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\"start\": 528.924, \"end\": 529.024, \"score\": 0.586}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 529.024, \"end\": 529.144, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 529.144, \"end\": 529.164, \"score\": 0.003}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 529.164, \"end\": 529.184, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,229 --> 00:00:15,777\n吳佩奕委員發言謝謝署席我請國發會移民署入委會來請相關部會委員長\n\n2\n00:00:24,828 --> 00:00:39,980\n主委好今天我們要審議的是外國專業人才延濫及僱用法的修正草案在行政院提出來的修法當中我們新增了兩項的規定一個是第六條本來現行法規是規定事件頂大\n\n3\n00:00:41,041 --> 00:01:00,089\n的畢業生來台工作可以不用兩年工作經驗我們現在新增的是修改為世界前1000名大學畢業生來台工作不用兩年工作經驗再來第二項是第11條就是外國人他最近五年內只要有取得教育部公告世界大學排名前200大的\n\n4\n00:01:01,929 --> 00:01:15,774\n這個學士畢業者可以自行的向勞動部來申請工作許可那整個方向就是朝向放寬這個修法其實涉及的很重大所以今天我們是有三個委員會的聯席審查那有關於這個細節部分我等會跟主委來討論很多個人會關心說外國專業人才的懶才大家都贊成支持\n\n5\n00:01:26,537 --> 00:01:39,442\n但是呢會不會成為中國政府派人來台灣工作滲透的一個紅色的管道按照我們現行的法規有中國大陸籍的人士他是不適用我們的這個就業金卡對不對這一點是沒有問題的那\n\n6\n00:01:44,744 --> 00:02:04,949\n但是呢在這個勞動部有一個說明當中有提到他有一個但書啦就是說就是如果他是在這個台灣與大陸地區人民關係條例這個規定當中這個但是他是第一個旅居國外4年以上\n\n7\n00:02:06,391 --> 00:02:19,549\n好的之下列的民眾第一個他要取得當地國籍者第二個取得當地永久居留權並領有有效護照者其實簡單來說基本上就是指海外出生的中國人會雙重國籍\n\n8\n00:02:21,451 --> 00:02:39,982\n在這個我們剛講的排除之內就它是有一個段數存在所以我們現在為什麼大家會開始關心呢前陣子我們看到哈佛大學他的這個畢業生代表致詞就是中國的學生將禦絨引起很多的討論\n\n9\n00:02:41,062 --> 00:03:05,761\n那可以看到就我們舉手邊的資料近年來有非常多中國的高官子女都是前往送往這個哈佛大學來讀書甚至有一說說哈佛是不是中國的海外黨校那所以中國政府其實是有計畫的在安排人士到前往這個世界的頂尖大學來讀書\n\n10\n00:03:08,343 --> 00:03:26,834\n我們就擔心說會不會就是有可能他是中國我現在講是可能假設性的情況不是說已經有具體案例他會不會是在持有中國以外國家護照的中國人有可能是雙重國籍的狀況\n\n11\n00:03:28,835 --> 00:03:53,511\n或者是他是在海外出生的中國紅二代那他因為有世界名校這樣子的身份有可能會因此更容易來台進行這個滲透的工作按照我們現在先要修的這個法規像我剛剛講的類這樣子情況的人要來台灣工作的話他會經過什麼樣的審查呢\n\n12\n00:03:56,676 --> 00:04:09,017\n謝謝委員委員關心的其實也是我們之前很在意的事情所以我們也有請陸委會參與整個修法的過程是不是請陸委會來回答這個問題他會比較精準好\n\n13\n00:04:10,690 --> 00:04:28,482\n非常謝謝委員的提問以及提醒那其實在修法的過程中我們就有留意到就是中國大陸人是可能會藉由轉換身份成外國籍或者是港澳籍來到台灣的這樣的問題所以我們在修法的過程之中就有建議必須要強化整個審查作業\n\n14\n00:04:29,242 --> 00:04:33,305\n那其實我們現在針對這樣的案件我們就已經有在強化審查在過程之中我們都會去確定的釐清他的身份人別然後也會確認他有沒有安全的疑慮有沒有符合我們整體的產業需求跟國家利益只要有疑義的話我們就會不予許可那我們後續也會持續的去完善整個SOP確保我們的國家安全\n\n15\n00:04:53,240 --> 00:05:13,880\n這個審查的單位第一個把關的是在什麼單位就是相關就是在我們的那個系統收案了以後如果說主管機關針對有異議或者是類似的案件的話他就會去會上相關機關例如說像是國安相關單位還有我們的陸委會移民署以及產業的主管機關\n\n16\n00:05:14,841 --> 00:05:31,596\n那相關機關會去進行一些相關的清搜然後檢索一些過往的一些相關的資料還有去檢索他們的資料庫如果有需要的話也會去請當事人去做說明提出佐證資料那相關機關再會綜合所有資訊來進行審查如果說有疑慮的話就會不予許可\n\n17\n00:05:35,379 --> 00:05:43,126\n好所以我們是有考量這個因素我們未來會逐案的來嚴格的把關審查所以我要特別提醒國發會要避免我們海外的攬查制度攬裁制度成為紅色滲透的管道這個要特別提醒你們注意委員補充我們對港澳也有相關的規範\n\n18\n00:05:55,336 --> 00:06:13,654\n是就包含了涉入因素還有國安疑慮我們都要主案嚴格來審查好那請移民署會可以請回我也請教這個主委剛提到的我們新增的第六條第十一條嘛那我想要討論因為我看到這個我們這個制度它應該是參照英國的這個高潛力人才簽證HPIVisa\n\n19\n00:06:14,915 --> 00:06:31,131\n也是開放英國是開放給全球前50大那日本也仿效了英國也建立了J-Find未來創造人才制度他開放是全球前100大那我們看到日本在第一年這個制度上路之後他的這個來申請的簽證數人數是353人\n\n20\n00:06:35,815 --> 00:06:42,780\n那英國呢第一年他所開放時候的簽證數是1342人所以這個成效這個數字不大一樣那日本的狀況其中有他的申請的人75%是中國人所以其實有一些相關的討論就是除了你的法規的開放方寬以外你相關的這個外國人才就業的環境\n\n21\n00:07:02,995 --> 00:07:03,836\n是不是友善那有相關的誘因哪一些的這些職業特別的吸引這些外國的人才我們有沒有去做相關的\n\n22\n00:07:15,101 --> 00:07:23,007\n這個評估針對英國跟日本這些已經開放上路的國家他們施行的成效我們有沒有做相關的這些討論跟檢討就是說未來台灣會不會我們修法通過了支持你們但是呢實際上面的成效因此而申請的人數會不會不多會不會有這樣的問題\n\n23\n00:07:38,638 --> 00:08:05,006\n這個因為它是我們初次開放但是過去如果我們把它用特定專業人士跟專業人士來看把200大設為特定專業人士的話我們其實過去因為台灣有經濟跟科技的進步也吸引到一萬八千多這樣的人那效果不會比較差那只是我們現在條件在放到跟日本一樣我們認為在某些領域上面科技這些經濟領域上面我們會吸引到比較多的人\n\n24\n00:08:05,566 --> 00:08:28,263\n那我們在整個法令我們現在是佔顧是6670位的增加那我估計這裡面應該可以增加600到1000位至少可以增加這樣的人數但是你委員剛剛提到一個很大的關鍵就是我們的生態系統不夠完整就是外國人進來以後我們各地的環境不夠友善譬如說他到比較郊區要去叫個計程車我們的55688只有中文\n\n25\n00:08:30,925 --> 00:08:49,184\n那Uber在比較偏鄉就沒有那我們現在就嘗試再改善這些地方然後做配套的改善好那就是提醒你們支持這個修法但是除了法律法規調適以外我們的環境我們的行政的作文也要一起來提升是的是的好謝謝好謝謝委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n229\t15777\t吳佩奕委員發言謝謝署席 我請國發會移民署入委會來 請相關部會委員長\n24828\t39980\t主委好今天我們要審議的是外國專業人才延濫及僱用法的修正草案在行政院提出來的修法當中我們新增了兩項的規定一個是第六條本來現行法規是規定事件頂大\n41041\t60089\t的畢業生來台工作可以不用兩年工作經驗我們現在新增的是修改為世界前1000名大學畢業生來台工作不用兩年工作經驗再來第二項是第11條就是外國人他最近五年內只要有取得教育部公告世界大學排名前200大的\n61929\t75774\t這個學士畢業者可以自行的向勞動部來申請工作許可那整個方向就是朝向放寬這個修法其實涉及的很重大所以今天我們是有三個委員會的聯席審查那有關於這個細節部分我等會跟主委來討論很多個人會關心說外國專業人才的懶才大家都贊成支持\n86537\t99442\t但是呢會不會成為中國政府派人來台灣工作滲透的一個紅色的管道按照我們現行的法規有中國大陸籍的人士他是不適用我們的這個就業金卡對不對這一點是沒有問題的那\n104744\t124949\t但是呢在這個勞動部有一個說明當中有提到他有一個但書啦就是說就是如果他是在這個台灣與大陸地區人民關係條例這個規定當中這個但是他是第一個旅居國外4年以上\n126391\t139549\t好的 之下列的民眾第一個他要取得當地國籍者第二個取得當地永久居留權並領有有效護照者其實簡單來說基本上就是指海外出生的中國人會雙重國籍\n141451\t159982\t在這個我們剛講的排除之內就它是有一個段數存在所以我們現在為什麼大家會開始關心呢前陣子我們看到哈佛大學他的這個畢業生代表致詞就是中國的學生將禦絨引起很多的討論\n161062\t185761\t那可以看到就我們舉手邊的資料近年來有非常多中國的高官子女都是前往送往這個哈佛大學來讀書甚至有一說說哈佛是不是中國的海外黨校那所以中國政府其實是有計畫的在安排人士到前往這個世界的頂尖大學來讀書\n188343\t206834\t我們就擔心說會不會就是有可能他是中國我現在講是可能假設性的情況不是說已經有具體案例他會不會是在持有中國以外國家護照的中國人有可能是雙重國籍的狀況\n208835\t233511\t或者是他是在海外出生的中國紅二代那他因為有世界名校這樣子的身份有可能會因此更容易來台進行這個滲透的工作按照我們現在先要修的這個法規像我剛剛講的類這樣子情況的人要來台灣工作的話他會經過什麼樣的審查呢\n236676\t249017\t謝謝委員委員關心的其實也是我們之前很在意的事情所以我們也有請陸委會參與整個修法的過程是不是請陸委會來回答這個問題他會比較精準好\n250690\t268482\t非常謝謝委員的提問以及提醒那其實在修法的過程中我們就有留意到就是中國大陸人是可能會藉由轉換身份成外國籍或者是港澳籍來到台灣的這樣的問題所以我們在修法的過程之中就有建議必須要強化整個審查作業\n269242\t273305\t那其實我們現在針對這樣的案件我們就已經有在強化審查在過程之中我們都會去確定的釐清他的身份人別然後也會確認他有沒有安全的疑慮有沒有符合我們整體的產業需求跟國家利益只要有疑義的話我們就會不予許可那我們後續也會持續的去完善整個SOP確保我們的國家安全\n293240\t313880\t這個審查的單位第一個把關的是在什麼單位就是相關就是在我們的那個系統收案了以後如果說主管機關針對有異議或者是類似的案件的話他就會去會上相關機關例如說像是國安相關單位還有我們的陸委會移民署以及產業的主管機關\n314841\t331596\t那相關機關會去進行一些相關的清搜然後檢索一些過往的一些相關的資料還有去檢索他們的資料庫如果有需要的話也會去請當事人去做說明提出佐證資料那相關機關再會綜合所有資訊來進行審查如果說有疑慮的話就會不予許可\n335379\t343126\t好 所以我們是有考量這個因素我們未來會逐案的來嚴格的把關審查所以我要特別提醒國發會要避免我們海外的攬查制度 攬裁制度成為紅色滲透的管道這個要特別提醒你們注意委員補充 我們對港澳也有相關的規範\n355336\t373654\t是 就包含了涉入因素還有國安疑慮我們都要主案嚴格來審查好 那請移民署會可以請回我也請教這個主委剛提到的我們新增的第六條 第十一條嘛那我想要討論因為我看到這個我們這個制度它應該是參照英國的這個高潛力人才簽證HPI Visa\n374915\t391131\t也是開放英國是開放給全球前50大那日本也仿效了英國也建立了J-Find未來創造人才制度他開放是全球前100大那我們看到日本在第一年這個制度上路之後他的這個來申請的簽證數人數是353人\n395815\t402780\t那英國呢 第一年他所開放時候的簽證數是1342人所以這個成效 這個數字不大一樣那日本的狀況其中有他的申請的人75%是中國人所以其實有一些相關的討論就是除了你的法規的開放方寬以外你相關的這個外國人才就業的環境\n422995\t423836\t是不是友善那有相關的誘因哪一些的這些職業特別的吸引這些外國的人才我們有沒有去做相關的\n435101\t443007\t這個評估針對英國跟日本這些已經開放上路的國家他們施行的成效我們有沒有做相關的這些討論跟檢討就是說未來台灣會不會我們修法通過了支持你們但是呢實際上面的成效因此而申請的人數會不會不多會不會有這樣的問題\n458638\t485006\t這個因為它是我們初次開放但是過去如果我們把它用特定專業人士跟專業人士來看把200大設為特定專業人士的話我們其實過去因為台灣有經濟跟科技的進步也吸引到一萬八千多這樣的人那效果不會比較差那只是我們現在條件在放到跟日本一樣我們認為在某些領域上面科技這些經濟領域上面我們會吸引到比較多的人\n485566\t508263\t那我們在整個法令我們現在是佔顧是6670位的增加那我估計這裡面應該可以增加600到1000位至少可以增加這樣的人數但是你委員剛剛提到一個很大的關鍵就是我們的生態系統不夠完整就是外國人進來以後我們各地的環境不夠友善譬如說他到比較郊區要去叫個計程車我們的55688只有中文\n510925\t529184\t那Uber在比較偏鄉就沒有那我們現在就嘗試再改善這些地方然後做配套的改善好 那就是提醒你們 支持這個修法但是除了法律 法規調適以外我們的環境 我們的行政的作文也要一起來提升是的 是的好 謝謝好 謝謝委員\n","txt":"吳佩奕委員發言謝謝署席 我請國發會移民署入委會來 請相關部會委員長\n主委好今天我們要審議的是外國專業人才延濫及僱用法的修正草案在行政院提出來的修法當中我們新增了兩項的規定一個是第六條本來現行法規是規定事件頂大\n的畢業生來台工作可以不用兩年工作經驗我們現在新增的是修改為世界前1000名大學畢業生來台工作不用兩年工作經驗再來第二項是第11條就是外國人他最近五年內只要有取得教育部公告世界大學排名前200大的\n這個學士畢業者可以自行的向勞動部來申請工作許可那整個方向就是朝向放寬這個修法其實涉及的很重大所以今天我們是有三個委員會的聯席審查那有關於這個細節部分我等會跟主委來討論很多個人會關心說外國專業人才的懶才大家都贊成支持\n但是呢會不會成為中國政府派人來台灣工作滲透的一個紅色的管道按照我們現行的法規有中國大陸籍的人士他是不適用我們的這個就業金卡對不對這一點是沒有問題的那\n但是呢在這個勞動部有一個說明當中有提到他有一個但書啦就是說就是如果他是在這個台灣與大陸地區人民關係條例這個規定當中這個但是他是第一個旅居國外4年以上\n好的 之下列的民眾第一個他要取得當地國籍者第二個取得當地永久居留權並領有有效護照者其實簡單來說基本上就是指海外出生的中國人會雙重國籍\n在這個我們剛講的排除之內就它是有一個段數存在所以我們現在為什麼大家會開始關心呢前陣子我們看到哈佛大學他的這個畢業生代表致詞就是中國的學生將禦絨引起很多的討論\n那可以看到就我們舉手邊的資料近年來有非常多中國的高官子女都是前往送往這個哈佛大學來讀書甚至有一說說哈佛是不是中國的海外黨校那所以中國政府其實是有計畫的在安排人士到前往這個世界的頂尖大學來讀書\n我們就擔心說會不會就是有可能他是中國我現在講是可能假設性的情況不是說已經有具體案例他會不會是在持有中國以外國家護照的中國人有可能是雙重國籍的狀況\n或者是他是在海外出生的中國紅二代那他因為有世界名校這樣子的身份有可能會因此更容易來台進行這個滲透的工作按照我們現在先要修的這個法規像我剛剛講的類這樣子情況的人要來台灣工作的話他會經過什麼樣的審查呢\n謝謝委員委員關心的其實也是我們之前很在意的事情所以我們也有請陸委會參與整個修法的過程是不是請陸委會來回答這個問題他會比較精準好\n非常謝謝委員的提問以及提醒那其實在修法的過程中我們就有留意到就是中國大陸人是可能會藉由轉換身份成外國籍或者是港澳籍來到台灣的這樣的問題所以我們在修法的過程之中就有建議必須要強化整個審查作業\n那其實我們現在針對這樣的案件我們就已經有在強化審查在過程之中我們都會去確定的釐清他的身份人別然後也會確認他有沒有安全的疑慮有沒有符合我們整體的產業需求跟國家利益只要有疑義的話我們就會不予許可那我們後續也會持續的去完善整個SOP確保我們的國家安全\n這個審查的單位第一個把關的是在什麼單位就是相關就是在我們的那個系統收案了以後如果說主管機關針對有異議或者是類似的案件的話他就會去會上相關機關例如說像是國安相關單位還有我們的陸委會移民署以及產業的主管機關\n那相關機關會去進行一些相關的清搜然後檢索一些過往的一些相關的資料還有去檢索他們的資料庫如果有需要的話也會去請當事人去做說明提出佐證資料那相關機關再會綜合所有資訊來進行審查如果說有疑慮的話就會不予許可\n好 所以我們是有考量這個因素我們未來會逐案的來嚴格的把關審查所以我要特別提醒國發會要避免我們海外的攬查制度 攬裁制度成為紅色滲透的管道這個要特別提醒你們注意委員補充 我們對港澳也有相關的規範\n是 就包含了涉入因素還有國安疑慮我們都要主案嚴格來審查好 那請移民署會可以請回我也請教這個主委剛提到的我們新增的第六條 第十一條嘛那我想要討論因為我看到這個我們這個制度它應該是參照英國的這個高潛力人才簽證HPI Visa\n也是開放英國是開放給全球前50大那日本也仿效了英國也建立了J-Find未來創造人才制度他開放是全球前100大那我們看到日本在第一年這個制度上路之後他的這個來申請的簽證數人數是353人\n那英國呢 第一年他所開放時候的簽證數是1342人所以這個成效 這個數字不大一樣那日本的狀況其中有他的申請的人75%是中國人所以其實有一些相關的討論就是除了你的法規的開放方寬以外你相關的這個外國人才就業的環境\n是不是友善那有相關的誘因哪一些的這些職業特別的吸引這些外國的人才我們有沒有去做相關的\n這個評估針對英國跟日本這些已經開放上路的國家他們施行的成效我們有沒有做相關的這些討論跟檢討就是說未來台灣會不會我們修法通過了支持你們但是呢實際上面的成效因此而申請的人數會不會不多會不會有這樣的問題\n這個因為它是我們初次開放但是過去如果我們把它用特定專業人士跟專業人士來看把200大設為特定專業人士的話我們其實過去因為台灣有經濟跟科技的進步也吸引到一萬八千多這樣的人那效果不會比較差那只是我們現在條件在放到跟日本一樣我們認為在某些領域上面科技這些經濟領域上面我們會吸引到比較多的人\n那我們在整個法令我們現在是佔顧是6670位的增加那我估計這裡面應該可以增加600到1000位至少可以增加這樣的人數但是你委員剛剛提到一個很大的關鍵就是我們的生態系統不夠完整就是外國人進來以後我們各地的環境不夠友善譬如說他到比較郊區要去叫個計程車我們的55688只有中文\n那Uber在比較偏鄉就沒有那我們現在就嘗試再改善這些地方然後做配套的改善好 那就是提醒你們 支持這個修法但是除了法律 法規調適以外我們的環境 我們的行政的作文也要一起來提升是的 是的好 謝謝好 謝謝委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.229 --> 00:15.777\n吳佩奕委員發言謝謝署席我請國發會移民署入委會來請相關部會委員長\n\n00:24.828 --> 00:39.980\n主委好今天我們要審議的是外國專業人才延濫及僱用法的修正草案在行政院提出來的修法當中我們新增了兩項的規定一個是第六條本來現行法規是規定事件頂大\n\n00:41.041 --> 01:00.089\n的畢業生來台工作可以不用兩年工作經驗我們現在新增的是修改為世界前1000名大學畢業生來台工作不用兩年工作經驗再來第二項是第11條就是外國人他最近五年內只要有取得教育部公告世界大學排名前200大的\n\n01:01.929 --> 01:15.774\n這個學士畢業者可以自行的向勞動部來申請工作許可那整個方向就是朝向放寬這個修法其實涉及的很重大所以今天我們是有三個委員會的聯席審查那有關於這個細節部分我等會跟主委來討論很多個人會關心說外國專業人才的懶才大家都贊成支持\n\n01:26.537 --> 01:39.442\n但是呢會不會成為中國政府派人來台灣工作滲透的一個紅色的管道按照我們現行的法規有中國大陸籍的人士他是不適用我們的這個就業金卡對不對這一點是沒有問題的那\n\n01:44.744 --> 02:04.949\n但是呢在這個勞動部有一個說明當中有提到他有一個但書啦就是說就是如果他是在這個台灣與大陸地區人民關係條例這個規定當中這個但是他是第一個旅居國外4年以上\n\n02:06.391 --> 02:19.549\n好的之下列的民眾第一個他要取得當地國籍者第二個取得當地永久居留權並領有有效護照者其實簡單來說基本上就是指海外出生的中國人會雙重國籍\n\n02:21.451 --> 02:39.982\n在這個我們剛講的排除之內就它是有一個段數存在所以我們現在為什麼大家會開始關心呢前陣子我們看到哈佛大學他的這個畢業生代表致詞就是中國的學生將禦絨引起很多的討論\n\n02:41.062 --> 03:05.761\n那可以看到就我們舉手邊的資料近年來有非常多中國的高官子女都是前往送往這個哈佛大學來讀書甚至有一說說哈佛是不是中國的海外黨校那所以中國政府其實是有計畫的在安排人士到前往這個世界的頂尖大學來讀書\n\n03:08.343 --> 03:26.834\n我們就擔心說會不會就是有可能他是中國我現在講是可能假設性的情況不是說已經有具體案例他會不會是在持有中國以外國家護照的中國人有可能是雙重國籍的狀況\n\n03:28.835 --> 03:53.511\n或者是他是在海外出生的中國紅二代那他因為有世界名校這樣子的身份有可能會因此更容易來台進行這個滲透的工作按照我們現在先要修的這個法規像我剛剛講的類這樣子情況的人要來台灣工作的話他會經過什麼樣的審查呢\n\n03:56.676 --> 04:09.017\n謝謝委員委員關心的其實也是我們之前很在意的事情所以我們也有請陸委會參與整個修法的過程是不是請陸委會來回答這個問題他會比較精準好\n\n04:10.690 --> 04:28.482\n非常謝謝委員的提問以及提醒那其實在修法的過程中我們就有留意到就是中國大陸人是可能會藉由轉換身份成外國籍或者是港澳籍來到台灣的這樣的問題所以我們在修法的過程之中就有建議必須要強化整個審查作業\n\n04:29.242 --> 04:33.305\n那其實我們現在針對這樣的案件我們就已經有在強化審查在過程之中我們都會去確定的釐清他的身份人別然後也會確認他有沒有安全的疑慮有沒有符合我們整體的產業需求跟國家利益只要有疑義的話我們就會不予許可那我們後續也會持續的去完善整個SOP確保我們的國家安全\n\n04:53.240 --> 05:13.880\n這個審查的單位第一個把關的是在什麼單位就是相關就是在我們的那個系統收案了以後如果說主管機關針對有異議或者是類似的案件的話他就會去會上相關機關例如說像是國安相關單位還有我們的陸委會移民署以及產業的主管機關\n\n05:14.841 --> 05:31.596\n那相關機關會去進行一些相關的清搜然後檢索一些過往的一些相關的資料還有去檢索他們的資料庫如果有需要的話也會去請當事人去做說明提出佐證資料那相關機關再會綜合所有資訊來進行審查如果說有疑慮的話就會不予許可\n\n05:35.379 --> 05:43.126\n好所以我們是有考量這個因素我們未來會逐案的來嚴格的把關審查所以我要特別提醒國發會要避免我們海外的攬查制度攬裁制度成為紅色滲透的管道這個要特別提醒你們注意委員補充我們對港澳也有相關的規範\n\n05:55.336 --> 06:13.654\n是就包含了涉入因素還有國安疑慮我們都要主案嚴格來審查好那請移民署會可以請回我也請教這個主委剛提到的我們新增的第六條第十一條嘛那我想要討論因為我看到這個我們這個制度它應該是參照英國的這個高潛力人才簽證HPIVisa\n\n06:14.915 --> 06:31.131\n也是開放英國是開放給全球前50大那日本也仿效了英國也建立了J-Find未來創造人才制度他開放是全球前100大那我們看到日本在第一年這個制度上路之後他的這個來申請的簽證數人數是353人\n\n06:35.815 --> 06:42.780\n那英國呢第一年他所開放時候的簽證數是1342人所以這個成效這個數字不大一樣那日本的狀況其中有他的申請的人75%是中國人所以其實有一些相關的討論就是除了你的法規的開放方寬以外你相關的這個外國人才就業的環境\n\n07:02.995 --> 07:03.836\n是不是友善那有相關的誘因哪一些的這些職業特別的吸引這些外國的人才我們有沒有去做相關的\n\n07:15.101 --> 07:23.007\n這個評估針對英國跟日本這些已經開放上路的國家他們施行的成效我們有沒有做相關的這些討論跟檢討就是說未來台灣會不會我們修法通過了支持你們但是呢實際上面的成效因此而申請的人數會不會不多會不會有這樣的問題\n\n07:38.638 --> 08:05.006\n這個因為它是我們初次開放但是過去如果我們把它用特定專業人士跟專業人士來看把200大設為特定專業人士的話我們其實過去因為台灣有經濟跟科技的進步也吸引到一萬八千多這樣的人那效果不會比較差那只是我們現在條件在放到跟日本一樣我們認為在某些領域上面科技這些經濟領域上面我們會吸引到比較多的人\n\n08:05.566 --> 08:28.263\n那我們在整個法令我們現在是佔顧是6670位的增加那我估計這裡面應該可以增加600到1000位至少可以增加這樣的人數但是你委員剛剛提到一個很大的關鍵就是我們的生態系統不夠完整就是外國人進來以後我們各地的環境不夠友善譬如說他到比較郊區要去叫個計程車我們的55688只有中文\n\n08:30.925 --> 08:49.184\n那Uber在比較偏鄉就沒有那我們現在就嘗試再改善這些地方然後做配套的改善好那就是提醒你們支持這個修法但是除了法律法規調適以外我們的環境我們的行政的作文也要一起來提升是的是的好謝謝好謝謝委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.229,"end":15.777,"text":"吳佩奕委員發言謝謝署席 我請國發會移民署入委會來 請相關部會委員長"},{"start":24.828,"end":39.98,"text":"主委好今天我們要審議的是外國專業人才延濫及僱用法的修正草案在行政院提出來的修法當中我們新增了兩項的規定一個是第六條本來現行法規是規定事件頂大"},{"start":41.041,"end":60.089,"text":"的畢業生來台工作可以不用兩年工作經驗我們現在新增的是修改為世界前1000名大學畢業生來台工作不用兩年工作經驗再來第二項是第11條就是外國人他最近五年內只要有取得教育部公告世界大學排名前200大的"},{"start":61.929,"end":75.774,"text":"這個學士畢業者可以自行的向勞動部來申請工作許可那整個方向就是朝向放寬這個修法其實涉及的很重大所以今天我們是有三個委員會的聯席審查那有關於這個細節部分我等會跟主委來討論很多個人會關心說外國專業人才的懶才大家都贊成支持"},{"start":86.537,"end":99.442,"text":"但是呢會不會成為中國政府派人來台灣工作滲透的一個紅色的管道按照我們現行的法規有中國大陸籍的人士他是不適用我們的這個就業金卡對不對這一點是沒有問題的那"},{"start":104.744,"end":124.949,"text":"但是呢在這個勞動部有一個說明當中有提到他有一個但書啦就是說就是如果他是在這個台灣與大陸地區人民關係條例這個規定當中這個但是他是第一個旅居國外4年以上"},{"start":126.391,"end":139.549,"text":"好的 之下列的民眾第一個他要取得當地國籍者第二個取得當地永久居留權並領有有效護照者其實簡單來說基本上就是指海外出生的中國人會雙重國籍"},{"start":141.451,"end":159.982,"text":"在這個我們剛講的排除之內就它是有一個段數存在所以我們現在為什麼大家會開始關心呢前陣子我們看到哈佛大學他的這個畢業生代表致詞就是中國的學生將禦絨引起很多的討論"},{"start":161.062,"end":185.761,"text":"那可以看到就我們舉手邊的資料近年來有非常多中國的高官子女都是前往送往這個哈佛大學來讀書甚至有一說說哈佛是不是中國的海外黨校那所以中國政府其實是有計畫的在安排人士到前往這個世界的頂尖大學來讀書"},{"start":188.343,"end":206.834,"text":"我們就擔心說會不會就是有可能他是中國我現在講是可能假設性的情況不是說已經有具體案例他會不會是在持有中國以外國家護照的中國人有可能是雙重國籍的狀況"},{"start":208.835,"end":233.511,"text":"或者是他是在海外出生的中國紅二代那他因為有世界名校這樣子的身份有可能會因此更容易來台進行這個滲透的工作按照我們現在先要修的這個法規像我剛剛講的類這樣子情況的人要來台灣工作的話他會經過什麼樣的審查呢"},{"start":236.676,"end":249.017,"text":"謝謝委員委員關心的其實也是我們之前很在意的事情所以我們也有請陸委會參與整個修法的過程是不是請陸委會來回答這個問題他會比較精準好"},{"start":250.69,"end":268.482,"text":"非常謝謝委員的提問以及提醒那其實在修法的過程中我們就有留意到就是中國大陸人是可能會藉由轉換身份成外國籍或者是港澳籍來到台灣的這樣的問題所以我們在修法的過程之中就有建議必須要強化整個審查作業"},{"start":269.242,"end":273.305,"text":"那其實我們現在針對這樣的案件我們就已經有在強化審查在過程之中我們都會去確定的釐清他的身份人別然後也會確認他有沒有安全的疑慮有沒有符合我們整體的產業需求跟國家利益只要有疑義的話我們就會不予許可那我們後續也會持續的去完善整個SOP確保我們的國家安全"},{"start":293.24,"end":313.88,"text":"這個審查的單位第一個把關的是在什麼單位就是相關就是在我們的那個系統收案了以後如果說主管機關針對有異議或者是類似的案件的話他就會去會上相關機關例如說像是國安相關單位還有我們的陸委會移民署以及產業的主管機關"},{"start":314.841,"end":331.596,"text":"那相關機關會去進行一些相關的清搜然後檢索一些過往的一些相關的資料還有去檢索他們的資料庫如果有需要的話也會去請當事人去做說明提出佐證資料那相關機關再會綜合所有資訊來進行審查如果說有疑慮的話就會不予許可"},{"start":335.379,"end":343.126,"text":"好 所以我們是有考量這個因素我們未來會逐案的來嚴格的把關審查所以我要特別提醒國發會要避免我們海外的攬查制度 攬裁制度成為紅色滲透的管道這個要特別提醒你們注意委員補充 我們對港澳也有相關的規範"},{"start":355.336,"end":373.654,"text":"是 就包含了涉入因素還有國安疑慮我們都要主案嚴格來審查好 那請移民署會可以請回我也請教這個主委剛提到的我們新增的第六條 第十一條嘛那我想要討論因為我看到這個我們這個制度它應該是參照英國的這個高潛力人才簽證HPI Visa"},{"start":374.915,"end":391.131,"text":"也是開放英國是開放給全球前50大那日本也仿效了英國也建立了J-Find未來創造人才制度他開放是全球前100大那我們看到日本在第一年這個制度上路之後他的這個來申請的簽證數人數是353人"},{"start":395.815,"end":402.78,"text":"那英國呢 第一年他所開放時候的簽證數是1342人所以這個成效 這個數字不大一樣那日本的狀況其中有他的申請的人75%是中國人所以其實有一些相關的討論就是除了你的法規的開放方寬以外你相關的這個外國人才就業的環境"},{"start":422.995,"end":423.836,"text":"是不是友善那有相關的誘因哪一些的這些職業特別的吸引這些外國的人才我們有沒有去做相關的"},{"start":435.101,"end":443.007,"text":"這個評估針對英國跟日本這些已經開放上路的國家他們施行的成效我們有沒有做相關的這些討論跟檢討就是說未來台灣會不會我們修法通過了支持你們但是呢實際上面的成效因此而申請的人數會不會不多會不會有這樣的問題"},{"start":458.638,"end":485.006,"text":"這個因為它是我們初次開放但是過去如果我們把它用特定專業人士跟專業人士來看把200大設為特定專業人士的話我們其實過去因為台灣有經濟跟科技的進步也吸引到一萬八千多這樣的人那效果不會比較差那只是我們現在條件在放到跟日本一樣我們認為在某些領域上面科技這些經濟領域上面我們會吸引到比較多的人"},{"start":485.566,"end":508.263,"text":"那我們在整個法令我們現在是佔顧是6670位的增加那我估計這裡面應該可以增加600到1000位至少可以增加這樣的人數但是你委員剛剛提到一個很大的關鍵就是我們的生態系統不夠完整就是外國人進來以後我們各地的環境不夠友善譬如說他到比較郊區要去叫個計程車我們的55688只有中文"},{"start":510.925,"end":529.184,"text":"那Uber在比較偏鄉就沒有那我們現在就嘗試再改善這些地方然後做配套的改善好 那就是提醒你們 支持這個修法但是除了法律 法規調適以外我們的環境 我們的行政的作文也要一起來提升是的 是的好 謝謝好 謝謝委員"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":491,"blocks":[["吳委員沛憶：（10時22分）謝謝主席。我請國發會、移民署、陸委會。"],["主席：請相關部會。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：委員早。"],["吳委員沛憶：主委好。今天我們要審議的是外國專業人才延攬及僱用法的修正草案，在行政院提出來的修法草案當中新增了兩項規定：一個是第六條，現行法規是規定世界頂大的畢業生來臺工作，可以不用兩年工作經驗，我們現在是修改為世界前一千名大學畢業生來臺工作，不用兩年工作經驗。再來是第十一條，也就是外國人最近五年內只要有取得教育部公告世界大學排名前兩百大的學士畢業者，可以自行向勞動部申請工作許可。整個方向就是朝向放寬，這個修法其實涉及得很重大，所以今天我們是三個委員會聯席審查，有關於細節部分，我等會跟主委來討論。很多國人會關心，外國專業人才的攬才，大家都贊成、支持，但是會不會成為中國政府派人來臺灣工作滲透的一個紅色的管道？按照我們現行的法規，有中國大陸籍的人士是不適用我們的就業金卡，對不對？這一點是沒有問題的。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：對。"],["吳委員沛憶：但是在勞動部的說明當中有提到，它有一個但書，就是在臺灣與大陸地區人民關係條例的規定當中，如果他是旅居國外四年以上之下列民眾：第一個，他有取得當地國籍者；第二個，取得當地永久居留權，並領有有效護照者。其實簡單來說，基本上就是指海外出生的中國人或是雙重國籍，他不在我們剛剛講的排除之內，它是有這麼一個但書存在。所以我們現在為什麼大家會開始關心呢？前一陣子，我們看到哈佛大學的畢業生代表致詞，就是中國的學生蔣雨融，引起很多的討論。據我們手邊的資料，可以看到近年來有非常多中國的高官子女都是送往哈佛大學讀書，甚至有一說是哈佛是不是中國的海外黨校，所以中國政府其實是有計畫的在安排人士前往世界頂尖大學讀書。我們就擔心會不會有可能，我現在講的是假設性的情況，不是已經有具體案例，他會不會是持有中國以外國家護照的中國人，有可能是雙重國籍的狀況，或者他是在海外出生的中國紅二代，他因為有世界名校這樣子的身分，有可能會因此更容易來臺進行滲透的工作。按照我們現在新要修的這個法規，像我剛剛講這樣子情況的人，要來臺灣工作的話，他會經過什麼樣的審查呢？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：謝謝委員，委員關心的其實也是我們之前很在意的事情，所以我們也有請陸委會參與整個修法的過程，是不是請陸委會來回答這個問題？他會比較精準。"],["吳委員沛憶：好。"],["蔡專門委員碧家：非常謝謝委員的提問以及提醒，其實在修法的過程中，我們就有留意到中國大陸人士可能會藉由轉換身分成外國籍或者是港澳籍來到臺灣這樣的問題，所以我們在修法的過程之中，就有建議必須要強化整個審查作業。其實我們現在針對這樣的案件就已經有在強化審查，在過程之中，我們都會去確定釐清他的身分、人別，也會確認他有沒有安全的疑慮、有沒有符合我們整體的產業需求跟國家利益，只要有疑義，我們就不予許可，我們後續也會持續完善整個SOP，確保我們的國家安全。"],["吳委員沛憶：這個審查的單位，第一個把關的是在什麼單位？"],["蔡專門委員碧家：在我們的系統收案了以後，如果主管機關針對有疑義或者是類此案件，他們就會去會商相關機關，例如國安相關單位，還有我們陸委會、移民署以及產業的主管機關，相關機關會去進行一些相關的情蒐，檢索過往的一些相關資料，還有檢索他們的資料庫，如果有需要的話，也會請當事人做說明，提出佐證資料，相關機關再綜合所有資訊來進行審查，如果有疑慮就不予許可。"],["吳委員沛憶：好，所以我們是有考量這個因素，未來會逐案的嚴格把關審查，所以我要特別提醒國發會，要避免我們海外的攬才制度成為紅色滲透的管道，這個要特別提醒你們注意。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：也跟委員補充，我們對港澳也有相關的規範。"],["吳委員沛憶：是，就是包含了涉陸因素，還有國安疑慮，我們都要逐案嚴格來審查。好，移民署、陸委會請回。","我要請教主委，剛剛提到要修正第六條、第十一條，我想要討論，因為我看到我們這個制度，它應該是參照英國的高潛力人才簽證HPI VISA，英國是開放給全球前五十大，日本也仿效了英國，也建立了J-Find未來創造人才制度，他開放的是全球前一百大。我們看到日本在第一年這個制度上路之後，來申請簽證的人數是353人，英國第一年開放之後的簽證數是1,342人，所以成效的數字不大一樣，日本的狀況，其中申請人75%是中國人，所以其實有一些相關的討論，就是除了法規的開放、放寬以外，相關的外國人才就業環境是不是友善，有相關的誘因，哪一些的職業特別吸引這些外國的人才，我們有沒有去做相關的評估？針對英國跟日本這些已經開放上路的國家，他們施行的成效，我們有沒有做相關的討論跟檢討？就是我們修法通過了支持你們，但是未來臺灣實際上面的成效，因此而申請的人數會不會不多？會不會有這樣的問題？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：因為是我們初次開放，但是如果我們把他用特定專業人士跟專業人士來看，把兩百大設為特定專業人士的話，其實我們過去因為臺灣有經濟跟科技的進步，也吸引到一萬八千多這樣的人，效果不會比較差。只是我們現在條件再放到跟日本一樣，我們認為在某些領域上面，科技、經濟領域上面會吸引到比較多的人，我們在整個法令現在暫估是增加6,670位，那我估計這裡面應該可以增加600到1,000位，至少可以增加這樣的人數。委員剛剛提到一個很大的關鍵，就是我們的生態系統不夠完整，外國人進來以後，我們各地的環境不夠友善，譬如說他到比較郊區要叫計程車，但我們的55688只有中文，Uber在比較偏鄉就沒有，我們現在還在嘗試改善這些地方，然後做配套的措施，讓他們在這邊可以生活得比較好。"],["吳委員沛憶：好，那就是提醒你們，我支持這個修法，但是除了法規調適以外，我們的環境……"],["劉主任委員鏡清：對，生態系統我們也要來建立。"],["吳委員沛憶：我們的行政作為也要一起來提升。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：是的。"],["吳委員沛憶：好，謝謝。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：好，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝吳沛憶委員。","下一位請張啓楷委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":328,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-3-19,26,22-1","speakers":["蔡易餘","羅美玲","邱議瑩","萬美玲","葛如鈞","鄭正鈐","楊瓊瓔","吳沛憶","張啓楷","林宜瑾","林岱樺","賴瑞隆","陳秀寳","呂玉玲","陳菁徽","劉建國","葉元之","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","陳超明","黃秀芳","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","羅廷瑋","陳亭妃","張雅琳","范雲","郭昱晴","王正旭","蔡易餘","謝衣鳯","麥玉珍","邱志偉","林月琴","張嘉郡","陳昭姿","蘇清泉","柯志恩","林淑芬","邱鎮軍","王育敏"],"page_start":231,"meetingDate":["2025-06-18"],"gazette_id":"1146001","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1146001_00010"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟、社會福利及衛生環境、教育及文化三委員會第1次聯席會議紀錄","content":"審查：(一)行政院函請審議「外國專業人才延攬及僱用法修正草案」案、(二)本院委員何欣純等\n19人擬具「外國專業人才延攬及僱用法第十二條及第十四條條文修正草案」案、(三)本院委員陳\n亭妃等16 人擬具「外國專業人才延攬及僱用法第四條、第六條及第十四條條文修正草案」案、\n(四)本院委員蔡易餘等17人擬具「外國專業人才延攬及僱用法修正草案」案、(五)本院委員羅美\n玲等16人擬具「外國專業人才延攬及僱用法修正草案」案（詢答）","agenda_id":"1146001_00014"}}}