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00:00:50,379\n主席長我們兩個都是單身但是我們在不同的崗位上為您能服務所以我們一起加油那在這個條例當中的是來自於我們對對等關稅以及匯率波動以及所可能產生的經濟衰退所以我們提出了這個條例所以本席認為\n\n3\n00:00:52,708 --> 00:01:09,936\n好在美國利益優先的情況之下對等關稅現在已經有投資銀行預測我們台灣今年的台灣經濟成長率會下修減少0.4到1.1而上一週的台幣巨幅升值所影響的是不止\n\n4\n00:01:10,416 --> 00:01:32,642\n至於以美國為主要市場的業者可能還一定也會波及所有出口的業者所以台幣巨幅的升值的影響本席認為更勝於美國的對等關稅他衝擊的是以出口為主的工具機即我高雄幾乎是在傳統產業佔百分之八九十的金屬加工產業好再下一頁下一頁下一頁\n\n5\n00:01:41,252 --> 00:01:52,485\n不能動不好意思主席不好意思這個電腦有問題可不可以好OK繼續一直不能動你們這個\n\n6\n00:01:59,022 --> 00:02:26,468\n那再來呢我認為在這個條例當中雖然事件100億而且呢也針對經濟社會國土安全韌性但是簡單的講他應該要有這樣的功能就是協助企業跟國能度過這次不可預知的對等關稅因為這個對等關稅是來自美國小數的菁英的決策所以他的不可預知性的對等關稅的全球經濟的核保我們是要去因應的\n\n7\n00:02:29,629 --> 00:02:52,535\n但是本席也要提醒在相關的資源項目當中我們忽略了一項台灣處於極端氣候與地震週期交互的違憲台灣處於地震帶與颱風入境核心的區域極端氣候頻率及強度是加劇的所以在你們的資料統整起來在人口聚集、交通設施\n\n8\n00:02:53,695 --> 00:03:18,113\n關鍵基礎設施處於潛在高風險包括土石流土壤異化跟易淹水的地方容易形成複合式的災害這個複合式災害所以顯示我國在國土韌性上的政策整合預警機制跟基礎建設的強化是有明顯的落差的而導致國人的生命財產安全暴露在潛在的風險中所以本席認為你們應該評估強化國土韌性建設同步\n\n9\n00:03:21,515 --> 00:03:44,438\n擴大政府的公共建設以為是民間的產業擴大公共建設我認為在這個條例當中沒有看到今天如果沒有我們的前瞻計畫如果沒有我的議後條例就不會造成我現在的企業的年年超增年年超增表示什麼意思\n\n10\n00:03:45,359 --> 00:04:11,704\n就是我企業活絡所以選對的人才能做對的事從蔡總統時代到現在賴清德總統時代都走在對的路上是因為我們對於我們的公共建設大陸的投入而讓我們的經濟成長能夠優於國際的水平這是多麼不容易的一個成就可是今天的特別條例當中我\n\n11\n00:04:13,544 --> 00:04:24,408\n非常的支持但是他大部分都是用在補助即使這1400億行政院版本我們支持企業是930億即使是民眾黨國民黨提高額度但是他還是在補助你比我還清楚他們不會顯示在企業的財報但是他會對企業什麼幫忙穩定他的財務狀況\n\n12\n00:04:35,051 --> 00:04:50,886\n但是他的獲利會不會增加不會的所以還是在這個都是在補助的部分所以我認為在公建的一個導入既然我們都可以有我們說不用到美國大蕭條的擴大公共建設講到國內近期內\n\n13\n00:04:53,248 --> 00:05:17,441\n蔡總統時代到現在的賴總統時代我們所做的擴大攻堅對穩定經濟是多麼重要可是剛才我已經開出名義講了已經經濟會下修因為對等關稅跟我的匯率的波動會造成經濟下修今天我的條例就是要穩住這個經濟的下修所以本席這邊具體建議幾項啦我不知道還有沒有這個可能性但是請主計長跟這個各部會一定要參採\n\n14\n00:05:18,542 --> 00:05:40,495\n既然極端氣候加速極端氣候跟地震週期風險有關的國家基礎建設來擴大政府的資助維持產業的活水所以第二個針對一定年限的老舊建物給予政策優惠促進改建再造跟民宅抗爭50年以上40年以上50年以上60年以上的老宅\n\n15\n00:05:42,297 --> 00:05:53,731\n這個你們都很有數據喔我們是在一個極端氣候跟地震週期這麼頻繁的國家我們在這個特別條例當中的擴大建設既然沒有擴大建設更不用再講說這些的這個相關的這個\n\n16\n00:05:57,895 --> 00:06:20,045\n在這個面對氣候變遷所帶來的公建當中的投入好也考量我們的公建應該要讓各級學校的老舊校舍進行改建讓他具備複合式災害防災時的這個避難你到日本大家都有可能到日本去做做考察也好或做遊玩他們最安全的公共建設在哪裡學校\n\n17\n00:06:21,653 --> 00:06:38,607\n主機場我剛才講的很多數據你一直都在點頭所以你都很清楚國內外的狀況是怎麼樣所以我們老舊想可是在國內什麼最脆弱的工業是在學校好在最後面對這個匯率波動直接影響的服務產業觀光商圈跟餐飲業你們應該給短期因為你們的這個支持企業的產業跟安定你們都針對出口的企業在做補助\n\n18\n00:06:51,357 --> 00:07:05,744\n但是因為我匯率的波動我的這個匯率的貶值我的光框商圈餐飲反而面對疫情後有稍微要回升了我們用了很大的力氣讓現在又因為匯率波動大家都要出國了\n\n19\n00:07:07,145 --> 00:07:36,525\n我們的觀光商圈還有餐飲還好遍野我們的匯率我們的特別條例並沒有給予支持所以在這邊我具體建議所以應該要刺激內需產業的活路不是針對外銷的企業內需產業的活特別是在觀光旅遊商業服務等遭受匯率波動直接衝擊的那我要講今天我們推出這個條例就希望人民有感大部分的就業人口是在哪裡\n\n20\n00:07:37,125 --> 00:07:49,960\n服務業主計長你又在點頭我非常感謝跟你講話我覺得頻率很對第二個提高政府基礎建設的支出更新老舊建設維持各級產業的生機來確保我們勞工的就業\n\n21\n00:07:54,525 --> 00:08:07,514\n因為有工作機會呀面對可能的市場開放榮畜產品這個是針對農業部講的這個部長陳俊晉陳部長應該很清楚我一直在倡議國境先進技術也就是基因定序從你的基因定序要導入你的精準的榮譽牧的產業升級而且我們要有一個國家來統籌這些基因的數據有一個規模數據我的產品同樣在養無國魚我的產品就是比中國好我就是比巴西好\n\n22\n00:08:24,585 --> 00:08:41,559\n比其他國家好這才叫做產業升級所以在這個先進技術基因定序的導入精準農業利用市場的力量來結合政策工具希望能夠縮小國內農民牧業的跟國際的生產成本主席長你怎麼看本席的建議\n\n23\n00:08:43,007 --> 00:09:10,180\n是委員提的各項建議也是我們原想要將來要做的但是坦白說我們115年度要把希望多希望把前瞻鄉邊做的一些各項的建設也能夠拉到總預算來做但是問題就是說115年度因為財化法我們減了3750幾億那這方面會有各種的困難但是這個我們目前也在逐漸的克服\n\n24\n00:09:10,600 --> 00:09:21,246\n那你剛剛談到的一個老舊的一個建物這個部分其實在特別條例就已經有些優先納進去了所以這個部分我們也是認為老舊建物的一個這個必須要做一個加強那再來\n\n25\n00:09:26,008 --> 00:09:41,432\n有關教育學校方面的部分因為學校方面我們是有保障的在那個全三年的一個稅收的一個23%裡面他是有一個保障的一個額度所以這個部分我們會盡量就優先來做是\n\n26\n00:09:41,932 --> 00:10:05,191\n主計長我對於您也有在評估雖然這次沒有納入那也有在相關的這個項目當中有去支持那我本期針對參與委員的版本有一項我非常的支持益助台水股份有限公司這次沒有納入但是我要讓主計長您知道一件事情我們的台水它的主要義務就兩個一個叫沿管一個叫管線貸換管線貸換占八成\n\n27\n00:10:11,316 --> 00:10:31,121\n鹽管佔兩成這兩成來自這個水利署的預算這八成的汰換都是來自哪裡台水的借錢全部都是用借貸好主席長你很清楚你有點頭我覺得跟你講話真的評語很對這個它是用借貸來做它最主要的業務\n\n28\n00:10:32,961 --> 00:10:35,464\n你能想像嗎一個國家的公建一個水管的台灣是讓這個企業是國營企業喔來做用借貸來做台灣他已經累積1100億的負債了然後呢他借貸來之後做兩件事情一個還債一個來再做公建\n\n29\n00:10:52,563 --> 00:10:58,307\n所以然後再來呢他又不准漲水價喔這是所有我們不分藍綠的立委又不可以漲水價有啦現在針對高耗能的1000噸以上的讓他可以漲啦所以電油的漲價的成本政府吸收可是你水的部分的動漲你也沒有支持他\n\n30\n00:11:14,079 --> 00:11:20,643\n所以我不曉得這個企業怎麼活得下去因為他叫做國營企業所以銀行再怎麼樣都要借給他你在民間怎麼可能借給這家公司所以他借貸來做公件借貸來之後又分做兩個一個還錢一個來做公件而且他的公件當中的貸款是佔這個公司的八成\n\n31\n00:11:37,074 --> 00:11:56,084\n然後呢他又不准他漲水價這我本行也反對那不准他漲的這個成本又在哪裡政府都不給他又給台電也給這個中油你就不會想說要給台這個台水所以我非常肯定參與蔡委員他這個針對你們的這個當中資源的項目我不曉得竹記長你怎麼看\n\n32\n00:12:00,686 --> 00:12:25,288\n我們針對台水第一個就是老舊管線的一個汰換這個部分其實我們是有補助的主流在補助對可是太少了你看今年你才補80億耶可是它是已經負債1000億耶你知道汰換的工程都是百億百億百億在支持耶那第二個就是將來也逐漸就是要提高水價的一個方式來做那您是不支持用這樣的\n\n33\n00:12:26,369 --> 00:12:46,901\n這次即使沒有納入你未來願不願意評估用我們的這個年度的結餘或者是我們超徵的這個金額來做這個台水它的債務的不要說債務啦確實也是債務或者是它的一個動漲的成本的一個吸收呢由政府來做你認不認同你要不要去評估呢我們會盡量來優先考慮好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n4343\t5524\t主席 跨部會雖然主管機關是經濟部但是我不認為經濟部能夠做相關的統整\n28769\t50379\t主席長我們兩個都是單身但是我們在不同的崗位上為您能服務所以我們一起加油那在這個條例當中的是來自於我們對對等關稅以及匯率波動以及所可能產生的經濟衰退所以我們提出了這個條例所以本席認為\n52708\t69936\t好在美國利益優先的情況之下對等關稅現在已經有投資銀行預測我們台灣今年的台灣經濟成長率會下修減少0.4到1.1而上一週的台幣巨幅升值所影響的是不止\n70416\t92642\t至於以美國為主要市場的業者可能還一定也會波及所有出口的業者所以台幣巨幅的升值的影響本席認為更勝於美國的對等關稅他衝擊的是以出口為主的工具機即我高雄幾乎是在傳統產業佔百分之八九十的金屬加工產業好再下一頁下一頁下一頁\n101252\t112485\t不能動 不好意思主席不好意思 這個電腦有問題可不可以好 OK繼續一直不能動 你們這個\n119022\t146468\t那再來呢我認為在這個條例當中雖然事件100億而且呢也針對經濟社會國土安全韌性但是簡單的講他應該要有這樣的功能就是協助企業跟國能度過這次不可預知的對等關稅因為這個對等關稅是來自美國小數的菁英的決策所以他的不可預知性的對等關稅的全球經濟的核保我們是要去因應的\n149629\t172535\t但是本席也要提醒在相關的資源項目當中我們忽略了一項台灣處於極端氣候與地震週期交互的違憲台灣處於地震帶與颱風入境核心的區域極端氣候頻率及強度是加劇的所以在你們的資料統整起來在人口聚集、交通設施\n173695\t198113\t關鍵基礎設施處於潛在高風險包括土石流土壤異化跟易淹水的地方容易形成複合式的災害這個複合式災害所以顯示我國在國土韌性上的政策整合預警機制跟基礎建設的強化是有明顯的落差的而導致國人的生命財產安全暴露在潛在的風險中所以本席認為你們應該評估強化國土韌性建設同步\n201515\t224438\t擴大政府的公共建設以為是民間的產業擴大公共建設我認為在這個條例當中沒有看到今天如果沒有我們的前瞻計畫如果沒有我的議後條例就不會造成我現在的企業的年年超增年年超增表示什麼意思\n225359\t251704\t就是我企業活絡所以選對的人才能做對的事從蔡總統時代到現在賴清德總統時代都走在對的路上是因為我們對於我們的公共建設大陸的投入而讓我們的經濟成長能夠優於國際的水平這是多麼不容易的一個成就可是今天的特別條例當中我\n253544\t264408\t非常的支持但是他大部分都是用在補助即使這1400億行政院版本我們支持企業是930億即使是民眾黨國民黨提高額度但是他還是在補助你比我還清楚他們不會顯示在企業的財報但是他會對企業什麼幫忙穩定他的財務狀況\n275051\t290886\t但是他的獲利會不會增加不會的所以還是在這個都是在補助的部分所以我認為在公建的一個導入既然我們都可以有我們說不用到美國大蕭條的擴大公共建設講到國內近期內\n293248\t317441\t蔡總統時代到現在的賴總統時代我們所做的擴大攻堅對穩定經濟是多麼重要可是剛才我已經開出名義講了已經經濟會下修因為對等關稅跟我的匯率的波動會造成經濟下修今天我的條例就是要穩住這個經濟的下修所以本席這邊具體建議幾項啦我不知道還有沒有這個可能性但是請主計長跟這個各部會一定要參採\n318542\t340495\t既然極端氣候加速極端氣候跟地震週期風險有關的國家基礎建設來擴大政府的資助維持產業的活水所以第二個針對一定年限的老舊建物給予政策優惠促進改建再造跟民宅抗爭50年以上40年以上50年以上60年以上的老宅\n342297\t353731\t這個你們都很有數據喔我們是在一個極端氣候跟地震週期這麼頻繁的國家我們在這個特別條例當中的擴大建設既然沒有擴大建設更不用再講說這些的這個相關的這個\n357895\t380045\t在這個面對氣候變遷所帶來的公建當中的投入好也考量我們的公建應該要讓各級學校的老舊校舍進行改建讓他具備複合式災害防災時的這個避難你到日本大家都有可能到日本去做做考察也好或做遊玩他們最安全的公共建設在哪裡學校\n381653\t398607\t主機場我剛才講的很多數據你一直都在點頭所以你都很清楚國內外的狀況是怎麼樣所以我們老舊想 可是在國內什麼最脆弱的工業是在學校好在最後面對這個匯率波動直接影響的服務產業觀光商圈跟餐飲業你們應該給短期因為你們的這個支持企業的產業跟安定你們都針對出口的企業在做補助\n411357\t425744\t但是因為我匯率的波動我的這個匯率的貶值我的光框商圈餐飲反而面對疫情後有稍微要回升了我們用了很大的力氣讓現在又因為匯率波動大家都要出國了\n427145\t456525\t我們的觀光商圈還有餐飲還好遍野我們的匯率我們的特別條例並沒有給予支持所以在這邊我具體建議所以應該要刺激內需產業的活路不是針對外銷的企業內需產業的活特別是在觀光旅遊商業服務等遭受匯率波動直接衝擊的那我要講今天我們推出這個條例就希望人民有感大部分的就業人口是在哪裡\n457125\t469960\t服務業主計長你又在點頭 我非常感謝跟你講話我覺得頻率很對第二個 提高政府基礎建設的支出更新老舊建設維持各級產業的生機來確保我們勞工的就業\n474525\t487514\t因為有工作機會呀面對可能的市場開放 榮畜產品這個是針對農業部講的 這個部長陳俊晉陳部長應該很清楚我一直在倡議國境先進技術也就是基因定序從你的基因定序要導入你的精準的榮譽牧的產業升級而且我們要有一個國家來統籌這些基因的數據有一個規模數據我的產品同樣在養無國魚我的產品就是比中國好 我就是比巴西好\n504585\t521559\t比其他國家好這才叫做產業升級所以在這個先進技術基因定序的導入精準農業利用市場的力量來結合政策工具希望能夠縮小國內農民牧業的跟國際的生產成本主席長你怎麼看本席的建議\n523007\t550180\t是委員提的各項建議也是我們原想要將來要做的但是坦白說我們115年度要把希望多希望把前瞻鄉邊做的一些各項的建設也能夠拉到總預算來做但是問題就是說115年度因為財化法我們減了3750幾億那這方面會有各種的困難但是這個我們目前也在逐漸的克服\n550600\t561246\t那你剛剛談到的一個老舊的一個建物這個部分其實在特別條例就已經有些優先納進去了所以這個部分我們也是認為老舊建物的一個這個必須要做一個加強那再來\n566008\t581432\t有關教育學校方面的部分因為學校方面我們是有保障的在那個全三年的一個稅收的一個23%裡面他是有一個保障的一個額度所以這個部分我們會盡量就優先來做是\n581932\t605191\t主計長我對於您也有在評估雖然這次沒有納入那也有在相關的這個項目當中有去支持那我本期針對參與委員的版本有一項我非常的支持益助台水股份有限公司這次沒有納入但是我要讓主計長您知道一件事情我們的台水它的主要義務就兩個一個叫沿管一個叫管線貸換管線貸換占八成\n611316\t631121\t鹽管佔兩成 這兩成來自這個水利署的預算這八成的汰換都是來自哪裡 台水的借錢全部都是用借貸好 主席長你很清楚 你有點頭 我覺得跟你講話真的評語很對這個 它是用借貸來做它最主要的業務\n632961\t635464\t你能想像嗎一個國家的公建一個水管的台灣是讓這個企業是國營企業喔來做用借貸來做台灣他已經累積1100億的負債了然後呢他借貸來之後做兩件事情一個還債一個來再做公建\n652563\t658307\t所以然後再來呢他又不准漲水價喔這是所有我們不分藍綠的立委又不可以漲水價有啦現在針對高耗能的1000噸以上的讓他可以漲啦所以電油的漲價的成本政府吸收可是你水的部分的動漲你也沒有支持他\n674079\t680643\t所以我不曉得這個企業怎麼活得下去 因為他叫做國營企業所以銀行再怎麼樣都要借給他 你在民間怎麼可能借給這家公司所以他借貸來做公件 借貸來之後又分做兩個 一個還錢 一個來做公件而且他的公件當中的貸款是佔這個公司的八成\n697074\t716084\t然後呢 他又不准他漲水價 這我本行也反對那不准他漲的 這個成本又在哪裡政府都不給他 又給台電 也給這個中油你就不會想說要給台 這個台水所以我非常肯定參與蔡委員 他這個針對你們的這個當中資源的項目我不曉得竹記長你怎麼看\n720686\t745288\t我們針對台水 第一個就是老舊管線的一個汰換這個部分其實我們是有補助的 主流在補助對 可是太少了 你看今年你才補80億耶可是它是已經負債1000億耶你知道汰換的工程都是百億百億百億在支持耶那第二個就是將來也逐漸就是要提高水價的一個方式來做那您是不支持用這樣的\n746369\t766901\t這次即使沒有納入 你未來願不願意評估用我們的這個年度的結餘 或者是我們超徵的這個金額來做這個台水它的債務的不要說債務啦 確實也是債務或者是它的一個動漲的成本的一個吸收呢由政府來做 你認不認同 你要不要去評估呢我們會盡量來優先考慮好 謝謝\n","txt":"主席 跨部會雖然主管機關是經濟部但是我不認為經濟部能夠做相關的統整\n主席長我們兩個都是單身但是我們在不同的崗位上為您能服務所以我們一起加油那在這個條例當中的是來自於我們對對等關稅以及匯率波動以及所可能產生的經濟衰退所以我們提出了這個條例所以本席認為\n好在美國利益優先的情況之下對等關稅現在已經有投資銀行預測我們台灣今年的台灣經濟成長率會下修減少0.4到1.1而上一週的台幣巨幅升值所影響的是不止\n至於以美國為主要市場的業者可能還一定也會波及所有出口的業者所以台幣巨幅的升值的影響本席認為更勝於美國的對等關稅他衝擊的是以出口為主的工具機即我高雄幾乎是在傳統產業佔百分之八九十的金屬加工產業好再下一頁下一頁下一頁\n不能動 不好意思主席不好意思 這個電腦有問題可不可以好 OK繼續一直不能動 你們這個\n那再來呢我認為在這個條例當中雖然事件100億而且呢也針對經濟社會國土安全韌性但是簡單的講他應該要有這樣的功能就是協助企業跟國能度過這次不可預知的對等關稅因為這個對等關稅是來自美國小數的菁英的決策所以他的不可預知性的對等關稅的全球經濟的核保我們是要去因應的\n但是本席也要提醒在相關的資源項目當中我們忽略了一項台灣處於極端氣候與地震週期交互的違憲台灣處於地震帶與颱風入境核心的區域極端氣候頻率及強度是加劇的所以在你們的資料統整起來在人口聚集、交通設施\n關鍵基礎設施處於潛在高風險包括土石流土壤異化跟易淹水的地方容易形成複合式的災害這個複合式災害所以顯示我國在國土韌性上的政策整合預警機制跟基礎建設的強化是有明顯的落差的而導致國人的生命財產安全暴露在潛在的風險中所以本席認為你們應該評估強化國土韌性建設同步\n擴大政府的公共建設以為是民間的產業擴大公共建設我認為在這個條例當中沒有看到今天如果沒有我們的前瞻計畫如果沒有我的議後條例就不會造成我現在的企業的年年超增年年超增表示什麼意思\n就是我企業活絡所以選對的人才能做對的事從蔡總統時代到現在賴清德總統時代都走在對的路上是因為我們對於我們的公共建設大陸的投入而讓我們的經濟成長能夠優於國際的水平這是多麼不容易的一個成就可是今天的特別條例當中我\n非常的支持但是他大部分都是用在補助即使這1400億行政院版本我們支持企業是930億即使是民眾黨國民黨提高額度但是他還是在補助你比我還清楚他們不會顯示在企業的財報但是他會對企業什麼幫忙穩定他的財務狀況\n但是他的獲利會不會增加不會的所以還是在這個都是在補助的部分所以我認為在公建的一個導入既然我們都可以有我們說不用到美國大蕭條的擴大公共建設講到國內近期內\n蔡總統時代到現在的賴總統時代我們所做的擴大攻堅對穩定經濟是多麼重要可是剛才我已經開出名義講了已經經濟會下修因為對等關稅跟我的匯率的波動會造成經濟下修今天我的條例就是要穩住這個經濟的下修所以本席這邊具體建議幾項啦我不知道還有沒有這個可能性但是請主計長跟這個各部會一定要參採\n既然極端氣候加速極端氣候跟地震週期風險有關的國家基礎建設來擴大政府的資助維持產業的活水所以第二個針對一定年限的老舊建物給予政策優惠促進改建再造跟民宅抗爭50年以上40年以上50年以上60年以上的老宅\n這個你們都很有數據喔我們是在一個極端氣候跟地震週期這麼頻繁的國家我們在這個特別條例當中的擴大建設既然沒有擴大建設更不用再講說這些的這個相關的這個\n在這個面對氣候變遷所帶來的公建當中的投入好也考量我們的公建應該要讓各級學校的老舊校舍進行改建讓他具備複合式災害防災時的這個避難你到日本大家都有可能到日本去做做考察也好或做遊玩他們最安全的公共建設在哪裡學校\n主機場我剛才講的很多數據你一直都在點頭所以你都很清楚國內外的狀況是怎麼樣所以我們老舊想 可是在國內什麼最脆弱的工業是在學校好在最後面對這個匯率波動直接影響的服務產業觀光商圈跟餐飲業你們應該給短期因為你們的這個支持企業的產業跟安定你們都針對出口的企業在做補助\n但是因為我匯率的波動我的這個匯率的貶值我的光框商圈餐飲反而面對疫情後有稍微要回升了我們用了很大的力氣讓現在又因為匯率波動大家都要出國了\n我們的觀光商圈還有餐飲還好遍野我們的匯率我們的特別條例並沒有給予支持所以在這邊我具體建議所以應該要刺激內需產業的活路不是針對外銷的企業內需產業的活特別是在觀光旅遊商業服務等遭受匯率波動直接衝擊的那我要講今天我們推出這個條例就希望人民有感大部分的就業人口是在哪裡\n服務業主計長你又在點頭 我非常感謝跟你講話我覺得頻率很對第二個 提高政府基礎建設的支出更新老舊建設維持各級產業的生機來確保我們勞工的就業\n因為有工作機會呀面對可能的市場開放 榮畜產品這個是針對農業部講的 這個部長陳俊晉陳部長應該很清楚我一直在倡議國境先進技術也就是基因定序從你的基因定序要導入你的精準的榮譽牧的產業升級而且我們要有一個國家來統籌這些基因的數據有一個規模數據我的產品同樣在養無國魚我的產品就是比中國好 我就是比巴西好\n比其他國家好這才叫做產業升級所以在這個先進技術基因定序的導入精準農業利用市場的力量來結合政策工具希望能夠縮小國內農民牧業的跟國際的生產成本主席長你怎麼看本席的建議\n是委員提的各項建議也是我們原想要將來要做的但是坦白說我們115年度要把希望多希望把前瞻鄉邊做的一些各項的建設也能夠拉到總預算來做但是問題就是說115年度因為財化法我們減了3750幾億那這方面會有各種的困難但是這個我們目前也在逐漸的克服\n那你剛剛談到的一個老舊的一個建物這個部分其實在特別條例就已經有些優先納進去了所以這個部分我們也是認為老舊建物的一個這個必須要做一個加強那再來\n有關教育學校方面的部分因為學校方面我們是有保障的在那個全三年的一個稅收的一個23%裡面他是有一個保障的一個額度所以這個部分我們會盡量就優先來做是\n主計長我對於您也有在評估雖然這次沒有納入那也有在相關的這個項目當中有去支持那我本期針對參與委員的版本有一項我非常的支持益助台水股份有限公司這次沒有納入但是我要讓主計長您知道一件事情我們的台水它的主要義務就兩個一個叫沿管一個叫管線貸換管線貸換占八成\n鹽管佔兩成 這兩成來自這個水利署的預算這八成的汰換都是來自哪裡 台水的借錢全部都是用借貸好 主席長你很清楚 你有點頭 我覺得跟你講話真的評語很對這個 它是用借貸來做它最主要的業務\n你能想像嗎一個國家的公建一個水管的台灣是讓這個企業是國營企業喔來做用借貸來做台灣他已經累積1100億的負債了然後呢他借貸來之後做兩件事情一個還債一個來再做公建\n所以然後再來呢他又不准漲水價喔這是所有我們不分藍綠的立委又不可以漲水價有啦現在針對高耗能的1000噸以上的讓他可以漲啦所以電油的漲價的成本政府吸收可是你水的部分的動漲你也沒有支持他\n所以我不曉得這個企業怎麼活得下去 因為他叫做國營企業所以銀行再怎麼樣都要借給他 你在民間怎麼可能借給這家公司所以他借貸來做公件 借貸來之後又分做兩個 一個還錢 一個來做公件而且他的公件當中的貸款是佔這個公司的八成\n然後呢 他又不准他漲水價 這我本行也反對那不准他漲的 這個成本又在哪裡政府都不給他 又給台電 也給這個中油你就不會想說要給台 這個台水所以我非常肯定參與蔡委員 他這個針對你們的這個當中資源的項目我不曉得竹記長你怎麼看\n我們針對台水 第一個就是老舊管線的一個汰換這個部分其實我們是有補助的 主流在補助對 可是太少了 你看今年你才補80億耶可是它是已經負債1000億耶你知道汰換的工程都是百億百億百億在支持耶那第二個就是將來也逐漸就是要提高水價的一個方式來做那您是不支持用這樣的\n這次即使沒有納入 你未來願不願意評估用我們的這個年度的結餘 或者是我們超徵的這個金額來做這個台水它的債務的不要說債務啦 確實也是債務或者是它的一個動漲的成本的一個吸收呢由政府來做 你認不認同 你要不要去評估呢我們會盡量來優先考慮好 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:04.343 --> 00:05.524\n主席跨部會雖然主管機關是經濟部但是我不認為經濟部能夠做相關的統整\n\n00:28.769 --> 00:50.379\n主席長我們兩個都是單身但是我們在不同的崗位上為您能服務所以我們一起加油那在這個條例當中的是來自於我們對對等關稅以及匯率波動以及所可能產生的經濟衰退所以我們提出了這個條例所以本席認為\n\n00:52.708 --> 01:09.936\n好在美國利益優先的情況之下對等關稅現在已經有投資銀行預測我們台灣今年的台灣經濟成長率會下修減少0.4到1.1而上一週的台幣巨幅升值所影響的是不止\n\n01:10.416 --> 01:32.642\n至於以美國為主要市場的業者可能還一定也會波及所有出口的業者所以台幣巨幅的升值的影響本席認為更勝於美國的對等關稅他衝擊的是以出口為主的工具機即我高雄幾乎是在傳統產業佔百分之八九十的金屬加工產業好再下一頁下一頁下一頁\n\n01:41.252 --> 01:52.485\n不能動不好意思主席不好意思這個電腦有問題可不可以好OK繼續一直不能動你們這個\n\n01:59.022 --> 02:26.468\n那再來呢我認為在這個條例當中雖然事件100億而且呢也針對經濟社會國土安全韌性但是簡單的講他應該要有這樣的功能就是協助企業跟國能度過這次不可預知的對等關稅因為這個對等關稅是來自美國小數的菁英的決策所以他的不可預知性的對等關稅的全球經濟的核保我們是要去因應的\n\n02:29.629 --> 02:52.535\n但是本席也要提醒在相關的資源項目當中我們忽略了一項台灣處於極端氣候與地震週期交互的違憲台灣處於地震帶與颱風入境核心的區域極端氣候頻率及強度是加劇的所以在你們的資料統整起來在人口聚集、交通設施\n\n02:53.695 --> 03:18.113\n關鍵基礎設施處於潛在高風險包括土石流土壤異化跟易淹水的地方容易形成複合式的災害這個複合式災害所以顯示我國在國土韌性上的政策整合預警機制跟基礎建設的強化是有明顯的落差的而導致國人的生命財產安全暴露在潛在的風險中所以本席認為你們應該評估強化國土韌性建設同步\n\n03:21.515 --> 03:44.438\n擴大政府的公共建設以為是民間的產業擴大公共建設我認為在這個條例當中沒有看到今天如果沒有我們的前瞻計畫如果沒有我的議後條例就不會造成我現在的企業的年年超增年年超增表示什麼意思\n\n03:45.359 --> 04:11.704\n就是我企業活絡所以選對的人才能做對的事從蔡總統時代到現在賴清德總統時代都走在對的路上是因為我們對於我們的公共建設大陸的投入而讓我們的經濟成長能夠優於國際的水平這是多麼不容易的一個成就可是今天的特別條例當中我\n\n04:13.544 --> 04:24.408\n非常的支持但是他大部分都是用在補助即使這1400億行政院版本我們支持企業是930億即使是民眾黨國民黨提高額度但是他還是在補助你比我還清楚他們不會顯示在企業的財報但是他會對企業什麼幫忙穩定他的財務狀況\n\n04:35.051 --> 04:50.886\n但是他的獲利會不會增加不會的所以還是在這個都是在補助的部分所以我認為在公建的一個導入既然我們都可以有我們說不用到美國大蕭條的擴大公共建設講到國內近期內\n\n04:53.248 --> 05:17.441\n蔡總統時代到現在的賴總統時代我們所做的擴大攻堅對穩定經濟是多麼重要可是剛才我已經開出名義講了已經經濟會下修因為對等關稅跟我的匯率的波動會造成經濟下修今天我的條例就是要穩住這個經濟的下修所以本席這邊具體建議幾項啦我不知道還有沒有這個可能性但是請主計長跟這個各部會一定要參採\n\n05:18.542 --> 05:40.495\n既然極端氣候加速極端氣候跟地震週期風險有關的國家基礎建設來擴大政府的資助維持產業的活水所以第二個針對一定年限的老舊建物給予政策優惠促進改建再造跟民宅抗爭50年以上40年以上50年以上60年以上的老宅\n\n05:42.297 --> 05:53.731\n這個你們都很有數據喔我們是在一個極端氣候跟地震週期這麼頻繁的國家我們在這個特別條例當中的擴大建設既然沒有擴大建設更不用再講說這些的這個相關的這個\n\n05:57.895 --> 06:20.045\n在這個面對氣候變遷所帶來的公建當中的投入好也考量我們的公建應該要讓各級學校的老舊校舍進行改建讓他具備複合式災害防災時的這個避難你到日本大家都有可能到日本去做做考察也好或做遊玩他們最安全的公共建設在哪裡學校\n\n06:21.653 --> 06:38.607\n主機場我剛才講的很多數據你一直都在點頭所以你都很清楚國內外的狀況是怎麼樣所以我們老舊想可是在國內什麼最脆弱的工業是在學校好在最後面對這個匯率波動直接影響的服務產業觀光商圈跟餐飲業你們應該給短期因為你們的這個支持企業的產業跟安定你們都針對出口的企業在做補助\n\n06:51.357 --> 07:05.744\n但是因為我匯率的波動我的這個匯率的貶值我的光框商圈餐飲反而面對疫情後有稍微要回升了我們用了很大的力氣讓現在又因為匯率波動大家都要出國了\n\n07:07.145 --> 07:36.525\n我們的觀光商圈還有餐飲還好遍野我們的匯率我們的特別條例並沒有給予支持所以在這邊我具體建議所以應該要刺激內需產業的活路不是針對外銷的企業內需產業的活特別是在觀光旅遊商業服務等遭受匯率波動直接衝擊的那我要講今天我們推出這個條例就希望人民有感大部分的就業人口是在哪裡\n\n07:37.125 --> 07:49.960\n服務業主計長你又在點頭我非常感謝跟你講話我覺得頻率很對第二個提高政府基礎建設的支出更新老舊建設維持各級產業的生機來確保我們勞工的就業\n\n07:54.525 --> 08:07.514\n因為有工作機會呀面對可能的市場開放榮畜產品這個是針對農業部講的這個部長陳俊晉陳部長應該很清楚我一直在倡議國境先進技術也就是基因定序從你的基因定序要導入你的精準的榮譽牧的產業升級而且我們要有一個國家來統籌這些基因的數據有一個規模數據我的產品同樣在養無國魚我的產品就是比中國好我就是比巴西好\n\n08:24.585 --> 08:41.559\n比其他國家好這才叫做產業升級所以在這個先進技術基因定序的導入精準農業利用市場的力量來結合政策工具希望能夠縮小國內農民牧業的跟國際的生產成本主席長你怎麼看本席的建議\n\n08:43.007 --> 09:10.180\n是委員提的各項建議也是我們原想要將來要做的但是坦白說我們115年度要把希望多希望把前瞻鄉邊做的一些各項的建設也能夠拉到總預算來做但是問題就是說115年度因為財化法我們減了3750幾億那這方面會有各種的困難但是這個我們目前也在逐漸的克服\n\n09:10.600 --> 09:21.246\n那你剛剛談到的一個老舊的一個建物這個部分其實在特別條例就已經有些優先納進去了所以這個部分我們也是認為老舊建物的一個這個必須要做一個加強那再來\n\n09:26.008 --> 09:41.432\n有關教育學校方面的部分因為學校方面我們是有保障的在那個全三年的一個稅收的一個23%裡面他是有一個保障的一個額度所以這個部分我們會盡量就優先來做是\n\n09:41.932 --> 10:05.191\n主計長我對於您也有在評估雖然這次沒有納入那也有在相關的這個項目當中有去支持那我本期針對參與委員的版本有一項我非常的支持益助台水股份有限公司這次沒有納入但是我要讓主計長您知道一件事情我們的台水它的主要義務就兩個一個叫沿管一個叫管線貸換管線貸換占八成\n\n10:11.316 --> 10:31.121\n鹽管佔兩成這兩成來自這個水利署的預算這八成的汰換都是來自哪裡台水的借錢全部都是用借貸好主席長你很清楚你有點頭我覺得跟你講話真的評語很對這個它是用借貸來做它最主要的業務\n\n10:32.961 --> 10:35.464\n你能想像嗎一個國家的公建一個水管的台灣是讓這個企業是國營企業喔來做用借貸來做台灣他已經累積1100億的負債了然後呢他借貸來之後做兩件事情一個還債一個來再做公建\n\n10:52.563 --> 10:58.307\n所以然後再來呢他又不准漲水價喔這是所有我們不分藍綠的立委又不可以漲水價有啦現在針對高耗能的1000噸以上的讓他可以漲啦所以電油的漲價的成本政府吸收可是你水的部分的動漲你也沒有支持他\n\n11:14.079 --> 11:20.643\n所以我不曉得這個企業怎麼活得下去因為他叫做國營企業所以銀行再怎麼樣都要借給他你在民間怎麼可能借給這家公司所以他借貸來做公件借貸來之後又分做兩個一個還錢一個來做公件而且他的公件當中的貸款是佔這個公司的八成\n\n11:37.074 --> 11:56.084\n然後呢他又不准他漲水價這我本行也反對那不准他漲的這個成本又在哪裡政府都不給他又給台電也給這個中油你就不會想說要給台這個台水所以我非常肯定參與蔡委員他這個針對你們的這個當中資源的項目我不曉得竹記長你怎麼看\n\n12:00.686 --> 12:25.288\n我們針對台水第一個就是老舊管線的一個汰換這個部分其實我們是有補助的主流在補助對可是太少了你看今年你才補80億耶可是它是已經負債1000億耶你知道汰換的工程都是百億百億百億在支持耶那第二個就是將來也逐漸就是要提高水價的一個方式來做那您是不支持用這樣的\n\n12:26.369 --> 12:46.901\n這次即使沒有納入你未來願不願意評估用我們的這個年度的結餘或者是我們超徵的這個金額來做這個台水它的債務的不要說債務啦確實也是債務或者是它的一個動漲的成本的一個吸收呢由政府來做你認不認同你要不要去評估呢我們會盡量來優先考慮好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":4.343,"end":5.524,"text":"主席 跨部會雖然主管機關是經濟部但是我不認為經濟部能夠做相關的統整"},{"start":28.769,"end":50.379,"text":"主席長我們兩個都是單身但是我們在不同的崗位上為您能服務所以我們一起加油那在這個條例當中的是來自於我們對對等關稅以及匯率波動以及所可能產生的經濟衰退所以我們提出了這個條例所以本席認為"},{"start":52.708,"end":69.936,"text":"好在美國利益優先的情況之下對等關稅現在已經有投資銀行預測我們台灣今年的台灣經濟成長率會下修減少0.4到1.1而上一週的台幣巨幅升值所影響的是不止"},{"start":70.416,"end":92.642,"text":"至於以美國為主要市場的業者可能還一定也會波及所有出口的業者所以台幣巨幅的升值的影響本席認為更勝於美國的對等關稅他衝擊的是以出口為主的工具機即我高雄幾乎是在傳統產業佔百分之八九十的金屬加工產業好再下一頁下一頁下一頁"},{"start":101.252,"end":112.485,"text":"不能動 不好意思主席不好意思 這個電腦有問題可不可以好 OK繼續一直不能動 你們這個"},{"start":119.022,"end":146.468,"text":"那再來呢我認為在這個條例當中雖然事件100億而且呢也針對經濟社會國土安全韌性但是簡單的講他應該要有這樣的功能就是協助企業跟國能度過這次不可預知的對等關稅因為這個對等關稅是來自美國小數的菁英的決策所以他的不可預知性的對等關稅的全球經濟的核保我們是要去因應的"},{"start":149.629,"end":172.535,"text":"但是本席也要提醒在相關的資源項目當中我們忽略了一項台灣處於極端氣候與地震週期交互的違憲台灣處於地震帶與颱風入境核心的區域極端氣候頻率及強度是加劇的所以在你們的資料統整起來在人口聚集、交通設施"},{"start":173.695,"end":198.113,"text":"關鍵基礎設施處於潛在高風險包括土石流土壤異化跟易淹水的地方容易形成複合式的災害這個複合式災害所以顯示我國在國土韌性上的政策整合預警機制跟基礎建設的強化是有明顯的落差的而導致國人的生命財產安全暴露在潛在的風險中所以本席認為你們應該評估強化國土韌性建設同步"},{"start":201.515,"end":224.438,"text":"擴大政府的公共建設以為是民間的產業擴大公共建設我認為在這個條例當中沒有看到今天如果沒有我們的前瞻計畫如果沒有我的議後條例就不會造成我現在的企業的年年超增年年超增表示什麼意思"},{"start":225.359,"end":251.704,"text":"就是我企業活絡所以選對的人才能做對的事從蔡總統時代到現在賴清德總統時代都走在對的路上是因為我們對於我們的公共建設大陸的投入而讓我們的經濟成長能夠優於國際的水平這是多麼不容易的一個成就可是今天的特別條例當中我"},{"start":253.544,"end":264.408,"text":"非常的支持但是他大部分都是用在補助即使這1400億行政院版本我們支持企業是930億即使是民眾黨國民黨提高額度但是他還是在補助你比我還清楚他們不會顯示在企業的財報但是他會對企業什麼幫忙穩定他的財務狀況"},{"start":275.051,"end":290.886,"text":"但是他的獲利會不會增加不會的所以還是在這個都是在補助的部分所以我認為在公建的一個導入既然我們都可以有我們說不用到美國大蕭條的擴大公共建設講到國內近期內"},{"start":293.248,"end":317.441,"text":"蔡總統時代到現在的賴總統時代我們所做的擴大攻堅對穩定經濟是多麼重要可是剛才我已經開出名義講了已經經濟會下修因為對等關稅跟我的匯率的波動會造成經濟下修今天我的條例就是要穩住這個經濟的下修所以本席這邊具體建議幾項啦我不知道還有沒有這個可能性但是請主計長跟這個各部會一定要參採"},{"start":318.542,"end":340.495,"text":"既然極端氣候加速極端氣候跟地震週期風險有關的國家基礎建設來擴大政府的資助維持產業的活水所以第二個針對一定年限的老舊建物給予政策優惠促進改建再造跟民宅抗爭50年以上40年以上50年以上60年以上的老宅"},{"start":342.297,"end":353.731,"text":"這個你們都很有數據喔我們是在一個極端氣候跟地震週期這麼頻繁的國家我們在這個特別條例當中的擴大建設既然沒有擴大建設更不用再講說這些的這個相關的這個"},{"start":357.895,"end":380.045,"text":"在這個面對氣候變遷所帶來的公建當中的投入好也考量我們的公建應該要讓各級學校的老舊校舍進行改建讓他具備複合式災害防災時的這個避難你到日本大家都有可能到日本去做做考察也好或做遊玩他們最安全的公共建設在哪裡學校"},{"start":381.653,"end":398.607,"text":"主機場我剛才講的很多數據你一直都在點頭所以你都很清楚國內外的狀況是怎麼樣所以我們老舊想 可是在國內什麼最脆弱的工業是在學校好在最後面對這個匯率波動直接影響的服務產業觀光商圈跟餐飲業你們應該給短期因為你們的這個支持企業的產業跟安定你們都針對出口的企業在做補助"},{"start":411.357,"end":425.744,"text":"但是因為我匯率的波動我的這個匯率的貶值我的光框商圈餐飲反而面對疫情後有稍微要回升了我們用了很大的力氣讓現在又因為匯率波動大家都要出國了"},{"start":427.145,"end":456.525,"text":"我們的觀光商圈還有餐飲還好遍野我們的匯率我們的特別條例並沒有給予支持所以在這邊我具體建議所以應該要刺激內需產業的活路不是針對外銷的企業內需產業的活特別是在觀光旅遊商業服務等遭受匯率波動直接衝擊的那我要講今天我們推出這個條例就希望人民有感大部分的就業人口是在哪裡"},{"start":457.125,"end":469.96,"text":"服務業主計長你又在點頭 我非常感謝跟你講話我覺得頻率很對第二個 提高政府基礎建設的支出更新老舊建設維持各級產業的生機來確保我們勞工的就業"},{"start":474.525,"end":487.514,"text":"因為有工作機會呀面對可能的市場開放 榮畜產品這個是針對農業部講的 這個部長陳俊晉陳部長應該很清楚我一直在倡議國境先進技術也就是基因定序從你的基因定序要導入你的精準的榮譽牧的產業升級而且我們要有一個國家來統籌這些基因的數據有一個規模數據我的產品同樣在養無國魚我的產品就是比中國好 我就是比巴西好"},{"start":504.585,"end":521.559,"text":"比其他國家好這才叫做產業升級所以在這個先進技術基因定序的導入精準農業利用市場的力量來結合政策工具希望能夠縮小國內農民牧業的跟國際的生產成本主席長你怎麼看本席的建議"},{"start":523.007,"end":550.18,"text":"是委員提的各項建議也是我們原想要將來要做的但是坦白說我們115年度要把希望多希望把前瞻鄉邊做的一些各項的建設也能夠拉到總預算來做但是問題就是說115年度因為財化法我們減了3750幾億那這方面會有各種的困難但是這個我們目前也在逐漸的克服"},{"start":550.6,"end":561.246,"text":"那你剛剛談到的一個老舊的一個建物這個部分其實在特別條例就已經有些優先納進去了所以這個部分我們也是認為老舊建物的一個這個必須要做一個加強那再來"},{"start":566.008,"end":581.432,"text":"有關教育學校方面的部分因為學校方面我們是有保障的在那個全三年的一個稅收的一個23%裡面他是有一個保障的一個額度所以這個部分我們會盡量就優先來做是"},{"start":581.932,"end":605.191,"text":"主計長我對於您也有在評估雖然這次沒有納入那也有在相關的這個項目當中有去支持那我本期針對參與委員的版本有一項我非常的支持益助台水股份有限公司這次沒有納入但是我要讓主計長您知道一件事情我們的台水它的主要義務就兩個一個叫沿管一個叫管線貸換管線貸換占八成"},{"start":611.316,"end":631.121,"text":"鹽管佔兩成 這兩成來自這個水利署的預算這八成的汰換都是來自哪裡 台水的借錢全部都是用借貸好 主席長你很清楚 你有點頭 我覺得跟你講話真的評語很對這個 它是用借貸來做它最主要的業務"},{"start":632.961,"end":635.464,"text":"你能想像嗎一個國家的公建一個水管的台灣是讓這個企業是國營企業喔來做用借貸來做台灣他已經累積1100億的負債了然後呢他借貸來之後做兩件事情一個還債一個來再做公建"},{"start":652.563,"end":658.307,"text":"所以然後再來呢他又不准漲水價喔這是所有我們不分藍綠的立委又不可以漲水價有啦現在針對高耗能的1000噸以上的讓他可以漲啦所以電油的漲價的成本政府吸收可是你水的部分的動漲你也沒有支持他"},{"start":674.079,"end":680.643,"text":"所以我不曉得這個企業怎麼活得下去 因為他叫做國營企業所以銀行再怎麼樣都要借給他 你在民間怎麼可能借給這家公司所以他借貸來做公件 借貸來之後又分做兩個 一個還錢 一個來做公件而且他的公件當中的貸款是佔這個公司的八成"},{"start":697.074,"end":716.084,"text":"然後呢 他又不准他漲水價 這我本行也反對那不准他漲的 這個成本又在哪裡政府都不給他 又給台電 也給這個中油你就不會想說要給台 這個台水所以我非常肯定參與蔡委員 他這個針對你們的這個當中資源的項目我不曉得竹記長你怎麼看"},{"start":720.686,"end":745.288,"text":"我們針對台水 第一個就是老舊管線的一個汰換這個部分其實我們是有補助的 主流在補助對 可是太少了 你看今年你才補80億耶可是它是已經負債1000億耶你知道汰換的工程都是百億百億百億在支持耶那第二個就是將來也逐漸就是要提高水價的一個方式來做那您是不支持用這樣的"},{"start":746.369,"end":766.901,"text":"這次即使沒有納入 你未來願不願意評估用我們的這個年度的結餘 或者是我們超徵的這個金額來做這個台水它的債務的不要說債務啦 確實也是債務或者是它的一個動漲的成本的一個吸收呢由政府來做 你認不認同 你要不要去評估呢我們會盡量來優先考慮好 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":484,"blocks":[["林委員岱樺：（9時47分）有請主計長。"],["主席：主計長。"],["林委員岱樺：因為是跨部會，雖然主管機關是經濟部，但是我不認為經濟部能夠做相關的統整。主計長，我們兩個都是單身，但是我們在不同的崗位上為人民服務，所以我們一起加油。","這個條例是來自於我們對對等關稅以及匯率波動以及所可能產生的經濟衰退，所以我們提出了這個條例，在美國利益優先的情況之下，現在已經有投資銀行預測，我們臺灣今年的經濟成長率會下修，減少0.4到1.1個百分點，而上一週臺幣的巨幅升值，所影響的不僅止於以美國為主要市場的業者，一定也會波及所有出口的業者，所以臺幣巨幅升值的影響，本席認為更甚於美國的對等關稅，它衝擊的是以出口為主的工具機，即我高雄在傳統產業中幾乎占80、90%的金屬加工產業。在這個條例當中，雖然有4,100億，而且也針對經濟、社會、國土安全韌性，但是簡單的講，它應該要有這樣的功能，就是協助企業跟國人度過這次不可預知的對等關稅，因為這個對等關稅是來自於美國少數菁英的決策，因為它有不可預知性，由對等關稅引發全球經濟核爆，我們要去因應。","但是本席也要提醒，在相關的資源項目當中，我們忽略了一項，臺灣處於極端氣候與地震週期交互下的風險，臺灣處於地震帶與颱風路徑的核心區域，極端氣候頻率及強度加劇，所以你們的資料統整起來，在人口聚集、交通設施、關鍵基礎設施處於潛在高風險區，包括土石流、土壤液化跟易淹水的地方，容易形成複合式的災害。所以顯示我國在國土韌性上的政策整合、預警機制跟基礎建設的強化，有明顯的落差，導致國人的生命、財產安全暴露在潛在的風險中。所以本席認為你們應該評估強化國土韌性建設，同步擴大政府的公共建設，以維護民間的產業。","我認為在這個條例當中，沒有看到擴大公共建設這方面，今天如果沒有前瞻計畫，如果沒有疫後條例，就不會造成現在稅收的年年超徵，年年超徵表示什麼意思？就是企業活絡，所以選對的人才能做對的事，從蔡總統時代到現在賴清德總統時代，都走在對的路上，是因為我們對於我們的公共建設大量的投入，而讓我們的經濟成長能夠優於國際的水平，這是多麼不容易的一個成就。","今天的特別條例我非常的支持，但是它大部分都是用在補助，在這4,100億的行政院版本中，支持企業的部分是930億，即使民眾黨、國民黨提高額度，但是它還是在補助，你比我還清楚，他們不會顯示在企業的財報，但是它對企業有什麼幫忙？穩定它的財務狀況，但是它的獲利會不會增加？不會的，因為都是在補助的部分，所以我認為在公建的導入，不用到美國大蕭條的擴大公共建設，講到國內、近期內，蔡總統時代到現在的賴總統時代，我們所做的擴大公建對穩定經濟是多麼重要，可是剛才我已經開宗明義講了，經濟會下修，因為對等關稅跟匯率波動會造成經濟下修，今天這個條例就是要穩住經濟的下修。","所以本席這邊具體建議幾項，我不知道還有沒有這個可能性，但是請主計長跟各部會一定要參採。第一個，加速跟極端氣候、地震週期風險有關的國家基礎建設，擴大政府的支出、維持產業的活水。第二個，針對一定年限的老舊建物給予政策優惠，促進改建再造跟民宅抗震，40年以上、50年以上、60年以上的老宅，這個你們都很有數據，我們是在一個極端氣候跟地震週期這麼頻繁的國家，在這個特別條例當中竟然沒有擴大建設，更不用講面對氣候變遷所帶來的公建投入。考量到我們的公建，應該要讓各級學校的老舊校舍進行改建，讓它具備複合式災害發生時有災防避難之功能，大家都有可能到日本去考察或是遊玩，他們最安全的公共建設在哪裡？學校！主計長，我剛才講了很多數據，你一直都在點頭，所以你很清楚國內外的狀況是怎麼樣，可是在國內的情形是什麼？最脆弱的公建是在學校。","最後，面對匯率波動，直接影響服務產業，即觀光、商圈跟餐飲業，你們應該給短期……因為你們所做的支持產業跟安定，都是針對出口的企業在做補助，但是因為匯率波動、貶值，觀光、商圈、餐飲在面對疫情後有要稍微回升了，我們用了很大的力氣，但現在又因為匯率波動，大家都要出國，我們的觀光商圈還有餐飲哀鴻遍野，但我們的特別條例並沒有給予支持。","所以在這邊我具體建議，第一，應該要刺激內需產業的活絡，不是針對外銷的企業，是內需產業，特別是在觀光旅遊、商業服務等直接遭受匯率波動衝擊的產業。我要講，今天我們推出這個條例就是希望人民有感，大部分的就業人口是在哪裡？服務業。好，主計長你又再點頭，我非常感謝，跟你講話我覺得頻率很對。","第二，提高政府基礎建設的支出，更新老舊建設，維持各級產業的生機，確保勞工的就業。因為有工作機會呀！面對可能的市場開放，尤其是農、畜產品，這個是針對農業部講的，陳駿季部長應該很清楚，我一直在倡議國際先進技術，特別是基因定序，基因定序要導入精準農、漁、牧業的產業升級，而且要有一個國家層級來統籌這些基因數據，能有規模數據，同樣在養吳郭魚，我們的產品就是比中國好、比巴西好、比其他國家好，這才叫做產業升級。所以先進技術的基因定序要導入精準農業，利用市場的力量來結合政策工具，希望能夠縮小國內農、漁、牧業跟國際間的生產成本。主計長，你怎麼看本席的建議？"],["陳主計長淑姿：委員，你提的各項建議也是我們將來想要做的，坦白說，我們115年度希望把前瞻相關的各項建設能夠納到總預算，但問題是，115年度因為財劃法的關係，我們將減少三千七百五十幾億，這方面會有各種的困難，我們目前也逐漸在克服。你剛剛談到老舊建物的部分，其實在特別條例就已經有優先納入，我們也認為老舊建物必須要做加強。再來是有關教育、學校方面的部分，學校方面我們是有保障的，它在前三年稅收的23%裡面是有一個保障額度，因此這部分我們會儘量優先進行。"],["林委員岱樺：主計長，您也有在評估，雖然這次沒有納入，但有在相關的項目當中去支持。本席針對蔡易餘委員的版本，有一項我非常支持，就是挹注台灣自來水股份有限公司，雖然這次沒有納入，但是我要讓主計長知道一件事情，台水的主要業務有兩個，一個是延管，一個是管線汰換，管線汰換占八成，延管占兩成，這兩成來自水利署的預算，而八成的汰換是來自哪裡？是台水借錢，全部都是用借貸，主計長，你很清楚，你有點頭，我覺得跟你講話真的頻率很對。它是用借貸來做最主要的業務，你能想像嗎？一個國家的公建，水管的汰換是國營企業用借貸來做汰換，它已經累積1,100億的負債了，然後它借貸來之後做兩件事情，一個還債，一個再做公建，而又不准它漲水價，這是所有不分藍綠立委都主張不可以漲水價，有啦！現在針對高耗能1,000噸以上的讓它可以漲。","電、油的漲價成本由政府吸收，可是水價凍漲，你們也沒有支持它，我不曉得這個企業怎麼活得下去？只因為它叫做國營事業、國營企業，所以銀行再怎麼樣都要借錢給它，如果是民間公司，銀行怎麼可能借錢給它！它用借貸來做公建，借貸之後又分做兩個，一個還錢、一個做公建，而且公建當中的汰換是占這個公司的八成，然後又不准它漲水價，這本席也反對，但不准它漲，那成本又在哪裡？政府不給它，給台電，也給中油，但就不會想要給台水，因此我非常肯定蔡易餘委員的版本。針對當中的資源項目，我不曉得主計長怎麼看？"],["陳主計長淑姿：針對台水的部分，第一個是老舊管線的汰換，其實我們是有補助的，逐年在補助。"],["林委員岱樺：對，可是太少了，你看今年才補80億耶！"],["陳主計長淑姿：對，80億。"],["林委員岱樺：可是它已經負債1,000億，你知道汰換的工程都是百億、百億、百億在支持耶！"],["陳主計長淑姿：是。第二個，將來也逐漸要以提高水價的方式來因應。"],["林委員岱樺：您支不支持用這樣的……這次即使沒有納入，您未來願不願意評估用年度的結餘，或者是超徵的金額來做台水的債務……不要說債務，但確實也是債務，或者是它凍漲成本的吸收呢？由政府來做，你認不認同？你要不要去評估呢？"],["陳主計長淑姿：我們會儘量優先考慮。"],["林委員岱樺：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝。","現在請賴士葆委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":154,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-3-19,20-1","speakers":["謝衣鳯","賴士葆","張啓楷","林岱樺","邱議瑩","林德福","張嘉郡","郭國文","陳亭妃","賴瑞隆","呂玉玲","李彥秀","鍾佳濱","李坤城","陳俊宇","林思銘","鄭正鈐","黃珊珊","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","蔡易餘","陳超明","邱志偉","羅明才","楊瓊瓔","葉元之","王正旭","陳玉珍","邱鎮軍","顏寬恒","翁曉玲","蘇清泉","王美惠","許宇甄","牛煦庭"],"page_start":41,"meetingDate":["2025-05-14"],"gazette_id":"1144901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144901_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟、財政兩委員會第1次聯席會議紀錄","content":"審查：一、行政院函請審議「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及國土安全韌性特別條例草案」案；\n二、本院國民黨黨團擬具「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及民眾消費韌性特別條例草案」案；三、\n本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「因應國際情勢衝擊強化經濟社會韌性特別條例草案」案；四、本院委\n員蔡易餘等18人擬具「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及國土安全韌性特別條例草案」案；五、本院\n委員王美惠等17人擬具「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及國土安全韌性特別條例草案」案（詢答）","agenda_id":"1144901_00002"}}}