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188.589, \"score\": 0.066}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"稅\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 188.589, \"end\": 188.609, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"稅\"}, {\"word\": \"修\", \"start\": 188.609, \"end\": 188.769, \"score\": 0.755}, {\"word\": \"正\", \"start\": 188.769, \"end\": 188.789, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 188.789, \"end\": 188.809, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"包\", \"start\": 188.809, \"end\": 189.069, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"含\", \"start\": 189.069, \"end\": 189.109, \"score\": 0.356}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 189.109, \"end\": 189.289, \"score\": 0.767}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"調\"}, {\"word\": \"降\", \"start\": 189.289, \"end\": 189.309, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"巴\", \"start\": 189.309, \"end\": 189.469, \"score\": 0.669}, {\"word\": \"拉\", \"start\": 189.469, \"end\": 189.669, \"score\": 0.617}, {\"word\": \"圭\", \"start\": 189.669, \"end\": 189.809, \"score\": 0.662}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 189.809, \"end\": 189.829, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 189.829, \"end\": 189.99, \"score\": 0.7}, {\"word\": \"骨\", \"start\": 189.99, \"end\": 190.01, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"豬\"}, {\"word\": \"肉\", \"start\": 190.01, \"end\": 190.21, \"score\": 0.701}, {\"word\": \"或\", \"start\": 190.21, \"end\": 190.39, \"score\": 0.763}, {\"word\": \"者\", \"start\": 190.39, \"end\": 190.51, \"score\": 0.828}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 190.51, \"end\": 190.55, \"score\": 0.068}, {\"word\": \"已\", \"start\": 190.55, \"end\": 190.57, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"調\"}, {\"word\": \"製\"}, {\"word\": \"或\", \"start\": 190.57, \"end\": 190.69, \"score\": 0.809}, {\"word\": \"保\", \"start\": 190.69, \"end\": 190.77, \"score\": 0.61}, {\"word\": \"存\", \"start\": 190.77, \"end\": 190.79, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 190.79, \"end\": 190.91, \"score\": 0.678}, {\"word\": \"牛\", \"start\": 190.91, \"end\": 190.93, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"雜\"}, {\"word\": \"碎\", \"start\": 190.93, \"end\": 190.95, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"等\", \"start\": 190.95, \"end\": 191.07, \"score\": 0.831}, {\"word\": \"等\", \"start\": 191.07, \"end\": 191.09, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 191.09, \"end\": 191.11, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 204.139, \"end\": 213.542, \"text\": \"那這些呢是稅率降到免稅那這個部分呢 農業部當時的說明因為外交部 農業部跟這個財政委員會我們共同針對這個台巴的相關的協議一定都是有參與到的那不會只有外交部嘛 有相關的評估可能是其他的部會\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 204.139, \"end\": 204.539, \"score\": 0.718}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 204.539, \"end\": 204.739, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 204.739, \"end\": 204.999, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 204.999, \"end\": 205.459, \"score\": 0.83}, {\"word\": \"稅\"}, {\"word\": \"率\", \"start\": 205.459, \"end\": 205.66, \"score\": 0.85}, {\"word\": \"降\", \"start\": 205.66, \"end\": 205.88, \"score\": 0.871}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 205.88, \"end\": 206.08, \"score\": 0.883}, {\"word\": \"免\", \"start\": 206.08, \"end\": 207.26, \"score\": 0.846}, {\"word\": \"稅\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 207.26, \"end\": 208.801, \"score\": 0.829}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 208.801, \"end\": 209.001, \"score\": 0.843}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 209.001, \"end\": 209.181, \"score\": 0.825}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 209.181, \"end\": 209.381, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"農\"}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 209.381, \"end\": 209.401, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"當\"}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 209.401, \"end\": 209.481, \"score\": 0.426}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 209.481, \"end\": 209.641, \"score\": 0.744}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 209.641, \"end\": 209.661, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"外\", \"start\": 209.661, \"end\": 209.681, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"交\", \"start\": 209.681, \"end\": 209.821, \"score\": 0.792}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 209.821, \"end\": 209.841, \"score\": 0.117}, {\"word\": \"農\"}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 209.841, \"end\": 209.941, \"score\": 0.906}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 209.941, \"end\": 209.981, \"score\": 0.232}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"財\"}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 209.981, \"end\": 210.001, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 210.001, \"end\": 210.121, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 210.121, \"end\": 210.141, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"共\", \"start\": 210.141, \"end\": 210.221, \"score\": 0.612}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 210.221, \"end\": 210.241, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"針\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 210.241, \"end\": 210.261, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"巴\", \"start\": 210.261, \"end\": 210.361, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 210.361, \"end\": 210.381, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 210.381, \"end\": 210.401, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 210.401, \"end\": 210.481, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"協\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 210.481, \"end\": 210.501, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"定\", \"start\": 210.501, \"end\": 210.521, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 210.521, \"end\": 210.561, \"score\": 0.451}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 210.561, \"end\": 210.741, \"score\": 0.777}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 210.741, \"end\": 210.861, \"score\": 0.778}, {\"word\": \"參\"}, {\"word\": \"與\"}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 210.861, \"end\": 211.061, \"score\": 0.682}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 211.061, \"end\": 211.441, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 211.441, \"end\": 211.621, \"score\": 0.651}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 211.621, \"end\": 211.641, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"只\", \"start\": 211.641, \"end\": 211.742, \"score\": 0.685}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 211.742, \"end\": 211.902, \"score\": 0.442}, {\"word\": \"外\", \"start\": 211.902, \"end\": 212.102, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"交\", \"start\": 212.102, \"end\": 212.382, \"score\": 0.834}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 212.382, \"end\": 212.662, \"score\": 0.883}, {\"word\": \"嘛\", \"start\": 212.662, \"end\": 212.862, \"score\": 0.699}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 212.862, \"end\": 212.882, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 212.882, \"end\": 213.002, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 213.002, \"end\": 213.062, \"score\": 0.19}, {\"word\": \"評\"}, {\"word\": \"估\", \"start\": 213.062, \"end\": 213.242, \"score\": 0.696}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 213.242, \"end\": 213.362, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 213.362, \"end\": 213.382, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 213.382, \"end\": 213.402, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 213.402, \"end\": 213.482, \"score\": 0.463}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 213.482, \"end\": 213.502, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 213.502, \"end\": 213.522, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 213.522, \"end\": 213.542, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"會\"}]}, {\"start\": 225.686, \"end\": 246.743, \"text\": \"那當時農業部的說明裡面他就講到說調降巴拉圭農產品關稅對我國的影響在冷凍去骨豬肉這個部分他寫到調降巴拉圭冷凍豬肉的關稅將可以替代自歐盟進口的部分高價豬肉對我國的養豬產業不至於造成影響\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 225.686, \"end\": 226.807, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"當\"}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"農\"}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 226.807, \"end\": 226.927, \"score\": 0.808}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 226.927, \"end\": 227.347, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 227.347, \"end\": 227.688, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"裡\"}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 227.688, \"end\": 228.288, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 228.288, \"end\": 228.428, \"score\": 0.776}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 228.428, \"end\": 228.829, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"講\"}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 228.829, \"end\": 229.589, \"score\": 0.85}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"調\"}, {\"word\": \"降\", \"start\": 229.589, \"end\": 229.889, \"score\": 0.959}, {\"word\": \"巴\", \"start\": 229.889, \"end\": 230.03, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"拉\", \"start\": 230.03, \"end\": 230.27, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"圭\", \"start\": 230.27, \"end\": 231.01, \"score\": 0.828}, {\"word\": \"農\"}, {\"word\": \"產\"}, {\"word\": \"品\", \"start\": 231.01, \"end\": 232.011, \"score\": 0.883}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"稅\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 232.011, \"end\": 232.391, \"score\": 0.868}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 232.391, \"end\": 232.532, \"score\": 0.822}, {\"word\": \"影\", \"start\": 232.532, \"end\": 233.432, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"響\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 233.432, 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237.736, \"end\": 237.936, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"冷\", \"start\": 237.936, \"end\": 238.536, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"凍\"}, {\"word\": \"豬\"}, {\"word\": \"肉\", \"start\": 238.536, \"end\": 238.677, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 238.677, \"end\": 239.557, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"稅\"}, {\"word\": \"將\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 239.557, \"end\": 239.677, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 239.677, \"end\": 239.878, \"score\": 0.767}, {\"word\": \"替\", \"start\": 239.878, \"end\": 240.118, \"score\": 0.863}, {\"word\": \"代\", \"start\": 240.118, \"end\": 240.658, \"score\": 0.861}, {\"word\": \"自\", \"start\": 240.658, \"end\": 240.858, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"歐\", \"start\": 240.858, \"end\": 241.119, \"score\": 0.798}, {\"word\": \"盟\", \"start\": 241.119, \"end\": 241.619, \"score\": 0.843}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"口\", \"start\": 241.619, \"end\": 241.879, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 241.879, \"end\": 242.099, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 242.099, \"end\": 242.32, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 242.32, \"end\": 242.56, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"高\", \"start\": 242.56, \"end\": 243.34, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"價\"}, {\"word\": \"豬\"}, {\"word\": \"肉\", \"start\": 243.34, \"end\": 243.921, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 243.921, \"end\": 244.361, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 244.361, \"end\": 245.642, \"score\": 0.871}, {\"word\": \"養\"}, {\"word\": \"豬\"}, {\"word\": \"產\"}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 245.642, \"end\": 245.802, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"至\", \"start\": 245.802, \"end\": 245.962, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"於\", \"start\": 245.962, \"end\": 246.163, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"造\", \"start\": 246.163, \"end\": 246.443, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"成\", \"start\": 246.443, 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00:00:54,088\n那先前呢其實我看到新聞這個部長您也有對於台巴之間的這個因為簽署相關的協議之後的產生的兩國之間的這個正向幫助有過一些談話所以我想要問一下當初在簽訂相關的這個協議的時候您有沒有掌握那協議的相關的內容\n\n4\n00:00:55,669 --> 00:01:21,400\n是108年跟10那個時候我還不是外交部長沒有沒有就最近的時候因為他這個今年的8因為他呢是要修正這個海關進口稅責所以才就進口一些農夫對他簽約的時間很早嘛那跟您沒有關係但是呢他到要準備實施上路的時候那您當時已經是外交部長了所以呢這個附委審查呢是113年的11月29號\n\n5\n00:01:23,621 --> 00:01:51,399\n委員會是在這個財政委員會審查那是114年的3月20號然後呢不需要協商行政院提案通過那呢當時我有看到新聞上面您有針對這個台灣跟巴拉圭那經過這樣子的一個協議之後那可能在外交上面能夠更緊密的結合那這個部分可不可以為我們說明一下其實台巴的經貿關係對雙方都很重要因為它有一個\n\n6\n00:01:52,800 --> 00:02:12,083\n難追共同市場有將近3億人口所以假設有自由貿易協定類似那當然他的進口台灣因為這個包括牛肉豬肉等另外就是我們現在那邊要設科學園區一個智慧化的科技園區本來有一個工業區在東方市\n\n7\n00:02:12,683 --> 00:02:19,365\n後來就是因為有些很多紛爭一直都無法開發那我們現在解決了所有問題我們現在台灣已經有企業包括像我們最近那個電動巴士國家隊經過我們國家審查過國產化的就去那邊已經有運電巴過去而且會設廠\n\n8\n00:02:31,630 --> 00:02:47,431\n另外也有紡織業人造纖維會在那邊因為他們有很好的水力發電也是綠電另外包括AI計算這些包括美國的國務卿Rubio他都有提到巴拉圭是很適合做AI資料中心的地方\n\n9\n00:02:47,751 --> 00:03:01,503\n所以我們過去會覺得說這些地方好像相對來講沒有那麼多商機可是我們現在發現跟我們建交反而我們可以運用在當地國的投資免關稅不然這個南美的關稅是很高的同樣我們對他進口台灣也是免關稅這樣也可以促進他產業的發展\n\n10\n00:03:07,728 --> 00:03:11,110\n所以您剛講到免關稅那實際上面我們免關稅那關稅修正到包含是說調降巴拉圭的去骨豬肉或者是已經調製或保存的牛雜碎等等的\n\n11\n00:03:24,139 --> 00:03:33,542\n那這些呢是稅率降到免稅那這個部分呢農業部當時的說明因為外交部農業部跟這個財政委員會我們共同針對這個台巴的相關的協議一定都是有參與到的那不會只有外交部嘛有相關的評估可能是其他的部會\n\n12\n00:03:45,686 --> 00:04:06,743\n那當時農業部的說明裡面他就講到說調降巴拉圭農產品關稅對我國的影響在冷凍去骨豬肉這個部分他寫到調降巴拉圭冷凍豬肉的關稅將可以替代自歐盟進口的部分高價豬肉對我國的養豬產業不至於造成影響\n\n13\n00:04:07,944 --> 00:04:19,434\n那這個我不曉得這個部長知不知道這件事情就是說我們在台巴協議的時候呢我們把豬肉冷凍去骨豬肉的關稅降到零了\n\n14\n00:04:20,373 --> 00:04:45,848\n我知道最近開始實施所以貝尼亞總統也認為這是一個非常重大的一個雙邊關係的突破那至於說農業部他基於他專業的評估那個進口這個巴拉圭的牛肉零關稅的時候當然他現在有一定的這個進口量但是對他們來講是出口國算是台灣是會變得最重要\n\n15\n00:04:46,608 --> 00:05:05,062\n但是呢這件事情呢在包含雲林的豬農開始有非常多的抗議這個也是要跟這個部長做一個報告那巴拉圭豬肉降到林關水那當初講的農業部的他的所謂的專業意見是不會被豬農造成影響但是呢實際上面這個我們的豬農有非常非常大的反彈在雲林等養豬的相關的縣市\n\n16\n00:05:12,968 --> 00:05:17,452\n所以呢在這樣子的一個經貿相關的這個我們的簽訂的時候對我們是有一些地方有加分的但對我們的某一些產業它也可能受到傷害那我們不能說因為呢我們簽了這個相關的合約然後我們\n\n17\n00:05:29,983 --> 00:05:48,112\n有一些產業受到正面的影響但是對於負面的影響這個部分我們就好像並不是這麼在乎尤其是豬農在台灣來講是非常非常重要的一個產業就像是先前以前可能我們防止非洲豬瘟然後我們這個豬肉的市場或者是說美國當時來豬進口的時候豬農的相關的反彈等等的\n\n18\n00:05:55,015 --> 00:06:21,867\n所以豬農對於這樣子的一個台巴協議把豬肉降到零關稅這件事情已經開始表達非常多的不滿我能夠理解外交部這邊的想法是說我們兩邊的雙邊互惠你給我們免稅或低稅率我們這邊也必須要在巴拉圭所需要之處給予零關稅或是低稅率這個我是能夠理解的\n\n19\n00:06:22,327 --> 00:06:28,231\n但是對於這個豬農所受到因為我們的這個雙邊的外交關係所受到的重創所受到的影響以及他們的不滿我覺得還是必須要反應讓外交部知道那我想要最後請教的是說那既然現在有跟您提到這件事情有沒有可能外交部這裡再去協同農業部\n\n20\n00:06:44,241 --> 00:06:46,122\n請問一下他們當初說不會受到影響但是豬農有反彈這件事情是不是請農業部他們能夠去跟豬農了解一下或者是說明一下或者是說在他們所需要相關的補貼補償或協助上面能夠做好\n\n21\n00:07:03,035 --> 00:07:07,540\n因為呢一個一個反推回來之後最後會推到的是因為我們做台巴的外交就像呢川普的這個關稅貿易戰我們也經常就是在外交委員會來詢問嘛那這種跨委員會的這個情況那雖然呢不是這個豬肉的部分\n\n22\n00:07:20,553 --> 00:07:30,307\n評估不是由外交部主責但它是為了增進台巴之間的經貿關係以及外交關係所以推演到最後其實還是兩國之間的關係的緊密程度所以我在這邊想要請我們的外交部長\n\n23\n00:07:35,774 --> 00:07:41,700\n是不是回去可以開通農業部請他們針對過去他們講說不會受到影響這個部分重新評估並且跟包含是雲林等縣市養豬比較多的縣市去做一個好的溝通如果真的豬農感受到會受到影響也必須要有相關的對應的措施\n\n24\n00:07:57,396 --> 00:08:05,909\n我們的政府部會不會是分外交部農業部每個部會然後互不隸屬互不關心所以在這個部分我想要請問部長是不是可以回去跟農業部來溝通一下這個豬農現在反應非常非常的激烈這個情況\n\n25\n00:08:14,828 --> 00:08:37,759\n我們會按照委員的意思來辦理那當然我們也尊重農業部他專業的判斷確實這個外交是總和外交嘛是全國人的事情其實這個是雙向因為台灣現在的豬肉出口因為我們都拔針了嘛而且這個非疫區我們這個有時候是雙向怎麼樣幫助我們的\n\n26\n00:08:39,236 --> 00:08:47,032\n農民啊能夠擴大市場這也是最近包括去巴拉圭比如說食品加工其實巴拉圭的牛肉\n\n27\n00:08:48,861 --> 00:09:16,158\n這個我們台灣的這個企業是覺得加工之後是非常有進度沒有因為台灣因為出口到包括美國對我知道因為台灣對於牛肉是比較沒有這麼量這麼大啦那對豬肉的影響一定會比較大如果你問牛跟豬的話來講的話豬肉對於豬農台灣的豬農的數量非常多我們養豬的品質也非常的好所以在豬肉相關的這個品項降到零關稅的時候那難免我們的豬農他可能\n\n28\n00:09:18,919 --> 00:09:23,661\n會有覺得有壓力或者說會認為會影響到他們的這個產業那如果說呢只是他們的誤會那希望說外交部這裡可以告訴農業部請他們去做說明那如果真的有影響的話農業部重新評估真的有影響的話該輔導的該協助的該協助開拓市場的這件事情呢一定要做\n\n29\n00:09:42,068 --> 00:10:07,807\n那因為他推到最後極致是我們台灣跟巴拉圭之間的互動關係我們中華民國的外交所以還是希望由我們外交部長能夠向農業部這邊來做一個說明就是說我們這裡接收到的信息我們有跟農業部長雙部長會議我們會來反映但是我覺得跟委員講這個不是零和我都同意我們現在利用巴拉圭其實我在跟很多的養豬業\n\n30\n00:10:09,229 --> 00:10:15,262\n尤其是智慧養豬的這些青龍討論整個要去巴拉圭設廠\n\n31\n00:10:16,721 --> 00:10:44,556\n然後其實善用巴拉圭在南追共同市場這個龐大的人口以及他們可以出口他們到美國到歐洲其實包括跟歐盟也在簽自由貿易協定您講的是青農的部分但我講的是在像雲林的傳統的豬農所以說雲林傳統豬農其實像他們也都有很多年輕人在因為我對雲林有一定的了解沒有我跟您說包含是丁學中委員跟張家俊委員都收到非常多來自豬農的抗議\n\n32\n00:10:45,456 --> 00:10:51,440\n所以這個抗議是確實存在的不是我今天一個人在這邊就覺得可以胡亂的來講說豬董的我都同意委員剛剛的提醒我也會去推動只是我想說這不是零和我們只要讓台灣的農業包括養豬業走出去\n\n33\n00:11:01,946 --> 00:11:10,308\n我理解我理解剛才我也有提到啦就是說我們也有額外的投資所以我理解我們必須簽訂這樣子的協議對某些產業是好的嘛但當豬農他們有抗議確實有在抗議的時候那我覺得我們也應該要負責不管是在外交上面的溝通或者是農業部上面的評估以及溝通我們都希望能夠讓外交好的同時對於國內的一些重要產業尤其是傳統的相關的農業\n\n34\n00:11:30,314 --> 00:11:34,679\n農牧業那他們也能夠感到安心好不好好我們一起來推動\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n1211\t17003\t謝謝主席 我們有請部長好 委員好部長好 我想要請教一個問題就是我們台灣跟巴拉圭是不是先前有一些經貿相關的協議那它的背景是如何的 可以幫我們稍微陳述一下嗎\n18387\t33338\t經貿的協議我們跟巴拉圭對就是呢台巴經濟合作協定在106年7月12號簽署107年2月28號生效實施那它是為了擴大台巴經濟合作協定的效益\n33778\t54088\t那先前呢其實我看到新聞這個部長您也有對於台巴之間的這個因為簽署相關的協議之後的產生的兩國之間的這個正向幫助有過一些談話所以我想要問一下當初在簽訂相關的這個協議的時候您有沒有掌握那協議的相關的內容\n55669\t81400\t是108年跟10那個時候我還不是外交部長沒有沒有就最近的時候因為他這個今年的8因為他呢是要修正這個海關進口稅責所以才就進口一些農夫對他簽約的時間很早嘛那跟您沒有關係但是呢他到要準備實施上路的時候那您當時已經是外交部長了所以呢這個附委審查呢是113年的11月29號\n83621\t111399\t委員會是在這個財政委員會審查那是114年的3月20號然後呢不需要協商行政院提案通過那呢當時我有看到新聞上面您有針對這個台灣跟巴拉圭那經過這樣子的一個協議之後那可能在外交上面能夠更緊密的結合那這個部分可不可以為我們說明一下其實台巴的經貿關係對雙方都很重要因為它有一個\n112800\t132083\t難追共同市場有將近3億人口所以假設有自由貿易協定類似那當然他的進口台灣因為這個包括牛肉豬肉等另外就是我們現在那邊要設科學園區一個智慧化的科技園區本來有一個工業區在東方市\n132683\t139365\t後來就是因為有些很多紛爭一直都無法開發那我們現在解決了所有問題我們現在台灣已經有企業包括像我們最近那個電動巴士國家隊經過我們國家審查過國產化的就去那邊已經有運電巴過去而且會設廠\n151630\t167431\t另外也有紡織業 人造纖維會在那邊 因為他們有很好的水力發電也是綠電另外包括AI計算這些包括美國的國務卿Rubio他都有提到巴拉圭是很適合做AI資料中心的地方\n167751\t181503\t所以我們過去會覺得說這些地方好像相對來講沒有那麼多商機可是我們現在發現跟我們建交反而我們可以運用在當地國的投資免關稅不然這個南美的關稅是很高的同樣我們對他進口台灣也是免關稅這樣也可以促進他產業的發展\n187728\t191110\t所以您剛講到免關稅那實際上面我們免關稅那關稅修正到包含是說調降巴拉圭的去骨豬肉或者是已經調製或保存的牛雜碎等等的\n204139\t213542\t那這些呢是稅率降到免稅那這個部分呢 農業部當時的說明因為外交部 農業部跟這個財政委員會我們共同針對這個台巴的相關的協議一定都是有參與到的那不會只有外交部嘛 有相關的評估可能是其他的部會\n225686\t246743\t那當時農業部的說明裡面他就講到說調降巴拉圭農產品關稅對我國的影響在冷凍去骨豬肉這個部分他寫到調降巴拉圭冷凍豬肉的關稅將可以替代自歐盟進口的部分高價豬肉對我國的養豬產業不至於造成影響\n247944\t259434\t那這個我不曉得這個部長知不知道這件事情就是說我們在台巴協議的時候呢我們把豬肉冷凍去骨豬肉的關稅降到零了\n260373\t285848\t我知道最近開始實施所以貝尼亞總統也認為這是一個非常重大的一個雙邊關係的突破那至於說農業部他基於他專業的評估那個進口這個巴拉圭的牛肉零關稅的時候當然他現在有一定的這個進口量但是對他們來講是出口國算是台灣是會變得最重要\n286608\t305062\t但是呢這件事情呢在包含雲林的豬農開始有非常多的抗議這個也是要跟這個部長做一個報告那巴拉圭豬肉降到林關水那當初講的農業部的他的所謂的專業意見是不會被豬農造成影響但是呢實際上面這個我們的豬農有非常非常大的反彈在雲林等養豬的相關的縣市\n312968\t317452\t所以呢在這樣子的一個經貿相關的這個我們的簽訂的時候對我們是有一些地方有加分的但對我們的某一些產業它也可能受到傷害那我們不能說因為呢我們簽了這個相關的合約然後我們\n329983\t348112\t有一些產業受到正面的影響但是對於負面的影響這個部分我們就好像並不是這麼在乎尤其是豬農在台灣來講是非常非常重要的一個產業就像是先前以前可能我們防止非洲豬瘟然後我們這個豬肉的市場或者是說美國當時來豬進口的時候豬農的相關的反彈等等的\n355015\t381867\t所以豬農對於這樣子的一個台巴協議把豬肉降到零關稅這件事情已經開始表達非常多的不滿我能夠理解外交部這邊的想法是說我們兩邊的雙邊互惠你給我們免稅或低稅率我們這邊也必須要在巴拉圭所需要之處給予零關稅或是低稅率這個我是能夠理解的\n382327\t388231\t但是對於這個豬農所受到因為我們的這個雙邊的外交關係所受到的重創所受到的影響以及他們的不滿我覺得還是必須要反應讓外交部知道那我想要最後請教的是說那既然現在有跟您提到這件事情有沒有可能外交部這裡再去協同農業部\n404241\t406122\t請問一下他們當初說不會受到影響但是豬農有反彈這件事情是不是請農業部他們能夠去跟豬農了解一下或者是說明一下或者是說在他們所需要相關的補貼補償或協助上面能夠做好\n423035\t427540\t因為呢一個一個反推回來之後最後會推到的是因為我們做台巴的外交就像呢川普的這個關稅貿易戰我們也經常就是在外交委員會來詢問嘛那這種跨委員會的這個情況那雖然呢不是這個豬肉的部分\n440553\t450307\t評估不是由外交部主責但它是為了增進台巴之間的經貿關係以及外交關係所以推演到最後其實還是兩國之間的關係的緊密程度所以我在這邊想要請我們的外交部長\n455774\t461700\t是不是回去可以開通農業部請他們針對過去他們講說不會受到影響這個部分重新評估並且跟包含是雲林等縣市養豬比較多的縣市去做一個好的溝通如果真的豬農感受到會受到影響也必須要有相關的對應的措施\n477396\t485909\t我們的政府部會不會是分外交部農業部每個部會然後互不隸屬互不關心所以在這個部分我想要請問部長是不是可以回去跟農業部來溝通一下這個豬農現在反應非常非常的激烈這個情況\n494828\t517759\t我們會按照委員的意思來辦理那當然我們也尊重農業部他專業的判斷確實這個外交是總和外交嘛是全國人的事情其實這個是雙向因為台灣現在的豬肉出口因為我們都拔針了嘛而且這個非疫區我們這個有時候是雙向怎麼樣幫助我們的\n519236\t527032\t農民啊能夠擴大市場這也是最近包括去巴拉圭比如說食品加工其實巴拉圭的牛肉\n528861\t556158\t這個我們台灣的這個企業是覺得加工之後是非常有進度沒有因為台灣 因為出口到包括美國對我知道因為台灣對於牛肉是比較沒有這麼量這麼大啦那對豬肉的影響一定會比較大如果你問牛跟豬的話來講的話豬肉對於豬農台灣的豬農的數量非常多我們養豬的品質也非常的好所以在豬肉相關的這個品項降到零關稅的時候那難免我們的豬農他可能\n558919\t563661\t會有覺得有壓力或者說會認為會影響到他們的這個產業那如果說呢只是他們的誤會那希望說外交部這裡可以告訴農業部請他們去做說明那如果真的有影響的話農業部重新評估真的有影響的話該輔導的該協助的該協助開拓市場的這件事情呢一定要做\n582068\t607807\t那因為他推到最後極致是我們台灣跟巴拉圭之間的互動關係我們中華民國的外交所以還是希望由我們外交部長能夠向農業部這邊來做一個說明就是說我們這裡接收到的信息我們有跟農業部長雙部長會議我們會來反映但是我覺得跟委員講這個不是零和我都同意我們現在利用巴拉圭其實我在跟很多的養豬業\n609229\t615262\t尤其是智慧養豬的這些青龍討論整個要去巴拉圭設廠\n616721\t644556\t然後其實善用巴拉圭在南追共同市場這個龐大的人口以及他們可以出口他們到美國到歐洲其實包括跟歐盟也在簽自由貿易協定您講的是青農的部分但我講的是在像雲林的傳統的豬農所以說雲林傳統豬農其實像他們也都有很多年輕人在因為我對雲林有一定的了解沒有 我跟您說包含是丁學中委員跟張家俊委員都收到非常多來自豬農的抗議\n645456\t651440\t所以這個抗議是確實存在的不是我今天一個人在這邊就覺得可以胡亂的來講說豬董的我都同意委員剛剛的提醒我也會去推動只是我想說這不是零和我們只要讓台灣的農業包括養豬業走出去\n661946\t670308\t我理解我理解剛才我也有提到啦就是說我們也有額外的投資所以我理解我們必須簽訂這樣子的協議對某些產業是好的嘛但當豬農他們有抗議確實有在抗議的時候那我覺得我們也應該要負責不管是在外交上面的溝通或者是農業部上面的評估以及溝通我們都希望能夠讓外交好的同時對於國內的一些重要產業尤其是傳統的相關的農業\n690314\t694679\t農牧業 那他們也能夠感到安心 好不好好 我們一起來推動\n","txt":"謝謝主席 我們有請部長好 委員好部長好 我想要請教一個問題就是我們台灣跟巴拉圭是不是先前有一些經貿相關的協議那它的背景是如何的 可以幫我們稍微陳述一下嗎\n經貿的協議我們跟巴拉圭對就是呢台巴經濟合作協定在106年7月12號簽署107年2月28號生效實施那它是為了擴大台巴經濟合作協定的效益\n那先前呢其實我看到新聞這個部長您也有對於台巴之間的這個因為簽署相關的協議之後的產生的兩國之間的這個正向幫助有過一些談話所以我想要問一下當初在簽訂相關的這個協議的時候您有沒有掌握那協議的相關的內容\n是108年跟10那個時候我還不是外交部長沒有沒有就最近的時候因為他這個今年的8因為他呢是要修正這個海關進口稅責所以才就進口一些農夫對他簽約的時間很早嘛那跟您沒有關係但是呢他到要準備實施上路的時候那您當時已經是外交部長了所以呢這個附委審查呢是113年的11月29號\n委員會是在這個財政委員會審查那是114年的3月20號然後呢不需要協商行政院提案通過那呢當時我有看到新聞上面您有針對這個台灣跟巴拉圭那經過這樣子的一個協議之後那可能在外交上面能夠更緊密的結合那這個部分可不可以為我們說明一下其實台巴的經貿關係對雙方都很重要因為它有一個\n難追共同市場有將近3億人口所以假設有自由貿易協定類似那當然他的進口台灣因為這個包括牛肉豬肉等另外就是我們現在那邊要設科學園區一個智慧化的科技園區本來有一個工業區在東方市\n後來就是因為有些很多紛爭一直都無法開發那我們現在解決了所有問題我們現在台灣已經有企業包括像我們最近那個電動巴士國家隊經過我們國家審查過國產化的就去那邊已經有運電巴過去而且會設廠\n另外也有紡織業 人造纖維會在那邊 因為他們有很好的水力發電也是綠電另外包括AI計算這些包括美國的國務卿Rubio他都有提到巴拉圭是很適合做AI資料中心的地方\n所以我們過去會覺得說這些地方好像相對來講沒有那麼多商機可是我們現在發現跟我們建交反而我們可以運用在當地國的投資免關稅不然這個南美的關稅是很高的同樣我們對他進口台灣也是免關稅這樣也可以促進他產業的發展\n所以您剛講到免關稅那實際上面我們免關稅那關稅修正到包含是說調降巴拉圭的去骨豬肉或者是已經調製或保存的牛雜碎等等的\n那這些呢是稅率降到免稅那這個部分呢 農業部當時的說明因為外交部 農業部跟這個財政委員會我們共同針對這個台巴的相關的協議一定都是有參與到的那不會只有外交部嘛 有相關的評估可能是其他的部會\n那當時農業部的說明裡面他就講到說調降巴拉圭農產品關稅對我國的影響在冷凍去骨豬肉這個部分他寫到調降巴拉圭冷凍豬肉的關稅將可以替代自歐盟進口的部分高價豬肉對我國的養豬產業不至於造成影響\n那這個我不曉得這個部長知不知道這件事情就是說我們在台巴協議的時候呢我們把豬肉冷凍去骨豬肉的關稅降到零了\n我知道最近開始實施所以貝尼亞總統也認為這是一個非常重大的一個雙邊關係的突破那至於說農業部他基於他專業的評估那個進口這個巴拉圭的牛肉零關稅的時候當然他現在有一定的這個進口量但是對他們來講是出口國算是台灣是會變得最重要\n但是呢這件事情呢在包含雲林的豬農開始有非常多的抗議這個也是要跟這個部長做一個報告那巴拉圭豬肉降到林關水那當初講的農業部的他的所謂的專業意見是不會被豬農造成影響但是呢實際上面這個我們的豬農有非常非常大的反彈在雲林等養豬的相關的縣市\n所以呢在這樣子的一個經貿相關的這個我們的簽訂的時候對我們是有一些地方有加分的但對我們的某一些產業它也可能受到傷害那我們不能說因為呢我們簽了這個相關的合約然後我們\n有一些產業受到正面的影響但是對於負面的影響這個部分我們就好像並不是這麼在乎尤其是豬農在台灣來講是非常非常重要的一個產業就像是先前以前可能我們防止非洲豬瘟然後我們這個豬肉的市場或者是說美國當時來豬進口的時候豬農的相關的反彈等等的\n所以豬農對於這樣子的一個台巴協議把豬肉降到零關稅這件事情已經開始表達非常多的不滿我能夠理解外交部這邊的想法是說我們兩邊的雙邊互惠你給我們免稅或低稅率我們這邊也必須要在巴拉圭所需要之處給予零關稅或是低稅率這個我是能夠理解的\n但是對於這個豬農所受到因為我們的這個雙邊的外交關係所受到的重創所受到的影響以及他們的不滿我覺得還是必須要反應讓外交部知道那我想要最後請教的是說那既然現在有跟您提到這件事情有沒有可能外交部這裡再去協同農業部\n請問一下他們當初說不會受到影響但是豬農有反彈這件事情是不是請農業部他們能夠去跟豬農了解一下或者是說明一下或者是說在他們所需要相關的補貼補償或協助上面能夠做好\n因為呢一個一個反推回來之後最後會推到的是因為我們做台巴的外交就像呢川普的這個關稅貿易戰我們也經常就是在外交委員會來詢問嘛那這種跨委員會的這個情況那雖然呢不是這個豬肉的部分\n評估不是由外交部主責但它是為了增進台巴之間的經貿關係以及外交關係所以推演到最後其實還是兩國之間的關係的緊密程度所以我在這邊想要請我們的外交部長\n是不是回去可以開通農業部請他們針對過去他們講說不會受到影響這個部分重新評估並且跟包含是雲林等縣市養豬比較多的縣市去做一個好的溝通如果真的豬農感受到會受到影響也必須要有相關的對應的措施\n我們的政府部會不會是分外交部農業部每個部會然後互不隸屬互不關心所以在這個部分我想要請問部長是不是可以回去跟農業部來溝通一下這個豬農現在反應非常非常的激烈這個情況\n我們會按照委員的意思來辦理那當然我們也尊重農業部他專業的判斷確實這個外交是總和外交嘛是全國人的事情其實這個是雙向因為台灣現在的豬肉出口因為我們都拔針了嘛而且這個非疫區我們這個有時候是雙向怎麼樣幫助我們的\n農民啊能夠擴大市場這也是最近包括去巴拉圭比如說食品加工其實巴拉圭的牛肉\n這個我們台灣的這個企業是覺得加工之後是非常有進度沒有因為台灣 因為出口到包括美國對我知道因為台灣對於牛肉是比較沒有這麼量這麼大啦那對豬肉的影響一定會比較大如果你問牛跟豬的話來講的話豬肉對於豬農台灣的豬農的數量非常多我們養豬的品質也非常的好所以在豬肉相關的這個品項降到零關稅的時候那難免我們的豬農他可能\n會有覺得有壓力或者說會認為會影響到他們的這個產業那如果說呢只是他們的誤會那希望說外交部這裡可以告訴農業部請他們去做說明那如果真的有影響的話農業部重新評估真的有影響的話該輔導的該協助的該協助開拓市場的這件事情呢一定要做\n那因為他推到最後極致是我們台灣跟巴拉圭之間的互動關係我們中華民國的外交所以還是希望由我們外交部長能夠向農業部這邊來做一個說明就是說我們這裡接收到的信息我們有跟農業部長雙部長會議我們會來反映但是我覺得跟委員講這個不是零和我都同意我們現在利用巴拉圭其實我在跟很多的養豬業\n尤其是智慧養豬的這些青龍討論整個要去巴拉圭設廠\n然後其實善用巴拉圭在南追共同市場這個龐大的人口以及他們可以出口他們到美國到歐洲其實包括跟歐盟也在簽自由貿易協定您講的是青農的部分但我講的是在像雲林的傳統的豬農所以說雲林傳統豬農其實像他們也都有很多年輕人在因為我對雲林有一定的了解沒有 我跟您說包含是丁學中委員跟張家俊委員都收到非常多來自豬農的抗議\n所以這個抗議是確實存在的不是我今天一個人在這邊就覺得可以胡亂的來講說豬董的我都同意委員剛剛的提醒我也會去推動只是我想說這不是零和我們只要讓台灣的農業包括養豬業走出去\n我理解我理解剛才我也有提到啦就是說我們也有額外的投資所以我理解我們必須簽訂這樣子的協議對某些產業是好的嘛但當豬農他們有抗議確實有在抗議的時候那我覺得我們也應該要負責不管是在外交上面的溝通或者是農業部上面的評估以及溝通我們都希望能夠讓外交好的同時對於國內的一些重要產業尤其是傳統的相關的農業\n農牧業 那他們也能夠感到安心 好不好好 我們一起來推動\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:01.211 --> 00:17.003\n謝謝主席我們有請部長好委員好部長好我想要請教一個問題就是我們台灣跟巴拉圭是不是先前有一些經貿相關的協議那它的背景是如何的可以幫我們稍微陳述一下嗎\n\n00:18.387 --> 00:33.338\n經貿的協議我們跟巴拉圭對就是呢台巴經濟合作協定在106年7月12號簽署107年2月28號生效實施那它是為了擴大台巴經濟合作協定的效益\n\n00:33.778 --> 00:54.088\n那先前呢其實我看到新聞這個部長您也有對於台巴之間的這個因為簽署相關的協議之後的產生的兩國之間的這個正向幫助有過一些談話所以我想要問一下當初在簽訂相關的這個協議的時候您有沒有掌握那協議的相關的內容\n\n00:55.669 --> 01:21.400\n是108年跟10那個時候我還不是外交部長沒有沒有就最近的時候因為他這個今年的8因為他呢是要修正這個海關進口稅責所以才就進口一些農夫對他簽約的時間很早嘛那跟您沒有關係但是呢他到要準備實施上路的時候那您當時已經是外交部長了所以呢這個附委審查呢是113年的11月29號\n\n01:23.621 --> 01:51.399\n委員會是在這個財政委員會審查那是114年的3月20號然後呢不需要協商行政院提案通過那呢當時我有看到新聞上面您有針對這個台灣跟巴拉圭那經過這樣子的一個協議之後那可能在外交上面能夠更緊密的結合那這個部分可不可以為我們說明一下其實台巴的經貿關係對雙方都很重要因為它有一個\n\n01:52.800 --> 02:12.083\n難追共同市場有將近3億人口所以假設有自由貿易協定類似那當然他的進口台灣因為這個包括牛肉豬肉等另外就是我們現在那邊要設科學園區一個智慧化的科技園區本來有一個工業區在東方市\n\n02:12.683 --> 02:19.365\n後來就是因為有些很多紛爭一直都無法開發那我們現在解決了所有問題我們現在台灣已經有企業包括像我們最近那個電動巴士國家隊經過我們國家審查過國產化的就去那邊已經有運電巴過去而且會設廠\n\n02:31.630 --> 02:47.431\n另外也有紡織業人造纖維會在那邊因為他們有很好的水力發電也是綠電另外包括AI計算這些包括美國的國務卿Rubio他都有提到巴拉圭是很適合做AI資料中心的地方\n\n02:47.751 --> 03:01.503\n所以我們過去會覺得說這些地方好像相對來講沒有那麼多商機可是我們現在發現跟我們建交反而我們可以運用在當地國的投資免關稅不然這個南美的關稅是很高的同樣我們對他進口台灣也是免關稅這樣也可以促進他產業的發展\n\n03:07.728 --> 03:11.110\n所以您剛講到免關稅那實際上面我們免關稅那關稅修正到包含是說調降巴拉圭的去骨豬肉或者是已經調製或保存的牛雜碎等等的\n\n03:24.139 --> 03:33.542\n那這些呢是稅率降到免稅那這個部分呢農業部當時的說明因為外交部農業部跟這個財政委員會我們共同針對這個台巴的相關的協議一定都是有參與到的那不會只有外交部嘛有相關的評估可能是其他的部會\n\n03:45.686 --> 04:06.743\n那當時農業部的說明裡面他就講到說調降巴拉圭農產品關稅對我國的影響在冷凍去骨豬肉這個部分他寫到調降巴拉圭冷凍豬肉的關稅將可以替代自歐盟進口的部分高價豬肉對我國的養豬產業不至於造成影響\n\n04:07.944 --> 04:19.434\n那這個我不曉得這個部長知不知道這件事情就是說我們在台巴協議的時候呢我們把豬肉冷凍去骨豬肉的關稅降到零了\n\n04:20.373 --> 04:45.848\n我知道最近開始實施所以貝尼亞總統也認為這是一個非常重大的一個雙邊關係的突破那至於說農業部他基於他專業的評估那個進口這個巴拉圭的牛肉零關稅的時候當然他現在有一定的這個進口量但是對他們來講是出口國算是台灣是會變得最重要\n\n04:46.608 --> 05:05.062\n但是呢這件事情呢在包含雲林的豬農開始有非常多的抗議這個也是要跟這個部長做一個報告那巴拉圭豬肉降到林關水那當初講的農業部的他的所謂的專業意見是不會被豬農造成影響但是呢實際上面這個我們的豬農有非常非常大的反彈在雲林等養豬的相關的縣市\n\n05:12.968 --> 05:17.452\n所以呢在這樣子的一個經貿相關的這個我們的簽訂的時候對我們是有一些地方有加分的但對我們的某一些產業它也可能受到傷害那我們不能說因為呢我們簽了這個相關的合約然後我們\n\n05:29.983 --> 05:48.112\n有一些產業受到正面的影響但是對於負面的影響這個部分我們就好像並不是這麼在乎尤其是豬農在台灣來講是非常非常重要的一個產業就像是先前以前可能我們防止非洲豬瘟然後我們這個豬肉的市場或者是說美國當時來豬進口的時候豬農的相關的反彈等等的\n\n05:55.015 --> 06:21.867\n所以豬農對於這樣子的一個台巴協議把豬肉降到零關稅這件事情已經開始表達非常多的不滿我能夠理解外交部這邊的想法是說我們兩邊的雙邊互惠你給我們免稅或低稅率我們這邊也必須要在巴拉圭所需要之處給予零關稅或是低稅率這個我是能夠理解的\n\n06:22.327 --> 06:28.231\n但是對於這個豬農所受到因為我們的這個雙邊的外交關係所受到的重創所受到的影響以及他們的不滿我覺得還是必須要反應讓外交部知道那我想要最後請教的是說那既然現在有跟您提到這件事情有沒有可能外交部這裡再去協同農業部\n\n06:44.241 --> 06:46.122\n請問一下他們當初說不會受到影響但是豬農有反彈這件事情是不是請農業部他們能夠去跟豬農了解一下或者是說明一下或者是說在他們所需要相關的補貼補償或協助上面能夠做好\n\n07:03.035 --> 07:07.540\n因為呢一個一個反推回來之後最後會推到的是因為我們做台巴的外交就像呢川普的這個關稅貿易戰我們也經常就是在外交委員會來詢問嘛那這種跨委員會的這個情況那雖然呢不是這個豬肉的部分\n\n07:20.553 --> 07:30.307\n評估不是由外交部主責但它是為了增進台巴之間的經貿關係以及外交關係所以推演到最後其實還是兩國之間的關係的緊密程度所以我在這邊想要請我們的外交部長\n\n07:35.774 --> 07:41.700\n是不是回去可以開通農業部請他們針對過去他們講說不會受到影響這個部分重新評估並且跟包含是雲林等縣市養豬比較多的縣市去做一個好的溝通如果真的豬農感受到會受到影響也必須要有相關的對應的措施\n\n07:57.396 --> 08:05.909\n我們的政府部會不會是分外交部農業部每個部會然後互不隸屬互不關心所以在這個部分我想要請問部長是不是可以回去跟農業部來溝通一下這個豬農現在反應非常非常的激烈這個情況\n\n08:14.828 --> 08:37.759\n我們會按照委員的意思來辦理那當然我們也尊重農業部他專業的判斷確實這個外交是總和外交嘛是全國人的事情其實這個是雙向因為台灣現在的豬肉出口因為我們都拔針了嘛而且這個非疫區我們這個有時候是雙向怎麼樣幫助我們的\n\n08:39.236 --> 08:47.032\n農民啊能夠擴大市場這也是最近包括去巴拉圭比如說食品加工其實巴拉圭的牛肉\n\n08:48.861 --> 09:16.158\n這個我們台灣的這個企業是覺得加工之後是非常有進度沒有因為台灣因為出口到包括美國對我知道因為台灣對於牛肉是比較沒有這麼量這麼大啦那對豬肉的影響一定會比較大如果你問牛跟豬的話來講的話豬肉對於豬農台灣的豬農的數量非常多我們養豬的品質也非常的好所以在豬肉相關的這個品項降到零關稅的時候那難免我們的豬農他可能\n\n09:18.919 --> 09:23.661\n會有覺得有壓力或者說會認為會影響到他們的這個產業那如果說呢只是他們的誤會那希望說外交部這裡可以告訴農業部請他們去做說明那如果真的有影響的話農業部重新評估真的有影響的話該輔導的該協助的該協助開拓市場的這件事情呢一定要做\n\n09:42.068 --> 10:07.807\n那因為他推到最後極致是我們台灣跟巴拉圭之間的互動關係我們中華民國的外交所以還是希望由我們外交部長能夠向農業部這邊來做一個說明就是說我們這裡接收到的信息我們有跟農業部長雙部長會議我們會來反映但是我覺得跟委員講這個不是零和我都同意我們現在利用巴拉圭其實我在跟很多的養豬業\n\n10:09.229 --> 10:15.262\n尤其是智慧養豬的這些青龍討論整個要去巴拉圭設廠\n\n10:16.721 --> 10:44.556\n然後其實善用巴拉圭在南追共同市場這個龐大的人口以及他們可以出口他們到美國到歐洲其實包括跟歐盟也在簽自由貿易協定您講的是青農的部分但我講的是在像雲林的傳統的豬農所以說雲林傳統豬農其實像他們也都有很多年輕人在因為我對雲林有一定的了解沒有我跟您說包含是丁學中委員跟張家俊委員都收到非常多來自豬農的抗議\n\n10:45.456 --> 10:51.440\n所以這個抗議是確實存在的不是我今天一個人在這邊就覺得可以胡亂的來講說豬董的我都同意委員剛剛的提醒我也會去推動只是我想說這不是零和我們只要讓台灣的農業包括養豬業走出去\n\n11:01.946 --> 11:10.308\n我理解我理解剛才我也有提到啦就是說我們也有額外的投資所以我理解我們必須簽訂這樣子的協議對某些產業是好的嘛但當豬農他們有抗議確實有在抗議的時候那我覺得我們也應該要負責不管是在外交上面的溝通或者是農業部上面的評估以及溝通我們都希望能夠讓外交好的同時對於國內的一些重要產業尤其是傳統的相關的農業\n\n11:30.314 --> 11:34.679\n農牧業那他們也能夠感到安心好不好好我們一起來推動\n\n","segments":[{"start":1.211,"end":17.003,"text":"謝謝主席 我們有請部長好 委員好部長好 我想要請教一個問題就是我們台灣跟巴拉圭是不是先前有一些經貿相關的協議那它的背景是如何的 可以幫我們稍微陳述一下嗎"},{"start":18.387,"end":33.338,"text":"經貿的協議我們跟巴拉圭對就是呢台巴經濟合作協定在106年7月12號簽署107年2月28號生效實施那它是為了擴大台巴經濟合作協定的效益"},{"start":33.778,"end":54.088,"text":"那先前呢其實我看到新聞這個部長您也有對於台巴之間的這個因為簽署相關的協議之後的產生的兩國之間的這個正向幫助有過一些談話所以我想要問一下當初在簽訂相關的這個協議的時候您有沒有掌握那協議的相關的內容"},{"start":55.669,"end":81.4,"text":"是108年跟10那個時候我還不是外交部長沒有沒有就最近的時候因為他這個今年的8因為他呢是要修正這個海關進口稅責所以才就進口一些農夫對他簽約的時間很早嘛那跟您沒有關係但是呢他到要準備實施上路的時候那您當時已經是外交部長了所以呢這個附委審查呢是113年的11月29號"},{"start":83.621,"end":111.399,"text":"委員會是在這個財政委員會審查那是114年的3月20號然後呢不需要協商行政院提案通過那呢當時我有看到新聞上面您有針對這個台灣跟巴拉圭那經過這樣子的一個協議之後那可能在外交上面能夠更緊密的結合那這個部分可不可以為我們說明一下其實台巴的經貿關係對雙方都很重要因為它有一個"},{"start":112.8,"end":132.083,"text":"難追共同市場有將近3億人口所以假設有自由貿易協定類似那當然他的進口台灣因為這個包括牛肉豬肉等另外就是我們現在那邊要設科學園區一個智慧化的科技園區本來有一個工業區在東方市"},{"start":132.683,"end":139.365,"text":"後來就是因為有些很多紛爭一直都無法開發那我們現在解決了所有問題我們現在台灣已經有企業包括像我們最近那個電動巴士國家隊經過我們國家審查過國產化的就去那邊已經有運電巴過去而且會設廠"},{"start":151.63,"end":167.431,"text":"另外也有紡織業 人造纖維會在那邊 因為他們有很好的水力發電也是綠電另外包括AI計算這些包括美國的國務卿Rubio他都有提到巴拉圭是很適合做AI資料中心的地方"},{"start":167.751,"end":181.503,"text":"所以我們過去會覺得說這些地方好像相對來講沒有那麼多商機可是我們現在發現跟我們建交反而我們可以運用在當地國的投資免關稅不然這個南美的關稅是很高的同樣我們對他進口台灣也是免關稅這樣也可以促進他產業的發展"},{"start":187.728,"end":191.11,"text":"所以您剛講到免關稅那實際上面我們免關稅那關稅修正到包含是說調降巴拉圭的去骨豬肉或者是已經調製或保存的牛雜碎等等的"},{"start":204.139,"end":213.542,"text":"那這些呢是稅率降到免稅那這個部分呢 農業部當時的說明因為外交部 農業部跟這個財政委員會我們共同針對這個台巴的相關的協議一定都是有參與到的那不會只有外交部嘛 有相關的評估可能是其他的部會"},{"start":225.686,"end":246.743,"text":"那當時農業部的說明裡面他就講到說調降巴拉圭農產品關稅對我國的影響在冷凍去骨豬肉這個部分他寫到調降巴拉圭冷凍豬肉的關稅將可以替代自歐盟進口的部分高價豬肉對我國的養豬產業不至於造成影響"},{"start":247.944,"end":259.434,"text":"那這個我不曉得這個部長知不知道這件事情就是說我們在台巴協議的時候呢我們把豬肉冷凍去骨豬肉的關稅降到零了"},{"start":260.373,"end":285.848,"text":"我知道最近開始實施所以貝尼亞總統也認為這是一個非常重大的一個雙邊關係的突破那至於說農業部他基於他專業的評估那個進口這個巴拉圭的牛肉零關稅的時候當然他現在有一定的這個進口量但是對他們來講是出口國算是台灣是會變得最重要"},{"start":286.608,"end":305.062,"text":"但是呢這件事情呢在包含雲林的豬農開始有非常多的抗議這個也是要跟這個部長做一個報告那巴拉圭豬肉降到林關水那當初講的農業部的他的所謂的專業意見是不會被豬農造成影響但是呢實際上面這個我們的豬農有非常非常大的反彈在雲林等養豬的相關的縣市"},{"start":312.968,"end":317.452,"text":"所以呢在這樣子的一個經貿相關的這個我們的簽訂的時候對我們是有一些地方有加分的但對我們的某一些產業它也可能受到傷害那我們不能說因為呢我們簽了這個相關的合約然後我們"},{"start":329.983,"end":348.112,"text":"有一些產業受到正面的影響但是對於負面的影響這個部分我們就好像並不是這麼在乎尤其是豬農在台灣來講是非常非常重要的一個產業就像是先前以前可能我們防止非洲豬瘟然後我們這個豬肉的市場或者是說美國當時來豬進口的時候豬農的相關的反彈等等的"},{"start":355.015,"end":381.867,"text":"所以豬農對於這樣子的一個台巴協議把豬肉降到零關稅這件事情已經開始表達非常多的不滿我能夠理解外交部這邊的想法是說我們兩邊的雙邊互惠你給我們免稅或低稅率我們這邊也必須要在巴拉圭所需要之處給予零關稅或是低稅率這個我是能夠理解的"},{"start":382.327,"end":388.231,"text":"但是對於這個豬農所受到因為我們的這個雙邊的外交關係所受到的重創所受到的影響以及他們的不滿我覺得還是必須要反應讓外交部知道那我想要最後請教的是說那既然現在有跟您提到這件事情有沒有可能外交部這裡再去協同農業部"},{"start":404.241,"end":406.122,"text":"請問一下他們當初說不會受到影響但是豬農有反彈這件事情是不是請農業部他們能夠去跟豬農了解一下或者是說明一下或者是說在他們所需要相關的補貼補償或協助上面能夠做好"},{"start":423.035,"end":427.54,"text":"因為呢一個一個反推回來之後最後會推到的是因為我們做台巴的外交就像呢川普的這個關稅貿易戰我們也經常就是在外交委員會來詢問嘛那這種跨委員會的這個情況那雖然呢不是這個豬肉的部分"},{"start":440.553,"end":450.307,"text":"評估不是由外交部主責但它是為了增進台巴之間的經貿關係以及外交關係所以推演到最後其實還是兩國之間的關係的緊密程度所以我在這邊想要請我們的外交部長"},{"start":455.774,"end":461.7,"text":"是不是回去可以開通農業部請他們針對過去他們講說不會受到影響這個部分重新評估並且跟包含是雲林等縣市養豬比較多的縣市去做一個好的溝通如果真的豬農感受到會受到影響也必須要有相關的對應的措施"},{"start":477.396,"end":485.909,"text":"我們的政府部會不會是分外交部農業部每個部會然後互不隸屬互不關心所以在這個部分我想要請問部長是不是可以回去跟農業部來溝通一下這個豬農現在反應非常非常的激烈這個情況"},{"start":494.828,"end":517.759,"text":"我們會按照委員的意思來辦理那當然我們也尊重農業部他專業的判斷確實這個外交是總和外交嘛是全國人的事情其實這個是雙向因為台灣現在的豬肉出口因為我們都拔針了嘛而且這個非疫區我們這個有時候是雙向怎麼樣幫助我們的"},{"start":519.236,"end":527.032,"text":"農民啊能夠擴大市場這也是最近包括去巴拉圭比如說食品加工其實巴拉圭的牛肉"},{"start":528.861,"end":556.158,"text":"這個我們台灣的這個企業是覺得加工之後是非常有進度沒有因為台灣 因為出口到包括美國對我知道因為台灣對於牛肉是比較沒有這麼量這麼大啦那對豬肉的影響一定會比較大如果你問牛跟豬的話來講的話豬肉對於豬農台灣的豬農的數量非常多我們養豬的品質也非常的好所以在豬肉相關的這個品項降到零關稅的時候那難免我們的豬農他可能"},{"start":558.919,"end":563.661,"text":"會有覺得有壓力或者說會認為會影響到他們的這個產業那如果說呢只是他們的誤會那希望說外交部這裡可以告訴農業部請他們去做說明那如果真的有影響的話農業部重新評估真的有影響的話該輔導的該協助的該協助開拓市場的這件事情呢一定要做"},{"start":582.068,"end":607.807,"text":"那因為他推到最後極致是我們台灣跟巴拉圭之間的互動關係我們中華民國的外交所以還是希望由我們外交部長能夠向農業部這邊來做一個說明就是說我們這裡接收到的信息我們有跟農業部長雙部長會議我們會來反映但是我覺得跟委員講這個不是零和我都同意我們現在利用巴拉圭其實我在跟很多的養豬業"},{"start":609.229,"end":615.262,"text":"尤其是智慧養豬的這些青龍討論整個要去巴拉圭設廠"},{"start":616.721,"end":644.556,"text":"然後其實善用巴拉圭在南追共同市場這個龐大的人口以及他們可以出口他們到美國到歐洲其實包括跟歐盟也在簽自由貿易協定您講的是青農的部分但我講的是在像雲林的傳統的豬農所以說雲林傳統豬農其實像他們也都有很多年輕人在因為我對雲林有一定的了解沒有 我跟您說包含是丁學中委員跟張家俊委員都收到非常多來自豬農的抗議"},{"start":645.456,"end":651.44,"text":"所以這個抗議是確實存在的不是我今天一個人在這邊就覺得可以胡亂的來講說豬董的我都同意委員剛剛的提醒我也會去推動只是我想說這不是零和我們只要讓台灣的農業包括養豬業走出去"},{"start":661.946,"end":670.308,"text":"我理解我理解剛才我也有提到啦就是說我們也有額外的投資所以我理解我們必須簽訂這樣子的協議對某些產業是好的嘛但當豬農他們有抗議確實有在抗議的時候那我覺得我們也應該要負責不管是在外交上面的溝通或者是農業部上面的評估以及溝通我們都希望能夠讓外交好的同時對於國內的一些重要產業尤其是傳統的相關的農業"},{"start":690.314,"end":694.679,"text":"農牧業 那他們也能夠感到安心 好不好好 我們一起來推動"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":318,"blocks":[["徐委員巧芯：（10時24分）謝謝主席，有請部長。"],["林部長佳龍：委員好。"],["徐委員巧芯：部長好。請教部長一個問題，我們臺灣跟巴拉圭先前有一些經貿相關協議，其背景如何，部長可以幫我們稍微陳述一下嗎？"],["林部長佳龍：經貿的協議，我們跟巴拉圭？"],["徐委員巧芯：對。就是臺巴經濟合作協定，在106年7月12號簽署，107年2月28號生效實施，主要是為了擴大臺巴經濟合作協定的效益。其實先前我有看到相關新聞，部長對於臺巴之間因為簽署相關協議在兩國之間所產生的正向幫助有過一些談話，所以我想要請問一下，當初在簽訂協議的時候，您有沒有掌握協議的相關內容？"],["林部長佳龍：108年……那個時候我還不是外交部長。"],["徐委員巧芯：沒有，就最近的時候，因為現在要修正海關進口稅則，所以才……"],["林部長佳龍：喔！OK，就是進口一些農畜……"],["徐委員巧芯：對，簽約的時間很早，這跟您沒有關係，但是到要準備實施上路的時候，您已經是外交部長了，所以付委審查是113年11月29號，然後財政委員會在114年3月20號審查，決議是不需要協商，照行政院提案通過。當時在新聞上我有看到您提到臺灣跟巴拉圭經過這樣一個協議之後，外交關係能夠更緊密結合，這個部分可不可以為我們說明一下？"],["林部長佳龍：好，其實臺巴經貿關係對雙方都很重要，因為他有一個南錐共同市場，有將近3億人口，假設有類似的自由貿易協定，當然他的農畜品就可以進口臺灣，包括牛肉、豬肉等，另外我們現在要在那邊設一個科學園區，一個……"],["徐委員巧芯：什麼科學園區？"],["林部長佳龍：一個智慧化的科技園區，本來有一個工業區在東方市，後來因為一些紛爭一直無法開發，現在我們解決了所有問題，已經有臺灣企業，包括最近的電動巴士國家隊，經過我們國家審查過國產化後就到那邊，已經有運電巴過去，而且會設廠；還有紡織業、人造纖維會在那邊設廠，因為他們有很好的水力發電，也是綠電；另外包括AI計算這一些，像美國國務卿盧比歐就有提過巴拉圭是很適合做AI資料中心的地方。過去我們會覺得這些地方好像相對來講沒有那麼多商機，可是我們現在發現跟我們建交之後，我們反而可以運用在當地國的投資免關稅，不然南美的關稅是很高的，同樣的，我們對他們進口臺灣的產品也是免關稅，這樣也可以促進他們產業的發展。"],["徐委員巧芯：好，您剛剛提到免關稅，實際上在免關稅部分，包含巴拉圭的去骨豬肉，或者已經調製或保存的牛雜碎等等，稅率都是降到免稅，這個部分當時農業部的說明，不好意思，因為外交部、農業部跟財政委員會，針對臺巴相關協議一定都有參與到，它不會只有外交部，就是相關的評估可能涉及其他部會，當時農業部的說明提到調降巴拉圭農產品關稅對我國的影響，在冷凍去骨豬肉部分，它寫到調降巴拉圭冷凍豬肉的關稅，將可以替代自歐盟進口的部分高價豬肉，對我國養豬產業不至於造成影響。我不曉得部長知不知道這件事，就是我們在臺巴協議的時候，把冷凍去骨豬肉的關稅降到零了？"],["林部長佳龍：我知道最近開始實施，貝尼亞總統也認為這是一個非常重大的雙邊關係的突破，至於農業部基於專業的評估，進口巴拉圭牛肉是零關稅，當然他們現在有一定的進口量，但是對他們來講，在出口國部分，臺灣會變得是最重要……"],["徐委員巧芯：但是這件事情，包含雲林的豬農開始有非常多的抗議，這個也要跟部長做一個報告，巴拉圭豬肉降到零關稅，當初農業部所謂的專業意見是不會對豬農造成影響，但事實上，雲林等養豬相關縣市的豬農有非常非常大的反彈，所以我們簽訂這樣一個經貿協議的時候，雖然有一些地方是有加分，但對某一些產業來講，也可能造成傷害，我們不能說因為簽了相關合約，有一些產業受到正面影響，但對於負面影響的部分，好像就並不是這麼在乎，尤其養豬業在臺灣來講是非常重要的一個產業，就像先前為了防止非洲豬瘟，影響到豬肉市場，或者美國萊豬進口的時候，豬農的相關反彈等等，對於這樣一個把豬肉降到零關稅的臺巴協議，很多豬農已經開始表達非常多的不滿，我能夠理解外交部的想法，因為這是雙邊互惠，你給我們免稅或低稅率，我們這邊也必須在巴拉圭需要之處給予零關稅或低稅率，這個我都能理解，但是對於豬農因為這個雙邊外交關係所受到的重創、受到的影響，以及他們的不滿，我覺得還是必須反映給外交部知道。","最後要請教的是，既然現在我跟您提到這件事情，外交部有沒有可能協同農業部，詢問當初他們說不會受到影響，而現在卻有豬農反彈這件事情，請農業部能夠去跟豬農了解一下、說明一下，或者在他們所需要的相關補貼、補償或協助上能夠做好，因為一個一個反推回來，最後會推到的是因為我們要做臺巴外交，就像川普的關稅貿易戰，我們也經常在外交委員會詢問，這種跨委員會的情況，雖然豬肉部分的評估不是由外交部主責，但它是為了增進臺巴之間的經貿關係及外交關係，推演到最後，其實還是兩國之間關係的緊密程度。所以我想要請外交部長是不是可以會同農業部，請他們針對過去他們所講的不會受到影響的部分重新去評估，並且跟包含雲林等養豬比較多的縣市再做一個好的溝通，如果豬農真的感受到受到影響，也必須要有相關的對應措施。我想我們的政府部門不會是分外交部、農業部，然後每個部會互不隸屬、互不關心，所以在這個部分我想請問部長，是不是可以回去跟農業部溝通一下，豬農現在對這個反應非常激烈的情況？"],["林部長佳龍：好，我們會按照委員的意思辦理，當然也會尊重農業部專業的判斷。"],["徐委員巧芯：當然。"],["林部長佳龍：確實，外交是總合外交，算是全國人民的事情，其實這個是雙向的，臺灣現在豬肉的出口，因為我們都拔針了，而且我們也是非疫區，這個有時候是雙向的，怎麼幫助我們的農民能擴大市場，這個也是……"],["徐委員巧芯：對。"],["林部長佳龍：最近包括去巴拉圭，比如食品加工，其實巴拉圭的牛肉，我們臺灣的企業是覺得加工之後是非常有潛力，是可以出口到包括美國……"],["徐委員巧芯：我知道，因為臺灣對於牛肉，這個量是比較沒有這麼大，對豬肉的影響一定會比較大，如果以牛跟豬來講的話，豬肉對於豬農，臺灣的豬農數量非常多，我們養豬的品質也非常好，所以與豬肉相關的品項降到零關稅的時候，豬農難免會覺得有壓力，或者是認為會影響到他們的產業。如果只是他們的誤會，希望外交部可以告訴農業部，請他們去說明；如果農業部重新評估後認為真的有影響的話，該輔導的、該協助的、該協助開拓市場的，這件事情一定要做。因為它推到最後的極致是，我們臺灣跟巴拉圭之間的互動關係以及我們中華民國的外交，所以還是希望由外交部長能夠向農業部做一個說明，就是我們這邊接收到的訊息。"],["林部長佳龍：好，我有跟農業部進行雙部長會議，我們會來反映，但也要跟委員講的是，這個不是零和……"],["徐委員巧芯：當然，我知道。"],["林部長佳龍：這些我都同意，我們現在利用巴拉圭的……其實我在跟很多養豬業，尤其是智慧養豬的這些青農討論整個要去巴拉圭設廠，其實善用巴拉圭在南錐共同市場這個龐大的人口，以及他們可以出口到美國、歐洲，包括跟歐盟也在簽自由貿易協定。"],["徐委員巧芯：您講的是青農的部分，但我講的是像在雲林的傳統豬農，所以雲林傳統豬農……"],["林部長佳龍：其實現在都有很多年輕人在……因為我對雲林有一定的瞭解。"],["徐委員巧芯：沒有，我跟您說，包含丁學忠委員跟張嘉郡委員都收到非常多來自豬農的抗議，所以這個抗議是確實存在的，不是我今天一個人在這邊就可以胡亂地講豬農的……"],["林部長佳龍：沒有，我都同意委員剛剛的提醒，我們也會去推動。"],["徐委員巧芯：好。"],["林部長佳龍：只是我想這個不是零和……"],["徐委員巧芯：我理解。"],["林部長佳龍：我們要讓臺灣的農業包括養豬業走出去……"],["徐委員巧芯：我理解。"],["林部長佳龍：包括像菲律賓也是另外一個很好的出路。"],["徐委員巧芯：剛才我也提到，就是說我們也有額外投資，所以我理解我們必須簽訂這樣子的協議，對我們某些產業是好的嘛！但是當豬農確實有在抗議的時候，我覺得我們也應該要負責，不管是在外交上面的溝通，或者是農業部的評估以及溝通，我們都希望能夠在讓外交好的同時，對於國內的一些重要產業，尤其是傳統的相關農、牧業也能夠感到安心，好不好？"],["林部長佳龍：好。"],["徐委員巧芯：謝謝部長，謝謝。"],["林部長佳龍：我們一起來推動。"],["主席：謝謝徐巧芯委員的質詢。","接下來請鍾佳濱委員，鍾佳濱委員，鍾佳濱委員不在。","待會我們在馬文君委員質詢後休息5分鐘。","我們請黃國昌委員上臺質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":56,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-35-20","speakers":["黃仁","陳俊宇","王定宇","羅美玲","陳永康","林楚茵","沈伯洋","徐巧芯","黃國昌","馬文君","葉元之","王鴻薇","李彥秀","張啓楷","林憶君","陳冠廷"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-06-19"],"gazette_id":"1146101","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1146101_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期外交及國防委員會第20次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"處理院會交付114年度中央政府總預算決議，外交部主管預算凍結案等3案","agenda_id":"1146101_00001"}}}