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587.59, \"end\": 588.111, \"score\": 0.845}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"O\", \"start\": 588.111, \"end\": 588.231, \"score\": 0.761}, {\"word\": \"K\", \"start\": 588.231, \"end\": 588.251, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 588.251, \"end\": 588.691, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 588.691, \"end\": 588.812, \"score\": 0.834}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 588.812, \"end\": 588.832, \"score\": 0.812}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,350 --> 00:00:02,254\n謝謝主席有請國安局蔡局長來局長請\n\n2\n00:00:09,515 --> 00:00:35,582\n主席早羅委員早局長早局長剛剛你有提到就是說中共擴大對我國的其實它滲透的手法已經到了五花八門的地步同時我們也提到就是說中共很密集對我們的妄害竊取機密甚至來做威懾我們從過去所知很多的攻擊或者滲透其實大部分都是來自於境外\n\n3\n00:00:36,002 --> 00:00:40,185\n可是今年9月份陽廣的官網首頁被入侵了然後首頁被置換為中國的五星旗甚至在9月19號、25號連續遭到網攻造成整個系統的癱瘓當然第一時間我們會想說這個又是來自於境外的駭客的入侵可是經過調查之後才發現原來是陽廣內部的工程師所為\n\n4\n00:01:07,887 --> 00:01:27,186\n當然我們有很多的專家學者就在提到了這是不是又是另外的中國的認知作戰的手法之一那局長您如何看待這個陽廣被入侵的這個狀態會不會是國內的協力者跟這個中國所引起的一個國安的事件這個有沒有一些跡象來顯示呢\n\n5\n00:01:27,466 --> 00:01:51,840\n有這個問題我們有在注意因為央廣也算是重要的一個政府的一個關鍵的重要設施因為它涉及到大眾傳播所以這個案子一發生我們就有在注意那第二個部分是這個案子確實有央廣內部的人員因為有外洩一些治安的資訊引發相關的一個犯罪偵訪的案件所以這案件檢調已經有在進行相關的調查\n\n6\n00:01:53,041 --> 00:02:14,190\n那我們所了解的是非常積極的在處理據說我打岔一下因為我剛有聽到你說他其實有外洩一些資料所以他這個工程師他除了惡意的把這個手願換成五星旗的網頁之外其實他確確實實有外洩了一些\n\n7\n00:02:16,017 --> 00:02:39,155\n資訊出去嗎是這樣子的意思嗎因為剛剛您的說法我說明一下因為他在進行那個網路的內部的這種干擾的手法的時候他有涉及到他們內部的一些資訊就包括資安管理的一些資訊那這部分的資訊可能涉案相關的人他們有一些相關的一個資訊的\n\n8\n00:02:41,707 --> 00:02:57,637\n交流那因為這大概是目前整個在處理的一個主要的一個方向那至於有沒有外力的部分這部分可能要再有檢調這部分來做進一步的偵辦那我們這邊要是有相關的情資的話也會提供給檢調單位來處理\n\n9\n00:02:59,306 --> 00:03:26,660\n所以目前有任何比較確實的情資嗎因為這案子還在正辦當中所以很多細節都不方便因為這個部分呢因為很敏感就是說他這個首頁呢至於五星期甚至呢媒體報導就是說可能還牽扯到一些政治人物我想這個部分的話國安單位可能要特別的來留意那好那再來我們要提到就是說其實我有看到就是說我們的報告裡面也整理出來了像\n\n10\n00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:50,367\n中國呢他這個滲透的這個方式真的是非常的多元像國安局這邊其實很早就已經有整理出來了現在鎖定這個退役軍人啊信義軍人政府機關還有這個親中的組織那管道呢當然報告上面我也看到有黑道幫派啦地下錢莊一些宮廟啦民間社團等等那手法也是非常的多元像網路的勾連金錢的這個利誘還有這個債務的脅迫等等\n\n11\n00:03:54,548 --> 00:04:12,623\n那其實之前我有看到某些專家學者都已經提到了其實不單單是這些手法那看起來這些手法好像是針對高層其實已經是全面的入侵因為我有看到一個高檢署的一個偵查的一個案件就是今年年初的時候他們有偵辦一個有關你這個國安有支持違反這個國安法的一個\n\n12\n00:04:18,848 --> 00:04:46,108\n案件那裡面就有提到就是說有一個張姓的這個民眾他就成立的這個軍用品的這個這個這個公司這個商店那當然去的人可能很多都是警察啦或者是說軍人軍警很多然後大家就說我給你折扣可是你必須要出示你的證件那再來的話他必須把這些證件上面的資料比如說名字啦聯絡電話等等就是單位是可能也還有單位把他這個做記錄下來\n\n13\n00:04:47,169 --> 00:05:07,282\n這跟一般上的就是上家給折扣的這個方式不太一樣一般上給折扣的話說你出示一下你的證件證明你的這個你有這個優惠的資格就OK了可是不是他做了所有的記錄那甚至呢他還辦了這個所謂的這個民房的這個座談那當然參加的這些這些人就發現說為什麼來的時候要寫非常仔細的一些資料\n\n14\n00:05:08,323 --> 00:05:22,037\n那時大家就覺得不太對勁所以這個我們可以發現說除了剛剛我們所提到的這些管道啦這些對象其實它幾乎已經到了前面入侵的部分你可能去買個東西你買個東西你可能就是會成為這個被諜報的這個對象\n\n15\n00:05:25,134 --> 00:05:52,011\n你的資料可能就是被後來也證實了偵辦的過程當中也證實了他也是經由這一些方式這個民眾這個開設這個經用品店的這個張姓的這個人他就把這些收集到的這些身份跟資料呢真的就是給中國了所以讓我們一般民眾根本防不勝防那我們要如何判斷說我連去買個東西我可能就是會資料就是壞一些我資料可能就被送到中國去了這個民眾要如何防範呢\n\n16\n00:05:52,751 --> 00:06:12,859\n我想這部分也謝謝委員的質詢民眾的這種所謂的保防或保護各自的意識可能也要我們透過這樣的討論來讓民眾更加重視這個問題包括企業也是一樣企業也有一些企業的機敏的資訊可能也要注意到這種機敏資訊的保護\n\n17\n00:06:13,459 --> 00:06:37,474\n那所以委員所提到的是民眾在消費行為的過程當中難免會留下一些個資那我們還是會盡量來提醒那在留用個資的過程當中可能還是要確認它的相關的一個必要性那假如說是沒有必要的一個消費行為過程當中要留下個資的話那我們會盡量提醒民眾可能要盡量避免這樣的一個狀況\n\n18\n00:06:38,174 --> 00:06:49,533\n因為這種個資被收集之後假如再經過大數據的運用的話就我們國安的角度來講它可能產生的影響會蠻大的不是只有你個人的傷害而是對於整個國家群體造成的一個影響\n\n19\n00:06:50,652 --> 00:07:08,898\n是像過去的話像民眾他去做消費的時候可能考慮就是說我這個資料可能會被留到詐騙集團的手裡也許過去的認知就只有這樣可是我們現在發現不是這樣而已除了會流入詐騙集團你可能你這些資料可能就會被送到中國去\n\n20\n00:07:10,238 --> 00:07:21,106\n這個部分可能現在有很多民眾還沒有辦法意識到可能大家還停留在就是說我的資料可能被這些不法的這些人士可能就是轉賣給詐騙集團可能只停留在這裡可是可能還是沒有意識到說\n\n21\n00:07:27,951 --> 00:07:52,431\n這個資料可能會跟國安有關係可能這是一個破口這部分要特別利用這個機會應該跟大家做個說明跟報告因為中共它有國家情報法的規定假如是有中資的這種APP或是有中國的中資的電商的話你在網路的這些消費的行為或使用APP的過程當中可能就有一些個資被收集了\n\n22\n00:07:52,791 --> 00:08:20,181\n那在中國的國家情報法的要求之下這些中資或中企他就必須要把這些他的客戶的資料來提供給中國的安全部門來參考運用所以我也是因為這樣的一個考量才會本局在之前有針對中資在國內比較流通的APP他的資安來做一個蠻全面的檢測用五個類別跟十五項的標準來認為他們對於個人的資訊的收集太超過一般的授權的權限\n\n23\n00:08:21,221 --> 00:08:41,073\n局長你剛才你現在講的這部分本來是我待會就是要繼續跟你說探討因為時間的關係你剛才所講到的5個APP受到這個就是它有我知道你們之前有做過檢測就是有一些違規違規嘛就是非常多的違規像小紅書微博抖音微信百度雲盤\n\n24\n00:08:42,294 --> 00:08:55,498\n這些是違規都項目非常的高尤其是小紅書是全面的這個違規可是問題是我們的民眾並不知道啊也許你使用這些APP的時候你的資訊你的資料你的個資全部都已經在中國了這是不是要加強來做這個宣導\n\n25\n00:08:57,479 --> 00:09:25,451\n因為事實上這方面的管制並不是國安局的夜管但國安局我們基於國家安全的需要以及對於中共收集國人個資的一個關切我們才會自己很積極主動的針對這些中置的APP來做治安的檢測那麼後續還會針對中置的一些產品來公告一些治安檢測的項目對因為我是看到說您確實是有做檢測嘛您跟一些國安單位其實今年就已經有公告了一些可是問題是到底多少民眾會去看這個資訊\n\n26\n00:09:26,511 --> 00:09:48,832\n有沒有意識到這個國安的危機所以我是這個部分的話我想說國安相關的單位應該要一起來想辦法讓民眾去了解對我們這方面的檢測報告大概都也有跟媒體朋友來分享那也希望透過媒體的報導讓國人在這一方面的治安的警覺跟意識可以透過一次一次的社會的一個討論能夠持續的來提升謝謝委員的提醒謝謝OK好謝謝以上謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n350\t2254\t謝謝主席有請國安局蔡局長來局長請\n9515\t35582\t主席早 羅委員早局長早 局長剛剛你有提到就是說中共擴大對我國的其實它滲透的手法已經到了五花八門的地步同時我們也提到就是說中共很密集對我們的妄害竊取機密甚至來做威懾我們從過去所知很多的攻擊或者滲透其實大部分都是來自於境外\n36002\t40185\t可是今年9月份 陽廣的官網首頁被入侵了然後首頁被置換為中國的五星旗甚至在9月19號、25號連續遭到網攻 造成整個系統的癱瘓當然第一時間我們會想說這個又是來自於境外的駭客的入侵可是經過調查之後才發現原來是陽廣內部的工程師所為\n67887\t87186\t當然我們有很多的專家學者就在提到了這是不是又是另外的中國的認知作戰的手法之一那局長您如何看待這個陽廣被入侵的這個狀態會不會是國內的協力者跟這個中國所引起的一個國安的事件這個有沒有一些跡象來顯示呢\n87466\t111840\t有 這個問題我們有在注意因為央廣也算是重要的一個政府的一個關鍵的重要設施因為它涉及到大眾傳播所以這個案子一發生我們就有在注意那第二個部分是這個案子確實有央廣內部的人員因為有外洩一些治安的資訊引發相關的一個犯罪偵訪的案件所以這案件檢調已經有在進行相關的調查\n113041\t134190\t那我們所了解的是非常積極的在處理據說我打岔一下 因為我剛有聽到你說他其實有外洩一些資料所以他這個工程師他除了惡意的把這個手願換成五星旗的網頁之外其實他確確實實有外洩了一些\n136017\t159155\t資訊出去嗎是這樣子的意思嗎因為剛剛您的說法我說明一下因為他在進行那個網路的內部的這種干擾的手法的時候他有涉及到他們內部的一些資訊就包括資安管理的一些資訊那這部分的資訊可能涉案相關的人他們有一些相關的一個資訊的\n161707\t177637\t交流那因為這大概是目前整個在處理的一個主要的一個方向那至於有沒有外力的部分這部分可能要再有檢調這部分來做進一步的偵辦那我們這邊要是有相關的情資的話也會提供給檢調單位來處理\n179306\t206660\t所以目前有任何比較確實的情資嗎因為這案子還在正辦當中所以很多細節都不方便因為這個部分呢因為很敏感就是說他這個首頁呢至於五星期甚至呢媒體報導就是說可能還牽扯到一些政治人物我想這個部分的話國安單位可能要特別的來留意那好那再來我們要提到就是說其實我有看到就是說我們的報告裡面也整理出來了像\n207320\t230367\t中國呢他這個滲透的這個方式真的是非常的多元像國安局這邊其實很早就已經有整理出來了現在鎖定這個退役軍人啊信義軍人政府機關還有這個親中的組織那管道呢當然報告上面我也看到有黑道幫派啦地下錢莊一些宮廟啦民間社團等等那手法也是非常的多元像網路的勾連金錢的這個利誘還有這個債務的脅迫等等\n234548\t252623\t那其實之前我有看到某些專家學者都已經提到了其實不單單是這些手法那看起來這些手法好像是針對高層其實已經是全面的入侵因為我有看到一個高檢署的一個偵查的一個案件就是今年年初的時候他們有偵辦一個有關你這個國安有支持違反這個國安法的一個\n258848\t286108\t案件那裡面就有提到就是說有一個張姓的這個民眾他就成立的這個軍用品的這個這個這個公司這個商店那當然去的人可能很多都是警察啦或者是說軍人軍警很多然後大家就說我給你折扣可是你必須要出示你的證件那再來的話他必須把這些證件上面的資料比如說名字啦聯絡電話等等就是單位是可能也還有單位把他這個做記錄下來\n287169\t307282\t這跟一般上的就是上家給折扣的這個方式不太一樣一般上給折扣的話說你出示一下你的證件證明你的這個你有這個優惠的資格就OK了可是不是他做了所有的記錄那甚至呢他還辦了這個所謂的這個民房的這個座談那當然參加的這些這些人就發現說為什麼來的時候要寫非常仔細的一些資料\n308323\t322037\t那時大家就覺得不太對勁所以這個我們可以發現說除了剛剛我們所提到的這些管道啦這些對象其實它幾乎已經到了前面入侵的部分你可能去買個東西你買個東西你可能就是會成為這個被諜報的這個對象\n325134\t352011\t你的資料可能就是被後來也證實了 偵辦的過程當中也證實了他也是經由這一些方式這個民眾 這個開設這個經用品店的這個張姓的這個人他就把這些收集到的這些身份跟資料呢真的就是給中國了所以讓我們一般民眾根本防不勝防那我們要如何判斷說我連去買個東西我可能就是會資料就是壞一些我資料可能就被送到中國去了這個民眾要如何防範呢\n352751\t372859\t我想這部分也謝謝委員的質詢民眾的這種所謂的保防或保護各自的意識可能也要我們透過這樣的討論來讓民眾更加重視這個問題包括企業也是一樣企業也有一些企業的機敏的資訊可能也要注意到這種機敏資訊的保護\n373459\t397474\t那所以委員所提到的是民眾在消費行為的過程當中難免會留下一些個資那我們還是會盡量來提醒那在留用個資的過程當中可能還是要確認它的相關的一個必要性那假如說是沒有必要的一個消費行為過程當中要留下個資的話那我們會盡量提醒民眾可能要盡量避免這樣的一個狀況\n398174\t409533\t因為這種個資被收集之後假如再經過大數據的運用的話就我們國安的角度來講它可能產生的影響會蠻大的不是只有你個人的傷害而是對於整個國家群體造成的一個影響\n410652\t428898\t是像過去的話像民眾他去做消費的時候可能考慮就是說我這個資料可能會被留到詐騙集團的手裡也許過去的認知就只有這樣可是我們現在發現不是這樣而已除了會流入詐騙集團你可能你這些資料可能就會被送到中國去\n430238\t441106\t這個部分可能現在有很多民眾還沒有辦法意識到可能大家還停留在就是說我的資料可能被這些不法的這些人士可能就是轉賣給詐騙集團可能只停留在這裡可是可能還是沒有意識到說\n447951\t472431\t這個資料可能會跟國安有關係可能這是一個破口這部分要特別利用這個機會應該跟大家做個說明跟報告因為中共它有國家情報法的規定假如是有中資的這種APP或是有中國的中資的電商的話你在網路的這些消費的行為或使用APP的過程當中可能就有一些個資被收集了\n472791\t500181\t那在中國的國家情報法的要求之下這些中資或中企他就必須要把這些他的客戶的資料來提供給中國的安全部門來參考運用所以我也是因為這樣的一個考量才會本局在之前有針對中資在國內比較流通的APP他的資安來做一個蠻全面的檢測用五個類別跟十五項的標準來認為他們對於個人的資訊的收集太超過一般的授權的權限\n501221\t521073\t局長你剛才你現在講的這部分本來是我待會就是要繼續跟你說探討因為時間的關係你剛才所講到的5個APP受到這個就是它有我知道你們之前有做過檢測就是有一些違規違規嘛就是非常多的違規像小紅書微博抖音微信百度雲盤\n522294\t535498\t這些是違規 都 項目非常的高尤其是小紅書是全面的這個違規可是問題是我們的民眾並不知道啊也許你使用這些APP的時候你的資訊 你的資料 你的個資全部都已經在中國了這是不是要加強來做這個宣導\n537479\t565451\t因為事實上這方面的管制並不是國安局的夜管但國安局我們基於國家安全的需要以及對於中共收集國人個資的一個關切我們才會自己很積極主動的針對這些中置的APP來做治安的檢測那麼後續還會針對中置的一些產品來公告一些治安檢測的項目對 因為我是看到說您確實是有做檢測嘛您跟一些國安單位其實今年就已經有公告了一些可是問題是到底多少民眾會去看這個資訊\n566511\t588832\t有沒有意識到這個國安的危機所以我是這個部分的話我想說國安相關的單位應該要一起來想辦法讓民眾去了解對 我們這方面的檢測報告大概都也有跟媒體朋友來分享那也希望透過媒體的報導讓國人在這一方面的治安的警覺跟意識可以透過一次一次的社會的一個討論能夠持續的來提升謝謝委員的提醒 謝謝OK 好 謝謝 以上謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席有請國安局蔡局長來局長請\n主席早 羅委員早局長早 局長剛剛你有提到就是說中共擴大對我國的其實它滲透的手法已經到了五花八門的地步同時我們也提到就是說中共很密集對我們的妄害竊取機密甚至來做威懾我們從過去所知很多的攻擊或者滲透其實大部分都是來自於境外\n可是今年9月份 陽廣的官網首頁被入侵了然後首頁被置換為中國的五星旗甚至在9月19號、25號連續遭到網攻 造成整個系統的癱瘓當然第一時間我們會想說這個又是來自於境外的駭客的入侵可是經過調查之後才發現原來是陽廣內部的工程師所為\n當然我們有很多的專家學者就在提到了這是不是又是另外的中國的認知作戰的手法之一那局長您如何看待這個陽廣被入侵的這個狀態會不會是國內的協力者跟這個中國所引起的一個國安的事件這個有沒有一些跡象來顯示呢\n有 這個問題我們有在注意因為央廣也算是重要的一個政府的一個關鍵的重要設施因為它涉及到大眾傳播所以這個案子一發生我們就有在注意那第二個部分是這個案子確實有央廣內部的人員因為有外洩一些治安的資訊引發相關的一個犯罪偵訪的案件所以這案件檢調已經有在進行相關的調查\n那我們所了解的是非常積極的在處理據說我打岔一下 因為我剛有聽到你說他其實有外洩一些資料所以他這個工程師他除了惡意的把這個手願換成五星旗的網頁之外其實他確確實實有外洩了一些\n資訊出去嗎是這樣子的意思嗎因為剛剛您的說法我說明一下因為他在進行那個網路的內部的這種干擾的手法的時候他有涉及到他們內部的一些資訊就包括資安管理的一些資訊那這部分的資訊可能涉案相關的人他們有一些相關的一個資訊的\n交流那因為這大概是目前整個在處理的一個主要的一個方向那至於有沒有外力的部分這部分可能要再有檢調這部分來做進一步的偵辦那我們這邊要是有相關的情資的話也會提供給檢調單位來處理\n所以目前有任何比較確實的情資嗎因為這案子還在正辦當中所以很多細節都不方便因為這個部分呢因為很敏感就是說他這個首頁呢至於五星期甚至呢媒體報導就是說可能還牽扯到一些政治人物我想這個部分的話國安單位可能要特別的來留意那好那再來我們要提到就是說其實我有看到就是說我們的報告裡面也整理出來了像\n中國呢他這個滲透的這個方式真的是非常的多元像國安局這邊其實很早就已經有整理出來了現在鎖定這個退役軍人啊信義軍人政府機關還有這個親中的組織那管道呢當然報告上面我也看到有黑道幫派啦地下錢莊一些宮廟啦民間社團等等那手法也是非常的多元像網路的勾連金錢的這個利誘還有這個債務的脅迫等等\n那其實之前我有看到某些專家學者都已經提到了其實不單單是這些手法那看起來這些手法好像是針對高層其實已經是全面的入侵因為我有看到一個高檢署的一個偵查的一個案件就是今年年初的時候他們有偵辦一個有關你這個國安有支持違反這個國安法的一個\n案件那裡面就有提到就是說有一個張姓的這個民眾他就成立的這個軍用品的這個這個這個公司這個商店那當然去的人可能很多都是警察啦或者是說軍人軍警很多然後大家就說我給你折扣可是你必須要出示你的證件那再來的話他必須把這些證件上面的資料比如說名字啦聯絡電話等等就是單位是可能也還有單位把他這個做記錄下來\n這跟一般上的就是上家給折扣的這個方式不太一樣一般上給折扣的話說你出示一下你的證件證明你的這個你有這個優惠的資格就OK了可是不是他做了所有的記錄那甚至呢他還辦了這個所謂的這個民房的這個座談那當然參加的這些這些人就發現說為什麼來的時候要寫非常仔細的一些資料\n那時大家就覺得不太對勁所以這個我們可以發現說除了剛剛我們所提到的這些管道啦這些對象其實它幾乎已經到了前面入侵的部分你可能去買個東西你買個東西你可能就是會成為這個被諜報的這個對象\n你的資料可能就是被後來也證實了 偵辦的過程當中也證實了他也是經由這一些方式這個民眾 這個開設這個經用品店的這個張姓的這個人他就把這些收集到的這些身份跟資料呢真的就是給中國了所以讓我們一般民眾根本防不勝防那我們要如何判斷說我連去買個東西我可能就是會資料就是壞一些我資料可能就被送到中國去了這個民眾要如何防範呢\n我想這部分也謝謝委員的質詢民眾的這種所謂的保防或保護各自的意識可能也要我們透過這樣的討論來讓民眾更加重視這個問題包括企業也是一樣企業也有一些企業的機敏的資訊可能也要注意到這種機敏資訊的保護\n那所以委員所提到的是民眾在消費行為的過程當中難免會留下一些個資那我們還是會盡量來提醒那在留用個資的過程當中可能還是要確認它的相關的一個必要性那假如說是沒有必要的一個消費行為過程當中要留下個資的話那我們會盡量提醒民眾可能要盡量避免這樣的一個狀況\n因為這種個資被收集之後假如再經過大數據的運用的話就我們國安的角度來講它可能產生的影響會蠻大的不是只有你個人的傷害而是對於整個國家群體造成的一個影響\n是像過去的話像民眾他去做消費的時候可能考慮就是說我這個資料可能會被留到詐騙集團的手裡也許過去的認知就只有這樣可是我們現在發現不是這樣而已除了會流入詐騙集團你可能你這些資料可能就會被送到中國去\n這個部分可能現在有很多民眾還沒有辦法意識到可能大家還停留在就是說我的資料可能被這些不法的這些人士可能就是轉賣給詐騙集團可能只停留在這裡可是可能還是沒有意識到說\n這個資料可能會跟國安有關係可能這是一個破口這部分要特別利用這個機會應該跟大家做個說明跟報告因為中共它有國家情報法的規定假如是有中資的這種APP或是有中國的中資的電商的話你在網路的這些消費的行為或使用APP的過程當中可能就有一些個資被收集了\n那在中國的國家情報法的要求之下這些中資或中企他就必須要把這些他的客戶的資料來提供給中國的安全部門來參考運用所以我也是因為這樣的一個考量才會本局在之前有針對中資在國內比較流通的APP他的資安來做一個蠻全面的檢測用五個類別跟十五項的標準來認為他們對於個人的資訊的收集太超過一般的授權的權限\n局長你剛才你現在講的這部分本來是我待會就是要繼續跟你說探討因為時間的關係你剛才所講到的5個APP受到這個就是它有我知道你們之前有做過檢測就是有一些違規違規嘛就是非常多的違規像小紅書微博抖音微信百度雲盤\n這些是違規 都 項目非常的高尤其是小紅書是全面的這個違規可是問題是我們的民眾並不知道啊也許你使用這些APP的時候你的資訊 你的資料 你的個資全部都已經在中國了這是不是要加強來做這個宣導\n因為事實上這方面的管制並不是國安局的夜管但國安局我們基於國家安全的需要以及對於中共收集國人個資的一個關切我們才會自己很積極主動的針對這些中置的APP來做治安的檢測那麼後續還會針對中置的一些產品來公告一些治安檢測的項目對 因為我是看到說您確實是有做檢測嘛您跟一些國安單位其實今年就已經有公告了一些可是問題是到底多少民眾會去看這個資訊\n有沒有意識到這個國安的危機所以我是這個部分的話我想說國安相關的單位應該要一起來想辦法讓民眾去了解對 我們這方面的檢測報告大概都也有跟媒體朋友來分享那也希望透過媒體的報導讓國人在這一方面的治安的警覺跟意識可以透過一次一次的社會的一個討論能夠持續的來提升謝謝委員的提醒 謝謝OK 好 謝謝 以上謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.350 --> 00:02.254\n謝謝主席有請國安局蔡局長來局長請\n\n00:09.515 --> 00:35.582\n主席早羅委員早局長早局長剛剛你有提到就是說中共擴大對我國的其實它滲透的手法已經到了五花八門的地步同時我們也提到就是說中共很密集對我們的妄害竊取機密甚至來做威懾我們從過去所知很多的攻擊或者滲透其實大部分都是來自於境外\n\n00:36.002 --> 00:40.185\n可是今年9月份陽廣的官網首頁被入侵了然後首頁被置換為中國的五星旗甚至在9月19號、25號連續遭到網攻造成整個系統的癱瘓當然第一時間我們會想說這個又是來自於境外的駭客的入侵可是經過調查之後才發現原來是陽廣內部的工程師所為\n\n01:07.887 --> 01:27.186\n當然我們有很多的專家學者就在提到了這是不是又是另外的中國的認知作戰的手法之一那局長您如何看待這個陽廣被入侵的這個狀態會不會是國內的協力者跟這個中國所引起的一個國安的事件這個有沒有一些跡象來顯示呢\n\n01:27.466 --> 01:51.840\n有這個問題我們有在注意因為央廣也算是重要的一個政府的一個關鍵的重要設施因為它涉及到大眾傳播所以這個案子一發生我們就有在注意那第二個部分是這個案子確實有央廣內部的人員因為有外洩一些治安的資訊引發相關的一個犯罪偵訪的案件所以這案件檢調已經有在進行相關的調查\n\n01:53.041 --> 02:14.190\n那我們所了解的是非常積極的在處理據說我打岔一下因為我剛有聽到你說他其實有外洩一些資料所以他這個工程師他除了惡意的把這個手願換成五星旗的網頁之外其實他確確實實有外洩了一些\n\n02:16.017 --> 02:39.155\n資訊出去嗎是這樣子的意思嗎因為剛剛您的說法我說明一下因為他在進行那個網路的內部的這種干擾的手法的時候他有涉及到他們內部的一些資訊就包括資安管理的一些資訊那這部分的資訊可能涉案相關的人他們有一些相關的一個資訊的\n\n02:41.707 --> 02:57.637\n交流那因為這大概是目前整個在處理的一個主要的一個方向那至於有沒有外力的部分這部分可能要再有檢調這部分來做進一步的偵辦那我們這邊要是有相關的情資的話也會提供給檢調單位來處理\n\n02:59.306 --> 03:26.660\n所以目前有任何比較確實的情資嗎因為這案子還在正辦當中所以很多細節都不方便因為這個部分呢因為很敏感就是說他這個首頁呢至於五星期甚至呢媒體報導就是說可能還牽扯到一些政治人物我想這個部分的話國安單位可能要特別的來留意那好那再來我們要提到就是說其實我有看到就是說我們的報告裡面也整理出來了像\n\n03:27.320 --> 03:50.367\n中國呢他這個滲透的這個方式真的是非常的多元像國安局這邊其實很早就已經有整理出來了現在鎖定這個退役軍人啊信義軍人政府機關還有這個親中的組織那管道呢當然報告上面我也看到有黑道幫派啦地下錢莊一些宮廟啦民間社團等等那手法也是非常的多元像網路的勾連金錢的這個利誘還有這個債務的脅迫等等\n\n03:54.548 --> 04:12.623\n那其實之前我有看到某些專家學者都已經提到了其實不單單是這些手法那看起來這些手法好像是針對高層其實已經是全面的入侵因為我有看到一個高檢署的一個偵查的一個案件就是今年年初的時候他們有偵辦一個有關你這個國安有支持違反這個國安法的一個\n\n04:18.848 --> 04:46.108\n案件那裡面就有提到就是說有一個張姓的這個民眾他就成立的這個軍用品的這個這個這個公司這個商店那當然去的人可能很多都是警察啦或者是說軍人軍警很多然後大家就說我給你折扣可是你必須要出示你的證件那再來的話他必須把這些證件上面的資料比如說名字啦聯絡電話等等就是單位是可能也還有單位把他這個做記錄下來\n\n04:47.169 --> 05:07.282\n這跟一般上的就是上家給折扣的這個方式不太一樣一般上給折扣的話說你出示一下你的證件證明你的這個你有這個優惠的資格就OK了可是不是他做了所有的記錄那甚至呢他還辦了這個所謂的這個民房的這個座談那當然參加的這些這些人就發現說為什麼來的時候要寫非常仔細的一些資料\n\n05:08.323 --> 05:22.037\n那時大家就覺得不太對勁所以這個我們可以發現說除了剛剛我們所提到的這些管道啦這些對象其實它幾乎已經到了前面入侵的部分你可能去買個東西你買個東西你可能就是會成為這個被諜報的這個對象\n\n05:25.134 --> 05:52.011\n你的資料可能就是被後來也證實了偵辦的過程當中也證實了他也是經由這一些方式這個民眾這個開設這個經用品店的這個張姓的這個人他就把這些收集到的這些身份跟資料呢真的就是給中國了所以讓我們一般民眾根本防不勝防那我們要如何判斷說我連去買個東西我可能就是會資料就是壞一些我資料可能就被送到中國去了這個民眾要如何防範呢\n\n05:52.751 --> 06:12.859\n我想這部分也謝謝委員的質詢民眾的這種所謂的保防或保護各自的意識可能也要我們透過這樣的討論來讓民眾更加重視這個問題包括企業也是一樣企業也有一些企業的機敏的資訊可能也要注意到這種機敏資訊的保護\n\n06:13.459 --> 06:37.474\n那所以委員所提到的是民眾在消費行為的過程當中難免會留下一些個資那我們還是會盡量來提醒那在留用個資的過程當中可能還是要確認它的相關的一個必要性那假如說是沒有必要的一個消費行為過程當中要留下個資的話那我們會盡量提醒民眾可能要盡量避免這樣的一個狀況\n\n06:38.174 --> 06:49.533\n因為這種個資被收集之後假如再經過大數據的運用的話就我們國安的角度來講它可能產生的影響會蠻大的不是只有你個人的傷害而是對於整個國家群體造成的一個影響\n\n06:50.652 --> 07:08.898\n是像過去的話像民眾他去做消費的時候可能考慮就是說我這個資料可能會被留到詐騙集團的手裡也許過去的認知就只有這樣可是我們現在發現不是這樣而已除了會流入詐騙集團你可能你這些資料可能就會被送到中國去\n\n07:10.238 --> 07:21.106\n這個部分可能現在有很多民眾還沒有辦法意識到可能大家還停留在就是說我的資料可能被這些不法的這些人士可能就是轉賣給詐騙集團可能只停留在這裡可是可能還是沒有意識到說\n\n07:27.951 --> 07:52.431\n這個資料可能會跟國安有關係可能這是一個破口這部分要特別利用這個機會應該跟大家做個說明跟報告因為中共它有國家情報法的規定假如是有中資的這種APP或是有中國的中資的電商的話你在網路的這些消費的行為或使用APP的過程當中可能就有一些個資被收集了\n\n07:52.791 --> 08:20.181\n那在中國的國家情報法的要求之下這些中資或中企他就必須要把這些他的客戶的資料來提供給中國的安全部門來參考運用所以我也是因為這樣的一個考量才會本局在之前有針對中資在國內比較流通的APP他的資安來做一個蠻全面的檢測用五個類別跟十五項的標準來認為他們對於個人的資訊的收集太超過一般的授權的權限\n\n08:21.221 --> 08:41.073\n局長你剛才你現在講的這部分本來是我待會就是要繼續跟你說探討因為時間的關係你剛才所講到的5個APP受到這個就是它有我知道你們之前有做過檢測就是有一些違規違規嘛就是非常多的違規像小紅書微博抖音微信百度雲盤\n\n08:42.294 --> 08:55.498\n這些是違規都項目非常的高尤其是小紅書是全面的這個違規可是問題是我們的民眾並不知道啊也許你使用這些APP的時候你的資訊你的資料你的個資全部都已經在中國了這是不是要加強來做這個宣導\n\n08:57.479 --> 09:25.451\n因為事實上這方面的管制並不是國安局的夜管但國安局我們基於國家安全的需要以及對於中共收集國人個資的一個關切我們才會自己很積極主動的針對這些中置的APP來做治安的檢測那麼後續還會針對中置的一些產品來公告一些治安檢測的項目對因為我是看到說您確實是有做檢測嘛您跟一些國安單位其實今年就已經有公告了一些可是問題是到底多少民眾會去看這個資訊\n\n09:26.511 --> 09:48.832\n有沒有意識到這個國安的危機所以我是這個部分的話我想說國安相關的單位應該要一起來想辦法讓民眾去了解對我們這方面的檢測報告大概都也有跟媒體朋友來分享那也希望透過媒體的報導讓國人在這一方面的治安的警覺跟意識可以透過一次一次的社會的一個討論能夠持續的來提升謝謝委員的提醒謝謝OK好謝謝以上謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.35,"end":2.254,"text":"謝謝主席有請國安局蔡局長來局長請"},{"start":9.515,"end":35.582,"text":"主席早 羅委員早局長早 局長剛剛你有提到就是說中共擴大對我國的其實它滲透的手法已經到了五花八門的地步同時我們也提到就是說中共很密集對我們的妄害竊取機密甚至來做威懾我們從過去所知很多的攻擊或者滲透其實大部分都是來自於境外"},{"start":36.002,"end":40.185,"text":"可是今年9月份 陽廣的官網首頁被入侵了然後首頁被置換為中國的五星旗甚至在9月19號、25號連續遭到網攻 造成整個系統的癱瘓當然第一時間我們會想說這個又是來自於境外的駭客的入侵可是經過調查之後才發現原來是陽廣內部的工程師所為"},{"start":67.887,"end":87.186,"text":"當然我們有很多的專家學者就在提到了這是不是又是另外的中國的認知作戰的手法之一那局長您如何看待這個陽廣被入侵的這個狀態會不會是國內的協力者跟這個中國所引起的一個國安的事件這個有沒有一些跡象來顯示呢"},{"start":87.466,"end":111.84,"text":"有 這個問題我們有在注意因為央廣也算是重要的一個政府的一個關鍵的重要設施因為它涉及到大眾傳播所以這個案子一發生我們就有在注意那第二個部分是這個案子確實有央廣內部的人員因為有外洩一些治安的資訊引發相關的一個犯罪偵訪的案件所以這案件檢調已經有在進行相關的調查"},{"start":113.041,"end":134.19,"text":"那我們所了解的是非常積極的在處理據說我打岔一下 因為我剛有聽到你說他其實有外洩一些資料所以他這個工程師他除了惡意的把這個手願換成五星旗的網頁之外其實他確確實實有外洩了一些"},{"start":136.017,"end":159.155,"text":"資訊出去嗎是這樣子的意思嗎因為剛剛您的說法我說明一下因為他在進行那個網路的內部的這種干擾的手法的時候他有涉及到他們內部的一些資訊就包括資安管理的一些資訊那這部分的資訊可能涉案相關的人他們有一些相關的一個資訊的"},{"start":161.707,"end":177.637,"text":"交流那因為這大概是目前整個在處理的一個主要的一個方向那至於有沒有外力的部分這部分可能要再有檢調這部分來做進一步的偵辦那我們這邊要是有相關的情資的話也會提供給檢調單位來處理"},{"start":179.306,"end":206.66,"text":"所以目前有任何比較確實的情資嗎因為這案子還在正辦當中所以很多細節都不方便因為這個部分呢因為很敏感就是說他這個首頁呢至於五星期甚至呢媒體報導就是說可能還牽扯到一些政治人物我想這個部分的話國安單位可能要特別的來留意那好那再來我們要提到就是說其實我有看到就是說我們的報告裡面也整理出來了像"},{"start":207.32,"end":230.367,"text":"中國呢他這個滲透的這個方式真的是非常的多元像國安局這邊其實很早就已經有整理出來了現在鎖定這個退役軍人啊信義軍人政府機關還有這個親中的組織那管道呢當然報告上面我也看到有黑道幫派啦地下錢莊一些宮廟啦民間社團等等那手法也是非常的多元像網路的勾連金錢的這個利誘還有這個債務的脅迫等等"},{"start":234.548,"end":252.623,"text":"那其實之前我有看到某些專家學者都已經提到了其實不單單是這些手法那看起來這些手法好像是針對高層其實已經是全面的入侵因為我有看到一個高檢署的一個偵查的一個案件就是今年年初的時候他們有偵辦一個有關你這個國安有支持違反這個國安法的一個"},{"start":258.848,"end":286.108,"text":"案件那裡面就有提到就是說有一個張姓的這個民眾他就成立的這個軍用品的這個這個這個公司這個商店那當然去的人可能很多都是警察啦或者是說軍人軍警很多然後大家就說我給你折扣可是你必須要出示你的證件那再來的話他必須把這些證件上面的資料比如說名字啦聯絡電話等等就是單位是可能也還有單位把他這個做記錄下來"},{"start":287.169,"end":307.282,"text":"這跟一般上的就是上家給折扣的這個方式不太一樣一般上給折扣的話說你出示一下你的證件證明你的這個你有這個優惠的資格就OK了可是不是他做了所有的記錄那甚至呢他還辦了這個所謂的這個民房的這個座談那當然參加的這些這些人就發現說為什麼來的時候要寫非常仔細的一些資料"},{"start":308.323,"end":322.037,"text":"那時大家就覺得不太對勁所以這個我們可以發現說除了剛剛我們所提到的這些管道啦這些對象其實它幾乎已經到了前面入侵的部分你可能去買個東西你買個東西你可能就是會成為這個被諜報的這個對象"},{"start":325.134,"end":352.011,"text":"你的資料可能就是被後來也證實了 偵辦的過程當中也證實了他也是經由這一些方式這個民眾 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都 項目非常的高尤其是小紅書是全面的這個違規可是問題是我們的民眾並不知道啊也許你使用這些APP的時候你的資訊 你的資料 你的個資全部都已經在中國了這是不是要加強來做這個宣導"},{"start":537.479,"end":565.451,"text":"因為事實上這方面的管制並不是國安局的夜管但國安局我們基於國家安全的需要以及對於中共收集國人個資的一個關切我們才會自己很積極主動的針對這些中置的APP來做治安的檢測那麼後續還會針對中置的一些產品來公告一些治安檢測的項目對 因為我是看到說您確實是有做檢測嘛您跟一些國安單位其實今年就已經有公告了一些可是問題是到底多少民眾會去看這個資訊"},{"start":566.511,"end":588.832,"text":"有沒有意識到這個國安的危機所以我是這個部分的話我想說國安相關的單位應該要一起來想辦法讓民眾去了解對 我們這方面的檢測報告大概都也有跟媒體朋友來分享那也希望透過媒體的報導讓國人在這一方面的治安的警覺跟意識可以透過一次一次的社會的一個討論能夠持續的來提升謝謝委員的提醒 謝謝OK 好 謝謝 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