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00:00:42,677\n主任好主任我們今天是討論組織法那在經濟委員會同樣會討論作用法那我想要請教主任那最近台灣整個不管是在公務或是非公務的各自外洩那公務的部分事實上剛剛莊惠雄召委也有去講到最近尤其像在基隆的案件是非常的極端直接由公務員他直接外洩去協助罷免\n\n3\n00:00:43,414 --> 00:01:05,293\n事實上剛剛包括羅志強也有講到的包括教育部次長他可能也都涉及到把個資展露給大家所以這個都是需要被檢討的但是非公務機關尤其是我們每天都會接到很多類似銀行問你要不要貸款或者是其他的一些詐騙集團會打來給你這是非公務機關的外洩\n\n4\n00:01:09,656 --> 00:01:15,044\n那我們成立了這樣一個個資會要怎麼防堵這樣的一個個資外線的狀況你們具體的作為咧\n\n5\n00:01:18,547 --> 00:01:45,723\n跟委員報告我覺得這件事情應該是說整個個人資料保護管理那個意識在目前現在其實還是比較是屬於表面要怎麼做大家還不知道如何去進行所以未來個人資料保護會成立除了剛剛我提到說有一個六年這個會回收分管有明確目的雖然還會暫時跟中央目的世界主管機關一起來合作\n\n6\n00:01:46,403 --> 00:02:13,654\n但是在就現有已經由未來由個人資料保護會監管的部分我們在18條跟20條之一剛剛委員已經特別去強調說對於非公務機關這部分要如何來去強化跟落實那這裡面還有包含說軟性的當然是教育這個宣導然後法規的這個證訊要跟這些目的事業的中央目的事業組織機關一起來合作主任我想\n\n7\n00:02:15,135 --> 00:02:39,140\n對於這種個資外洩事前預防很重要但是事後的懲罰才是真的可以遏止未來再有個資外洩所以說比方說像基隆的事件我就認為說基本上這一些被個資的人應該要提出國賠應該要提出國賠國賠法不管是國家賠償法第二條或者是第四條\n\n8\n00:02:40,540 --> 00:03:02,024\n都認為說國家應該先行賠償然後對於公務員有故意或重大過失的他必須要在另外求償所以我覺得這部分除了應該大家要提出國賠之外我們也要去督促啊到底誰洩漏個資不可以讓他雲淡風輕國家要有代位的一個求償這個應該是要貫徹的好不好\n\n9\n00:03:05,335 --> 00:03:30,201\n不然你沒辦法懲罰嘛你沒有實質的懲罰他永遠公務員洩漏個資的時候雲淡風輕好吧道個歉結束了是這樣嗎不可能是這樣好不好各位我們在第二階段在做用法的部分會再展開一個全面的這個部分的意見我們會把它納入對那當然在做用法的部分還在檢討那我想在最後一分鐘我再跟主任再來討論就是說事實上在\n\n10\n00:03:31,361 --> 00:03:51,521\n這一次111年的憲判制13號他強調的一個個資他認為說你客觀上有還原而間接識別當事人的可能即使資料經過處理只要在客觀上存在任何特定方法可以還原並間接識別特定人的可能性該資料仍屬於個人資料\n\n11\n00:03:53,303 --> 00:04:11,150\n所以我們知道說在憲判制這個13號的一個出爐之後你去識別化的資料你只要能夠再用特定方法可以再去還原然後把這個去識別的人再把它特定化然後就可以知道這個人仍然是屬於個資\n\n12\n00:04:12,831 --> 00:04:18,718\n好那基於這樣的一個憲判之初如後我們知道說過去有包括113年這個法務部113年的10303513040號認為去識別化的極非屬個人資料或是105年法這個法律自10503510730號\n\n13\n00:04:35,096 --> 00:04:51,777\n認為可能間接識別生存存在的個人資料就是個人資料為特定目的外的利用所以又不是屬於個人資料所以有好幾次的一個含釋都排除掉去識別化的資料\n\n14\n00:04:52,378 --> 00:05:09,073\n但是大法官甚至卻進一步的哇他又更開闊的去講說你只要經過特定方法把去識別化的再把它海撈或者是其他的資料Google的資料再把它補充起來你就可以知道這個人是誰仍然是屬於這一個\n\n15\n00:05:11,294 --> 00:05:31,771\n這個屬於個人資料那範圍就不是像單純文字講那麼簡單的喔不是說身份證我都蓋起來我的出生年月日都蓋起來這樣就是屬於沒有影響各自的範圍變得很大喔所以主任面對這樣的一個轉變而且事實上現在整個網路資訊的時代\n\n16\n00:05:36,114 --> 00:05:52,368\n勢必也會變這樣所以這部分你們必須要做更多努力包括說過去的這相關的一個含釋是不是有需要檢討改進的必要請你接受該來者會這個在第二階段的修法會有這個議題而且蠻重要的謝謝委員長好那就期待好謝謝好謝謝我們接下來請邱志偉\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n5595\t8402\t謝謝主席 那有請李主任請李主任趙偉博案\n14984\t42677\t主任好主任我們今天是討論組織法那在經濟委員會同樣會討論作用法那我想要請教主任那最近台灣整個不管是在公務或是非公務的各自外洩那公務的部分事實上剛剛莊惠雄召委也有去講到最近尤其像在基隆的案件是非常的極端直接由公務員他直接外洩去協助罷免\n43414\t65293\t事實上剛剛包括羅志強也有講到的包括教育部次長他可能也都涉及到把個資展露給大家所以這個都是需要被檢討的但是非公務機關尤其是我們每天都會接到很多類似銀行問你要不要貸款或者是其他的一些詐騙集團會打來給你這是非公務機關的外洩\n69656\t75044\t那我們成立了這樣一個個資會要怎麼防堵這樣的一個個資外線的狀況你們具體的作為咧\n78547\t105723\t跟委員報告我覺得這件事情應該是說整個個人資料保護管理那個意識在目前現在其實還是比較是屬於表面要怎麼做大家還不知道如何去進行所以未來個人資料保護會成立除了剛剛我提到說有一個六年這個會回收分管有明確目的雖然還會暫時跟中央目的世界主管機關一起來合作\n106403\t133654\t但是在就現有已經由未來由個人資料保護會監管的部分我們在18條跟20條之一剛剛委員已經特別去強調說對於非公務機關這部分要如何來去強化跟落實那這裡面還有包含說軟性的當然是教育這個宣導然後法規的這個證訊要跟這些目的事業的中央目的事業組織機關一起來合作主任我想\n135135\t159140\t對於這種個資外洩 事前預防很重要但是事後的懲罰才是真的可以遏止未來再有個資外洩所以說比方說像基隆的事件我就認為說 基本上這一些被個資的人應該要提出國賠應該要提出國賠 國賠法不管是國家賠償法第二條或者是第四條\n160540\t182024\t都認為說國家應該先行賠償然後對於公務員有故意或重大過失的他必須要在另外求償所以我覺得這部分除了應該大家要提出國賠之外我們也要去督促啊到底誰洩漏個資不可以讓他雲淡風輕國家要有代位的一個求償這個應該是要貫徹的好不好\n185335\t210201\t不然你沒辦法懲罰嘛你沒有實質的懲罰他永遠公務員洩漏個資的時候雲淡風輕 好吧 道個歉結束了 是這樣嗎 不可能是這樣好不好 各位我們在第二階段在做用法的部分會再展開一個全面的這個部分的意見我們會把它納入對 那當然在做用法的部分還在檢討那我想在最後一分鐘我再跟主任再來討論就是說 事實上在\n211361\t231521\t這一次111年的憲判制13號他強調的一個個資他認為說你客觀上有還原而間接識別當事人的可能即使資料經過處理只要在客觀上存在任何特定方法可以還原並間接識別特定人的可能性該資料仍屬於個人資料\n233303\t251150\t所以我們知道說在憲判制這個13號的一個出爐之後你去識別化的資料你只要能夠再用特定方法可以再去還原然後把這個去識別的人再把它特定化然後就可以知道這個人 仍然是屬於個資\n252831\t258718\t好 那基於這樣的一個憲判之初 如後我們知道說過去有包括113年這個法務部113年的103035 13040號認為去識別化的極非屬個人資料或是105年法 這個法律自105035 10730號\n275096\t291777\t認為可能間接識別生存存在的個人資料就是個人資料為特定目的外的利用所以又不是屬於個人資料所以有好幾次的一個含釋都排除掉去識別化的資料\n292378\t309073\t但是大法官甚至卻進一步的 哇 他又更開闊的去講說你只要經過特定方法把去識別化的再把它海撈或者是其他的資料 Google的資料再把它補充起來你就可以知道這個人是誰仍然是屬於這一個\n311294\t331771\t這個屬於個人資料 那範圍就不是像單純文字講那麼簡單的喔不是說身份證我都蓋起來 我的出生年月日都蓋起來這樣就是屬於沒有影響各自的 範圍變得很大喔所以主任面對這樣的一個轉變而且事實上現在整個網路資訊的時代\n336114\t352368\t勢必也會變這樣所以這部分你們必須要做更多努力包括說過去的這相關的一個含釋是不是有需要檢討改進的必要請你接受該來者會 這個在第二階段的修法會有這個議題而且蠻重要的謝謝委員長好 那就期待好 謝謝好 謝謝我們接下來請邱志偉\n","txt":"謝謝主席 那有請李主任請李主任趙偉博案\n主任好主任我們今天是討論組織法那在經濟委員會同樣會討論作用法那我想要請教主任那最近台灣整個不管是在公務或是非公務的各自外洩那公務的部分事實上剛剛莊惠雄召委也有去講到最近尤其像在基隆的案件是非常的極端直接由公務員他直接外洩去協助罷免\n事實上剛剛包括羅志強也有講到的包括教育部次長他可能也都涉及到把個資展露給大家所以這個都是需要被檢討的但是非公務機關尤其是我們每天都會接到很多類似銀行問你要不要貸款或者是其他的一些詐騙集團會打來給你這是非公務機關的外洩\n那我們成立了這樣一個個資會要怎麼防堵這樣的一個個資外線的狀況你們具體的作為咧\n跟委員報告我覺得這件事情應該是說整個個人資料保護管理那個意識在目前現在其實還是比較是屬於表面要怎麼做大家還不知道如何去進行所以未來個人資料保護會成立除了剛剛我提到說有一個六年這個會回收分管有明確目的雖然還會暫時跟中央目的世界主管機關一起來合作\n但是在就現有已經由未來由個人資料保護會監管的部分我們在18條跟20條之一剛剛委員已經特別去強調說對於非公務機關這部分要如何來去強化跟落實那這裡面還有包含說軟性的當然是教育這個宣導然後法規的這個證訊要跟這些目的事業的中央目的事業組織機關一起來合作主任我想\n對於這種個資外洩 事前預防很重要但是事後的懲罰才是真的可以遏止未來再有個資外洩所以說比方說像基隆的事件我就認為說 基本上這一些被個資的人應該要提出國賠應該要提出國賠 國賠法不管是國家賠償法第二條或者是第四條\n都認為說國家應該先行賠償然後對於公務員有故意或重大過失的他必須要在另外求償所以我覺得這部分除了應該大家要提出國賠之外我們也要去督促啊到底誰洩漏個資不可以讓他雲淡風輕國家要有代位的一個求償這個應該是要貫徹的好不好\n不然你沒辦法懲罰嘛你沒有實質的懲罰他永遠公務員洩漏個資的時候雲淡風輕 好吧 道個歉結束了 是這樣嗎 不可能是這樣好不好 各位我們在第二階段在做用法的部分會再展開一個全面的這個部分的意見我們會把它納入對 那當然在做用法的部分還在檢討那我想在最後一分鐘我再跟主任再來討論就是說 事實上在\n這一次111年的憲判制13號他強調的一個個資他認為說你客觀上有還原而間接識別當事人的可能即使資料經過處理只要在客觀上存在任何特定方法可以還原並間接識別特定人的可能性該資料仍屬於個人資料\n所以我們知道說在憲判制這個13號的一個出爐之後你去識別化的資料你只要能夠再用特定方法可以再去還原然後把這個去識別的人再把它特定化然後就可以知道這個人 仍然是屬於個資\n好 那基於這樣的一個憲判之初 如後我們知道說過去有包括113年這個法務部113年的103035 13040號認為去識別化的極非屬個人資料或是105年法 這個法律自105035 10730號\n認為可能間接識別生存存在的個人資料就是個人資料為特定目的外的利用所以又不是屬於個人資料所以有好幾次的一個含釋都排除掉去識別化的資料\n但是大法官甚至卻進一步的 哇 他又更開闊的去講說你只要經過特定方法把去識別化的再把它海撈或者是其他的資料 Google的資料再把它補充起來你就可以知道這個人是誰仍然是屬於這一個\n這個屬於個人資料 那範圍就不是像單純文字講那麼簡單的喔不是說身份證我都蓋起來 我的出生年月日都蓋起來這樣就是屬於沒有影響各自的 範圍變得很大喔所以主任面對這樣的一個轉變而且事實上現在整個網路資訊的時代\n勢必也會變這樣所以這部分你們必須要做更多努力包括說過去的這相關的一個含釋是不是有需要檢討改進的必要請你接受該來者會 這個在第二階段的修法會有這個議題而且蠻重要的謝謝委員長好 那就期待好 謝謝好 謝謝我們接下來請邱志偉\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:05.595 --> 00:08.402\n謝謝主席那有請李主任請李主任趙偉博案\n\n00:14.984 --> 00:42.677\n主任好主任我們今天是討論組織法那在經濟委員會同樣會討論作用法那我想要請教主任那最近台灣整個不管是在公務或是非公務的各自外洩那公務的部分事實上剛剛莊惠雄召委也有去講到最近尤其像在基隆的案件是非常的極端直接由公務員他直接外洩去協助罷免\n\n00:43.414 --> 01:05.293\n事實上剛剛包括羅志強也有講到的包括教育部次長他可能也都涉及到把個資展露給大家所以這個都是需要被檢討的但是非公務機關尤其是我們每天都會接到很多類似銀行問你要不要貸款或者是其他的一些詐騙集團會打來給你這是非公務機關的外洩\n\n01:09.656 --> 01:15.044\n那我們成立了這樣一個個資會要怎麼防堵這樣的一個個資外線的狀況你們具體的作為咧\n\n01:18.547 --> 01:45.723\n跟委員報告我覺得這件事情應該是說整個個人資料保護管理那個意識在目前現在其實還是比較是屬於表面要怎麼做大家還不知道如何去進行所以未來個人資料保護會成立除了剛剛我提到說有一個六年這個會回收分管有明確目的雖然還會暫時跟中央目的世界主管機關一起來合作\n\n01:46.403 --> 02:13.654\n但是在就現有已經由未來由個人資料保護會監管的部分我們在18條跟20條之一剛剛委員已經特別去強調說對於非公務機關這部分要如何來去強化跟落實那這裡面還有包含說軟性的當然是教育這個宣導然後法規的這個證訊要跟這些目的事業的中央目的事業組織機關一起來合作主任我想\n\n02:15.135 --> 02:39.140\n對於這種個資外洩事前預防很重要但是事後的懲罰才是真的可以遏止未來再有個資外洩所以說比方說像基隆的事件我就認為說基本上這一些被個資的人應該要提出國賠應該要提出國賠國賠法不管是國家賠償法第二條或者是第四條\n\n02:40.540 --> 03:02.024\n都認為說國家應該先行賠償然後對於公務員有故意或重大過失的他必須要在另外求償所以我覺得這部分除了應該大家要提出國賠之外我們也要去督促啊到底誰洩漏個資不可以讓他雲淡風輕國家要有代位的一個求償這個應該是要貫徹的好不好\n\n03:05.335 --> 03:30.201\n不然你沒辦法懲罰嘛你沒有實質的懲罰他永遠公務員洩漏個資的時候雲淡風輕好吧道個歉結束了是這樣嗎不可能是這樣好不好各位我們在第二階段在做用法的部分會再展開一個全面的這個部分的意見我們會把它納入對那當然在做用法的部分還在檢討那我想在最後一分鐘我再跟主任再來討論就是說事實上在\n\n03:31.361 --> 03:51.521\n這一次111年的憲判制13號他強調的一個個資他認為說你客觀上有還原而間接識別當事人的可能即使資料經過處理只要在客觀上存在任何特定方法可以還原並間接識別特定人的可能性該資料仍屬於個人資料\n\n03:53.303 --> 04:11.150\n所以我們知道說在憲判制這個13號的一個出爐之後你去識別化的資料你只要能夠再用特定方法可以再去還原然後把這個去識別的人再把它特定化然後就可以知道這個人仍然是屬於個資\n\n04:12.831 --> 04:18.718\n好那基於這樣的一個憲判之初如後我們知道說過去有包括113年這個法務部113年的10303513040號認為去識別化的極非屬個人資料或是105年法這個法律自10503510730號\n\n04:35.096 --> 04:51.777\n認為可能間接識別生存存在的個人資料就是個人資料為特定目的外的利用所以又不是屬於個人資料所以有好幾次的一個含釋都排除掉去識別化的資料\n\n04:52.378 --> 05:09.073\n但是大法官甚至卻進一步的哇他又更開闊的去講說你只要經過特定方法把去識別化的再把它海撈或者是其他的資料Google的資料再把它補充起來你就可以知道這個人是誰仍然是屬於這一個\n\n05:11.294 --> 05:31.771\n這個屬於個人資料那範圍就不是像單純文字講那麼簡單的喔不是說身份證我都蓋起來我的出生年月日都蓋起來這樣就是屬於沒有影響各自的範圍變得很大喔所以主任面對這樣的一個轉變而且事實上現在整個網路資訊的時代\n\n05:36.114 --> 05:52.368\n勢必也會變這樣所以這部分你們必須要做更多努力包括說過去的這相關的一個含釋是不是有需要檢討改進的必要請你接受該來者會這個在第二階段的修法會有這個議題而且蠻重要的謝謝委員長好那就期待好謝謝好謝謝我們接下來請邱志偉\n\n","segments":[{"start":5.595,"end":8.402,"text":"謝謝主席 那有請李主任請李主任趙偉博案"},{"start":14.984,"end":42.677,"text":"主任好主任我們今天是討論組織法那在經濟委員會同樣會討論作用法那我想要請教主任那最近台灣整個不管是在公務或是非公務的各自外洩那公務的部分事實上剛剛莊惠雄召委也有去講到最近尤其像在基隆的案件是非常的極端直接由公務員他直接外洩去協助罷免"},{"start":43.414,"end":65.293,"text":"事實上剛剛包括羅志強也有講到的包括教育部次長他可能也都涉及到把個資展露給大家所以這個都是需要被檢討的但是非公務機關尤其是我們每天都會接到很多類似銀行問你要不要貸款或者是其他的一些詐騙集團會打來給你這是非公務機關的外洩"},{"start":69.656,"end":75.044,"text":"那我們成立了這樣一個個資會要怎麼防堵這樣的一個個資外線的狀況你們具體的作為咧"},{"start":78.547,"end":105.723,"text":"跟委員報告我覺得這件事情應該是說整個個人資料保護管理那個意識在目前現在其實還是比較是屬於表面要怎麼做大家還不知道如何去進行所以未來個人資料保護會成立除了剛剛我提到說有一個六年這個會回收分管有明確目的雖然還會暫時跟中央目的世界主管機關一起來合作"},{"start":106.403,"end":133.654,"text":"但是在就現有已經由未來由個人資料保護會監管的部分我們在18條跟20條之一剛剛委員已經特別去強調說對於非公務機關這部分要如何來去強化跟落實那這裡面還有包含說軟性的當然是教育這個宣導然後法規的這個證訊要跟這些目的事業的中央目的事業組織機關一起來合作主任我想"},{"start":135.135,"end":159.14,"text":"對於這種個資外洩 事前預防很重要但是事後的懲罰才是真的可以遏止未來再有個資外洩所以說比方說像基隆的事件我就認為說 基本上這一些被個資的人應該要提出國賠應該要提出國賠 國賠法不管是國家賠償法第二條或者是第四條"},{"start":160.54,"end":182.024,"text":"都認為說國家應該先行賠償然後對於公務員有故意或重大過失的他必須要在另外求償所以我覺得這部分除了應該大家要提出國賠之外我們也要去督促啊到底誰洩漏個資不可以讓他雲淡風輕國家要有代位的一個求償這個應該是要貫徹的好不好"},{"start":185.335,"end":210.201,"text":"不然你沒辦法懲罰嘛你沒有實質的懲罰他永遠公務員洩漏個資的時候雲淡風輕 好吧 道個歉結束了 是這樣嗎 不可能是這樣好不好 各位我們在第二階段在做用法的部分會再展開一個全面的這個部分的意見我們會把它納入對 那當然在做用法的部分還在檢討那我想在最後一分鐘我再跟主任再來討論就是說 事實上在"},{"start":211.361,"end":231.521,"text":"這一次111年的憲判制13號他強調的一個個資他認為說你客觀上有還原而間接識別當事人的可能即使資料經過處理只要在客觀上存在任何特定方法可以還原並間接識別特定人的可能性該資料仍屬於個人資料"},{"start":233.303,"end":251.15,"text":"所以我們知道說在憲判制這個13號的一個出爐之後你去識別化的資料你只要能夠再用特定方法可以再去還原然後把這個去識別的人再把它特定化然後就可以知道這個人 仍然是屬於個資"},{"start":252.831,"end":258.718,"text":"好 那基於這樣的一個憲判之初 如後我們知道說過去有包括113年這個法務部113年的103035 13040號認為去識別化的極非屬個人資料或是105年法 這個法律自105035 10730號"},{"start":275.096,"end":291.777,"text":"認為可能間接識別生存存在的個人資料就是個人資料為特定目的外的利用所以又不是屬於個人資料所以有好幾次的一個含釋都排除掉去識別化的資料"},{"start":292.378,"end":309.073,"text":"但是大法官甚至卻進一步的 哇 他又更開闊的去講說你只要經過特定方法把去識別化的再把它海撈或者是其他的資料 Google的資料再把它補充起來你就可以知道這個人是誰仍然是屬於這一個"},{"start":311.294,"end":331.771,"text":"這個屬於個人資料 那範圍就不是像單純文字講那麼簡單的喔不是說身份證我都蓋起來 我的出生年月日都蓋起來這樣就是屬於沒有影響各自的 範圍變得很大喔所以主任面對這樣的一個轉變而且事實上現在整個網路資訊的時代"},{"start":336.114,"end":352.368,"text":"勢必也會變這樣所以這部分你們必須要做更多努力包括說過去的這相關的一個含釋是不是有需要檢討改進的必要請你接受該來者會 這個在第二階段的修法會有這個議題而且蠻重要的謝謝委員長好 那就期待好 謝謝好 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