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00:01:05,564\n然後呢侯永瑜就拍拍胸部沒有關係新北市來幫你們出我就覺得很奇怪啊請教一下這個主席長這個明年給這個地方的這個統籌分配款有沒有增加他們有沒有錢來付這個電費啊\n\n4\n00:01:07,659 --> 00:01:34,642\n明年因為財化法的關係我們給地方的統籌分配稅款會增加4165億那它原來就有4676億兩個合起來就8000多億然後財化法又規定一般性補助款要維持然後縣市又要求希望我們計劃型補助那個補助的比率不能變動還有已經合訂的要照常執行這是我們沒辦法負擔的\n\n5\n00:01:35,202 --> 00:01:48,950\n所以這個部分一定是要把原來地方制度法規定屬於地方自治的事項回歸給地方去編列這才有辦法解決這個按照地方制度法的第18條第19條還有國民教育法的第8條的規定\n\n6\n00:01:52,892 --> 00:02:12,707\n轄區內的學校經費是屬於地方政府的職責但是因為過去中央錢比較多所以我們有補助地方但是如果現在地方拿到統籌分配款比過去多了比如像台北市比過去多了444億新北市比過去多了410億那他們有沒有錢來繳這個電費\n\n7\n00:02:16,457 --> 00:02:36,394\n他是絕對有錢的像如果說台北市的話我光是統籌分配稅款加我現在目前一般性社福的分配如果光是這兩項他就多出一百多億計劃型的部分還沒有合但是沒有辦法還沒有合給他這個部分但是他光是這兩項加起來就增加一百多億\n\n8\n00:02:36,894 --> 00:02:55,360\n所以主席長我跟你講這是所有我們所有的內閣部會首長都在這邊我就跟你講現在不論是蔣萬安侯友宜或是盧秀燕他就一條一條拿出來跟你講他說他以前過去都是中央編的為什麼現在變成地方編但是沒關係地方咬緊牙關也要編\n\n9\n00:02:56,320 --> 00:03:16,005\n但是其實是中央給地方的錢啊就本來是中央的錢變成這個地方的統售分配款地方的統售分配款也增加了所以本來要由地方來出的事這些錢不是就應該由地方來出嗎這就是我們當初來修財化法的時候一直提到就是說我們的財權跟事權一定要分清楚不要拿錢不辦事嘛但是我跟你講你們現在吃虧了\n\n10\n00:03:17,985 --> 00:03:33,195\n現在他就會跟所有的地方的不論那些校長不論那些地方那些人就跟你們講這些本來是中央要給的經費他現在就跟你講啦租金的補貼啦學校的電費啦弱勢學生的營養午餐費啦中央以後都不出了\n\n11\n00:03:34,176 --> 00:03:59,677\n以後由地方自己出那明明就是地方有增加這些經費但是他不會跟你講所以我要求主計處你們要把本來由這個中央出的現在因為統籌分配款地方增加了由地方出的有哪一些是由以前中央出現在改由地方出但是那是因為你們統籌分配款增加了把它一條一條列出來好不好你們有這個準備了嗎有有嗎有這些資料了嗎\n\n12\n00:04:01,279 --> 00:04:28,998\n如果有這些資料你給我一份我跟你講接下來像蔣萬安這一種的跑去說啊中央不出了我地方出會越來越多像蔣萬安這種的那原本就是因為地方統籌分款增加了嘛增加了你有足夠的費用可以去處理這件事情但是呢你們要做好防衛不然以後一條一條出來講都說中央不出了地方出那原本地方就有錢出了嘛因為財務法已經通過新的財務法通過了嘛把這資料準備一份給我謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n149\t1291\t謝謝主席 我們請主席長陳主席長請\n20799\t47647\t委員好來 主席長好 辛苦了那今天這個台北市長蔣萬安他去行政院開這個院會他很生氣他說為什麼中央要裝冷氣啊那在電費要的地方來出然後新北市長侯友宜呢在上禮拜跟了一大堆的這個校長講他說你們校長啊你們可能不知道接下來的這個冷氣中央不出錢了你們要由學校自己來負責\n49417\t65564\t然後呢 侯永瑜就拍拍胸部沒有關係 新北市來幫你們出我就覺得很奇怪啊請教一下這個主席長這個明年給這個地方的這個統籌分配款有沒有增加他們有沒有錢來付這個電費啊\n67659\t94642\t明年因為財化法的關係我們給地方的統籌分配稅款會增加4165億那它原來就有4676億兩個合起來就8000多億然後財化法又規定一般性補助款要維持然後縣市又要求希望我們計劃型補助那個補助的比率不能變動還有已經合訂的要照常執行這是我們沒辦法負擔的\n95202\t108950\t所以這個部分一定是要把原來地方制度法規定屬於地方自治的事項回歸給地方去編列這才有辦法解決這個按照地方制度法的第18條第19條還有國民教育法的第8條的規定\n112892\t132707\t轄區內的學校經費是屬於地方政府的職責但是因為過去中央錢比較多所以我們有補助地方但是如果現在地方拿到統籌分配款比過去多了比如像台北市比過去多了444億新北市比過去多了410億那他們有沒有錢來繳這個電費\n136457\t156394\t他是絕對有錢的像如果說台北市的話我光是統籌分配稅款加我現在目前一般性社福的分配如果光是這兩項他就多出一百多億計劃型的部分還沒有合但是沒有辦法還沒有合給他這個部分但是他光是這兩項加起來就增加一百多億\n156894\t175360\t所以主席長我跟你講這是所有我們所有的內閣部會首長都在這邊我就跟你講現在不論是蔣萬安侯友宜或是盧秀燕他就一條一條拿出來跟你講他說他以前過去都是中央編的為什麼現在變成地方編但是沒關係地方咬緊牙關也要編\n176320\t196005\t但是其實是中央給地方的錢啊就本來是中央的錢變成這個地方的統售分配款地方的統售分配款也增加了所以本來要由地方來出的事這些錢不是就應該由地方來出嗎這就是我們當初來修財化法的時候一直提到就是說我們的財權跟事權一定要分清楚不要拿錢不辦事嘛但是我跟你講你們現在吃虧了\n197985\t213195\t現在他就會跟所有的地方的不論那些校長不論那些地方那些人就跟你們講這些本來是中央要給的經費他現在就跟你講啦租金的補貼啦學校的電費啦弱勢學生的營養午餐費啦中央以後都不出了\n214176\t239677\t以後由地方自己出那明明就是地方有增加這些經費但是他不會跟你講所以我要求主計處你們要把本來由這個中央出的現在因為統籌分配款地方增加了由地方出的有哪一些是由以前中央出現在改由地方出但是那是因為你們統籌分配款增加了把它一條一條列出來好不好你們有這個準備了嗎有有嗎有這些資料了嗎\n241279\t268998\t如果有這些資料你給我一份我跟你講接下來像蔣萬安這一種的跑去說啊中央不出了我地方出會越來越多像蔣萬安這種的那原本就是因為地方統籌分款增加了嘛增加了你有足夠的費用可以去處理這件事情但是呢你們要做好防衛不然以後一條一條出來講都說中央不出了地方出那原本地方就有錢出了嘛因為財務法已經通過新的財務法通過了嘛把這資料準備一份給我謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席 我們請主席長陳主席長請\n委員好來 主席長好 辛苦了那今天這個台北市長蔣萬安他去行政院開這個院會他很生氣他說為什麼中央要裝冷氣啊那在電費要的地方來出然後新北市長侯友宜呢在上禮拜跟了一大堆的這個校長講他說你們校長啊你們可能不知道接下來的這個冷氣中央不出錢了你們要由學校自己來負責\n然後呢 侯永瑜就拍拍胸部沒有關係 新北市來幫你們出我就覺得很奇怪啊請教一下這個主席長這個明年給這個地方的這個統籌分配款有沒有增加他們有沒有錢來付這個電費啊\n明年因為財化法的關係我們給地方的統籌分配稅款會增加4165億那它原來就有4676億兩個合起來就8000多億然後財化法又規定一般性補助款要維持然後縣市又要求希望我們計劃型補助那個補助的比率不能變動還有已經合訂的要照常執行這是我們沒辦法負擔的\n所以這個部分一定是要把原來地方制度法規定屬於地方自治的事項回歸給地方去編列這才有辦法解決這個按照地方制度法的第18條第19條還有國民教育法的第8條的規定\n轄區內的學校經費是屬於地方政府的職責但是因為過去中央錢比較多所以我們有補助地方但是如果現在地方拿到統籌分配款比過去多了比如像台北市比過去多了444億新北市比過去多了410億那他們有沒有錢來繳這個電費\n他是絕對有錢的像如果說台北市的話我光是統籌分配稅款加我現在目前一般性社福的分配如果光是這兩項他就多出一百多億計劃型的部分還沒有合但是沒有辦法還沒有合給他這個部分但是他光是這兩項加起來就增加一百多億\n所以主席長我跟你講這是所有我們所有的內閣部會首長都在這邊我就跟你講現在不論是蔣萬安侯友宜或是盧秀燕他就一條一條拿出來跟你講他說他以前過去都是中央編的為什麼現在變成地方編但是沒關係地方咬緊牙關也要編\n但是其實是中央給地方的錢啊就本來是中央的錢變成這個地方的統售分配款地方的統售分配款也增加了所以本來要由地方來出的事這些錢不是就應該由地方來出嗎這就是我們當初來修財化法的時候一直提到就是說我們的財權跟事權一定要分清楚不要拿錢不辦事嘛但是我跟你講你們現在吃虧了\n現在他就會跟所有的地方的不論那些校長不論那些地方那些人就跟你們講這些本來是中央要給的經費他現在就跟你講啦租金的補貼啦學校的電費啦弱勢學生的營養午餐費啦中央以後都不出了\n以後由地方自己出那明明就是地方有增加這些經費但是他不會跟你講所以我要求主計處你們要把本來由這個中央出的現在因為統籌分配款地方增加了由地方出的有哪一些是由以前中央出現在改由地方出但是那是因為你們統籌分配款增加了把它一條一條列出來好不好你們有這個準備了嗎有有嗎有這些資料了嗎\n如果有這些資料你給我一份我跟你講接下來像蔣萬安這一種的跑去說啊中央不出了我地方出會越來越多像蔣萬安這種的那原本就是因為地方統籌分款增加了嘛增加了你有足夠的費用可以去處理這件事情但是呢你們要做好防衛不然以後一條一條出來講都說中央不出了地方出那原本地方就有錢出了嘛因為財務法已經通過新的財務法通過了嘛把這資料準備一份給我謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.149 --> 00:01.291\n謝謝主席我們請主席長陳主席長請\n\n00:20.799 --> 00:47.647\n委員好來主席長好辛苦了那今天這個台北市長蔣萬安他去行政院開這個院會他很生氣他說為什麼中央要裝冷氣啊那在電費要的地方來出然後新北市長侯友宜呢在上禮拜跟了一大堆的這個校長講他說你們校長啊你們可能不知道接下來的這個冷氣中央不出錢了你們要由學校自己來負責\n\n00:49.417 --> 01:05.564\n然後呢侯永瑜就拍拍胸部沒有關係新北市來幫你們出我就覺得很奇怪啊請教一下這個主席長這個明年給這個地方的這個統籌分配款有沒有增加他們有沒有錢來付這個電費啊\n\n01:07.659 --> 01:34.642\n明年因為財化法的關係我們給地方的統籌分配稅款會增加4165億那它原來就有4676億兩個合起來就8000多億然後財化法又規定一般性補助款要維持然後縣市又要求希望我們計劃型補助那個補助的比率不能變動還有已經合訂的要照常執行這是我們沒辦法負擔的\n\n01:35.202 --> 01:48.950\n所以這個部分一定是要把原來地方制度法規定屬於地方自治的事項回歸給地方去編列這才有辦法解決這個按照地方制度法的第18條第19條還有國民教育法的第8條的規定\n\n01:52.892 --> 02:12.707\n轄區內的學校經費是屬於地方政府的職責但是因為過去中央錢比較多所以我們有補助地方但是如果現在地方拿到統籌分配款比過去多了比如像台北市比過去多了444億新北市比過去多了410億那他們有沒有錢來繳這個電費\n\n02:16.457 --> 02:36.394\n他是絕對有錢的像如果說台北市的話我光是統籌分配稅款加我現在目前一般性社福的分配如果光是這兩項他就多出一百多億計劃型的部分還沒有合但是沒有辦法還沒有合給他這個部分但是他光是這兩項加起來就增加一百多億\n\n02:36.894 --> 02:55.360\n所以主席長我跟你講這是所有我們所有的內閣部會首長都在這邊我就跟你講現在不論是蔣萬安侯友宜或是盧秀燕他就一條一條拿出來跟你講他說他以前過去都是中央編的為什麼現在變成地方編但是沒關係地方咬緊牙關也要編\n\n02:56.320 --> 03:16.005\n但是其實是中央給地方的錢啊就本來是中央的錢變成這個地方的統售分配款地方的統售分配款也增加了所以本來要由地方來出的事這些錢不是就應該由地方來出嗎這就是我們當初來修財化法的時候一直提到就是說我們的財權跟事權一定要分清楚不要拿錢不辦事嘛但是我跟你講你們現在吃虧了\n\n03:17.985 --> 03:33.195\n現在他就會跟所有的地方的不論那些校長不論那些地方那些人就跟你們講這些本來是中央要給的經費他現在就跟你講啦租金的補貼啦學校的電費啦弱勢學生的營養午餐費啦中央以後都不出了\n\n03:34.176 --> 03:59.677\n以後由地方自己出那明明就是地方有增加這些經費但是他不會跟你講所以我要求主計處你們要把本來由這個中央出的現在因為統籌分配款地方增加了由地方出的有哪一些是由以前中央出現在改由地方出但是那是因為你們統籌分配款增加了把它一條一條列出來好不好你們有這個準備了嗎有有嗎有這些資料了嗎\n\n04:01.279 --> 04:28.998\n如果有這些資料你給我一份我跟你講接下來像蔣萬安這一種的跑去說啊中央不出了我地方出會越來越多像蔣萬安這種的那原本就是因為地方統籌分款增加了嘛增加了你有足夠的費用可以去處理這件事情但是呢你們要做好防衛不然以後一條一條出來講都說中央不出了地方出那原本地方就有錢出了嘛因為財務法已經通過新的財務法通過了嘛把這資料準備一份給我謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.149,"end":1.291,"text":"謝謝主席 我們請主席長陳主席長請"},{"start":20.799,"end":47.647,"text":"委員好來 主席長好 辛苦了那今天這個台北市長蔣萬安他去行政院開這個院會他很生氣他說為什麼中央要裝冷氣啊那在電費要的地方來出然後新北市長侯友宜呢在上禮拜跟了一大堆的這個校長講他說你們校長啊你們可能不知道接下來的這個冷氣中央不出錢了你們要由學校自己來負責"},{"start":49.417,"end":65.564,"text":"然後呢 侯永瑜就拍拍胸部沒有關係 新北市來幫你們出我就覺得很奇怪啊請教一下這個主席長這個明年給這個地方的這個統籌分配款有沒有增加他們有沒有錢來付這個電費啊"},{"start":67.659,"end":94.642,"text":"明年因為財化法的關係我們給地方的統籌分配稅款會增加4165億那它原來就有4676億兩個合起來就8000多億然後財化法又規定一般性補助款要維持然後縣市又要求希望我們計劃型補助那個補助的比率不能變動還有已經合訂的要照常執行這是我們沒辦法負擔的"},{"start":95.202,"end":108.95,"text":"所以這個部分一定是要把原來地方制度法規定屬於地方自治的事項回歸給地方去編列這才有辦法解決這個按照地方制度法的第18條第19條還有國民教育法的第8條的規定"},{"start":112.892,"end":132.707,"text":"轄區內的學校經費是屬於地方政府的職責但是因為過去中央錢比較多所以我們有補助地方但是如果現在地方拿到統籌分配款比過去多了比如像台北市比過去多了444億新北市比過去多了410億那他們有沒有錢來繳這個電費"},{"start":136.457,"end":156.394,"text":"他是絕對有錢的像如果說台北市的話我光是統籌分配稅款加我現在目前一般性社福的分配如果光是這兩項他就多出一百多億計劃型的部分還沒有合但是沒有辦法還沒有合給他這個部分但是他光是這兩項加起來就增加一百多億"},{"start":156.894,"end":175.36,"text":"所以主席長我跟你講這是所有我們所有的內閣部會首長都在這邊我就跟你講現在不論是蔣萬安侯友宜或是盧秀燕他就一條一條拿出來跟你講他說他以前過去都是中央編的為什麼現在變成地方編但是沒關係地方咬緊牙關也要編"},{"start":176.32,"end":196.005,"text":"但是其實是中央給地方的錢啊就本來是中央的錢變成這個地方的統售分配款地方的統售分配款也增加了所以本來要由地方來出的事這些錢不是就應該由地方來出嗎這就是我們當初來修財化法的時候一直提到就是說我們的財權跟事權一定要分清楚不要拿錢不辦事嘛但是我跟你講你們現在吃虧了"},{"start":197.985,"end":213.195,"text":"現在他就會跟所有的地方的不論那些校長不論那些地方那些人就跟你們講這些本來是中央要給的經費他現在就跟你講啦租金的補貼啦學校的電費啦弱勢學生的營養午餐費啦中央以後都不出了"},{"start":214.176,"end":239.677,"text":"以後由地方自己出那明明就是地方有增加這些經費但是他不會跟你講所以我要求主計處你們要把本來由這個中央出的現在因為統籌分配款地方增加了由地方出的有哪一些是由以前中央出現在改由地方出但是那是因為你們統籌分配款增加了把它一條一條列出來好不好你們有這個準備了嗎有有嗎有這些資料了嗎"},{"start":241.279,"end":268.998,"text":"如果有這些資料你給我一份我跟你講接下來像蔣萬安這一種的跑去說啊中央不出了我地方出會越來越多像蔣萬安這種的那原本就是因為地方統籌分款增加了嘛增加了你有足夠的費用可以去處理這件事情但是呢你們要做好防衛不然以後一條一條出來講都說中央不出了地方出那原本地方就有錢出了嘛因為財務法已經通過新的財務法通過了嘛把這資料準備一份給我謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":830,"blocks":[["李委員坤城：（11時35分）謝謝主席，我們請主計長。"],["主席：請陳主計長。"],["陳主計長淑姿：委員好。"],["李委員坤城：主計長好，辛苦了。今天臺北市長蔣萬安去行政院開院會，他很生氣，他說為什麼中央要裝冷氣，電費要由地方來出？新北市長侯友宜在上禮拜跟一大堆的校長講，他說校長你們可能不知道，接下來的冷氣中央不出錢了，要由學校自己來負責，然後侯友宜就拍拍胸脯說：沒有關係，新北市來幫你們出。我就覺得很奇怪，請教一下主計長，明年給地方的統籌分配款有沒有增加？"],["陳主計長淑姿：有。"],["李委員坤城：他們有沒有錢來付這個電費？"],["陳主計長淑姿：明年因為財劃法的關係，我們給地方的統籌分配稅款會增加4,165億，原來就有4,676億，兩個合起來就有八千多億。而財劃法又規定一般性補助款要維持，縣市又要求、希望計畫型補助的補助比率不能變動，以及已經核定的要照常執行，這是我們沒辦法負擔的，所以這個部分一定是要把原來地方制度法規定屬於地方自治的事項回歸給地方去編列，這才有辦法解決。"],["李委員坤城：按照地方制度法第十八條、第十九條及國民教育法第八條的規定，轄區內的學校經費是屬於地方政府的職責，但是因為過去中央錢比較多，所以有補助地方，但是如果現在地方拿到的統籌分配款比過去多，比如臺北市比過去多了444億、新北市比過去多了410億，他們有沒有錢來繳這個電費？"],["陳主計長淑姿：他們是絕對有錢的，像臺北市的話，光是統籌分配稅款加上目前一般性社福的分配，光是這兩項，它就多出一百多億，雖然計畫型的部分還沒有核給它，但光是這兩項加起來就增加一百多億，絕對是有能力去……"],["李委員坤城：主計長，我跟你講，所有的內閣、部會首長都在這邊，我就跟你講，現在不論是蔣萬安、侯友宜或盧秀燕，他就一條一條拿出來講，他說過去都是中央編的，為什麼現在變成地方編？但是沒關係，地方咬緊牙關也要編。但其實是中央給地方的錢，本來是中央的錢，後來變成地方的統籌分配款，地方的統籌分配款也增加了，所以本來要由地方來做的事，這些錢不就應該由地方來出嗎？"],["陳主計長淑姿：是。"],["李委員坤城：這就是我們當初在修財劃法的時候所一直提到的，就是財權跟事權一定要分清楚，不要拿錢不辦事嘛！但是我跟你講，你們現在吃虧了，所以他就跟所有地方的那些校長或地方的那些人講，這些本來是中央要給的經費，他現在就講，租金的補貼、學校的電費及弱勢學生的營養午餐費，中央以後都不出了，以後由地方自己出，明明地方有增加這些經費，但是他不會跟他們講。所以我要求主計總處，你們要把本來由中央出的，現在因為統籌分配款地方增加了，由地方出的有哪一些是以前由中央出，現在改由地方出，但那是因為他們的統籌分配增加了，把它一條一條列出來，好不好？你們有這個準備了嗎？"],["陳主計長淑姿：有。"],["李委員坤城：有嗎？有這些資料了嗎？"],["陳主計長淑姿：我們正在準備。"],["李委員坤城：如果有這些資料，你給我一份，我跟你講，接下來像蔣萬安這一種的，跑去說中央不出了，由地方出，會越來越多像蔣萬安這種的，原本就是因為地方統籌分配款增加了，增加了就有足夠的費用可以去處理這件事情，但是你們要做好防衛，不然以後一條一條出來講，都說中央不出的地方出，但原本地方就有錢出，因為新的財劃法通過了嘛！把這資料準備一份給我，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝李坤城委員的質詢。","下一位會請李彥秀委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":290,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-3-20,15,35,19,22,23,36,26-1","speakers":["賴士葆","林德福","吳秉叡","陳亭妃","賴瑞隆","郭國文","林思銘","李昆澤","李柏毅","黃國昌","柯志恩","萬美玲","鄭正鈐","洪孟楷","張智倫","賴惠員","鍾佳濱","吳沛憶","張啓楷","王育敏","張宏陸","劉書彬","王世堅","黃秀芳","林俊憲","李坤城","李彥秀","蘇巧慧","鄭天財Sra 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