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636.324, \"end\": 645.081, \"text\": \"第一個要報告的 你直接告訴我是百分之多少到多少嘛我就問的是塑橡膠的產業 我問你什麼 你回答什麼呀\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 636.324, \"end\": 636.405, \"score\": 0.779}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 636.405, \"end\": 636.605, \"score\": 0.726}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 636.605, \"end\": 636.906, \"score\": 0.693}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 636.906, \"end\": 637.106, \"score\": 0.871}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 637.106, \"end\": 637.968, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 637.968, \"end\": 638.128, \"score\": 0.627}, {\"word\": \"直\", \"start\": 638.128, \"end\": 638.268, \"score\": 0.884}, {\"word\": \"接\", \"start\": 638.268, \"end\": 638.468, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 638.468, \"end\": 638.829, \"score\": 0.803}, {\"word\": \"訴\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 638.829, \"end\": 639.009, \"score\": 0.756}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 639.009, \"end\": 639.23, \"score\": 0.638}, {\"word\": 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\"業\"}, {\"word\": \"振\", \"start\": 968.643, \"end\": 968.663, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"興\"}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 968.663, \"end\": 968.863, \"score\": 0.623}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 968.863, \"end\": 969.344, \"score\": 0.818}, {\"word\": \"金\", \"start\": 969.344, \"end\": 969.364, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"額\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 969.364, \"end\": 969.384, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 969.384, \"end\": 969.504, \"score\": 0.825}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 969.504, \"end\": 969.524, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 969.524, \"end\": 969.544, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"調\"}, {\"word\": \"高\", \"start\": 969.544, \"end\": 969.564, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 986.835, \"end\": 987.116, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 987.116, \"end\": 987.437, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 987.437, \"end\": 987.577, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"理\", \"start\": 987.577, \"end\": 987.758, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 987.758, \"end\": 987.978, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 987.978, \"end\": 988.119, \"score\": 0.938}, {\"word\": \"天\", \"start\": 988.119, \"end\": 988.62, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 988.62, \"end\": 988.821, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 988.821, \"end\": 989.021, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 989.021, \"end\": 989.502, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"通\", \"start\": 989.502, \"end\": 990.465, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"過\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"增\", \"start\": 990.465, \"end\": 990.706, \"score\": 0.893}, {\"word\": \"加\", \"start\": 990.706, \"end\": 992.009, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"2\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"億\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 992.009, \"end\": 992.45, \"score\": 0.791}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"子\", \"start\": 992.45, \"end\": 992.551, \"score\": 0.868}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 992.551, \"end\": 992.851, \"score\": 0.809}, {\"word\": \"規\"}, {\"word\": \"模\", \"start\": 992.851, \"end\": 993.252, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 993.252, \"end\": 993.272, \"score\": 0.005}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,169 --> 00:00:05,698\n我們有請這個行政院經貿談判辦公室的副總談判代表\n\n2\n00:00:12,457 --> 00:00:30,604\n首先非常遺憾我今天看到書面報告裡面行政院的經貿辦公室還是沒有把國人的話聽進去今天的報告裡面翻開來還是一樣是官腔喪事喜辦只講說有幾成是零關稅卻不去談論那一些要被疊加關稅的產業\n\n3\n00:00:32,905 --> 00:00:43,615\n現在已經開始被收稅了他們到底會受到哪一些的衝擊影響有多大出口比例從業人員等等的問題以及你們規劃的930億的預算現在目前明明都還沒有談完就已經決定編列這個數額到底是哪裡想像來的\n\n4\n00:00:51,903 --> 00:01:03,833\n那首先大家對於20加N的這個疊加性的關稅影響呢很多國人是不知道的4月確實有說有疊加式的這個關稅可是問題是我們要請大家去跟美國談不過就是希望第一個關稅的稅率能夠下降第二個不要用疊加的方式嘛\n\n5\n00:01:13,101 --> 00:01:42,564\n結果你的關稅你說我從32%下降到20%那疊加性沒有被取消為什麼賴總統都沒有告訴國人一直到這個話題延燒起來之後鄭麗君才開了一個記者會告訴大家對確實有疊加我在這裡詢問三個主要的產業第一個自行車的部分我想要請教我們的最惠國的待遇關稅範圍也就是MFN的部分大概是在百分之多少到多少\n\n6\n00:01:44,851 --> 00:01:54,313\n就這一個部分我想我們的關稅結構有經過進一步的分析我們大部分的工業產品實際上都是我問的是自行車產業我們一個一個產業來談我不想再聽這些官腔的事情了一個一個產業來談我才知道你們到底在談判的時候你們知不知道你們在談什麼嘛自行車最惠國待遇的關稅範圍是多少很難嗎\n\n7\n00:02:14,375 --> 00:02:23,260\n我想這個數字呢或許我們可以再做進一步的調查什麼意思還要調查你知道這些數據都是在網路上都查得到的嗎那為什麼我現在在公開質詢你你不知道呢來再來整體的從業人員我們在2024年有多少的台灣人民在從事這項產業\n\n8\n00:02:40,082 --> 00:02:54,316\n報告委員我們基本上是協助產業我們要知道這個產業的規模有多大嘛有多少人有可能被裁員那你是不是應該要知道這個產業裡面有多少人在工作你知道嗎\n\n9\n00:02:55,357 --> 00:03:24,669\n我可以跟委員報告我們當然知道這個產業大概有三萬七千人的就業人口但是我要跟您報告的是我們是行政院經貿談判辦公室我們來協助協調對外的談判事務沒錯但是你們在談判的時候你們也要了解嘛所以我剛剛問的第一個問題還沒有答出來啊就是說我們在自行車的最惠國待遇的關稅範圍大概是多少到多少他們應該已經拿答案給你看了吧剛剛你不知道現在知道了吧\n\n10\n00:03:25,570 --> 00:03:31,535\n我想我們的自行車的產業大概在5.6%上下的MFN但是我們剛剛是想要跟您進一步說明我們的整個產業基本上零關稅在工業產品的零關稅比例你說百分之五對不對平均嘛平均百分之五剛剛你講的平均百分之五對不對你選的是最低值我來告訴大家我們可以看一下這個自行車\n\n11\n00:03:49,890 --> 00:04:13,440\n自行車的關稅裡面我們可以看到在關稅表裡面的HTS裡面的87120015Bicycles這個不是電動的然後呢輪子呢over63.5cm的就是比較大輪胎的整車我請問一下它的匯率是多少原本的最惠國匯率是多少上面寫得很清楚11%對吧\n\n12\n00:04:19,355 --> 00:04:32,579\n按照您這個表格看起來這個表格就是都公開大家都可以看得到的表格不是按照我的表格好嗎所以如果我今天的表格有錯你可以告訴我但是我想要問63公分點5公分這個輪子的自行車的整車它的輸美關稅原本是不是11%\n\n13\n00:04:43,232 --> 00:05:06,568\n跟委員報告我剛剛會提到說這是參考您的提供資料是因為我們看到關稅稅責號列的最上面應該有一個column1or2就是有我是把它截掉了嘛不可能我整本都給你啊所以我想要問你知不知道63.5公分的自行車的整車它的輸美關稅是百分之多少在沒有疊加之前\n\n14\n00:05:07,915 --> 00:05:18,264\n我想每一個產品我們要去查這些關稅的稅率都不是問題所以我今天拿出來問你你也不清楚你還要回去查是不是你要告訴我的意思是這樣子跟委員報告我們的對美的關稅的談判\n\n15\n00:05:24,388 --> 00:05:31,231\n應該不是一個產品一個產品不是一個產品不是一個產品但是實際上影響到的就是每一項產品嘛所以當你今天你們很自信的說你們都去談判了結果我問你一個自行車的整成我拿的是自行車裡面最高稅率的那個本來的最惠國大約就是11%結果你不知道在自行車的這個產業裡面最大的\n\n16\n00:05:50,380 --> 00:06:02,349\n11%的原本的最惠國待遇的是哪一種的車型你不知道啊所以11%的原本的關稅加上20%是多少是高達31%你要讓這樣子的一個\n\n17\n00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:22,781\n63公分以上的整車類似這樣的產業以後如何生存來我再問紡織業紡織業我們的最惠國的關稅範圍是百分之多少到多少你們現在桌上應該已經有資料了翻給他看吧\n\n18\n00:06:23,959 --> 00:06:37,703\n我不曉得你們都在談判一些什麼我現在問的問題都非常簡單因為這一整個月以來大家都在針對自行車房之業像塑膠水五金產業手工具產業工具機重電產業這些議題都是原本有關稅的要疊加上去的所以你們應該早就知道我們會提出這樣子的一個疑問請問可以回答了嗎\n\n19\n00:06:49,386 --> 00:07:14,781\n要我等你多久時間需要暫停嗎跟委員報告我們蘇美的所有的關稅稅則有的是從價稅有的是從量稅我問你的是紡織產業確實就是紡織跟成衣所以是多少個百分比的範圍嗎我想我可以跟您報告像從量稅或許它會達到了大概有30%\n\n20\n00:07:16,389 --> 00:07:20,733\n這樣子一個稅率好你知道我要問什麼來我們看一下這個叫做針織衫一般男生女生都會穿的針織衫因為我覺得呢我們每次講紡織業大家也不曉得紡織業代表什麼意思是什麼樣的一個產品來給大家看一下這叫做針織衫它的序號呢61103030\n\n21\n00:07:39,307 --> 00:07:49,640\n然後呢,你可以看,這個sweaters,pullovers,similararticles,knittedorcrocheted,andofamandate,fibres,neocene,是32%的原關稅,加上20%之後,會是多少?\n\n22\n00:07:56,647 --> 00:08:00,190\n52%啊所以不是說我們疊加關稅好像現在都講的喔本來我看你的報告裡面寫的都是大多數都是零關稅只有少量的可能3%5%加上去就是2425也沒有很高比本來的32還要低我隨便挑一個女性男性最常穿的針織衫的產業\n\n23\n00:08:22,586 --> 00:08:26,033\n他原本的關稅就高達32%加了20%以後是52%啊我還沒有講前面的幾條啊前面的幾條羊毛的部分你可以看得到\n\n24\n00:08:36,001 --> 00:08:53,913\n我看一下羊毛的部分這個第一項6%的有17%的是containing23%ormoreofwool就是你如果添加23%或以上的羊毛相關的紡織物是17個百分點17加20是37所以你們在整個紡織產業裡面談下來的這個關稅因為原本他就有疊加上去之後對這個產業來說是很大的影響\n\n25\n00:09:06,241 --> 00:09:14,047\n你們了解以及有思考要怎麼處理嗎報告委員謝謝您的這個指點實際上我們都有注意到我們講平均值世代指的是我們有82%以上現在蘇美已經都是領關稅在工業產品上面我知道但是我問的是有特定的產業它受到影響嗎對有一些特定的產品它的關稅相對比較高\n\n26\n00:09:29,980 --> 00:09:35,041\n這個不只是相對比較高你都說到52%了只是相對比較高嗎我再來問像素膠這個也不是什麼很難的問題大家都在問來我們的素像膠最惠國的關稅的範圍大概是百分之多少\n\n27\n00:09:50,799 --> 00:09:52,200\n我需要暫停嗎我想要跟委員報告的這些個別的產品我現在就是在問個別的產業不是產品在這個產業裡面會有產品產業裡面它會先受損在個別的產品它會受損得更嚴重\n\n28\n00:10:10,831 --> 00:10:14,093\n所以我想要問你的是我們一直在講說塑像膠它會因為這次的關稅疊加受到影響那我請問你它的範圍原本的關稅範圍是多少為什麼我這三個這麼主要討論了一整個多月會受影響的產業我現在問你都還要浪費我三分鐘以上的時間你們才能夠回答呢\n\n29\n00:10:36,324 --> 00:10:45,081\n第一個要報告的你直接告訴我是百分之多少到多少嘛我就問的是塑橡膠的產業我問你什麼你回答什麼呀\n\n30\n00:10:46,787 --> 00:11:05,765\n對委員我們的塑膠產業平均的MFN關稅現在是4.6但是我們必須要看所有產品不是取決於單一的稅率的問題第二個我們必須要看我們實際上有沒有在出口這些產品第三個我們的競爭對手這些產品都是因為有在出口所以才會被討論\n\n31\n00:11:07,006 --> 00:11:10,347\n你要說紡織業沒有在被出口嗎你要說橡膠沒有被出口嗎你要告訴我自行車沒有對美出口嗎這些話你說得出來嗎我們再來看一下塑膠的部分塑膠很多人也不知道什麼是塑膠我隨便拉一個給大家看其中我們的手套\n\n32\n00:11:26,672 --> 00:11:44,102\n這個塑膠型的手套比如說你的家用清潔手套或者是你去吃手扒雞的這種手套這都是經常看到的很多的民生用品台灣做起來也是很便宜銷售到世界各國來說的話呢我們也相當有競爭力原本的關稅稅率就是6.5%加上20%以後是多少26.5%啊\n\n33\n00:11:51,280 --> 00:11:56,861\n所以關稅的稅率並不像你們講的啊暫時性的啊疊加的加起來呢也沒有很高好像24%你們大多都在講八成零關稅四成零關稅可是你們沒有告訴我們的在某一些特定的產業裡面他們受到巨大的傷害好我們看下一張有多少的廠商包含農民包含勞工他們都是非常不滿的\n\n34\n00:12:18,126 --> 00:12:23,629\n他們都覺得呢接下來關稅的海嘯會讓他們受到影響好下一張我剛剛問你的問題其實在網路上你也都能夠查得到來自經濟部的來源嘛所以我不曉得為什麼回答我們的問題要這麼慢估計的產業的衝擊的百分之比率你可以看到都非常高我剛才跟你講的所謂的自行車的這個部分來我們看一下美國市場\n\n35\n00:12:48,082 --> 00:13:14,720\n7月喔我們跟去年的7月比較蘇美的市場的減幅擴大到怎麼樣呢今年1月到7月出口美國是2.67億美元減幅是14.4%所以你可以看到今天不是現在才開始而且未來可能會更嚴重這就是大家對你們現在很沒有信心的原因所以我要告訴大家的事情是來下一張\n\n36\n00:13:16,212 --> 00:13:20,133\n連卓榮泰院長都說你們沒有做詳盡的說明要深刻的檢討那結果呢民進黨的立委說早就講過了還有呢民進黨的議員跟發言人說是我不認真我想要請教一下你們對於當初談完公布開講20%之後沒有特別在強調關於疊加性的部分並沒有被談掉這件事情\n\n37\n00:13:42,921 --> 00:13:46,506\n有沒有一個公開的說法跟國人說清楚\n\n38\n00:13:48,238 --> 00:13:58,721\n我想那個卓院長也已經在行政院會跟大家說明以後行政機關一定會就這些問題不厭其煩的一而再再而三的去說明對等關稅實際上的柯真那對於對等關稅我們的談判因為目前我們還沒有談到確定的稅率那就談判小組的規劃就是我們先把談稅率本身談到大致底定之後我們接下來才會去針對柯真的方式計算的方式來跟\n\n39\n00:14:16,326 --> 00:14:36,454\n所以呢你們的經濟部的關稅影響評估報告評估到哪裡了什麼時候要送完整的細節到立法院那既然談的狀況比原本至少郭志輝部長講的要比日韓還要好其實是更差那900多億的產業振興方案有沒有要增加\n\n40\n00:14:37,861 --> 00:14:53,516\n我想行政院都是持續在討論這個議題特別像您剛剛講的有一些重點你們不要再講持續討論這個議題因為昨天卓榮他院長說相關的很多比如說特別條例等等的很快就要出來啦很快數字就要出來了不是嗎\n\n41\n00:14:55,101 --> 00:15:05,634\n還是這個事情要等到下一個會期才要處理我想行政院可能或許會在今天做進一步的這個說明就這個國內的因應產業方案所以我要問的是國內因應產業方案原本規劃的900多億\n\n42\n00:15:11,101 --> 00:15:24,157\n在我們發現談判比原本預期想像要差的狀況之下第一個疊加性的第二個高於日韓請問我們原本要振興產業的900多億有沒有要往上調最後一個問題請您明確的回答我\n\n43\n00:15:30,882 --> 00:15:40,327\n第一個要跟委員報告的我們的談判是從32%降為20%所以並沒有比原本的預期差這是第一點沒有比原本的預期差那之前郭志輝在說什麼他說我們已經投資了這個台積電1650億了所以我們條件考於日韓所以說我們很有信心我們拿到的會比日韓還要來的低結果日韓是15%然後呢日本還不是疊加性的\n\n44\n00:15:57,637 --> 00:16:09,564\n那我不曉得我們跟主要的競爭國家比起來我們優勢優在哪裡所以我不同意你剛剛講的這句話請你收回那再來我要問的請回答我最後一個問題就是900多億的產業振興方案跟你原本至少郭志輝他講的那麼的覺得可以很好的這個狀態是不一樣的那請問900多億的產業振興方案金額有沒有要調高\n\n45\n00:16:26,835 --> 00:16:33,272\n就我的理解今天行政院會通過會增加200億的這樣子的規模好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n169\t5698\t我們有請這個行政院經貿談判辦公室的副總談判代表\n12457\t30604\t首先非常遺憾我今天看到書面報告裡面行政院的經貿辦公室還是沒有把國人的話聽進去今天的報告裡面翻開來還是一樣是官腔喪事喜辦只講說有幾成是零關稅卻不去談論那一些要被疊加關稅的產業\n32905\t43615\t現在已經開始被收稅了他們到底會受到哪一些的衝擊影響有多大出口比例從業人員等等的問題以及你們規劃的930億的預算現在目前明明都還沒有談完就已經決定編列這個數額到底是哪裡想像來的\n51903\t63833\t那首先大家對於20加N的這個疊加性的關稅影響呢很多國人是不知道的4月確實有說有疊加式的這個關稅可是問題是我們要請大家去跟美國談不過就是希望第一個關稅的稅率能夠下降第二個不要用疊加的方式嘛\n73101\t102564\t結果你的關稅你說我從32%下降到20%那疊加性沒有被取消為什麼賴總統都沒有告訴國人一直到這個話題延燒起來之後鄭麗君才開了一個記者會告訴大家對確實有疊加我在這裡詢問三個主要的產業第一個自行車的部分我想要請教我們的最惠國的待遇關稅範圍也就是MFN的部分大概是在百分之多少到多少\n104851\t114313\t就這一個部分我想我們的關稅結構有經過進一步的分析我們大部分的工業產品實際上都是我問的是自行車產業我們一個一個產業來談我不想再聽這些官腔的事情了一個一個產業來談我才知道你們到底在談判的時候你們知不知道你們在談什麼嘛自行車最惠國待遇的關稅範圍是多少很難嗎\n134375\t143260\t我想這個數字呢或許我們可以再做進一步的調查什麼意思 還要調查你知道這些數據都是在網路上都查得到的嗎那為什麼我現在在公開質詢你 你不知道呢來 再來整體的從業人員我們在2024年有多少的台灣人民在從事這項產業\n160082\t174316\t報告委員 我們基本上是協助產業我們要知道這個產業的規模有多大嘛有多少人有可能被裁員那你是不是應該要知道這個產業裡面有多少人在工作你知道嗎\n175357\t204669\t我可以跟委員報告我們當然知道這個產業大概有三萬七千人的就業人口但是我要跟您報告的是我們是行政院經貿談判辦公室我們來協助協調對外的談判事務沒錯但是你們在談判的時候你們也要了解嘛所以我剛剛問的第一個問題還沒有答出來啊就是說我們在自行車的最惠國待遇的關稅範圍大概是多少到多少他們應該已經拿答案給你看了吧剛剛你不知道現在知道了吧\n205570\t211535\t我想我們的自行車的產業大概在5.6%上下的MFN但是我們剛剛是想要跟您進一步說明我們的整個產業基本上零關稅在工業產品的零關稅比例你說百分之五對不對平均嘛平均百分之五剛剛你講的平均百分之五對不對你選的是最低值我來告訴大家我們可以看一下這個自行車\n229890\t253440\t自行車的關稅裡面我們可以看到在關稅表裡面的HTS裡面的87120015Bicycles這個不是電動的然後呢輪子呢over 63.5cm的就是比較大輪胎的整車我請問一下它的匯率是多少原本的最惠國匯率是多少上面寫得很清楚11%對吧\n259355\t272579\t按照您這個表格看起來這個表格就是都公開大家都可以看得到的表格不是按照我的表格好嗎所以如果我今天的表格有錯你可以告訴我但是我想要問63公分點5公分這個輪子的自行車的整車它的輸美關稅原本是不是11%\n283232\t306568\t跟委員報告我剛剛會提到說這是參考您的提供資料是因為我們看到關稅稅責號列的最上面應該有一個column 1 or 2就是有我是把它截掉了嘛不可能我整本都給你啊所以我想要問你知不知道63.5公分的自行車的整車它的輸美關稅是百分之多少在沒有疊加之前\n307915\t318264\t我想每一個產品我們要去查這些關稅的稅率都不是問題所以我今天拿出來問你你也不清楚你還要回去查是不是你要告訴我的意思是這樣子跟委員報告我們的對美的關稅的談判\n324388\t331231\t應該不是一個產品一個產品不是一個產品不是一個產品但是實際上影響到的就是每一項產品嘛所以當你今天你們很自信的說你們都去談判了結果我問你一個自行車的整成我拿的是自行車裡面最高稅率的那個本來的最惠國大約就是11%結果你不知道在自行車的這個產業裡面最大的\n350380\t362349\t11%的原本的最惠國待遇的是哪一種的車型你不知道啊所以11%的原本的關稅加上20%是多少是高達31%你要讓這樣子的一個\n367200\t382781\t63公分以上的整車類似這樣的產業以後如何生存來我再問紡織業紡織業我們的最惠國的關稅範圍是百分之多少到多少你們現在桌上應該已經有資料了翻給他看吧\n383959\t397703\t我不曉得你們都在談判一些什麼我現在問的問題都非常簡單因為這一整個月以來大家都在針對自行車房之業像塑膠水五金產業手工具產業工具機重電產業這些議題都是原本有關稅的要疊加上去的所以你們應該早就知道我們會提出這樣子的一個疑問請問可以回答了嗎\n409386\t434781\t要我等你多久時間需要暫停嗎跟委員報告我們蘇美的所有的關稅稅則有的是從價稅有的是從量稅我問你的是紡織產業確實就是紡織跟成衣所以是多少個百分比的範圍嗎我想我可以跟您報告像從量稅或許它會達到了大概有30%\n436389\t440733\t這樣子一個稅率好你知道我要問什麼來我們看一下這個叫做針織衫一般男生女生都會穿的針織衫因為我覺得呢我們每次講紡織業大家也不曉得紡織業代表什麼意思是什麼樣的一個產品來給大家看一下這叫做針織衫它的序號呢611 03030\n459307\t469640\t然後呢,你可以看,這個sweaters, pullovers, similar articles, knitted or crocheted, and of a mandate, fibres, neocene,是32%的原關稅,加上20%之後,會是多少?\n476647\t480190\t52%啊所以不是說我們疊加關稅好像現在都講的 喔本來我看你的報告裡面寫的都是大多數都是零關稅只有少量的可能3% 5%加上去就是24 25也沒有很高比本來的32還要低我隨便挑一個女性男性最常穿的針織衫的產業\n502586\t506033\t他原本的關稅就高達32%加了20%以後是52%啊我還沒有講前面的幾條啊前面的幾條羊毛的部分你可以看得到\n516001\t533913\t我看一下羊毛的部分這個第一項6%的有17%的是containing 23% or more of wool就是你如果添加23%或以上的羊毛相關的紡織物是17個百分點17加20是37所以你們在整個紡織產業裡面談下來的這個關稅因為原本他就有疊加上去之後對這個產業來說是很大的影響\n546241\t554047\t你們了解以及有思考要怎麼處理嗎報告委員謝謝您的這個指點實際上我們都有注意到我們講平均值世代指的是我們有82%以上現在蘇美已經都是領關稅在工業產品上面我知道但是我問的是有特定的產業它受到影響嗎對有一些特定的產品它的關稅相對比較高\n569980\t575041\t這個不只是相對比較高 你都說到52%了 只是相對比較高嗎我再來問 像素膠 這個也不是什麼很難的問題 大家都在問來 我們的素像膠 最惠國的關稅的範圍大概是百分之多少\n590799\t592200\t我需要暫停嗎我想要跟委員報告的這些個別的產品我現在就是在問個別的產業不是產品在這個產業裡面會有產品產業裡面它會先受損在個別的產品它會受損得更嚴重\n610831\t614093\t所以我想要問你的是我們一直在講說塑像膠它會因為這次的關稅疊加受到影響那我請問你它的範圍原本的關稅範圍是多少為什麼我這三個這麼主要討論了一整個多月會受影響的產業我現在問你都還要浪費我三分鐘以上的時間你們才能夠回答呢\n636324\t645081\t第一個要報告的 你直接告訴我是百分之多少到多少嘛我就問的是塑橡膠的產業 我問你什麼 你回答什麼呀\n646787\t665765\t對委員我們的塑膠產業平均的MFN關稅現在是4.6但是我們必須要看所有產品不是取決於單一的稅率的問題第二個我們必須要看我們實際上有沒有在出口這些產品第三個我們的競爭對手這些產品都是因為有在出口所以才會被討論\n667006\t670347\t你要說紡織業沒有在被出口嗎你要說橡膠沒有被出口嗎你要告訴我自行車沒有對美出口嗎這些話你說得出來嗎我們再來看一下塑膠的部分塑膠很多人也不知道什麼是塑膠我隨便拉一個給大家看其中我們的手套\n686672\t704102\t這個塑膠型的手套比如說你的家用清潔手套或者是你去吃手扒雞的這種手套這都是經常看到的很多的民生用品台灣做起來也是很便宜銷售到世界各國來說的話呢我們也相當有競爭力原本的關稅稅率就是6.5%加上20%以後是多少26.5%啊\n711280\t716861\t所以關稅的稅率並不像你們講的啊 暫時性的啊 疊加的加起來呢也沒有很高好像24%你們大多都在講八成零關稅四成零關稅可是你們沒有告訴我們的在某一些特定的產業裡面他們受到巨大的傷害好 我們看下一張有多少的廠商包含農民包含勞工他們都是非常不滿的\n738126\t743629\t他們都覺得呢接下來關稅的海嘯會讓他們受到影響好下一張我剛剛問你的問題其實在網路上你也都能夠查得到來自經濟部的來源嘛所以我不曉得為什麼回答我們的問題要這麼慢估計的產業的衝擊的百分之比率你可以看到都非常高我剛才跟你講的所謂的自行車的這個部分來我們看一下美國市場\n768082\t794720\t7月喔 我們跟去年的7月比較蘇美的市場的減幅擴大到怎麼樣呢今年1月到7月出口美國是2.67億美元減幅是14.4%所以你可以看到今天不是現在才開始而且未來可能會更嚴重這就是大家對你們現在很沒有信心的原因所以我要告訴大家的事情是來 下一張\n796212\t800133\t連卓榮泰院長都說你們沒有做詳盡的說明要深刻的檢討那結果呢民進黨的立委說早就講過了還有呢民進黨的議員跟發言人說是我不認真我想要請教一下你們對於當初談完公布開講20%之後沒有特別在強調關於疊加性的部分並沒有被談掉這件事情\n822921\t826506\t有沒有一個公開的說法跟國人說清楚\n828238\t838721\t我想那個卓院長也已經在行政院會跟大家說明以後行政機關一定會就這些問題不厭其煩的一而再再而三的去說明對等關稅實際上的柯真那對於對等關稅我們的談判因為目前我們還沒有談到確定的稅率那就談判小組的規劃就是我們先把談稅率本身談到大致底定之後我們接下來才會去針對柯真的方式計算的方式來跟\n856326\t876454\t所以呢你們的經濟部的關稅影響評估報告評估到哪裡了什麼時候要送完整的細節到立法院那既然談的狀況比原本至少郭志輝部長講的要比日韓還要好其實是更差那900多億的產業振興方案有沒有要增加\n877861\t893516\t我想行政院都是持續在討論這個議題特別像您剛剛講的有一些重點你們不要再講持續討論這個議題因為昨天卓榮他院長說相關的很多比如說特別條例等等的很快就要出來啦很快數字就要出來了不是嗎\n895101\t905634\t還是這個事情要等到下一個會期才要處理我想行政院可能或許會在今天做進一步的這個說明就這個國內的因應產業方案所以我要問的是國內因應產業方案原本規劃的900多億\n911101\t924157\t在我們發現談判比原本預期想像要差的狀況之下第一個疊加性的第二個高於日韓請問我們原本要振興產業的900多億有沒有要往上調最後一個問題請您明確的回答我\n930882\t940327\t第一個要跟委員報告的我們的談判是從32%降為20%所以並沒有比原本的預期差這是第一點沒有比原本的預期差那之前郭志輝在說什麼他說我們已經投資了這個台積電1650億了所以我們條件考於日韓所以說我們很有信心我們拿到的會比日韓還要來的低結果日韓是15%然後呢日本還不是疊加性的\n957637\t969564\t那我不曉得我們跟主要的競爭國家比起來我們優勢優在哪裡所以我不同意你剛剛講的這句話請你收回那再來我要問的請回答我最後一個問題就是900多億的產業振興方案跟你原本至少郭志輝他講的那麼的覺得可以很好的這個狀態是不一樣的那請問900多億的產業振興方案金額有沒有要調高\n986835\t993272\t就我的理解今天行政院會通過會增加200億的這樣子的規模好 謝謝\n","txt":"我們有請這個行政院經貿談判辦公室的副總談判代表\n首先非常遺憾我今天看到書面報告裡面行政院的經貿辦公室還是沒有把國人的話聽進去今天的報告裡面翻開來還是一樣是官腔喪事喜辦只講說有幾成是零關稅卻不去談論那一些要被疊加關稅的產業\n現在已經開始被收稅了他們到底會受到哪一些的衝擊影響有多大出口比例從業人員等等的問題以及你們規劃的930億的預算現在目前明明都還沒有談完就已經決定編列這個數額到底是哪裡想像來的\n那首先大家對於20加N的這個疊加性的關稅影響呢很多國人是不知道的4月確實有說有疊加式的這個關稅可是問題是我們要請大家去跟美國談不過就是希望第一個關稅的稅率能夠下降第二個不要用疊加的方式嘛\n結果你的關稅你說我從32%下降到20%那疊加性沒有被取消為什麼賴總統都沒有告訴國人一直到這個話題延燒起來之後鄭麗君才開了一個記者會告訴大家對確實有疊加我在這裡詢問三個主要的產業第一個自行車的部分我想要請教我們的最惠國的待遇關稅範圍也就是MFN的部分大概是在百分之多少到多少\n就這一個部分我想我們的關稅結構有經過進一步的分析我們大部分的工業產品實際上都是我問的是自行車產業我們一個一個產業來談我不想再聽這些官腔的事情了一個一個產業來談我才知道你們到底在談判的時候你們知不知道你們在談什麼嘛自行車最惠國待遇的關稅範圍是多少很難嗎\n我想這個數字呢或許我們可以再做進一步的調查什麼意思 還要調查你知道這些數據都是在網路上都查得到的嗎那為什麼我現在在公開質詢你 你不知道呢來 再來整體的從業人員我們在2024年有多少的台灣人民在從事這項產業\n報告委員 我們基本上是協助產業我們要知道這個產業的規模有多大嘛有多少人有可能被裁員那你是不是應該要知道這個產業裡面有多少人在工作你知道嗎\n我可以跟委員報告我們當然知道這個產業大概有三萬七千人的就業人口但是我要跟您報告的是我們是行政院經貿談判辦公室我們來協助協調對外的談判事務沒錯但是你們在談判的時候你們也要了解嘛所以我剛剛問的第一個問題還沒有答出來啊就是說我們在自行車的最惠國待遇的關稅範圍大概是多少到多少他們應該已經拿答案給你看了吧剛剛你不知道現在知道了吧\n我想我們的自行車的產業大概在5.6%上下的MFN但是我們剛剛是想要跟您進一步說明我們的整個產業基本上零關稅在工業產品的零關稅比例你說百分之五對不對平均嘛平均百分之五剛剛你講的平均百分之五對不對你選的是最低值我來告訴大家我們可以看一下這個自行車\n自行車的關稅裡面我們可以看到在關稅表裡面的HTS裡面的87120015Bicycles這個不是電動的然後呢輪子呢over 63.5cm的就是比較大輪胎的整車我請問一下它的匯率是多少原本的最惠國匯率是多少上面寫得很清楚11%對吧\n按照您這個表格看起來這個表格就是都公開大家都可以看得到的表格不是按照我的表格好嗎所以如果我今天的表格有錯你可以告訴我但是我想要問63公分點5公分這個輪子的自行車的整車它的輸美關稅原本是不是11%\n跟委員報告我剛剛會提到說這是參考您的提供資料是因為我們看到關稅稅責號列的最上面應該有一個column 1 or 2就是有我是把它截掉了嘛不可能我整本都給你啊所以我想要問你知不知道63.5公分的自行車的整車它的輸美關稅是百分之多少在沒有疊加之前\n我想每一個產品我們要去查這些關稅的稅率都不是問題所以我今天拿出來問你你也不清楚你還要回去查是不是你要告訴我的意思是這樣子跟委員報告我們的對美的關稅的談判\n應該不是一個產品一個產品不是一個產品不是一個產品但是實際上影響到的就是每一項產品嘛所以當你今天你們很自信的說你們都去談判了結果我問你一個自行車的整成我拿的是自行車裡面最高稅率的那個本來的最惠國大約就是11%結果你不知道在自行車的這個產業裡面最大的\n11%的原本的最惠國待遇的是哪一種的車型你不知道啊所以11%的原本的關稅加上20%是多少是高達31%你要讓這樣子的一個\n63公分以上的整車類似這樣的產業以後如何生存來我再問紡織業紡織業我們的最惠國的關稅範圍是百分之多少到多少你們現在桌上應該已經有資料了翻給他看吧\n我不曉得你們都在談判一些什麼我現在問的問題都非常簡單因為這一整個月以來大家都在針對自行車房之業像塑膠水五金產業手工具產業工具機重電產業這些議題都是原本有關稅的要疊加上去的所以你們應該早就知道我們會提出這樣子的一個疑問請問可以回答了嗎\n要我等你多久時間需要暫停嗎跟委員報告我們蘇美的所有的關稅稅則有的是從價稅有的是從量稅我問你的是紡織產業確實就是紡織跟成衣所以是多少個百分比的範圍嗎我想我可以跟您報告像從量稅或許它會達到了大概有30%\n這樣子一個稅率好你知道我要問什麼來我們看一下這個叫做針織衫一般男生女生都會穿的針織衫因為我覺得呢我們每次講紡織業大家也不曉得紡織業代表什麼意思是什麼樣的一個產品來給大家看一下這叫做針織衫它的序號呢611 03030\n然後呢,你可以看,這個sweaters, pullovers, similar articles, knitted or crocheted, and of a mandate, fibres, neocene,是32%的原關稅,加上20%之後,會是多少?\n52%啊所以不是說我們疊加關稅好像現在都講的 喔本來我看你的報告裡面寫的都是大多數都是零關稅只有少量的可能3% 5%加上去就是24 25也沒有很高比本來的32還要低我隨便挑一個女性男性最常穿的針織衫的產業\n他原本的關稅就高達32%加了20%以後是52%啊我還沒有講前面的幾條啊前面的幾條羊毛的部分你可以看得到\n我看一下羊毛的部分這個第一項6%的有17%的是containing 23% or more of wool就是你如果添加23%或以上的羊毛相關的紡織物是17個百分點17加20是37所以你們在整個紡織產業裡面談下來的這個關稅因為原本他就有疊加上去之後對這個產業來說是很大的影響\n你們了解以及有思考要怎麼處理嗎報告委員謝謝您的這個指點實際上我們都有注意到我們講平均值世代指的是我們有82%以上現在蘇美已經都是領關稅在工業產品上面我知道但是我問的是有特定的產業它受到影響嗎對有一些特定的產品它的關稅相對比較高\n這個不只是相對比較高 你都說到52%了 只是相對比較高嗎我再來問 像素膠 這個也不是什麼很難的問題 大家都在問來 我們的素像膠 最惠國的關稅的範圍大概是百分之多少\n我需要暫停嗎我想要跟委員報告的這些個別的產品我現在就是在問個別的產業不是產品在這個產業裡面會有產品產業裡面它會先受損在個別的產品它會受損得更嚴重\n所以我想要問你的是我們一直在講說塑像膠它會因為這次的關稅疊加受到影響那我請問你它的範圍原本的關稅範圍是多少為什麼我這三個這麼主要討論了一整個多月會受影響的產業我現在問你都還要浪費我三分鐘以上的時間你們才能夠回答呢\n第一個要報告的 你直接告訴我是百分之多少到多少嘛我就問的是塑橡膠的產業 我問你什麼 你回答什麼呀\n對委員我們的塑膠產業平均的MFN關稅現在是4.6但是我們必須要看所有產品不是取決於單一的稅率的問題第二個我們必須要看我們實際上有沒有在出口這些產品第三個我們的競爭對手這些產品都是因為有在出口所以才會被討論\n你要說紡織業沒有在被出口嗎你要說橡膠沒有被出口嗎你要告訴我自行車沒有對美出口嗎這些話你說得出來嗎我們再來看一下塑膠的部分塑膠很多人也不知道什麼是塑膠我隨便拉一個給大家看其中我們的手套\n這個塑膠型的手套比如說你的家用清潔手套或者是你去吃手扒雞的這種手套這都是經常看到的很多的民生用品台灣做起來也是很便宜銷售到世界各國來說的話呢我們也相當有競爭力原本的關稅稅率就是6.5%加上20%以後是多少26.5%啊\n所以關稅的稅率並不像你們講的啊 暫時性的啊 疊加的加起來呢也沒有很高好像24%你們大多都在講八成零關稅四成零關稅可是你們沒有告訴我們的在某一些特定的產業裡面他們受到巨大的傷害好 我們看下一張有多少的廠商包含農民包含勞工他們都是非常不滿的\n他們都覺得呢接下來關稅的海嘯會讓他們受到影響好下一張我剛剛問你的問題其實在網路上你也都能夠查得到來自經濟部的來源嘛所以我不曉得為什麼回答我們的問題要這麼慢估計的產業的衝擊的百分之比率你可以看到都非常高我剛才跟你講的所謂的自行車的這個部分來我們看一下美國市場\n7月喔 我們跟去年的7月比較蘇美的市場的減幅擴大到怎麼樣呢今年1月到7月出口美國是2.67億美元減幅是14.4%所以你可以看到今天不是現在才開始而且未來可能會更嚴重這就是大家對你們現在很沒有信心的原因所以我要告訴大家的事情是來 下一張\n連卓榮泰院長都說你們沒有做詳盡的說明要深刻的檢討那結果呢民進黨的立委說早就講過了還有呢民進黨的議員跟發言人說是我不認真我想要請教一下你們對於當初談完公布開講20%之後沒有特別在強調關於疊加性的部分並沒有被談掉這件事情\n有沒有一個公開的說法跟國人說清楚\n我想那個卓院長也已經在行政院會跟大家說明以後行政機關一定會就這些問題不厭其煩的一而再再而三的去說明對等關稅實際上的柯真那對於對等關稅我們的談判因為目前我們還沒有談到確定的稅率那就談判小組的規劃就是我們先把談稅率本身談到大致底定之後我們接下來才會去針對柯真的方式計算的方式來跟\n所以呢你們的經濟部的關稅影響評估報告評估到哪裡了什麼時候要送完整的細節到立法院那既然談的狀況比原本至少郭志輝部長講的要比日韓還要好其實是更差那900多億的產業振興方案有沒有要增加\n我想行政院都是持續在討論這個議題特別像您剛剛講的有一些重點你們不要再講持續討論這個議題因為昨天卓榮他院長說相關的很多比如說特別條例等等的很快就要出來啦很快數字就要出來了不是嗎\n還是這個事情要等到下一個會期才要處理我想行政院可能或許會在今天做進一步的這個說明就這個國內的因應產業方案所以我要問的是國內因應產業方案原本規劃的900多億\n在我們發現談判比原本預期想像要差的狀況之下第一個疊加性的第二個高於日韓請問我們原本要振興產業的900多億有沒有要往上調最後一個問題請您明確的回答我\n第一個要跟委員報告的我們的談判是從32%降為20%所以並沒有比原本的預期差這是第一點沒有比原本的預期差那之前郭志輝在說什麼他說我們已經投資了這個台積電1650億了所以我們條件考於日韓所以說我們很有信心我們拿到的會比日韓還要來的低結果日韓是15%然後呢日本還不是疊加性的\n那我不曉得我們跟主要的競爭國家比起來我們優勢優在哪裡所以我不同意你剛剛講的這句話請你收回那再來我要問的請回答我最後一個問題就是900多億的產業振興方案跟你原本至少郭志輝他講的那麼的覺得可以很好的這個狀態是不一樣的那請問900多億的產業振興方案金額有沒有要調高\n就我的理解今天行政院會通過會增加200億的這樣子的規模好 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.169 --> 00:05.698\n我們有請這個行政院經貿談判辦公室的副總談判代表\n\n00:12.457 --> 00:30.604\n首先非常遺憾我今天看到書面報告裡面行政院的經貿辦公室還是沒有把國人的話聽進去今天的報告裡面翻開來還是一樣是官腔喪事喜辦只講說有幾成是零關稅卻不去談論那一些要被疊加關稅的產業\n\n00:32.905 --> 00:43.615\n現在已經開始被收稅了他們到底會受到哪一些的衝擊影響有多大出口比例從業人員等等的問題以及你們規劃的930億的預算現在目前明明都還沒有談完就已經決定編列這個數額到底是哪裡想像來的\n\n00:51.903 --> 01:03.833\n那首先大家對於20加N的這個疊加性的關稅影響呢很多國人是不知道的4月確實有說有疊加式的這個關稅可是問題是我們要請大家去跟美國談不過就是希望第一個關稅的稅率能夠下降第二個不要用疊加的方式嘛\n\n01:13.101 --> 01:42.564\n結果你的關稅你說我從32%下降到20%那疊加性沒有被取消為什麼賴總統都沒有告訴國人一直到這個話題延燒起來之後鄭麗君才開了一個記者會告訴大家對確實有疊加我在這裡詢問三個主要的產業第一個自行車的部分我想要請教我們的最惠國的待遇關稅範圍也就是MFN的部分大概是在百分之多少到多少\n\n01:44.851 --> 01:54.313\n就這一個部分我想我們的關稅結構有經過進一步的分析我們大部分的工業產品實際上都是我問的是自行車產業我們一個一個產業來談我不想再聽這些官腔的事情了一個一個產業來談我才知道你們到底在談判的時候你們知不知道你們在談什麼嘛自行車最惠國待遇的關稅範圍是多少很難嗎\n\n02:14.375 --> 02:23.260\n我想這個數字呢或許我們可以再做進一步的調查什麼意思還要調查你知道這些數據都是在網路上都查得到的嗎那為什麼我現在在公開質詢你你不知道呢來再來整體的從業人員我們在2024年有多少的台灣人民在從事這項產業\n\n02:40.082 --> 02:54.316\n報告委員我們基本上是協助產業我們要知道這個產業的規模有多大嘛有多少人有可能被裁員那你是不是應該要知道這個產業裡面有多少人在工作你知道嗎\n\n02:55.357 --> 03:24.669\n我可以跟委員報告我們當然知道這個產業大概有三萬七千人的就業人口但是我要跟您報告的是我們是行政院經貿談判辦公室我們來協助協調對外的談判事務沒錯但是你們在談判的時候你們也要了解嘛所以我剛剛問的第一個問題還沒有答出來啊就是說我們在自行車的最惠國待遇的關稅範圍大概是多少到多少他們應該已經拿答案給你看了吧剛剛你不知道現在知道了吧\n\n03:25.570 --> 03:31.535\n我想我們的自行車的產業大概在5.6%上下的MFN但是我們剛剛是想要跟您進一步說明我們的整個產業基本上零關稅在工業產品的零關稅比例你說百分之五對不對平均嘛平均百分之五剛剛你講的平均百分之五對不對你選的是最低值我來告訴大家我們可以看一下這個自行車\n\n03:49.890 --> 04:13.440\n自行車的關稅裡面我們可以看到在關稅表裡面的HTS裡面的87120015Bicycles這個不是電動的然後呢輪子呢over63.5cm的就是比較大輪胎的整車我請問一下它的匯率是多少原本的最惠國匯率是多少上面寫得很清楚11%對吧\n\n04:19.355 --> 04:32.579\n按照您這個表格看起來這個表格就是都公開大家都可以看得到的表格不是按照我的表格好嗎所以如果我今天的表格有錯你可以告訴我但是我想要問63公分點5公分這個輪子的自行車的整車它的輸美關稅原本是不是11%\n\n04:43.232 --> 05:06.568\n跟委員報告我剛剛會提到說這是參考您的提供資料是因為我們看到關稅稅責號列的最上面應該有一個column1or2就是有我是把它截掉了嘛不可能我整本都給你啊所以我想要問你知不知道63.5公分的自行車的整車它的輸美關稅是百分之多少在沒有疊加之前\n\n05:07.915 --> 05:18.264\n我想每一個產品我們要去查這些關稅的稅率都不是問題所以我今天拿出來問你你也不清楚你還要回去查是不是你要告訴我的意思是這樣子跟委員報告我們的對美的關稅的談判\n\n05:24.388 --> 05:31.231\n應該不是一個產品一個產品不是一個產品不是一個產品但是實際上影響到的就是每一項產品嘛所以當你今天你們很自信的說你們都去談判了結果我問你一個自行車的整成我拿的是自行車裡面最高稅率的那個本來的最惠國大約就是11%結果你不知道在自行車的這個產業裡面最大的\n\n05:50.380 --> 06:02.349\n11%的原本的最惠國待遇的是哪一種的車型你不知道啊所以11%的原本的關稅加上20%是多少是高達31%你要讓這樣子的一個\n\n06:07.200 --> 06:22.781\n63公分以上的整車類似這樣的產業以後如何生存來我再問紡織業紡織業我們的最惠國的關稅範圍是百分之多少到多少你們現在桌上應該已經有資料了翻給他看吧\n\n06:23.959 --> 06:37.703\n我不曉得你們都在談判一些什麼我現在問的問題都非常簡單因為這一整個月以來大家都在針對自行車房之業像塑膠水五金產業手工具產業工具機重電產業這些議題都是原本有關稅的要疊加上去的所以你們應該早就知道我們會提出這樣子的一個疑問請問可以回答了嗎\n\n06:49.386 --> 07:14.781\n要我等你多久時間需要暫停嗎跟委員報告我們蘇美的所有的關稅稅則有的是從價稅有的是從量稅我問你的是紡織產業確實就是紡織跟成衣所以是多少個百分比的範圍嗎我想我可以跟您報告像從量稅或許它會達到了大概有30%\n\n07:16.389 --> 07:20.733\n這樣子一個稅率好你知道我要問什麼來我們看一下這個叫做針織衫一般男生女生都會穿的針織衫因為我覺得呢我們每次講紡織業大家也不曉得紡織業代表什麼意思是什麼樣的一個產品來給大家看一下這叫做針織衫它的序號呢61103030\n\n07:39.307 --> 07:49.640\n然後呢,你可以看,這個sweaters,pullovers,similararticles,knittedorcrocheted,andofamandate,fibres,neocene,是32%的原關稅,加上20%之後,會是多少?\n\n07:56.647 --> 08:00.190\n52%啊所以不是說我們疊加關稅好像現在都講的喔本來我看你的報告裡面寫的都是大多數都是零關稅只有少量的可能3%5%加上去就是2425也沒有很高比本來的32還要低我隨便挑一個女性男性最常穿的針織衫的產業\n\n08:22.586 --> 08:26.033\n他原本的關稅就高達32%加了20%以後是52%啊我還沒有講前面的幾條啊前面的幾條羊毛的部分你可以看得到\n\n08:36.001 --> 08:53.913\n我看一下羊毛的部分這個第一項6%的有17%的是containing23%ormoreofwool就是你如果添加23%或以上的羊毛相關的紡織物是17個百分點17加20是37所以你們在整個紡織產業裡面談下來的這個關稅因為原本他就有疊加上去之後對這個產業來說是很大的影響\n\n09:06.241 --> 09:14.047\n你們了解以及有思考要怎麼處理嗎報告委員謝謝您的這個指點實際上我們都有注意到我們講平均值世代指的是我們有82%以上現在蘇美已經都是領關稅在工業產品上面我知道但是我問的是有特定的產業它受到影響嗎對有一些特定的產品它的關稅相對比較高\n\n09:29.980 --> 09:35.041\n這個不只是相對比較高你都說到52%了只是相對比較高嗎我再來問像素膠這個也不是什麼很難的問題大家都在問來我們的素像膠最惠國的關稅的範圍大概是百分之多少\n\n09:50.799 --> 09:52.200\n我需要暫停嗎我想要跟委員報告的這些個別的產品我現在就是在問個別的產業不是產品在這個產業裡面會有產品產業裡面它會先受損在個別的產品它會受損得更嚴重\n\n10:10.831 --> 10:14.093\n所以我想要問你的是我們一直在講說塑像膠它會因為這次的關稅疊加受到影響那我請問你它的範圍原本的關稅範圍是多少為什麼我這三個這麼主要討論了一整個多月會受影響的產業我現在問你都還要浪費我三分鐘以上的時間你們才能夠回答呢\n\n10:36.324 --> 10:45.081\n第一個要報告的你直接告訴我是百分之多少到多少嘛我就問的是塑橡膠的產業我問你什麼你回答什麼呀\n\n10:46.787 --> 11:05.765\n對委員我們的塑膠產業平均的MFN關稅現在是4.6但是我們必須要看所有產品不是取決於單一的稅率的問題第二個我們必須要看我們實際上有沒有在出口這些產品第三個我們的競爭對手這些產品都是因為有在出口所以才會被討論\n\n11:07.006 --> 11:10.347\n你要說紡織業沒有在被出口嗎你要說橡膠沒有被出口嗎你要告訴我自行車沒有對美出口嗎這些話你說得出來嗎我們再來看一下塑膠的部分塑膠很多人也不知道什麼是塑膠我隨便拉一個給大家看其中我們的手套\n\n11:26.672 --> 11:44.102\n這個塑膠型的手套比如說你的家用清潔手套或者是你去吃手扒雞的這種手套這都是經常看到的很多的民生用品台灣做起來也是很便宜銷售到世界各國來說的話呢我們也相當有競爭力原本的關稅稅率就是6.5%加上20%以後是多少26.5%啊\n\n11:51.280 --> 11:56.861\n所以關稅的稅率並不像你們講的啊暫時性的啊疊加的加起來呢也沒有很高好像24%你們大多都在講八成零關稅四成零關稅可是你們沒有告訴我們的在某一些特定的產業裡面他們受到巨大的傷害好我們看下一張有多少的廠商包含農民包含勞工他們都是非常不滿的\n\n12:18.126 --> 12:23.629\n他們都覺得呢接下來關稅的海嘯會讓他們受到影響好下一張我剛剛問你的問題其實在網路上你也都能夠查得到來自經濟部的來源嘛所以我不曉得為什麼回答我們的問題要這麼慢估計的產業的衝擊的百分之比率你可以看到都非常高我剛才跟你講的所謂的自行車的這個部分來我們看一下美國市場\n\n12:48.082 --> 13:14.720\n7月喔我們跟去年的7月比較蘇美的市場的減幅擴大到怎麼樣呢今年1月到7月出口美國是2.67億美元減幅是14.4%所以你可以看到今天不是現在才開始而且未來可能會更嚴重這就是大家對你們現在很沒有信心的原因所以我要告訴大家的事情是來下一張\n\n13:16.212 --> 13:20.133\n連卓榮泰院長都說你們沒有做詳盡的說明要深刻的檢討那結果呢民進黨的立委說早就講過了還有呢民進黨的議員跟發言人說是我不認真我想要請教一下你們對於當初談完公布開講20%之後沒有特別在強調關於疊加性的部分並沒有被談掉這件事情\n\n13:42.921 --> 13:46.506\n有沒有一個公開的說法跟國人說清楚\n\n13:48.238 --> 13:58.721\n我想那個卓院長也已經在行政院會跟大家說明以後行政機關一定會就這些問題不厭其煩的一而再再而三的去說明對等關稅實際上的柯真那對於對等關稅我們的談判因為目前我們還沒有談到確定的稅率那就談判小組的規劃就是我們先把談稅率本身談到大致底定之後我們接下來才會去針對柯真的方式計算的方式來跟\n\n14:16.326 --> 14:36.454\n所以呢你們的經濟部的關稅影響評估報告評估到哪裡了什麼時候要送完整的細節到立法院那既然談的狀況比原本至少郭志輝部長講的要比日韓還要好其實是更差那900多億的產業振興方案有沒有要增加\n\n14:37.861 --> 14:53.516\n我想行政院都是持續在討論這個議題特別像您剛剛講的有一些重點你們不要再講持續討論這個議題因為昨天卓榮他院長說相關的很多比如說特別條例等等的很快就要出來啦很快數字就要出來了不是嗎\n\n14:55.101 --> 15:05.634\n還是這個事情要等到下一個會期才要處理我想行政院可能或許會在今天做進一步的這個說明就這個國內的因應產業方案所以我要問的是國內因應產業方案原本規劃的900多億\n\n15:11.101 --> 15:24.157\n在我們發現談判比原本預期想像要差的狀況之下第一個疊加性的第二個高於日韓請問我們原本要振興產業的900多億有沒有要往上調最後一個問題請您明確的回答我\n\n15:30.882 --> 15:40.327\n第一個要跟委員報告的我們的談判是從32%降為20%所以並沒有比原本的預期差這是第一點沒有比原本的預期差那之前郭志輝在說什麼他說我們已經投資了這個台積電1650億了所以我們條件考於日韓所以說我們很有信心我們拿到的會比日韓還要來的低結果日韓是15%然後呢日本還不是疊加性的\n\n15:57.637 --> 16:09.564\n那我不曉得我們跟主要的競爭國家比起來我們優勢優在哪裡所以我不同意你剛剛講的這句話請你收回那再來我要問的請回答我最後一個問題就是900多億的產業振興方案跟你原本至少郭志輝他講的那麼的覺得可以很好的這個狀態是不一樣的那請問900多億的產業振興方案金額有沒有要調高\n\n16:26.835 --> 16:33.272\n就我的理解今天行政院會通過會增加200億的這樣子的規模好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.169,"end":5.698,"text":"我們有請這個行政院經貿談判辦公室的副總談判代表"},{"start":12.457,"end":30.604,"text":"首先非常遺憾我今天看到書面報告裡面行政院的經貿辦公室還是沒有把國人的話聽進去今天的報告裡面翻開來還是一樣是官腔喪事喜辦只講說有幾成是零關稅卻不去談論那一些要被疊加關稅的產業"},{"start":32.905,"end":43.615,"text":"現在已經開始被收稅了他們到底會受到哪一些的衝擊影響有多大出口比例從業人員等等的問題以及你們規劃的930億的預算現在目前明明都還沒有談完就已經決定編列這個數額到底是哪裡想像來的"},{"start":51.903,"end":63.833,"text":"那首先大家對於20加N的這個疊加性的關稅影響呢很多國人是不知道的4月確實有說有疊加式的這個關稅可是問題是我們要請大家去跟美國談不過就是希望第一個關稅的稅率能夠下降第二個不要用疊加的方式嘛"},{"start":73.101,"end":102.564,"text":"結果你的關稅你說我從32%下降到20%那疊加性沒有被取消為什麼賴總統都沒有告訴國人一直到這個話題延燒起來之後鄭麗君才開了一個記者會告訴大家對確實有疊加我在這裡詢問三個主要的產業第一個自行車的部分我想要請教我們的最惠國的待遇關稅範圍也就是MFN的部分大概是在百分之多少到多少"},{"start":104.851,"end":114.313,"text":"就這一個部分我想我們的關稅結構有經過進一步的分析我們大部分的工業產品實際上都是我問的是自行車產業我們一個一個產業來談我不想再聽這些官腔的事情了一個一個產業來談我才知道你們到底在談判的時候你們知不知道你們在談什麼嘛自行車最惠國待遇的關稅範圍是多少很難嗎"},{"start":134.375,"end":143.26,"text":"我想這個數字呢或許我們可以再做進一步的調查什麼意思 還要調查你知道這些數據都是在網路上都查得到的嗎那為什麼我現在在公開質詢你 你不知道呢來 再來整體的從業人員我們在2024年有多少的台灣人民在從事這項產業"},{"start":160.082,"end":174.316,"text":"報告委員 我們基本上是協助產業我們要知道這個產業的規模有多大嘛有多少人有可能被裁員那你是不是應該要知道這個產業裡面有多少人在工作你知道嗎"},{"start":175.357,"end":204.669,"text":"我可以跟委員報告我們當然知道這個產業大概有三萬七千人的就業人口但是我要跟您報告的是我們是行政院經貿談判辦公室我們來協助協調對外的談判事務沒錯但是你們在談判的時候你們也要了解嘛所以我剛剛問的第一個問題還沒有答出來啊就是說我們在自行車的最惠國待遇的關稅範圍大概是多少到多少他們應該已經拿答案給你看了吧剛剛你不知道現在知道了吧"},{"start":205.57,"end":211.535,"text":"我想我們的自行車的產業大概在5.6%上下的MFN但是我們剛剛是想要跟您進一步說明我們的整個產業基本上零關稅在工業產品的零關稅比例你說百分之五對不對平均嘛平均百分之五剛剛你講的平均百分之五對不對你選的是最低值我來告訴大家我們可以看一下這個自行車"},{"start":229.89,"end":253.44,"text":"自行車的關稅裡面我們可以看到在關稅表裡面的HTS裡面的87120015Bicycles這個不是電動的然後呢輪子呢over 63.5cm的就是比較大輪胎的整車我請問一下它的匯率是多少原本的最惠國匯率是多少上面寫得很清楚11%對吧"},{"start":259.355,"end":272.579,"text":"按照您這個表格看起來這個表格就是都公開大家都可以看得到的表格不是按照我的表格好嗎所以如果我今天的表格有錯你可以告訴我但是我想要問63公分點5公分這個輪子的自行車的整車它的輸美關稅原本是不是11%"},{"start":283.232,"end":306.568,"text":"跟委員報告我剛剛會提到說這是參考您的提供資料是因為我們看到關稅稅責號列的最上面應該有一個column 1 or 2就是有我是把它截掉了嘛不可能我整本都給你啊所以我想要問你知不知道63.5公分的自行車的整車它的輸美關稅是百分之多少在沒有疊加之前"},{"start":307.915,"end":318.264,"text":"我想每一個產品我們要去查這些關稅的稅率都不是問題所以我今天拿出來問你你也不清楚你還要回去查是不是你要告訴我的意思是這樣子跟委員報告我們的對美的關稅的談判"},{"start":324.388,"end":331.231,"text":"應該不是一個產品一個產品不是一個產品不是一個產品但是實際上影響到的就是每一項產品嘛所以當你今天你們很自信的說你們都去談判了結果我問你一個自行車的整成我拿的是自行車裡面最高稅率的那個本來的最惠國大約就是11%結果你不知道在自行車的這個產業裡面最大的"},{"start":350.38,"end":362.349,"text":"11%的原本的最惠國待遇的是哪一種的車型你不知道啊所以11%的原本的關稅加上20%是多少是高達31%你要讓這樣子的一個"},{"start":367.2,"end":382.781,"text":"63公分以上的整車類似這樣的產業以後如何生存來我再問紡織業紡織業我們的最惠國的關稅範圍是百分之多少到多少你們現在桌上應該已經有資料了翻給他看吧"},{"start":383.959,"end":397.703,"text":"我不曉得你們都在談判一些什麼我現在問的問題都非常簡單因為這一整個月以來大家都在針對自行車房之業像塑膠水五金產業手工具產業工具機重電產業這些議題都是原本有關稅的要疊加上去的所以你們應該早就知道我們會提出這樣子的一個疑問請問可以回答了嗎"},{"start":409.386,"end":434.781,"text":"要我等你多久時間需要暫停嗎跟委員報告我們蘇美的所有的關稅稅則有的是從價稅有的是從量稅我問你的是紡織產業確實就是紡織跟成衣所以是多少個百分比的範圍嗎我想我可以跟您報告像從量稅或許它會達到了大概有30%"},{"start":436.389,"end":440.733,"text":"這樣子一個稅率好你知道我要問什麼來我們看一下這個叫做針織衫一般男生女生都會穿的針織衫因為我覺得呢我們每次講紡織業大家也不曉得紡織業代表什麼意思是什麼樣的一個產品來給大家看一下這叫做針織衫它的序號呢611 03030"},{"start":459.307,"end":469.64,"text":"然後呢,你可以看,這個sweaters, pullovers, similar articles, knitted or crocheted, and of a mandate, fibres, neocene,是32%的原關稅,加上20%之後,會是多少?"},{"start":476.647,"end":480.19,"text":"52%啊所以不是說我們疊加關稅好像現在都講的 喔本來我看你的報告裡面寫的都是大多數都是零關稅只有少量的可能3% 5%加上去就是24 25也沒有很高比本來的32還要低我隨便挑一個女性男性最常穿的針織衫的產業"},{"start":502.586,"end":506.033,"text":"他原本的關稅就高達32%加了20%以後是52%啊我還沒有講前面的幾條啊前面的幾條羊毛的部分你可以看得到"},{"start":516.001,"end":533.913,"text":"我看一下羊毛的部分這個第一項6%的有17%的是containing 23% or more of wool就是你如果添加23%或以上的羊毛相關的紡織物是17個百分點17加20是37所以你們在整個紡織產業裡面談下來的這個關稅因為原本他就有疊加上去之後對這個產業來說是很大的影響"},{"start":546.241,"end":554.047,"text":"你們了解以及有思考要怎麼處理嗎報告委員謝謝您的這個指點實際上我們都有注意到我們講平均值世代指的是我們有82%以上現在蘇美已經都是領關稅在工業產品上面我知道但是我問的是有特定的產業它受到影響嗎對有一些特定的產品它的關稅相對比較高"},{"start":569.98,"end":575.041,"text":"這個不只是相對比較高 你都說到52%了 只是相對比較高嗎我再來問 像素膠 這個也不是什麼很難的問題 大家都在問來 我們的素像膠 最惠國的關稅的範圍大概是百分之多少"},{"start":590.799,"end":592.2,"text":"我需要暫停嗎我想要跟委員報告的這些個別的產品我現在就是在問個別的產業不是產品在這個產業裡面會有產品產業裡面它會先受損在個別的產品它會受損得更嚴重"},{"start":610.831,"end":614.093,"text":"所以我想要問你的是我們一直在講說塑像膠它會因為這次的關稅疊加受到影響那我請問你它的範圍原本的關稅範圍是多少為什麼我這三個這麼主要討論了一整個多月會受影響的產業我現在問你都還要浪費我三分鐘以上的時間你們才能夠回答呢"},{"start":636.324,"end":645.081,"text":"第一個要報告的 你直接告訴我是百分之多少到多少嘛我就問的是塑橡膠的產業 我問你什麼 你回答什麼呀"},{"start":646.787,"end":665.765,"text":"對委員我們的塑膠產業平均的MFN關稅現在是4.6但是我們必須要看所有產品不是取決於單一的稅率的問題第二個我們必須要看我們實際上有沒有在出口這些產品第三個我們的競爭對手這些產品都是因為有在出口所以才會被討論"},{"start":667.006,"end":670.347,"text":"你要說紡織業沒有在被出口嗎你要說橡膠沒有被出口嗎你要告訴我自行車沒有對美出口嗎這些話你說得出來嗎我們再來看一下塑膠的部分塑膠很多人也不知道什麼是塑膠我隨便拉一個給大家看其中我們的手套"},{"start":686.672,"end":704.102,"text":"這個塑膠型的手套比如說你的家用清潔手套或者是你去吃手扒雞的這種手套這都是經常看到的很多的民生用品台灣做起來也是很便宜銷售到世界各國來說的話呢我們也相當有競爭力原本的關稅稅率就是6.5%加上20%以後是多少26.5%啊"},{"start":711.28,"end":716.861,"text":"所以關稅的稅率並不像你們講的啊 暫時性的啊 疊加的加起來呢也沒有很高好像24%你們大多都在講八成零關稅四成零關稅可是你們沒有告訴我們的在某一些特定的產業裡面他們受到巨大的傷害好 我們看下一張有多少的廠商包含農民包含勞工他們都是非常不滿的"},{"start":738.126,"end":743.629,"text":"他們都覺得呢接下來關稅的海嘯會讓他們受到影響好下一張我剛剛問你的問題其實在網路上你也都能夠查得到來自經濟部的來源嘛所以我不曉得為什麼回答我們的問題要這麼慢估計的產業的衝擊的百分之比率你可以看到都非常高我剛才跟你講的所謂的自行車的這個部分來我們看一下美國市場"},{"start":768.082,"end":794.72,"text":"7月喔 我們跟去年的7月比較蘇美的市場的減幅擴大到怎麼樣呢今年1月到7月出口美國是2.67億美元減幅是14.4%所以你可以看到今天不是現在才開始而且未來可能會更嚴重這就是大家對你們現在很沒有信心的原因所以我要告訴大家的事情是來 下一張"},{"start":796.212,"end":800.133,"text":"連卓榮泰院長都說你們沒有做詳盡的說明要深刻的檢討那結果呢民進黨的立委說早就講過了還有呢民進黨的議員跟發言人說是我不認真我想要請教一下你們對於當初談完公布開講20%之後沒有特別在強調關於疊加性的部分並沒有被談掉這件事情"},{"start":822.921,"end":826.506,"text":"有沒有一個公開的說法跟國人說清楚"},{"start":828.238,"end":838.721,"text":"我想那個卓院長也已經在行政院會跟大家說明以後行政機關一定會就這些問題不厭其煩的一而再再而三的去說明對等關稅實際上的柯真那對於對等關稅我們的談判因為目前我們還沒有談到確定的稅率那就談判小組的規劃就是我們先把談稅率本身談到大致底定之後我們接下來才會去針對柯真的方式計算的方式來跟"},{"start":856.326,"end":876.454,"text":"所以呢你們的經濟部的關稅影響評估報告評估到哪裡了什麼時候要送完整的細節到立法院那既然談的狀況比原本至少郭志輝部長講的要比日韓還要好其實是更差那900多億的產業振興方案有沒有要增加"},{"start":877.861,"end":893.516,"text":"我想行政院都是持續在討論這個議題特別像您剛剛講的有一些重點你們不要再講持續討論這個議題因為昨天卓榮他院長說相關的很多比如說特別條例等等的很快就要出來啦很快數字就要出來了不是嗎"},{"start":895.101,"end":905.634,"text":"還是這個事情要等到下一個會期才要處理我想行政院可能或許會在今天做進一步的這個說明就這個國內的因應產業方案所以我要問的是國內因應產業方案原本規劃的900多億"},{"start":911.101,"end":924.157,"text":"在我們發現談判比原本預期想像要差的狀況之下第一個疊加性的第二個高於日韓請問我們原本要振興產業的900多億有沒有要往上調最後一個問題請您明確的回答我"},{"start":930.882,"end":940.327,"text":"第一個要跟委員報告的我們的談判是從32%降為20%所以並沒有比原本的預期差這是第一點沒有比原本的預期差那之前郭志輝在說什麼他說我們已經投資了這個台積電1650億了所以我們條件考於日韓所以說我們很有信心我們拿到的會比日韓還要來的低結果日韓是15%然後呢日本還不是疊加性的"},{"start":957.637,"end":969.564,"text":"那我不曉得我們跟主要的競爭國家比起來我們優勢優在哪裡所以我不同意你剛剛講的這句話請你收回那再來我要問的請回答我最後一個問題就是900多億的產業振興方案跟你原本至少郭志輝他講的那麼的覺得可以很好的這個狀態是不一樣的那請問900多億的產業振興方案金額有沒有要調高"},{"start":986.835,"end":993.272,"text":"就我的理解今天行政院會通過會增加200億的這樣子的規模好 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":95,"blocks":[["徐委員巧芯：（9時24分）謝謝主席，有請行政院經貿談判辦公室的副總談判代表。"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：委員好。"],["徐委員巧芯：首先，非常遺憾，我今天看到書面報告，行政院經貿辦公室還是沒有把國人的話聽進去。翻開今天的報告，裡面還是一樣的官腔，喪事喜辦，只講有幾成是零關稅，卻不去談論那些要被疊加關稅的產業現在已經開始被收稅了，他們到底會受到哪些衝擊？影響有多大？乃至出口比例、從業人員等等問題，以及你們所規劃的930億預算，現在明明都還沒有談完，就已經決定編列這個數額，這到底是哪裡想像來的？","對於20加N疊加性關稅的影響，很多國人是不知道的。4月時確實有說到疊加性關稅，但問題是，我們請大家去跟美國談，所希望的就是：第一，關稅稅率能夠下降；第二，不要用疊加的方式。結果你們說關稅已經從32%下降到20%，可是疊加性並沒有取消，這點為什麼賴總統都沒有告訴國人？一直到這個話題延燒起來後，鄭麗君才開了一個記者會告訴大家：對，確實有疊加。","我在這裡要詢問三個主要產業：一，自行車部分，我想請教我們的最惠國待遇關稅範圍，也就是MFN的部分，大概是從百分之多少到多少？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：就這部分來說，我們的關稅結構有經過進一步的分析。我們大部分的工業產品實際上都是……"],["徐委員巧芯：我問的是自行車產業，我們一個一個產業來談，我不想再聽這些官腔了！一個一個產業來談，這樣我才知道你們在談判的時候到底知不知道你們在談什麼。自行車最惠國待遇的關稅範圍是多少？很難嗎？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：這個數字或許我們可以再做進一步的調查。"],["徐委員巧芯：什麼意思？還要調查？這些數據在網路上都查得到，你知道嗎？為什麼我現在公開質詢你，你卻不知道呢？","再來，整體從業人員，2024年有多少臺灣人民在從事這項產業？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：報告委員，我們基本上是協助產業來面對……"],["徐委員巧芯：我們要知道這個產業的規模有多大，有多少人可能被裁員，所以你是不是應該要知道這個產業裡面有多少人在工作？你知道嗎？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：跟委員報告，我們當然知道，這個產業的就業人口大概有3萬7,000人。但我要跟您報告的是，我們是行政院經貿談判辦公室，我們來協助、協調對外的談判事務……"],["徐委員巧芯：對，沒錯！但你們在談判時也要了解，所以我剛剛問的第一個問題你還沒有答出來啊！也就是自行車的最惠國待遇關稅範圍大概是多少到多少？他們應該已經拿答案給你看了吧？剛剛你不知道，現在知道了吧？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：我們的自行車產業大概在5.6%上下的MFN，但我剛剛是想跟您進一步說明，我們的整個產業基本上，工業產品的零關稅比例已經高達……"],["徐委員巧芯：5%，對不對？平均5%，剛剛你講的，平均5%，對不對？你選的是最低值！我來告訴大家，我們看一下自行車的關稅，在關稅表裡面的HTS 87120015 Bicycles，這不是電動的，輪子not over 63.5cm整車。我請問一下它的稅率是多少？原本的最惠國稅率是多少？上面寫得很清楚，11%，對吧？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：按照您這個表格看起來……"],["徐委員巧芯：這個表格是公開的，大家都可以看得到，不是按照我的表格，好嗎？如果今天表格有錯，你可以告訴我。但是我想請問，63.5公分輪子的整車自行車，它的輸美關稅原本是不是11%？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：跟委員報告，我剛剛提到是參考您所提供的資料，是因為關稅稅則號列的最上面應該要有一個column one or two……"],["徐委員巧芯：有，我把它截掉了，不可能整本都給你啊！"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：對……"],["徐委員巧芯：所以我想問你知不知道63.5公分的自行車整車輸美關稅是百分之多少？在沒有疊加之前。"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：我想每一個產品我們要去查它的關稅稅率都不是問題。"],["徐委員巧芯：但是我今天拿出來問你，你也不清楚，你還要回去查，你要告訴我的意思是不是這樣子？對吧？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：跟委員報告，我們對美關稅的談判應該不是一個產品一個產品去談的，我們在談的是整體性產業利益……"],["徐委員巧芯：不是一個產品一個產品去談，但是實際上影響到的就是每一項產品嘛！"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：是。"],["徐委員巧芯：所以當你今天很自信地說你們都去談判了，結果我問你一個自行車的整車，我們拿的是自行車裡面最高的那個稅率，本來的最惠國待遇就是11%，結果你不知道在自行車的產業裡面最大的11%、原本最惠國待遇的是哪一種車型，你不知道啊！所以11%的原本關稅加上20%是多少？是高達31%，你要讓這樣一個63公分以下的整車，類似這樣的產業以後如何生存？","來，我再問紡織業，紡織業，我們的最惠國關稅範圍是百分之多少到多少？你們現在桌上應該已經有資料了，翻給他看吧。我不曉得你們都在談判什麼，我現在問的問題都非常簡單，因為這一整個月以來，大家都在針對自行車、紡織業、塑橡膠、水五金產業、手工具產業、工具機、重電產業，這些議題都是原本有關稅，要疊加上去的，所以你們應該早就知道我們會提出這樣的疑問。請問可以回答了嗎？要我等你多久？時間需要暫停嗎？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：跟委員報告，我們輸美的所有關稅稅則，有的是從價稅，有的是從量稅，有的是……"],["徐委員巧芯：我問你的是紡織產業！"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：確實就是紡織跟成衣。"],["徐委員巧芯：所以是多少個百分比的範圍嘛！"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：我可以跟您報告，像從量稅或許它會達到大概30%這樣子的稅率。"],["徐委員巧芯：好，你知道我要問什麼。來，我們看一下，這個叫做針織衫，一般男生女生都會穿的針織衫，因為我覺得我們每次講紡織業，大家也不曉得紡織業代表什麼意思，它是什麼樣的產品。來，我給大家看一下，這叫做針織衫，它的序號61103030，然後你可以看一下Sweaters, pullovers and similar articles, knitted or crocheted, of manmade fibers, nesoi是32%的原關稅，加上20%之後會是多少？52%！所以不是說我們疊加關稅好像……現在都講的，本來我看你的報告裡面寫的大多數都是零關稅，只有少量的可能3%、5%，加上去就是24%、25%，也沒有很高，比本來的32%還要低。我隨便挑一個女性男性最常穿的針織衫的產業，它原本的關稅就高達32%，加了20%以後是52%啊，我還沒有講前面的幾條喔，前面幾條例如羊毛的部分，你可以看得到，羊毛的部分，第一項6%的有：17%的是containing 23% or more of wool，就是你如果添加23%或以上的羊毛相關的紡織物是17個百分點，17加20是37，所以你們在整個紡織產業裡面談下來的這個關稅，因為原本它就有關稅，疊加上去之後，對這個產業來說是很大的影響，你們了解以及有思考要怎麼處理嗎？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：報告委員，謝謝您的這個指點，實際上我們都有注意到，我們講平均值指的是我們有82%以上，現在輸美已經都是零關稅，在工業產品上面……"],["徐委員巧芯：我知道，但是我問的是有特定的產業它受到影響嘛！"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：對，有一些特定的產品，它的關稅相對比較高，這些政府都有在注意。"],["徐委員巧芯：這個不只是相對比較高，你都收到52%了，還只是相對比較高嗎？我再來問，塑橡膠，這個也不是什麼很難的問題，大家都在問，來，我們的塑橡膠最惠國的關稅範圍大概是百分之多少？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：我想這些產品……"],["徐委員巧芯：我需要暫停嗎？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：我想要跟委員報告的，這些個別的產品關稅高不代表……"],["徐委員巧芯：我現在就是在問個別的產業，不是產品！在這個產業裡面會有產品，產業裡面它會先受損，在個別的產品，它會受損得更嚴重，所以我想要問你的是，我們一直在講說塑橡膠會因為這次的關稅疊加受到影響，那我請問你，它原本的關稅範圍是多少？為什麼這三個這麼主要，討論了一整個多月會受影響的產業，我現在問你都還要浪費我3分鐘以上的時間你們才能夠回答呢？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：第一個要報告的，關稅不是一個單一元素……"],["徐委員巧芯：你直接告訴我是百分之多少到多少嘛！我現在問的是塑橡膠的產業，我問你什麼，你回答什麼呀。"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：對，委員，我們的塑膠產業，平均的MFN關稅現在是4.6%，但是我們必須要看，所有產品不是取決於單一稅率的問題。第二個，我們必須要看我們實際上有沒有在出口這些產品。第三個，我們的競爭對手，他們現在的稅率是多少。"],["徐委員巧芯：這些產品都是因為有在出口，所以才會被討論，你要說紡織業沒有被出口嗎？你要說橡膠沒有被出口嗎？你要告訴我自行車沒有對美出口嗎？這些話你說得出來嗎？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：整體來講……"],["徐委員巧芯：我們再來看一下塑膠的部分，塑膠，很多人也不知道什麼是塑膠，我隨便拉一個給大家看，其中我們的手套，塑膠型的手套，比如說你的家用清潔手套，或者是你去吃手扒雞的這種手套，這都是經常看到的民生用品，臺灣做起來也是很便宜，銷售到世界各國來說的話，我們也相當有競爭力，原本的關稅稅率就是6.5%，加上20%以後是多少？26.5%，所以關稅的稅率並不像你們講的暫時性的、疊加的，加起來也沒有很高，好像24%，你們大多都在講八成零關稅、四成零關稅，可是你們沒有告訴我們的，在某一些特定的產業裡面，他們受到巨大的傷害。","好，我們看下一張，有多少的廠商，包含農民，包含勞工，他們都是非常不滿的，他們都覺得接下來關稅海嘯會讓他們受到影響。","再下一張，我剛剛問你的問題，其實在網路上你也都能夠查得到，是來自經濟部嘛，所以我不曉得為什麼回答我們的問題要這麼慢。估計的產業受衝擊的百分比率，你可以看到都非常高。我剛才跟你講的所謂自行車的部分，我們看一下美國市場，我們跟去年的7月比較，輸美市場的減幅擴大到怎麼樣呢？今年1月到7月，出口美國是2.67億美元，減幅是14.4%，所以你可以看到，這不是現在才開始，而且未來可能會更嚴重，這就是大家對你們現在很沒有信心的原因。所以我要告訴大家的事情是，來，下一張，連卓榮泰院長都說你們沒有做詳盡的說明，要深刻的檢討，結果呢？民進黨的立委說「早就講過了」，還有民進黨的議員跟發言人說是我不認真，我想要請教一下，你們對於當初談完，公布開獎20%之後，沒有特別再強調關於疊加性的部分並沒有被談掉這件事情，有沒有一個公開的說法跟國人說清楚？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：我想卓院長也已經在行政院會跟大家說明，以後行政機關一定會就這些問題不厭其煩地，一而再、再而三地去說明對等關稅實際上的課徵。對於對等關稅的談判，因為目前我們還沒有談到確定的稅率，就談判小組的規劃，我們先把稅率本身談到大致底定之後，我們接下來才會去針對課徵的方式、計算的方式，來跟美國對接。"],["徐委員巧芯：所以你們經濟部的關稅影響評估報告評估到哪裡了？什麼時候要送完整的細節到立法院？既然談的狀況比原本……至少郭智輝部長講的，要比日、韓還要好，其實是更差，九百多億的產業振興方案有沒有要增加？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：我想行政院都是持續在討論這個議題，特別像您剛剛講的，有一些重點產業……"],["徐委員巧芯：你們不要再講持續討論這個議題，因為昨天卓榮泰院長說，相關的很多，比如說特別條例等等的，很快就要出來啦，很快數字就要出來了，不是嗎？還是這個事情要等到下一個會期才要處理？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：我想行政院可能或許會在今天做進一步的說明，就整個國內的因應產業方案。"],["徐委員巧芯：所以我要問的是，國內因應產業方案原本規劃的九百多億，在我們發現談判比原本預期、想像要差的狀況之下，第一個，疊加性的；第二個，高於日韓，請問我們原本要振興產業的九百多億有沒有要往上調？最後一個問題，請你明確的回答我。"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：第一個要跟委員報告的是，我們的談判是從32%降為20%，所以並沒有比原本的預期差，這是一點。第二點……"],["徐委員巧芯：沒有比原本預期差？那之前郭智輝在說什麼？他說我們台積電已經投資了1,650億，所以我們的條件好於日韓，我們很有信心，我們拿到的會比日韓還要來得低，結果日韓是15%，然後日本還不是疊加性的，我不曉得我們跟主要的競爭國家比起來，我們的優勢又在哪裡？所以我不同意你剛剛講的這句話，請你收回。","再來，請回答我最後一個問題，九百多億的產業振興方案，跟郭智輝原本講的覺得可以很好的狀態是不一樣的，請問九百多億的產業振興方案金額有沒有要調高？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：就我的理解，今天行政院會通過增加200億的規模。"],["徐委員巧芯：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝徐巧芯委員的質詢。","接下來請陳永康委員上臺質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":46,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-35-25","speakers":["黃仁","徐巧芯","陳永康","羅美玲","陳俊宇","王定宇","沈伯洋","馬文君","賴士葆","林倩綺","黃國昌","陳冠廷","林憶君","林楚茵","蘇清泉"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-08-14"],"gazette_id":"1147301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1147301_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期外交及國防委員會第25次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請外交部部長、經濟部次長、財政部次長、農業部次長、行政院經貿談判辦公室副總談判代表\n報告「因應台美關稅及國際局勢變化台美關係互動情形，暨俄烏戰事與以哈衝突外交援助概\n況」，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1147301_00001"}}}