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{\"start\": 298.925, \"end\": 317.684, \"text\": \"那我們是不是可以納入56條的處罰的架構來做來做開罰的民眾檢舉的部分如果是真的要有車要有車牌號碼跟那個如果是人的那個部分的話我想這個這個實務執法上面像在56條這些相關違規停車的部分基本上不管是警察執法\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 298.925, \"end\": 299.085, \"score\": 0.867}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 299.085, \"end\": 299.205, \"score\": 0.81}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 299.205, \"end\": 299.305, \"score\": 0.802}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 299.305, \"end\": 299.426, \"score\": 0.83}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 299.426, \"end\": 299.446, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 299.446, \"end\": 299.546, \"score\": 0.823}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 299.546, \"end\": 299.806, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"納\"}, {\"word\": \"入\", \"start\": 299.806, \"end\": 300.587, \"score\": 0.795}, {\"word\": \"5\"}, {\"word\": \"6\"}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 300.587, \"end\": 301.007, \"score\": 0.902}, {\"word\": \"處\"}, {\"word\": \"罰\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 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0.907}, {\"word\": \"單\"}, {\"word\": \"純\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 329.512, \"end\": 329.953, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"妨\"}, {\"word\": \"礙\"}, {\"word\": \"交\", \"start\": 329.953, \"end\": 330.173, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"通\", \"start\": 330.173, \"end\": 330.333, \"score\": 0.884}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 330.333, \"end\": 330.513, \"score\": 0.805}, {\"word\": \"它\", \"start\": 330.513, \"end\": 330.653, \"score\": 0.846}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 330.653, \"end\": 330.873, \"score\": 0.97}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 330.873, \"end\": 331.053, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"借\", \"start\": 331.053, \"end\": 331.674, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 331.674, \"end\": 331.854, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 331.854, \"end\": 331.994, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 331.994, \"end\": 332.134, \"score\": 0.905}, {\"word\": \"名\", \"start\": 332.134, \"end\": 332.555, \"score\": 0.902}, {\"word\": \"行\", 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\"start\": 362.995, \"end\": 363.015, \"score\": 0.35}]}, {\"start\": 364.356, \"end\": 378.887, \"text\": \"600到1200可是針對人肉占據車位我們沒有法可以來做開罰所以我講說開罰是不是要開第一個是不是要開罰是不是要用什麼樣的法條來開罰這個其實不是要討論的不是說把他拿來當處罰他以來然後我們不做任何的處理嗎\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"6\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 364.356, \"end\": 365.217, \"score\": 0.736}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"2\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 365.217, \"end\": 365.357, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 365.357, \"end\": 366.358, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"針\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 366.358, \"end\": 366.658, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"肉\", \"start\": 366.658, \"end\": 366.858, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"占\", \"start\": 366.858, \"end\": 367.419, \"score\": 0.831}, {\"word\": \"據\"}, {\"word\": \"車\"}, {\"word\": \"位\", \"start\": 367.419, \"end\": 367.619, \"score\": 0.776}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 367.619, 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{\"word\": \"K\", \"start\": 438.434, \"end\": 438.474, \"score\": 0.499}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 438.474, \"end\": 438.574, \"score\": 0.798}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"市\", \"start\": 438.574, \"end\": 438.654, \"score\": 0.748}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 438.654, \"end\": 438.935, \"score\": 0.876}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"邱\", \"start\": 438.935, \"end\": 438.955, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"若\", \"start\": 438.955, \"end\": 439.195, \"score\": 0.905}, {\"word\": \"驊\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 439.195, \"end\": 439.215, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:05,131 --> 00:00:22,492\n好謝謝主席主席我們請交通部陳好交通部陳正次委員好市長好市長本期今天有準備兩段影片我們先請市長一併來做觀看那第一段影片\n\n2\n00:00:35,043 --> 00:00:36,304\n好接著第二段影片\n\n3\n00:00:56,818 --> 00:01:12,348\n市長第一段影片呢是去年1月8日發生在高雄的人肉站車位的事件那第二段是在也是去年5月7號也同樣發生在高雄那請問市長這樣的以人身佔據公共停車格的行為您認為合不合理\n\n4\n00:01:14,062 --> 00:01:26,991\n那個暫居停車位用這種方式應該不是很恰當那同仁給我的相關是說處罰條例有相關的法條可以做出那我們目前可以依據哪一條法規對這樣的行為做出開罰你們要是這個條文嗎\n\n5\n00:01:36,044 --> 00:01:39,307\n要不要上警政署那個警政署那個陳組長陳組長來你上來幫忙一下陳組長警政署陳組長\n\n6\n00:01:59,775 --> 00:02:24,533\n我先確認一下好不好我請你證書你會不會聊一下因為時間的關係我們現在目前沒有法可針對這樣的行為作出開罰那也只有道交條例第78條第一項第4款那與交通平凡之道路或是鐵路平交道附近任意奔跑追逐西西或是坐臥蹲立然後足以影響到交通他才會處罰500元那再請問再請問次長一個問題喔那如果車位違規停車他的罰款金額範圍是多少錢\n\n7\n00:02:30,710 --> 00:02:50,101\n維規停車600到1200600到1200那還有並排停車是2400嘛那市長還有並排停車是2400那我這邊本期想要請問市長那你們發現以人身霸占公共車位他只罰500塊那這樣子民眾在這樣的邏輯下他會認為兩害相權取其輕然後他覺得500塊跟被罰1200比起來\n\n8\n00:02:57,184 --> 00:03:24,961\n這個舉證又那麼困難所以這樣的情形不斷在發生那交通部可以做出什麼樣的積極作為來改變這樣的現象呢你會不會講一下委員我認為如果是警察有報案的話警察會到場處理是那您提到的是有報的情況下那在難以舉證的情況因為通常民眾報案那警察到現場他們早就已經離開現場了那這樣子要怎麼來做在做開罰呢\n\n9\n00:03:26,258 --> 00:03:40,494\n如果警察到他沒離開警察可能用設置法來處理但是他如果看到警察來就拔掉你說的是沒有離開的情況下嗎對那很多情況是他們報案可是他們已經離開現場了那這樣怎麼來做開罰請針對本行的問題作答謝謝\n\n10\n00:03:51,220 --> 00:04:02,092\n佔用車位的人那個被佔用的人當然可以投訴啊如果他舉證他要怎麼投訴人都已經沒有在現場了他是提供影片嗎你們要開罰車組是嗎\n\n11\n00:04:04,290 --> 00:04:32,593\n所有的這個都要有事實啊你如果說違規事實沒辦法提出來就是說要相關的處罰我們現在看到的問題是他人肉戰車位他的處罰他不具嚇阻力那再加上舉發也困難所以交通部是不是要來演繹就是來針對民定的收證方式還有授權警方來做處理交通部可以做這樣子可以做這樣子可以再演繹嗎\n\n12\n00:04:33,359 --> 00:04:56,358\n我跟委員報告一下這個原則上如果說是屬於這個違反大陸交通管理事件的這個舉發第一個部分一定是有這個違規的事實嗎那第二個部分剛剛委員所謂講的授權舉發的部分是說那我們看到影片他確實有違規的事實啊就是說開放讓民眾檢舉是不是那目前有沒有開放給民眾做檢舉這條沒有這條沒有\n\n13\n00:04:58,925 --> 00:05:17,684\n那我們是不是可以納入56條的處罰的架構來做來做開罰的民眾檢舉的部分如果是真的要有車要有車牌號碼跟那個如果是人的那個部分的話我想這個這個實務執法上面像在56條這些相關違規停車的部分基本上不管是警察執法\n\n14\n00:05:17,984 --> 00:05:33,475\n因為我們剛才看到這兩段影片它不是經過它是有目的性的預留車位然後佔據這些車位然後再讓就是開車的人可以順利停進這個車位那這樣已經不單純是妨礙交通了它也是借行人之名行違規之時停車違規之時\n\n15\n00:05:35,757 --> 00:06:03,015\n委員這樣的一個行為是不是在處罰條例裡頭來來處罰這可能要要要稍微探究一下因為剛才委員特別提到的像這兩個花園的這個額度的比較一個是違規停車另外一個是比較偏向於佔用行人的去佔用那個那個那剛才又特別提到說這個可能又跟社會秩序是有關的所以我們提到違規停車是因為他現在有有明確的開罰他是\n\n16\n00:06:04,356 --> 00:06:18,887\n600到1200可是針對人肉占據車位我們沒有法可以來做開罰所以我講說開罰是不是要開第一個是不是要開罰是不是要用什麼樣的法條來開罰這個其實不是要討論的不是說把他拿來當處罰他以來然後我們不做任何的處理嗎\n\n17\n00:06:28,565 --> 00:06:39,874\n對所以我剛才特別提到說這樣的一個行為到底是要什麼樣的用什麼法條來處罰這個我想我們再跟警政庭再討論一下我們是不是可以用56條來做開罰呢\n\n18\n00:06:42,403 --> 00:07:02,699\n因為56條裡頭是一些違規行為是汽車違規停車的行為因為最後還是車輛停到停車格那我們是不是可以針對車主來做開罰所以那個車子他停進去他並沒有違反這些相關的規定是那一個占用的行為那前提也是因為譬如說他們的親友先去占據車位了\n\n19\n00:07:03,819 --> 00:07:19,215\n我要跟委員這樣的一個是不是可罰性要怎麼罰這個可能要再討論一下所以這部分我跟委員報告一下我們想我們再跟警政署來討論現行的相關的法條用什麼樣的方式來做處理是比較恰當的OK好謝謝市長好謝謝謝謝邱若驊委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n5131\t22492\t好謝謝主席主席我們請交通部陳好交通部陳正次委員好市長好市長本期今天有準備兩段影片我們先請市長一併來做觀看那第一段影片\n35043\t36304\t好 接著第二段影片\n56818\t72348\t市長第一段影片呢是去年1月8日發生在高雄的人肉站車位的事件那第二段是在也是去年5月7號也同樣發生在高雄那請問市長這樣的以人身佔據公共停車格的行為您認為合不合理\n74062\t86991\t那個暫居停車位用這種方式應該不是很恰當那同仁給我的相關是說處罰條例有相關的法條可以做出那我們目前可以依據哪一條法規對這樣的行為做出開罰你們要是這個條文嗎\n96044\t99307\t要不要上警政署那個警政署那個陳組長陳組長來你上來幫忙一下陳組長警政署陳組長\n119775\t144533\t我先確認一下好不好我請你證書你會不會聊一下因為時間的關係我們現在目前沒有法可針對這樣的行為作出開罰那也只有道交條例第78條第一項第4款那與交通平凡之道路或是鐵路平交道附近任意奔跑追逐西西或是坐臥蹲立然後足以影響到交通他才會處罰500元那再請問再請問次長一個問題喔那如果車位違規停車他的罰款金額範圍是多少錢\n150710\t170101\t維規停車600到1200600到1200那還有並排停車是2400嘛那市長還有並排停車是2400那我這邊本期想要請問市長那你們發現以人身霸占公共車位他只罰500塊那這樣子民眾在這樣的邏輯下他會認為兩害相權取其輕然後他覺得500塊跟被罰1200比起來\n177184\t204961\t這個舉證又那麼困難所以這樣的情形不斷在發生那交通部可以做出什麼樣的積極作為來改變這樣的現象呢你會不會講一下委員 我認為如果是警察有報案的話警察會到場處理是 那您提到的是有報的情況下那在難以舉證的情況因為通常民眾報案那警察到現場他們早就已經離開現場了那這樣子要怎麼來做 在做開罰呢\n206258\t220494\t如果警察到 他沒離開警察可能用設置法來處理但是他如果看到警察來就拔掉你說的是沒有離開的情況下嗎對那很多情況是他們報案 可是他們已經離開現場了那這樣怎麼來做開罰請針對本行的問題作答 謝謝\n231220\t242092\t佔用車位的人 那個被佔用的人當然可以投訴啊如果他舉證 他要怎麼投訴人都已經沒有在現場了 他是提供影片嗎 你們要開罰車組是嗎\n244290\t272593\t所有的這個都要有事實啊你如果說違規事實沒辦法提出來就是說要相關的處罰我們現在看到的問題是他人肉戰車位他的處罰他不具嚇阻力那再加上舉發也困難所以交通部是不是要來演繹就是來針對民定的收證方式還有授權警方來做處理交通部可以做這樣子可以做這樣子可以再演繹嗎\n273359\t296358\t我跟委員報告一下這個原則上如果說是屬於這個違反大陸交通管理事件的這個舉發第一個部分一定是有這個違規的事實嗎那第二個部分剛剛委員所謂講的授權舉發的部分是說那我們看到影片他確實有違規的事實啊就是說開放讓民眾檢舉是不是那目前有沒有開放給民眾做檢舉這條沒有 這條沒有\n298925\t317684\t那我們是不是可以納入56條的處罰的架構來做來做開罰的民眾檢舉的部分如果是真的要有車要有車牌號碼跟那個如果是人的那個部分的話我想這個這個實務執法上面像在56條這些相關違規停車的部分基本上不管是警察執法\n317984\t333475\t因為我們剛才看到這兩段影片它不是經過它是有目的性的預留車位然後佔據這些車位然後再讓就是開車的人可以順利停進這個車位那這樣已經不單純是妨礙交通了它也是借行人之名行違規之時停車違規之時\n335757\t363015\t委員這樣的一個行為是不是在處罰條例裡頭來來處罰這可能要要要稍微探究一下因為剛才委員特別提到的像這兩個花園的這個額度的比較一個是違規停車另外一個是比較偏向於佔用行人的去佔用那個那個那剛才又特別提到說這個可能又跟社會秩序是有關的所以我們提到違規停車是因為他現在有有明確的開罰他是\n364356\t378887\t600到1200可是針對人肉占據車位我們沒有法可以來做開罰所以我講說開罰是不是要開第一個是不是要開罰是不是要用什麼樣的法條來開罰這個其實不是要討論的不是說把他拿來當處罰他以來然後我們不做任何的處理嗎\n388565\t399874\t對 所以我剛才特別提到說這樣的一個行為到底是要什麼樣的用什麼法條來處罰這個我想我們再跟警政庭再討論一下我們是不是可以用56條來做開罰呢\n402403\t422699\t因為56條裡頭是一些違規行為是汽車違規停車的行為因為最後還是車輛停到停車格那我們是不是可以針對車主來做開罰所以那個車子他停進去他並沒有違反這些相關的規定是那一個占用的行為那前提也是因為譬如說他們的親友先去占據車位了\n423819\t439215\t我要跟委員 這樣的一個是不是可罰性 要怎麼罰這個可能要再討論一下所以這部分我跟委員報告一下我們想我們再跟警政署來討論現行的相關的法條用什麼樣的方式來做處理是比較恰當的OK 好 謝謝市長好 謝謝謝謝邱若驊委員\n","txt":"好謝謝主席主席我們請交通部陳好交通部陳正次委員好市長好市長本期今天有準備兩段影片我們先請市長一併來做觀看那第一段影片\n好 接著第二段影片\n市長第一段影片呢是去年1月8日發生在高雄的人肉站車位的事件那第二段是在也是去年5月7號也同樣發生在高雄那請問市長這樣的以人身佔據公共停車格的行為您認為合不合理\n那個暫居停車位用這種方式應該不是很恰當那同仁給我的相關是說處罰條例有相關的法條可以做出那我們目前可以依據哪一條法規對這樣的行為做出開罰你們要是這個條文嗎\n要不要上警政署那個警政署那個陳組長陳組長來你上來幫忙一下陳組長警政署陳組長\n我先確認一下好不好我請你證書你會不會聊一下因為時間的關係我們現在目前沒有法可針對這樣的行為作出開罰那也只有道交條例第78條第一項第4款那與交通平凡之道路或是鐵路平交道附近任意奔跑追逐西西或是坐臥蹲立然後足以影響到交通他才會處罰500元那再請問再請問次長一個問題喔那如果車位違規停車他的罰款金額範圍是多少錢\n維規停車600到1200600到1200那還有並排停車是2400嘛那市長還有並排停車是2400那我這邊本期想要請問市長那你們發現以人身霸占公共車位他只罰500塊那這樣子民眾在這樣的邏輯下他會認為兩害相權取其輕然後他覺得500塊跟被罰1200比起來\n這個舉證又那麼困難所以這樣的情形不斷在發生那交通部可以做出什麼樣的積極作為來改變這樣的現象呢你會不會講一下委員 我認為如果是警察有報案的話警察會到場處理是 那您提到的是有報的情況下那在難以舉證的情況因為通常民眾報案那警察到現場他們早就已經離開現場了那這樣子要怎麼來做 在做開罰呢\n如果警察到 他沒離開警察可能用設置法來處理但是他如果看到警察來就拔掉你說的是沒有離開的情況下嗎對那很多情況是他們報案 可是他們已經離開現場了那這樣怎麼來做開罰請針對本行的問題作答 謝謝\n佔用車位的人 那個被佔用的人當然可以投訴啊如果他舉證 他要怎麼投訴人都已經沒有在現場了 他是提供影片嗎 你們要開罰車組是嗎\n所有的這個都要有事實啊你如果說違規事實沒辦法提出來就是說要相關的處罰我們現在看到的問題是他人肉戰車位他的處罰他不具嚇阻力那再加上舉發也困難所以交通部是不是要來演繹就是來針對民定的收證方式還有授權警方來做處理交通部可以做這樣子可以做這樣子可以再演繹嗎\n我跟委員報告一下這個原則上如果說是屬於這個違反大陸交通管理事件的這個舉發第一個部分一定是有這個違規的事實嗎那第二個部分剛剛委員所謂講的授權舉發的部分是說那我們看到影片他確實有違規的事實啊就是說開放讓民眾檢舉是不是那目前有沒有開放給民眾做檢舉這條沒有 這條沒有\n那我們是不是可以納入56條的處罰的架構來做來做開罰的民眾檢舉的部分如果是真的要有車要有車牌號碼跟那個如果是人的那個部分的話我想這個這個實務執法上面像在56條這些相關違規停車的部分基本上不管是警察執法\n因為我們剛才看到這兩段影片它不是經過它是有目的性的預留車位然後佔據這些車位然後再讓就是開車的人可以順利停進這個車位那這樣已經不單純是妨礙交通了它也是借行人之名行違規之時停車違規之時\n委員這樣的一個行為是不是在處罰條例裡頭來來處罰這可能要要要稍微探究一下因為剛才委員特別提到的像這兩個花園的這個額度的比較一個是違規停車另外一個是比較偏向於佔用行人的去佔用那個那個那剛才又特別提到說這個可能又跟社會秩序是有關的所以我們提到違規停車是因為他現在有有明確的開罰他是\n600到1200可是針對人肉占據車位我們沒有法可以來做開罰所以我講說開罰是不是要開第一個是不是要開罰是不是要用什麼樣的法條來開罰這個其實不是要討論的不是說把他拿來當處罰他以來然後我們不做任何的處理嗎\n對 所以我剛才特別提到說這樣的一個行為到底是要什麼樣的用什麼法條來處罰這個我想我們再跟警政庭再討論一下我們是不是可以用56條來做開罰呢\n因為56條裡頭是一些違規行為是汽車違規停車的行為因為最後還是車輛停到停車格那我們是不是可以針對車主來做開罰所以那個車子他停進去他並沒有違反這些相關的規定是那一個占用的行為那前提也是因為譬如說他們的親友先去占據車位了\n我要跟委員 這樣的一個是不是可罰性 要怎麼罰這個可能要再討論一下所以這部分我跟委員報告一下我們想我們再跟警政署來討論現行的相關的法條用什麼樣的方式來做處理是比較恰當的OK 好 謝謝市長好 謝謝謝謝邱若驊委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:05.131 --> 00:22.492\n好謝謝主席主席我們請交通部陳好交通部陳正次委員好市長好市長本期今天有準備兩段影片我們先請市長一併來做觀看那第一段影片\n\n00:35.043 --> 00:36.304\n好接著第二段影片\n\n00:56.818 --> 01:12.348\n市長第一段影片呢是去年1月8日發生在高雄的人肉站車位的事件那第二段是在也是去年5月7號也同樣發生在高雄那請問市長這樣的以人身佔據公共停車格的行為您認為合不合理\n\n01:14.062 --> 01:26.991\n那個暫居停車位用這種方式應該不是很恰當那同仁給我的相關是說處罰條例有相關的法條可以做出那我們目前可以依據哪一條法規對這樣的行為做出開罰你們要是這個條文嗎\n\n01:36.044 --> 01:39.307\n要不要上警政署那個警政署那個陳組長陳組長來你上來幫忙一下陳組長警政署陳組長\n\n01:59.775 --> 02:24.533\n我先確認一下好不好我請你證書你會不會聊一下因為時間的關係我們現在目前沒有法可針對這樣的行為作出開罰那也只有道交條例第78條第一項第4款那與交通平凡之道路或是鐵路平交道附近任意奔跑追逐西西或是坐臥蹲立然後足以影響到交通他才會處罰500元那再請問再請問次長一個問題喔那如果車位違規停車他的罰款金額範圍是多少錢\n\n02:30.710 --> 02:50.101\n維規停車600到1200600到1200那還有並排停車是2400嘛那市長還有並排停車是2400那我這邊本期想要請問市長那你們發現以人身霸占公共車位他只罰500塊那這樣子民眾在這樣的邏輯下他會認為兩害相權取其輕然後他覺得500塊跟被罰1200比起來\n\n02:57.184 --> 03:24.961\n這個舉證又那麼困難所以這樣的情形不斷在發生那交通部可以做出什麼樣的積極作為來改變這樣的現象呢你會不會講一下委員我認為如果是警察有報案的話警察會到場處理是那您提到的是有報的情況下那在難以舉證的情況因為通常民眾報案那警察到現場他們早就已經離開現場了那這樣子要怎麼來做在做開罰呢\n\n03:26.258 --> 03:40.494\n如果警察到他沒離開警察可能用設置法來處理但是他如果看到警察來就拔掉你說的是沒有離開的情況下嗎對那很多情況是他們報案可是他們已經離開現場了那這樣怎麼來做開罰請針對本行的問題作答謝謝\n\n03:51.220 --> 04:02.092\n佔用車位的人那個被佔用的人當然可以投訴啊如果他舉證他要怎麼投訴人都已經沒有在現場了他是提供影片嗎你們要開罰車組是嗎\n\n04:04.290 --> 04:32.593\n所有的這個都要有事實啊你如果說違規事實沒辦法提出來就是說要相關的處罰我們現在看到的問題是他人肉戰車位他的處罰他不具嚇阻力那再加上舉發也困難所以交通部是不是要來演繹就是來針對民定的收證方式還有授權警方來做處理交通部可以做這樣子可以做這樣子可以再演繹嗎\n\n04:33.359 --> 04:56.358\n我跟委員報告一下這個原則上如果說是屬於這個違反大陸交通管理事件的這個舉發第一個部分一定是有這個違規的事實嗎那第二個部分剛剛委員所謂講的授權舉發的部分是說那我們看到影片他確實有違規的事實啊就是說開放讓民眾檢舉是不是那目前有沒有開放給民眾做檢舉這條沒有這條沒有\n\n04:58.925 --> 05:17.684\n那我們是不是可以納入56條的處罰的架構來做來做開罰的民眾檢舉的部分如果是真的要有車要有車牌號碼跟那個如果是人的那個部分的話我想這個這個實務執法上面像在56條這些相關違規停車的部分基本上不管是警察執法\n\n05:17.984 --> 05:33.475\n因為我們剛才看到這兩段影片它不是經過它是有目的性的預留車位然後佔據這些車位然後再讓就是開車的人可以順利停進這個車位那這樣已經不單純是妨礙交通了它也是借行人之名行違規之時停車違規之時\n\n05:35.757 --> 06:03.015\n委員這樣的一個行為是不是在處罰條例裡頭來來處罰這可能要要要稍微探究一下因為剛才委員特別提到的像這兩個花園的這個額度的比較一個是違規停車另外一個是比較偏向於佔用行人的去佔用那個那個那剛才又特別提到說這個可能又跟社會秩序是有關的所以我們提到違規停車是因為他現在有有明確的開罰他是\n\n06:04.356 --> 06:18.887\n600到1200可是針對人肉占據車位我們沒有法可以來做開罰所以我講說開罰是不是要開第一個是不是要開罰是不是要用什麼樣的法條來開罰這個其實不是要討論的不是說把他拿來當處罰他以來然後我們不做任何的處理嗎\n\n06:28.565 --> 06:39.874\n對所以我剛才特別提到說這樣的一個行為到底是要什麼樣的用什麼法條來處罰這個我想我們再跟警政庭再討論一下我們是不是可以用56條來做開罰呢\n\n06:42.403 --> 07:02.699\n因為56條裡頭是一些違規行為是汽車違規停車的行為因為最後還是車輛停到停車格那我們是不是可以針對車主來做開罰所以那個車子他停進去他並沒有違反這些相關的規定是那一個占用的行為那前提也是因為譬如說他們的親友先去占據車位了\n\n07:03.819 --> 07:19.215\n我要跟委員這樣的一個是不是可罰性要怎麼罰這個可能要再討論一下所以這部分我跟委員報告一下我們想我們再跟警政署來討論現行的相關的法條用什麼樣的方式來做處理是比較恰當的OK好謝謝市長好謝謝謝謝邱若驊委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":5.131,"end":22.492,"text":"好謝謝主席主席我們請交通部陳好交通部陳正次委員好市長好市長本期今天有準備兩段影片我們先請市長一併來做觀看那第一段影片"},{"start":35.043,"end":36.304,"text":"好 接著第二段影片"},{"start":56.818,"end":72.348,"text":"市長第一段影片呢是去年1月8日發生在高雄的人肉站車位的事件那第二段是在也是去年5月7號也同樣發生在高雄那請問市長這樣的以人身佔據公共停車格的行為您認為合不合理"},{"start":74.062,"end":86.991,"text":"那個暫居停車位用這種方式應該不是很恰當那同仁給我的相關是說處罰條例有相關的法條可以做出那我們目前可以依據哪一條法規對這樣的行為做出開罰你們要是這個條文嗎"},{"start":96.044,"end":99.307,"text":"要不要上警政署那個警政署那個陳組長陳組長來你上來幫忙一下陳組長警政署陳組長"},{"start":119.775,"end":144.533,"text":"我先確認一下好不好我請你證書你會不會聊一下因為時間的關係我們現在目前沒有法可針對這樣的行為作出開罰那也只有道交條例第78條第一項第4款那與交通平凡之道路或是鐵路平交道附近任意奔跑追逐西西或是坐臥蹲立然後足以影響到交通他才會處罰500元那再請問再請問次長一個問題喔那如果車位違規停車他的罰款金額範圍是多少錢"},{"start":150.71,"end":170.101,"text":"維規停車600到1200600到1200那還有並排停車是2400嘛那市長還有並排停車是2400那我這邊本期想要請問市長那你們發現以人身霸占公共車位他只罰500塊那這樣子民眾在這樣的邏輯下他會認為兩害相權取其輕然後他覺得500塊跟被罰1200比起來"},{"start":177.184,"end":204.961,"text":"這個舉證又那麼困難所以這樣的情形不斷在發生那交通部可以做出什麼樣的積極作為來改變這樣的現象呢你會不會講一下委員 我認為如果是警察有報案的話警察會到場處理是 那您提到的是有報的情況下那在難以舉證的情況因為通常民眾報案那警察到現場他們早就已經離開現場了那這樣子要怎麼來做 在做開罰呢"},{"start":206.258,"end":220.494,"text":"如果警察到 他沒離開警察可能用設置法來處理但是他如果看到警察來就拔掉你說的是沒有離開的情況下嗎對那很多情況是他們報案 可是他們已經離開現場了那這樣怎麼來做開罰請針對本行的問題作答 謝謝"},{"start":231.22,"end":242.092,"text":"佔用車位的人 那個被佔用的人當然可以投訴啊如果他舉證 他要怎麼投訴人都已經沒有在現場了 他是提供影片嗎 你們要開罰車組是嗎"},{"start":244.29,"end":272.593,"text":"所有的這個都要有事實啊你如果說違規事實沒辦法提出來就是說要相關的處罰我們現在看到的問題是他人肉戰車位他的處罰他不具嚇阻力那再加上舉發也困難所以交通部是不是要來演繹就是來針對民定的收證方式還有授權警方來做處理交通部可以做這樣子可以做這樣子可以再演繹嗎"},{"start":273.359,"end":296.358,"text":"我跟委員報告一下這個原則上如果說是屬於這個違反大陸交通管理事件的這個舉發第一個部分一定是有這個違規的事實嗎那第二個部分剛剛委員所謂講的授權舉發的部分是說那我們看到影片他確實有違規的事實啊就是說開放讓民眾檢舉是不是那目前有沒有開放給民眾做檢舉這條沒有 這條沒有"},{"start":298.925,"end":317.684,"text":"那我們是不是可以納入56條的處罰的架構來做來做開罰的民眾檢舉的部分如果是真的要有車要有車牌號碼跟那個如果是人的那個部分的話我想這個這個實務執法上面像在56條這些相關違規停車的部分基本上不管是警察執法"},{"start":317.984,"end":333.475,"text":"因為我們剛才看到這兩段影片它不是經過它是有目的性的預留車位然後佔據這些車位然後再讓就是開車的人可以順利停進這個車位那這樣已經不單純是妨礙交通了它也是借行人之名行違規之時停車違規之時"},{"start":335.757,"end":363.015,"text":"委員這樣的一個行為是不是在處罰條例裡頭來來處罰這可能要要要稍微探究一下因為剛才委員特別提到的像這兩個花園的這個額度的比較一個是違規停車另外一個是比較偏向於佔用行人的去佔用那個那個那剛才又特別提到說這個可能又跟社會秩序是有關的所以我們提到違規停車是因為他現在有有明確的開罰他是"},{"start":364.356,"end":378.887,"text":"600到1200可是針對人肉占據車位我們沒有法可以來做開罰所以我講說開罰是不是要開第一個是不是要開罰是不是要用什麼樣的法條來開罰這個其實不是要討論的不是說把他拿來當處罰他以來然後我們不做任何的處理嗎"},{"start":388.565,"end":399.874,"text":"對 所以我剛才特別提到說這樣的一個行為到底是要什麼樣的用什麼法條來處罰這個我想我們再跟警政庭再討論一下我們是不是可以用56條來做開罰呢"},{"start":402.403,"end":422.699,"text":"因為56條裡頭是一些違規行為是汽車違規停車的行為因為最後還是車輛停到停車格那我們是不是可以針對車主來做開罰所以那個車子他停進去他並沒有違反這些相關的規定是那一個占用的行為那前提也是因為譬如說他們的親友先去占據車位了"},{"start":423.819,"end":439.215,"text":"我要跟委員 這樣的一個是不是可罰性 要怎麼罰這個可能要再討論一下所以這部分我跟委員報告一下我們想我們再跟警政署來討論現行的相關的法條用什麼樣的方式來做處理是比較恰當的OK 好 謝謝市長好 謝謝謝謝邱若驊委員"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":878,"blocks":[["邱委員若華：（12時44分）謝謝主席，主席，我們請交通部陳次長。"],["主席：交通部陳政次。"],["陳次長彥伯：委員好。"],["邱委員若華：次長好。次長，本席今天有準備兩段影片，我先請次長一併來觀看，現在請先看第一段影片。","（播放影片）"],["邱委員若華：接著請看第二段影片。","（播放影片）"],["邱委員若華：次長，第一段影片是去年1月8日發生在高雄的人肉占車位的事件，第二段在去年5月7號也同樣發生在高雄，請問次長，這種以人身占據公共停車格的行為，您認為合不合理？"],["陳次長彥伯：用這種方式占據停車位應該不是很恰當，同仁跟我說，處罰條例有相關的法條可以處理。"],["邱委員若華：是，那我們目前可以依據哪一條法規對這樣的行為開罰？"],["陳次長彥伯：是這個條文嗎？警政署要不要來說明一下？"],["主席：警政署陳組長，來，你上來幫忙一下。"],["邱委員若華：請陳組長。"],["主席：請警政署陳組長。"],["陳次長彥伯：我們先確認一下，好不好？我請警政署來說明一下。"],["邱委員若華：沒關係，次長，因為時間的關係。我們目前沒有法可針對這樣的行為開罰，也只有道交條例第七十八條第一項第四款規定，行人於交通頻繁之道路或鐵路平交道附近任意奔跑、追逐、嬉戲或坐、臥、蹲、立，足以阻礙交通，才會處罰五百元。再請問次長一個問題，如果車輛違規停車，他的罰款金額範圍是多少錢？違規停車。"],["陳次長彥伯：六百到一千二。"],["邱委員若華：六百到一千二，還有併排停車是兩千四嘛。"],["陳次長彥伯：就是乘以二。"],["邱委員若華：本席想要請問次長，你有沒有發現，以人身霸占公共車位只罰五百塊，民眾在這樣的邏輯下會認為兩害相權取其輕，他覺得被罰五百塊跟被罰一千二比起來，加上前者舉證又那麼困難，所以這樣的情形不斷地發生，交通部有什麼積極作為可以改變這樣的現象呢？"],["陳組長明志：委員，我認為如果有報案的話，警察會到場處理，我想……"],["邱委員若華：是，您提到的是有報案的情況下，但在難以舉證的情況，因為通常民眾報案，警察到現場時，他們早就已經離開現場了，這樣要怎麼開罰呢？"],["陳組長明志：如果警察到他們沒離開，警察可能用社秩法處理，但是如果他看到警察來就跑掉……"],["邱委員若華：你說的是沒有離開的情況下嘛。"],["陳組長明志：對。"],["邱委員若華：很多情況是民眾報案，可是占位的人已經離開現場了，這樣如何開罰？請針對本席的問題作答，謝謝。"],["陳組長明志：有人占用車位，被占用的人當然可以投訴，如果他舉證……"],["邱委員若華：他要怎麼投訴？人都已經沒有在現場了，他是提供影片嗎？你們要開罰車主，是嗎？"],["陳次長彥伯：委員，所有的處罰都要有事實，如果違規事實沒辦法提出來，要說相關的處罰的話……"],["邱委員若華：我們現在看到的問題是，人肉占車位的處罰不具嚇阻力，然後再加上舉發也困難，所以交通部是不是也要研議明定蒐證方式，還有授權警方處理？交通部可以再研議嗎？"],["林司長福山：跟委員報告一下，原則上如果是屬於違反道路交通管理事件的舉發，第一個部分一定是有違規的事實；第二個部分，剛剛委員所講的授權舉發是說……"],["邱委員若華：就我們看到的影片，他確實有違規的事實啊！"],["林司長福山：開放讓民眾檢舉，是不是？"],["邱委員若華：目前有沒有開放讓民眾檢舉？"],["林司長福山：這一條沒有。"],["邱委員若華：那我們是不是可以納入第五十六條的處罰架構開罰？"],["林司長福山：可是民眾檢舉的部分，如果是針對車輛要有車牌號碼跟違規事實；如果是人的部分，我想在實務執法上面，像第五十六條這些相關違規停車的部分，基本上，不管是警察執法或者是民眾……"],["邱委員若華：我們剛才看到的這兩段影片，他不是經過，他是有目的性的預留車位，然後占據這些車位，然後再讓開車的人可以順利停進這個車位，這樣已經不單純是妨礙交通了，他也是借行人之名行違規停車之實，難道我們沒有法可以……"],["陳次長彥伯：委員，這樣的行為是不是在處罰條例裡頭處罰，這可能要稍微探究一下，因為剛才委員特別提到兩個罰鍰額度的比較：一個是違規停車，另外一個是比較偏向行人去占用車位，剛才又特別提到這個可能又跟社會秩序是有關的，所以……"],["邱委員若華：本席提到違規停車是因為現在有明確的罰則，罰鍰是六百到一千二，可是針對人肉占據車位，我們沒有法可以開罰。"],["陳次長彥伯：所以我講開罰，第一個，是不是要開罰、是不是要用什麼樣的法條開罰，這個其實是要討論的，不是說把處罰條例拿來當……"],["邱委員若華：本席之所以會提就是因為有這樣的歪風，我們必須遏止，難道交通部還要繼續放任民眾這樣的行為，然後我們不做任何處理嗎？"],["陳次長彥伯：對，所以我剛才特別提到，這樣的行為到底要用什麼法條處罰，我想我們再跟警政機關討論。"],["邱委員若華：在這裡本席也提議，我們是不是可以用第五十六條開罰呢？"],["陳次長彥伯：因為第五十六條裡頭是一些汽車的違規停車行為，跟一個人站在車格中是不一樣的……"],["邱委員若華：因為最後還是車輛停到停車格，那我們是不是可以針對車主來開罰？"],["陳次長彥伯：那個車子停進去並沒有違反相關的規定，是那一個占用的行為……"],["邱委員若華：那前提也是因為，比如說他們的親友先去占據車位了。"],["陳次長彥伯：跟委員報告，這樣的行為是不是有可罰性、要怎麼罰，這個可能要再討論一下……"],["邱委員若華：交通部要不要再做研議嘛？"],["陳次長彥伯：這部分我跟委員報告一下，我想我們再跟警政署討論就現行的相關法條，用什麼樣的方式處理是比較恰當的，好不好？"],["邱委員若華：OK，好，謝謝次長。"],["陳次長彥伯：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝邱若華委員。"],["主席（邱委員若華代）：接著我們請林國成委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":68,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-23-11","speakers":["林國成","葛如鈞","洪孟楷","許智傑","陳素月","蔡其昌","何欣純","林俊憲","張啓楷","廖先翔","李昆澤","游顥","黃健豪","陳雪生","魯明哲","徐富癸","邱若華","葉元之"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-05-12"],"gazette_id":"1144802","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144802_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期交通委員會第11次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查(一)委員吳宗憲等17人、(二)委員賴士葆等28人、(三)委員楊瓊瓔等26人分別擬具「人\n工智慧基本法草案」及(四)台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「人工智慧發展及管理條例草案」案；二、審查\n( 一) 委員林俊憲等23 人擬具「公路法第二十七條、第二十八條及第七十五條條文修正草案」、\n(二)委員陳冠廷等18人、(三)委員徐富癸等17人分別擬具「公路法第三十二條條文修正草案」、\n(四)委員陳冠廷等16人擬具「公路法第三十三條條文修正草案」、(五)台灣民眾黨黨團、(六)委\n員馬文君等19 人、( 七) 委員邱若華等17 人分別擬具「公路法第三十九條之一條文修正草案」、\n(八)委員何欣純等18人擬具「公路法第四十六條及第六十條之一條文修正草案」、(九)委員王義\n川等16人擬具「公路法第六十五條條文修正草案」及(十)委員林俊憲等21人擬具「公路法第七十\n二條條文修正草案」案；三、審查 ( 一 ) 委員林俊憲等 22 人擬具「停車場法第四條條文修正草\n案」、(二)委員廖先翔等17人擬具「停車場法第三十二條條文修正草案」及(三)台灣民眾黨黨團\n擬具「停車場法第三十八條條文修正草案」案。【本日會議僅針對開會事由二及三進行合併詢\n答】","agenda_id":"1144802_00001"}}}