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\"我現在程序上我的了解是這樣就是說這些要到院會裡面宣讀完之後然後才送程序委員會互委那所以我希望這個流程不要有任何的阻擋然後能夠順利的進入了程序委員會互委之後呢那希望這個委員會能夠安排因為我現在的了解是說他本來是說要在院會做報告\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 337.324, \"end\": 337.665, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 337.665, \"end\": 337.965, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"程\", \"start\": 337.965, \"end\": 338.185, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"序\", \"start\": 338.185, \"end\": 338.325, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 338.325, \"end\": 338.465, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 338.465, \"end\": 338.545, \"score\": 0.793}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 338.545, \"end\": 338.665, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 338.665, \"end\": 338.926, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 338.926, \"end\": 339.086, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 339.086, \"end\": 339.766, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 339.766, \"end\": 339.906, 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\"那\", \"start\": 357.158, \"end\": 357.358, \"score\": 0.938}, {\"word\": \"希\", \"start\": 357.358, \"end\": 357.538, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"望\", \"start\": 357.538, \"end\": 358.699, \"score\": 0.957}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 358.699, \"end\": 359.099, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 359.099, \"end\": 360.14, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"安\", \"start\": 360.14, \"end\": 360.34, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"排\", \"start\": 360.34, \"end\": 361.121, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 361.121, \"end\": 361.681, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 361.681, \"end\": 361.981, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 361.981, \"end\": 362.041, \"score\": 0.639}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 362.041, \"end\": 362.161, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 362.161, \"end\": 362.382, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 362.382, \"end\": 362.542, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 362.542, \"end\": 362.962, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 362.962, \"end\": 363.462, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"本\", \"start\": 363.462, \"end\": 363.722, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 363.722, \"end\": 364.043, \"score\": 0.918}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 364.043, \"end\": 364.183, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 364.183, \"end\": 364.343, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 364.343, \"end\": 365.043, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"做\", \"start\": 365.043, \"end\": 365.464, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 365.464, \"end\": 365.484, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 366.104, \"end\": 391.84, \"text\": \"是那現在應該按照文化部的例子的話應該是可以交付委員會那如果說我們國防部的這個這一部分的解凍也可以按照這個程序就是說院會宣讀完之後然後就同意授權由委員會來進行這個報告之後來進行解凍我想這樣子會對我們的國防預算的這個執行會有很大的幫忙好\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 366.104, \"end\": 366.424, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 366.424, \"end\": 366.704, \"score\": 0.843}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 366.704, \"end\": 367.965, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"應\"}, {\"word\": \"該\"}, {\"word\": \"按\", \"start\": 367.965, \"end\": 368.165, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"照\", \"start\": 368.165, \"end\": 368.586, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"文\", \"start\": 368.586, \"end\": 368.746, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"化\", \"start\": 368.746, \"end\": 368.946, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 368.946, \"end\": 369.086, \"score\": 0.736}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 369.086, \"end\": 369.206, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"例\", \"start\": 369.206, \"end\": 369.446, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"子\", \"start\": 369.446, \"end\": 369.566, 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{\"word\": \"防\", \"start\": 374.469, \"end\": 374.749, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 374.749, \"end\": 374.949, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 374.949, \"end\": 376.971, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 376.971, \"end\": 377.071, \"score\": 0.808}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 377.071, \"end\": 377.171, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 377.171, \"end\": 377.251, \"score\": 0.841}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 377.251, \"end\": 377.391, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 377.391, \"end\": 377.731, \"score\": 0.834}, {\"word\": \"凍\"}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 377.731, \"end\": 377.911, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 377.911, \"end\": 377.991, \"score\": 0.783}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 377.991, \"end\": 378.051, \"score\": 0.582}, {\"word\": \"按\", \"start\": 378.051, \"end\": 378.171, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"照\", 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{\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 386.376, \"end\": 386.777, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"凍\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 386.777, \"end\": 386.877, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 386.877, \"end\": 387.637, \"score\": 0.824}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"子\", \"start\": 387.637, \"end\": 388.157, \"score\": 0.85}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 388.157, \"end\": 388.538, \"score\": 0.869}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 388.538, \"end\": 389.038, \"score\": 0.984}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"防\", \"start\": 389.038, \"end\": 389.398, \"score\": 0.851}, {\"word\": \"預\"}, {\"word\": \"算\", \"start\": 389.398, \"end\": 389.618, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 389.618, \"end\": 390.279, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"執\"}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 390.279, \"end\": 391.179, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 391.179, \"end\": 391.299, \"score\": 0.955}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 391.299, \"end\": 391.439, \"score\": 0.868}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 391.439, \"end\": 391.559, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 391.559, \"end\": 391.659, \"score\": 0.757}, {\"word\": \"幫\"}, {\"word\": \"忙\", \"start\": 391.659, \"end\": 391.82, \"score\": 0.828}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 391.82, \"end\": 391.84, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 392.58, \"end\": 404.663, \"text\": \"所以本席只是提醒啦在民進黨這裡我們當然是完全希望能夠國防的預算不要中間有所謂的空白期免得有空白期灰色地帶的侵擾就會直接由嚴轉戰成為直接的台灣的整個全面被中國有機會趁虛而入那至於是不是能夠走文化部的模式我就請國防部這裡再跟這個\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 392.58, \"end\": 392.7, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 392.7, \"end\": 392.78, \"score\": 0.72}, {\"word\": \"本\", \"start\": 392.78, \"end\": 392.92, \"score\": 0.729}, {\"word\": \"席\", \"start\": 392.92, \"end\": 393.16, \"score\": 0.595}, {\"word\": \"只\", \"start\": 393.16, \"end\": 393.18, \"score\": 0.008}, {\"word\": 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00:01:16,316\n完全30了然後才來申請而且要經過院會飛機是要讓他掉下來嘛所以本席當然是認為可以解凍的要趕快來解凍不過我想我會提到這個來當開場白是因為我們知道今天在自由時報當中有刊登出來了就是賴清德賴總統在接受日本媒體訪問的時候有特別提到有關於現在兩岸局勢的部分那麼他特別提到的是說如果\n\n5\n00:01:17,356 --> 00:01:31,675\n兩岸會有所謂的擦槍走火的狀況也是因為中共透過油鹽轉戰為什麼我剛剛的開場白會特別的提到就是現在國防部的很多的預算包括我們這個業務費是要執行30%之後\n\n6\n00:01:35,299 --> 00:01:51,594\n才能提到院會來解凍那麼面對連總統都特別在對國際媒體的時候都講到那就是中國不斷的在台灣的四周包括東海南海做軍演那麼可怕的是由演轉戰的時候那麼我們到底該怎麼辦這個訊息的釋出我相信那麼這個也是問題\n\n7\n00:01:57,620 --> 00:02:06,469\n越來越嚴重了那麼部長怎麼來看這個連總統都對外提到中國的軍演在台灣四周所引發的灰色地帶作戰\n\n8\n00:02:08,615 --> 00:02:34,014\n我想這分兩點第一點就是說灰色地帶的一個襲擾是一種軍事的一個恫嚇加上認知戰那我們對於這樣子的一個灰色地帶的一個應處我們要從這兩個面向一方面我們對於這樣的軍事恫嚇我們要相關的有一些因應的作為但是我們不能夠來大量的消耗我們的\n\n9\n00:02:35,474 --> 00:02:57,703\n這些戰力所以要有一些如何的應處這是我們現在要面臨的一個課題第二個當然就是說認知戰我們對於這樣子的一個灰色地帶洗澡然後連結到他們相關從事認知戰我們要從事相關的反認知戰的一個反制的作為\n\n10\n00:02:58,643 --> 00:03:06,185\n好所以本席其實本來要問的是另外一個問題但是因為時間有限喔我要強調的就是中國加劇對台灣的這個整體的所謂侵擾那麼中共以我這個從天下雜誌所揭露的訊息當中就是包括我們2024年到2025年不斷的從共機共建再到氣球\n\n11\n00:03:20,948 --> 00:03:37,952\n的所謂氣球徵貨的這個數目其實都是在增加當中啦當然這個氣球徵貨的數目是降低但是從共機共建的次數是增加的但是如果說他們不斷地是用這個騷擾跟侵擾的方式但是如果面臨我們的國防預算是被凍結的狀態的時候他就等在\n\n12\n00:03:40,273 --> 00:03:51,459\n我們在凍結來不及解凍然後來發動整體的清老然後在演習當中由嚴轉戰的過程當中那麼我們是不是已經做好了必要的因應的準備\n\n13\n00:03:53,347 --> 00:04:21,814\n所以我這邊特別強調因為我們業務費的部分被凍結了百分之三十那因為如果說我們要按照這個條件是說我們要整體預算執行到百分之三十的話會落到這個六月多以後立法院修會的一個時間因為我不清楚現在立法院要不要延長然後延長到什麼時候所以我們很希望能夠在五月底以前\n\n14\n00:04:23,434 --> 00:04:48,180\n這個就能夠處理掉我們這個整個業務會的百分之三十的凍結不然的話對我們的影響會相當的大所以因為如果再拖下去那我們滿了三十但因為對啊因為滿三十之後這是表示說三十之後才能送進來嘛然後送進委員會再送業務會嘛這就是一個非常荒謬的狀況就是我剛剛開場特別問到的所以說\n\n15\n00:04:48,700 --> 00:05:00,389\n到時候整個國軍是要整個停擺嗎大家不要粗糙不要出情然後大家可能連上洗手間都不准去因為沒有業務費的話是不是連水電都不行那更不要講這些有關於海陸空的抵禦跟防禦那麼如果說現在這個規定在野黨就是已經這樣規定了有沒有特別去溝通跟去尤其是跟在野黨的委員來做讓他們理解\n\n16\n00:05:20,883 --> 00:05:35,757\n我們都有在做溝通那你們溝通了之後的結果是什麼在野黨的委員還是不同意國民黨的在野黨委員不同意嗎還是說這個騎乘定在那裡了就沒有辦法改所以也沒有辦法送\n\n17\n00:05:37,324 --> 00:06:05,484\n我現在程序上我的了解是這樣就是說這些要到院會裡面宣讀完之後然後才送程序委員會互委那所以我希望這個流程不要有任何的阻擋然後能夠順利的進入了程序委員會互委之後呢那希望這個委員會能夠安排因為我現在的了解是說他本來是說要在院會做報告\n\n18\n00:06:06,104 --> 00:06:31,840\n是那現在應該按照文化部的例子的話應該是可以交付委員會那如果說我們國防部的這個這一部分的解凍也可以按照這個程序就是說院會宣讀完之後然後就同意授權由委員會來進行這個報告之後來進行解凍我想這樣子會對我們的國防預算的這個執行會有很大的幫忙好\n\n19\n00:06:32,580 --> 00:06:44,663\n所以本席只是提醒啦在民進黨這裡我們當然是完全希望能夠國防的預算不要中間有所謂的空白期免得有空白期灰色地帶的侵擾就會直接由嚴轉戰成為直接的台灣的整個全面被中國有機會趁虛而入那至於是不是能夠走文化部的模式我就請國防部這裡再跟這個\n\n20\n00:06:58,527 --> 00:07:20,953\n至少我們國防委員會的在野黨的委員能夠讓他們來理解我相信他們應該站在這個國家本事議題沒有再分所謂這個在野黨或執政黨的部分我相信他們應該會有方向應該是善意的吧所以我們會跟朝院的委員都每一位都來進行好如果沒有的話我覺得事實是可以讓民眾知道\n\n21\n00:07:22,148 --> 00:07:32,206\n因為國防不可以,國家這個,國這個字不能有動,如果有動,難免會遭到我希望得到草野委員的一致的支持好,加油,謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n510\t2214\t謝謝主席 主席有請顧部長有請部長 謝謝林委員好\n11838\t27065\t部長早安部長我們今天當然主要是預算解凍啦那麼面對其實中國的威脅本席是認為國防預算是完全不可以有任何的這個差池那麼像現在呢因為在野黨的堅持所以我們的國防預算是要執行了30%之後才能做解凍但是我們知道這個不論是我們的國軍弟兄他們的這個所謂戰備需要的物資包括你說像中\n40612\t48572\t中國的軍艦或者是空軍的這個所謂共機啊一直在繞台那個弟兄的這個飛機升上去之後不能說這個有料\n51247\t76316\t完全30了然後才來申請而且要經過院會飛機是要讓他掉下來嘛所以本席當然是認為可以解凍的要趕快來解凍不過我想我會提到這個來當開場白是因為我們知道今天在自由時報當中有刊登出來了就是賴清德賴總統在接受日本媒體訪問的時候有特別提到有關於現在兩岸局勢的部分那麼他特別提到的是說如果\n77356\t91675\t兩岸會有所謂的擦槍走火的狀況也是因為中共透過油鹽轉戰為什麼我剛剛的開場白會特別的提到就是現在國防部的很多的預算包括我們這個業務費是要執行30%之後\n95299\t111594\t才能提到院會來解凍那麼面對連總統都特別在對國際媒體的時候都講到那就是中國不斷的在台灣的四周包括東海南海做軍演那麼可怕的是由演轉戰的時候那麼我們到底該怎麼辦這個訊息的釋出我相信那麼這個也是問題\n117620\t126469\t越來越嚴重了那麼部長怎麼來看這個連總統都對外提到中國的軍演在台灣四周所引發的灰色地帶作戰\n128615\t154014\t我想這分兩點第一點就是說灰色地帶的一個襲擾是一種軍事的一個恫嚇加上認知戰那我們對於這樣子的一個灰色地帶的一個應處我們要從這兩個面向一方面我們對於這樣的軍事恫嚇我們要相關的有一些因應的作為但是我們不能夠來大量的消耗我們的\n155474\t177703\t這些戰力所以要有一些如何的應處這是我們現在要面臨的一個課題第二個當然就是說認知戰我們對於這樣子的一個灰色地帶洗澡然後連結到他們相關從事認知戰我們要從事相關的反認知戰的一個反制的作為\n178643\t186185\t好所以本席其實本來要問的是另外一個問題但是因為時間有限喔我要強調的就是中國加劇對台灣的這個整體的所謂侵擾那麼中共以我這個從天下雜誌所揭露的訊息當中就是包括我們2024年到2025年不斷的從共機共建再到氣球\n200948\t217952\t的所謂氣球徵貨的這個數目其實都是在增加當中啦當然這個氣球徵貨的數目是降低但是從共機共建的次數是增加的但是如果說他們不斷地是用這個騷擾跟侵擾的方式但是如果面臨我們的國防預算是被凍結的狀態的時候他就等在\n220273\t231459\t我們在凍結來不及解凍然後來發動整體的清老然後在演習當中由嚴轉戰的過程當中那麼我們是不是已經做好了必要的因應的準備\n233347\t261814\t所以我這邊特別強調因為我們業務費的部分被凍結了百分之三十那因為如果說我們要按照這個條件是說我們要整體預算執行到百分之三十的話會落到這個六月多以後立法院修會的一個時間因為我不清楚現在立法院要不要延長然後延長到什麼時候所以我們很希望能夠在五月底以前\n263434\t288180\t這個就能夠處理掉我們這個整個業務會的百分之三十的凍結不然的話對我們的影響會相當的大所以因為如果再拖下去那我們滿了三十但因為對啊因為滿三十之後這是表示說三十之後才能送進來嘛然後送進委員會再送業務會嘛這就是一個非常荒謬的狀況就是我剛剛開場特別問到的所以說\n288700\t300389\t到時候整個國軍是要整個停擺嗎大家不要粗糙不要出情然後大家可能連上洗手間都不准去因為沒有業務費的話是不是連水電都不行那更不要講這些有關於海陸空的抵禦跟防禦那麼如果說現在這個規定在野黨就是已經這樣規定了有沒有特別去溝通跟去尤其是跟在野黨的委員來做讓他們理解\n320883\t335757\t我們都有在做溝通那你們溝通了之後的結果是什麼在野黨的委員還是不同意國民黨的在野黨委員不同意嗎還是說這個騎乘定在那裡了就沒有辦法改所以也沒有辦法送\n337324\t365484\t我現在程序上我的了解是這樣就是說這些要到院會裡面宣讀完之後然後才送程序委員會互委那所以我希望這個流程不要有任何的阻擋然後能夠順利的進入了程序委員會互委之後呢那希望這個委員會能夠安排因為我現在的了解是說他本來是說要在院會做報告\n366104\t391840\t是那現在應該按照文化部的例子的話應該是可以交付委員會那如果說我們國防部的這個這一部分的解凍也可以按照這個程序就是說院會宣讀完之後然後就同意授權由委員會來進行這個報告之後來進行解凍我想這樣子會對我們的國防預算的這個執行會有很大的幫忙好\n392580\t404663\t所以本席只是提醒啦在民進黨這裡我們當然是完全希望能夠國防的預算不要中間有所謂的空白期免得有空白期灰色地帶的侵擾就會直接由嚴轉戰成為直接的台灣的整個全面被中國有機會趁虛而入那至於是不是能夠走文化部的模式我就請國防部這裡再跟這個\n418527\t440953\t至少我們國防委員會的在野黨的委員能夠讓他們來理解我相信他們應該站在這個國家本事議題沒有再分所謂這個在野黨或執政黨的部分我相信他們應該會有方向應該是善意的吧所以我們會跟朝院的委員都每一位都來進行好如果沒有的話我覺得事實是可以讓民眾知道\n442148\t452206\t因為國防不可以,國家這個,國這個字不能有動,如果有動,難免會遭到我希望得到草野委員的一致的支持好,加油,謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席 主席有請顧部長有請部長 謝謝林委員好\n部長早安部長我們今天當然主要是預算解凍啦那麼面對其實中國的威脅本席是認為國防預算是完全不可以有任何的這個差池那麼像現在呢因為在野黨的堅持所以我們的國防預算是要執行了30%之後才能做解凍但是我們知道這個不論是我們的國軍弟兄他們的這個所謂戰備需要的物資包括你說像中\n中國的軍艦或者是空軍的這個所謂共機啊一直在繞台那個弟兄的這個飛機升上去之後不能說這個有料\n完全30了然後才來申請而且要經過院會飛機是要讓他掉下來嘛所以本席當然是認為可以解凍的要趕快來解凍不過我想我會提到這個來當開場白是因為我們知道今天在自由時報當中有刊登出來了就是賴清德賴總統在接受日本媒體訪問的時候有特別提到有關於現在兩岸局勢的部分那麼他特別提到的是說如果\n兩岸會有所謂的擦槍走火的狀況也是因為中共透過油鹽轉戰為什麼我剛剛的開場白會特別的提到就是現在國防部的很多的預算包括我們這個業務費是要執行30%之後\n才能提到院會來解凍那麼面對連總統都特別在對國際媒體的時候都講到那就是中國不斷的在台灣的四周包括東海南海做軍演那麼可怕的是由演轉戰的時候那麼我們到底該怎麼辦這個訊息的釋出我相信那麼這個也是問題\n越來越嚴重了那麼部長怎麼來看這個連總統都對外提到中國的軍演在台灣四周所引發的灰色地帶作戰\n我想這分兩點第一點就是說灰色地帶的一個襲擾是一種軍事的一個恫嚇加上認知戰那我們對於這樣子的一個灰色地帶的一個應處我們要從這兩個面向一方面我們對於這樣的軍事恫嚇我們要相關的有一些因應的作為但是我們不能夠來大量的消耗我們的\n這些戰力所以要有一些如何的應處這是我們現在要面臨的一個課題第二個當然就是說認知戰我們對於這樣子的一個灰色地帶洗澡然後連結到他們相關從事認知戰我們要從事相關的反認知戰的一個反制的作為\n好所以本席其實本來要問的是另外一個問題但是因為時間有限喔我要強調的就是中國加劇對台灣的這個整體的所謂侵擾那麼中共以我這個從天下雜誌所揭露的訊息當中就是包括我們2024年到2025年不斷的從共機共建再到氣球\n的所謂氣球徵貨的這個數目其實都是在增加當中啦當然這個氣球徵貨的數目是降低但是從共機共建的次數是增加的但是如果說他們不斷地是用這個騷擾跟侵擾的方式但是如果面臨我們的國防預算是被凍結的狀態的時候他就等在\n我們在凍結來不及解凍然後來發動整體的清老然後在演習當中由嚴轉戰的過程當中那麼我們是不是已經做好了必要的因應的準備\n所以我這邊特別強調因為我們業務費的部分被凍結了百分之三十那因為如果說我們要按照這個條件是說我們要整體預算執行到百分之三十的話會落到這個六月多以後立法院修會的一個時間因為我不清楚現在立法院要不要延長然後延長到什麼時候所以我們很希望能夠在五月底以前\n這個就能夠處理掉我們這個整個業務會的百分之三十的凍結不然的話對我們的影響會相當的大所以因為如果再拖下去那我們滿了三十但因為對啊因為滿三十之後這是表示說三十之後才能送進來嘛然後送進委員會再送業務會嘛這就是一個非常荒謬的狀況就是我剛剛開場特別問到的所以說\n到時候整個國軍是要整個停擺嗎大家不要粗糙不要出情然後大家可能連上洗手間都不准去因為沒有業務費的話是不是連水電都不行那更不要講這些有關於海陸空的抵禦跟防禦那麼如果說現在這個規定在野黨就是已經這樣規定了有沒有特別去溝通跟去尤其是跟在野黨的委員來做讓他們理解\n我們都有在做溝通那你們溝通了之後的結果是什麼在野黨的委員還是不同意國民黨的在野黨委員不同意嗎還是說這個騎乘定在那裡了就沒有辦法改所以也沒有辦法送\n我現在程序上我的了解是這樣就是說這些要到院會裡面宣讀完之後然後才送程序委員會互委那所以我希望這個流程不要有任何的阻擋然後能夠順利的進入了程序委員會互委之後呢那希望這個委員會能夠安排因為我現在的了解是說他本來是說要在院會做報告\n是那現在應該按照文化部的例子的話應該是可以交付委員會那如果說我們國防部的這個這一部分的解凍也可以按照這個程序就是說院會宣讀完之後然後就同意授權由委員會來進行這個報告之後來進行解凍我想這樣子會對我們的國防預算的這個執行會有很大的幫忙好\n所以本席只是提醒啦在民進黨這裡我們當然是完全希望能夠國防的預算不要中間有所謂的空白期免得有空白期灰色地帶的侵擾就會直接由嚴轉戰成為直接的台灣的整個全面被中國有機會趁虛而入那至於是不是能夠走文化部的模式我就請國防部這裡再跟這個\n至少我們國防委員會的在野黨的委員能夠讓他們來理解我相信他們應該站在這個國家本事議題沒有再分所謂這個在野黨或執政黨的部分我相信他們應該會有方向應該是善意的吧所以我們會跟朝院的委員都每一位都來進行好如果沒有的話我覺得事實是可以讓民眾知道\n因為國防不可以,國家這個,國這個字不能有動,如果有動,難免會遭到我希望得到草野委員的一致的支持好,加油,謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.510 --> 00:02.214\n謝謝主席主席有請顧部長有請部長謝謝林委員好\n\n00:11.838 --> 00:27.065\n部長早安部長我們今天當然主要是預算解凍啦那麼面對其實中國的威脅本席是認為國防預算是完全不可以有任何的這個差池那麼像現在呢因為在野黨的堅持所以我們的國防預算是要執行了30%之後才能做解凍但是我們知道這個不論是我們的國軍弟兄他們的這個所謂戰備需要的物資包括你說像中\n\n00:40.612 --> 00:48.572\n中國的軍艦或者是空軍的這個所謂共機啊一直在繞台那個弟兄的這個飛機升上去之後不能說這個有料\n\n00:51.247 --> 01:16.316\n完全30了然後才來申請而且要經過院會飛機是要讓他掉下來嘛所以本席當然是認為可以解凍的要趕快來解凍不過我想我會提到這個來當開場白是因為我們知道今天在自由時報當中有刊登出來了就是賴清德賴總統在接受日本媒體訪問的時候有特別提到有關於現在兩岸局勢的部分那麼他特別提到的是說如果\n\n01:17.356 --> 01:31.675\n兩岸會有所謂的擦槍走火的狀況也是因為中共透過油鹽轉戰為什麼我剛剛的開場白會特別的提到就是現在國防部的很多的預算包括我們這個業務費是要執行30%之後\n\n01:35.299 --> 01:51.594\n才能提到院會來解凍那麼面對連總統都特別在對國際媒體的時候都講到那就是中國不斷的在台灣的四周包括東海南海做軍演那麼可怕的是由演轉戰的時候那麼我們到底該怎麼辦這個訊息的釋出我相信那麼這個也是問題\n\n01:57.620 --> 02:06.469\n越來越嚴重了那麼部長怎麼來看這個連總統都對外提到中國的軍演在台灣四周所引發的灰色地帶作戰\n\n02:08.615 --> 02:34.014\n我想這分兩點第一點就是說灰色地帶的一個襲擾是一種軍事的一個恫嚇加上認知戰那我們對於這樣子的一個灰色地帶的一個應處我們要從這兩個面向一方面我們對於這樣的軍事恫嚇我們要相關的有一些因應的作為但是我們不能夠來大量的消耗我們的\n\n02:35.474 --> 02:57.703\n這些戰力所以要有一些如何的應處這是我們現在要面臨的一個課題第二個當然就是說認知戰我們對於這樣子的一個灰色地帶洗澡然後連結到他們相關從事認知戰我們要從事相關的反認知戰的一個反制的作為\n\n02:58.643 --> 03:06.185\n好所以本席其實本來要問的是另外一個問題但是因為時間有限喔我要強調的就是中國加劇對台灣的這個整體的所謂侵擾那麼中共以我這個從天下雜誌所揭露的訊息當中就是包括我們2024年到2025年不斷的從共機共建再到氣球\n\n03:20.948 --> 03:37.952\n的所謂氣球徵貨的這個數目其實都是在增加當中啦當然這個氣球徵貨的數目是降低但是從共機共建的次數是增加的但是如果說他們不斷地是用這個騷擾跟侵擾的方式但是如果面臨我們的國防預算是被凍結的狀態的時候他就等在\n\n03:40.273 --> 03:51.459\n我們在凍結來不及解凍然後來發動整體的清老然後在演習當中由嚴轉戰的過程當中那麼我們是不是已經做好了必要的因應的準備\n\n03:53.347 --> 04:21.814\n所以我這邊特別強調因為我們業務費的部分被凍結了百分之三十那因為如果說我們要按照這個條件是說我們要整體預算執行到百分之三十的話會落到這個六月多以後立法院修會的一個時間因為我不清楚現在立法院要不要延長然後延長到什麼時候所以我們很希望能夠在五月底以前\n\n04:23.434 --> 04:48.180\n這個就能夠處理掉我們這個整個業務會的百分之三十的凍結不然的話對我們的影響會相當的大所以因為如果再拖下去那我們滿了三十但因為對啊因為滿三十之後這是表示說三十之後才能送進來嘛然後送進委員會再送業務會嘛這就是一個非常荒謬的狀況就是我剛剛開場特別問到的所以說\n\n04:48.700 --> 05:00.389\n到時候整個國軍是要整個停擺嗎大家不要粗糙不要出情然後大家可能連上洗手間都不准去因為沒有業務費的話是不是連水電都不行那更不要講這些有關於海陸空的抵禦跟防禦那麼如果說現在這個規定在野黨就是已經這樣規定了有沒有特別去溝通跟去尤其是跟在野黨的委員來做讓他們理解\n\n05:20.883 --> 05:35.757\n我們都有在做溝通那你們溝通了之後的結果是什麼在野黨的委員還是不同意國民黨的在野黨委員不同意嗎還是說這個騎乘定在那裡了就沒有辦法改所以也沒有辦法送\n\n05:37.324 --> 06:05.484\n我現在程序上我的了解是這樣就是說這些要到院會裡面宣讀完之後然後才送程序委員會互委那所以我希望這個流程不要有任何的阻擋然後能夠順利的進入了程序委員會互委之後呢那希望這個委員會能夠安排因為我現在的了解是說他本來是說要在院會做報告\n\n06:06.104 --> 06:31.840\n是那現在應該按照文化部的例子的話應該是可以交付委員會那如果說我們國防部的這個這一部分的解凍也可以按照這個程序就是說院會宣讀完之後然後就同意授權由委員會來進行這個報告之後來進行解凍我想這樣子會對我們的國防預算的這個執行會有很大的幫忙好\n\n06:32.580 --> 06:44.663\n所以本席只是提醒啦在民進黨這裡我們當然是完全希望能夠國防的預算不要中間有所謂的空白期免得有空白期灰色地帶的侵擾就會直接由嚴轉戰成為直接的台灣的整個全面被中國有機會趁虛而入那至於是不是能夠走文化部的模式我就請國防部這裡再跟這個\n\n06:58.527 --> 07:20.953\n至少我們國防委員會的在野黨的委員能夠讓他們來理解我相信他們應該站在這個國家本事議題沒有再分所謂這個在野黨或執政黨的部分我相信他們應該會有方向應該是善意的吧所以我們會跟朝院的委員都每一位都來進行好如果沒有的話我覺得事實是可以讓民眾知道\n\n07:22.148 --> 07:32.206\n因為國防不可以,國家這個,國這個字不能有動,如果有動,難免會遭到我希望得到草野委員的一致的支持好,加油,謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.51,"end":2.214,"text":"謝謝主席 主席有請顧部長有請部長 謝謝林委員好"},{"start":11.838,"end":27.065,"text":"部長早安部長我們今天當然主要是預算解凍啦那麼面對其實中國的威脅本席是認為國防預算是完全不可以有任何的這個差池那麼像現在呢因為在野黨的堅持所以我們的國防預算是要執行了30%之後才能做解凍但是我們知道這個不論是我們的國軍弟兄他們的這個所謂戰備需要的物資包括你說像中"},{"start":40.612,"end":48.572,"text":"中國的軍艦或者是空軍的這個所謂共機啊一直在繞台那個弟兄的這個飛機升上去之後不能說這個有料"},{"start":51.247,"end":76.316,"text":"完全30了然後才來申請而且要經過院會飛機是要讓他掉下來嘛所以本席當然是認為可以解凍的要趕快來解凍不過我想我會提到這個來當開場白是因為我們知道今天在自由時報當中有刊登出來了就是賴清德賴總統在接受日本媒體訪問的時候有特別提到有關於現在兩岸局勢的部分那麼他特別提到的是說如果"},{"start":77.356,"end":91.675,"text":"兩岸會有所謂的擦槍走火的狀況也是因為中共透過油鹽轉戰為什麼我剛剛的開場白會特別的提到就是現在國防部的很多的預算包括我們這個業務費是要執行30%之後"},{"start":95.299,"end":111.594,"text":"才能提到院會來解凍那麼面對連總統都特別在對國際媒體的時候都講到那就是中國不斷的在台灣的四周包括東海南海做軍演那麼可怕的是由演轉戰的時候那麼我們到底該怎麼辦這個訊息的釋出我相信那麼這個也是問題"},{"start":117.62,"end":126.469,"text":"越來越嚴重了那麼部長怎麼來看這個連總統都對外提到中國的軍演在台灣四周所引發的灰色地帶作戰"},{"start":128.615,"end":154.014,"text":"我想這分兩點第一點就是說灰色地帶的一個襲擾是一種軍事的一個恫嚇加上認知戰那我們對於這樣子的一個灰色地帶的一個應處我們要從這兩個面向一方面我們對於這樣的軍事恫嚇我們要相關的有一些因應的作為但是我們不能夠來大量的消耗我們的"},{"start":155.474,"end":177.703,"text":"這些戰力所以要有一些如何的應處這是我們現在要面臨的一個課題第二個當然就是說認知戰我們對於這樣子的一個灰色地帶洗澡然後連結到他們相關從事認知戰我們要從事相關的反認知戰的一個反制的作為"},{"start":178.643,"end":186.185,"text":"好所以本席其實本來要問的是另外一個問題但是因為時間有限喔我要強調的就是中國加劇對台灣的這個整體的所謂侵擾那麼中共以我這個從天下雜誌所揭露的訊息當中就是包括我們2024年到2025年不斷的從共機共建再到氣球"},{"start":200.948,"end":217.952,"text":"的所謂氣球徵貨的這個數目其實都是在增加當中啦當然這個氣球徵貨的數目是降低但是從共機共建的次數是增加的但是如果說他們不斷地是用這個騷擾跟侵擾的方式但是如果面臨我們的國防預算是被凍結的狀態的時候他就等在"},{"start":220.273,"end":231.459,"text":"我們在凍結來不及解凍然後來發動整體的清老然後在演習當中由嚴轉戰的過程當中那麼我們是不是已經做好了必要的因應的準備"},{"start":233.347,"end":261.814,"text":"所以我這邊特別強調因為我們業務費的部分被凍結了百分之三十那因為如果說我們要按照這個條件是說我們要整體預算執行到百分之三十的話會落到這個六月多以後立法院修會的一個時間因為我不清楚現在立法院要不要延長然後延長到什麼時候所以我們很希望能夠在五月底以前"},{"start":263.434,"end":288.18,"text":"這個就能夠處理掉我們這個整個業務會的百分之三十的凍結不然的話對我們的影響會相當的大所以因為如果再拖下去那我們滿了三十但因為對啊因為滿三十之後這是表示說三十之後才能送進來嘛然後送進委員會再送業務會嘛這就是一個非常荒謬的狀況就是我剛剛開場特別問到的所以說"},{"start":288.7,"end":300.389,"text":"到時候整個國軍是要整個停擺嗎大家不要粗糙不要出情然後大家可能連上洗手間都不准去因為沒有業務費的話是不是連水電都不行那更不要講這些有關於海陸空的抵禦跟防禦那麼如果說現在這個規定在野黨就是已經這樣規定了有沒有特別去溝通跟去尤其是跟在野黨的委員來做讓他們理解"},{"start":320.883,"end":335.757,"text":"我們都有在做溝通那你們溝通了之後的結果是什麼在野黨的委員還是不同意國民黨的在野黨委員不同意嗎還是說這個騎乘定在那裡了就沒有辦法改所以也沒有辦法送"},{"start":337.324,"end":365.484,"text":"我現在程序上我的了解是這樣就是說這些要到院會裡面宣讀完之後然後才送程序委員會互委那所以我希望這個流程不要有任何的阻擋然後能夠順利的進入了程序委員會互委之後呢那希望這個委員會能夠安排因為我現在的了解是說他本來是說要在院會做報告"},{"start":366.104,"end":391.84,"text":"是那現在應該按照文化部的例子的話應該是可以交付委員會那如果說我們國防部的這個這一部分的解凍也可以按照這個程序就是說院會宣讀完之後然後就同意授權由委員會來進行這個報告之後來進行解凍我想這樣子會對我們的國防預算的這個執行會有很大的幫忙好"},{"start":392.58,"end":404.663,"text":"所以本席只是提醒啦在民進黨這裡我們當然是完全希望能夠國防的預算不要中間有所謂的空白期免得有空白期灰色地帶的侵擾就會直接由嚴轉戰成為直接的台灣的整個全面被中國有機會趁虛而入那至於是不是能夠走文化部的模式我就請國防部這裡再跟這個"},{"start":418.527,"end":440.953,"text":"至少我們國防委員會的在野黨的委員能夠讓他們來理解我相信他們應該站在這個國家本事議題沒有再分所謂這個在野黨或執政黨的部分我相信他們應該會有方向應該是善意的吧所以我們會跟朝院的委員都每一位都來進行好如果沒有的話我覺得事實是可以讓民眾知道"},{"start":442.148,"end":452.206,"text":"因為國防不可以,國家這個,國這個字不能有動,如果有動,難免會遭到我希望得到草野委員的一致的支持好,加油,謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":229,"blocks":[["林委員楚茵：（9時52分）謝謝主席。主席，有請顧部長。"],["主席：有請部長，謝謝。"],["顧部長立雄：林委員好。"],["林委員楚茵：部長早安。部長，我們今天當然主要是預算解凍，面對中國的威脅，本席認為國防預算完全不可以有任何差池。現在因為在野黨的堅持，所以我們的國防預算要執行百分之三十之後才能解凍，但是我們知道不論是我們國軍弟兄戰備需要的物資，包括中國的軍艦，或者是共機一直繞臺，國軍弟兄的飛機升上去之後，總不能油料完全用了三十，然後才來申請，而且要經過院會，是要讓飛機掉下來嗎？所以本席當然是認為可以解凍的要趕快解凍。","我會提到這個來當開場白，是因為我們知道今天在自由時報當中有刊登出來了，賴清德賴總統在接受日本媒體訪問的時候，有特別提到關於現在兩岸局勢的部分。他特別提到的是，如果兩岸會有所謂擦槍走火的狀況，也是因為中共透過由演轉戰。為什麼我剛剛的開場白會特別提到，現在國防部很多預算，包括業務費要執行百分之三十之後才能提到院會解凍？連總統在對國際媒體的時候都特別講到，中國不斷地在臺灣的四周包括東海、南海進行軍演，可怕的是由演轉戰的時候，我們到底該怎麼辦？這個訊息的釋出，我相信問題也是越來越嚴重了！部長怎麼看連總統都對外提到中國軍演在臺灣四周引發的灰色地帶作戰？"],["顧部長立雄：我想這分兩點，第一點就是灰色地帶襲擾是一種軍事恫嚇，加上認知戰，對於這樣子灰色地帶的應處，我們要從這兩個面向，一方面，我們對於這樣的軍事恫嚇，要有一些相關的因應作為，但是我們不能夠大量消耗我們的戰力。"],["林委員楚茵：是。"],["顧部長立雄：所以要如何應處是我們現在要面臨的一個課題。第二個當然就是認知戰，我們對於這樣子的灰色地帶襲擾，然後連結到他們從事的認知戰，我們要從事相關反認知戰的反制作為。"],["林委員楚茵：本席本來要問的是另外一個問題，但是因為時間有限，我要強調的就是中國加劇對臺灣整體的侵擾，以我從天下雜誌所節錄的訊息當中，2024年到2025年共機、共艦，以及氣球偵獲的數目，其實都是在增加當中，當然氣球偵獲的數目有降低，但是共機、共艦偵獲數是增加的。如果他們不斷用騷擾跟侵擾的方式，卻面臨我們國防預算是被凍結狀態的時候，他們就會在我們還來不及解凍的時候發動整體侵擾，然後在演習的過程當中由演轉戰。我們是不是已經做好必要的因應準備？"],["顧部長立雄：所以我這邊特別講到，因為我們業務費的部分被凍結了百分之三十，按照這個條件，如果我們的整體預算要執行到百分之三十的話，會落到六月多以後立法院的休會期間，因為我不清楚現在立法院要不要延長，然後延長到什麼時候，所以我們很期望能夠在5月底以前就能夠處理掉我們整個業務費百分之三十的凍結，不然的話，對我們的影響會相當大，因為如果再拖下去，我們滿了三十，但因為……"],["林委員楚茵：對啊！滿三十之後就是表示三十之後才能送進來，然後送進委員會、再送院會，這就是一個非常荒謬的狀況，也是我剛剛開場特別問到的，所以到時候整個國軍是要整個停擺嗎？大家不要出操、不要出勤，然後大家可能連上洗手間都不准去，因為沒有業務費，是不是連水電都不行？更不要講有關海陸空的抵禦跟防禦。如果現在在野黨就是已經這樣規定了，有沒有特別去溝通？尤其是讓在野黨的委員理解？"],["顧部長立雄：我們都有在溝通。"],["林委員楚茵：你們溝通之後的結果是什麼？在野黨的委員還是不同意？國民黨的委員不同意嗎？"],["顧部長立雄：我們現在應該是……"],["林委員楚茵：還是說這個期程訂在那裡了就沒有辦法改，所以也沒有辦法送？"],["顧部長立雄：現在程序上我的了解是這樣，就是這些要到院會裡面宣讀完之後，然後才送程序委員會付委。我希望這個流程不要有任何阻擋，能夠順利進入程序委員會付委之後，希望委員會能夠安排。因為我現在的了解是，它本來是要在院會報告。"],["林委員楚茵：是。"],["顧部長立雄：現在按照文化部的例子，應該是可以交付委員會。如果我們國防部這部分的解凍也可以按照這個程序，就是院會宣讀完之後，然後就同意授權由委員會進行報告之後，再進行解凍，我想這樣子對我們國防預算的執行會有很大的幫忙。"],["林委員楚茵：好，所以本席只是提醒，在民進黨這裡，我們當然是完全希望國防預算中間不要有所謂的空白期，免得有空白期，灰色地帶的侵擾就會直接由演轉戰，使臺灣全面整個直接有機會被中國趁虛而入。至於是不是能夠走文化部的模式，我就請國防部至少能夠讓我們國防委員會的在野黨委員理解。我相信他們應該站在國家本是一體，沒有分在野黨或執政黨，我相信他們應該會有……方向應該是善意的吧！"],["顧部長立雄：是，我會跟朝野的委員，每一位都來進行……"],["林委員楚茵：好，如果沒有的話，我覺得可以適時讓民眾知道，因為國家的「國」這個字不能有洞，如果有洞，壞東西會跑進來。"],["顧部長立雄：我希望得到朝野委員一致的支持。"],["林委員楚茵：好，加油，謝謝。"],["顧部長立雄：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝楚茵委員。待會等到林憶君委員質詢完畢的時候，我們休息10分鐘。","接下來，有請陳冠廷委員上臺質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":40,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-35-13","speakers":["沈伯洋","陳俊宇","徐巧芯","羅美玲","林楚茵","陳冠廷","王定宇","林憶君","王鴻薇","黃國昌","陳永康","馬文君","黃仁"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-05-14"],"gazette_id":"1144901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144901_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期外交及國防委員會第13次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"處理院會交付114年度中央政府總預算決議，國防部主管預算凍結案等54案","agenda_id":"1144901_00001"}}}