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933.918, \"end\": 934.279, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"善\", \"start\": 934.279, \"end\": 934.539, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 934.539, \"end\": 934.639, \"score\": 0.807}, {\"word\": \"運\"}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"空\", \"start\": 934.639, \"end\": 934.659, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 963.544, \"end\": 963.565, \"score\": 0.004}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:16,651 --> 00:00:19,192\n謝謝院長有請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備詢林委員好\n\n2\n00:00:30,865 --> 00:00:58,448\n好院長好院長本席在上個月22號有當面跟您報告過就全體台南市民因應期盼的我們台南市第一條捷運藍線第一期的建設問題那本來預計明年這條捷運就可以動工那今年3月綜合規劃也已經在國發會完成審議那經過修正6月也正式送到行政院\n\n3\n00:00:59,309 --> 00:01:28,693\n那但是直到現在我們還要等待行政院的核定所以在這裡請教院長到底什麼時候可以核定那你是不是可以今天明確的告訴台南市民行政院最快什麼時候可以來核定部長先說一下目前的跟委員報告這個確實經過一長段的這個審查的過程那也請台南市政府做很多的修正那我們交通部也已經審定過那目前是在行政院\n\n4\n00:01:29,113 --> 00:01:49,638\n那國發會也有做一些建議的報告不過跟委員報告就是說現在我們因為這個才化法的原因我們今年其實在捷運中央交通部能夠協助地方的預算上面其實比起過去是少很多所以今年有很多的縣市都有受到一些影響那這個部分我們目前正在盤\n\n5\n00:01:51,319 --> 00:02:10,130\n說未來的才化法化完之後我們交通部還剩下多少的力氣可以協助各個都市的捷運的計畫也就是說分配的這個比例上面我們其實都會再做新的考量那這個部分我們希望這一兩天月能夠比較確定定案之後我相信這個審核的速度就會加快\n\n6\n00:02:10,526 --> 00:02:29,876\n本席知道因為藍白兩黨二修了才劃法那特別是海大出包那不只導致這個中央地方這個資源跟權責始終分配不清以外那甚至包含我們台南在內的九個縣市其實他所獲得配額數還低於修法前\n\n7\n00:02:32,238 --> 00:02:59,394\n這是百分百的人禍那所以行政院我覺得也絕對不能讓這樣的人禍然後來影響到地方的重大建設那對於我們台南的經費支持我還是衷心希望行政院能全力的來配合來支持那台南喔是六都唯一沒有這個捷運系統的城市那我們的發展已經比別人晚那結果現在不僅就是\n\n8\n00:03:00,094 --> 00:03:16,631\n透過才化法的分配我們還分配的比別人少然後捷運建設又獲得重要的支持有可能又比別人少那我想這不僅我不能接受我想全臺南市民都不能接受所以我想怎麼樣讓才化法\n\n9\n00:03:20,135 --> 00:03:36,035\n能有一個比較這個正確的版本來幫助我們縣市分配會比較那個平均那我舉個例來講雙北當年的捷運建設其實中央都補助八九成\n\n10\n00:03:37,177 --> 00:03:55,659\n行政院是否可以拿出當初支持雙北的捷運的決斷力來協助台南突破修惡版的財化法的困境我想這裡延伸出兩個問題第一個就是我們符合民主程序\n\n11\n00:03:57,160 --> 00:04:22,311\n而且讓國家真正能夠均衡的發展所謂的公正版的就我剛說的公正版的才化法行政院年底前是不是或者這個會期是否可以提出版本第二個問題是說在未來台灣的捷運建設上中央是否也可以比照當年雙北的這樣的一個支持來挹注台南的經費\n\n12\n00:04:24,178 --> 00:04:24,741\n院長兩個問題來答覆委員第一個藍線的第一期\n\n13\n00:04:29,439 --> 00:04:56,965\n國發費核算核定的這個金額是332億在核定之後的7年完成那如果現在因為我們中央跟地方財政收支發分法重新訂定之後中央少了4165億所以我們少了很多對地方補助的錢要嘛就是地方多負擔一些要嘛就是這個工程的7年要往後延那我覺得往後延大概大家接受的程度很低啦所以如何來討論出一個合理的\n\n14\n00:04:57,901 --> 00:05:25,394\n共同分擔的一個比例這是第一個問題那第二個財化法的問題我們會在適當的時間而且應該是在今年的時間我們提出一個版本來行政院的版本那我希望這個版本垂直能夠劃分的很清楚市權能夠劃分很清楚中央地方劃分很清楚水平能夠財務非常的均衡那這樣子就不會造成現在台南所遇到的問題照新的財化法怎麼算怎麼劃\n\n15\n00:05:26,786 --> 00:05:54,705\n到最後台南都是損失最多的對都是minus不是這樣子我們也想但是公視就是一定的我們也不能上下其手所以我們只想說是不是在明年度的財化法因為不可能大修啦明年度已經來不及了後年以後我們希望大修明年度財化法我們可不可以在還有餘裕的這個財政能夠我們來管控的部分能夠補上這些像台南像屏東甚至像嘉義雲林\n\n16\n00:05:55,445 --> 00:06:17,234\n整個非常不公平的狀態我們把它補起來能不能有這個能力可是還是拜託院長雙軌並進第一個是不是讓我們趕快捷運可以往下走往下走的話就是先趕快核定至於要跟地方政府怎麼樣分配的問題其實總數不變的話先核定我們下面可以繼續走\n\n17\n00:06:17,674 --> 00:06:40,573\n因為我們還有很多的規劃這些設計要走那不然明年動不了工那工程就一直往後延宕所以是不是這一趴先請院長先幫忙然後再來我們財劃板當然也要給台南一個合理的分配剛剛在答覆蘇曉慧委員相同類似新北捷運的時候我就說過我們明年希望我們中央政府總計算能夠順利的執行\n\n18\n00:06:41,394 --> 00:07:03,885\n也行大院能夠快速的審查順利的事情那今年像這個部分的我們在今年都做一個了結跟地方該怎麼算我們今年該核定就來核定那明年中央地方行政立法兩院大步向前走好所以捷運今年一定能合併謝謝院長那再來跟院長討論就是七八月喔我們台南丹納斯颱風的風災那\n\n19\n00:07:07,967 --> 00:07:34,104\n因為當然我們在院長的指導之下其實我們有從寬從速的發放一些經費可是市府如果立有未待的地方其實我們也希望中央再加碼協助舉例來講像泡水車的補助台南市政府反應很快可是資源不夠所以我們每台泡水汽車補助上限是一萬塊那摩托車上限是兩千塊那汽機車對於一個家庭來講真的是非常而重要\n\n20\n00:07:35,245 --> 00:07:57,059\n建基在電基在市府喔已有的補助上中央是不是可以再投入一些補助的資源來攜手減輕台南市民的負擔院長這個可不可以來考慮一下幫我們在港灣道踢掛好因為泡水車的處理我們當時是利用是地方政府是用這樣的標準對那我們這次在\n\n21\n00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:17,930\n花蓮因為它是一個被泥沙整個埋沒掉的受損的程度是不一樣我們在車輛方面是五萬塊機車方面是一萬塊那顯然是比較多花蓮這次也受到很多善款捐助我們來做一些使用\n\n22\n00:08:20,009 --> 00:08:45,346\n台南的這個部分也應該政財基金會有一些善款我們是不是請政財基金會重新來考量一下能不能著雨提高而且我主張把善款能夠快速積極用掉用在該用的地方去不要讓捐款的人認為說我捐的錢是擺在銀行裡面的趕快把它捐給災民的身上讓他們去自己使用到好謝謝院長那再來要跟院長討論\n\n23\n00:08:49,127 --> 00:09:13,505\n中正紀念堂中長期規劃的問題有些喜歡蔣介石的人他要在家裡替他立個牌位公著其實我們都沒有意見可是如果用國家的資源強逼全民納稅來維運蔣介石這個機構我覺得這明顯違反了民主精神的作為根本也不該繼續存在在台灣社會\n\n24\n00:09:14,446 --> 00:09:31,405\n那促轉會任務總結報告有指出目前這個國立中正紀念堂管理處組織法的定位其實他就是以法律的形式在辦理威權統治者的紀念業務所以促轉會在解散之前他也有規劃修正或廢止這個相關的條例\n\n25\n00:09:34,567 --> 00:10:00,593\n當初提出的時程是2023年研擬草案2024到2025年要審查獲立法與立法2026跟2027要實施並完成根據行政院推動轉型正義匯報第六次的會議就有建議把中正經驗堂管理處改組成民主教育園區管理中心並入國家人權博物館\n\n26\n00:10:02,372 --> 00:10:23,420\n本席認為你破除這個組織的意義上的權威真的是轉型正義的非常重要的工作之一所以我有完成連署並提出中正紀念堂組織法廢止案跟民主教育園區的成立所需的相關的組織法那請問這個相關的法制作業不曉得行政院什麼時候要跟上喔\n\n27\n00:10:23,820 --> 00:10:45,499\n那另外中正紀念堂中長期轉型規劃也涉及文化資產跟文化景觀身份競合還有都市計畫等等的問題這部分因為時間的關係我再請文化部與書面跟本席辦公室來做說明那我請教院長是說這個法制如何跟上何時跟上在轉型正義第六式會議當中決定\n\n28\n00:10:48,005 --> 00:11:14,770\n結合歷史記憶的保存跟民主教育推廣將這個中正紀念堂有雙重的目標先轉型為民主教育園區讓我們認為說先轉型再談明先轉型再談組織以後再來說先轉型因為轉型當中之所謂轉型就是社會上有不同的意見在這邊糾葛然後我們希望這個轉型能夠順順的轉型因為轉到民主教育以及轉到這個歷史記憶的保存\n\n29\n00:11:15,590 --> 00:11:42,487\n應該是中性的先轉型到這樣的民主園區以後讓大家熟悉這個場域讓大家先熟悉這個場域辦一些人權的活動藝術的活動文化的活動讓他這些您剛剛說的威權的意向讓他漸漸淡去我們再來討論他轉型之後組織上如何強化好院長謝謝那最後要請運動部部長\n\n30\n00:11:47,779 --> 00:12:05,434\n我要跟院長跟運動部里楊部長來討論一下台灣的運動外交的問題中國打壓台灣的選手我們是屢見不鮮大大小小的賽事我們不僅不能使用真正的國民還得\n\n31\n00:12:08,636 --> 00:12:31,477\n選手還要負擔這個額外的身心壓力跟安全疑慮像今年七月的世大運中國就當台灣的選手的面來搶賀電這種荒唐的案例那李昂部長剛退役你應該非常清楚台灣選手的國境處境那是實際上不只選手連在場邊家有的觀眾也會受到中國的威脅\n\n32\n00:12:32,698 --> 00:12:56,126\n像李昂部長你去年在這個巴黎奧運這個比賽的時候場邊就有很多觀眾自發性的製作台灣諧音梗的這個看板海報可是也被遭遇無理的沒收那李部長你去年李昂配的這個最後一物喔甚至還有人在場邊羞辱性的大喊說台灣是中國的\n\n33\n00:12:56,906 --> 00:13:23,794\n那運動部的LOGO的靈感我相信就是來自陳傑憲在十二牆轟出這個三分炮然後落雷的時候說比出那個手勢我們雖然知道說我們雖然知道他比的沒有國家的名字可是我們知道他代表什麼意義那想請教李洋部長既然你這個LOGO的創意如此有這層含利那你未來又什麼樣\n\n34\n00:13:24,654 --> 00:13:49,673\n有什麼樣的策略要讓台灣的選手在國際比賽的時候可以毫無顧忌地秀出國家的名字另外就是往後如果遇到像搶賀電這樣的狀況或觀眾受到羞辱的時候你身為運動部長你要怎麼處置或者怎麼跟該主辦國合作來保障我們台灣公民跟我們的選手部長\n\n35\n00:13:50,774 --> 00:14:14,992\n跟委員您報告那當然這部分我身為運動員退役我強烈的譴責任何的政治打壓因為我們希望我們運動可以是只否運動那當然我們一定會在奧會模式下希望保障任何運動員的參賽權益也希望保障我們運動員每一個人他都非常努力的訓練的過程那未來我們希望說我們可以養\n\n36\n00:14:15,612 --> 00:14:32,105\n可以培養更多的運動員進入單向國際的組織那增加我們國際的能見度那包含我自己當時成為了部長其實我們來到有非常多的來自國際的運動員向我祝賀所以我認為\n\n37\n00:14:33,847 --> 00:14:56,906\n運動員本身就具有國際的知名度我們也希望說像明年我也預計會參加IWG也就是我們的國際婦女運動工作小組我們希望藉由性別平權以及運動外交讓國際看見我們台灣那面對中國的打壓或羞辱這部分我們肯定是需要在奧會模式下絕對的保護運動員的參賽權益\n\n38\n00:14:59,141 --> 00:15:25,104\n好那再追問一下部長你在選手時間飛到各國去征戰那有哪個國家的全民運動或運動產業環境是讓你覺得可以借鏡的舉例來說像美國他是用商業的力量來維持來發展運動那像英國跟澳洲他是用政府來主導運動政策的那你要怎麼樣形成一個台灣模式的運動環境\n\n39\n00:15:26,813 --> 00:15:34,659\n其實有非常多的國家我們台灣也有自己我們屬於我們台灣自己的優勢那未來我們希望說打造更多良善的運動空\n\n40\n00:16:03,544 --> 00:16:03,565\n好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n16651\t19192\t謝謝院長 有請卓院長 麻煩再請卓院長備詢林委員好\n30865\t58448\t好 院長好院長 本席在上個月22號有當面跟您報告過就全體台南市民因應期盼的我們台南市第一條捷運藍線第一期的建設問題那本來預計明年這條捷運就可以動工那今年3月綜合規劃也已經在國發會完成審議那經過修正6月也正式送到行政院\n59309\t88693\t那但是直到現在我們還要等待行政院的核定所以在這裡請教院長到底什麼時候可以核定那你是不是可以今天明確的告訴台南市民行政院最快什麼時候可以來核定部長先說一下目前的跟委員報告這個確實經過一長段的這個審查的過程那也請台南市政府做很多的修正那我們交通部也已經審定過那目前是在行政院\n89113\t109638\t那國發會也有做一些建議的報告不過跟委員報告就是說現在我們因為這個才化法的原因我們今年其實在捷運中央交通部能夠協助地方的預算上面其實比起過去是少很多所以今年有很多的縣市都有受到一些影響那這個部分我們目前正在盤\n111319\t130130\t說未來的才化法化完之後我們交通部還剩下多少的力氣可以協助各個都市的捷運的計畫也就是說分配的這個比例上面我們其實都會再做新的考量那這個部分我們希望這一兩天月能夠比較確定定案之後我相信這個審核的速度就會加快\n130526\t149876\t本席知道因為藍白兩黨二修了才劃法那特別是海大出包那不只導致這個中央地方這個資源跟權責始終分配不清以外那甚至包含我們台南在內的九個縣市其實他所獲得配額數還低於修法前\n152238\t179394\t這是百分百的人禍那所以行政院我覺得也絕對不能讓這樣的人禍然後來影響到地方的重大建設那對於我們台南的經費支持我還是衷心希望行政院能全力的來配合來支持那台南喔是六都唯一沒有這個捷運系統的城市那我們的發展已經比別人晚那結果現在不僅就是\n180094\t196631\t透過才化法的分配我們還分配的比別人少然後捷運建設又獲得重要的支持有可能又比別人少那我想這不僅我不能接受我想全臺南市民都不能接受所以我想怎麼樣讓才化法\n200135\t216035\t能有一個比較這個正確的版本來幫助我們縣市分配會比較那個平均那我舉個例來講雙北當年的捷運建設其實中央都補助八九成\n217177\t235659\t行政院是否可以拿出當初支持雙北的捷運的決斷力來協助台南突破修惡版的財化法的困境我想這裡延伸出兩個問題第一個就是我們符合民主程序\n237160\t262311\t而且讓國家真正能夠均衡的發展所謂的公正版的就我剛說的公正版的才化法行政院年底前是不是或者這個會期是否可以提出版本第二個問題是說在未來台灣的捷運建設上中央是否也可以比照當年雙北的這樣的一個支持來挹注台南的經費\n264178\t264741\t院長 兩個問題來答覆委員第一個 藍線的第一期\n269439\t296965\t國發費核算核定的這個金額是332億在核定之後的7年完成那如果現在因為我們中央跟地方財政收支發分法重新訂定之後中央少了4165億所以我們少了很多對地方補助的錢要嘛就是地方多負擔一些要嘛就是這個工程的7年要往後延那我覺得往後延大概大家接受的程度很低啦所以如何來討論出一個合理的\n297901\t325394\t共同分擔的一個比例這是第一個問題那第二個財化法的問題我們會在適當的時間而且應該是在今年的時間我們提出一個版本來行政院的版本那我希望這個版本垂直能夠劃分的很清楚市權能夠劃分很清楚中央地方劃分很清楚水平能夠財務非常的均衡那這樣子就不會造成現在台南所遇到的問題照新的財化法怎麼算怎麼劃\n326786\t354705\t到最後台南都是損失最多的對都是minus不是這樣子我們也想但是公視就是一定的我們也不能上下其手所以我們只想說是不是在明年度的財化法因為不可能大修啦明年度已經來不及了後年以後我們希望大修明年度財化法我們可不可以在還有餘裕的這個財政能夠我們來管控的部分能夠補上這些像台南像屏東甚至像嘉義雲林\n355445\t377234\t整個非常不公平的狀態我們把它補起來能不能有這個能力可是還是拜託院長雙軌並進第一個是不是讓我們趕快捷運可以往下走往下走的話就是先趕快核定至於要跟地方政府怎麼樣分配的問題其實總數不變的話先核定我們下面可以繼續走\n377674\t400573\t因為我們還有很多的規劃這些設計要走那不然明年動不了工那工程就一直往後延宕所以是不是這一趴先請院長先幫忙然後再來我們財劃板當然也要給台南一個合理的分配剛剛在答覆蘇曉慧委員相同類似新北捷運的時候我就說過我們明年希望我們中央政府總計算能夠順利的執行\n401394\t423885\t也行大院能夠快速的審查順利的事情那今年像這個部分的我們在今年都做一個了結跟地方該怎麼算我們今年該核定就來核定那明年中央地方行政立法兩院大步向前走好所以捷運今年一定能合併謝謝院長那再來跟院長討論就是七八月喔我們台南丹納斯颱風的風災那\n427967\t454104\t因為當然我們在院長的指導之下其實我們有從寬從速的發放一些經費可是市府如果立有未待的地方其實我們也希望中央再加碼協助舉例來講像泡水車的補助台南市政府反應很快可是資源不夠所以我們每台泡水汽車補助上限是一萬塊那摩托車上限是兩千塊那汽機車對於一個家庭來講真的是非常而重要\n455245\t477059\t建基在 電基在市府喔 已有的補助上中央是不是可以再投入一些補助的資源來攜手減輕台南市民的負擔院長這個可不可以來考慮一下幫我們在港灣道踢掛好 因為泡水車的處理我們當時是利用是地方政府是用這樣的標準對那我們這次在\n478240\t497930\t花蓮因為它是一個被泥沙整個埋沒掉的受損的程度是不一樣我們在車輛方面是五萬塊機車方面是一萬塊那顯然是比較多花蓮這次也受到很多善款捐助我們來做一些使用\n500009\t525346\t台南的這個部分也應該政財基金會有一些善款我們是不是請政財基金會重新來考量一下能不能著雨提高而且我主張把善款能夠快速積極用掉 用在該用的地方去不要讓捐款的人認為說我捐的錢是擺在銀行裡面的趕快把它捐給災民的身上讓他們去自己使用到好 謝謝院長那再來要跟院長討論\n529127\t553505\t中正紀念堂中長期規劃的問題有些喜歡蔣介石的人他要在家裡替他立個牌位公著其實我們都沒有意見可是如果用國家的資源強逼全民納稅來維運蔣介石這個機構我覺得這明顯違反了民主精神的作為根本也不該繼續存在在台灣社會\n554446\t571405\t那促轉會任務總結報告有指出目前這個國立中正紀念堂管理處組織法的定位其實他就是以法律的形式在辦理威權統治者的紀念業務所以促轉會在解散之前他也有規劃修正或廢止這個相關的條例\n574567\t600593\t當初提出的時程是2023年研擬草案2024到2025年要審查獲立法與立法2026跟2027要實施並完成根據行政院推動轉型正義匯報第六次的會議就有建議把中正經驗堂管理處改組成民主教育園區管理中心並入國家人權博物館\n602372\t623420\t本席認為你破除這個組織的意義上的權威真的是轉型正義的非常重要的工作之一所以我有完成連署並提出中正紀念堂組織法廢止案跟民主教育園區的成立所需的相關的組織法那請問這個相關的法制作業不曉得行政院什麼時候要跟上喔\n623820\t645499\t那另外中正紀念堂中長期轉型規劃也涉及文化資產跟文化景觀身份競合還有都市計畫等等的問題這部分因為時間的關係我再請文化部與書面跟本席辦公室來做說明那我請教院長是說這個法制如何跟上 何時跟上在轉型正義第六式會議當中決定\n648005\t674770\t結合歷史記憶的保存跟民主教育推廣將這個中正紀念堂有雙重的目標先轉型為民主教育園區讓我們認為說先轉型再談明先轉型再談組織以後再來說先轉型因為轉型當中之所謂轉型就是社會上有不同的意見在這邊糾葛然後我們希望這個轉型能夠順順的轉型因為轉到民主教育以及轉到這個歷史記憶的保存\n675590\t702487\t應該是中性的先轉型到這樣的民主園區以後讓大家熟悉這個場域讓大家先熟悉這個場域辦一些人權的活動 藝術的活動 文化的活動讓他這些 您剛剛說的威權的意向讓他漸漸淡去我們再來討論他轉型之後組織上如何強化好 院長謝謝那最後要請運動部部長\n707779\t725434\t我要跟院長跟運動部里楊部長來討論一下台灣的運動外交的問題中國打壓台灣的選手我們是屢見不鮮大大小小的賽事我們不僅不能使用真正的國民還得\n728636\t751477\t選手還要負擔這個額外的身心壓力跟安全疑慮像今年七月的世大運中國就當台灣的選手的面來搶賀電這種荒唐的案例那李昂部長剛退役你應該非常清楚台灣選手的國境處境那是實際上不只選手連在場邊家有的觀眾也會受到中國的威脅\n752698\t776126\t像李昂部長你去年在這個巴黎奧運這個比賽的時候場邊就有很多觀眾自發性的製作台灣諧音梗的這個看板海報可是也被遭遇無理的沒收那李部長你去年李昂配的這個最後一物喔甚至還有人在場邊羞辱性的大喊說台灣是中國的\n776906\t803794\t那運動部的LOGO的靈感我相信就是來自陳傑憲在十二牆轟出這個三分炮然後落雷的時候說比出那個手勢我們雖然知道說我們雖然知道他比的沒有國家的名字可是我們知道他代表什麼意義那想請教李洋部長既然你這個LOGO的創意如此有這層含利那你未來又什麼樣\n804654\t829673\t有什麼樣的策略要讓台灣的選手在國際比賽的時候可以毫無顧忌地秀出國家的名字另外就是往後如果遇到像搶賀電這樣的狀況或觀眾受到羞辱的時候你身為運動部長你要怎麼處置或者怎麼跟該主辦國合作來保障我們台灣公民跟我們的選手部長\n830774\t854992\t跟委員您報告那當然這部分我身為運動員退役我強烈的譴責任何的政治打壓因為我們希望我們運動可以是只否運動那當然我們一定會在奧會模式下希望保障任何運動員的參賽權益也希望保障我們運動員每一個人他都非常努力的訓練的過程那未來我們希望說我們可以養\n855612\t872105\t可以培養更多的運動員進入單向國際的組織那增加我們國際的能見度那包含我自己當時成為了部長其實我們來到有非常多的來自國際的運動員向我祝賀所以我認為\n873847\t896906\t運動員本身就具有國際的知名度我們也希望說像明年我也預計會參加IWG也就是我們的國際婦女運動工作小組我們希望藉由性別平權以及運動外交讓國際看見我們台灣那面對中國的打壓或羞辱這部分我們肯定是需要在奧會模式下絕對的保護運動員的參賽權益\n899141\t925104\t好 那再追問一下部長你在選手時間飛到各國去征戰那有哪個國家的全民運動或運動產業環境是讓你覺得可以借鏡的舉例來說像美國他是用商業的力量來維持來發展運動那像英國跟澳洲他是用政府來主導運動政策的那你要怎麼樣形成一個台灣模式的運動環境\n926813\t934659\t其實有非常多的國家我們台灣也有自己我們屬於我們台灣自己的優勢那未來我們希望說打造更多良善的運動空\n963544\t963565\t好 謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝院長 有請卓院長 麻煩再請卓院長備詢林委員好\n好 院長好院長 本席在上個月22號有當面跟您報告過就全體台南市民因應期盼的我們台南市第一條捷運藍線第一期的建設問題那本來預計明年這條捷運就可以動工那今年3月綜合規劃也已經在國發會完成審議那經過修正6月也正式送到行政院\n那但是直到現在我們還要等待行政院的核定所以在這裡請教院長到底什麼時候可以核定那你是不是可以今天明確的告訴台南市民行政院最快什麼時候可以來核定部長先說一下目前的跟委員報告這個確實經過一長段的這個審查的過程那也請台南市政府做很多的修正那我們交通部也已經審定過那目前是在行政院\n那國發會也有做一些建議的報告不過跟委員報告就是說現在我們因為這個才化法的原因我們今年其實在捷運中央交通部能夠協助地方的預算上面其實比起過去是少很多所以今年有很多的縣市都有受到一些影響那這個部分我們目前正在盤\n說未來的才化法化完之後我們交通部還剩下多少的力氣可以協助各個都市的捷運的計畫也就是說分配的這個比例上面我們其實都會再做新的考量那這個部分我們希望這一兩天月能夠比較確定定案之後我相信這個審核的速度就會加快\n本席知道因為藍白兩黨二修了才劃法那特別是海大出包那不只導致這個中央地方這個資源跟權責始終分配不清以外那甚至包含我們台南在內的九個縣市其實他所獲得配額數還低於修法前\n這是百分百的人禍那所以行政院我覺得也絕對不能讓這樣的人禍然後來影響到地方的重大建設那對於我們台南的經費支持我還是衷心希望行政院能全力的來配合來支持那台南喔是六都唯一沒有這個捷運系統的城市那我們的發展已經比別人晚那結果現在不僅就是\n透過才化法的分配我們還分配的比別人少然後捷運建設又獲得重要的支持有可能又比別人少那我想這不僅我不能接受我想全臺南市民都不能接受所以我想怎麼樣讓才化法\n能有一個比較這個正確的版本來幫助我們縣市分配會比較那個平均那我舉個例來講雙北當年的捷運建設其實中央都補助八九成\n行政院是否可以拿出當初支持雙北的捷運的決斷力來協助台南突破修惡版的財化法的困境我想這裡延伸出兩個問題第一個就是我們符合民主程序\n而且讓國家真正能夠均衡的發展所謂的公正版的就我剛說的公正版的才化法行政院年底前是不是或者這個會期是否可以提出版本第二個問題是說在未來台灣的捷運建設上中央是否也可以比照當年雙北的這樣的一個支持來挹注台南的經費\n院長 兩個問題來答覆委員第一個 藍線的第一期\n國發費核算核定的這個金額是332億在核定之後的7年完成那如果現在因為我們中央跟地方財政收支發分法重新訂定之後中央少了4165億所以我們少了很多對地方補助的錢要嘛就是地方多負擔一些要嘛就是這個工程的7年要往後延那我覺得往後延大概大家接受的程度很低啦所以如何來討論出一個合理的\n共同分擔的一個比例這是第一個問題那第二個財化法的問題我們會在適當的時間而且應該是在今年的時間我們提出一個版本來行政院的版本那我希望這個版本垂直能夠劃分的很清楚市權能夠劃分很清楚中央地方劃分很清楚水平能夠財務非常的均衡那這樣子就不會造成現在台南所遇到的問題照新的財化法怎麼算怎麼劃\n到最後台南都是損失最多的對都是minus不是這樣子我們也想但是公視就是一定的我們也不能上下其手所以我們只想說是不是在明年度的財化法因為不可能大修啦明年度已經來不及了後年以後我們希望大修明年度財化法我們可不可以在還有餘裕的這個財政能夠我們來管控的部分能夠補上這些像台南像屏東甚至像嘉義雲林\n整個非常不公平的狀態我們把它補起來能不能有這個能力可是還是拜託院長雙軌並進第一個是不是讓我們趕快捷運可以往下走往下走的話就是先趕快核定至於要跟地方政府怎麼樣分配的問題其實總數不變的話先核定我們下面可以繼續走\n因為我們還有很多的規劃這些設計要走那不然明年動不了工那工程就一直往後延宕所以是不是這一趴先請院長先幫忙然後再來我們財劃板當然也要給台南一個合理的分配剛剛在答覆蘇曉慧委員相同類似新北捷運的時候我就說過我們明年希望我們中央政府總計算能夠順利的執行\n也行大院能夠快速的審查順利的事情那今年像這個部分的我們在今年都做一個了結跟地方該怎麼算我們今年該核定就來核定那明年中央地方行政立法兩院大步向前走好所以捷運今年一定能合併謝謝院長那再來跟院長討論就是七八月喔我們台南丹納斯颱風的風災那\n因為當然我們在院長的指導之下其實我們有從寬從速的發放一些經費可是市府如果立有未待的地方其實我們也希望中央再加碼協助舉例來講像泡水車的補助台南市政府反應很快可是資源不夠所以我們每台泡水汽車補助上限是一萬塊那摩托車上限是兩千塊那汽機車對於一個家庭來講真的是非常而重要\n建基在 電基在市府喔 已有的補助上中央是不是可以再投入一些補助的資源來攜手減輕台南市民的負擔院長這個可不可以來考慮一下幫我們在港灣道踢掛好 因為泡水車的處理我們當時是利用是地方政府是用這樣的標準對那我們這次在\n花蓮因為它是一個被泥沙整個埋沒掉的受損的程度是不一樣我們在車輛方面是五萬塊機車方面是一萬塊那顯然是比較多花蓮這次也受到很多善款捐助我們來做一些使用\n台南的這個部分也應該政財基金會有一些善款我們是不是請政財基金會重新來考量一下能不能著雨提高而且我主張把善款能夠快速積極用掉 用在該用的地方去不要讓捐款的人認為說我捐的錢是擺在銀行裡面的趕快把它捐給災民的身上讓他們去自己使用到好 謝謝院長那再來要跟院長討論\n中正紀念堂中長期規劃的問題有些喜歡蔣介石的人他要在家裡替他立個牌位公著其實我們都沒有意見可是如果用國家的資源強逼全民納稅來維運蔣介石這個機構我覺得這明顯違反了民主精神的作為根本也不該繼續存在在台灣社會\n那促轉會任務總結報告有指出目前這個國立中正紀念堂管理處組織法的定位其實他就是以法律的形式在辦理威權統治者的紀念業務所以促轉會在解散之前他也有規劃修正或廢止這個相關的條例\n當初提出的時程是2023年研擬草案2024到2025年要審查獲立法與立法2026跟2027要實施並完成根據行政院推動轉型正義匯報第六次的會議就有建議把中正經驗堂管理處改組成民主教育園區管理中心並入國家人權博物館\n本席認為你破除這個組織的意義上的權威真的是轉型正義的非常重要的工作之一所以我有完成連署並提出中正紀念堂組織法廢止案跟民主教育園區的成立所需的相關的組織法那請問這個相關的法制作業不曉得行政院什麼時候要跟上喔\n那另外中正紀念堂中長期轉型規劃也涉及文化資產跟文化景觀身份競合還有都市計畫等等的問題這部分因為時間的關係我再請文化部與書面跟本席辦公室來做說明那我請教院長是說這個法制如何跟上 何時跟上在轉型正義第六式會議當中決定\n結合歷史記憶的保存跟民主教育推廣將這個中正紀念堂有雙重的目標先轉型為民主教育園區讓我們認為說先轉型再談明先轉型再談組織以後再來說先轉型因為轉型當中之所謂轉型就是社會上有不同的意見在這邊糾葛然後我們希望這個轉型能夠順順的轉型因為轉到民主教育以及轉到這個歷史記憶的保存\n應該是中性的先轉型到這樣的民主園區以後讓大家熟悉這個場域讓大家先熟悉這個場域辦一些人權的活動 藝術的活動 文化的活動讓他這些 您剛剛說的威權的意向讓他漸漸淡去我們再來討論他轉型之後組織上如何強化好 院長謝謝那最後要請運動部部長\n我要跟院長跟運動部里楊部長來討論一下台灣的運動外交的問題中國打壓台灣的選手我們是屢見不鮮大大小小的賽事我們不僅不能使用真正的國民還得\n選手還要負擔這個額外的身心壓力跟安全疑慮像今年七月的世大運中國就當台灣的選手的面來搶賀電這種荒唐的案例那李昂部長剛退役你應該非常清楚台灣選手的國境處境那是實際上不只選手連在場邊家有的觀眾也會受到中國的威脅\n像李昂部長你去年在這個巴黎奧運這個比賽的時候場邊就有很多觀眾自發性的製作台灣諧音梗的這個看板海報可是也被遭遇無理的沒收那李部長你去年李昂配的這個最後一物喔甚至還有人在場邊羞辱性的大喊說台灣是中國的\n那運動部的LOGO的靈感我相信就是來自陳傑憲在十二牆轟出這個三分炮然後落雷的時候說比出那個手勢我們雖然知道說我們雖然知道他比的沒有國家的名字可是我們知道他代表什麼意義那想請教李洋部長既然你這個LOGO的創意如此有這層含利那你未來又什麼樣\n有什麼樣的策略要讓台灣的選手在國際比賽的時候可以毫無顧忌地秀出國家的名字另外就是往後如果遇到像搶賀電這樣的狀況或觀眾受到羞辱的時候你身為運動部長你要怎麼處置或者怎麼跟該主辦國合作來保障我們台灣公民跟我們的選手部長\n跟委員您報告那當然這部分我身為運動員退役我強烈的譴責任何的政治打壓因為我們希望我們運動可以是只否運動那當然我們一定會在奧會模式下希望保障任何運動員的參賽權益也希望保障我們運動員每一個人他都非常努力的訓練的過程那未來我們希望說我們可以養\n可以培養更多的運動員進入單向國際的組織那增加我們國際的能見度那包含我自己當時成為了部長其實我們來到有非常多的來自國際的運動員向我祝賀所以我認為\n運動員本身就具有國際的知名度我們也希望說像明年我也預計會參加IWG也就是我們的國際婦女運動工作小組我們希望藉由性別平權以及運動外交讓國際看見我們台灣那面對中國的打壓或羞辱這部分我們肯定是需要在奧會模式下絕對的保護運動員的參賽權益\n好 那再追問一下部長你在選手時間飛到各國去征戰那有哪個國家的全民運動或運動產業環境是讓你覺得可以借鏡的舉例來說像美國他是用商業的力量來維持來發展運動那像英國跟澳洲他是用政府來主導運動政策的那你要怎麼樣形成一個台灣模式的運動環境\n其實有非常多的國家我們台灣也有自己我們屬於我們台灣自己的優勢那未來我們希望說打造更多良善的運動空\n好 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:16.651 --> 00:19.192\n謝謝院長有請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備詢林委員好\n\n00:30.865 --> 00:58.448\n好院長好院長本席在上個月22號有當面跟您報告過就全體台南市民因應期盼的我們台南市第一條捷運藍線第一期的建設問題那本來預計明年這條捷運就可以動工那今年3月綜合規劃也已經在國發會完成審議那經過修正6月也正式送到行政院\n\n00:59.309 --> 01:28.693\n那但是直到現在我們還要等待行政院的核定所以在這裡請教院長到底什麼時候可以核定那你是不是可以今天明確的告訴台南市民行政院最快什麼時候可以來核定部長先說一下目前的跟委員報告這個確實經過一長段的這個審查的過程那也請台南市政府做很多的修正那我們交通部也已經審定過那目前是在行政院\n\n01:29.113 --> 01:49.638\n那國發會也有做一些建議的報告不過跟委員報告就是說現在我們因為這個才化法的原因我們今年其實在捷運中央交通部能夠協助地方的預算上面其實比起過去是少很多所以今年有很多的縣市都有受到一些影響那這個部分我們目前正在盤\n\n01:51.319 --> 02:10.130\n說未來的才化法化完之後我們交通部還剩下多少的力氣可以協助各個都市的捷運的計畫也就是說分配的這個比例上面我們其實都會再做新的考量那這個部分我們希望這一兩天月能夠比較確定定案之後我相信這個審核的速度就會加快\n\n02:10.526 --> 02:29.876\n本席知道因為藍白兩黨二修了才劃法那特別是海大出包那不只導致這個中央地方這個資源跟權責始終分配不清以外那甚至包含我們台南在內的九個縣市其實他所獲得配額數還低於修法前\n\n02:32.238 --> 02:59.394\n這是百分百的人禍那所以行政院我覺得也絕對不能讓這樣的人禍然後來影響到地方的重大建設那對於我們台南的經費支持我還是衷心希望行政院能全力的來配合來支持那台南喔是六都唯一沒有這個捷運系統的城市那我們的發展已經比別人晚那結果現在不僅就是\n\n03:00.094 --> 03:16.631\n透過才化法的分配我們還分配的比別人少然後捷運建設又獲得重要的支持有可能又比別人少那我想這不僅我不能接受我想全臺南市民都不能接受所以我想怎麼樣讓才化法\n\n03:20.135 --> 03:36.035\n能有一個比較這個正確的版本來幫助我們縣市分配會比較那個平均那我舉個例來講雙北當年的捷運建設其實中央都補助八九成\n\n03:37.177 --> 03:55.659\n行政院是否可以拿出當初支持雙北的捷運的決斷力來協助台南突破修惡版的財化法的困境我想這裡延伸出兩個問題第一個就是我們符合民主程序\n\n03:57.160 --> 04:22.311\n而且讓國家真正能夠均衡的發展所謂的公正版的就我剛說的公正版的才化法行政院年底前是不是或者這個會期是否可以提出版本第二個問題是說在未來台灣的捷運建設上中央是否也可以比照當年雙北的這樣的一個支持來挹注台南的經費\n\n04:24.178 --> 04:24.741\n院長兩個問題來答覆委員第一個藍線的第一期\n\n04:29.439 --> 04:56.965\n國發費核算核定的這個金額是332億在核定之後的7年完成那如果現在因為我們中央跟地方財政收支發分法重新訂定之後中央少了4165億所以我們少了很多對地方補助的錢要嘛就是地方多負擔一些要嘛就是這個工程的7年要往後延那我覺得往後延大概大家接受的程度很低啦所以如何來討論出一個合理的\n\n04:57.901 --> 05:25.394\n共同分擔的一個比例這是第一個問題那第二個財化法的問題我們會在適當的時間而且應該是在今年的時間我們提出一個版本來行政院的版本那我希望這個版本垂直能夠劃分的很清楚市權能夠劃分很清楚中央地方劃分很清楚水平能夠財務非常的均衡那這樣子就不會造成現在台南所遇到的問題照新的財化法怎麼算怎麼劃\n\n05:26.786 --> 05:54.705\n到最後台南都是損失最多的對都是minus不是這樣子我們也想但是公視就是一定的我們也不能上下其手所以我們只想說是不是在明年度的財化法因為不可能大修啦明年度已經來不及了後年以後我們希望大修明年度財化法我們可不可以在還有餘裕的這個財政能夠我們來管控的部分能夠補上這些像台南像屏東甚至像嘉義雲林\n\n05:55.445 --> 06:17.234\n整個非常不公平的狀態我們把它補起來能不能有這個能力可是還是拜託院長雙軌並進第一個是不是讓我們趕快捷運可以往下走往下走的話就是先趕快核定至於要跟地方政府怎麼樣分配的問題其實總數不變的話先核定我們下面可以繼續走\n\n06:17.674 --> 06:40.573\n因為我們還有很多的規劃這些設計要走那不然明年動不了工那工程就一直往後延宕所以是不是這一趴先請院長先幫忙然後再來我們財劃板當然也要給台南一個合理的分配剛剛在答覆蘇曉慧委員相同類似新北捷運的時候我就說過我們明年希望我們中央政府總計算能夠順利的執行\n\n06:41.394 --> 07:03.885\n也行大院能夠快速的審查順利的事情那今年像這個部分的我們在今年都做一個了結跟地方該怎麼算我們今年該核定就來核定那明年中央地方行政立法兩院大步向前走好所以捷運今年一定能合併謝謝院長那再來跟院長討論就是七八月喔我們台南丹納斯颱風的風災那\n\n07:07.967 --> 07:34.104\n因為當然我們在院長的指導之下其實我們有從寬從速的發放一些經費可是市府如果立有未待的地方其實我們也希望中央再加碼協助舉例來講像泡水車的補助台南市政府反應很快可是資源不夠所以我們每台泡水汽車補助上限是一萬塊那摩托車上限是兩千塊那汽機車對於一個家庭來講真的是非常而重要\n\n07:35.245 --> 07:57.059\n建基在電基在市府喔已有的補助上中央是不是可以再投入一些補助的資源來攜手減輕台南市民的負擔院長這個可不可以來考慮一下幫我們在港灣道踢掛好因為泡水車的處理我們當時是利用是地方政府是用這樣的標準對那我們這次在\n\n07:58.240 --> 08:17.930\n花蓮因為它是一個被泥沙整個埋沒掉的受損的程度是不一樣我們在車輛方面是五萬塊機車方面是一萬塊那顯然是比較多花蓮這次也受到很多善款捐助我們來做一些使用\n\n08:20.009 --> 08:45.346\n台南的這個部分也應該政財基金會有一些善款我們是不是請政財基金會重新來考量一下能不能著雨提高而且我主張把善款能夠快速積極用掉用在該用的地方去不要讓捐款的人認為說我捐的錢是擺在銀行裡面的趕快把它捐給災民的身上讓他們去自己使用到好謝謝院長那再來要跟院長討論\n\n08:49.127 --> 09:13.505\n中正紀念堂中長期規劃的問題有些喜歡蔣介石的人他要在家裡替他立個牌位公著其實我們都沒有意見可是如果用國家的資源強逼全民納稅來維運蔣介石這個機構我覺得這明顯違反了民主精神的作為根本也不該繼續存在在台灣社會\n\n09:14.446 --> 09:31.405\n那促轉會任務總結報告有指出目前這個國立中正紀念堂管理處組織法的定位其實他就是以法律的形式在辦理威權統治者的紀念業務所以促轉會在解散之前他也有規劃修正或廢止這個相關的條例\n\n09:34.567 --> 10:00.593\n當初提出的時程是2023年研擬草案2024到2025年要審查獲立法與立法2026跟2027要實施並完成根據行政院推動轉型正義匯報第六次的會議就有建議把中正經驗堂管理處改組成民主教育園區管理中心並入國家人權博物館\n\n10:02.372 --> 10:23.420\n本席認為你破除這個組織的意義上的權威真的是轉型正義的非常重要的工作之一所以我有完成連署並提出中正紀念堂組織法廢止案跟民主教育園區的成立所需的相關的組織法那請問這個相關的法制作業不曉得行政院什麼時候要跟上喔\n\n10:23.820 --> 10:45.499\n那另外中正紀念堂中長期轉型規劃也涉及文化資產跟文化景觀身份競合還有都市計畫等等的問題這部分因為時間的關係我再請文化部與書面跟本席辦公室來做說明那我請教院長是說這個法制如何跟上何時跟上在轉型正義第六式會議當中決定\n\n10:48.005 --> 11:14.770\n結合歷史記憶的保存跟民主教育推廣將這個中正紀念堂有雙重的目標先轉型為民主教育園區讓我們認為說先轉型再談明先轉型再談組織以後再來說先轉型因為轉型當中之所謂轉型就是社會上有不同的意見在這邊糾葛然後我們希望這個轉型能夠順順的轉型因為轉到民主教育以及轉到這個歷史記憶的保存\n\n11:15.590 --> 11:42.487\n應該是中性的先轉型到這樣的民主園區以後讓大家熟悉這個場域讓大家先熟悉這個場域辦一些人權的活動藝術的活動文化的活動讓他這些您剛剛說的威權的意向讓他漸漸淡去我們再來討論他轉型之後組織上如何強化好院長謝謝那最後要請運動部部長\n\n11:47.779 --> 12:05.434\n我要跟院長跟運動部里楊部長來討論一下台灣的運動外交的問題中國打壓台灣的選手我們是屢見不鮮大大小小的賽事我們不僅不能使用真正的國民還得\n\n12:08.636 --> 12:31.477\n選手還要負擔這個額外的身心壓力跟安全疑慮像今年七月的世大運中國就當台灣的選手的面來搶賀電這種荒唐的案例那李昂部長剛退役你應該非常清楚台灣選手的國境處境那是實際上不只選手連在場邊家有的觀眾也會受到中國的威脅\n\n12:32.698 --> 12:56.126\n像李昂部長你去年在這個巴黎奧運這個比賽的時候場邊就有很多觀眾自發性的製作台灣諧音梗的這個看板海報可是也被遭遇無理的沒收那李部長你去年李昂配的這個最後一物喔甚至還有人在場邊羞辱性的大喊說台灣是中國的\n\n12:56.906 --> 13:23.794\n那運動部的LOGO的靈感我相信就是來自陳傑憲在十二牆轟出這個三分炮然後落雷的時候說比出那個手勢我們雖然知道說我們雖然知道他比的沒有國家的名字可是我們知道他代表什麼意義那想請教李洋部長既然你這個LOGO的創意如此有這層含利那你未來又什麼樣\n\n13:24.654 --> 13:49.673\n有什麼樣的策略要讓台灣的選手在國際比賽的時候可以毫無顧忌地秀出國家的名字另外就是往後如果遇到像搶賀電這樣的狀況或觀眾受到羞辱的時候你身為運動部長你要怎麼處置或者怎麼跟該主辦國合作來保障我們台灣公民跟我們的選手部長\n\n13:50.774 --> 14:14.992\n跟委員您報告那當然這部分我身為運動員退役我強烈的譴責任何的政治打壓因為我們希望我們運動可以是只否運動那當然我們一定會在奧會模式下希望保障任何運動員的參賽權益也希望保障我們運動員每一個人他都非常努力的訓練的過程那未來我們希望說我們可以養\n\n14:15.612 --> 14:32.105\n可以培養更多的運動員進入單向國際的組織那增加我們國際的能見度那包含我自己當時成為了部長其實我們來到有非常多的來自國際的運動員向我祝賀所以我認為\n\n14:33.847 --> 14:56.906\n運動員本身就具有國際的知名度我們也希望說像明年我也預計會參加IWG也就是我們的國際婦女運動工作小組我們希望藉由性別平權以及運動外交讓國際看見我們台灣那面對中國的打壓或羞辱這部分我們肯定是需要在奧會模式下絕對的保護運動員的參賽權益\n\n14:59.141 --> 15:25.104\n好那再追問一下部長你在選手時間飛到各國去征戰那有哪個國家的全民運動或運動產業環境是讓你覺得可以借鏡的舉例來說像美國他是用商業的力量來維持來發展運動那像英國跟澳洲他是用政府來主導運動政策的那你要怎麼樣形成一個台灣模式的運動環境\n\n15:26.813 --> 15:34.659\n其實有非常多的國家我們台灣也有自己我們屬於我們台灣自己的優勢那未來我們希望說打造更多良善的運動空\n\n16:03.544 --> 16:03.565\n好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":16.651,"end":19.192,"text":"謝謝院長 有請卓院長 麻煩再請卓院長備詢林委員好"},{"start":30.865,"end":58.448,"text":"好 院長好院長 本席在上個月22號有當面跟您報告過就全體台南市民因應期盼的我們台南市第一條捷運藍線第一期的建設問題那本來預計明年這條捷運就可以動工那今年3月綜合規劃也已經在國發會完成審議那經過修正6月也正式送到行政院"},{"start":59.309,"end":88.693,"text":"那但是直到現在我們還要等待行政院的核定所以在這裡請教院長到底什麼時候可以核定那你是不是可以今天明確的告訴台南市民行政院最快什麼時候可以來核定部長先說一下目前的跟委員報告這個確實經過一長段的這個審查的過程那也請台南市政府做很多的修正那我們交通部也已經審定過那目前是在行政院"},{"start":89.113,"end":109.638,"text":"那國發會也有做一些建議的報告不過跟委員報告就是說現在我們因為這個才化法的原因我們今年其實在捷運中央交通部能夠協助地方的預算上面其實比起過去是少很多所以今年有很多的縣市都有受到一些影響那這個部分我們目前正在盤"},{"start":111.319,"end":130.13,"text":"說未來的才化法化完之後我們交通部還剩下多少的力氣可以協助各個都市的捷運的計畫也就是說分配的這個比例上面我們其實都會再做新的考量那這個部分我們希望這一兩天月能夠比較確定定案之後我相信這個審核的速度就會加快"},{"start":130.526,"end":149.876,"text":"本席知道因為藍白兩黨二修了才劃法那特別是海大出包那不只導致這個中央地方這個資源跟權責始終分配不清以外那甚至包含我們台南在內的九個縣市其實他所獲得配額數還低於修法前"},{"start":152.238,"end":179.394,"text":"這是百分百的人禍那所以行政院我覺得也絕對不能讓這樣的人禍然後來影響到地方的重大建設那對於我們台南的經費支持我還是衷心希望行政院能全力的來配合來支持那台南喔是六都唯一沒有這個捷運系統的城市那我們的發展已經比別人晚那結果現在不僅就是"},{"start":180.094,"end":196.631,"text":"透過才化法的分配我們還分配的比別人少然後捷運建設又獲得重要的支持有可能又比別人少那我想這不僅我不能接受我想全臺南市民都不能接受所以我想怎麼樣讓才化法"},{"start":200.135,"end":216.035,"text":"能有一個比較這個正確的版本來幫助我們縣市分配會比較那個平均那我舉個例來講雙北當年的捷運建設其實中央都補助八九成"},{"start":217.177,"end":235.659,"text":"行政院是否可以拿出當初支持雙北的捷運的決斷力來協助台南突破修惡版的財化法的困境我想這裡延伸出兩個問題第一個就是我們符合民主程序"},{"start":237.16,"end":262.311,"text":"而且讓國家真正能夠均衡的發展所謂的公正版的就我剛說的公正版的才化法行政院年底前是不是或者這個會期是否可以提出版本第二個問題是說在未來台灣的捷運建設上中央是否也可以比照當年雙北的這樣的一個支持來挹注台南的經費"},{"start":264.178,"end":264.741,"text":"院長 兩個問題來答覆委員第一個 藍線的第一期"},{"start":269.439,"end":296.965,"text":"國發費核算核定的這個金額是332億在核定之後的7年完成那如果現在因為我們中央跟地方財政收支發分法重新訂定之後中央少了4165億所以我們少了很多對地方補助的錢要嘛就是地方多負擔一些要嘛就是這個工程的7年要往後延那我覺得往後延大概大家接受的程度很低啦所以如何來討論出一個合理的"},{"start":297.901,"end":325.394,"text":"共同分擔的一個比例這是第一個問題那第二個財化法的問題我們會在適當的時間而且應該是在今年的時間我們提出一個版本來行政院的版本那我希望這個版本垂直能夠劃分的很清楚市權能夠劃分很清楚中央地方劃分很清楚水平能夠財務非常的均衡那這樣子就不會造成現在台南所遇到的問題照新的財化法怎麼算怎麼劃"},{"start":326.786,"end":354.705,"text":"到最後台南都是損失最多的對都是minus不是這樣子我們也想但是公視就是一定的我們也不能上下其手所以我們只想說是不是在明年度的財化法因為不可能大修啦明年度已經來不及了後年以後我們希望大修明年度財化法我們可不可以在還有餘裕的這個財政能夠我們來管控的部分能夠補上這些像台南像屏東甚至像嘉義雲林"},{"start":355.445,"end":377.234,"text":"整個非常不公平的狀態我們把它補起來能不能有這個能力可是還是拜託院長雙軌並進第一個是不是讓我們趕快捷運可以往下走往下走的話就是先趕快核定至於要跟地方政府怎麼樣分配的問題其實總數不變的話先核定我們下面可以繼續走"},{"start":377.674,"end":400.573,"text":"因為我們還有很多的規劃這些設計要走那不然明年動不了工那工程就一直往後延宕所以是不是這一趴先請院長先幫忙然後再來我們財劃板當然也要給台南一個合理的分配剛剛在答覆蘇曉慧委員相同類似新北捷運的時候我就說過我們明年希望我們中央政府總計算能夠順利的執行"},{"start":401.394,"end":423.885,"text":"也行大院能夠快速的審查順利的事情那今年像這個部分的我們在今年都做一個了結跟地方該怎麼算我們今年該核定就來核定那明年中央地方行政立法兩院大步向前走好所以捷運今年一定能合併謝謝院長那再來跟院長討論就是七八月喔我們台南丹納斯颱風的風災那"},{"start":427.967,"end":454.104,"text":"因為當然我們在院長的指導之下其實我們有從寬從速的發放一些經費可是市府如果立有未待的地方其實我們也希望中央再加碼協助舉例來講像泡水車的補助台南市政府反應很快可是資源不夠所以我們每台泡水汽車補助上限是一萬塊那摩托車上限是兩千塊那汽機車對於一個家庭來講真的是非常而重要"},{"start":455.245,"end":477.059,"text":"建基在 電基在市府喔 已有的補助上中央是不是可以再投入一些補助的資源來攜手減輕台南市民的負擔院長這個可不可以來考慮一下幫我們在港灣道踢掛好 因為泡水車的處理我們當時是利用是地方政府是用這樣的標準對那我們這次在"},{"start":478.24,"end":497.93,"text":"花蓮因為它是一個被泥沙整個埋沒掉的受損的程度是不一樣我們在車輛方面是五萬塊機車方面是一萬塊那顯然是比較多花蓮這次也受到很多善款捐助我們來做一些使用"},{"start":500.009,"end":525.346,"text":"台南的這個部分也應該政財基金會有一些善款我們是不是請政財基金會重新來考量一下能不能著雨提高而且我主張把善款能夠快速積極用掉 用在該用的地方去不要讓捐款的人認為說我捐的錢是擺在銀行裡面的趕快把它捐給災民的身上讓他們去自己使用到好 謝謝院長那再來要跟院長討論"},{"start":529.127,"end":553.505,"text":"中正紀念堂中長期規劃的問題有些喜歡蔣介石的人他要在家裡替他立個牌位公著其實我們都沒有意見可是如果用國家的資源強逼全民納稅來維運蔣介石這個機構我覺得這明顯違反了民主精神的作為根本也不該繼續存在在台灣社會"},{"start":554.446,"end":571.405,"text":"那促轉會任務總結報告有指出目前這個國立中正紀念堂管理處組織法的定位其實他就是以法律的形式在辦理威權統治者的紀念業務所以促轉會在解散之前他也有規劃修正或廢止這個相關的條例"},{"start":574.567,"end":600.593,"text":"當初提出的時程是2023年研擬草案2024到2025年要審查獲立法與立法2026跟2027要實施並完成根據行政院推動轉型正義匯報第六次的會議就有建議把中正經驗堂管理處改組成民主教育園區管理中心並入國家人權博物館"},{"start":602.372,"end":623.42,"text":"本席認為你破除這個組織的意義上的權威真的是轉型正義的非常重要的工作之一所以我有完成連署並提出中正紀念堂組織法廢止案跟民主教育園區的成立所需的相關的組織法那請問這個相關的法制作業不曉得行政院什麼時候要跟上喔"},{"start":623.82,"end":645.499,"text":"那另外中正紀念堂中長期轉型規劃也涉及文化資產跟文化景觀身份競合還有都市計畫等等的問題這部分因為時間的關係我再請文化部與書面跟本席辦公室來做說明那我請教院長是說這個法制如何跟上 何時跟上在轉型正義第六式會議當中決定"},{"start":648.005,"end":674.77,"text":"結合歷史記憶的保存跟民主教育推廣將這個中正紀念堂有雙重的目標先轉型為民主教育園區讓我們認為說先轉型再談明先轉型再談組織以後再來說先轉型因為轉型當中之所謂轉型就是社會上有不同的意見在這邊糾葛然後我們希望這個轉型能夠順順的轉型因為轉到民主教育以及轉到這個歷史記憶的保存"},{"start":675.59,"end":702.487,"text":"應該是中性的先轉型到這樣的民主園區以後讓大家熟悉這個場域讓大家先熟悉這個場域辦一些人權的活動 藝術的活動 文化的活動讓他這些 您剛剛說的威權的意向讓他漸漸淡去我們再來討論他轉型之後組織上如何強化好 院長謝謝那最後要請運動部部長"},{"start":707.779,"end":725.434,"text":"我要跟院長跟運動部里楊部長來討論一下台灣的運動外交的問題中國打壓台灣的選手我們是屢見不鮮大大小小的賽事我們不僅不能使用真正的國民還得"},{"start":728.636,"end":751.477,"text":"選手還要負擔這個額外的身心壓力跟安全疑慮像今年七月的世大運中國就當台灣的選手的面來搶賀電這種荒唐的案例那李昂部長剛退役你應該非常清楚台灣選手的國境處境那是實際上不只選手連在場邊家有的觀眾也會受到中國的威脅"},{"start":752.698,"end":776.126,"text":"像李昂部長你去年在這個巴黎奧運這個比賽的時候場邊就有很多觀眾自發性的製作台灣諧音梗的這個看板海報可是也被遭遇無理的沒收那李部長你去年李昂配的這個最後一物喔甚至還有人在場邊羞辱性的大喊說台灣是中國的"},{"start":776.906,"end":803.794,"text":"那運動部的LOGO的靈感我相信就是來自陳傑憲在十二牆轟出這個三分炮然後落雷的時候說比出那個手勢我們雖然知道說我們雖然知道他比的沒有國家的名字可是我們知道他代表什麼意義那想請教李洋部長既然你這個LOGO的創意如此有這層含利那你未來又什麼樣"},{"start":804.654,"end":829.673,"text":"有什麼樣的策略要讓台灣的選手在國際比賽的時候可以毫無顧忌地秀出國家的名字另外就是往後如果遇到像搶賀電這樣的狀況或觀眾受到羞辱的時候你身為運動部長你要怎麼處置或者怎麼跟該主辦國合作來保障我們台灣公民跟我們的選手部長"},{"start":830.774,"end":854.992,"text":"跟委員您報告那當然這部分我身為運動員退役我強烈的譴責任何的政治打壓因為我們希望我們運動可以是只否運動那當然我們一定會在奧會模式下希望保障任何運動員的參賽權益也希望保障我們運動員每一個人他都非常努力的訓練的過程那未來我們希望說我們可以養"},{"start":855.612,"end":872.105,"text":"可以培養更多的運動員進入單向國際的組織那增加我們國際的能見度那包含我自己當時成為了部長其實我們來到有非常多的來自國際的運動員向我祝賀所以我認為"},{"start":873.847,"end":896.906,"text":"運動員本身就具有國際的知名度我們也希望說像明年我也預計會參加IWG也就是我們的國際婦女運動工作小組我們希望藉由性別平權以及運動外交讓國際看見我們台灣那面對中國的打壓或羞辱這部分我們肯定是需要在奧會模式下絕對的保護運動員的參賽權益"},{"start":899.141,"end":925.104,"text":"好 那再追問一下部長你在選手時間飛到各國去征戰那有哪個國家的全民運動或運動產業環境是讓你覺得可以借鏡的舉例來說像美國他是用商業的力量來維持來發展運動那像英國跟澳洲他是用政府來主導運動政策的那你要怎麼樣形成一個台灣模式的運動環境"},{"start":926.813,"end":934.659,"text":"其實有非常多的國家我們台灣也有自己我們屬於我們台灣自己的優勢那未來我們希望說打造更多良善的運動空"},{"start":963.544,"end":963.565,"text":"好 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":1709,"blocks":[["林委員宜瑾：（17時1分）謝謝院長，有請卓院長。"],["主席：麻煩再請卓院長備詢。"],["卓院長榮泰：林委員好。"],["林委員宜瑾：院長好。院長，本席在上個月22號有當面跟您報告過，就是全體臺南市民殷殷期盼臺南市第一條捷運藍線第一期的建設問題，這條捷運本來預計明年就可以動工，今年3月綜合規劃也已經在國發會完成審議，經過修正，6月也正式送到行政院，但是直到現在我們還在等待行政院的核定，所以在這裡請教院長，到底什麼時候可以核定？你今天是不是可以明確的告訴臺南市民，行政院最快什麼時候可以來核定？"],["卓院長榮泰：部長先說一下目前的……"],["陳部長世凱：跟委員報告，這個確實經過一長段的審查過程，也請臺南市政府做了很多的修正，交通部也已經審定過，目前是在行政院，國發會也有做一些建議的報告，不過，跟委員報告，現在因為財劃法的原因，今年中央交通部在捷運這方面能夠協助地方的預算其實比起過去少很多，所以今年有很多的縣市都有受到一些影響。這個部分我們目前正在盤，看未來的財劃法劃完之後，交通部還剩下多少力氣可以協助各個都市的捷運的計畫，也就是分配的比例上，我們其實都會再做新的考量。這個部分我們希望在這一、兩個月內能夠比較確定，定案之後，我相信審核的速度就會加快。"],["林委員宜瑾：本席知道，因為藍白兩黨惡修了財劃法，特別是還大出包，不只導致中央、地方資源跟權責始終分配不清，甚至包含臺南在內的9個縣市所獲得的配額數還低於修法前，這是百分百的人禍！我覺得行政院絕對不能讓這樣的人禍影響到地方的重大建設。"],["卓院長榮泰：是。"],["林委員宜瑾：對於臺南的經費支持，我還是衷心希望行政院能全力的來配合、支持。臺南是六都唯一沒有捷運系統的城市，我們的發展已經比別人晚了，結果現在透過財劃法的分配，我們分配到的還比別人少，然後捷運建設獲得中央的支持有可能又比別人少，我想這不僅我不能接受，全臺南市民都不能接受，怎麼樣讓財劃法能有一個比較正確的版本來幫助縣市分配會比較平均？","我舉個例來講，像雙北當年的捷運建設其實中央都補助八、九成，那行政院是否可以拿出當初支持雙北捷運這樣的決斷力來協助臺南，突破修惡版財劃法的困境？我想這裡也延伸出兩個問題，第一個是我們符合民主程序，而且讓國家真正能夠均衡發展，就是我剛說的公正版的財劃法，行政院年底前或者這個會期是否可以提出版本？第二個問題是，在未來臺灣的捷運建設上，中央是否也可以比照當年對雙北這樣的支持來挹注臺南經費？"],["卓院長榮泰：兩個問題答復委員，第一個，藍線的第一期，國發會核定的金額是332億。"],["林委員宜瑾：是。"],["卓院長榮泰：在核定之後7年完成，如果現在因為中央跟地方財政收支劃分法重新訂定之後，中央少了4,165億，所以我們少了很多對地方補助的錢，要嘛就是地方多負擔一些，要嘛就是這個工程的7年要往後延。我覺得往後延，大概大家接受的程度很低，所以如何討論出一個合理的共同分擔的比例，這是第一個問題。","第二個是財劃法的問題，我們會在適當的時間，而且應該是在今年我們提出一個版本、行政院的版本。"],["林委員宜瑾：好，今年年底之前。"],["卓院長榮泰：我希望這個版本垂直能夠劃分得很清楚，事權能夠劃分得很清楚；中央、地方劃分得很清楚；水平能夠財務非常均衡，這樣子就不會造成現在臺南所遇到的問題。照新的財劃法怎麼算、怎麼劃，到最後臺南都是損失最多的。"],["林委員宜瑾：對，都是minus。"],["卓院長榮泰：不是這樣子，我們也想，但公式就是一定的……"],["林委員宜瑾：當然。"],["卓院長榮泰：我們也不能上下其手，所以我們只是想說不是在明年度的財劃法，因為不可能大修，明年度已經來不及了，後年以後我們希望大修，明年的財劃法我們可不可以在還有餘裕、財政上我們能夠管控的部分，把這些像臺南、屏東，甚至嘉義、雲林整個非常不公平的狀態補起來，看能不能有這個能力。"],["林委員宜瑾：好，可是還是拜託院長就雙軌並進，第一個，是不是讓我們的捷運可以趕快往下走？"],["卓院長榮泰：是。"],["林委員宜瑾：往下走的話就是先趕快核定。至於要跟地方政府怎麼樣分配的問題，其實總數不變的話先核定，我們下面就可以繼續走，因為我們還有很多的規劃設計要走，不然明年動不了工，工程就一直往後延宕，所以這一趴是不是請院長先幫忙？再來就財劃法當然也要給臺南一個合理的分配。"],["卓院長榮泰：剛剛在答復蘇巧慧委員新北捷運的時候我就說過，希望明年中央政府總預算能夠順利執行，也請大院能夠快速審查、順利執行。而今年像這個部分，我們在今年就做一個了結，跟地方該怎麼算，我們今年該核定就來核定；明年中央、地方的行政、立法兩院大步向前走。"],["林委員宜瑾：好，所以捷運今年一定能核定？"],["卓院長榮泰：好，我們會努力這樣做。"],["林委員宜瑾：謝謝院長。再來跟院長討論的就是7、8月臺南丹娜絲颱風的風災，當然在院長的指導之下，其實有從寬從速地發放一些經費，可是市府如果力有未逮的地方，其實我們也希望中央再加碼協助。舉例來講，像泡水車的補助，臺南市政府反應很快，可是資源不夠，所以每臺泡水汽車補助上限是1萬塊、摩托車的上限是2,000塊。汽機車對一個家庭來講真的是非常重要，奠基在市府已有的補助上，中央是不是可以再投入一些補助的資源，攜手減輕臺南市民的負擔？院長，這個可不可以考慮一下，幫我們添一些？"],["卓院長榮泰：因為泡水車的處理，地方政府是用這樣的標準。"],["林委員宜瑾：對。"],["卓院長榮泰：那我們這次在花蓮光復……"],["林委員宜瑾：花蓮，對，是比較高。"],["卓院長榮泰：因為它是被泥沙整個埋沒掉的，受損的程度是不一樣的。"],["林委員宜瑾：是，當然。"],["卓院長榮泰：我們在車輛方面是5萬塊，機車方面是1萬塊。"],["林委員宜瑾：對。"],["卓院長榮泰：顯然是比較多。花蓮這次也收到很多善款捐助，我們來做一些使用。臺南的這個部分，賑災基金會應該也有一些善款，我們是不是請賑災基金會重新來考量一下，看能不能酌予提高？而且我主張把善款快速、積極地用掉，用在該用的地方，不要讓捐款的人認為自己捐的錢是擺在銀行裡面的，要趕快把它捐到災民身上，讓他們自己能使用到。"],["林委員宜瑾：謝謝院長。","再來要跟院長討論中正紀念堂中長期規劃的問題。有些喜歡蔣介石的人要在自己家裡替他立個牌位供著，其實我們都沒有意見，可是如果用國家資源強逼全民納稅來維運蔣介石的機構，我覺得這是明顯違反民主精神的作為，根本也不該繼續存在在臺灣社會。促轉會任務總結報告有指出，目前國立中正紀念堂管理處組織法的定位其實就是以法律的形式在辦理威權統治者的紀念業務，所以促轉會在解散之前也有規劃修正或廢止相關的條例，當初提出的時程是2023年研擬草案，2024到2025年要審查與立法，2026和2027年要實施並完成。行政院推動轉型正義會報第6次會議就有建議，把中正紀念堂管理處改組成民主教育園區處理中心，將它併入國家人權博物館。本席認為破除這個組織意義上的權威，真的是轉型正義非常重要的工作之一，所以我有完成連署並提出中正紀念堂管理處組織法廢止案跟民主教育園區成立所需相關組織法的草案，請問相關的法制作業行政院什麼時候要跟上來？","另外，中正紀念堂中長期的轉型規劃也涉及文化資產跟文化景觀的身分競合，還有都市計畫變更等等的問題，這部分因為時間的關係，我再請文化部以書面跟本席辦公室說明。我要請教院長的是，法制作業如何跟上？何時跟上？"],["卓院長榮泰：在轉型正義會報第6次會議當中決定，先結合歷史記憶保存跟民主教育推廣，將中正紀念堂賦予雙重的目標，先轉型為民主教育園區；我們認為先轉型再談名、先轉型再談組織，以後再來處理。因為之所以要轉型，就是社會上有不同的意見在這邊糾葛，我們希望這個轉型能夠順順地轉型，因為轉到民主教育以及轉到歷史記憶的保存應該是中性的，先轉型為這樣的民主園區以後，讓大家熟悉這個場域……"],["林委員宜瑾：可是到時候法令還是要跟上啊！不然中正紀念堂管理處組織法……"],["卓院長榮泰：讓大家先熟悉這個場域，我們辦一些人權的活動、藝術的活動、文化的活動，讓您剛剛說的威權意象漸漸淡去，我們再來討論它轉型之後組織上要如何強化。"],["林委員宜瑾：好，院長，謝謝。","最後要請運動部部長。我要跟院長和運動部李洋部長來討論一下臺灣運動外交的問題。"],["卓院長榮泰：好。"],["林委員宜瑾：中國打壓臺灣選手屢見不鮮，在大大小小的賽事當中，我們不僅不能使用真正的國名，選手還要承擔額外的身心壓力和安全疑慮，像今年7月的世大運，就發生中國當著臺灣選手的面搶賀電的荒唐案例。李洋部長剛退役，你應該非常清楚臺灣選手的國際處境。實際上不只選手，連在場邊加油的觀眾也會受到中國的威脅，像李洋部長去年在巴黎奧運比賽的時候，場邊就有很多觀眾自發性地製作臺灣諧音哏的看板和海報，可是也遭遇無禮的沒收。部長去年「麟洋配」的最後一舞，甚至還有人在場邊羞辱性地大喊「臺灣是中國的」。運動部logo的靈感我相信就是來自陳傑憲在12強轟出三分砲繞壘時所比出的手勢，雖然他比的沒有國家的名字，可是我們知道它代表什麼意義。想請教李洋部長，既然這個logo的創意有這層含義，你未來又有什麼樣的策略，讓臺灣的選手在國際比賽的時候，可以毫無顧忌的秀出國家的名字？另外，往後如果遇到像搶賀電這樣的狀況或觀眾受到羞辱的時候，你身為運動部長要怎麼處置，或者怎麼跟該主辦國合作來保障臺灣公民跟選手？"],["李部長洋：跟委員您報告，當然這部分，我身為運動員退役，我強烈譴責任何的政治打壓，因為我們希望運動可以是只for運動。當然我們一定會在奧會模式下，希望保障任何運動員的參賽權益，也希望保障每一個運動員非常努力的訓練過程。未來我們希望可以培養更多的運動員進入單項國際的組織，增加我們國際的能見度。包含我自己當時成為了部長，其實有非常多來自國際的運動員向我祝賀，所以我認為運動員本身就具有國際的知名度。明年我預計參加IWG，也就是國際婦女與運動工作小組，希望藉由性別平權以及運動外交，讓國際看見臺灣。"],["林委員宜瑾：面對中國的打壓或羞辱的狀況呢？"],["李部長洋：這部分我們肯定是需要在奧會模式下，絕對的保護運動員的參賽權益。"],["林委員宜瑾：好。再追問一下部長，你在選手期間飛到各國去征戰，有哪個國家的全民運動或運動產業環境是讓你覺得可以借鏡的？舉例來說，像美國是用商業的力量來維持、發展運動，像英國跟澳洲是由政府來主導運動政策的，那麼你要怎麼樣形成一個臺灣模式的運動環境？"],["李部長洋：其實有非常多的國家，臺灣也有屬於臺灣自己的優勢，未來我們希望打造更多良善的運動空間，包含在適應運動，其實領有身心障礙手冊的大約有一百多萬人，未領有手冊的有兩百多萬人，在這部分，我們希望打造更佳良善的運動環境，讓更多人參與到運動純粹的快樂。其實大部分有80%是後天造成，沒有人可以預估誰會是下一個，所以我們希望可以在臺灣打造出更加良善的運動環境。"],["林委員宜瑾：好，謝謝部長、謝謝院長。"],["李部長洋：謝謝委員。"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝林宜瑾委員質詢，謝謝卓院長、各相關部會首長備詢，謝謝。","報告院會，本日質詢的委員均已質詢完畢，謝謝卓院長、鄭副院長及各部會首長列席答詢，也謝謝黃建賓委員、林倩綺委員陪同我們一起參與今天的總質詢。","現在作以下決定：下次會議（10月21日）繼續進行施政報告之質詢。","現在散會。","散會（17時18分）"]],"agenda":{"page_end":23,"meet_id":"院會-11-4-4","speakers":["韓國瑜","江啟臣"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-10-14"],"gazette_id":"1147901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1147901_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期第4次會議紀錄","content":"報告事項","agenda_id":"1147901_00001"}}}