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\"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,409 --> 00:00:27,618\n謝謝主席我先麻煩我們經濟部次長還有顏惠欣副總談判代表委員好我先請教一下副總談判代表我們現在看昨天川普宣布中國的部分是在延後90天嘛暫停90天他們現在目前的暫行關稅是多少\n\n2\n00:00:28,936 --> 00:00:48,881\n他們現在暫行關稅是55%是疊加的還是excluded他是疊加的所以他把原來稅再加上55%暫行90天那我們台灣現在正跟美國要進到最後一個階段就是concluding的這個會議就是總結會議\n\n3\n00:00:52,830 --> 00:01:01,183\n我們的總結會議的期程會不會因為美國跟中國的關稅談判受到影響\n\n4\n00:01:05,144 --> 00:01:30,906\n欸報告委員我想那個台這個不這是國際的局勢嘛對這是國際的局勢上面每一個國家跟美國的談判都是個別進行的最近有些專家講的是這一次談判跟以往的經貿談判完全不一樣川普給的時間很短要談的國家近百個很多所以每個國家面對的變化環境很快所以沒有一個國家可以\n\n5\n00:01:31,846 --> 00:02:00,789\n即時連談判的代表在當下可能都沒辦法第一時間掌握到即時的資訊更遑論對自己的這個授權的政府能夠提供即時的資訊或透明化這個是這次談判的困難點我昨天看了一個我們以前的老同事國民黨的這個徐仁立委他現在在美國智庫擔任研究員他特別點出來這一次的談判其實大家不要用黨派去批判這個事情各國面對的困境是一樣然後呢\n\n6\n00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:28,411\n疊加從四月份四月二號到四月九號我們就知道疊加是通則那不疊加日本跟歐盟是要付出一定的代價才決定不疊加甚至於日本的不疊加好像公告好像還沒有看到嘛對所以到底會不會變日本人也炒在蛋啦就他那個不疊加事實上白宮沒有公告出來喔那我要回到我要問的命題我們剛才知道中國昨天被宣布暫緩九十天\n\n7\n00:02:29,793 --> 00:02:57,822\n有人說這好消息有人說壞消息我們就是持平來講55%的疊加稅率再維持90天中國的出口競爭力會受到很大的影響那台灣的產業我待會要請教經濟部就是我們常常講產業受損產業受損產業受損要看兩塊我進到美國是我們最大的出口市場加上稅我的成本提高那我產品有沒有不可替代性如果產品具有不可替代性那誰倒霉消費者倒霉你要付多一點錢\n\n8\n00:02:58,622 --> 00:03:10,510\n那如果我產品有被替代性那我要看什麼我要看我的競爭國它是多少歲所以比方說以螺絲螺帽我們的第一大競爭對象是中國它是55%疊加我們是20%疊加那在競爭的優勢上我不敢講我們的競爭優勢是下降因為它加了55%嘛所以這個經貿要這樣看所以我回到請教我們這個嚴副總談判代表\n\n9\n00:03:25,117 --> 00:03:52,291\n大家關心的是好我們現在講這暫時狀態那暫時狀態也不會太久了但我剛問的一個命題就是在整個台美的談判當中中國當然是有影響不管是避免他來洗產地或者是他經過台灣中轉美國現在對越南越南的20%有加一個但書欸中國過來的變40%欸所以很明顯這一次關稅談判如果硬要扯一個罪魁禍首就中國啊\n\n10\n00:03:52,791 --> 00:04:14,629\n就是針對中國的一個圍堵政策所以回到我們現在進行的總結談判總結談判就會有一個最終我們得到的結論要不然我們就是20%疊加所以我剛才請教的問題很簡單我們總結談判是不是在進行中我們的期程會不會受中國延後90天受到影響如果會那我這90天內我就不能期待了嘛就你的判斷\n\n11\n00:04:15,686 --> 00:04:26,286\n跟委員報告如同我一開始所說的整個這一次台美的這個對等關稅談判或者是美國跟各國的這個對等關稅談判地緣政治是一個\n\n12\n00:04:27,166 --> 00:04:50,220\n很重要的因素所以呢那我覺得地緣政治是美國本身看起來它的一個策略性或戰略性上面的考量但是有沒有涉及到特定的國家我想我在這邊就不便進一步幫美國說明那有沒有得到任何的implication或者什麼就是我們的談判的期程因為當年我們在進那個WTO的時候當時是國際協議就是要一起公佈\n\n13\n00:04:57,567 --> 00:05:09,381\n那我不曉得我們這一次的最後的總結談判有沒有這樣的氛圍啦我不要講說有什麼樣的現象或的事實有沒有的氛圍就是我們的最終談判的期程可能還要再等\n\n14\n00:05:11,304 --> 00:05:34,201\n跟委員報告我想我們談判就是一個互動的過程所以我們跟美國現在就是還沒有進行到最終的總結性會議而且我們想要把232這些議題跟對等關稅一起處理這個也會涉及到比較複雜性的討論232對台灣影響其實比較大因為我們對美的deficit我們的赤字90%其實是來自於\n\n15\n00:05:36,142 --> 00:05:58,794\nICT產業那ICT產業只要裡面裝的晶片在美國有設廠的都可以豁免變零趴那對台灣來講其實赤字不會掉下來第二個就沒有解決赤字問題然後台灣被衝擊到的這一塊產業是沒有衝擊到那我就請教經濟部啦那個那個嚴副總裁可以輕輕請回座\n\n16\n00:05:59,548 --> 00:06:22,607\n所以我就要回到經濟衝擊這一塊第一個我們對美赤字其實90%來自於ICT產業可是他又因為他在美國有設廠所以他的產品他的那個基板上面只要有那些晶片他可以得到百分之百的關稅的豁免然後呢現在疊加的關稅誰在付代價傳統產業或者農業你知道嗎就是\n\n17\n00:06:27,833 --> 00:06:53,208\n因為這樣子導致貿易赤字所以我們談判會比較困難結果他又因為在美國有設產所以他可能要豁免結果北鳥要受罪啊就換成傳統產業疊加關稅是卡在他身上所以這一點上我們國內的ICT產業其實會因而直接或間接受益所以從那邊得到的稅收應該要相當額度的來補貼我們的傳統產業跟農業這樣才合理啊\n\n18\n00:06:57,341 --> 00:07:16,688\n我認為我們的科技產業獲利對台灣是好事畢竟它是我們重要的產業可是這一次的談判是因為貿易赤字是其中一個主要的因素而疊加的關稅又沒有疊到他身上就變成傳統產業要幫忙負擔這個赤字你懂我邏輯意思嗎所以我先請教在這一個目前關稅疊加的狀況下\n\n19\n00:07:18,729 --> 00:07:43,277\n我們造成出口美國市場的成本會增加我剛已經講了如果我們的產品具有不可替代性那沒關係就是美國消費者要買貴一點的東西但是如果我們的產品具有可替代性我就要看競爭對手的關稅你們現在這個評估報告出來了沒有報告委員我分兩點來說明第一點就是因為我們也了解到這些傳統產業可能會受影響\n\n20\n00:07:46,188 --> 00:08:07,046\n經濟部在特別條例的部分也特別這個編列了希望能夠編列460億來照顧這些業者尤其是我們的中小企業那第二個部分委員有提到有競爭性的產品確實我們也有做一些初步的研析例如像我們比較關注的產業像水五金扣件\n\n21\n00:08:08,066 --> 00:08:29,458\n水五金的產品它其實原本的競爭的對手就包括越南跟中國但是現在中國的稅非常的高尤其又疊加之後相較之下我們確實是在關稅的部分是較中國為低但是我們還是要持續因為我們現在談判還在進行當中當然是希望能夠\n\n22\n00:08:30,357 --> 00:08:49,213\n爭取更優惠的這個關稅我們都希望關稅越低越好最好大家都是零但是要付出我們國內市場的代價那我們現在面對一個暫時性的現實就是20%的疊加當然有的人從4月份就不讀書都認為說這個疊加是新聞沒有啦疊加從一開始就有了啦\n\n23\n00:08:49,844 --> 00:09:11,165\n而且全世界都有啦日本跟歐盟的不疊加也是最近談判結果才把它解放出來其他都是疊加的我再問一個命題就是我們都希望關稅越低越好那個叫成本我出口到美國100塊錢加了20%再加原有的稅可能變成135塊那叫我的成本\n\n24\n00:09:12,148 --> 00:09:40,115\n那我現在面對競爭者的時候你剛才就講一個很好的事情像水五金跟扣件扣件就是我們講螺絲螺帽我們的主要競爭對手是越南跟中國而中國是55%疊加所以當兩個產品到美國報價的時候大家都會變貴但是中國要比我們貴更多那對我們的競爭力其實在現況上並不是下降的\n\n25\n00:09:41,072 --> 00:10:01,121\n所以這個東西要出來甚至要幫助我們的業者因為現在在搶聖誕節訂單跟明年第一季的訂單要幫助我們的業者像美國這邊說台灣的品質更好加了20%關稅比那個加55%的我們相較起來更有價格的競爭優勢要協助業者那如果失去競爭優勢的我們的400多億的輔導就要進場協助他這樣才能夠讓業者趕快安心下來這牽涉到很多人的就業機會\n\n26\n00:10:10,345 --> 00:10:34,722\n然後像藍花藍花我們的競爭對手也是越南跟荷蘭看不同的藍種荷蘭他們現在是15%的樣子歐盟國家歐盟嘛15%嘛可是它是不疊加喔那我們的藍花是20%要疊加那藍花業者面對荷蘭我們競爭優勢就往下掉可是我們另外一個競爭對手是越南\n\n27\n00:10:35,763 --> 00:10:56,610\n越南在中低價位的跟我們是競爭對手那越南的蘭花是20%疊加跟我們一樣那大家評分可是越南如果它的蘭種什麼來自於中國什麼的它變40%我希望經濟部把這個分析寫精細一點讓每個業者知道我現在的競爭優勢到底是加還是減還是平盤然後它減之後它需要什麼樣的協助\n\n28\n00:10:59,771 --> 00:11:27,559\n是行政的協助資金的協助技術的協助很具體的告訴他我可以短期融資多少中期什麼東西然後呢談判辦這邊再盡快把總結會議趕快談出來這樣整套國家策略才清晰這樣懂我意思嗎所以談判當中我們不為難有些資訊事實上也不是第一個要保密第二個是談判資訊是在變動當中很難很難立即掌握那我們只希望談判辦跟我們經貿單位\n\n29\n00:11:29,120 --> 00:11:37,293\n盡快的在總結會議幫台灣爭取一個比較好的競爭位置那我今天本來一堆要問外交部的事情我就下次再請教林部長了好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n409\t27618\t謝謝主席我先麻煩我們經濟部次長還有顏惠欣副總談判代表委員好我先請教一下副總談判代表我們現在看昨天川普宣布中國的部分是在延後90天嘛暫停90天他們現在目前的暫行關稅是多少\n28936\t48881\t他們現在暫行關稅是55%是疊加的還是excluded他是疊加的所以他把原來稅再加上55%暫行90天那我們台灣現在正跟美國要進到最後一個階段就是concluding的這個會議就是總結會議\n52830\t61183\t我們的總結會議的期程會不會因為美國跟中國的關稅談判受到影響\n65144\t90906\t欸 報告委員我想那個台 這個不 這是國際的局勢嘛對 這是國際的局勢上面每一個國家跟美國的談判都是個別進行的最近有些專家講的是這一次談判跟以往的經貿談判完全不一樣川普給的時間很短要談的國家近百個 很多所以每個國家面對的變化環境很快所以沒有一個國家可以\n91846\t120789\t即時連談判的代表在當下可能都沒辦法第一時間掌握到即時的資訊更遑論對自己的這個授權的政府能夠提供即時的資訊或透明化這個是這次談判的困難點我昨天看了一個我們以前的老同事國民黨的這個徐仁立委他現在在美國智庫擔任研究員他特別點出來這一次的談判其實大家不要用黨派去批判這個事情各國面對的困境是一樣然後呢\n122120\t148411\t疊加從四月份 四月二號到四月九號我們就知道疊加是通則那不疊加 日本跟歐盟是要付出一定的代價才決定不疊加甚至於日本的不疊加好像公告好像還沒有看到嘛對 所以到底會不會變日本人也炒在蛋啦就他那個不疊加事實上白宮沒有公告出來喔那我要回到我要問的命題我們剛才知道中國昨天被宣布暫緩九十天\n149793\t177822\t有人說這好消息有人說壞消息我們就是持平來講55%的疊加稅率再維持90天中國的出口競爭力會受到很大的影響那台灣的產業我待會要請教經濟部就是我們常常講產業受損 產業受損產業受損要看兩塊我進到美國是我們最大的出口市場加上稅我的成本提高那我產品有沒有不可替代性如果產品具有不可替代性那誰倒霉 消費者倒霉你要付多一點錢\n178622\t190510\t那如果我產品有被替代性 那我要看什麼我要看我的競爭國 它是多少歲所以比方說以螺絲螺帽 我們的第一大競爭對象是中國它是55%疊加 我們是20%疊加那在競爭的優勢上 我不敢講我們的競爭優勢是下降因為它加了55%嘛 所以這個經貿要這樣看所以我回到請教我們這個嚴副總談判代表\n205117\t232291\t大家關心的是好我們現在講這暫時狀態那暫時狀態也不會太久了但我剛問的一個命題就是在整個台美的談判當中中國當然是有影響不管是避免他來洗產地或者是他經過台灣中轉美國現在對越南越南的20%有加一個但書欸中國過來的變40%欸所以很明顯這一次關稅談判如果硬要扯一個罪魁禍首就中國啊\n232791\t254629\t就是針對中國的一個圍堵政策所以回到我們現在進行的總結談判總結談判就會有一個最終我們得到的結論要不然我們就是20%疊加所以我剛才請教的問題很簡單我們總結談判是不是在進行中我們的期程會不會受中國延後90天受到影響如果會 那我這90天內我就不能期待了嘛就你的判斷\n255686\t266286\t跟委員報告如同我一開始所說的整個這一次台美的這個對等關稅談判或者是美國跟各國的這個對等關稅談判地緣政治是一個\n267166\t290220\t很重要的因素所以呢那我覺得地緣政治是美國本身看起來它的一個策略性或戰略性上面的考量但是有沒有涉及到特定的國家我想我在這邊就不便進一步幫美國說明那有沒有得到任何的implication或者什麼就是我們的談判的期程因為當年我們在進那個WTO的時候當時是國際協議就是要一起公佈\n297567\t309381\t那我不曉得我們這一次的最後的總結談判有沒有這樣的氛圍啦我不要講說有什麼樣的現象或的事實有沒有的氛圍就是我們的最終談判的期程可能還要再等\n311304\t334201\t跟委員報告我想我們談判就是一個互動的過程所以我們跟美國現在就是還沒有進行到最終的總結性會議而且我們想要把232這些議題跟對等關稅一起處理這個也會涉及到比較複雜性的討論232對台灣影響其實比較大因為我們對美的deficit我們的赤字90%其實是來自於\n336142\t358794\tICT產業那ICT產業只要裡面裝的晶片在美國有設廠的都可以豁免變零趴那對台灣來講其實赤字不會掉下來第二個就沒有解決赤字問題然後台灣被衝擊到的這一塊產業是沒有衝擊到那我就請教經濟部啦那個那個嚴副總裁可以輕輕請回座\n359548\t382607\t所以我就要回到經濟衝擊這一塊第一個我們對美赤字其實90%來自於ICT產業可是他又因為他在美國有設廠所以他的產品他的那個基板上面只要有那些晶片他可以得到百分之百的關稅的豁免然後呢現在疊加的關稅誰在付代價傳統產業或者農業你知道嗎 就是\n387833\t413208\t因為這樣子導致貿易赤字所以我們談判會比較困難結果他又因為在美國有設產所以他可能要豁免結果北鳥要受罪啊就換成傳統產業疊加關稅是卡在他身上所以這一點上我們國內的ICT產業其實會因而直接或間接受益所以從那邊得到的稅收應該要相當額度的來補貼我們的傳統產業跟農業這樣才合理啊\n417341\t436688\t我認為我們的科技產業獲利對台灣是好事畢竟它是我們重要的產業可是這一次的談判是因為貿易赤字是其中一個主要的因素而疊加的關稅又沒有疊到他身上就變成傳統產業要幫忙負擔這個赤字你懂我邏輯意思嗎所以我先請教在這一個目前關稅疊加的狀況下\n438729\t463277\t我們造成出口美國市場的成本會增加我剛已經講了如果我們的產品具有不可替代性那沒關係就是美國消費者要買貴一點的東西但是如果我們的產品具有可替代性我就要看競爭對手的關稅你們現在這個評估報告出來了沒有報告委員我分兩點來說明第一點就是因為我們也了解到這些傳統產業可能會受影響\n466188\t487046\t經濟部在特別條例的部分也特別這個編列了希望能夠編列460億來照顧這些業者尤其是我們的中小企業那第二個部分委員有提到有競爭性的產品確實我們也有做一些初步的研析例如像我們比較關注的產業像水五金扣件\n488066\t509458\t水五金的產品它其實原本的競爭的對手就包括越南跟中國但是現在中國的稅非常的高尤其又疊加之後相較之下我們確實是在關稅的部分是較中國為低但是我們還是要持續因為我們現在談判還在進行當中當然是希望能夠\n510357\t529213\t爭取更優惠的這個關稅我們都希望關稅越低越好最好大家都是零但是要付出我們國內市場的代價那我們現在面對一個暫時性的現實就是20%的疊加當然有的人從4月份就不讀書都認為說這個疊加是新聞 沒有啦疊加從一開始就有了啦\n529844\t551165\t而且全世界都有啦日本跟歐盟的不疊加也是最近談判結果才把它解放出來其他都是疊加的我再問一個命題就是我們都希望關稅越低越好那個叫成本我出口到美國100塊錢加了20%再加原有的稅可能變成135塊那叫我的成本\n552148\t580115\t那我現在面對競爭者的時候你剛才就講一個很好的事情像水五金跟扣件扣件就是我們講螺絲螺帽我們的主要競爭對手是越南跟中國而中國是55%疊加所以當兩個產品到美國報價的時候大家都會變貴但是中國要比我們貴更多那對我們的競爭力其實在現況上並不是下降的\n581072\t601121\t所以這個東西要出來甚至要幫助我們的業者因為現在在搶聖誕節訂單跟明年第一季的訂單要幫助我們的業者像美國這邊說台灣的品質更好加了20%關稅比那個加55%的我們相較起來更有價格的競爭優勢要協助業者那如果失去競爭優勢的我們的400多億的輔導就要進場協助他這樣才能夠讓業者趕快安心下來這牽涉到很多人的就業機會\n610345\t634722\t然後像藍花 藍花我們的競爭對手也是越南跟荷蘭看不同的藍種 荷蘭他們現在是15%的樣子歐盟國家 歐盟嘛 15%嘛 可是它是不疊加喔那我們的藍花是20%要疊加那藍花業者面對荷蘭 我們競爭優勢就往下掉可是我們另外一個競爭對手是越南\n635763\t656610\t越南在中低價位的跟我們是競爭對手那越南的蘭花是20%疊加跟我們一樣那大家評分可是越南如果它的蘭種什麼來自於中國什麼的它變40%我希望經濟部把這個分析寫精細一點讓每個業者知道我現在的競爭優勢到底是加還是減還是平盤然後它減之後它需要什麼樣的協助\n659771\t687559\t是行政的協助資金的協助技術的協助很具體的告訴他我可以短期融資多少中期什麼東西然後呢談判辦這邊再盡快把總結會議趕快談出來這樣整套國家策略才清晰這樣懂我意思嗎所以談判當中我們不為難有些資訊事實上也不是第一個要保密第二個是談判資訊是在變動當中很難很難立即掌握那我們只希望談判辦跟我們經貿單位\n689120\t697293\t盡快的在總結會議幫台灣爭取一個比較好的競爭位置那我今天本來一堆要問外交部的事情我就下次再請教林部長了好 謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席我先麻煩我們經濟部次長還有顏惠欣副總談判代表委員好我先請教一下副總談判代表我們現在看昨天川普宣布中國的部分是在延後90天嘛暫停90天他們現在目前的暫行關稅是多少\n他們現在暫行關稅是55%是疊加的還是excluded他是疊加的所以他把原來稅再加上55%暫行90天那我們台灣現在正跟美國要進到最後一個階段就是concluding的這個會議就是總結會議\n我們的總結會議的期程會不會因為美國跟中國的關稅談判受到影響\n欸 報告委員我想那個台 這個不 這是國際的局勢嘛對 這是國際的局勢上面每一個國家跟美國的談判都是個別進行的最近有些專家講的是這一次談判跟以往的經貿談判完全不一樣川普給的時間很短要談的國家近百個 很多所以每個國家面對的變化環境很快所以沒有一個國家可以\n即時連談判的代表在當下可能都沒辦法第一時間掌握到即時的資訊更遑論對自己的這個授權的政府能夠提供即時的資訊或透明化這個是這次談判的困難點我昨天看了一個我們以前的老同事國民黨的這個徐仁立委他現在在美國智庫擔任研究員他特別點出來這一次的談判其實大家不要用黨派去批判這個事情各國面對的困境是一樣然後呢\n疊加從四月份 四月二號到四月九號我們就知道疊加是通則那不疊加 日本跟歐盟是要付出一定的代價才決定不疊加甚至於日本的不疊加好像公告好像還沒有看到嘛對 所以到底會不會變日本人也炒在蛋啦就他那個不疊加事實上白宮沒有公告出來喔那我要回到我要問的命題我們剛才知道中國昨天被宣布暫緩九十天\n有人說這好消息有人說壞消息我們就是持平來講55%的疊加稅率再維持90天中國的出口競爭力會受到很大的影響那台灣的產業我待會要請教經濟部就是我們常常講產業受損 產業受損產業受損要看兩塊我進到美國是我們最大的出口市場加上稅我的成本提高那我產品有沒有不可替代性如果產品具有不可替代性那誰倒霉 消費者倒霉你要付多一點錢\n那如果我產品有被替代性 那我要看什麼我要看我的競爭國 它是多少歲所以比方說以螺絲螺帽 我們的第一大競爭對象是中國它是55%疊加 我們是20%疊加那在競爭的優勢上 我不敢講我們的競爭優勢是下降因為它加了55%嘛 所以這個經貿要這樣看所以我回到請教我們這個嚴副總談判代表\n大家關心的是好我們現在講這暫時狀態那暫時狀態也不會太久了但我剛問的一個命題就是在整個台美的談判當中中國當然是有影響不管是避免他來洗產地或者是他經過台灣中轉美國現在對越南越南的20%有加一個但書欸中國過來的變40%欸所以很明顯這一次關稅談判如果硬要扯一個罪魁禍首就中國啊\n就是針對中國的一個圍堵政策所以回到我們現在進行的總結談判總結談判就會有一個最終我們得到的結論要不然我們就是20%疊加所以我剛才請教的問題很簡單我們總結談判是不是在進行中我們的期程會不會受中國延後90天受到影響如果會 那我這90天內我就不能期待了嘛就你的判斷\n跟委員報告如同我一開始所說的整個這一次台美的這個對等關稅談判或者是美國跟各國的這個對等關稅談判地緣政治是一個\n很重要的因素所以呢那我覺得地緣政治是美國本身看起來它的一個策略性或戰略性上面的考量但是有沒有涉及到特定的國家我想我在這邊就不便進一步幫美國說明那有沒有得到任何的implication或者什麼就是我們的談判的期程因為當年我們在進那個WTO的時候當時是國際協議就是要一起公佈\n那我不曉得我們這一次的最後的總結談判有沒有這樣的氛圍啦我不要講說有什麼樣的現象或的事實有沒有的氛圍就是我們的最終談判的期程可能還要再等\n跟委員報告我想我們談判就是一個互動的過程所以我們跟美國現在就是還沒有進行到最終的總結性會議而且我們想要把232這些議題跟對等關稅一起處理這個也會涉及到比較複雜性的討論232對台灣影響其實比較大因為我們對美的deficit我們的赤字90%其實是來自於\nICT產業那ICT產業只要裡面裝的晶片在美國有設廠的都可以豁免變零趴那對台灣來講其實赤字不會掉下來第二個就沒有解決赤字問題然後台灣被衝擊到的這一塊產業是沒有衝擊到那我就請教經濟部啦那個那個嚴副總裁可以輕輕請回座\n所以我就要回到經濟衝擊這一塊第一個我們對美赤字其實90%來自於ICT產業可是他又因為他在美國有設廠所以他的產品他的那個基板上面只要有那些晶片他可以得到百分之百的關稅的豁免然後呢現在疊加的關稅誰在付代價傳統產業或者農業你知道嗎 就是\n因為這樣子導致貿易赤字所以我們談判會比較困難結果他又因為在美國有設產所以他可能要豁免結果北鳥要受罪啊就換成傳統產業疊加關稅是卡在他身上所以這一點上我們國內的ICT產業其實會因而直接或間接受益所以從那邊得到的稅收應該要相當額度的來補貼我們的傳統產業跟農業這樣才合理啊\n我認為我們的科技產業獲利對台灣是好事畢竟它是我們重要的產業可是這一次的談判是因為貿易赤字是其中一個主要的因素而疊加的關稅又沒有疊到他身上就變成傳統產業要幫忙負擔這個赤字你懂我邏輯意思嗎所以我先請教在這一個目前關稅疊加的狀況下\n我們造成出口美國市場的成本會增加我剛已經講了如果我們的產品具有不可替代性那沒關係就是美國消費者要買貴一點的東西但是如果我們的產品具有可替代性我就要看競爭對手的關稅你們現在這個評估報告出來了沒有報告委員我分兩點來說明第一點就是因為我們也了解到這些傳統產業可能會受影響\n經濟部在特別條例的部分也特別這個編列了希望能夠編列460億來照顧這些業者尤其是我們的中小企業那第二個部分委員有提到有競爭性的產品確實我們也有做一些初步的研析例如像我們比較關注的產業像水五金扣件\n水五金的產品它其實原本的競爭的對手就包括越南跟中國但是現在中國的稅非常的高尤其又疊加之後相較之下我們確實是在關稅的部分是較中國為低但是我們還是要持續因為我們現在談判還在進行當中當然是希望能夠\n爭取更優惠的這個關稅我們都希望關稅越低越好最好大家都是零但是要付出我們國內市場的代價那我們現在面對一個暫時性的現實就是20%的疊加當然有的人從4月份就不讀書都認為說這個疊加是新聞 沒有啦疊加從一開始就有了啦\n而且全世界都有啦日本跟歐盟的不疊加也是最近談判結果才把它解放出來其他都是疊加的我再問一個命題就是我們都希望關稅越低越好那個叫成本我出口到美國100塊錢加了20%再加原有的稅可能變成135塊那叫我的成本\n那我現在面對競爭者的時候你剛才就講一個很好的事情像水五金跟扣件扣件就是我們講螺絲螺帽我們的主要競爭對手是越南跟中國而中國是55%疊加所以當兩個產品到美國報價的時候大家都會變貴但是中國要比我們貴更多那對我們的競爭力其實在現況上並不是下降的\n所以這個東西要出來甚至要幫助我們的業者因為現在在搶聖誕節訂單跟明年第一季的訂單要幫助我們的業者像美國這邊說台灣的品質更好加了20%關稅比那個加55%的我們相較起來更有價格的競爭優勢要協助業者那如果失去競爭優勢的我們的400多億的輔導就要進場協助他這樣才能夠讓業者趕快安心下來這牽涉到很多人的就業機會\n然後像藍花 藍花我們的競爭對手也是越南跟荷蘭看不同的藍種 荷蘭他們現在是15%的樣子歐盟國家 歐盟嘛 15%嘛 可是它是不疊加喔那我們的藍花是20%要疊加那藍花業者面對荷蘭 我們競爭優勢就往下掉可是我們另外一個競爭對手是越南\n越南在中低價位的跟我們是競爭對手那越南的蘭花是20%疊加跟我們一樣那大家評分可是越南如果它的蘭種什麼來自於中國什麼的它變40%我希望經濟部把這個分析寫精細一點讓每個業者知道我現在的競爭優勢到底是加還是減還是平盤然後它減之後它需要什麼樣的協助\n是行政的協助資金的協助技術的協助很具體的告訴他我可以短期融資多少中期什麼東西然後呢談判辦這邊再盡快把總結會議趕快談出來這樣整套國家策略才清晰這樣懂我意思嗎所以談判當中我們不為難有些資訊事實上也不是第一個要保密第二個是談判資訊是在變動當中很難很難立即掌握那我們只希望談判辦跟我們經貿單位\n盡快的在總結會議幫台灣爭取一個比較好的競爭位置那我今天本來一堆要問外交部的事情我就下次再請教林部長了好 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.409 --> 00:27.618\n謝謝主席我先麻煩我們經濟部次長還有顏惠欣副總談判代表委員好我先請教一下副總談判代表我們現在看昨天川普宣布中國的部分是在延後90天嘛暫停90天他們現在目前的暫行關稅是多少\n\n00:28.936 --> 00:48.881\n他們現在暫行關稅是55%是疊加的還是excluded他是疊加的所以他把原來稅再加上55%暫行90天那我們台灣現在正跟美國要進到最後一個階段就是concluding的這個會議就是總結會議\n\n00:52.830 --> 01:01.183\n我們的總結會議的期程會不會因為美國跟中國的關稅談判受到影響\n\n01:05.144 --> 01:30.906\n欸報告委員我想那個台這個不這是國際的局勢嘛對這是國際的局勢上面每一個國家跟美國的談判都是個別進行的最近有些專家講的是這一次談判跟以往的經貿談判完全不一樣川普給的時間很短要談的國家近百個很多所以每個國家面對的變化環境很快所以沒有一個國家可以\n\n01:31.846 --> 02:00.789\n即時連談判的代表在當下可能都沒辦法第一時間掌握到即時的資訊更遑論對自己的這個授權的政府能夠提供即時的資訊或透明化這個是這次談判的困難點我昨天看了一個我們以前的老同事國民黨的這個徐仁立委他現在在美國智庫擔任研究員他特別點出來這一次的談判其實大家不要用黨派去批判這個事情各國面對的困境是一樣然後呢\n\n02:02.120 --> 02:28.411\n疊加從四月份四月二號到四月九號我們就知道疊加是通則那不疊加日本跟歐盟是要付出一定的代價才決定不疊加甚至於日本的不疊加好像公告好像還沒有看到嘛對所以到底會不會變日本人也炒在蛋啦就他那個不疊加事實上白宮沒有公告出來喔那我要回到我要問的命題我們剛才知道中國昨天被宣布暫緩九十天\n\n02:29.793 --> 02:57.822\n有人說這好消息有人說壞消息我們就是持平來講55%的疊加稅率再維持90天中國的出口競爭力會受到很大的影響那台灣的產業我待會要請教經濟部就是我們常常講產業受損產業受損產業受損要看兩塊我進到美國是我們最大的出口市場加上稅我的成本提高那我產品有沒有不可替代性如果產品具有不可替代性那誰倒霉消費者倒霉你要付多一點錢\n\n02:58.622 --> 03:10.510\n那如果我產品有被替代性那我要看什麼我要看我的競爭國它是多少歲所以比方說以螺絲螺帽我們的第一大競爭對象是中國它是55%疊加我們是20%疊加那在競爭的優勢上我不敢講我們的競爭優勢是下降因為它加了55%嘛所以這個經貿要這樣看所以我回到請教我們這個嚴副總談判代表\n\n03:25.117 --> 03:52.291\n大家關心的是好我們現在講這暫時狀態那暫時狀態也不會太久了但我剛問的一個命題就是在整個台美的談判當中中國當然是有影響不管是避免他來洗產地或者是他經過台灣中轉美國現在對越南越南的20%有加一個但書欸中國過來的變40%欸所以很明顯這一次關稅談判如果硬要扯一個罪魁禍首就中國啊\n\n03:52.791 --> 04:14.629\n就是針對中國的一個圍堵政策所以回到我們現在進行的總結談判總結談判就會有一個最終我們得到的結論要不然我們就是20%疊加所以我剛才請教的問題很簡單我們總結談判是不是在進行中我們的期程會不會受中國延後90天受到影響如果會那我這90天內我就不能期待了嘛就你的判斷\n\n04:15.686 --> 04:26.286\n跟委員報告如同我一開始所說的整個這一次台美的這個對等關稅談判或者是美國跟各國的這個對等關稅談判地緣政治是一個\n\n04:27.166 --> 04:50.220\n很重要的因素所以呢那我覺得地緣政治是美國本身看起來它的一個策略性或戰略性上面的考量但是有沒有涉及到特定的國家我想我在這邊就不便進一步幫美國說明那有沒有得到任何的implication或者什麼就是我們的談判的期程因為當年我們在進那個WTO的時候當時是國際協議就是要一起公佈\n\n04:57.567 --> 05:09.381\n那我不曉得我們這一次的最後的總結談判有沒有這樣的氛圍啦我不要講說有什麼樣的現象或的事實有沒有的氛圍就是我們的最終談判的期程可能還要再等\n\n05:11.304 --> 05:34.201\n跟委員報告我想我們談判就是一個互動的過程所以我們跟美國現在就是還沒有進行到最終的總結性會議而且我們想要把232這些議題跟對等關稅一起處理這個也會涉及到比較複雜性的討論232對台灣影響其實比較大因為我們對美的deficit我們的赤字90%其實是來自於\n\n05:36.142 --> 05:58.794\nICT產業那ICT產業只要裡面裝的晶片在美國有設廠的都可以豁免變零趴那對台灣來講其實赤字不會掉下來第二個就沒有解決赤字問題然後台灣被衝擊到的這一塊產業是沒有衝擊到那我就請教經濟部啦那個那個嚴副總裁可以輕輕請回座\n\n05:59.548 --> 06:22.607\n所以我就要回到經濟衝擊這一塊第一個我們對美赤字其實90%來自於ICT產業可是他又因為他在美國有設廠所以他的產品他的那個基板上面只要有那些晶片他可以得到百分之百的關稅的豁免然後呢現在疊加的關稅誰在付代價傳統產業或者農業你知道嗎就是\n\n06:27.833 --> 06:53.208\n因為這樣子導致貿易赤字所以我們談判會比較困難結果他又因為在美國有設產所以他可能要豁免結果北鳥要受罪啊就換成傳統產業疊加關稅是卡在他身上所以這一點上我們國內的ICT產業其實會因而直接或間接受益所以從那邊得到的稅收應該要相當額度的來補貼我們的傳統產業跟農業這樣才合理啊\n\n06:57.341 --> 07:16.688\n我認為我們的科技產業獲利對台灣是好事畢竟它是我們重要的產業可是這一次的談判是因為貿易赤字是其中一個主要的因素而疊加的關稅又沒有疊到他身上就變成傳統產業要幫忙負擔這個赤字你懂我邏輯意思嗎所以我先請教在這一個目前關稅疊加的狀況下\n\n07:18.729 --> 07:43.277\n我們造成出口美國市場的成本會增加我剛已經講了如果我們的產品具有不可替代性那沒關係就是美國消費者要買貴一點的東西但是如果我們的產品具有可替代性我就要看競爭對手的關稅你們現在這個評估報告出來了沒有報告委員我分兩點來說明第一點就是因為我們也了解到這些傳統產業可能會受影響\n\n07:46.188 --> 08:07.046\n經濟部在特別條例的部分也特別這個編列了希望能夠編列460億來照顧這些業者尤其是我們的中小企業那第二個部分委員有提到有競爭性的產品確實我們也有做一些初步的研析例如像我們比較關注的產業像水五金扣件\n\n08:08.066 --> 08:29.458\n水五金的產品它其實原本的競爭的對手就包括越南跟中國但是現在中國的稅非常的高尤其又疊加之後相較之下我們確實是在關稅的部分是較中國為低但是我們還是要持續因為我們現在談判還在進行當中當然是希望能夠\n\n08:30.357 --> 08:49.213\n爭取更優惠的這個關稅我們都希望關稅越低越好最好大家都是零但是要付出我們國內市場的代價那我們現在面對一個暫時性的現實就是20%的疊加當然有的人從4月份就不讀書都認為說這個疊加是新聞沒有啦疊加從一開始就有了啦\n\n08:49.844 --> 09:11.165\n而且全世界都有啦日本跟歐盟的不疊加也是最近談判結果才把它解放出來其他都是疊加的我再問一個命題就是我們都希望關稅越低越好那個叫成本我出口到美國100塊錢加了20%再加原有的稅可能變成135塊那叫我的成本\n\n09:12.148 --> 09:40.115\n那我現在面對競爭者的時候你剛才就講一個很好的事情像水五金跟扣件扣件就是我們講螺絲螺帽我們的主要競爭對手是越南跟中國而中國是55%疊加所以當兩個產品到美國報價的時候大家都會變貴但是中國要比我們貴更多那對我們的競爭力其實在現況上並不是下降的\n\n09:41.072 --> 10:01.121\n所以這個東西要出來甚至要幫助我們的業者因為現在在搶聖誕節訂單跟明年第一季的訂單要幫助我們的業者像美國這邊說台灣的品質更好加了20%關稅比那個加55%的我們相較起來更有價格的競爭優勢要協助業者那如果失去競爭優勢的我們的400多億的輔導就要進場協助他這樣才能夠讓業者趕快安心下來這牽涉到很多人的就業機會\n\n10:10.345 --> 10:34.722\n然後像藍花藍花我們的競爭對手也是越南跟荷蘭看不同的藍種荷蘭他們現在是15%的樣子歐盟國家歐盟嘛15%嘛可是它是不疊加喔那我們的藍花是20%要疊加那藍花業者面對荷蘭我們競爭優勢就往下掉可是我們另外一個競爭對手是越南\n\n10:35.763 --> 10:56.610\n越南在中低價位的跟我們是競爭對手那越南的蘭花是20%疊加跟我們一樣那大家評分可是越南如果它的蘭種什麼來自於中國什麼的它變40%我希望經濟部把這個分析寫精細一點讓每個業者知道我現在的競爭優勢到底是加還是減還是平盤然後它減之後它需要什麼樣的協助\n\n10:59.771 --> 11:27.559\n是行政的協助資金的協助技術的協助很具體的告訴他我可以短期融資多少中期什麼東西然後呢談判辦這邊再盡快把總結會議趕快談出來這樣整套國家策略才清晰這樣懂我意思嗎所以談判當中我們不為難有些資訊事實上也不是第一個要保密第二個是談判資訊是在變動當中很難很難立即掌握那我們只希望談判辦跟我們經貿單位\n\n11:29.120 --> 11:37.293\n盡快的在總結會議幫台灣爭取一個比較好的競爭位置那我今天本來一堆要問外交部的事情我就下次再請教林部長了好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.409,"end":27.618,"text":"謝謝主席我先麻煩我們經濟部次長還有顏惠欣副總談判代表委員好我先請教一下副總談判代表我們現在看昨天川普宣布中國的部分是在延後90天嘛暫停90天他們現在目前的暫行關稅是多少"},{"start":28.936,"end":48.881,"text":"他們現在暫行關稅是55%是疊加的還是excluded他是疊加的所以他把原來稅再加上55%暫行90天那我們台灣現在正跟美國要進到最後一個階段就是concluding的這個會議就是總結會議"},{"start":52.83,"end":61.183,"text":"我們的總結會議的期程會不會因為美國跟中國的關稅談判受到影響"},{"start":65.144,"end":90.906,"text":"欸 報告委員我想那個台 這個不 這是國際的局勢嘛對 這是國際的局勢上面每一個國家跟美國的談判都是個別進行的最近有些專家講的是這一次談判跟以往的經貿談判完全不一樣川普給的時間很短要談的國家近百個 很多所以每個國家面對的變化環境很快所以沒有一個國家可以"},{"start":91.846,"end":120.789,"text":"即時連談判的代表在當下可能都沒辦法第一時間掌握到即時的資訊更遑論對自己的這個授權的政府能夠提供即時的資訊或透明化這個是這次談判的困難點我昨天看了一個我們以前的老同事國民黨的這個徐仁立委他現在在美國智庫擔任研究員他特別點出來這一次的談判其實大家不要用黨派去批判這個事情各國面對的困境是一樣然後呢"},{"start":122.12,"end":148.411,"text":"疊加從四月份 四月二號到四月九號我們就知道疊加是通則那不疊加 日本跟歐盟是要付出一定的代價才決定不疊加甚至於日本的不疊加好像公告好像還沒有看到嘛對 所以到底會不會變日本人也炒在蛋啦就他那個不疊加事實上白宮沒有公告出來喔那我要回到我要問的命題我們剛才知道中國昨天被宣布暫緩九十天"},{"start":149.793,"end":177.822,"text":"有人說這好消息有人說壞消息我們就是持平來講55%的疊加稅率再維持90天中國的出口競爭力會受到很大的影響那台灣的產業我待會要請教經濟部就是我們常常講產業受損 產業受損產業受損要看兩塊我進到美國是我們最大的出口市場加上稅我的成本提高那我產品有沒有不可替代性如果產品具有不可替代性那誰倒霉 消費者倒霉你要付多一點錢"},{"start":178.622,"end":190.51,"text":"那如果我產品有被替代性 那我要看什麼我要看我的競爭國 它是多少歲所以比方說以螺絲螺帽 我們的第一大競爭對象是中國它是55%疊加 我們是20%疊加那在競爭的優勢上 我不敢講我們的競爭優勢是下降因為它加了55%嘛 所以這個經貿要這樣看所以我回到請教我們這個嚴副總談判代表"},{"start":205.117,"end":232.291,"text":"大家關心的是好我們現在講這暫時狀態那暫時狀態也不會太久了但我剛問的一個命題就是在整個台美的談判當中中國當然是有影響不管是避免他來洗產地或者是他經過台灣中轉美國現在對越南越南的20%有加一個但書欸中國過來的變40%欸所以很明顯這一次關稅談判如果硬要扯一個罪魁禍首就中國啊"},{"start":232.791,"end":254.629,"text":"就是針對中國的一個圍堵政策所以回到我們現在進行的總結談判總結談判就會有一個最終我們得到的結論要不然我們就是20%疊加所以我剛才請教的問題很簡單我們總結談判是不是在進行中我們的期程會不會受中國延後90天受到影響如果會 那我這90天內我就不能期待了嘛就你的判斷"},{"start":255.686,"end":266.286,"text":"跟委員報告如同我一開始所說的整個這一次台美的這個對等關稅談判或者是美國跟各國的這個對等關稅談判地緣政治是一個"},{"start":267.166,"end":290.22,"text":"很重要的因素所以呢那我覺得地緣政治是美國本身看起來它的一個策略性或戰略性上面的考量但是有沒有涉及到特定的國家我想我在這邊就不便進一步幫美國說明那有沒有得到任何的implication或者什麼就是我們的談判的期程因為當年我們在進那個WTO的時候當時是國際協議就是要一起公佈"},{"start":297.567,"end":309.381,"text":"那我不曉得我們這一次的最後的總結談判有沒有這樣的氛圍啦我不要講說有什麼樣的現象或的事實有沒有的氛圍就是我們的最終談判的期程可能還要再等"},{"start":311.304,"end":334.201,"text":"跟委員報告我想我們談判就是一個互動的過程所以我們跟美國現在就是還沒有進行到最終的總結性會議而且我們想要把232這些議題跟對等關稅一起處理這個也會涉及到比較複雜性的討論232對台灣影響其實比較大因為我們對美的deficit我們的赤字90%其實是來自於"},{"start":336.142,"end":358.794,"text":"ICT產業那ICT產業只要裡面裝的晶片在美國有設廠的都可以豁免變零趴那對台灣來講其實赤字不會掉下來第二個就沒有解決赤字問題然後台灣被衝擊到的這一塊產業是沒有衝擊到那我就請教經濟部啦那個那個嚴副總裁可以輕輕請回座"},{"start":359.548,"end":382.607,"text":"所以我就要回到經濟衝擊這一塊第一個我們對美赤字其實90%來自於ICT產業可是他又因為他在美國有設廠所以他的產品他的那個基板上面只要有那些晶片他可以得到百分之百的關稅的豁免然後呢現在疊加的關稅誰在付代價傳統產業或者農業你知道嗎 就是"},{"start":387.833,"end":413.208,"text":"因為這樣子導致貿易赤字所以我們談判會比較困難結果他又因為在美國有設產所以他可能要豁免結果北鳥要受罪啊就換成傳統產業疊加關稅是卡在他身上所以這一點上我們國內的ICT產業其實會因而直接或間接受益所以從那邊得到的稅收應該要相當額度的來補貼我們的傳統產業跟農業這樣才合理啊"},{"start":417.341,"end":436.688,"text":"我認為我們的科技產業獲利對台灣是好事畢竟它是我們重要的產業可是這一次的談判是因為貿易赤字是其中一個主要的因素而疊加的關稅又沒有疊到他身上就變成傳統產業要幫忙負擔這個赤字你懂我邏輯意思嗎所以我先請教在這一個目前關稅疊加的狀況下"},{"start":438.729,"end":463.277,"text":"我們造成出口美國市場的成本會增加我剛已經講了如果我們的產品具有不可替代性那沒關係就是美國消費者要買貴一點的東西但是如果我們的產品具有可替代性我就要看競爭對手的關稅你們現在這個評估報告出來了沒有報告委員我分兩點來說明第一點就是因為我們也了解到這些傳統產業可能會受影響"},{"start":466.188,"end":487.046,"text":"經濟部在特別條例的部分也特別這個編列了希望能夠編列460億來照顧這些業者尤其是我們的中小企業那第二個部分委員有提到有競爭性的產品確實我們也有做一些初步的研析例如像我們比較關注的產業像水五金扣件"},{"start":488.066,"end":509.458,"text":"水五金的產品它其實原本的競爭的對手就包括越南跟中國但是現在中國的稅非常的高尤其又疊加之後相較之下我們確實是在關稅的部分是較中國為低但是我們還是要持續因為我們現在談判還在進行當中當然是希望能夠"},{"start":510.357,"end":529.213,"text":"爭取更優惠的這個關稅我們都希望關稅越低越好最好大家都是零但是要付出我們國內市場的代價那我們現在面對一個暫時性的現實就是20%的疊加當然有的人從4月份就不讀書都認為說這個疊加是新聞 沒有啦疊加從一開始就有了啦"},{"start":529.844,"end":551.165,"text":"而且全世界都有啦日本跟歐盟的不疊加也是最近談判結果才把它解放出來其他都是疊加的我再問一個命題就是我們都希望關稅越低越好那個叫成本我出口到美國100塊錢加了20%再加原有的稅可能變成135塊那叫我的成本"},{"start":552.148,"end":580.115,"text":"那我現在面對競爭者的時候你剛才就講一個很好的事情像水五金跟扣件扣件就是我們講螺絲螺帽我們的主要競爭對手是越南跟中國而中國是55%疊加所以當兩個產品到美國報價的時候大家都會變貴但是中國要比我們貴更多那對我們的競爭力其實在現況上並不是下降的"},{"start":581.072,"end":601.121,"text":"所以這個東西要出來甚至要幫助我們的業者因為現在在搶聖誕節訂單跟明年第一季的訂單要幫助我們的業者像美國這邊說台灣的品質更好加了20%關稅比那個加55%的我們相較起來更有價格的競爭優勢要協助業者那如果失去競爭優勢的我們的400多億的輔導就要進場協助他這樣才能夠讓業者趕快安心下來這牽涉到很多人的就業機會"},{"start":610.345,"end":634.722,"text":"然後像藍花 藍花我們的競爭對手也是越南跟荷蘭看不同的藍種 荷蘭他們現在是15%的樣子歐盟國家 歐盟嘛 15%嘛 可是它是不疊加喔那我們的藍花是20%要疊加那藍花業者面對荷蘭 我們競爭優勢就往下掉可是我們另外一個競爭對手是越南"},{"start":635.763,"end":656.61,"text":"越南在中低價位的跟我們是競爭對手那越南的蘭花是20%疊加跟我們一樣那大家評分可是越南如果它的蘭種什麼來自於中國什麼的它變40%我希望經濟部把這個分析寫精細一點讓每個業者知道我現在的競爭優勢到底是加還是減還是平盤然後它減之後它需要什麼樣的協助"},{"start":659.771,"end":687.559,"text":"是行政的協助資金的協助技術的協助很具體的告訴他我可以短期融資多少中期什麼東西然後呢談判辦這邊再盡快把總結會議趕快談出來這樣整套國家策略才清晰這樣懂我意思嗎所以談判當中我們不為難有些資訊事實上也不是第一個要保密第二個是談判資訊是在變動當中很難很難立即掌握那我們只希望談判辦跟我們經貿單位"},{"start":689.12,"end":697.293,"text":"盡快的在總結會議幫台灣爭取一個比較好的競爭位置那我今天本來一堆要問外交部的事情我就下次再請教林部長了好 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":238,"blocks":[["王委員定宇：（10時19分）謝謝主席，我先麻煩經濟部次長及顏慧欣副總談判代表。"],["江次長文若：委員好。"],["王委員定宇：我先請教一下副總談判代表，昨天川普宣布，中國的部分再延後90天，暫停90天，他們現在的暫行關稅是多少？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：他們現在暫行關稅是55%。"],["王委員定宇：是疊加的還是excluded？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：他是疊加的。"],["王委員定宇：所以他是把原來的稅率再加上55%，暫行90天。我們臺灣現在正要跟美國進到最後一個階段，就是concluding會議，就是總結會議，我們的總結會議期程會不會因為美國跟中國的關稅談判而受到影響？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：報告委員，我想這個……"],["王委員定宇：這是國際的局勢。"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：在國際的局勢上，每一個國家跟美國的談判都是個別進行的。"],["王委員定宇：最近有些專家講，這一次談判跟以往的經貿談判完全不一樣，川普給的時間很短，要談的國家近百個，很多，每個國家面對的環境變化很快，所以沒有一個國家可以即時……連談判的代表在當下可能都沒辦法第一時間掌握到即時的資訊，更遑論對授權自己的政府提供即時的資訊或透明化，這是這一次談判的困難點。我昨天看了一個我們以前的老同事，國民黨的許毓仁立委，他現在在美國智庫擔任研究員，他特別點出來，這一次談判其實大家不用站在黨派的立場去批判這個事情，各國面對的困境是一樣的。然後從4月2號到4月9號，我們就知道疊加是通則，不疊加的日本跟歐盟要付出一定的代價，才決定不疊加，甚至於日本的不疊加，公告好像還沒有看到。"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：對。"],["王委員定宇：所以到底會不會變，日本人也很擔心，就是他那個不疊加事實上白宮沒有公告出來。我要回到我要問的命題，我們知道中國昨天被宣布暫緩90天，有人說這是好消息，有人說是壞消息，我們就是持平來講，55%的疊加稅率再維持90天，中國的出口競爭力會受到很大的影響。那臺灣的產業，我待會要請教經濟部，我們常講產業受損，產業受損要看兩塊，美國是我們最大的出口市場，加上稅，我的成本提高，我的產品有沒有不可替代性？如果產品具有不可替代性，那誰倒楣？消費者倒楣，你要付多一點錢；那如果我的產品有被替代性，那我要看我的競爭國是多少稅。比方以螺絲、螺帽來講，我們的第一大競爭對象是中國，他是55%疊加，我們是20%疊加，那在競爭的優勢上，我不敢講我們的競爭優勢是下降，因為他們加了55%，經貿要這樣看。","所以我要請教顏副總談判代表，我們現在講這個暫時狀態，暫時狀態也不會太久了，我剛剛問的一個命題就是在整個臺美的談判當中，中國當然是有影響，不管是避免他來洗產地，或者是他經過臺灣中轉，美國現在對越南，越南的20%有加一個但書，中國過來的要變40%。所以很明顯，這一次關稅談判如果硬要扯一個罪魁禍首的話，就是中國啊！就是針對中國的圍堵政策。所以回到我們現在進行的總結談判，總結談判就會有一個最終得到的結論，要不然我們就是20%疊加，所以我剛剛請教的問題很簡單，我們的總結談判是不是在進行中？我們的期程會不會受中國延後90天的影響？如果會，那我這90天內就不能期待了嘛。"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：跟委員報告，如同我一開始所說的，整個這一次臺美的對等關稅談判，或者是美國跟各國的對等關稅談判，地緣政治是一個很重要的因素，我覺得地緣政治看起來是美國本身一個策略性或戰略性的考量，但是有沒有涉及到特定的國家，我想我在這邊就不便進一步幫美國說明。"],["王委員定宇：你不便回答啦！有沒有得到任何的implication，或者談判的期程？因為當年我們要進WTO的時候，當時的國際協議就是要一起公布，我不曉得我們這一次最後的總結談判有沒有這樣的氛圍，我不要說有什麼樣的現象或事實，有沒有一種氛圍，就是我們的最終談判期程可能還要再等？"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：跟委員報告，我想我們談判就是一個互動的過程，所以我們跟美國現在就是還沒有進行到最終的總結性會議，而且我們想要把232這些議題跟對等關稅一起處理，這也會涉及比較複雜性的討論。"],["王委員定宇：232對臺灣影響其實比較大，因為我們對美的赤字90%其實是來自於……"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：資通訊產品。"],["王委員定宇：ICT產業。"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：是。"],["王委員定宇：那ICT產業，只要裡面裝的晶片在美國有設廠的都可以豁免變0%，對臺灣來講，赤字不會掉下來。第二、因為沒有解決赤字問題，臺灣這一塊產業是沒有被衝擊到的。我就請教經濟部，回到經濟衝擊這一塊，第一、我們對美赤字其實90%來自於ICT產業，可是又因為他們在美國有設廠，他的產品只要基板上面有那些晶片，他可以得到百分之百的關稅的豁免，然後現在疊加的關稅，是誰在付代價？傳統產業或農業，你知道嗎？因為這樣導致貿易赤字，所以我們談判會比較困難，結果ICT產業因為在美國有設廠，所以可以得到豁免，結果疊加關稅就卡在傳統產業身上，在這一點上，我們國內的ICT產業其實會因而直接或間接受益，所以從那邊得到的稅收應該要有相當的額度來補貼我們的傳統產業跟農業，這樣才合理啊！","我認為我們的科技產業獲利對臺灣是好事，畢竟它是我們重要的產業，可是這一次的談判因為貿易赤字是其中一個主要的因素，但疊加的關稅卻沒有疊加在ICT產業身上，變成傳統產業要幫忙負擔這個赤字，你懂我的邏輯意思嗎？所以，我先請教在目前關稅疊加的狀況下，我們造成出口美國市場的成本增加，我剛剛已經講了，如果我們的產品具有不可替代性，那沒關係，就是美國消費者要買貴一點的東西，但是如果我們的產品具有可替代性，我就要看競爭對手的關稅，你們現在這個評估報告出來了沒有？"],["江次長文若：報告委員，我分兩點來說明，第一點，因為我們也了解到這些傳統產業可能會受影響，所以經濟部在特別條例中特別希望能夠編列460億來照顧這些業者，尤其是我們的中小企業；第二個部分，委員提到有競爭性的產品，確實我們也有做一些初步的研析，例如我們比較關注的產業，像水五金、扣件等等，水五金產品原本的競爭對手就包括越南跟中國，但是現在中國的稅非常高，尤其又疊加，相較之下我們確實在關稅部分較中國為低，但是因為我們現在談判還在進行當中，當然還是希望能夠爭取更優惠的關稅。"],["王委員定宇：我們都希望關稅越低越好。"],["江次長文若：對。"],["王委員定宇：最好大家都是0，但是那要付出我們國內市場的代價啦。我們現在面對一個暫時性的現實，就是20%的疊加，當然有的人從4月份就不讀書，都認為這個疊加是新聞，沒有啦！疊加從一開始就有，而且全世界都有，日本跟歐盟的不疊加，也是最近談判的結果，才解放出來的，其他都是疊加的。","我再問一個命題，就是我們都希望關稅越低越好，那個叫成本，我出口到美國100塊錢，加了20%再加原有的稅，可能變成135塊，那叫我的成本，那我現在面對競爭者的時候，你剛才就講了一個很好的事情，像水五金跟扣件，扣件就是我們講的螺絲、螺帽，我們的主要競爭對手是越南跟中國，而中國是55%疊加，所以當兩個產品到美國報價的時候，大家都會變貴，但是中國要比我們貴更多，那對我們的競爭力而言，其實並不是下降的，這個東西要出來，甚至要幫助我們的業者，因為現在在搶聖誕節訂單跟明年第一季的訂單，要幫助我們的業者，跟美國說臺灣的品質更好，加了20%的關稅比那個加55%的更有價格的競爭優勢，要協助業者。如果是失去競爭優勢的，我們那四百多億輔導就要進場協助，這樣才能夠讓業者趕快安心下來，這牽涉到很多人的就業機會。然後像蘭花，我們的競爭對手也是越南跟荷蘭，看不同的蘭種，荷蘭現在是15%的樣子……"],["江次長文若：歐盟國家。"],["王委員定宇：歐盟15%，可是他是不疊加喔！我們的蘭花是20%要疊加，那蘭花業者面對荷蘭，我們的競爭優勢就往下掉。可是我們另外一個競爭對手是越南，越南在中低價位的跟我們是競爭對手，而越南的蘭花是20%疊加，跟我們一樣，那大家平分，可是越南如果他的蘭種什麼的來自於中國等等就變40%。我希望經濟部把這個分析寫精細一點，讓每個業者知道他現在的競爭優勢到底是加或減還是平盤，減了之後他需要什麼樣的協助，是行政協助、資金協助、技術協助，很具體地告訴他，我可以短期融資多少、中期是什麼東西，然後談判辦這邊再儘快把總結會議趕快談出來，這樣整套國家策略才清晰，你懂我的意思嗎？"],["江次長文若：是。"],["王委員定宇：談判當中我們不為難，有些資訊事實上也不是……第一個要保密，第二個，談判資訊是在變動當中，很難立即掌握，那我們只希望談判辦跟經貿單位，儘快地在總結會議幫臺灣爭取一個比較好的競爭位置。","我今天本來有一堆要問外交部的事情，那我就下次再請教林部長，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝王定宇委員的質詢。","外交部部長林佳龍10點半以後因為有要事請假，由政務次長陳明祺代為列席。","接下來由沈伯洋召委上臺質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":46,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-35-25","speakers":["黃仁","徐巧芯","陳永康","羅美玲","陳俊宇","王定宇","沈伯洋","馬文君","賴士葆","林倩綺","黃國昌","陳冠廷","林憶君","林楚茵","蘇清泉"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-08-14"],"gazette_id":"1147301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1147301_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期外交及國防委員會第25次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請外交部部長、經濟部次長、財政部次長、農業部次長、行政院經貿談判辦公室副總談判代表\n報告「因應台美關稅及國際局勢變化台美關係互動情形，暨俄烏戰事與以哈衝突外交援助概\n況」，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1147301_00001"}}}