{"id":161393,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/161393","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/4f2e91488ef6971b73ff1a2bb7b02a10a35373469a84e2c37ba5a36b7b1a506694c2a44ecd674d185ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"邱志偉","委員發言時間":"14:45:46 - 14:57:11","影片長度":"00:11:25","會議時間":"2025-05-14T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟、財政兩委員會第1次聯席會議（事由：審查：\n一、行政院函請審議「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及國土安全韌性特別條例草案」案。\n二、本院國民黨黨團擬具「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及民眾消費韌性特別條例草案」案。\n三、本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「因應國際情勢衝擊強化經濟社會韌性特別條例草案」案。\n四、本院委員蔡易餘等18人擬具「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及國土安全韌性特別條例草案」案。\n五、本院委員王美惠等17人擬具「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及國土安全韌性特別條例草案」案。\n（第一案如未獲議事處來函則不予審查，第二至第五案業經各黨團簽署不復議同意書。）（詢答）\n【5月14日及5月15日二天一次會】）","type":"Clip","date":"2025-05-14","start_time":"2025-05-14T14:45:46+08:00","end_time":"2025-05-14T14:57:11+08:00","duration":685,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第3會期經濟、財政兩委員會第1次聯席會議","type":"聯席會議","term":11,"sessionPeriod":3,"sessionTimes":1,"committees":[19,20],"id":"聯席會議-11-3-19,20-1"},"features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"transcript":{"id":"161393","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/161393","tool":"pyannote","id":"161393-pyannote"},"job_id":"j3hrqiuq0Z8ZjUvn","queued_at":"2025-05-14 15:39:36","status":"done","log":[{"time":"2025-05-14 15:40:27","msg":"downloading https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/161393","target":null},{"time":"2025-05-14 15:40:27","msg":"download ivod and merge to wav","target":"/home/conda/test/whisper-api-data/tmp/lyivod-clip-161393.wav"},{"time":"2025-05-14 15:40:53","msg":"running pyannote","target":null},{"time":"2025-05-14 15:41:08","msg":"status: done","target":null}],"result":{"result":[[0.047843750000000004,1.5834687500000002,"SPEAKER_00"],[7.152218750000001,8.012843750000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[8.56971875,10.30784375,"SPEAKER_04"],[10.712843750000001,12.704093750000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[13.007843750000003,14.172218750000003,"SPEAKER_04"],[15.032843750000001,15.302843750000001,"SPEAKER_04"],[16.028468750000002,17.54721875,"SPEAKER_04"],[18.10409375,21.37784375,"SPEAKER_04"],[21.96846875,24.41534375,"SPEAKER_04"],[24.73596875,25.37721875,"SPEAKER_04"],[25.96784375,26.676593750000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[27.199718750000002,29.69721875,"SPEAKER_04"],[31.03034375,31.317218750000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[34.18596875,36.91971875,"SPEAKER_04"],[37.510343750000004,39.096593750000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[39.26534375,39.78846875,"SPEAKER_04"],[40.64909375,41.492843750000006,"SPEAKER_04"],[41.59409375,43.180343750000006,"SPEAKER_04"],[41.931593750000005,42.235343750000006,"SPEAKER_03"],[46.58909375,47.719718750000006,"SPEAKER_04"],[47.922218750000006,49.13721875,"SPEAKER_04"],[49.99784375,53.33909375,"SPEAKER_04"],[53.47409375,54.75659375,"SPEAKER_04"],[55.14471875,55.937843750000006,"SPEAKER_04"],[56.54534375,58.67159375000001,"SPEAKER_04"],[59.07659375,61.455968750000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[62.181593750000005,63.31221875000001,"SPEAKER_04"],[63.88596875,66.26534375,"SPEAKER_04"],[67.14284375,69.11721875,"SPEAKER_04"],[67.24409375,67.86846875,"SPEAKER_03"],[69.11721875,69.28596875000001,"SPEAKER_03"],[69.42096875,72.71159375,"SPEAKER_03"],[72.34034375,75.90096875,"SPEAKER_04"],[75.61409375000001,75.76596875,"SPEAKER_03"],[76.25534375000001,80.55846875,"SPEAKER_03"],[81.19971875,82.21221875,"SPEAKER_03"],[82.63409375,94.63221875,"SPEAKER_03"],[93.14721875000001,95.50971875,"SPEAKER_04"],[95.99909375,98.17596875000001,"SPEAKER_04"],[98.56409375000001,103.77846875,"SPEAKER_04"],[104.28471875000001,109.46534375,"SPEAKER_04"],[110.41034375000001,112.04721875000001,"SPEAKER_04"],[112.55346875000001,122.66159375000001,"SPEAKER_03"],[122.83034375000001,124.88909375,"SPEAKER_03"],[125.14221875000001,128.82096875000002,"SPEAKER_03"],[128.95596875,129.02346875,"SPEAKER_03"],[129.05721875,132.01034375,"SPEAKER_03"],[132.29721875,134.60909375,"SPEAKER_03"],[134.98034375,135.75659375,"SPEAKER_03"],[135.77346875,139.99221875,"SPEAKER_03"],[138.97971875000002,150.75846875000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[144.93659375000001,145.34159375000002,"SPEAKER_03"],[151.46721875,151.87221875,"SPEAKER_04"],[152.07471875000002,155.04471875000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[155.26409375,157.77846875,"SPEAKER_04"],[157.13721875000002,157.76159375,"SPEAKER_03"],[157.77846875,157.89659375000002,"SPEAKER_03"],[157.89659375000002,157.91346875000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[158.25096875,162.40221875,"SPEAKER_04"],[162.77346875,163.53284375,"SPEAKER_04"],[164.54534375,165.28784375,"SPEAKER_04"],[165.52409375000002,166.51971875,"SPEAKER_04"],[166.85721875000002,167.41409375,"SPEAKER_04"],[168.03846875000002,170.62034375000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[171.05909375000002,172.37534375,"SPEAKER_04"],[173.01659375,180.07034375,"SPEAKER_04"],[180.50909375,181.40346875,"SPEAKER_04"],[182.06159375000001,183.37784375,"SPEAKER_04"],[183.76596875,184.22159375,"SPEAKER_04"],[184.33971875,184.40721875,"SPEAKER_04"],[184.40721875,184.94721875000002,"SPEAKER_03"],[184.94721875000002,186.33096875,"SPEAKER_04"],[184.98096875000002,184.99784375000002,"SPEAKER_03"],[186.73596875,187.12409375000001,"SPEAKER_03"],[187.12409375000001,187.17471875,"SPEAKER_04"],[187.29284375,189.40221875,"SPEAKER_04"],[190.17846875,191.34284375000001,"SPEAKER_04"],[190.19534375,190.65096875,"SPEAKER_03"],[191.56221875,191.98409375,"SPEAKER_04"],[191.66346875000002,191.73096875000002,"SPEAKER_00"],[192.43971875000003,193.35096875000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[193.62096875,200.28659375,"SPEAKER_04"],[201.56909375,205.36596875,"SPEAKER_04"],[205.88909375,207.30659375000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[207.86346875,208.96034375000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[209.87159375000002,210.44534375,"SPEAKER_04"],[210.96846875,211.52534375000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[212.60534375,214.66409375,"SPEAKER_04"],[215.38971875000001,216.77346875,"SPEAKER_04"],[217.26284375,222.00471875000002,"SPEAKER_04"],[223.38846875000002,224.70471875,"SPEAKER_04"],[225.41346875000002,227.40471875,"SPEAKER_04"],[227.40471875,227.62409375000001,"SPEAKER_03"],[227.62409375000001,227.70846875,"SPEAKER_04"],[227.91096875000002,238.76159375,"SPEAKER_04"],[229.14284375000003,229.54784375000003,"SPEAKER_03"],[239.11596875,244.71846875000003,"SPEAKER_03"],[245.12346875000003,246.87846875000002,"SPEAKER_03"],[246.92909375000002,247.78971875000002,"SPEAKER_03"],[248.11034375000003,250.97909375,"SPEAKER_03"],[251.31659375,252.19409375,"SPEAKER_03"],[252.48096875000002,254.92784375000002,"SPEAKER_03"],[255.14721875,259.34909375,"SPEAKER_03"],[259.41659375,260.42909375,"SPEAKER_03"],[260.73284375000003,264.10784375000003,"SPEAKER_03"],[264.32721875000004,271.53284375000004,"SPEAKER_03"],[270.43596875000003,274.09784375000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[275.24534375,275.90346875,"SPEAKER_04"],[276.13971875000004,278.16471875,"SPEAKER_04"],[278.63721875000005,282.87284375,"SPEAKER_04"],[283.46346875,284.20596875,"SPEAKER_04"],[285.48846875000004,288.32346875,"SPEAKER_04"],[288.44159375000004,289.80846875000003,"SPEAKER_04"],[290.92221875,291.86721875,"SPEAKER_04"],[292.32284375,293.03159375,"SPEAKER_04"],[294.85409375,301.99221875,"SPEAKER_04"],[302.93721875,303.84846875,"SPEAKER_04"],[304.32096875,305.43471875,"SPEAKER_04"],[306.04221875,307.20659375,"SPEAKER_04"],[309.94034375,312.03284375000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[313.04534375000003,315.01971875000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[316.52159375,319.59284375000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[320.45346875,321.06096875000003,"SPEAKER_04"],[321.31409375000004,322.15784375000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[322.78221875,323.71034375,"SPEAKER_04"],[324.79034375000003,325.68471875,"SPEAKER_04"],[326.29221875,326.79846875000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[327.08534375,327.77721875000003,"SPEAKER_04"],[327.99659375000005,328.57034375,"SPEAKER_04"],[333.36284375,334.30784375,"SPEAKER_04"],[334.76346875,343.38659375000003,"SPEAKER_04"],[340.99034375,341.04096875000005,"SPEAKER_01"],[343.63971875000004,344.48346875000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[345.61409375,348.55034375,"SPEAKER_04"],[346.84596875,348.51659375,"SPEAKER_00"],[348.55034375,348.60096875000005,"SPEAKER_00"],[349.00596875,360.02534375000005,"SPEAKER_04"],[360.02534375000005,360.70034375,"SPEAKER_01"],[360.70034375,360.71721875000003,"SPEAKER_04"],[361.44284375,361.45971875000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[361.45971875000004,378.50346875,"SPEAKER_01"],[380.22471875,380.25846875,"SPEAKER_01"],[380.25846875,390.61971875,"SPEAKER_04"],[391.24409375000005,394.51784375,"SPEAKER_04"],[395.41221875,398.02784375000005,"SPEAKER_04"],[398.02784375000005,398.85471875,"SPEAKER_01"],[399.29346875000005,399.31034375,"SPEAKER_04"],[399.31034375,416.97846875000005,"SPEAKER_01"],[416.97846875000005,420.72471875,"SPEAKER_04"],[421.45034375,425.83784375000005,"SPEAKER_04"],[426.68159375000005,429.48284375000003,"SPEAKER_04"],[429.87096875000003,433.58346875,"SPEAKER_04"],[434.00534375,435.52409375,"SPEAKER_04"],[435.81096875000003,436.26659375,"SPEAKER_04"],[436.28346875000005,437.34659375,"SPEAKER_04"],[438.02159375,439.60784375000003,"SPEAKER_04"],[439.84409375,445.22721875,"SPEAKER_04"],[445.83471875000004,450.23909375000005,"SPEAKER_04"],[450.71159375,456.21284375000005,"SPEAKER_03"],[456.55034375,464.32971875000004,"SPEAKER_03"],[464.66721875,470.62409375000004,"SPEAKER_03"],[470.70846875,473.15534375000004,"SPEAKER_03"],[473.35784375000003,475.29846875000004,"SPEAKER_03"],[475.29846875000004,475.36596875000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[475.36596875000004,475.41659375,"SPEAKER_03"],[475.41659375,487.14471875000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[487.60034375000004,487.90409375,"SPEAKER_04"],[488.57909375,489.96284375000005,"SPEAKER_04"],[492.12284375,492.67971875,"SPEAKER_04"],[492.89909375,494.60346875000005,"SPEAKER_04"],[494.92409375000005,496.67909375000005,"SPEAKER_04"],[498.09659375,498.28221875,"SPEAKER_00"],[498.73784375,499.69971875000005,"SPEAKER_00"],[499.98659375000005,500.15534375000004,"SPEAKER_04"],[500.62784375,501.01596875,"SPEAKER_04"],[501.26909375,502.09596875000005,"SPEAKER_04"],[502.09596875000005,502.39971875000003,"SPEAKER_00"],[503.04096875000005,505.01534375000006,"SPEAKER_04"],[505.89284375000005,507.93471875000006,"SPEAKER_04"],[508.60971875,513.80721875,"SPEAKER_04"],[514.3472187500001,514.93784375,"SPEAKER_04"],[515.12346875,517.78971875,"SPEAKER_04"],[519.1228437500001,520.05096875,"SPEAKER_04"],[520.3884687500001,520.8103437500001,"SPEAKER_00"],[520.97909375,522.3628437500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[522.85221875,529.6697187500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[530.29409375,531.8972187500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[532.43721875,537.5334687500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[538.2253437500001,538.9678437499999,"SPEAKER_04"],[539.44034375,544.1653437500001,"SPEAKER_00"],[543.4565937500001,545.4140937500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[545.90346875,546.2409687500001,"SPEAKER_00"],[546.59534375,547.2534687500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[546.89909375,549.02534375,"SPEAKER_00"],[547.70909375,549.24471875,"SPEAKER_04"],[549.7847187500001,553.3115937499999,"SPEAKER_04"],[549.9028437500001,550.42596875,"SPEAKER_00"],[553.53096875,567.97596875,"SPEAKER_00"],[562.20471875,563.9934687500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[565.34346875,566.99721875,"SPEAKER_04"],[567.72284375,569.10659375,"SPEAKER_04"],[569.0222187500001,572.09346875,"SPEAKER_00"],[569.64659375,572.1440937500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[572.49846875,576.0759687500001,"SPEAKER_00"],[575.89034375,581.1047187500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[581.61096875,584.2097187500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[585.00284375,585.96471875,"SPEAKER_04"],[586.65659375,589.0359687499999,"SPEAKER_04"],[589.4578437499999,590.4197187500001,"SPEAKER_00"],[589.74471875,593.0859687500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[594.58784375,595.83659375,"SPEAKER_04"],[596.3428437499999,598.2665937500001,"SPEAKER_00"],[598.2665937500001,600.5615937499999,"SPEAKER_04"],[600.5109687500001,604.52721875,"SPEAKER_00"],[604.8984687500001,607.90221875,"SPEAKER_04"],[607.9697187500001,608.0203437499999,"SPEAKER_04"],[608.07096875,609.4209687499999,"SPEAKER_04"],[611.15909375,612.3572187500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[612.6609687499999,613.97721875,"SPEAKER_04"],[614.39909375,615.09096875,"SPEAKER_04"],[615.47909375,616.81221875,"SPEAKER_04"],[618.02721875,621.41909375,"SPEAKER_02"],[621.95909375,624.50721875,"SPEAKER_02"],[624.91221875,626.92034375,"SPEAKER_02"],[627.4097187500001,633.07971875,"SPEAKER_02"],[633.4509687500001,635.35784375,"SPEAKER_02"],[635.6615937500001,636.1003437500001,"SPEAKER_02"],[636.4040937500001,637.04534375,"SPEAKER_02"],[637.48409375,638.2097187500001,"SPEAKER_02"],[638.3784687500001,646.46159375,"SPEAKER_02"],[646.8159687500001,652.23284375,"SPEAKER_02"],[652.4353437500001,653.17784375,"SPEAKER_02"],[653.34659375,656.99159375,"SPEAKER_02"],[653.5828437499999,653.78534375,"SPEAKER_04"],[653.93721875,655.60784375,"SPEAKER_04"],[656.6709687500002,657.1772187500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[657.3797187499999,667.94346875,"SPEAKER_04"],[668.36534375,670.2553437500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[671.7234687499999,674.4909687500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[675.16596875,678.7097187500001,"SPEAKER_04"],[679.94159375,681.89909375,"SPEAKER_04"],[684.5147187500002,685.69596875,"SPEAKER_04"]]}},"whisperx":{"name":"ronny","tool":"whisperx","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/161393","tool":"whisperx","id":"161393-whisperx","init_prompt":""},"job_id":"gC6YLuMYahgNXIeL","queued_at":"2025-05-14 15:39:37","status":"done","log":[{"time":"2025-05-14 15:41:08","msg":"downloading https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/161393","target":null},{"time":"2025-05-14 15:41:09","msg":"already downloaded","target":"/home/conda/test/whisper-api-data/tmp/lyivod-clip-161393.wav"},{"time":"2025-05-14 15:41:09","msg":"running whisperx with  --language zh --model large-v3","target":null},{"time":"2025-05-14 15:41:17","msg":"merging result","target":null},{"time":"2025-05-14 15:41:18","msg":"status: done","target":null}],"result":{"segments":[]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":1670,"blocks":[["邱委員志偉：（14時45分）憑我對陳昭明委員的了解，我可以替他背書，他絕對支持行政院的版本，支持強化國土安全韌性，不反對就贊成嘛，他絕對支持行政院的版本1,500億，所以管主委可以放心，百分之百支持，我可以替他背書。","請經濟部何次長，還有台電王總經理。"],["主席：請何次長、王總經理。"],["何次長晉滄：委員好。"],["邱委員志偉：次長，辛苦了。美國的財政部長貝森特說臺灣有一個非常好的方案，對不對？好像整體臺美的關稅談判會往好的方向去發展，什麼時候會有最後的結果？就你手上的情報可以說的。"],["何次長晉滄：因為我沒有參加談判小組，但是我想……"],["邱委員志偉：你不一定會參加，但是你要知道，你要掌握。"],["何次長晉滄：我知道現在我們談判小組正副院長都很用心在準備一些相關的資料，從上上禮拜談判回來之後，大概在國內也都正在準備相關的資料，在做第二輪的談判當中。"],["邱委員志偉：據你了解是不是往好的方向去發展，我們待遇絕對是比中國的關稅還好，中國目前是30%。有關半導體的部分，就你掌握的資訊，你覺得如何？半導體會不會額外再課稅？"],["何次長晉滄：當然這還是要看美方那邊最後的決定，我們一直在跟美國，我們也把意見書提供給美方，我們也希望美方能夠充分了解臺美之間在半導體上的互補角色，臺美的合作其實是有……"],["邱委員志偉：具體的部分你沒有辦法講，但是抽象你可以描述，就像貝森特所講的是往好的方向嘛？"],["何次長晉滄：是。"],["邱委員志偉：最起碼跟日本一樣，當然不可能超過中國，所以代表我們有做好最好的準備。","另外，針對今天的特別條例有關預算編列的部分，我對台電的1,000億大力支持，為什麼？因為它顧產業、顧民生，如果沒有這1,000億，恐怕民生用電勢必要反映成本，就可能會調漲，有這個可能性嘛，那會不會衝擊到民生？會嘛？"],["何次長晉滄：會。"],["邱委員志偉：會不會影響產業？"],["何次長晉滄：也會。"],["邱委員志偉：產業影響最大是哪些？是微中小傳統產業，它用電量比較多，而且微中小這些產業的調適能力跟彈性沒那麼大，所以它要能夠維持它的競爭力，否則關稅一來首當其衝是微中小。微中小集中在哪裡？中南部的製造業，像是做螺絲、鋼鐵等等，他們都需要用電，對嗎？所以只要你想到顧民生，只要你想到顧產業，只要有一點良知，你不可能沒有支持這1,000億。"],["何次長晉滄：跟委員報告，其實這幾天……"],["邱委員志偉：這不是讓台電去給員工加薪，不是這樣，不是增加他們的福利，而是要顧民生、顧產業。"],["何次長晉滄：是。跟委員報告，其實這幾天有工商團體，他們也都一直在對外說要支持，籲請朝野黨團都能夠支持政府撥補台電這1,000億，其實是有助於產業，同時能夠穩定物價，讓他們成本上不會增加太多，尤其在面對高關稅的衝擊之下，也可以讓我們國內的物價更穩定。"],["邱委員志偉：所以有充分的必要性，也有急迫性，是不是這樣？"],["何次長晉滄：是。"],["邱委員志偉：我甚至認為1,000億可能還不夠，因為這關稅到底會影響多長時間，沒有人可以去預測，所以最起碼1,000億可以穩定產業和人心，否則很多人都說看不到未來，所以這部分我們還是要極力去爭取，也希望所有產業界的代表能夠向國民黨跟民進黨發聲。羅明才在這邊，可能他也會支持台電增加1,000億，我覺得還要請產業界多讓國民黨及民眾黨了解基層的心聲。","另外，請教農業部陳部長。"],["陳部長駿季：委員好。"],["邱委員志偉：我看了一下，農業部大概是加了180億，是不是？"],["陳部長駿季：是，180億。"],["邱委員志偉：比例不高耶，只有不到5%，對不對？"],["陳部長駿季：4%左右。"],["邱委員志偉：我看了你的這些措施，大概是延續性的補貼跟資本性的支出，你們對中長期轉型的機制比不上經濟部的方案。"],["陳部長駿季：我跟委員報告，我們在短期就是希望透過資金的協助，所以在金融支持跟後面的外銷獎勵，外銷獎勵讓它持續，中間這個產業支持的部分，就是讓他們趁這個機會去做轉型，包括加值的轉型。"],["邱委員志偉：我是覺得你們還要兼顧中長期的產業轉型。"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["邱委員志偉：另外，如果農民需要政府的這筆經費，有關申貸、申請跟核撥的程序，你們要簡化，你們要思考怎麼樣做到從簡、從速、從寬。"],["陳部長駿季：我們農金署在這個部分過去一直在跟農民互動，所以已經有相當的簡化，這一次我們特別包括舊貸的部分也會來處理，然後新貸的部分包括利息差補貼，我們會用最快的時間去處理。"],["邱委員志偉：同樣的我也要請教何次長，相關的這些補貼未來是不是能夠再放寬，直接比照疫後條例？疫後條例是全部開放給所有中小企業，你說間接影響有時候很抽象，我想全面都會受到影響，大概沒有一家例外，就算電費這1,000億沒有給台電，所有的中小企業都受到影響，對不對？所以這個補貼的資格是不是能夠比照疫後條例？"],["何次長晉滄：我們現在是更優於，因為疫後條例是營業額要下降15%，那我們這次放寬到10%。另外，我們本來是有限定可能要輸美的產業才可以來申請，事實上我們現在也放寬了，只要受到衝擊的中小企業都可以來申請，所以事實上資格有大幅放寬。"],["邱委員志偉：不管是農業部或經濟部，只要受到關稅所影響的，不管是農業、漁業或者是傳統製造業，相關的審核程序應該從簡、從速、從寬。","繼續我想請問主計長，次長先留一下，台電王總也留一下。"],["主席：王總也留下來。"],["邱委員志偉：主計長，請教這個三個版本，即行政院的版本、國民黨的版本及民眾黨的版本，我看民眾黨版本裡面有把金額下限都訂出來了，以前有這樣訂定嗎？"],["陳主計長淑姿：對。"],["邱委員志偉：不管是行政院或是國民黨的版本，基本上只訂定一個總額，對不對？沒有講到細項，現在有細項會增加施政的困難度跟彈性，你的看法如何？"],["陳主計長淑姿：這個部分我們還要再研究是不是有違反……"],["邱委員志偉：你以前有碰到過這種立法例？沒有吧？"],["陳主計長淑姿：對，所以我們就是要……"],["邱委員志偉：你做這麼久都沒看過這種立法例，直接寫明金額要多少。"],["陳主計長淑姿：這個部分可能會限定金額，這樣是不是有違反財政紀律法的規範？這個部分我們要跟法律局做研究。"],["邱委員志偉：你們可能要研究一下，這個是侵犯行政權。"],["陳主計長淑姿：是的。"],["邱委員志偉：侵犯行政權，你也同意嗎？"],["陳主計長淑姿：我們認為比較有問題就是這個部分。"],["邱委員志偉：另外這是跨部會的預算，之前也有跨部會，以前跨部會都是國發會主導，為什麼這次要由經濟部來主導？這個金額那麼大，就由經濟部來做莊家？"],["陳主計長淑姿：這個是上面決定的，不是我們。"],["邱委員志偉：照理說由國發會來統合是比較好。"],["陳主計長淑姿：對，以往是國發會來做統籌。"],["邱委員志偉：最後30秒請教一下台電王總。有這1,000億跟沒有這1,000億，到底影響最大的部分是什麼？"],["王總經理耀庭：因為台電現在的淨值大概只有一千出頭的億而已，如果今天能源像是煤或天然氣的價格再有一點波動，再上去的話，萬一受國際情勢，那台電承受這方面的能力是不足的，不足的結果可能漲電價的壓力就非常大，所以我們期望有這1,000億增加我們的裕度，增加我們的韌性，這樣在每半年電價審議委員會在審議的時候，可以給我們考量，這個韌性就可以出來。"],["邱委員志偉：這個邏輯很清楚，所以這個條例是要增加和強化經濟社會國土安全的韌性。"],["王總經理耀庭：是。"],["邱委員志偉：你要達成國土安全跟經濟社會的韌性，台電要先有韌性，國防部也要先有韌性，海委會、海巡署也要有韌性，要有韌性才能確保經濟社會跟國土安全的韌性。","我一向詢答都很準時的，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝。","現在請羅明才委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":154,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-3-19,20-1","speakers":["謝衣鳯","賴士葆","張啓楷","林岱樺","邱議瑩","林德福","張嘉郡","郭國文","陳亭妃","賴瑞隆","呂玉玲","李彥秀","鍾佳濱","李坤城","陳俊宇","林思銘","鄭正鈐","黃珊珊","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","蔡易餘","陳超明","邱志偉","羅明才","楊瓊瓔","葉元之","王正旭","陳玉珍","邱鎮軍","顏寬恒","翁曉玲","蘇清泉","王美惠","許宇甄","牛煦庭"],"page_start":41,"meetingDate":["2025-05-14"],"gazette_id":"1144901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144901_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟、財政兩委員會第1次聯席會議紀錄","content":"審查：一、行政院函請審議「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及國土安全韌性特別條例草案」案；\n二、本院國民黨黨團擬具「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及民眾消費韌性特別條例草案」案；三、\n本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「因應國際情勢衝擊強化經濟社會韌性特別條例草案」案；四、本院委\n員蔡易餘等18人擬具「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及國土安全韌性特別條例草案」案；五、本院\n委員王美惠等17人擬具「因應國際情勢強化經濟社會及國土安全韌性特別條例草案」案（詢答）","agenda_id":"1144901_00002"}}}