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\"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:04,288 --> 00:00:13,693\n謝謝主席謝謝官員我想請邱部長還有食藥署還有健保署委員好\n\n2\n00:00:16,075 --> 00:00:40,232\n謝謝邱部長上禮拜我們有探討了一位其實在各方面都有違反到不管是醫療法醫事法等等還牽涉到國稅局法務部那您上禮拜說衛福部將嚴格的查辦所以在這邊也想問我們各部門的進度因為這個醫師可能在訴前的諮詢就已經違規還請病人貸款\n\n3\n00:00:42,193 --> 00:01:02,221\n那私底下有匯款還有他告訴很明確的告知病人說這個手術他除了申報健保以外還請你私下再付費給我然後我再另外做一些數試然後我們請健保署可以去追查他是不是所有的手術都是這樣做食藥署的話是因為他已經主動告知個案\n\n4\n00:01:03,341 --> 00:01:20,106\n這個人匯過來的錢他是去大陸幫他買大陸的醫材過來做手術有沒有違規還有最後您說您一週內會發函給法務部以及國稅局等等的所以想請問您各部門的進度現在如何了\n\n5\n00:01:20,987 --> 00:01:40,040\n好謝謝委員的隨行我想我們了解到這個信息以後馬上就站在中央主管機關的一個角色我們就會要去了解到地方衛生局處理的一個過程那所以其實他已經就\n\n6\n00:01:41,781 --> 00:02:01,326\n讓他就沒有再繼續做醫療行為那至於他剛剛委員所提到的各種各種問題我們都一個一個必須要去了解他是不是違反相關的規定跟法令一定要依法辦理那這個部分請醫事室看進度報告一下\n\n7\n00:02:02,455 --> 00:02:29,364\n是跟委員報告這個事情我們一直跟高雄市政府衛生局保持密切的聯繫那麼據我們所知在這個事件發生很快的時間內高雄市衛生局就去查了而且確實查到非常多不法的行為那包含有這個醫材是大陸的進口有違規的問題還有收費有稅務的問題這一些高雄市衛生局都已經移情給相關的機關來做敘處了\n\n8\n00:02:31,545 --> 00:02:55,244\n我們得知的訊息是這樣子包含國稅局他們也也已經函送了然後以及這個違反醫材他會送檢調來進一步的查明這樣子跟委員報告這個我們非常的關注這個事情所以請分區業務組針對這一名醫師還有這個醫院擴大把他全面的這個病例都要做專業審查\n\n9\n00:02:56,425 --> 00:03:06,246\n然後之後我們會精算出這個額度然後會擴大回推去扣這個20倍最高到20倍的罰款同時最終給他處以停業處分\n\n10\n00:03:08,545 --> 00:03:28,404\n針對食藥署的部分有關於醫師使用是不是大陸的醫材的部分因為當初他是主動提所以我們跟高雄市的衛生局他們已經進行積極的調查我想在有一定告一段對之後會立刻來跟大家做公佈以上好謝謝請三位署長可以回座\n\n11\n00:03:29,878 --> 00:03:52,036\n再來這個必須要給部長還是稍微鼓勵啦因為經過了非常非常多委員幾乎快要一年的質詢所以昨天您的這個狼藝平台上線了可是許多民團他還是沒有那麼滿意那以下我跟你列出幾點是因為之前呢您曾經在說成立狼藝平台的時候\n\n12\n00:03:53,837 --> 00:04:22,632\n說爛咖沒有這麼多所以不用可是我們看教師他們有很詳細的一個教師系統可以讓新的學校去聘任教師的時候在其他沒有公開資訊但是學校會知道說這個教室有沒有不良的記錄那律師的話他除了查有沒有罩他還可以去查他有沒有被懲處過以及有沒有違反律師倫理連這個律師忘記幫客戶上訴都會被列在上面\n\n13\n00:04:23,352 --> 00:04:50,802\n為了這些所有客戶他在聘請律師之前有一個公開清楚的資訊那昨天呢大家就說奇怪你們覺得爛咖沒有這麼多難道你們是覺得教師的爛咖很多或是律師的爛咖很多所以必須成立這個平台嗎再來你把平台公佈以後呢大家就有點震驚是因為這個平台公佈還有三位還在執業現在還在執業\n\n14\n00:04:52,182 --> 00:05:12,716\n然後因為他還沒送懲戒嘛這個懲戒也是我們一年來跟你討論的問題還有這個是性平有關於病人可能你們定義為脆弱族群的可是他性平有牽涉到同行就是說醫師或者是護理師其實很多都上新聞也都沒有在這上面\n\n15\n00:05:13,556 --> 00:05:28,652\n還有判刑確定才被放上去判刑確定都已經是三四年後的事情了行政調查結果出爐的也沒有上去這個是昨天許許多多的人反映的意見那這邊就跟你討論\n\n16\n00:05:30,456 --> 00:05:52,343\n這個也是之前你們的林靜儀次長曾經跟一個法律的教授在網路上比戰他在講說這個懲戒到底要依照哪一款才可以送那你們也一再的說無罪推定原則所以要判刑後才可以送懲戒等等好剛剛其實伊絲絲副市長講得非常的好\n\n17\n00:05:53,303 --> 00:06:10,996\n高雄市衛生局的動作比你們快很多他上禮拜馬上就做了行政調查調查了上百個病例然後馬上送懲戒馬上送懲戒以後又暫時停止他現在準備要開懲戒委員會所以我想要知道的是\n\n18\n00:06:12,441 --> 00:06:28,014\n這一年來我們跟你討論的醫師法第25條第28支4條到底是你們覺得很不好用還是不敢用還是你們沒有辦法做出清楚的定義所以不知道怎麼用謝謝委員的催省\n\n19\n00:06:34,827 --> 00:06:55,386\n我們看第一頁那個其實要這樣的一個公佈公佈也是要從技術面跟專業面各方面做一個很一直陸續的討論也要爭取譬如說這個我們也跟司法院一直聯繫但是這個部分\n\n20\n00:06:56,107 --> 00:07:18,057\n在嫁接上還沒有完全的直接嫁接所以這個還是用手工的以後我們會就是說去找我們以後希望跟相關的就直接連結那就是沒有落網之魚第二個就是說其實我們有關於涉及性品事件\n\n21\n00:07:19,429 --> 00:07:36,776\n是不是要停止這個停止只要有設置的話是不是要停止這個事情我們會在8月下旬邀請醫事人員的團體法規專家來召開會議來看看這樣的情況怎麼樣在合法又合乎大家期待的情況下來進行\n\n22\n00:07:37,876 --> 00:07:53,228\n那另外就是在剛剛講的另外懲罪是有關於違背醫學倫理的這個函式我們現在也在演繹當中我們希望來針對這個做一個比較明確的函式那這個名剛剛那個說\n\n23\n00:07:59,913 --> 00:08:21,054\n那還沒那麼多這個不是我講的啦這是醫事長講的衛福部官員講的我平常用詞是很尊重人家的啦那個每一個不管是誰我們都應該尊重他的這個就是您剛講到的韓式啦這個韓式是我5月就提案的\n\n24\n00:08:21,995 --> 00:08:33,670\n這五月就提案現在已經是八月中了那你中間有開過會還是你八月底才要開第一次會來跟專家討論這個意思是要不要這個回答\n\n25\n00:08:35,168 --> 00:08:58,336\n跟委員報告兩件事剛剛講的是在調查期間就給他停職這個是要開會討論那韓式的部分我們已經都準備好那先前當然也有一個延商的過程那我們預定是在8月中旬就可以把這個補充這個違背醫學倫理的內涵提供給各縣市衛生局衛生局還有醫事工會你也可以提供是是是好謝謝\n\n26\n00:08:59,736 --> 00:09:27,475\n再來我們就要講到說好剛剛你提到的停權的問題這個也是我想跟你討論剛才第28條為什麼上禮拜這個新聞出來民眾很震驚是因為民眾還可以上網掛他的號他在10天內發生了兩起減重手術死亡然後被開了記者會家屬出來公布一些這個與醫師互動的截圖以後結果發現他居然還在看診還可以掛號才發現說\n\n27\n00:09:30,656 --> 00:09:56,647\n原來讓一個醫師停權不是很容易結果最後高雄市衛生局用的這個我們也覺得很奇怪因為他用的是第36條他是用行政執行法第36條行政執行法很少用在醫生行政執行法是為了要維持公共秩序的他是阻止犯罪危害發生或是避免急迫危險那可以及時強制對於人的管束等等的\n\n28\n00:09:58,187 --> 00:10:15,595\n這個問題其實幾乎每一個胃黃委員會的委員都問過你了還有外委員會也問過你了我們現在是28條法源不足嗎不足高雄市衛生局來對他做緊急的停權嗎那醫師法到底有沒有修法的必要性還有我也想問你們用28-4條到底這三年來\n\n29\n00:10:18,877 --> 00:10:37,045\n近幾年來到底適用了幾個人還是其實根本裁罰的數量很少這個我可能會再用書面跟你們追數據可是如果你可以現在告訴我的話也OK報告委員我們我現在手上是沒有這個資料然後我們會後會來做補充好\n\n30\n00:10:40,615 --> 00:10:55,445\n那你會覺得你們是因為不敢用還是你認為有修法的必要因為現在高雄市衛生局是用這種很少用在醫生的法律才對他進行停權那你醫師法存在的目的是什麼\n\n31\n00:10:56,198 --> 00:11:21,226\n我想高雄市一定是N你相關的法令可以做的但是先保障我們民眾的權益所以先用這樣行政執行法第36條先來處理那自己說是不是說在議事法裡面的一個規定需要我們再把相關的資料整理一下然後再檢討看看他這樣的效果效力是不是說需要調整我們\n\n32\n00:11:21,886 --> 00:11:44,487\n那今天會後我會再跟你們要這個資料就是你們近幾年利用28-4到底有裁罰了多少的人最後只是一個延伸啦就是說很多醫生他會覺得您成立這個平台不管是獵醫或是良醫也是為了保障病人當然然後也為了保障其實我們大多數的醫生都是好的\n\n33\n00:11:45,328 --> 00:12:14,164\n所以除了性品的這些判決或是行政調查也有大家都會在新聞上看到長期倒刷健保卡偽造病例違法用密醫使用非法的療法等等的如果他是有懲戒的決議也應該要揭露因為上禮拜其實您看到這個案例也非常非常的生氣我是想表達的是說衛福部長您是否有考慮把獵醫良醫這些事都列進去考量假使這些尋求愛美追求壽身的人\n\n34\n00:12:14,764 --> 00:12:27,211\n他事先可以知道這些資訊的話比如說這個醫生嚴重的違反醫學倫理嚴重的違反醫師法醫療法他都事先知道我們可以可能有機會挽救第二條人命不是嗎\n\n35\n00:12:30,351 --> 00:12:48,788\n當然我們絕對保障民眾的權益不管是他知的權益或者是他接受醫療的就醫的一個安全性這個是最高的準則我們就是團隊就是全力在往這方面來努力所以需要做怎麼樣的工作我們都一定全力來努力\n\n36\n00:12:48,968 --> 00:13:11,406\n好因為林淑芬委員等一下可能會問這題所以我只是先延伸告訴你說其實除了狼醫性平事件還有很多病患需要知道的資訊我們就是為了保障其他99.9%以上好的醫生還有病人這樣子好嗎是的好那之後我再用書面書面跟你們詢問謝謝謝謝主席謝謝陳慶威委員來\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n4288\t13693\t謝謝主席 謝謝官員 我想請邱部長還有食藥署還有健保署委員好\n16075\t40232\t謝謝 邱部長上禮拜我們有探討了一位其實在各方面都有違反到不管是醫療法 醫事法等等還牽涉到國稅局 法務部那您上禮拜說衛福部將嚴格的查辦所以在這邊也想問我們各部門的進度因為這個醫師可能在訴前的諮詢就已經違規還請病人貸款\n42193\t62221\t那私底下有匯款還有他告訴很明確的告知病人說這個手術他除了申報健保以外還請你私下再付費給我然後我再另外做一些數試然後我們請健保署可以去追查他是不是所有的手術都是這樣做食藥署的話是因為他已經主動告知個案\n63341\t80106\t這個人匯過來的錢他是去大陸幫他買大陸的醫材過來做手術有沒有違規還有最後您說您一週內會發函給法務部以及國稅局等等的所以想請問您各部門的進度現在如何了\n80987\t100040\t好 謝謝委員的隨行我想我們了解到這個信息以後馬上就站在中央主管機關的一個角色我們就會要去了解到地方衛生局處理的一個過程那所以其實他已經就\n101781\t121326\t讓他就沒有再繼續做醫療行為那至於他剛剛委員所提到的各種各種問題我們都一個一個必須要去了解他是不是違反相關的規定跟法令一定要依法辦理那這個部分請醫事室看進度報告一下\n122455\t149364\t是跟委員報告這個事情我們一直跟高雄市政府衛生局保持密切的聯繫那麼據我們所知在這個事件發生很快的時間內高雄市衛生局就去查了而且確實查到非常多不法的行為那包含有這個醫材是大陸的進口有違規的問題還有收費有稅務的問題這一些高雄市衛生局都已經移情給相關的機關來做敘處了\n151545\t175244\t我們得知的訊息是這樣子包含國稅局他們也也已經函送了然後以及這個違反醫材他會送檢調來進一步的查明這樣子跟委員報告這個我們非常的關注這個事情所以請分區業務組針對這一名醫師還有這個醫院擴大把他全面的這個病例都要做專業審查\n176425\t186246\t然後之後我們會精算出這個額度然後會擴大回推去扣這個20倍最高到20倍的罰款同時最終給他處以停業處分\n188545\t208404\t針對食藥署的部分有關於醫師使用是不是大陸的醫材的部分因為當初他是主動提所以我們跟高雄市的衛生局他們已經進行積極的調查我想在有一定告一段對之後會立刻來跟大家做公佈以上好 謝謝請三位署長可以回座\n209878\t232036\t再來這個必須要給部長還是稍微鼓勵啦因為經過了非常非常多委員幾乎快要一年的質詢所以昨天您的這個狼藝平台上線了可是許多民團他還是沒有那麼滿意那以下我跟你列出幾點是因為之前呢您曾經在說成立狼藝平台的時候\n233837\t262632\t說爛咖沒有這麼多所以不用可是我們看教師他們有很詳細的一個教師系統可以讓新的學校去聘任教師的時候在其他沒有公開資訊但是學校會知道說這個教室有沒有不良的記錄那律師的話他除了查有沒有罩他還可以去查他有沒有被懲處過以及有沒有違反律師倫理連這個律師忘記幫客戶上訴都會被列在上面\n263352\t290802\t為了這些所有客戶他在聘請律師之前有一個公開清楚的資訊那昨天呢大家就說奇怪你們覺得爛咖沒有這麼多難道你們是覺得教師的爛咖很多或是律師的爛咖很多所以必須成立這個平台嗎再來你把平台公佈以後呢大家就有點震驚是因為這個平台公佈還有三位還在執業現在還在執業\n292182\t312716\t然後因為他還沒送懲戒嘛這個懲戒也是我們一年來跟你討論的問題還有這個是性平有關於病人可能你們定義為脆弱族群的可是他性平有牽涉到同行就是說醫師或者是護理師其實很多都上新聞也都沒有在這上面\n313556\t328652\t還有判刑確定才被放上去判刑確定都已經是三四年後的事情了行政調查結果出爐的也沒有上去這個是昨天許許多多的人反映的意見那這邊就跟你討論\n330456\t352343\t這個也是之前你們的林靜儀次長曾經跟一個法律的教授在網路上比戰他在講說這個懲戒到底要依照哪一款才可以送那你們也一再的說無罪推定原則所以要判刑後才可以送懲戒等等好 剛剛其實伊絲絲副市長講得非常的好\n353303\t370996\t高雄市衛生局的動作比你們快很多他上禮拜馬上就做了行政調查調查了上百個病例然後馬上送懲戒馬上送懲戒以後又暫時停止他現在準備要開懲戒委員會所以我想要知道的是\n372441\t388014\t這一年來我們跟你討論的醫師法第25條第28支4條到底是你們覺得很不好用還是不敢用還是你們沒有辦法做出清楚的定義所以不知道怎麼用謝謝委員的催省\n394827\t415386\t我們看第一頁那個其實要這樣的一個公佈公佈也是要從技術面跟專業面各方面做一個很一直陸續的討論也要爭取譬如說這個我們也跟司法院一直聯繫但是這個部分\n416107\t438057\t在嫁接上還沒有完全的直接嫁接所以這個還是用手工的以後我們會就是說去找我們以後希望跟相關的就直接連結那就是沒有落網之魚第二個就是說其實我們有關於涉及性品事件\n439429\t456776\t是不是要停止這個停止只要有設置的話是不是要停止這個事情我們會在8月下旬邀請醫事人員的團體法規專家來召開會議來看看這樣的情況怎麼樣在合法又合乎大家期待的情況下來進行\n457876\t473228\t那另外就是在剛剛講的另外懲罪是有關於違背醫學倫理的這個函式我們現在也在演繹當中我們希望來針對這個做一個比較明確的函式那這個名剛剛那個說\n479913\t501054\t那還沒那麼多 這個不是我講的啦這是醫事長講的衛福部官員講的我平常用詞是很尊重人家的啦那個每一個不管是誰我們都應該尊重他的這個就是您剛講到的韓式啦這個韓式是我5月就提案的\n501995\t513670\t這五月就提案現在已經是八月中了那你中間有開過會還是你八月底才要開第一次會來跟專家討論這個意思是要不要這個回答\n515168\t538336\t跟委員報告兩件事剛剛講的是在調查期間就給他停職這個是要開會討論那韓式的部分我們已經都準備好那先前當然也有一個延商的過程那我們預定是在8月中旬就可以把這個補充這個違背醫學倫理的內涵提供給各縣市衛生局衛生局還有醫事工會你也可以提供是是是好謝謝\n539736\t567475\t再來我們就要講到說好剛剛你提到的停權的問題這個也是我想跟你討論剛才第28條為什麼上禮拜這個新聞出來民眾很震驚是因為民眾還可以上網掛他的號他在10天內發生了兩起減重手術死亡然後被開了記者會家屬出來公布一些這個與醫師互動的截圖以後結果發現他居然還在看診還可以掛號才發現說\n570656\t596647\t原來讓一個醫師停權不是很容易結果最後高雄市衛生局用的這個我們也覺得很奇怪因為他用的是第36條他是用行政執行法第36條行政執行法很少用在醫生行政執行法是為了要維持公共秩序的他是阻止犯罪危害發生或是避免急迫危險那可以及時強制對於人的管束等等的\n598187\t615595\t這個問題其實幾乎每一個胃黃委員會的委員都問過你了還有外委員會也問過你了我們現在是28條法源不足嗎不足高雄市衛生局來對他做緊急的停權嗎那醫師法到底有沒有修法的必要性還有我也想問你們用28-4條到底這三年來\n618877\t637045\t近幾年來到底適用了幾個人還是其實根本裁罰的數量很少這個我可能會再用書面跟你們追數據可是如果你可以現在告訴我的話也OK報告委員我們我現在手上是沒有這個資料然後我們會後會來做補充好\n640615\t655445\t那你會覺得你們是因為不敢用還是你認為有修法的必要因為現在高雄市衛生局是用這種很少用在醫生的法律才對他進行停權那你醫師法存在的目的是什麼\n656198\t681226\t我想高雄市一定是N你相關的法令可以做的但是先保障我們民眾的權益所以先用這樣行政執行法第36條先來處理那自己說是不是說在議事法裡面的一個規定需要我們再把相關的資料整理一下然後再檢討看看他這樣的效果效力是不是說需要調整我們\n681886\t704487\t那今天會後我會再跟你們要這個資料就是你們近幾年利用28-4到底有裁罰了多少的人最後只是一個延伸啦就是說很多醫生他會覺得您成立這個平台不管是獵醫或是良醫也是為了保障病人當然然後也為了保障其實我們大多數的醫生都是好的\n705328\t734164\t所以除了性品的這些判決或是行政調查也有 大家都會在新聞上看到長期倒刷健保卡 偽造病例違法用密醫 使用非法的療法等等的如果他是有懲戒的決議也應該要揭露因為上禮拜其實您看到這個案例也非常非常的生氣我是想表達的是說 衛福部長您是否有考慮把獵醫良醫這些事都列進去考量假使這些尋求愛美 追求壽身的人\n734764\t747211\t他事先可以知道這些資訊的話比如說這個醫生嚴重的違反醫學倫理嚴重的違反醫師法醫療法他都事先知道我們可以可能有機會挽救第二條人命不是嗎\n750351\t768788\t當然我們絕對保障民眾的權益不管是他知的權益或者是他接受醫療的就醫的一個安全性這個是最高的準則我們就是團隊就是全力在往這方面來努力所以需要做怎麼樣的工作我們都一定全力來努力\n768968\t791406\t好因為林淑芬委員等一下可能會問這題所以我只是先延伸告訴你說其實除了狼醫性平事件還有很多病患需要知道的資訊我們就是為了保障其他99.9%以上好的醫生還有病人這樣子好嗎是的好那之後我再用書面書面跟你們詢問謝謝謝謝主席謝謝陳慶威委員來\n","txt":"謝謝主席 謝謝官員 我想請邱部長還有食藥署還有健保署委員好\n謝謝 邱部長上禮拜我們有探討了一位其實在各方面都有違反到不管是醫療法 醫事法等等還牽涉到國稅局 法務部那您上禮拜說衛福部將嚴格的查辦所以在這邊也想問我們各部門的進度因為這個醫師可能在訴前的諮詢就已經違規還請病人貸款\n那私底下有匯款還有他告訴很明確的告知病人說這個手術他除了申報健保以外還請你私下再付費給我然後我再另外做一些數試然後我們請健保署可以去追查他是不是所有的手術都是這樣做食藥署的話是因為他已經主動告知個案\n這個人匯過來的錢他是去大陸幫他買大陸的醫材過來做手術有沒有違規還有最後您說您一週內會發函給法務部以及國稅局等等的所以想請問您各部門的進度現在如何了\n好 謝謝委員的隨行我想我們了解到這個信息以後馬上就站在中央主管機關的一個角色我們就會要去了解到地方衛生局處理的一個過程那所以其實他已經就\n讓他就沒有再繼續做醫療行為那至於他剛剛委員所提到的各種各種問題我們都一個一個必須要去了解他是不是違反相關的規定跟法令一定要依法辦理那這個部分請醫事室看進度報告一下\n是跟委員報告這個事情我們一直跟高雄市政府衛生局保持密切的聯繫那麼據我們所知在這個事件發生很快的時間內高雄市衛生局就去查了而且確實查到非常多不法的行為那包含有這個醫材是大陸的進口有違規的問題還有收費有稅務的問題這一些高雄市衛生局都已經移情給相關的機關來做敘處了\n我們得知的訊息是這樣子包含國稅局他們也也已經函送了然後以及這個違反醫材他會送檢調來進一步的查明這樣子跟委員報告這個我們非常的關注這個事情所以請分區業務組針對這一名醫師還有這個醫院擴大把他全面的這個病例都要做專業審查\n然後之後我們會精算出這個額度然後會擴大回推去扣這個20倍最高到20倍的罰款同時最終給他處以停業處分\n針對食藥署的部分有關於醫師使用是不是大陸的醫材的部分因為當初他是主動提所以我們跟高雄市的衛生局他們已經進行積極的調查我想在有一定告一段對之後會立刻來跟大家做公佈以上好 謝謝請三位署長可以回座\n再來這個必須要給部長還是稍微鼓勵啦因為經過了非常非常多委員幾乎快要一年的質詢所以昨天您的這個狼藝平台上線了可是許多民團他還是沒有那麼滿意那以下我跟你列出幾點是因為之前呢您曾經在說成立狼藝平台的時候\n說爛咖沒有這麼多所以不用可是我們看教師他們有很詳細的一個教師系統可以讓新的學校去聘任教師的時候在其他沒有公開資訊但是學校會知道說這個教室有沒有不良的記錄那律師的話他除了查有沒有罩他還可以去查他有沒有被懲處過以及有沒有違反律師倫理連這個律師忘記幫客戶上訴都會被列在上面\n為了這些所有客戶他在聘請律師之前有一個公開清楚的資訊那昨天呢大家就說奇怪你們覺得爛咖沒有這麼多難道你們是覺得教師的爛咖很多或是律師的爛咖很多所以必須成立這個平台嗎再來你把平台公佈以後呢大家就有點震驚是因為這個平台公佈還有三位還在執業現在還在執業\n然後因為他還沒送懲戒嘛這個懲戒也是我們一年來跟你討論的問題還有這個是性平有關於病人可能你們定義為脆弱族群的可是他性平有牽涉到同行就是說醫師或者是護理師其實很多都上新聞也都沒有在這上面\n還有判刑確定才被放上去判刑確定都已經是三四年後的事情了行政調查結果出爐的也沒有上去這個是昨天許許多多的人反映的意見那這邊就跟你討論\n這個也是之前你們的林靜儀次長曾經跟一個法律的教授在網路上比戰他在講說這個懲戒到底要依照哪一款才可以送那你們也一再的說無罪推定原則所以要判刑後才可以送懲戒等等好 剛剛其實伊絲絲副市長講得非常的好\n高雄市衛生局的動作比你們快很多他上禮拜馬上就做了行政調查調查了上百個病例然後馬上送懲戒馬上送懲戒以後又暫時停止他現在準備要開懲戒委員會所以我想要知道的是\n這一年來我們跟你討論的醫師法第25條第28支4條到底是你們覺得很不好用還是不敢用還是你們沒有辦法做出清楚的定義所以不知道怎麼用謝謝委員的催省\n我們看第一頁那個其實要這樣的一個公佈公佈也是要從技術面跟專業面各方面做一個很一直陸續的討論也要爭取譬如說這個我們也跟司法院一直聯繫但是這個部分\n在嫁接上還沒有完全的直接嫁接所以這個還是用手工的以後我們會就是說去找我們以後希望跟相關的就直接連結那就是沒有落網之魚第二個就是說其實我們有關於涉及性品事件\n是不是要停止這個停止只要有設置的話是不是要停止這個事情我們會在8月下旬邀請醫事人員的團體法規專家來召開會議來看看這樣的情況怎麼樣在合法又合乎大家期待的情況下來進行\n那另外就是在剛剛講的另外懲罪是有關於違背醫學倫理的這個函式我們現在也在演繹當中我們希望來針對這個做一個比較明確的函式那這個名剛剛那個說\n那還沒那麼多 這個不是我講的啦這是醫事長講的衛福部官員講的我平常用詞是很尊重人家的啦那個每一個不管是誰我們都應該尊重他的這個就是您剛講到的韓式啦這個韓式是我5月就提案的\n這五月就提案現在已經是八月中了那你中間有開過會還是你八月底才要開第一次會來跟專家討論這個意思是要不要這個回答\n跟委員報告兩件事剛剛講的是在調查期間就給他停職這個是要開會討論那韓式的部分我們已經都準備好那先前當然也有一個延商的過程那我們預定是在8月中旬就可以把這個補充這個違背醫學倫理的內涵提供給各縣市衛生局衛生局還有醫事工會你也可以提供是是是好謝謝\n再來我們就要講到說好剛剛你提到的停權的問題這個也是我想跟你討論剛才第28條為什麼上禮拜這個新聞出來民眾很震驚是因為民眾還可以上網掛他的號他在10天內發生了兩起減重手術死亡然後被開了記者會家屬出來公布一些這個與醫師互動的截圖以後結果發現他居然還在看診還可以掛號才發現說\n原來讓一個醫師停權不是很容易結果最後高雄市衛生局用的這個我們也覺得很奇怪因為他用的是第36條他是用行政執行法第36條行政執行法很少用在醫生行政執行法是為了要維持公共秩序的他是阻止犯罪危害發生或是避免急迫危險那可以及時強制對於人的管束等等的\n這個問題其實幾乎每一個胃黃委員會的委員都問過你了還有外委員會也問過你了我們現在是28條法源不足嗎不足高雄市衛生局來對他做緊急的停權嗎那醫師法到底有沒有修法的必要性還有我也想問你們用28-4條到底這三年來\n近幾年來到底適用了幾個人還是其實根本裁罰的數量很少這個我可能會再用書面跟你們追數據可是如果你可以現在告訴我的話也OK報告委員我們我現在手上是沒有這個資料然後我們會後會來做補充好\n那你會覺得你們是因為不敢用還是你認為有修法的必要因為現在高雄市衛生局是用這種很少用在醫生的法律才對他進行停權那你醫師法存在的目的是什麼\n我想高雄市一定是N你相關的法令可以做的但是先保障我們民眾的權益所以先用這樣行政執行法第36條先來處理那自己說是不是說在議事法裡面的一個規定需要我們再把相關的資料整理一下然後再檢討看看他這樣的效果效力是不是說需要調整我們\n那今天會後我會再跟你們要這個資料就是你們近幾年利用28-4到底有裁罰了多少的人最後只是一個延伸啦就是說很多醫生他會覺得您成立這個平台不管是獵醫或是良醫也是為了保障病人當然然後也為了保障其實我們大多數的醫生都是好的\n所以除了性品的這些判決或是行政調查也有 大家都會在新聞上看到長期倒刷健保卡 偽造病例違法用密醫 使用非法的療法等等的如果他是有懲戒的決議也應該要揭露因為上禮拜其實您看到這個案例也非常非常的生氣我是想表達的是說 衛福部長您是否有考慮把獵醫良醫這些事都列進去考量假使這些尋求愛美 追求壽身的人\n他事先可以知道這些資訊的話比如說這個醫生嚴重的違反醫學倫理嚴重的違反醫師法醫療法他都事先知道我們可以可能有機會挽救第二條人命不是嗎\n當然我們絕對保障民眾的權益不管是他知的權益或者是他接受醫療的就醫的一個安全性這個是最高的準則我們就是團隊就是全力在往這方面來努力所以需要做怎麼樣的工作我們都一定全力來努力\n好因為林淑芬委員等一下可能會問這題所以我只是先延伸告訴你說其實除了狼醫性平事件還有很多病患需要知道的資訊我們就是為了保障其他99.9%以上好的醫生還有病人這樣子好嗎是的好那之後我再用書面書面跟你們詢問謝謝謝謝主席謝謝陳慶威委員來\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:04.288 --> 00:13.693\n謝謝主席謝謝官員我想請邱部長還有食藥署還有健保署委員好\n\n00:16.075 --> 00:40.232\n謝謝邱部長上禮拜我們有探討了一位其實在各方面都有違反到不管是醫療法醫事法等等還牽涉到國稅局法務部那您上禮拜說衛福部將嚴格的查辦所以在這邊也想問我們各部門的進度因為這個醫師可能在訴前的諮詢就已經違規還請病人貸款\n\n00:42.193 --> 01:02.221\n那私底下有匯款還有他告訴很明確的告知病人說這個手術他除了申報健保以外還請你私下再付費給我然後我再另外做一些數試然後我們請健保署可以去追查他是不是所有的手術都是這樣做食藥署的話是因為他已經主動告知個案\n\n01:03.341 --> 01:20.106\n這個人匯過來的錢他是去大陸幫他買大陸的醫材過來做手術有沒有違規還有最後您說您一週內會發函給法務部以及國稅局等等的所以想請問您各部門的進度現在如何了\n\n01:20.987 --> 01:40.040\n好謝謝委員的隨行我想我們了解到這個信息以後馬上就站在中央主管機關的一個角色我們就會要去了解到地方衛生局處理的一個過程那所以其實他已經就\n\n01:41.781 --> 02:01.326\n讓他就沒有再繼續做醫療行為那至於他剛剛委員所提到的各種各種問題我們都一個一個必須要去了解他是不是違反相關的規定跟法令一定要依法辦理那這個部分請醫事室看進度報告一下\n\n02:02.455 --> 02:29.364\n是跟委員報告這個事情我們一直跟高雄市政府衛生局保持密切的聯繫那麼據我們所知在這個事件發生很快的時間內高雄市衛生局就去查了而且確實查到非常多不法的行為那包含有這個醫材是大陸的進口有違規的問題還有收費有稅務的問題這一些高雄市衛生局都已經移情給相關的機關來做敘處了\n\n02:31.545 --> 02:55.244\n我們得知的訊息是這樣子包含國稅局他們也也已經函送了然後以及這個違反醫材他會送檢調來進一步的查明這樣子跟委員報告這個我們非常的關注這個事情所以請分區業務組針對這一名醫師還有這個醫院擴大把他全面的這個病例都要做專業審查\n\n02:56.425 --> 03:06.246\n然後之後我們會精算出這個額度然後會擴大回推去扣這個20倍最高到20倍的罰款同時最終給他處以停業處分\n\n03:08.545 --> 03:28.404\n針對食藥署的部分有關於醫師使用是不是大陸的醫材的部分因為當初他是主動提所以我們跟高雄市的衛生局他們已經進行積極的調查我想在有一定告一段對之後會立刻來跟大家做公佈以上好謝謝請三位署長可以回座\n\n03:29.878 --> 03:52.036\n再來這個必須要給部長還是稍微鼓勵啦因為經過了非常非常多委員幾乎快要一年的質詢所以昨天您的這個狼藝平台上線了可是許多民團他還是沒有那麼滿意那以下我跟你列出幾點是因為之前呢您曾經在說成立狼藝平台的時候\n\n03:53.837 --> 04:22.632\n說爛咖沒有這麼多所以不用可是我們看教師他們有很詳細的一個教師系統可以讓新的學校去聘任教師的時候在其他沒有公開資訊但是學校會知道說這個教室有沒有不良的記錄那律師的話他除了查有沒有罩他還可以去查他有沒有被懲處過以及有沒有違反律師倫理連這個律師忘記幫客戶上訴都會被列在上面\n\n04:23.352 --> 04:50.802\n為了這些所有客戶他在聘請律師之前有一個公開清楚的資訊那昨天呢大家就說奇怪你們覺得爛咖沒有這麼多難道你們是覺得教師的爛咖很多或是律師的爛咖很多所以必須成立這個平台嗎再來你把平台公佈以後呢大家就有點震驚是因為這個平台公佈還有三位還在執業現在還在執業\n\n04:52.182 --> 05:12.716\n然後因為他還沒送懲戒嘛這個懲戒也是我們一年來跟你討論的問題還有這個是性平有關於病人可能你們定義為脆弱族群的可是他性平有牽涉到同行就是說醫師或者是護理師其實很多都上新聞也都沒有在這上面\n\n05:13.556 --> 05:28.652\n還有判刑確定才被放上去判刑確定都已經是三四年後的事情了行政調查結果出爐的也沒有上去這個是昨天許許多多的人反映的意見那這邊就跟你討論\n\n05:30.456 --> 05:52.343\n這個也是之前你們的林靜儀次長曾經跟一個法律的教授在網路上比戰他在講說這個懲戒到底要依照哪一款才可以送那你們也一再的說無罪推定原則所以要判刑後才可以送懲戒等等好剛剛其實伊絲絲副市長講得非常的好\n\n05:53.303 --> 06:10.996\n高雄市衛生局的動作比你們快很多他上禮拜馬上就做了行政調查調查了上百個病例然後馬上送懲戒馬上送懲戒以後又暫時停止他現在準備要開懲戒委員會所以我想要知道的是\n\n06:12.441 --> 06:28.014\n這一年來我們跟你討論的醫師法第25條第28支4條到底是你們覺得很不好用還是不敢用還是你們沒有辦法做出清楚的定義所以不知道怎麼用謝謝委員的催省\n\n06:34.827 --> 06:55.386\n我們看第一頁那個其實要這樣的一個公佈公佈也是要從技術面跟專業面各方面做一個很一直陸續的討論也要爭取譬如說這個我們也跟司法院一直聯繫但是這個部分\n\n06:56.107 --> 07:18.057\n在嫁接上還沒有完全的直接嫁接所以這個還是用手工的以後我們會就是說去找我們以後希望跟相關的就直接連結那就是沒有落網之魚第二個就是說其實我們有關於涉及性品事件\n\n07:19.429 --> 07:36.776\n是不是要停止這個停止只要有設置的話是不是要停止這個事情我們會在8月下旬邀請醫事人員的團體法規專家來召開會議來看看這樣的情況怎麼樣在合法又合乎大家期待的情況下來進行\n\n07:37.876 --> 07:53.228\n那另外就是在剛剛講的另外懲罪是有關於違背醫學倫理的這個函式我們現在也在演繹當中我們希望來針對這個做一個比較明確的函式那這個名剛剛那個說\n\n07:59.913 --> 08:21.054\n那還沒那麼多這個不是我講的啦這是醫事長講的衛福部官員講的我平常用詞是很尊重人家的啦那個每一個不管是誰我們都應該尊重他的這個就是您剛講到的韓式啦這個韓式是我5月就提案的\n\n08:21.995 --> 08:33.670\n這五月就提案現在已經是八月中了那你中間有開過會還是你八月底才要開第一次會來跟專家討論這個意思是要不要這個回答\n\n08:35.168 --> 08:58.336\n跟委員報告兩件事剛剛講的是在調查期間就給他停職這個是要開會討論那韓式的部分我們已經都準備好那先前當然也有一個延商的過程那我們預定是在8月中旬就可以把這個補充這個違背醫學倫理的內涵提供給各縣市衛生局衛生局還有醫事工會你也可以提供是是是好謝謝\n\n08:59.736 --> 09:27.475\n再來我們就要講到說好剛剛你提到的停權的問題這個也是我想跟你討論剛才第28條為什麼上禮拜這個新聞出來民眾很震驚是因為民眾還可以上網掛他的號他在10天內發生了兩起減重手術死亡然後被開了記者會家屬出來公布一些這個與醫師互動的截圖以後結果發現他居然還在看診還可以掛號才發現說\n\n09:30.656 --> 09:56.647\n原來讓一個醫師停權不是很容易結果最後高雄市衛生局用的這個我們也覺得很奇怪因為他用的是第36條他是用行政執行法第36條行政執行法很少用在醫生行政執行法是為了要維持公共秩序的他是阻止犯罪危害發生或是避免急迫危險那可以及時強制對於人的管束等等的\n\n09:58.187 --> 10:15.595\n這個問題其實幾乎每一個胃黃委員會的委員都問過你了還有外委員會也問過你了我們現在是28條法源不足嗎不足高雄市衛生局來對他做緊急的停權嗎那醫師法到底有沒有修法的必要性還有我也想問你們用28-4條到底這三年來\n\n10:18.877 --> 10:37.045\n近幾年來到底適用了幾個人還是其實根本裁罰的數量很少這個我可能會再用書面跟你們追數據可是如果你可以現在告訴我的話也OK報告委員我們我現在手上是沒有這個資料然後我們會後會來做補充好\n\n10:40.615 --> 10:55.445\n那你會覺得你們是因為不敢用還是你認為有修法的必要因為現在高雄市衛生局是用這種很少用在醫生的法律才對他進行停權那你醫師法存在的目的是什麼\n\n10:56.198 --> 11:21.226\n我想高雄市一定是N你相關的法令可以做的但是先保障我們民眾的權益所以先用這樣行政執行法第36條先來處理那自己說是不是說在議事法裡面的一個規定需要我們再把相關的資料整理一下然後再檢討看看他這樣的效果效力是不是說需要調整我們\n\n11:21.886 --> 11:44.487\n那今天會後我會再跟你們要這個資料就是你們近幾年利用28-4到底有裁罰了多少的人最後只是一個延伸啦就是說很多醫生他會覺得您成立這個平台不管是獵醫或是良醫也是為了保障病人當然然後也為了保障其實我們大多數的醫生都是好的\n\n11:45.328 --> 12:14.164\n所以除了性品的這些判決或是行政調查也有大家都會在新聞上看到長期倒刷健保卡偽造病例違法用密醫使用非法的療法等等的如果他是有懲戒的決議也應該要揭露因為上禮拜其實您看到這個案例也非常非常的生氣我是想表達的是說衛福部長您是否有考慮把獵醫良醫這些事都列進去考量假使這些尋求愛美追求壽身的人\n\n12:14.764 --> 12:27.211\n他事先可以知道這些資訊的話比如說這個醫生嚴重的違反醫學倫理嚴重的違反醫師法醫療法他都事先知道我們可以可能有機會挽救第二條人命不是嗎\n\n12:30.351 --> 12:48.788\n當然我們絕對保障民眾的權益不管是他知的權益或者是他接受醫療的就醫的一個安全性這個是最高的準則我們就是團隊就是全力在往這方面來努力所以需要做怎麼樣的工作我們都一定全力來努力\n\n12:48.968 --> 13:11.406\n好因為林淑芬委員等一下可能會問這題所以我只是先延伸告訴你說其實除了狼醫性平事件還有很多病患需要知道的資訊我們就是為了保障其他99.9%以上好的醫生還有病人這樣子好嗎是的好那之後我再用書面書面跟你們詢問謝謝謝謝主席謝謝陳慶威委員來\n\n","segments":[{"start":4.288,"end":13.693,"text":"謝謝主席 謝謝官員 我想請邱部長還有食藥署還有健保署委員好"},{"start":16.075,"end":40.232,"text":"謝謝 邱部長上禮拜我們有探討了一位其實在各方面都有違反到不管是醫療法 醫事法等等還牽涉到國稅局 法務部那您上禮拜說衛福部將嚴格的查辦所以在這邊也想問我們各部門的進度因為這個醫師可能在訴前的諮詢就已經違規還請病人貸款"},{"start":42.193,"end":62.221,"text":"那私底下有匯款還有他告訴很明確的告知病人說這個手術他除了申報健保以外還請你私下再付費給我然後我再另外做一些數試然後我們請健保署可以去追查他是不是所有的手術都是這樣做食藥署的話是因為他已經主動告知個案"},{"start":63.341,"end":80.106,"text":"這個人匯過來的錢他是去大陸幫他買大陸的醫材過來做手術有沒有違規還有最後您說您一週內會發函給法務部以及國稅局等等的所以想請問您各部門的進度現在如何了"},{"start":80.987,"end":100.04,"text":"好 謝謝委員的隨行我想我們了解到這個信息以後馬上就站在中央主管機關的一個角色我們就會要去了解到地方衛生局處理的一個過程那所以其實他已經就"},{"start":101.781,"end":121.326,"text":"讓他就沒有再繼續做醫療行為那至於他剛剛委員所提到的各種各種問題我們都一個一個必須要去了解他是不是違反相關的規定跟法令一定要依法辦理那這個部分請醫事室看進度報告一下"},{"start":122.455,"end":149.364,"text":"是跟委員報告這個事情我們一直跟高雄市政府衛生局保持密切的聯繫那麼據我們所知在這個事件發生很快的時間內高雄市衛生局就去查了而且確實查到非常多不法的行為那包含有這個醫材是大陸的進口有違規的問題還有收費有稅務的問題這一些高雄市衛生局都已經移情給相關的機關來做敘處了"},{"start":151.545,"end":175.244,"text":"我們得知的訊息是這樣子包含國稅局他們也也已經函送了然後以及這個違反醫材他會送檢調來進一步的查明這樣子跟委員報告這個我們非常的關注這個事情所以請分區業務組針對這一名醫師還有這個醫院擴大把他全面的這個病例都要做專業審查"},{"start":176.425,"end":186.246,"text":"然後之後我們會精算出這個額度然後會擴大回推去扣這個20倍最高到20倍的罰款同時最終給他處以停業處分"},{"start":188.545,"end":208.404,"text":"針對食藥署的部分有關於醫師使用是不是大陸的醫材的部分因為當初他是主動提所以我們跟高雄市的衛生局他們已經進行積極的調查我想在有一定告一段對之後會立刻來跟大家做公佈以上好 謝謝請三位署長可以回座"},{"start":209.878,"end":232.036,"text":"再來這個必須要給部長還是稍微鼓勵啦因為經過了非常非常多委員幾乎快要一年的質詢所以昨天您的這個狼藝平台上線了可是許多民團他還是沒有那麼滿意那以下我跟你列出幾點是因為之前呢您曾經在說成立狼藝平台的時候"},{"start":233.837,"end":262.632,"text":"說爛咖沒有這麼多所以不用可是我們看教師他們有很詳細的一個教師系統可以讓新的學校去聘任教師的時候在其他沒有公開資訊但是學校會知道說這個教室有沒有不良的記錄那律師的話他除了查有沒有罩他還可以去查他有沒有被懲處過以及有沒有違反律師倫理連這個律師忘記幫客戶上訴都會被列在上面"},{"start":263.352,"end":290.802,"text":"為了這些所有客戶他在聘請律師之前有一個公開清楚的資訊那昨天呢大家就說奇怪你們覺得爛咖沒有這麼多難道你們是覺得教師的爛咖很多或是律師的爛咖很多所以必須成立這個平台嗎再來你把平台公佈以後呢大家就有點震驚是因為這個平台公佈還有三位還在執業現在還在執業"},{"start":292.182,"end":312.716,"text":"然後因為他還沒送懲戒嘛這個懲戒也是我們一年來跟你討論的問題還有這個是性平有關於病人可能你們定義為脆弱族群的可是他性平有牽涉到同行就是說醫師或者是護理師其實很多都上新聞也都沒有在這上面"},{"start":313.556,"end":328.652,"text":"還有判刑確定才被放上去判刑確定都已經是三四年後的事情了行政調查結果出爐的也沒有上去這個是昨天許許多多的人反映的意見那這邊就跟你討論"},{"start":330.456,"end":352.343,"text":"這個也是之前你們的林靜儀次長曾經跟一個法律的教授在網路上比戰他在講說這個懲戒到底要依照哪一款才可以送那你們也一再的說無罪推定原則所以要判刑後才可以送懲戒等等好 剛剛其實伊絲絲副市長講得非常的好"},{"start":353.303,"end":370.996,"text":"高雄市衛生局的動作比你們快很多他上禮拜馬上就做了行政調查調查了上百個病例然後馬上送懲戒馬上送懲戒以後又暫時停止他現在準備要開懲戒委員會所以我想要知道的是"},{"start":372.441,"end":388.014,"text":"這一年來我們跟你討論的醫師法第25條第28支4條到底是你們覺得很不好用還是不敢用還是你們沒有辦法做出清楚的定義所以不知道怎麼用謝謝委員的催省"},{"start":394.827,"end":415.386,"text":"我們看第一頁那個其實要這樣的一個公佈公佈也是要從技術面跟專業面各方面做一個很一直陸續的討論也要爭取譬如說這個我們也跟司法院一直聯繫但是這個部分"},{"start":416.107,"end":438.057,"text":"在嫁接上還沒有完全的直接嫁接所以這個還是用手工的以後我們會就是說去找我們以後希望跟相關的就直接連結那就是沒有落網之魚第二個就是說其實我們有關於涉及性品事件"},{"start":439.429,"end":456.776,"text":"是不是要停止這個停止只要有設置的話是不是要停止這個事情我們會在8月下旬邀請醫事人員的團體法規專家來召開會議來看看這樣的情況怎麼樣在合法又合乎大家期待的情況下來進行"},{"start":457.876,"end":473.228,"text":"那另外就是在剛剛講的另外懲罪是有關於違背醫學倫理的這個函式我們現在也在演繹當中我們希望來針對這個做一個比較明確的函式那這個名剛剛那個說"},{"start":479.913,"end":501.054,"text":"那還沒那麼多 這個不是我講的啦這是醫事長講的衛福部官員講的我平常用詞是很尊重人家的啦那個每一個不管是誰我們都應該尊重他的這個就是您剛講到的韓式啦這個韓式是我5月就提案的"},{"start":501.995,"end":513.67,"text":"這五月就提案現在已經是八月中了那你中間有開過會還是你八月底才要開第一次會來跟專家討論這個意思是要不要這個回答"},{"start":515.168,"end":538.336,"text":"跟委員報告兩件事剛剛講的是在調查期間就給他停職這個是要開會討論那韓式的部分我們已經都準備好那先前當然也有一個延商的過程那我們預定是在8月中旬就可以把這個補充這個違背醫學倫理的內涵提供給各縣市衛生局衛生局還有醫事工會你也可以提供是是是好謝謝"},{"start":539.736,"end":567.475,"text":"再來我們就要講到說好剛剛你提到的停權的問題這個也是我想跟你討論剛才第28條為什麼上禮拜這個新聞出來民眾很震驚是因為民眾還可以上網掛他的號他在10天內發生了兩起減重手術死亡然後被開了記者會家屬出來公布一些這個與醫師互動的截圖以後結果發現他居然還在看診還可以掛號才發現說"},{"start":570.656,"end":596.647,"text":"原來讓一個醫師停權不是很容易結果最後高雄市衛生局用的這個我們也覺得很奇怪因為他用的是第36條他是用行政執行法第36條行政執行法很少用在醫生行政執行法是為了要維持公共秩序的他是阻止犯罪危害發生或是避免急迫危險那可以及時強制對於人的管束等等的"},{"start":598.187,"end":615.595,"text":"這個問題其實幾乎每一個胃黃委員會的委員都問過你了還有外委員會也問過你了我們現在是28條法源不足嗎不足高雄市衛生局來對他做緊急的停權嗎那醫師法到底有沒有修法的必要性還有我也想問你們用28-4條到底這三年來"},{"start":618.877,"end":637.045,"text":"近幾年來到底適用了幾個人還是其實根本裁罰的數量很少這個我可能會再用書面跟你們追數據可是如果你可以現在告訴我的話也OK報告委員我們我現在手上是沒有這個資料然後我們會後會來做補充好"},{"start":640.615,"end":655.445,"text":"那你會覺得你們是因為不敢用還是你認為有修法的必要因為現在高雄市衛生局是用這種很少用在醫生的法律才對他進行停權那你醫師法存在的目的是什麼"},{"start":656.198,"end":681.226,"text":"我想高雄市一定是N你相關的法令可以做的但是先保障我們民眾的權益所以先用這樣行政執行法第36條先來處理那自己說是不是說在議事法裡面的一個規定需要我們再把相關的資料整理一下然後再檢討看看他這樣的效果效力是不是說需要調整我們"},{"start":681.886,"end":704.487,"text":"那今天會後我會再跟你們要這個資料就是你們近幾年利用28-4到底有裁罰了多少的人最後只是一個延伸啦就是說很多醫生他會覺得您成立這個平台不管是獵醫或是良醫也是為了保障病人當然然後也為了保障其實我們大多數的醫生都是好的"},{"start":705.328,"end":734.164,"text":"所以除了性品的這些判決或是行政調查也有 大家都會在新聞上看到長期倒刷健保卡 偽造病例違法用密醫 使用非法的療法等等的如果他是有懲戒的決議也應該要揭露因為上禮拜其實您看到這個案例也非常非常的生氣我是想表達的是說 衛福部長您是否有考慮把獵醫良醫這些事都列進去考量假使這些尋求愛美 追求壽身的人"},{"start":734.764,"end":747.211,"text":"他事先可以知道這些資訊的話比如說這個醫生嚴重的違反醫學倫理嚴重的違反醫師法醫療法他都事先知道我們可以可能有機會挽救第二條人命不是嗎"},{"start":750.351,"end":768.788,"text":"當然我們絕對保障民眾的權益不管是他知的權益或者是他接受醫療的就醫的一個安全性這個是最高的準則我們就是團隊就是全力在往這方面來努力所以需要做怎麼樣的工作我們都一定全力來努力"},{"start":768.968,"end":791.406,"text":"好因為林淑芬委員等一下可能會問這題所以我只是先延伸告訴你說其實除了狼醫性平事件還有很多病患需要知道的資訊我們就是為了保障其他99.9%以上好的醫生還有病人這樣子好嗎是的好那之後我再用書面書面跟你們詢問謝謝謝謝主席謝謝陳慶威委員來"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":287,"blocks":[["陳委員菁徽：（9時48分）謝謝主席，謝謝官員，我想請邱部長、食藥署、健保署。"],["邱部長泰源：委員好。"],["姜署長至剛：委員好。"],["石署長崇良：委員好。"],["陳委員菁徽：謝謝。邱部長，上禮拜我們有探討了一位醫師其實在各方面都有違反，不管是醫療法、醫事法等等，還牽涉到國稅局、法務部，您上禮拜說衛福部將嚴格的查辦，所以也想問各部門的進度。因為這個醫師可能在術前的諮詢就已經違規，還請病人貸款、私底下匯款，還有醫師很明確的告知病人說這個手術除了申報健保以外，請你私下再付費給我，我再另外做一些術式。我們有請健保署去追查醫師是不是所有的手術都是這樣做；食藥署的話，是因為醫師已經主動告知個案，這個人匯過來的錢，是去大陸幫他買大陸的醫材過來做手術，這樣有沒有違規？最後您說您一週內會發函給法務部以及國稅局等等的，所以想請問您各部門的進度現在如何了？"],["邱部長泰源：謝謝委員的垂詢。我們了解到這個訊息以後，馬上就站在中央主管機關的角色，我們要了解地方衛生局處理的過程，其實已經沒有再讓他繼續做醫療行為，至於剛剛委員所提到的各種問題，我們都一個一個必須要去了解他是不是違反相關的規定跟法令，一定要依法辦理，這個部分請醫事司將進度報告一下。"],["劉副司長玉菁：跟委員報告，這個事情我們一直跟高雄市政府衛生局保持密切的聯繫，據我們所知，在這個事件發生很快的時間內高雄市衛生局就去查了，而且確實查到非常多不法的行為，包含醫材是大陸進口有違規的問題，還有收費有稅務的問題，這一些高雄市衛生局都已經移請給相關的機關來續處了，我們得知的訊息是這樣子，包含國稅局，他們也已經函送了，以及違反醫材的部分，也會送檢調來進一步的查明。"],["陳委員菁徽：健保署。"],["石署長崇良：跟委員報告，我們非常的關注這個事情，所以已經請分區業務組針對這一名醫師還有這個醫院，擴大把全面的病歷都要做專業審查，之後我們會精算出這個額度，會擴大回推去扣最高到二十倍的罰款，同時最重給他處以停約處分。"],["陳委員菁徽：食藥署。"],["姜署長至剛：針對食藥署，有關於醫師是不是使用大陸的醫材的部分，因為當初他是主動提，所以我們跟高雄市的衛生局，他們已經進行積極的調查，我想在調查告一段落之後，會立刻來跟大家公布，以上。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，謝謝，請三位署長可以回座。","再來，必須要給部長稍微鼓勵啦！因為經過了非常、非常多委員幾乎快要1年的質詢，昨天狼醫平台上線了，可是許多民團還是沒有那麼滿意，以下我跟你列出幾點，因為之前要成立狼醫平台的時候，您曾經說爛咖沒有這麼多，所以不用。可是我們看教師，他們有很詳細的一個教師系統，可以讓新的學校去聘任教師的時候，在其他沒有公開資訊的情況下，但學校會知道說這個教師有沒有不良的紀錄；律師的話，除了查他有沒有照，還可以去查他有沒有被懲處過，以及有沒有違反律師倫理，連這個律師忘記幫客戶上訴，都會被列在上面，為了所有客戶在聘請律師之前有一個公開清楚的資訊。","昨天大家就說奇怪，你們覺得爛咖沒有這麼多，難道你們是覺得教師的爛咖很多，或是律師的爛咖很多，所以必須成立這個平台嗎？再來，你把平台公布以後，大家就有點震驚，因為這個平台公布後，發現還有3位現在還在執業，因為他還沒送懲戒，懲戒這部分也是我們一年來跟你討論的問題，還有這是性平，是有關於病人，可能是你們定義為脆弱族群的，可是性平有牽涉到同行，就是醫師或者是護理師，其實很多都上新聞，也都沒有在這上面，還有判刑確定才被放上去，判刑確定都已經是3、4年後的事情了，行政調查結果出爐的也沒有上去，這是昨天許許多多的人反映的意見。","這邊就跟你討論，這也是之前你們的林靜儀次長曾經跟一個法律的教授在網路上筆戰，他在講說懲戒到底要依照哪一款才可以送，你們也一再地說無罪推定原則，所以要判刑後才可以送懲戒等等。剛剛其實醫事司副司長講得非常的好，高雄市衛生局的動作比你們快很多，它上禮拜馬上就做了行政調查，調查了上百個病例，然後馬上送懲戒，馬上送懲戒以後又暫時停職，它現在準備要開懲戒委員會，所以我想要知道的是，這一年來我們跟你討論的醫師法第二十五條、第二十八條之四，到底是你們覺得很不好用，還是不敢用，還是你們沒有辦法做出清楚的定義，所以不知道怎麼用？"],["邱部長泰源：謝謝委員的垂詢，其實要像簡報第一頁這樣的公布也是要從技術面跟專業面各方面陸續地討論，也要徵詢，譬如說，我們也跟司法院一直聯繫，但是這個部分在嫁接上還沒有完全的直接嫁接，所以這還是用手工的去尋找，我們以後希望跟相關的直接連結，就會沒有漏網之魚。","第二個，有關於只要有涉及性平事件是不是要停職的這件事情，我們會在8月下旬邀請醫事人員的團體、法規專家來召開會議，來看看這樣的情況，怎麼樣在合法又合乎大家期待的情況下來進行。","另外，剛剛講的懲戒事由有關於違背醫學倫理的函釋，我們現在也在研擬，當中我們希望針對這個做一個比較明確的函釋。","醫界沒那麼多爛咖，這不是我講的啦，這是醫事司司長講的。"],["陳委員菁徽：衛福部官員講的。"],["邱部長泰源：不是我……我平常的用詞是很尊重人家的啦。不管是誰，我們都應該尊重他的……"],["陳委員菁徽：好，這就是您剛剛講到的函釋，這個函釋是我5月就提案的，現在已經是8月中了，你中間有開過會，還是你8月底才要開第一次會來跟專家討論？"],["邱部長泰源：醫事司要不要……"],["劉副司長玉菁：跟委員報告兩件事，剛剛講的是在調查期間就給他停職，這個是要開會討論。函釋的部分，我們已經都準備好，先前當然也有一個研商的過程，我們預定是在8月中旬就可以把違背醫學倫理的函釋，提供給各縣市衛生局……"],["陳委員菁徽：衛生局，還有醫師公會你也可以提供。"],["劉副司長玉菁：是。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，謝謝。再來，我們就要講到，剛剛你提到停權的問題，這也是我想跟你討論剛才的第二十八條，為什麼上禮拜這個新聞出來，民眾很震驚？是因為民眾還可以上網掛他的號，他在10天內發生了2起減重手術死亡，然後被開了記者會，家屬出來公布一些與醫師互動的截圖以後，結果發現他居然還在看診，還可以掛號，才發現說原來讓一個醫師停權不是很容易，結果最後高雄市衛生局用的，這個我們也覺得很奇怪，因為它用的是行政執行法第三十六條，行政執行法很少用在醫生，行政執行法是為了要維持公共秩序的，是為阻止犯罪、危害發生或是避免急迫危險，得為即時強制，對於人的管束等等，這個問題其實幾乎每一個衛環委員會的委員都問過你了，還有外委員會也問過你了，我們現在是因為第二十八條法源不足嗎？是因為不足以讓高雄市衛生局對他做緊急的停權嗎？醫師法到底有沒有修法的必要性？還有，我也想問，你們用第二十八條之四，到底近幾年來到底適用了幾個人，還是裁罰的數量根本很少？我可能會再用書面跟你們追數據，可是如果你可以現在告訴我的話也OK。"],["邱部長泰源：醫事司有沒有……"],["劉副司長玉菁：報告委員，我現在手上是沒有這個資料，我們會後會來做補充。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，那你覺得你們是因為不敢用，還是你認為有修法的必要？因為現在高雄市衛生局是用這種很少用在醫生的法律才對他進行停權，那醫師法存在的目的是什麼？"],["邱部長泰源：我想高雄市一定是研究相關的法令，依據可以做的，但是先保障我們民眾的權益嘛，所以先用行政執行法第三十六條來處理，那至於說醫師法裡面的規定等等，我們再把相關的資料整理一下，再檢討看看它這樣的效果、效力是不是需要調整，我們再來調整。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，今天會後我會再跟你們要這個資料，就是你們近幾年利用第二十八條之四，到底有裁罰了多少的人？"],["邱部長泰源：好的、好的。"],["陳委員菁徽：最後只是一個延伸，很多醫生會覺得您成立這個平台，不管是劣醫或是良醫，是為了保障病人，也為了保障我們大多數的醫生都是好的，所以除了性平的這些判決或是行政調查，大家也都會在新聞上看到長期盜刷健保卡、偽造病歷、違法用密醫、使用非法的療法等等的，如果它是有懲戒的決議也應該要揭露，因為上禮拜其實您看到這個案例，也非常、非常的生氣，我想表達的是作為衛福部部長您是否有考慮把劣醫、良醫這些事都列進去考量？假使這些尋求愛美、追求瘦身的人，他們事先可以知道這些資訊的話，比如這個醫生嚴重違反醫學倫理及違反醫師法、醫療法，他們都可以事先知道，我們可能有機會挽救第二條人命，不是嗎？"],["邱部長泰源：當然我們絕對會保障民眾的權益，不管是他知的權益，或者他接受醫療的就醫安全性，這個是最高的準則，我們團隊就是全力在往這方面來努力。"],["陳委員菁徽：我知道……"],["邱部長泰源：需要做怎麼樣的工作，我們都一定全力來努力。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，因為林淑芬委員等一下可能也會問這題。"],["邱部長泰源：是。"],["陳委員菁徽：所以我只是先延伸告訴你，其實除了狼醫及性平事件，還有很多病患需要知道的資訊，我們就是為了保障其他99.9%以上好的醫生還有病人，這樣好嗎？"],["邱部長泰源：是的。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，我之後會再用書面跟你們詢問，謝謝。也謝謝主席。"],["邱部長泰源：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝陳菁徽委員。","接續請邱鎮軍委員質詢。","跟大家報告，王育敏委員質詢完後，我們休息10分鐘。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":328,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-26-24","speakers":["蘇清泉","陳昭姿","林月琴","陳菁徽","邱鎮軍","王育敏","廖偉翔","盧縣一","林淑芬","黃秀芳","王正旭","葉元之","陳瑩","劉建國","楊曜","涂權吉"],"page_start":267,"meetingDate":["2025-08-14"],"gazette_id":"1147202","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1147202_00007"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第24次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請衛生福利部、經濟部、財政部就「美國針對進口藥品、原料藥課稅對我國產業造成影響」進\n行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1147202_00006"}}}