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626.839, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"陳\"}, {\"word\": \"樹\"}, {\"word\": \"葉\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 626.839, \"end\": 626.859, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:01,274 --> 00:00:05,099\n謝謝主席請主席邀請次長我們交通部陳次長\n\n2\n00:00:10,729 --> 00:00:37,763\n市長早安就是平常本席在地方經常會遇到民眾反應就是其實就是常常接到民眾反應說我們的這個汽車燃料費為什麼不改由這個水油徵收或者是說隨這個工程里程來徵收這樣子比較公平因為有的人的車子他可能使用的頻率不高可能只有假日\n\n3\n00:00:38,303 --> 00:00:51,420\n也許是只有假日才來使用所以他們認為說如果按照這樣子的就是目前的隨車徵收的話對於使用頻率比較低的車主來說比較不公平那這個議題其實在過去\n\n4\n00:00:54,704 --> 00:01:10,417\n我也曾經提過案也質詢過不過當然我們江部都有自愛難省的一個部分我們也看到育年所在108年的時候也有針對氣燃費徵收做一個研究報告結論也是說維持隨車徵收\n\n5\n00:01:15,541 --> 00:01:33,278\n那現在就是說因為隨著這個時間的推移因為108年到現在也又過了8年也快又快了好幾年了67年了所以就是說經過這樣子的一個時間時空的轉移我們對這個部分有沒有新的想法\n\n6\n00:01:37,219 --> 00:01:54,560\n我想我跟委員報告有關這個如何徵收的這個方式也是剛才陳主委員剛才講的這在其實在歷好幾年了不是歷年大概大家都一直在提從以前的這個隨車到隨郵甚至有人提到說\n\n7\n00:01:56,162 --> 00:02:11,227\n按里程按重量等等的都有那其實這樣的一個議題就是因為不管是採用哪一個方式來徵收都有它的優點跟它的缺點那整體上的考量還是第一個要考慮公平那另外一個是\n\n8\n00:02:12,288 --> 00:02:33,928\n徵收的一個整個成本也好或者整個的收入也好因為進來以後要來做養護的工作或修建的工作另外是民眾的可負擔性所以整體上來看目前還是朝向的既有的隨車徵收的方式但是我們也聽到的大家各界的一個建議尤其是電動車輛引進以後\n\n9\n00:02:35,629 --> 00:02:54,208\n所以目前我們也正為請這個運營所做相關的研究我們希望能夠再繼續一個觀察一下或者是了解一下世界各國隨著這樣的近鄰的議題以後或者是隨著科技的進步以後是不是有什麼樣一個徵收的方式因為這樣的一個徵收方式不是只有我們\n\n10\n00:02:55,450 --> 00:03:06,842\n其實各國也都有在實行而且我們看到各國實施上多數也是採用隨車徵收的一個方式所以目前才是用這樣的方式繼續再徵收以上\n\n11\n00:03:07,333 --> 00:03:26,869\n是好那今天就是委員會針對這個公路法第27條就是有委員提案這個進行詢問那當然就是我們也認為說如果說我們沒有辦法將汽車燃料使用費改由隨有徵收的話可能跟我們目前的第27條的這個\n\n12\n00:03:29,011 --> 00:03:47,408\n條文的就是說這一個項目的名稱跟目的是不符合的所以就主張說這個條文裡面就是說公路主管機關為了公路養護及修建安全管理所需費用得徵收汽車燃料使用費所以為了讓民使相輔所以也建議\n\n13\n00:03:48,530 --> 00:04:02,129\n不如就是將這樣子的一個徵收的一個項目名稱更正為公路養護修建及安全管理費那這樣子來修訂我們交通部這邊的意見跟態度是如何\n\n14\n00:04:03,275 --> 00:04:27,871\n這樣的一個方向我們贊同至於說文字是不是要這麼長是需要這麼多字我想到我們主條再討論的時候我們再來大家再來討論如果改成這樣子的一個項目名稱的話當然就是可以涵蓋未來可能就是要徵收的電動車這種車種如果說用汽車燃料使用費汽燃費的話可能就徵收不到\n\n15\n00:04:28,651 --> 00:04:45,195\n對會排除這個非使用汽油的車種車輛嘛所以這樣子也是又有公平性的問題那當然這個部分就是有待大家的一個討論跟共識啦好那再來就是有關這個新車平等的這個計畫的問題\n\n16\n00:04:48,616 --> 00:04:56,907\n我們知道就是交通部為了推動就是評估新車的安全性所以我們也在張濱有興建了這個測試中心那時候在落成的時候由蘇貞昌院長主持本席也有去參與那這個目的主要就是說要透過\n\n17\n00:05:06,780 --> 00:05:11,065\n獨立的第三方機構對市售車輛進行試驗並將這個試驗的數據轉換成新等評級然後提供民眾易於理解在選購車輛的時候對這個車輛的安全性的資訊能夠有比較充分的一個了解跟掌握\n\n18\n00:05:26,022 --> 00:05:42,749\n我覺得這個很好我們也很肯定那當然就是說這個也是涉及到預算的問題那這個等一下我再來詢問那我先想了解一下目前我們這個成立之後我們所進行的測試目前為止大概完成了多少量\n\n19\n00:05:45,066 --> 00:06:06,134\n跟委員報告一下大概目標都是每年8台那去年有做到8台嗎好像沒有去年6台去年才6台因為去年的預算有稍微這個結局一點然後今年就恢復這個8台然後包括這個車廠自費來申請這個測試的到目前已經完成18個車型\n\n20\n00:06:14,157 --> 00:06:32,564\n十六個車型是包含車廠車商自費的那在這些完成就是測驗的車輛裡面有包括電動車嗎有特斯拉大概應該是完成這兩型了\n\n21\n00:06:34,441 --> 00:06:51,768\n完成兩行嘛因為本席看到的資料裡面就是我們TN-CAP目前已經試驗完成的兩台這個電動車就是包括這個Model3跟ModelY是不是這個完成的時間好像都是最近才完成的去年跟今年\n\n22\n00:06:52,228 --> 00:07:19,386\n去年跟今年那因為我們也關注到就是說其實在電動車逐漸讓駕駛人能夠接受使用之後我們也陸續看到好幾件這個車禍的事故那包括就是在這個是在國外發生的有2021年12月在巴黎發生的一件就是Model3的這個車型的一個\n\n23\n00:07:20,387 --> 00:07:35,709\n撞擊之後發生的火燒車事件包括2024年9月20號這是在國內新竹發生的也是撞了護欄之後起火燃燒然後2024年10月份是在加拿大\n\n24\n00:07:36,730 --> 00:07:51,230\n的多輪作發生的也是ModelY失控撞傷忽然之後起火還有包括今年1月25號國道1號陽梅休息站的這是也是電動車撞擊之後起火造成44傷\n\n25\n00:07:53,012 --> 00:08:18,530\n因為這樣子的一個電動車的撞擊失火的這樣的事故事實上在基層我也聽到很多民眾的一個疑慮那當然就是我們也看到說對照目前我們TNCAP所做的這個測試我們也當然很高興有看到這樣的測試可是要怎樣讓消費者對這個有信心是不是可以請次長講一下\n\n26\n00:08:20,748 --> 00:08:41,881\n跟委員報告現在這個2050淨零碳排這個電動車這個讓民眾有信心對它這個安全這個值得信賴這個是最重要的一個課題那所以就是說針對這個我想針對電動小客車的部分剛剛委員所提到這個TNcable那個是一個更高標準的要求\n\n27\n00:08:42,421 --> 00:09:11,200\n然後在這個車輛在做這個法規符合性車輛安全檢測基準的這個檢測的時候剛剛市長也有提到針對這個電動車的安全性台灣跟歐盟跟日本一樣都是條合聯合國UNR100的這個法規進來那這個R100的一個法規就包括整車的電氣這個防護功能還有包括電池本身的部分都要去做這個\n\n28\n00:09:13,282 --> 00:09:36,138\n這個碰撞那其實我也這個我想說這個也不是打這個廣告像特斯拉這個部分的話在車輛安全這個就要上市銷售這個火線已經撞過一次了然後在這個去年跟前年的這個TNCAP的部分的話也在做這個實在碰撞那基本上大概這個都沒有發生爆炸起火這樣子的情況\n\n29\n00:09:37,727 --> 00:09:46,438\n剛剛有提到說TNCAP是比較高的標準那一般就是在市面上銷售的也是都會符合這樣子的標準嗎\n\n30\n00:09:47,612 --> 00:10:09,865\n要有正面碰撞就是要做實車碰撞然後側撞也要用台車再做一次碰撞那電池基本上都在車底下面所以這樣子一撞會不會滲漏然後甚至靜置完之後會不會起火這個都是在法規的要求裡面\n\n31\n00:10:10,467 --> 00:10:26,859\n是好我想這個也是民眾非常關心的這個就是電動車的一個安全性的問題然後那我們也當然希望就是說讓這樣的資訊也要讓國人能夠充分的能夠知道這樣子好謝謝我們加強宣導是謝謝陳樹葉委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n1274\t5099\t謝謝主席請主席邀請次長我們交通部陳次長\n10729\t37763\t市長早安就是平常本席在地方經常會遇到民眾反應就是其實就是常常接到民眾反應說我們的這個汽車燃料費為什麼不改由這個水油徵收或者是說隨這個工程里程來徵收這樣子比較公平因為有的人的車子他可能使用的頻率不高可能只有假日\n38303\t51420\t也許是只有假日才來使用所以他們認為說如果按照這樣子的就是目前的隨車徵收的話對於使用頻率比較低的車主來說比較不公平那這個議題其實在過去\n54704\t70417\t我也曾經提過案 也質詢過不過當然我們江部都有自愛難省的一個部分我們也看到育年所在108年的時候也有針對氣燃費徵收做一個研究報告結論也是說維持隨車徵收\n75541\t93278\t那現在就是說因為隨著這個時間的推移因為108年到現在也又過了8年也快又快了好幾年了67年了所以就是說經過這樣子的一個時間時空的轉移我們對這個部分有沒有新的想法\n97219\t114560\t我想我跟委員報告有關這個如何徵收的這個方式也是剛才陳主委員剛才講的這在其實在歷好幾年了不是歷年大概大家都一直在提從以前的這個隨車到隨郵甚至有人提到說\n116162\t131227\t按里程按重量等等的都有那其實這樣的一個議題就是因為不管是採用哪一個方式來徵收都有它的優點跟它的缺點那整體上的考量還是第一個要考慮公平那另外一個是\n132288\t153928\t徵收的一個整個成本也好或者整個的收入也好因為進來以後要來做養護的工作或修建的工作另外是民眾的可負擔性所以整體上來看目前還是朝向的既有的隨車徵收的方式但是我們也聽到的大家各界的一個建議尤其是電動車輛引進以後\n155629\t174208\t所以目前我們也正為請這個運營所做相關的研究我們希望能夠再繼續一個觀察一下或者是了解一下世界各國隨著這樣的近鄰的議題以後或者是隨著科技的進步以後是不是有什麼樣一個徵收的方式因為這樣的一個徵收方式不是只有我們\n175450\t186842\t其實各國也都有在實行而且我們看到各國實施上多數也是採用隨車徵收的一個方式所以目前才是用這樣的方式繼續再徵收 以上\n187333\t206869\t是好那今天就是委員會針對這個公路法第27條就是有委員提案這個進行詢問那當然就是我們也認為說如果說我們沒有辦法將汽車燃料使用費改由隨有徵收的話可能跟我們目前的第27條的這個\n209011\t227408\t條文的就是說這一個項目的名稱跟目的是不符合的所以就主張說這個條文裡面就是說公路主管機關為了公路養護及修建安全管理所需費用得徵收汽車燃料使用費所以為了讓民使相輔所以也建議\n228530\t242129\t不如就是將這樣子的一個徵收的一個項目名稱更正為公路養護修建及安全管理費那這樣子來修訂我們交通部這邊的意見跟態度是如何\n243275\t267871\t這樣的一個方向我們贊同至於說文字是不是要這麼長是需要這麼多字我想到我們主條再討論的時候我們再來大家再來討論如果改成這樣子的一個項目名稱的話當然就是可以涵蓋未來可能就是要徵收的電動車這種車種如果說用汽車燃料使用費汽燃費的話可能就徵收不到\n268651\t285195\t對 會排除這個非使用汽油的車種車輛嘛所以這樣子也是又有公平性的問題那當然這個部分就是有待大家的一個討論跟共識啦好 那再來就是有關這個新車平等的這個計畫的問題\n288616\t296907\t我們知道就是交通部為了推動就是評估新車的安全性所以我們也在張濱有興建了這個測試中心那時候在落成的時候由蘇貞昌院長主持本席也有去參與那這個目的主要就是說要透過\n306780\t311065\t獨立的第三方機構對市售車輛進行試驗並將這個試驗的數據轉換成新等評級然後提供民眾易於理解在選購車輛的時候對這個車輛的安全性的資訊能夠有比較充分的一個了解跟掌握\n326022\t342749\t我覺得這個很好我們也很肯定那當然就是說這個也是涉及到預算的問題那這個等一下我再來詢問那我先想了解一下目前我們這個成立之後我們所進行的測試目前為止大概完成了多少量\n345066\t366134\t跟委員報告一下大概目標都是每年8台那去年有做到8台嗎好像沒有去年6台去年才6台因為去年的預算有稍微這個結局一點然後今年就恢復這個8台然後包括這個車廠自費來申請這個測試的到目前已經完成18個車型\n374157\t392564\t十六個車型是包含車廠 車商自費的那在這些完成就是測驗的車輛裡面有包括電動車嗎有 特斯拉大概應該是完成這兩型了\n394441\t411768\t完成兩行嘛因為本席看到的資料裡面就是我們TN-CAP目前已經試驗完成的兩台這個電動車就是包括這個Model 3跟Model Y 是不是這個完成的時間好像都是最近才完成的去年跟今年\n412228\t439386\t去年跟今年那因為我們也關注到就是說其實在電動車逐漸讓駕駛人能夠接受使用之後我們也陸續看到好幾件這個車禍的事故那包括就是在這個是在國外發生的有2021年12月在巴黎發生的一件就是Model 3的這個車型的一個\n440387\t455709\t撞擊之後發生的火燒車事件包括2024年9月20號這是在國內新竹發生的也是撞了護欄之後起火燃燒然後2024年10月份是在加拿大\n456730\t471230\t的多輪作發生的也是Model Y失控撞傷忽然之後起火還有包括今年1月25號國道1號陽梅休息站的這是也是電動車撞擊之後起火造成44傷\n473012\t498530\t因為這樣子的一個電動車的撞擊失火的這樣的事故事實上在基層我也聽到很多民眾的一個疑慮那當然就是我們也看到說對照目前我們TNCAP所做的這個測試我們也當然很高興有看到這樣的測試可是要怎樣讓消費者對這個有信心是不是可以請次長講一下\n500748\t521881\t跟委員報告現在這個2050淨零碳排這個電動車這個讓民眾有信心對它這個安全這個值得信賴這個是最重要的一個課題那所以就是說針對這個我想針對電動小客車的部分剛剛委員所提到這個TN cable那個是一個更高標準的要求\n522421\t551200\t然後在這個車輛在做這個法規符合性車輛安全檢測基準的這個檢測的時候剛剛市長也有提到針對這個電動車的安全性台灣跟歐盟跟日本一樣都是條合聯合國UNR100的這個法規進來那這個R100的一個法規就包括整車的電氣這個防護功能還有包括電池本身的部分都要去做這個\n553282\t576138\t這個碰撞那其實我也這個我想說這個也不是打這個廣告像特斯拉這個部分的話在車輛安全這個就要上市銷售這個火線已經撞過一次了然後在這個去年跟前年的這個TNCAP的部分的話也在做這個實在碰撞那基本上大概這個都沒有發生爆炸起火這樣子的情況\n577727\t586438\t剛剛有提到說TN CAP是比較高的標準那一般就是在市面上銷售的也是都會符合這樣子的標準嗎\n587612\t609865\t要有正面碰撞就是要做實車碰撞然後側撞也要用台車再做一次碰撞那電池基本上都在車底下面所以這樣子一撞會不會滲漏然後甚至靜置完之後會不會起火這個都是在法規的要求裡面\n610467\t626859\t是好我想這個也是民眾非常關心的這個就是電動車的一個安全性的問題然後那我們也當然希望就是說讓這樣的資訊也要讓國人能夠充分的能夠知道這樣子好謝謝我們加強宣導是謝謝陳樹葉委員\n","txt":"謝謝主席請主席邀請次長我們交通部陳次長\n市長早安就是平常本席在地方經常會遇到民眾反應就是其實就是常常接到民眾反應說我們的這個汽車燃料費為什麼不改由這個水油徵收或者是說隨這個工程里程來徵收這樣子比較公平因為有的人的車子他可能使用的頻率不高可能只有假日\n也許是只有假日才來使用所以他們認為說如果按照這樣子的就是目前的隨車徵收的話對於使用頻率比較低的車主來說比較不公平那這個議題其實在過去\n我也曾經提過案 也質詢過不過當然我們江部都有自愛難省的一個部分我們也看到育年所在108年的時候也有針對氣燃費徵收做一個研究報告結論也是說維持隨車徵收\n那現在就是說因為隨著這個時間的推移因為108年到現在也又過了8年也快又快了好幾年了67年了所以就是說經過這樣子的一個時間時空的轉移我們對這個部分有沒有新的想法\n我想我跟委員報告有關這個如何徵收的這個方式也是剛才陳主委員剛才講的這在其實在歷好幾年了不是歷年大概大家都一直在提從以前的這個隨車到隨郵甚至有人提到說\n按里程按重量等等的都有那其實這樣的一個議題就是因為不管是採用哪一個方式來徵收都有它的優點跟它的缺點那整體上的考量還是第一個要考慮公平那另外一個是\n徵收的一個整個成本也好或者整個的收入也好因為進來以後要來做養護的工作或修建的工作另外是民眾的可負擔性所以整體上來看目前還是朝向的既有的隨車徵收的方式但是我們也聽到的大家各界的一個建議尤其是電動車輛引進以後\n所以目前我們也正為請這個運營所做相關的研究我們希望能夠再繼續一個觀察一下或者是了解一下世界各國隨著這樣的近鄰的議題以後或者是隨著科技的進步以後是不是有什麼樣一個徵收的方式因為這樣的一個徵收方式不是只有我們\n其實各國也都有在實行而且我們看到各國實施上多數也是採用隨車徵收的一個方式所以目前才是用這樣的方式繼續再徵收 以上\n是好那今天就是委員會針對這個公路法第27條就是有委員提案這個進行詢問那當然就是我們也認為說如果說我們沒有辦法將汽車燃料使用費改由隨有徵收的話可能跟我們目前的第27條的這個\n條文的就是說這一個項目的名稱跟目的是不符合的所以就主張說這個條文裡面就是說公路主管機關為了公路養護及修建安全管理所需費用得徵收汽車燃料使用費所以為了讓民使相輔所以也建議\n不如就是將這樣子的一個徵收的一個項目名稱更正為公路養護修建及安全管理費那這樣子來修訂我們交通部這邊的意見跟態度是如何\n這樣的一個方向我們贊同至於說文字是不是要這麼長是需要這麼多字我想到我們主條再討論的時候我們再來大家再來討論如果改成這樣子的一個項目名稱的話當然就是可以涵蓋未來可能就是要徵收的電動車這種車種如果說用汽車燃料使用費汽燃費的話可能就徵收不到\n對 會排除這個非使用汽油的車種車輛嘛所以這樣子也是又有公平性的問題那當然這個部分就是有待大家的一個討論跟共識啦好 那再來就是有關這個新車平等的這個計畫的問題\n我們知道就是交通部為了推動就是評估新車的安全性所以我們也在張濱有興建了這個測試中心那時候在落成的時候由蘇貞昌院長主持本席也有去參與那這個目的主要就是說要透過\n獨立的第三方機構對市售車輛進行試驗並將這個試驗的數據轉換成新等評級然後提供民眾易於理解在選購車輛的時候對這個車輛的安全性的資訊能夠有比較充分的一個了解跟掌握\n我覺得這個很好我們也很肯定那當然就是說這個也是涉及到預算的問題那這個等一下我再來詢問那我先想了解一下目前我們這個成立之後我們所進行的測試目前為止大概完成了多少量\n跟委員報告一下大概目標都是每年8台那去年有做到8台嗎好像沒有去年6台去年才6台因為去年的預算有稍微這個結局一點然後今年就恢復這個8台然後包括這個車廠自費來申請這個測試的到目前已經完成18個車型\n十六個車型是包含車廠 車商自費的那在這些完成就是測驗的車輛裡面有包括電動車嗎有 特斯拉大概應該是完成這兩型了\n完成兩行嘛因為本席看到的資料裡面就是我們TN-CAP目前已經試驗完成的兩台這個電動車就是包括這個Model 3跟Model Y 是不是這個完成的時間好像都是最近才完成的去年跟今年\n去年跟今年那因為我們也關注到就是說其實在電動車逐漸讓駕駛人能夠接受使用之後我們也陸續看到好幾件這個車禍的事故那包括就是在這個是在國外發生的有2021年12月在巴黎發生的一件就是Model 3的這個車型的一個\n撞擊之後發生的火燒車事件包括2024年9月20號這是在國內新竹發生的也是撞了護欄之後起火燃燒然後2024年10月份是在加拿大\n的多輪作發生的也是Model Y失控撞傷忽然之後起火還有包括今年1月25號國道1號陽梅休息站的這是也是電動車撞擊之後起火造成44傷\n因為這樣子的一個電動車的撞擊失火的這樣的事故事實上在基層我也聽到很多民眾的一個疑慮那當然就是我們也看到說對照目前我們TNCAP所做的這個測試我們也當然很高興有看到這樣的測試可是要怎樣讓消費者對這個有信心是不是可以請次長講一下\n跟委員報告現在這個2050淨零碳排這個電動車這個讓民眾有信心對它這個安全這個值得信賴這個是最重要的一個課題那所以就是說針對這個我想針對電動小客車的部分剛剛委員所提到這個TN cable那個是一個更高標準的要求\n然後在這個車輛在做這個法規符合性車輛安全檢測基準的這個檢測的時候剛剛市長也有提到針對這個電動車的安全性台灣跟歐盟跟日本一樣都是條合聯合國UNR100的這個法規進來那這個R100的一個法規就包括整車的電氣這個防護功能還有包括電池本身的部分都要去做這個\n這個碰撞那其實我也這個我想說這個也不是打這個廣告像特斯拉這個部分的話在車輛安全這個就要上市銷售這個火線已經撞過一次了然後在這個去年跟前年的這個TNCAP的部分的話也在做這個實在碰撞那基本上大概這個都沒有發生爆炸起火這樣子的情況\n剛剛有提到說TN CAP是比較高的標準那一般就是在市面上銷售的也是都會符合這樣子的標準嗎\n要有正面碰撞就是要做實車碰撞然後側撞也要用台車再做一次碰撞那電池基本上都在車底下面所以這樣子一撞會不會滲漏然後甚至靜置完之後會不會起火這個都是在法規的要求裡面\n是好我想這個也是民眾非常關心的這個就是電動車的一個安全性的問題然後那我們也當然希望就是說讓這樣的資訊也要讓國人能夠充分的能夠知道這樣子好謝謝我們加強宣導是謝謝陳樹葉委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:01.274 --> 00:05.099\n謝謝主席請主席邀請次長我們交通部陳次長\n\n00:10.729 --> 00:37.763\n市長早安就是平常本席在地方經常會遇到民眾反應就是其實就是常常接到民眾反應說我們的這個汽車燃料費為什麼不改由這個水油徵收或者是說隨這個工程里程來徵收這樣子比較公平因為有的人的車子他可能使用的頻率不高可能只有假日\n\n00:38.303 --> 00:51.420\n也許是只有假日才來使用所以他們認為說如果按照這樣子的就是目前的隨車徵收的話對於使用頻率比較低的車主來說比較不公平那這個議題其實在過去\n\n00:54.704 --> 01:10.417\n我也曾經提過案也質詢過不過當然我們江部都有自愛難省的一個部分我們也看到育年所在108年的時候也有針對氣燃費徵收做一個研究報告結論也是說維持隨車徵收\n\n01:15.541 --> 01:33.278\n那現在就是說因為隨著這個時間的推移因為108年到現在也又過了8年也快又快了好幾年了67年了所以就是說經過這樣子的一個時間時空的轉移我們對這個部分有沒有新的想法\n\n01:37.219 --> 01:54.560\n我想我跟委員報告有關這個如何徵收的這個方式也是剛才陳主委員剛才講的這在其實在歷好幾年了不是歷年大概大家都一直在提從以前的這個隨車到隨郵甚至有人提到說\n\n01:56.162 --> 02:11.227\n按里程按重量等等的都有那其實這樣的一個議題就是因為不管是採用哪一個方式來徵收都有它的優點跟它的缺點那整體上的考量還是第一個要考慮公平那另外一個是\n\n02:12.288 --> 02:33.928\n徵收的一個整個成本也好或者整個的收入也好因為進來以後要來做養護的工作或修建的工作另外是民眾的可負擔性所以整體上來看目前還是朝向的既有的隨車徵收的方式但是我們也聽到的大家各界的一個建議尤其是電動車輛引進以後\n\n02:35.629 --> 02:54.208\n所以目前我們也正為請這個運營所做相關的研究我們希望能夠再繼續一個觀察一下或者是了解一下世界各國隨著這樣的近鄰的議題以後或者是隨著科技的進步以後是不是有什麼樣一個徵收的方式因為這樣的一個徵收方式不是只有我們\n\n02:55.450 --> 03:06.842\n其實各國也都有在實行而且我們看到各國實施上多數也是採用隨車徵收的一個方式所以目前才是用這樣的方式繼續再徵收以上\n\n03:07.333 --> 03:26.869\n是好那今天就是委員會針對這個公路法第27條就是有委員提案這個進行詢問那當然就是我們也認為說如果說我們沒有辦法將汽車燃料使用費改由隨有徵收的話可能跟我們目前的第27條的這個\n\n03:29.011 --> 03:47.408\n條文的就是說這一個項目的名稱跟目的是不符合的所以就主張說這個條文裡面就是說公路主管機關為了公路養護及修建安全管理所需費用得徵收汽車燃料使用費所以為了讓民使相輔所以也建議\n\n03:48.530 --> 04:02.129\n不如就是將這樣子的一個徵收的一個項目名稱更正為公路養護修建及安全管理費那這樣子來修訂我們交通部這邊的意見跟態度是如何\n\n04:03.275 --> 04:27.871\n這樣的一個方向我們贊同至於說文字是不是要這麼長是需要這麼多字我想到我們主條再討論的時候我們再來大家再來討論如果改成這樣子的一個項目名稱的話當然就是可以涵蓋未來可能就是要徵收的電動車這種車種如果說用汽車燃料使用費汽燃費的話可能就徵收不到\n\n04:28.651 --> 04:45.195\n對會排除這個非使用汽油的車種車輛嘛所以這樣子也是又有公平性的問題那當然這個部分就是有待大家的一個討論跟共識啦好那再來就是有關這個新車平等的這個計畫的問題\n\n04:48.616 --> 04:56.907\n我們知道就是交通部為了推動就是評估新車的安全性所以我們也在張濱有興建了這個測試中心那時候在落成的時候由蘇貞昌院長主持本席也有去參與那這個目的主要就是說要透過\n\n05:06.780 --> 05:11.065\n獨立的第三方機構對市售車輛進行試驗並將這個試驗的數據轉換成新等評級然後提供民眾易於理解在選購車輛的時候對這個車輛的安全性的資訊能夠有比較充分的一個了解跟掌握\n\n05:26.022 --> 05:42.749\n我覺得這個很好我們也很肯定那當然就是說這個也是涉及到預算的問題那這個等一下我再來詢問那我先想了解一下目前我們這個成立之後我們所進行的測試目前為止大概完成了多少量\n\n05:45.066 --> 06:06.134\n跟委員報告一下大概目標都是每年8台那去年有做到8台嗎好像沒有去年6台去年才6台因為去年的預算有稍微這個結局一點然後今年就恢復這個8台然後包括這個車廠自費來申請這個測試的到目前已經完成18個車型\n\n06:14.157 --> 06:32.564\n十六個車型是包含車廠車商自費的那在這些完成就是測驗的車輛裡面有包括電動車嗎有特斯拉大概應該是完成這兩型了\n\n06:34.441 --> 06:51.768\n完成兩行嘛因為本席看到的資料裡面就是我們TN-CAP目前已經試驗完成的兩台這個電動車就是包括這個Model3跟ModelY是不是這個完成的時間好像都是最近才完成的去年跟今年\n\n06:52.228 --> 07:19.386\n去年跟今年那因為我們也關注到就是說其實在電動車逐漸讓駕駛人能夠接受使用之後我們也陸續看到好幾件這個車禍的事故那包括就是在這個是在國外發生的有2021年12月在巴黎發生的一件就是Model3的這個車型的一個\n\n07:20.387 --> 07:35.709\n撞擊之後發生的火燒車事件包括2024年9月20號這是在國內新竹發生的也是撞了護欄之後起火燃燒然後2024年10月份是在加拿大\n\n07:36.730 --> 07:51.230\n的多輪作發生的也是ModelY失控撞傷忽然之後起火還有包括今年1月25號國道1號陽梅休息站的這是也是電動車撞擊之後起火造成44傷\n\n07:53.012 --> 08:18.530\n因為這樣子的一個電動車的撞擊失火的這樣的事故事實上在基層我也聽到很多民眾的一個疑慮那當然就是我們也看到說對照目前我們TNCAP所做的這個測試我們也當然很高興有看到這樣的測試可是要怎樣讓消費者對這個有信心是不是可以請次長講一下\n\n08:20.748 --> 08:41.881\n跟委員報告現在這個2050淨零碳排這個電動車這個讓民眾有信心對它這個安全這個值得信賴這個是最重要的一個課題那所以就是說針對這個我想針對電動小客車的部分剛剛委員所提到這個TNcable那個是一個更高標準的要求\n\n08:42.421 --> 09:11.200\n然後在這個車輛在做這個法規符合性車輛安全檢測基準的這個檢測的時候剛剛市長也有提到針對這個電動車的安全性台灣跟歐盟跟日本一樣都是條合聯合國UNR100的這個法規進來那這個R100的一個法規就包括整車的電氣這個防護功能還有包括電池本身的部分都要去做這個\n\n09:13.282 --> 09:36.138\n這個碰撞那其實我也這個我想說這個也不是打這個廣告像特斯拉這個部分的話在車輛安全這個就要上市銷售這個火線已經撞過一次了然後在這個去年跟前年的這個TNCAP的部分的話也在做這個實在碰撞那基本上大概這個都沒有發生爆炸起火這樣子的情況\n\n09:37.727 --> 09:46.438\n剛剛有提到說TNCAP是比較高的標準那一般就是在市面上銷售的也是都會符合這樣子的標準嗎\n\n09:47.612 --> 10:09.865\n要有正面碰撞就是要做實車碰撞然後側撞也要用台車再做一次碰撞那電池基本上都在車底下面所以這樣子一撞會不會滲漏然後甚至靜置完之後會不會起火這個都是在法規的要求裡面\n\n10:10.467 --> 10:26.859\n是好我想這個也是民眾非常關心的這個就是電動車的一個安全性的問題然後那我們也當然希望就是說讓這樣的資訊也要讓國人能夠充分的能夠知道這樣子好謝謝我們加強宣導是謝謝陳樹葉委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":1.274,"end":5.099,"text":"謝謝主席請主席邀請次長我們交通部陳次長"},{"start":10.729,"end":37.763,"text":"市長早安就是平常本席在地方經常會遇到民眾反應就是其實就是常常接到民眾反應說我們的這個汽車燃料費為什麼不改由這個水油徵收或者是說隨這個工程里程來徵收這樣子比較公平因為有的人的車子他可能使用的頻率不高可能只有假日"},{"start":38.303,"end":51.42,"text":"也許是只有假日才來使用所以他們認為說如果按照這樣子的就是目前的隨車徵收的話對於使用頻率比較低的車主來說比較不公平那這個議題其實在過去"},{"start":54.704,"end":70.417,"text":"我也曾經提過案 也質詢過不過當然我們江部都有自愛難省的一個部分我們也看到育年所在108年的時候也有針對氣燃費徵收做一個研究報告結論也是說維持隨車徵收"},{"start":75.541,"end":93.278,"text":"那現在就是說因為隨著這個時間的推移因為108年到現在也又過了8年也快又快了好幾年了67年了所以就是說經過這樣子的一個時間時空的轉移我們對這個部分有沒有新的想法"},{"start":97.219,"end":114.56,"text":"我想我跟委員報告有關這個如何徵收的這個方式也是剛才陳主委員剛才講的這在其實在歷好幾年了不是歷年大概大家都一直在提從以前的這個隨車到隨郵甚至有人提到說"},{"start":116.162,"end":131.227,"text":"按里程按重量等等的都有那其實這樣的一個議題就是因為不管是採用哪一個方式來徵收都有它的優點跟它的缺點那整體上的考量還是第一個要考慮公平那另外一個是"},{"start":132.288,"end":153.928,"text":"徵收的一個整個成本也好或者整個的收入也好因為進來以後要來做養護的工作或修建的工作另外是民眾的可負擔性所以整體上來看目前還是朝向的既有的隨車徵收的方式但是我們也聽到的大家各界的一個建議尤其是電動車輛引進以後"},{"start":155.629,"end":174.208,"text":"所以目前我們也正為請這個運營所做相關的研究我們希望能夠再繼續一個觀察一下或者是了解一下世界各國隨著這樣的近鄰的議題以後或者是隨著科技的進步以後是不是有什麼樣一個徵收的方式因為這樣的一個徵收方式不是只有我們"},{"start":175.45,"end":186.842,"text":"其實各國也都有在實行而且我們看到各國實施上多數也是採用隨車徵收的一個方式所以目前才是用這樣的方式繼續再徵收 以上"},{"start":187.333,"end":206.869,"text":"是好那今天就是委員會針對這個公路法第27條就是有委員提案這個進行詢問那當然就是我們也認為說如果說我們沒有辦法將汽車燃料使用費改由隨有徵收的話可能跟我們目前的第27條的這個"},{"start":209.011,"end":227.408,"text":"條文的就是說這一個項目的名稱跟目的是不符合的所以就主張說這個條文裡面就是說公路主管機關為了公路養護及修建安全管理所需費用得徵收汽車燃料使用費所以為了讓民使相輔所以也建議"},{"start":228.53,"end":242.129,"text":"不如就是將這樣子的一個徵收的一個項目名稱更正為公路養護修建及安全管理費那這樣子來修訂我們交通部這邊的意見跟態度是如何"},{"start":243.275,"end":267.871,"text":"這樣的一個方向我們贊同至於說文字是不是要這麼長是需要這麼多字我想到我們主條再討論的時候我們再來大家再來討論如果改成這樣子的一個項目名稱的話當然就是可以涵蓋未來可能就是要徵收的電動車這種車種如果說用汽車燃料使用費汽燃費的話可能就徵收不到"},{"start":268.651,"end":285.195,"text":"對 會排除這個非使用汽油的車種車輛嘛所以這樣子也是又有公平性的問題那當然這個部分就是有待大家的一個討論跟共識啦好 那再來就是有關這個新車平等的這個計畫的問題"},{"start":288.616,"end":296.907,"text":"我們知道就是交通部為了推動就是評估新車的安全性所以我們也在張濱有興建了這個測試中心那時候在落成的時候由蘇貞昌院長主持本席也有去參與那這個目的主要就是說要透過"},{"start":306.78,"end":311.065,"text":"獨立的第三方機構對市售車輛進行試驗並將這個試驗的數據轉換成新等評級然後提供民眾易於理解在選購車輛的時候對這個車輛的安全性的資訊能夠有比較充分的一個了解跟掌握"},{"start":326.022,"end":342.749,"text":"我覺得這個很好我們也很肯定那當然就是說這個也是涉及到預算的問題那這個等一下我再來詢問那我先想了解一下目前我們這個成立之後我們所進行的測試目前為止大概完成了多少量"},{"start":345.066,"end":366.134,"text":"跟委員報告一下大概目標都是每年8台那去年有做到8台嗎好像沒有去年6台去年才6台因為去年的預算有稍微這個結局一點然後今年就恢復這個8台然後包括這個車廠自費來申請這個測試的到目前已經完成18個車型"},{"start":374.157,"end":392.564,"text":"十六個車型是包含車廠 車商自費的那在這些完成就是測驗的車輛裡面有包括電動車嗎有 特斯拉大概應該是完成這兩型了"},{"start":394.441,"end":411.768,"text":"完成兩行嘛因為本席看到的資料裡面就是我們TN-CAP目前已經試驗完成的兩台這個電動車就是包括這個Model 3跟Model Y 是不是這個完成的時間好像都是最近才完成的去年跟今年"},{"start":412.228,"end":439.386,"text":"去年跟今年那因為我們也關注到就是說其實在電動車逐漸讓駕駛人能夠接受使用之後我們也陸續看到好幾件這個車禍的事故那包括就是在這個是在國外發生的有2021年12月在巴黎發生的一件就是Model 3的這個車型的一個"},{"start":440.387,"end":455.709,"text":"撞擊之後發生的火燒車事件包括2024年9月20號這是在國內新竹發生的也是撞了護欄之後起火燃燒然後2024年10月份是在加拿大"},{"start":456.73,"end":471.23,"text":"的多輪作發生的也是Model Y失控撞傷忽然之後起火還有包括今年1月25號國道1號陽梅休息站的這是也是電動車撞擊之後起火造成44傷"},{"start":473.012,"end":498.53,"text":"因為這樣子的一個電動車的撞擊失火的這樣的事故事實上在基層我也聽到很多民眾的一個疑慮那當然就是我們也看到說對照目前我們TNCAP所做的這個測試我們也當然很高興有看到這樣的測試可是要怎樣讓消費者對這個有信心是不是可以請次長講一下"},{"start":500.748,"end":521.881,"text":"跟委員報告現在這個2050淨零碳排這個電動車這個讓民眾有信心對它這個安全這個值得信賴這個是最重要的一個課題那所以就是說針對這個我想針對電動小客車的部分剛剛委員所提到這個TN cable那個是一個更高標準的要求"},{"start":522.421,"end":551.2,"text":"然後在這個車輛在做這個法規符合性車輛安全檢測基準的這個檢測的時候剛剛市長也有提到針對這個電動車的安全性台灣跟歐盟跟日本一樣都是條合聯合國UNR100的這個法規進來那這個R100的一個法規就包括整車的電氣這個防護功能還有包括電池本身的部分都要去做這個"},{"start":553.282,"end":576.138,"text":"這個碰撞那其實我也這個我想說這個也不是打這個廣告像特斯拉這個部分的話在車輛安全這個就要上市銷售這個火線已經撞過一次了然後在這個去年跟前年的這個TNCAP的部分的話也在做這個實在碰撞那基本上大概這個都沒有發生爆炸起火這樣子的情況"},{"start":577.727,"end":586.438,"text":"剛剛有提到說TN CAP是比較高的標準那一般就是在市面上銷售的也是都會符合這樣子的標準嗎"},{"start":587.612,"end":609.865,"text":"要有正面碰撞就是要做實車碰撞然後側撞也要用台車再做一次碰撞那電池基本上都在車底下面所以這樣子一撞會不會滲漏然後甚至靜置完之後會不會起火這個都是在法規的要求裡面"},{"start":610.467,"end":626.859,"text":"是好我想這個也是民眾非常關心的這個就是電動車的一個安全性的問題然後那我們也當然希望就是說讓這樣的資訊也要讓國人能夠充分的能夠知道這樣子好謝謝我們加強宣導是謝謝陳樹葉委員"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":677,"blocks":[["陳委員素月：（12時）謝謝主席，請主席邀請次長。"],["主席：交通部陳次長。"],["陳次長彥伯：委員好。"],["陳委員素月：次長早安。"],["陳次長彥伯：早。"],["陳委員素月：平常本席在地方經常會遇到民眾反映，我們的汽車燃料費為什麼不改成隨油徵收或者是隨里程徵收？這樣子比較公平，因為有人的車子可能使用頻率不高，也許是只有假日才使用，所以他們認為如果按照目前隨車徵收的話，對於使用頻率比較低的車主來說比較不公平。這個議題其實在過去我也曾經提過案，也質詢過，當然交通部都有窒礙難行的部分。我們也看到運研所在108年的時候，也有針對汽燃費徵收做一個研究報告，結論也是維持隨車徵收。隨著時間的推移，108年到現在又過了6、7年，經過這樣子的時間、時空轉移，你們對這個部分有沒有新的想法？"],["陳次長彥伯：跟委員報告，有關如何徵收及徵收方式誠如委員剛才講的，其實好幾年來，歷年大家都一直在提，從以前的隨車到隨油，甚至有人提到按里程、按重量等等的都有。其實關於這樣的一個議題，不管採用哪一個方式徵收都有它的優點跟它的缺點，整體上的考量來講，第一個還是要考慮公平，另外一個是徵收的成本也好，整個的收入也好，它進來以後要做養護的工作或修建的工作，另外是民眾的可負擔性，所以整體上來看，目前還是朝向既有的隨車徵收方式。但是我們也聽到各界的建議，尤其是電動車輛引進以後，目前我們也正委請運研所做相關的研究。我們希望能夠繼續再觀察一下，並且了解一下世界各國隨著淨零議題或者隨著科技進步以後，是不是有什麼樣的徵收方式。因為這樣的徵收方式並非只有我們才有，其實各國也都有在實行，而且我們看到各國實施上多數也是採用隨車徵收的方式，所以目前還是用這樣的方式繼續徵收。以上。"],["陳委員素月：今天委員會針對公路法第二十七條委員提案進行詢答，當然我們也認為，如果沒有辦法將汽車燃料使用費改成隨油徵收的話，可能跟我們目前第二十七條條文的項目名稱、目的不符合。而這個條文裡面規定，公路主管機關為了公路養護、修建及安全管理所需費用，得徵收汽車燃料使用費。為了讓名實相符，也有建議不如將徵收項目名稱更正為公路養護、修建及安全管理費。針對這樣子修訂，交通部的意見跟態度是如何？"],["陳次長彥伯：這樣的一個方向我們贊同，至於文字是不是要這麼長、需要這麼多字，我想到逐條討論的時候，大家再來討論。"],["陳委員素月：是，如果改成這樣子的項目名稱的話，當然就是可以涵蓋未來要徵收的電動車這種車種嘛，如果說用汽車燃料使用費、汽燃費的話，可能就徵收不到電動車？"],["陳次長彥伯：對，會排除非使用汽油的電車。"],["陳委員素月：非使用汽油的車種，所以這樣子又有公平性的問題啦！"],["陳次長彥伯：是。"],["陳委員素月：當然這個部分有待大家的討論跟共識啦！再來，有關新車評等計畫的問題，我們知道交通部為了推動評估新車的安全性，所以在彰濱興建了測試中心，落成的時候由蘇貞昌院長主持，本席也有參與。這個目的主要就是要透過獨立的第三方機構對市售車輛進行試驗，並將試驗的數據轉換成星等評級，讓民眾易於理解，在選購車輛的時候，對車輛安全性的資訊能夠有比較充分的了解跟掌握啦！我覺得這個很好，我們也很肯定，當然這個也是涉及到預算的問題，這個等一下我再來詢問啦！我先想了解一下，我們成立之後進行的測試，目前為止大概完成了多少輛？"],["林司長福山：跟委員報告，目標大概都是每年……"],["陳委員素月：每年八臺？"],["林司長福山：對。"],["陳委員素月：去年有做到八臺嗎？好像沒有。"],["林司長福山：去年六臺。"],["陳委員素月：去年才六臺嘛！"],["林司長福山：因為去年的預算有稍微拮据一點，然後今年就回復到八臺，包括車廠自願來自費申請測試的，到目前已經完成18個車型。"],["陳委員素月：多少？"],["林司長福山：16個車型。"],["陳委員素月：16個車型是包含車商自費的？"],["陳次長彥伯：自費的部分。"],["陳委員素月：好，那在這些完成測驗的車輛裡面，有包括電動車嗎？"],["林司長福山：有，特斯拉應該是完成這兩型了。"],["陳委員素月：完成兩型嘛，好，因為本席看到的資料裡面就是我們TNCAP目前已經試驗完成兩臺電動車，就是包括MODEL 3跟MODEL Y是不是？"],["林司長福山：是。"],["陳委員素月：完成的時間好像都是最近才完成的？"],["林司長福山：去年跟今年。"],["陳委員素月：去年跟今年，因為我們也關注到，其實電動車逐漸讓駕駛人能夠接受使用之後，我們也陸續看到好幾件車禍的事故，包括在國外發生的，2021年12月在巴黎發生的一件MODEL 3車型撞擊之後發生的火燒車事件；包括2024年9月20號，這是在國內新竹發生的，也是撞了護欄之後起火燃燒；然後2024年10月份是在加拿大的多倫多發生的，也是MODEL Y失控撞上護欄之後起火；還有包括今年1月25號，國道一號楊梅休息站的也是電動車撞擊之後起火，造成4死4傷嘛！因為電動車撞擊失火這樣的事故，事實上在基層我也聽到很多民眾的疑慮啦，我們也看到對照目前TNCAP做的這個測試，我們當然很高興有看到這樣的測試，可是要怎樣讓消費者對這個有信心，是不是可以請司長講一下？"],["林司長福山：跟委員報告，現在2050淨零碳排電動車要讓民眾有信心，安全、值得信賴這個是最重要的一個課題，所以針對電動小客車的部分，剛剛委員所提到這個TNCAP，那是一個更高標準的要求，然後在車輛做法規符合性車輛安全檢測基準檢測的時候，剛剛次長也有提到，針對電動車的安全性，臺灣跟歐盟、日本一樣，都是調合聯合國UN-R100這一個法規進來，而這個R100的法規就包括整車電器防護功能，還有電池本身的部分都要去做碰撞。其實我想這個也不是打廣告，像特斯拉，在車輛安全方面要上市銷售時，這個法規符合性已經撞過一次了，然後在去年跟前年的TNCAP部分也在做實車碰撞，基本上都沒有發生爆炸起火這樣的情況。"],["陳委員素月：是，你剛剛有提到TNCAP是比較高的標準，一般在市面上銷售的也都會符合這樣子的標準嗎？"],["林司長福山：都要正面碰撞，就是要實車碰撞、側撞，也要用這一臺車再做一次碰撞。電池基本上都在車體下面，所以這樣子一撞會不會滲漏，甚至靜置完之後會不會起火，這個都是在法規的要求裡面。"],["陳委員素月：好，我想這個也是民眾非常關心的電動車安全性問題啦，我們當然也希望這樣的資訊要讓國人能夠充分的知道，好，謝謝。"],["陳次長彥伯：是，我們會加強宣導。"],["主席：謝謝陳素月委員。","請何欣純委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":68,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-23-11","speakers":["林國成","葛如鈞","洪孟楷","許智傑","陳素月","蔡其昌","何欣純","林俊憲","張啓楷","廖先翔","李昆澤","游顥","黃健豪","陳雪生","魯明哲","徐富癸","邱若華","葉元之"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-05-12"],"gazette_id":"1144802","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144802_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期交通委員會第11次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查(一)委員吳宗憲等17人、(二)委員賴士葆等28人、(三)委員楊瓊瓔等26人分別擬具「人\n工智慧基本法草案」及(四)台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「人工智慧發展及管理條例草案」案；二、審查\n( 一) 委員林俊憲等23 人擬具「公路法第二十七條、第二十八條及第七十五條條文修正草案」、\n(二)委員陳冠廷等18人、(三)委員徐富癸等17人分別擬具「公路法第三十二條條文修正草案」、\n(四)委員陳冠廷等16人擬具「公路法第三十三條條文修正草案」、(五)台灣民眾黨黨團、(六)委\n員馬文君等19 人、( 七) 委員邱若華等17 人分別擬具「公路法第三十九條之一條文修正草案」、\n(八)委員何欣純等18人擬具「公路法第四十六條及第六十條之一條文修正草案」、(九)委員王義\n川等16人擬具「公路法第六十五條條文修正草案」及(十)委員林俊憲等21人擬具「公路法第七十\n二條條文修正草案」案；三、審查 ( 一 ) 委員林俊憲等 22 人擬具「停車場法第四條條文修正草\n案」、(二)委員廖先翔等17人擬具「停車場法第三十二條條文修正草案」及(三)台灣民眾黨黨團\n擬具「停車場法第三十八條條文修正草案」案。【本日會議僅針對開會事由二及三進行合併詢\n答】","agenda_id":"1144802_00001"}}}