543,"text":"就是說這獨老房子現在是各個縣市政府他們自己社會局在做是他們社會局但是我有一些都是民間自己團體在做像一些獨老送餐那些都是民間團體自己在做的包圍那些有一些是他自己其實因為我在台中當過社會局長"},{"start":479.784,"end":491.116,"text":"有很多事實上是我們社會局我們委託我們用那個我們我們有委辦的方式就是說我們那個名冊給他之後然後呢我們來由他來做送餐我是希望說你們長照3.0把這個獨老這個這個這個有需要照顧的要把它列進去那有時候他他"},{"start":499.484,"end":520.361,"text":"有時候老人家會覺得說我不需要你的照顧但實際上他可能有需要啊所以不是說我不需要你的照顧那你就不用照顧但實際上他可能老人家有說面子或是怎麼樣我覺得這個東西你們自己要去除了他主觀的意願之外一些客觀的一些條件你們也要去做評估啊OK 好吧今天就先這樣好 謝謝李委員 謝謝部長"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":828,"blocks":[["李委員坤城：（12時24分）謝謝主席。邱部長先喝口水再上來，沒關係，你慢慢喝，沒關係。"],["主席：請邱部長。"],["邱部長泰源：委員好。"],["李委員坤城：部長好，辛苦了。今天院會會通過兒童托育服務法，是不是？"],["邱部長泰源：有報告，應該會核定。"],["李委員坤城：好。我有看到，專為0到2歲的托育立一個專法，然後其中有一項就是保留監視的影像，儲存30天，然後上傳雲端，特別是針對我們的托育機構嘛，對不對？其中是不是有這一項？"],["呂次長建德：是。"],["邱部長泰源：是。"],["李委員坤城：這一項之前是不是也有在做？我們之前有一個托嬰中心監視錄影設備設置及資訊管理利用辦法，之前是不是有這個辦法？"],["張副署長美美：我們之前就有了，可是是儲存在托嬰中心裡面。"],["李委員坤城：沒有上傳雲端嘛。"],["張副署長美美：對。"],["李委員坤城：所以現在有一個監管雲嘛，是不是？"],["張副署長美美：對，我們希望日後能夠上傳到地方政府的雲端。"],["李委員坤城：現在就是公托有，私托也有嘛，對不對？應該是全面性的，對不對？"],["張副署長美美：目前公私立托嬰中心都有。"],["李委員坤城：都有嘛，對不對？但是他們就是自己保存，沒有上傳到雲端，所以我們現在是要求各個縣市政府都要設立監管雲嗎？"],["張副署長美美：對。"],["李委員坤城：經費就是各個縣市政府自己處理嗎？"],["張副署長美美：中央補助他們。"],["李委員坤城：中央會補助地方政府，那是只針對公共的托育機構嗎？"],["張副署長美美：法令通過之後，我們就會補助，就是公私立都要上雲端。"],["李委員坤城：都要上雲端就對了？"],["張副署長美美：是。"],["李委員坤城：然後就是保存30天。"],["張副署長美美：30日。"],["李委員坤城：其實我們也很擔心，在很多案件中，發現保存在托幼機構裡面，萬一發生事情的時候，通常不知道為什麼影片就會找不到，所以我們就上傳雲端。當然怎麼去使用它，要有相關的配套措施，也要兼顧到兒童的人權，也包含教保員他們的人權，就是相關的配套措施也要做好。","我再請教一下，因為今天是討論長照3.0，今天長期照顧司的司長也有來。現在我再討論一個問題，就是獨老的問題，按照數據來講的話，我這裡有一個2024年的數據，新北市是全臺灣獨老最多的縣市，總計有18.9萬人，包含臺北市、高雄市也有，我不知道衛福部有沒有去統計到底現在獨老的狀況是怎麼樣，就是超過65歲、家裡只有一個長者在，有沒有這個數據？"],["邱部長泰源：有。請呂次長說明。"],["呂次長建德：非常感謝委員的關心。我跟委員報告，我們現在對於獨老事實上是有一定的定義，主要指的是家中兩個人都是65歲以上，這是第一個情況；第二個情況可能就是雖然有子女，可是子女不在父母居住的這個縣市……"],["李委員坤城：縣市喔？"],["呂次長建德：就是不在父母現在居住的縣市，就是父母接受照管的那一個區域，以這個定義來說的話，目前全臺有5萬5,129人。"],["李委員坤城：這是有列冊的是不是？"],["呂次長建德：這是有列冊關懷的部分。"],["李委員坤城：但是我看這個數據也不一樣啊，審計部是說五萬多，但是你們自己的數據是39萬，然後內政部更高，內政部是六十幾萬。"],["呂次長建德：報告委員，這個事實上是定義的問題，內政部那邊是指戶數，我們的定義比較像是需關懷者，就是我剛剛說的，就是要符合這兩個要件。"],["李委員坤城：其實範圍滿大的，你們是以縣市來看，比如說，今天如果在三重有一個65歲的長者自己一個人居住，可是他的子女一定要在臺北才算嘛，如果是在蘆州，但蘆州比較近一點，如果說他是在板橋，那這樣就不算了，是不是？"],["張副署長美美：主要第一個當然是自己一個人住，然後第二個就是他的子女沒有辦法就近協助。"],["李委員坤城：對，可是你們的範圍太大了，是要跨縣市嗎？"],["張副署長美美：如果跨轄的話，鄰近的部分，縣市政府可能會評估他的子女是不是能夠照顧他，如果不能關懷他，那他也可以跟我們提出來，我們也會列入在我們的獨老名冊上。"],["李委員坤城：我的意思是說，你們現在是用跨縣市？"],["張副署長美美：對。"],["李委員坤城：如果是在同縣市，但是不同區，那獨老人數應該會更多。"],["張副署長美美：戶籍裡面單獨一戶的人，就是剛剛提到的，其實那個是戶政的資料，這類人數是多的；可是各地方政府在做獨老的關懷訪視，第一個是他可以表達他有需要關懷，這個部分就是我們所謂的列冊，到去年6月大概是5萬6,000人，今年又增加了，大概有6萬人，我們目前的定義是這個樣子。"],["李委員坤城：我是討論定義啦，我是說你們現在的定義放得比較寬，就是說你是要跨縣市，是不是？比如說，長者在新北三重，而子女要跨到基隆、跨到臺北，然後家裡面只有長者一個人，這樣才算是獨老，我的意思是說，如果他是住三重，但是子女可能在板橋，這樣就不算？"],["張副署長美美：沒有，他也可以說他有需求，我們也會列入，有第三個條款，就是他認為他有需要，我們就會把他列進來。"],["李委員坤城：好。你們現在對於這種獨老的照顧，有沒有列在你們的長照3.0裡面？"],["呂次長建德：報告委員，我先做兩個回復，第一個就是說，你現在說的39萬跟我們的6萬中間相差28萬，我必須要承認，這個我們可能有低估，其實賴清德總統也非常關心這個問題，所以我們現在會有一個計畫，跟地方政府必須共同來做一次全國性的survey，然後把真正需要關心的人數提高。"],["李委員坤城：我覺得需要做一個調查。"],["呂次長建德：對，沒錯，這個部分也跟委員報告，我們已經跟內政部那邊開過幾次會了，這個部分的計畫最近會推出，這是第一個重點。","第二個重點就是說，跟委員報告，其實有些人雖然現在是獨老，可是也不見得就一定會需要受到照顧，因為有些長輩可能覺得live alone也可以，他自己就想要這樣，他也不想要受到人家的打擾，所以我們現在最重要的是有關懷需求者，有關懷需求的話，現在長照3.0會把他列入，整個列入的話，就是除了擴大目前的1966的部分之外，另外我們會加強剛剛說的獨老的訪視。"],["李委員坤城：獨老的訪視現在是各個縣市政府的社會局在做？"],["呂次長建德：對，是他們社會局。"],["李委員坤城：但是有一些都是民間自己團體在做，像一些獨老送餐，那些都是民間團體自己在做的。"],["呂次長建德：報告委員，那一些裡面，有一些是他們自己在做，因為我在臺中當過社會局長，有很多事實上是我們社會局委託他們做，我們用委辦的方式，把名冊給他們之後，然後由他們來送餐。"],["李委員坤城：我是希望你們長照3.0把需要照顧的獨老列進去。"],["呂次長建德：OK。"],["李委員坤城：有時候老人家會覺得不需要你的照顧，但是實際上他可能有需要啊。"],["呂次長建德：對。"],["李委員坤城：所以不是他們說不需要你們照顧，你們就不用照顧，實際上老人家有時候可能因為愛面子或是怎麼樣，我覺得這個東西你們自己要去注意，除了他們主觀的意願之外，客觀的一些條件，你們也要去做評估。"],["呂次長建德：好的，OK。"],["李委員坤城：好不好？"],["呂次長建德：好。"],["李委員坤城：好，那今天就先這樣，謝謝。"],["呂次長建德：感謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝李委員，謝謝部長。","翁曉玲、翁曉玲，翁曉玲委員不在。","請廖偉翔委員質詢，謝謝。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":256,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-26-10","speakers":["蘇清泉","陳昭姿","林月琴","陳菁徽","王育敏","邱鎮軍","林淑芬","涂權吉","黃秀芳","王正旭","陳瑩","廖偉翔","陳培瑜","李坤城","徐富癸","楊瓊瓔","楊曜","劉書彬","劉建國","黃國昌","顏寬恒","張嘉郡","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","翁曉玲"],"page_start":163,"meetingDate":["2025-05-08"],"gazette_id":"1144701","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144701_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第10次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請衛生福利部部長就「長照2.0執行情形檢討及3.0未來規劃」進行專題報告，並備質詢；\n二、邀請衛生福利部部長就「澳洲進口豬腳驗出含萊克多巴胺，如何加強肉品食安查驗，讓民眾\n放心」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1144701_00004"}}}