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\"嚴\"}, {\"word\": \"重\", \"start\": 522.804, \"end\": 523.184, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": \"淹\"}, {\"word\": \"水\", \"start\": 523.184, \"end\": 523.344, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 523.344, \"end\": 524.305, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"結\"}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 524.305, \"end\": 524.525, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 524.525, \"end\": 524.765, \"score\": 0.957}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 524.765, \"end\": 525.045, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"完\", \"start\": 525.045, \"end\": 525.306, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"成\", \"start\": 525.306, \"end\": 525.526, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"堤\", \"start\": 525.526, \"end\": 525.706, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"防\", \"start\": 525.706, \"end\": 525.886, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"加\", \"start\": 525.886, \"end\": 526.086, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"高\", \"start\": 526.086, \"end\": 526.306, \"score\": 0.984}, {\"word\": \"之\", 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530.511, \"end\": 531.312, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"僅\"}, {\"word\": \"讓\"}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 531.312, \"end\": 531.592, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 531.592, \"end\": 531.792, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 531.792, \"end\": 531.932, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 531.932, \"end\": 532.533, \"score\": 0.965}, {\"word\": \"眾\"}, {\"word\": \"受\", \"start\": 532.533, \"end\": 532.793, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"苦\", \"start\": 532.793, \"end\": 533.514, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"而\", \"start\": 533.514, \"end\": 533.855, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"且\", \"start\": 533.855, \"end\": 534.695, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 534.695, \"end\": 534.956, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 534.956, \"end\": 535.116, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 535.116, \"end\": 535.316, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 535.316, \"end\": 535.556, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"府\", \"start\": 535.556, \"end\": 535.957, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"額\"}, {\"word\": \"外\", \"start\": 535.957, \"end\": 536.117, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 536.117, \"end\": 536.277, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"負\", \"start\": 536.277, \"end\": 536.437, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"擔\"}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"費\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 536.437, \"end\": 536.638, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"底\", \"start\": 536.638, \"end\": 537.719, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 537.719, \"end\": 538.079, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"誰\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 538.079, \"end\": 539.0, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"而\", \"start\": 539.0, \"end\": 539.08, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"且\", \"start\": 539.08, \"end\": 539.301, \"score\": 0.935}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 539.301, \"end\": 539.581, \"score\": 0.854}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 539.581, \"end\": 539.681, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 539.681, \"end\": 539.801, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"工\", \"start\": 539.801, \"end\": 539.981, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"程\", \"start\": 539.981, \"end\": 540.802, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"計\"}, {\"word\": \"畫\"}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 540.802, \"end\": 540.923, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 540.923, \"end\": 541.103, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 541.103, \"end\": 541.283, \"score\": 0.891}, {\"word\": \"央\", \"start\": 541.283, \"end\": 541.723, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"審\"}, {\"word\": \"核\", \"start\": 541.723, \"end\": 541.743, \"score\": 0.41}]}, {\"start\": 542.244, \"end\": 567.635, \"text\": \"中央才是內行人啊所以要麻煩院長啊還有部長要責成相關的單位要通盤檢討之外還要有審慎的規劃這個不是說推給誰就行的不是說推給縣府推給公所就沒事了這個治水計畫還是要繼續就好像剛才院長講的我也很感動啊他覺得說要趕快再有一個新的治水的特別預算趕快來解決這些問題\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 542.244, \"end\": 542.404, \"score\": 0.886}, 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\"end\": 550.908, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 550.908, \"end\": 551.288, \"score\": 0.891}, {\"word\": \"審\"}, {\"word\": \"慎\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 551.288, \"end\": 552.308, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"規\"}, {\"word\": \"劃\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 552.308, \"end\": 552.428, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 552.428, \"end\": 552.788, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"推\", \"start\": 552.788, \"end\": 553.389, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"給\"}, {\"word\": \"誰\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 553.389, \"end\": 553.549, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 553.549, \"end\": 553.769, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 553.769, \"end\": 554.169, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 554.169, \"end\": 554.369, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 554.369, \"end\": 554.549, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"推\", 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\"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 559.111, \"end\": 559.271, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"繼\"}, {\"word\": \"續\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 559.271, \"end\": 559.411, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 559.411, \"end\": 559.511, \"score\": 0.799}, {\"word\": \"像\", \"start\": 559.511, \"end\": 559.891, \"score\": 0.866}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"才\", \"start\": 559.891, \"end\": 560.091, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 560.091, \"end\": 560.712, \"score\": 0.924}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"講\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 560.712, \"end\": 561.112, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 561.112, \"end\": 561.232, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 561.232, \"end\": 561.312, \"score\": 0.745}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 561.312, \"end\": 561.532, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"感\", \"start\": 561.532, \"end\": 561.912, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"啊\", \"start\": 561.912, \"end\": 562.332, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 562.332, \"end\": 562.612, \"score\": 0.766}, {\"word\": \"覺\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 562.612, \"end\": 562.993, \"score\": 0.851}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 562.993, \"end\": 563.373, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"趕\"}, {\"word\": \"快\", \"start\": 563.373, \"end\": 563.593, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 563.593, \"end\": 563.893, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 563.893, \"end\": 564.073, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 564.073, \"end\": 564.373, \"score\": 0.84}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"新\", \"start\": 564.373, \"end\": 564.553, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 564.553, \"end\": 564.733, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"治\", \"start\": 564.733, \"end\": 564.953, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"水\", \"start\": 564.953, \"end\": 565.174, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 565.174, \"end\": 565.334, 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\"好\", \"start\": 964.66, \"end\": 967.182, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"張\"}, {\"word\": \"家\", \"start\": 967.182, \"end\": 967.322, \"score\": 0.876}, {\"word\": \"俊\", \"start\": 967.322, \"end\": 967.482, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"文\", \"start\": 967.482, \"end\": 967.682, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"子\", \"start\": 967.682, \"end\": 968.003, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"馨\", \"start\": 968.003, \"end\": 968.303, \"score\": 0.867}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"卓\", \"start\": 968.303, \"end\": 968.443, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 968.443, \"end\": 969.104, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 969.104, \"end\": 969.224, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"各\", \"start\": 969.224, \"end\": 969.404, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"格\", \"start\": 969.404, \"end\": 969.584, \"score\": 0.913}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 969.584, \"end\": 969.704, \"score\": 0.834}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 969.704, \"end\": 969.724, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"備\"}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,330 --> 00:00:04,084\n謝謝院長我想請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備選\n\n2\n00:00:07,216 --> 00:00:31,003\n主任長辛苦了那自己這一個多月來我想您也多次的到現場去看災業了解目前災區的一些需要那包括所有基層救災防災的人員的辛苦我想您都看在眼裡那我想給您看幾個照片你看這個是我們雲林林內平頂的路段\n\n3\n00:00:32,170 --> 00:00:45,168\n有看到嗎是不是斷的這個肝殘寸斷Y7扭8您覺得這是不是應該要緊急搶修呢是不是應該要有趕快做出變道絕對影響到\n\n4\n00:00:48,203 --> 00:01:06,504\n人民的安全如果有產業的話也影響到產業的進出沒錯所以這影響到了人民的安全還有他們的生計但是呢這些路段都在於八色鳥保護區所以依照野生動物保育法呢他必須要\n\n5\n00:01:07,185 --> 00:01:21,552\n林業署同意他才可以施作他甚至都不允許他可以去做這個變道所以呢這些產業道路到現在為止呢都必須要公文往返您知道去年凱米颱風啊\n\n6\n00:01:23,291 --> 00:01:39,960\n因為這個公文往返要好幾個月超過半年所以他都沒有辦法整治啊是不是可以拜託院長責成農業部林業署針對災後的搶修不要再往返這些公文了因為他不是新的開發區啊\n\n7\n00:01:41,221 --> 00:02:00,111\n他不是說我要在這裡做一個重新的開發他只是為了要修路讓農民可以通過甚至住在山裡面的這些民眾能夠安全的回家是不是可以拜託卓院長責成他們說盡速的趕快不要再流程好幾個月你看這些災民怎麼辦呢\n\n8\n00:02:01,813 --> 00:02:22,773\n請部長來說明跟協助我謝謝委員提供這樣的資訊我想林保署有關於林保署所挾的這些林產業道路的部分我一定會要求他們就是盡快的搶通如果說那邊有居民的話一定要先有變道行程這個部分我想我們回去再梳理如果禁訴大概是多久因為上一次你跟我禁訴也拖了好幾個禮拜\n\n9\n00:02:23,914 --> 00:02:37,510\n不是那不一樣的案例那是去年啊對不一樣的案例對不一樣的案例但是那也拖了好幾個禮拜甚至好幾個月委員我想這個部分因為他們牽涉到後面的勘察以後還要規劃\n\n10\n00:02:38,851 --> 00:03:05,122\n我的意思是說你要先給他變道嘛你要勘察你要規劃這個我都支持因為你要做一條安全的路嘛但是你不可能就讓他放著這樣子好幾個月我想先用變道的方式讓農民可以通然後後面路的部分照他們的進度去做規劃這個我想我回去再交代部長拜託你今天就要趕快下命令趕快讓他們去做變道否則這個繼續下去如果有農民又不小心掉下去\n\n11\n00:03:05,902 --> 00:03:15,567\n如果不小心有任何的傷亡誰來負責呢可以嗎院長對這個我們可以來處理院長你可以公開的指示農業部盡速的來完成這個嗎\n\n12\n00:03:17,126 --> 00:03:43,461\n現在我想沈部長看到這個他一定會主動來處理這個事情那我會再跟部長好好的來研究如何加速來進行是特別拜託院長那下一張下一張你看這個邊坡你知道站在那上面的時候像一個懸崖這是去年楷米颱風走山的樣子它上面在懸崖的最上方都是屋子那屋子是可能差幾十公分就要全部掉下來了\n\n13\n00:03:44,602 --> 00:04:09,345\n到現在因為要走這個流程因為要走這個八色鳥保護區的流程然後還要做什麼審查流程工程流程到現在還沒有辦法做所以我也希望說不要明年的這個時候我還要再拿出這些照片來給院長看說沒辦法做那這些人民他們欲哭無淚啊\n\n14\n00:04:10,294 --> 00:04:35,788\n我跟委員報告就是我們在做整個大規模崩塌的這個防治的時候我必須要講你保護區的開發限制應該是針對開發案啊你怎麼會針對災後搶修呢這是一個重點就是說你要自己內部要修改啊你不能去年跟你講你說你要改今年再跟你講你也說你要改到底什麼時候要改這是我第一次\n\n15\n00:04:36,992 --> 00:04:38,841\n你上次來我辦公室我親自拿給你的\n\n16\n00:04:41,397 --> 00:05:08,034\n你還跟我說好好好的確那個時候有幫忙但是已經比就是你的幫忙已經比本來的時候快了我沒有要在這裡跟你爭論這個我們的大規模崩塌我們不會因為保護區就比較慢我們會積極的做的確是比較慢因為沒有經過你知道那個根本地方政府公所他不敢去改變到因為林務署沒有同意啊沒有同意\n\n17\n00:05:08,974 --> 00:05:17,236\n沒有廠商敢去做你知道嗎所以這個是一個很大的問題院長拜託您我不需要在這裡跟部長爭誰對誰錯問題是災民他就沒有受到幫助嘛他就現在出入不安全嘛你現在是要在這裡跟我爭論你沒有責任嗎絕對不是這樣子我接下來要問的是水利問題\n\n18\n00:05:32,279 --> 00:05:54,863\n我接下來想要跟院長反映一個我們雲林地方的問題就是我們大湖口溪淹水的情況非常嚴重這一次呢大湖口溪這個治理啊我想要呼籲就是不能夠頭痛一頭腳痛一腳水利署其實是一個我非常敬重的單位他們很有專業有經驗理應要通盤檢討結果今年的7月12號\n\n19\n00:05:59,864 --> 00:06:21,269\n他們發了一個新聞稿到現場去看到現場去看沾沾自喜的發文說花了12億加高提房結果不到半個月不到半個月就淹水了而且是本來沒有做沒淹水喔做完了之後大淹水喔您覺得這樣子能夠向居民交代嗎\n\n20\n00:06:24,354 --> 00:06:47,884\n是報告委員我想這個目前的這個我們雖然已經進度啊來到90幾個%但是還是最後的那個部分還沒有完成時間的部分嘛但是我們在處理我們都一直在處理但是因為這個啟動的時間在過去那比較慢一點但是颱風這個時候來我們也只能努力啦\n\n21\n00:06:49,104 --> 00:07:15,518\n我沒有說你們不努力說實在水利署是很努力但是我的意思是它這個是中央管河川這個大湖口溪是中央管河川它要花這12億它難道不用通盤檢討嗎它難道不用通盤檢討說它如果增高堤防它花了12億增高堤防它外水增高壓力增大它整個外水倒灌進去從這個湘涵\n\n22\n00:07:17,179 --> 00:07:40,026\n倒灌進去市區結果沒有加高不淹水加高了之後外面壓力增大它整個回堵倒灌整個斗南市區都淹水這個南道水利署在想要加高的時候都沒有計算過說它外水加高的時候會增加多少壓力它必須建議說要做一個水閘門在這裡嘛為什麼不做通盤檢討呢\n\n23\n00:07:41,266 --> 00:07:43,467\n怎麼會一下坐這裡然後出現問題再坐那裡呢是報告委員我想我們都會通盤檢討過去的計畫事實證明他就是沒有通盤檢討才發生這個問題的嘛這個問題說實在蓋這個水閘門多少錢你知道嗎蓋這個水閘門可能幾百萬就做起來了\n\n24\n00:07:58,797 --> 00:08:19,687\n可是因為水利署他沒有通盤檢討他花了12億加高了兩邊堤防很棒這個我也感謝他們但是怎麼會在加高堤防的同時你不去想說你外面的壓力增高他有可能會倒灌舉一個例子湖北鎮蓋西安抽水站的時候他因為\n\n25\n00:08:20,507 --> 00:08:46,506\n是用向下打出去的它也因為外水壓力過大本來沒有做那個抽水站都不淹水一做了之後整個河水倒灌虎尾鎮都淹水這是同樣的道理啊所以我現在要講的是說103年完成了這個鄉罕到目前為止到今年為止從來都不曾發生過這樣子嚴重淹水的問題結果今年完成堤防加高之後\n\n26\n00:08:47,247 --> 00:09:01,743\n就馬上倒灌淹水了這樣子的規劃不僅讓地方的民眾受苦而且還要地方政府額外去負擔經費這到底是誰的問題而且所有的工程計畫都要中央審核\n\n27\n00:09:02,244 --> 00:09:27,635\n中央才是內行人啊所以要麻煩院長啊還有部長要責成相關的單位要通盤檢討之外還要有審慎的規劃這個不是說推給誰就行的不是說推給縣府推給公所就沒事了這個治水計畫還是要繼續就好像剛才院長講的我也很感動啊他覺得說要趕快再有一個新的治水的特別預算趕快來解決這些問題\n\n28\n00:09:28,735 --> 00:09:48,911\n那我現在不是要就責任何人我是說我們要趕快解決問題是不是大家一起來解決問題包括內政部現在假設是內水排不出去的話如果這個加了水門那內水排不出去內水歸內政部管是不是可以在這旁邊加蓋一個簡易的抽水站\n\n29\n00:09:50,232 --> 00:10:09,080\n讓他可以把內水抽出去這個部分是不是內政部長也可以關心一下這個設計當初的這個食餘量的設計沒有到實際發生的時候的食餘量這麼大他這個設計是夠的他今年沒有議題他加高了之後\n\n30\n00:10:10,222 --> 00:10:29,175\n我現在的意思是說它的設計沒有問題它的問題出在於它沒有通盤檢討它沒有發現說它沒有發現你不要幫我們解釋啊降雨的那個量我跟你說它有符合它今年有符合它這個加了之後的確是\n\n31\n00:10:30,549 --> 00:10:47,286\n外水沒有液體出來他做的沒有問題他做的問題是在於他沒有通盤檢討他沒有發現說他水壓加高會造成倒灌所以變成是你未來要做的你必須要通盤檢討要做下來所以我希望說院長部長\n\n32\n00:10:48,647 --> 00:11:04,921\n是不是可以責成這個水利署坐下來好好再做一個覆盤包括我要求水利署跟經濟部做三件事情委員是否同意第一個檢討這次為什麼會淹水的原因把它檢討出來這次為什麼淹水\n\n33\n00:11:06,243 --> 00:11:22,585\n馬上來解決這次淹水原因如果要增加閘門增加什麼事是馬上來做這個還有那個內水戳出去的那個整個系統再來檢討一次當初做的這個加高提案雖然是很好那有沒有忽略了其他的地方或是哪裡不足我想三個層次來處理好不好\n\n34\n00:11:23,186 --> 00:11:43,412\n好拜託院長拜託院長謝謝院長你這樣子的態度我想我們所有的災民都會非常感謝你那我們這個問題希望可以儘速的得到一個回應那是不是看這個禮拜之內水利署可以盡快的到我們雲林來然後來解決這個問題我們請署長或是代理長到現場再馬上看一次好謝謝是這個問題我們會根據這個院長的指示馬上處理\n\n35\n00:11:48,888 --> 00:11:54,367\n好謝謝那我也再想要給院長看一下下一個PowerPoint\n\n36\n00:11:56,144 --> 00:12:19,029\n就是這個PowerPoint其實這個出來的時候我真的嚇一跳行政院的第一個版本裡面這一次丹納斯颱風雲林受損那麼嚴重竟然第一個版本裡面區域沒有包含納入雲林線那經過本席提醒之後趕快用紅字再加上雲林線等縣市其實為什麼我會那麼緊張\n\n37\n00:12:20,069 --> 00:12:36,349\n因為我們很擔心很擔心說假設你風災的災區範圍沒有寫到雲林縣到時候560億我們如果一毛都分不到怎麼辦呢所以院長我在這裡提醒您真的災民\n\n38\n00:12:37,671 --> 00:13:04,724\n跟我一樣我們都很歡樂的想說你知道嗎我們也很不願意受災我們也很不願意受到這個農損結果一看到說行政院的那個災後特別條例近年不穩我們這樣陷到這麼嚴重你還親身去看你還總統也親身去看是不是這個以後要特別提醒行政院要重視一下不然實在是很歡樂的那我也繼續請問院長\n\n39\n00:13:06,505 --> 00:13:29,774\n重建條例編了560億那這筆預算會怎麼樣在農業水利交通社會復原等項目之間分配呢分配的數我們現在在核算當中就是出現560億的總數那如果條例通過之後我們會另外送一個特別預算請大院來審議那時候通過特別預算才會是具體執行的\n\n40\n00:13:31,175 --> 00:13:49,429\n瞭解那雲林在這個農損農業損害中的這個佔比是全國的前段班大概算起來農業災損是排名全國第二那是否會以這個損失的比例作為一個資源分配的依據呢一定是以實際自災發生損害的受災情況來經過認定之後農業部來彙整那經過\n\n41\n00:13:57,395 --> 00:14:05,506\n整個特別預算的籌編來進行到裡面讓我會希望會達到一個最大的照顧最廣泛的照顧而且最實際的照顧\n\n42\n00:14:06,460 --> 00:14:28,877\n這一點要特別拜託院長關於農業部的問題待會我再繼續提醒您因為我們也覺得受到不公平的待遇那我先針對這個預算分配幾點建議之後我們再來討論農業部的問題那就是有關於這個特別條例如果通過之後呢是不是農業救助跟其他的工程項目它是不一樣的\n\n43\n00:14:30,759 --> 00:14:57,960\n農業復耕他是有黃金時期啊他是你這一週你下一週你這個節氣沒有種下去其實他的收成就影響了那會大幅的把他的產值品質都下降可不可以承諾有關於農業復耕的這個補助啊條例通過之後一週內甚至兩週內先撥款給農民呢因為復耕這件事情喔不是說他今天想種就可以種他必須照著那種節氣來種啊\n\n44\n00:15:00,316 --> 00:15:12,971\n好這個特別條例的裁員來自於舉債那我們要完成這個程序之後我一定要求各部會及時迅速的執行最快的時間在執行完畢表示政府\n\n45\n00:15:16,714 --> 00:15:41,979\n那現在新的標準是什麼請問一下\n\n46\n00:16:04,660 --> 00:16:09,724\n好謝謝謝謝張家俊文子馨謝謝卓院長還有各格院的備詢謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n330\t4084\t謝謝院長我想請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備選\n7216\t31003\t主任長辛苦了那自己這一個多月來我想您也多次的到現場去看災業了解目前災區的一些需要那包括所有基層救災防災的人員的辛苦我想您都看在眼裡那我想給您看幾個照片你看這個是我們雲林林內平頂的路段\n32170\t45168\t有看到嗎是不是斷的這個肝殘寸斷Y7 扭8您覺得這是不是應該要緊急搶修呢是不是應該要有趕快做出變道絕對影響到\n48203\t66504\t人民的安全如果有產業的話也影響到產業的進出沒錯所以這影響到了人民的安全還有他們的生計但是呢這些路段都在於八色鳥保護區所以依照野生動物保育法呢他必須要\n67185\t81552\t林業署同意他才可以施作他甚至都不允許他可以去做這個變道所以呢這些產業道路到現在為止呢都必須要公文往返您知道去年凱米颱風啊\n83291\t99960\t因為這個公文往返要好幾個月超過半年所以他都沒有辦法整治啊是不是可以拜託院長責成農業部林業署針對災後的搶修不要再往返這些公文了因為他不是新的開發區啊\n101221\t120111\t他不是說我要在這裡做一個重新的開發他只是為了要修路讓農民可以通過甚至住在山裡面的這些民眾能夠安全的回家是不是可以拜託卓院長責成他們說盡速的趕快不要再流程好幾個月你看這些災民怎麼辦呢\n121813\t142773\t請部長來說明跟協助我謝謝委員提供這樣的資訊我想林保署有關於林保署所挾的這些林產業道路的部分我一定會要求他們就是盡快的搶通如果說那邊有居民的話一定要先有變道行程這個部分我想我們回去再梳理如果禁訴大概是多久因為上一次你跟我禁訴也拖了好幾個禮拜\n143914\t157510\t不是 那不一樣的案例那是去年啊對 不一樣的案例對 不一樣的案例但是那也拖了好幾個禮拜甚至好幾個月委員 我想這個部分因為他們牽涉到後面的勘察以後還要規劃\n158851\t185122\t我的意思是說你要先給他變道嘛你要勘察 你要規劃這個我都支持因為你要做一條安全的路嘛但是你不可能就讓他放著這樣子好幾個月我想先用變道的方式讓農民可以通然後後面路的部分照他們的進度去做規劃這個我想我回去再交代部長拜託你今天就要趕快下命令趕快讓他們去做變道否則這個繼續下去如果有農民又不小心掉下去\n185902\t195567\t如果不小心有任何的傷亡 誰來負責呢可以嗎 院長對 這個我們可以來處理院長 你可以公開的指示農業部盡速的來完成這個嗎\n197126\t223461\t現在我想沈部長看到這個他一定會主動來處理這個事情那我會再跟部長好好的來研究如何加速來進行是 特別拜託院長那下一張下一張你看這個邊坡你知道站在那上面的時候像一個懸崖這是去年楷米颱風走山的樣子它上面在懸崖的最上方都是屋子那屋子是可能差幾十公分就要全部掉下來了\n224602\t249345\t到現在因為要走這個流程因為要走這個八色鳥保護區的流程然後還要做什麼審查流程 工程流程到現在還沒有辦法做所以我也希望說不要明年的這個時候我還要再拿出這些照片來給院長看說沒辦法做那這些人民他們欲哭無淚啊\n250294\t275788\t我跟委員報告就是我們在做整個大規模崩塌的這個防治的時候我必須要講你保護區的開發限制應該是針對開發案啊你怎麼會針對災後搶修呢這是一個重點就是說你要自己內部要修改啊你不能去年跟你講你說你要改今年再跟你講你也說你要改到底什麼時候要改這是我第一次\n276992\t278841\t你上次來我辦公室我親自拿給你的\n281397\t308034\t你還跟我說好好好的確那個時候有幫忙但是已經比就是你的幫忙已經比本來的時候快了我沒有要在這裡跟你爭論這個我們的大規模崩塌我們不會因為保護區就比較慢我們會積極的做的確是比較慢因為沒有經過你知道那個根本地方政府公所他不敢去改變到因為林務署沒有同意啊沒有同意\n308974\t317236\t沒有廠商敢去做你知道嗎所以這個是一個很大的問題院長拜託您我不需要在這裡跟部長爭誰對誰錯問題是災民他就沒有受到幫助嘛他就現在出入不安全嘛你現在是要在這裡跟我爭論你沒有責任嗎絕對不是這樣子我接下來要問的是水利問題\n332279\t354863\t我接下來想要跟院長反映一個我們雲林地方的問題就是我們大湖口溪淹水的情況非常嚴重這一次呢大湖口溪這個治理啊我想要呼籲就是不能夠頭痛一頭腳痛一腳水利署其實是一個我非常敬重的單位他們很有專業有經驗理應要通盤檢討結果今年的7月12號\n359864\t381269\t他們發了一個新聞稿到現場去看到現場去看沾沾自喜的發文說花了12億加高提房結果不到半個月不到半個月就淹水了而且是本來沒有做沒淹水喔做完了之後大淹水喔您覺得這樣子能夠向居民交代嗎\n384354\t407884\t是 報告委員 我想這個目前的這個我們雖然已經進度啊 來到90幾個%但是還是最後的那個部分還沒有完成時間的部分嘛但是我們在處理 我們都一直在處理但是因為這個啟動的時間在過去那比較慢一點但是颱風這個時候來我們也只能努力啦\n409104\t435518\t我沒有說你們不努力說實在水利署是很努力但是我的意思是它這個是中央管河川這個大湖口溪是中央管河川它要花這12億它難道不用通盤檢討嗎它難道不用通盤檢討說它如果增高堤防它花了12億增高堤防它外水增高壓力增大它整個外水倒灌進去從這個湘涵\n437179\t460026\t倒灌進去市區結果沒有加高不淹水加高了之後外面壓力增大它整個回堵倒灌整個斗南市區都淹水這個南道水利署在想要加高的時候都沒有計算過說它外水加高的時候會增加多少壓力它必須建議說要做一個水閘門在這裡嘛為什麼不做通盤檢討呢\n461266\t463467\t怎麼會一下坐這裡然後出現問題再坐那裡呢是 報告委員我想我們都會通盤檢討過去的計畫事實證明他就是沒有通盤檢討才發生這個問題的嘛這個問題說實在蓋這個水閘門多少錢你知道嗎蓋這個水閘門可能幾百萬就做起來了\n478797\t499687\t可是因為水利署他沒有通盤檢討他花了12億加高了兩邊堤防很棒這個我也感謝他們但是怎麼會在加高堤防的同時你不去想說你外面的壓力增高他有可能會倒灌舉一個例子湖北鎮蓋西安抽水站的時候他因為\n500507\t526506\t是用向下打出去的它也因為外水壓力過大本來沒有做那個抽水站都不淹水一做了之後整個河水倒灌虎尾鎮都淹水這是同樣的道理啊所以我現在要講的是說103年完成了這個鄉罕到目前為止到今年為止從來都不曾發生過這樣子嚴重淹水的問題結果今年完成堤防加高之後\n527247\t541743\t就馬上倒灌淹水了這樣子的規劃不僅讓地方的民眾受苦而且還要地方政府額外去負擔經費這到底是誰的問題而且所有的工程計畫都要中央審核\n542244\t567635\t中央才是內行人啊所以要麻煩院長啊還有部長要責成相關的單位要通盤檢討之外還要有審慎的規劃這個不是說推給誰就行的不是說推給縣府推給公所就沒事了這個治水計畫還是要繼續就好像剛才院長講的我也很感動啊他覺得說要趕快再有一個新的治水的特別預算趕快來解決這些問題\n568735\t588911\t那我現在不是要就責任何人我是說我們要趕快解決問題是不是大家一起來解決問題包括內政部現在假設是內水排不出去的話如果這個加了水門那內水排不出去內水歸內政部管是不是可以在這旁邊加蓋一個簡易的抽水站\n590232\t609080\t讓他可以把內水抽出去這個部分是不是內政部長也可以關心一下這個設計當初的這個食餘量的設計沒有到實際發生的時候的食餘量這麼大他這個設計是夠的他今年沒有議題他加高了之後\n610222\t629175\t我現在的意思是說它的設計沒有問題它的問題出在於它沒有通盤檢討它沒有發現說它沒有發現你不要幫我們解釋啊降雨的那個量我跟你說它有符合它今年有符合它這個加了之後的確是\n630549\t647286\t外水沒有液體出來他做的沒有問題他做的問題是在於他沒有通盤檢討他沒有發現說他水壓加高會造成倒灌所以變成是你未來要做的你必須要通盤檢討要做下來所以我希望說院長部長\n648647\t664921\t是不是可以責成這個水利署坐下來好好再做一個覆盤包括我要求水利署跟經濟部做三件事情委員是否同意第一個檢討這次為什麼會淹水的原因把它檢討出來這次為什麼淹水\n666243\t682585\t馬上來解決這次淹水原因如果要增加閘門增加什麼事是馬上來做這個還有那個內水戳出去的那個整個系統再來檢討一次當初做的這個加高提案雖然是很好那有沒有忽略了其他的地方或是哪裡不足我想三個層次來處理好不好\n683186\t703412\t好 拜託院長 拜託院長謝謝 院長你這樣子的態度我想我們所有的災民都會非常感謝你那我們這個問題希望可以儘速的得到一個回應那是不是看這個禮拜之內水利署可以盡快的到我們雲林來然後來解決這個問題我們請署長或是代理長到現場再馬上看一次 好 謝謝是 這個問題我們會根據這個院長的指示馬上處理\n708888\t714367\t好 謝謝那我也再想要給院長看一下下一個Power Point\n716144\t739029\t就是這個PowerPoint其實這個出來的時候我真的嚇一跳行政院的第一個版本裡面這一次丹納斯颱風雲林受損那麼嚴重竟然第一個版本裡面區域沒有包含納入雲林線那經過本席提醒之後趕快用紅字再加上雲林線等縣市其實為什麼我會那麼緊張\n740069\t756349\t因為我們很擔心很擔心說假設你風災的災區範圍沒有寫到雲林縣到時候560億我們如果一毛都分不到怎麼辦呢所以院長我在這裡提醒您真的 災民\n757671\t784724\t跟我一樣 我們都很歡樂的想說 你知道嗎 我們也很不願意受災我們也很不願意受到這個農損結果一看到說行政院的那個災後特別條例近年不穩我們這樣陷到這麼嚴重 你還親身去看你還 總統也親身去看是不是這個以後要特別提醒行政院要重視一下不然 實在是很歡樂的那我也繼續請問院長\n786505\t809774\t重建條例編了560億那這筆預算會怎麼樣在農業水利交通社會復原等項目之間分配呢分配的數我們現在在核算當中就是出現560億的總數那如果條例通過之後我們會另外送一個特別預算請大院來審議那時候通過特別預算才會是具體執行的\n811175\t829429\t瞭解那雲林在這個農損農業損害中的這個佔比是全國的前段班大概算起來農業災損是排名全國第二那是否會以這個損失的比例作為一個資源分配的依據呢一定是以實際自災發生損害的受災情況來經過認定之後農業部來彙整那經過\n837395\t845506\t整個特別預算的籌編來進行到裡面讓我會希望會達到一個最大的照顧最廣泛的照顧而且最實際的照顧\n846460\t868877\t這一點要特別拜託院長關於農業部的問題待會我再繼續提醒您因為我們也覺得受到不公平的待遇那我先針對這個預算分配幾點建議之後我們再來討論農業部的問題那就是有關於這個特別條例如果通過之後呢是不是農業救助跟其他的工程項目它是不一樣的\n870759\t897960\t農業復耕他是有黃金時期啊他是你這一週你下一週你這個節氣沒有種下去其實他的收成就影響了那會大幅的把他的產值品質都下降可不可以承諾有關於農業復耕的這個補助啊條例通過之後一週內甚至兩週內先撥款給農民呢因為復耕這件事情喔不是說他今天想種就可以種他必須照著那種節氣來種啊\n900316\t912971\t好 這個特別條例的裁員來自於舉債那我們要完成這個程序之後我一定要求各部會及時迅速的執行最快的時間在執行完畢表示政府\n916714\t941979\t那現在新的標準是什麼請問一下\n964660\t969724\t好謝謝謝謝張家俊文 子馨謝謝卓院長還有各格院的備詢 謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝院長我想請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備選\n主任長辛苦了那自己這一個多月來我想您也多次的到現場去看災業了解目前災區的一些需要那包括所有基層救災防災的人員的辛苦我想您都看在眼裡那我想給您看幾個照片你看這個是我們雲林林內平頂的路段\n有看到嗎是不是斷的這個肝殘寸斷Y7 扭8您覺得這是不是應該要緊急搶修呢是不是應該要有趕快做出變道絕對影響到\n人民的安全如果有產業的話也影響到產業的進出沒錯所以這影響到了人民的安全還有他們的生計但是呢這些路段都在於八色鳥保護區所以依照野生動物保育法呢他必須要\n林業署同意他才可以施作他甚至都不允許他可以去做這個變道所以呢這些產業道路到現在為止呢都必須要公文往返您知道去年凱米颱風啊\n因為這個公文往返要好幾個月超過半年所以他都沒有辦法整治啊是不是可以拜託院長責成農業部林業署針對災後的搶修不要再往返這些公文了因為他不是新的開發區啊\n他不是說我要在這裡做一個重新的開發他只是為了要修路讓農民可以通過甚至住在山裡面的這些民眾能夠安全的回家是不是可以拜託卓院長責成他們說盡速的趕快不要再流程好幾個月你看這些災民怎麼辦呢\n請部長來說明跟協助我謝謝委員提供這樣的資訊我想林保署有關於林保署所挾的這些林產業道路的部分我一定會要求他們就是盡快的搶通如果說那邊有居民的話一定要先有變道行程這個部分我想我們回去再梳理如果禁訴大概是多久因為上一次你跟我禁訴也拖了好幾個禮拜\n不是 那不一樣的案例那是去年啊對 不一樣的案例對 不一樣的案例但是那也拖了好幾個禮拜甚至好幾個月委員 我想這個部分因為他們牽涉到後面的勘察以後還要規劃\n我的意思是說你要先給他變道嘛你要勘察 你要規劃這個我都支持因為你要做一條安全的路嘛但是你不可能就讓他放著這樣子好幾個月我想先用變道的方式讓農民可以通然後後面路的部分照他們的進度去做規劃這個我想我回去再交代部長拜託你今天就要趕快下命令趕快讓他們去做變道否則這個繼續下去如果有農民又不小心掉下去\n如果不小心有任何的傷亡 誰來負責呢可以嗎 院長對 這個我們可以來處理院長 你可以公開的指示農業部盡速的來完成這個嗎\n現在我想沈部長看到這個他一定會主動來處理這個事情那我會再跟部長好好的來研究如何加速來進行是 特別拜託院長那下一張下一張你看這個邊坡你知道站在那上面的時候像一個懸崖這是去年楷米颱風走山的樣子它上面在懸崖的最上方都是屋子那屋子是可能差幾十公分就要全部掉下來了\n到現在因為要走這個流程因為要走這個八色鳥保護區的流程然後還要做什麼審查流程 工程流程到現在還沒有辦法做所以我也希望說不要明年的這個時候我還要再拿出這些照片來給院長看說沒辦法做那這些人民他們欲哭無淚啊\n我跟委員報告就是我們在做整個大規模崩塌的這個防治的時候我必須要講你保護區的開發限制應該是針對開發案啊你怎麼會針對災後搶修呢這是一個重點就是說你要自己內部要修改啊你不能去年跟你講你說你要改今年再跟你講你也說你要改到底什麼時候要改這是我第一次\n你上次來我辦公室我親自拿給你的\n你還跟我說好好好的確那個時候有幫忙但是已經比就是你的幫忙已經比本來的時候快了我沒有要在這裡跟你爭論這個我們的大規模崩塌我們不會因為保護區就比較慢我們會積極的做的確是比較慢因為沒有經過你知道那個根本地方政府公所他不敢去改變到因為林務署沒有同意啊沒有同意\n沒有廠商敢去做你知道嗎所以這個是一個很大的問題院長拜託您我不需要在這裡跟部長爭誰對誰錯問題是災民他就沒有受到幫助嘛他就現在出入不安全嘛你現在是要在這裡跟我爭論你沒有責任嗎絕對不是這樣子我接下來要問的是水利問題\n我接下來想要跟院長反映一個我們雲林地方的問題就是我們大湖口溪淹水的情況非常嚴重這一次呢大湖口溪這個治理啊我想要呼籲就是不能夠頭痛一頭腳痛一腳水利署其實是一個我非常敬重的單位他們很有專業有經驗理應要通盤檢討結果今年的7月12號\n他們發了一個新聞稿到現場去看到現場去看沾沾自喜的發文說花了12億加高提房結果不到半個月不到半個月就淹水了而且是本來沒有做沒淹水喔做完了之後大淹水喔您覺得這樣子能夠向居民交代嗎\n是 報告委員 我想這個目前的這個我們雖然已經進度啊 來到90幾個%但是還是最後的那個部分還沒有完成時間的部分嘛但是我們在處理 我們都一直在處理但是因為這個啟動的時間在過去那比較慢一點但是颱風這個時候來我們也只能努力啦\n我沒有說你們不努力說實在水利署是很努力但是我的意思是它這個是中央管河川這個大湖口溪是中央管河川它要花這12億它難道不用通盤檢討嗎它難道不用通盤檢討說它如果增高堤防它花了12億增高堤防它外水增高壓力增大它整個外水倒灌進去從這個湘涵\n倒灌進去市區結果沒有加高不淹水加高了之後外面壓力增大它整個回堵倒灌整個斗南市區都淹水這個南道水利署在想要加高的時候都沒有計算過說它外水加高的時候會增加多少壓力它必須建議說要做一個水閘門在這裡嘛為什麼不做通盤檢討呢\n怎麼會一下坐這裡然後出現問題再坐那裡呢是 報告委員我想我們都會通盤檢討過去的計畫事實證明他就是沒有通盤檢討才發生這個問題的嘛這個問題說實在蓋這個水閘門多少錢你知道嗎蓋這個水閘門可能幾百萬就做起來了\n可是因為水利署他沒有通盤檢討他花了12億加高了兩邊堤防很棒這個我也感謝他們但是怎麼會在加高堤防的同時你不去想說你外面的壓力增高他有可能會倒灌舉一個例子湖北鎮蓋西安抽水站的時候他因為\n是用向下打出去的它也因為外水壓力過大本來沒有做那個抽水站都不淹水一做了之後整個河水倒灌虎尾鎮都淹水這是同樣的道理啊所以我現在要講的是說103年完成了這個鄉罕到目前為止到今年為止從來都不曾發生過這樣子嚴重淹水的問題結果今年完成堤防加高之後\n就馬上倒灌淹水了這樣子的規劃不僅讓地方的民眾受苦而且還要地方政府額外去負擔經費這到底是誰的問題而且所有的工程計畫都要中央審核\n中央才是內行人啊所以要麻煩院長啊還有部長要責成相關的單位要通盤檢討之外還要有審慎的規劃這個不是說推給誰就行的不是說推給縣府推給公所就沒事了這個治水計畫還是要繼續就好像剛才院長講的我也很感動啊他覺得說要趕快再有一個新的治水的特別預算趕快來解決這些問題\n那我現在不是要就責任何人我是說我們要趕快解決問題是不是大家一起來解決問題包括內政部現在假設是內水排不出去的話如果這個加了水門那內水排不出去內水歸內政部管是不是可以在這旁邊加蓋一個簡易的抽水站\n讓他可以把內水抽出去這個部分是不是內政部長也可以關心一下這個設計當初的這個食餘量的設計沒有到實際發生的時候的食餘量這麼大他這個設計是夠的他今年沒有議題他加高了之後\n我現在的意思是說它的設計沒有問題它的問題出在於它沒有通盤檢討它沒有發現說它沒有發現你不要幫我們解釋啊降雨的那個量我跟你說它有符合它今年有符合它這個加了之後的確是\n外水沒有液體出來他做的沒有問題他做的問題是在於他沒有通盤檢討他沒有發現說他水壓加高會造成倒灌所以變成是你未來要做的你必須要通盤檢討要做下來所以我希望說院長部長\n是不是可以責成這個水利署坐下來好好再做一個覆盤包括我要求水利署跟經濟部做三件事情委員是否同意第一個檢討這次為什麼會淹水的原因把它檢討出來這次為什麼淹水\n馬上來解決這次淹水原因如果要增加閘門增加什麼事是馬上來做這個還有那個內水戳出去的那個整個系統再來檢討一次當初做的這個加高提案雖然是很好那有沒有忽略了其他的地方或是哪裡不足我想三個層次來處理好不好\n好 拜託院長 拜託院長謝謝 院長你這樣子的態度我想我們所有的災民都會非常感謝你那我們這個問題希望可以儘速的得到一個回應那是不是看這個禮拜之內水利署可以盡快的到我們雲林來然後來解決這個問題我們請署長或是代理長到現場再馬上看一次 好 謝謝是 這個問題我們會根據這個院長的指示馬上處理\n好 謝謝那我也再想要給院長看一下下一個Power Point\n就是這個PowerPoint其實這個出來的時候我真的嚇一跳行政院的第一個版本裡面這一次丹納斯颱風雲林受損那麼嚴重竟然第一個版本裡面區域沒有包含納入雲林線那經過本席提醒之後趕快用紅字再加上雲林線等縣市其實為什麼我會那麼緊張\n因為我們很擔心很擔心說假設你風災的災區範圍沒有寫到雲林縣到時候560億我們如果一毛都分不到怎麼辦呢所以院長我在這裡提醒您真的 災民\n跟我一樣 我們都很歡樂的想說 你知道嗎 我們也很不願意受災我們也很不願意受到這個農損結果一看到說行政院的那個災後特別條例近年不穩我們這樣陷到這麼嚴重 你還親身去看你還 總統也親身去看是不是這個以後要特別提醒行政院要重視一下不然 實在是很歡樂的那我也繼續請問院長\n重建條例編了560億那這筆預算會怎麼樣在農業水利交通社會復原等項目之間分配呢分配的數我們現在在核算當中就是出現560億的總數那如果條例通過之後我們會另外送一個特別預算請大院來審議那時候通過特別預算才會是具體執行的\n瞭解那雲林在這個農損農業損害中的這個佔比是全國的前段班大概算起來農業災損是排名全國第二那是否會以這個損失的比例作為一個資源分配的依據呢一定是以實際自災發生損害的受災情況來經過認定之後農業部來彙整那經過\n整個特別預算的籌編來進行到裡面讓我會希望會達到一個最大的照顧最廣泛的照顧而且最實際的照顧\n這一點要特別拜託院長關於農業部的問題待會我再繼續提醒您因為我們也覺得受到不公平的待遇那我先針對這個預算分配幾點建議之後我們再來討論農業部的問題那就是有關於這個特別條例如果通過之後呢是不是農業救助跟其他的工程項目它是不一樣的\n農業復耕他是有黃金時期啊他是你這一週你下一週你這個節氣沒有種下去其實他的收成就影響了那會大幅的把他的產值品質都下降可不可以承諾有關於農業復耕的這個補助啊條例通過之後一週內甚至兩週內先撥款給農民呢因為復耕這件事情喔不是說他今天想種就可以種他必須照著那種節氣來種啊\n好 這個特別條例的裁員來自於舉債那我們要完成這個程序之後我一定要求各部會及時迅速的執行最快的時間在執行完畢表示政府\n那現在新的標準是什麼請問一下\n好謝謝謝謝張家俊文 子馨謝謝卓院長還有各格院的備詢 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.330 --> 00:04.084\n謝謝院長我想請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備選\n\n00:07.216 --> 00:31.003\n主任長辛苦了那自己這一個多月來我想您也多次的到現場去看災業了解目前災區的一些需要那包括所有基層救災防災的人員的辛苦我想您都看在眼裡那我想給您看幾個照片你看這個是我們雲林林內平頂的路段\n\n00:32.170 --> 00:45.168\n有看到嗎是不是斷的這個肝殘寸斷Y7扭8您覺得這是不是應該要緊急搶修呢是不是應該要有趕快做出變道絕對影響到\n\n00:48.203 --> 01:06.504\n人民的安全如果有產業的話也影響到產業的進出沒錯所以這影響到了人民的安全還有他們的生計但是呢這些路段都在於八色鳥保護區所以依照野生動物保育法呢他必須要\n\n01:07.185 --> 01:21.552\n林業署同意他才可以施作他甚至都不允許他可以去做這個變道所以呢這些產業道路到現在為止呢都必須要公文往返您知道去年凱米颱風啊\n\n01:23.291 --> 01:39.960\n因為這個公文往返要好幾個月超過半年所以他都沒有辦法整治啊是不是可以拜託院長責成農業部林業署針對災後的搶修不要再往返這些公文了因為他不是新的開發區啊\n\n01:41.221 --> 02:00.111\n他不是說我要在這裡做一個重新的開發他只是為了要修路讓農民可以通過甚至住在山裡面的這些民眾能夠安全的回家是不是可以拜託卓院長責成他們說盡速的趕快不要再流程好幾個月你看這些災民怎麼辦呢\n\n02:01.813 --> 02:22.773\n請部長來說明跟協助我謝謝委員提供這樣的資訊我想林保署有關於林保署所挾的這些林產業道路的部分我一定會要求他們就是盡快的搶通如果說那邊有居民的話一定要先有變道行程這個部分我想我們回去再梳理如果禁訴大概是多久因為上一次你跟我禁訴也拖了好幾個禮拜\n\n02:23.914 --> 02:37.510\n不是那不一樣的案例那是去年啊對不一樣的案例對不一樣的案例但是那也拖了好幾個禮拜甚至好幾個月委員我想這個部分因為他們牽涉到後面的勘察以後還要規劃\n\n02:38.851 --> 03:05.122\n我的意思是說你要先給他變道嘛你要勘察你要規劃這個我都支持因為你要做一條安全的路嘛但是你不可能就讓他放著這樣子好幾個月我想先用變道的方式讓農民可以通然後後面路的部分照他們的進度去做規劃這個我想我回去再交代部長拜託你今天就要趕快下命令趕快讓他們去做變道否則這個繼續下去如果有農民又不小心掉下去\n\n03:05.902 --> 03:15.567\n如果不小心有任何的傷亡誰來負責呢可以嗎院長對這個我們可以來處理院長你可以公開的指示農業部盡速的來完成這個嗎\n\n03:17.126 --> 03:43.461\n現在我想沈部長看到這個他一定會主動來處理這個事情那我會再跟部長好好的來研究如何加速來進行是特別拜託院長那下一張下一張你看這個邊坡你知道站在那上面的時候像一個懸崖這是去年楷米颱風走山的樣子它上面在懸崖的最上方都是屋子那屋子是可能差幾十公分就要全部掉下來了\n\n03:44.602 --> 04:09.345\n到現在因為要走這個流程因為要走這個八色鳥保護區的流程然後還要做什麼審查流程工程流程到現在還沒有辦法做所以我也希望說不要明年的這個時候我還要再拿出這些照片來給院長看說沒辦法做那這些人民他們欲哭無淚啊\n\n04:10.294 --> 04:35.788\n我跟委員報告就是我們在做整個大規模崩塌的這個防治的時候我必須要講你保護區的開發限制應該是針對開發案啊你怎麼會針對災後搶修呢這是一個重點就是說你要自己內部要修改啊你不能去年跟你講你說你要改今年再跟你講你也說你要改到底什麼時候要改這是我第一次\n\n04:36.992 --> 04:38.841\n你上次來我辦公室我親自拿給你的\n\n04:41.397 --> 05:08.034\n你還跟我說好好好的確那個時候有幫忙但是已經比就是你的幫忙已經比本來的時候快了我沒有要在這裡跟你爭論這個我們的大規模崩塌我們不會因為保護區就比較慢我們會積極的做的確是比較慢因為沒有經過你知道那個根本地方政府公所他不敢去改變到因為林務署沒有同意啊沒有同意\n\n05:08.974 --> 05:17.236\n沒有廠商敢去做你知道嗎所以這個是一個很大的問題院長拜託您我不需要在這裡跟部長爭誰對誰錯問題是災民他就沒有受到幫助嘛他就現在出入不安全嘛你現在是要在這裡跟我爭論你沒有責任嗎絕對不是這樣子我接下來要問的是水利問題\n\n05:32.279 --> 05:54.863\n我接下來想要跟院長反映一個我們雲林地方的問題就是我們大湖口溪淹水的情況非常嚴重這一次呢大湖口溪這個治理啊我想要呼籲就是不能夠頭痛一頭腳痛一腳水利署其實是一個我非常敬重的單位他們很有專業有經驗理應要通盤檢討結果今年的7月12號\n\n05:59.864 --> 06:21.269\n他們發了一個新聞稿到現場去看到現場去看沾沾自喜的發文說花了12億加高提房結果不到半個月不到半個月就淹水了而且是本來沒有做沒淹水喔做完了之後大淹水喔您覺得這樣子能夠向居民交代嗎\n\n06:24.354 --> 06:47.884\n是報告委員我想這個目前的這個我們雖然已經進度啊來到90幾個%但是還是最後的那個部分還沒有完成時間的部分嘛但是我們在處理我們都一直在處理但是因為這個啟動的時間在過去那比較慢一點但是颱風這個時候來我們也只能努力啦\n\n06:49.104 --> 07:15.518\n我沒有說你們不努力說實在水利署是很努力但是我的意思是它這個是中央管河川這個大湖口溪是中央管河川它要花這12億它難道不用通盤檢討嗎它難道不用通盤檢討說它如果增高堤防它花了12億增高堤防它外水增高壓力增大它整個外水倒灌進去從這個湘涵\n\n07:17.179 --> 07:40.026\n倒灌進去市區結果沒有加高不淹水加高了之後外面壓力增大它整個回堵倒灌整個斗南市區都淹水這個南道水利署在想要加高的時候都沒有計算過說它外水加高的時候會增加多少壓力它必須建議說要做一個水閘門在這裡嘛為什麼不做通盤檢討呢\n\n07:41.266 --> 07:43.467\n怎麼會一下坐這裡然後出現問題再坐那裡呢是報告委員我想我們都會通盤檢討過去的計畫事實證明他就是沒有通盤檢討才發生這個問題的嘛這個問題說實在蓋這個水閘門多少錢你知道嗎蓋這個水閘門可能幾百萬就做起來了\n\n07:58.797 --> 08:19.687\n可是因為水利署他沒有通盤檢討他花了12億加高了兩邊堤防很棒這個我也感謝他們但是怎麼會在加高堤防的同時你不去想說你外面的壓力增高他有可能會倒灌舉一個例子湖北鎮蓋西安抽水站的時候他因為\n\n08:20.507 --> 08:46.506\n是用向下打出去的它也因為外水壓力過大本來沒有做那個抽水站都不淹水一做了之後整個河水倒灌虎尾鎮都淹水這是同樣的道理啊所以我現在要講的是說103年完成了這個鄉罕到目前為止到今年為止從來都不曾發生過這樣子嚴重淹水的問題結果今年完成堤防加高之後\n\n08:47.247 --> 09:01.743\n就馬上倒灌淹水了這樣子的規劃不僅讓地方的民眾受苦而且還要地方政府額外去負擔經費這到底是誰的問題而且所有的工程計畫都要中央審核\n\n09:02.244 --> 09:27.635\n中央才是內行人啊所以要麻煩院長啊還有部長要責成相關的單位要通盤檢討之外還要有審慎的規劃這個不是說推給誰就行的不是說推給縣府推給公所就沒事了這個治水計畫還是要繼續就好像剛才院長講的我也很感動啊他覺得說要趕快再有一個新的治水的特別預算趕快來解決這些問題\n\n09:28.735 --> 09:48.911\n那我現在不是要就責任何人我是說我們要趕快解決問題是不是大家一起來解決問題包括內政部現在假設是內水排不出去的話如果這個加了水門那內水排不出去內水歸內政部管是不是可以在這旁邊加蓋一個簡易的抽水站\n\n09:50.232 --> 10:09.080\n讓他可以把內水抽出去這個部分是不是內政部長也可以關心一下這個設計當初的這個食餘量的設計沒有到實際發生的時候的食餘量這麼大他這個設計是夠的他今年沒有議題他加高了之後\n\n10:10.222 --> 10:29.175\n我現在的意思是說它的設計沒有問題它的問題出在於它沒有通盤檢討它沒有發現說它沒有發現你不要幫我們解釋啊降雨的那個量我跟你說它有符合它今年有符合它這個加了之後的確是\n\n10:30.549 --> 10:47.286\n外水沒有液體出來他做的沒有問題他做的問題是在於他沒有通盤檢討他沒有發現說他水壓加高會造成倒灌所以變成是你未來要做的你必須要通盤檢討要做下來所以我希望說院長部長\n\n10:48.647 --> 11:04.921\n是不是可以責成這個水利署坐下來好好再做一個覆盤包括我要求水利署跟經濟部做三件事情委員是否同意第一個檢討這次為什麼會淹水的原因把它檢討出來這次為什麼淹水\n\n11:06.243 --> 11:22.585\n馬上來解決這次淹水原因如果要增加閘門增加什麼事是馬上來做這個還有那個內水戳出去的那個整個系統再來檢討一次當初做的這個加高提案雖然是很好那有沒有忽略了其他的地方或是哪裡不足我想三個層次來處理好不好\n\n11:23.186 --> 11:43.412\n好拜託院長拜託院長謝謝院長你這樣子的態度我想我們所有的災民都會非常感謝你那我們這個問題希望可以儘速的得到一個回應那是不是看這個禮拜之內水利署可以盡快的到我們雲林來然後來解決這個問題我們請署長或是代理長到現場再馬上看一次好謝謝是這個問題我們會根據這個院長的指示馬上處理\n\n11:48.888 --> 11:54.367\n好謝謝那我也再想要給院長看一下下一個PowerPoint\n\n11:56.144 --> 12:19.029\n就是這個PowerPoint其實這個出來的時候我真的嚇一跳行政院的第一個版本裡面這一次丹納斯颱風雲林受損那麼嚴重竟然第一個版本裡面區域沒有包含納入雲林線那經過本席提醒之後趕快用紅字再加上雲林線等縣市其實為什麼我會那麼緊張\n\n12:20.069 --> 12:36.349\n因為我們很擔心很擔心說假設你風災的災區範圍沒有寫到雲林縣到時候560億我們如果一毛都分不到怎麼辦呢所以院長我在這裡提醒您真的災民\n\n12:37.671 --> 13:04.724\n跟我一樣我們都很歡樂的想說你知道嗎我們也很不願意受災我們也很不願意受到這個農損結果一看到說行政院的那個災後特別條例近年不穩我們這樣陷到這麼嚴重你還親身去看你還總統也親身去看是不是這個以後要特別提醒行政院要重視一下不然實在是很歡樂的那我也繼續請問院長\n\n13:06.505 --> 13:29.774\n重建條例編了560億那這筆預算會怎麼樣在農業水利交通社會復原等項目之間分配呢分配的數我們現在在核算當中就是出現560億的總數那如果條例通過之後我們會另外送一個特別預算請大院來審議那時候通過特別預算才會是具體執行的\n\n13:31.175 --> 13:49.429\n瞭解那雲林在這個農損農業損害中的這個佔比是全國的前段班大概算起來農業災損是排名全國第二那是否會以這個損失的比例作為一個資源分配的依據呢一定是以實際自災發生損害的受災情況來經過認定之後農業部來彙整那經過\n\n13:57.395 --> 14:05.506\n整個特別預算的籌編來進行到裡面讓我會希望會達到一個最大的照顧最廣泛的照顧而且最實際的照顧\n\n14:06.460 --> 14:28.877\n這一點要特別拜託院長關於農業部的問題待會我再繼續提醒您因為我們也覺得受到不公平的待遇那我先針對這個預算分配幾點建議之後我們再來討論農業部的問題那就是有關於這個特別條例如果通過之後呢是不是農業救助跟其他的工程項目它是不一樣的\n\n14:30.759 --> 14:57.960\n農業復耕他是有黃金時期啊他是你這一週你下一週你這個節氣沒有種下去其實他的收成就影響了那會大幅的把他的產值品質都下降可不可以承諾有關於農業復耕的這個補助啊條例通過之後一週內甚至兩週內先撥款給農民呢因為復耕這件事情喔不是說他今天想種就可以種他必須照著那種節氣來種啊\n\n15:00.316 --> 15:12.971\n好這個特別條例的裁員來自於舉債那我們要完成這個程序之後我一定要求各部會及時迅速的執行最快的時間在執行完畢表示政府\n\n15:16.714 --> 15:41.979\n那現在新的標準是什麼請問一下\n\n16:04.660 --> 16:09.724\n好謝謝謝謝張家俊文子馨謝謝卓院長還有各格院的備詢謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.33,"end":4.084,"text":"謝謝院長我想請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備選"},{"start":7.216,"end":31.003,"text":"主任長辛苦了那自己這一個多月來我想您也多次的到現場去看災業了解目前災區的一些需要那包括所有基層救災防災的人員的辛苦我想您都看在眼裡那我想給您看幾個照片你看這個是我們雲林林內平頂的路段"},{"start":32.17,"end":45.168,"text":"有看到嗎是不是斷的這個肝殘寸斷Y7 扭8您覺得這是不是應該要緊急搶修呢是不是應該要有趕快做出變道絕對影響到"},{"start":48.203,"end":66.504,"text":"人民的安全如果有產業的話也影響到產業的進出沒錯所以這影響到了人民的安全還有他們的生計但是呢這些路段都在於八色鳥保護區所以依照野生動物保育法呢他必須要"},{"start":67.185,"end":81.552,"text":"林業署同意他才可以施作他甚至都不允許他可以去做這個變道所以呢這些產業道路到現在為止呢都必須要公文往返您知道去年凱米颱風啊"},{"start":83.291,"end":99.96,"text":"因為這個公文往返要好幾個月超過半年所以他都沒有辦法整治啊是不是可以拜託院長責成農業部林業署針對災後的搶修不要再往返這些公文了因為他不是新的開發區啊"},{"start":101.221,"end":120.111,"text":"他不是說我要在這裡做一個重新的開發他只是為了要修路讓農民可以通過甚至住在山裡面的這些民眾能夠安全的回家是不是可以拜託卓院長責成他們說盡速的趕快不要再流程好幾個月你看這些災民怎麼辦呢"},{"start":121.813,"end":142.773,"text":"請部長來說明跟協助我謝謝委員提供這樣的資訊我想林保署有關於林保署所挾的這些林產業道路的部分我一定會要求他們就是盡快的搶通如果說那邊有居民的話一定要先有變道行程這個部分我想我們回去再梳理如果禁訴大概是多久因為上一次你跟我禁訴也拖了好幾個禮拜"},{"start":143.914,"end":157.51,"text":"不是 那不一樣的案例那是去年啊對 不一樣的案例對 不一樣的案例但是那也拖了好幾個禮拜甚至好幾個月委員 我想這個部分因為他們牽涉到後面的勘察以後還要規劃"},{"start":158.851,"end":185.122,"text":"我的意思是說你要先給他變道嘛你要勘察 你要規劃這個我都支持因為你要做一條安全的路嘛但是你不可能就讓他放著這樣子好幾個月我想先用變道的方式讓農民可以通然後後面路的部分照他們的進度去做規劃這個我想我回去再交代部長拜託你今天就要趕快下命令趕快讓他們去做變道否則這個繼續下去如果有農民又不小心掉下去"},{"start":185.902,"end":195.567,"text":"如果不小心有任何的傷亡 誰來負責呢可以嗎 院長對 這個我們可以來處理院長 你可以公開的指示農業部盡速的來完成這個嗎"},{"start":197.126,"end":223.461,"text":"現在我想沈部長看到這個他一定會主動來處理這個事情那我會再跟部長好好的來研究如何加速來進行是 特別拜託院長那下一張下一張你看這個邊坡你知道站在那上面的時候像一個懸崖這是去年楷米颱風走山的樣子它上面在懸崖的最上方都是屋子那屋子是可能差幾十公分就要全部掉下來了"},{"start":224.602,"end":249.345,"text":"到現在因為要走這個流程因為要走這個八色鳥保護區的流程然後還要做什麼審查流程 工程流程到現在還沒有辦法做所以我也希望說不要明年的這個時候我還要再拿出這些照片來給院長看說沒辦法做那這些人民他們欲哭無淚啊"},{"start":250.294,"end":275.788,"text":"我跟委員報告就是我們在做整個大規模崩塌的這個防治的時候我必須要講你保護區的開發限制應該是針對開發案啊你怎麼會針對災後搶修呢這是一個重點就是說你要自己內部要修改啊你不能去年跟你講你說你要改今年再跟你講你也說你要改到底什麼時候要改這是我第一次"},{"start":276.992,"end":278.841,"text":"你上次來我辦公室我親自拿給你的"},{"start":281.397,"end":308.034,"text":"你還跟我說好好好的確那個時候有幫忙但是已經比就是你的幫忙已經比本來的時候快了我沒有要在這裡跟你爭論這個我們的大規模崩塌我們不會因為保護區就比較慢我們會積極的做的確是比較慢因為沒有經過你知道那個根本地方政府公所他不敢去改變到因為林務署沒有同意啊沒有同意"},{"start":308.974,"end":317.236,"text":"沒有廠商敢去做你知道嗎所以這個是一個很大的問題院長拜託您我不需要在這裡跟部長爭誰對誰錯問題是災民他就沒有受到幫助嘛他就現在出入不安全嘛你現在是要在這裡跟我爭論你沒有責任嗎絕對不是這樣子我接下來要問的是水利問題"},{"start":332.279,"end":354.863,"text":"我接下來想要跟院長反映一個我們雲林地方的問題就是我們大湖口溪淹水的情況非常嚴重這一次呢大湖口溪這個治理啊我想要呼籲就是不能夠頭痛一頭腳痛一腳水利署其實是一個我非常敬重的單位他們很有專業有經驗理應要通盤檢討結果今年的7月12號"},{"start":359.864,"end":381.269,"text":"他們發了一個新聞稿到現場去看到現場去看沾沾自喜的發文說花了12億加高提房結果不到半個月不到半個月就淹水了而且是本來沒有做沒淹水喔做完了之後大淹水喔您覺得這樣子能夠向居民交代嗎"},{"start":384.354,"end":407.884,"text":"是 報告委員 我想這個目前的這個我們雖然已經進度啊 來到90幾個%但是還是最後的那個部分還沒有完成時間的部分嘛但是我們在處理 我們都一直在處理但是因為這個啟動的時間在過去那比較慢一點但是颱風這個時候來我們也只能努力啦"},{"start":409.104,"end":435.518,"text":"我沒有說你們不努力說實在水利署是很努力但是我的意思是它這個是中央管河川這個大湖口溪是中央管河川它要花這12億它難道不用通盤檢討嗎它難道不用通盤檢討說它如果增高堤防它花了12億增高堤防它外水增高壓力增大它整個外水倒灌進去從這個湘涵"},{"start":437.179,"end":460.026,"text":"倒灌進去市區結果沒有加高不淹水加高了之後外面壓力增大它整個回堵倒灌整個斗南市區都淹水這個南道水利署在想要加高的時候都沒有計算過說它外水加高的時候會增加多少壓力它必須建議說要做一個水閘門在這裡嘛為什麼不做通盤檢討呢"},{"start":461.266,"end":463.467,"text":"怎麼會一下坐這裡然後出現問題再坐那裡呢是 報告委員我想我們都會通盤檢討過去的計畫事實證明他就是沒有通盤檢討才發生這個問題的嘛這個問題說實在蓋這個水閘門多少錢你知道嗎蓋這個水閘門可能幾百萬就做起來了"},{"start":478.797,"end":499.687,"text":"可是因為水利署他沒有通盤檢討他花了12億加高了兩邊堤防很棒這個我也感謝他們但是怎麼會在加高堤防的同時你不去想說你外面的壓力增高他有可能會倒灌舉一個例子湖北鎮蓋西安抽水站的時候他因為"},{"start":500.507,"end":526.506,"text":"是用向下打出去的它也因為外水壓力過大本來沒有做那個抽水站都不淹水一做了之後整個河水倒灌虎尾鎮都淹水這是同樣的道理啊所以我現在要講的是說103年完成了這個鄉罕到目前為止到今年為止從來都不曾發生過這樣子嚴重淹水的問題結果今年完成堤防加高之後"},{"start":527.247,"end":541.743,"text":"就馬上倒灌淹水了這樣子的規劃不僅讓地方的民眾受苦而且還要地方政府額外去負擔經費這到底是誰的問題而且所有的工程計畫都要中央審核"},{"start":542.244,"end":567.635,"text":"中央才是內行人啊所以要麻煩院長啊還有部長要責成相關的單位要通盤檢討之外還要有審慎的規劃這個不是說推給誰就行的不是說推給縣府推給公所就沒事了這個治水計畫還是要繼續就好像剛才院長講的我也很感動啊他覺得說要趕快再有一個新的治水的特別預算趕快來解決這些問題"},{"start":568.735,"end":588.911,"text":"那我現在不是要就責任何人我是說我們要趕快解決問題是不是大家一起來解決問題包括內政部現在假設是內水排不出去的話如果這個加了水門那內水排不出去內水歸內政部管是不是可以在這旁邊加蓋一個簡易的抽水站"},{"start":590.232,"end":609.08,"text":"讓他可以把內水抽出去這個部分是不是內政部長也可以關心一下這個設計當初的這個食餘量的設計沒有到實際發生的時候的食餘量這麼大他這個設計是夠的他今年沒有議題他加高了之後"},{"start":610.222,"end":629.175,"text":"我現在的意思是說它的設計沒有問題它的問題出在於它沒有通盤檢討它沒有發現說它沒有發現你不要幫我們解釋啊降雨的那個量我跟你說它有符合它今年有符合它這個加了之後的確是"},{"start":630.549,"end":647.286,"text":"外水沒有液體出來他做的沒有問題他做的問題是在於他沒有通盤檢討他沒有發現說他水壓加高會造成倒灌所以變成是你未來要做的你必須要通盤檢討要做下來所以我希望說院長部長"},{"start":648.647,"end":664.921,"text":"是不是可以責成這個水利署坐下來好好再做一個覆盤包括我要求水利署跟經濟部做三件事情委員是否同意第一個檢討這次為什麼會淹水的原因把它檢討出來這次為什麼淹水"},{"start":666.243,"end":682.585,"text":"馬上來解決這次淹水原因如果要增加閘門增加什麼事是馬上來做這個還有那個內水戳出去的那個整個系統再來檢討一次當初做的這個加高提案雖然是很好那有沒有忽略了其他的地方或是哪裡不足我想三個層次來處理好不好"},{"start":683.186,"end":703.412,"text":"好 拜託院長 拜託院長謝謝 院長你這樣子的態度我想我們所有的災民都會非常感謝你那我們這個問題希望可以儘速的得到一個回應那是不是看這個禮拜之內水利署可以盡快的到我們雲林來然後來解決這個問題我們請署長或是代理長到現場再馬上看一次 好 謝謝是 這個問題我們會根據這個院長的指示馬上處理"},{"start":708.888,"end":714.367,"text":"好 謝謝那我也再想要給院長看一下下一個Power Point"},{"start":716.144,"end":739.029,"text":"就是這個PowerPoint其實這個出來的時候我真的嚇一跳行政院的第一個版本裡面這一次丹納斯颱風雲林受損那麼嚴重竟然第一個版本裡面區域沒有包含納入雲林線那經過本席提醒之後趕快用紅字再加上雲林線等縣市其實為什麼我會那麼緊張"},{"start":740.069,"end":756.349,"text":"因為我們很擔心很擔心說假設你風災的災區範圍沒有寫到雲林縣到時候560億我們如果一毛都分不到怎麼辦呢所以院長我在這裡提醒您真的 災民"},{"start":757.671,"end":784.724,"text":"跟我一樣 我們都很歡樂的想說 你知道嗎 我們也很不願意受災我們也很不願意受到這個農損結果一看到說行政院的那個災後特別條例近年不穩我們這樣陷到這麼嚴重 你還親身去看你還 總統也親身去看是不是這個以後要特別提醒行政院要重視一下不然 實在是很歡樂的那我也繼續請問院長"},{"start":786.505,"end":809.774,"text":"重建條例編了560億那這筆預算會怎麼樣在農業水利交通社會復原等項目之間分配呢分配的數我們現在在核算當中就是出現560億的總數那如果條例通過之後我們會另外送一個特別預算請大院來審議那時候通過特別預算才會是具體執行的"},{"start":811.175,"end":829.429,"text":"瞭解那雲林在這個農損農業損害中的這個佔比是全國的前段班大概算起來農業災損是排名全國第二那是否會以這個損失的比例作為一個資源分配的依據呢一定是以實際自災發生損害的受災情況來經過認定之後農業部來彙整那經過"},{"start":837.395,"end":845.506,"text":"整個特別預算的籌編來進行到裡面讓我會希望會達到一個最大的照顧最廣泛的照顧而且最實際的照顧"},{"start":846.46,"end":868.877,"text":"這一點要特別拜託院長關於農業部的問題待會我再繼續提醒您因為我們也覺得受到不公平的待遇那我先針對這個預算分配幾點建議之後我們再來討論農業部的問題那就是有關於這個特別條例如果通過之後呢是不是農業救助跟其他的工程項目它是不一樣的"},{"start":870.759,"end":897.96,"text":"農業復耕他是有黃金時期啊他是你這一週你下一週你這個節氣沒有種下去其實他的收成就影響了那會大幅的把他的產值品質都下降可不可以承諾有關於農業復耕的這個補助啊條例通過之後一週內甚至兩週內先撥款給農民呢因為復耕這件事情喔不是說他今天想種就可以種他必須照著那種節氣來種啊"},{"start":900.316,"end":912.971,"text":"好 這個特別條例的裁員來自於舉債那我們要完成這個程序之後我一定要求各部會及時迅速的執行最快的時間在執行完畢表示政府"},{"start":916.714,"end":941.979,"text":"那現在新的標準是什麼請問一下"},{"start":964.66,"end":969.724,"text":"好謝謝謝謝張家俊文 子馨謝謝卓院長還有各格院的備詢 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":595,"blocks":[["張委員嘉郡：（11時22分）謝謝院長，我想請卓院長。"],["主席：麻煩再請卓院長備詢。"],["張委員嘉郡：卓院長辛苦了，這一個多月來，您也多次到現場勘災，也了解目前災區的一些需要，包括所有基層救災、防災人員的辛苦，我想您都看在眼裡。","我想給您看幾個照片，你看這個是我們雲林林內坪頂的路段，有看到嗎？是不是斷得肝腸寸斷、歪七扭八，您覺得這是不是應該要緊急搶修呢？是不是應該要趕快做出便道？"],["卓院長榮泰：這絕對影響到人民的安全，如果有產業的話，也影響產業的進出。"],["張委員嘉郡：沒錯，這影響到人民的安全還有他們的生計，但是這一些路段都在八色鳥保護區，所以依照野生動物保育法，必須要林保署同意才可以施作，甚至都不允許這邊可以做便道，所以這些產業道路到現在為止都必須要公文往返。您知道去年凱米颱風過後，因為這個公文往返要好幾個月、超過半年，所以它都沒有辦法整治，是不是可以拜託院長責成農業部林保署針對災後的搶修不要再往返這些公文，因為它不是新的開發區，不是要在這裡做一個新的開發，只是為了要修路讓農民可以通過，甚至讓住在山裡面的民眾能夠安全回家，是不是可以拜託卓院長責成他們儘速辦理，不要再讓流程走好幾個月，你看這些災民怎麼辦呢？"],["卓院長榮泰：請部長來說明跟協助。"],["陳部長駿季：謝謝委員提供這樣的資訊，有關於林保署所轄的林產業道路部分，我一定會要求他們儘快的搶通，如果那邊有居民的話，一定要先有便道形成，這個部分我們回去來處理。"],["張委員嘉郡：儘速大概是多久？因為上一次你跟我說儘速，也拖了好幾個禮拜！"],["陳部長駿季：不是，那是不一樣的案子。"],["張委員嘉郡：那是去年。"],["陳部長駿季：對，不一樣的案例。"],["張委員嘉郡：但是那也拖了好幾個禮拜，甚至好幾個月。"],["陳部長駿季：很抱歉，委員，這個部分因為牽涉到後面的勘查後還要進行規劃。"],["張委員嘉郡：是，我的意思是你要先給它便道，你要勘查、你要規劃，這個我都支持，因為你要做一條安全的路，但是你不可能就讓它放著這樣子好幾個月。"],["陳部長駿季：了解，我想先用便道的方式，讓農民可以通行，然後後面路的部分，照他們的進度去做規劃，這個我回去會交代。"],["張委員嘉郡：好不好？部長，拜託你今天就要趕快下命令，讓他們去做便道，否則這個繼續下去，如果又有農民不小心掉下去、如果不小心有任何的傷亡，誰來負責呢？院長，可以嗎？"],["陳部長駿季：對，這個我們可以來處理。"],["張委員嘉郡：院長，你可以公開的指示農業部儘速來完成這個嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：我想陳部長現在看到這個，他一定會主動來處理這件事情，我會再跟部長好好地來研究如何加速進行。"],["張委員嘉郡：是，特別拜託院長。","來看下一張圖片，你看這個邊坡，你知道站在那上面的時候像站在一個懸崖邊，這是去年凱米颱風走山的樣子，它上面、懸崖的最上方都是屋子，屋子可能差幾十公分就要全部掉下來了，到現在因為要走八色鳥保護區的流程，還要做審查流程、工程流程，所以到現在還沒有辦法做，所以我也希望，不要明年的這個時候，我還要再拿出這些照片給院長看，他們說沒辦法做，這些人民他們欲哭無淚啊！"],["陳部長駿季：我跟委員報告，我們在做整個大規模崩塌防治的時候，不會因為是保護區……"],["張委員嘉郡：我必須要講，保護區的開發限制應該是針對開發案，你怎麼會針對災後搶修呢？"],["陳部長駿季：我跟你講，這是一個重點，就是我們在……"],["張委員嘉郡：你自己內部要修改，你不能去年跟你講，你說你要改；今年再跟你講，你也說你要改，到底什麼時候要改？"],["陳部長駿季：這是我第一次知道……"],["張委員嘉郡：你上次來我辦公室，我親自拿給你的！你還跟我說好、好、好。"],["陳部長駿季：我沒有到你辦公室過。"],["張委員嘉郡：的確那個時候有幫忙，你的幫忙已經比本來的速度快了。"],["陳部長駿季：沒關係！我可以跟委員承諾……"],["張委員嘉郡：我沒有要在這裡跟你爭論這個……"],["陳部長駿季：這個大規模崩塌，我們不會因為保護區就比較慢，我們會積極的做。"],["張委員嘉郡：有！的確是比較慢，因為沒有經過……你知道地方政府、公所根本不敢去蓋便道，因為林保署沒有同意，沒有廠商敢去做，你知道嗎？所以這是一個很大的問題，院長，拜託您，我不需要在這裡跟部長爭誰對誰錯，問題是災民就沒有受到幫助嘛！他現在就是出入不安全，你現在是要在這裡跟我爭論這你沒有責任嗎？絕對不是這樣子……"],["陳部長駿季：我不是這樣講，因為便道也要安全……"],["張委員嘉郡：接下來要問的是水利問題，我接下來想要跟院長反映一個我們雲林地方的問題，就是我們大湖口溪淹水的情況非常嚴重，我想要呼籲，這一次大湖口溪的治理不能夠頭痛醫頭、腳痛醫腳，水利署其實是一個我非常敬重的單位，他們很有專業、有經驗，理應要通盤檢討，結果今年的7月12號他們發了一個新聞稿，即他們到現場去看，沾沾自喜的發文說，花了12億加高堤防，結果不到半個月就淹水了，而且本來沒有做的時候沒淹水喔！做完了之後大淹水！您覺得這樣子能夠向居民交代嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：請部長說明。"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，目前我們的進度雖然來到百分之九十幾，但最後的那個部分還沒有完成，是時間的部分，我們一直有在處理，因為啟動的時間在過去比較慢一點，但是颱風這個時候來，我們也只能努力啦！"],["張委員嘉郡：我沒有說你們不努力，說實在水利署是很努力，但是我的意思是中央管河川，關於這個大湖口溪計畫要花這12億，難道不用通盤檢討嗎？難道不用通盤檢討如果花了12億增高堤防，外水增高，壓力增大，整個外水倒灌進去，從這個箱涵倒灌進去市區，結果沒有加高的時候不會淹水；加高了之後，外面壓力增大，整個回堵、倒灌，整個斗南市區都淹水，難道水利署在想要加高的時候都沒有計算過外水加高的時候會增加多少壓力，它必須建議要做一個水閘門在這裡？為什麼不做通盤檢討呢？怎麼會一下做這裡，然後出現問題時再做那裡呢？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，我們都會通盤檢討，過去的計畫在執行的過程到現在，為什麼會……"],["張委員嘉郡：事實證明它就是沒有通盤檢討才發生這個問題嘛，這個問題說實在的，蓋這個水閘門多少錢，你知道嗎？蓋這個水閘門可能幾百萬就做得起來了，可是因為水利署沒有通盤檢討，它花了12億加高了兩邊堤防，很棒！這個我也感謝他們，但是怎麼會在加高堤防的同時，不去想外面的壓力增高，它有可能會倒灌？"],["郭部長智輝：因為……"],["張委員嘉郡：舉一個例子，虎尾鎮蓋西安抽水站的時候，因為是向下打出去的，它也因為外水壓力過大，本來沒有做抽水站都不淹水，一做了之後，整個河水倒灌，虎尾鎮都淹水了，這是同樣的道理啊！所以我現在要講的是，103年完成了這個箱涵，到今年為止，從來都不曾發生過這麼嚴重的淹水問題，結果今年完成堤防加高之後，就馬上倒灌、淹水了，這樣子的規劃不僅讓地方的民眾受苦，而且還要地方政府額外負擔經費去處理，這到底是誰的問題？而且所有的工程計畫都要中央審核，中央才是內行人啊！所以要麻煩院長還有部長責成相關的單位通盤檢討之外，還要審慎的規劃，這個不是說推給誰就行的，不是說推給縣府、推給公所就沒事了，這個治水計畫還是要繼續，就好像剛才院長講的，我也很感動，他覺得要趕快再有一個新的治水的特別預算，趕快來解決這些問題。","我現在不是要究責任何人，我是說我們要趕快解決問題，是不是大家一起來解決問題？包括內政部，假設現在是內水排不出去的話，如果這個加了水門，內水排不出去，內水歸內政部管，是不是可以在這旁邊加蓋一個簡易的抽水站，讓它可以把內水抽出去？這個部分是不是內政部長也可以關心一下？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，我想當初設計時的時雨量沒有到實際發生時的時雨量這麼大，所以它外面的水就沒有辦法……"],["張委員嘉郡：我跟你說，它這個設計是夠的，它今年沒有溢堤，它加高了之後……我現在的意思是說它的設計沒有問題，它的問題在於沒有通盤檢討，它沒有發現……"],["郭部長智輝：因為我們是根據過去的經驗，包括時雨量、降雨量……"],["張委員嘉郡：你不要幫他們解釋，我跟你說，它有符合，它今年有符合，它這個加了之後的確是外水沒有溢堤出來，它做的沒有問題，它的問題在於沒有通盤檢討，它沒有發現水壓加高會造成倒灌，變成你未來要做的是必須要通盤檢討，所以我希望院長、部長，是不是可以責成水利署坐下來好好再做個複盤？"],["卓院長榮泰：報告委員，我要求水利署跟經濟部做三件事情，委員是否同意？第一個，檢討這一次為什麼會淹水的原因，把它檢討出來，這次為什麼會淹水。"],["張委員嘉郡：謝謝。"],["卓院長榮泰：第二個，馬上來解決這次淹水的原因，如果要增加閘門、增加什麼的，馬上來做處理。"],["張委員嘉郡：還有把內水抽出去的抽水站。"],["卓院長榮泰：第三個，整個系統再來檢討一次，當初做的這個加高堤岸，雖然是很好，但有沒有忽略其他地方或是哪裡不足，就這三個層次來處理。"],["張委員嘉郡：好，拜託院長了，謝謝院長！你這樣子的態度，我想我們所有的災民都會非常感謝你。我們這個問題希望可以儘速地得到回應，看這個禮拜之內是不是水利署可以儘快到我們雲林來解決這個問題？"],["卓院長榮泰：我們請署長或是賴次長到現場再馬上看一次，謝謝。"],["郭部長智輝：是，這個問題我們會根據院長的指示，馬上處理。"],["張委員嘉郡：好，謝謝。","接著我想要給院長看下一張PowerPoint，其實這個草案出來的時候我真的嚇一跳，這一次丹娜絲颱風雲林受損那麼嚴重，行政院第一個版本裡面的區域竟然沒有納入雲林縣！經過本席提醒之後才趕快用紅字再加上「雲林縣等縣（市）」，為什麼我會那麼緊張？因為我們很擔心、很擔心，假設你風災的災區範圍沒有寫到雲林縣，到時候560億我們如果一毛都分不到怎麼辦？所以院長，我在這裡提醒您，說真的災民跟我一樣，我們都很擔心，你知不知道我們也很不願意受災，我們也很不願意受到農損，結果一看到行政院的災後特別條例竟然沒有我們，但我們淹得這麼嚴重，你還親自去看，總統也親自去看，是不是以後要特別提醒行政院重視一下，不然我們實在是很擔心！","我繼續問院長，重建條例編了560億，那這筆預算會怎麼樣在農業、水利、交通、社會復原等項目之間來做分配呢？"],["卓院長榮泰：分配的數額我們現在在核算當中就出現560億的總數，如果條例通過之後，我們會另外送一個特別預算請大院來審議，那個時候通過的特別預算才會是具體執行的數字。"],["張委員嘉郡：了解。雲林在農業損害中的占比是全國的前段班，大概算起來農業災損是排名全國第二，是否會以損失的比例作為一個資源分配的依據呢？"],["卓院長榮泰：是，一定是以實際致災、發生損害的受災情況，經過認定之後由農業部來彙整，並經過整個特別預算的籌編進到裡面，我希望會達到最大的、最廣泛的而且最實際的照顧。"],["張委員嘉郡：這一點要特別拜託院長，關於農業部的問題，待會我再繼續提醒您，因為我們也覺得受到不公平的待遇，我先針對這個預算分配提幾點建議之後，我們再來討論農業部的問題。","有關於這個特別條例，如果通過之後，是不是農業救助跟其他的工程項目是不一樣的？農業復耕是有黃金時期，這一週或下一週或這個節氣沒有種下去，其實它的收成就影響了，會大幅地把它的產值、品質都下降，有關於農業復耕的補助條例通過之後，可不可以承諾一週內甚至兩週內先撥款給農民呢？因為復耕這件事情，不是說他今天想種就可以種，他必須照著節氣來種。"],["卓院長榮泰：特別條例的財源來自於舉債，只要完成程序之後，我一定要求各部會即時、迅速地執行，在最快的時間內執行完畢，表示政府對人民的承諾。"],["張委員嘉郡：而且我必須要提醒院長，農業部的部分，雲林都沒有納入全品項，到目前為止，我問了農業部長好多次，它的標準是什麼？它根本沒有標準啊！"],["卓院長榮泰：有，它有標準。"],["張委員嘉郡：以前還有千分之五，農業產值的千分之五就有，還有10級陣風以上就有，結果他告訴我說這些標準都已經取消了，那現在新的標準是什麼？"],["卓院長榮泰：我們請農業部說明，它還是有標準在的，在全品項免現勘都是有標準在的。"],["張委員嘉郡：它沒有標準！他現在告訴我，它沒有標準，他在經濟委員會告訴我說現在都要專家會議討論，沒有一個明定的標準，到目前為止……"],["卓院長榮泰：我會請農業部……"],["張委員嘉郡：連屏東都納入全品項了，只有我們雲林縣沒有！"],["卓院長榮泰：我會請農業部說明清楚，各縣市一定一律平等，這個請委員放心。"],["張委員嘉郡：謝謝。"],["卓院長榮泰：實際受災我們一定一律補償。"],["主席：謝謝張嘉郡委員的質詢，謝謝卓院長還有各位閣員的備詢。","接下來我們請賴惠員委員質詢，謝龍介委員請準備。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":138,"meet_id":"院會-11-3-24","speakers":["韓國瑜","鍾佳濱","傅崐萁","林國成","王定宇","楊瓊瓔","張啓楷","徐富癸","張嘉郡","賴惠員","謝龍介","林俊憲","王育敏","蔡易餘","邱鎮軍","郭國文","蘇清泉","陳冠廷","盧縣一","林岱樺","羅智強","劉建國","黃建賓"],"page_start":41,"meetingDate":["2025-08-12"],"gazette_id":"1147001","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1147001_00003","1147001_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期第24次會議紀錄","content":"行政院院長提出「丹娜絲颱風及七二八豪雨災後復原重建」專案報告並備質詢─ 詢答完畢─","agenda_id":"1147001_00006"}}}