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00:01:26,006\n不好意思如果你們不去更正你們速發部官網上的東西不用再跟我解釋了有沒有人要更正沒有更正就更正剛剛的說法我剛才想要跟那個邱若驊委員所解釋的就是如同我們部長所講的因為超級電腦是一個比較模糊的概念那就泛用文詞不需要在質詢台上面去確定跟學界不一樣的東西好謝謝要精準我們開始變精準我覺得這個資訊圈的人真的會覺得很難過我再問部長\n\n5\n00:01:31,329 --> 00:01:33,512\n請問CA信任憑證跟自動安全有沒有關係\n\n6\n00:01:35,069 --> 00:01:59,841\n那個CA是剛講就是跟資通安全有沒有關係如果你需要一些加密的那個訊息有受效經過CA拿到憑證對嘛所以跟資安有關嘛TWCA你們請大家換憑證的網頁官網上前兩句就講了如果有好的信任憑證可以阻絕駭客入侵不會有這種資安的疑慮所以CA跟資安有沒有關請教速發部長當然有關嘛\n\n7\n00:02:04,623 --> 00:02:31,888\n這不用解釋啊所以我想請教昨天傍晚的時候中華電信新任董事長我們知道他很努力啦他昨天講了兩個他說CA出問題跟資安無關第二個他說這一次中華電信新任憑證出了問題影響維護其為請問部長你對這兩個說法有沒有意見我們認不認同兩個問題第一個CA跟資安無關中華電信董事長說的你作為資安的最高指導機關有沒有意見\n\n8\n00:02:32,628 --> 00:02:53,205\n他的CA是說8月以後他再發新的憑證不能發可是既有的憑證還是可以用那你如果憑證出了問題跟治安有沒有關嘛他的憑證沒有出問題是發憑證出問題發憑證出問題是說他8月1號以後不能發新的憑證我們現在不是在玩文字校正遊戲CA信任憑證就是跟治安有關你剛剛已經說了\n\n9\n00:02:54,466 --> 00:03:11,042\nCA本身能不能發平所以亂發跟治安有沒有關亂發當然所以我覺得這樣我理解啦我理解部長的意思啦在某一個特定語境之下可以無關沒有關係這個大家自有公平那自通安全我們剛剛講到影響維護其為你認不認同\n\n10\n00:03:14,745 --> 00:03:33,040\n這次的這個信任憑證的事件影響為乎其為董事長說的認不認同我們剛剛講我們在早先就已經有雙憑證機制所以呢中華電信如果不能再發信任憑證所以您認同為乎其為影響為乎其為政府單位幾乎沒有影響那業者就算了你們是電商的產業指導單位\n\n11\n00:03:35,422 --> 00:03:58,615\n業者我們有督促剛剛委員有建議我們也跟中華電信討論過業者的剛剛講過去發的憑證還是有效以後不能拿新憑證但是要換新憑證的時候中華電信要負責幫業者換新憑證如果要有收費中華電信要匯出好趕快積極處理那這個我覺得還是有很多問題我們之後再討論因為時間有限那我想今天謝謝昭偉安排的這個題目啦\n\n12\n00:03:59,275 --> 00:04:13,735\n那我們看到剛剛我在這個經濟委員會質詢國發會主委完全不知道AI基本法現在在哪裡請問AI基本法是不是還在行政院裡面對吧我說院版嘛院版是不是還在行政院對嘛\n\n13\n00:04:15,257 --> 00:04:38,274\n結果我們國發會完全不知道啊他不知道你你也不知道他為什麼呢因為他推出AI新十大建設的說法的時候完全沒有速發部的角色你們怎麼在互相邊緣化他的新聞稿裡面沒提到所以有沒有參與如果我們不會的話可以說明一下AI新十大建設速發部有沒有參與負責哪些部分非常重要的部分我們十大建設裡面我們組織了兩個建設然後協辦六個建設所有參與\n\n14\n00:04:43,277 --> 00:05:01,505\nOK那根據國發會主委的說法行政院預計六月就會核定那請問部長我們沒有一個上位的基本法很可能彼此會有漢格啊請問一下行政院有沒有機會預計在六月份我們早一點啊不然他AI新十大建設都要推出去建了結果我們沒有AI基本法\n\n15\n00:05:02,885 --> 00:05:25,071\n這個讓AI新十大建設與法有據嗎有沒有機會行政院早一點6月算出院版的AI基本法草案我們那個AI的這個產業的推動在過去兩年都已經在進展那當然就是說基本法主要是管理所以我剛剛講就是說在十大建設裡面我們包括有些建設像建立算力這東西事實上這可以並行並沒有說一定要希望先出來\n\n16\n00:05:26,031 --> 00:05:48,363\n部長你剛剛講出你的心裡話啦AI基本法其實不是只是要管理而已您剛剛一直也都說它是一個基本框架它又要發展又要資料治理結果您內心深處講出你的心裡話是管理沒有關係啦我們還是等你們的版本出來那我想請教部長講到AI基本法現行11部基本法當中有沒有內容有提到行政院的任務編組的條文\n\n17\n00:05:49,904 --> 00:06:18,343\n有沒有行政院這個大部分的基本法都沒有那有沒有嘛有幾個有但是答案都已經出來了啦其實就這幾個都有所以能不能支持我們依法要設立任務編組啊我們第17條第7條有設立人工智慧業務的跨部會協調組織有委員會啊其實這是可以的嘛對不對有機會支持吧這個我們等院這必須是要報院要同意就是說這不是我能決定的\n\n18\n00:06:20,084 --> 00:06:27,536\n好沒關係那我請教部長你可以決定當然你可以提出建議那速發部115年預計編列多少預算推行AI相關的業務115年對因為現在正在編現在正在你編對不對那預計你編多少\n\n19\n00:06:36,088 --> 00:06:51,865\n我們那個預算部分現在因為剛剛講有這個AI的這個十大建設目前是希望能夠編列一百六十加碼一百六十億一百六十億在速發部這邊做AI的過去是多少你知道嗎\n\n20\n00:06:53,747 --> 00:07:16,486\n過去哇暴增20倍以上過去我們問過啊速發部跟數位產業AI產業數位都納進來不是AI是5億多這個當然啦我想也許我們算法不同也許你們有AI的這個這個資安預防等等但這個這個相增增減相關的報告請給我們那想問一下部長是不是知道11部基本法裡面\n\n21\n00:07:16,786 --> 00:07:45,165\n有沒有做確保預算的相關條文因為你推AI基本法各部會要做這個所謂的作用法您剛剛也提了大家需不需要一些預算現有的基本法當中有沒有做預算確保的條文有還是沒有有一些有對有嘛其實我們都幫你找好了啦文化基本法還甚至保障專款專用海洋基本法也做這個相關的預算一定要必要措施還要寬列喔\n\n22\n00:07:45,885 --> 00:08:08,477\n所以我想是不是部長您可不可以建議院長還有行政院來支持我們第11條草案裡面要放入確保預算的條文啊有沒有機會來支持一下因為沒有預算各個部會怎麼來推進呢那個委員的很多建議我們謝謝委員支持啦我想這個委員在這個AI基本法確實有很多的建議跟想法都很好那我們會剛剛講這個布版的時候會考慮\n\n23\n00:08:11,826 --> 00:08:33,789\n那布版因為現在這個院版一直卡在行政院那布版現在好像現在又拉回來還要修改嗎現在到底是在院還是布啊因為您一下子說院嘛可是現在布又還沒辦法提出我們現在是說院因為要院大院通過這個需要沒有沒有我說的是行政院現在到底是您的版本速發布的版本現在是停在行政院還是又拉回來修改\n\n24\n00:08:35,310 --> 00:08:59,583\n原來的那個版本是國科會草案的版本嘛那我們現在是要所以你們從來沒有送過一份過去從來沒有我們就是把原來的國科會草案那個版本原則上是不然那個請那個市長我跟委員說明喔大概就是國科會他預告的版本行政院交給蘇華部主政之後我們大概有開了兩次的會所以我們大概有修正部分的條文現在就在行政院的校文的審理中這樣\n\n25\n00:08:59,923 --> 00:09:20,835\n卡在行政院嘛所以現在是卡在行政院因為這一點我想所有的委員教文委員會還有交通委員會包含召委我們都非常關心啦所以您又提到說那速發布要7月15號以前才能將布版整理出來可是這剛剛很奇怪啊您說您的版本已經送到行政院了那為什麼現在布版不能早一點提供給我們看呢\n\n26\n00:09:21,935 --> 00:09:40,321\n因為現在是行政院那到7月15號以前我們還是要努力我們現在我們那天在委員會教育交通聯席我們只是要布板喔欸為什麼布板您都可以給行政院了現在其實已經可以提出來了啊對啊所以7月15號以前我們當然會提出好所以您現在有抓7月15號以前嘛對不對對\n\n27\n00:09:41,121 --> 00:10:02,406\n好7月15號以前我希望啦書發部可以預定照你們的想法也承諾了7月15號要如期完成這個佈板提供給教育及教章兩個委員會審查使用這一點沒有改變嘛對不對沒有改變好那最後借主席一點點時間剛剛有提到很多打詐的議題其實近期有非常多的陳情這個虛擬這個貨幣或數位資產的產業有非常多的KOL\n\n28\n00:10:09,568 --> 00:10:35,058\n突然遭到大幅度的下架其實很多人都只是在做知識的推廣這個我覺得那他們是不明不白的沒有任何的沒有任何的理由那相關的這個平台呢有說好像跟速發部說不定是有什麼樣的關係所以這一點我希望請部長了解一下虛擬貨幣或者是數位資產不是全部都是妖魔如果照這樣的一個做法\n\n29\n00:10:35,478 --> 00:11:00,837\n只要有問題就來砍就說他詐欺那這樣我想美國在推動比特幣穩定比特幣的法案穩定幣的法案都會落入你們的這個評估標準這樣很奇怪我們接受通報以後我們是跟金管會就報給金管會那這個決定應該是金管會決定好所以我想相關的這個橫向剝剝通不要讓民眾其實有一些新興的產業他們是做正規的事情\n\n30\n00:11:01,297 --> 00:11:09,609\n那不小心誤殺到正規的事這過去抒發部或者是相關部會已經有過類似的例子希望這種誤殺的方式不要再出現好不好好謝謝謝謝部長謝謝主席\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n4417\t6747\t好 謝謝主席 有請速發部黃燕南部長請部長\n13870\t41425\t好 謝謝部長我想支持蔡奇商委員剛剛的說法打造通茶網把負擔加注在民眾身上部會應該還是要多努力透過一些新的技術同時我有幾個問題想問剛剛有提到現在用的GPU就不叫超級電腦但你們速發部的官網上面直接就寫了超級電腦訓練出所有的語言模型中略打算加上台灣本地的資料去做到台灣的引擎\n42245\t62538\t所以是你們速發部網站寫錯了還是你們剛剛其實在糊弄別人啊用GPU集成的電腦就不叫超級電腦嗎這是你們速發部公網自己寫的喔教證一下超級電腦的定義其實就是擁有超級算力的電腦管它CPU GPU你們不要突然在質詢台上面突然發明跟產業界不一樣的說法\n63038\t86006\t不好意思如果你們不去更正你們速發部官網上的東西不用再跟我解釋了有沒有人要更正沒有更正就更正剛剛的說法我剛才想要跟那個邱若驊委員所解釋的就是如同我們部長所講的因為超級電腦是一個比較模糊的概念那就泛用文詞不需要在質詢台上面去確定跟學界不一樣的東西好謝謝要精準我們開始變精準我覺得這個資訊圈的人真的會覺得很難過我再問部長\n91329\t93512\t請問CA信任憑證跟自動安全有沒有關係\n95069\t119841\t那個CA是剛講就是跟資通安全有沒有關係如果你需要一些加密的那個訊息有受效經過CA拿到憑證對嘛所以跟資安有關嘛TWCA你們請大家換憑證的網頁官網上前兩句就講了如果有好的信任憑證可以阻絕駭客入侵不會有這種資安的疑慮所以CA跟資安有沒有關請教速發部長當然有關嘛\n124623\t151888\t這不用解釋啊所以我想請教昨天傍晚的時候中華電信新任董事長我們知道他很努力啦他昨天講了兩個他說CA出問題跟資安無關第二個他說這一次中華電信新任憑證出了問題影響維護其為請問部長你對這兩個說法有沒有意見我們認不認同兩個問題第一個CA跟資安無關中華電信董事長說的你作為資安的最高指導機關有沒有意見\n152628\t173205\t他的CA是說8月以後他再發新的憑證不能發可是既有的憑證還是可以用那你如果憑證出了問題跟治安有沒有關嘛他的憑證沒有出問題是發憑證出問題發憑證出問題是說他8月1號以後不能發新的憑證我們現在不是在玩文字校正遊戲CA信任憑證就是跟治安有關你剛剛已經說了\n174466\t191042\tCA本身能不能發平所以亂發跟治安有沒有關亂發當然所以我覺得這樣我理解啦我理解部長的意思啦在某一個特定語境之下可以無關沒有關係這個大家自有公平那自通安全我們剛剛講到影響維護其為你認不認同\n194745\t213040\t這次的這個信任憑證的事件影響為乎其為 董事長說的認不認同我們剛剛講我們在早先就已經有雙憑證機制所以呢中華電信如果不能再發信任憑證所以您認同為乎其為影響為乎其為政府單位幾乎沒有影響那業者就算了你們是電商的產業指導單位\n215422\t238615\t業者我們有督促 剛剛委員有建議我們也跟中華電信討論過業者的 剛剛講過去發的憑證還是有效以後不能拿新憑證但是要換新憑證的時候中華電信要負責幫業者換新憑證如果要有收費 中華電信要匯出好 趕快積極處理那這個我覺得還是有很多問題我們之後再討論因為時間有限那我想今天謝謝昭偉安排的這個題目啦\n239275\t253735\t那我們看到剛剛我在這個經濟委員會質詢國發會主委完全不知道AI基本法現在在哪裡請問AI基本法是不是還在行政院裡面對吧我說院版嘛院版是不是還在行政院對嘛\n255257\t278274\t結果我們國發會完全不知道啊他不知道你 你也不知道他 為什麼呢因為他推出AI新十大建設的說法的時候完全沒有速發部的角色你們怎麼在互相邊緣化他的新聞稿裡面沒提到 所以有沒有參與如果我們不會的話 可以說明一下AI新十大建設速發部有沒有參與 負責哪些部分非常重要的部分 我們十大建設裡面我們組織了兩個建設 然後協辦六個建設所有參與\n283277\t301505\tOK那根據國發會主委的說法行政院預計六月就會核定那請問部長我們沒有一個上位的基本法很可能彼此會有漢格啊請問一下行政院有沒有機會預計在六月份我們早一點啊不然他AI新十大建設都要推出去建了結果我們沒有AI基本法\n302885\t325071\t這個讓AI新十大建設與法有據嗎有沒有機會行政院早一點6月算出院版的AI基本法草案我們那個AI的這個產業的推動在過去兩年都已經在進展那當然就是說基本法主要是管理所以我剛剛講就是說在十大建設裡面我們包括有些建設像建立算力這東西事實上這可以並行並沒有說一定要希望先出來\n326031\t348363\t部長你剛剛講出你的心裡話啦AI基本法其實不是只是要管理而已您剛剛一直也都說它是一個基本框架它又要發展又要資料治理結果您內心深處講出你的心裡話是管理沒有關係啦我們還是等你們的版本出來那我想請教部長講到AI基本法現行11部基本法當中有沒有內容有提到行政院的任務編組的條文\n349904\t378343\t有沒有行政院這個大部分的基本法都沒有那有沒有嘛有幾個有但是答案都已經出來了啦其實就這幾個都有所以能不能支持我們依法要設立任務編組啊我們第17條第7條有設立人工智慧業務的跨部會協調組織有委員會啊其實這是可以的嘛對不對有機會支持吧這個我們等院這必須是要報院要同意就是說這不是我能決定的\n380084\t387536\t好沒關係那我請教部長你可以決定當然你可以提出建議那速發部115年預計編列多少預算推行AI相關的業務115年對因為現在正在編現在正在你編對不對那預計你編多少\n396088\t411865\t我們那個預算部分現在因為剛剛講有這個AI的這個十大建設目前是希望能夠編列一百六十加碼一百六十億一百六十億在速發部這邊做AI的過去是多少你知道嗎\n413747\t436486\t過去哇暴增20倍以上過去我們問過啊速發部跟數位產業AI產業數位都納進來不是AI是5億多這個當然啦我想也許我們算法不同也許你們有AI的這個這個資安預防等等但這個這個相增增減相關的報告請給我們那想問一下部長是不是知道11部基本法裡面\n436786\t465165\t有沒有做確保預算的相關條文因為你推AI基本法各部會要做這個所謂的作用法您剛剛也提了大家需不需要一些預算現有的基本法當中有沒有做預算確保的條文有還是沒有有一些有 對有嘛其實我們都幫你找好了啦文化基本法還甚至保障專款專用海洋基本法也做這個相關的預算一定要必要措施還要寬列喔\n465885\t488477\t所以我想是不是部長您可不可以建議院長還有行政院來支持我們第11條草案裡面要放入確保預算的條文啊有沒有機會來支持一下因為沒有預算各個部會怎麼來推進呢那個委員的很多建議我們謝謝委員支持啦我想這個委員在這個AI基本法確實有很多的建議跟想法都很好那我們會剛剛講這個布版的時候會考慮\n491826\t513789\t那布版因為現在這個院版一直卡在行政院那布版現在好像現在又拉回來還要修改嗎現在到底是在院還是布啊因為您一下子說院嘛可是現在布又還沒辦法提出我們現在是說院因為要院大院通過這個需要沒有沒有我說的是行政院現在到底是您的版本速發布的版本現在是停在行政院還是又拉回來修改\n515310\t539583\t原來的那個版本是國科會草案的版本嘛那我們現在是要所以你們從來沒有送過一份過去從來沒有我們就是把原來的國科會草案那個版本原則上是不然那個請那個市長我跟委員說明喔大概就是國科會他預告的版本行政院交給蘇華部主政之後我們大概有開了兩次的會所以我們大概有修正部分的條文現在就在行政院的校文的審理中這樣\n539923\t560835\t卡在行政院嘛所以現在是卡在行政院因為這一點我想所有的委員教文委員會還有交通委員會包含召委我們都非常關心啦所以您又提到說那速發布要7月15號以前才能將布版整理出來可是這剛剛很奇怪啊您說您的版本已經送到行政院了那為什麼現在布版不能早一點提供給我們看呢\n561935\t580321\t因為現在是行政院那到7月15號以前我們還是要努力我們現在我們那天在委員會教育交通聯席我們只是要布板喔欸為什麼布板您都可以給行政院了現在其實已經可以提出來了啊對啊所以7月15號以前我們當然會提出好所以您現在有抓7月15號以前嘛對不對對\n581121\t602406\t好7月15號以前我希望啦書發部可以預定照你們的想法也承諾了7月15號要如期完成這個佈板提供給教育及教章兩個委員會審查使用這一點沒有改變嘛對不對沒有改變好那最後借主席一點點時間剛剛有提到很多打詐的議題其實近期有非常多的陳情這個虛擬這個貨幣或數位資產的產業有非常多的KOL\n609568\t635058\t突然遭到大幅度的下架其實很多人都只是在做知識的推廣這個我覺得那他們是不明不白的沒有任何的沒有任何的理由那相關的這個平台呢有說好像跟速發部說不定是有什麼樣的關係所以這一點我希望請部長了解一下虛擬貨幣或者是數位資產不是全部都是妖魔如果照這樣的一個做法\n635478\t660837\t只要有問題就來砍就說他詐欺那這樣我想美國在推動比特幣穩定比特幣的法案穩定幣的法案都會落入你們的這個評估標準這樣很奇怪我們接受通報以後我們是跟金管會就報給金管會那這個決定應該是金管會決定好所以我想相關的這個橫向剝剝通不要讓民眾其實有一些新興的產業他們是做正規的事情\n661297\t669609\t那不小心誤殺到正規的事這過去抒發部或者是相關部會已經有過類似的例子希望這種誤殺的方式不要再出現好不好好謝謝謝謝部長謝謝主席\n","txt":"好 謝謝主席 有請速發部黃燕南部長請部長\n好 謝謝部長我想支持蔡奇商委員剛剛的說法打造通茶網把負擔加注在民眾身上部會應該還是要多努力透過一些新的技術同時我有幾個問題想問剛剛有提到現在用的GPU就不叫超級電腦但你們速發部的官網上面直接就寫了超級電腦訓練出所有的語言模型中略打算加上台灣本地的資料去做到台灣的引擎\n所以是你們速發部網站寫錯了還是你們剛剛其實在糊弄別人啊用GPU集成的電腦就不叫超級電腦嗎這是你們速發部公網自己寫的喔教證一下超級電腦的定義其實就是擁有超級算力的電腦管它CPU GPU你們不要突然在質詢台上面突然發明跟產業界不一樣的說法\n不好意思如果你們不去更正你們速發部官網上的東西不用再跟我解釋了有沒有人要更正沒有更正就更正剛剛的說法我剛才想要跟那個邱若驊委員所解釋的就是如同我們部長所講的因為超級電腦是一個比較模糊的概念那就泛用文詞不需要在質詢台上面去確定跟學界不一樣的東西好謝謝要精準我們開始變精準我覺得這個資訊圈的人真的會覺得很難過我再問部長\n請問CA信任憑證跟自動安全有沒有關係\n那個CA是剛講就是跟資通安全有沒有關係如果你需要一些加密的那個訊息有受效經過CA拿到憑證對嘛所以跟資安有關嘛TWCA你們請大家換憑證的網頁官網上前兩句就講了如果有好的信任憑證可以阻絕駭客入侵不會有這種資安的疑慮所以CA跟資安有沒有關請教速發部長當然有關嘛\n這不用解釋啊所以我想請教昨天傍晚的時候中華電信新任董事長我們知道他很努力啦他昨天講了兩個他說CA出問題跟資安無關第二個他說這一次中華電信新任憑證出了問題影響維護其為請問部長你對這兩個說法有沒有意見我們認不認同兩個問題第一個CA跟資安無關中華電信董事長說的你作為資安的最高指導機關有沒有意見\n他的CA是說8月以後他再發新的憑證不能發可是既有的憑證還是可以用那你如果憑證出了問題跟治安有沒有關嘛他的憑證沒有出問題是發憑證出問題發憑證出問題是說他8月1號以後不能發新的憑證我們現在不是在玩文字校正遊戲CA信任憑證就是跟治安有關你剛剛已經說了\nCA本身能不能發平所以亂發跟治安有沒有關亂發當然所以我覺得這樣我理解啦我理解部長的意思啦在某一個特定語境之下可以無關沒有關係這個大家自有公平那自通安全我們剛剛講到影響維護其為你認不認同\n這次的這個信任憑證的事件影響為乎其為 董事長說的認不認同我們剛剛講我們在早先就已經有雙憑證機制所以呢中華電信如果不能再發信任憑證所以您認同為乎其為影響為乎其為政府單位幾乎沒有影響那業者就算了你們是電商的產業指導單位\n業者我們有督促 剛剛委員有建議我們也跟中華電信討論過業者的 剛剛講過去發的憑證還是有效以後不能拿新憑證但是要換新憑證的時候中華電信要負責幫業者換新憑證如果要有收費 中華電信要匯出好 趕快積極處理那這個我覺得還是有很多問題我們之後再討論因為時間有限那我想今天謝謝昭偉安排的這個題目啦\n那我們看到剛剛我在這個經濟委員會質詢國發會主委完全不知道AI基本法現在在哪裡請問AI基本法是不是還在行政院裡面對吧我說院版嘛院版是不是還在行政院對嘛\n結果我們國發會完全不知道啊他不知道你 你也不知道他 為什麼呢因為他推出AI新十大建設的說法的時候完全沒有速發部的角色你們怎麼在互相邊緣化他的新聞稿裡面沒提到 所以有沒有參與如果我們不會的話 可以說明一下AI新十大建設速發部有沒有參與 負責哪些部分非常重要的部分 我們十大建設裡面我們組織了兩個建設 然後協辦六個建設所有參與\nOK那根據國發會主委的說法行政院預計六月就會核定那請問部長我們沒有一個上位的基本法很可能彼此會有漢格啊請問一下行政院有沒有機會預計在六月份我們早一點啊不然他AI新十大建設都要推出去建了結果我們沒有AI基本法\n這個讓AI新十大建設與法有據嗎有沒有機會行政院早一點6月算出院版的AI基本法草案我們那個AI的這個產業的推動在過去兩年都已經在進展那當然就是說基本法主要是管理所以我剛剛講就是說在十大建設裡面我們包括有些建設像建立算力這東西事實上這可以並行並沒有說一定要希望先出來\n部長你剛剛講出你的心裡話啦AI基本法其實不是只是要管理而已您剛剛一直也都說它是一個基本框架它又要發展又要資料治理結果您內心深處講出你的心裡話是管理沒有關係啦我們還是等你們的版本出來那我想請教部長講到AI基本法現行11部基本法當中有沒有內容有提到行政院的任務編組的條文\n有沒有行政院這個大部分的基本法都沒有那有沒有嘛有幾個有但是答案都已經出來了啦其實就這幾個都有所以能不能支持我們依法要設立任務編組啊我們第17條第7條有設立人工智慧業務的跨部會協調組織有委員會啊其實這是可以的嘛對不對有機會支持吧這個我們等院這必須是要報院要同意就是說這不是我能決定的\n好沒關係那我請教部長你可以決定當然你可以提出建議那速發部115年預計編列多少預算推行AI相關的業務115年對因為現在正在編現在正在你編對不對那預計你編多少\n我們那個預算部分現在因為剛剛講有這個AI的這個十大建設目前是希望能夠編列一百六十加碼一百六十億一百六十億在速發部這邊做AI的過去是多少你知道嗎\n過去哇暴增20倍以上過去我們問過啊速發部跟數位產業AI產業數位都納進來不是AI是5億多這個當然啦我想也許我們算法不同也許你們有AI的這個這個資安預防等等但這個這個相增增減相關的報告請給我們那想問一下部長是不是知道11部基本法裡面\n有沒有做確保預算的相關條文因為你推AI基本法各部會要做這個所謂的作用法您剛剛也提了大家需不需要一些預算現有的基本法當中有沒有做預算確保的條文有還是沒有有一些有 對有嘛其實我們都幫你找好了啦文化基本法還甚至保障專款專用海洋基本法也做這個相關的預算一定要必要措施還要寬列喔\n所以我想是不是部長您可不可以建議院長還有行政院來支持我們第11條草案裡面要放入確保預算的條文啊有沒有機會來支持一下因為沒有預算各個部會怎麼來推進呢那個委員的很多建議我們謝謝委員支持啦我想這個委員在這個AI基本法確實有很多的建議跟想法都很好那我們會剛剛講這個布版的時候會考慮\n那布版因為現在這個院版一直卡在行政院那布版現在好像現在又拉回來還要修改嗎現在到底是在院還是布啊因為您一下子說院嘛可是現在布又還沒辦法提出我們現在是說院因為要院大院通過這個需要沒有沒有我說的是行政院現在到底是您的版本速發布的版本現在是停在行政院還是又拉回來修改\n原來的那個版本是國科會草案的版本嘛那我們現在是要所以你們從來沒有送過一份過去從來沒有我們就是把原來的國科會草案那個版本原則上是不然那個請那個市長我跟委員說明喔大概就是國科會他預告的版本行政院交給蘇華部主政之後我們大概有開了兩次的會所以我們大概有修正部分的條文現在就在行政院的校文的審理中這樣\n卡在行政院嘛所以現在是卡在行政院因為這一點我想所有的委員教文委員會還有交通委員會包含召委我們都非常關心啦所以您又提到說那速發布要7月15號以前才能將布版整理出來可是這剛剛很奇怪啊您說您的版本已經送到行政院了那為什麼現在布版不能早一點提供給我們看呢\n因為現在是行政院那到7月15號以前我們還是要努力我們現在我們那天在委員會教育交通聯席我們只是要布板喔欸為什麼布板您都可以給行政院了現在其實已經可以提出來了啊對啊所以7月15號以前我們當然會提出好所以您現在有抓7月15號以前嘛對不對對\n好7月15號以前我希望啦書發部可以預定照你們的想法也承諾了7月15號要如期完成這個佈板提供給教育及教章兩個委員會審查使用這一點沒有改變嘛對不對沒有改變好那最後借主席一點點時間剛剛有提到很多打詐的議題其實近期有非常多的陳情這個虛擬這個貨幣或數位資產的產業有非常多的KOL\n突然遭到大幅度的下架其實很多人都只是在做知識的推廣這個我覺得那他們是不明不白的沒有任何的沒有任何的理由那相關的這個平台呢有說好像跟速發部說不定是有什麼樣的關係所以這一點我希望請部長了解一下虛擬貨幣或者是數位資產不是全部都是妖魔如果照這樣的一個做法\n只要有問題就來砍就說他詐欺那這樣我想美國在推動比特幣穩定比特幣的法案穩定幣的法案都會落入你們的這個評估標準這樣很奇怪我們接受通報以後我們是跟金管會就報給金管會那這個決定應該是金管會決定好所以我想相關的這個橫向剝剝通不要讓民眾其實有一些新興的產業他們是做正規的事情\n那不小心誤殺到正規的事這過去抒發部或者是相關部會已經有過類似的例子希望這種誤殺的方式不要再出現好不好好謝謝謝謝部長謝謝主席\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:04.417 --> 00:06.747\n好謝謝主席有請速發部黃燕南部長請部長\n\n00:13.870 --> 00:41.425\n好謝謝部長我想支持蔡奇商委員剛剛的說法打造通茶網把負擔加注在民眾身上部會應該還是要多努力透過一些新的技術同時我有幾個問題想問剛剛有提到現在用的GPU就不叫超級電腦但你們速發部的官網上面直接就寫了超級電腦訓練出所有的語言模型中略打算加上台灣本地的資料去做到台灣的引擎\n\n00:42.245 --> 01:02.538\n所以是你們速發部網站寫錯了還是你們剛剛其實在糊弄別人啊用GPU集成的電腦就不叫超級電腦嗎這是你們速發部公網自己寫的喔教證一下超級電腦的定義其實就是擁有超級算力的電腦管它CPUGPU你們不要突然在質詢台上面突然發明跟產業界不一樣的說法\n\n01:03.038 --> 01:26.006\n不好意思如果你們不去更正你們速發部官網上的東西不用再跟我解釋了有沒有人要更正沒有更正就更正剛剛的說法我剛才想要跟那個邱若驊委員所解釋的就是如同我們部長所講的因為超級電腦是一個比較模糊的概念那就泛用文詞不需要在質詢台上面去確定跟學界不一樣的東西好謝謝要精準我們開始變精準我覺得這個資訊圈的人真的會覺得很難過我再問部長\n\n01:31.329 --> 01:33.512\n請問CA信任憑證跟自動安全有沒有關係\n\n01:35.069 --> 01:59.841\n那個CA是剛講就是跟資通安全有沒有關係如果你需要一些加密的那個訊息有受效經過CA拿到憑證對嘛所以跟資安有關嘛TWCA你們請大家換憑證的網頁官網上前兩句就講了如果有好的信任憑證可以阻絕駭客入侵不會有這種資安的疑慮所以CA跟資安有沒有關請教速發部長當然有關嘛\n\n02:04.623 --> 02:31.888\n這不用解釋啊所以我想請教昨天傍晚的時候中華電信新任董事長我們知道他很努力啦他昨天講了兩個他說CA出問題跟資安無關第二個他說這一次中華電信新任憑證出了問題影響維護其為請問部長你對這兩個說法有沒有意見我們認不認同兩個問題第一個CA跟資安無關中華電信董事長說的你作為資安的最高指導機關有沒有意見\n\n02:32.628 --> 02:53.205\n他的CA是說8月以後他再發新的憑證不能發可是既有的憑證還是可以用那你如果憑證出了問題跟治安有沒有關嘛他的憑證沒有出問題是發憑證出問題發憑證出問題是說他8月1號以後不能發新的憑證我們現在不是在玩文字校正遊戲CA信任憑證就是跟治安有關你剛剛已經說了\n\n02:54.466 --> 03:11.042\nCA本身能不能發平所以亂發跟治安有沒有關亂發當然所以我覺得這樣我理解啦我理解部長的意思啦在某一個特定語境之下可以無關沒有關係這個大家自有公平那自通安全我們剛剛講到影響維護其為你認不認同\n\n03:14.745 --> 03:33.040\n這次的這個信任憑證的事件影響為乎其為董事長說的認不認同我們剛剛講我們在早先就已經有雙憑證機制所以呢中華電信如果不能再發信任憑證所以您認同為乎其為影響為乎其為政府單位幾乎沒有影響那業者就算了你們是電商的產業指導單位\n\n03:35.422 --> 03:58.615\n業者我們有督促剛剛委員有建議我們也跟中華電信討論過業者的剛剛講過去發的憑證還是有效以後不能拿新憑證但是要換新憑證的時候中華電信要負責幫業者換新憑證如果要有收費中華電信要匯出好趕快積極處理那這個我覺得還是有很多問題我們之後再討論因為時間有限那我想今天謝謝昭偉安排的這個題目啦\n\n03:59.275 --> 04:13.735\n那我們看到剛剛我在這個經濟委員會質詢國發會主委完全不知道AI基本法現在在哪裡請問AI基本法是不是還在行政院裡面對吧我說院版嘛院版是不是還在行政院對嘛\n\n04:15.257 --> 04:38.274\n結果我們國發會完全不知道啊他不知道你你也不知道他為什麼呢因為他推出AI新十大建設的說法的時候完全沒有速發部的角色你們怎麼在互相邊緣化他的新聞稿裡面沒提到所以有沒有參與如果我們不會的話可以說明一下AI新十大建設速發部有沒有參與負責哪些部分非常重要的部分我們十大建設裡面我們組織了兩個建設然後協辦六個建設所有參與\n\n04:43.277 --> 05:01.505\nOK那根據國發會主委的說法行政院預計六月就會核定那請問部長我們沒有一個上位的基本法很可能彼此會有漢格啊請問一下行政院有沒有機會預計在六月份我們早一點啊不然他AI新十大建設都要推出去建了結果我們沒有AI基本法\n\n05:02.885 --> 05:25.071\n這個讓AI新十大建設與法有據嗎有沒有機會行政院早一點6月算出院版的AI基本法草案我們那個AI的這個產業的推動在過去兩年都已經在進展那當然就是說基本法主要是管理所以我剛剛講就是說在十大建設裡面我們包括有些建設像建立算力這東西事實上這可以並行並沒有說一定要希望先出來\n\n05:26.031 --> 05:48.363\n部長你剛剛講出你的心裡話啦AI基本法其實不是只是要管理而已您剛剛一直也都說它是一個基本框架它又要發展又要資料治理結果您內心深處講出你的心裡話是管理沒有關係啦我們還是等你們的版本出來那我想請教部長講到AI基本法現行11部基本法當中有沒有內容有提到行政院的任務編組的條文\n\n05:49.904 --> 06:18.343\n有沒有行政院這個大部分的基本法都沒有那有沒有嘛有幾個有但是答案都已經出來了啦其實就這幾個都有所以能不能支持我們依法要設立任務編組啊我們第17條第7條有設立人工智慧業務的跨部會協調組織有委員會啊其實這是可以的嘛對不對有機會支持吧這個我們等院這必須是要報院要同意就是說這不是我能決定的\n\n06:20.084 --> 06:27.536\n好沒關係那我請教部長你可以決定當然你可以提出建議那速發部115年預計編列多少預算推行AI相關的業務115年對因為現在正在編現在正在你編對不對那預計你編多少\n\n06:36.088 --> 06:51.865\n我們那個預算部分現在因為剛剛講有這個AI的這個十大建設目前是希望能夠編列一百六十加碼一百六十億一百六十億在速發部這邊做AI的過去是多少你知道嗎\n\n06:53.747 --> 07:16.486\n過去哇暴增20倍以上過去我們問過啊速發部跟數位產業AI產業數位都納進來不是AI是5億多這個當然啦我想也許我們算法不同也許你們有AI的這個這個資安預防等等但這個這個相增增減相關的報告請給我們那想問一下部長是不是知道11部基本法裡面\n\n07:16.786 --> 07:45.165\n有沒有做確保預算的相關條文因為你推AI基本法各部會要做這個所謂的作用法您剛剛也提了大家需不需要一些預算現有的基本法當中有沒有做預算確保的條文有還是沒有有一些有對有嘛其實我們都幫你找好了啦文化基本法還甚至保障專款專用海洋基本法也做這個相關的預算一定要必要措施還要寬列喔\n\n07:45.885 --> 08:08.477\n所以我想是不是部長您可不可以建議院長還有行政院來支持我們第11條草案裡面要放入確保預算的條文啊有沒有機會來支持一下因為沒有預算各個部會怎麼來推進呢那個委員的很多建議我們謝謝委員支持啦我想這個委員在這個AI基本法確實有很多的建議跟想法都很好那我們會剛剛講這個布版的時候會考慮\n\n08:11.826 --> 08:33.789\n那布版因為現在這個院版一直卡在行政院那布版現在好像現在又拉回來還要修改嗎現在到底是在院還是布啊因為您一下子說院嘛可是現在布又還沒辦法提出我們現在是說院因為要院大院通過這個需要沒有沒有我說的是行政院現在到底是您的版本速發布的版本現在是停在行政院還是又拉回來修改\n\n08:35.310 --> 08:59.583\n原來的那個版本是國科會草案的版本嘛那我們現在是要所以你們從來沒有送過一份過去從來沒有我們就是把原來的國科會草案那個版本原則上是不然那個請那個市長我跟委員說明喔大概就是國科會他預告的版本行政院交給蘇華部主政之後我們大概有開了兩次的會所以我們大概有修正部分的條文現在就在行政院的校文的審理中這樣\n\n08:59.923 --> 09:20.835\n卡在行政院嘛所以現在是卡在行政院因為這一點我想所有的委員教文委員會還有交通委員會包含召委我們都非常關心啦所以您又提到說那速發布要7月15號以前才能將布版整理出來可是這剛剛很奇怪啊您說您的版本已經送到行政院了那為什麼現在布版不能早一點提供給我們看呢\n\n09:21.935 --> 09:40.321\n因為現在是行政院那到7月15號以前我們還是要努力我們現在我們那天在委員會教育交通聯席我們只是要布板喔欸為什麼布板您都可以給行政院了現在其實已經可以提出來了啊對啊所以7月15號以前我們當然會提出好所以您現在有抓7月15號以前嘛對不對對\n\n09:41.121 --> 10:02.406\n好7月15號以前我希望啦書發部可以預定照你們的想法也承諾了7月15號要如期完成這個佈板提供給教育及教章兩個委員會審查使用這一點沒有改變嘛對不對沒有改變好那最後借主席一點點時間剛剛有提到很多打詐的議題其實近期有非常多的陳情這個虛擬這個貨幣或數位資產的產業有非常多的KOL\n\n10:09.568 --> 10:35.058\n突然遭到大幅度的下架其實很多人都只是在做知識的推廣這個我覺得那他們是不明不白的沒有任何的沒有任何的理由那相關的這個平台呢有說好像跟速發部說不定是有什麼樣的關係所以這一點我希望請部長了解一下虛擬貨幣或者是數位資產不是全部都是妖魔如果照這樣的一個做法\n\n10:35.478 --> 11:00.837\n只要有問題就來砍就說他詐欺那這樣我想美國在推動比特幣穩定比特幣的法案穩定幣的法案都會落入你們的這個評估標準這樣很奇怪我們接受通報以後我們是跟金管會就報給金管會那這個決定應該是金管會決定好所以我想相關的這個橫向剝剝通不要讓民眾其實有一些新興的產業他們是做正規的事情\n\n11:01.297 --> 11:09.609\n那不小心誤殺到正規的事這過去抒發部或者是相關部會已經有過類似的例子希望這種誤殺的方式不要再出現好不好好謝謝謝謝部長謝謝主席\n\n","segments":[{"start":4.417,"end":6.747,"text":"好 謝謝主席 有請速發部黃燕南部長請部長"},{"start":13.87,"end":41.425,"text":"好 謝謝部長我想支持蔡奇商委員剛剛的說法打造通茶網把負擔加注在民眾身上部會應該還是要多努力透過一些新的技術同時我有幾個問題想問剛剛有提到現在用的GPU就不叫超級電腦但你們速發部的官網上面直接就寫了超級電腦訓練出所有的語言模型中略打算加上台灣本地的資料去做到台灣的引擎"},{"start":42.245,"end":62.538,"text":"所以是你們速發部網站寫錯了還是你們剛剛其實在糊弄別人啊用GPU集成的電腦就不叫超級電腦嗎這是你們速發部公網自己寫的喔教證一下超級電腦的定義其實就是擁有超級算力的電腦管它CPU GPU你們不要突然在質詢台上面突然發明跟產業界不一樣的說法"},{"start":63.038,"end":86.006,"text":"不好意思如果你們不去更正你們速發部官網上的東西不用再跟我解釋了有沒有人要更正沒有更正就更正剛剛的說法我剛才想要跟那個邱若驊委員所解釋的就是如同我們部長所講的因為超級電腦是一個比較模糊的概念那就泛用文詞不需要在質詢台上面去確定跟學界不一樣的東西好謝謝要精準我們開始變精準我覺得這個資訊圈的人真的會覺得很難過我再問部長"},{"start":91.329,"end":93.512,"text":"請問CA信任憑證跟自動安全有沒有關係"},{"start":95.069,"end":119.841,"text":"那個CA是剛講就是跟資通安全有沒有關係如果你需要一些加密的那個訊息有受效經過CA拿到憑證對嘛所以跟資安有關嘛TWCA你們請大家換憑證的網頁官網上前兩句就講了如果有好的信任憑證可以阻絕駭客入侵不會有這種資安的疑慮所以CA跟資安有沒有關請教速發部長當然有關嘛"},{"start":124.623,"end":151.888,"text":"這不用解釋啊所以我想請教昨天傍晚的時候中華電信新任董事長我們知道他很努力啦他昨天講了兩個他說CA出問題跟資安無關第二個他說這一次中華電信新任憑證出了問題影響維護其為請問部長你對這兩個說法有沒有意見我們認不認同兩個問題第一個CA跟資安無關中華電信董事長說的你作為資安的最高指導機關有沒有意見"},{"start":152.628,"end":173.205,"text":"他的CA是說8月以後他再發新的憑證不能發可是既有的憑證還是可以用那你如果憑證出了問題跟治安有沒有關嘛他的憑證沒有出問題是發憑證出問題發憑證出問題是說他8月1號以後不能發新的憑證我們現在不是在玩文字校正遊戲CA信任憑證就是跟治安有關你剛剛已經說了"},{"start":174.466,"end":191.042,"text":"CA本身能不能發平所以亂發跟治安有沒有關亂發當然所以我覺得這樣我理解啦我理解部長的意思啦在某一個特定語境之下可以無關沒有關係這個大家自有公平那自通安全我們剛剛講到影響維護其為你認不認同"},{"start":194.745,"end":213.04,"text":"這次的這個信任憑證的事件影響為乎其為 董事長說的認不認同我們剛剛講我們在早先就已經有雙憑證機制所以呢中華電信如果不能再發信任憑證所以您認同為乎其為影響為乎其為政府單位幾乎沒有影響那業者就算了你們是電商的產業指導單位"},{"start":215.422,"end":238.615,"text":"業者我們有督促 剛剛委員有建議我們也跟中華電信討論過業者的 剛剛講過去發的憑證還是有效以後不能拿新憑證但是要換新憑證的時候中華電信要負責幫業者換新憑證如果要有收費 中華電信要匯出好 趕快積極處理那這個我覺得還是有很多問題我們之後再討論因為時間有限那我想今天謝謝昭偉安排的這個題目啦"},{"start":239.275,"end":253.735,"text":"那我們看到剛剛我在這個經濟委員會質詢國發會主委完全不知道AI基本法現在在哪裡請問AI基本法是不是還在行政院裡面對吧我說院版嘛院版是不是還在行政院對嘛"},{"start":255.257,"end":278.274,"text":"結果我們國發會完全不知道啊他不知道你 你也不知道他 為什麼呢因為他推出AI新十大建設的說法的時候完全沒有速發部的角色你們怎麼在互相邊緣化他的新聞稿裡面沒提到 所以有沒有參與如果我們不會的話 可以說明一下AI新十大建設速發部有沒有參與 負責哪些部分非常重要的部分 我們十大建設裡面我們組織了兩個建設 然後協辦六個建設所有參與"},{"start":283.277,"end":301.505,"text":"OK那根據國發會主委的說法行政院預計六月就會核定那請問部長我們沒有一個上位的基本法很可能彼此會有漢格啊請問一下行政院有沒有機會預計在六月份我們早一點啊不然他AI新十大建設都要推出去建了結果我們沒有AI基本法"},{"start":302.885,"end":325.071,"text":"這個讓AI新十大建設與法有據嗎有沒有機會行政院早一點6月算出院版的AI基本法草案我們那個AI的這個產業的推動在過去兩年都已經在進展那當然就是說基本法主要是管理所以我剛剛講就是說在十大建設裡面我們包括有些建設像建立算力這東西事實上這可以並行並沒有說一定要希望先出來"},{"start":326.031,"end":348.363,"text":"部長你剛剛講出你的心裡話啦AI基本法其實不是只是要管理而已您剛剛一直也都說它是一個基本框架它又要發展又要資料治理結果您內心深處講出你的心裡話是管理沒有關係啦我們還是等你們的版本出來那我想請教部長講到AI基本法現行11部基本法當中有沒有內容有提到行政院的任務編組的條文"},{"start":349.904,"end":378.343,"text":"有沒有行政院這個大部分的基本法都沒有那有沒有嘛有幾個有但是答案都已經出來了啦其實就這幾個都有所以能不能支持我們依法要設立任務編組啊我們第17條第7條有設立人工智慧業務的跨部會協調組織有委員會啊其實這是可以的嘛對不對有機會支持吧這個我們等院這必須是要報院要同意就是說這不是我能決定的"},{"start":380.084,"end":387.536,"text":"好沒關係那我請教部長你可以決定當然你可以提出建議那速發部115年預計編列多少預算推行AI相關的業務115年對因為現在正在編現在正在你編對不對那預計你編多少"},{"start":396.088,"end":411.865,"text":"我們那個預算部分現在因為剛剛講有這個AI的這個十大建設目前是希望能夠編列一百六十加碼一百六十億一百六十億在速發部這邊做AI的過去是多少你知道嗎"},{"start":413.747,"end":436.486,"text":"過去哇暴增20倍以上過去我們問過啊速發部跟數位產業AI產業數位都納進來不是AI是5億多這個當然啦我想也許我們算法不同也許你們有AI的這個這個資安預防等等但這個這個相增增減相關的報告請給我們那想問一下部長是不是知道11部基本法裡面"},{"start":436.786,"end":465.165,"text":"有沒有做確保預算的相關條文因為你推AI基本法各部會要做這個所謂的作用法您剛剛也提了大家需不需要一些預算現有的基本法當中有沒有做預算確保的條文有還是沒有有一些有 對有嘛其實我們都幫你找好了啦文化基本法還甚至保障專款專用海洋基本法也做這個相關的預算一定要必要措施還要寬列喔"},{"start":465.885,"end":488.477,"text":"所以我想是不是部長您可不可以建議院長還有行政院來支持我們第11條草案裡面要放入確保預算的條文啊有沒有機會來支持一下因為沒有預算各個部會怎麼來推進呢那個委員的很多建議我們謝謝委員支持啦我想這個委員在這個AI基本法確實有很多的建議跟想法都很好那我們會剛剛講這個布版的時候會考慮"},{"start":491.826,"end":513.789,"text":"那布版因為現在這個院版一直卡在行政院那布版現在好像現在又拉回來還要修改嗎現在到底是在院還是布啊因為您一下子說院嘛可是現在布又還沒辦法提出我們現在是說院因為要院大院通過這個需要沒有沒有我說的是行政院現在到底是您的版本速發布的版本現在是停在行政院還是又拉回來修改"},{"start":515.31,"end":539.583,"text":"原來的那個版本是國科會草案的版本嘛那我們現在是要所以你們從來沒有送過一份過去從來沒有我們就是把原來的國科會草案那個版本原則上是不然那個請那個市長我跟委員說明喔大概就是國科會他預告的版本行政院交給蘇華部主政之後我們大概有開了兩次的會所以我們大概有修正部分的條文現在就在行政院的校文的審理中這樣"},{"start":539.923,"end":560.835,"text":"卡在行政院嘛所以現在是卡在行政院因為這一點我想所有的委員教文委員會還有交通委員會包含召委我們都非常關心啦所以您又提到說那速發布要7月15號以前才能將布版整理出來可是這剛剛很奇怪啊您說您的版本已經送到行政院了那為什麼現在布版不能早一點提供給我們看呢"},{"start":561.935,"end":580.321,"text":"因為現在是行政院那到7月15號以前我們還是要努力我們現在我們那天在委員會教育交通聯席我們只是要布板喔欸為什麼布板您都可以給行政院了現在其實已經可以提出來了啊對啊所以7月15號以前我們當然會提出好所以您現在有抓7月15號以前嘛對不對對"},{"start":581.121,"end":602.406,"text":"好7月15號以前我希望啦書發部可以預定照你們的想法也承諾了7月15號要如期完成這個佈板提供給教育及教章兩個委員會審查使用這一點沒有改變嘛對不對沒有改變好那最後借主席一點點時間剛剛有提到很多打詐的議題其實近期有非常多的陳情這個虛擬這個貨幣或數位資產的產業有非常多的KOL"},{"start":609.568,"end":635.058,"text":"突然遭到大幅度的下架其實很多人都只是在做知識的推廣這個我覺得那他們是不明不白的沒有任何的沒有任何的理由那相關的這個平台呢有說好像跟速發部說不定是有什麼樣的關係所以這一點我希望請部長了解一下虛擬貨幣或者是數位資產不是全部都是妖魔如果照這樣的一個做法"},{"start":635.478,"end":660.837,"text":"只要有問題就來砍就說他詐欺那這樣我想美國在推動比特幣穩定比特幣的法案穩定幣的法案都會落入你們的這個評估標準這樣很奇怪我們接受通報以後我們是跟金管會就報給金管會那這個決定應該是金管會決定好所以我想相關的這個橫向剝剝通不要讓民眾其實有一些新興的產業他們是做正規的事情"},{"start":661.297,"end":669.609,"text":"那不小心誤殺到正規的事這過去抒發部或者是相關部會已經有過類似的例子希望這種誤殺的方式不要再出現好不好好謝謝謝謝部長謝謝主席"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":492,"blocks":[["葛委員如鈞：（10時42分）謝謝主席，有請數發部黃彥男部長。"],["主席：請部長。"],["黃部長彥男：葛委員好。"],["葛委員如鈞：部長好。我支持蔡其昌委員剛剛的說法，這個打詐通查網把負擔加諸在民眾身上，部會應該還是要多努力，透過一些新的技術。同時我有幾個問題想問，剛剛有提到現在用的GPU就不叫超級電腦，但你們數發部的官網上面直接就寫了，超級電腦訓練出所有的語言模型，中略，打算加上臺灣本地的資料去做到臺灣的引擎，所以是你們數發部網站寫錯了，還是你們剛剛其實在糊弄別人？用GPU集成的電腦就不叫超級電腦嗎？這是你們數發部官網自己寫的喔，校正一下。"],["黃部長彥男：不，超級電腦的定義其實有點模糊……"],["葛委員如鈞：就是擁有超級算力的電腦，管他CPU、GPU，你們不要在質詢臺上面突然發明跟產業界不一樣的說法。不好意思，如果你們不去更正你們數發部官網上的東西，不用再跟我解釋了，有沒有要更正？沒有更正，你就更正剛剛的說法。"],["林次長宜敬：那個就是我剛才想要跟邱若華委員所解釋的，就如同我們部長所講的，因為超級電腦是一個比較模糊的概念，那有兩種……"],["葛委員如鈞：這個就是泛用名詞，不需要在質詢臺上面去……"],["林次長宜敬：是，我們不需要再討論這個事情。"],["葛委員如鈞：定跟學界不一樣的東西，好，謝謝。"],["黃部長彥男：這個要精準，我們可以再精準，對GPU啦！這個基本上。"],["葛委員如鈞：好，我覺得這個說法資訊圈的人聽了真的會覺得很難過。","我再請問部長，請問CA信任憑證跟資通安全有沒有關係？"],["黃部長彥男：CA是一個憑證……"],["葛委員如鈞：跟資通安全有沒有關係？跟資通安全有沒有關係？"],["黃部長彥男：就是說如果你需要一些加密的訊息，有時候要經過CA拿到憑證……"],["葛委員如鈞：對嘛，所以跟資安有關嘛！TWCA你們請大家換憑證的網頁，官網上前兩句就講了，如果有好的信任憑證，可以阻絕駭客入侵，不會有資安的疑慮，所以CA跟資安有沒有關？請教數發部部長。"],["黃部長彥男：這當然有關，但是它跟加密的……"],["葛委員如鈞：當然有關嘛，好，這不用解釋啊！所以我想請教，昨天傍晚的時候，中華電信新任董事長，我們知道他很努力，他昨天講了兩個，他說CA出問題跟資安無關；第二個，他說這一次中華電信信任憑證出了問題，影響微乎其微。請問部長，你對這兩個說法有沒有意見？認不認同？"],["黃部長彥男：我們……"],["葛委員如鈞：兩個問題：第一個，CA跟資安無關，中華電信董事長說的，你作為資安最高指導機關，有沒有意見？"],["黃部長彥男：不，他是說8月以後他要再發新的憑證不能發，可是既有的憑證還是可以用……"],["葛委員如鈞：那你如果憑證出了問題，跟資安有沒有關嘛？部長。"],["黃部長彥男：他的憑證沒有出問題，是發憑證出問題。發憑證出問題是說它8月1日以後不能發新的憑證，並不代表……"],["葛委員如鈞：部長，我們現在不是在玩文字校正遊戲……"],["黃部長彥男：沒有、沒有，我……"],["葛委員如鈞：CA信任憑證就是與資安有關，您剛剛已經說了。"],["黃部長彥男：沒有，委員，CA本身能不能發憑證……"],["葛委員如鈞：所以亂發跟資安有沒有關？"],["黃部長彥男：不是，亂發當然……"],["葛委員如鈞：對嘛！這樣我理解了，我理解部長的意思啦！在某一個特定語境之下可以無關，沒有關係，這個大家自有公評。那資通安全，我們剛剛講到影響微乎其微，您認不認同？這一次信任憑證事件的影響微乎其微，董事長說的，認不認同？"],["黃部長彥男：剛剛有講，我們在早先就已經有雙憑證機制，所以中華電信如果不能再發新的憑證……"],["葛委員如鈞：所以您認同影響微乎其微？"],["黃部長彥男：至少對政府單位安全是幾乎沒有影響……"],["葛委員如鈞：所以業者就算了？你們是電商的產業指導單位欸！"],["黃部長彥男：不是，業者我們有督促，剛剛委員有建議，我們也跟中華電信討論過，剛剛講過去發的憑證還是有效，業者以後不能拿新憑證，但是要換新憑證的時候，中華電信要負責幫業者換新憑證，如果有收費，中華電信會出這個錢。"],["葛委員如鈞：好，趕快積極處理，我覺得還是有很多問題，我們之後再討論，因為時間有限。","今天謝謝召委安排了這個題目，剛剛我在經濟委員會質詢，國發會主委完全不知道AI基本法現在在哪裡，請問AI基本法是不是還在行政院裡面？對吧？我是說院版，院版是不是還在行政院？"],["黃部長彥男：還在行政院。"],["葛委員如鈞：對嘛！結果國發會完全不知道啊！它不知道你，你也不知道它，為什麼呢？因為它推出AI新十大建設的說法的時候，完全沒有數發部的角色，你們怎麼在互相邊緣化？"],["黃部長彥男：有啊！"],["葛委員如鈞：它的新聞稿裡面沒提到，所以有沒有參與？"],["黃部長彥男：當然有，我們十項建設……"],["葛委員如鈞：如果有誤會的話可以說明一下，AI新十大建設數發部有沒有參與？負責哪些部分？"],["黃部長彥男：有，非常重要的部分，因為十大建設裡面我們主責兩個建設，然後協辦其中六個建設。"],["葛委員如鈞：所以有參與，OK。根據國發會主委的說法，行政院預計6月就會核定，部長，我們沒有一個上位的基本法，很可能彼此會有扞格啊！請問一下，行政院有沒有機會預計在6月份送出，我們早一點啊！不然AI新十大建設都要推出去建了，結果我們沒有AI基本法，讓AI新十大建設於法有據嘛！有沒有機會行政院早一點，6月送出院版的AI基本法草案？"],["黃部長彥男：我們AI產業的推動在過去兩年都已經在進展，當然基本法主要是管理，所以我剛剛講在十大建設裡面，包括有些建設，像建立算力，這個東西事實上可以並行，並沒有說一定要基本法先出來才要做產業的部分。"],["葛委員如鈞：部長，你剛剛講出你的心裡話啦！AI基本法其實不只是管理而已，您剛剛也一直說它是一個基本框架……"],["黃部長彥男：對，基本框架。"],["葛委員如鈞：它又要發展，又要資料治理，結果您內心深處……"],["黃部長彥男：沒有，那個……"],["葛委員如鈞：講出你的心裡話是管理，沒有關係啦！我們還是等你們的版本出來。我想請教部長，講到AI基本法，現行11部基本法當中，有沒有內容有提到行政院任務編組的條文？有沒有？"],["黃部長彥男：大部分的基本法都沒有所謂的主責機關。"],["葛委員如鈞：有沒有嘛？"],["黃部長彥男：有幾個有，但是……"],["葛委員如鈞：對，答案都已經出來了，其實這幾個都有，所以能不能支持我們依法要設立任務編組？我們第七條有設立人工智慧業務的跨部會協調組織，有委員會啊！其實這是可以的，對不對？有機會支持吧？"],["黃部長彥男：因為這個畢竟要報院，院要同意，這不是我能決定的。"],["葛委員如鈞：好，沒關係，你可以決定啊！當然你可以提出建議嘛！請教部長，數發部115年預計編列多少預算推行AI相關的業務？"],["黃部長彥男：115年目前還在討論。"],["葛委員如鈞：因為現在正在擬編，對不對？"],["黃部長彥男：對。"],["葛委員如鈞：預計擬編多少？"],["黃部長彥男：預算部分，因為剛剛講有AI十大建設嘛！目前是希望能夠加碼160億。"],["葛委員如鈞：160億在數發部這邊？做AI的。"],["黃部長彥男：對。"],["葛委員如鈞：過去是多少你知道嗎？"],["黃部長彥男：過去？"],["葛委員如鈞：哇！暴增20倍以上啊！過去我們問過數發部，包括數位產業、AI產業，數位都納進來，不只是AI喔！是五億多喔！當然啦！也許我們算法不同，也許你們有AI的資安預防等等，但是相關增減的報告請給我們。"],["黃部長彥男：好。"],["葛委員如鈞：想問一下部長，你知不知道在11部基本法裡面，有沒有做確保預算的相關條文？因為你推AI基本法，各部會要做所謂的作用法，您剛剛也提了，大家需不需要業務預算？現有的基本法當中，有沒有做預算確保的條文？有還是沒有？"],["黃部長彥男：有一些有。"],["葛委員如鈞：有嘛！其實我們都幫你找好了，文化基本法甚至還保障專款專用，海洋基本法也確保相關的預算，一定要採取必要措施，還要寬列喔！所以部長可不可以建議院長還有行政院來支持我們草案裡面的第十一條，要放入確保預算的條文？有沒有機會來支持一下？因為沒有預算，各個部會怎麼來推進呢？"],["黃部長彥男：謝謝委員支持，我想委員在AI基本法確實有很多的建議和想法都很好，我們剛剛有講，在部版的時候會考慮。"],["葛委員如鈞：好，因為一直卡在行政院，好像現在又拉回來，部版還要修改嗎？現在到底是在院還是部？因為您一下子說院，可是現在部又還沒辦法提出。"],["黃部長彥男：我們現在是說，院因為要大院通過，這個需要……"],["葛委員如鈞：沒有，我說的是數發部的版本現在是停在行政院，還是又拉回來修改？"],["黃部長彥男：沒有，原來那個版本是國科會草案的版本，我們現在是要……"],["葛委員如鈞：所以你們從來沒有送一份過去，從來沒有？"],["黃部長彥男：我們就是把原來的國科會草案版本做修正，不然我請司長來說明。"],["蔡司長壽洤：我跟委員說明，國科會預告的版本，在行政院交給數發部主政之後，我們大概開了兩次會，所以我們有修正部分的條文，現在在行政院的教文審理中。"],["葛委員如鈞：在行政院嘛？"],["蔡司長壽洤：是。"],["葛委員如鈞：所以現在是卡在行政院。因為這一點我想所有的委員，教文委員會還有交通委員會，包含召委，我們都非常關心啦！可是您又提到數發部要7月15日以前才能將部版整理出來，這個很奇怪啊！您說您的版本已經送到行政院了，為什麼現在部版不能早一點提供給我們看呢？"],["蔡司長壽洤：因為現在是在行政院，在7月15日以前我們還是要努力，第一個……"],["葛委員如鈞：那一天在委員會，教育及文化委員會、交通委員會聯席，我們只是要部版喔！部版您都可以給行政院了，現在其實已經可以提出來啦！"],["蔡司長壽洤：對，所以7月15日以前我們當然會提進去。"],["葛委員如鈞：好，所以您現在有抓7月15日以前，對不對？"],["蔡司長壽洤：對。"],["葛委員如鈞：好，7月15日以前，我希望數發部可以照你們的想法，也承諾7月15日要如期完成部版，提供給教育及交通兩個委員會審查使用，這一點沒有改變，對不對？"],["黃部長彥男：沒有改變。"],["葛委員如鈞：好。最後借主席一點點時間，剛剛有提到很多打詐的議題，其實近期有非常多的陳情，虛擬貨幣或數位資產的產業有非常多的KOL突然遭到大幅度的下架，其實很多人都只是在做知識的推廣，那他們是不明不白的喔！沒有任何的理由，相關的平臺有說好像跟數發部說不定有什麼樣的關係，所以這一點我希望請部長瞭解一下。"],["黃部長彥男：好，我瞭解一下。"],["葛委員如鈞：虛擬貨幣或者是數位資產不是全部都是妖魔，如果照這個做法，只要有問題就來砍，就說它詐欺，這樣的話，我想美國在推動比特幣的法案、穩定幣的法案，都會落入你們的評估標準，這樣很奇怪，好不好？"],["黃部長彥男：我們接受通報以後就報給金管會，所以這個決定應該是金管會決定的。"],["林署長俊秀：我們會再跟它來確定。"],["黃部長彥男：我們再跟它討論。"],["葛委員如鈞：好，其實有一些新興產業是做正規的事情，不小心誤殺到正規的事，這個過去在數發部或者是相關部會已經有過類似的例子，希望這種誤殺的方式不要再出現，好不好？"],["黃部長彥男：好，我們再跟金管會討論，謝謝。"],["葛委員如鈞：好，謝謝部長，謝謝主席。"],["主席：現在休息10分鐘。","休息（10時53分）","繼續開會（11時5分）"],["主席：現在開始開會，請大家回座。","請劉書彬委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":442,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-23-16","speakers":["許智傑","洪孟楷","李昆澤","林國成","陳素月","林俊憲","徐富癸","邱若華","蔡其昌","葛如鈞","劉書彬","黃健豪","張雅琳","翁曉玲","鍾佳濱","葉元之","魯明哲","廖先翔","游顥","王鴻薇","何欣純","楊瓊瓔"],"page_start":379,"meetingDate":["2025-06-18"],"gazette_id":"1146001","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1146001_00012"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期交通委員會第16次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請數位發展部部長黃彥男就「推動 AI 之產業發展政策」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1146001_00016"}}}