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\"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:05,129 --> 00:00:31,997\n主席有請曾主委曾主委有請委員好主委你好我從在2008年的時候在憲府時期的時候就參與這個平普正名的運動那事隔多年了終於在將近三年前的時候呢這個憲法第17號已經出爐給予那個平普族親有一道的希望\n\n2\n00:00:33,033 --> 00:00:52,519\n這三年來我也曾經在原民會這邊做過要求要跟民間對話過往國家對這個評普組只有予以文化的承認而憲判的結果是正式的予以政治的承認而這個政治的承認要一些法定權利的給予\n\n3\n00:00:54,465 --> 00:01:21,021\n但是必須符合一些要件一來三年之內要完成立法那不是修法就是立新法民間一直想說要用修法的方式但是你們卻用新法的方式這個部分待會請主委說明一下大家一直沒有辦法接受但就實質的內容來說大家希望說集體的權利的部分應該符合原住民基本法\n\n4\n00:01:21,826 --> 00:01:33,276\n而另外的部分呢在限制當中有提到說呢斟酌於國家資源要另以法令定制用一個三年內要制定但是所有的民間的版本希望在個人的權利的部分能夠一年內達成諸位這頭還沒有一個討論商量的空間\n\n5\n00:01:41,963 --> 00:02:09,559\n主委請回答好這個平埔族平埔族這個生分法我們在5月15號已經送大業也送來送很晚了我講老師說比較慢還是我們三催四趕是三催四促才產生出來是好那我們推算那現在就是說我們的平埔的這個族群的朋友他們是希望所有的錢利都能夠一次就到位那但在這個\n\n6\n00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:22,089\n原來的山地原住民跟平地原住民來講是希望說他是有別以這兩個族群的那這個原住民族的這個基本法\n\n7\n00:02:23,134 --> 00:02:48,275\n他是在規範這個3D原住民跟平地原住民的那這個這個平埔族群是後來的那當然有一些這個基本法裡面有一些確實沒有辦法來規範現在的這個平埔原住民所以我們當然要用另外的專法來為平埔族的這個族人量身打造為他們在我覺得關鍵其實在那三年跟一年之間是啊\n\n8\n00:02:48,815 --> 00:03:14,529\n有關於個人權益的部分你用三年的部分老實講大家就會覺得充滿變數充滿變數不只是內容的問題而已而且還有包括整部法令的部分你現在現階段你如果這麼有自信的話用一個新法的方式想要來處理這個平埔原住民的身份跟權益的問題的話那我就問你\n\n9\n00:03:15,427 --> 00:03:40,265\n你們現在推出來之後你有把握在這個會期當中能夠通過嗎我們希望在這個會期當中下個會期九月就開始了啊是十月就到期了不是嗎對主委我覺得你沒有什麼危機感如果十月就還是這個聲紋沒有通過的話我們評普原住民主的這個民主認定我們立刻就會啟動\n\n10\n00:03:41,728 --> 00:04:05,049\n對認定是該是啟動嘛但是權益的部分規範還是模模糊糊嘛沒有一個法令上的依據嘛憲判就希望你三年內完成立法工作嘛是對不是嗎是就是主委您的責任啊是啊對啊那現在又出現啊出現了另一個委員的版本啊連原住民三個字連提都不提基本上這根本是違憲的嘛不是嗎沒有錯這個當然剛剛都沒有聽到你講\n\n11\n00:04:06,348 --> 00:04:27,336\n可是問題是現實的政治多數當中這個違憲的法案如果萬一通過的話那你來怎麼辦我就問你啊這個如果是內容的一個法律來推過的話當然我們沒有辦法接受啦我們也會拜託行政院這裡也要提出至少也要提出呼籲或者是釋憲啊所以說呢萬一萬一\n\n12\n00:04:28,476 --> 00:04:41,466\n如果呢,因為是花一彩,我願意承認原住民的身份,違反了第17號判,現判的話,你還是可以踩住你的基本的立場,該赴議的時候赴議,該釋憲的時候要釋憲,否則這個矮化嘛,這個歧視嘛,對不對?\n\n13\n00:04:47,370 --> 00:05:09,602\n所以主委你的立場要踩住啊而且很重要的是說這內容的部分要如何讓這個憲法的判決得以這個落實之外還有部分還要讓這個竹青的這個期待可以落實啊所以竹青期待落實的部分的這個內容之外我覺得趁這個機會啦反正現在研會已經\n\n14\n00:05:11,812 --> 00:05:27,595\n成為自己的事實了嘛你不如就這個時候一來加強這個立法工作在這個會期把它完成二來加強對話再來台南一次因為西拉雅是平埔族當中最大的文化儀式祭典也是最完整的\n\n15\n00:05:28,996 --> 00:05:48,421\n現階段呢基本上他們行動是最積極的你能不能撥個時間來下來跟台南對話一下會我們要盡快就趕快趕快下去我是說這個會期之內喔對啊趕快安排喔加強民間對話積極推動立法讓憲判能夠得以早日落實好不好加油謝謝好謝謝郭國文委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n5129\t31997\t主席有請曾主委曾主委有請委員好主委你好我從在2008年的時候在憲府時期的時候就參與這個平普正名的運動那事隔多年了終於在將近三年前的時候呢這個憲法第17號已經出爐給予那個平普族親有一道的希望\n33033\t52519\t這三年來我也曾經在原民會這邊做過要求要跟民間對話過往國家對這個評普組只有予以文化的承認而憲判的結果是正式的予以政治的承認而這個政治的承認要一些法定權利的給予\n54465\t81021\t但是必須符合一些要件一來三年之內要完成立法那不是修法就是立新法民間一直想說要用修法的方式但是你們卻用新法的方式這個部分待會請主委說明一下大家一直沒有辦法接受但就實質的內容來說大家希望說集體的權利的部分應該符合原住民基本法\n81826\t93276\t而另外的部分呢 在限制當中有提到說呢 斟酌於國家資源要另以法令定制 用一個三年內要制定但是所有的民間的版本 希望在個人的權利的部分能夠一年內達成諸位 這頭還沒有一個討論 商量的空間\n101963\t129559\t主委請回答好這個平埔族平埔族這個生分法我們在5月15號已經送大業也送來送很晚了我講老師說比較慢還是我們三催四趕是三催四促才產生出來是好那我們推算那現在就是說我們的平埔的這個族群的朋友他們是希望所有的錢利都能夠一次就到位那但在這個\n131560\t142089\t原來的山地原住民跟平地原住民來講是希望說他是有別以這兩個族群的那這個原住民族的這個基本法\n143134\t168275\t他是在規範這個3D原住民跟平地原住民的那這個這個平埔族群是後來的那當然有一些這個基本法裡面有一些確實沒有辦法來規範現在的這個平埔原住民所以我們當然要用另外的專法來為平埔族的這個族人量身打造為他們在我覺得關鍵其實在那三年跟一年之間是啊\n168815\t194529\t有關於個人權益的部分你用三年的部分老實講大家就會覺得充滿變數充滿變數不只是內容的問題而已而且還有包括整部法令的部分你現在現階段你如果這麼有自信的話用一個新法的方式想要來處理這個平埔原住民的身份跟權益的問題的話那我就問你\n195427\t220265\t你們現在推出來之後 你有把握在這個會期當中能夠通過嗎我們希望在這個會期當中下個會期九月就開始了啊是十月就到期了不是嗎對主委我覺得你沒有什麼危機感如果十月就還是這個聲紋沒有通過的話我們評普原住民主的這個民主認定我們立刻就會啟動\n221728\t245049\t對 認定是該是啟動嘛 但是權益的部分規範還是模模糊糊嘛沒有一個法令上的依據嘛 憲判就希望你三年內完成立法工作嘛 是對 不是嗎 是就是主委您的責任啊 是啊對啊 那現在又出現啊 出現了另一個委員的版本啊連原住民三個字連提都不提基本上這根本是違憲的嘛 不是嗎沒有錯 這個當然 剛剛都沒有聽到你講\n246348\t267336\t可是問題是現實的政治多數當中這個違憲的法案如果萬一通過的話那你來怎麼辦我就問你啊這個如果是內容的一個法律來推過的話當然我們沒有辦法接受啦我們也會拜託行政院這裡也要提出至少也要提出呼籲或者是釋憲啊所以說呢萬一萬一\n268476\t281466\t如果呢,因為是花一彩,我願意承認原住民的身份,違反了第17號判,現判的話,你還是可以踩住你的基本的立場,該赴議的時候赴議,該釋憲的時候要釋憲,否則這個矮化嘛,這個歧視嘛,對不對?\n287370\t309602\t所以主委你的立場要踩住啊而且很重要的是說這內容的部分要如何讓這個憲法的判決得以這個落實之外還有部分還要讓這個竹青的這個期待可以落實啊所以竹青期待落實的部分的這個內容之外我覺得趁這個機會啦反正現在研會已經\n311812\t327595\t成為自己的事實了嘛你不如就這個時候一來加強這個立法工作在這個會期把它完成二來加強對話再來台南一次因為西拉雅是平埔族當中最大的文化儀式祭典也是最完整的\n328996\t348421\t現階段呢 基本上他們行動是最積極的你能不能撥個時間來下來跟台南對話一下會 我們要盡快就趕快 趕快下去我是說這個會期之內喔對啊 趕快安排喔加強民間對話 積極推動立法讓憲判能夠得以早日落實 好不好加油謝謝好 謝謝郭國文委員\n","txt":"主席有請曾主委曾主委有請委員好主委你好我從在2008年的時候在憲府時期的時候就參與這個平普正名的運動那事隔多年了終於在將近三年前的時候呢這個憲法第17號已經出爐給予那個平普族親有一道的希望\n這三年來我也曾經在原民會這邊做過要求要跟民間對話過往國家對這個評普組只有予以文化的承認而憲判的結果是正式的予以政治的承認而這個政治的承認要一些法定權利的給予\n但是必須符合一些要件一來三年之內要完成立法那不是修法就是立新法民間一直想說要用修法的方式但是你們卻用新法的方式這個部分待會請主委說明一下大家一直沒有辦法接受但就實質的內容來說大家希望說集體的權利的部分應該符合原住民基本法\n而另外的部分呢 在限制當中有提到說呢 斟酌於國家資源要另以法令定制 用一個三年內要制定但是所有的民間的版本 希望在個人的權利的部分能夠一年內達成諸位 這頭還沒有一個討論 商量的空間\n主委請回答好這個平埔族平埔族這個生分法我們在5月15號已經送大業也送來送很晚了我講老師說比較慢還是我們三催四趕是三催四促才產生出來是好那我們推算那現在就是說我們的平埔的這個族群的朋友他們是希望所有的錢利都能夠一次就到位那但在這個\n原來的山地原住民跟平地原住民來講是希望說他是有別以這兩個族群的那這個原住民族的這個基本法\n他是在規範這個3D原住民跟平地原住民的那這個這個平埔族群是後來的那當然有一些這個基本法裡面有一些確實沒有辦法來規範現在的這個平埔原住民所以我們當然要用另外的專法來為平埔族的這個族人量身打造為他們在我覺得關鍵其實在那三年跟一年之間是啊\n有關於個人權益的部分你用三年的部分老實講大家就會覺得充滿變數充滿變數不只是內容的問題而已而且還有包括整部法令的部分你現在現階段你如果這麼有自信的話用一個新法的方式想要來處理這個平埔原住民的身份跟權益的問題的話那我就問你\n你們現在推出來之後 你有把握在這個會期當中能夠通過嗎我們希望在這個會期當中下個會期九月就開始了啊是十月就到期了不是嗎對主委我覺得你沒有什麼危機感如果十月就還是這個聲紋沒有通過的話我們評普原住民主的這個民主認定我們立刻就會啟動\n對 認定是該是啟動嘛 但是權益的部分規範還是模模糊糊嘛沒有一個法令上的依據嘛 憲判就希望你三年內完成立法工作嘛 是對 不是嗎 是就是主委您的責任啊 是啊對啊 那現在又出現啊 出現了另一個委員的版本啊連原住民三個字連提都不提基本上這根本是違憲的嘛 不是嗎沒有錯 這個當然 剛剛都沒有聽到你講\n可是問題是現實的政治多數當中這個違憲的法案如果萬一通過的話那你來怎麼辦我就問你啊這個如果是內容的一個法律來推過的話當然我們沒有辦法接受啦我們也會拜託行政院這裡也要提出至少也要提出呼籲或者是釋憲啊所以說呢萬一萬一\n如果呢,因為是花一彩,我願意承認原住民的身份,違反了第17號判,現判的話,你還是可以踩住你的基本的立場,該赴議的時候赴議,該釋憲的時候要釋憲,否則這個矮化嘛,這個歧視嘛,對不對?\n所以主委你的立場要踩住啊而且很重要的是說這內容的部分要如何讓這個憲法的判決得以這個落實之外還有部分還要讓這個竹青的這個期待可以落實啊所以竹青期待落實的部分的這個內容之外我覺得趁這個機會啦反正現在研會已經\n成為自己的事實了嘛你不如就這個時候一來加強這個立法工作在這個會期把它完成二來加強對話再來台南一次因為西拉雅是平埔族當中最大的文化儀式祭典也是最完整的\n現階段呢 基本上他們行動是最積極的你能不能撥個時間來下來跟台南對話一下會 我們要盡快就趕快 趕快下去我是說這個會期之內喔對啊 趕快安排喔加強民間對話 積極推動立法讓憲判能夠得以早日落實 好不好加油謝謝好 謝謝郭國文委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:05.129 --> 00:31.997\n主席有請曾主委曾主委有請委員好主委你好我從在2008年的時候在憲府時期的時候就參與這個平普正名的運動那事隔多年了終於在將近三年前的時候呢這個憲法第17號已經出爐給予那個平普族親有一道的希望\n\n00:33.033 --> 00:52.519\n這三年來我也曾經在原民會這邊做過要求要跟民間對話過往國家對這個評普組只有予以文化的承認而憲判的結果是正式的予以政治的承認而這個政治的承認要一些法定權利的給予\n\n00:54.465 --> 01:21.021\n但是必須符合一些要件一來三年之內要完成立法那不是修法就是立新法民間一直想說要用修法的方式但是你們卻用新法的方式這個部分待會請主委說明一下大家一直沒有辦法接受但就實質的內容來說大家希望說集體的權利的部分應該符合原住民基本法\n\n01:21.826 --> 01:33.276\n而另外的部分呢在限制當中有提到說呢斟酌於國家資源要另以法令定制用一個三年內要制定但是所有的民間的版本希望在個人的權利的部分能夠一年內達成諸位這頭還沒有一個討論商量的空間\n\n01:41.963 --> 02:09.559\n主委請回答好這個平埔族平埔族這個生分法我們在5月15號已經送大業也送來送很晚了我講老師說比較慢還是我們三催四趕是三催四促才產生出來是好那我們推算那現在就是說我們的平埔的這個族群的朋友他們是希望所有的錢利都能夠一次就到位那但在這個\n\n02:11.560 --> 02:22.089\n原來的山地原住民跟平地原住民來講是希望說他是有別以這兩個族群的那這個原住民族的這個基本法\n\n02:23.134 --> 02:48.275\n他是在規範這個3D原住民跟平地原住民的那這個這個平埔族群是後來的那當然有一些這個基本法裡面有一些確實沒有辦法來規範現在的這個平埔原住民所以我們當然要用另外的專法來為平埔族的這個族人量身打造為他們在我覺得關鍵其實在那三年跟一年之間是啊\n\n02:48.815 --> 03:14.529\n有關於個人權益的部分你用三年的部分老實講大家就會覺得充滿變數充滿變數不只是內容的問題而已而且還有包括整部法令的部分你現在現階段你如果這麼有自信的話用一個新法的方式想要來處理這個平埔原住民的身份跟權益的問題的話那我就問你\n\n03:15.427 --> 03:40.265\n你們現在推出來之後你有把握在這個會期當中能夠通過嗎我們希望在這個會期當中下個會期九月就開始了啊是十月就到期了不是嗎對主委我覺得你沒有什麼危機感如果十月就還是這個聲紋沒有通過的話我們評普原住民主的這個民主認定我們立刻就會啟動\n\n03:41.728 --> 04:05.049\n對認定是該是啟動嘛但是權益的部分規範還是模模糊糊嘛沒有一個法令上的依據嘛憲判就希望你三年內完成立法工作嘛是對不是嗎是就是主委您的責任啊是啊對啊那現在又出現啊出現了另一個委員的版本啊連原住民三個字連提都不提基本上這根本是違憲的嘛不是嗎沒有錯這個當然剛剛都沒有聽到你講\n\n04:06.348 --> 04:27.336\n可是問題是現實的政治多數當中這個違憲的法案如果萬一通過的話那你來怎麼辦我就問你啊這個如果是內容的一個法律來推過的話當然我們沒有辦法接受啦我們也會拜託行政院這裡也要提出至少也要提出呼籲或者是釋憲啊所以說呢萬一萬一\n\n04:28.476 --> 04:41.466\n如果呢,因為是花一彩,我願意承認原住民的身份,違反了第17號判,現判的話,你還是可以踩住你的基本的立場,該赴議的時候赴議,該釋憲的時候要釋憲,否則這個矮化嘛,這個歧視嘛,對不對?\n\n04:47.370 --> 05:09.602\n所以主委你的立場要踩住啊而且很重要的是說這內容的部分要如何讓這個憲法的判決得以這個落實之外還有部分還要讓這個竹青的這個期待可以落實啊所以竹青期待落實的部分的這個內容之外我覺得趁這個機會啦反正現在研會已經\n\n05:11.812 --> 05:27.595\n成為自己的事實了嘛你不如就這個時候一來加強這個立法工作在這個會期把它完成二來加強對話再來台南一次因為西拉雅是平埔族當中最大的文化儀式祭典也是最完整的\n\n05:28.996 --> 05:48.421\n現階段呢基本上他們行動是最積極的你能不能撥個時間來下來跟台南對話一下會我們要盡快就趕快趕快下去我是說這個會期之內喔對啊趕快安排喔加強民間對話積極推動立法讓憲判能夠得以早日落實好不好加油謝謝好謝謝郭國文委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":5.129,"end":31.997,"text":"主席有請曾主委曾主委有請委員好主委你好我從在2008年的時候在憲府時期的時候就參與這個平普正名的運動那事隔多年了終於在將近三年前的時候呢這個憲法第17號已經出爐給予那個平普族親有一道的希望"},{"start":33.033,"end":52.519,"text":"這三年來我也曾經在原民會這邊做過要求要跟民間對話過往國家對這個評普組只有予以文化的承認而憲判的結果是正式的予以政治的承認而這個政治的承認要一些法定權利的給予"},{"start":54.465,"end":81.021,"text":"但是必須符合一些要件一來三年之內要完成立法那不是修法就是立新法民間一直想說要用修法的方式但是你們卻用新法的方式這個部分待會請主委說明一下大家一直沒有辦法接受但就實質的內容來說大家希望說集體的權利的部分應該符合原住民基本法"},{"start":81.826,"end":93.276,"text":"而另外的部分呢 在限制當中有提到說呢 斟酌於國家資源要另以法令定制 用一個三年內要制定但是所有的民間的版本 希望在個人的權利的部分能夠一年內達成諸位 這頭還沒有一個討論 商量的空間"},{"start":101.963,"end":129.559,"text":"主委請回答好這個平埔族平埔族這個生分法我們在5月15號已經送大業也送來送很晚了我講老師說比較慢還是我們三催四趕是三催四促才產生出來是好那我們推算那現在就是說我們的平埔的這個族群的朋友他們是希望所有的錢利都能夠一次就到位那但在這個"},{"start":131.56,"end":142.089,"text":"原來的山地原住民跟平地原住民來講是希望說他是有別以這兩個族群的那這個原住民族的這個基本法"},{"start":143.134,"end":168.275,"text":"他是在規範這個3D原住民跟平地原住民的那這個這個平埔族群是後來的那當然有一些這個基本法裡面有一些確實沒有辦法來規範現在的這個平埔原住民所以我們當然要用另外的專法來為平埔族的這個族人量身打造為他們在我覺得關鍵其實在那三年跟一年之間是啊"},{"start":168.815,"end":194.529,"text":"有關於個人權益的部分你用三年的部分老實講大家就會覺得充滿變數充滿變數不只是內容的問題而已而且還有包括整部法令的部分你現在現階段你如果這麼有自信的話用一個新法的方式想要來處理這個平埔原住民的身份跟權益的問題的話那我就問你"},{"start":195.427,"end":220.265,"text":"你們現在推出來之後 你有把握在這個會期當中能夠通過嗎我們希望在這個會期當中下個會期九月就開始了啊是十月就到期了不是嗎對主委我覺得你沒有什麼危機感如果十月就還是這個聲紋沒有通過的話我們評普原住民主的這個民主認定我們立刻就會啟動"},{"start":221.728,"end":245.049,"text":"對 認定是該是啟動嘛 但是權益的部分規範還是模模糊糊嘛沒有一個法令上的依據嘛 憲判就希望你三年內完成立法工作嘛 是對 不是嗎 是就是主委您的責任啊 是啊對啊 那現在又出現啊 出現了另一個委員的版本啊連原住民三個字連提都不提基本上這根本是違憲的嘛 不是嗎沒有錯 這個當然 剛剛都沒有聽到你講"},{"start":246.348,"end":267.336,"text":"可是問題是現實的政治多數當中這個違憲的法案如果萬一通過的話那你來怎麼辦我就問你啊這個如果是內容的一個法律來推過的話當然我們沒有辦法接受啦我們也會拜託行政院這裡也要提出至少也要提出呼籲或者是釋憲啊所以說呢萬一萬一"},{"start":268.476,"end":281.466,"text":"如果呢,因為是花一彩,我願意承認原住民的身份,違反了第17號判,現判的話,你還是可以踩住你的基本的立場,該赴議的時候赴議,該釋憲的時候要釋憲,否則這個矮化嘛,這個歧視嘛,對不對?"},{"start":287.37,"end":309.602,"text":"所以主委你的立場要踩住啊而且很重要的是說這內容的部分要如何讓這個憲法的判決得以這個落實之外還有部分還要讓這個竹青的這個期待可以落實啊所以竹青期待落實的部分的這個內容之外我覺得趁這個機會啦反正現在研會已經"},{"start":311.812,"end":327.595,"text":"成為自己的事實了嘛你不如就這個時候一來加強這個立法工作在這個會期把它完成二來加強對話再來台南一次因為西拉雅是平埔族當中最大的文化儀式祭典也是最完整的"},{"start":328.996,"end":348.421,"text":"現階段呢 基本上他們行動是最積極的你能不能撥個時間來下來跟台南對話一下會 我們要盡快就趕快 趕快下去我是說這個會期之內喔對啊 趕快安排喔加強民間對話 積極推動立法讓憲判能夠得以早日落實 好不好加油謝謝好 謝謝郭國文委員"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":1323,"blocks":[["郭委員國文：（11時44分）主席，有請曾主委。"],["主席：曾主委有請。"],["曾主任委員智勇：委員好。"],["郭委員國文：主委，你好。我從在2008年的時候，在縣府時期的時候，就參與平埔正名的運動，事隔多年終於在將近三年前的時候，憲判字第17號已經出爐，給予平埔族群有一道希望。這3年來我也曾經在原民會這邊做過要求，要跟民間對話，不過我們國家對平埔族只有予以文化承認，而憲判結果是正式地予以政治的承認，而這個政治的承認要有一些法定權利的給予，但是必須符合一些要件，一來3年之內要完成立法，不是修法就是立新法，民間一直想說要用修法的方式，但是你們卻用新法的方式，這個部分待會請主委說明一下，大家一直沒有辦法接受。但就實質的內容來說，大家希望集體權利的部分，應該符合原住民基本法的精神。","另外，憲判當中有提到，斟酌國家資源，另以法律定之；然後要求3年內要制定，但是所有的民間版本，都希望個人權利的部分能夠在1年內達成，主委，這裡頭還有沒有一個討論、商量的空間？主委，請回答。"],["曾主任委員智勇：平埔族的身分法，我們在5月15號已送大院，也送來……"],["郭委員國文：老實說，你送得很晚，還是我們三催四促才產生出來的。"],["曾主任委員智勇：現在平埔族群的朋友希望的所有權利都能夠一次就到位了，但就原來的山地原住民跟平地原住民來講，是希望有別於這兩個族群的，而原住民族基本法是在規範山地原住民跟平地原住民的，平埔族群是後來的，所以在基本法裡面有一些確實沒有辦法來規範現在的平埔原住民，所以我們當然要用另外的專法來為平埔族的族人量身打造，為他們在……"],["郭委員國文：我覺得關鍵其實在那3年跟1年之間，有關於個人權益的部分，若用3年的話，老實講大家就會覺得充滿變數，充滿變數不只是內容的問題，還包括整部法令的部分，現階段你如果這麼有自信，用一個新法的方式想要來處理平埔原住民身分跟權益問題的話，那我就問你，你們現在推出來之後，你有把握在這個會期當中能夠通過嗎？"],["曾主任委員智勇：我們希望在這個會期當中……"],["郭委員國文：我們下個會期9月就開始了，10月就到期了，不是嗎？主委，我覺得你沒有什麼危機感。"],["曾主任委員智勇：如果10月這個身分法還沒有通過的話，則我們平埔原住民族的民族認定，我們立刻就會啟動。"],["郭委員國文：認定是要開始啟動，但是權益的規範還是模模糊糊的，沒有一個法律上的依據，憲判就希望你3年內完成立法工作，不是嗎？這是主委您的責任啊！"],["曾主任委員智勇：是。"],["郭委員國文：對啊！現在又出現另一個委員的版本，連「原住民」這3個字都不提，基本上這根本是違憲的，不是嗎？"],["曾主任委員智勇：沒有錯，這個當然……"],["郭委員國文：剛剛都沒有聽到你講，問題是現實的政治多數當中，這個違憲法案萬一通過的話，那你該怎麼辦？我就問你啊！"],["曾主任委員智勇：如果是那樣的法律通過的話，當然我們沒有辦法接受，我們也會拜託行政院至少也要提出呼籲或者是釋憲。"],["郭委員國文：所以萬一又是橫柴入灶，不願意承認這原住民的身分，違反了憲判字第17號的話，你還是可以踩住你基本的立場，該覆議的時候覆議、該釋憲的時候釋憲。"],["曾主任委員智勇：對。"],["郭委員國文：否則這個是矮化、這個是歧視，對不對？所以主委你的立場要踩住，而且很重要的是內容的部分要如何讓憲法的判決得以落實之外，還有要讓族親的期待可以落實，所以族親期待落實的部分，除了內容之外，我覺得趁這個機會，反正現在延會已經成為具體事實了，你不如就這個時候，一來加強立法工作，在這個會期把它完成；二來加強對話，再來臺南一次，因為西拉雅是平埔族當中最大的，文化儀式、祭典也是最完整的，現階段他們行動也是最積極的，你能否撥個時間下來跟臺南對話一下？"],["曾主任委員智勇：會，我們會儘快下去。"],["郭委員國文：我是說這個會期之內喔！"],["曾主任委員智勇：對啊！會趕快。"],["郭委員國文：趕快安排喔！加強民間對話、積極推動立法，讓憲判得以早日落實，好不好？"],["曾主任委員智勇：是。"],["郭委員國文：加油。"],["曾主任委員智勇：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝郭國文委員的質詢。","下一位請鄭正鈐委員質詢，鄭正鈐委員，鄭正鈐委員不在。","下一位請伍麗華委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":120,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-15-21","speakers":["牛煦庭","盧縣一","張智倫","王美惠","麥玉珍","張宏陸","黃捷","蘇巧慧","李柏毅","高金素梅","許宇甄","徐欣瑩","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","郭國文","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","吳琪銘","陳瑩","丁學忠","林宜瑾"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-05-22"],"gazette_id":"1145302","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1145302_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期內政委員會第21次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請原住民族委員會主任委員率同所屬及財團法人原住民族文化事業基金會董事長與財團法\n人原住民族語言研究發展基金會董事長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢；二、處理114年度中央政\n府總預算案有關原住民族委員會及所屬預算解凍案；三、審查「原住民族基本法」修正草案等12\n案：(一)審查委員伍麗華 Saidhai Tahovecahe 等16人擬具「原住民族基本法增訂第二條之二條\n文草案」案、(二)審查委員伍麗華 Saidhai Tahovecahe 等17人擬具「原住民族基本法第二十一\n條條文修正草案」案、(三)審查委員高金素梅等21人擬具「原住民族基本法部分條文修正草案」\n案、(四)審查委員黃仁等30人擬具「原住民族基本法第十九條條文修正草案」案、(五)審查委員\n黃仁等26人擬具「原住民族基本法第十五條條文修正草案」案、(六)審查委員鄭天財 Sra Kacaw\n等18人擬具「原住民族基本法增訂第六條之一條文草案」案、(七)審查委員黃仁等20人擬具「原\n住民族基本法增訂第二十八條之一條文草案」案、(八)審查委員黃仁等22人擬具「原住民族基本\n法第十條條文修正草案」案、(九)審查委員黃仁等21人擬具「原住民族基本法第六條條文修正草\n案」案、(十)審查委員高金素梅等20人擬具「原住民族基本法第十八條條文修正草案」案、 (十\n一)審查委員鄭天財 Sra Kacaw 等17人擬具「原住民族基本法第十八條條文修正草案」案、(十\n二)審查委員盧縣一等18人擬具「原住民族基本法部分條文修正草案」案【第三案僅詢答，另定\n期處理】","agenda_id":"1145302_00001"}}}