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\"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"陳\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 955.038, \"end\": 955.058, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:04,170 --> 00:00:10,924\n謝謝副院長我們請卓院長還有副院長還有鄭副院長請備詢\n\n2\n00:00:21,278 --> 00:00:48,880\n陳國元好院長好副院長好大家辛苦了其實我們整個談判團隊真的很用心很努力其實我們看到美國的態度所有的國家每一個世界各國其實都面臨了很大的壓力所以我相信你們在前線在做這樣的一個談判壓力也非常的大因為你們帶著所有台灣人民的期待\n\n3\n00:00:49,540 --> 00:01:06,015\n可是我們又要保護我們自己的產業又要把我們產業的根留在台灣所以真的是很辛苦可是因為我們在談判的過程當中資訊回到台灣是很複雜的\n\n4\n00:01:07,276 --> 00:01:35,252\n所以有很多不同階段的訊息而造成了我們台灣自己本身產業有很多誤解所以其實我光用這個所謂關稅疊不疊加的問題我想這個應該是最近我們的媒體當中其實最多論述最多討論的但是我覺得有必要把它一次澄清\n\n5\n00:01:36,192 --> 00:01:59,876\n其實如果依照關稅疊加的部分我找了所有的資料我沒有詢問你們我自己找資料我發現如果以美國官方公布的其實關稅不疊加的只有歐盟各國其他就算我們在談的日本他也還在協議當中並沒有正式對外公布\n\n6\n00:02:01,162 --> 00:02:21,978\n我們台灣是在努力當中所有的國家也都在努力當中所以為什麼有人就用所謂的我們在騙基本上我們關稅要疊加我們還說20%我們沒有騙我們要先把這個基底談好\n\n7\n00:02:23,001 --> 00:02:38,448\n那關稅疊加是每個國家都這樣並不是只有台灣是只有歐盟沒有是所有的國家都面臨現在這個狀況可是你這個基底還沒有談好\n\n8\n00:02:39,485 --> 00:02:56,074\n你怎麼再說下一步所以我覺得這個部分應該要先釐清讓所有台灣人民知道而不是不同的訊息不同的民意代表所說的會讓人家誤解副院長是不是\n\n9\n00:02:56,554 --> 00:03:15,606\n是委員的觀察完全的正確因為美國對各國本來就有它的MFN也就是原稅率那台灣自然也在原稅率的對象裡面只有洽簽雙邊協議有FTA的國家他們就沒有原稅率有些品項沒有\n\n10\n00:03:16,286 --> 00:03:30,371\n那的確在所有達成協議的國家裡面目前看到的是歐盟在最終達成協議談判最終稅率的時候那麼歐盟有不疊加MFN原稅率來這樣的做最終的稅率的這個決定\n\n11\n00:03:31,491 --> 00:03:54,749\n那日本有表達去爭取但目前的確也要帶美方來證實最後的這個結果那台灣因為我們還在談判中我們現在取得的20%加上MA分是從32降下來是一個階段性的一個結果那我們持續談判等到我們在談最終稅率的時候我想最終就會來決定要不要\n\n12\n00:03:55,269 --> 00:04:11,549\n再加上MFN不過可以跟委員報告的是說我們最近三次的視訊會議當中我們已經表達希望爭取不要疊加MFN這也是我方的立場我們會積極努力來爭取所以我們到目前為止我們的態度都沒改變\n\n13\n00:04:12,964 --> 00:04:34,885\n我想從卓院長對外也是說我們現在在努力中啊我們當然要努力不疊加嘛這是我們的方向所以我覺得我們應該要對外把這樣的一個定調而不是說哇因為不同的立場然後好像在唱衰我們這一個整個談判的過程我覺得真的是不好的\n\n14\n00:04:35,385 --> 00:04:55,025\n因為當你在做政治口水的時候基本上也會傷害到我們的產業也會讓我們的產業沒有信心我們前線在努力所有的談判團隊每天我們的視訊會議我們整個包括他給我們的時間我們要一直等待\n\n15\n00:04:55,706 --> 00:05:15,512\n大家是這樣子繃緊神經我就是要給大家鼓勵的所以這個部分我覺得因為我明明所看到的資訊跟媒體當中的資訊其實是有很大落差我覺得應該趁這個機會讓我們的卓院長跟鄭副院長把它表達清楚\n\n16\n00:05:16,112 --> 00:05:44,738\n非常感謝委員一句話您的這番話對行政團隊尤其對談判團隊是正面的非常大的一個鼓勵當我們在談判的時候我們如果想到我們的國人是希望我們去爭取更好的而不是一直說我們是在欺騙國人這個對談判團隊的心理素質是影響很大更何況如果我們的對手看我們國內是這種狀況的話他會覺得跟我們談判他可能會得到更多我們現在還沒有辦法跟他談的過程\n\n17\n00:05:45,154 --> 00:06:05,724\n所以謝謝委員這樣正向的一個鼓勵我們會珍惜但是我們會利用這樣的鼓勵我們請談判團隊據理力爭為國家爭取最大利益一定要加油啦因為我也不能接受用欺騙兩個字因為我們在前線有很多真的還沒有到談判的結果我們不能公佈啊\n\n18\n00:06:07,577 --> 00:06:30,588\n你來我往的過程當中每一個都是機密每一個都是重點那當然我們知道我們要保護我們的產業我們一定要保護我們自己能夠保護的最後一個底線談判代表比誰都知道所以我覺得真的今天會利用這個時間去把這個疊加的部分因為\n\n19\n00:06:31,550 --> 00:06:46,615\n我覺得很難過啦因為我們也不能替你們說話我們就希望說能夠用這樣的訊息我自己去找的我說奇怪明明在美國官方網站真的沒有疊加的就一個歐盟各國\n\n20\n00:06:47,515 --> 00:07:13,856\n那為什麼還不斷的用這樣子的一個言語然後呢來傷害我們的談判團隊這是我覺得我不捨的地方那第二個部分就是說其實我們目前為止說真的放無薪假的確實有這個不能說沒有那無薪假的部分就是因為有太多的不確定性\n\n21\n00:07:15,373 --> 00:07:40,991\n他害怕所以我一直在談的是我們擔任民意代表我們更應該是要讓產業有信心不能用錯誤的訊息或是懷疑猜疑的訊息而讓產業更沒有信心所以我們現在放無薪假我也知道我們行政院有要求我們勞動部一定要積極主動去了解原因是勞動部主動訪視\n\n22\n00:07:42,634 --> 00:08:00,010\n對但是呢因為說真的我們在基層有聽到大家的壓力是因為我們的匯率沒有穩定到底未來會不會隨時有做調整所以他們都會擔心我多接了一張單我可能會\n\n23\n00:08:02,165 --> 00:08:22,534\n因為這樣而損失一張單就是在這個賺的價差的當中所以這個怎麼讓大家穩定信心這個很重要所以我覺得他們現在都覺得說我乾脆現在先按兵不動也是現在無薪假的原因我先按兵不動\n\n24\n00:08:23,334 --> 00:08:41,944\n我來了解整個局勢變化之後我再進一步所以這個都是他們內心的不穩定跟擔心所以這個也跟我們勞動部長說明一下這個無薪假有時候是一個擔憂因為我們的競爭力到底會不會萎縮來部長\n\n25\n00:08:45,106 --> 00:09:05,837\n跟委員說明第一個其實因為實際上應該叫減班休息因為有時候講無薪假會讓大家以為真的可以無薪有時候有些勞工以為真的可以無薪他就不知道自己的權益在法規上面是不能夠無薪的至少要給最低工資這是第一個第二個就像剛剛委員說到其實現在大家可能會同時受到美國的關稅\n\n26\n00:09:07,048 --> 00:09:35,184\n又有匯率的影響所以我們現在在我們的強化版的僱傭安定措施裡面把如果你是受到匯率影響的也放進來可以做薪資補貼那我們薪資的這個差額補貼過去是五成我們也提高到七成所以其實我們都希望更大力的來支持減班休息勞工的經濟安全的部分那現在把原本的行業別原本是三個那現在也放寬到九個\n\n27\n00:09:36,104 --> 00:10:04,980\n那這也是聽了很多我們工會跟勞工朋友的想法所以我想我們會盡全力的來支持我們的勞工朋友最重要的是我們希望不要讓勞工朋友遇到失業或者是他要離開職場的狀況因為他只要還keep在他的這個職場上面的話未來訂單來他隨時都還可以快速的恢復就可以上位上位這對企業好那對勞工朋友至少他在經濟上面他不會馬上要去找工作尤其是如果遇到中高齡的勞工這對他來說都會是更多的挑戰\n\n28\n00:10:05,700 --> 00:10:17,725\n所以剛剛部長所說的我們應該更改這不是無薪假他基本上都要給基本工資對不對所以我們應該把這個觀念稍微調整所以我一定都會強調說\n\n29\n00:10:19,465 --> 00:10:38,753\n不是叫無心價這叫減班休息因為講多了真的很多勞工會以為好像真的可以無心所以是減班休息隨時等待這一波的動盪完我們要隨時上工隨時上位對不對所以我今天問這些問題都是要讓我們的行政團隊不要被誤解\n\n30\n00:10:39,913 --> 00:10:58,259\n因為常常都會被誤解減班休息還有因為是景氣大環境關係其中還有一部分是因為關稅關係勞動部都把它分析出來的我們會針對關稅的部分特別來加以重視但是整個大環境減班休息的我們還是用一般的勞工政策來替他做一些紓困上的解決\n\n31\n00:10:58,479 --> 00:11:10,676\n跟委員再補充每一個通報減班休息的廠商勞動部都會親自聯繫跟拜訪來瞭解到底發生什麼事情需要什麼協助我們可以投注什麼資源每一個通報減班休息的廠商我們都會主動聯繫\n\n32\n00:11:11,547 --> 00:11:33,753\n我們可能更積極然後跟他們做聯繫也把這樣的訊息通報每一個我們產業別他們都有工會嘛讓他們知道我們政府是有在協助在這個區塊的一個勞工的諮詢甚至協助我們已經規劃接下來要去每一個可能會受影響的工協會都希望讓他們知道我們有提供這樣的資源\n\n33\n00:11:34,173 --> 00:12:01,493\n好那這個速度可能快一點那我再就叫我們的院長院長其實我們把所有的產業品把它弄出來其實可能會比較直接的就是蝴蝶蘭還有五國魚還有茶葉鬼頭刀毛豆鱸魚這是農業的那其實我們再把它細分說真的蝴蝶蘭是因為我們最主要的對手是荷蘭\n\n34\n00:12:02,914 --> 00:12:21,836\n因為荷蘭的關稅比我們低所以我覺得這個部分蝴蝶蘭可能是我們的重中之重在我們台南我們大家都聽到要死所以這個部分要拜託然後再來吳國瑜的產業他基本上因為我們主要競爭對手是中國\n\n35\n00:12:22,617 --> 00:12:43,717\n那當然中國是55%是還沒疊加的部分但是我們以這個關稅的一個基礎來講它是55%那這個茶葉的部分基本上因為我們競爭的對手跟我們都差不多所以我覺得我們還要細分整個我們的競爭對手優越是比較\n\n36\n00:12:44,718 --> 00:13:00,553\n對一定要比較否則大家會亂掉說我們被受害的這麼嚴重但是其實產業都說我們的航班是趕快撐上來我相信我們台灣撐得過因為我們有可以條件去跟人家拚競爭我們擔心的是說\n\n37\n00:13:02,515 --> 00:13:30,598\n像蝴蝶蘭荷蘭就比我們關稅低這麼多那在關稅要出去就已經競爭力少了人家一截了所以我認為說我們還要把每一個產業的細項把它分出來那還有就是說我們工具機的產業也是我們工具機的產業我們為什麼大家會哀哀叫因為工具機的產業我們主要對手是德國日本韓國他們的一個\n\n38\n00:13:32,118 --> 00:13:56,861\n關稅都比我們低所以我覺得我們要依照產業別特別再把它挑出來加重協助我覺得這才是比較重要否則你看我們我們也認為說我們所有的這個產業別中小企業有可能說手工具產業啦水五金產業重電產業還有我們的塑膠產業都可能受到衝擊可是因為競爭對手都是中國\n\n39\n00:13:57,782 --> 00:14:19,836\n都是中國所以相對的壓力就減了我覺得我們應該要把這個訊息丟出來否則大家都不知道可能自己這個產業的也未必那麼清楚都不知道我的競爭對手是誰都覺得說你看美國關稅這個樣子我是不是失去了競爭力可是其實所有的產業都說\n\n40\n00:14:21,337 --> 00:14:47,377\n我只要我跟別人是一樣的關稅我就有把握我可以贏過別人這是我們台灣的驕傲啊那我們要怎麼讓他有這樣的條件就是我們現在要去幫他的從農業從中小企業這樣的角度所以我覺得這個是我們先要做也是我要拜託院長我們的資訊要給產業更清楚讓他們有信心你從中國拚中國的\n\n41\n00:14:49,838 --> 00:15:14,734\n55%你在怕什麼我覺得這個樣子的話他會更有信心那真的我們的對手是比較低的競爭關稅是比較低的那我們就要給他更多的幫忙所以這個部分院長我早上的報告裡面我說到工業方面工具機手工具水滸金重電塑膠農業方面的蝴蝶籃毛豆鬼頭刀以及委員剛剛所說的我們受的衝擊比較大\n\n42\n00:15:15,956 --> 00:15:20,001\n所以我們用各種的金融支持產業支持方面來協助讓他的衝擊減少認為我們這個地方我們競爭力可能會減少\n\n43\n00:15:54,697 --> 00:15:55,058\n好謝謝好謝謝陳委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n4170\t10924\t謝謝副院長我們請卓院長還有副院長還有鄭副院長請備詢\n21278\t48880\t陳國元好院長好 副院長好大家辛苦了其實我們整個談判團隊真的很用心很努力其實我們看到美國的態度所有的國家每一個世界各國其實都面臨了很大的壓力所以我相信你們在前線在做這樣的一個談判壓力也非常的大因為你們帶著所有台灣人民的期待\n49540\t66015\t可是我們又要保護我們自己的產業又要把我們產業的根留在台灣所以真的是很辛苦可是因為我們在談判的過程當中資訊回到台灣是很複雜的\n67276\t95252\t所以有很多不同階段的訊息而造成了我們台灣自己本身產業有很多誤解所以其實我光用這個所謂關稅疊不疊加的問題我想這個應該是最近我們的媒體當中其實最多論述最多討論的但是我覺得有必要把它一次澄清\n96192\t119876\t其實如果依照關稅疊加的部分我找了所有的資料我沒有詢問你們我自己找資料我發現如果以美國官方公布的其實關稅不疊加的只有歐盟各國其他就算我們在談的日本他也還在協議當中並沒有正式對外公布\n121162\t141978\t我們台灣是在努力當中所有的國家也都在努力當中所以為什麼有人就用所謂的我們在騙基本上我們關稅要疊加我們還說20%我們沒有騙我們要先把這個基底談好\n143001\t158448\t那關稅疊加是每個國家都這樣並不是只有台灣是只有歐盟沒有是所有的國家都面臨現在這個狀況可是你這個基底還沒有談好\n159485\t176074\t你怎麼再說下一步所以我覺得這個部分應該要先釐清讓所有台灣人民知道而不是不同的訊息不同的民意代表所說的會讓人家誤解副院長是不是\n176554\t195606\t是 委員的觀察完全的正確因為美國對各國本來就有它的MFN也就是原稅率那台灣自然也在原稅率的對象裡面只有洽簽雙邊協議有FTA的國家他們就沒有原稅率有些品項沒有\n196286\t210371\t那的確在所有達成協議的國家裡面目前看到的是歐盟在最終達成協議談判最終稅率的時候那麼歐盟有不疊加MFN原稅率來這樣的做最終的稅率的這個決定\n211491\t234749\t那日本有表達去爭取但目前的確也要帶美方來證實最後的這個結果那台灣因為我們還在談判中我們現在取得的20%加上MA分是從32降下來是一個階段性的一個結果那我們持續談判等到我們在談最終稅率的時候我想最終就會來決定要不要\n235269\t251549\t再加上MFN不過可以跟委員報告的是說我們最近三次的視訊會議當中我們已經表達希望爭取不要疊加MFN這也是我方的立場我們會積極努力來爭取所以我們到目前為止我們的態度都沒改變\n252964\t274885\t我想從卓院長對外 也是說我們現在在努力中啊我們當然要努力不疊加嘛 這是我們的方向所以我覺得我們應該要對外把這樣的一個定調而不是說 哇 因為不同的立場然後好像在唱衰我們這一個整個談判的過程我覺得真的是不好的\n275385\t295025\t因為當你在做政治口水的時候基本上也會傷害到我們的產業也會讓我們的產業沒有信心我們前線在努力所有的談判團隊每天我們的視訊會議我們整個包括他給我們的時間我們要一直等待\n295706\t315512\t大家是這樣子繃緊神經我就是要給大家鼓勵的所以這個部分我覺得因為我明明所看到的資訊跟媒體當中的資訊其實是有很大落差我覺得應該趁這個機會讓我們的卓院長跟鄭副院長把它表達清楚\n316112\t344738\t非常感謝委員一句話您的這番話對行政團隊尤其對談判團隊是正面的非常大的一個鼓勵當我們在談判的時候我們如果想到我們的國人是希望我們去爭取更好的而不是一直說我們是在欺騙國人這個對談判團隊的心理素質是影響很大更何況如果我們的對手看我們國內是這種狀況的話他會覺得跟我們談判他可能會得到更多我們現在還沒有辦法跟他談的過程\n345154\t365724\t所以謝謝委員這樣正向的一個鼓勵我們會珍惜但是我們會利用這樣的鼓勵我們請談判團隊據理力爭為國家爭取最大利益一定要加油啦因為我也不能接受用欺騙兩個字因為我們在前線有很多真的還沒有到談判的結果我們不能公佈啊\n367577\t390588\t你來我往的過程當中每一個都是機密每一個都是重點那當然我們知道我們要保護我們的產業我們一定要保護我們自己能夠保護的最後一個底線談判代表比誰都知道所以我覺得真的今天會利用這個時間去把這個疊加的部分因為\n391550\t406615\t我覺得很難過啦因為我們也不能替你們說話我們就希望說能夠用這樣的訊息我自己去找的我說奇怪明明在美國官方網站真的沒有疊加的就一個歐盟各國\n407515\t433856\t那為什麼還不斷的用這樣子的一個言語然後呢來傷害我們的談判團隊這是我覺得我不捨的地方那第二個部分就是說其實我們目前為止說真的放無薪假的確實有這個不能說沒有那無薪假的部分就是因為有太多的不確定性\n435373\t460991\t他害怕 所以我一直在談的是我們擔任民意代表我們更應該是要讓產業有信心不能用錯誤的訊息或是懷疑 猜疑的訊息而讓產業更沒有信心所以我們現在放無薪假我也知道我們行政院有要求我們勞動部一定要積極主動去了解原因是 勞動部主動訪視\n462634\t480010\t對但是呢因為說真的我們在基層有聽到大家的壓力是因為我們的匯率沒有穩定到底未來會不會隨時有做調整所以他們都會擔心我多接了一張單我可能會\n482165\t502534\t因為這樣而損失一張單就是在這個賺的價差的當中所以這個怎麼讓大家穩定信心這個很重要所以我覺得他們現在都覺得說我乾脆現在先按兵不動也是現在無薪假的原因我先按兵不動\n503334\t521944\t我來了解整個局勢變化之後我再進一步所以這個都是他們內心的不穩定跟擔心所以這個也跟我們勞動部長說明一下這個無薪假有時候是一個擔憂因為我們的競爭力到底會不會萎縮來 部長\n525106\t545837\t跟委員說明第一個其實因為實際上應該叫減班休息因為有時候講無薪假會讓大家以為真的可以無薪有時候有些勞工以為真的可以無薪他就不知道自己的權益在法規上面是不能夠無薪的至少要給最低工資這是第一個第二個就像剛剛委員說到其實現在大家可能會同時受到美國的關稅\n547048\t575184\t又有匯率的影響所以我們現在在我們的強化版的僱傭安定措施裡面把如果你是受到匯率影響的也放進來可以做薪資補貼那我們薪資的這個差額補貼過去是五成我們也提高到七成所以其實我們都希望更大力的來支持減班休息勞工的經濟安全的部分那現在把原本的行業別原本是三個那現在也放寬到九個\n576104\t604980\t那這也是聽了很多我們工會跟勞工朋友的想法所以我想我們會盡全力的來支持我們的勞工朋友最重要的是我們希望不要讓勞工朋友遇到失業或者是他要離開職場的狀況因為他只要還keep在他的這個職場上面的話未來訂單來他隨時都還可以快速的恢復就可以上位上位這對企業好那對勞工朋友至少他在經濟上面他不會馬上要去找工作尤其是如果遇到中高齡的勞工這對他來說都會是更多的挑戰\n605700\t617725\t所以剛剛部長所說的我們應該更改這不是無薪假他基本上都要給基本工資對不對所以我們應該把這個觀念稍微調整所以我一定都會強調說\n619465\t638753\t不是叫無心價這叫減班休息因為講多了真的很多勞工會以為好像真的可以無心所以是減班休息隨時等待這一波的動盪完我們要隨時上工隨時上位對不對所以我今天問這些問題都是要讓我們的行政團隊不要被誤解\n639913\t658259\t因為常常都會被誤解減班休息還有因為是景氣大環境關係其中還有一部分是因為關稅關係勞動部都把它分析出來的我們會針對關稅的部分特別來加以重視但是整個大環境減班休息的我們還是用一般的勞工政策來替他做一些紓困上的解決\n658479\t670676\t跟委員再補充每一個通報減班休息的廠商勞動部都會親自聯繫跟拜訪來瞭解到底發生什麼事情需要什麼協助我們可以投注什麼資源每一個通報減班休息的廠商我們都會主動聯繫\n671547\t693753\t我們可能更積極然後跟他們做聯繫也把這樣的訊息通報每一個我們產業別他們都有工會嘛讓他們知道我們政府是有在協助在這個區塊的一個勞工的諮詢甚至協助我們已經規劃接下來要去每一個可能會受影響的工協會都希望讓他們知道我們有提供這樣的資源\n694173\t721493\t好那這個速度可能快一點那我再就叫我們的院長院長其實我們把所有的產業品把它弄出來其實可能會比較直接的就是蝴蝶蘭還有五國魚還有茶葉鬼頭刀毛豆鱸魚這是農業的那其實我們再把它細分說真的蝴蝶蘭是因為我們最主要的對手是荷蘭\n722914\t741836\t因為荷蘭的關稅比我們低所以我覺得這個部分蝴蝶蘭可能是我們的重中之重在我們台南我們大家都聽到要死所以這個部分要拜託然後再來吳國瑜的產業他基本上因為我們主要競爭對手是中國\n742617\t763717\t那當然中國是55%是還沒疊加的部分但是我們以這個關稅的一個基礎來講它是55%那這個茶葉的部分基本上因為我們競爭的對手跟我們都差不多所以我覺得我們還要細分整個我們的競爭對手優越是比較\n764718\t780553\t對 一定要比較否則大家會亂掉 說我們被受害的這麼嚴重但是其實產業都說 我們的航班是趕快撐上來我相信我們台灣撐得過因為我們有可以條件去跟人家拚競爭我們擔心的是說\n782515\t810598\t像蝴蝶蘭荷蘭就比我們關稅低這麼多那在關稅要出去就已經競爭力少了人家一截了所以我認為說我們還要把每一個產業的細項把它分出來那還有就是說我們工具機的產業也是我們工具機的產業我們為什麼大家會哀哀叫因為工具機的產業我們主要對手是德國日本韓國他們的一個\n812118\t836861\t關稅都比我們低所以我覺得我們要依照產業別特別再把它挑出來加重協助我覺得這才是比較重要否則你看我們我們也認為說我們所有的這個產業別中小企業有可能說手工具產業啦水五金產業重電產業還有我們的塑膠產業都可能受到衝擊可是因為競爭對手都是中國\n837782\t859836\t都是中國 所以相對的壓力就減了我覺得我們應該要把這個訊息丟出來否則大家都不知道可能自己這個產業的也未必那麼清楚都不知道我的競爭對手是誰都覺得說你看美國關稅這個樣子我是不是失去了競爭力可是其實所有的產業都說\n861337\t887377\t我只要我跟別人是一樣的關稅我就有把握我可以贏過別人這是我們台灣的驕傲啊那我們要怎麼讓他有這樣的條件就是我們現在要去幫他的從農業 從中小企業這樣的角度所以我覺得這個是我們先要做也是我要拜託院長我們的資訊要給產業更清楚讓他們有信心你從中國拚 中國的\n889838\t914734\t55% 你在怕什麼我覺得這個樣子的話他會更有信心那真的我們的對手是比較低的競爭關稅是比較低的那我們就要給他更多的幫忙所以這個部分院長我早上的報告裡面我說到工業方面工具機手工具水滸金重電塑膠農業方面的蝴蝶籃毛豆鬼頭刀以及委員剛剛所說的我們受的衝擊比較大\n915956\t920001\t所以我們用各種的金融支持產業支持方面來協助讓他的衝擊減少認為我們這個地方我們競爭力可能會減少\n954697\t955058\t好 謝謝好 謝謝陳委員\n","txt":"謝謝副院長我們請卓院長還有副院長還有鄭副院長請備詢\n陳國元好院長好 副院長好大家辛苦了其實我們整個談判團隊真的很用心很努力其實我們看到美國的態度所有的國家每一個世界各國其實都面臨了很大的壓力所以我相信你們在前線在做這樣的一個談判壓力也非常的大因為你們帶著所有台灣人民的期待\n可是我們又要保護我們自己的產業又要把我們產業的根留在台灣所以真的是很辛苦可是因為我們在談判的過程當中資訊回到台灣是很複雜的\n所以有很多不同階段的訊息而造成了我們台灣自己本身產業有很多誤解所以其實我光用這個所謂關稅疊不疊加的問題我想這個應該是最近我們的媒體當中其實最多論述最多討論的但是我覺得有必要把它一次澄清\n其實如果依照關稅疊加的部分我找了所有的資料我沒有詢問你們我自己找資料我發現如果以美國官方公布的其實關稅不疊加的只有歐盟各國其他就算我們在談的日本他也還在協議當中並沒有正式對外公布\n我們台灣是在努力當中所有的國家也都在努力當中所以為什麼有人就用所謂的我們在騙基本上我們關稅要疊加我們還說20%我們沒有騙我們要先把這個基底談好\n那關稅疊加是每個國家都這樣並不是只有台灣是只有歐盟沒有是所有的國家都面臨現在這個狀況可是你這個基底還沒有談好\n你怎麼再說下一步所以我覺得這個部分應該要先釐清讓所有台灣人民知道而不是不同的訊息不同的民意代表所說的會讓人家誤解副院長是不是\n是 委員的觀察完全的正確因為美國對各國本來就有它的MFN也就是原稅率那台灣自然也在原稅率的對象裡面只有洽簽雙邊協議有FTA的國家他們就沒有原稅率有些品項沒有\n那的確在所有達成協議的國家裡面目前看到的是歐盟在最終達成協議談判最終稅率的時候那麼歐盟有不疊加MFN原稅率來這樣的做最終的稅率的這個決定\n那日本有表達去爭取但目前的確也要帶美方來證實最後的這個結果那台灣因為我們還在談判中我們現在取得的20%加上MA分是從32降下來是一個階段性的一個結果那我們持續談判等到我們在談最終稅率的時候我想最終就會來決定要不要\n再加上MFN不過可以跟委員報告的是說我們最近三次的視訊會議當中我們已經表達希望爭取不要疊加MFN這也是我方的立場我們會積極努力來爭取所以我們到目前為止我們的態度都沒改變\n我想從卓院長對外 也是說我們現在在努力中啊我們當然要努力不疊加嘛 這是我們的方向所以我覺得我們應該要對外把這樣的一個定調而不是說 哇 因為不同的立場然後好像在唱衰我們這一個整個談判的過程我覺得真的是不好的\n因為當你在做政治口水的時候基本上也會傷害到我們的產業也會讓我們的產業沒有信心我們前線在努力所有的談判團隊每天我們的視訊會議我們整個包括他給我們的時間我們要一直等待\n大家是這樣子繃緊神經我就是要給大家鼓勵的所以這個部分我覺得因為我明明所看到的資訊跟媒體當中的資訊其實是有很大落差我覺得應該趁這個機會讓我們的卓院長跟鄭副院長把它表達清楚\n非常感謝委員一句話您的這番話對行政團隊尤其對談判團隊是正面的非常大的一個鼓勵當我們在談判的時候我們如果想到我們的國人是希望我們去爭取更好的而不是一直說我們是在欺騙國人這個對談判團隊的心理素質是影響很大更何況如果我們的對手看我們國內是這種狀況的話他會覺得跟我們談判他可能會得到更多我們現在還沒有辦法跟他談的過程\n所以謝謝委員這樣正向的一個鼓勵我們會珍惜但是我們會利用這樣的鼓勵我們請談判團隊據理力爭為國家爭取最大利益一定要加油啦因為我也不能接受用欺騙兩個字因為我們在前線有很多真的還沒有到談判的結果我們不能公佈啊\n你來我往的過程當中每一個都是機密每一個都是重點那當然我們知道我們要保護我們的產業我們一定要保護我們自己能夠保護的最後一個底線談判代表比誰都知道所以我覺得真的今天會利用這個時間去把這個疊加的部分因為\n我覺得很難過啦因為我們也不能替你們說話我們就希望說能夠用這樣的訊息我自己去找的我說奇怪明明在美國官方網站真的沒有疊加的就一個歐盟各國\n那為什麼還不斷的用這樣子的一個言語然後呢來傷害我們的談判團隊這是我覺得我不捨的地方那第二個部分就是說其實我們目前為止說真的放無薪假的確實有這個不能說沒有那無薪假的部分就是因為有太多的不確定性\n他害怕 所以我一直在談的是我們擔任民意代表我們更應該是要讓產業有信心不能用錯誤的訊息或是懷疑 猜疑的訊息而讓產業更沒有信心所以我們現在放無薪假我也知道我們行政院有要求我們勞動部一定要積極主動去了解原因是 勞動部主動訪視\n對但是呢因為說真的我們在基層有聽到大家的壓力是因為我們的匯率沒有穩定到底未來會不會隨時有做調整所以他們都會擔心我多接了一張單我可能會\n因為這樣而損失一張單就是在這個賺的價差的當中所以這個怎麼讓大家穩定信心這個很重要所以我覺得他們現在都覺得說我乾脆現在先按兵不動也是現在無薪假的原因我先按兵不動\n我來了解整個局勢變化之後我再進一步所以這個都是他們內心的不穩定跟擔心所以這個也跟我們勞動部長說明一下這個無薪假有時候是一個擔憂因為我們的競爭力到底會不會萎縮來 部長\n跟委員說明第一個其實因為實際上應該叫減班休息因為有時候講無薪假會讓大家以為真的可以無薪有時候有些勞工以為真的可以無薪他就不知道自己的權益在法規上面是不能夠無薪的至少要給最低工資這是第一個第二個就像剛剛委員說到其實現在大家可能會同時受到美國的關稅\n又有匯率的影響所以我們現在在我們的強化版的僱傭安定措施裡面把如果你是受到匯率影響的也放進來可以做薪資補貼那我們薪資的這個差額補貼過去是五成我們也提高到七成所以其實我們都希望更大力的來支持減班休息勞工的經濟安全的部分那現在把原本的行業別原本是三個那現在也放寬到九個\n那這也是聽了很多我們工會跟勞工朋友的想法所以我想我們會盡全力的來支持我們的勞工朋友最重要的是我們希望不要讓勞工朋友遇到失業或者是他要離開職場的狀況因為他只要還keep在他的這個職場上面的話未來訂單來他隨時都還可以快速的恢復就可以上位上位這對企業好那對勞工朋友至少他在經濟上面他不會馬上要去找工作尤其是如果遇到中高齡的勞工這對他來說都會是更多的挑戰\n所以剛剛部長所說的我們應該更改這不是無薪假他基本上都要給基本工資對不對所以我們應該把這個觀念稍微調整所以我一定都會強調說\n不是叫無心價這叫減班休息因為講多了真的很多勞工會以為好像真的可以無心所以是減班休息隨時等待這一波的動盪完我們要隨時上工隨時上位對不對所以我今天問這些問題都是要讓我們的行政團隊不要被誤解\n因為常常都會被誤解減班休息還有因為是景氣大環境關係其中還有一部分是因為關稅關係勞動部都把它分析出來的我們會針對關稅的部分特別來加以重視但是整個大環境減班休息的我們還是用一般的勞工政策來替他做一些紓困上的解決\n跟委員再補充每一個通報減班休息的廠商勞動部都會親自聯繫跟拜訪來瞭解到底發生什麼事情需要什麼協助我們可以投注什麼資源每一個通報減班休息的廠商我們都會主動聯繫\n我們可能更積極然後跟他們做聯繫也把這樣的訊息通報每一個我們產業別他們都有工會嘛讓他們知道我們政府是有在協助在這個區塊的一個勞工的諮詢甚至協助我們已經規劃接下來要去每一個可能會受影響的工協會都希望讓他們知道我們有提供這樣的資源\n好那這個速度可能快一點那我再就叫我們的院長院長其實我們把所有的產業品把它弄出來其實可能會比較直接的就是蝴蝶蘭還有五國魚還有茶葉鬼頭刀毛豆鱸魚這是農業的那其實我們再把它細分說真的蝴蝶蘭是因為我們最主要的對手是荷蘭\n因為荷蘭的關稅比我們低所以我覺得這個部分蝴蝶蘭可能是我們的重中之重在我們台南我們大家都聽到要死所以這個部分要拜託然後再來吳國瑜的產業他基本上因為我們主要競爭對手是中國\n那當然中國是55%是還沒疊加的部分但是我們以這個關稅的一個基礎來講它是55%那這個茶葉的部分基本上因為我們競爭的對手跟我們都差不多所以我覺得我們還要細分整個我們的競爭對手優越是比較\n對 一定要比較否則大家會亂掉 說我們被受害的這麼嚴重但是其實產業都說 我們的航班是趕快撐上來我相信我們台灣撐得過因為我們有可以條件去跟人家拚競爭我們擔心的是說\n像蝴蝶蘭荷蘭就比我們關稅低這麼多那在關稅要出去就已經競爭力少了人家一截了所以我認為說我們還要把每一個產業的細項把它分出來那還有就是說我們工具機的產業也是我們工具機的產業我們為什麼大家會哀哀叫因為工具機的產業我們主要對手是德國日本韓國他們的一個\n關稅都比我們低所以我覺得我們要依照產業別特別再把它挑出來加重協助我覺得這才是比較重要否則你看我們我們也認為說我們所有的這個產業別中小企業有可能說手工具產業啦水五金產業重電產業還有我們的塑膠產業都可能受到衝擊可是因為競爭對手都是中國\n都是中國 所以相對的壓力就減了我覺得我們應該要把這個訊息丟出來否則大家都不知道可能自己這個產業的也未必那麼清楚都不知道我的競爭對手是誰都覺得說你看美國關稅這個樣子我是不是失去了競爭力可是其實所有的產業都說\n我只要我跟別人是一樣的關稅我就有把握我可以贏過別人這是我們台灣的驕傲啊那我們要怎麼讓他有這樣的條件就是我們現在要去幫他的從農業 從中小企業這樣的角度所以我覺得這個是我們先要做也是我要拜託院長我們的資訊要給產業更清楚讓他們有信心你從中國拚 中國的\n55% 你在怕什麼我覺得這個樣子的話他會更有信心那真的我們的對手是比較低的競爭關稅是比較低的那我們就要給他更多的幫忙所以這個部分院長我早上的報告裡面我說到工業方面工具機手工具水滸金重電塑膠農業方面的蝴蝶籃毛豆鬼頭刀以及委員剛剛所說的我們受的衝擊比較大\n所以我們用各種的金融支持產業支持方面來協助讓他的衝擊減少認為我們這個地方我們競爭力可能會減少\n好 謝謝好 謝謝陳委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:04.170 --> 00:10.924\n謝謝副院長我們請卓院長還有副院長還有鄭副院長請備詢\n\n00:21.278 --> 00:48.880\n陳國元好院長好副院長好大家辛苦了其實我們整個談判團隊真的很用心很努力其實我們看到美國的態度所有的國家每一個世界各國其實都面臨了很大的壓力所以我相信你們在前線在做這樣的一個談判壓力也非常的大因為你們帶著所有台灣人民的期待\n\n00:49.540 --> 01:06.015\n可是我們又要保護我們自己的產業又要把我們產業的根留在台灣所以真的是很辛苦可是因為我們在談判的過程當中資訊回到台灣是很複雜的\n\n01:07.276 --> 01:35.252\n所以有很多不同階段的訊息而造成了我們台灣自己本身產業有很多誤解所以其實我光用這個所謂關稅疊不疊加的問題我想這個應該是最近我們的媒體當中其實最多論述最多討論的但是我覺得有必要把它一次澄清\n\n01:36.192 --> 01:59.876\n其實如果依照關稅疊加的部分我找了所有的資料我沒有詢問你們我自己找資料我發現如果以美國官方公布的其實關稅不疊加的只有歐盟各國其他就算我們在談的日本他也還在協議當中並沒有正式對外公布\n\n02:01.162 --> 02:21.978\n我們台灣是在努力當中所有的國家也都在努力當中所以為什麼有人就用所謂的我們在騙基本上我們關稅要疊加我們還說20%我們沒有騙我們要先把這個基底談好\n\n02:23.001 --> 02:38.448\n那關稅疊加是每個國家都這樣並不是只有台灣是只有歐盟沒有是所有的國家都面臨現在這個狀況可是你這個基底還沒有談好\n\n02:39.485 --> 02:56.074\n你怎麼再說下一步所以我覺得這個部分應該要先釐清讓所有台灣人民知道而不是不同的訊息不同的民意代表所說的會讓人家誤解副院長是不是\n\n02:56.554 --> 03:15.606\n是委員的觀察完全的正確因為美國對各國本來就有它的MFN也就是原稅率那台灣自然也在原稅率的對象裡面只有洽簽雙邊協議有FTA的國家他們就沒有原稅率有些品項沒有\n\n03:16.286 --> 03:30.371\n那的確在所有達成協議的國家裡面目前看到的是歐盟在最終達成協議談判最終稅率的時候那麼歐盟有不疊加MFN原稅率來這樣的做最終的稅率的這個決定\n\n03:31.491 --> 03:54.749\n那日本有表達去爭取但目前的確也要帶美方來證實最後的這個結果那台灣因為我們還在談判中我們現在取得的20%加上MA分是從32降下來是一個階段性的一個結果那我們持續談判等到我們在談最終稅率的時候我想最終就會來決定要不要\n\n03:55.269 --> 04:11.549\n再加上MFN不過可以跟委員報告的是說我們最近三次的視訊會議當中我們已經表達希望爭取不要疊加MFN這也是我方的立場我們會積極努力來爭取所以我們到目前為止我們的態度都沒改變\n\n04:12.964 --> 04:34.885\n我想從卓院長對外也是說我們現在在努力中啊我們當然要努力不疊加嘛這是我們的方向所以我覺得我們應該要對外把這樣的一個定調而不是說哇因為不同的立場然後好像在唱衰我們這一個整個談判的過程我覺得真的是不好的\n\n04:35.385 --> 04:55.025\n因為當你在做政治口水的時候基本上也會傷害到我們的產業也會讓我們的產業沒有信心我們前線在努力所有的談判團隊每天我們的視訊會議我們整個包括他給我們的時間我們要一直等待\n\n04:55.706 --> 05:15.512\n大家是這樣子繃緊神經我就是要給大家鼓勵的所以這個部分我覺得因為我明明所看到的資訊跟媒體當中的資訊其實是有很大落差我覺得應該趁這個機會讓我們的卓院長跟鄭副院長把它表達清楚\n\n05:16.112 --> 05:44.738\n非常感謝委員一句話您的這番話對行政團隊尤其對談判團隊是正面的非常大的一個鼓勵當我們在談判的時候我們如果想到我們的國人是希望我們去爭取更好的而不是一直說我們是在欺騙國人這個對談判團隊的心理素質是影響很大更何況如果我們的對手看我們國內是這種狀況的話他會覺得跟我們談判他可能會得到更多我們現在還沒有辦法跟他談的過程\n\n05:45.154 --> 06:05.724\n所以謝謝委員這樣正向的一個鼓勵我們會珍惜但是我們會利用這樣的鼓勵我們請談判團隊據理力爭為國家爭取最大利益一定要加油啦因為我也不能接受用欺騙兩個字因為我們在前線有很多真的還沒有到談判的結果我們不能公佈啊\n\n06:07.577 --> 06:30.588\n你來我往的過程當中每一個都是機密每一個都是重點那當然我們知道我們要保護我們的產業我們一定要保護我們自己能夠保護的最後一個底線談判代表比誰都知道所以我覺得真的今天會利用這個時間去把這個疊加的部分因為\n\n06:31.550 --> 06:46.615\n我覺得很難過啦因為我們也不能替你們說話我們就希望說能夠用這樣的訊息我自己去找的我說奇怪明明在美國官方網站真的沒有疊加的就一個歐盟各國\n\n06:47.515 --> 07:13.856\n那為什麼還不斷的用這樣子的一個言語然後呢來傷害我們的談判團隊這是我覺得我不捨的地方那第二個部分就是說其實我們目前為止說真的放無薪假的確實有這個不能說沒有那無薪假的部分就是因為有太多的不確定性\n\n07:15.373 --> 07:40.991\n他害怕所以我一直在談的是我們擔任民意代表我們更應該是要讓產業有信心不能用錯誤的訊息或是懷疑猜疑的訊息而讓產業更沒有信心所以我們現在放無薪假我也知道我們行政院有要求我們勞動部一定要積極主動去了解原因是勞動部主動訪視\n\n07:42.634 --> 08:00.010\n對但是呢因為說真的我們在基層有聽到大家的壓力是因為我們的匯率沒有穩定到底未來會不會隨時有做調整所以他們都會擔心我多接了一張單我可能會\n\n08:02.165 --> 08:22.534\n因為這樣而損失一張單就是在這個賺的價差的當中所以這個怎麼讓大家穩定信心這個很重要所以我覺得他們現在都覺得說我乾脆現在先按兵不動也是現在無薪假的原因我先按兵不動\n\n08:23.334 --> 08:41.944\n我來了解整個局勢變化之後我再進一步所以這個都是他們內心的不穩定跟擔心所以這個也跟我們勞動部長說明一下這個無薪假有時候是一個擔憂因為我們的競爭力到底會不會萎縮來部長\n\n08:45.106 --> 09:05.837\n跟委員說明第一個其實因為實際上應該叫減班休息因為有時候講無薪假會讓大家以為真的可以無薪有時候有些勞工以為真的可以無薪他就不知道自己的權益在法規上面是不能夠無薪的至少要給最低工資這是第一個第二個就像剛剛委員說到其實現在大家可能會同時受到美國的關稅\n\n09:07.048 --> 09:35.184\n又有匯率的影響所以我們現在在我們的強化版的僱傭安定措施裡面把如果你是受到匯率影響的也放進來可以做薪資補貼那我們薪資的這個差額補貼過去是五成我們也提高到七成所以其實我們都希望更大力的來支持減班休息勞工的經濟安全的部分那現在把原本的行業別原本是三個那現在也放寬到九個\n\n09:36.104 --> 10:04.980\n那這也是聽了很多我們工會跟勞工朋友的想法所以我想我們會盡全力的來支持我們的勞工朋友最重要的是我們希望不要讓勞工朋友遇到失業或者是他要離開職場的狀況因為他只要還keep在他的這個職場上面的話未來訂單來他隨時都還可以快速的恢復就可以上位上位這對企業好那對勞工朋友至少他在經濟上面他不會馬上要去找工作尤其是如果遇到中高齡的勞工這對他來說都會是更多的挑戰\n\n10:05.700 --> 10:17.725\n所以剛剛部長所說的我們應該更改這不是無薪假他基本上都要給基本工資對不對所以我們應該把這個觀念稍微調整所以我一定都會強調說\n\n10:19.465 --> 10:38.753\n不是叫無心價這叫減班休息因為講多了真的很多勞工會以為好像真的可以無心所以是減班休息隨時等待這一波的動盪完我們要隨時上工隨時上位對不對所以我今天問這些問題都是要讓我們的行政團隊不要被誤解\n\n10:39.913 --> 10:58.259\n因為常常都會被誤解減班休息還有因為是景氣大環境關係其中還有一部分是因為關稅關係勞動部都把它分析出來的我們會針對關稅的部分特別來加以重視但是整個大環境減班休息的我們還是用一般的勞工政策來替他做一些紓困上的解決\n\n10:58.479 --> 11:10.676\n跟委員再補充每一個通報減班休息的廠商勞動部都會親自聯繫跟拜訪來瞭解到底發生什麼事情需要什麼協助我們可以投注什麼資源每一個通報減班休息的廠商我們都會主動聯繫\n\n11:11.547 --> 11:33.753\n我們可能更積極然後跟他們做聯繫也把這樣的訊息通報每一個我們產業別他們都有工會嘛讓他們知道我們政府是有在協助在這個區塊的一個勞工的諮詢甚至協助我們已經規劃接下來要去每一個可能會受影響的工協會都希望讓他們知道我們有提供這樣的資源\n\n11:34.173 --> 12:01.493\n好那這個速度可能快一點那我再就叫我們的院長院長其實我們把所有的產業品把它弄出來其實可能會比較直接的就是蝴蝶蘭還有五國魚還有茶葉鬼頭刀毛豆鱸魚這是農業的那其實我們再把它細分說真的蝴蝶蘭是因為我們最主要的對手是荷蘭\n\n12:02.914 --> 12:21.836\n因為荷蘭的關稅比我們低所以我覺得這個部分蝴蝶蘭可能是我們的重中之重在我們台南我們大家都聽到要死所以這個部分要拜託然後再來吳國瑜的產業他基本上因為我們主要競爭對手是中國\n\n12:22.617 --> 12:43.717\n那當然中國是55%是還沒疊加的部分但是我們以這個關稅的一個基礎來講它是55%那這個茶葉的部分基本上因為我們競爭的對手跟我們都差不多所以我覺得我們還要細分整個我們的競爭對手優越是比較\n\n12:44.718 --> 13:00.553\n對一定要比較否則大家會亂掉說我們被受害的這麼嚴重但是其實產業都說我們的航班是趕快撐上來我相信我們台灣撐得過因為我們有可以條件去跟人家拚競爭我們擔心的是說\n\n13:02.515 --> 13:30.598\n像蝴蝶蘭荷蘭就比我們關稅低這麼多那在關稅要出去就已經競爭力少了人家一截了所以我認為說我們還要把每一個產業的細項把它分出來那還有就是說我們工具機的產業也是我們工具機的產業我們為什麼大家會哀哀叫因為工具機的產業我們主要對手是德國日本韓國他們的一個\n\n13:32.118 --> 13:56.861\n關稅都比我們低所以我覺得我們要依照產業別特別再把它挑出來加重協助我覺得這才是比較重要否則你看我們我們也認為說我們所有的這個產業別中小企業有可能說手工具產業啦水五金產業重電產業還有我們的塑膠產業都可能受到衝擊可是因為競爭對手都是中國\n\n13:57.782 --> 14:19.836\n都是中國所以相對的壓力就減了我覺得我們應該要把這個訊息丟出來否則大家都不知道可能自己這個產業的也未必那麼清楚都不知道我的競爭對手是誰都覺得說你看美國關稅這個樣子我是不是失去了競爭力可是其實所有的產業都說\n\n14:21.337 --> 14:47.377\n我只要我跟別人是一樣的關稅我就有把握我可以贏過別人這是我們台灣的驕傲啊那我們要怎麼讓他有這樣的條件就是我們現在要去幫他的從農業從中小企業這樣的角度所以我覺得這個是我們先要做也是我要拜託院長我們的資訊要給產業更清楚讓他們有信心你從中國拚中國的\n\n14:49.838 --> 15:14.734\n55%你在怕什麼我覺得這個樣子的話他會更有信心那真的我們的對手是比較低的競爭關稅是比較低的那我們就要給他更多的幫忙所以這個部分院長我早上的報告裡面我說到工業方面工具機手工具水滸金重電塑膠農業方面的蝴蝶籃毛豆鬼頭刀以及委員剛剛所說的我們受的衝擊比較大\n\n15:15.956 --> 15:20.001\n所以我們用各種的金融支持產業支持方面來協助讓他的衝擊減少認為我們這個地方我們競爭力可能會減少\n\n15:54.697 --> 15:55.058\n好謝謝好謝謝陳委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":4.17,"end":10.924,"text":"謝謝副院長我們請卓院長還有副院長還有鄭副院長請備詢"},{"start":21.278,"end":48.88,"text":"陳國元好院長好 副院長好大家辛苦了其實我們整個談判團隊真的很用心很努力其實我們看到美國的態度所有的國家每一個世界各國其實都面臨了很大的壓力所以我相信你們在前線在做這樣的一個談判壓力也非常的大因為你們帶著所有台灣人民的期待"},{"start":49.54,"end":66.015,"text":"可是我們又要保護我們自己的產業又要把我們產業的根留在台灣所以真的是很辛苦可是因為我們在談判的過程當中資訊回到台灣是很複雜的"},{"start":67.276,"end":95.252,"text":"所以有很多不同階段的訊息而造成了我們台灣自己本身產業有很多誤解所以其實我光用這個所謂關稅疊不疊加的問題我想這個應該是最近我們的媒體當中其實最多論述最多討論的但是我覺得有必要把它一次澄清"},{"start":96.192,"end":119.876,"text":"其實如果依照關稅疊加的部分我找了所有的資料我沒有詢問你們我自己找資料我發現如果以美國官方公布的其實關稅不疊加的只有歐盟各國其他就算我們在談的日本他也還在協議當中並沒有正式對外公布"},{"start":121.162,"end":141.978,"text":"我們台灣是在努力當中所有的國家也都在努力當中所以為什麼有人就用所謂的我們在騙基本上我們關稅要疊加我們還說20%我們沒有騙我們要先把這個基底談好"},{"start":143.001,"end":158.448,"text":"那關稅疊加是每個國家都這樣並不是只有台灣是只有歐盟沒有是所有的國家都面臨現在這個狀況可是你這個基底還沒有談好"},{"start":159.485,"end":176.074,"text":"你怎麼再說下一步所以我覺得這個部分應該要先釐清讓所有台灣人民知道而不是不同的訊息不同的民意代表所說的會讓人家誤解副院長是不是"},{"start":176.554,"end":195.606,"text":"是 委員的觀察完全的正確因為美國對各國本來就有它的MFN也就是原稅率那台灣自然也在原稅率的對象裡面只有洽簽雙邊協議有FTA的國家他們就沒有原稅率有些品項沒有"},{"start":196.286,"end":210.371,"text":"那的確在所有達成協議的國家裡面目前看到的是歐盟在最終達成協議談判最終稅率的時候那麼歐盟有不疊加MFN原稅率來這樣的做最終的稅率的這個決定"},{"start":211.491,"end":234.749,"text":"那日本有表達去爭取但目前的確也要帶美方來證實最後的這個結果那台灣因為我們還在談判中我們現在取得的20%加上MA分是從32降下來是一個階段性的一個結果那我們持續談判等到我們在談最終稅率的時候我想最終就會來決定要不要"},{"start":235.269,"end":251.549,"text":"再加上MFN不過可以跟委員報告的是說我們最近三次的視訊會議當中我們已經表達希望爭取不要疊加MFN這也是我方的立場我們會積極努力來爭取所以我們到目前為止我們的態度都沒改變"},{"start":252.964,"end":274.885,"text":"我想從卓院長對外 也是說我們現在在努力中啊我們當然要努力不疊加嘛 這是我們的方向所以我覺得我們應該要對外把這樣的一個定調而不是說 哇 因為不同的立場然後好像在唱衰我們這一個整個談判的過程我覺得真的是不好的"},{"start":275.385,"end":295.025,"text":"因為當你在做政治口水的時候基本上也會傷害到我們的產業也會讓我們的產業沒有信心我們前線在努力所有的談判團隊每天我們的視訊會議我們整個包括他給我們的時間我們要一直等待"},{"start":295.706,"end":315.512,"text":"大家是這樣子繃緊神經我就是要給大家鼓勵的所以這個部分我覺得因為我明明所看到的資訊跟媒體當中的資訊其實是有很大落差我覺得應該趁這個機會讓我們的卓院長跟鄭副院長把它表達清楚"},{"start":316.112,"end":344.738,"text":"非常感謝委員一句話您的這番話對行政團隊尤其對談判團隊是正面的非常大的一個鼓勵當我們在談判的時候我們如果想到我們的國人是希望我們去爭取更好的而不是一直說我們是在欺騙國人這個對談判團隊的心理素質是影響很大更何況如果我們的對手看我們國內是這種狀況的話他會覺得跟我們談判他可能會得到更多我們現在還沒有辦法跟他談的過程"},{"start":345.154,"end":365.724,"text":"所以謝謝委員這樣正向的一個鼓勵我們會珍惜但是我們會利用這樣的鼓勵我們請談判團隊據理力爭為國家爭取最大利益一定要加油啦因為我也不能接受用欺騙兩個字因為我們在前線有很多真的還沒有到談判的結果我們不能公佈啊"},{"start":367.577,"end":390.588,"text":"你來我往的過程當中每一個都是機密每一個都是重點那當然我們知道我們要保護我們的產業我們一定要保護我們自己能夠保護的最後一個底線談判代表比誰都知道所以我覺得真的今天會利用這個時間去把這個疊加的部分因為"},{"start":391.55,"end":406.615,"text":"我覺得很難過啦因為我們也不能替你們說話我們就希望說能夠用這樣的訊息我自己去找的我說奇怪明明在美國官方網站真的沒有疊加的就一個歐盟各國"},{"start":407.515,"end":433.856,"text":"那為什麼還不斷的用這樣子的一個言語然後呢來傷害我們的談判團隊這是我覺得我不捨的地方那第二個部分就是說其實我們目前為止說真的放無薪假的確實有這個不能說沒有那無薪假的部分就是因為有太多的不確定性"},{"start":435.373,"end":460.991,"text":"他害怕 所以我一直在談的是我們擔任民意代表我們更應該是要讓產業有信心不能用錯誤的訊息或是懷疑 猜疑的訊息而讓產業更沒有信心所以我們現在放無薪假我也知道我們行政院有要求我們勞動部一定要積極主動去了解原因是 勞動部主動訪視"},{"start":462.634,"end":480.01,"text":"對但是呢因為說真的我們在基層有聽到大家的壓力是因為我們的匯率沒有穩定到底未來會不會隨時有做調整所以他們都會擔心我多接了一張單我可能會"},{"start":482.165,"end":502.534,"text":"因為這樣而損失一張單就是在這個賺的價差的當中所以這個怎麼讓大家穩定信心這個很重要所以我覺得他們現在都覺得說我乾脆現在先按兵不動也是現在無薪假的原因我先按兵不動"},{"start":503.334,"end":521.944,"text":"我來了解整個局勢變化之後我再進一步所以這個都是他們內心的不穩定跟擔心所以這個也跟我們勞動部長說明一下這個無薪假有時候是一個擔憂因為我們的競爭力到底會不會萎縮來 部長"},{"start":525.106,"end":545.837,"text":"跟委員說明第一個其實因為實際上應該叫減班休息因為有時候講無薪假會讓大家以為真的可以無薪有時候有些勞工以為真的可以無薪他就不知道自己的權益在法規上面是不能夠無薪的至少要給最低工資這是第一個第二個就像剛剛委員說到其實現在大家可能會同時受到美國的關稅"},{"start":547.048,"end":575.184,"text":"又有匯率的影響所以我們現在在我們的強化版的僱傭安定措施裡面把如果你是受到匯率影響的也放進來可以做薪資補貼那我們薪資的這個差額補貼過去是五成我們也提高到七成所以其實我們都希望更大力的來支持減班休息勞工的經濟安全的部分那現在把原本的行業別原本是三個那現在也放寬到九個"},{"start":576.104,"end":604.98,"text":"那這也是聽了很多我們工會跟勞工朋友的想法所以我想我們會盡全力的來支持我們的勞工朋友最重要的是我們希望不要讓勞工朋友遇到失業或者是他要離開職場的狀況因為他只要還keep在他的這個職場上面的話未來訂單來他隨時都還可以快速的恢復就可以上位上位這對企業好那對勞工朋友至少他在經濟上面他不會馬上要去找工作尤其是如果遇到中高齡的勞工這對他來說都會是更多的挑戰"},{"start":605.7,"end":617.725,"text":"所以剛剛部長所說的我們應該更改這不是無薪假他基本上都要給基本工資對不對所以我們應該把這個觀念稍微調整所以我一定都會強調說"},{"start":619.465,"end":638.753,"text":"不是叫無心價這叫減班休息因為講多了真的很多勞工會以為好像真的可以無心所以是減班休息隨時等待這一波的動盪完我們要隨時上工隨時上位對不對所以我今天問這些問題都是要讓我們的行政團隊不要被誤解"},{"start":639.913,"end":658.259,"text":"因為常常都會被誤解減班休息還有因為是景氣大環境關係其中還有一部分是因為關稅關係勞動部都把它分析出來的我們會針對關稅的部分特別來加以重視但是整個大環境減班休息的我們還是用一般的勞工政策來替他做一些紓困上的解決"},{"start":658.479,"end":670.676,"text":"跟委員再補充每一個通報減班休息的廠商勞動部都會親自聯繫跟拜訪來瞭解到底發生什麼事情需要什麼協助我們可以投注什麼資源每一個通報減班休息的廠商我們都會主動聯繫"},{"start":671.547,"end":693.753,"text":"我們可能更積極然後跟他們做聯繫也把這樣的訊息通報每一個我們產業別他們都有工會嘛讓他們知道我們政府是有在協助在這個區塊的一個勞工的諮詢甚至協助我們已經規劃接下來要去每一個可能會受影響的工協會都希望讓他們知道我們有提供這樣的資源"},{"start":694.173,"end":721.493,"text":"好那這個速度可能快一點那我再就叫我們的院長院長其實我們把所有的產業品把它弄出來其實可能會比較直接的就是蝴蝶蘭還有五國魚還有茶葉鬼頭刀毛豆鱸魚這是農業的那其實我們再把它細分說真的蝴蝶蘭是因為我們最主要的對手是荷蘭"},{"start":722.914,"end":741.836,"text":"因為荷蘭的關稅比我們低所以我覺得這個部分蝴蝶蘭可能是我們的重中之重在我們台南我們大家都聽到要死所以這個部分要拜託然後再來吳國瑜的產業他基本上因為我們主要競爭對手是中國"},{"start":742.617,"end":763.717,"text":"那當然中國是55%是還沒疊加的部分但是我們以這個關稅的一個基礎來講它是55%那這個茶葉的部分基本上因為我們競爭的對手跟我們都差不多所以我覺得我們還要細分整個我們的競爭對手優越是比較"},{"start":764.718,"end":780.553,"text":"對 一定要比較否則大家會亂掉 說我們被受害的這麼嚴重但是其實產業都說 我們的航班是趕快撐上來我相信我們台灣撐得過因為我們有可以條件去跟人家拚競爭我們擔心的是說"},{"start":782.515,"end":810.598,"text":"像蝴蝶蘭荷蘭就比我們關稅低這麼多那在關稅要出去就已經競爭力少了人家一截了所以我認為說我們還要把每一個產業的細項把它分出來那還有就是說我們工具機的產業也是我們工具機的產業我們為什麼大家會哀哀叫因為工具機的產業我們主要對手是德國日本韓國他們的一個"},{"start":812.118,"end":836.861,"text":"關稅都比我們低所以我覺得我們要依照產業別特別再把它挑出來加重協助我覺得這才是比較重要否則你看我們我們也認為說我們所有的這個產業別中小企業有可能說手工具產業啦水五金產業重電產業還有我們的塑膠產業都可能受到衝擊可是因為競爭對手都是中國"},{"start":837.782,"end":859.836,"text":"都是中國 所以相對的壓力就減了我覺得我們應該要把這個訊息丟出來否則大家都不知道可能自己這個產業的也未必那麼清楚都不知道我的競爭對手是誰都覺得說你看美國關稅這個樣子我是不是失去了競爭力可是其實所有的產業都說"},{"start":861.337,"end":887.377,"text":"我只要我跟別人是一樣的關稅我就有把握我可以贏過別人這是我們台灣的驕傲啊那我們要怎麼讓他有這樣的條件就是我們現在要去幫他的從農業 從中小企業這樣的角度所以我覺得這個是我們先要做也是我要拜託院長我們的資訊要給產業更清楚讓他們有信心你從中國拚 中國的"},{"start":889.838,"end":914.734,"text":"55% 你在怕什麼我覺得這個樣子的話他會更有信心那真的我們的對手是比較低的競爭關稅是比較低的那我們就要給他更多的幫忙所以這個部分院長我早上的報告裡面我說到工業方面工具機手工具水滸金重電塑膠農業方面的蝴蝶籃毛豆鬼頭刀以及委員剛剛所說的我們受的衝擊比較大"},{"start":915.956,"end":920.001,"text":"所以我們用各種的金融支持產業支持方面來協助讓他的衝擊減少認為我們這個地方我們競爭力可能會減少"},{"start":954.697,"end":955.058,"text":"好 謝謝好 謝謝陳委員"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":134,"blocks":[["陳委員亭妃：（15時3分）謝謝副院長。我請卓院長。"],["主席：請卓院長備詢。"],["陳委員亭妃：還有副院長。"],["主席：還有鄭副院長，請備詢。"],["卓院長榮泰：陳委員好。"],["陳委員亭妃：院長好、副院長好。大家辛苦了，其實我們整個談判團隊真的很用心、很努力。我們看到美國的態度，所有國家、世界各國其實都面臨了很大的壓力，所以我相信你們在前線這樣談判，壓力也非常的大，因為你們帶著所有臺灣人民的期待，可是我們又要保護自己的產業、又要把產業的根留在臺灣，所以真的是很辛苦！可是在談判的過程當中，資訊回到臺灣是很複雜的，有很多不同階段的訊息造成了臺灣自己本身產業有很多誤解。光用關稅疊不疊加的問題，我想這個應該是最近媒體有最多論述、最多討論的，我覺得有必要把它一次澄清。如果依照關稅疊加的部分，我找了所有的資料，我沒有詢問你們，我自己找資料。我發現如果以美國官方公布的，其實關稅不疊加的只有歐盟各國，其他就算我們在談的日本也在協議當中，並沒有正式對外公布，臺灣是在努力當中、所有國家也都在努力當中，為什麼有人就說我們在騙？基本上我們關稅要疊加啊！我們竟然還說20%。我們沒有騙，我們是要先把基底談好，關稅疊加是每個國家都這樣，並不是只有臺灣，是只有歐盟沒有，所有的國家都在面臨現在這個狀況，可是這個基底還沒有談好，你怎麼再說下一步？我覺得這個部分應該要先釐清，讓所有臺灣人民知道，而不是因為不同的訊息、不同的民意代表所說的，讓人家有誤解。副院長，是不是？"],["鄭副院長麗君：是，委員的觀察完全正確。因為美國對各國本來就有他的MFN，也就是原稅率，臺灣自然也在原稅率的對象裡面，只有洽簽雙邊協議、有FTA的國家有些品項就沒有原稅率。的確在所有達成協議的國家裡面，目前看到的是歐盟在達成協議、談判最終稅率的時候，有不疊加MFN原稅率來做最終稅率的決定；日本有表達去爭取，但目前的確也要待美方證實最後的結果；因為臺灣還在談判中，我們現在取得的20%加上MFN是從32%降下來，是一個階段性的結果，那我們持續談判，等到談最終稅率的時候，我想最終就會來決定要不要再加上MFN。不過我可以跟委員報告的是，我們在最近3次的視訊會議當中，已經表達希望爭取不要疊加MFN，這也是我方的立場，我們會積極努力來爭取。"],["陳委員亭妃：所以我們到目前為止，態度都沒改變嘛！卓院長對外也是說：我們現在在努力中啊！"],["卓院長榮泰：是。"],["陳委員亭妃：我們當然要努力不疊加，這是我們的方向，所以我們應該要對外把這樣的方向定調，而不是說：哇！因為不同的立場，然後好像在唱衰整個談判的過程，我覺得這個是不好的。因為當你在做政治口水的時候，基本上也會傷害到我們的產業，也會讓我們的產業沒有信心。前線在努力，所有的談判團隊除了進行視訊會議，還要一直等待，大家是這樣子繃緊神經，我覺得是要給大家鼓勵的。因為我所看到的資訊跟媒體當中的資訊，其實是有很大落差，我覺得應該要趁這個機會，讓卓院長跟副院長把它表達清楚。"],["卓院長榮泰：非常感謝委員，您的這番話對行政團隊，尤其對於談判團隊是正面的、非常大的鼓勵，當我們在談判的時候想到國人是希望去爭取更好，而不是一直說我們是在欺騙國人，這個對談判團隊的心理素質影響很大。更何況，如果我們的對手看國內是這種狀況，他會覺得跟我們談判可能會得到更多，在我們現在還沒有辦法跟他談的過程，所以謝謝委員正向的鼓勵，我們會珍惜，但是我們也會利用這樣的鼓勵，請談判團隊據理力爭為國家爭取最大利益。"],["陳委員亭妃：一定要加油，我不能接受用「欺騙」兩個字，因為前線真的有很多還沒有到談判的結果，我們不能公布啊！"],["卓院長榮泰：是。"],["陳委員亭妃：在你來我往的過程當中，每一個都是機密、每一個都是重點，當然我們知道一定要保護我們的產業、一定要保護我們自己能夠保護的最後底線，談判代表比誰都知道。我今天會利用這個時間把疊加的部分表達，是因為我覺得很難過，我也不能替你們說話，就希望能夠用這樣的訊息釐清。這是我自己去找的，我說：奇怪，明明在美國官方網站真的沒有疊加的就歐盟各國，為什麼還不斷用這樣子的言語來傷害談判團隊？這是我覺得不捨的地方。","第二個部分，目前為止，說真的，確實有放無薪假，不能說沒有。無薪假的部分，就是因為有太多的不確定性，他害怕。我一直在談的是，我們擔任民意代表，更應該要讓產業有信心，不能用錯誤的訊息或是懷疑、猜疑的訊息，而讓產業更沒有信心，所以現在放無薪假，我也知道行政院有要求勞動部一定要積極主動去了解原因。"],["卓院長榮泰：是，勞動部主動訪視。"],["陳委員亭妃：對，但是說真的，在基層有聽到大家的壓力是因為我們的匯率沒有穩定，到底未來會不會隨時調整？他們都會擔心如果多接了一張單，可能會這樣而損失一張單，因為賺的取決在這價差當中，所以怎麼讓大家穩定信心是很重要的。他們現在都覺得乾脆現在先按兵不動，這也是現在無薪假的原因，先按兵不動了解整個局勢變化之後再進一步，所以這些都造成他們內心不穩定跟擔心，也跟勞動部長說明一下，無薪假有時候是一個擔憂，我們的競爭力到底會不會萎縮？來，部長。"],["洪部長申翰：跟委員說明，第一個，實際上應該叫減班休息，因為有時候講無薪假會讓大家以為真的可以無薪，有些勞工會以為真的可以無薪，他不知道自己的權益，在法規上面是不能夠無薪的，至少要給最低工資，這是第一個。","第二個，就像剛剛委員說到，其實現在大家可能同時受到美國的關稅以及匯率的影響，所以現在在強化版的僱用安定措施裡面，如果受到匯率影響的也有放進來，可以做薪資補貼。薪資的差額補貼過去是五成，我們也提高到七成，我們都希望更大力地來支持減班休息勞工的經濟安全。現在把原本的行業別三個放寬到九個，這也是聽了很多工會跟勞工朋友的想法，所以我想我們會盡全力地來支持勞工朋友。最重要的是，我們希望不要讓勞工朋友遇到失業或者要離開職場的狀況，因為他只要還keep在職場上面的話，未來訂單來，他隨時都還可以快速恢復……"],["陳委員亭妃：就可以上位。"],["洪部長申翰：上位。這對企業好，對勞工朋友，至少他在經濟上面不會馬上要去找工作，尤其是如果中高齡的勞工遇到，對他來說會是更多的挑戰。"],["陳委員亭妃：所以剛剛部長所說的，我們應該更改，這不是無薪假，基本上還是要給基本工資，對不對？"],["洪部長申翰：對。"],["陳委員亭妃：所以我們應該把這個觀念稍微調整……"],["洪部長申翰：所以我一定都會強調這不是叫無薪假，這叫減班休息，因為講多了，很多勞工會以為好像真的可以無薪。"],["陳委員亭妃：所以是減班休息，隨時等待這一波的動盪完要隨時上工、隨時上位，對不對？"],["洪部長申翰：是。"],["陳委員亭妃：所以我今天問這些問題都是要讓行政團隊不要被誤解，因為常常都會被誤解。"],["卓院長榮泰：報告委員，減班休息還有因為景氣、大環境的關係，其中還有一部分是因為關稅的關係，勞動部都把它分析出來，我們會針對關稅的部分特別加以重視，但是整個大環境減班休息的，我們還是用一般的勞工政策替他做一些紓困上的解決。"],["洪部長申翰：跟委員再補充，每一個通報減班休息的廠商，勞動部都會親自聯繫跟拜訪，去了解到底發生什麼事情、需要什麼協助，我們可以投入什麼資源？每一個通報減班休息的廠商，我們都會主動聯繫。"],["陳委員亭妃：你們可能要更積極跟他們聯繫，也把這樣的訊息通報每一個產業別，他們都有工會嘛！讓他們知道政府在這個區塊是有協助勞工的諮詢，甚至協助，這個部分……"],["洪部長申翰：我們已經規劃接下來要去每一個可能會受影響的工協會，希望讓他們都知道我們有提供這樣的資源。"],["陳委員亭妃：好，速度可能要快一點。我再就教院長，我們把所有的產業別弄出來，可能會比較直接影響的就是蝴蝶蘭、吳郭魚、茶葉、鬼頭刀、毛豆、鱸魚，這是農業的部分。其實我們再把它細分，說真的，我們的蝴蝶蘭最主要的對手是荷蘭，因為荷蘭的關稅比我們低，所以我覺得蝴蝶蘭可能是我們的重中之重。"],["卓院長榮泰：確實。"],["陳委員亭妃：它的產地在臺南，大家都疼得要死，所以這個部分要拜託。再來，吳郭魚的產業，基本上因為我們主要競爭對手是中國，當然中國關稅是55%，55%是還沒疊加，但是以這個關稅的基礎來講，它是55%。茶葉的部分，基本上，因為我們的競爭對手跟我們都差不多，所以我覺得我們還要細分競爭對手……"],["鄭副院長麗君：競爭對手的優劣勢比較。"],["陳委員亭妃：對，一定要比較，否則大家會亂掉，說我們受害的這麼嚴重，其實產業都說只要跟別人有一樣的競爭基礎，所以我相信臺灣撐得過，因為我們有條件可以去跟人家拼競爭。我們擔心的是，像蝴蝶蘭，荷蘭就比我們關稅低這麼多，因為關稅，要出去的時候競爭力就已經少了人家一節了，所以我認為我們還要把每一個產業的細項分出來。","還有工具機產業也是一樣，為什麼工具機產業會哀哀叫？因為我們的工具機產業主要對手是德國、日本、韓國，他們的關稅都比我們低，所以我覺得我們要依照產業別特別再把它挑出來加重協助，這才是比較重要的。我們也認為手工具產業、水五金產業、重電產業，還有塑膠產業都可能受到衝擊，可是因為競爭對手都是中國，所以相對的壓力就減了，我覺得我們應該要把這個訊息丟出來，否則大家都不知道。可能自己在這個產業的也未必那麼清楚，都不知道競爭對手是誰，都覺得美國關稅這個樣子，我是不是就失去了競爭力？其實所有的產業都說只要跟別人是一樣的關稅，就有把握可以贏過別人，這是臺灣的驕傲啊！那我們要怎麼讓他有這樣的條件？就是我們現在要去幫他的，從農業、從中小企業這樣的角度，所以我覺得這是我們現在要做的，也是我要拜託院長的，我們的資訊要讓產業更清楚，讓他們有信心。你跟中國拼，而中國是55%，你在怕什麼？這樣的話，它會更有信心。如果對手的競爭關稅是比較低的，那我們就要給它更多的幫忙。所以這個部分院長……"],["卓院長榮泰：兩句話答復委員。我早上的報告裡面說到工業方面：工具機、手工具、水五金、重電、塑膠，農業方面的蝴蝶蘭、毛豆、鬼頭刀，以及委員剛剛所說的，受的衝擊比較大，所以我們用各種的金融支持、產業支持等方面來協助，讓它的衝擊減少。因為我們認為這個地方我們的競爭力可能會減少。"],["陳委員亭妃：要拜託院長。"],["卓院長榮泰：但是對於其他的，競爭對手稅率比我們高，或是產品沒有我們好，或許我們的競爭力是不錯的，我說過政府還是幫助它，不會因為你競爭力好，讓你自己去拚，政府不能做啦啦隊，我的意思就在這裡。我們還是跟你站在一起，跟產業站在一起，同時把它拚出來。"],["陳委員亭妃：說真的，我們的產業，我們很驕傲，他們認為只要政府給他們好的競爭空間，他們是絕對有信心可以打贏這場仗的。"],["卓院長榮泰：政府也要用力的支持。"],["陳委員亭妃：好，謝謝。"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝陳委員，謝謝院長、副院長。","接下來，請賴士葆委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":158,"meet_id":"院會-11-3-26","speakers":["江啟臣","吳思瑤","傅崐萁","許宇甄","林倩綺","陳昭姿","王定宇","黃珊珊","羅美玲","鍾佳濱","羅智強","陳冠廷","高金素梅","李坤城","黃健豪","陳亭妃","賴士葆","林岱樺","徐巧芯","何欣純","楊瓊瓔","陳培瑜","牛煦庭"],"page_start":45,"meetingDate":["2025-08-25"],"gazette_id":"1147401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1147401_00003","1147401_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期第26次會議紀錄","content":"行政院院長提出「臺美關稅談判之進程、方針、原則及臺灣產業可能遭受之衝擊影響評估」專案\n報告並備質詢─詢答完畢─","agenda_id":"1147401_00003"}}}