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{\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"蔡\", \"start\": 960.221, \"end\": 960.843, \"score\": 0.853}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 960.843, \"end\": 961.705, \"score\": 0.913}, {\"word\": \"資\"}, {\"word\": \"訊\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"左\", \"start\": 961.705, \"end\": 961.846, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 961.846, \"end\": 962.267, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"各\", \"start\": 962.267, \"end\": 962.387, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 962.387, \"end\": 962.608, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"首\", \"start\": 962.608, \"end\": 962.628, \"score\": 0.064}, {\"word\": \"長\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:05,199 --> 00:00:11,866\n好謝謝院長那我們是不是有請卓院長以及我們陳政委麻煩再請卓院長陳政委備詢\n\n2\n00:00:21,929 --> 00:00:35,062\n蔡委員好謝謝辛苦了謝謝院長好院長丹納斯颱風從布袋登陸登陸的地方就是布袋的新聞我自己的故鄉我就是在那邊出生\n\n3\n00:00:35,731 --> 00:00:59,337\n那丹納斯颱風就是沿著巴掌溪那十七級風加進來所以我們看到從布袋新聞它的變電所是特高壓電塔就倒殺機然後沿路沿著巴掌溪所以我們看到議場包括大廈啦包括幾樓啊沿路的電感可以說吼無一幸免全部的電感倒光光\n\n4\n00:01:00,576 --> 00:01:13,169\n所以他再往外再拓出去這個十七西方的力量所以我們看到有藝族然後在旁邊入朝然後在旁邊鋪紙甚至以南的台南七國中軍那些都是電話條的\n\n5\n00:01:15,772 --> 00:01:33,594\n倒掉的一個重災區所以從這裡事實上已經可以看出說像這一種氣候的這樣的一個緊急的一個狀況然後17級風進來的時候我們就看到了說哇這個很多我們過去的基礎設施它的這個韌性的問題\n\n6\n00:01:35,476 --> 00:02:04,207\n那這一次為什麼修復電的時間最長的到了第十天才復電這中間很多台電的人員非常辛苦我們就可以知道說整個電網的問題就在於說他要先修復主幹線主幹線之後才有分期限所以院長包括你第一時間就來布袋你就背我在新聞在看那個特高壓電塔的一個修復的狀況但是我們如果在那個特高壓的一個電塔我們讓它地下化\n\n7\n00:02:06,903 --> 00:02:18,570\n那些特高壓電塔是地下化的也許就不會有因為要先修理特高壓電塔才去修理那些主幹線甚至主幹線如果是地下化的\n\n8\n00:02:20,157 --> 00:02:43,182\n這部分可以直接就是可以進入這些台電能源直接就是進入家戶去修理所以我們可以知道說整個我們要強化這樣的地方的基礎建設那這一次的特別條例也有所謂電網的一個強韌要怎麼樣電纜強韌那我認為應該從台電的特高壓以及它的主幹線\n\n9\n00:02:44,422 --> 00:02:58,710\n這部分我們是不是就可以先來做給他地下化剩餘的部分再來是這個地方是會陰水還是不會陰水再來考慮要不要地下化是不是院長我們朝這樣來努力是台電的品工工過去到現在的經驗\n\n10\n00:03:00,393 --> 00:03:15,409\n義煙水跟地層下限地區要做地下電纜確實有它自行工程上的困難那我們現在如果排除這些個地區之外能夠朝地下化去做的我們在克服工程技術各方面我們來籌措經費逐年來改善\n\n11\n00:03:16,030 --> 00:03:38,036\n那至於沒有辦法做到地下化的我曾經跟那個爬上屋電線桿上去施工的工程單位的人聊過他們認為他們也希望說比方說不要像現在一整排的電桿同樣的規模我們其中有幾根是特別強韌的讓它倒下來就是一節一節的不會全部整排都倒下來可能是5隻倒下來5隻其他都還在\n\n12\n00:03:38,576 --> 00:04:07,325\n如果中間加一段一段的強化的韌性的電線感用比較好的鋼質把它撐起來的話或許可以救急非地下化工程所能夠達到的目標那這個都請台電目前在研究當中我想我們未來再增加電網韌性除了10年有5000億我們縮短到4年來執行之外我們在這次的特別條例跟風災特別條例跟韌性特別條例當中我們都希望可以給台電更多餘的這些經費讓他\n\n13\n00:04:08,525 --> 00:04:33,235\n一方面搶修搶險一方面就近的這些韌性加強也在做適度的加強預算好院長我們很樂見我們要朝這樣的調整強化整個電網的韌性但是我們也知道說過去在做電纜的一個地下化在預算的分配上面可能就是台電要負擔一半剩下一半是地方政府負擔但是我們在這一次知道說這一種\n\n14\n00:04:37,097 --> 00:05:01,208\n全面的如果我們真的要去推主幹線的地下化第一地方政府能量負擔這個能量是不足的第二台電現在你叫他負擔事實上他的負擔是很重所以第一個我們用特別條例特別預算來協助這一塊第二個我認為這些主幹線通常是落在地方的公路總局就是我們以前講的新的\n\n15\n00:05:02,322 --> 00:05:27,845\n包括台17船台19船甚至台3船這些心得類是在向公路總局如果可以在這部分也負擔他們應該要有的一個相對應的一個責任的話我覺得適度也可以讓台電他們下降很多壓力那這部分你是不是也可以來參考一下我們這個建議是合理的我們往這個方向來做財政結構的這個分配那由中央因為電網\n\n16\n00:05:28,806 --> 00:05:32,266\n它是一個國土任性的問題中央該負比較多的責任\n\n17\n00:05:32,790 --> 00:05:59,390\n好那這部分就我們也是期待啦為這個特別預算來改觀再來就是說丹納斯後啦接下來就是強降雨啦所以台灣那包括泰布雷他曾經就是在三小時下降了400公里的雨量這個是非常的多所以然後接下來整個造成了過去的防洪標準他沒有辦法\n\n18\n00:06:00,191 --> 00:06:19,430\n達到這次的強降雨然後造成很多議題甚至就蔓延的一個狀況所以我也希望說我們為這次的特別條例事實上我們嘉義有很多需要治水的地方是需要這次特別條例來做一個處理第一就是我們的河拔水白水\n\n19\n00:06:20,271 --> 00:06:48,120\n這個哈巴蘇院長你也有來看你也有來我們浩駐家阿含那邊的鄉親甚至我們知道有一個鄉親他流著眼淚然後跟院長說希望未來不要再淹水了但是我們知道這個哈巴蘇白水壘事實上它的治理工程已經到達了80%以上的治理但是看起來還是無法因應這樣的一個強降雨過去我們是用25年的防洪標準看起來不夠這部分可能需要加強\n\n20\n00:06:48,880 --> 00:07:02,847\n那剩下的包括六角排水它也是不水如果加白水的話實際上它的地利壓不到50%所以它後面還有很長一段這一段預算就需要很多如果說我們從過去的前瞻預算\n\n21\n00:07:04,848 --> 00:07:20,714\n都只能治理一半的話我希望院長我們這次能不能再特別條例我們以及未來你所說的我們要再用一千萬一千億的特別預算四年一千億的特別預算讓這個六角排水全斷\n\n22\n00:07:22,775 --> 00:07:41,515\n這幾年就可以直接讓他全段可以讓他完成不然永遠是一段一段走上去你一段一段走上去你還是有一個問題就是說因為你上游的地方它的承載量一旦超出了它就會拔出來拔出來就會去那裡產產的這樣蔓延過去下游的村莊還是都種\n\n23\n00:07:43,748 --> 00:08:12,118\n還是全部都會淹水所以這個淹水的問題我們真的是希望要加速過去都卡在說我們基於預算的考量逐年變類逐年變類現在每天風太大風太大就逐年還是要淹水所以這問題我們還是希望院長你能夠在我們包括哈巴蘇白水我們嘉義六哈白水我們的南京大白這幾條比較重要的我們要都是我們\n\n24\n00:08:13,098 --> 00:08:16,067\n我們可不可以這邊用比較\n\n25\n00:08:21,287 --> 00:08:44,983\n一次到位的預算然後來解決這裡的淹水問題是的過去我們都比較著重在中央館河川中央館河川的整治率已經相當一個程度了那這一次的四年一千億就是明定他是在縣市館河川的改善計畫所以會進到剛剛委員所說那幾個縣市館的河川過去縣市館河川他比較沒有自己的能力\n\n26\n00:08:45,843 --> 00:09:00,851\n做那麼徹底的清淤或者整治的工程或是一樣的加高甚至出海口的這個抽排的增加加強等等那我們希望透過這一次的四年千億的限水管核酸改善能夠把這個部分給它補強回來\n\n27\n00:09:01,912 --> 00:09:25,805\n好所以跟院長我剛剛有跟你報告的包括六角排水他可能還需要三十幾億你說南境排水這個全部都加起來我估計可能要再差五十幾億因為過去都是一段一段做所以現在可能預算規模很大那我們就如同院長剛說的我們逐年來編列我們趕快在這個一千億的預算中然後來協助這一塊\n\n28\n00:09:26,785 --> 00:09:53,994\n但是我要跟院長說從去年的凱米事實上我們也看到說中央管的河川輸菌的問題還是持續中去年凱米颱風後我們在第五河川分屬它輸菌了超過400萬方的土方輸菌了這些所以在今年的強降雨巴掌溪沒有溢流了就是巴掌溪有效果\n\n29\n00:09:54,454 --> 00:10:05,561\n但是你看這個沙頂沙頂落大河結果那些土石流又沿著上游又下來我們看到整個巴蘭溪內上面的土都這樣流下來所以還是要持續要有輸進的需求\n\n30\n00:10:13,866 --> 00:10:28,452\n所以是不是我們在這一次特別條例裡面它裡面沒有講到疏浚這塊那我自己我提一個對岸我希望可以把疏浚這一塊還是把它納入在我們這一次的災後重建的條例然後持續要有預算\n\n31\n00:10:29,345 --> 00:10:49,343\n來做這一個重要河川的一個輸進這部分可以嗎中央管河川的輸進我們在年度的公務預算當中就會有所編列那我再來檢討就這一次風災好雨之後優先應該整治地區我們會把它挑出來能夠及時來改善好那謝謝院長那接下來再來講農業的問題農業的這次\n\n32\n00:10:55,154 --> 00:11:18,633\n事實上想不到啦這17級風啦17級風齁差不多在我們嘉義我們泰國本來大概是很多青榮返鄉然後在那邊做溫王寺的一個耕作所以那邊的青榮很多都投入然後都做溫王寺那這次這個風這麼強縱使他用西新崗或者是他用阿館的齁這樣的一個溫王寺都垂海去\n\n33\n00:11:20,744 --> 00:11:45,832\n行政院行政團隊也很棒啊農業部長也是說好我們要怎麼協助這些青龍讓他們恢復迅速恢復他們的生產能量好現在要恢復生產能量我們就要說好我們這個溫王寺補助八成補助八成這個青龍大家都覺得這樣有感受到我們行政院的一個誠意但是因為災害有很多不同的樣態\n\n34\n00:11:46,972 --> 00:12:12,817\n有的是我們是倒的有的是沒倒沒倒的他是胖子破了胖子破了你就要整個換新結果我們就看到了說你說胖子過去了胖子現在一分底你要修理好差不多要三十五萬我們就是給他照以往的就是補助十萬一分地補助十萬\n\n35\n00:12:15,018 --> 00:12:34,710\n結果後來就產生了這樣的一個有感覺會有感覺不講白的就是說如果我溫室是倒掉的倒掉的我補助八成我蓬勃催去的催廢去的我比較補助三十五萬補助十萬定於三成不夠所以他說乾脆\n\n36\n00:12:35,919 --> 00:12:58,139\n我的溫室抓整個就直接把它夾掉說它也是毀損當然這樣不好這樣是不好而且浪費預算所以我們想這一塊是不是我們在蓬勃上去的這塊能不能做一個調整然後讓因為我們現在已經宣布了溫室導調補助八成結果它的蓬勃的部分是不是可以這部分來做一個調整一下\n\n37\n00:12:59,057 --> 00:13:26,998\n我跟委員說明這件事情我也注意到了就是我們在處理這個溫室設施的部分重建的部分是八成沒問題那設施那個帆布的就是塑膠布的部分因為它是一個消耗性耗材那我也去調查了現在的所有的這些成本所以我現在正準備從原來的三分之一再往上調一些因為我覺得那個落差太大所以這個部分我們已經有在處理好看能不能再調整一下\n\n38\n00:13:27,557 --> 00:13:46,219\n那現在青龍因為青龍他也要恢復他的工作事實上還是需要時間然後就是叫文廣式的修繕可是文廣式的修繕大概有要做我們市的公司的那幾間他們也面臨到缺工的一個問題缺工事實上他們現在需要工也真的是掉不工\n\n39\n00:13:47,148 --> 00:14:06,458\n所以有沒有可能在這段時間我們讓這些做溫廣式的他們可能會有工會讓他們工會一樣可以納入所謂的外展的一個制度這樣因為特區外展他們可能就可以再去聘請一些移工然後來協助這段時間需要密集的來修繕這些溫廣式\n\n40\n00:14:07,728 --> 00:14:24,417\n這部分有沒有辦法來協助我跟委員說明外展移工的部分在溫室的確現在的工班也很難處理我們也預估要全部把它重新修好至少要8到12個月會拉得很長所以我想我們會盡快的跟勞動部來協調不過\n\n41\n00:14:26,218 --> 00:14:51,254\n引進外籍醫工那個可能必須時間會比較長至少要半年以後的事情所以我們現在就是我們也協調了溫室工會看他們彼此是不是可以做一些比較好的一個分工然後有一些是屬於協助工的部分我們會來幫他找一些比較臨時來做協助的這些人力來滿足他們的需求好\n\n42\n00:14:52,581 --> 00:15:08,437\n最後一個議題就是因為我們現在正在講要加速復原可是加速復原的壓力在哪裡在基層尤其是公所的公務人員但是我們從這一次知道可以很深的感受這個工程人員不夠\n\n43\n00:15:09,077 --> 00:15:28,518\n工程人員不足辦理發包的尤其是在公所這一塊公所他建設課的人以最高值等就到八值等所以他基本上是留不住人的他人都會跑到縣政府甚至是跑到中央政府中央政府值等比較高這個值等的一個差距已經造成公所留不住\n\n44\n00:15:30,879 --> 00:15:57,094\n接下來就來一個整個的一個進步所以中國租金電廠也可以來檢討一下怎麼讓集成的三級證可以留得住這樣一個工程的難度好不好除非有真的家族代表明顯有討論過六度跟非六度的那種不太拉近那主委現在請求重新再來六度對那是六度跟非六度但是還沒有處理到三級證因為三級證是一塊\n\n45\n00:15:59,820 --> 00:16:02,628\n好謝謝蔡議員的資訊謝謝左院長各部會首長\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n5199\t11866\t好謝謝院長那我們是不是有請卓院長以及我們陳政委麻煩再請卓院長陳政委備詢\n21929\t35062\t蔡委員好謝謝辛苦了謝謝院長好院長丹納斯颱風從布袋登陸登陸的地方就是布袋的新聞我自己的故鄉我就是在那邊出生\n35731\t59337\t那丹納斯颱風就是沿著巴掌溪那十七級風加進來所以我們看到從布袋新聞它的變電所是特高壓電塔就倒殺機然後沿路沿著巴掌溪所以我們看到議場包括大廈啦包括幾樓啊沿路的電感可以說吼無一幸免全部的電感倒光光\n60576\t73169\t所以他再往外再拓出去這個十七西方的力量所以我們看到有藝族然後在旁邊入朝然後在旁邊鋪紙甚至以南的台南七國 中軍那些都是電話條的\n75772\t93594\t倒掉的一個重災區所以從這裡事實上已經可以看出說像這一種氣候的這樣的一個緊急的一個狀況然後17級風進來的時候我們就看到了說哇這個很多我們過去的基礎設施它的這個韌性的問題\n95476\t124207\t那這一次為什麼修復電的時間最長的到了第十天才復電這中間很多台電的人員非常辛苦我們就可以知道說整個電網的問題就在於說他要先修復主幹線主幹線之後才有分期限所以院長包括你第一時間就來布袋你就背我在新聞在看那個特高壓電塔的一個修復的狀況但是我們如果在那個特高壓的一個電塔我們讓它地下化\n126903\t138570\t那些特高壓電塔是地下化的也許就不會有因為要先修理特高壓電塔才去修理那些主幹線甚至主幹線如果是地下化的\n140157\t163182\t這部分可以直接就是可以進入這些台電能源直接就是進入家戶去修理所以我們可以知道說整個我們要強化這樣的地方的基礎建設那這一次的特別條例也有所謂電網的一個強韌要怎麼樣電纜強韌那我認為應該從台電的特高壓以及它的主幹線\n164422\t178710\t這部分我們是不是就可以先來做給他地下化剩餘的部分再來是這個地方是會陰水還是不會陰水再來考慮要不要地下化是不是院長我們朝這樣來努力是 台電的品工工過去到現在的經驗\n180393\t195409\t義煙水跟地層下限地區要做地下電纜確實有它自行工程上的困難那我們現在如果排除這些個地區之外能夠朝地下化去做的我們在克服工程技術各方面我們來籌措經費逐年來改善\n196030\t218036\t那至於沒有辦法做到地下化的我曾經跟那個爬上屋電線桿上去施工的工程單位的人聊過他們認為他們也希望說比方說不要像現在一整排的電桿同樣的規模我們其中有幾根是特別強韌的讓它倒下來就是一節一節的不會全部整排都倒下來可能是5隻倒下來5隻其他都還在\n218576\t247325\t如果中間加一段一段的強化的韌性的電線感用比較好的鋼質把它撐起來的話或許可以救急非地下化工程所能夠達到的目標那這個都請台電目前在研究當中我想我們未來再增加電網韌性除了10年有5000億我們縮短到4年來執行之外我們在這次的特別條例跟風災特別條例跟韌性特別條例當中我們都希望可以給台電更多餘的這些經費讓他\n248525\t273235\t一方面搶修搶險一方面就近的這些韌性加強也在做適度的加強預算好 院長我們很樂見我們要朝這樣的調整強化整個電網的韌性但是我們也知道說過去在做電纜的一個地下化在預算的分配上面可能就是台電要負擔一半剩下一半是地方政府負擔但是我們在這一次知道說這一種\n277097\t301208\t全面的如果我們真的要去推主幹線的地下化第一地方政府能量負擔這個能量是不足的第二台電現在你叫他負擔事實上他的負擔是很重所以第一個我們用特別條例特別預算來協助這一塊第二個我認為這些主幹線通常是落在地方的公路總局就是我們以前講的新的\n302322\t327845\t包括台17船 台19船 甚至台3船這些心得類是在向公路總局如果可以在這部分也負擔他們應該要有的一個相對應的一個責任的話我覺得適度也可以讓台電他們下降很多壓力那這部分你是不是也可以來參考一下我們這個建議是合理的我們往這個方向來做財政結構的這個分配那由中央因為電網\n328806\t332266\t它是一個國土任性的問題 中央該負比較多的責任\n332790\t359390\t好那這部分就我們也是期待啦為這個特別預算來改觀再來就是說丹納斯後啦接下來就是強降雨啦所以台灣那包括泰布雷他曾經就是在三小時下降了400公里的雨量這個是非常的多所以然後接下來整個造成了過去的防洪標準他沒有辦法\n360191\t379430\t達到這次的強降雨然後造成很多議題甚至就蔓延的一個狀況所以我也希望說我們為這次的特別條例事實上我們嘉義有很多需要治水的地方是需要這次特別條例來做一個處理第一就是我們的河拔水白水\n380271\t408120\t這個哈巴蘇 院長你也有來看你也有來我們浩駐家阿含那邊的鄉親甚至我們知道有一個鄉親他流著眼淚然後跟院長說希望未來不要再淹水了但是我們知道這個哈巴蘇白水壘事實上它的治理工程已經到達了80%以上的治理但是看起來還是無法因應這樣的一個強降雨過去我們是用25年的防洪標準看起來不夠 這部分可能需要加強\n408880\t422847\t那剩下的包括六角排水 它也是不水如果加白水的話 實際上它的地利壓不到50%所以它後面還有很長一段這一段預算就需要很多如果說我們從過去的前瞻預算\n424848\t440714\t都只能治理一半的話我希望院長我們這次能不能再特別條例我們以及未來你所說的我們要再用一千萬一千億的特別預算四年一千億的特別預算讓這個六角排水全斷\n442775\t461515\t這幾年就可以直接讓他全段可以讓他完成不然永遠是一段一段走上去你一段一段走上去你還是有一個問題就是說因為你上游的地方它的承載量一旦超出了它就會拔出來 拔出來就會去那裡產產的這樣蔓延過去下游的村莊還是都種\n463748\t492118\t還是全部都會淹水所以這個淹水的問題我們真的是希望要加速過去都卡在說我們基於預算的考量逐年變類逐年變類現在每天風太大風太大就逐年還是要淹水所以這問題我們還是希望院長你能夠在我們包括哈巴蘇白水我們嘉義六哈白水我們的南京大白這幾條比較重要的我們要都是我們\n493098\t496067\t我們可不可以這邊用比較\n501287\t524983\t一次到位的預算然後來解決這裡的淹水問題是的過去我們都比較著重在中央館河川中央館河川的整治率已經相當一個程度了那這一次的四年一千億就是明定他是在縣市館河川的改善計畫所以會進到剛剛委員所說那幾個縣市館的河川過去縣市館河川他比較沒有自己的能力\n525843\t540851\t做那麼徹底的清淤或者整治的工程或是一樣的加高甚至出海口的這個抽排的增加加強等等那我們希望透過這一次的四年千億的限水管核酸改善能夠把這個部分給它補強回來\n541912\t565805\t好所以跟院長我剛剛有跟你報告的包括六角排水他可能還需要三十幾億你說南境排水這個全部都加起來我估計可能要再差五十幾億因為過去都是一段一段做所以現在可能預算規模很大那我們就如同院長剛說的我們逐年來編列我們趕快在這個一千億的預算中然後來協助這一塊\n566785\t593994\t但是我要跟院長說從去年的凱米事實上我們也看到說中央管的河川輸菌的問題還是持續中去年凱米颱風後我們在第五河川分屬它輸菌了超過400萬方的土方輸菌了這些所以在今年的強降雨巴掌溪沒有溢流了就是巴掌溪有效果\n594454\t605561\t但是你看這個沙頂 沙頂落大河結果那些土石流又沿著上游又下來我們看到整個巴蘭溪內上面的土都這樣流下來所以還是要持續要有輸進的需求\n613866\t628452\t所以是不是我們在這一次特別條例裡面它裡面沒有講到疏浚這塊那我自己我提一個對岸我希望可以把疏浚這一塊還是把它納入在我們這一次的災後重建的條例然後持續要有預算\n629345\t649343\t來做這一個重要河川的一個輸進這部分可以嗎中央管河川的輸進我們在年度的公務預算當中就會有所編列那我再來檢討就這一次風災好雨之後優先應該整治地區我們會把它挑出來能夠及時來改善好那謝謝院長那接下來再來講農業的問題農業的這次\n655154\t678633\t事實上想不到啦 這17級風啦17級風齁 差不多在我們嘉義我們泰國本來大概是很多青榮返鄉然後在那邊做溫王寺的一個耕作所以那邊的青榮很多都投入然後都做溫王寺那這次這個風這麼強縱使他用西新崗或者是他用阿館的齁這樣的一個溫王寺都垂海去\n680744\t705832\t行政院 行政團隊也很棒啊農業部長也是說好 我們要怎麼協助這些青龍讓他們恢復迅速恢復他們的生產能量好 現在要恢復生產能量我們就要說好 我們這個溫王寺補助八成補助八成這個青龍大家都覺得這樣有感受到我們行政院的一個誠意但是因為災害有很多不同的樣態\n706972\t732817\t有的是我們是倒的 有的是沒倒沒倒的 他是胖子破了胖子破了 你就要整個換新結果我們就看到了說 你說胖子過去了胖子現在一分底 你要修理好差不多要三十五萬我們就是給他照以往的就是補助十萬一分地補助十萬\n735018\t754710\t結果後來就產生了這樣的一個有感覺會有感覺不講白的就是說如果我溫室是倒掉的倒掉的我補助八成我蓬勃催去的催廢去的我比較補助三十五萬補助十萬定於三成不夠所以他說乾脆\n755919\t778139\t我的溫室抓整個就直接把它夾掉說它也是毀損 當然這樣不好這樣是不好 而且浪費預算所以我們想這一塊是不是我們在蓬勃上去的這塊能不能做一個調整然後讓因為我們現在已經宣布了溫室導調補助八成結果它的蓬勃的部分是不是可以這部分來做一個調整一下\n779057\t806998\t我跟委員說明這件事情我也注意到了就是我們在處理這個溫室設施的部分重建的部分是八成沒問題那設施那個帆布的就是塑膠布的部分因為它是一個消耗性耗材那我也去調查了現在的所有的這些成本所以我現在正準備從原來的三分之一再往上調一些因為我覺得那個落差太大所以這個部分我們已經有在處理好 看能不能再調整一下\n807557\t826219\t那現在青龍 因為青龍他也要恢復他的工作事實上還是需要時間然後就是叫文廣式的修繕可是文廣式的修繕大概有要做我們市的公司的那幾間他們也面臨到缺工的一個問題 缺工事實上他們現在需要工也真的是掉不工\n827148\t846458\t所以有沒有可能在這段時間我們讓這些做溫廣式的他們可能會有工會讓他們工會一樣可以納入所謂的外展的一個制度這樣因為特區外展他們可能就可以再去聘請一些移工然後來協助這段時間需要密集的來修繕這些溫廣式\n847728\t864417\t這部分有沒有辦法來協助我跟委員說明外展移工的部分在溫室的確現在的工班也很難處理我們也預估要全部把它重新修好至少要8到12個月會拉得很長所以我想我們會盡快的跟勞動部來協調不過\n866218\t891254\t引進外籍醫工那個可能必須時間會比較長至少要半年以後的事情所以我們現在就是我們也協調了溫室工會看他們彼此是不是可以做一些比較好的一個分工然後有一些是屬於協助工的部分我們會來幫他找一些比較臨時來做協助的這些人力來滿足他們的需求好\n892581\t908437\t最後一個議題就是因為我們現在正在講要加速復原可是加速復原的壓力在哪裡在基層 尤其是公所的公務人員但是我們從這一次知道可以很深的感受這個工程人員不夠\n909077\t928518\t工程人員不足 辦理發包的尤其是在公所這一塊公所他建設課的人以最高值等就到八值等所以他基本上是留不住人的他人都會跑到縣政府甚至是跑到中央政府中央政府值等比較高這個值等的一個差距已經造成公所留不住\n930879\t957094\t接下來就來一個整個的一個進步所以中國租金電廠也可以來檢討一下怎麼讓集成的三級證可以留得住這樣一個工程的難度好不好 除非有真的家族代表明顯有討論過六度跟非六度的那種不太拉近那主委現在請求重新再來六度對 那是六度跟非六度但是還沒有處理到三級證因為三級證是一塊\n959820\t962628\t好 謝謝蔡議員的資訊謝謝左院長 各部會首長\n","txt":"好謝謝院長那我們是不是有請卓院長以及我們陳政委麻煩再請卓院長陳政委備詢\n蔡委員好謝謝辛苦了謝謝院長好院長丹納斯颱風從布袋登陸登陸的地方就是布袋的新聞我自己的故鄉我就是在那邊出生\n那丹納斯颱風就是沿著巴掌溪那十七級風加進來所以我們看到從布袋新聞它的變電所是特高壓電塔就倒殺機然後沿路沿著巴掌溪所以我們看到議場包括大廈啦包括幾樓啊沿路的電感可以說吼無一幸免全部的電感倒光光\n所以他再往外再拓出去這個十七西方的力量所以我們看到有藝族然後在旁邊入朝然後在旁邊鋪紙甚至以南的台南七國 中軍那些都是電話條的\n倒掉的一個重災區所以從這裡事實上已經可以看出說像這一種氣候的這樣的一個緊急的一個狀況然後17級風進來的時候我們就看到了說哇這個很多我們過去的基礎設施它的這個韌性的問題\n那這一次為什麼修復電的時間最長的到了第十天才復電這中間很多台電的人員非常辛苦我們就可以知道說整個電網的問題就在於說他要先修復主幹線主幹線之後才有分期限所以院長包括你第一時間就來布袋你就背我在新聞在看那個特高壓電塔的一個修復的狀況但是我們如果在那個特高壓的一個電塔我們讓它地下化\n那些特高壓電塔是地下化的也許就不會有因為要先修理特高壓電塔才去修理那些主幹線甚至主幹線如果是地下化的\n這部分可以直接就是可以進入這些台電能源直接就是進入家戶去修理所以我們可以知道說整個我們要強化這樣的地方的基礎建設那這一次的特別條例也有所謂電網的一個強韌要怎麼樣電纜強韌那我認為應該從台電的特高壓以及它的主幹線\n這部分我們是不是就可以先來做給他地下化剩餘的部分再來是這個地方是會陰水還是不會陰水再來考慮要不要地下化是不是院長我們朝這樣來努力是 台電的品工工過去到現在的經驗\n義煙水跟地層下限地區要做地下電纜確實有它自行工程上的困難那我們現在如果排除這些個地區之外能夠朝地下化去做的我們在克服工程技術各方面我們來籌措經費逐年來改善\n那至於沒有辦法做到地下化的我曾經跟那個爬上屋電線桿上去施工的工程單位的人聊過他們認為他們也希望說比方說不要像現在一整排的電桿同樣的規模我們其中有幾根是特別強韌的讓它倒下來就是一節一節的不會全部整排都倒下來可能是5隻倒下來5隻其他都還在\n如果中間加一段一段的強化的韌性的電線感用比較好的鋼質把它撐起來的話或許可以救急非地下化工程所能夠達到的目標那這個都請台電目前在研究當中我想我們未來再增加電網韌性除了10年有5000億我們縮短到4年來執行之外我們在這次的特別條例跟風災特別條例跟韌性特別條例當中我們都希望可以給台電更多餘的這些經費讓他\n一方面搶修搶險一方面就近的這些韌性加強也在做適度的加強預算好 院長我們很樂見我們要朝這樣的調整強化整個電網的韌性但是我們也知道說過去在做電纜的一個地下化在預算的分配上面可能就是台電要負擔一半剩下一半是地方政府負擔但是我們在這一次知道說這一種\n全面的如果我們真的要去推主幹線的地下化第一地方政府能量負擔這個能量是不足的第二台電現在你叫他負擔事實上他的負擔是很重所以第一個我們用特別條例特別預算來協助這一塊第二個我認為這些主幹線通常是落在地方的公路總局就是我們以前講的新的\n包括台17船 台19船 甚至台3船這些心得類是在向公路總局如果可以在這部分也負擔他們應該要有的一個相對應的一個責任的話我覺得適度也可以讓台電他們下降很多壓力那這部分你是不是也可以來參考一下我們這個建議是合理的我們往這個方向來做財政結構的這個分配那由中央因為電網\n它是一個國土任性的問題 中央該負比較多的責任\n好那這部分就我們也是期待啦為這個特別預算來改觀再來就是說丹納斯後啦接下來就是強降雨啦所以台灣那包括泰布雷他曾經就是在三小時下降了400公里的雨量這個是非常的多所以然後接下來整個造成了過去的防洪標準他沒有辦法\n達到這次的強降雨然後造成很多議題甚至就蔓延的一個狀況所以我也希望說我們為這次的特別條例事實上我們嘉義有很多需要治水的地方是需要這次特別條例來做一個處理第一就是我們的河拔水白水\n這個哈巴蘇 院長你也有來看你也有來我們浩駐家阿含那邊的鄉親甚至我們知道有一個鄉親他流著眼淚然後跟院長說希望未來不要再淹水了但是我們知道這個哈巴蘇白水壘事實上它的治理工程已經到達了80%以上的治理但是看起來還是無法因應這樣的一個強降雨過去我們是用25年的防洪標準看起來不夠 這部分可能需要加強\n那剩下的包括六角排水 它也是不水如果加白水的話 實際上它的地利壓不到50%所以它後面還有很長一段這一段預算就需要很多如果說我們從過去的前瞻預算\n都只能治理一半的話我希望院長我們這次能不能再特別條例我們以及未來你所說的我們要再用一千萬一千億的特別預算四年一千億的特別預算讓這個六角排水全斷\n這幾年就可以直接讓他全段可以讓他完成不然永遠是一段一段走上去你一段一段走上去你還是有一個問題就是說因為你上游的地方它的承載量一旦超出了它就會拔出來 拔出來就會去那裡產產的這樣蔓延過去下游的村莊還是都種\n還是全部都會淹水所以這個淹水的問題我們真的是希望要加速過去都卡在說我們基於預算的考量逐年變類逐年變類現在每天風太大風太大就逐年還是要淹水所以這問題我們還是希望院長你能夠在我們包括哈巴蘇白水我們嘉義六哈白水我們的南京大白這幾條比較重要的我們要都是我們\n我們可不可以這邊用比較\n一次到位的預算然後來解決這裡的淹水問題是的過去我們都比較著重在中央館河川中央館河川的整治率已經相當一個程度了那這一次的四年一千億就是明定他是在縣市館河川的改善計畫所以會進到剛剛委員所說那幾個縣市館的河川過去縣市館河川他比較沒有自己的能力\n做那麼徹底的清淤或者整治的工程或是一樣的加高甚至出海口的這個抽排的增加加強等等那我們希望透過這一次的四年千億的限水管核酸改善能夠把這個部分給它補強回來\n好所以跟院長我剛剛有跟你報告的包括六角排水他可能還需要三十幾億你說南境排水這個全部都加起來我估計可能要再差五十幾億因為過去都是一段一段做所以現在可能預算規模很大那我們就如同院長剛說的我們逐年來編列我們趕快在這個一千億的預算中然後來協助這一塊\n但是我要跟院長說從去年的凱米事實上我們也看到說中央管的河川輸菌的問題還是持續中去年凱米颱風後我們在第五河川分屬它輸菌了超過400萬方的土方輸菌了這些所以在今年的強降雨巴掌溪沒有溢流了就是巴掌溪有效果\n但是你看這個沙頂 沙頂落大河結果那些土石流又沿著上游又下來我們看到整個巴蘭溪內上面的土都這樣流下來所以還是要持續要有輸進的需求\n所以是不是我們在這一次特別條例裡面它裡面沒有講到疏浚這塊那我自己我提一個對岸我希望可以把疏浚這一塊還是把它納入在我們這一次的災後重建的條例然後持續要有預算\n來做這一個重要河川的一個輸進這部分可以嗎中央管河川的輸進我們在年度的公務預算當中就會有所編列那我再來檢討就這一次風災好雨之後優先應該整治地區我們會把它挑出來能夠及時來改善好那謝謝院長那接下來再來講農業的問題農業的這次\n事實上想不到啦 這17級風啦17級風齁 差不多在我們嘉義我們泰國本來大概是很多青榮返鄉然後在那邊做溫王寺的一個耕作所以那邊的青榮很多都投入然後都做溫王寺那這次這個風這麼強縱使他用西新崗或者是他用阿館的齁這樣的一個溫王寺都垂海去\n行政院 行政團隊也很棒啊農業部長也是說好 我們要怎麼協助這些青龍讓他們恢復迅速恢復他們的生產能量好 現在要恢復生產能量我們就要說好 我們這個溫王寺補助八成補助八成這個青龍大家都覺得這樣有感受到我們行政院的一個誠意但是因為災害有很多不同的樣態\n有的是我們是倒的 有的是沒倒沒倒的 他是胖子破了胖子破了 你就要整個換新結果我們就看到了說 你說胖子過去了胖子現在一分底 你要修理好差不多要三十五萬我們就是給他照以往的就是補助十萬一分地補助十萬\n結果後來就產生了這樣的一個有感覺會有感覺不講白的就是說如果我溫室是倒掉的倒掉的我補助八成我蓬勃催去的催廢去的我比較補助三十五萬補助十萬定於三成不夠所以他說乾脆\n我的溫室抓整個就直接把它夾掉說它也是毀損 當然這樣不好這樣是不好 而且浪費預算所以我們想這一塊是不是我們在蓬勃上去的這塊能不能做一個調整然後讓因為我們現在已經宣布了溫室導調補助八成結果它的蓬勃的部分是不是可以這部分來做一個調整一下\n我跟委員說明這件事情我也注意到了就是我們在處理這個溫室設施的部分重建的部分是八成沒問題那設施那個帆布的就是塑膠布的部分因為它是一個消耗性耗材那我也去調查了現在的所有的這些成本所以我現在正準備從原來的三分之一再往上調一些因為我覺得那個落差太大所以這個部分我們已經有在處理好 看能不能再調整一下\n那現在青龍 因為青龍他也要恢復他的工作事實上還是需要時間然後就是叫文廣式的修繕可是文廣式的修繕大概有要做我們市的公司的那幾間他們也面臨到缺工的一個問題 缺工事實上他們現在需要工也真的是掉不工\n所以有沒有可能在這段時間我們讓這些做溫廣式的他們可能會有工會讓他們工會一樣可以納入所謂的外展的一個制度這樣因為特區外展他們可能就可以再去聘請一些移工然後來協助這段時間需要密集的來修繕這些溫廣式\n這部分有沒有辦法來協助我跟委員說明外展移工的部分在溫室的確現在的工班也很難處理我們也預估要全部把它重新修好至少要8到12個月會拉得很長所以我想我們會盡快的跟勞動部來協調不過\n引進外籍醫工那個可能必須時間會比較長至少要半年以後的事情所以我們現在就是我們也協調了溫室工會看他們彼此是不是可以做一些比較好的一個分工然後有一些是屬於協助工的部分我們會來幫他找一些比較臨時來做協助的這些人力來滿足他們的需求好\n最後一個議題就是因為我們現在正在講要加速復原可是加速復原的壓力在哪裡在基層 尤其是公所的公務人員但是我們從這一次知道可以很深的感受這個工程人員不夠\n工程人員不足 辦理發包的尤其是在公所這一塊公所他建設課的人以最高值等就到八值等所以他基本上是留不住人的他人都會跑到縣政府甚至是跑到中央政府中央政府值等比較高這個值等的一個差距已經造成公所留不住\n接下來就來一個整個的一個進步所以中國租金電廠也可以來檢討一下怎麼讓集成的三級證可以留得住這樣一個工程的難度好不好 除非有真的家族代表明顯有討論過六度跟非六度的那種不太拉近那主委現在請求重新再來六度對 那是六度跟非六度但是還沒有處理到三級證因為三級證是一塊\n好 謝謝蔡議員的資訊謝謝左院長 各部會首長\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:05.199 --> 00:11.866\n好謝謝院長那我們是不是有請卓院長以及我們陳政委麻煩再請卓院長陳政委備詢\n\n00:21.929 --> 00:35.062\n蔡委員好謝謝辛苦了謝謝院長好院長丹納斯颱風從布袋登陸登陸的地方就是布袋的新聞我自己的故鄉我就是在那邊出生\n\n00:35.731 --> 00:59.337\n那丹納斯颱風就是沿著巴掌溪那十七級風加進來所以我們看到從布袋新聞它的變電所是特高壓電塔就倒殺機然後沿路沿著巴掌溪所以我們看到議場包括大廈啦包括幾樓啊沿路的電感可以說吼無一幸免全部的電感倒光光\n\n01:00.576 --> 01:13.169\n所以他再往外再拓出去這個十七西方的力量所以我們看到有藝族然後在旁邊入朝然後在旁邊鋪紙甚至以南的台南七國中軍那些都是電話條的\n\n01:15.772 --> 01:33.594\n倒掉的一個重災區所以從這裡事實上已經可以看出說像這一種氣候的這樣的一個緊急的一個狀況然後17級風進來的時候我們就看到了說哇這個很多我們過去的基礎設施它的這個韌性的問題\n\n01:35.476 --> 02:04.207\n那這一次為什麼修復電的時間最長的到了第十天才復電這中間很多台電的人員非常辛苦我們就可以知道說整個電網的問題就在於說他要先修復主幹線主幹線之後才有分期限所以院長包括你第一時間就來布袋你就背我在新聞在看那個特高壓電塔的一個修復的狀況但是我們如果在那個特高壓的一個電塔我們讓它地下化\n\n02:06.903 --> 02:18.570\n那些特高壓電塔是地下化的也許就不會有因為要先修理特高壓電塔才去修理那些主幹線甚至主幹線如果是地下化的\n\n02:20.157 --> 02:43.182\n這部分可以直接就是可以進入這些台電能源直接就是進入家戶去修理所以我們可以知道說整個我們要強化這樣的地方的基礎建設那這一次的特別條例也有所謂電網的一個強韌要怎麼樣電纜強韌那我認為應該從台電的特高壓以及它的主幹線\n\n02:44.422 --> 02:58.710\n這部分我們是不是就可以先來做給他地下化剩餘的部分再來是這個地方是會陰水還是不會陰水再來考慮要不要地下化是不是院長我們朝這樣來努力是台電的品工工過去到現在的經驗\n\n03:00.393 --> 03:15.409\n義煙水跟地層下限地區要做地下電纜確實有它自行工程上的困難那我們現在如果排除這些個地區之外能夠朝地下化去做的我們在克服工程技術各方面我們來籌措經費逐年來改善\n\n03:16.030 --> 03:38.036\n那至於沒有辦法做到地下化的我曾經跟那個爬上屋電線桿上去施工的工程單位的人聊過他們認為他們也希望說比方說不要像現在一整排的電桿同樣的規模我們其中有幾根是特別強韌的讓它倒下來就是一節一節的不會全部整排都倒下來可能是5隻倒下來5隻其他都還在\n\n03:38.576 --> 04:07.325\n如果中間加一段一段的強化的韌性的電線感用比較好的鋼質把它撐起來的話或許可以救急非地下化工程所能夠達到的目標那這個都請台電目前在研究當中我想我們未來再增加電網韌性除了10年有5000億我們縮短到4年來執行之外我們在這次的特別條例跟風災特別條例跟韌性特別條例當中我們都希望可以給台電更多餘的這些經費讓他\n\n04:08.525 --> 04:33.235\n一方面搶修搶險一方面就近的這些韌性加強也在做適度的加強預算好院長我們很樂見我們要朝這樣的調整強化整個電網的韌性但是我們也知道說過去在做電纜的一個地下化在預算的分配上面可能就是台電要負擔一半剩下一半是地方政府負擔但是我們在這一次知道說這一種\n\n04:37.097 --> 05:01.208\n全面的如果我們真的要去推主幹線的地下化第一地方政府能量負擔這個能量是不足的第二台電現在你叫他負擔事實上他的負擔是很重所以第一個我們用特別條例特別預算來協助這一塊第二個我認為這些主幹線通常是落在地方的公路總局就是我們以前講的新的\n\n05:02.322 --> 05:27.845\n包括台17船台19船甚至台3船這些心得類是在向公路總局如果可以在這部分也負擔他們應該要有的一個相對應的一個責任的話我覺得適度也可以讓台電他們下降很多壓力那這部分你是不是也可以來參考一下我們這個建議是合理的我們往這個方向來做財政結構的這個分配那由中央因為電網\n\n05:28.806 --> 05:32.266\n它是一個國土任性的問題中央該負比較多的責任\n\n05:32.790 --> 05:59.390\n好那這部分就我們也是期待啦為這個特別預算來改觀再來就是說丹納斯後啦接下來就是強降雨啦所以台灣那包括泰布雷他曾經就是在三小時下降了400公里的雨量這個是非常的多所以然後接下來整個造成了過去的防洪標準他沒有辦法\n\n06:00.191 --> 06:19.430\n達到這次的強降雨然後造成很多議題甚至就蔓延的一個狀況所以我也希望說我們為這次的特別條例事實上我們嘉義有很多需要治水的地方是需要這次特別條例來做一個處理第一就是我們的河拔水白水\n\n06:20.271 --> 06:48.120\n這個哈巴蘇院長你也有來看你也有來我們浩駐家阿含那邊的鄉親甚至我們知道有一個鄉親他流著眼淚然後跟院長說希望未來不要再淹水了但是我們知道這個哈巴蘇白水壘事實上它的治理工程已經到達了80%以上的治理但是看起來還是無法因應這樣的一個強降雨過去我們是用25年的防洪標準看起來不夠這部分可能需要加強\n\n06:48.880 --> 07:02.847\n那剩下的包括六角排水它也是不水如果加白水的話實際上它的地利壓不到50%所以它後面還有很長一段這一段預算就需要很多如果說我們從過去的前瞻預算\n\n07:04.848 --> 07:20.714\n都只能治理一半的話我希望院長我們這次能不能再特別條例我們以及未來你所說的我們要再用一千萬一千億的特別預算四年一千億的特別預算讓這個六角排水全斷\n\n07:22.775 --> 07:41.515\n這幾年就可以直接讓他全段可以讓他完成不然永遠是一段一段走上去你一段一段走上去你還是有一個問題就是說因為你上游的地方它的承載量一旦超出了它就會拔出來拔出來就會去那裡產產的這樣蔓延過去下游的村莊還是都種\n\n07:43.748 --> 08:12.118\n還是全部都會淹水所以這個淹水的問題我們真的是希望要加速過去都卡在說我們基於預算的考量逐年變類逐年變類現在每天風太大風太大就逐年還是要淹水所以這問題我們還是希望院長你能夠在我們包括哈巴蘇白水我們嘉義六哈白水我們的南京大白這幾條比較重要的我們要都是我們\n\n08:13.098 --> 08:16.067\n我們可不可以這邊用比較\n\n08:21.287 --> 08:44.983\n一次到位的預算然後來解決這裡的淹水問題是的過去我們都比較著重在中央館河川中央館河川的整治率已經相當一個程度了那這一次的四年一千億就是明定他是在縣市館河川的改善計畫所以會進到剛剛委員所說那幾個縣市館的河川過去縣市館河川他比較沒有自己的能力\n\n08:45.843 --> 09:00.851\n做那麼徹底的清淤或者整治的工程或是一樣的加高甚至出海口的這個抽排的增加加強等等那我們希望透過這一次的四年千億的限水管核酸改善能夠把這個部分給它補強回來\n\n09:01.912 --> 09:25.805\n好所以跟院長我剛剛有跟你報告的包括六角排水他可能還需要三十幾億你說南境排水這個全部都加起來我估計可能要再差五十幾億因為過去都是一段一段做所以現在可能預算規模很大那我們就如同院長剛說的我們逐年來編列我們趕快在這個一千億的預算中然後來協助這一塊\n\n09:26.785 --> 09:53.994\n但是我要跟院長說從去年的凱米事實上我們也看到說中央管的河川輸菌的問題還是持續中去年凱米颱風後我們在第五河川分屬它輸菌了超過400萬方的土方輸菌了這些所以在今年的強降雨巴掌溪沒有溢流了就是巴掌溪有效果\n\n09:54.454 --> 10:05.561\n但是你看這個沙頂沙頂落大河結果那些土石流又沿著上游又下來我們看到整個巴蘭溪內上面的土都這樣流下來所以還是要持續要有輸進的需求\n\n10:13.866 --> 10:28.452\n所以是不是我們在這一次特別條例裡面它裡面沒有講到疏浚這塊那我自己我提一個對岸我希望可以把疏浚這一塊還是把它納入在我們這一次的災後重建的條例然後持續要有預算\n\n10:29.345 --> 10:49.343\n來做這一個重要河川的一個輸進這部分可以嗎中央管河川的輸進我們在年度的公務預算當中就會有所編列那我再來檢討就這一次風災好雨之後優先應該整治地區我們會把它挑出來能夠及時來改善好那謝謝院長那接下來再來講農業的問題農業的這次\n\n10:55.154 --> 11:18.633\n事實上想不到啦這17級風啦17級風齁差不多在我們嘉義我們泰國本來大概是很多青榮返鄉然後在那邊做溫王寺的一個耕作所以那邊的青榮很多都投入然後都做溫王寺那這次這個風這麼強縱使他用西新崗或者是他用阿館的齁這樣的一個溫王寺都垂海去\n\n11:20.744 --> 11:45.832\n行政院行政團隊也很棒啊農業部長也是說好我們要怎麼協助這些青龍讓他們恢復迅速恢復他們的生產能量好現在要恢復生產能量我們就要說好我們這個溫王寺補助八成補助八成這個青龍大家都覺得這樣有感受到我們行政院的一個誠意但是因為災害有很多不同的樣態\n\n11:46.972 --> 12:12.817\n有的是我們是倒的有的是沒倒沒倒的他是胖子破了胖子破了你就要整個換新結果我們就看到了說你說胖子過去了胖子現在一分底你要修理好差不多要三十五萬我們就是給他照以往的就是補助十萬一分地補助十萬\n\n12:15.018 --> 12:34.710\n結果後來就產生了這樣的一個有感覺會有感覺不講白的就是說如果我溫室是倒掉的倒掉的我補助八成我蓬勃催去的催廢去的我比較補助三十五萬補助十萬定於三成不夠所以他說乾脆\n\n12:35.919 --> 12:58.139\n我的溫室抓整個就直接把它夾掉說它也是毀損當然這樣不好這樣是不好而且浪費預算所以我們想這一塊是不是我們在蓬勃上去的這塊能不能做一個調整然後讓因為我們現在已經宣布了溫室導調補助八成結果它的蓬勃的部分是不是可以這部分來做一個調整一下\n\n12:59.057 --> 13:26.998\n我跟委員說明這件事情我也注意到了就是我們在處理這個溫室設施的部分重建的部分是八成沒問題那設施那個帆布的就是塑膠布的部分因為它是一個消耗性耗材那我也去調查了現在的所有的這些成本所以我現在正準備從原來的三分之一再往上調一些因為我覺得那個落差太大所以這個部分我們已經有在處理好看能不能再調整一下\n\n13:27.557 --> 13:46.219\n那現在青龍因為青龍他也要恢復他的工作事實上還是需要時間然後就是叫文廣式的修繕可是文廣式的修繕大概有要做我們市的公司的那幾間他們也面臨到缺工的一個問題缺工事實上他們現在需要工也真的是掉不工\n\n13:47.148 --> 14:06.458\n所以有沒有可能在這段時間我們讓這些做溫廣式的他們可能會有工會讓他們工會一樣可以納入所謂的外展的一個制度這樣因為特區外展他們可能就可以再去聘請一些移工然後來協助這段時間需要密集的來修繕這些溫廣式\n\n14:07.728 --> 14:24.417\n這部分有沒有辦法來協助我跟委員說明外展移工的部分在溫室的確現在的工班也很難處理我們也預估要全部把它重新修好至少要8到12個月會拉得很長所以我想我們會盡快的跟勞動部來協調不過\n\n14:26.218 --> 14:51.254\n引進外籍醫工那個可能必須時間會比較長至少要半年以後的事情所以我們現在就是我們也協調了溫室工會看他們彼此是不是可以做一些比較好的一個分工然後有一些是屬於協助工的部分我們會來幫他找一些比較臨時來做協助的這些人力來滿足他們的需求好\n\n14:52.581 --> 15:08.437\n最後一個議題就是因為我們現在正在講要加速復原可是加速復原的壓力在哪裡在基層尤其是公所的公務人員但是我們從這一次知道可以很深的感受這個工程人員不夠\n\n15:09.077 --> 15:28.518\n工程人員不足辦理發包的尤其是在公所這一塊公所他建設課的人以最高值等就到八值等所以他基本上是留不住人的他人都會跑到縣政府甚至是跑到中央政府中央政府值等比較高這個值等的一個差距已經造成公所留不住\n\n15:30.879 --> 15:57.094\n接下來就來一個整個的一個進步所以中國租金電廠也可以來檢討一下怎麼讓集成的三級證可以留得住這樣一個工程的難度好不好除非有真的家族代表明顯有討論過六度跟非六度的那種不太拉近那主委現在請求重新再來六度對那是六度跟非六度但是還沒有處理到三級證因為三級證是一塊\n\n15:59.820 --> 16:02.628\n好謝謝蔡議員的資訊謝謝左院長各部會首長\n\n","segments":[{"start":5.199,"end":11.866,"text":"好謝謝院長那我們是不是有請卓院長以及我們陳政委麻煩再請卓院長陳政委備詢"},{"start":21.929,"end":35.062,"text":"蔡委員好謝謝辛苦了謝謝院長好院長丹納斯颱風從布袋登陸登陸的地方就是布袋的新聞我自己的故鄉我就是在那邊出生"},{"start":35.731,"end":59.337,"text":"那丹納斯颱風就是沿著巴掌溪那十七級風加進來所以我們看到從布袋新聞它的變電所是特高壓電塔就倒殺機然後沿路沿著巴掌溪所以我們看到議場包括大廈啦包括幾樓啊沿路的電感可以說吼無一幸免全部的電感倒光光"},{"start":60.576,"end":73.169,"text":"所以他再往外再拓出去這個十七西方的力量所以我們看到有藝族然後在旁邊入朝然後在旁邊鋪紙甚至以南的台南七國 中軍那些都是電話條的"},{"start":75.772,"end":93.594,"text":"倒掉的一個重災區所以從這裡事實上已經可以看出說像這一種氣候的這樣的一個緊急的一個狀況然後17級風進來的時候我們就看到了說哇這個很多我們過去的基礎設施它的這個韌性的問題"},{"start":95.476,"end":124.207,"text":"那這一次為什麼修復電的時間最長的到了第十天才復電這中間很多台電的人員非常辛苦我們就可以知道說整個電網的問題就在於說他要先修復主幹線主幹線之後才有分期限所以院長包括你第一時間就來布袋你就背我在新聞在看那個特高壓電塔的一個修復的狀況但是我們如果在那個特高壓的一個電塔我們讓它地下化"},{"start":126.903,"end":138.57,"text":"那些特高壓電塔是地下化的也許就不會有因為要先修理特高壓電塔才去修理那些主幹線甚至主幹線如果是地下化的"},{"start":140.157,"end":163.182,"text":"這部分可以直接就是可以進入這些台電能源直接就是進入家戶去修理所以我們可以知道說整個我們要強化這樣的地方的基礎建設那這一次的特別條例也有所謂電網的一個強韌要怎麼樣電纜強韌那我認為應該從台電的特高壓以及它的主幹線"},{"start":164.422,"end":178.71,"text":"這部分我們是不是就可以先來做給他地下化剩餘的部分再來是這個地方是會陰水還是不會陰水再來考慮要不要地下化是不是院長我們朝這樣來努力是 台電的品工工過去到現在的經驗"},{"start":180.393,"end":195.409,"text":"義煙水跟地層下限地區要做地下電纜確實有它自行工程上的困難那我們現在如果排除這些個地區之外能夠朝地下化去做的我們在克服工程技術各方面我們來籌措經費逐年來改善"},{"start":196.03,"end":218.036,"text":"那至於沒有辦法做到地下化的我曾經跟那個爬上屋電線桿上去施工的工程單位的人聊過他們認為他們也希望說比方說不要像現在一整排的電桿同樣的規模我們其中有幾根是特別強韌的讓它倒下來就是一節一節的不會全部整排都倒下來可能是5隻倒下來5隻其他都還在"},{"start":218.576,"end":247.325,"text":"如果中間加一段一段的強化的韌性的電線感用比較好的鋼質把它撐起來的話或許可以救急非地下化工程所能夠達到的目標那這個都請台電目前在研究當中我想我們未來再增加電網韌性除了10年有5000億我們縮短到4年來執行之外我們在這次的特別條例跟風災特別條例跟韌性特別條例當中我們都希望可以給台電更多餘的這些經費讓他"},{"start":248.525,"end":273.235,"text":"一方面搶修搶險一方面就近的這些韌性加強也在做適度的加強預算好 院長我們很樂見我們要朝這樣的調整強化整個電網的韌性但是我們也知道說過去在做電纜的一個地下化在預算的分配上面可能就是台電要負擔一半剩下一半是地方政府負擔但是我們在這一次知道說這一種"},{"start":277.097,"end":301.208,"text":"全面的如果我們真的要去推主幹線的地下化第一地方政府能量負擔這個能量是不足的第二台電現在你叫他負擔事實上他的負擔是很重所以第一個我們用特別條例特別預算來協助這一塊第二個我認為這些主幹線通常是落在地方的公路總局就是我們以前講的新的"},{"start":302.322,"end":327.845,"text":"包括台17船 台19船 甚至台3船這些心得類是在向公路總局如果可以在這部分也負擔他們應該要有的一個相對應的一個責任的話我覺得適度也可以讓台電他們下降很多壓力那這部分你是不是也可以來參考一下我們這個建議是合理的我們往這個方向來做財政結構的這個分配那由中央因為電網"},{"start":328.806,"end":332.266,"text":"它是一個國土任性的問題 中央該負比較多的責任"},{"start":332.79,"end":359.39,"text":"好那這部分就我們也是期待啦為這個特別預算來改觀再來就是說丹納斯後啦接下來就是強降雨啦所以台灣那包括泰布雷他曾經就是在三小時下降了400公里的雨量這個是非常的多所以然後接下來整個造成了過去的防洪標準他沒有辦法"},{"start":360.191,"end":379.43,"text":"達到這次的強降雨然後造成很多議題甚至就蔓延的一個狀況所以我也希望說我們為這次的特別條例事實上我們嘉義有很多需要治水的地方是需要這次特別條例來做一個處理第一就是我們的河拔水白水"},{"start":380.271,"end":408.12,"text":"這個哈巴蘇 院長你也有來看你也有來我們浩駐家阿含那邊的鄉親甚至我們知道有一個鄉親他流著眼淚然後跟院長說希望未來不要再淹水了但是我們知道這個哈巴蘇白水壘事實上它的治理工程已經到達了80%以上的治理但是看起來還是無法因應這樣的一個強降雨過去我們是用25年的防洪標準看起來不夠 這部分可能需要加強"},{"start":408.88,"end":422.847,"text":"那剩下的包括六角排水 它也是不水如果加白水的話 實際上它的地利壓不到50%所以它後面還有很長一段這一段預算就需要很多如果說我們從過去的前瞻預算"},{"start":424.848,"end":440.714,"text":"都只能治理一半的話我希望院長我們這次能不能再特別條例我們以及未來你所說的我們要再用一千萬一千億的特別預算四年一千億的特別預算讓這個六角排水全斷"},{"start":442.775,"end":461.515,"text":"這幾年就可以直接讓他全段可以讓他完成不然永遠是一段一段走上去你一段一段走上去你還是有一個問題就是說因為你上游的地方它的承載量一旦超出了它就會拔出來 拔出來就會去那裡產產的這樣蔓延過去下游的村莊還是都種"},{"start":463.748,"end":492.118,"text":"還是全部都會淹水所以這個淹水的問題我們真的是希望要加速過去都卡在說我們基於預算的考量逐年變類逐年變類現在每天風太大風太大就逐年還是要淹水所以這問題我們還是希望院長你能夠在我們包括哈巴蘇白水我們嘉義六哈白水我們的南京大白這幾條比較重要的我們要都是我們"},{"start":493.098,"end":496.067,"text":"我們可不可以這邊用比較"},{"start":501.287,"end":524.983,"text":"一次到位的預算然後來解決這裡的淹水問題是的過去我們都比較著重在中央館河川中央館河川的整治率已經相當一個程度了那這一次的四年一千億就是明定他是在縣市館河川的改善計畫所以會進到剛剛委員所說那幾個縣市館的河川過去縣市館河川他比較沒有自己的能力"},{"start":525.843,"end":540.851,"text":"做那麼徹底的清淤或者整治的工程或是一樣的加高甚至出海口的這個抽排的增加加強等等那我們希望透過這一次的四年千億的限水管核酸改善能夠把這個部分給它補強回來"},{"start":541.912,"end":565.805,"text":"好所以跟院長我剛剛有跟你報告的包括六角排水他可能還需要三十幾億你說南境排水這個全部都加起來我估計可能要再差五十幾億因為過去都是一段一段做所以現在可能預算規模很大那我們就如同院長剛說的我們逐年來編列我們趕快在這個一千億的預算中然後來協助這一塊"},{"start":566.785,"end":593.994,"text":"但是我要跟院長說從去年的凱米事實上我們也看到說中央管的河川輸菌的問題還是持續中去年凱米颱風後我們在第五河川分屬它輸菌了超過400萬方的土方輸菌了這些所以在今年的強降雨巴掌溪沒有溢流了就是巴掌溪有效果"},{"start":594.454,"end":605.561,"text":"但是你看這個沙頂 沙頂落大河結果那些土石流又沿著上游又下來我們看到整個巴蘭溪內上面的土都這樣流下來所以還是要持續要有輸進的需求"},{"start":613.866,"end":628.452,"text":"所以是不是我們在這一次特別條例裡面它裡面沒有講到疏浚這塊那我自己我提一個對岸我希望可以把疏浚這一塊還是把它納入在我們這一次的災後重建的條例然後持續要有預算"},{"start":629.345,"end":649.343,"text":"來做這一個重要河川的一個輸進這部分可以嗎中央管河川的輸進我們在年度的公務預算當中就會有所編列那我再來檢討就這一次風災好雨之後優先應該整治地區我們會把它挑出來能夠及時來改善好那謝謝院長那接下來再來講農業的問題農業的這次"},{"start":655.154,"end":678.633,"text":"事實上想不到啦 這17級風啦17級風齁 差不多在我們嘉義我們泰國本來大概是很多青榮返鄉然後在那邊做溫王寺的一個耕作所以那邊的青榮很多都投入然後都做溫王寺那這次這個風這麼強縱使他用西新崗或者是他用阿館的齁這樣的一個溫王寺都垂海去"},{"start":680.744,"end":705.832,"text":"行政院 行政團隊也很棒啊農業部長也是說好 我們要怎麼協助這些青龍讓他們恢復迅速恢復他們的生產能量好 現在要恢復生產能量我們就要說好 我們這個溫王寺補助八成補助八成這個青龍大家都覺得這樣有感受到我們行政院的一個誠意但是因為災害有很多不同的樣態"},{"start":706.972,"end":732.817,"text":"有的是我們是倒的 有的是沒倒沒倒的 他是胖子破了胖子破了 你就要整個換新結果我們就看到了說 你說胖子過去了胖子現在一分底 你要修理好差不多要三十五萬我們就是給他照以往的就是補助十萬一分地補助十萬"},{"start":735.018,"end":754.71,"text":"結果後來就產生了這樣的一個有感覺會有感覺不講白的就是說如果我溫室是倒掉的倒掉的我補助八成我蓬勃催去的催廢去的我比較補助三十五萬補助十萬定於三成不夠所以他說乾脆"},{"start":755.919,"end":778.139,"text":"我的溫室抓整個就直接把它夾掉說它也是毀損 當然這樣不好這樣是不好 而且浪費預算所以我們想這一塊是不是我們在蓬勃上去的這塊能不能做一個調整然後讓因為我們現在已經宣布了溫室導調補助八成結果它的蓬勃的部分是不是可以這部分來做一個調整一下"},{"start":779.057,"end":806.998,"text":"我跟委員說明這件事情我也注意到了就是我們在處理這個溫室設施的部分重建的部分是八成沒問題那設施那個帆布的就是塑膠布的部分因為它是一個消耗性耗材那我也去調查了現在的所有的這些成本所以我現在正準備從原來的三分之一再往上調一些因為我覺得那個落差太大所以這個部分我們已經有在處理好 看能不能再調整一下"},{"start":807.557,"end":826.219,"text":"那現在青龍 因為青龍他也要恢復他的工作事實上還是需要時間然後就是叫文廣式的修繕可是文廣式的修繕大概有要做我們市的公司的那幾間他們也面臨到缺工的一個問題 缺工事實上他們現在需要工也真的是掉不工"},{"start":827.148,"end":846.458,"text":"所以有沒有可能在這段時間我們讓這些做溫廣式的他們可能會有工會讓他們工會一樣可以納入所謂的外展的一個制度這樣因為特區外展他們可能就可以再去聘請一些移工然後來協助這段時間需要密集的來修繕這些溫廣式"},{"start":847.728,"end":864.417,"text":"這部分有沒有辦法來協助我跟委員說明外展移工的部分在溫室的確現在的工班也很難處理我們也預估要全部把它重新修好至少要8到12個月會拉得很長所以我想我們會盡快的跟勞動部來協調不過"},{"start":866.218,"end":891.254,"text":"引進外籍醫工那個可能必須時間會比較長至少要半年以後的事情所以我們現在就是我們也協調了溫室工會看他們彼此是不是可以做一些比較好的一個分工然後有一些是屬於協助工的部分我們會來幫他找一些比較臨時來做協助的這些人力來滿足他們的需求好"},{"start":892.581,"end":908.437,"text":"最後一個議題就是因為我們現在正在講要加速復原可是加速復原的壓力在哪裡在基層 尤其是公所的公務人員但是我們從這一次知道可以很深的感受這個工程人員不夠"},{"start":909.077,"end":928.518,"text":"工程人員不足 辦理發包的尤其是在公所這一塊公所他建設課的人以最高值等就到八值等所以他基本上是留不住人的他人都會跑到縣政府甚至是跑到中央政府中央政府值等比較高這個值等的一個差距已經造成公所留不住"},{"start":930.879,"end":957.094,"text":"接下來就來一個整個的一個進步所以中國租金電廠也可以來檢討一下怎麼讓集成的三級證可以留得住這樣一個工程的難度好不好 除非有真的家族代表明顯有討論過六度跟非六度的那種不太拉近那主委現在請求重新再來六度對 那是六度跟非六度但是還沒有處理到三級證因為三級證是一塊"},{"start":959.82,"end":962.628,"text":"好 謝謝蔡議員的資訊謝謝左院長 各部會首長"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":152,"blocks":[["蔡委員易餘：（15時13分）謝謝院長，我們是不是有請卓院長以及陳政委。"],["主席：麻煩再請卓院長、陳政委備詢。"],["卓院長榮泰：蔡委員好，謝謝，辛苦了。"],["蔡委員易餘：院長好。丹娜絲颱風從布袋登陸，登陸的地方就是布袋新塭，那是我自己的故鄉，我就是在那邊出生。丹娜絲颱風沿著八掌溪、17級風捲進來，所以我們看到從布袋新塭它的變電所、特高壓電塔就倒3支，然後沿著八掌溪，因此我們看到義竹，包括芉仔寮，包括過路仔，沿路的電桿可以說無一倖免，全部的電桿倒光光，它再往外拓出去，這個17級風的力量耶！我們看到從義竹，然後是再旁邊的鹿草、朴子，甚至往南到臺南的七股、將軍、學甲，都是電線桿倒塌的重災區，所以從這裡事實上已經可以看出像這種氣候的緊急狀況、17級風進來的時候，過去很多基礎設施的韌性問題。","這次為什麼最長到第10天才復電？這中間很多台電人員非常辛苦，我們也因此得知，整個電網的問題就在於，必須先修復主幹線，之後才是分歧線。所以院長，包括你第一時間就來布袋，陪我到新塭那邊看特高壓電塔的修復狀況，但是我們如果把那些特高壓電塔地下化，也許就不會有必須先修理特高壓電塔，才去修理主幹線的問題，甚至主幹線如果是地下化的，台電人員就可以直接進入家戶去修理。所以我們可以知道，為了強化地方的基礎建設，這次的特別條例也有所謂的電網強韌，要怎麼樣讓電網強韌？我認為應該從台電的特高壓電塔以及它的主幹線開始，這部分是不是可以先把它地下化，剩餘的部分再視這個地方會不會淹水來考慮要不要地下化？院長是不是可以朝這個方向來努力？"],["卓院長榮泰：是，台電的評估、從過去到現在的經驗，易淹水跟地層下陷地區要做地下電纜確實有它執行上、工程上的困難，我們現在如果排除這些地區，能夠朝地下化去做的，我們再克服工程技術各方面來籌措經費，逐年來改善，至於沒有辦法做到地下化的，我曾經跟爬上電線桿施工的工程單位人員聊過，他們也希望比方說不要像現在一整排電桿都採同樣的規格，而是其中有幾根是特別強韌的，當它倒下來的時候是一節、一節的，不會整排全部都倒下來，可能是倒下來5支，其他都還在，如果中間加上一段、一段韌性強化的電線桿，用比較好的鋼質把它撐起來的話，或許可以救急，達到非地下化工程所能夠達到的目標，這個目前都請台電在研究當中。我們未來增加電網韌性除了10年5,000億縮短到4年來執行之外，在這次的特別條例（風災特別條例跟韌性特別條例）當中，我們都希望可以給台電更多的經費，讓它一方面搶修、搶險，一方面就近做適度的韌性加強也有相關的預算。"],["蔡委員易餘：好，院長，我們很樂見要朝這個方向調整，強化整個電網的韌性。但是我們也知道，過去在做電纜地下化的時候，在預算分配上是台電負擔一半，剩下一半由地方政府負擔，可是這次如果要全面推動主幹線地下化，第一，地方政府負擔的能量是不足的，第二，現在要叫台電負擔，事實上他們的負擔也是很重的。所以第一個，我們用特別條例、特別預算來協助這一塊，第二個，我認為這些主幹線通常是落在我們以前說的省道，包括臺17線、臺19線甚至臺3線，如果公路局也可以負擔他們應有的相對應責任的話，我覺得也可以適度減輕台電的壓力，這部分是不是可以參考一下？"],["卓院長榮泰：可以，委員這個建議是合理的，我們也朝這個方向來做財政結構的分配，由中央……因為電網是國土韌性的問題，中央該負比較多的責任。"],["蔡委員易餘：好，這部分我們就期待透過特別預算來解決。","丹娜絲颱風之後就是強降雨，我們那邊包括太保曾經在3小時內降下400毫米的雨量，這是非常多的，造成過去的防洪標準沒有辦法防範而溢堤，甚至漫淹的狀況，事實上，我們嘉義有很多需要治水的地方需要這次的特別條例來處理，第一個就是我們的荷苞嶼排水，這個荷苞嶼，院長也有來看過，你有來我們朴子這裡探視那邊的鄉親，甚至我們知道有一個鄉親流著眼淚也跟院長說希望未來不要再淹水了，但是我們知道荷苞嶼排水，事實上它的治理工程已經到達了80%以上的治理，但是看起來還是無法因應這樣的強降雨，過去我們是用25年的防洪標準，看起來不夠，這部分可能需要加強，剩下的包括六腳排水，那邊也是淹水，實際上六腳排水的治理還不到50%，所以它後面還有很長一段，這一段預算就需要很多。如果我們從過去的前瞻預算都只能治理一半的話，院長，我們這次能不能在特別條例以及未來你所說我們要再用1,000億的特別預算，4年1,000億的特別預算在這幾年就讓六腳排水可以直接全段完成，不然你永遠是一段一段做上去，一段一段做上去還是會有一個問題，因為上游的地方承載量一旦超出了，它就會溢出去，一旦溢出就會流到那些田裡，從這些田這樣漫延過去，下游的村莊還是都中，還是全部都會淹水。所以這個淹水的問題，我們真的是希望要加速，過去都卡在基於預算的考量，我們逐年編列，現在每年颱風來，颱風一來，逐年還是會淹水。所以關於這問題，我們還是希望院長能夠協助我們包括荷苞嶼排水、嘉義六腳排水、南靖大排，這幾條比較重要的，都是我們這些重要部落的村莊需要把水排出去的，我們可不可以這邊用比較一次到位的預算來解決這裡的淹水問題？"],["卓院長榮泰：是的，過去我們都比較著重在中央管河川，中央管河川的整治率已經相當一個程度了，這一次的4年1,000億就明定它是在縣市管河川的改善計畫，所以會進到剛剛委員所說的那幾個縣市管的河川，過去縣市管的河川，它比較沒有自己的能力做那麼澈底的清淤，或者整治的工程，或是堤岸的加高，甚至出海口抽排的增加、加強等等，我們希望透過這一次的4年1,000億的縣市管河川改善，能夠把這個部分補強回來。"],["蔡委員易餘：好，我剛剛跟院長報告的，包括六腳排水，它可能還需要三十幾億。你說南靖排水，這個夯不啷噹加起來，我覺得可能還差五十幾億，因為過去都是一段一段做，可能預算規模很大，就如同院長剛剛說的，我們趕快在這1,000億的預算中來協助這一塊。但是我要跟院長說，從去年的凱米颱風，事實上我們也看到中央管河川疏濬的問題還是持續中，去年凱米颱風後，第五河川分署疏濬了超過400萬方的土方，疏濬了這些，所以在今年的強降雨，八掌溪沒有溢流了，就是八掌溪是有效果，不過你看這個雨，山上下大雨，結果那些土石流沿著上游又下來，我們看到就說哇，你看！整個八掌溪等於上面的那些土又這樣流下來了，所以還是持續有疏濬的需求。這一次特別條例裡面沒有講到疏濬這塊，我自己提一個對案，我希望還是可以把疏濬這一塊納入在這一次災後重建的條例，然後持續要有預算做重要河川的疏濬，這部分可以嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：中央管河川的疏濬，我們在年度的公務預算當中就會有所編列，那麼我再來檢討，就這一次風災豪雨之後應該優先整治的地區，我們會把它挑出來，能夠即時改善。"],["蔡委員易餘：好，謝謝院長。","接下來再來說農業的問題，事實上是想不到啦！這次是17級風，我們嘉義太保本來大概是有很多青農返鄉，在那邊做溫網室的耕作，所以那邊的青農很多都投入做溫網室，但這次颱風這麼強，縱使他是使用C型鋼或R管的溫網室，也都吹壞了。院長，你們的行政團隊很棒，農業部長也說好，希望可以協助這些青農迅速恢復生產能量。為了讓這些青農恢復生產能量，你們就說溫網室補助八成。哇！補助八成，所以這些青農都有感受到行政院的誠意，但是因為災害有很多不同的樣態，有的是溫室倒了，有的沒倒；而沒倒的，就是帆布破損，帆布破損就一定要整個換新。過去帆布一分地的修理費差不多要35萬，你們就照以往的補助方式，一分地補助10萬，結果就產生了一個不公平的現象，就是如果是溫室倒掉的，補助八成，如果是帆布吹壞掉的，補助10萬，等於三成不到，所以他們就認為那乾脆把溫室整個直接弄掉，然後等於也是毀損。當然這樣不好，而且浪費預算，所以我想針對帆布壞掉的這一塊能不能做一個調整？就是現在我們已經宣布溫室倒掉的補助八成，那麼帆布壞掉的，是不是也可以做一個調整？"],["陳部長駿季：我跟委員說明，這件事情我也注意到了，就是我們在處理溫室設施的部分，重建的部分是八成沒問題，但帆布、塑膠布的部分，因為它是消耗性耗材，我們也去調查現在的成本，所以正準備從原來的補助三分之一再往上調一些，因為我也覺得那個落差太大，所以這個部分我們已經有在處理了。"],["蔡委員易餘：好，看能不能再調整一下。另外，現在青農如果要恢復工作，事實上是需要時間，因為溫網室需要修繕，可是有做溫網室修繕的公司大概就那幾間，他們也面臨到缺工的問題，現在需要工人真的都調不到，因為他們也有工會，所以有沒有可能在這段時間，讓這些做溫網室的工會一樣可以納入所謂的外展制度，這樣他們就有辦法透過外展再去聘請一些移工，來協助這段時間所需要密集修繕的溫網室工作？這部分有沒有辦法協助？"],["陳部長駿季：外展移工的部分，的確，現在有關修繕溫室的工班很難處理，我們預估全部重新修好至少要8到12個月……"],["蔡委員易餘：是啊！"],["陳部長駿季：會拉得很長，所以我們會儘快跟勞動部協調，不過引進外籍移工可能需要的時間會比較長，至少是半年以後的事情，所以我們現在也協調溫室工會，看他們彼此是不是可以做一些比較好的分工，然後有一些屬於協助工的部分，我們來幫他們找一些比較臨時的協助人力，以滿足他們的需求。"],["蔡委員易餘：好。最後一個議題，因為我們現在正在講要加速復原，可是加速復原的壓力在哪裡？在基層，尤其是公所的公務人員，從這一次事件我們就可以很深的感受到，現在辦理發包的工程人員不夠、不足，尤其是在公所這一塊，公所建設課的人員最高職等就八職等，所以基本上是留不住人，人都跑到縣政府，甚至是跑到中央政府，因為中央政府的職等比較高，而這個職等的差距已經造成公所留不住人，那就會延緩到接下來救災的整個進度，針對這部分，院長是不是也可以檢討一下，怎麼讓基層的三級政府可以留得住這樣的工程人才？"],["卓院長榮泰：我們除了有專業加給之外，前幾年也討論過六都跟非六都職等不同的問題，並把它拉近了，委員現在提出來，我們會重新再就相關案子來討論。"],["蔡委員易餘：那是六都和非六都，但是還沒有處理到三級政府……"],["卓院長榮泰：好，這個部分，我們再來檢討，謝謝。"],["蔡委員易餘：三級政府這一塊，可能要再來想一下辦法，好不好？"],["卓院長榮泰：好的，謝謝。"],["蔡委員易餘：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝蔡易餘委員的質詢，謝謝卓院長、各部會首長的備詢，謝謝。接下來請邱鎮軍委員質詢，郭國文委員請準備。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":138,"meet_id":"院會-11-3-24","speakers":["韓國瑜","鍾佳濱","傅崐萁","林國成","王定宇","楊瓊瓔","張啓楷","徐富癸","張嘉郡","賴惠員","謝龍介","林俊憲","王育敏","蔡易餘","邱鎮軍","郭國文","蘇清泉","陳冠廷","盧縣一","林岱樺","羅智強","劉建國","黃建賓"],"page_start":41,"meetingDate":["2025-08-12"],"gazette_id":"1147001","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1147001_00003","1147001_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期第24次會議紀錄","content":"行政院院長提出「丹娜絲颱風及七二八豪雨災後復原重建」專案報告並備質詢─ 詢答完畢─","agenda_id":"1147001_00006"}}}