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\"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:05,649 --> 00:00:30,768\n謝謝主席我想請一下國發會高副主委還有我們經濟部的郭部長來請部長跟高副主委首先先請一下高副主委一下因為賴總統在520談話當中說提到要成立主權基金的部分我想請教一下國發會這邊看法是怎麼樣我先簡單講一下因為前央行的\n\n2\n00:00:33,629 --> 00:00:53,427\n就是彭淮南那個總裁他有特別提到說他反對用外匯存底無償撥為主權基金的使用然後另外財政部跟央行他們都已經跳出來直接講說這個事情不歸他們管我想請教一下國發會對這部分的看法是怎麼樣\n\n3\n00:00:54,381 --> 00:01:14,271\n我想基本上總統已經宣示我們要成立主權基金那院長也有在院會裡面在那個立法院質詢的時候也明白表示我們會成立專案所以就我們國發會我們作為行政團隊的議員我們當然就是尊重總統跟那個院長的指示所以總統在做這樣的一個宣示之前的時候有沒有跟國發會這邊溝通過\n\n4\n00:01:16,272 --> 00:01:37,930\n我覺得有跟行政院相關的單位溝通過OK我為什麼特別提到這個問題因為那個副主委因為在113年12月13號的時候立法院曾經請國發會提出主權基金的一個規劃進度報告那麼在今年的1月15號國發會也回函了立法院你知道這件事情嗎\n\n5\n00:01:41,394 --> 00:02:03,266\n就我所知我們曾經因為前你知道這件事情嗎你知道今年1月15號國發會有回函立法院針對國發基金的一個資料我手上這一份非常的清楚國發基金還是對於那個主權基金對主權基金的一個回覆\n\n6\n00:02:05,233 --> 00:02:27,389\n你不知道是不是我直接跟你講在這份資料當中的時候那個國發會這邊很清楚的知道表示說他們邀集了央行主計總署財政部金管會勞動基金運用局公務員退府基金管理局共同討論得到的結論有四項\n\n7\n00:02:28,610 --> 00:02:48,836\n有四項結論第一個說國內已經有類似主權基金的機制而且操作績效良好這第一點第二點的時候強調主權基金追求報酬極大化波動風險高第三個部分提到如果需要提高外匯投資比例可以請央行研議\n\n8\n00:02:50,256 --> 00:03:12,123\n那麼第四個部分提到國發基金之中已經有類主權基金性質的台三公司正在進行全球策略的產業投資佈局所以結論的時候呢基本上國發會是不認為需要有主權基金的才四個月的時候竟然有發生這麼大的一個轉彎然後剛剛副主委所表示就是\n\n9\n00:03:13,363 --> 00:03:40,960\n我們聽不出來總統要做這樣主權基金的宣示的時候有跟國發會這邊先討論過或諮詢過國發會的意思我跟委員報告說因為這是1月15號的所以1月15號我們發函的時候我們是根據我們過去所以四個月就出現了重大變化您聽我講完就是我們有就是爭據我們之前跟各個相關部會我們也討論的\n\n10\n00:03:43,141 --> 00:04:06,614\n結論跟那個回復這個然後我要可以翻到那四個結論嗎第一個呢的確如果因為整個國發會給立法院的報告很清楚的認為其實不太需要主權基金結果四個月的時候你講說國發會今天找了這麼多的單位結果四個月之後的時候總統就做了另外一個不一樣的宣告\n\n11\n00:04:06,994 --> 00:04:31,688\n因為我想特別問一下部分因為在這個時間點宣告的時候很多國人其實很擔心一件事情因為我們郭部長剛陪我們前國發會的時候我們的行政院秘書長去了美國參加他們SLACUSA的部分的時候那強調要讓美國再次的偉大所以大家擔心是不是主權基金這次的時候要把台灣一些相關的一個基金去重壓美國\n\n12\n00:04:33,773 --> 00:04:49,713\n我覺得不能這樣說因為我剛才講到說我們其實主權基金有三個一個是策略性投資財務性投資或是mix那的確我們說我們現行的有一些譬如說我們的財三啊國發啊或者市場基金裡面也有一些\n\n13\n00:04:51,154 --> 00:05:12,348\n策略財務型投資的那種性質所以我們就會回答說我們國內也有類似的因為你要回答因為我時間有限你如果覺得要針對1月15號你們給立法院的一個主權基金的一個回報要做一個法轄彎的時候你之後再來跟我做一個很詳細的一個說明好不好那因為針對這個部分\n\n14\n00:05:13,849 --> 00:05:27,455\n很多國人很擔心這個主權基金是不是變成就像我們讓台積電到美國去就像我們在對等關稅當中的時候我們很快的在整個對美談判當中的時候很快的就貢獻出我們台灣的貢獻處為了要讓我們\n\n15\n00:05:30,777 --> 00:05:53,078\n前國發會主委我們國民新秘書長說要讓美國再次偉大我們擔心我們的主權基金是不是要配合這件事情我覺得我們主權基金只有一個目的就是讓台灣的產業競爭力更加的強化所以在之後我們對於整個相關的法所以到時候我們主權基金會是國發會這邊在主管嗎我們要看\n\n16\n00:05:53,938 --> 00:06:14,308\n行政院指定誰作為主管機關目前還沒有確定那這個問題剛丟出來我想說您這邊如果對於1月15號給立法院的資料跟你現在要再次對政府的一個政策做一個辯護的時候要怎麼樣轉彎你再跟本辦公室做一個很詳細的一個報告我們會跟委員仔細的解釋絕對不是法夾彎\n\n17\n00:06:15,569 --> 00:06:43,328\n然後我這邊我要特別問一件事情就是說因為在這一次就是賴總統的這個一年的報告當中的時候整個市政滿意度當中的時候我發現經濟的議題當中是民眾非常的不滿意的包括TVBS民調當中的時候我對經濟發展跟能源政策其實在整個滿意度當中都非常非常的偏低那麼在進新聞的民調當中的時候呢就是對經濟滿意度的\n\n18\n00:06:46,230 --> 00:06:47,791\n我請台電跟你說明一下OK\n\n19\n00:07:14,660 --> 00:07:32,974\n興達其實他還沒有除役他去年9月就到期對不對我們送審他在嚴審中他嚴審中的時候呢可是基本上沒有被批准所以當時的時候提到一個狀態就是說當我們的備載電量在8%以下的時候他可以作為緊急使用是不是這個情況\n\n20\n00:07:34,396 --> 00:07:47,170\n所以說現在我們的新達電廠30號藍莓酒現在我們在質詢這時間點它還在運作就表示我們現在的備載容量已經在8%左右或者低於8%的情況是這樣子嗎\n\n21\n00:07:48,712 --> 00:08:12,779\n他是在之前我們前幾天預估夜間風有可能不到8%所以他必須運作那機組的特性你運作之後不能讓他上來就馬上停他必須要適用機組的特性讓他慢慢的去做適度的降載所以他必須所以這個地方就像我之前幾個禮拜我問到一個大林五號機組天然氣機組的時候也是已經除夜之後的時候現在變成緊急使用然後\n\n22\n00:08:13,519 --> 00:08:28,026\n台電也在使用那現在星達電廠三四號藍莓機組我們這個時間點他還繼續在用然後已經到齊了然後你們說你們要研議可是還沒有過的時候呢他現在用緊急使用的時候然後我們現在正在燒\n\n23\n00:08:30,263 --> 00:08:51,600\n興達電廠30號燃煤機組那我這邊的時候我要特別跟那個郭部長這邊提到一個點你現在給我30秒鐘我做一個結論你超過5分鐘針對這個我們就是核管法已經過了你之前說你有跟我提到說我們最快的時候如果行政部門配合跟我們要去訂製新的燃料棒的時候大概需要16到18個月對不對\n\n24\n00:08:54,042 --> 00:09:19,613\n所以我在想說我們目前對於這個部分要怎麼樣的去讓台灣的電力其實能夠充足夠用因為德國去年比我們提早一年變成非核家園他們現在出現一個很清楚缺電跟電價高漲的情況他們也開始表示不反對法國他們要在歐盟當中把核能\n\n25\n00:09:21,138 --> 00:09:22,839\n我還是要懇請各位委員稍微遵守一下時間我都會給大家多幾分鐘\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n5649\t30768\t謝謝主席我想請一下國發會高副主委還有我們經濟部的郭部長來 請部長跟高副主委首先先請一下高副主委一下因為賴總統在520談話當中說提到要成立主權基金的部分我想請教一下國發會這邊看法是怎麼樣我先簡單講一下因為前央行的\n33629\t53427\t就是彭淮南那個總裁他有特別提到說他反對用外匯存底無償撥為主權基金的使用然後另外財政部跟央行他們都已經跳出來直接講說這個事情不歸他們管我想請教一下國發會對這部分的看法是怎麼樣\n54381\t74271\t我想基本上總統已經宣示我們要成立主權基金那院長也有在院會裡面在那個立法院質詢的時候也明白表示我們會成立專案所以就我們國發會我們作為行政團隊的議員我們當然就是尊重總統跟那個院長的指示所以總統在做這樣的一個宣示之前的時候有沒有跟國發會這邊溝通過\n76272\t97930\t我覺得有跟行政院相關的單位溝通過OK 我為什麼特別提到這個問題因為那個副主委因為在113年12月13號的時候立法院曾經請國發會提出主權基金的一個規劃進度報告那麼在今年的1月15號國發會也回函了立法院你知道這件事情嗎\n101394\t123266\t就我所知我們曾經因為前你知道這件事情嗎你知道今年1月15號國發會有回函立法院針對國發基金的一個資料我手上這一份非常的清楚國發基金還是對於那個主權基金對主權基金的一個回覆\n125233\t147389\t你不知道是不是我直接跟你講在這份資料當中的時候那個國發會這邊很清楚的知道表示說他們邀集了央行主計總署財政部金管會勞動基金運用局公務員退府基金管理局共同討論得到的結論有四項\n148610\t168836\t有四項結論第一個說國內已經有類似主權基金的機制而且操作績效良好這第一點第二點的時候強調主權基金追求報酬極大化波動風險高第三個部分提到如果需要提高外匯投資比例可以請央行研議\n170256\t192123\t那麼第四個部分提到國發基金之中已經有類主權基金性質的台三公司正在進行全球策略的產業投資佈局所以結論的時候呢基本上國發會是不認為需要有主權基金的才四個月的時候竟然有發生這麼大的一個轉彎然後剛剛副主委所表示就是\n193363\t220960\t我們聽不出來總統要做這樣主權基金的宣示的時候有跟國發會這邊先討論過或諮詢過國發會的意思我跟委員報告說因為這是1月15號的所以1月15號我們發函的時候我們是根據我們過去所以四個月就出現了重大變化您聽我講完就是我們有就是爭據我們之前跟各個相關部會我們也討論的\n223141\t246614\t結論跟那個回復這個然後我要 可以翻到那四個結論嗎第一個呢 的確 如果 因為整個國發會給立法院的報告很清楚的認為其實不太需要主權基金結果四個月的時候 你講說國發會今天找了這麼多的單位結果四個月之後的時候 總統就做了另外一個不一樣的宣告\n246994\t271688\t因為我想特別問一下部分因為在這個時間點宣告的時候很多國人其實很擔心一件事情因為我們郭部長剛陪我們前國發會的時候我們的行政院秘書長去了美國參加他們SLAC USA的部分的時候那強調要讓美國再次的偉大所以大家擔心是不是主權基金這次的時候要把台灣一些相關的一個基金去重壓美國\n273773\t289713\t我覺得不能這樣說因為我剛才講到說我們其實主權基金有三個一個是策略性投資財務性投資或是mix那的確我們說我們現行的有一些譬如說我們的財三啊國發啊或者市場基金裡面也有一些\n291154\t312348\t策略財務型投資的那種性質所以我們就會回答說我們國內也有類似的因為你要回答因為我時間有限你如果覺得要針對1月15號你們給立法院的一個主權基金的一個回報要做一個法轄彎的時候你之後再來跟我做一個很詳細的一個說明好不好那因為針對這個部分\n313849\t327455\t很多國人很擔心這個主權基金是不是變成就像我們讓台積電到美國去就像我們在對等關稅當中的時候我們很快的在整個對美談判當中的時候很快的就貢獻出我們台灣的貢獻處為了要讓我們\n330777\t353078\t前國發會主委我們國民新秘書長說要讓美國再次偉大我們擔心我們的主權基金是不是要配合這件事情我覺得我們主權基金只有一個目的就是讓台灣的產業競爭力更加的強化所以在之後我們對於整個相關的法所以到時候我們主權基金會是國發會這邊在主管嗎我們要看\n353938\t374308\t行政院指定誰作為主管機關目前還沒有確定那這個問題剛丟出來我想說您這邊如果對於1月15號給立法院的資料跟你現在要再次對政府的一個政策做一個辯護的時候要怎麼樣轉彎你再跟本辦公室做一個很詳細的一個報告我們會跟委員仔細的解釋絕對不是法夾彎\n375569\t403328\t然後我這邊我要特別問一件事情就是說因為在這一次就是賴總統的這個一年的報告當中的時候整個市政滿意度當中的時候我發現經濟的議題當中是民眾非常的不滿意的包括TVBS民調當中的時候我對經濟發展跟能源政策其實在整個滿意度當中都非常非常的偏低那麼在進新聞的民調當中的時候呢就是對經濟滿意度的\n406230\t407791\t我請台電跟你說明一下OK\n434660\t452974\t興達其實他還沒有除役他去年9月就到期對不對我們送審他在嚴審中他嚴審中的時候呢可是基本上沒有被批准所以當時的時候提到一個狀態就是說當我們的備載電量在8%以下的時候他可以作為緊急使用是不是這個情況\n454396\t467170\t所以說現在我們的新達電廠30號藍莓酒現在我們在質詢這時間點它還在運作就表示我們現在的備載容量已經在8%左右或者低於8%的情況是這樣子嗎\n468712\t492779\t他是在之前我們前幾天預估夜間風有可能不到8%所以他必須運作那機組的特性你運作之後不能讓他上來就馬上停他必須要適用機組的特性讓他慢慢的去做適度的降載所以他必須所以這個地方就像我之前幾個禮拜我問到一個大林五號機組天然氣機組的時候也是已經除夜之後的時候現在變成緊急使用然後\n493519\t508026\t台電也在使用那現在星達電廠三四號藍莓機組我們這個時間點他還繼續在用然後已經到齊了然後你們說你們要研議可是還沒有過的時候呢他現在用緊急使用的時候然後我們現在正在燒\n510263\t531600\t興達電廠30號燃煤機組那我這邊的時候我要特別跟那個郭部長這邊提到一個點你現在給我30秒鐘我做一個結論你超過5分鐘針對這個我們就是核管法已經過了你之前說你有跟我提到說我們最快的時候如果行政部門配合跟我們要去訂製新的燃料棒的時候大概需要16到18個月對不對\n534042\t559613\t所以我在想說我們目前對於這個部分要怎麼樣的去讓台灣的電力其實能夠充足夠用因為德國去年比我們提早一年變成非核家園他們現在出現一個很清楚缺電跟電價高漲的情況他們也開始表示不反對法國他們要在歐盟當中把核能\n561138\t562839\t我還是要懇請各位委員稍微遵守一下時間我都會給大家多幾分鐘\n","txt":"謝謝主席我想請一下國發會高副主委還有我們經濟部的郭部長來 請部長跟高副主委首先先請一下高副主委一下因為賴總統在520談話當中說提到要成立主權基金的部分我想請教一下國發會這邊看法是怎麼樣我先簡單講一下因為前央行的\n就是彭淮南那個總裁他有特別提到說他反對用外匯存底無償撥為主權基金的使用然後另外財政部跟央行他們都已經跳出來直接講說這個事情不歸他們管我想請教一下國發會對這部分的看法是怎麼樣\n我想基本上總統已經宣示我們要成立主權基金那院長也有在院會裡面在那個立法院質詢的時候也明白表示我們會成立專案所以就我們國發會我們作為行政團隊的議員我們當然就是尊重總統跟那個院長的指示所以總統在做這樣的一個宣示之前的時候有沒有跟國發會這邊溝通過\n我覺得有跟行政院相關的單位溝通過OK 我為什麼特別提到這個問題因為那個副主委因為在113年12月13號的時候立法院曾經請國發會提出主權基金的一個規劃進度報告那麼在今年的1月15號國發會也回函了立法院你知道這件事情嗎\n就我所知我們曾經因為前你知道這件事情嗎你知道今年1月15號國發會有回函立法院針對國發基金的一個資料我手上這一份非常的清楚國發基金還是對於那個主權基金對主權基金的一個回覆\n你不知道是不是我直接跟你講在這份資料當中的時候那個國發會這邊很清楚的知道表示說他們邀集了央行主計總署財政部金管會勞動基金運用局公務員退府基金管理局共同討論得到的結論有四項\n有四項結論第一個說國內已經有類似主權基金的機制而且操作績效良好這第一點第二點的時候強調主權基金追求報酬極大化波動風險高第三個部分提到如果需要提高外匯投資比例可以請央行研議\n那麼第四個部分提到國發基金之中已經有類主權基金性質的台三公司正在進行全球策略的產業投資佈局所以結論的時候呢基本上國發會是不認為需要有主權基金的才四個月的時候竟然有發生這麼大的一個轉彎然後剛剛副主委所表示就是\n我們聽不出來總統要做這樣主權基金的宣示的時候有跟國發會這邊先討論過或諮詢過國發會的意思我跟委員報告說因為這是1月15號的所以1月15號我們發函的時候我們是根據我們過去所以四個月就出現了重大變化您聽我講完就是我們有就是爭據我們之前跟各個相關部會我們也討論的\n結論跟那個回復這個然後我要 可以翻到那四個結論嗎第一個呢 的確 如果 因為整個國發會給立法院的報告很清楚的認為其實不太需要主權基金結果四個月的時候 你講說國發會今天找了這麼多的單位結果四個月之後的時候 總統就做了另外一個不一樣的宣告\n因為我想特別問一下部分因為在這個時間點宣告的時候很多國人其實很擔心一件事情因為我們郭部長剛陪我們前國發會的時候我們的行政院秘書長去了美國參加他們SLAC USA的部分的時候那強調要讓美國再次的偉大所以大家擔心是不是主權基金這次的時候要把台灣一些相關的一個基金去重壓美國\n我覺得不能這樣說因為我剛才講到說我們其實主權基金有三個一個是策略性投資財務性投資或是mix那的確我們說我們現行的有一些譬如說我們的財三啊國發啊或者市場基金裡面也有一些\n策略財務型投資的那種性質所以我們就會回答說我們國內也有類似的因為你要回答因為我時間有限你如果覺得要針對1月15號你們給立法院的一個主權基金的一個回報要做一個法轄彎的時候你之後再來跟我做一個很詳細的一個說明好不好那因為針對這個部分\n很多國人很擔心這個主權基金是不是變成就像我們讓台積電到美國去就像我們在對等關稅當中的時候我們很快的在整個對美談判當中的時候很快的就貢獻出我們台灣的貢獻處為了要讓我們\n前國發會主委我們國民新秘書長說要讓美國再次偉大我們擔心我們的主權基金是不是要配合這件事情我覺得我們主權基金只有一個目的就是讓台灣的產業競爭力更加的強化所以在之後我們對於整個相關的法所以到時候我們主權基金會是國發會這邊在主管嗎我們要看\n行政院指定誰作為主管機關目前還沒有確定那這個問題剛丟出來我想說您這邊如果對於1月15號給立法院的資料跟你現在要再次對政府的一個政策做一個辯護的時候要怎麼樣轉彎你再跟本辦公室做一個很詳細的一個報告我們會跟委員仔細的解釋絕對不是法夾彎\n然後我這邊我要特別問一件事情就是說因為在這一次就是賴總統的這個一年的報告當中的時候整個市政滿意度當中的時候我發現經濟的議題當中是民眾非常的不滿意的包括TVBS民調當中的時候我對經濟發展跟能源政策其實在整個滿意度當中都非常非常的偏低那麼在進新聞的民調當中的時候呢就是對經濟滿意度的\n我請台電跟你說明一下OK\n興達其實他還沒有除役他去年9月就到期對不對我們送審他在嚴審中他嚴審中的時候呢可是基本上沒有被批准所以當時的時候提到一個狀態就是說當我們的備載電量在8%以下的時候他可以作為緊急使用是不是這個情況\n所以說現在我們的新達電廠30號藍莓酒現在我們在質詢這時間點它還在運作就表示我們現在的備載容量已經在8%左右或者低於8%的情況是這樣子嗎\n他是在之前我們前幾天預估夜間風有可能不到8%所以他必須運作那機組的特性你運作之後不能讓他上來就馬上停他必須要適用機組的特性讓他慢慢的去做適度的降載所以他必須所以這個地方就像我之前幾個禮拜我問到一個大林五號機組天然氣機組的時候也是已經除夜之後的時候現在變成緊急使用然後\n台電也在使用那現在星達電廠三四號藍莓機組我們這個時間點他還繼續在用然後已經到齊了然後你們說你們要研議可是還沒有過的時候呢他現在用緊急使用的時候然後我們現在正在燒\n興達電廠30號燃煤機組那我這邊的時候我要特別跟那個郭部長這邊提到一個點你現在給我30秒鐘我做一個結論你超過5分鐘針對這個我們就是核管法已經過了你之前說你有跟我提到說我們最快的時候如果行政部門配合跟我們要去訂製新的燃料棒的時候大概需要16到18個月對不對\n所以我在想說我們目前對於這個部分要怎麼樣的去讓台灣的電力其實能夠充足夠用因為德國去年比我們提早一年變成非核家園他們現在出現一個很清楚缺電跟電價高漲的情況他們也開始表示不反對法國他們要在歐盟當中把核能\n我還是要懇請各位委員稍微遵守一下時間我都會給大家多幾分鐘\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:05.649 --> 00:30.768\n謝謝主席我想請一下國發會高副主委還有我們經濟部的郭部長來請部長跟高副主委首先先請一下高副主委一下因為賴總統在520談話當中說提到要成立主權基金的部分我想請教一下國發會這邊看法是怎麼樣我先簡單講一下因為前央行的\n\n00:33.629 --> 00:53.427\n就是彭淮南那個總裁他有特別提到說他反對用外匯存底無償撥為主權基金的使用然後另外財政部跟央行他們都已經跳出來直接講說這個事情不歸他們管我想請教一下國發會對這部分的看法是怎麼樣\n\n00:54.381 --> 01:14.271\n我想基本上總統已經宣示我們要成立主權基金那院長也有在院會裡面在那個立法院質詢的時候也明白表示我們會成立專案所以就我們國發會我們作為行政團隊的議員我們當然就是尊重總統跟那個院長的指示所以總統在做這樣的一個宣示之前的時候有沒有跟國發會這邊溝通過\n\n01:16.272 --> 01:37.930\n我覺得有跟行政院相關的單位溝通過OK我為什麼特別提到這個問題因為那個副主委因為在113年12月13號的時候立法院曾經請國發會提出主權基金的一個規劃進度報告那麼在今年的1月15號國發會也回函了立法院你知道這件事情嗎\n\n01:41.394 --> 02:03.266\n就我所知我們曾經因為前你知道這件事情嗎你知道今年1月15號國發會有回函立法院針對國發基金的一個資料我手上這一份非常的清楚國發基金還是對於那個主權基金對主權基金的一個回覆\n\n02:05.233 --> 02:27.389\n你不知道是不是我直接跟你講在這份資料當中的時候那個國發會這邊很清楚的知道表示說他們邀集了央行主計總署財政部金管會勞動基金運用局公務員退府基金管理局共同討論得到的結論有四項\n\n02:28.610 --> 02:48.836\n有四項結論第一個說國內已經有類似主權基金的機制而且操作績效良好這第一點第二點的時候強調主權基金追求報酬極大化波動風險高第三個部分提到如果需要提高外匯投資比例可以請央行研議\n\n02:50.256 --> 03:12.123\n那麼第四個部分提到國發基金之中已經有類主權基金性質的台三公司正在進行全球策略的產業投資佈局所以結論的時候呢基本上國發會是不認為需要有主權基金的才四個月的時候竟然有發生這麼大的一個轉彎然後剛剛副主委所表示就是\n\n03:13.363 --> 03:40.960\n我們聽不出來總統要做這樣主權基金的宣示的時候有跟國發會這邊先討論過或諮詢過國發會的意思我跟委員報告說因為這是1月15號的所以1月15號我們發函的時候我們是根據我們過去所以四個月就出現了重大變化您聽我講完就是我們有就是爭據我們之前跟各個相關部會我們也討論的\n\n03:43.141 --> 04:06.614\n結論跟那個回復這個然後我要可以翻到那四個結論嗎第一個呢的確如果因為整個國發會給立法院的報告很清楚的認為其實不太需要主權基金結果四個月的時候你講說國發會今天找了這麼多的單位結果四個月之後的時候總統就做了另外一個不一樣的宣告\n\n04:06.994 --> 04:31.688\n因為我想特別問一下部分因為在這個時間點宣告的時候很多國人其實很擔心一件事情因為我們郭部長剛陪我們前國發會的時候我們的行政院秘書長去了美國參加他們SLACUSA的部分的時候那強調要讓美國再次的偉大所以大家擔心是不是主權基金這次的時候要把台灣一些相關的一個基金去重壓美國\n\n04:33.773 --> 04:49.713\n我覺得不能這樣說因為我剛才講到說我們其實主權基金有三個一個是策略性投資財務性投資或是mix那的確我們說我們現行的有一些譬如說我們的財三啊國發啊或者市場基金裡面也有一些\n\n04:51.154 --> 05:12.348\n策略財務型投資的那種性質所以我們就會回答說我們國內也有類似的因為你要回答因為我時間有限你如果覺得要針對1月15號你們給立法院的一個主權基金的一個回報要做一個法轄彎的時候你之後再來跟我做一個很詳細的一個說明好不好那因為針對這個部分\n\n05:13.849 --> 05:27.455\n很多國人很擔心這個主權基金是不是變成就像我們讓台積電到美國去就像我們在對等關稅當中的時候我們很快的在整個對美談判當中的時候很快的就貢獻出我們台灣的貢獻處為了要讓我們\n\n05:30.777 --> 05:53.078\n前國發會主委我們國民新秘書長說要讓美國再次偉大我們擔心我們的主權基金是不是要配合這件事情我覺得我們主權基金只有一個目的就是讓台灣的產業競爭力更加的強化所以在之後我們對於整個相關的法所以到時候我們主權基金會是國發會這邊在主管嗎我們要看\n\n05:53.938 --> 06:14.308\n行政院指定誰作為主管機關目前還沒有確定那這個問題剛丟出來我想說您這邊如果對於1月15號給立法院的資料跟你現在要再次對政府的一個政策做一個辯護的時候要怎麼樣轉彎你再跟本辦公室做一個很詳細的一個報告我們會跟委員仔細的解釋絕對不是法夾彎\n\n06:15.569 --> 06:43.328\n然後我這邊我要特別問一件事情就是說因為在這一次就是賴總統的這個一年的報告當中的時候整個市政滿意度當中的時候我發現經濟的議題當中是民眾非常的不滿意的包括TVBS民調當中的時候我對經濟發展跟能源政策其實在整個滿意度當中都非常非常的偏低那麼在進新聞的民調當中的時候呢就是對經濟滿意度的\n\n06:46.230 --> 06:47.791\n我請台電跟你說明一下OK\n\n07:14.660 --> 07:32.974\n興達其實他還沒有除役他去年9月就到期對不對我們送審他在嚴審中他嚴審中的時候呢可是基本上沒有被批准所以當時的時候提到一個狀態就是說當我們的備載電量在8%以下的時候他可以作為緊急使用是不是這個情況\n\n07:34.396 --> 07:47.170\n所以說現在我們的新達電廠30號藍莓酒現在我們在質詢這時間點它還在運作就表示我們現在的備載容量已經在8%左右或者低於8%的情況是這樣子嗎\n\n07:48.712 --> 08:12.779\n他是在之前我們前幾天預估夜間風有可能不到8%所以他必須運作那機組的特性你運作之後不能讓他上來就馬上停他必須要適用機組的特性讓他慢慢的去做適度的降載所以他必須所以這個地方就像我之前幾個禮拜我問到一個大林五號機組天然氣機組的時候也是已經除夜之後的時候現在變成緊急使用然後\n\n08:13.519 --> 08:28.026\n台電也在使用那現在星達電廠三四號藍莓機組我們這個時間點他還繼續在用然後已經到齊了然後你們說你們要研議可是還沒有過的時候呢他現在用緊急使用的時候然後我們現在正在燒\n\n08:30.263 --> 08:51.600\n興達電廠30號燃煤機組那我這邊的時候我要特別跟那個郭部長這邊提到一個點你現在給我30秒鐘我做一個結論你超過5分鐘針對這個我們就是核管法已經過了你之前說你有跟我提到說我們最快的時候如果行政部門配合跟我們要去訂製新的燃料棒的時候大概需要16到18個月對不對\n\n08:54.042 --> 09:19.613\n所以我在想說我們目前對於這個部分要怎麼樣的去讓台灣的電力其實能夠充足夠用因為德國去年比我們提早一年變成非核家園他們現在出現一個很清楚缺電跟電價高漲的情況他們也開始表示不反對法國他們要在歐盟當中把核能\n\n09:21.138 --> 09:22.839\n我還是要懇請各位委員稍微遵守一下時間我都會給大家多幾分鐘\n\n","segments":[{"start":5.649,"end":30.768,"text":"謝謝主席我想請一下國發會高副主委還有我們經濟部的郭部長來 請部長跟高副主委首先先請一下高副主委一下因為賴總統在520談話當中說提到要成立主權基金的部分我想請教一下國發會這邊看法是怎麼樣我先簡單講一下因為前央行的"},{"start":33.629,"end":53.427,"text":"就是彭淮南那個總裁他有特別提到說他反對用外匯存底無償撥為主權基金的使用然後另外財政部跟央行他們都已經跳出來直接講說這個事情不歸他們管我想請教一下國發會對這部分的看法是怎麼樣"},{"start":54.381,"end":74.271,"text":"我想基本上總統已經宣示我們要成立主權基金那院長也有在院會裡面在那個立法院質詢的時候也明白表示我們會成立專案所以就我們國發會我們作為行政團隊的議員我們當然就是尊重總統跟那個院長的指示所以總統在做這樣的一個宣示之前的時候有沒有跟國發會這邊溝通過"},{"start":76.272,"end":97.93,"text":"我覺得有跟行政院相關的單位溝通過OK 我為什麼特別提到這個問題因為那個副主委因為在113年12月13號的時候立法院曾經請國發會提出主權基金的一個規劃進度報告那麼在今年的1月15號國發會也回函了立法院你知道這件事情嗎"},{"start":101.394,"end":123.266,"text":"就我所知我們曾經因為前你知道這件事情嗎你知道今年1月15號國發會有回函立法院針對國發基金的一個資料我手上這一份非常的清楚國發基金還是對於那個主權基金對主權基金的一個回覆"},{"start":125.233,"end":147.389,"text":"你不知道是不是我直接跟你講在這份資料當中的時候那個國發會這邊很清楚的知道表示說他們邀集了央行主計總署財政部金管會勞動基金運用局公務員退府基金管理局共同討論得到的結論有四項"},{"start":148.61,"end":168.836,"text":"有四項結論第一個說國內已經有類似主權基金的機制而且操作績效良好這第一點第二點的時候強調主權基金追求報酬極大化波動風險高第三個部分提到如果需要提高外匯投資比例可以請央行研議"},{"start":170.256,"end":192.123,"text":"那麼第四個部分提到國發基金之中已經有類主權基金性質的台三公司正在進行全球策略的產業投資佈局所以結論的時候呢基本上國發會是不認為需要有主權基金的才四個月的時候竟然有發生這麼大的一個轉彎然後剛剛副主委所表示就是"},{"start":193.363,"end":220.96,"text":"我們聽不出來總統要做這樣主權基金的宣示的時候有跟國發會這邊先討論過或諮詢過國發會的意思我跟委員報告說因為這是1月15號的所以1月15號我們發函的時候我們是根據我們過去所以四個月就出現了重大變化您聽我講完就是我們有就是爭據我們之前跟各個相關部會我們也討論的"},{"start":223.141,"end":246.614,"text":"結論跟那個回復這個然後我要 可以翻到那四個結論嗎第一個呢 的確 如果 因為整個國發會給立法院的報告很清楚的認為其實不太需要主權基金結果四個月的時候 你講說國發會今天找了這麼多的單位結果四個月之後的時候 總統就做了另外一個不一樣的宣告"},{"start":246.994,"end":271.688,"text":"因為我想特別問一下部分因為在這個時間點宣告的時候很多國人其實很擔心一件事情因為我們郭部長剛陪我們前國發會的時候我們的行政院秘書長去了美國參加他們SLAC USA的部分的時候那強調要讓美國再次的偉大所以大家擔心是不是主權基金這次的時候要把台灣一些相關的一個基金去重壓美國"},{"start":273.773,"end":289.713,"text":"我覺得不能這樣說因為我剛才講到說我們其實主權基金有三個一個是策略性投資財務性投資或是mix那的確我們說我們現行的有一些譬如說我們的財三啊國發啊或者市場基金裡面也有一些"},{"start":291.154,"end":312.348,"text":"策略財務型投資的那種性質所以我們就會回答說我們國內也有類似的因為你要回答因為我時間有限你如果覺得要針對1月15號你們給立法院的一個主權基金的一個回報要做一個法轄彎的時候你之後再來跟我做一個很詳細的一個說明好不好那因為針對這個部分"},{"start":313.849,"end":327.455,"text":"很多國人很擔心這個主權基金是不是變成就像我們讓台積電到美國去就像我們在對等關稅當中的時候我們很快的在整個對美談判當中的時候很快的就貢獻出我們台灣的貢獻處為了要讓我們"},{"start":330.777,"end":353.078,"text":"前國發會主委我們國民新秘書長說要讓美國再次偉大我們擔心我們的主權基金是不是要配合這件事情我覺得我們主權基金只有一個目的就是讓台灣的產業競爭力更加的強化所以在之後我們對於整個相關的法所以到時候我們主權基金會是國發會這邊在主管嗎我們要看"},{"start":353.938,"end":374.308,"text":"行政院指定誰作為主管機關目前還沒有確定那這個問題剛丟出來我想說您這邊如果對於1月15號給立法院的資料跟你現在要再次對政府的一個政策做一個辯護的時候要怎麼樣轉彎你再跟本辦公室做一個很詳細的一個報告我們會跟委員仔細的解釋絕對不是法夾彎"},{"start":375.569,"end":403.328,"text":"然後我這邊我要特別問一件事情就是說因為在這一次就是賴總統的這個一年的報告當中的時候整個市政滿意度當中的時候我發現經濟的議題當中是民眾非常的不滿意的包括TVBS民調當中的時候我對經濟發展跟能源政策其實在整個滿意度當中都非常非常的偏低那麼在進新聞的民調當中的時候呢就是對經濟滿意度的"},{"start":406.23,"end":407.791,"text":"我請台電跟你說明一下OK"},{"start":434.66,"end":452.974,"text":"興達其實他還沒有除役他去年9月就到期對不對我們送審他在嚴審中他嚴審中的時候呢可是基本上沒有被批准所以當時的時候提到一個狀態就是說當我們的備載電量在8%以下的時候他可以作為緊急使用是不是這個情況"},{"start":454.396,"end":467.17,"text":"所以說現在我們的新達電廠30號藍莓酒現在我們在質詢這時間點它還在運作就表示我們現在的備載容量已經在8%左右或者低於8%的情況是這樣子嗎"},{"start":468.712,"end":492.779,"text":"他是在之前我們前幾天預估夜間風有可能不到8%所以他必須運作那機組的特性你運作之後不能讓他上來就馬上停他必須要適用機組的特性讓他慢慢的去做適度的降載所以他必須所以這個地方就像我之前幾個禮拜我問到一個大林五號機組天然氣機組的時候也是已經除夜之後的時候現在變成緊急使用然後"},{"start":493.519,"end":508.026,"text":"台電也在使用那現在星達電廠三四號藍莓機組我們這個時間點他還繼續在用然後已經到齊了然後你們說你們要研議可是還沒有過的時候呢他現在用緊急使用的時候然後我們現在正在燒"},{"start":510.263,"end":531.6,"text":"興達電廠30號燃煤機組那我這邊的時候我要特別跟那個郭部長這邊提到一個點你現在給我30秒鐘我做一個結論你超過5分鐘針對這個我們就是核管法已經過了你之前說你有跟我提到說我們最快的時候如果行政部門配合跟我們要去訂製新的燃料棒的時候大概需要16到18個月對不對"},{"start":534.042,"end":559.613,"text":"所以我在想說我們目前對於這個部分要怎麼樣的去讓台灣的電力其實能夠充足夠用因為德國去年比我們提早一年變成非核家園他們現在出現一個很清楚缺電跟電價高漲的情況他們也開始表示不反對法國他們要在歐盟當中把核能"},{"start":561.138,"end":562.839,"text":"我還是要懇請各位委員稍微遵守一下時間我都會給大家多幾分鐘"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":359,"blocks":[["鄭委員正鈐：（9時56分）謝謝主席，我想請一下國發會高副主委還有經濟部郭部長。"],["主席：請部長跟高副主委。"],["鄭委員正鈐：首先先請一下高副主委，因為……"],["高副主任委員仙桂：委員好。"],["鄭委員正鈐：賴總統在520談話當中提到要成立主權基金的部分，我想請教一下國發會這邊看法是怎麼樣？我先簡單講一下，因為前央行總裁彭淮南，他有特別提到，他反對用外匯存底無償撥為主權基金的使用。另外，財政部跟央行他們都已經跳出來直接講說這個事情不歸他們管，我想請教一下，國發會對於這部分的看法是怎麼樣？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：我想基本上總統已經宣示我們要成立主權基金，院長也有在立法院質詢時明白表示我們會成立專案，所以我們國發會作為行政團隊的一員，我們當然尊重總統跟院長的指示。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，所以總統在做這樣的宣示之前，有沒有跟國發會這邊溝通過？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：我覺得有跟行政院相關的單位溝通過。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，我為什麼特別提到這個問題？副主委，因為在113年12月13號的時候，立法院曾經請國發會提出主權基金的規劃進度報告，在今年的1月15號，國發會也回函立法院，你知道這件事情嗎？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：就我所知，我們曾經因為……"],["鄭委員正鈐：你知道這件事情嗎？你知道今年1月15號國發會有回函立法院，是針對國發基金的資料，我手上這一份非常的清楚……"],["高副主任委員仙桂：是國發基金還是主權基金？"],["鄭委員正鈐：對主權基金的一個回函，你不知道，是不是？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：是，我不曉得。"],["鄭委員正鈐：我直接跟你講，在這份資料當中，國發會很清楚的表示有邀集央行、主計總處、財政部、金管會、勞動基金運用局、公務人員退撫基金管理局共同討論，得到的結論有四項：第一點是國內已經有類似主權基金的機制，而且操作績效良好，這是第一點。第二點是強調主權基金追求報酬極大化，波動風險高。第三點提到如果需要提高外匯投資比例，可請央行研議。第四點提到國發基金之中已有類主權基金性質的台杉公司正在進行全球策略性產業投資布局。所以結論就是基本上國發會不認為需要有主權基金，但是才4個月的時間竟然發生這麼大的轉彎……"],["高副主任委員仙桂：委員，我只能跟……"],["鄭委員正鈐：然後剛剛副主委所表示的，我們聽不出來總統要做主權基金這項宣示時有跟國發會先討論過或諮詢過國發會的意見。"],["高副主任委員仙桂：跟委員報告，因為這是1月15號的函，1月15號我們發函的時候，我們是根據過去曾經……"],["鄭委員正鈐：所以4個月就出現了重大變化啊？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：您聽我講完，我們是根據之前跟各相關部會討論的結論來回函，簡報可以翻到那四個結論嗎？第一個，的確……"],["鄭委員正鈐：因為時間有限……"],["高副主任委員仙桂：好，主權基金如果……"],["鄭委員正鈐：因為整個國發會給立法院的報告很清楚地認為不太需要主權基金，國發會當初找了這麼多個單位來討論，結果4個月之後，總統就做了另外一個不一樣的宣告！"],["高副主任委員仙桂：因為……"],["鄭委員正鈐：我想特別問一下，他在這個時間點宣告，很多國人其實很擔心一件事情，因為我們郭部長才剛陪行政院秘書長（前國發會主委）去美國參加他們的SelectUSA，強調要讓美國再次偉大，所以大家擔心這個主權基金是不是要把臺灣一些相關的基金去重押美國？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：我覺得不能這樣說，因為我剛才講到，主權基金有三種，分別是策略型投資、財務型投資或是mix，的確我們現行有一些，譬如說台杉、國發或者四大基金裡面也有一些財務型投資的那種性質，所以我們就會回答說國內也有類似的基金有同樣的性質。"],["鄭委員正鈐：副主委，因為我時間有限，你如果要針對1月15號你們給立法院有關主權基金的回函要做一個髮夾彎的時候，請你之後再來跟我做一個很詳細的說明，好不好？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：好。"],["鄭委員正鈐：針對這個部分，很多國人很擔心，這個主權基金是不是會變成像我們讓台積電到美國去，就像在對等關稅當中，我們在對美談判的時候很快地就貢獻出我們臺灣能夠貢獻的，為了我們前國發會主委的龔明鑫秘書長說要讓美國再次偉大，我們擔心我們的主權基金是不是要配合這件事情？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：我覺得我們主權基金只有一個目的，就是讓臺灣的產業競爭力更加的強化，不是在於要扶植任何的國家。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，所以之後我們對於整個相關的法……所以到時候我們的主權基金是國發會這邊主管嗎？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：要看行政院指定誰作為主管機關，目前還沒有確定。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，這個問題才剛丟出來，您這邊如果對於1月15號給立法院的資料，跟你現在要再次對政府的政策做辯護的時候，要怎麼樣轉彎，請你再跟本辦公室做一個很詳細的報告。"],["高副主任委員仙桂：我們會跟委員仔細地解釋，絕對不是髮夾彎。"],["鄭委員正鈐：好。我在這邊要特別問一件事情，在這一次賴總統的周年施政滿意度調查當中，我發現民眾對於經濟的部分是非常不滿意，以TVBS民調來看，民眾對於經濟發展、能源政策的滿意比率在整個滿意度調查當中都非常非常的偏低；在鏡新聞的民調當中，對經濟滿意度的比率也是最低的，是各項指標裡面最低的。","因為時間有限，我想特別請教郭部長，因為核管法已經修正通過了，對於現在台電的用電情況，興達電廠的3、4號燃煤機組在現在這個時間點還繼續在運轉當中，對不對？"],["郭部長智輝：我請台電跟你說明一下。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK。"],["蔡副總經理志孟：興達其實還沒有除役。"],["鄭委員正鈐：可是它去年9月就到期，對不對？"],["蔡副總經理志孟：我們送審，現在在延審中。"],["鄭委員正鈐：它在延審中，可是基本上沒有被批准。當時有提到一個狀態，就是當我們的備載電量在8%以下的時候，它可以作為緊急使用，是不是這個情況？"],["蔡副總經理志孟：是，因為那是環評……"],["鄭委員正鈐：所以興達電廠的3、4號燃煤機組，現在我們在質詢的這個時間點還在運作，就表示我們現在的備載容量已經在8%左右或者低於8%的情況，是這樣子嗎？"],["蔡副總經理志孟：是在之前，我們前幾天預估夜尖峰有可能不到8%，所以它必須運作。以機組的特性來說，運作之後不能一上來就馬上停，必須要適用機組的特性，讓它慢慢的、適度的去降載，所以它必須配合整個系統……"],["鄭委員正鈐：所以這個就像我前幾個禮拜問到大林5號機組……"],["主席：鄭委員，時間到了！"],["鄭委員正鈐：大林天然氣機組，也是已經在除役之後，現在變為緊急使用，然後台電也在使用。現在興達電廠3、4號燃煤機組，在現在這個時間點還繼續在用，已經到期了，你們說要延役，可是還沒有通過，就以緊急使用的方式，現在正在燒興達電廠3、4號燃煤機組。我在這邊要特別跟郭部長提到一個點……"],["主席：鄭委員，你的時間到了喔！"],["鄭委員正鈐：你再給我30秒鐘，我做個結論。"],["主席：你已經超過5分鐘了！"],["鄭委員正鈐：核管法已經過了，之前你有跟我提到，以最快的時間來說，如果行政部門配合，我們要去訂製新的燃料棒大概需要16到18個月，對不對？所以我在想我們目前對於這個部分要怎麼樣讓臺灣的電力能夠充足夠用，因為德國去年比我們提早一年變成非核家園，他們現在出現了很清楚的缺電跟電價高漲的情況，他們也開始表示不反對法國要在歐盟當中把核能提為再生能源的主張，所以德國的態度也在做很清楚的改變……"],["主席：鄭委員，你的時間到了。"],["鄭委員正鈐：好，我們希望郭部長這邊針對核管法通過之後，經濟部要怎麼去做我們的能源政策，給本席一個很清楚的時間點的說明，好不好？"],["郭部長智輝：我們會參考大家的意見提出修正……"],["主席：部長，您再書面回復，好不好？"],["郭部長智輝：好。"],["主席：謝謝。","我還是要懇請各位委員稍微遵守一下時間，我都會給大家多幾分鐘，但是……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：今天是幾分鐘？"],["主席：今天是5分鐘，他已經說了10分鐘，我都會讓你們說10分鐘，都是你們已經說了10分鐘之後，我才會站起來啦！"],["楊委員瓊瓔：你……"],["主席：我自己說5分鐘而已喔！"],["楊委員瓊瓔：我一早5點半就出門，來這裡只說5分鐘！"],["主席：今天的主席不是我，我是代理的。","請鄭天財委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":230,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-19-14","speakers":["蔡易餘","陳亭妃","邱議瑩","張啓楷","林岱樺","鄭正鈐","楊瓊瓔","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","陳超明","謝衣鳯","賴瑞隆","邱志偉","張嘉郡","羅廷瑋","徐富癸","徐欣瑩","黃國昌","呂玉玲"],"page_start":139,"meetingDate":["2025-05-22"],"gazette_id":"1145201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1145201_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第14次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、處理或審查114年度中央政府總預算有關經濟部及所屬主管預算凍結案等 39案；二、處理或\n審查 114 年度中央政府總預算有關國家發展委員會及所屬主管預算凍結案等 21 案；三、繼續審\n查：(一)行政院函請審議「個人資料保護法部分條文修正草案」案、(二)本院委員王美惠等18人\n擬具「個人資料保護法部分條文修正草案」案、(三)本院委員羅廷瑋等17人擬具「個人資料保護\n法部分條文修正草案」案、( 四) 本院委員李坤城等16 人擬具「個人資料保護法部分條文修正草\n案」案、(五)本院委員郭昱晴等19人擬具「個人資料保護法部分條文修正草案」案、(六)本院委\n員陳亭妃等16人擬具「個人資料保護法第十二條、第二十七條及第四十八條條文修正草案」案、\n(七)本院委員蔡易餘等18人擬具「個人資料保護法部分條文修正草案」案","agenda_id":"1145201_00003"}}}