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談判過程當然必須要很多的機密但我希望就是一樣鼓勵我們的談判團隊持續的加油希望幫台灣爭取到最好的一些狀況也希望讓我們的產業讓我們的農民的衝擊降到最小再來我請教一下那個油煉糖水加薪這一塊長期我們也在講部長一樣都會支持吧\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 664.312, \"end\": 664.472, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 664.472, \"end\": 664.712, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 664.712, \"end\": 664.953, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 664.953, \"end\": 665.253, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 665.253, \"end\": 665.513, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 665.513, \"end\": 665.633, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 665.633, \"end\": 666.094, \"score\": 0.864}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 666.094, \"end\": 666.374, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 666.374, \"end\": 667.195, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 667.195, \"end\": 667.595, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": 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\"start\": 994.246, \"end\": 994.286, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 994.286, \"end\": 994.686, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 994.686, \"end\": 994.806, \"score\": 0.835}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 994.806, \"end\": 994.986, \"score\": 0.819}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 994.986, \"end\": 995.006, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 995.006, \"end\": 995.026, \"score\": 0.864}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:02,386 --> 00:00:12,505\n好主席請那個陳部長郭部長跟曾董事長郭部長陳部長我先問陳部長我先問一下部長\n\n2\n00:00:16,450 --> 00:00:40,808\n我們現在這次的風災我們都要求重優重寬重速重減那有沒有達到這樣的一個原則我想第一個部分就是重速的部分從過往的這些地方政府勘在這報上來這個時間我們用主動公告的方式事實上也至少節省了公告這段時間的大概從一個禮拜節省到三天之內所以這些原則都掌握了\n\n3\n00:00:42,149 --> 00:01:08,495\n苦民所苦啦就是人民當在現在這個風災的特別是這一次的雨特別是風超出原先的預期所以造成了相當大的一些災情我希望這個部分從寬從幽從速從簡這個原則一定要盡快而且接下來現在才七月而已還不知道還會遇到這樣我希望未來的原則都是把握這樣的原則我們一定是用同理心的角度去面對這樣因為時間有限然後接下來我問的是經費夠不夠\n\n4\n00:01:10,103 --> 00:01:23,268\n接下來經費夠不夠我跟委員報告在天然災害救助基金在114年是大概是將近38億將近39億那我要跟委員報告在這次颱風之前已經用掉了22億左右\n\n5\n00:01:25,339 --> 00:01:48,200\n換句話說年初開始有非常多的低溫已經造成了這些天然災害損失所以這一次的颱風一定是不夠的這一次已經不夠用絕對是不夠用的那農業部不夠用那怎麼辦這些經費怎麼辦我跟委員報告過去不夠用的話我們第一時間會去跟行政院爭取二倍金但是很可惜的這一次的立法院因為我們的公務\n\n6\n00:01:49,241 --> 00:02:07,340\n撥補到基金的預算有被刪減那我在這邊特別強調一旦被刪減了以後我們就不能直接動資二倍金也就是說立法院藍白國會都刪減掉這個預算之後變成你們也無法動資因為立法院是不讓你們動資這些錢的所以連二倍金都無法動用是這樣嗎\n\n7\n00:02:08,141 --> 00:02:22,636\n對是根據相關的那個會計規定你只要刪了撥補的基金的經費部長那接下來呢現在才7月而已颱風期有可能到9月10月都還有颱風那接下來遇到農民的災損的時候怎麼辦不過我想齁\n\n8\n00:02:23,477 --> 00:02:51,196\n就算沒有辦法去凍飾二杯精那我們還是會想辦法用移緩季節或用其他的方式來爭取我這邊只要告訴我們所有的全國的農民齁不管怎麼樣天災我們農業部一定站在第一線跟他們在一起經費的部分我們一定會來想辦法所以雖然經費已經沒有了但是農業部還是會想辦法就對了對我們還是會去想辦法還是會想辦法請跟院長去找出方法出來好嗎好不好也跟立法院持續的溝通好不好\n\n9\n00:02:51,636 --> 00:03:10,228\n應該要找到一些方法解決這個問題啦就是任何一個政黨執政都遇到天災但遇到天災的時候我們都希望支持現在每個國民黨的縣市首長也請求支援支持啊就現在經費這樣子狀況下你要國家怎麼做是怎麼來協助這些農民每個農民都希望每個受災民都希望政府來支持結果現在這樣狀態怎麼做\n\n10\n00:03:12,076 --> 00:03:36,551\n我希望部長全力的來繼續跟院長院也跟包括國民兩黨持續溝通民進黨是全力支持的但是國民兩黨這一塊持續溝通什麼樣的有沒有什麼樣的方式能夠把這件事情能夠做一個妥善的解決好不好好接下來我請教一下部長跟曾董事長好嗎那個郭部長郭部長曾董事長郭部長我請教一下一樣的問題從寬從幽從速從簡經濟部門有把持這樣的原則\n\n11\n00:03:42,601 --> 00:03:59,658\n是的有照這樣在做嗎我們有照這樣在做好那經濟部的經費上面有沒有遇到問題我們現在就是就我們這個我們現在有一部分就是沒有\n\n12\n00:04:01,055 --> 00:04:19,208\n不足的部分那我想我們跟農業部也是一樣就因為這是一個災難所以我們會想辦法把這個不足的經費盡量來這個爭取跟院長這邊爭取我再回來我待會再問一下部長好了我先問一下台電董事長好了好不好董事長\n\n13\n00:04:21,039 --> 00:04:49,920\n這一次台電其實很辛苦啦因為就像上次一樣因為像高雄過去也遇到山坨等等那個風力之強17級的風那個掃掉連電線桿直接把你掃斷那恐怕是很多人沒有看到是難以想像電線桿裡面還有鐵絲的全部直接掃斷掉而且斷一整排的因為不會只有那一支斷其他全斷所以這一次從台南從嘉義上來其實造成了這個我們的電力上很大的一個重創\n\n14\n00:04:52,088 --> 00:04:54,177\n我們的整個恢復了嗎目前狀況恢復到什麼樣的狀態\n\n15\n00:04:55,134 --> 00:05:20,947\n那個公園報告我們在禮拜六的晚上九點他就已經全部的恢復都恢復了最晚的是在嘉義縣因為嘉義縣是颱風登陸的地點我還是要謝謝其實真的還是要謝謝台電啦齁其實台電的第一層的同仁每次在遇到這種風災我的選區都是在臨海區啦前陣小港旗津都是受風面第一排每一次只要發生狀況的時候第一線都是拚了命在救的\n\n16\n00:05:22,227 --> 00:05:44,886\n颱風正大的時候風雨正大的時候台電的第一線員工都在第一線用命在救救復電然後甚至還遇到很多是高壓電甚至遇到是鐵板被吹起來壓在高壓電上面還是要拼命的想辦法你不處理掉那些東西就是沒辦法復電所以是拼了命的在那個那我想要講的是台電是國家的台電台電是人民的台電\n\n17\n00:05:46,664 --> 00:06:15,104\n上次的整個經費全部都給過唯獨就把台電的一千億整個扣下來其實坦白講我是覺得非常的難過啦就是說台電這次在支持台電就給台電更多的一些資源但是現在完全完全把那所謂的能源政策的問題全部把它丟給台電去丟包給台電去承擔我認為這個對台電是非常非常不公平台電的士氣也會受到很大的影響嘛我董事長接下來台電在這些財政上會不會有壓力\n\n18\n00:06:16,971 --> 00:06:33,522\n我跟委員報告就是說因為其實災損的部分我們還要統計因為將近3500根電桿那其實我問一下台電這次這樣的損失大概會多少我們現在還在統計跟委員報告出估大概多少至少損失了多少\n\n19\n00:06:34,851 --> 00:06:53,659\n應該有10億啦台電損失了10億以上應該有10億左右所以這個部分就台電又要擔起來就台電已經過去來政府因為扛住了整個動漲電價然後穩定物價的這些責任現在還在加10億上去那這還不包括很多人力上面的成本吧\n\n20\n00:06:55,240 --> 00:07:22,965\n我們有全部都一起做一些統計跟估計大概是這樣但是我要跟委員報告現在是我們是損害掉的我們儘快能夠把它恢復但接下來的狀況是我相信今天一定很多委員問我們那接下來怎麼辦其實我們有在考慮接下來怎麼辦但剛才部長的報告也有提了大概的一些方向那這些其實都是需要因為電網的韌性需要投資需要經費而且其實這不是台灣的一個國家的問題\n\n21\n00:07:24,105 --> 00:07:41,481\n全世界都遇到這樣子的問題最近很多的國際媒體報導各個國家都在增加電網的投資那增加電網的投資的經費有政府的補貼也有透過電價調整來反映的一大堆這種狀況我覺得我們只要稍微檢視一下外電大概都看得到\n\n22\n00:07:42,262 --> 00:07:59,859\n特別是這些的很多的像過去以來比如像高雄很多因為防災型的關係所以我們努力的做了一些地下化甚至有些強韌的做法所以其實那個災情就會減少我認為這一次的整個沿海地區很多都必須要做更多的強化更正性這個都需要投入更多的一些資源\n\n23\n00:08:00,579 --> 00:08:15,809\n後續的改善可能真的是會比較需要時間也需要更多的政府的各個單位來配合因為包含入權包含等等相關的狀況這個我們它當然資源是經費是一個非常重要的元素\n\n24\n00:08:16,109 --> 00:08:34,905\n那我問一下台電這樣的話會不會有財務上的壓力如果遲遲的沒辦法撥補政府遲遲沒有辦法撥補其實這應該政府給的政策是政府在定的嘛那政府要求你不漲電價政府認為你們不應該希望穩定住民生的這個電價的時候不給你漲的時候那你承受了虧損那這個會不會有很大的壓力\n\n25\n00:08:36,380 --> 00:08:41,305\n跟委員報告財務一直是台電的壓力那這會不會影響到台電的軍心士氣我跟委員報告就是說我們\n\n26\n00:08:48,564 --> 00:09:16,773\n政府對於台電的一些經費上的支持是對台電的肯定跟鼓勵基本上肯定了台電事實上在整個國際燃料價格上漲的時候扛住了國內通膨的壓力我們一再說明世界上很多國家都在補貼很多國家調的因為大家都希望穩定住電價穩定住物價非常多的通貨膨脹因為一旦電價物價提升了之後造成了國家的整體損失是更大的嘛\n\n27\n00:09:17,594 --> 00:09:46,721\n所以大家都是用這樣的策略在進行在處理的就唯獨台灣遇到一個非理性的國會的多數兩黨然後然後用這樣的方式來對待台電我希望董事長繼續努力了好不好這個然後另外鼓舞台電的同仁們這個我們會全力以赴再繼續在法院爭取這邊的軍隊台電來說台電的同仁把電網修復就是我們的責任我們一定會努力把這個工作做好我們也開始在討論後續強化的一些工作\n\n28\n00:09:47,401 --> 00:09:59,810\n就是及早來規劃我們全力來支持同時現在給予台電同仁更多的鼓勵啦第一線特別是第一線的同仁辛苦的同仁用命在幫大家復電的這些同仁給他們更多的鼓勵我們一定會轉當會想...部長需要請教一下部長啦齁部長我還是要問一下齁這個...\n\n29\n00:10:04,400 --> 00:10:18,380\n大家現在關心這個美國的這個稅率的問題董事長請坐啦董事長請坐非的問題現在大家擔心如果8月1號快要到了如果沒有談出一個結果出來的話會不會受到影響會不會被回復到這個32這樣的狀況部長現在談的最新狀況怎麼樣\n\n30\n00:10:21,324 --> 00:10:41,289\n我們現在還在談判中嘛還在談判中副院長到美國再次去談了嘛是嗎這個是第四次嘛第四次去談了嘛對不對那現在努力的朝向在10跟20之間去做努力嘛是嗎是在這樣的目標下嗎我們始終是希望能夠談出一個對國內有利的這樣的一個稅率\n\n31\n00:10:43,275 --> 00:11:03,732\n也做了各種的準備嘛一旦如果有任何狀況需要去支持各企業各什麼的也都做的準備我想我們的談判小組他們都有做充分的準備啦好我們期盼有好的結果那在8月1號前會談出來嗎這個結果8月1號美國他也有講嘛如果8月1號前沒有談到完整他也可以postform\n\n32\n00:11:04,312 --> 00:11:29,294\n所以還是會有那個我想這個都還在不確定的這個這麼多不確定的因素所以我沒有辦法跟委員報告了解談判過程當然必須要很多的機密但我希望就是一樣鼓勵我們的談判團隊持續的加油希望幫台灣爭取到最好的一些狀況也希望讓我們的產業讓我們的農民的衝擊降到最小再來我請教一下那個油煉糖水加薪這一塊長期我們也在講部長一樣都會支持吧\n\n33\n00:11:29,975 --> 00:11:42,047\n我們當然是全力支持我指的也不只這些啦包括像中鋼、螳融、台船甚至漢翔等泛工股我也鼓勵其實都要支持啦因為這些都很辛苦他們也都我也認為國家應該由這些企業來帶頭調性來動整個薪資的上漲\n\n34\n00:11:46,331 --> 00:12:09,113\n部長同意這樣的方向嗎我們大家一起努力好一起努力最後一個問題啦上次在小港的臨海園區裡面三元的能源發生的火災燃燒了26小時燒了26小時裡面甚至有造成了這個氫氧酸等等一些危險的物質我希望部長這已經我當時上禮拜一發生的我要求兩個禮拜內提出一份報告啦部長有掌握這件事情嗎\n\n35\n00:12:10,474 --> 00:12:35,956\n因為那個我都在救災所以如果我希望部長了解一下整個狀況好不好因為下個禮拜整個報告要出來我們要當地跟鄉親說明就是為什麼這樣的場具有這種高風險高危險的場為什麼會離市民這麼近經濟部的相關有沒有相關的審核的責任我的意思是說經濟部在你的園區內不要把這個東西直接丟給市政府有些部分該你們掌握的責任你們還是要掌握住就是\n\n36\n00:12:36,977 --> 00:13:00,018\n高雄小港已經承受了相當多的一些高污染甚至高危險的一些產業而這個當時你看一燒起來以後是消防員是趕快逃出來三位如果沒有逃出來恐怕都很危險的所以那只能讓他繼續在那邊燒讓他燒燒到整個自然那個然後燒掉了26個小時燒了26個小時然後裡面產生了多少的一些\n\n37\n00:13:00,839 --> 00:13:24,705\n有害的一些毒氣的部分當天的空污狀況其實是很糟的那我的意思是說我希望經濟部在未來在評估這些事情的時候要審慎思考至少離住宅區至少離人民要離得遠一點你不能夠在這麼近的區域雖然它是叫做臨海產業園區但是它旁邊就是居民很多的居民我們都在談大林埔遷村想把一些影響降到最低的結果我們現在又把這些具有高風險\n\n38\n00:13:26,055 --> 00:13:33,647\n可能有影響的又放在人民的周邊這個是人民是很難接受的我希望經濟部在這件事情上未來要加強去做把關\n\n39\n00:13:34,690 --> 00:13:55,667\n部長可以嗎給我們一個承諾我們會加強來加強把關通知幾乎該有的則也要訂進來但是報告委員他進來的時候我們他是符合這個我們產業園區各種用地用途及使用規範辦法的第三條產業用地第一項規定為容許引進的產業部長我就是希望請你們再去思考跟檢討\n\n40\n00:13:56,288 --> 00:14:12,197\n是我們會就第一個燃燒了26個小時他的安全他的所有的周邊一定他的消防所有的一定出了一些問題包括他的狀況顯然超出了李明軒預期的狀況了他不是一般我們所熟悉的這些廠房同時他燃燒出來的是\n\n41\n00:14:14,048 --> 00:14:36,914\n清氟酸有毒的這個是甚至於他有的有毒性的一些物質的這個周邊的居民其實都相當擔心的甚至於當天還有很多人說當天的空氣甚至當天的水他們都擔心這邊是有問題的報告委員那您那所這個指責的這個空氣品質監測我想我們都有設置這個空氣品質監測站\n\n42\n00:14:38,496 --> 00:15:02,207\n那您剛所說的部分有害空氣污染物到目前為止我想我們都沒有發現有空污的問題部長我知道了裡面在場內有一度有監測到場內一度有監測到但是我要講的是即使是在周邊也都是這種的它的擴散效應等等我的意思是說那個只是一個最低最低的標準\n\n43\n00:15:02,887 --> 00:15:19,174\n最低最低的標準啦這種東西放在離居民這麼近這件事情本身就有高度的爭議啦我還是要請部長思考不要完全的相信跟迷失在那所謂的監測站監測不是24小時監測監測也不是所有的周邊的點全部監測監測時\n\n44\n00:15:21,095 --> 00:15:41,469\n拿出來測一下他永遠有帶有很多的不確定性在那對我來說這件事情就是不你想啦如果是在台北市的哪一個區域裡面願意接受這樣的東西嗎台北市的任何一個區域你告訴我願意接受這樣的東西嗎那如果不行的話請臨海公衛區用更重新調整你們的標準\n\n45\n00:15:42,759 --> 00:16:06,926\n重新調整表現它這裡面會產生有毒的氣質有毒的氣體即使是會產生有毒氣體的風險你說你沒有監測到不代表沒有發生一度在場內是有監測到一度在場內是有監測到監測了幾次它不是24小時在監測它不是隨時在監測我一直想部長真的要將心比心站在周邊居民的角度來思考\n\n46\n00:16:08,556 --> 00:16:35,026\n換作這個東西如果是在中正區有人有辦法接收這樣的事情嗎隔壁有辦法接收這樣的一個廠房嗎距離幾百公尺有辦法接收這樣的廠房所以我講的是請進一步要重新調整你們的標準要更嚴格的去檢視有些該進來的廠房標準同時也要提升他的安全性這一次我看來是一堆的問題我看到是一堆的問題我希望部長就在完畢之後花一點點時間了解這個案子好不好好的謝謝部長好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n2386\t12505\t好主席請那個陳部長郭部長跟曾董事長郭部長陳部長我先問陳部長我先問一下部長\n16450\t40808\t我們現在這次的風災 我們都要求重優 重寬 重速 重減那有沒有達到這樣的一個原則我想第一個部分就是重速的部分 從過往的這些地方政府勘在這報上來 這個時間我們用主動公告的方式 事實上也至少節省了公告這段時間的大概從一個禮拜 節省到三天之內所以這些原則都掌握了\n42149\t68495\t苦民所苦啦就是人民當在現在這個風災的特別是這一次的雨特別是風超出原先的預期所以造成了相當大的一些災情我希望這個部分從寬從幽從速從簡這個原則一定要盡快而且接下來現在才七月而已還不知道還會遇到這樣我希望未來的原則都是把握這樣的原則我們一定是用同理心的角度去面對這樣因為時間有限然後接下來我問的是經費夠不夠\n70103\t83268\t接下來經費夠不夠我跟委員報告在天然災害救助基金在114年是大概是將近38億將近39億那我要跟委員報告在這次颱風之前已經用掉了22億左右\n85339\t108200\t換句話說年初開始有非常多的低溫已經造成了這些天然災害損失所以這一次的颱風一定是不夠的這一次已經不夠用絕對是不夠用的那農業部不夠用那怎麼辦這些經費怎麼辦我跟委員報告過去不夠用的話我們第一時間會去跟行政院爭取二倍金但是很可惜的這一次的立法院因為我們的公務\n109241\t127340\t撥補到基金的預算有被刪減那我在這邊特別強調一旦被刪減了以後我們就不能直接動資二倍金也就是說立法院藍白國會都刪減掉這個預算之後變成你們也無法動資因為立法院是不讓你們動資這些錢的所以連二倍金都無法動用是這樣嗎\n128141\t142636\t對 是根據相關的那個會計規定你只要刪了撥補的基金的經費部長那接下來呢 現在才7月而已颱風期有可能到9月10月都還有颱風那接下來遇到農民的災損的時候怎麼辦不過我想齁\n143477\t171196\t就算沒有辦法去凍飾二杯精那我們還是會想辦法用移緩季節或用其他的方式來爭取我這邊只要告訴我們所有的全國的農民齁不管怎麼樣天災我們農業部一定站在第一線跟他們在一起經費的部分我們一定會來想辦法所以雖然經費已經沒有了但是農業部還是會想辦法就對了對我們還是會去想辦法還是會想辦法請跟院長去找出方法出來好嗎好不好也跟立法院持續的溝通好不好\n171636\t190228\t應該要找到一些方法解決這個問題啦就是任何一個政黨執政都遇到天災但遇到天災的時候我們都希望支持現在每個國民黨的縣市首長也請求支援支持啊就現在經費這樣子狀況下你要國家怎麼做是怎麼來協助這些農民每個農民都希望每個受災民都希望政府來支持結果現在這樣狀態怎麼做\n192076\t216551\t我希望部長全力的來繼續跟院長院也跟包括國民兩黨持續溝通民進黨是全力支持的但是國民兩黨這一塊持續溝通什麼樣的有沒有什麼樣的方式能夠把這件事情能夠做一個妥善的解決好不好好接下來我請教一下部長跟曾董事長好嗎那個郭部長郭部長 曾董事長郭部長我請教一下一樣的問題從寬從幽從速從簡經濟部門有把持這樣的原則\n222601\t239658\t是的有照這樣在做嗎我們有照這樣在做好那經濟部的經費上面有沒有遇到問題我們現在就是就我們這個我們現在有一部分就是沒有\n241055\t259208\t不足的部分那我想我們跟農業部也是一樣就因為這是一個災難所以我們會想辦法把這個不足的經費盡量來這個爭取跟院長這邊爭取我再回來我待會再問一下部長好了我先問一下台電董事長好了好不好董事長\n261039\t289920\t這一次台電其實很辛苦啦 因為就像上次一樣 因為像高雄過去也遇到山坨等等那個風力之強 17級的風那個掃掉連電線桿直接把你掃斷那恐怕是很多人沒有看到是難以想像電線桿裡面還有鐵絲的 全部直接掃斷掉而且斷一整排的 因為不會只有那一支斷 其他全斷所以這一次從台南 從嘉義上來 其實造成了這個我們的電力上很大的一個重創\n292088\t294177\t我們的整個恢復了嗎 目前狀況恢復到什麼樣的狀態\n295134\t320947\t那個公園報告我們在禮拜六的晚上九點他就已經全部的恢復 都恢復了最晚的是在嘉義縣 因為嘉義縣是颱風登陸的地點我還是要謝謝 其實真的還是要謝謝台電啦齁其實台電的第一層的同仁每次在遇到這種風災我的選區都是在臨海區啦 前陣小港 旗津都是受風面第一排每一次只要發生狀況的時候第一線都是拚了命在救的\n322227\t344886\t颱風正大的時候 風雨正大的時候 台電的第一線員工都在第一線用命在救 救復電然後甚至還遇到很多是高壓電 甚至遇到是鐵板被吹起來壓在高壓電上面 還是要拼命的想辦法你不處理掉那些東西就是沒辦法復電所以是拼了命的在那個 那我想要講的是台電是國家的台電 台電是人民的台電\n346664\t375104\t上次的整個經費全部都給過唯獨就把台電的一千億整個扣下來其實坦白講我是覺得非常的難過啦就是說台電這次在支持台電就給台電更多的一些資源但是現在完全完全把那所謂的能源政策的問題全部把它丟給台電去丟包給台電去承擔我認為這個對台電是非常非常不公平台電的士氣也會受到很大的影響嘛我董事長接下來台電在這些財政上會不會有壓力\n376971\t393522\t我跟委員報告就是說因為其實災損的部分我們還要統計因為將近3500根電桿那其實我問一下台電這次這樣的損失大概會多少我們現在還在統計跟委員報告出估大概多少至少損失了多少\n394851\t413659\t應該有10億啦台電損失了10億以上應該有10億左右所以這個部分就台電又要擔起來就台電已經過去來政府因為扛住了整個動漲電價然後穩定物價的這些責任現在還在加10億上去那這還不包括很多人力上面的成本吧\n415240\t442965\t我們有全部都一起做一些統計跟估計大概是這樣但是我要跟委員報告現在是我們是損害掉的我們儘快能夠把它恢復但接下來的狀況是我相信今天一定很多委員問我們那接下來怎麼辦其實我們有在考慮接下來怎麼辦但剛才部長的報告也有提了大概的一些方向那這些其實都是需要因為電網的韌性需要投資需要經費而且其實這不是台灣的一個國家的問題\n444105\t461481\t全世界都遇到這樣子的問題最近很多的國際媒體報導各個國家都在增加電網的投資那增加電網的投資的經費有政府的補貼也有透過電價調整來反映的一大堆這種狀況我覺得我們只要稍微檢視一下外電大概都看得到\n462262\t479859\t特別是這些的很多的像過去以來比如像高雄很多因為防災型的關係所以我們努力的做了一些地下化甚至有些強韌的做法所以其實那個災情就會減少我認為這一次的整個沿海地區很多都必須要做更多的強化更正性這個都需要投入更多的一些資源\n480579\t495809\t後續的改善可能真的是會比較需要時間也需要更多的政府的各個單位來配合因為包含入權包含等等相關的狀況這個我們它當然資源是經費是一個非常重要的元素\n496109\t514905\t那我問一下台電這樣的話會不會有財務上的壓力如果遲遲的沒辦法撥補政府遲遲沒有辦法撥補其實這應該政府給的政策是政府在定的嘛那政府要求你不漲電價政府認為你們不應該希望穩定住民生的這個電價的時候不給你漲的時候那你承受了虧損那這個會不會有很大的壓力\n516380\t521305\t跟委員報告財務一直是台電的壓力那這會不會影響到台電的軍心士氣我跟委員報告就是說我們\n528564\t556773\t政府對於台電的一些經費上的支持是對台電的肯定跟鼓勵基本上肯定了台電事實上在整個國際燃料價格上漲的時候扛住了國內通膨的壓力我們一再說明世界上很多國家都在補貼很多國家調的因為大家都希望穩定住電價穩定住物價非常多的通貨膨脹因為一旦電價物價提升了之後造成了國家的整體損失是更大的嘛\n557594\t586721\t所以大家都是用這樣的策略在進行在處理的就唯獨台灣遇到一個非理性的國會的多數兩黨然後然後用這樣的方式來對待台電我希望董事長繼續努力了好不好這個然後另外鼓舞台電的同仁們這個我們會全力以赴再繼續在法院爭取這邊的軍隊台電來說台電的同仁把電網修復就是我們的責任我們一定會努力把這個工作做好我們也開始在討論後續強化的一些工作\n587401\t599810\t就是及早來規劃 我們全力來支持同時現在給予台電同仁更多的鼓勵啦 第一線特別是第一線的同仁 辛苦的同仁用命在幫大家復電的這些同仁 給他們更多的鼓勵我們一定會轉當 會想...部長 需要請教一下部長啦齁部長我還是要問一下齁 這個...\n604400\t618380\t大家現在關心這個美國的這個稅率的問題董事長請坐啦 董事長請坐非的問題現在大家擔心如果8月1號快要到了如果沒有談出一個結果出來的話會不會受到影響會不會被回復到這個32這樣的狀況部長現在談的最新狀況怎麼樣\n621324\t641289\t我們現在還在談判中嘛還在談判中 副院長到美國再次去談了嘛 是嗎這個是第四次嘛第四次去談了嘛 對不對那現在努力的朝向在10跟20之間去做努力嘛 是嗎是在這樣的目標下嗎我們始終是希望能夠談出一個對國內有利的這樣的一個稅率\n643275\t663732\t也做了各種的準備嘛一旦如果有任何狀況需要去支持各企業各什麼的也都做的準備我想我們的談判小組他們都有做充分的準備啦好我們期盼有好的結果那在8月1號前會談出來嗎這個結果8月1號美國他也有講嘛如果8月1號前沒有談到完整他也可以post form\n664312\t689294\t所以還是會有那個我想這個都還在不確定的這個這麼多不確定的因素所以我沒有辦法跟委員報告了解 談判過程當然必須要很多的機密但我希望就是一樣鼓勵我們的談判團隊持續的加油希望幫台灣爭取到最好的一些狀況也希望讓我們的產業讓我們的農民的衝擊降到最小再來我請教一下那個油煉糖水加薪這一塊長期我們也在講部長一樣都會支持吧\n689975\t702047\t我們當然是全力支持我指的也不只這些啦包括像中鋼、螳融、台船甚至漢翔等泛工股我也鼓勵其實都要支持啦因為這些都很辛苦他們也都我也認為國家應該由這些企業來帶頭調性來動整個薪資的上漲\n706331\t729113\t部長同意這樣的方向嗎我們大家一起努力好一起努力最後一個問題啦上次在小港的臨海園區裡面三元的能源發生的火災燃燒了26小時燒了26小時裡面甚至有造成了這個氫氧酸等等一些危險的物質我希望部長這已經我當時上禮拜一發生的我要求兩個禮拜內提出一份報告啦部長有掌握這件事情嗎\n730474\t755956\t因為那個我都在救災所以如果我希望部長了解一下整個狀況好不好因為下個禮拜整個報告要出來我們要當地跟鄉親說明就是為什麼這樣的場具有這種高風險高危險的場為什麼會離市民這麼近經濟部的相關有沒有相關的審核的責任我的意思是說經濟部在你的園區內不要把這個東西直接丟給市政府有些部分該你們掌握的責任你們還是要掌握住就是\n756977\t780018\t高雄小港已經承受了相當多的一些高污染甚至高危險的一些產業而這個當時你看一燒起來以後是消防員是趕快逃出來三位如果沒有逃出來恐怕都很危險的所以那只能讓他繼續在那邊燒讓他燒燒到整個自然那個然後燒掉了26個小時燒了26個小時然後裡面產生了多少的一些\n780839\t804705\t有害的一些毒氣的部分當天的空污狀況其實是很糟的那我的意思是說我希望經濟部在未來在評估這些事情的時候要審慎思考至少離住宅區至少離人民要離得遠一點你不能夠在這麼近的區域雖然它是叫做臨海產業園區但是它旁邊就是居民很多的居民我們都在談大林埔遷村想把一些影響降到最低的結果我們現在又把這些具有高風險\n806055\t813647\t可能有影響的又放在人民的周邊這個是人民是很難接受的我希望經濟部在這件事情上未來要加強去做把關\n814690\t835667\t部長可以嗎 給我們一個承諾我們會加強來加強把關通知 幾乎該有的則也要訂進來但是報告委員 他進來的時候我們他是符合這個我們產業園區各種用地用途及使用規範辦法的第三條產業用地第一項規定為容許引進的產業部長 我就是希望請你們再去思考跟檢討\n836288\t852197\t是 我們會就第一個 燃燒了26個小時他的安全他的所有的周邊一定他的消防所有的一定出了一些問題包括他的狀況顯然超出了李明軒預期的狀況了他不是一般我們所熟悉的這些廠房同時他燃燒出來的是\n854048\t876914\t清氟酸有毒的這個是甚至於他有的有毒性的一些物質的這個周邊的居民其實都相當擔心的甚至於當天還有很多人說當天的空氣甚至當天的水他們都擔心這邊是有問題的報告委員那您那所這個指責的這個空氣品質監測我想我們都有設置這個空氣品質監測站\n878496\t902207\t那您剛所說的部分有害空氣污染物到目前為止我想我們都沒有發現有空污的問題部長我知道了裡面在場內有一度有監測到場內一度有監測到但是我要講的是即使是在周邊也都是這種的它的擴散效應等等我的意思是說那個只是一個最低最低的標準\n902887\t919174\t最低最低的標準啦這種東西放在離居民這麼近這件事情本身就有高度的爭議啦我還是要請部長思考不要完全的相信跟迷失在那所謂的監測站監測不是24小時監測監測也不是所有的周邊的點全部監測監測時\n921095\t941469\t拿出來測一下他永遠有 帶有很多的不確定性在那對我來說這件事情就是不你想啦 如果是在台北市的哪一個區域裡面願意接受這樣的東西嗎台北市的任何一個區域你告訴我願意接受這樣的東西嗎那如果不行的話請臨海公衛區用更 重新調整你們的標準\n942759\t966926\t重新調整表現 它這裡面會產生有毒的氣質 有毒的氣體即使是會產生有毒氣體的風險你說你沒有監測到 不代表沒有發生一度在場內是有監測到 一度在場內是有監測到監測了幾次 它不是24小時在監測 它不是隨時在監測我一直想 部長真的要將心比心站在周邊居民的角度來思考\n968556\t995026\t換作這個東西如果是在中正區有人有辦法接收這樣的事情嗎隔壁有辦法接收這樣的一個廠房嗎距離幾百公尺有辦法接收這樣的廠房所以我講的是請進一步要重新調整你們的標準要更嚴格的去檢視有些該進來的廠房標準同時也要提升他的安全性這一次我看來是一堆的問題我看到是一堆的問題我希望部長就在完畢之後花一點點時間了解這個案子好不好好的謝謝部長好謝謝\n","txt":"好主席請那個陳部長郭部長跟曾董事長郭部長陳部長我先問陳部長我先問一下部長\n我們現在這次的風災 我們都要求重優 重寬 重速 重減那有沒有達到這樣的一個原則我想第一個部分就是重速的部分 從過往的這些地方政府勘在這報上來 這個時間我們用主動公告的方式 事實上也至少節省了公告這段時間的大概從一個禮拜 節省到三天之內所以這些原則都掌握了\n苦民所苦啦就是人民當在現在這個風災的特別是這一次的雨特別是風超出原先的預期所以造成了相當大的一些災情我希望這個部分從寬從幽從速從簡這個原則一定要盡快而且接下來現在才七月而已還不知道還會遇到這樣我希望未來的原則都是把握這樣的原則我們一定是用同理心的角度去面對這樣因為時間有限然後接下來我問的是經費夠不夠\n接下來經費夠不夠我跟委員報告在天然災害救助基金在114年是大概是將近38億將近39億那我要跟委員報告在這次颱風之前已經用掉了22億左右\n換句話說年初開始有非常多的低溫已經造成了這些天然災害損失所以這一次的颱風一定是不夠的這一次已經不夠用絕對是不夠用的那農業部不夠用那怎麼辦這些經費怎麼辦我跟委員報告過去不夠用的話我們第一時間會去跟行政院爭取二倍金但是很可惜的這一次的立法院因為我們的公務\n撥補到基金的預算有被刪減那我在這邊特別強調一旦被刪減了以後我們就不能直接動資二倍金也就是說立法院藍白國會都刪減掉這個預算之後變成你們也無法動資因為立法院是不讓你們動資這些錢的所以連二倍金都無法動用是這樣嗎\n對 是根據相關的那個會計規定你只要刪了撥補的基金的經費部長那接下來呢 現在才7月而已颱風期有可能到9月10月都還有颱風那接下來遇到農民的災損的時候怎麼辦不過我想齁\n就算沒有辦法去凍飾二杯精那我們還是會想辦法用移緩季節或用其他的方式來爭取我這邊只要告訴我們所有的全國的農民齁不管怎麼樣天災我們農業部一定站在第一線跟他們在一起經費的部分我們一定會來想辦法所以雖然經費已經沒有了但是農業部還是會想辦法就對了對我們還是會去想辦法還是會想辦法請跟院長去找出方法出來好嗎好不好也跟立法院持續的溝通好不好\n應該要找到一些方法解決這個問題啦就是任何一個政黨執政都遇到天災但遇到天災的時候我們都希望支持現在每個國民黨的縣市首長也請求支援支持啊就現在經費這樣子狀況下你要國家怎麼做是怎麼來協助這些農民每個農民都希望每個受災民都希望政府來支持結果現在這樣狀態怎麼做\n我希望部長全力的來繼續跟院長院也跟包括國民兩黨持續溝通民進黨是全力支持的但是國民兩黨這一塊持續溝通什麼樣的有沒有什麼樣的方式能夠把這件事情能夠做一個妥善的解決好不好好接下來我請教一下部長跟曾董事長好嗎那個郭部長郭部長 曾董事長郭部長我請教一下一樣的問題從寬從幽從速從簡經濟部門有把持這樣的原則\n是的有照這樣在做嗎我們有照這樣在做好那經濟部的經費上面有沒有遇到問題我們現在就是就我們這個我們現在有一部分就是沒有\n不足的部分那我想我們跟農業部也是一樣就因為這是一個災難所以我們會想辦法把這個不足的經費盡量來這個爭取跟院長這邊爭取我再回來我待會再問一下部長好了我先問一下台電董事長好了好不好董事長\n這一次台電其實很辛苦啦 因為就像上次一樣 因為像高雄過去也遇到山坨等等那個風力之強 17級的風那個掃掉連電線桿直接把你掃斷那恐怕是很多人沒有看到是難以想像電線桿裡面還有鐵絲的 全部直接掃斷掉而且斷一整排的 因為不會只有那一支斷 其他全斷所以這一次從台南 從嘉義上來 其實造成了這個我們的電力上很大的一個重創\n我們的整個恢復了嗎 目前狀況恢復到什麼樣的狀態\n那個公園報告我們在禮拜六的晚上九點他就已經全部的恢復 都恢復了最晚的是在嘉義縣 因為嘉義縣是颱風登陸的地點我還是要謝謝 其實真的還是要謝謝台電啦齁其實台電的第一層的同仁每次在遇到這種風災我的選區都是在臨海區啦 前陣小港 旗津都是受風面第一排每一次只要發生狀況的時候第一線都是拚了命在救的\n颱風正大的時候 風雨正大的時候 台電的第一線員工都在第一線用命在救 救復電然後甚至還遇到很多是高壓電 甚至遇到是鐵板被吹起來壓在高壓電上面 還是要拼命的想辦法你不處理掉那些東西就是沒辦法復電所以是拼了命的在那個 那我想要講的是台電是國家的台電 台電是人民的台電\n上次的整個經費全部都給過唯獨就把台電的一千億整個扣下來其實坦白講我是覺得非常的難過啦就是說台電這次在支持台電就給台電更多的一些資源但是現在完全完全把那所謂的能源政策的問題全部把它丟給台電去丟包給台電去承擔我認為這個對台電是非常非常不公平台電的士氣也會受到很大的影響嘛我董事長接下來台電在這些財政上會不會有壓力\n我跟委員報告就是說因為其實災損的部分我們還要統計因為將近3500根電桿那其實我問一下台電這次這樣的損失大概會多少我們現在還在統計跟委員報告出估大概多少至少損失了多少\n應該有10億啦台電損失了10億以上應該有10億左右所以這個部分就台電又要擔起來就台電已經過去來政府因為扛住了整個動漲電價然後穩定物價的這些責任現在還在加10億上去那這還不包括很多人力上面的成本吧\n我們有全部都一起做一些統計跟估計大概是這樣但是我要跟委員報告現在是我們是損害掉的我們儘快能夠把它恢復但接下來的狀況是我相信今天一定很多委員問我們那接下來怎麼辦其實我們有在考慮接下來怎麼辦但剛才部長的報告也有提了大概的一些方向那這些其實都是需要因為電網的韌性需要投資需要經費而且其實這不是台灣的一個國家的問題\n全世界都遇到這樣子的問題最近很多的國際媒體報導各個國家都在增加電網的投資那增加電網的投資的經費有政府的補貼也有透過電價調整來反映的一大堆這種狀況我覺得我們只要稍微檢視一下外電大概都看得到\n特別是這些的很多的像過去以來比如像高雄很多因為防災型的關係所以我們努力的做了一些地下化甚至有些強韌的做法所以其實那個災情就會減少我認為這一次的整個沿海地區很多都必須要做更多的強化更正性這個都需要投入更多的一些資源\n後續的改善可能真的是會比較需要時間也需要更多的政府的各個單位來配合因為包含入權包含等等相關的狀況這個我們它當然資源是經費是一個非常重要的元素\n那我問一下台電這樣的話會不會有財務上的壓力如果遲遲的沒辦法撥補政府遲遲沒有辦法撥補其實這應該政府給的政策是政府在定的嘛那政府要求你不漲電價政府認為你們不應該希望穩定住民生的這個電價的時候不給你漲的時候那你承受了虧損那這個會不會有很大的壓力\n跟委員報告財務一直是台電的壓力那這會不會影響到台電的軍心士氣我跟委員報告就是說我們\n政府對於台電的一些經費上的支持是對台電的肯定跟鼓勵基本上肯定了台電事實上在整個國際燃料價格上漲的時候扛住了國內通膨的壓力我們一再說明世界上很多國家都在補貼很多國家調的因為大家都希望穩定住電價穩定住物價非常多的通貨膨脹因為一旦電價物價提升了之後造成了國家的整體損失是更大的嘛\n所以大家都是用這樣的策略在進行在處理的就唯獨台灣遇到一個非理性的國會的多數兩黨然後然後用這樣的方式來對待台電我希望董事長繼續努力了好不好這個然後另外鼓舞台電的同仁們這個我們會全力以赴再繼續在法院爭取這邊的軍隊台電來說台電的同仁把電網修復就是我們的責任我們一定會努力把這個工作做好我們也開始在討論後續強化的一些工作\n就是及早來規劃 我們全力來支持同時現在給予台電同仁更多的鼓勵啦 第一線特別是第一線的同仁 辛苦的同仁用命在幫大家復電的這些同仁 給他們更多的鼓勵我們一定會轉當 會想...部長 需要請教一下部長啦齁部長我還是要問一下齁 這個...\n大家現在關心這個美國的這個稅率的問題董事長請坐啦 董事長請坐非的問題現在大家擔心如果8月1號快要到了如果沒有談出一個結果出來的話會不會受到影響會不會被回復到這個32這樣的狀況部長現在談的最新狀況怎麼樣\n我們現在還在談判中嘛還在談判中 副院長到美國再次去談了嘛 是嗎這個是第四次嘛第四次去談了嘛 對不對那現在努力的朝向在10跟20之間去做努力嘛 是嗎是在這樣的目標下嗎我們始終是希望能夠談出一個對國內有利的這樣的一個稅率\n也做了各種的準備嘛一旦如果有任何狀況需要去支持各企業各什麼的也都做的準備我想我們的談判小組他們都有做充分的準備啦好我們期盼有好的結果那在8月1號前會談出來嗎這個結果8月1號美國他也有講嘛如果8月1號前沒有談到完整他也可以post form\n所以還是會有那個我想這個都還在不確定的這個這麼多不確定的因素所以我沒有辦法跟委員報告了解 談判過程當然必須要很多的機密但我希望就是一樣鼓勵我們的談判團隊持續的加油希望幫台灣爭取到最好的一些狀況也希望讓我們的產業讓我們的農民的衝擊降到最小再來我請教一下那個油煉糖水加薪這一塊長期我們也在講部長一樣都會支持吧\n我們當然是全力支持我指的也不只這些啦包括像中鋼、螳融、台船甚至漢翔等泛工股我也鼓勵其實都要支持啦因為這些都很辛苦他們也都我也認為國家應該由這些企業來帶頭調性來動整個薪資的上漲\n部長同意這樣的方向嗎我們大家一起努力好一起努力最後一個問題啦上次在小港的臨海園區裡面三元的能源發生的火災燃燒了26小時燒了26小時裡面甚至有造成了這個氫氧酸等等一些危險的物質我希望部長這已經我當時上禮拜一發生的我要求兩個禮拜內提出一份報告啦部長有掌握這件事情嗎\n因為那個我都在救災所以如果我希望部長了解一下整個狀況好不好因為下個禮拜整個報告要出來我們要當地跟鄉親說明就是為什麼這樣的場具有這種高風險高危險的場為什麼會離市民這麼近經濟部的相關有沒有相關的審核的責任我的意思是說經濟部在你的園區內不要把這個東西直接丟給市政府有些部分該你們掌握的責任你們還是要掌握住就是\n高雄小港已經承受了相當多的一些高污染甚至高危險的一些產業而這個當時你看一燒起來以後是消防員是趕快逃出來三位如果沒有逃出來恐怕都很危險的所以那只能讓他繼續在那邊燒讓他燒燒到整個自然那個然後燒掉了26個小時燒了26個小時然後裡面產生了多少的一些\n有害的一些毒氣的部分當天的空污狀況其實是很糟的那我的意思是說我希望經濟部在未來在評估這些事情的時候要審慎思考至少離住宅區至少離人民要離得遠一點你不能夠在這麼近的區域雖然它是叫做臨海產業園區但是它旁邊就是居民很多的居民我們都在談大林埔遷村想把一些影響降到最低的結果我們現在又把這些具有高風險\n可能有影響的又放在人民的周邊這個是人民是很難接受的我希望經濟部在這件事情上未來要加強去做把關\n部長可以嗎 給我們一個承諾我們會加強來加強把關通知 幾乎該有的則也要訂進來但是報告委員 他進來的時候我們他是符合這個我們產業園區各種用地用途及使用規範辦法的第三條產業用地第一項規定為容許引進的產業部長 我就是希望請你們再去思考跟檢討\n是 我們會就第一個 燃燒了26個小時他的安全他的所有的周邊一定他的消防所有的一定出了一些問題包括他的狀況顯然超出了李明軒預期的狀況了他不是一般我們所熟悉的這些廠房同時他燃燒出來的是\n清氟酸有毒的這個是甚至於他有的有毒性的一些物質的這個周邊的居民其實都相當擔心的甚至於當天還有很多人說當天的空氣甚至當天的水他們都擔心這邊是有問題的報告委員那您那所這個指責的這個空氣品質監測我想我們都有設置這個空氣品質監測站\n那您剛所說的部分有害空氣污染物到目前為止我想我們都沒有發現有空污的問題部長我知道了裡面在場內有一度有監測到場內一度有監測到但是我要講的是即使是在周邊也都是這種的它的擴散效應等等我的意思是說那個只是一個最低最低的標準\n最低最低的標準啦這種東西放在離居民這麼近這件事情本身就有高度的爭議啦我還是要請部長思考不要完全的相信跟迷失在那所謂的監測站監測不是24小時監測監測也不是所有的周邊的點全部監測監測時\n拿出來測一下他永遠有 帶有很多的不確定性在那對我來說這件事情就是不你想啦 如果是在台北市的哪一個區域裡面願意接受這樣的東西嗎台北市的任何一個區域你告訴我願意接受這樣的東西嗎那如果不行的話請臨海公衛區用更 重新調整你們的標準\n重新調整表現 它這裡面會產生有毒的氣質 有毒的氣體即使是會產生有毒氣體的風險你說你沒有監測到 不代表沒有發生一度在場內是有監測到 一度在場內是有監測到監測了幾次 它不是24小時在監測 它不是隨時在監測我一直想 部長真的要將心比心站在周邊居民的角度來思考\n換作這個東西如果是在中正區有人有辦法接收這樣的事情嗎隔壁有辦法接收這樣的一個廠房嗎距離幾百公尺有辦法接收這樣的廠房所以我講的是請進一步要重新調整你們的標準要更嚴格的去檢視有些該進來的廠房標準同時也要提升他的安全性這一次我看來是一堆的問題我看到是一堆的問題我希望部長就在完畢之後花一點點時間了解這個案子好不好好的謝謝部長好謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:02.386 --> 00:12.505\n好主席請那個陳部長郭部長跟曾董事長郭部長陳部長我先問陳部長我先問一下部長\n\n00:16.450 --> 00:40.808\n我們現在這次的風災我們都要求重優重寬重速重減那有沒有達到這樣的一個原則我想第一個部分就是重速的部分從過往的這些地方政府勘在這報上來這個時間我們用主動公告的方式事實上也至少節省了公告這段時間的大概從一個禮拜節省到三天之內所以這些原則都掌握了\n\n00:42.149 --> 01:08.495\n苦民所苦啦就是人民當在現在這個風災的特別是這一次的雨特別是風超出原先的預期所以造成了相當大的一些災情我希望這個部分從寬從幽從速從簡這個原則一定要盡快而且接下來現在才七月而已還不知道還會遇到這樣我希望未來的原則都是把握這樣的原則我們一定是用同理心的角度去面對這樣因為時間有限然後接下來我問的是經費夠不夠\n\n01:10.103 --> 01:23.268\n接下來經費夠不夠我跟委員報告在天然災害救助基金在114年是大概是將近38億將近39億那我要跟委員報告在這次颱風之前已經用掉了22億左右\n\n01:25.339 --> 01:48.200\n換句話說年初開始有非常多的低溫已經造成了這些天然災害損失所以這一次的颱風一定是不夠的這一次已經不夠用絕對是不夠用的那農業部不夠用那怎麼辦這些經費怎麼辦我跟委員報告過去不夠用的話我們第一時間會去跟行政院爭取二倍金但是很可惜的這一次的立法院因為我們的公務\n\n01:49.241 --> 02:07.340\n撥補到基金的預算有被刪減那我在這邊特別強調一旦被刪減了以後我們就不能直接動資二倍金也就是說立法院藍白國會都刪減掉這個預算之後變成你們也無法動資因為立法院是不讓你們動資這些錢的所以連二倍金都無法動用是這樣嗎\n\n02:08.141 --> 02:22.636\n對是根據相關的那個會計規定你只要刪了撥補的基金的經費部長那接下來呢現在才7月而已颱風期有可能到9月10月都還有颱風那接下來遇到農民的災損的時候怎麼辦不過我想齁\n\n02:23.477 --> 02:51.196\n就算沒有辦法去凍飾二杯精那我們還是會想辦法用移緩季節或用其他的方式來爭取我這邊只要告訴我們所有的全國的農民齁不管怎麼樣天災我們農業部一定站在第一線跟他們在一起經費的部分我們一定會來想辦法所以雖然經費已經沒有了但是農業部還是會想辦法就對了對我們還是會去想辦法還是會想辦法請跟院長去找出方法出來好嗎好不好也跟立法院持續的溝通好不好\n\n02:51.636 --> 03:10.228\n應該要找到一些方法解決這個問題啦就是任何一個政黨執政都遇到天災但遇到天災的時候我們都希望支持現在每個國民黨的縣市首長也請求支援支持啊就現在經費這樣子狀況下你要國家怎麼做是怎麼來協助這些農民每個農民都希望每個受災民都希望政府來支持結果現在這樣狀態怎麼做\n\n03:12.076 --> 03:36.551\n我希望部長全力的來繼續跟院長院也跟包括國民兩黨持續溝通民進黨是全力支持的但是國民兩黨這一塊持續溝通什麼樣的有沒有什麼樣的方式能夠把這件事情能夠做一個妥善的解決好不好好接下來我請教一下部長跟曾董事長好嗎那個郭部長郭部長曾董事長郭部長我請教一下一樣的問題從寬從幽從速從簡經濟部門有把持這樣的原則\n\n03:42.601 --> 03:59.658\n是的有照這樣在做嗎我們有照這樣在做好那經濟部的經費上面有沒有遇到問題我們現在就是就我們這個我們現在有一部分就是沒有\n\n04:01.055 --> 04:19.208\n不足的部分那我想我們跟農業部也是一樣就因為這是一個災難所以我們會想辦法把這個不足的經費盡量來這個爭取跟院長這邊爭取我再回來我待會再問一下部長好了我先問一下台電董事長好了好不好董事長\n\n04:21.039 --> 04:49.920\n這一次台電其實很辛苦啦因為就像上次一樣因為像高雄過去也遇到山坨等等那個風力之強17級的風那個掃掉連電線桿直接把你掃斷那恐怕是很多人沒有看到是難以想像電線桿裡面還有鐵絲的全部直接掃斷掉而且斷一整排的因為不會只有那一支斷其他全斷所以這一次從台南從嘉義上來其實造成了這個我們的電力上很大的一個重創\n\n04:52.088 --> 04:54.177\n我們的整個恢復了嗎目前狀況恢復到什麼樣的狀態\n\n04:55.134 --> 05:20.947\n那個公園報告我們在禮拜六的晚上九點他就已經全部的恢復都恢復了最晚的是在嘉義縣因為嘉義縣是颱風登陸的地點我還是要謝謝其實真的還是要謝謝台電啦齁其實台電的第一層的同仁每次在遇到這種風災我的選區都是在臨海區啦前陣小港旗津都是受風面第一排每一次只要發生狀況的時候第一線都是拚了命在救的\n\n05:22.227 --> 05:44.886\n颱風正大的時候風雨正大的時候台電的第一線員工都在第一線用命在救救復電然後甚至還遇到很多是高壓電甚至遇到是鐵板被吹起來壓在高壓電上面還是要拼命的想辦法你不處理掉那些東西就是沒辦法復電所以是拼了命的在那個那我想要講的是台電是國家的台電台電是人民的台電\n\n05:46.664 --> 06:15.104\n上次的整個經費全部都給過唯獨就把台電的一千億整個扣下來其實坦白講我是覺得非常的難過啦就是說台電這次在支持台電就給台電更多的一些資源但是現在完全完全把那所謂的能源政策的問題全部把它丟給台電去丟包給台電去承擔我認為這個對台電是非常非常不公平台電的士氣也會受到很大的影響嘛我董事長接下來台電在這些財政上會不會有壓力\n\n06:16.971 --> 06:33.522\n我跟委員報告就是說因為其實災損的部分我們還要統計因為將近3500根電桿那其實我問一下台電這次這樣的損失大概會多少我們現在還在統計跟委員報告出估大概多少至少損失了多少\n\n06:34.851 --> 06:53.659\n應該有10億啦台電損失了10億以上應該有10億左右所以這個部分就台電又要擔起來就台電已經過去來政府因為扛住了整個動漲電價然後穩定物價的這些責任現在還在加10億上去那這還不包括很多人力上面的成本吧\n\n06:55.240 --> 07:22.965\n我們有全部都一起做一些統計跟估計大概是這樣但是我要跟委員報告現在是我們是損害掉的我們儘快能夠把它恢復但接下來的狀況是我相信今天一定很多委員問我們那接下來怎麼辦其實我們有在考慮接下來怎麼辦但剛才部長的報告也有提了大概的一些方向那這些其實都是需要因為電網的韌性需要投資需要經費而且其實這不是台灣的一個國家的問題\n\n07:24.105 --> 07:41.481\n全世界都遇到這樣子的問題最近很多的國際媒體報導各個國家都在增加電網的投資那增加電網的投資的經費有政府的補貼也有透過電價調整來反映的一大堆這種狀況我覺得我們只要稍微檢視一下外電大概都看得到\n\n07:42.262 --> 07:59.859\n特別是這些的很多的像過去以來比如像高雄很多因為防災型的關係所以我們努力的做了一些地下化甚至有些強韌的做法所以其實那個災情就會減少我認為這一次的整個沿海地區很多都必須要做更多的強化更正性這個都需要投入更多的一些資源\n\n08:00.579 --> 08:15.809\n後續的改善可能真的是會比較需要時間也需要更多的政府的各個單位來配合因為包含入權包含等等相關的狀況這個我們它當然資源是經費是一個非常重要的元素\n\n08:16.109 --> 08:34.905\n那我問一下台電這樣的話會不會有財務上的壓力如果遲遲的沒辦法撥補政府遲遲沒有辦法撥補其實這應該政府給的政策是政府在定的嘛那政府要求你不漲電價政府認為你們不應該希望穩定住民生的這個電價的時候不給你漲的時候那你承受了虧損那這個會不會有很大的壓力\n\n08:36.380 --> 08:41.305\n跟委員報告財務一直是台電的壓力那這會不會影響到台電的軍心士氣我跟委員報告就是說我們\n\n08:48.564 --> 09:16.773\n政府對於台電的一些經費上的支持是對台電的肯定跟鼓勵基本上肯定了台電事實上在整個國際燃料價格上漲的時候扛住了國內通膨的壓力我們一再說明世界上很多國家都在補貼很多國家調的因為大家都希望穩定住電價穩定住物價非常多的通貨膨脹因為一旦電價物價提升了之後造成了國家的整體損失是更大的嘛\n\n09:17.594 --> 09:46.721\n所以大家都是用這樣的策略在進行在處理的就唯獨台灣遇到一個非理性的國會的多數兩黨然後然後用這樣的方式來對待台電我希望董事長繼續努力了好不好這個然後另外鼓舞台電的同仁們這個我們會全力以赴再繼續在法院爭取這邊的軍隊台電來說台電的同仁把電網修復就是我們的責任我們一定會努力把這個工作做好我們也開始在討論後續強化的一些工作\n\n09:47.401 --> 09:59.810\n就是及早來規劃我們全力來支持同時現在給予台電同仁更多的鼓勵啦第一線特別是第一線的同仁辛苦的同仁用命在幫大家復電的這些同仁給他們更多的鼓勵我們一定會轉當會想...部長需要請教一下部長啦齁部長我還是要問一下齁這個...\n\n10:04.400 --> 10:18.380\n大家現在關心這個美國的這個稅率的問題董事長請坐啦董事長請坐非的問題現在大家擔心如果8月1號快要到了如果沒有談出一個結果出來的話會不會受到影響會不會被回復到這個32這樣的狀況部長現在談的最新狀況怎麼樣\n\n10:21.324 --> 10:41.289\n我們現在還在談判中嘛還在談判中副院長到美國再次去談了嘛是嗎這個是第四次嘛第四次去談了嘛對不對那現在努力的朝向在10跟20之間去做努力嘛是嗎是在這樣的目標下嗎我們始終是希望能夠談出一個對國內有利的這樣的一個稅率\n\n10:43.275 --> 11:03.732\n也做了各種的準備嘛一旦如果有任何狀況需要去支持各企業各什麼的也都做的準備我想我們的談判小組他們都有做充分的準備啦好我們期盼有好的結果那在8月1號前會談出來嗎這個結果8月1號美國他也有講嘛如果8月1號前沒有談到完整他也可以postform\n\n11:04.312 --> 11:29.294\n所以還是會有那個我想這個都還在不確定的這個這麼多不確定的因素所以我沒有辦法跟委員報告了解談判過程當然必須要很多的機密但我希望就是一樣鼓勵我們的談判團隊持續的加油希望幫台灣爭取到最好的一些狀況也希望讓我們的產業讓我們的農民的衝擊降到最小再來我請教一下那個油煉糖水加薪這一塊長期我們也在講部長一樣都會支持吧\n\n11:29.975 --> 11:42.047\n我們當然是全力支持我指的也不只這些啦包括像中鋼、螳融、台船甚至漢翔等泛工股我也鼓勵其實都要支持啦因為這些都很辛苦他們也都我也認為國家應該由這些企業來帶頭調性來動整個薪資的上漲\n\n11:46.331 --> 12:09.113\n部長同意這樣的方向嗎我們大家一起努力好一起努力最後一個問題啦上次在小港的臨海園區裡面三元的能源發生的火災燃燒了26小時燒了26小時裡面甚至有造成了這個氫氧酸等等一些危險的物質我希望部長這已經我當時上禮拜一發生的我要求兩個禮拜內提出一份報告啦部長有掌握這件事情嗎\n\n12:10.474 --> 12:35.956\n因為那個我都在救災所以如果我希望部長了解一下整個狀況好不好因為下個禮拜整個報告要出來我們要當地跟鄉親說明就是為什麼這樣的場具有這種高風險高危險的場為什麼會離市民這麼近經濟部的相關有沒有相關的審核的責任我的意思是說經濟部在你的園區內不要把這個東西直接丟給市政府有些部分該你們掌握的責任你們還是要掌握住就是\n\n12:36.977 --> 13:00.018\n高雄小港已經承受了相當多的一些高污染甚至高危險的一些產業而這個當時你看一燒起來以後是消防員是趕快逃出來三位如果沒有逃出來恐怕都很危險的所以那只能讓他繼續在那邊燒讓他燒燒到整個自然那個然後燒掉了26個小時燒了26個小時然後裡面產生了多少的一些\n\n13:00.839 --> 13:24.705\n有害的一些毒氣的部分當天的空污狀況其實是很糟的那我的意思是說我希望經濟部在未來在評估這些事情的時候要審慎思考至少離住宅區至少離人民要離得遠一點你不能夠在這麼近的區域雖然它是叫做臨海產業園區但是它旁邊就是居民很多的居民我們都在談大林埔遷村想把一些影響降到最低的結果我們現在又把這些具有高風險\n\n13:26.055 --> 13:33.647\n可能有影響的又放在人民的周邊這個是人民是很難接受的我希望經濟部在這件事情上未來要加強去做把關\n\n13:34.690 --> 13:55.667\n部長可以嗎給我們一個承諾我們會加強來加強把關通知幾乎該有的則也要訂進來但是報告委員他進來的時候我們他是符合這個我們產業園區各種用地用途及使用規範辦法的第三條產業用地第一項規定為容許引進的產業部長我就是希望請你們再去思考跟檢討\n\n13:56.288 --> 14:12.197\n是我們會就第一個燃燒了26個小時他的安全他的所有的周邊一定他的消防所有的一定出了一些問題包括他的狀況顯然超出了李明軒預期的狀況了他不是一般我們所熟悉的這些廠房同時他燃燒出來的是\n\n14:14.048 --> 14:36.914\n清氟酸有毒的這個是甚至於他有的有毒性的一些物質的這個周邊的居民其實都相當擔心的甚至於當天還有很多人說當天的空氣甚至當天的水他們都擔心這邊是有問題的報告委員那您那所這個指責的這個空氣品質監測我想我們都有設置這個空氣品質監測站\n\n14:38.496 --> 15:02.207\n那您剛所說的部分有害空氣污染物到目前為止我想我們都沒有發現有空污的問題部長我知道了裡面在場內有一度有監測到場內一度有監測到但是我要講的是即使是在周邊也都是這種的它的擴散效應等等我的意思是說那個只是一個最低最低的標準\n\n15:02.887 --> 15:19.174\n最低最低的標準啦這種東西放在離居民這麼近這件事情本身就有高度的爭議啦我還是要請部長思考不要完全的相信跟迷失在那所謂的監測站監測不是24小時監測監測也不是所有的周邊的點全部監測監測時\n\n15:21.095 --> 15:41.469\n拿出來測一下他永遠有帶有很多的不確定性在那對我來說這件事情就是不你想啦如果是在台北市的哪一個區域裡面願意接受這樣的東西嗎台北市的任何一個區域你告訴我願意接受這樣的東西嗎那如果不行的話請臨海公衛區用更重新調整你們的標準\n\n15:42.759 --> 16:06.926\n重新調整表現它這裡面會產生有毒的氣質有毒的氣體即使是會產生有毒氣體的風險你說你沒有監測到不代表沒有發生一度在場內是有監測到一度在場內是有監測到監測了幾次它不是24小時在監測它不是隨時在監測我一直想部長真的要將心比心站在周邊居民的角度來思考\n\n16:08.556 --> 16:35.026\n換作這個東西如果是在中正區有人有辦法接收這樣的事情嗎隔壁有辦法接收這樣的一個廠房嗎距離幾百公尺有辦法接收這樣的廠房所以我講的是請進一步要重新調整你們的標準要更嚴格的去檢視有些該進來的廠房標準同時也要提升他的安全性這一次我看來是一堆的問題我看到是一堆的問題我希望部長就在完畢之後花一點點時間了解這個案子好不好好的謝謝部長好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":2.386,"end":12.505,"text":"好主席請那個陳部長郭部長跟曾董事長郭部長陳部長我先問陳部長我先問一下部長"},{"start":16.45,"end":40.808,"text":"我們現在這次的風災 我們都要求重優 重寬 重速 重減那有沒有達到這樣的一個原則我想第一個部分就是重速的部分 從過往的這些地方政府勘在這報上來 這個時間我們用主動公告的方式 事實上也至少節省了公告這段時間的大概從一個禮拜 節省到三天之內所以這些原則都掌握了"},{"start":42.149,"end":68.495,"text":"苦民所苦啦就是人民當在現在這個風災的特別是這一次的雨特別是風超出原先的預期所以造成了相當大的一些災情我希望這個部分從寬從幽從速從簡這個原則一定要盡快而且接下來現在才七月而已還不知道還會遇到這樣我希望未來的原則都是把握這樣的原則我們一定是用同理心的角度去面對這樣因為時間有限然後接下來我問的是經費夠不夠"},{"start":70.103,"end":83.268,"text":"接下來經費夠不夠我跟委員報告在天然災害救助基金在114年是大概是將近38億將近39億那我要跟委員報告在這次颱風之前已經用掉了22億左右"},{"start":85.339,"end":108.2,"text":"換句話說年初開始有非常多的低溫已經造成了這些天然災害損失所以這一次的颱風一定是不夠的這一次已經不夠用絕對是不夠用的那農業部不夠用那怎麼辦這些經費怎麼辦我跟委員報告過去不夠用的話我們第一時間會去跟行政院爭取二倍金但是很可惜的這一次的立法院因為我們的公務"},{"start":109.241,"end":127.34,"text":"撥補到基金的預算有被刪減那我在這邊特別強調一旦被刪減了以後我們就不能直接動資二倍金也就是說立法院藍白國會都刪減掉這個預算之後變成你們也無法動資因為立法院是不讓你們動資這些錢的所以連二倍金都無法動用是這樣嗎"},{"start":128.141,"end":142.636,"text":"對 是根據相關的那個會計規定你只要刪了撥補的基金的經費部長那接下來呢 現在才7月而已颱風期有可能到9月10月都還有颱風那接下來遇到農民的災損的時候怎麼辦不過我想齁"},{"start":143.477,"end":171.196,"text":"就算沒有辦法去凍飾二杯精那我們還是會想辦法用移緩季節或用其他的方式來爭取我這邊只要告訴我們所有的全國的農民齁不管怎麼樣天災我們農業部一定站在第一線跟他們在一起經費的部分我們一定會來想辦法所以雖然經費已經沒有了但是農業部還是會想辦法就對了對我們還是會去想辦法還是會想辦法請跟院長去找出方法出來好嗎好不好也跟立法院持續的溝通好不好"},{"start":171.636,"end":190.228,"text":"應該要找到一些方法解決這個問題啦就是任何一個政黨執政都遇到天災但遇到天災的時候我們都希望支持現在每個國民黨的縣市首長也請求支援支持啊就現在經費這樣子狀況下你要國家怎麼做是怎麼來協助這些農民每個農民都希望每個受災民都希望政府來支持結果現在這樣狀態怎麼做"},{"start":192.076,"end":216.551,"text":"我希望部長全力的來繼續跟院長院也跟包括國民兩黨持續溝通民進黨是全力支持的但是國民兩黨這一塊持續溝通什麼樣的有沒有什麼樣的方式能夠把這件事情能夠做一個妥善的解決好不好好接下來我請教一下部長跟曾董事長好嗎那個郭部長郭部長 曾董事長郭部長我請教一下一樣的問題從寬從幽從速從簡經濟部門有把持這樣的原則"},{"start":222.601,"end":239.658,"text":"是的有照這樣在做嗎我們有照這樣在做好那經濟部的經費上面有沒有遇到問題我們現在就是就我們這個我們現在有一部分就是沒有"},{"start":241.055,"end":259.208,"text":"不足的部分那我想我們跟農業部也是一樣就因為這是一個災難所以我們會想辦法把這個不足的經費盡量來這個爭取跟院長這邊爭取我再回來我待會再問一下部長好了我先問一下台電董事長好了好不好董事長"},{"start":261.039,"end":289.92,"text":"這一次台電其實很辛苦啦 因為就像上次一樣 因為像高雄過去也遇到山坨等等那個風力之強 17級的風那個掃掉連電線桿直接把你掃斷那恐怕是很多人沒有看到是難以想像電線桿裡面還有鐵絲的 全部直接掃斷掉而且斷一整排的 因為不會只有那一支斷 其他全斷所以這一次從台南 從嘉義上來 其實造成了這個我們的電力上很大的一個重創"},{"start":292.088,"end":294.177,"text":"我們的整個恢復了嗎 目前狀況恢復到什麼樣的狀態"},{"start":295.134,"end":320.947,"text":"那個公園報告我們在禮拜六的晚上九點他就已經全部的恢復 都恢復了最晚的是在嘉義縣 因為嘉義縣是颱風登陸的地點我還是要謝謝 其實真的還是要謝謝台電啦齁其實台電的第一層的同仁每次在遇到這種風災我的選區都是在臨海區啦 前陣小港 旗津都是受風面第一排每一次只要發生狀況的時候第一線都是拚了命在救的"},{"start":322.227,"end":344.886,"text":"颱風正大的時候 風雨正大的時候 台電的第一線員工都在第一線用命在救 救復電然後甚至還遇到很多是高壓電 甚至遇到是鐵板被吹起來壓在高壓電上面 還是要拼命的想辦法你不處理掉那些東西就是沒辦法復電所以是拼了命的在那個 那我想要講的是台電是國家的台電 台電是人民的台電"},{"start":346.664,"end":375.104,"text":"上次的整個經費全部都給過唯獨就把台電的一千億整個扣下來其實坦白講我是覺得非常的難過啦就是說台電這次在支持台電就給台電更多的一些資源但是現在完全完全把那所謂的能源政策的問題全部把它丟給台電去丟包給台電去承擔我認為這個對台電是非常非常不公平台電的士氣也會受到很大的影響嘛我董事長接下來台電在這些財政上會不會有壓力"},{"start":376.971,"end":393.522,"text":"我跟委員報告就是說因為其實災損的部分我們還要統計因為將近3500根電桿那其實我問一下台電這次這樣的損失大概會多少我們現在還在統計跟委員報告出估大概多少至少損失了多少"},{"start":394.851,"end":413.659,"text":"應該有10億啦台電損失了10億以上應該有10億左右所以這個部分就台電又要擔起來就台電已經過去來政府因為扛住了整個動漲電價然後穩定物價的這些責任現在還在加10億上去那這還不包括很多人力上面的成本吧"},{"start":415.24,"end":442.965,"text":"我們有全部都一起做一些統計跟估計大概是這樣但是我要跟委員報告現在是我們是損害掉的我們儘快能夠把它恢復但接下來的狀況是我相信今天一定很多委員問我們那接下來怎麼辦其實我們有在考慮接下來怎麼辦但剛才部長的報告也有提了大概的一些方向那這些其實都是需要因為電網的韌性需要投資需要經費而且其實這不是台灣的一個國家的問題"},{"start":444.105,"end":461.481,"text":"全世界都遇到這樣子的問題最近很多的國際媒體報導各個國家都在增加電網的投資那增加電網的投資的經費有政府的補貼也有透過電價調整來反映的一大堆這種狀況我覺得我們只要稍微檢視一下外電大概都看得到"},{"start":462.262,"end":479.859,"text":"特別是這些的很多的像過去以來比如像高雄很多因為防災型的關係所以我們努力的做了一些地下化甚至有些強韌的做法所以其實那個災情就會減少我認為這一次的整個沿海地區很多都必須要做更多的強化更正性這個都需要投入更多的一些資源"},{"start":480.579,"end":495.809,"text":"後續的改善可能真的是會比較需要時間也需要更多的政府的各個單位來配合因為包含入權包含等等相關的狀況這個我們它當然資源是經費是一個非常重要的元素"},{"start":496.109,"end":514.905,"text":"那我問一下台電這樣的話會不會有財務上的壓力如果遲遲的沒辦法撥補政府遲遲沒有辦法撥補其實這應該政府給的政策是政府在定的嘛那政府要求你不漲電價政府認為你們不應該希望穩定住民生的這個電價的時候不給你漲的時候那你承受了虧損那這個會不會有很大的壓力"},{"start":516.38,"end":521.305,"text":"跟委員報告財務一直是台電的壓力那這會不會影響到台電的軍心士氣我跟委員報告就是說我們"},{"start":528.564,"end":556.773,"text":"政府對於台電的一些經費上的支持是對台電的肯定跟鼓勵基本上肯定了台電事實上在整個國際燃料價格上漲的時候扛住了國內通膨的壓力我們一再說明世界上很多國家都在補貼很多國家調的因為大家都希望穩定住電價穩定住物價非常多的通貨膨脹因為一旦電價物價提升了之後造成了國家的整體損失是更大的嘛"},{"start":557.594,"end":586.721,"text":"所以大家都是用這樣的策略在進行在處理的就唯獨台灣遇到一個非理性的國會的多數兩黨然後然後用這樣的方式來對待台電我希望董事長繼續努力了好不好這個然後另外鼓舞台電的同仁們這個我們會全力以赴再繼續在法院爭取這邊的軍隊台電來說台電的同仁把電網修復就是我們的責任我們一定會努力把這個工作做好我們也開始在討論後續強化的一些工作"},{"start":587.401,"end":599.81,"text":"就是及早來規劃 我們全力來支持同時現在給予台電同仁更多的鼓勵啦 第一線特別是第一線的同仁 辛苦的同仁用命在幫大家復電的這些同仁 給他們更多的鼓勵我們一定會轉當 會想...部長 需要請教一下部長啦齁部長我還是要問一下齁 這個..."},{"start":604.4,"end":618.38,"text":"大家現在關心這個美國的這個稅率的問題董事長請坐啦 董事長請坐非的問題現在大家擔心如果8月1號快要到了如果沒有談出一個結果出來的話會不會受到影響會不會被回復到這個32這樣的狀況部長現在談的最新狀況怎麼樣"},{"start":621.324,"end":641.289,"text":"我們現在還在談判中嘛還在談判中 副院長到美國再次去談了嘛 是嗎這個是第四次嘛第四次去談了嘛 對不對那現在努力的朝向在10跟20之間去做努力嘛 是嗎是在這樣的目標下嗎我們始終是希望能夠談出一個對國內有利的這樣的一個稅率"},{"start":643.275,"end":663.732,"text":"也做了各種的準備嘛一旦如果有任何狀況需要去支持各企業各什麼的也都做的準備我想我們的談判小組他們都有做充分的準備啦好我們期盼有好的結果那在8月1號前會談出來嗎這個結果8月1號美國他也有講嘛如果8月1號前沒有談到完整他也可以post form"},{"start":664.312,"end":689.294,"text":"所以還是會有那個我想這個都還在不確定的這個這麼多不確定的因素所以我沒有辦法跟委員報告了解 談判過程當然必須要很多的機密但我希望就是一樣鼓勵我們的談判團隊持續的加油希望幫台灣爭取到最好的一些狀況也希望讓我們的產業讓我們的農民的衝擊降到最小再來我請教一下那個油煉糖水加薪這一塊長期我們也在講部長一樣都會支持吧"},{"start":689.975,"end":702.047,"text":"我們當然是全力支持我指的也不只這些啦包括像中鋼、螳融、台船甚至漢翔等泛工股我也鼓勵其實都要支持啦因為這些都很辛苦他們也都我也認為國家應該由這些企業來帶頭調性來動整個薪資的上漲"},{"start":706.331,"end":729.113,"text":"部長同意這樣的方向嗎我們大家一起努力好一起努力最後一個問題啦上次在小港的臨海園區裡面三元的能源發生的火災燃燒了26小時燒了26小時裡面甚至有造成了這個氫氧酸等等一些危險的物質我希望部長這已經我當時上禮拜一發生的我要求兩個禮拜內提出一份報告啦部長有掌握這件事情嗎"},{"start":730.474,"end":755.956,"text":"因為那個我都在救災所以如果我希望部長了解一下整個狀況好不好因為下個禮拜整個報告要出來我們要當地跟鄉親說明就是為什麼這樣的場具有這種高風險高危險的場為什麼會離市民這麼近經濟部的相關有沒有相關的審核的責任我的意思是說經濟部在你的園區內不要把這個東西直接丟給市政府有些部分該你們掌握的責任你們還是要掌握住就是"},{"start":756.977,"end":780.018,"text":"高雄小港已經承受了相當多的一些高污染甚至高危險的一些產業而這個當時你看一燒起來以後是消防員是趕快逃出來三位如果沒有逃出來恐怕都很危險的所以那只能讓他繼續在那邊燒讓他燒燒到整個自然那個然後燒掉了26個小時燒了26個小時然後裡面產生了多少的一些"},{"start":780.839,"end":804.705,"text":"有害的一些毒氣的部分當天的空污狀況其實是很糟的那我的意思是說我希望經濟部在未來在評估這些事情的時候要審慎思考至少離住宅區至少離人民要離得遠一點你不能夠在這麼近的區域雖然它是叫做臨海產業園區但是它旁邊就是居民很多的居民我們都在談大林埔遷村想把一些影響降到最低的結果我們現在又把這些具有高風險"},{"start":806.055,"end":813.647,"text":"可能有影響的又放在人民的周邊這個是人民是很難接受的我希望經濟部在這件事情上未來要加強去做把關"},{"start":814.69,"end":835.667,"text":"部長可以嗎 給我們一個承諾我們會加強來加強把關通知 幾乎該有的則也要訂進來但是報告委員 他進來的時候我們他是符合這個我們產業園區各種用地用途及使用規範辦法的第三條產業用地第一項規定為容許引進的產業部長 我就是希望請你們再去思考跟檢討"},{"start":836.288,"end":852.197,"text":"是 我們會就第一個 燃燒了26個小時他的安全他的所有的周邊一定他的消防所有的一定出了一些問題包括他的狀況顯然超出了李明軒預期的狀況了他不是一般我們所熟悉的這些廠房同時他燃燒出來的是"},{"start":854.048,"end":876.914,"text":"清氟酸有毒的這個是甚至於他有的有毒性的一些物質的這個周邊的居民其實都相當擔心的甚至於當天還有很多人說當天的空氣甚至當天的水他們都擔心這邊是有問題的報告委員那您那所這個指責的這個空氣品質監測我想我們都有設置這個空氣品質監測站"},{"start":878.496,"end":902.207,"text":"那您剛所說的部分有害空氣污染物到目前為止我想我們都沒有發現有空污的問題部長我知道了裡面在場內有一度有監測到場內一度有監測到但是我要講的是即使是在周邊也都是這種的它的擴散效應等等我的意思是說那個只是一個最低最低的標準"},{"start":902.887,"end":919.174,"text":"最低最低的標準啦這種東西放在離居民這麼近這件事情本身就有高度的爭議啦我還是要請部長思考不要完全的相信跟迷失在那所謂的監測站監測不是24小時監測監測也不是所有的周邊的點全部監測監測時"},{"start":921.095,"end":941.469,"text":"拿出來測一下他永遠有 帶有很多的不確定性在那對我來說這件事情就是不你想啦 如果是在台北市的哪一個區域裡面願意接受這樣的東西嗎台北市的任何一個區域你告訴我願意接受這樣的東西嗎那如果不行的話請臨海公衛區用更 重新調整你們的標準"},{"start":942.759,"end":966.926,"text":"重新調整表現 它這裡面會產生有毒的氣質 有毒的氣體即使是會產生有毒氣體的風險你說你沒有監測到 不代表沒有發生一度在場內是有監測到 一度在場內是有監測到監測了幾次 它不是24小時在監測 它不是隨時在監測我一直想 部長真的要將心比心站在周邊居民的角度來思考"},{"start":968.556,"end":995.026,"text":"換作這個東西如果是在中正區有人有辦法接收這樣的事情嗎隔壁有辦法接收這樣的一個廠房嗎距離幾百公尺有辦法接收這樣的廠房所以我講的是請進一步要重新調整你們的標準要更嚴格的去檢視有些該進來的廠房標準同時也要提升他的安全性這一次我看來是一堆的問題我看到是一堆的問題我希望部長就在完畢之後花一點點時間了解這個案子好不好好的謝謝部長好謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":206,"blocks":[["賴委員瑞隆：（9時37分）主席，請陳部長、郭部長跟曾董事長。"],["主席：請郭部長、陳部長。"],["賴委員瑞隆：我先問一下陳部長。部長，我們這次的風災，我們要求從優、從寬、從速、從簡，有沒有達到這樣的原則？"],["陳部長駿季：第一個部分就是從速的部分，從過往的這些地方政府勘災，再報上來的這個時間，我們用主動公告的方式，事實上節省公告這段時間，從1個禮拜大概節省到3天之內。"],["賴委員瑞隆：所以這些原則都有掌握？"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["賴委員瑞隆：苦民所苦，人民受風災的影響，特別是這次的雨、風超出了原先的預期，所以造成了相當大的一些災情，我希望這個部分從寬、從優、從速、從簡，這個原則一定要儘快處理，而且現在才7月而已，還不知道會遇到怎樣的災害，我希望未來都是把握這樣的原則。"],["陳部長駿季：會，我們一定是用同理心的角度去面對這樣的問題。"],["賴委員瑞隆：好，因為時間有限，我接著要問的是，接下來的經費夠不夠？"],["陳部長駿季：跟委員報告，天然災害救助金在114年大概38億將近39億，我要跟委員報告，在這次颱風之前，已經用掉了22億左右，換句話說，年初開始有非常多的低溫已經造成了天然災害的損失，所以這一次的颱風一定是不夠的。"],["賴委員瑞隆：這一次已經不夠用？"],["陳部長駿季：絕對是不夠用的。"],["賴委員瑞隆：農業部不夠用，這些經費怎麼辦？"],["陳部長駿季：跟委員報告，過去不夠用的話，我們第一時間會去跟行政院爭取二備金，但是很可惜的，立法院這一次，因為我們的公務撥補到基金的預算有被刪減，我在這邊特別強調，一旦被刪減了以後，我們就不能直接動支二備金。"],["賴委員瑞隆：也就是說，立法院藍白國會都刪減掉這個預算之後，變成你們也無法動支，因為立法院是不讓你們動支這些錢的，所以連二備金都無法動用，是這樣嗎？"],["陳部長駿季：對，這是根據相關的會計規定，你只要刪了撥補基金的經費，就不能動二備金。"],["賴委員瑞隆：部長，接下來呢？現在才7月而已，颱風期有可能到9月、10月都還有颱風，接下來遇到農民災損的時候怎麼辦？"],["陳部長駿季：不過我想，就算沒有辦法去動二備金，我們還是會想辦法用移緩濟急，或用其他的方式來爭取，我要告訴我們所有全國的農民，不管怎麼樣，天災我們農業部一定站在第一線，跟他們在一起，經費的部分，我們一定會來想辦法。"],["賴委員瑞隆：所以雖然經費已經沒有了，但是農業部還是會想辦法就對了？"],["陳部長駿季：對，我們還是會去想辦法。"],["賴委員瑞隆：還是會想辦法，請跟院長找出方法出來，好嗎？"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["賴委員瑞隆：也跟立法院持續地溝通，好不好？"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["賴委員瑞隆：應該要找到一些方法解決這個問題啦！任何一個政黨執政都會遇到天災，但遇到天災的時候，我們都希望支持，現在每個國民黨的縣市首長也請求資源的支持，現在經費這樣的狀況下，你要國家怎麼做事？怎麼來協助這些農民？每個農民、每個災民都希望政府來支持，結果現在這樣狀態要怎麼做？我希望部長全力地繼續跟院長，還包括國、民兩黨持續溝通，民進黨是全力支持的啦！但是國、民兩黨這一塊要持續溝通，看有沒有什麼樣方式能夠把這件事情做一個妥善的解決，好不好？"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["賴委員瑞隆：好。接下來我請教一下郭部長及曾董事長，好嗎？"],["主席：請郭部長及曾董事長。"],["賴委員瑞隆：郭部長，我請教一下，一樣的問題啦！「從寬、從優、從速、從簡」，經濟部有沒有把持這樣的原則？"],["郭部長智輝：是的。"],["賴委員瑞隆：有照這原則在做嘛？"],["郭部長智輝：我們有照這樣在做。"],["賴委員瑞隆：好，經濟部的經費上面有沒有遇到問題？"],["郭部長智輝：我們現在經費不足的部分，我想我們跟農業部也是一樣，因為這是一個災難，所以我們會想辦法把不足的經費儘量跟院長這邊爭取。"],["賴委員瑞隆：好。我待會再問一下部長好了，我先問一下台電董事長，好不好？董事長，這一次台電其實很辛苦啦！因為就像上次高雄遇到山陀兒颱風侵襲時，風力之強，有17級的陣風，連電線桿都直接被掃斷，恐怕很多人沒有看到是難以想像的，電線桿裡面還有埋設鐵絲的全部直接被掃斷掉，而且斷是斷一整排的，不會只有那一支斷，其他全斷，所以這一次從臺南、從嘉義上來，造成了你們的電力上有很大的重創，你們整個的電力恢復了嗎？目前恢復到什麼樣的狀態？"],["曾董事長文生：跟委員報告，我們在禮拜六的晚上九點就已經全部恢復供電……"],["賴委員瑞隆：都恢復了？"],["曾董事長文生：最晚的是在嘉義縣，因為嘉義縣是颱風登陸的地點。"],["賴委員瑞隆：我還是要謝謝，真的還是要謝謝台電啦！其實台電的第一層同仁每次在遇到這種風災，我的選區都是在臨海區，前鎮、小港、旗津都是受風面第一排，每一次只要發生狀況的時候，第一線都是拚了命在救，當颱風正大的時候、風雨正大的時候，台電的員工都在第一線用命在搶救復電，還遇到很多是高壓電，甚至遇到是鐵板被吹起來壓在高壓電上的，還是要拚命地想辦法，不處理掉那些東西就是沒辦法復電，所以是拚了命地在救。","我想要講的是，台電是國家的台電、台電是人民的台電，上次整個經費全部都給過，唯獨就把台電的1,000億整個扣下來，其實坦白講，我是覺得非常地難過啦！這是在支持台電，就是給台電更多的一些資源，但是現在完全把所謂能源政策的問題，全部把它丟包給台電去承擔，我認為這個對台電是非常、非常不公平，台電的士氣也會受到很大的影響啦！董事長，接下來台電在這些財政上會不會有壓力？"],["曾董事長文生：跟委員報告，關於災損的部分，我們還在統計，因為將近3,500根電桿，其實……"],["賴委員瑞隆：我問一下，台電這次這樣的損失大概會多少？你們粗估多少？"],["曾董事長文生：跟委員報告，我們現在還在統計。"],["賴委員瑞隆：粗估大概多少？至少損失了多少？"],["曾董事長文生：應該有10億啦！"],["賴委員瑞隆：台電損失了10億以上。"],["曾董事長文生：我們現在算起來應該有10億左右。"],["賴委員瑞隆：所以台電又要擔起來這個部分，台電過去已經扛住了整個凍漲電價、穩定物價的這些責任，現在還要再加10億上去，這還不包括很多人力上面的成本吧？"],["曾董事長文生：我們有全部做一些統計跟估計，大概是這樣，但是……"],["賴委員瑞隆：接下來……"],["曾董事長文生：跟委員報告，現在是我們損害掉的要儘快能夠把它恢復，但接下來的狀況是，我相信今天一定很多委員問我們接下來怎麼辦？其實我們也在考慮接下來怎麼做，剛才部長的報告也有提了大概的一些方向，這些其實都是需要……因為電網的韌性需要投資、需要經費，而且這不是臺灣一個國家的問題，全世界都遇到這樣的問題，最近很多的國際媒體報導，各個國家都在增加電網的投資，而增加電網投資的經費有政府的補貼，也有透過電價調整來反應的，一大堆這種狀況，我覺得我們只要稍微檢視一下外電大概都看得到。"],["賴委員瑞隆：特別是這些很多的……像過去以來，比如像高雄很多因為防災型的關係，我們努力地做了一些地下化，甚至有些強韌的作法，所以那個災情就會減少。我認為這一次的整個沿海地區，很多都必須要做更多的強化跟韌性，這個都需要投入更多的一些資源，我真的……"],["曾董事長文生：後續的改善可能真的會比較需要時間，也需要更多政府的各個單位來配合，因為包含路權等等相關的狀況，當然資源及經費是一個非常重要的元素。"],["賴委員瑞隆：我問一下，台電這樣的話，會不會有財務上的壓力？如果政府遲遲沒有辦法撥補，這應該是政府要給的，政策是政府在訂的嘛！政府要求你們不漲電價，政府認為你們應該要穩定住民生電價，不給你們漲的時候，你們承受的虧損，這個會不會有很大的壓力？"],["曾董事長文生：跟委員報告，財務一直是台電的壓力。"],["賴委員瑞隆：這會不會影響到……"],["曾董事長文生：我要先講台電……"],["賴委員瑞隆：這會不會影響到台電的軍心士氣？"],["曾董事長文生：我跟委員報告，我們政府對於台電的一些經費上的支持是對台電的肯定跟鼓勵，基本上肯定了台電在整個國際燃料價格上漲的時候，扛住了國內通膨的壓力。我們一再說明，世界上很多國家都在補貼，很多國家調的電價漲幅……"],["賴委員瑞隆：因為大家都希望穩定住電價、穩定住物價嘛！"],["曾董事長文生：造成了非常多通貨膨脹的後續問題。"],["賴委員瑞隆：因為一旦電價及物價提升了之後，造成了國家整體的損失是更大的嘛！所以大家都是用這樣的策略在進行、在處理的。"],["曾董事長文生：是。"],["賴委員瑞隆：就唯獨臺灣遇到一個非理性國會的多數兩黨，用這樣的方式來對待台電，我希望董事長繼續努力，好不好？另外還要鼓舞台電的同仁們，我們會全力以赴繼續在立法院去爭取經費。"],["曾董事長文生：我跟委員報告，對台電來說，台電的同仁把電網修復就是我們的責任，我們一定會努力把這個工作做好，我們也開始在討論後續強化的一些工作。"],["賴委員瑞隆：就是及早來規劃，我們會全力來支持。"],["曾董事長文生：是的，謝謝。"],["賴委員瑞隆：同時間也給予台電同仁更多的鼓勵啦！"],["曾董事長文生：謝謝。"],["賴委員瑞隆：特別是第一線的同仁、辛苦的同仁，用命在幫大家復電的這些同仁們給他們更多的鼓勵。"],["曾董事長文生：我們一定會轉達，謝謝。"],["賴委員瑞隆：請教一下部長，我還是要問一下，大家現在在關心美國稅率的問題啦！現在大家擔心8月1日快要到了，如果沒有談出一個結果出來的話，會不會受到影響？會不會回復到32%這樣的狀況？部長，現在談的最新狀況怎麼樣？"],["郭部長智輝：我們現在還在談判中。"],["賴委員瑞隆：還在談判當中。副院長到美國再次去談了嘛，是嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：這是第4次吧！"],["賴委員瑞隆：去談第4次了嘛，對不對？現在努力地朝向在10%跟20%之間做努力，是嗎？是在這樣的目標下嘛？"],["郭部長智輝：我們始終是希望能夠談出一個對國內有利的稅率啦！"],["賴委員瑞隆：有做了各種的準備嗎？一旦如果有任何狀況需要去支持各企業的，也都做了準備嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：是的，我想我們的談判小組都有做充分的準備啦！"],["賴委員瑞隆：好，我們期盼有好的結果。"],["郭部長智輝：是。"],["賴委員瑞隆：在8月1日前，這個結果會談出來嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：8月1日……因為美國也有講，如果8月1日前沒有談到一個很完整的，他們也可以postpone嘛！"],["賴委員瑞隆：所以還是會有那個……"],["郭部長智輝：我想這個都還有很多不確定的因素啦！所以我沒有辦法跟委員報告。"],["賴委員瑞隆：我了解。談判過程當然必須要很多的機密，但我希望就是一樣鼓勵你們的談判團隊啦！持續地加油，希望幫臺灣爭取到最好的一些狀況，也希望讓我們的產業、讓我們農漁民的衝擊都降到最小啦！"],["郭部長智輝：是。"],["賴委員瑞隆：再來，我請教一下，油、電、糖、水加薪這塊，我們長期也都在講，部長應該都會支持吧？"],["郭部長智輝：我們當然是全力支持。"],["賴委員瑞隆：我指的也不只這些，包括像中鋼、唐榮、台船，甚至漢翔等泛公股，我也鼓勵都要支持啦！因為這些都很辛苦，我也認為國家應該由這些企業來帶頭調薪，以帶動整個薪資的上漲，部長同意這樣的方向嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：對，我們大家一起努力。"],["賴委員瑞隆：好，一起努力。最後一個問題，上次在小港的臨海園區裡面，三元能源發生的火災燃燒了26小時，甚至造成了氫氧酸等等一些的危險物質。上禮拜一發生的，我要求兩個禮拜內提出一份報告，部長有掌握這件事情嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：因為我都在救災，所以……"],["賴委員瑞隆：我希望部長了解一下整個狀況好不好？因為下個禮拜整個報告要出來，我們要跟當地鄉親們說明。"],["郭部長智輝：是，我們會……"],["賴委員瑞隆：就是這樣具有高風險、高危險的廠，為什麼會離市民這麼近？經濟部有沒有相關審核的責任？我的意思是，經濟部在你們的園區內，不要把這個東西直接丟給市政府，有些部分該你們要掌握的責任，你們還是要掌握住。高雄小港已經承受了相當多的一些高污染，甚至高危險的一些產業，而你看當時一燒起來以後，消防員趕快逃出來，如果這3位沒有逃出來，恐怕都很危險，所以只能讓它繼續在那邊燒，讓它燒了26個小時，裡面產生了多少的有害毒氣？當天的空污狀況其實是很糟的。我的意思是，希望經濟部未來在評估這些事情的時候要審慎思考，至少離住宅區、人民要遠一點，不能夠再這麼近，雖然它是叫做臨海產業園區，但是旁邊就是很多的居民。我們都在談大林蒲遷村，想把一些影響降到最低，結果現在又把這些具有高風險、可能有影響的，又放在人民的周邊，這個是人民是很難接受的。我希望經濟部在這件事情上，未來要加強把關，部長，可以嗎？給我們一個承諾。"],["郭部長智輝：我們會加強把關。"],["賴委員瑞隆：加強把關，同時經濟部該有的責任也要訂進來。"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，它進來的時候是符合產業園區各種用地用途及使用規範辦法第三條關於產業用地，第一項規定為容許引進的產業……"],["賴委員瑞隆：部長，我就是希望你們再去思考跟檢討。"],["郭部長智輝：是，我們會來檢討。"],["賴委員瑞隆：延燒了26個小時，它的安全、它的所有周邊、它的消防所有等等的，一定出了一些問題，包括它的狀況顯然超出了你們預期的狀況。它不是一般我們所熟悉的這些廠房，同時它燃燒出來的氫氟酸是有毒的，甚至於其他有毒性的一些物質，周邊的居民其實都相當擔心。當天還有很多人說，當天的空氣、水，他們都擔心是有問題的。"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，您剛才所指責的空氣品質監測，我們都有設置空氣品質監測站，您剛才所說有害空氣污染物的部分，到目前為止我們都沒有發現有空污的問題。"],["賴委員瑞隆：部長，我知道在廠內一度有監測到，但是我要講的是，即使是在周邊也都是這種的，它的擴散效應等等。我的意思是那個只是一個最低、最低的標準啦！這種東西放在離居民這麼近這件事情，本身就有高度的爭議，我還是要請部長思考，不要完全地相信跟迷失在所謂的監測站。"],["郭部長智輝：是，我們會……"],["賴委員瑞隆：監測不是24小時監測，監測也不是所有周邊的點全部監測，監測只是拿出來測一下。"],["郭部長智輝：我們會精進……"],["賴委員瑞隆：它永遠帶有很多的不確定性在，對我來說，這件事情就是不……你想啦！如果是在臺北市，哪一個區裡面願意接受這樣的東西？臺北市任何一個區，你告訴我願意接受這樣的東西嗎？如果不行的話，關於臨海工業區，更要重新調整你們的標準。它這裡面會產生有毒的氣體，即使是會產生有毒氣體的風險，沒有監測到不代表沒有發生，一度在廠內有監測到，監測了幾次？它不是24小時在監測，不是隨時在監測。部長，真的要將心比心，站在周邊居民的角度來思考，換作這個如果是在中正區，有人有辦法接受這樣的事情嗎？隔壁有辦法接受這樣的一個廠房嗎？距離幾百公尺有辦法接受這樣的廠房嗎？所以我講的是請經濟部要重新調整你們的標準，要更嚴格地去檢視蓋進來的廠房，標準同時也要提升它的安全性。這一次我看來是一堆的問題，希望部長救災完畢之後，花一點點時間瞭解這個案子，好不好？謝謝部長。"],["郭部長智輝：好的。"],["主席：謝謝。現在請鄭正鈐委員詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":84,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-19-18","speakers":["謝衣鳯","邱議瑩","賴瑞隆","鄭正鈐","張啓楷","張嘉郡","蔡易餘","楊瓊瓔","陳超明","邱志偉","林俊憲","郭國文","黃國昌","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","林岱樺","陳亭妃","呂玉玲","陳冠廷","徐欣瑩"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-07-21"],"gazette_id":"1146802","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1146802_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第18次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請經濟部部長、農業部部長、內政部首長及交通部首長就「丹娜絲颱風及0708豪雨災損及回復\n情形」進行報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1146802_00001"}}}