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我是後置事次長向委員報告我們針對於戰備的用水跟用油都有一定的戰備存量那這個數字不方便在公開的部分做說明那至於電的部分我們重要的設施它的發電機幾乎都是在地下室所以比較不會從外界直接去偵測到發電機的溫度那有些部分是暴露在這個外界環境中的這個部分我們下去做研究\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 327.626, \"end\": 328.327, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 328.327, \"end\": 328.487, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"置\", \"start\": 328.487, \"end\": 328.667, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 328.667, \"end\": 328.867, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"先\", \"start\": 328.867, \"end\": 329.947, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 329.947, \"end\": 330.128, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 330.128, \"end\": 330.328, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 330.328, \"end\": 330.428, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 330.428, \"end\": 330.528, \"score\": 0.799}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 330.528, \"end\": 330.688, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"置\", \"start\": 330.688, \"end\": 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\"start\": 539.146, \"end\": 539.326, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"油\", \"start\": 539.326, \"end\": 539.346, \"score\": 0.781}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,069 --> 00:00:00,389\n林委員好好\n\n2\n00:00:11,214 --> 00:00:28,799\n本席非常肯定也一定會支持我們現在居民合一去建構國家整體的防衛韌性所以在這邊要提點的是國軍暫時的基礎水電供應的問題不要把日常的必然當作暫時的當然\n\n3\n00:00:31,300 --> 00:00:46,788\n好,從這邊我們有一個非常主觀的一個條件中國從未放棄入侵台灣好,那從1949年中共建政至今我們歷經的古靈頭823、853及\n\n4\n00:00:49,249 --> 00:01:10,777\n打雙不打的炮擊及1996的台海飛彈危機包括近三次的環台軍事演習之每日的軍機跟軍艦的擾台狀態這不論是在國民黨或者是民進黨執政中共政權對台的侵略的企圖是始終如一面對中國的威脅我們必須務實面對可能發生的衝突\n\n5\n00:01:13,658 --> 00:01:37,154\n好在我們縱觀現在的這個烏俄戰爭或者是以色列伊朗以色列的衝突關鍵民生基礎設施實際上是優先攻擊的重點即使是以色列的鐵穹防空的系統也無法確保關鍵基礎設施的不被破壞這三則新聞從以下的二軍猛攻烏克蘭的電廠以阿\n\n6\n00:01:40,976 --> 00:02:02,672\n這個以以衝突的這個核電廠成為箭靶以及以色列的兩大電廠也遭炸毀這樣的一個關鍵民生設施成為是在這個區域戰爭區域這個區域政治當中在政治當中尤其是在戰時當中它幾乎是必會被攻擊的現象\n\n7\n00:02:03,413 --> 00:02:24,704\n好那漢光演習設定2027年的中共犯台本席想要問部長的是在關鍵基礎設施遭受破壞的假設條件下16萬國軍的緊急戰備用水現代化的作戰系統如雷達緊急醫療等的作戰電力有關緊急用水跟戰備供電的這兩個問題我想問國防部你們的準備如何\n\n8\n00:02:29,426 --> 00:02:42,455\n我現在就以下面這個烏二戰爭我們低熱源的人體都會被無人機的紅外線偵測偵測到這個發現我就右下方這個圖這個是在只要是紅外線對我們3637度的人體就會了你們現在的戰備供電叫做燃就是這個發電機\n\n9\n00:02:55,043 --> 00:03:01,126\n發電機它有噪音更大然後呢這個溫度更高比36跟37更高所以連我們的體溫在這個烏鶴戰爭都可以用這樣子的一個都可以用紅外線偵測了那你在戰時當中你的戰備的供電池僅靠我們現在的這個發電機不會有危險嘛你馬上就曝光了\n\n10\n00:03:20,458 --> 00:03:44,127\n然後呢這個國防自主才能自強在上週的中科院舉辦的國內外的無人水面載具的展示本席非常肯定有很多的國內業者投入國防產業的研發跟應用那也唯有與產業的集合才能實現國家防衛的韌性好但是要提醒國防部烏克蘭是因為戰爭的狀態他迫於無奈\n\n11\n00:03:45,047 --> 00:03:54,612\n迫於無奈才用商規軍用但是我國現在是陳平時期未必適合以非軍規或非工業的規格方案來進行戰備規劃請國防部三師我就舉一個例子\n\n12\n00:04:01,255 --> 00:04:08,638\n無人機的水平傳動軸你們現在在訓練是用什麼是採用非公規的樹鋼產品就是你們現在在訓練的無人機這樣的水平傳動軸是塑膠的你知道軍規一定至少要工業規格以上軍規是工業規格的特殊規格在升級\n\n13\n00:04:22,290 --> 00:04:27,131\n現在你們是用成平的時候是用這樣子的方式用商規用這個一般的這個塑膠類的所組成的一個傳動軸在做無人機好這個所以呢本席在這邊要請國防部有具體的建議希望能夠暫備用電包括緊急醫療你的電不足我的人命醫療\n\n14\n00:04:47,297 --> 00:05:08,898\n這個一定馬上受到危險那包括這個戰備的用水包括我也想聽看看你們的這個戰備用水是怎麼樣的一個準備的方案在你針對你的旱關演習那以這個避免基礎設施的損壞或人員工藝的匱乏的時候戰力無法持續這個無法持續的問題\n\n15\n00:05:09,859 --> 00:05:24,929\n還有在這邊我也要同步請這個全棟署等一下也回應一下基於全民動源的基礎全棟署應該同步思考作業指管區緊急民生供電跟供水的對應方案部長請針對這個議題回應\n\n16\n00:05:27,626 --> 00:05:55,463\n我們請後置事先委員好我是後置事次長向委員報告我們針對於戰備的用水跟用油都有一定的戰備存量那這個數字不方便在公開的部分做說明那至於電的部分我們重要的設施它的發電機幾乎都是在地下室所以比較不會從外界直接去偵測到發電機的溫度那有些部分是暴露在這個外界環境中的這個部分我們下去做研究\n\n17\n00:05:56,303 --> 00:06:24,330\n好OK那你的水是用水車嗎我不會問你細節但是就以我們現在以高雄來講我們經濟的凱米塔颱風山陀颱風有啊我們缺水啊馬上就水車所以你在暫時的時候也會用水車是嗎不是說你回答我說你只回答我說好我有多少的存量那到時候暫時的時候我還是用水車來供應嗎我們是用礦泉水的方式人員飲用是用礦泉水\n\n18\n00:06:25,819 --> 00:06:42,019\n能源引用軍用也是如此是你覺得這樣足夠嗎妥適嗎那外島是用海水氮化氣去把海水轉換成淡水外島是那國內就是用礦檢水是部長您覺得對於這樣戰備用電跟用水\n\n19\n00:06:43,151 --> 00:06:56,685\n以這個我們現在陳平時期的訓練就是因應真的是暫時我們絕對不希望也絕對不希望這個事情發生但是你就是要因應啊你覺得以剛才這樣您的部署這樣的回答你覺得足夠嗎\n\n20\n00:06:58,366 --> 00:07:24,880\n我沒有辦法太詳細的回答委員的一些問題但是基本上來講假設是固定式的設施剛剛已經講了我們就自主維生的這個系統要盡量做好這個抗炸的一個設備維護那另外會有一些機動性的一個運動來確保這個我們的這個油也好水也好能夠不被敵人爭執那應該要進入這個機動化的一個狀態\n\n21\n00:07:27,862 --> 00:07:36,479\n那至於您剛後面再提到那個有關中科院的部分,是不是要請中科院回答一下?\n\n22\n00:07:38,724 --> 00:07:56,972\n無人機的部分我們有分軍用商規和軍用軍規委員剛剛質疑的地方就是軍種採購的所謂軍用商規無人機他是希望用低價大量的方式讓國軍能夠熟悉無人機的相關運用發展相關的準則和戰術但是軍用軍規的部分請委員放心我們一定會遵循軍規的標準好\n\n23\n00:07:58,453 --> 00:08:25,648\n那部長我可以理解我也不會我覺得也尊重你們對於相關細節的一個應該要有一些分寸的一個保留這我都非常的支持但是本席認為這說你認為戰備用水跟戰備用電如果如果只是用一個我們防災型的這樣的一個因應方式的話那我認為是非常危險的一件事情\n\n24\n00:08:26,248 --> 00:08:44,509\n這一點我覺得我同意委員的看法就是說我們確實還有很多精進的地方因為當進入這個有全面入侵的狀態的時候我們確實還有很多的困難所以這個時候的軍民協同是相當的重要因為一方面要支援軍事專案一方面要維持\n\n25\n00:08:45,029 --> 00:08:59,346\n基本的民生運作是好我們一起加油國人的一個安全包括他的一個即使因應在戰時跟陳平當中其實國軍是真的是我們國人的後盾好我們一起加油謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n69\t389\t林委員好好\n11214\t28799\t本席非常肯定也一定會支持我們現在居民合一去建構國家整體的防衛韌性所以在這邊要提點的是國軍暫時的基礎水電供應的問題不要把日常的必然當作暫時的當然\n31300\t46788\t好,從這邊我們有一個非常主觀的一個條件中國從未放棄入侵台灣好,那從1949年中共建政至今我們歷經的古靈頭823、853及\n49249\t70777\t打雙不打的炮擊及1996的台海飛彈危機包括近三次的環台軍事演習之每日的軍機跟軍艦的擾台狀態這不論是在國民黨或者是民進黨執政中共政權對台的侵略的企圖是始終如一面對中國的威脅我們必須務實面對可能發生的衝突\n73658\t97154\t好在我們縱觀現在的這個烏俄戰爭或者是以色列伊朗以色列的衝突關鍵民生基礎設施實際上是優先攻擊的重點即使是以色列的鐵穹防空的系統也無法確保關鍵基礎設施的不被破壞這三則新聞從以下的二軍猛攻烏克蘭的電廠以阿\n100976\t122672\t這個以以衝突的這個核電廠成為箭靶以及以色列的兩大電廠也遭炸毀這樣的一個關鍵民生設施成為是在這個區域戰爭區域這個區域政治當中在政治當中尤其是在戰時當中它幾乎是必會被攻擊的現象\n123413\t144704\t好 那漢光演習設定2027年的中共犯台本席想要問部長的是在關鍵基礎設施遭受破壞的假設條件下16萬國軍的緊急戰備用水現代化的作戰系統如雷達 緊急醫療等的作戰電力有關緊急用水跟戰備供電的這兩個問題我想問國防部你們的準備如何\n149426\t162455\t我現在就以下面這個烏二戰爭我們低熱源的人體都會被無人機的紅外線偵測偵測到這個發現我就右下方這個圖這個是在只要是紅外線對我們36 37度的人體就會了你們現在的戰備供電叫做燃就是這個發電機\n175043\t181126\t發電機它有噪音更大然後呢這個溫度更高比36跟37更高所以連我們的體溫在這個烏鶴戰爭都可以用這樣子的一個都可以用紅外線偵測了那你在戰時當中你的戰備的供電池僅靠我們現在的這個發電機不會有危險嘛你馬上就曝光了\n200458\t224127\t然後呢這個國防自主才能自強在上週的中科院舉辦的國內外的無人水面載具的展示本席非常肯定有很多的國內業者投入國防產業的研發跟應用那也唯有與產業的集合才能實現國家防衛的韌性好但是要提醒國防部烏克蘭是因為戰爭的狀態他迫於無奈\n225047\t234612\t迫於無奈才用商規軍用但是我國現在是陳平時期未必適合以非軍規或非工業的規格方案來進行戰備規劃請國防部三師我就舉一個例子\n241255\t248638\t無人機的水平傳動軸你們現在在訓練是用什麼是採用非公規的樹鋼產品就是你們現在在訓練的無人機這樣的水平傳動軸是塑膠的你知道軍規一定至少要工業規格以上軍規是工業規格的特殊規格在升級\n262290\t267131\t現在你們是用成平的時候是用這樣子的方式用商規用這個一般的這個塑膠類的所組成的一個傳動軸在做無人機好這個所以呢本席在這邊要請國防部有具體的建議希望能夠暫備用電包括緊急醫療你的電不足我的人命醫療\n287297\t308898\t這個一定馬上受到危險那包括這個戰備的用水包括我也想聽看看你們的這個戰備用水是怎麼樣的一個準備的方案在你針對你的旱關演習那以這個避免基礎設施的損壞或人員工藝的匱乏的時候戰力無法持續這個無法持續的問題\n309859\t324929\t還有在這邊我也要同步請這個全棟署等一下也回應一下基於全民動源的基礎全棟署應該同步思考作業指管區緊急民生供電跟供水的對應方案部長請針對這個議題回應\n327626\t355463\t我們請後置事先委員好 我是後置事次長向委員報告我們針對於戰備的用水跟用油都有一定的戰備存量那這個數字不方便在公開的部分做說明那至於電的部分我們重要的設施它的發電機幾乎都是在地下室所以比較不會從外界直接去偵測到發電機的溫度那有些部分是暴露在這個外界環境中的這個部分我們下去做研究\n356303\t384330\t好 OK那你的水是用水車嗎我不會問你細節但是就以我們現在以高雄來講我們經濟的凱米塔颱風 山陀颱風有啊 我們缺水啊馬上就水車所以你在暫時的時候也會用水車是嗎不是說你回答我說你只回答我說好 我有多少的存量那到時候暫時的時候我還是用水車來供應嗎我們是用礦泉水的方式人員飲用是用礦泉水\n385819\t402019\t能源引用 軍用也是如此是你覺得這樣足夠嗎 妥適嗎那外島是用海水氮化氣去把海水轉換成淡水外島 是那國內就是用礦檢水是部長您覺得對於這樣戰備用電跟用水\n403151\t416685\t以這個我們現在陳平時期的訓練就是因應真的是暫時我們絕對不希望也絕對不希望這個事情發生但是你就是要因應啊你覺得以剛才這樣您的部署這樣的回答你覺得足夠嗎\n418366\t444880\t我沒有辦法太詳細的回答委員的一些問題但是基本上來講假設是固定式的設施剛剛已經講了我們就自主維生的這個系統要盡量做好這個抗炸的一個設備維護那另外會有一些機動性的一個運動來確保這個我們的這個油也好水也好能夠不被敵人爭執那應該要進入這個機動化的一個狀態\n447862\t456479\t那至於您剛後面再提到那個有關中科院的部分,是不是要請中科院回答一下?\n458724\t476972\t無人機的部分我們有分軍用商規和軍用軍規委員剛剛質疑的地方就是軍種採購的所謂軍用商規無人機他是希望用低價大量的方式讓國軍能夠熟悉無人機的相關運用發展相關的準則和戰術但是軍用軍規的部分請委員放心我們一定會遵循軍規的標準好\n478453\t505648\t那部長我可以理解我也不會我覺得也尊重你們對於相關細節的一個應該要有一些分寸的一個保留這我都非常的支持但是本席認為這說你認為戰備用水跟戰備用電如果如果只是用一個我們防災型的這樣的一個因應方式的話那我認為是非常危險的一件事情\n506248\t524509\t這一點我覺得我同意委員的看法就是說我們確實還有很多精進的地方因為當進入這個有全面入侵的狀態的時候我們確實還有很多的困難所以這個時候的軍民協同是相當的重要因為一方面要支援軍事專案一方面要維持\n525029\t539346\t基本的民生運作是 好 我們一起加油國人的一個安全包括他的一個即使因應在戰時跟陳平當中其實國軍是真的是我們國人的後盾好 我們一起加油 謝謝\n","txt":"林委員好好\n本席非常肯定也一定會支持我們現在居民合一去建構國家整體的防衛韌性所以在這邊要提點的是國軍暫時的基礎水電供應的問題不要把日常的必然當作暫時的當然\n好,從這邊我們有一個非常主觀的一個條件中國從未放棄入侵台灣好,那從1949年中共建政至今我們歷經的古靈頭823、853及\n打雙不打的炮擊及1996的台海飛彈危機包括近三次的環台軍事演習之每日的軍機跟軍艦的擾台狀態這不論是在國民黨或者是民進黨執政中共政權對台的侵略的企圖是始終如一面對中國的威脅我們必須務實面對可能發生的衝突\n好在我們縱觀現在的這個烏俄戰爭或者是以色列伊朗以色列的衝突關鍵民生基礎設施實際上是優先攻擊的重點即使是以色列的鐵穹防空的系統也無法確保關鍵基礎設施的不被破壞這三則新聞從以下的二軍猛攻烏克蘭的電廠以阿\n這個以以衝突的這個核電廠成為箭靶以及以色列的兩大電廠也遭炸毀這樣的一個關鍵民生設施成為是在這個區域戰爭區域這個區域政治當中在政治當中尤其是在戰時當中它幾乎是必會被攻擊的現象\n好 那漢光演習設定2027年的中共犯台本席想要問部長的是在關鍵基礎設施遭受破壞的假設條件下16萬國軍的緊急戰備用水現代化的作戰系統如雷達 緊急醫療等的作戰電力有關緊急用水跟戰備供電的這兩個問題我想問國防部你們的準備如何\n我現在就以下面這個烏二戰爭我們低熱源的人體都會被無人機的紅外線偵測偵測到這個發現我就右下方這個圖這個是在只要是紅外線對我們36 37度的人體就會了你們現在的戰備供電叫做燃就是這個發電機\n發電機它有噪音更大然後呢這個溫度更高比36跟37更高所以連我們的體溫在這個烏鶴戰爭都可以用這樣子的一個都可以用紅外線偵測了那你在戰時當中你的戰備的供電池僅靠我們現在的這個發電機不會有危險嘛你馬上就曝光了\n然後呢這個國防自主才能自強在上週的中科院舉辦的國內外的無人水面載具的展示本席非常肯定有很多的國內業者投入國防產業的研發跟應用那也唯有與產業的集合才能實現國家防衛的韌性好但是要提醒國防部烏克蘭是因為戰爭的狀態他迫於無奈\n迫於無奈才用商規軍用但是我國現在是陳平時期未必適合以非軍規或非工業的規格方案來進行戰備規劃請國防部三師我就舉一個例子\n無人機的水平傳動軸你們現在在訓練是用什麼是採用非公規的樹鋼產品就是你們現在在訓練的無人機這樣的水平傳動軸是塑膠的你知道軍規一定至少要工業規格以上軍規是工業規格的特殊規格在升級\n現在你們是用成平的時候是用這樣子的方式用商規用這個一般的這個塑膠類的所組成的一個傳動軸在做無人機好這個所以呢本席在這邊要請國防部有具體的建議希望能夠暫備用電包括緊急醫療你的電不足我的人命醫療\n這個一定馬上受到危險那包括這個戰備的用水包括我也想聽看看你們的這個戰備用水是怎麼樣的一個準備的方案在你針對你的旱關演習那以這個避免基礎設施的損壞或人員工藝的匱乏的時候戰力無法持續這個無法持續的問題\n還有在這邊我也要同步請這個全棟署等一下也回應一下基於全民動源的基礎全棟署應該同步思考作業指管區緊急民生供電跟供水的對應方案部長請針對這個議題回應\n我們請後置事先委員好 我是後置事次長向委員報告我們針對於戰備的用水跟用油都有一定的戰備存量那這個數字不方便在公開的部分做說明那至於電的部分我們重要的設施它的發電機幾乎都是在地下室所以比較不會從外界直接去偵測到發電機的溫度那有些部分是暴露在這個外界環境中的這個部分我們下去做研究\n好 OK那你的水是用水車嗎我不會問你細節但是就以我們現在以高雄來講我們經濟的凱米塔颱風 山陀颱風有啊 我們缺水啊馬上就水車所以你在暫時的時候也會用水車是嗎不是說你回答我說你只回答我說好 我有多少的存量那到時候暫時的時候我還是用水車來供應嗎我們是用礦泉水的方式人員飲用是用礦泉水\n能源引用 軍用也是如此是你覺得這樣足夠嗎 妥適嗎那外島是用海水氮化氣去把海水轉換成淡水外島 是那國內就是用礦檢水是部長您覺得對於這樣戰備用電跟用水\n以這個我們現在陳平時期的訓練就是因應真的是暫時我們絕對不希望也絕對不希望這個事情發生但是你就是要因應啊你覺得以剛才這樣您的部署這樣的回答你覺得足夠嗎\n我沒有辦法太詳細的回答委員的一些問題但是基本上來講假設是固定式的設施剛剛已經講了我們就自主維生的這個系統要盡量做好這個抗炸的一個設備維護那另外會有一些機動性的一個運動來確保這個我們的這個油也好水也好能夠不被敵人爭執那應該要進入這個機動化的一個狀態\n那至於您剛後面再提到那個有關中科院的部分,是不是要請中科院回答一下?\n無人機的部分我們有分軍用商規和軍用軍規委員剛剛質疑的地方就是軍種採購的所謂軍用商規無人機他是希望用低價大量的方式讓國軍能夠熟悉無人機的相關運用發展相關的準則和戰術但是軍用軍規的部分請委員放心我們一定會遵循軍規的標準好\n那部長我可以理解我也不會我覺得也尊重你們對於相關細節的一個應該要有一些分寸的一個保留這我都非常的支持但是本席認為這說你認為戰備用水跟戰備用電如果如果只是用一個我們防災型的這樣的一個因應方式的話那我認為是非常危險的一件事情\n這一點我覺得我同意委員的看法就是說我們確實還有很多精進的地方因為當進入這個有全面入侵的狀態的時候我們確實還有很多的困難所以這個時候的軍民協同是相當的重要因為一方面要支援軍事專案一方面要維持\n基本的民生運作是 好 我們一起加油國人的一個安全包括他的一個即使因應在戰時跟陳平當中其實國軍是真的是我們國人的後盾好 我們一起加油 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.069 --> 00:00.389\n林委員好好\n\n00:11.214 --> 00:28.799\n本席非常肯定也一定會支持我們現在居民合一去建構國家整體的防衛韌性所以在這邊要提點的是國軍暫時的基礎水電供應的問題不要把日常的必然當作暫時的當然\n\n00:31.300 --> 00:46.788\n好,從這邊我們有一個非常主觀的一個條件中國從未放棄入侵台灣好,那從1949年中共建政至今我們歷經的古靈頭823、853及\n\n00:49.249 --> 01:10.777\n打雙不打的炮擊及1996的台海飛彈危機包括近三次的環台軍事演習之每日的軍機跟軍艦的擾台狀態這不論是在國民黨或者是民進黨執政中共政權對台的侵略的企圖是始終如一面對中國的威脅我們必須務實面對可能發生的衝突\n\n01:13.658 --> 01:37.154\n好在我們縱觀現在的這個烏俄戰爭或者是以色列伊朗以色列的衝突關鍵民生基礎設施實際上是優先攻擊的重點即使是以色列的鐵穹防空的系統也無法確保關鍵基礎設施的不被破壞這三則新聞從以下的二軍猛攻烏克蘭的電廠以阿\n\n01:40.976 --> 02:02.672\n這個以以衝突的這個核電廠成為箭靶以及以色列的兩大電廠也遭炸毀這樣的一個關鍵民生設施成為是在這個區域戰爭區域這個區域政治當中在政治當中尤其是在戰時當中它幾乎是必會被攻擊的現象\n\n02:03.413 --> 02:24.704\n好那漢光演習設定2027年的中共犯台本席想要問部長的是在關鍵基礎設施遭受破壞的假設條件下16萬國軍的緊急戰備用水現代化的作戰系統如雷達緊急醫療等的作戰電力有關緊急用水跟戰備供電的這兩個問題我想問國防部你們的準備如何\n\n02:29.426 --> 02:42.455\n我現在就以下面這個烏二戰爭我們低熱源的人體都會被無人機的紅外線偵測偵測到這個發現我就右下方這個圖這個是在只要是紅外線對我們3637度的人體就會了你們現在的戰備供電叫做燃就是這個發電機\n\n02:55.043 --> 03:01.126\n發電機它有噪音更大然後呢這個溫度更高比36跟37更高所以連我們的體溫在這個烏鶴戰爭都可以用這樣子的一個都可以用紅外線偵測了那你在戰時當中你的戰備的供電池僅靠我們現在的這個發電機不會有危險嘛你馬上就曝光了\n\n03:20.458 --> 03:44.127\n然後呢這個國防自主才能自強在上週的中科院舉辦的國內外的無人水面載具的展示本席非常肯定有很多的國內業者投入國防產業的研發跟應用那也唯有與產業的集合才能實現國家防衛的韌性好但是要提醒國防部烏克蘭是因為戰爭的狀態他迫於無奈\n\n03:45.047 --> 03:54.612\n迫於無奈才用商規軍用但是我國現在是陳平時期未必適合以非軍規或非工業的規格方案來進行戰備規劃請國防部三師我就舉一個例子\n\n04:01.255 --> 04:08.638\n無人機的水平傳動軸你們現在在訓練是用什麼是採用非公規的樹鋼產品就是你們現在在訓練的無人機這樣的水平傳動軸是塑膠的你知道軍規一定至少要工業規格以上軍規是工業規格的特殊規格在升級\n\n04:22.290 --> 04:27.131\n現在你們是用成平的時候是用這樣子的方式用商規用這個一般的這個塑膠類的所組成的一個傳動軸在做無人機好這個所以呢本席在這邊要請國防部有具體的建議希望能夠暫備用電包括緊急醫療你的電不足我的人命醫療\n\n04:47.297 --> 05:08.898\n這個一定馬上受到危險那包括這個戰備的用水包括我也想聽看看你們的這個戰備用水是怎麼樣的一個準備的方案在你針對你的旱關演習那以這個避免基礎設施的損壞或人員工藝的匱乏的時候戰力無法持續這個無法持續的問題\n\n05:09.859 --> 05:24.929\n還有在這邊我也要同步請這個全棟署等一下也回應一下基於全民動源的基礎全棟署應該同步思考作業指管區緊急民生供電跟供水的對應方案部長請針對這個議題回應\n\n05:27.626 --> 05:55.463\n我們請後置事先委員好我是後置事次長向委員報告我們針對於戰備的用水跟用油都有一定的戰備存量那這個數字不方便在公開的部分做說明那至於電的部分我們重要的設施它的發電機幾乎都是在地下室所以比較不會從外界直接去偵測到發電機的溫度那有些部分是暴露在這個外界環境中的這個部分我們下去做研究\n\n05:56.303 --> 06:24.330\n好OK那你的水是用水車嗎我不會問你細節但是就以我們現在以高雄來講我們經濟的凱米塔颱風山陀颱風有啊我們缺水啊馬上就水車所以你在暫時的時候也會用水車是嗎不是說你回答我說你只回答我說好我有多少的存量那到時候暫時的時候我還是用水車來供應嗎我們是用礦泉水的方式人員飲用是用礦泉水\n\n06:25.819 --> 06:42.019\n能源引用軍用也是如此是你覺得這樣足夠嗎妥適嗎那外島是用海水氮化氣去把海水轉換成淡水外島是那國內就是用礦檢水是部長您覺得對於這樣戰備用電跟用水\n\n06:43.151 --> 06:56.685\n以這個我們現在陳平時期的訓練就是因應真的是暫時我們絕對不希望也絕對不希望這個事情發生但是你就是要因應啊你覺得以剛才這樣您的部署這樣的回答你覺得足夠嗎\n\n06:58.366 --> 07:24.880\n我沒有辦法太詳細的回答委員的一些問題但是基本上來講假設是固定式的設施剛剛已經講了我們就自主維生的這個系統要盡量做好這個抗炸的一個設備維護那另外會有一些機動性的一個運動來確保這個我們的這個油也好水也好能夠不被敵人爭執那應該要進入這個機動化的一個狀態\n\n07:27.862 --> 07:36.479\n那至於您剛後面再提到那個有關中科院的部分,是不是要請中科院回答一下?\n\n07:38.724 --> 07:56.972\n無人機的部分我們有分軍用商規和軍用軍規委員剛剛質疑的地方就是軍種採購的所謂軍用商規無人機他是希望用低價大量的方式讓國軍能夠熟悉無人機的相關運用發展相關的準則和戰術但是軍用軍規的部分請委員放心我們一定會遵循軍規的標準好\n\n07:58.453 --> 08:25.648\n那部長我可以理解我也不會我覺得也尊重你們對於相關細節的一個應該要有一些分寸的一個保留這我都非常的支持但是本席認為這說你認為戰備用水跟戰備用電如果如果只是用一個我們防災型的這樣的一個因應方式的話那我認為是非常危險的一件事情\n\n08:26.248 --> 08:44.509\n這一點我覺得我同意委員的看法就是說我們確實還有很多精進的地方因為當進入這個有全面入侵的狀態的時候我們確實還有很多的困難所以這個時候的軍民協同是相當的重要因為一方面要支援軍事專案一方面要維持\n\n08:45.029 --> 08:59.346\n基本的民生運作是好我們一起加油國人的一個安全包括他的一個即使因應在戰時跟陳平當中其實國軍是真的是我們國人的後盾好我們一起加油謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.069,"end":0.389,"text":"林委員好好"},{"start":11.214,"end":28.799,"text":"本席非常肯定也一定會支持我們現在居民合一去建構國家整體的防衛韌性所以在這邊要提點的是國軍暫時的基礎水電供應的問題不要把日常的必然當作暫時的當然"},{"start":31.3,"end":46.788,"text":"好,從這邊我們有一個非常主觀的一個條件中國從未放棄入侵台灣好,那從1949年中共建政至今我們歷經的古靈頭823、853及"},{"start":49.249,"end":70.777,"text":"打雙不打的炮擊及1996的台海飛彈危機包括近三次的環台軍事演習之每日的軍機跟軍艦的擾台狀態這不論是在國民黨或者是民進黨執政中共政權對台的侵略的企圖是始終如一面對中國的威脅我們必須務實面對可能發生的衝突"},{"start":73.658,"end":97.154,"text":"好在我們縱觀現在的這個烏俄戰爭或者是以色列伊朗以色列的衝突關鍵民生基礎設施實際上是優先攻擊的重點即使是以色列的鐵穹防空的系統也無法確保關鍵基礎設施的不被破壞這三則新聞從以下的二軍猛攻烏克蘭的電廠以阿"},{"start":100.976,"end":122.672,"text":"這個以以衝突的這個核電廠成為箭靶以及以色列的兩大電廠也遭炸毀這樣的一個關鍵民生設施成為是在這個區域戰爭區域這個區域政治當中在政治當中尤其是在戰時當中它幾乎是必會被攻擊的現象"},{"start":123.413,"end":144.704,"text":"好 那漢光演習設定2027年的中共犯台本席想要問部長的是在關鍵基礎設施遭受破壞的假設條件下16萬國軍的緊急戰備用水現代化的作戰系統如雷達 緊急醫療等的作戰電力有關緊急用水跟戰備供電的這兩個問題我想問國防部你們的準備如何"},{"start":149.426,"end":162.455,"text":"我現在就以下面這個烏二戰爭我們低熱源的人體都會被無人機的紅外線偵測偵測到這個發現我就右下方這個圖這個是在只要是紅外線對我們36 37度的人體就會了你們現在的戰備供電叫做燃就是這個發電機"},{"start":175.043,"end":181.126,"text":"發電機它有噪音更大然後呢這個溫度更高比36跟37更高所以連我們的體溫在這個烏鶴戰爭都可以用這樣子的一個都可以用紅外線偵測了那你在戰時當中你的戰備的供電池僅靠我們現在的這個發電機不會有危險嘛你馬上就曝光了"},{"start":200.458,"end":224.127,"text":"然後呢這個國防自主才能自強在上週的中科院舉辦的國內外的無人水面載具的展示本席非常肯定有很多的國內業者投入國防產業的研發跟應用那也唯有與產業的集合才能實現國家防衛的韌性好但是要提醒國防部烏克蘭是因為戰爭的狀態他迫於無奈"},{"start":225.047,"end":234.612,"text":"迫於無奈才用商規軍用但是我國現在是陳平時期未必適合以非軍規或非工業的規格方案來進行戰備規劃請國防部三師我就舉一個例子"},{"start":241.255,"end":248.638,"text":"無人機的水平傳動軸你們現在在訓練是用什麼是採用非公規的樹鋼產品就是你們現在在訓練的無人機這樣的水平傳動軸是塑膠的你知道軍規一定至少要工業規格以上軍規是工業規格的特殊規格在升級"},{"start":262.29,"end":267.131,"text":"現在你們是用成平的時候是用這樣子的方式用商規用這個一般的這個塑膠類的所組成的一個傳動軸在做無人機好這個所以呢本席在這邊要請國防部有具體的建議希望能夠暫備用電包括緊急醫療你的電不足我的人命醫療"},{"start":287.297,"end":308.898,"text":"這個一定馬上受到危險那包括這個戰備的用水包括我也想聽看看你們的這個戰備用水是怎麼樣的一個準備的方案在你針對你的旱關演習那以這個避免基礎設施的損壞或人員工藝的匱乏的時候戰力無法持續這個無法持續的問題"},{"start":309.859,"end":324.929,"text":"還有在這邊我也要同步請這個全棟署等一下也回應一下基於全民動源的基礎全棟署應該同步思考作業指管區緊急民生供電跟供水的對應方案部長請針對這個議題回應"},{"start":327.626,"end":355.463,"text":"我們請後置事先委員好 我是後置事次長向委員報告我們針對於戰備的用水跟用油都有一定的戰備存量那這個數字不方便在公開的部分做說明那至於電的部分我們重要的設施它的發電機幾乎都是在地下室所以比較不會從外界直接去偵測到發電機的溫度那有些部分是暴露在這個外界環境中的這個部分我們下去做研究"},{"start":356.303,"end":384.33,"text":"好 OK那你的水是用水車嗎我不會問你細節但是就以我們現在以高雄來講我們經濟的凱米塔颱風 山陀颱風有啊 我們缺水啊馬上就水車所以你在暫時的時候也會用水車是嗎不是說你回答我說你只回答我說好 我有多少的存量那到時候暫時的時候我還是用水車來供應嗎我們是用礦泉水的方式人員飲用是用礦泉水"},{"start":385.819,"end":402.019,"text":"能源引用 軍用也是如此是你覺得這樣足夠嗎 妥適嗎那外島是用海水氮化氣去把海水轉換成淡水外島 是那國內就是用礦檢水是部長您覺得對於這樣戰備用電跟用水"},{"start":403.151,"end":416.685,"text":"以這個我們現在陳平時期的訓練就是因應真的是暫時我們絕對不希望也絕對不希望這個事情發生但是你就是要因應啊你覺得以剛才這樣您的部署這樣的回答你覺得足夠嗎"},{"start":418.366,"end":444.88,"text":"我沒有辦法太詳細的回答委員的一些問題但是基本上來講假設是固定式的設施剛剛已經講了我們就自主維生的這個系統要盡量做好這個抗炸的一個設備維護那另外會有一些機動性的一個運動來確保這個我們的這個油也好水也好能夠不被敵人爭執那應該要進入這個機動化的一個狀態"},{"start":447.862,"end":456.479,"text":"那至於您剛後面再提到那個有關中科院的部分,是不是要請中科院回答一下?"},{"start":458.724,"end":476.972,"text":"無人機的部分我們有分軍用商規和軍用軍規委員剛剛質疑的地方就是軍種採購的所謂軍用商規無人機他是希望用低價大量的方式讓國軍能夠熟悉無人機的相關運用發展相關的準則和戰術但是軍用軍規的部分請委員放心我們一定會遵循軍規的標準好"},{"start":478.453,"end":505.648,"text":"那部長我可以理解我也不會我覺得也尊重你們對於相關細節的一個應該要有一些分寸的一個保留這我都非常的支持但是本席認為這說你認為戰備用水跟戰備用電如果如果只是用一個我們防災型的這樣的一個因應方式的話那我認為是非常危險的一件事情"},{"start":506.248,"end":524.509,"text":"這一點我覺得我同意委員的看法就是說我們確實還有很多精進的地方因為當進入這個有全面入侵的狀態的時候我們確實還有很多的困難所以這個時候的軍民協同是相當的重要因為一方面要支援軍事專案一方面要維持"},{"start":525.029,"end":539.346,"text":"基本的民生運作是 好 我們一起加油國人的一個安全包括他的一個即使因應在戰時跟陳平當中其實國軍是真的是我們國人的後盾好 我們一起加油 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":283,"blocks":[["林委員岱樺：（10時21分）有請部長。"],["主席：有請部長，謝謝。"],["顧部長立雄：林委員好。"],["林委員岱樺：本席非常肯定也一定會支持現在軍民合一去建構國家整體的防衛韌性，所以在這邊要提點的是，國軍戰時的基礎水電供應的問題，不要把日常的必然當作戰時的當然。從這邊我們有一個非常主觀的條件，中國從未放棄入侵臺灣，從1949年中共建政至今，我們歷經古寧頭、823砲戰及單打雙不打的炮擊，及1996的臺海飛彈危機，包括近3次的環臺軍事演習與每日的軍機跟軍艦擾臺狀態，這不論是在國民黨或者是民進黨執政，中共政權對臺的侵略企圖是始終如一，面對中國的威脅，我們必須務實面對可能發生的衝突。綜觀現在的烏俄戰爭或者是伊朗、以色列的衝突，關鍵民生基礎設施實際上是優先攻擊的重點，即使是以色列的鐵穹防空的系統也無法確保關鍵基礎設施不被破壞，以下這三則新聞，從俄軍猛攻烏克蘭的電廠、以伊衝突核電廠成為箭靶，以及以色列的兩大電廠也遭炸毀，這樣的關鍵民生設施成為區域政治當中，尤其是在戰時當中，幾乎是必會被攻擊的現象。","漢光演習設定2027年中共犯臺，本席想要問部長的是，在關鍵基礎設施遭受破壞的假設條件下，16萬國軍的緊急戰備用水，現代化的作戰系統如雷達及緊急醫療等作戰電力，有關緊急用水跟戰備供電的這兩個問題，我想問國防部，你們的準備如何？好，我現在就以烏俄戰爭為例，我們低熱源的人體都會被無人機的紅外線偵測發現，右下角這個圖，只要是紅外線，對我們36、37度的人體就會偵測到了。你們現在的戰備供電叫做發電機，發電機的噪音更大、溫度更高，比36跟37度更高，所以連我們的體溫在烏俄戰爭都可以用紅外線偵測了，你在戰時當中，你的戰備供電僅靠現在的發電機不會有危險嗎？你馬上就曝光了。","國防自主才能自強，在上週中科院舉辦的國內外無人水面載具展示，本席非常肯定有很多的國內業者投入國防產業的研發跟應用，也唯有與產業結合才能實現國家防衛的韌性，但是要提醒國防部，烏克蘭是因為戰爭的狀態，迫於無奈才用商規軍用，但是我國現在是承平時期，未必適合以非軍規或非工業的規格方案來進行戰備規劃，請國防部三思。我就舉一個例子，無人機的水平傳動軸你們現在在訓練是用什麼？是採用非工規的塑鋼產品，就是你們現在在做訓練的無人機水平傳動軸是塑膠的，你知道軍規至少要工業規格以上，軍規是工業規格的特殊規格再升級，現在承平的時候你們是用這樣的方式，用商規、用塑膠類所組成的傳動軸在做無人機，所以本席在這邊要具體建議國防部，請務實規劃戰備用電，包括緊急醫療，一旦電不足，人命、醫療一定馬上受到威脅，包括戰備用水，我也想聽看看你們的戰備用水準備方案是怎麼樣？針對漢光演習，以避免基礎設施損壞或能源供應匱乏時戰力無法持續的問題。在這邊我也要同步請全動署等一下也回應一下，基於全民動員的基礎，全動署應該同步思考作業指管區緊急民生供電及供水的對應方案。部長，請針對這個議題回應。"],["顧部長立雄：我們請後次室說明。"],["李次長鳳翔：委員好，我是後次室次長。向委員報告，我們針對戰備的用水跟用油，都有一定的戰備存量，這個數字不方便公開做說明。針對電的部分，我們重要設施的發電機幾乎都是在地下室，所以比較不會從外界直接去偵測到發電機的溫度，有些部分是暴露在外界環境中，我們再下去做研究。"],["林委員岱樺：好。那你的水是用水車嗎？我不會問你細節，但是就以高雄來講，我們經歷了凱米颱風、山陀兒颱風，有啊，我們缺水，馬上水車就來，所以在戰時的時候也會用水車是嗎？你只回答我有多少存量，但戰時還是用水車來供應嗎？"],["李次長鳳翔：報告委員，我們是用礦泉水的方式，人員飲用是用礦泉水。"],["林委員岱樺：人員飲用，軍用也是如此？"],["李次長鳳翔：是。"],["林委員岱樺：你覺得這樣足夠嗎、妥適嗎？"],["李次長鳳翔：外島是用海水淡化器去把海水轉換成淡水。"],["林委員岱樺：國內就是用礦泉水？"],["李次長鳳翔：是。"],["林委員岱樺：部長，您覺得對於這樣的戰備用電跟用水，我們現在承平時期的訓練就是為了因應戰時，我們絕對不希望這個事情發生，但你就是要因應，以剛才您的部屬這樣回答，你覺得足夠嗎？"],["顧部長立雄：我沒有辦法太詳盡地回答委員的一些問題，但基本上來講，假設是固定式的設施，剛剛已經講了，我們就自足維生的系統，要儘量做好抗炸的維護，另外會有機動性的運送來確保油也好、水也好，能夠不被敵人偵知，應該要進入機動化的狀態。至於您後面提到有關中科院的部分，是不是請中科院回答一下？"],["李院長世強：委員，無人機的部分，我們有分軍用商規和軍用軍規，委員剛剛質疑的地方就是軍種採購的所謂軍用商規無人機，是希望用低價大量的方式，讓國軍能夠熟悉無人機的相關運用，發展相關的準則和戰術；但是軍用軍規的部分，請委員放心，我們一定會遵循軍規的標準。"],["林委員岱樺：好。部長，我可以理解，我也尊重你們對於相關細節應該要有一些分寸的保留，這我都非常支持，但本席認為戰備用水跟戰備用電如果只是用防災型這樣的因應方式的話，我認為是非常危險的一件事情。"],["顧部長立雄：這一點我同意委員的看法，我們確實還有很多需要精進的地方，因為當進入有全面入侵的狀態，我們確實還有很多的困難，所以這個時候的軍民協同是相當、相當地重要，因為一方面要支援軍事作戰，一方面要維持基本的民生運作。"],["林委員岱樺：好，我們一起加油。"],["顧部長立雄：是。"],["林委員岱樺：為了國人的安全，在承平時期要為因應戰時狀態做準備，國軍真的是我們國人的後盾，我們一起加油，謝謝。"],["顧部長立雄：好，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝林委員，部長請回。","接下來有請徐巧芯委員上臺質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":300,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-35-21","speakers":["沈伯洋","陳永康","羅美玲","陳俊宇","王定宇","林楚茵","陳冠廷","林岱樺","徐巧芯","林憶君","黃仁"],"page_start":263,"meetingDate":["2025-06-25"],"gazette_id":"1146201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1146201_00012"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期外交及國防委員會第21次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、繼續處理院會交付113年度中央政府總預算決議，國防部主管預算凍結案等6案；二、處理院\n會交付114年度中央政府總預算決議，國防部主管預算凍結案等34案；三、處理院會交付114年度\n中央政府總預算決議，外交部主管預算凍結案1案；四、處理院會交付114年度中央政府總預算決\n議，僑務委員會主管預算凍結案1案","agenda_id":"1146201_00013"}}}