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\"們\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"努\", \"start\": 773.992, \"end\": 774.052, \"score\": 0.666}, {\"word\": \"力\", \"start\": 774.052, \"end\": 777.255, \"score\": 0.887}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"王\", \"start\": 777.255, \"end\": 777.415, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 777.415, \"end\": 778.356, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 778.356, \"end\": 778.496, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 778.496, \"end\": 779.177, \"score\": 0.848}, {\"word\": \"接\", \"start\": 779.177, \"end\": 779.317, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"下\", \"start\": 779.317, \"end\": 779.617, \"score\": 0.839}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 779.617, \"end\": 780.198, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"葛\", \"start\": 780.198, \"end\": 780.398, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 780.398, \"end\": 780.558, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"君\", \"start\": 780.558, \"end\": 781.079, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 781.079, \"end\": 781.099, \"score\": 0.101}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:01,758 --> 00:00:04,159\n王委員可以匆匆攏攏沒有關係好謝謝主席我就照你說的匆匆攏攏對你來講有刃有餘我先喘口氣\n\n2\n00:00:29,629 --> 00:00:45,160\n金管會不要這個匆匆忙忙就好好謝謝主席我請金管會彭主委好我們請彭主委你好彭主委是\n\n3\n00:00:46,243 --> 00:01:06,141\n我們行政院卓院長施政報告開宗明義第一章就是寫要把我們台灣打造成為亞洲資產管理中心這非常的好但是我們有一個大的問題我記得在您一上任那時候我就去年六月我就跟你提\n\n4\n00:01:06,781 --> 00:01:30,937\n就是說我們國內保險業可運用資金的餘額高達35兆之多其中70%有25兆竟然是放在海外購買國外的債券或者基金诶諸位如果說我們呼籲外國把資產\n\n5\n00:01:32,799 --> 00:01:35,933\n交給我們台灣管理結果我們台灣自己70%\n\n6\n00:01:39,264 --> 00:02:02,927\n的資金是用在國外買債券基金那我們對人家怎麼說服我們自己70%給別人管然後要別人說你的資產給我們台灣管這不是很怪嗎那我們要說服哪些國家說服非洲嗎肯亞嗎這是很奇怪的事其次\n\n7\n00:02:04,764 --> 00:02:24,298\n這購買海外的債券跟基金當時我們就說到有兩大風險一個戰爭一個匯率嘛結果這兩大就在我們講的去年之後沒幾個月都發生了戰爭俄國大家知道我們國內有三大受險公司五大受險公司\n\n8\n00:02:25,178 --> 00:02:49,258\n買了俄國1380億的債券後來陸續到期到期的部分俄國的答覆很簡單等我戰爭打完了再來算這筆錢戰爭的因素跑出來了匯率在今年的5月我們對美金的匯率那個台幣大幅度的\n\n9\n00:02:50,530 --> 00:02:59,698\n升值的結果光單月將近兩千億兩千億的損失耶天啊所以\n\n10\n00:03:02,371 --> 00:03:27,669\n戰爭跟匯率我們都碰到了所以當時當時我就說我們海外資金上限70%可以到我們的授權資金有70%的上限可以到海外去這個部分我們應該調降我們應該適度的趕快導引這些保險資金讓它回到我們台灣那結果當時\n\n11\n00:03:31,462 --> 00:03:59,411\n貴會的答覆是說有啦找了這些保險公司談這些保險公司說兩個原因第一個原因說我們台灣利率太低第二個台灣市場太小他們意思是說他們也是情不得已出去但是主委你不曉得記不記得當時我就說這兩個原因都不成理由啦第一個你說我們台灣利率低我承認我們台灣利率是低但是\n\n12\n00:04:00,529 --> 00:04:14,045\n你這些受險公司也是以我們台灣這麼低的利率下去當期望值做成產品賣給我們國內的保險的大眾所以利率低你不能講\n\n13\n00:04:16,422 --> 00:04:44,112\n你期望值也低你的產品也低嗎不是嗎第二個他們說我們台灣的市場太小所以當時主委我就拜託貴會後來我也拜託財政部就是說我請貴會跟財政部都要趕快輔導我們國內這些需要建設的部會比方說內政部比方說交通部比方說衛福部衛福部他們有長照啊\n\n14\n00:04:45,492 --> 00:05:08,491\n交通部有各項的交通建設鐵路公路高速公路各地方的捷運這都是需要資金的啊我們引導他們進來我們設交通債券交通公債內政我們有社會住宅等等嘛那不管設宅\n\n15\n00:05:10,539 --> 00:05:38,055\n長照或者未來開通的捷運自償性都很高也付得起這些利息所以我說要趕快做所以我今天要問你的問題就是說到底這一年來我們輔導了有哪一些部會有沒有去準備好去成立哪一些建設公債建設基金有還是沒有第二點這個讓保險資金去海外\n\n16\n00:05:39,056 --> 00:05:52,446\n的這個比例是不是要從70%下降下調因為在國外看起來這不可思議耶中國啊我們對岸中國跟我們競爭的中國只有2%我們70%韓國8.3%美國12%只有日本高一點日本高一點也不到我們13日本21.6天啊\n\n17\n00:06:05,583 --> 00:06:29,034\n只有我們台灣70%這麼高所以這兩個問題我想請教主委有做了嗎謝謝委員給我這個機會來回答這個問題其實我們也很希望我們壽險業長期要降低海外的投資的比重因為我們現在壽險面臨到一個叫做避別的不匹配\n\n18\n00:06:30,114 --> 00:06:57,528\n因為他的負債跟他資產不一致所以會面臨到匯率跟利率的風險這是一個但是因為他已經長期投在海外不可能短期就把它匯回來台灣有剛剛委員提到很重要台灣沒有這麼多的工具像比如說他們投的最重要的投固定收益現在大概已經將近20兆的這樣一個金額在台灣其實我們整年所有的公債跟債券市場沒辦法很快吸納所以我們想法就至少你新錢\n\n19\n00:06:58,709 --> 00:07:26,556\n每年他會收到的薪錢大概是兩兆左右的錢我們盡量找工具剛剛委員提到我們做了什麼比如說我們也希望說能夠有一個比如說第一個我們鬆綁法規讓我們的受請公司的這個資金本來交給國外投資能夠交給自己的投信來投資這是一個再來就是我們的兆元投資計畫裡面我們也提出很多很多方案我們甚至請交易所櫃買成立一個資本服務團去協助這些公司力單位去證券化債券化\n\n20\n00:07:27,976 --> 00:07:49,330\n然後還有像很多地方這種發綠債那我們希望說盡量把這個政府剛剛委員提到比如說假設我們也曾經嘗試過把高速公路的收費能不能把它做個證券化也都在跟各個部會在做協商因為這個部分還要花點時間主委我很感謝貴會你們有做這些努力那成果呢到現在成果怎麼樣\n\n21\n00:07:50,030 --> 00:08:05,975\n其實我們現在陸陸續續有一些啦但是還沒辦法吸納我們的這麼大的受險資金因為很多部會他的心態他就是變於形式嘛反正要建設的錢很簡單預算編了就有啊\n\n22\n00:08:10,185 --> 00:08:29,621\n大家便於形式嘛就從大筆一揮從預算下去編但是我們不應該只是單向的從預算不是這樣嗎我們應該適度的因為需要有時間嘛慢慢的就像你剛剛講不能一下子回來他也不可能一下子回來但是我們每年導引3%5%\n\n23\n00:08:32,303 --> 00:08:59,859\n這對我們黨預祝這些資金回來建設我們自己台灣這才是正確的嘛不是嗎所以沒有具體的結果就對了現在等於說因為受選人資金整體是非常龐大國內要找尋這些涉及到公建的案例確實是沒有那麼容易啦過去蔡英文總統的時候我看她過去那八年他們也是到後來才警覺這個事情嚴重他們\n\n24\n00:09:01,144 --> 00:09:06,710\n有去說服交通部有成立了七檔交通建設的\n\n25\n00:09:08,731 --> 00:09:35,128\n資金啦債券雖然那個金額不算大都大概數十億之多但是聊勝於無這是一個開始嘛他們有七檔八年做了七檔所以我希望在你這麼專業認真之下你帶領的團隊能夠趕快跟我們這些相關部會去做這也是我們努力的方向那其次就是關於這個詐騙的部分這個\n\n26\n00:09:37,950 --> 00:09:46,739\n我們這些逃逸的外勞還有逃逸失聯甚至工作渠道的外勞那他們就把這個戶頭就賣給這些詐騙集團那本來這本來數字不大從2022年的521案\n\n27\n00:09:57,550 --> 00:10:26,585\n逐年增加9211862一直到今年6月統計已經超過2000戶2054戶啦那當然我們也祭出重罰說這個可以把他罰100萬以下這個最高會判3年以下可是可是主委光是重罰甚至關他都沒用他人都出境啦人都出境那難道我們要怎樣\n\n28\n00:10:27,165 --> 00:10:49,946\n要去引渡他來我們台灣嗎這都是不可能的事情所以我認為這些事情知識體大我也詢問了我們相關金管會的同仁們他們是說有找勞動部下去談但是我覺得這個部分可能談得還不夠徹底我覺得當然勞動部他似乎不積極\n\n29\n00:10:51,247 --> 00:11:17,938\n不積極所以我希望跟勞動部談你們跟他們談清楚就是說在這件事情上面開戶所謂的外勞他們的自己財產管理的這一部分的權利人權啊這個應該擺在一邊為什麼因為不管他是期限已經到了要回國或者他都已經失聯了簡單的方式就把這個戶頭切斷就好嘛\n\n30\n00:11:20,259 --> 00:11:46,709\n切斷就好人家失聯逃逸的他失聯逃逸他還不敢用這個戶頭啊那請他的雇主也一定現金給他嘛不是嗎所以這樣子的外勞他剛好順便把這個戶頭賣掉就算了所以這樣子的情況下不要在那邊一直考量說外勞也有他的人權他有他的權利去管理他的資金\n\n31\n00:11:47,849 --> 00:12:14,755\n這個一切都在他失聯之後甚至期滿回國以後就要簡單明瞭把它斷線這個也可以載入到勞動部載入到跟外勞引進的合約裡面就可以寫這麼清楚好不好我希望你們跟勞動部因為我知道現在在阻撓的都勞動部啊不積極的都勞動部你跟勞動部講清楚\n\n32\n00:12:17,184 --> 00:12:40,379\n說這個事情知識體大不要再用那些有的沒有的藉口就是不要把簡單的事情複雜化好不好好謝謝我們會朝著努力我們也看到我們是從去年我們就開始有對接移民署這些的外籍的那個警示帳戶的比例從高峰已經開始往下走那我們會來持續跟其他部會一起來努力\n\n33\n00:12:41,199 --> 00:13:01,099\n我剛看到的數字我念的數字都是往上爬當然有往下的數字當然是好啦八月已經下降下來的因為我們管控措施也慢慢看到一些成效我們會努力謝謝謝謝王委員謝謝主委接下來我們請葛如君委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n1758\t4159\t王委員可以匆匆攏攏沒有關係好 謝謝主席我就照你說的匆匆攏攏對你來講 有刃有餘我先喘口氣\n29629\t45160\t金管會不要這個匆匆忙忙就好好 謝謝主席我請金管會彭主委好 我們請彭主委你好彭主委是\n46243\t66141\t我們行政院卓院長施政報告開宗明義第一章就是寫要把我們台灣打造成為亞洲資產管理中心這非常的好但是我們有一個大的問題我記得在您一上任那時候我就去年六月我就跟你提\n66781\t90937\t就是說我們國內保險業可運用資金的餘額高達35兆之多其中70%有25兆竟然是放在海外購買國外的債券或者基金诶 諸位如果說我們呼籲外國把資產\n92799\t95933\t交給我們台灣管理結果我們台灣自己70%\n99264\t122927\t的資金是用在國外買債券基金那我們對人家怎麼說服我們自己70%給別人管然後要別人說你的資產給我們台灣管這不是很怪嗎那我們要說服哪些國家說服非洲嗎 肯亞嗎這是很奇怪的事其次\n124764\t144298\t這購買海外的債券跟基金當時我們就說到有兩大風險一個戰爭一個匯率嘛結果這兩大就在我們講的去年之後沒幾個月都發生了戰爭俄國大家知道我們國內有三大受險公司五大受險公司\n145178\t169258\t買了俄國1380億的債券後來陸續到期到期的部分俄國的答覆很簡單等我戰爭打完了再來算這筆錢戰爭的因素跑出來了匯率在今年的5月我們對美金的匯率那個台幣大幅度的\n170530\t179698\t升值的結果光單月將近兩千億兩千億的損失耶天啊所以\n182371\t207669\t戰爭跟匯率我們都碰到了所以當時當時我就說我們海外資金上限70%可以到我們的授權資金有70%的上限可以到海外去這個部分我們應該調降我們應該適度的趕快導引這些保險資金讓它回到我們台灣那結果當時\n211462\t239411\t貴會的答覆是說有啦找了這些保險公司談這些保險公司說兩個原因第一個原因說我們台灣利率太低第二個台灣市場太小他們意思是說他們也是情不得已出去但是主委你不曉得記不記得當時我就說這兩個原因都不成理由啦第一個你說我們台灣利率低我承認我們台灣利率是低但是\n240529\t254045\t你這些受險公司也是以我們台灣這麼低的利率下去當期望值做成產品賣給我們國內的保險的大眾所以利率低你不能講\n256422\t284112\t你期望值也低 你的產品也低嗎不是嗎 第二個他們說我們台灣的市場太小所以當時 主委我就拜託貴會後來我也拜託財政部就是說我請貴會跟財政部都要趕快輔導我們國內這些需要建設的部會比方說內政部 比方說交通部比方說衛福部衛福部他們有長照啊\n285492\t308491\t交通部有各項的交通建設 鐵路 公路 高速公路各地方的捷運這都是需要資金的啊我們引導他們進來 我們設交通債券 交通公債內政 我們有社會住宅等等嘛那不管設宅\n310539\t338055\t長照或者未來開通的捷運自償性都很高也付得起這些利息所以我說要趕快做所以我今天要問你的問題就是說到底這一年來我們輔導了有哪一些部會有沒有去準備好去成立哪一些建設公債建設基金有還是沒有第二點這個讓保險資金去海外\n339056\t352446\t的這個比例是不是要從70%下降下調因為在國外看起來這不可思議耶中國啊我們對岸中國跟我們競爭的中國只有2%我們70%韓國8.3%美國12%只有日本高一點日本高一點也不到我們1 3日本21.6天啊\n365583\t389034\t只有我們台灣70%這麼高所以這兩個問題我想請教主委有做了嗎謝謝委員給我這個機會來回答這個問題其實我們也很希望我們壽險業長期要降低海外的投資的比重因為我們現在壽險面臨到一個叫做避別的不匹配\n390114\t417528\t因為他的負債跟他資產不一致所以會面臨到匯率跟利率的風險這是一個但是因為他已經長期投在海外不可能短期就把它匯回來台灣有剛剛委員提到很重要台灣沒有這麼多的工具像比如說他們投的最重要的投固定收益現在大概已經將近20兆的這樣一個金額在台灣其實我們整年所有的公債跟債券市場沒辦法很快吸納所以我們想法就至少你新錢\n418709\t446556\t每年他會收到的薪錢大概是兩兆左右的錢我們盡量找工具剛剛委員提到我們做了什麼比如說我們也希望說能夠有一個比如說第一個我們鬆綁法規讓我們的受請公司的這個資金本來交給國外投資能夠交給自己的投信來投資這是一個再來就是我們的兆元投資計畫裡面我們也提出很多很多方案我們甚至請交易所櫃買成立一個資本服務團去協助這些公司力單位去證券化債券化\n447976\t469330\t然後還有像很多地方這種發綠債那我們希望說盡量把這個政府剛剛委員提到比如說假設我們也曾經嘗試過把高速公路的收費能不能把它做個證券化也都在跟各個部會在做協商因為這個部分還要花點時間主委我很感謝貴會你們有做這些努力那成果呢 到現在成果怎麼樣\n470030\t485975\t其實我們現在陸陸續續有一些啦但是還沒辦法吸納我們的這麼大的受險資金因為很多部會他的心態他就是變於形式嘛反正要建設的錢很簡單預算編了就有啊\n490185\t509621\t大家便於形式嘛就從大筆一揮從預算下去編但是我們不應該只是單向的從預算不是這樣嗎我們應該適度的因為需要有時間嘛慢慢的就像你剛剛講不能一下子回來他也不可能一下子回來但是我們每年導引3% 5%\n512303\t539859\t這對我們黨預祝這些資金回來建設我們自己台灣這才是正確的嘛不是嗎所以沒有具體的結果就對了現在等於說因為受選人資金整體是非常龐大國內要找尋這些涉及到公建的案例確實是沒有那麼容易啦過去蔡英文總統的時候我看她過去那八年他們也是到後來才警覺這個事情嚴重他們\n541144\t546710\t有去說服交通部有成立了七檔交通建設的\n548731\t575128\t資金啦 債券雖然那個金額不算大都大概數十億之多但是聊勝於無這是一個開始嘛他們有七檔八年做了七檔所以我希望在你這麼專業認真之下你帶領的團隊能夠趕快跟我們這些相關部會去做這也是我們努力的方向那其次就是關於這個詐騙的部分這個\n577950\t586739\t我們這些逃逸的外勞還有逃逸失聯甚至工作渠道的外勞那他們就把這個戶頭就賣給這些詐騙集團那本來這本來數字不大從2022年的521案\n597550\t626585\t逐年增加9211862一直到今年6月統計已經超過2000戶2054戶啦那當然我們也祭出重罰說這個可以把他罰100萬以下這個最高會判3年以下可是可是主委光是重罰甚至關他都沒用他人都出境啦人都出境那難道我們要怎樣\n627165\t649946\t要去引渡他來我們台灣嗎這都是不可能的事情所以我認為這些事情知識體大我也詢問了我們相關金管會的同仁們他們是說有找勞動部下去談但是我覺得這個部分可能談得還不夠徹底我覺得當然勞動部他似乎不積極\n651247\t677938\t不積極所以我希望跟勞動部談你們跟他們談清楚就是說在這件事情上面開戶所謂的外勞他們的自己財產管理的這一部分的權利人權啊這個應該擺在一邊為什麼因為不管他是期限已經到了要回國或者他都已經失聯了簡單的方式就把這個戶頭切斷就好嘛\n680259\t706709\t切斷就好人家失聯逃逸的他失聯逃逸他還不敢用這個戶頭啊那請他的雇主也一定現金給他嘛不是嗎所以這樣子的外勞他剛好順便把這個戶頭賣掉就算了所以這樣子的情況下不要在那邊一直考量說外勞也有他的人權他有他的權利去管理他的資金\n707849\t734755\t這個一切都在他失聯之後甚至期滿回國以後就要簡單明瞭把它斷線這個也可以載入到勞動部載入到跟外勞引進的合約裡面就可以寫這麼清楚好不好我希望你們跟勞動部因為我知道現在在阻撓的都勞動部啊不積極的都勞動部你跟勞動部講清楚\n737184\t760379\t說這個事情知識體大不要再用那些有的沒有的藉口就是不要把簡單的事情複雜化好不好好 謝謝我們會朝著努力我們也看到我們是從去年我們就開始有對接移民署這些的外籍的那個警示帳戶的比例從高峰已經開始往下走那我們會來持續跟其他部會一起來努力\n761199\t781099\t我剛看到的數字我念的數字都是往上爬當然有往下的數字當然是好啦八月已經下降下來的因為我們管控措施也慢慢看到一些成效我們會努力謝謝謝謝王委員 謝謝主委接下來我們請葛如君委員\n","txt":"王委員可以匆匆攏攏沒有關係好 謝謝主席我就照你說的匆匆攏攏對你來講 有刃有餘我先喘口氣\n金管會不要這個匆匆忙忙就好好 謝謝主席我請金管會彭主委好 我們請彭主委你好彭主委是\n我們行政院卓院長施政報告開宗明義第一章就是寫要把我們台灣打造成為亞洲資產管理中心這非常的好但是我們有一個大的問題我記得在您一上任那時候我就去年六月我就跟你提\n就是說我們國內保險業可運用資金的餘額高達35兆之多其中70%有25兆竟然是放在海外購買國外的債券或者基金诶 諸位如果說我們呼籲外國把資產\n交給我們台灣管理結果我們台灣自己70%\n的資金是用在國外買債券基金那我們對人家怎麼說服我們自己70%給別人管然後要別人說你的資產給我們台灣管這不是很怪嗎那我們要說服哪些國家說服非洲嗎 肯亞嗎這是很奇怪的事其次\n這購買海外的債券跟基金當時我們就說到有兩大風險一個戰爭一個匯率嘛結果這兩大就在我們講的去年之後沒幾個月都發生了戰爭俄國大家知道我們國內有三大受險公司五大受險公司\n買了俄國1380億的債券後來陸續到期到期的部分俄國的答覆很簡單等我戰爭打完了再來算這筆錢戰爭的因素跑出來了匯率在今年的5月我們對美金的匯率那個台幣大幅度的\n升值的結果光單月將近兩千億兩千億的損失耶天啊所以\n戰爭跟匯率我們都碰到了所以當時當時我就說我們海外資金上限70%可以到我們的授權資金有70%的上限可以到海外去這個部分我們應該調降我們應該適度的趕快導引這些保險資金讓它回到我們台灣那結果當時\n貴會的答覆是說有啦找了這些保險公司談這些保險公司說兩個原因第一個原因說我們台灣利率太低第二個台灣市場太小他們意思是說他們也是情不得已出去但是主委你不曉得記不記得當時我就說這兩個原因都不成理由啦第一個你說我們台灣利率低我承認我們台灣利率是低但是\n你這些受險公司也是以我們台灣這麼低的利率下去當期望值做成產品賣給我們國內的保險的大眾所以利率低你不能講\n你期望值也低 你的產品也低嗎不是嗎 第二個他們說我們台灣的市場太小所以當時 主委我就拜託貴會後來我也拜託財政部就是說我請貴會跟財政部都要趕快輔導我們國內這些需要建設的部會比方說內政部 比方說交通部比方說衛福部衛福部他們有長照啊\n交通部有各項的交通建設 鐵路 公路 高速公路各地方的捷運這都是需要資金的啊我們引導他們進來 我們設交通債券 交通公債內政 我們有社會住宅等等嘛那不管設宅\n長照或者未來開通的捷運自償性都很高也付得起這些利息所以我說要趕快做所以我今天要問你的問題就是說到底這一年來我們輔導了有哪一些部會有沒有去準備好去成立哪一些建設公債建設基金有還是沒有第二點這個讓保險資金去海外\n的這個比例是不是要從70%下降下調因為在國外看起來這不可思議耶中國啊我們對岸中國跟我們競爭的中國只有2%我們70%韓國8.3%美國12%只有日本高一點日本高一點也不到我們1 3日本21.6天啊\n只有我們台灣70%這麼高所以這兩個問題我想請教主委有做了嗎謝謝委員給我這個機會來回答這個問題其實我們也很希望我們壽險業長期要降低海外的投資的比重因為我們現在壽險面臨到一個叫做避別的不匹配\n因為他的負債跟他資產不一致所以會面臨到匯率跟利率的風險這是一個但是因為他已經長期投在海外不可能短期就把它匯回來台灣有剛剛委員提到很重要台灣沒有這麼多的工具像比如說他們投的最重要的投固定收益現在大概已經將近20兆的這樣一個金額在台灣其實我們整年所有的公債跟債券市場沒辦法很快吸納所以我們想法就至少你新錢\n每年他會收到的薪錢大概是兩兆左右的錢我們盡量找工具剛剛委員提到我們做了什麼比如說我們也希望說能夠有一個比如說第一個我們鬆綁法規讓我們的受請公司的這個資金本來交給國外投資能夠交給自己的投信來投資這是一個再來就是我們的兆元投資計畫裡面我們也提出很多很多方案我們甚至請交易所櫃買成立一個資本服務團去協助這些公司力單位去證券化債券化\n然後還有像很多地方這種發綠債那我們希望說盡量把這個政府剛剛委員提到比如說假設我們也曾經嘗試過把高速公路的收費能不能把它做個證券化也都在跟各個部會在做協商因為這個部分還要花點時間主委我很感謝貴會你們有做這些努力那成果呢 到現在成果怎麼樣\n其實我們現在陸陸續續有一些啦但是還沒辦法吸納我們的這麼大的受險資金因為很多部會他的心態他就是變於形式嘛反正要建設的錢很簡單預算編了就有啊\n大家便於形式嘛就從大筆一揮從預算下去編但是我們不應該只是單向的從預算不是這樣嗎我們應該適度的因為需要有時間嘛慢慢的就像你剛剛講不能一下子回來他也不可能一下子回來但是我們每年導引3% 5%\n這對我們黨預祝這些資金回來建設我們自己台灣這才是正確的嘛不是嗎所以沒有具體的結果就對了現在等於說因為受選人資金整體是非常龐大國內要找尋這些涉及到公建的案例確實是沒有那麼容易啦過去蔡英文總統的時候我看她過去那八年他們也是到後來才警覺這個事情嚴重他們\n有去說服交通部有成立了七檔交通建設的\n資金啦 債券雖然那個金額不算大都大概數十億之多但是聊勝於無這是一個開始嘛他們有七檔八年做了七檔所以我希望在你這麼專業認真之下你帶領的團隊能夠趕快跟我們這些相關部會去做這也是我們努力的方向那其次就是關於這個詐騙的部分這個\n我們這些逃逸的外勞還有逃逸失聯甚至工作渠道的外勞那他們就把這個戶頭就賣給這些詐騙集團那本來這本來數字不大從2022年的521案\n逐年增加9211862一直到今年6月統計已經超過2000戶2054戶啦那當然我們也祭出重罰說這個可以把他罰100萬以下這個最高會判3年以下可是可是主委光是重罰甚至關他都沒用他人都出境啦人都出境那難道我們要怎樣\n要去引渡他來我們台灣嗎這都是不可能的事情所以我認為這些事情知識體大我也詢問了我們相關金管會的同仁們他們是說有找勞動部下去談但是我覺得這個部分可能談得還不夠徹底我覺得當然勞動部他似乎不積極\n不積極所以我希望跟勞動部談你們跟他們談清楚就是說在這件事情上面開戶所謂的外勞他們的自己財產管理的這一部分的權利人權啊這個應該擺在一邊為什麼因為不管他是期限已經到了要回國或者他都已經失聯了簡單的方式就把這個戶頭切斷就好嘛\n切斷就好人家失聯逃逸的他失聯逃逸他還不敢用這個戶頭啊那請他的雇主也一定現金給他嘛不是嗎所以這樣子的外勞他剛好順便把這個戶頭賣掉就算了所以這樣子的情況下不要在那邊一直考量說外勞也有他的人權他有他的權利去管理他的資金\n這個一切都在他失聯之後甚至期滿回國以後就要簡單明瞭把它斷線這個也可以載入到勞動部載入到跟外勞引進的合約裡面就可以寫這麼清楚好不好我希望你們跟勞動部因為我知道現在在阻撓的都勞動部啊不積極的都勞動部你跟勞動部講清楚\n說這個事情知識體大不要再用那些有的沒有的藉口就是不要把簡單的事情複雜化好不好好 謝謝我們會朝著努力我們也看到我們是從去年我們就開始有對接移民署這些的外籍的那個警示帳戶的比例從高峰已經開始往下走那我們會來持續跟其他部會一起來努力\n我剛看到的數字我念的數字都是往上爬當然有往下的數字當然是好啦八月已經下降下來的因為我們管控措施也慢慢看到一些成效我們會努力謝謝謝謝王委員 謝謝主委接下來我們請葛如君委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:01.758 --> 00:04.159\n王委員可以匆匆攏攏沒有關係好謝謝主席我就照你說的匆匆攏攏對你來講有刃有餘我先喘口氣\n\n00:29.629 --> 00:45.160\n金管會不要這個匆匆忙忙就好好謝謝主席我請金管會彭主委好我們請彭主委你好彭主委是\n\n00:46.243 --> 01:06.141\n我們行政院卓院長施政報告開宗明義第一章就是寫要把我們台灣打造成為亞洲資產管理中心這非常的好但是我們有一個大的問題我記得在您一上任那時候我就去年六月我就跟你提\n\n01:06.781 --> 01:30.937\n就是說我們國內保險業可運用資金的餘額高達35兆之多其中70%有25兆竟然是放在海外購買國外的債券或者基金诶諸位如果說我們呼籲外國把資產\n\n01:32.799 --> 01:35.933\n交給我們台灣管理結果我們台灣自己70%\n\n01:39.264 --> 02:02.927\n的資金是用在國外買債券基金那我們對人家怎麼說服我們自己70%給別人管然後要別人說你的資產給我們台灣管這不是很怪嗎那我們要說服哪些國家說服非洲嗎肯亞嗎這是很奇怪的事其次\n\n02:04.764 --> 02:24.298\n這購買海外的債券跟基金當時我們就說到有兩大風險一個戰爭一個匯率嘛結果這兩大就在我們講的去年之後沒幾個月都發生了戰爭俄國大家知道我們國內有三大受險公司五大受險公司\n\n02:25.178 --> 02:49.258\n買了俄國1380億的債券後來陸續到期到期的部分俄國的答覆很簡單等我戰爭打完了再來算這筆錢戰爭的因素跑出來了匯率在今年的5月我們對美金的匯率那個台幣大幅度的\n\n02:50.530 --> 02:59.698\n升值的結果光單月將近兩千億兩千億的損失耶天啊所以\n\n03:02.371 --> 03:27.669\n戰爭跟匯率我們都碰到了所以當時當時我就說我們海外資金上限70%可以到我們的授權資金有70%的上限可以到海外去這個部分我們應該調降我們應該適度的趕快導引這些保險資金讓它回到我們台灣那結果當時\n\n03:31.462 --> 03:59.411\n貴會的答覆是說有啦找了這些保險公司談這些保險公司說兩個原因第一個原因說我們台灣利率太低第二個台灣市場太小他們意思是說他們也是情不得已出去但是主委你不曉得記不記得當時我就說這兩個原因都不成理由啦第一個你說我們台灣利率低我承認我們台灣利率是低但是\n\n04:00.529 --> 04:14.045\n你這些受險公司也是以我們台灣這麼低的利率下去當期望值做成產品賣給我們國內的保險的大眾所以利率低你不能講\n\n04:16.422 --> 04:44.112\n你期望值也低你的產品也低嗎不是嗎第二個他們說我們台灣的市場太小所以當時主委我就拜託貴會後來我也拜託財政部就是說我請貴會跟財政部都要趕快輔導我們國內這些需要建設的部會比方說內政部比方說交通部比方說衛福部衛福部他們有長照啊\n\n04:45.492 --> 05:08.491\n交通部有各項的交通建設鐵路公路高速公路各地方的捷運這都是需要資金的啊我們引導他們進來我們設交通債券交通公債內政我們有社會住宅等等嘛那不管設宅\n\n05:10.539 --> 05:38.055\n長照或者未來開通的捷運自償性都很高也付得起這些利息所以我說要趕快做所以我今天要問你的問題就是說到底這一年來我們輔導了有哪一些部會有沒有去準備好去成立哪一些建設公債建設基金有還是沒有第二點這個讓保險資金去海外\n\n05:39.056 --> 05:52.446\n的這個比例是不是要從70%下降下調因為在國外看起來這不可思議耶中國啊我們對岸中國跟我們競爭的中國只有2%我們70%韓國8.3%美國12%只有日本高一點日本高一點也不到我們13日本21.6天啊\n\n06:05.583 --> 06:29.034\n只有我們台灣70%這麼高所以這兩個問題我想請教主委有做了嗎謝謝委員給我這個機會來回答這個問題其實我們也很希望我們壽險業長期要降低海外的投資的比重因為我們現在壽險面臨到一個叫做避別的不匹配\n\n06:30.114 --> 06:57.528\n因為他的負債跟他資產不一致所以會面臨到匯率跟利率的風險這是一個但是因為他已經長期投在海外不可能短期就把它匯回來台灣有剛剛委員提到很重要台灣沒有這麼多的工具像比如說他們投的最重要的投固定收益現在大概已經將近20兆的這樣一個金額在台灣其實我們整年所有的公債跟債券市場沒辦法很快吸納所以我們想法就至少你新錢\n\n06:58.709 --> 07:26.556\n每年他會收到的薪錢大概是兩兆左右的錢我們盡量找工具剛剛委員提到我們做了什麼比如說我們也希望說能夠有一個比如說第一個我們鬆綁法規讓我們的受請公司的這個資金本來交給國外投資能夠交給自己的投信來投資這是一個再來就是我們的兆元投資計畫裡面我們也提出很多很多方案我們甚至請交易所櫃買成立一個資本服務團去協助這些公司力單位去證券化債券化\n\n07:27.976 --> 07:49.330\n然後還有像很多地方這種發綠債那我們希望說盡量把這個政府剛剛委員提到比如說假設我們也曾經嘗試過把高速公路的收費能不能把它做個證券化也都在跟各個部會在做協商因為這個部分還要花點時間主委我很感謝貴會你們有做這些努力那成果呢到現在成果怎麼樣\n\n07:50.030 --> 08:05.975\n其實我們現在陸陸續續有一些啦但是還沒辦法吸納我們的這麼大的受險資金因為很多部會他的心態他就是變於形式嘛反正要建設的錢很簡單預算編了就有啊\n\n08:10.185 --> 08:29.621\n大家便於形式嘛就從大筆一揮從預算下去編但是我們不應該只是單向的從預算不是這樣嗎我們應該適度的因為需要有時間嘛慢慢的就像你剛剛講不能一下子回來他也不可能一下子回來但是我們每年導引3%5%\n\n08:32.303 --> 08:59.859\n這對我們黨預祝這些資金回來建設我們自己台灣這才是正確的嘛不是嗎所以沒有具體的結果就對了現在等於說因為受選人資金整體是非常龐大國內要找尋這些涉及到公建的案例確實是沒有那麼容易啦過去蔡英文總統的時候我看她過去那八年他們也是到後來才警覺這個事情嚴重他們\n\n09:01.144 --> 09:06.710\n有去說服交通部有成立了七檔交通建設的\n\n09:08.731 --> 09:35.128\n資金啦債券雖然那個金額不算大都大概數十億之多但是聊勝於無這是一個開始嘛他們有七檔八年做了七檔所以我希望在你這麼專業認真之下你帶領的團隊能夠趕快跟我們這些相關部會去做這也是我們努力的方向那其次就是關於這個詐騙的部分這個\n\n09:37.950 --> 09:46.739\n我們這些逃逸的外勞還有逃逸失聯甚至工作渠道的外勞那他們就把這個戶頭就賣給這些詐騙集團那本來這本來數字不大從2022年的521案\n\n09:57.550 --> 10:26.585\n逐年增加9211862一直到今年6月統計已經超過2000戶2054戶啦那當然我們也祭出重罰說這個可以把他罰100萬以下這個最高會判3年以下可是可是主委光是重罰甚至關他都沒用他人都出境啦人都出境那難道我們要怎樣\n\n10:27.165 --> 10:49.946\n要去引渡他來我們台灣嗎這都是不可能的事情所以我認為這些事情知識體大我也詢問了我們相關金管會的同仁們他們是說有找勞動部下去談但是我覺得這個部分可能談得還不夠徹底我覺得當然勞動部他似乎不積極\n\n10:51.247 --> 11:17.938\n不積極所以我希望跟勞動部談你們跟他們談清楚就是說在這件事情上面開戶所謂的外勞他們的自己財產管理的這一部分的權利人權啊這個應該擺在一邊為什麼因為不管他是期限已經到了要回國或者他都已經失聯了簡單的方式就把這個戶頭切斷就好嘛\n\n11:20.259 --> 11:46.709\n切斷就好人家失聯逃逸的他失聯逃逸他還不敢用這個戶頭啊那請他的雇主也一定現金給他嘛不是嗎所以這樣子的外勞他剛好順便把這個戶頭賣掉就算了所以這樣子的情況下不要在那邊一直考量說外勞也有他的人權他有他的權利去管理他的資金\n\n11:47.849 --> 12:14.755\n這個一切都在他失聯之後甚至期滿回國以後就要簡單明瞭把它斷線這個也可以載入到勞動部載入到跟外勞引進的合約裡面就可以寫這麼清楚好不好我希望你們跟勞動部因為我知道現在在阻撓的都勞動部啊不積極的都勞動部你跟勞動部講清楚\n\n12:17.184 --> 12:40.379\n說這個事情知識體大不要再用那些有的沒有的藉口就是不要把簡單的事情複雜化好不好好謝謝我們會朝著努力我們也看到我們是從去年我們就開始有對接移民署這些的外籍的那個警示帳戶的比例從高峰已經開始往下走那我們會來持續跟其他部會一起來努力\n\n12:41.199 --> 13:01.099\n我剛看到的數字我念的數字都是往上爬當然有往下的數字當然是好啦八月已經下降下來的因為我們管控措施也慢慢看到一些成效我們會努力謝謝謝謝王委員謝謝主委接下來我們請葛如君委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":1.758,"end":4.159,"text":"王委員可以匆匆攏攏沒有關係好 謝謝主席我就照你說的匆匆攏攏對你來講 有刃有餘我先喘口氣"},{"start":29.629,"end":45.16,"text":"金管會不要這個匆匆忙忙就好好 謝謝主席我請金管會彭主委好 我們請彭主委你好彭主委是"},{"start":46.243,"end":66.141,"text":"我們行政院卓院長施政報告開宗明義第一章就是寫要把我們台灣打造成為亞洲資產管理中心這非常的好但是我們有一個大的問題我記得在您一上任那時候我就去年六月我就跟你提"},{"start":66.781,"end":90.937,"text":"就是說我們國內保險業可運用資金的餘額高達35兆之多其中70%有25兆竟然是放在海外購買國外的債券或者基金诶 諸位如果說我們呼籲外國把資產"},{"start":92.799,"end":95.933,"text":"交給我們台灣管理結果我們台灣自己70%"},{"start":99.264,"end":122.927,"text":"的資金是用在國外買債券基金那我們對人家怎麼說服我們自己70%給別人管然後要別人說你的資產給我們台灣管這不是很怪嗎那我們要說服哪些國家說服非洲嗎 肯亞嗎這是很奇怪的事其次"},{"start":124.764,"end":144.298,"text":"這購買海外的債券跟基金當時我們就說到有兩大風險一個戰爭一個匯率嘛結果這兩大就在我們講的去年之後沒幾個月都發生了戰爭俄國大家知道我們國內有三大受險公司五大受險公司"},{"start":145.178,"end":169.258,"text":"買了俄國1380億的債券後來陸續到期到期的部分俄國的答覆很簡單等我戰爭打完了再來算這筆錢戰爭的因素跑出來了匯率在今年的5月我們對美金的匯率那個台幣大幅度的"},{"start":170.53,"end":179.698,"text":"升值的結果光單月將近兩千億兩千億的損失耶天啊所以"},{"start":182.371,"end":207.669,"text":"戰爭跟匯率我們都碰到了所以當時當時我就說我們海外資金上限70%可以到我們的授權資金有70%的上限可以到海外去這個部分我們應該調降我們應該適度的趕快導引這些保險資金讓它回到我們台灣那結果當時"},{"start":211.462,"end":239.411,"text":"貴會的答覆是說有啦找了這些保險公司談這些保險公司說兩個原因第一個原因說我們台灣利率太低第二個台灣市場太小他們意思是說他們也是情不得已出去但是主委你不曉得記不記得當時我就說這兩個原因都不成理由啦第一個你說我們台灣利率低我承認我們台灣利率是低但是"},{"start":240.529,"end":254.045,"text":"你這些受險公司也是以我們台灣這麼低的利率下去當期望值做成產品賣給我們國內的保險的大眾所以利率低你不能講"},{"start":256.422,"end":284.112,"text":"你期望值也低 你的產品也低嗎不是嗎 第二個他們說我們台灣的市場太小所以當時 主委我就拜託貴會後來我也拜託財政部就是說我請貴會跟財政部都要趕快輔導我們國內這些需要建設的部會比方說內政部 比方說交通部比方說衛福部衛福部他們有長照啊"},{"start":285.492,"end":308.491,"text":"交通部有各項的交通建設 鐵路 公路 高速公路各地方的捷運這都是需要資金的啊我們引導他們進來 我們設交通債券 交通公債內政 我們有社會住宅等等嘛那不管設宅"},{"start":310.539,"end":338.055,"text":"長照或者未來開通的捷運自償性都很高也付得起這些利息所以我說要趕快做所以我今天要問你的問題就是說到底這一年來我們輔導了有哪一些部會有沒有去準備好去成立哪一些建設公債建設基金有還是沒有第二點這個讓保險資金去海外"},{"start":339.056,"end":352.446,"text":"的這個比例是不是要從70%下降下調因為在國外看起來這不可思議耶中國啊我們對岸中國跟我們競爭的中國只有2%我們70%韓國8.3%美國12%只有日本高一點日本高一點也不到我們1 3日本21.6天啊"},{"start":365.583,"end":389.034,"text":"只有我們台灣70%這麼高所以這兩個問題我想請教主委有做了嗎謝謝委員給我這個機會來回答這個問題其實我們也很希望我們壽險業長期要降低海外的投資的比重因為我們現在壽險面臨到一個叫做避別的不匹配"},{"start":390.114,"end":417.528,"text":"因為他的負債跟他資產不一致所以會面臨到匯率跟利率的風險這是一個但是因為他已經長期投在海外不可能短期就把它匯回來台灣有剛剛委員提到很重要台灣沒有這麼多的工具像比如說他們投的最重要的投固定收益現在大概已經將近20兆的這樣一個金額在台灣其實我們整年所有的公債跟債券市場沒辦法很快吸納所以我們想法就至少你新錢"},{"start":418.709,"end":446.556,"text":"每年他會收到的薪錢大概是兩兆左右的錢我們盡量找工具剛剛委員提到我們做了什麼比如說我們也希望說能夠有一個比如說第一個我們鬆綁法規讓我們的受請公司的這個資金本來交給國外投資能夠交給自己的投信來投資這是一個再來就是我們的兆元投資計畫裡面我們也提出很多很多方案我們甚至請交易所櫃買成立一個資本服務團去協助這些公司力單位去證券化債券化"},{"start":447.976,"end":469.33,"text":"然後還有像很多地方這種發綠債那我們希望說盡量把這個政府剛剛委員提到比如說假設我們也曾經嘗試過把高速公路的收費能不能把它做個證券化也都在跟各個部會在做協商因為這個部分還要花點時間主委我很感謝貴會你們有做這些努力那成果呢 到現在成果怎麼樣"},{"start":470.03,"end":485.975,"text":"其實我們現在陸陸續續有一些啦但是還沒辦法吸納我們的這麼大的受險資金因為很多部會他的心態他就是變於形式嘛反正要建設的錢很簡單預算編了就有啊"},{"start":490.185,"end":509.621,"text":"大家便於形式嘛就從大筆一揮從預算下去編但是我們不應該只是單向的從預算不是這樣嗎我們應該適度的因為需要有時間嘛慢慢的就像你剛剛講不能一下子回來他也不可能一下子回來但是我們每年導引3% 5%"},{"start":512.303,"end":539.859,"text":"這對我們黨預祝這些資金回來建設我們自己台灣這才是正確的嘛不是嗎所以沒有具體的結果就對了現在等於說因為受選人資金整體是非常龐大國內要找尋這些涉及到公建的案例確實是沒有那麼容易啦過去蔡英文總統的時候我看她過去那八年他們也是到後來才警覺這個事情嚴重他們"},{"start":541.144,"end":546.71,"text":"有去說服交通部有成立了七檔交通建設的"},{"start":548.731,"end":575.128,"text":"資金啦 債券雖然那個金額不算大都大概數十億之多但是聊勝於無這是一個開始嘛他們有七檔八年做了七檔所以我希望在你這麼專業認真之下你帶領的團隊能夠趕快跟我們這些相關部會去做這也是我們努力的方向那其次就是關於這個詐騙的部分這個"},{"start":577.95,"end":586.739,"text":"我們這些逃逸的外勞還有逃逸失聯甚至工作渠道的外勞那他們就把這個戶頭就賣給這些詐騙集團那本來這本來數字不大從2022年的521案"},{"start":597.55,"end":626.585,"text":"逐年增加9211862一直到今年6月統計已經超過2000戶2054戶啦那當然我們也祭出重罰說這個可以把他罰100萬以下這個最高會判3年以下可是可是主委光是重罰甚至關他都沒用他人都出境啦人都出境那難道我們要怎樣"},{"start":627.165,"end":649.946,"text":"要去引渡他來我們台灣嗎這都是不可能的事情所以我認為這些事情知識體大我也詢問了我們相關金管會的同仁們他們是說有找勞動部下去談但是我覺得這個部分可能談得還不夠徹底我覺得當然勞動部他似乎不積極"},{"start":651.247,"end":677.938,"text":"不積極所以我希望跟勞動部談你們跟他們談清楚就是說在這件事情上面開戶所謂的外勞他們的自己財產管理的這一部分的權利人權啊這個應該擺在一邊為什麼因為不管他是期限已經到了要回國或者他都已經失聯了簡單的方式就把這個戶頭切斷就好嘛"},{"start":680.259,"end":706.709,"text":"切斷就好人家失聯逃逸的他失聯逃逸他還不敢用這個戶頭啊那請他的雇主也一定現金給他嘛不是嗎所以這樣子的外勞他剛好順便把這個戶頭賣掉就算了所以這樣子的情況下不要在那邊一直考量說外勞也有他的人權他有他的權利去管理他的資金"},{"start":707.849,"end":734.755,"text":"這個一切都在他失聯之後甚至期滿回國以後就要簡單明瞭把它斷線這個也可以載入到勞動部載入到跟外勞引進的合約裡面就可以寫這麼清楚好不好我希望你們跟勞動部因為我知道現在在阻撓的都勞動部啊不積極的都勞動部你跟勞動部講清楚"},{"start":737.184,"end":760.379,"text":"說這個事情知識體大不要再用那些有的沒有的藉口就是不要把簡單的事情複雜化好不好好 謝謝我們會朝著努力我們也看到我們是從去年我們就開始有對接移民署這些的外籍的那個警示帳戶的比例從高峰已經開始往下走那我們會來持續跟其他部會一起來努力"},{"start":761.199,"end":781.099,"text":"我剛看到的數字我念的數字都是往上爬當然有往下的數字當然是好啦八月已經下降下來的因為我們管控措施也慢慢看到一些成效我們會努力謝謝謝謝王委員 謝謝主委接下來我們請葛如君委員"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":850,"blocks":[["王委員世堅：（11時31分）謝謝主席，我就照你說的從從容容。"],["主席：對你來講，游刃有餘。"],["王委員世堅：我先喘口氣。"],["主席：金管會不要匆匆忙忙就好。"],["王委員世堅：謝謝主席。我請金管會彭主委。"],["主席：請彭主委。"],["彭主任委員金隆：委員好。"],["王委員世堅：行政院卓院長施政報告開宗明義第一章就是寫，要把臺灣打造成為亞洲資產管理中心，這非常的好！但是我們有一個大的問題，我記得在您一上任的時候，即去年6月我就跟你提，國內保險業可運用的資金餘額高達35兆之多，其中70%、有25兆竟然是放在海外購買國外的債券或者基金。如果我們呼籲外國把資產交給臺灣管理，結果臺灣自己有70%的資金在國外買債券、基金，我們怎麼說服人家？我們自己70%給別人管，然後要別人把資金、資產給臺灣管，這不是很怪嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：是。"],["王委員世堅：那我們要說服哪些國家？說服非洲嗎？肯亞嗎？這是很奇怪的事。其次，在購買海外的債券跟基金，當時我們就說有兩大風險，一個是戰爭，另一個是匯率，結果這兩大就如我們講的，去年之後、沒幾個月都發生了。關於戰爭，大家知道俄國，國內有五大壽險公司買了俄國1,380億的債券，後來陸續到期。到期的部分，俄國的答復很簡單，等他戰爭打完了，再來算這筆錢，戰爭的因素跑出來了。至於匯率，今年5月我們兌美金的匯率，因為臺幣大幅度升值的結果，光單月有將近2,000億的損失。天啊！所以戰爭跟匯率我們都碰到了，當時我就說國內的壽險資金有70%的上限可以到海外，這個部分應該調降，應該適度的趕快導引這些保險資金回到臺灣。結果當時貴會的答復是，有找了這些保險公司談，這些保險公司說兩個原因：第一個原因是臺灣利率太低；第二個、臺灣市場太小。他們的意思是他們也是情不得已才出去，但是不曉得主委記不記得？當時我就說這兩個原因都不成理由。第一個、你說臺灣利率低，我承認臺灣利率是低，但這些壽險公司也是以臺灣這麼低的利率下去當期望值，做成產品賣給國內的保險大眾，所以你不能講利率低，利率低，期望值也低，產品也低，不是嗎？第二個、他們說臺灣的市場太小，所以當時我就拜託貴會，也拜託財政部，請貴會跟財政部都要趕快輔導……"],["彭主任委員金隆：找標的。"],["王委員世堅：輔導國內這些需要建設的部會，比方內政部、交通部、衛福部。衛福部有長照，交通部有各項的交通建設，包括鐵路、公路、高速公路、各地方的捷運，這些都需要資金。我們引導他們進來，設交通債券、交通公債，內政則有社會住宅等等。不管社宅、長照或者未來開通的捷運，自償性都很高，也付得起這些利息，所以我說要趕快做。我今天要問你的問題就是，到底這一年來，你們輔導了哪一些部會？有沒有準備好成立哪一些建設公債、建設基金？有還是沒有？","第二點、讓保險資金去海外的比例是不是要從70%下降、下調？因為在國外看起來，這不可思議！對岸的中國、跟我們競爭的中國只有2%，我們70%，韓國8.3%、美國12%，只有日本高一點，日本高一點也不到我們的三分之一，日本21.6%。天啊！只有臺灣70%，這麼高，所以我想請教主委這兩個問題，有做了嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：謝謝委員給我機會來回答這個問題。其實我們也很希望壽險業長期要降低海外的投資比重，現在壽險面臨到一個叫做幣別的不匹配，因為它的負債跟資產不一致，所以會面臨到匯率跟利率的風險，這是一個。但是它已經長期投資在海外，不可能短期就把它匯回來，剛剛委員提到很重要的，臺灣沒有這麼多工具，比如他們最重要的是投固定收益，現在將近20兆的金額在臺灣，整年所有的公債跟債券市場沒辦法很快吸納，所以我們的想法就是至少新錢，每年他會收到的新錢大概是2兆左右，我們儘量找工具。","剛剛委員提到，我們做了什麼？我們也希望能夠有比如第一個、我們鬆綁法規讓壽險公司的資金本來交給國外投資，能夠改交給自己的投信來投資，這是一個。再來就是我們在兆元投資計畫裡面也提出很多、很多方案，甚至請交易所、櫃買成立一個資本服務團，協助這些公私立單位證券化、債券化，還有像很多地方政府發綠債。我們希望儘量把政府……剛剛委員提到，我們也曾經嘗試過能不能把高速公路的收費證券化，也都在跟各個部會協商，因為這個部分還要花一點時間。"],["王委員世堅：我很感謝貴會有做這些努力，到現在成果怎麼樣？"],["彭主任委員金隆：其實我們陸陸續續有一些，但是還沒辦法吸納這麼大的壽險資金。"],["王委員世堅：因為很多部會的心態就是便宜行事，反正要建設的錢很簡單，預算編了就有，所以大家就便宜行事，大筆一揮，從預算下去編，但是我們不應該只是單項的從預算，不是這樣嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：是。"],["王委員世堅：我們應該適度的，因為需要時間、慢慢的，就像你剛剛講的，不能一下子回來，也不可能一下子回來，但是我們每年導引3%、5%，讓這些資金挹注臺灣、回來建設我們自己，這才是正確的，不是嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：是。"],["王委員世堅：所以沒有具體的結果就對了？"],["彭主任委員金隆：現在等於說因為壽險資金整體是非常龐大，國內要找尋這些涉及到公建的案例確實沒有那麼容易啦。"],["王委員世堅：過去蔡英文總統的時候，我看他過去那8年，他們也是到後來才警覺這個事情嚴重，他們有去說服交通部成立了7檔交通建設的債券，雖然那個金額不算大，大概都數十億之多，但是聊勝於無，這是一個開始。"],["彭主任委員金隆：是。"],["王委員世堅：他們有7檔，8年做了7檔，所以我希望在你這麼專業、認真之下，你帶領的團隊能夠趕快跟我們這些相關部會去做協調，好不好？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這也是我們努力的方向。"],["王委員世堅：其次就是關於詐騙的部分，我們這些逃逸的外勞，還有逃逸、失聯，甚至工作期到的外勞，他們就把戶頭賣給這些詐騙集團。本來數字不大，從2022年的521人逐年增加到921人、1,862人，一直到今年6月統計已經超過2,000人，有2,054人。當然我們也祭出重罰，說可以罰一百萬以下、最高可判三年以下。"],["彭主任委員金隆：人都離境、走了。"],["王委員世堅：可是主委，光是重罰甚至關他都沒用，他人都出境了！難道我們要去引渡他回來我們臺灣嗎？這都是不可能的事情，所以我認為這些事情茲事體大。"],["彭主任委員金隆：是。"],["王委員世堅：我也詢問了你們相關金管會的同仁們，他們是說有找勞動部去談。"],["彭主任委員金隆：有。"],["王委員世堅：但是我覺得這個部分可能談得還不夠徹底，當然勞動部似乎不積極，所以我希望跟勞動部談，你們跟他們談清楚，在這一件事情上面，所謂的外勞開戶，他們自己的財產管理這一部分的權利、人權應該擺在一邊，為什麼？因為不管他是期限已經到了要回國，或者他都已經失聯了，簡單的方式就是把這個戶頭切斷就好嘛！切斷就好！人家失聯、逃逸的也不敢用這個戶頭，聘請他的雇主也一定是給他現金嘛！不是嗎？所以這樣子的外勞，他剛好順便把這個戶頭賣掉就算了。所以這樣子的情況下，不要在這邊一直考量外勞也有他的人權，他有他的權利去管理他的資金，這一切都是在他失聯之後，甚至期滿回國以後就要簡單明瞭把它斷線，這個也可以請勞動部納入到跟外勞引進的合約裡面，就可以寫得很清楚，好不好？"],["彭主任委員金隆：是，謝謝，我們有在這邊……"],["王委員世堅：我希望你們跟勞動部……因為我知道現在阻撓的都是勞動部。"],["彭主任委員金隆：對。"],["王委員世堅：不積極的都是勞動部，你跟勞動部講清楚，說這個事情茲事體大，不要再用那些有的、沒有的藉口，就是不要把簡單的事情複雜化，好不好？"],["彭主任委員金隆：好，謝謝，我們會朝這方面努力，也看到自從去年我們開始有對接移民署這些外籍勞工的部分，警示帳戶的比例從高峰已經開始往下走，我們會持續跟其他部會一起來努力。"],["王委員世堅：好，我剛剛看到的數字、我唸的數字都是往上爬的。"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，現在8月……"],["王委員世堅：當然有往下的數字是好啦，我希望你提供。"],["彭主任委員金隆：8月已經下降下來了，因為我們的管控措施也慢慢看到一些成效。"],["王委員世堅：好，加油。"],["彭主任委員金隆：我們會努力。"],["王委員世堅：加油。"],["彭主任委員金隆：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝王委員，謝謝主委。","接下來我們請葛如鈞委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":102,"meet_id":"委員會-11-4-20-2","speakers":["李坤城","林德福","吳秉叡","賴士葆","郭國文","賴惠員","林思銘","顏寬恒","鍾佳濱","黃珊珊","李彥秀","王世堅","葛如鈞","黃國昌","楊瓊瓔","林楚茵","邱志偉","陳玉珍","羅明才"],"page_start":41,"meetingDate":["2025-10-13"],"gazette_id":"1148401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1148401_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期財政委員會第2次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請金融監督管理委員會彭主任委員金隆率所屬機關首長暨中央存款保險股份有限公司、監管相\n關機構有關之財團法人、臺灣證券交易所股份有限公司、臺灣期貨交易所股份有限公司、臺灣集\n中保管結算所股份有限公司等董事長、總經理列席業務報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1148401_00002"}}}