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00:01:18,448\n地方很多病患他們要拿那個處方簽的藥實際上都要跑遍很多藥局那時候舉的是眼藥的例子最近短效胰島素也非常的缺很多病患他是在醫院看病然後拿著處方簽跑遍藥局都買不到短效胰島素最後還是要跑到大醫院\n\n4\n00:01:19,068 --> 00:01:45,435\n我覺得這你就失去當時讓大家可以就近到社區藥局領藥的這種便利性現在很多藥已經沒有辦法達到這樣的效果那所以您的您很有信心我當然是我們也是希望您的信心是真的可以化為實際但是實際上狀況就不是這樣而且我不曉得部長你有沒有掌握現在有非常多的大的藥廠都發出缺藥通知你知道這個事嗎\n\n5\n00:01:46,295 --> 00:02:05,118\n我這邊手上就有一堆資料譬如說我們紓壓痰點演藝啊公司就說因廠商停止供應預計115年停止供應然後一大堆很多人都是說因為原物料短缺造成的結果那這個部分到底\n\n6\n00:02:06,192 --> 00:02:22,198\n部長您有沒有真的去了解問題提出一個比較明確的解決的問題因為這沒有什麼政治性議題這就是一般民生大家要用藥我覺得不要粉飾台針對問題解決問題部長您的解決方式到底是什麼\n\n7\n00:02:22,398 --> 00:02:39,020\n好謝謝委員我想謝謝委員關心我們特別是新北市的一個醫藥方面的一個提供新北市的醫藥方面的團體我們都很熟所以大概也都知道他們運作的狀況這是長久的問題\n\n8\n00:02:40,121 --> 00:03:06,476\n在有些藥不懂我相信這應該不會只是新北市的狀況因為他的藥來源都是藥商那藥商不可能說北部藥商有這樣的問題然後南部沒這樣的問題我不相信我覺得應該就是全國的問題是的所以我兩個部分一個是說一直這幾年來一直發生我們一直在解決讓醫譬如說處方先拿的能夠順暢的拿這個部分怎麼樣去這也是有些\n\n9\n00:03:08,717 --> 00:03:24,886\n應該是這樣藥變少這是事實就是藥商供應的量變小這是事實不管他是原物料缺少還是說因為藥價關係他不願意投入太多在台灣這個是事實但現在出現還有一個分配的問題就是說最後他到醫院都拿得到但他藥局就是沒有\n\n10\n00:03:25,746 --> 00:03:51,329\n所以我覺得分配問題你應該也可以去針對這個部分去思考一下你醫院有時候一大堆也不見得大家集資去領嘛可是藥局就沒有那怎麼去調配那個量讓醫院也不要沒有但是讓他有充足的情況之下有比較多餘的可以進入到社區藥局便利我們民眾去領嘛這個不是不能解決第二個是缺藥平台啦因為上次我也有跟你提過\n\n11\n00:03:52,150 --> 00:04:18,697\n你們都會講說只要有缺藥就可以到缺藥平台去反映可是藥局的心聲就是反映的沒用反映的沒用所以到最後當他覺得這個東西反映沒用之後就不會再去反映了就是這樣就覺得反正也沒有意義所以最後你們這邊的得到訊息就會誤解成說都沒有人來反映都沒有人反映所以一定沒缺藥可是實際上人家是因為反映的沒用所以沒去反映\n\n12\n00:04:19,477 --> 00:04:45,027\n所以我真的覺得這個衛福部官員跟基層有很大的落差我真的強烈建議因為部長你也是醫師出身嘛您在其實我了解您在那個醫師團體聲望很高啦很多醫生對你很肯定你其實可以多多問看他們的意見不管是醫師團體或是藥師團體一樣到底我講的是不是事實還是你了解的是事實\n\n13\n00:04:45,947 --> 00:05:03,359\n因為我們兩個的了解有落差沒有我委員所講的的確是有這種現象那我們一直在改善那要怎麼改善嘛因為這個問題拖很久了江組長來跟議員這邊進一步報告剛才提到的\n\n14\n00:05:04,740 --> 00:05:31,915\n我非常非常肯定我也知道是現實那我要說明的事情台灣的整個市場小所以我們在藥物舉個例子胰島素這件事情那胰島素面臨的是全世界第一名製廠占比的叫諾和諾的一家它的短效的胰島素等等還有其他的那因為短效胰島素人類胰島素特殊性上面它必須用在關鍵的一般民眾的胰島素\n\n15\n00:05:33,476 --> 00:05:55,354\n常平時的狀況之下其實是可以替代的可是有些關鍵的地方就需求特別嚴重要進入交互病房裡面昏迷的糖尿病的病患跟酮酸中毒他就必須要用這種的所以我們在做的這樣的情形之下我們要讓最關鍵的人能夠用得到所以我們做的必須要做控制跟控藥\n\n16\n00:05:56,314 --> 00:06:11,126\n那這個東西在社區一般民眾我今天你會講很長我知道啦其實我的問題很簡單就是我的問題非常簡單你讓需要的人能夠在社區拿到藥那就是這樣該不該做該嘛\n\n17\n00:06:14,468 --> 00:06:29,862\n那該嘛那問題出在哪裡你要把問題找到嘛而不是講一大堆這個藥是怎麼樣要控制說那問題是你就沒有讓人家拿到藥啊謝謝委員這邊委員報告的地方是我們在處方的行為上會決定他拿得到拿不到\n\n18\n00:06:30,603 --> 00:06:51,138\n所以我們跟整個醫學會上面我反應的是說處方的行為希望他拿得到的部分他還是拿不到比如說眼藥水嘛應該他不是什麼你剛剛講的他要控制要讓特殊的人才能拿到應該不是這個情況但是現在很多病患他跑藥局要去拿眼藥水也拿不到啊\n\n19\n00:06:51,838 --> 00:07:10,680\n就是你要普遍性的去解決這個缺藥的問題嘛了解我們這個部分一個是真的是缺嘛一個是所謂的平衡的部分能夠讓他的供應鏈能夠穩定這兩部分我們持續在努力如果說我們在這邊一直反映基層的心聲然後你一直講一堆理由我相信這問題沒有辦法解決你應該是說\n\n20\n00:07:13,262 --> 00:07:41,668\n確實我們應該要讓民眾如果他這個藥是應該在藥局拿得到他就應該要拿得到不過不要因為缺藥的問題讓他拿不到你們是要去解決這件事情然後去跟藥局做一個加強聯繫譬如說你現在的聯繫方式是缺藥平台但缺藥平台現在已經失靈了那怎麼樣再重新讓這些藥局對缺藥平台產生信心用什麼方式讓他覺得說我今天跟政府反映事情是有用的\n\n21\n00:07:42,452 --> 00:08:04,457\n你現在要建立起政府對於民眾或者是藥局的信心我們現在反映的是這個事情而不是針對署長剛剛提到特定一個藥到底它是為什麼我們要平衡當然那個也是其中之一但是大的方向是你要解決我剛剛講的那兩件事這個我們深刻了解我們會記得因為這個同樣的問題一直在反映\n\n22\n00:08:05,492 --> 00:08:34,021\n我上次好像有請部長這邊說是不是你說你說會檢討嗎然後說會給我們一個檢討的一個說明嗎我不知道你有做嗎好不然的話同樣的問題就是每次一直在問啊然後然後每次我講的我都覺得部長你很認同啊但是認同都沒有行動啊那總是要行動我們有認同也一直在想要解決所以這個必須要跟這有急迫性啊部長這不是\n\n23\n00:08:36,642 --> 00:08:56,828\n藥界有它的文化啦又大的藥局又連鎖藥局又小藥局這個強度有時候他們拿到的貨的確可能的確這個不管是一的這個專業配合藥的一個分佈我們的確要坐下來來溝通看看那要多久\n\n24\n00:08:58,849 --> 00:09:16,786\n國際間我們當然爭取藥進來讓他不要缺藥這也是很重要不要缺藥裡面再來就分配分配的讓他社區的民眾能夠順暢這是一定要做的事情但是這個就是可能又有點變成一種\n\n25\n00:09:18,187 --> 00:09:30,478\n一種比較business的一個因素在裡面但是為了社區民眾的一個拿藥的方便我想我們會出來來介入來協調\n\n26\n00:09:36,242 --> 00:09:52,017\n我們就這個部分我們積極辦理跟委員這邊做報告什麼時候再來問你嘛什麼時候會有一個初步的一個構想出來或者是一個做法因為今天的戰略都比較比較高大上很崇高啦但那個戰略\n\n27\n00:09:53,458 --> 00:10:01,642\n跟實際落差很大跟委員報告一下其實我們想的我們組長整組其實都已經因為我剛剛的問題都已經講完了啦我現在只要一個期程就是什麼時候\n\n28\n00:10:08,370 --> 00:10:31,558\n大概我大概什麼時候再來問你你可以有一個比較具體的解決的方案跟委員報告他牽涉後續的後面那一段是講很實情的問題都很了解不要再拖時間了要以數個月到半年以上來計才有辦法數個月調控的有點需要有一些時間因為他牽涉到全球不是做法啦什麼時候\n\n29\n00:10:31,978 --> 00:10:50,192\n做法應該回去就可以拿出來了我們已經都已經有做法跟想法了沒有問題這個我們跟委員們做進一步我們的規劃的報告我想我們一個月內把做法跟委員報告那三個月會提出一個更積極的一個進行的程度這樣OK好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n10180\t37065\t馬上請到那個部長 衛福部長 謝謝委員好那個部長好我相信今天召委排這個專題報告應該就是大家很擔心缺藥的問題嘛特別是美國關稅之後對缺藥問題會不會特別嚴重那我看部長你回答媒體的訪問好像信心滿滿啊所以已經下令要求什麼自計的存量要三個月然後又提出四大策略\n38005\t53461\t譬如說什麼要強化供應的預警啊什麼要價合理等等四大策略感覺上好像胸有成竹可是其實部長我不知道到底有沒有掌握到實際狀況其實我應該上個月也有在委員會有跟你提有跟你提過在我們\n54302\t78448\t地方很多病患他們要拿那個處方簽的藥實際上都要跑遍很多藥局那時候舉的是眼藥的例子最近短效胰島素也非常的缺很多病患他是在醫院看病然後拿著處方簽跑遍藥局都買不到短效胰島素最後還是要跑到大醫院\n79068\t105435\t我覺得這你就失去當時讓大家可以就近到社區藥局領藥的這種便利性現在很多藥已經沒有辦法達到這樣的效果那所以您的您很有信心我當然是我們也是希望您的信心是真的可以化為實際但是實際上狀況就不是這樣而且我不曉得部長你有沒有掌握現在有非常多的大的藥廠都發出缺藥通知你知道這個事嗎\n106295\t125118\t我這邊手上就有一堆資料譬如說我們紓壓痰點演藝啊公司就說因廠商停止供應預計115年停止供應然後一大堆很多人都是說因為原物料短缺造成的結果那這個部分到底\n126192\t142198\t部長您有沒有真的去了解問題提出一個比較明確的解決的問題因為這沒有什麼政治性議題這就是一般民生大家要用藥我覺得不要粉飾台針對問題解決問題部長您的解決方式到底是什麼\n142398\t159020\t好 謝謝委員我想謝謝委員關心我們特別是新北市的一個醫藥方面的一個提供新北市的醫藥方面的團體我們都很熟所以大概也都知道他們運作的狀況這是長久的問題\n160121\t186476\t在有些藥 不懂我相信這應該不會只是新北市的狀況因為他的藥來源都是藥商那藥商不可能說北部藥商有這樣的問題然後南部沒這樣的問題 我不相信我覺得應該就是全國的問題是的 所以我兩個部分一個是說一直這幾年來一直發生我們一直在解決讓醫 譬如說處方先拿的能夠順暢的拿這個部分怎麼樣去 這也是有些\n188717\t204886\t應該是這樣 藥變少這是事實就是藥商供應的量變小這是事實不管他是原物料缺少還是說因為藥價關係他不願意投入太多在台灣這個是事實但現在出現還有一個分配的問題就是說最後他到醫院都拿得到但他藥局就是沒有\n205746\t231329\t所以我覺得分配問題你應該也可以去針對這個部分去思考一下你醫院有時候一大堆也不見得大家集資去領嘛可是藥局就沒有那怎麼去調配那個量讓醫院也不要沒有但是讓他有充足的情況之下有比較多餘的可以進入到社區藥局便利我們民眾去領嘛這個不是不能解決第二個是缺藥平台啦因為上次我也有跟你提過\n232150\t258697\t你們都會講說只要有缺藥就可以到缺藥平台去反映可是藥局的心聲就是反映的沒用反映的沒用所以到最後當他覺得這個東西反映沒用之後就不會再去反映了就是這樣就覺得反正也沒有意義所以最後你們這邊的得到訊息就會誤解成說都沒有人來反映都沒有人反映所以一定沒缺藥可是實際上人家是因為反映的沒用所以沒去反映\n259477\t285027\t所以我真的覺得這個衛福部官員跟基層有很大的落差我真的強烈建議因為部長你也是醫師出身嘛您在其實我了解您在那個醫師團體聲望很高啦很多醫生對你很肯定你其實可以多多問看他們的意見不管是醫師團體或是藥師團體一樣到底我講的是不是事實還是你了解的是事實\n285947\t303359\t因為我們兩個的了解有落差沒有 我委員所講的的確是有這種現象那我們一直在改善那要怎麼改善嘛因為這個問題拖很久了江組長來跟議員這邊進一步報告剛才提到的\n304740\t331915\t我非常非常肯定我也知道是現實那我要說明的事情台灣的整個市場小所以我們在藥物舉個例子胰島素這件事情那胰島素面臨的是全世界第一名製廠占比的叫諾和諾的一家它的短效的胰島素等等還有其他的那因為短效胰島素人類胰島素特殊性上面它必須用在關鍵的一般民眾的胰島素\n333476\t355354\t常平時的狀況之下其實是可以替代的可是有些關鍵的地方就需求特別嚴重要進入交互病房裡面昏迷的糖尿病的病患跟酮酸中毒他就必須要用這種的所以我們在做的這樣的情形之下我們要讓最關鍵的人能夠用得到所以我們做的必須要做控制跟控藥\n356314\t371126\t那這個東西在社區一般民眾我今天你會講很長我知道啦其實我的問題很簡單就是我的問題非常簡單你讓需要的人能夠在社區拿到藥那就是這樣該不該做 該嘛\n374468\t389862\t那該嘛 那問題出在哪裡你要把問題找到嘛而不是講一大堆這個藥是怎麼樣要控制說那問題是你就沒有讓人家拿到藥啊謝謝委員這邊委員報告的地方是我們在處方的行為上會決定他拿得到拿不到\n390603\t411138\t所以我們跟整個醫學會上面我反應的是說處方的行為希望他拿得到的部分他還是拿不到比如說眼藥水嘛應該他不是什麼你剛剛講的他要控制要讓特殊的人才能拿到應該不是這個情況但是現在很多病患他跑藥局要去拿眼藥水也拿不到啊\n411838\t430680\t就是你要普遍性的去解決這個缺藥的問題嘛了解我們這個部分一個是真的是缺嘛一個是所謂的平衡的部分能夠讓他的供應鏈能夠穩定這兩部分我們持續在努力如果說我們在這邊一直反映基層的心聲然後你一直講一堆理由我相信這問題沒有辦法解決你應該是說\n433262\t461668\t確實我們應該要讓民眾如果他這個藥是應該在藥局拿得到他就應該要拿得到不過不要因為缺藥的問題讓他拿不到你們是要去解決這件事情然後去跟藥局做一個加強聯繫譬如說你現在的聯繫方式是缺藥平台但缺藥平台現在已經失靈了那怎麼樣再重新讓這些藥局對缺藥平台產生信心用什麼方式讓他覺得說我今天跟政府反映事情是有用的\n462452\t484457\t你現在要建立起政府對於民眾或者是藥局的信心我們現在反映的是這個事情而不是針對署長剛剛提到特定一個藥到底它是為什麼我們要平衡當然那個也是其中之一但是大的方向是你要解決我剛剛講的那兩件事這個我們深刻了解我們會記得因為這個同樣的問題一直在反映\n485492\t514021\t我上次好像有請部長這邊說是不是你說你說會檢討嗎然後說會給我們一個檢討的一個說明嗎我不知道你有做嗎好不然的話同樣的問題就是每次一直在問啊然後然後每次我講的我都覺得部長你很認同啊但是認同都沒有行動啊那總是要行動我們有認同也一直在想要解決所以這個必須要跟這有急迫性啊部長這不是\n516642\t536828\t藥界有它的文化啦又大的藥局又連鎖藥局又小藥局這個強度有時候他們拿到的貨的確可能的確這個不管是一的這個專業配合藥的一個分佈我們的確要坐下來來溝通看看那要多久\n538849\t556786\t國際間我們當然爭取藥進來讓他不要缺藥這也是很重要不要缺藥裡面再來就分配分配的讓他社區的民眾能夠順暢這是一定要做的事情但是這個就是可能又有點變成一種\n558187\t570478\t一種比較business的一個因素在裡面但是為了社區民眾的一個拿藥的方便我想我們會出來來介入來協調\n576242\t592017\t我們就這個部分我們積極辦理跟委員這邊做報告什麼時候再來問你嘛什麼時候會有一個初步的一個構想出來或者是一個做法因為今天的戰略都比較比較高大上很崇高啦但那個戰略\n593458\t601642\t跟實際落差很大跟委員報告一下其實我們想的我們組長整組其實都已經因為我剛剛的問題都已經講完了啦我現在只要一個期程就是什麼時候\n608370\t631558\t大概我大概什麼時候再來問你你可以有一個比較具體的解決的方案跟委員報告他牽涉後續的後面那一段是講很實情的問題都很了解不要再拖時間了要以數個月到半年以上來計才有辦法數個月調控的有點需要有一些時間因為他牽涉到全球不是做法啦什麼時候\n631978\t650192\t做法應該回去就可以拿出來了我們已經都已經有做法跟想法了沒有問題這個我們跟委員們做進一步我們的規劃的報告我想我們一個月內把做法跟委員報告那三個月會提出一個更積極的一個進行的程度這樣OK 好 謝謝\n","txt":"馬上請到那個部長 衛福部長 謝謝委員好那個部長好我相信今天召委排這個專題報告應該就是大家很擔心缺藥的問題嘛特別是美國關稅之後對缺藥問題會不會特別嚴重那我看部長你回答媒體的訪問好像信心滿滿啊所以已經下令要求什麼自計的存量要三個月然後又提出四大策略\n譬如說什麼要強化供應的預警啊什麼要價合理等等四大策略感覺上好像胸有成竹可是其實部長我不知道到底有沒有掌握到實際狀況其實我應該上個月也有在委員會有跟你提有跟你提過在我們\n地方很多病患他們要拿那個處方簽的藥實際上都要跑遍很多藥局那時候舉的是眼藥的例子最近短效胰島素也非常的缺很多病患他是在醫院看病然後拿著處方簽跑遍藥局都買不到短效胰島素最後還是要跑到大醫院\n我覺得這你就失去當時讓大家可以就近到社區藥局領藥的這種便利性現在很多藥已經沒有辦法達到這樣的效果那所以您的您很有信心我當然是我們也是希望您的信心是真的可以化為實際但是實際上狀況就不是這樣而且我不曉得部長你有沒有掌握現在有非常多的大的藥廠都發出缺藥通知你知道這個事嗎\n我這邊手上就有一堆資料譬如說我們紓壓痰點演藝啊公司就說因廠商停止供應預計115年停止供應然後一大堆很多人都是說因為原物料短缺造成的結果那這個部分到底\n部長您有沒有真的去了解問題提出一個比較明確的解決的問題因為這沒有什麼政治性議題這就是一般民生大家要用藥我覺得不要粉飾台針對問題解決問題部長您的解決方式到底是什麼\n好 謝謝委員我想謝謝委員關心我們特別是新北市的一個醫藥方面的一個提供新北市的醫藥方面的團體我們都很熟所以大概也都知道他們運作的狀況這是長久的問題\n在有些藥 不懂我相信這應該不會只是新北市的狀況因為他的藥來源都是藥商那藥商不可能說北部藥商有這樣的問題然後南部沒這樣的問題 我不相信我覺得應該就是全國的問題是的 所以我兩個部分一個是說一直這幾年來一直發生我們一直在解決讓醫 譬如說處方先拿的能夠順暢的拿這個部分怎麼樣去 這也是有些\n應該是這樣 藥變少這是事實就是藥商供應的量變小這是事實不管他是原物料缺少還是說因為藥價關係他不願意投入太多在台灣這個是事實但現在出現還有一個分配的問題就是說最後他到醫院都拿得到但他藥局就是沒有\n所以我覺得分配問題你應該也可以去針對這個部分去思考一下你醫院有時候一大堆也不見得大家集資去領嘛可是藥局就沒有那怎麼去調配那個量讓醫院也不要沒有但是讓他有充足的情況之下有比較多餘的可以進入到社區藥局便利我們民眾去領嘛這個不是不能解決第二個是缺藥平台啦因為上次我也有跟你提過\n你們都會講說只要有缺藥就可以到缺藥平台去反映可是藥局的心聲就是反映的沒用反映的沒用所以到最後當他覺得這個東西反映沒用之後就不會再去反映了就是這樣就覺得反正也沒有意義所以最後你們這邊的得到訊息就會誤解成說都沒有人來反映都沒有人反映所以一定沒缺藥可是實際上人家是因為反映的沒用所以沒去反映\n所以我真的覺得這個衛福部官員跟基層有很大的落差我真的強烈建議因為部長你也是醫師出身嘛您在其實我了解您在那個醫師團體聲望很高啦很多醫生對你很肯定你其實可以多多問看他們的意見不管是醫師團體或是藥師團體一樣到底我講的是不是事實還是你了解的是事實\n因為我們兩個的了解有落差沒有 我委員所講的的確是有這種現象那我們一直在改善那要怎麼改善嘛因為這個問題拖很久了江組長來跟議員這邊進一步報告剛才提到的\n我非常非常肯定我也知道是現實那我要說明的事情台灣的整個市場小所以我們在藥物舉個例子胰島素這件事情那胰島素面臨的是全世界第一名製廠占比的叫諾和諾的一家它的短效的胰島素等等還有其他的那因為短效胰島素人類胰島素特殊性上面它必須用在關鍵的一般民眾的胰島素\n常平時的狀況之下其實是可以替代的可是有些關鍵的地方就需求特別嚴重要進入交互病房裡面昏迷的糖尿病的病患跟酮酸中毒他就必須要用這種的所以我們在做的這樣的情形之下我們要讓最關鍵的人能夠用得到所以我們做的必須要做控制跟控藥\n那這個東西在社區一般民眾我今天你會講很長我知道啦其實我的問題很簡單就是我的問題非常簡單你讓需要的人能夠在社區拿到藥那就是這樣該不該做 該嘛\n那該嘛 那問題出在哪裡你要把問題找到嘛而不是講一大堆這個藥是怎麼樣要控制說那問題是你就沒有讓人家拿到藥啊謝謝委員這邊委員報告的地方是我們在處方的行為上會決定他拿得到拿不到\n所以我們跟整個醫學會上面我反應的是說處方的行為希望他拿得到的部分他還是拿不到比如說眼藥水嘛應該他不是什麼你剛剛講的他要控制要讓特殊的人才能拿到應該不是這個情況但是現在很多病患他跑藥局要去拿眼藥水也拿不到啊\n就是你要普遍性的去解決這個缺藥的問題嘛了解我們這個部分一個是真的是缺嘛一個是所謂的平衡的部分能夠讓他的供應鏈能夠穩定這兩部分我們持續在努力如果說我們在這邊一直反映基層的心聲然後你一直講一堆理由我相信這問題沒有辦法解決你應該是說\n確實我們應該要讓民眾如果他這個藥是應該在藥局拿得到他就應該要拿得到不過不要因為缺藥的問題讓他拿不到你們是要去解決這件事情然後去跟藥局做一個加強聯繫譬如說你現在的聯繫方式是缺藥平台但缺藥平台現在已經失靈了那怎麼樣再重新讓這些藥局對缺藥平台產生信心用什麼方式讓他覺得說我今天跟政府反映事情是有用的\n你現在要建立起政府對於民眾或者是藥局的信心我們現在反映的是這個事情而不是針對署長剛剛提到特定一個藥到底它是為什麼我們要平衡當然那個也是其中之一但是大的方向是你要解決我剛剛講的那兩件事這個我們深刻了解我們會記得因為這個同樣的問題一直在反映\n我上次好像有請部長這邊說是不是你說你說會檢討嗎然後說會給我們一個檢討的一個說明嗎我不知道你有做嗎好不然的話同樣的問題就是每次一直在問啊然後然後每次我講的我都覺得部長你很認同啊但是認同都沒有行動啊那總是要行動我們有認同也一直在想要解決所以這個必須要跟這有急迫性啊部長這不是\n藥界有它的文化啦又大的藥局又連鎖藥局又小藥局這個強度有時候他們拿到的貨的確可能的確這個不管是一的這個專業配合藥的一個分佈我們的確要坐下來來溝通看看那要多久\n國際間我們當然爭取藥進來讓他不要缺藥這也是很重要不要缺藥裡面再來就分配分配的讓他社區的民眾能夠順暢這是一定要做的事情但是這個就是可能又有點變成一種\n一種比較business的一個因素在裡面但是為了社區民眾的一個拿藥的方便我想我們會出來來介入來協調\n我們就這個部分我們積極辦理跟委員這邊做報告什麼時候再來問你嘛什麼時候會有一個初步的一個構想出來或者是一個做法因為今天的戰略都比較比較高大上很崇高啦但那個戰略\n跟實際落差很大跟委員報告一下其實我們想的我們組長整組其實都已經因為我剛剛的問題都已經講完了啦我現在只要一個期程就是什麼時候\n大概我大概什麼時候再來問你你可以有一個比較具體的解決的方案跟委員報告他牽涉後續的後面那一段是講很實情的問題都很了解不要再拖時間了要以數個月到半年以上來計才有辦法數個月調控的有點需要有一些時間因為他牽涉到全球不是做法啦什麼時候\n做法應該回去就可以拿出來了我們已經都已經有做法跟想法了沒有問題這個我們跟委員們做進一步我們的規劃的報告我想我們一個月內把做法跟委員報告那三個月會提出一個更積極的一個進行的程度這樣OK 好 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:10.180 --> 00:37.065\n馬上請到那個部長衛福部長謝謝委員好那個部長好我相信今天召委排這個專題報告應該就是大家很擔心缺藥的問題嘛特別是美國關稅之後對缺藥問題會不會特別嚴重那我看部長你回答媒體的訪問好像信心滿滿啊所以已經下令要求什麼自計的存量要三個月然後又提出四大策略\n\n00:38.005 --> 00:53.461\n譬如說什麼要強化供應的預警啊什麼要價合理等等四大策略感覺上好像胸有成竹可是其實部長我不知道到底有沒有掌握到實際狀況其實我應該上個月也有在委員會有跟你提有跟你提過在我們\n\n00:54.302 --> 01:18.448\n地方很多病患他們要拿那個處方簽的藥實際上都要跑遍很多藥局那時候舉的是眼藥的例子最近短效胰島素也非常的缺很多病患他是在醫院看病然後拿著處方簽跑遍藥局都買不到短效胰島素最後還是要跑到大醫院\n\n01:19.068 --> 01:45.435\n我覺得這你就失去當時讓大家可以就近到社區藥局領藥的這種便利性現在很多藥已經沒有辦法達到這樣的效果那所以您的您很有信心我當然是我們也是希望您的信心是真的可以化為實際但是實際上狀況就不是這樣而且我不曉得部長你有沒有掌握現在有非常多的大的藥廠都發出缺藥通知你知道這個事嗎\n\n01:46.295 --> 02:05.118\n我這邊手上就有一堆資料譬如說我們紓壓痰點演藝啊公司就說因廠商停止供應預計115年停止供應然後一大堆很多人都是說因為原物料短缺造成的結果那這個部分到底\n\n02:06.192 --> 02:22.198\n部長您有沒有真的去了解問題提出一個比較明確的解決的問題因為這沒有什麼政治性議題這就是一般民生大家要用藥我覺得不要粉飾台針對問題解決問題部長您的解決方式到底是什麼\n\n02:22.398 --> 02:39.020\n好謝謝委員我想謝謝委員關心我們特別是新北市的一個醫藥方面的一個提供新北市的醫藥方面的團體我們都很熟所以大概也都知道他們運作的狀況這是長久的問題\n\n02:40.121 --> 03:06.476\n在有些藥不懂我相信這應該不會只是新北市的狀況因為他的藥來源都是藥商那藥商不可能說北部藥商有這樣的問題然後南部沒這樣的問題我不相信我覺得應該就是全國的問題是的所以我兩個部分一個是說一直這幾年來一直發生我們一直在解決讓醫譬如說處方先拿的能夠順暢的拿這個部分怎麼樣去這也是有些\n\n03:08.717 --> 03:24.886\n應該是這樣藥變少這是事實就是藥商供應的量變小這是事實不管他是原物料缺少還是說因為藥價關係他不願意投入太多在台灣這個是事實但現在出現還有一個分配的問題就是說最後他到醫院都拿得到但他藥局就是沒有\n\n03:25.746 --> 03:51.329\n所以我覺得分配問題你應該也可以去針對這個部分去思考一下你醫院有時候一大堆也不見得大家集資去領嘛可是藥局就沒有那怎麼去調配那個量讓醫院也不要沒有但是讓他有充足的情況之下有比較多餘的可以進入到社區藥局便利我們民眾去領嘛這個不是不能解決第二個是缺藥平台啦因為上次我也有跟你提過\n\n03:52.150 --> 04:18.697\n你們都會講說只要有缺藥就可以到缺藥平台去反映可是藥局的心聲就是反映的沒用反映的沒用所以到最後當他覺得這個東西反映沒用之後就不會再去反映了就是這樣就覺得反正也沒有意義所以最後你們這邊的得到訊息就會誤解成說都沒有人來反映都沒有人反映所以一定沒缺藥可是實際上人家是因為反映的沒用所以沒去反映\n\n04:19.477 --> 04:45.027\n所以我真的覺得這個衛福部官員跟基層有很大的落差我真的強烈建議因為部長你也是醫師出身嘛您在其實我了解您在那個醫師團體聲望很高啦很多醫生對你很肯定你其實可以多多問看他們的意見不管是醫師團體或是藥師團體一樣到底我講的是不是事實還是你了解的是事實\n\n04:45.947 --> 05:03.359\n因為我們兩個的了解有落差沒有我委員所講的的確是有這種現象那我們一直在改善那要怎麼改善嘛因為這個問題拖很久了江組長來跟議員這邊進一步報告剛才提到的\n\n05:04.740 --> 05:31.915\n我非常非常肯定我也知道是現實那我要說明的事情台灣的整個市場小所以我們在藥物舉個例子胰島素這件事情那胰島素面臨的是全世界第一名製廠占比的叫諾和諾的一家它的短效的胰島素等等還有其他的那因為短效胰島素人類胰島素特殊性上面它必須用在關鍵的一般民眾的胰島素\n\n05:33.476 --> 05:55.354\n常平時的狀況之下其實是可以替代的可是有些關鍵的地方就需求特別嚴重要進入交互病房裡面昏迷的糖尿病的病患跟酮酸中毒他就必須要用這種的所以我們在做的這樣的情形之下我們要讓最關鍵的人能夠用得到所以我們做的必須要做控制跟控藥\n\n05:56.314 --> 06:11.126\n那這個東西在社區一般民眾我今天你會講很長我知道啦其實我的問題很簡單就是我的問題非常簡單你讓需要的人能夠在社區拿到藥那就是這樣該不該做該嘛\n\n06:14.468 --> 06:29.862\n那該嘛那問題出在哪裡你要把問題找到嘛而不是講一大堆這個藥是怎麼樣要控制說那問題是你就沒有讓人家拿到藥啊謝謝委員這邊委員報告的地方是我們在處方的行為上會決定他拿得到拿不到\n\n06:30.603 --> 06:51.138\n所以我們跟整個醫學會上面我反應的是說處方的行為希望他拿得到的部分他還是拿不到比如說眼藥水嘛應該他不是什麼你剛剛講的他要控制要讓特殊的人才能拿到應該不是這個情況但是現在很多病患他跑藥局要去拿眼藥水也拿不到啊\n\n06:51.838 --> 07:10.680\n就是你要普遍性的去解決這個缺藥的問題嘛了解我們這個部分一個是真的是缺嘛一個是所謂的平衡的部分能夠讓他的供應鏈能夠穩定這兩部分我們持續在努力如果說我們在這邊一直反映基層的心聲然後你一直講一堆理由我相信這問題沒有辦法解決你應該是說\n\n07:13.262 --> 07:41.668\n確實我們應該要讓民眾如果他這個藥是應該在藥局拿得到他就應該要拿得到不過不要因為缺藥的問題讓他拿不到你們是要去解決這件事情然後去跟藥局做一個加強聯繫譬如說你現在的聯繫方式是缺藥平台但缺藥平台現在已經失靈了那怎麼樣再重新讓這些藥局對缺藥平台產生信心用什麼方式讓他覺得說我今天跟政府反映事情是有用的\n\n07:42.452 --> 08:04.457\n你現在要建立起政府對於民眾或者是藥局的信心我們現在反映的是這個事情而不是針對署長剛剛提到特定一個藥到底它是為什麼我們要平衡當然那個也是其中之一但是大的方向是你要解決我剛剛講的那兩件事這個我們深刻了解我們會記得因為這個同樣的問題一直在反映\n\n08:05.492 --> 08:34.021\n我上次好像有請部長這邊說是不是你說你說會檢討嗎然後說會給我們一個檢討的一個說明嗎我不知道你有做嗎好不然的話同樣的問題就是每次一直在問啊然後然後每次我講的我都覺得部長你很認同啊但是認同都沒有行動啊那總是要行動我們有認同也一直在想要解決所以這個必須要跟這有急迫性啊部長這不是\n\n08:36.642 --> 08:56.828\n藥界有它的文化啦又大的藥局又連鎖藥局又小藥局這個強度有時候他們拿到的貨的確可能的確這個不管是一的這個專業配合藥的一個分佈我們的確要坐下來來溝通看看那要多久\n\n08:58.849 --> 09:16.786\n國際間我們當然爭取藥進來讓他不要缺藥這也是很重要不要缺藥裡面再來就分配分配的讓他社區的民眾能夠順暢這是一定要做的事情但是這個就是可能又有點變成一種\n\n09:18.187 --> 09:30.478\n一種比較business的一個因素在裡面但是為了社區民眾的一個拿藥的方便我想我們會出來來介入來協調\n\n09:36.242 --> 09:52.017\n我們就這個部分我們積極辦理跟委員這邊做報告什麼時候再來問你嘛什麼時候會有一個初步的一個構想出來或者是一個做法因為今天的戰略都比較比較高大上很崇高啦但那個戰略\n\n09:53.458 --> 10:01.642\n跟實際落差很大跟委員報告一下其實我們想的我們組長整組其實都已經因為我剛剛的問題都已經講完了啦我現在只要一個期程就是什麼時候\n\n10:08.370 --> 10:31.558\n大概我大概什麼時候再來問你你可以有一個比較具體的解決的方案跟委員報告他牽涉後續的後面那一段是講很實情的問題都很了解不要再拖時間了要以數個月到半年以上來計才有辦法數個月調控的有點需要有一些時間因為他牽涉到全球不是做法啦什麼時候\n\n10:31.978 --> 10:50.192\n做法應該回去就可以拿出來了我們已經都已經有做法跟想法了沒有問題這個我們跟委員們做進一步我們的規劃的報告我想我們一個月內把做法跟委員報告那三個月會提出一個更積極的一個進行的程度這樣OK好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":10.18,"end":37.065,"text":"馬上請到那個部長 衛福部長 謝謝委員好那個部長好我相信今天召委排這個專題報告應該就是大家很擔心缺藥的問題嘛特別是美國關稅之後對缺藥問題會不會特別嚴重那我看部長你回答媒體的訪問好像信心滿滿啊所以已經下令要求什麼自計的存量要三個月然後又提出四大策略"},{"start":38.005,"end":53.461,"text":"譬如說什麼要強化供應的預警啊什麼要價合理等等四大策略感覺上好像胸有成竹可是其實部長我不知道到底有沒有掌握到實際狀況其實我應該上個月也有在委員會有跟你提有跟你提過在我們"},{"start":54.302,"end":78.448,"text":"地方很多病患他們要拿那個處方簽的藥實際上都要跑遍很多藥局那時候舉的是眼藥的例子最近短效胰島素也非常的缺很多病患他是在醫院看病然後拿著處方簽跑遍藥局都買不到短效胰島素最後還是要跑到大醫院"},{"start":79.068,"end":105.435,"text":"我覺得這你就失去當時讓大家可以就近到社區藥局領藥的這種便利性現在很多藥已經沒有辦法達到這樣的效果那所以您的您很有信心我當然是我們也是希望您的信心是真的可以化為實際但是實際上狀況就不是這樣而且我不曉得部長你有沒有掌握現在有非常多的大的藥廠都發出缺藥通知你知道這個事嗎"},{"start":106.295,"end":125.118,"text":"我這邊手上就有一堆資料譬如說我們紓壓痰點演藝啊公司就說因廠商停止供應預計115年停止供應然後一大堆很多人都是說因為原物料短缺造成的結果那這個部分到底"},{"start":126.192,"end":142.198,"text":"部長您有沒有真的去了解問題提出一個比較明確的解決的問題因為這沒有什麼政治性議題這就是一般民生大家要用藥我覺得不要粉飾台針對問題解決問題部長您的解決方式到底是什麼"},{"start":142.398,"end":159.02,"text":"好 謝謝委員我想謝謝委員關心我們特別是新北市的一個醫藥方面的一個提供新北市的醫藥方面的團體我們都很熟所以大概也都知道他們運作的狀況這是長久的問題"},{"start":160.121,"end":186.476,"text":"在有些藥 不懂我相信這應該不會只是新北市的狀況因為他的藥來源都是藥商那藥商不可能說北部藥商有這樣的問題然後南部沒這樣的問題 我不相信我覺得應該就是全國的問題是的 所以我兩個部分一個是說一直這幾年來一直發生我們一直在解決讓醫 譬如說處方先拿的能夠順暢的拿這個部分怎麼樣去 這也是有些"},{"start":188.717,"end":204.886,"text":"應該是這樣 藥變少這是事實就是藥商供應的量變小這是事實不管他是原物料缺少還是說因為藥價關係他不願意投入太多在台灣這個是事實但現在出現還有一個分配的問題就是說最後他到醫院都拿得到但他藥局就是沒有"},{"start":205.746,"end":231.329,"text":"所以我覺得分配問題你應該也可以去針對這個部分去思考一下你醫院有時候一大堆也不見得大家集資去領嘛可是藥局就沒有那怎麼去調配那個量讓醫院也不要沒有但是讓他有充足的情況之下有比較多餘的可以進入到社區藥局便利我們民眾去領嘛這個不是不能解決第二個是缺藥平台啦因為上次我也有跟你提過"},{"start":232.15,"end":258.697,"text":"你們都會講說只要有缺藥就可以到缺藥平台去反映可是藥局的心聲就是反映的沒用反映的沒用所以到最後當他覺得這個東西反映沒用之後就不會再去反映了就是這樣就覺得反正也沒有意義所以最後你們這邊的得到訊息就會誤解成說都沒有人來反映都沒有人反映所以一定沒缺藥可是實際上人家是因為反映的沒用所以沒去反映"},{"start":259.477,"end":285.027,"text":"所以我真的覺得這個衛福部官員跟基層有很大的落差我真的強烈建議因為部長你也是醫師出身嘛您在其實我了解您在那個醫師團體聲望很高啦很多醫生對你很肯定你其實可以多多問看他們的意見不管是醫師團體或是藥師團體一樣到底我講的是不是事實還是你了解的是事實"},{"start":285.947,"end":303.359,"text":"因為我們兩個的了解有落差沒有 我委員所講的的確是有這種現象那我們一直在改善那要怎麼改善嘛因為這個問題拖很久了江組長來跟議員這邊進一步報告剛才提到的"},{"start":304.74,"end":331.915,"text":"我非常非常肯定我也知道是現實那我要說明的事情台灣的整個市場小所以我們在藥物舉個例子胰島素這件事情那胰島素面臨的是全世界第一名製廠占比的叫諾和諾的一家它的短效的胰島素等等還有其他的那因為短效胰島素人類胰島素特殊性上面它必須用在關鍵的一般民眾的胰島素"},{"start":333.476,"end":355.354,"text":"常平時的狀況之下其實是可以替代的可是有些關鍵的地方就需求特別嚴重要進入交互病房裡面昏迷的糖尿病的病患跟酮酸中毒他就必須要用這種的所以我們在做的這樣的情形之下我們要讓最關鍵的人能夠用得到所以我們做的必須要做控制跟控藥"},{"start":356.314,"end":371.126,"text":"那這個東西在社區一般民眾我今天你會講很長我知道啦其實我的問題很簡單就是我的問題非常簡單你讓需要的人能夠在社區拿到藥那就是這樣該不該做 該嘛"},{"start":374.468,"end":389.862,"text":"那該嘛 那問題出在哪裡你要把問題找到嘛而不是講一大堆這個藥是怎麼樣要控制說那問題是你就沒有讓人家拿到藥啊謝謝委員這邊委員報告的地方是我們在處方的行為上會決定他拿得到拿不到"},{"start":390.603,"end":411.138,"text":"所以我們跟整個醫學會上面我反應的是說處方的行為希望他拿得到的部分他還是拿不到比如說眼藥水嘛應該他不是什麼你剛剛講的他要控制要讓特殊的人才能拿到應該不是這個情況但是現在很多病患他跑藥局要去拿眼藥水也拿不到啊"},{"start":411.838,"end":430.68,"text":"就是你要普遍性的去解決這個缺藥的問題嘛了解我們這個部分一個是真的是缺嘛一個是所謂的平衡的部分能夠讓他的供應鏈能夠穩定這兩部分我們持續在努力如果說我們在這邊一直反映基層的心聲然後你一直講一堆理由我相信這問題沒有辦法解決你應該是說"},{"start":433.262,"end":461.668,"text":"確實我們應該要讓民眾如果他這個藥是應該在藥局拿得到他就應該要拿得到不過不要因為缺藥的問題讓他拿不到你們是要去解決這件事情然後去跟藥局做一個加強聯繫譬如說你現在的聯繫方式是缺藥平台但缺藥平台現在已經失靈了那怎麼樣再重新讓這些藥局對缺藥平台產生信心用什麼方式讓他覺得說我今天跟政府反映事情是有用的"},{"start":462.452,"end":484.457,"text":"你現在要建立起政府對於民眾或者是藥局的信心我們現在反映的是這個事情而不是針對署長剛剛提到特定一個藥到底它是為什麼我們要平衡當然那個也是其中之一但是大的方向是你要解決我剛剛講的那兩件事這個我們深刻了解我們會記得因為這個同樣的問題一直在反映"},{"start":485.492,"end":514.021,"text":"我上次好像有請部長這邊說是不是你說你說會檢討嗎然後說會給我們一個檢討的一個說明嗎我不知道你有做嗎好不然的話同樣的問題就是每次一直在問啊然後然後每次我講的我都覺得部長你很認同啊但是認同都沒有行動啊那總是要行動我們有認同也一直在想要解決所以這個必須要跟這有急迫性啊部長這不是"},{"start":516.642,"end":536.828,"text":"藥界有它的文化啦又大的藥局又連鎖藥局又小藥局這個強度有時候他們拿到的貨的確可能的確這個不管是一的這個專業配合藥的一個分佈我們的確要坐下來來溝通看看那要多久"},{"start":538.849,"end":556.786,"text":"國際間我們當然爭取藥進來讓他不要缺藥這也是很重要不要缺藥裡面再來就分配分配的讓他社區的民眾能夠順暢這是一定要做的事情但是這個就是可能又有點變成一種"},{"start":558.187,"end":570.478,"text":"一種比較business的一個因素在裡面但是為了社區民眾的一個拿藥的方便我想我們會出來來介入來協調"},{"start":576.242,"end":592.017,"text":"我們就這個部分我們積極辦理跟委員這邊做報告什麼時候再來問你嘛什麼時候會有一個初步的一個構想出來或者是一個做法因為今天的戰略都比較比較高大上很崇高啦但那個戰略"},{"start":593.458,"end":601.642,"text":"跟實際落差很大跟委員報告一下其實我們想的我們組長整組其實都已經因為我剛剛的問題都已經講完了啦我現在只要一個期程就是什麼時候"},{"start":608.37,"end":631.558,"text":"大概我大概什麼時候再來問你你可以有一個比較具體的解決的方案跟委員報告他牽涉後續的後面那一段是講很實情的問題都很了解不要再拖時間了要以數個月到半年以上來計才有辦法數個月調控的有點需要有一些時間因為他牽涉到全球不是做法啦什麼時候"},{"start":631.978,"end":650.192,"text":"做法應該回去就可以拿出來了我們已經都已經有做法跟想法了沒有問題這個我們跟委員們做進一步我們的規劃的報告我想我們一個月內把做法跟委員報告那三個月會提出一個更積極的一個進行的程度這樣OK 好 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":773,"blocks":[["葉委員元之：（12時7分）麻煩請衛福部長，謝謝。"],["主席：部長請。"],["邱部長泰源：委員好！"],["葉委員元之：部長好。我相信今天召委排這個專題報告應該就是大家很擔心缺藥的問題，特別是在美國實施對等關稅之後，對缺藥問題來說會不會特別嚴重，我看部長你回答媒體的訪問好像信心滿滿，說已經下令要求製劑的存量要3個月，然後又提出四大策略，譬如說要強化供應的預警啊！什麼藥價合理等等四大策略，感覺上好像胸有成竹，可是我不知道部長到底有沒有掌握到實際狀況，其實我應該是上個月也有在委員會跟你提過。"],["邱部長泰源：有，是。"],["葉委員元之：在我們地方有很多病患他們要拿處方箋的藥，實際上都要跑遍很多藥局，那個時候我舉的是眼藥的例子，最近短效胰島素也非常地缺，很多病患他是在醫院看病，然後拿了處方箋跑遍藥局都買不到短效胰島素，最後還是要跑到大醫院，我覺得這就失去當時讓大家可以就近到社區藥局領藥的便利性，現在很多藥已經沒有辦法達到這樣的效果，所以您很有信心，我們也是希望你的信心是真的可以化為實際啦！但是實際上狀況就不是這樣，而且我不曉得部長你有沒有掌握，現在有非常多的大藥廠都發出缺藥通知耶！你知道這件事嗎？"],["邱部長泰源：是。"],["葉委員元之：我這邊手上就有一堆資料，譬如說舒壓坦點眼液，公司就說因廠商停止供應，預計115年停止供應，然後一大堆！很多人都是說因為原物料短缺造成的結果，這個部分到底部長您有沒有真的去瞭解問題，提出一個比較明確的解決方式？因為這沒有什麼政治性議題，這就是一般民生大家要用藥，我覺得不要粉飾太平啦！針對問題解決問題，部長，您的解決方式到底是什麼？"],["邱部長泰源：好，謝謝委員。謝謝委員關心我們特別是新北市醫藥方面的提供，新北市醫藥方面的團體我們都很熟，所以大概也都知道他們運作的狀況，這是長久的問題，有些藥……"],["葉委員元之：部長，我相信這應該不會只是新北市的狀況，因為它藥的來源都是藥商嘛！那藥商不可能說北部藥商有這樣的問題，然後南部沒這樣的問題，我不相信耶！我覺得這應該是全國的問題。"],["邱部長泰源：是的，所以有兩個部分，一個是說這幾年來一直發生，我們一直在解決，譬如說處方箋拿了能夠順暢地拿藥，這個部分也是有些……"],["葉委員元之：問題應該是這樣，藥變少是事實嘛！就是藥商供應的量變小，這是事實嘛！不管他是原物料缺少，還是因為藥價的關係所以他不願意投入太多在臺灣，這個是事實，但是現在還有出現一個分配的問題，就是說最後他到醫院都拿得到，但是他在藥局就是沒有，所以我覺得分配問題你應該也可以針對這個部分去思考一下，你醫院有時候一大堆，也不見得大家都即時去領嘛！可是藥局就是沒有，所以怎麼去調配那個量，讓醫院也不要沒有，但是讓它在充足的情況之下，有比較多餘的可以進入到社區藥局，便利我們民眾去領嘛！這個不是不能解決。","第二個是缺藥平臺，因為上次我也有跟你提過，你們都會講說只要有缺藥就可以到缺藥平臺去反映，可是藥局的心聲就是反映了沒用，所以到最後當它覺得這個東西反映沒用之後就不會再去反映了，就是這樣啊！就覺得反正也沒有意義啊！所以最後你們這邊得到的訊息就會誤解成都沒有人來反映啊！都沒有人來反映，所以一定沒缺藥，可是實際上人家是因為反映了沒用所以沒去反映，所以我真的覺得衛福部官員與基層有很大的落差。","我真的強烈建議，因為部長您也是醫師出身，我瞭解您在醫師團體的聲望很高啦！很多醫生對你很肯定，你其實可以多多問問看他們的意見，不管是醫師團體或者是藥師團體，一樣，到底我講的是不是事實？還是你瞭解的是事實？因為我們兩個的瞭解有落差。"],["邱部長泰源：沒有、沒有，委員所講的，的確是有這種現象，我們一直在改善。"],["葉委員元之：那要怎麼改善嘛？因為這個問題拖很久了。"],["邱部長泰源：這個部分請姜署長來說明。"],["葉委員元之：是。"],["姜署長至剛：跟葉委員進一步報告，剛才提到的，我非常非常肯定，我也知道是現實。我要說明的事情是，臺灣整個的市場小，所以我們在藥物的部分，舉一個例子，像胰島素這件事情，胰島素全世界第一名製產占比的是「諾和諾德」這一家，它有生產短效胰島素等等，還有其它的。因為短效胰島素、人類胰島素的特殊性，它必須用在關鍵的時候，一般民眾的胰島素在長平持的狀況之下其實是可以替代的，可是在一些關鍵的時候，譬如說特別嚴重要進入加護病房裡面、昏迷的糖尿病病患跟酮酸中毒，他就必須要用這種的，在這樣的情形之下，我們要讓最關鍵的人能夠用得到，所以我們必須要做控制跟控藥。這個東西在社區一般民眾還有醫師的使用……"],["葉委員元之：署長，我跟你講，我知道你會講很長啦！"],["姜署長至剛：沒有，我現在……"],["葉委員元之：其實我的問題很簡單，我的問題非常簡單，你讓需要的人能夠在社區拿得到藥，就是這樣，那該不該做？該嘛！至於問題出在哪裡，你要把問題找到嘛！而不是講一大堆，說這個藥是怎麼樣、要控制，問題是你就沒有讓人家拿到藥啊！"],["姜署長至剛：謝謝委員，在這邊要跟委員報告的是，我們在處方的行為上會決定他拿得到、拿不到，所以我們跟整個醫學會溝通，有辦法讓他們那邊拿到。"],["葉委員元之：我反映的是說，處方的行為希望他拿得到的部分，他還是拿不到，好不好？"],["姜署長至剛：對，我就是說……"],["葉委員元之：比如說眼藥水，它應該不是你剛剛講的，它要控制，要讓特殊的人才能拿到，應該不是這個情況，但是現在很多的病患跑藥局要去拿眼藥水也拿不到啊！你要普遍性地去解決這個缺藥的問題嘛！"],["姜署長至剛：瞭解，就這個部分，一個是真的缺嘛！"],["葉委員元之：對嘛！"],["姜署長至剛：一個是所謂的平衡部分，讓它的供應鏈能夠穩定，這兩個部分我們持續在努力。"],["葉委員元之：如果說我們在這邊反映基層的心聲，然後你一直講一堆理由，我相信這個問題就沒有辦法解決。"],["姜署長至剛：這個我們……"],["葉委員元之：你應該是說，確實我們應該要讓民眾……如果他這個藥應該在藥局拿得到，他就應該要拿得到，不要因為缺藥的問題而讓他拿不到，你們是要去解決這件事情，然後去跟藥局加強聯繫，譬如說你現在的聯繫方式是缺藥平臺，但是缺藥平臺現在已經失靈了，怎麼樣再重新讓這些藥局對缺藥平臺產生信心，用什麼方式讓它覺得我今天跟政府反映事情是有用的，你現在要建立起民眾或者是藥局對於政府的信心，我們現在反映的是這件事情，而不是針對署長剛剛提到特定一個藥到底它是為什麼、我們要平衡等等，當然那個也是其中之一，但是大的方向是你要解決我剛剛講的那兩件事啊！"],["姜署長至剛：這個我們深刻瞭解，我們會進一步地努力。"],["葉委員元之：對，因為同樣的問題一直在反映，我上次好像有請部長這邊，你說會檢討嘛！然後會給我們一個檢討的說明，你有做嗎？"],["邱部長泰源：好，呃……"],["葉委員元之：不然的話，同樣的問題就是每次一直在問啊！然後每次我講的我都覺得部長你很認同，但是只有認同，都沒有行動啊！總是要有行動。"],["邱部長泰源：我們有認同，也一直想要解決，所以這個必須要跟……"],["葉委員元之：這有急迫性啦！部長，這個不是等你想到政黨輪替，來不及啦！"],["邱部長泰源：因為藥界有它的文化啦！有大的藥局，也有連鎖藥局，也有小藥局，所以這個強度，有時候他們拿到的貨的確可能……不管是醫的專業配合藥的分布，我們的確要坐下來溝通，看看怎麼樣……"],["葉委員元之：好，那要多久？你要多久？"],["邱部長泰源：國際間我們當然是爭取藥進來，讓它不要缺藥，這也是很重要。除了不要缺藥，再來就是分配，分配了讓它均勻，讓社區的民眾拿藥能夠順暢，這是一定要做的事情。"],["葉委員元之：對，那要多久？"],["邱部長泰源：但是這個可能又有點變成一種比較business的因素在裡面，但是為了社區民眾拿藥方便，我想我們會來介入、來協調，請食藥署……"],["姜署長至剛：我們就這個部分會積極辦理，跟委員這邊做報告。"],["邱部長泰源：然後再跟委員報告。"],["葉委員元之：那要等到什麼時候再來問你？什麼時候會有一個初步的構想出來，或者是提出一個做法？"],["姜署長至剛：我們其實是有構想。"],["葉委員元之：因為今天的戰略都比較高大上，很崇高啦！但是那個戰略跟實際的落差很大。"],["姜署長至剛：跟委員報告一下，其實我們想的，我們署長整組都已經有在做，正在溝通。"],["葉委員元之：好，沒關係，因為我剛剛的問題都已經講完了，我現在只要一個期程，大概什麼時候？"],["姜署長至剛：我們可能在……"],["葉委員元之：大概什麼時候再來問你，你可以有一個比較具體的解決方案？"],["姜署長至剛：跟委員報告，它牽涉到後續的，後面那一段就講了，很實際的是有一些韌性……"],["葉委員元之：好，沒關係，你給一個時程，我已經都很瞭解了，不要再拖時間了。"],["姜署長至剛：我覺得至少要數個月到半年以上才有辦法。"],["葉委員元之：數個月？"],["姜署長至剛：因為時程調控需要有一些時間，因為它牽涉到全球就沒有……"],["葉委員元之：不是，做法啦！什麼時候會有一個做法出來？不是說什麼時候……"],["姜署長至剛：喔！做法，做法應該回去就可以拿出來了，我們都已經有做法和想法了，沒有問題，這個我們可以跟委員們做進一步的規劃報告。"],["邱部長泰源：我想我們1個月內把做法跟委員報告。"],["葉委員元之：好。"],["邱部長泰源：3個月會提出一個更積極的進行程度。"],["葉委員元之：OK，好，謝謝。"],["邱部長泰源：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝葉委員，謝謝部長。","繼續請陳瑩委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":328,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-26-24","speakers":["蘇清泉","陳昭姿","林月琴","陳菁徽","邱鎮軍","王育敏","廖偉翔","盧縣一","林淑芬","黃秀芳","王正旭","葉元之","陳瑩","劉建國","楊曜","涂權吉"],"page_start":267,"meetingDate":["2025-08-14"],"gazette_id":"1147202","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1147202_00007"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第24次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請衛生福利部、經濟部、財政部就「美國針對進口藥品、原料藥課稅對我國產業造成影響」進\n行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1147202_00006"}}}