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\"end\": 824.207, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"官\", \"start\": 824.207, \"end\": 824.708, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"回\", \"start\": 824.708, \"end\": 824.909, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"座\", \"start\": 824.909, \"end\": 824.929, \"score\": 0.0}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:06,263 --> 00:00:11,686\n好謝謝主席有請教育部部長有請鄭部長委員好部長早安我今天就剛剛其實這個萬美玲委員她提到要跟這個國防部講一下那個水的問題那天其實在審特別預算的時候其實我人也在場但是呢這個所謂的常備用水\n\n2\n00:00:34,440 --> 00:00:50,379\n軍備用的儲水跟一般的礦泉水看似都是水但是其實這個魔鬼藏在細節當中那我先呼應一下這個其實也不用跟國防部說因為國防部講的這個戰備的用水一瓶120元其實是普遍\n\n3\n00:00:50,959 --> 00:01:12,416\n在军事专家眼中它的市价就是这么高为什么因为五年以上的保存水它的保存期限比较久瓶身加厚为了要降低透氧率生产的成本是比较高的同时这个水还经过三次的RO逆渗透瓶口在封盖之前还有臭氧杀菌整瓶水要无菌的状态\n\n4\n00:01:13,257 --> 00:01:33,288\n所以這個是必須要在國防部在這次的特別預算當中有特別編列這樣子的預算這也是因應我們的國防的需求軍事戰備用水是的確需要的在這裡希望有解決這個萬美玲委員她的一些疑問好那部長\n\n5\n00:01:34,148 --> 00:02:01,886\n我想這個校事會議您還記得嗎5月28號的時候其實我是委員會當中我是第一個提出來的委員那當初其實我們因為校事會議引起在學校端很多老師他們的寒蟬效應那親師的溝通出現了一些裂痕那這是我們當時提醒教育部要注意的那麼在8月7號的時候我在向教育部再次提及了五大的一個建議那我想這個五大的建議包含\n\n6\n00:02:03,373 --> 00:02:28,868\n建立這個分級的一個處理提高校事會議的啟動的一個門檻再來第二點就是要保障老師知情跟答辯權再來第三要健全調查委員的選任跟培訓的制度這個是人才庫的部分再來第四就是我們要有第三方的公正公平的審議的單位再來第五點就是我們要如何建立這些曾經被校事會議調查過後\n\n7\n00:02:30,649 --> 00:02:54,291\n但是其實也查無實證或者是最後其實以所謂的像法官一樣不提訴這樣子的老師他怎麼樣來恢復他的名譽在心理層面跟他的整個所有的法律的支持我們要怎麼樣來做實質上的一個幫助這些老師們我想我提出了這五大要點我們也很高興就是在9月16號的時候我們的鄭部長您也承諾了\n\n8\n00:02:54,932 --> 00:03:18,425\n那在年底之前我們的消失會議有很大的改善的一個空間那調整的一個空間那同時您也說要刪除這個現行匿名檢舉單數的一個規定那我想這個部分來講其實對於消失會議來講我們是有往正向的方向去走但是我們其實最重要的就是希望能夠減少更多的衝突那麼減少爛訴\n\n9\n00:03:20,206 --> 00:03:38,007\n我想初步的溝通我們也得到了一些正面的回應同時也符合教師們的期待這是我們最希望能夠看到的但是在大部分的細節的部分我想可能還不是那麼的清楚跟明瞭在這裡我想要再次的請教部長\n\n10\n00:03:39,489 --> 00:04:04,208\n就是在事前我們剛剛有講要分流不要那麼急就把這被投訴的老師直接送到所謂的這個校事會議當中就是那個門檻要稍微提高但是在這個進入校事會議之前我們的行政務團親師的溝通那不管這個結果成功與否那後續應該怎麼處置有沒有一個所謂的一致性的SOP的一個處置的方式\n\n11\n00:04:04,668 --> 00:04:25,475\n或者是還是依照各校他自己的一個方式處理但是如果這個結果比方說家長不夠滿意他甚至要再回頭重複的申訴這有可能也會造成所謂的行政耗損這樣子的一個狀況之下我們可不可以在這個部分也提出改善的方針\n\n12\n00:04:26,115 --> 00:04:41,051\n那第二點我想問的就是當承辦人員他沒有受訓或承辦過所謂的重大情節的案件他影響到了所謂的這個調查的一個結果那這個部分我們有沒有追責的一個機制那第三點我想要問的就是\n\n13\n00:04:42,116 --> 00:05:10,704\n目前最大的一個問題是沒有一個先篩選的制度任何的檢舉都可能會進到所謂的校事會議那基於學校本身他是當事人他又有可能成為所謂的調查的單位我們真的不免擔心球員兼裁判在整個所有的所謂的部長你可能會說會有所謂的複查的一個機制但是這個複查的機制如果還是有體系內的人在審\n\n14\n00:05:11,744 --> 00:05:25,907\n那麼難免在有權力結構的校園當中那這個權力結構的環境裡頭副省的制度本身就缺乏被信任的空間這第三點我們怎麼樣來克服請教一下部長\n\n15\n00:05:26,550 --> 00:05:46,817\n那謝謝委員的一個提醒確實委員當時的一個對校事會議的一個制度上的一些期待我們確實也在分區座談裡面委員對問題的掌握是非常的精準的所以我們大概整個陳委員所提我們怎麼樣去分流行政務談其實是溝通這些的\n\n16\n00:05:47,637 --> 00:06:07,960\n我们在未来的新的办法我们会有一些包含例证的一些提示让第一线上的一些学校在整个在运作里边能够有一些实例的一些参考跟有一些依循的这我们都会来做包含刚才委员提到说当一个老师被误告然后到最后\n\n17\n00:06:08,661 --> 00:06:29,039\n甚至我們講說法院或者校會判他這個不成立也結案了那對於老師所遭受的權益上的一些受損我們只會去回憶回復他這個我們大概都是朝這個方向因為自從有效式會議以來我們知道其實在所有的769件當中目前只有成案的只有3.38%是\n\n18\n00:06:31,061 --> 00:06:56,039\n所以相對的來講就是這些其實教師會議都是成本喔都是費用喔所以我們這個部分包含老師我們就第一個要杜絕這個爛數第二個就是對老師遭受到不名譽的一個指控然後沒有成立的時候所造成的一些甚至在我們要讓他有回復名譽的機制啦我們都有一套的機制希望能夠回復到他原來的一個\n\n19\n00:06:56,579 --> 00:07:21,918\n如果有家長對於這個調查的結果是不滿意的他如果要重複的這個再申請避免重複的申訴這個部分我們可以避免嗎因為我們如果沒有新的市政我們基本上就列入不受理也有這樣的一個機制出來好那我想呢就是不管是在行政務談那親事溝通我們要有一個一致性的SOP因為包含\n\n20\n00:07:22,378 --> 00:07:45,043\n包含我們法院也有一些實際的一個判例對學生誣告老師法院也做成實際的這個裁判的一個動作我們希望累積有更多的一個案例讓學校在裡面對學生的宣導或者對家長或者學校裡面的運作有一些更多的一些彼此在一個民主法治的社會裡面有一個更適宜的一個\n\n21\n00:07:45,763 --> 00:08:13,273\n我想其实我们都不希望造成学校行政人力或者是教师他们在教学在被调查的期间这一两个月当中他们可能一方面要准备教材二方面要应付所谓的校师会议这样子的调查造成他们其实身心俱疲那我想这影响到的还是学生们受教的一个权益我们还是让教学回归专业让学校能够变成更良善的一个我完全认同委员的一个\n\n22\n00:08:13,553 --> 00:08:34,893\n好那么往这个方向走那我想校师会议有很多细腻的部分很多细节的部分我们可能再找时间再来好好地沟通跟讨论好那第二个我想呢就是在昨天其实我们也跟培育委员特别有开了一个座谈会那也就是相对的来讲我们非常关心所谓的特教生他们的一些权益的一些问题了\n\n23\n00:08:35,433 --> 00:08:59,564\n那我想給特教生一個比較完整的運動學習的一個環境那教育部跟國教署其實近幾年來也都非常非常的重視也投入了相當的的心力那展現了我們的政府對所謂的生長生的這個權益的一個正式的一個問題但是隨著體育署升格為運動部那接著下來我們過去體育署所負責的不管是他的課程的設計\n\n24\n00:09:01,005 --> 00:09:20,367\n師資的培育或者是特教生的支持現在有沒有明確承接的單位如果沒有明確承接的單位我們也很擔心在校園當中尤其是高中以下他們是有體育課的但是他們的權益到底是誰來接手會不會因為我們的組織改革了\n\n25\n00:09:20,928 --> 00:09:39,570\n我们可能这些所谓的特教生他们的适应体育的这个部分变成被边缘化了反而他们的权益被忽视了这个部分我们是不是也请教育部这边来回应一下对委员关心我们特殊教育这一个对象的学生在整个视讯体育事实上运动部\n\n26\n00:09:40,311 --> 00:09:57,912\n有私信體育師我想這一個對銜接這一個我們這個特殊教育的學生我們在當然未來是一定是跨部會合作的那另外也跟我們報告對特殊教育的一個學生我們本來就有一個IEP的這樣的一個個別化的\n\n27\n00:09:58,700 --> 00:10:14,570\n的一個教學計畫那個別化的教學計畫除了有特教老師有學科老師他還有特別為這一個學生所這一個個別化的一個教育的這個體育的這樣一個訓練但是因為現在我們知道這個適應體育它有分課程內\n\n28\n00:10:15,590 --> 00:10:38,340\n跟課程外這兩塊的業務是被切割的喔那這兩塊的業務現在到底是由哪一個單位接手課程內的部分特教學生一定當然是教育部要優先但屬於教育專業私信這一個部分我們當然也跟運動部會合作但教育部對銜接這個接觸每一個特殊教育的學生我想我們則後旁待\n\n29\n00:10:38,900 --> 00:10:58,556\n這個是12年以下也就是高中以下我們有體育班我們體育課那麼他們還是原班在就是在原班上課對於所謂的這個特教生來說但是如果到了大專院校的階段我們怎麼樣來給他們具體的課程跟教學的支持這個部分有考慮嗎因為到了大專以上喔\n\n30\n00:11:00,042 --> 00:11:19,727\n因為剛剛講的其實都是我們的12年國教以下對不對那大專以上的怎麼辦跟委員說明我們的特教中層計畫裡面的這些措施運動部成立之後他會接手體育署原本在做的工作有具體的時程嗎有有有有他們委託了台師大有成立的這個適應體育的那個\n\n31\n00:11:22,228 --> 00:11:48,156\n所以有具体的时程跟方式是的那事后可以提供给我们办公室吗因为其实我们最担心的就是我们的适应体育其实应该要放在非常重要的位置上不管我们的这个运动部当然运动部成立是一个好事是大家都很期待的这代表我们其实是很关心全民运动但是我们也担心就是所谓的这些特效生他们的一些权益被受损了那这个部分事后再提供给我们办公室可以吗\n\n32\n00:11:48,676 --> 00:12:05,608\n沒問題好那第三個問題其實今天不要讓這個舒冰主席站那麼久我快速我一點點就好了那這個去年其實我們一直在我的辦公室一直在關心所謂特交助理員他們的薪資待遇那我想這個教育部也聽取了我們的意見\n\n33\n00:12:06,408 --> 00:12:29,182\n那在這個特教教師助理員的部分我們可以來調整他們加薪的條件同時呢這個教育部也承諾可以回溯到這個113年的8月1號開始生效那這點其實我們非常的感恩也非常的開心教育部真的聽到了但是還是有特教助理員向我們來反映學生助理員已經獲得了全國統一的加薪\n\n34\n00:12:29,582 --> 00:12:46,461\n但是教師助理員的待遇因為現在地方政府他們的財政狀況不一政策上也有差異所以沒有辦法一致就有這樣子的這個特交助理員他告訴我說雖然名為加薪但是我的時數被減了\n\n35\n00:12:48,243 --> 00:13:04,258\n我的時數被減了我的工資相對來講被變相的減薪這個部分我們怎麼樣來建立讓他們整個所有的這些助理員他們的保障能夠跟全國一致這個部分我們有沒有解方\n\n36\n00:13:05,865 --> 00:13:33,490\n我想這個我們當然希望說所有的這個教師助理員學生助理員的薪水能夠受到一定的一個保障那如果我們現在會後我們來收集各縣市在實際的情況怎麼樣然後我們來看怎麼樣來協助讓這些的助理員的一個薪資所以快速的盤點什麼時間點之前可以盤點結束然後由統一的一個月\n\n37\n00:13:35,410 --> 00:13:44,929\n好好謝謝部長的回應好謝謝部長謝謝署長謝謝主席謝謝謝謝疫情委員的質詢那官員請回座\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n6263\t11686\t好 謝謝主席有請教育部部長有請鄭部長委員好部長早安 我今天就剛剛其實這個萬美玲委員她提到要跟這個國防部講一下那個水的問題那天其實在審特別預算的時候其實我人也在場但是呢這個所謂的常備用水\n34440\t50379\t軍備用的儲水跟一般的礦泉水看似都是水但是其實這個魔鬼藏在細節當中那我先呼應一下這個其實也不用跟國防部說因為國防部講的這個戰備的用水一瓶120元其實是普遍\n50959\t72416\t在军事专家眼中它的市价就是这么高为什么因为五年以上的保存水它的保存期限比较久瓶身加厚为了要降低透氧率生产的成本是比较高的同时这个水还经过三次的RO逆渗透瓶口在封盖之前还有臭氧杀菌整瓶水要无菌的状态\n73257\t93288\t所以這個是必須要在國防部在這次的特別預算當中有特別編列這樣子的預算這也是因應我們的國防的需求軍事戰備用水是的確需要的在這裡希望有解決這個萬美玲委員她的一些疑問好那部長\n94148\t121886\t我想這個校事會議您還記得嗎5月28號的時候其實我是委員會當中我是第一個提出來的委員那當初其實我們因為校事會議引起在學校端很多老師他們的寒蟬效應那親師的溝通出現了一些裂痕那這是我們當時提醒教育部要注意的那麼在8月7號的時候我在向教育部再次提及了五大的一個建議那我想這個五大的建議包含\n123373\t148868\t建立這個分級的一個處理提高校事會議的啟動的一個門檻再來第二點就是要保障老師知情跟答辯權再來第三要健全調查委員的選任跟培訓的制度這個是人才庫的部分再來第四就是我們要有第三方的公正公平的審議的單位再來第五點就是我們要如何建立這些曾經被校事會議調查過後\n150649\t174291\t但是其實也查無實證或者是最後其實以所謂的像法官一樣不提訴這樣子的老師他怎麼樣來恢復他的名譽在心理層面跟他的整個所有的法律的支持我們要怎麼樣來做實質上的一個幫助這些老師們我想我提出了這五大要點我們也很高興就是在9月16號的時候我們的鄭部長您也承諾了\n174932\t198425\t那在年底之前我們的消失會議有很大的改善的一個空間那調整的一個空間那同時您也說要刪除這個現行匿名檢舉單數的一個規定那我想這個部分來講其實對於消失會議來講我們是有往正向的方向去走但是我們其實最重要的就是希望能夠減少更多的衝突那麼減少爛訴\n200206\t218007\t我想初步的溝通我們也得到了一些正面的回應同時也符合教師們的期待這是我們最希望能夠看到的但是在大部分的細節的部分我想可能還不是那麼的清楚跟明瞭在這裡我想要再次的請教部長\n219489\t244208\t就是在事前我們剛剛有講要分流不要那麼急就把這被投訴的老師直接送到所謂的這個校事會議當中就是那個門檻要稍微提高但是在這個進入校事會議之前我們的行政務團親師的溝通那不管這個結果成功與否那後續應該怎麼處置有沒有一個所謂的一致性的SOP的一個處置的方式\n244668\t265475\t或者是還是依照各校他自己的一個方式處理但是如果這個結果比方說家長不夠滿意他甚至要再回頭重複的申訴這有可能也會造成所謂的行政耗損這樣子的一個狀況之下我們可不可以在這個部分也提出改善的方針\n266115\t281051\t那第二點我想問的就是當承辦人員他沒有受訓或承辦過所謂的重大情節的案件他影響到了所謂的這個調查的一個結果那這個部分我們有沒有追責的一個機制那第三點我想要問的就是\n282116\t310704\t目前最大的一個問題是沒有一個先篩選的制度任何的檢舉都可能會進到所謂的校事會議那基於學校本身他是當事人他又有可能成為所謂的調查的單位我們真的不免擔心球員兼裁判在整個所有的所謂的部長你可能會說會有所謂的複查的一個機制但是這個複查的機制如果還是有體系內的人在審\n311744\t325907\t那麼難免在有權力結構的校園當中那這個權力結構的環境裡頭副省的制度本身就缺乏被信任的空間這第三點我們怎麼樣來克服請教一下部長\n326550\t346817\t那謝謝委員的一個提醒確實委員當時的一個對校事會議的一個制度上的一些期待我們確實也在分區座談裡面委員對問題的掌握是非常的精準的所以我們大概整個陳委員所提我們怎麼樣去分流行政務談其實是溝通這些的\n347637\t367960\t我们在未来的新的办法我们会有一些包含例证的一些提示让第一线上的一些学校在整个在运作里边能够有一些实例的一些参考跟有一些依循的这我们都会来做包含刚才委员提到说当一个老师被误告然后到最后\n368661\t389039\t甚至我們講說法院或者校會判他這個不成立也結案了那對於老師所遭受的權益上的一些受損我們只會去回憶 回復他這個我們大概都是朝這個方向因為自從有效式會議以來我們知道其實在所有的769件當中目前只有成案的只有3.38%是\n391061\t416039\t所以相對的來講就是這些其實教師會議都是成本喔都是費用喔所以我們這個部分包含老師我們就第一個要杜絕這個爛數第二個就是對老師遭受到不名譽的一個指控然後沒有成立的時候所造成的一些甚至在我們要讓他有回復名譽的機制啦我們都有一套的機制希望能夠回復到他原來的一個\n416579\t441918\t如果有家長對於這個調查的結果是不滿意的他如果要重複的這個再申請避免重複的申訴這個部分我們可以避免嗎因為我們如果沒有新的市政我們基本上就列入不受理也有這樣的一個機制出來好那我想呢就是不管是在行政務談那親事溝通我們要有一個一致性的SOP因為包含\n442378\t465043\t包含我們法院也有一些實際的一個判例對學生 誣告老師法院也做成實際的這個裁判的一個動作我們希望累積有更多的一個案例讓學校在裡面對學生的宣導或者對家長或者學校裡面的運作有一些更多的一些彼此在一個民主法治的社會裡面有一個更適宜的一個\n465763\t493273\t我想其实我们都不希望造成学校行政人力或者是教师他们在教学在被调查的期间这一两个月当中他们可能一方面要准备教材二方面要应付所谓的校师会议这样子的调查造成他们其实身心俱疲那我想这影响到的还是学生们受教的一个权益我们还是让教学回归专业让学校能够变成更良善的一个我完全认同委员的一个\n493553\t514893\t好 那么往这个方向走那我想校师会议有很多细腻的部分很多细节的部分我们可能再找时间再来好好地沟通跟讨论好 那第二个我想呢就是在昨天其实我们也跟培育委员特别有开了一个座谈会那也就是相对的来讲我们非常关心所谓的特教生他们的一些权益的一些问题了\n515433\t539564\t那我想給特教生一個比較完整的運動學習的一個環境那教育部跟國教署其實近幾年來也都非常非常的重視也投入了相當的的心力那展現了我們的政府對所謂的生長生的這個權益的一個正式的一個問題但是隨著體育署升格為運動部那接著下來我們過去體育署所負責的不管是他的課程的設計\n541005\t560367\t師資的培育或者是特教生的支持現在有沒有明確承接的單位如果沒有明確承接的單位我們也很擔心在校園當中尤其是高中以下他們是有體育課的但是他們的權益到底是誰來接手會不會因為我們的組織改革了\n560928\t579570\t我们可能这些所谓的特教生他们的适应体育的这个部分变成被边缘化了反而他们的权益被忽视了这个部分我们是不是也请教育部这边来回应一下对委员关心我们特殊教育这一个对象的学生在整个视讯体育事实上运动部\n580311\t597912\t有私信體育師我想這一個對銜接這一個我們這個特殊教育的學生我們在當然未來是一定是跨部會合作的那另外也跟我們報告對特殊教育的一個學生我們本來就有一個IEP的這樣的一個個別化的\n598700\t614570\t的一個教學計畫那個別化的教學計畫除了有特教老師有學科老師他還有特別為這一個學生所這一個個別化的一個教育的這個體育的這樣一個訓練但是因為現在我們知道這個適應體育它有分課程內\n615590\t638340\t跟課程外這兩塊的業務是被切割的喔那這兩塊的業務現在到底是由哪一個單位接手課程內的部分特教學生一定當然是教育部要優先但屬於教育專業私信這一個部分我們當然也跟運動部會合作但教育部對銜接這個接觸每一個特殊教育的學生我想我們則後旁待\n638900\t658556\t這個是12年以下也就是高中以下我們有體育班我們體育課那麼他們還是原班在就是在原班上課對於所謂的這個特教生來說但是如果到了大專院校的階段我們怎麼樣來給他們具體的課程跟教學的支持這個部分有考慮嗎因為到了大專以上喔\n660042\t679727\t因為剛剛講的其實都是我們的12年國教以下對不對那大專以上的怎麼辦跟委員說明我們的特教中層計畫裡面的這些措施運動部成立之後他會接手體育署原本在做的工作有具體的時程嗎有有有有他們委託了台師大有成立的這個適應體育的那個\n682228\t708156\t所以有具体的时程跟方式是的那事后可以提供给我们办公室吗因为其实我们最担心的就是我们的适应体育其实应该要放在非常重要的位置上不管我们的这个运动部当然运动部成立是一个好事是大家都很期待的这代表我们其实是很关心全民运动但是我们也担心就是所谓的这些特效生他们的一些权益被受损了那这个部分事后再提供给我们办公室可以吗\n708676\t725608\t沒問題好那第三個問題其實今天不要讓這個舒冰主席站那麼久我快速我一點點就好了那這個去年其實我們一直在我的辦公室一直在關心所謂特交助理員他們的薪資待遇那我想這個教育部也聽取了我們的意見\n726408\t749182\t那在這個特教教師助理員的部分我們可以來調整他們加薪的條件同時呢這個教育部也承諾可以回溯到這個113年的8月1號開始生效那這點其實我們非常的感恩也非常的開心教育部真的聽到了但是還是有特教助理員向我們來反映學生助理員已經獲得了全國統一的加薪\n749582\t766461\t但是教師助理員的待遇因為現在地方政府他們的財政狀況不一政策上也有差異所以沒有辦法一致就有這樣子的這個特交助理員他告訴我說雖然名為加薪但是我的時數被減了\n768243\t784258\t我的時數被減了我的工資相對來講被變相的減薪這個部分我們怎麼樣來建立讓他們整個所有的這些助理員他們的保障能夠跟全國一致這個部分我們有沒有解方\n785865\t813490\t我想這個我們當然希望說所有的這個教師助理員學生助理員的薪水能夠受到一定的一個保障那如果我們現在會後我們來收集各縣市在實際的情況怎麼樣然後我們來看怎麼樣來協助讓這些的助理員的一個薪資所以快速的盤點什麼時間點之前可以盤點結束然後由統一的一個月\n815410\t824929\t好好謝謝部長的回應好謝謝部長謝謝署長謝謝主席謝謝謝謝疫情委員的質詢那官員請回座\n","txt":"好 謝謝主席有請教育部部長有請鄭部長委員好部長早安 我今天就剛剛其實這個萬美玲委員她提到要跟這個國防部講一下那個水的問題那天其實在審特別預算的時候其實我人也在場但是呢這個所謂的常備用水\n軍備用的儲水跟一般的礦泉水看似都是水但是其實這個魔鬼藏在細節當中那我先呼應一下這個其實也不用跟國防部說因為國防部講的這個戰備的用水一瓶120元其實是普遍\n在军事专家眼中它的市价就是这么高为什么因为五年以上的保存水它的保存期限比较久瓶身加厚为了要降低透氧率生产的成本是比较高的同时这个水还经过三次的RO逆渗透瓶口在封盖之前还有臭氧杀菌整瓶水要无菌的状态\n所以這個是必須要在國防部在這次的特別預算當中有特別編列這樣子的預算這也是因應我們的國防的需求軍事戰備用水是的確需要的在這裡希望有解決這個萬美玲委員她的一些疑問好那部長\n我想這個校事會議您還記得嗎5月28號的時候其實我是委員會當中我是第一個提出來的委員那當初其實我們因為校事會議引起在學校端很多老師他們的寒蟬效應那親師的溝通出現了一些裂痕那這是我們當時提醒教育部要注意的那麼在8月7號的時候我在向教育部再次提及了五大的一個建議那我想這個五大的建議包含\n建立這個分級的一個處理提高校事會議的啟動的一個門檻再來第二點就是要保障老師知情跟答辯權再來第三要健全調查委員的選任跟培訓的制度這個是人才庫的部分再來第四就是我們要有第三方的公正公平的審議的單位再來第五點就是我們要如何建立這些曾經被校事會議調查過後\n但是其實也查無實證或者是最後其實以所謂的像法官一樣不提訴這樣子的老師他怎麼樣來恢復他的名譽在心理層面跟他的整個所有的法律的支持我們要怎麼樣來做實質上的一個幫助這些老師們我想我提出了這五大要點我們也很高興就是在9月16號的時候我們的鄭部長您也承諾了\n那在年底之前我們的消失會議有很大的改善的一個空間那調整的一個空間那同時您也說要刪除這個現行匿名檢舉單數的一個規定那我想這個部分來講其實對於消失會議來講我們是有往正向的方向去走但是我們其實最重要的就是希望能夠減少更多的衝突那麼減少爛訴\n我想初步的溝通我們也得到了一些正面的回應同時也符合教師們的期待這是我們最希望能夠看到的但是在大部分的細節的部分我想可能還不是那麼的清楚跟明瞭在這裡我想要再次的請教部長\n就是在事前我們剛剛有講要分流不要那麼急就把這被投訴的老師直接送到所謂的這個校事會議當中就是那個門檻要稍微提高但是在這個進入校事會議之前我們的行政務團親師的溝通那不管這個結果成功與否那後續應該怎麼處置有沒有一個所謂的一致性的SOP的一個處置的方式\n或者是還是依照各校他自己的一個方式處理但是如果這個結果比方說家長不夠滿意他甚至要再回頭重複的申訴這有可能也會造成所謂的行政耗損這樣子的一個狀況之下我們可不可以在這個部分也提出改善的方針\n那第二點我想問的就是當承辦人員他沒有受訓或承辦過所謂的重大情節的案件他影響到了所謂的這個調查的一個結果那這個部分我們有沒有追責的一個機制那第三點我想要問的就是\n目前最大的一個問題是沒有一個先篩選的制度任何的檢舉都可能會進到所謂的校事會議那基於學校本身他是當事人他又有可能成為所謂的調查的單位我們真的不免擔心球員兼裁判在整個所有的所謂的部長你可能會說會有所謂的複查的一個機制但是這個複查的機制如果還是有體系內的人在審\n那麼難免在有權力結構的校園當中那這個權力結構的環境裡頭副省的制度本身就缺乏被信任的空間這第三點我們怎麼樣來克服請教一下部長\n那謝謝委員的一個提醒確實委員當時的一個對校事會議的一個制度上的一些期待我們確實也在分區座談裡面委員對問題的掌握是非常的精準的所以我們大概整個陳委員所提我們怎麼樣去分流行政務談其實是溝通這些的\n我们在未来的新的办法我们会有一些包含例证的一些提示让第一线上的一些学校在整个在运作里边能够有一些实例的一些参考跟有一些依循的这我们都会来做包含刚才委员提到说当一个老师被误告然后到最后\n甚至我們講說法院或者校會判他這個不成立也結案了那對於老師所遭受的權益上的一些受損我們只會去回憶 回復他這個我們大概都是朝這個方向因為自從有效式會議以來我們知道其實在所有的769件當中目前只有成案的只有3.38%是\n所以相對的來講就是這些其實教師會議都是成本喔都是費用喔所以我們這個部分包含老師我們就第一個要杜絕這個爛數第二個就是對老師遭受到不名譽的一個指控然後沒有成立的時候所造成的一些甚至在我們要讓他有回復名譽的機制啦我們都有一套的機制希望能夠回復到他原來的一個\n如果有家長對於這個調查的結果是不滿意的他如果要重複的這個再申請避免重複的申訴這個部分我們可以避免嗎因為我們如果沒有新的市政我們基本上就列入不受理也有這樣的一個機制出來好那我想呢就是不管是在行政務談那親事溝通我們要有一個一致性的SOP因為包含\n包含我們法院也有一些實際的一個判例對學生 誣告老師法院也做成實際的這個裁判的一個動作我們希望累積有更多的一個案例讓學校在裡面對學生的宣導或者對家長或者學校裡面的運作有一些更多的一些彼此在一個民主法治的社會裡面有一個更適宜的一個\n我想其实我们都不希望造成学校行政人力或者是教师他们在教学在被调查的期间这一两个月当中他们可能一方面要准备教材二方面要应付所谓的校师会议这样子的调查造成他们其实身心俱疲那我想这影响到的还是学生们受教的一个权益我们还是让教学回归专业让学校能够变成更良善的一个我完全认同委员的一个\n好 那么往这个方向走那我想校师会议有很多细腻的部分很多细节的部分我们可能再找时间再来好好地沟通跟讨论好 那第二个我想呢就是在昨天其实我们也跟培育委员特别有开了一个座谈会那也就是相对的来讲我们非常关心所谓的特教生他们的一些权益的一些问题了\n那我想給特教生一個比較完整的運動學習的一個環境那教育部跟國教署其實近幾年來也都非常非常的重視也投入了相當的的心力那展現了我們的政府對所謂的生長生的這個權益的一個正式的一個問題但是隨著體育署升格為運動部那接著下來我們過去體育署所負責的不管是他的課程的設計\n師資的培育或者是特教生的支持現在有沒有明確承接的單位如果沒有明確承接的單位我們也很擔心在校園當中尤其是高中以下他們是有體育課的但是他們的權益到底是誰來接手會不會因為我們的組織改革了\n我们可能这些所谓的特教生他们的适应体育的这个部分变成被边缘化了反而他们的权益被忽视了这个部分我们是不是也请教育部这边来回应一下对委员关心我们特殊教育这一个对象的学生在整个视讯体育事实上运动部\n有私信體育師我想這一個對銜接這一個我們這個特殊教育的學生我們在當然未來是一定是跨部會合作的那另外也跟我們報告對特殊教育的一個學生我們本來就有一個IEP的這樣的一個個別化的\n的一個教學計畫那個別化的教學計畫除了有特教老師有學科老師他還有特別為這一個學生所這一個個別化的一個教育的這個體育的這樣一個訓練但是因為現在我們知道這個適應體育它有分課程內\n跟課程外這兩塊的業務是被切割的喔那這兩塊的業務現在到底是由哪一個單位接手課程內的部分特教學生一定當然是教育部要優先但屬於教育專業私信這一個部分我們當然也跟運動部會合作但教育部對銜接這個接觸每一個特殊教育的學生我想我們則後旁待\n這個是12年以下也就是高中以下我們有體育班我們體育課那麼他們還是原班在就是在原班上課對於所謂的這個特教生來說但是如果到了大專院校的階段我們怎麼樣來給他們具體的課程跟教學的支持這個部分有考慮嗎因為到了大專以上喔\n因為剛剛講的其實都是我們的12年國教以下對不對那大專以上的怎麼辦跟委員說明我們的特教中層計畫裡面的這些措施運動部成立之後他會接手體育署原本在做的工作有具體的時程嗎有有有有他們委託了台師大有成立的這個適應體育的那個\n所以有具体的时程跟方式是的那事后可以提供给我们办公室吗因为其实我们最担心的就是我们的适应体育其实应该要放在非常重要的位置上不管我们的这个运动部当然运动部成立是一个好事是大家都很期待的这代表我们其实是很关心全民运动但是我们也担心就是所谓的这些特效生他们的一些权益被受损了那这个部分事后再提供给我们办公室可以吗\n沒問題好那第三個問題其實今天不要讓這個舒冰主席站那麼久我快速我一點點就好了那這個去年其實我們一直在我的辦公室一直在關心所謂特交助理員他們的薪資待遇那我想這個教育部也聽取了我們的意見\n那在這個特教教師助理員的部分我們可以來調整他們加薪的條件同時呢這個教育部也承諾可以回溯到這個113年的8月1號開始生效那這點其實我們非常的感恩也非常的開心教育部真的聽到了但是還是有特教助理員向我們來反映學生助理員已經獲得了全國統一的加薪\n但是教師助理員的待遇因為現在地方政府他們的財政狀況不一政策上也有差異所以沒有辦法一致就有這樣子的這個特交助理員他告訴我說雖然名為加薪但是我的時數被減了\n我的時數被減了我的工資相對來講被變相的減薪這個部分我們怎麼樣來建立讓他們整個所有的這些助理員他們的保障能夠跟全國一致這個部分我們有沒有解方\n我想這個我們當然希望說所有的這個教師助理員學生助理員的薪水能夠受到一定的一個保障那如果我們現在會後我們來收集各縣市在實際的情況怎麼樣然後我們來看怎麼樣來協助讓這些的助理員的一個薪資所以快速的盤點什麼時間點之前可以盤點結束然後由統一的一個月\n好好謝謝部長的回應好謝謝部長謝謝署長謝謝主席謝謝謝謝疫情委員的質詢那官員請回座\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:06.263 --> 00:11.686\n好謝謝主席有請教育部部長有請鄭部長委員好部長早安我今天就剛剛其實這個萬美玲委員她提到要跟這個國防部講一下那個水的問題那天其實在審特別預算的時候其實我人也在場但是呢這個所謂的常備用水\n\n00:34.440 --> 00:50.379\n軍備用的儲水跟一般的礦泉水看似都是水但是其實這個魔鬼藏在細節當中那我先呼應一下這個其實也不用跟國防部說因為國防部講的這個戰備的用水一瓶120元其實是普遍\n\n00:50.959 --> 01:12.416\n在军事专家眼中它的市价就是这么高为什么因为五年以上的保存水它的保存期限比较久瓶身加厚为了要降低透氧率生产的成本是比较高的同时这个水还经过三次的RO逆渗透瓶口在封盖之前还有臭氧杀菌整瓶水要无菌的状态\n\n01:13.257 --> 01:33.288\n所以這個是必須要在國防部在這次的特別預算當中有特別編列這樣子的預算這也是因應我們的國防的需求軍事戰備用水是的確需要的在這裡希望有解決這個萬美玲委員她的一些疑問好那部長\n\n01:34.148 --> 02:01.886\n我想這個校事會議您還記得嗎5月28號的時候其實我是委員會當中我是第一個提出來的委員那當初其實我們因為校事會議引起在學校端很多老師他們的寒蟬效應那親師的溝通出現了一些裂痕那這是我們當時提醒教育部要注意的那麼在8月7號的時候我在向教育部再次提及了五大的一個建議那我想這個五大的建議包含\n\n02:03.373 --> 02:28.868\n建立這個分級的一個處理提高校事會議的啟動的一個門檻再來第二點就是要保障老師知情跟答辯權再來第三要健全調查委員的選任跟培訓的制度這個是人才庫的部分再來第四就是我們要有第三方的公正公平的審議的單位再來第五點就是我們要如何建立這些曾經被校事會議調查過後\n\n02:30.649 --> 02:54.291\n但是其實也查無實證或者是最後其實以所謂的像法官一樣不提訴這樣子的老師他怎麼樣來恢復他的名譽在心理層面跟他的整個所有的法律的支持我們要怎麼樣來做實質上的一個幫助這些老師們我想我提出了這五大要點我們也很高興就是在9月16號的時候我們的鄭部長您也承諾了\n\n02:54.932 --> 03:18.425\n那在年底之前我們的消失會議有很大的改善的一個空間那調整的一個空間那同時您也說要刪除這個現行匿名檢舉單數的一個規定那我想這個部分來講其實對於消失會議來講我們是有往正向的方向去走但是我們其實最重要的就是希望能夠減少更多的衝突那麼減少爛訴\n\n03:20.206 --> 03:38.007\n我想初步的溝通我們也得到了一些正面的回應同時也符合教師們的期待這是我們最希望能夠看到的但是在大部分的細節的部分我想可能還不是那麼的清楚跟明瞭在這裡我想要再次的請教部長\n\n03:39.489 --> 04:04.208\n就是在事前我們剛剛有講要分流不要那麼急就把這被投訴的老師直接送到所謂的這個校事會議當中就是那個門檻要稍微提高但是在這個進入校事會議之前我們的行政務團親師的溝通那不管這個結果成功與否那後續應該怎麼處置有沒有一個所謂的一致性的SOP的一個處置的方式\n\n04:04.668 --> 04:25.475\n或者是還是依照各校他自己的一個方式處理但是如果這個結果比方說家長不夠滿意他甚至要再回頭重複的申訴這有可能也會造成所謂的行政耗損這樣子的一個狀況之下我們可不可以在這個部分也提出改善的方針\n\n04:26.115 --> 04:41.051\n那第二點我想問的就是當承辦人員他沒有受訓或承辦過所謂的重大情節的案件他影響到了所謂的這個調查的一個結果那這個部分我們有沒有追責的一個機制那第三點我想要問的就是\n\n04:42.116 --> 05:10.704\n目前最大的一個問題是沒有一個先篩選的制度任何的檢舉都可能會進到所謂的校事會議那基於學校本身他是當事人他又有可能成為所謂的調查的單位我們真的不免擔心球員兼裁判在整個所有的所謂的部長你可能會說會有所謂的複查的一個機制但是這個複查的機制如果還是有體系內的人在審\n\n05:11.744 --> 05:25.907\n那麼難免在有權力結構的校園當中那這個權力結構的環境裡頭副省的制度本身就缺乏被信任的空間這第三點我們怎麼樣來克服請教一下部長\n\n05:26.550 --> 05:46.817\n那謝謝委員的一個提醒確實委員當時的一個對校事會議的一個制度上的一些期待我們確實也在分區座談裡面委員對問題的掌握是非常的精準的所以我們大概整個陳委員所提我們怎麼樣去分流行政務談其實是溝通這些的\n\n05:47.637 --> 06:07.960\n我们在未来的新的办法我们会有一些包含例证的一些提示让第一线上的一些学校在整个在运作里边能够有一些实例的一些参考跟有一些依循的这我们都会来做包含刚才委员提到说当一个老师被误告然后到最后\n\n06:08.661 --> 06:29.039\n甚至我們講說法院或者校會判他這個不成立也結案了那對於老師所遭受的權益上的一些受損我們只會去回憶回復他這個我們大概都是朝這個方向因為自從有效式會議以來我們知道其實在所有的769件當中目前只有成案的只有3.38%是\n\n06:31.061 --> 06:56.039\n所以相對的來講就是這些其實教師會議都是成本喔都是費用喔所以我們這個部分包含老師我們就第一個要杜絕這個爛數第二個就是對老師遭受到不名譽的一個指控然後沒有成立的時候所造成的一些甚至在我們要讓他有回復名譽的機制啦我們都有一套的機制希望能夠回復到他原來的一個\n\n06:56.579 --> 07:21.918\n如果有家長對於這個調查的結果是不滿意的他如果要重複的這個再申請避免重複的申訴這個部分我們可以避免嗎因為我們如果沒有新的市政我們基本上就列入不受理也有這樣的一個機制出來好那我想呢就是不管是在行政務談那親事溝通我們要有一個一致性的SOP因為包含\n\n07:22.378 --> 07:45.043\n包含我們法院也有一些實際的一個判例對學生誣告老師法院也做成實際的這個裁判的一個動作我們希望累積有更多的一個案例讓學校在裡面對學生的宣導或者對家長或者學校裡面的運作有一些更多的一些彼此在一個民主法治的社會裡面有一個更適宜的一個\n\n07:45.763 --> 08:13.273\n我想其实我们都不希望造成学校行政人力或者是教师他们在教学在被调查的期间这一两个月当中他们可能一方面要准备教材二方面要应付所谓的校师会议这样子的调查造成他们其实身心俱疲那我想这影响到的还是学生们受教的一个权益我们还是让教学回归专业让学校能够变成更良善的一个我完全认同委员的一个\n\n08:13.553 --> 08:34.893\n好那么往这个方向走那我想校师会议有很多细腻的部分很多细节的部分我们可能再找时间再来好好地沟通跟讨论好那第二个我想呢就是在昨天其实我们也跟培育委员特别有开了一个座谈会那也就是相对的来讲我们非常关心所谓的特教生他们的一些权益的一些问题了\n\n08:35.433 --> 08:59.564\n那我想給特教生一個比較完整的運動學習的一個環境那教育部跟國教署其實近幾年來也都非常非常的重視也投入了相當的的心力那展現了我們的政府對所謂的生長生的這個權益的一個正式的一個問題但是隨著體育署升格為運動部那接著下來我們過去體育署所負責的不管是他的課程的設計\n\n09:01.005 --> 09:20.367\n師資的培育或者是特教生的支持現在有沒有明確承接的單位如果沒有明確承接的單位我們也很擔心在校園當中尤其是高中以下他們是有體育課的但是他們的權益到底是誰來接手會不會因為我們的組織改革了\n\n09:20.928 --> 09:39.570\n我们可能这些所谓的特教生他们的适应体育的这个部分变成被边缘化了反而他们的权益被忽视了这个部分我们是不是也请教育部这边来回应一下对委员关心我们特殊教育这一个对象的学生在整个视讯体育事实上运动部\n\n09:40.311 --> 09:57.912\n有私信體育師我想這一個對銜接這一個我們這個特殊教育的學生我們在當然未來是一定是跨部會合作的那另外也跟我們報告對特殊教育的一個學生我們本來就有一個IEP的這樣的一個個別化的\n\n09:58.700 --> 10:14.570\n的一個教學計畫那個別化的教學計畫除了有特教老師有學科老師他還有特別為這一個學生所這一個個別化的一個教育的這個體育的這樣一個訓練但是因為現在我們知道這個適應體育它有分課程內\n\n10:15.590 --> 10:38.340\n跟課程外這兩塊的業務是被切割的喔那這兩塊的業務現在到底是由哪一個單位接手課程內的部分特教學生一定當然是教育部要優先但屬於教育專業私信這一個部分我們當然也跟運動部會合作但教育部對銜接這個接觸每一個特殊教育的學生我想我們則後旁待\n\n10:38.900 --> 10:58.556\n這個是12年以下也就是高中以下我們有體育班我們體育課那麼他們還是原班在就是在原班上課對於所謂的這個特教生來說但是如果到了大專院校的階段我們怎麼樣來給他們具體的課程跟教學的支持這個部分有考慮嗎因為到了大專以上喔\n\n11:00.042 --> 11:19.727\n因為剛剛講的其實都是我們的12年國教以下對不對那大專以上的怎麼辦跟委員說明我們的特教中層計畫裡面的這些措施運動部成立之後他會接手體育署原本在做的工作有具體的時程嗎有有有有他們委託了台師大有成立的這個適應體育的那個\n\n11:22.228 --> 11:48.156\n所以有具体的时程跟方式是的那事后可以提供给我们办公室吗因为其实我们最担心的就是我们的适应体育其实应该要放在非常重要的位置上不管我们的这个运动部当然运动部成立是一个好事是大家都很期待的这代表我们其实是很关心全民运动但是我们也担心就是所谓的这些特效生他们的一些权益被受损了那这个部分事后再提供给我们办公室可以吗\n\n11:48.676 --> 12:05.608\n沒問題好那第三個問題其實今天不要讓這個舒冰主席站那麼久我快速我一點點就好了那這個去年其實我們一直在我的辦公室一直在關心所謂特交助理員他們的薪資待遇那我想這個教育部也聽取了我們的意見\n\n12:06.408 --> 12:29.182\n那在這個特教教師助理員的部分我們可以來調整他們加薪的條件同時呢這個教育部也承諾可以回溯到這個113年的8月1號開始生效那這點其實我們非常的感恩也非常的開心教育部真的聽到了但是還是有特教助理員向我們來反映學生助理員已經獲得了全國統一的加薪\n\n12:29.582 --> 12:46.461\n但是教師助理員的待遇因為現在地方政府他們的財政狀況不一政策上也有差異所以沒有辦法一致就有這樣子的這個特交助理員他告訴我說雖然名為加薪但是我的時數被減了\n\n12:48.243 --> 13:04.258\n我的時數被減了我的工資相對來講被變相的減薪這個部分我們怎麼樣來建立讓他們整個所有的這些助理員他們的保障能夠跟全國一致這個部分我們有沒有解方\n\n13:05.865 --> 13:33.490\n我想這個我們當然希望說所有的這個教師助理員學生助理員的薪水能夠受到一定的一個保障那如果我們現在會後我們來收集各縣市在實際的情況怎麼樣然後我們來看怎麼樣來協助讓這些的助理員的一個薪資所以快速的盤點什麼時間點之前可以盤點結束然後由統一的一個月\n\n13:35.410 --> 13:44.929\n好好謝謝部長的回應好謝謝部長謝謝署長謝謝主席謝謝謝謝疫情委員的質詢那官員請回座\n\n","segments":[{"start":6.263,"end":11.686,"text":"好 謝謝主席有請教育部部長有請鄭部長委員好部長早安 我今天就剛剛其實這個萬美玲委員她提到要跟這個國防部講一下那個水的問題那天其實在審特別預算的時候其實我人也在場但是呢這個所謂的常備用水"},{"start":34.44,"end":50.379,"text":"軍備用的儲水跟一般的礦泉水看似都是水但是其實這個魔鬼藏在細節當中那我先呼應一下這個其實也不用跟國防部說因為國防部講的這個戰備的用水一瓶120元其實是普遍"},{"start":50.959,"end":72.416,"text":"在军事专家眼中它的市价就是这么高为什么因为五年以上的保存水它的保存期限比较久瓶身加厚为了要降低透氧率生产的成本是比较高的同时这个水还经过三次的RO逆渗透瓶口在封盖之前还有臭氧杀菌整瓶水要无菌的状态"},{"start":73.257,"end":93.288,"text":"所以這個是必須要在國防部在這次的特別預算當中有特別編列這樣子的預算這也是因應我們的國防的需求軍事戰備用水是的確需要的在這裡希望有解決這個萬美玲委員她的一些疑問好那部長"},{"start":94.148,"end":121.886,"text":"我想這個校事會議您還記得嗎5月28號的時候其實我是委員會當中我是第一個提出來的委員那當初其實我們因為校事會議引起在學校端很多老師他們的寒蟬效應那親師的溝通出現了一些裂痕那這是我們當時提醒教育部要注意的那麼在8月7號的時候我在向教育部再次提及了五大的一個建議那我想這個五大的建議包含"},{"start":123.373,"end":148.868,"text":"建立這個分級的一個處理提高校事會議的啟動的一個門檻再來第二點就是要保障老師知情跟答辯權再來第三要健全調查委員的選任跟培訓的制度這個是人才庫的部分再來第四就是我們要有第三方的公正公平的審議的單位再來第五點就是我們要如何建立這些曾經被校事會議調查過後"},{"start":150.649,"end":174.291,"text":"但是其實也查無實證或者是最後其實以所謂的像法官一樣不提訴這樣子的老師他怎麼樣來恢復他的名譽在心理層面跟他的整個所有的法律的支持我們要怎麼樣來做實質上的一個幫助這些老師們我想我提出了這五大要點我們也很高興就是在9月16號的時候我們的鄭部長您也承諾了"},{"start":174.932,"end":198.425,"text":"那在年底之前我們的消失會議有很大的改善的一個空間那調整的一個空間那同時您也說要刪除這個現行匿名檢舉單數的一個規定那我想這個部分來講其實對於消失會議來講我們是有往正向的方向去走但是我們其實最重要的就是希望能夠減少更多的衝突那麼減少爛訴"},{"start":200.206,"end":218.007,"text":"我想初步的溝通我們也得到了一些正面的回應同時也符合教師們的期待這是我們最希望能夠看到的但是在大部分的細節的部分我想可能還不是那麼的清楚跟明瞭在這裡我想要再次的請教部長"},{"start":219.489,"end":244.208,"text":"就是在事前我們剛剛有講要分流不要那麼急就把這被投訴的老師直接送到所謂的這個校事會議當中就是那個門檻要稍微提高但是在這個進入校事會議之前我們的行政務團親師的溝通那不管這個結果成功與否那後續應該怎麼處置有沒有一個所謂的一致性的SOP的一個處置的方式"},{"start":244.668,"end":265.475,"text":"或者是還是依照各校他自己的一個方式處理但是如果這個結果比方說家長不夠滿意他甚至要再回頭重複的申訴這有可能也會造成所謂的行政耗損這樣子的一個狀況之下我們可不可以在這個部分也提出改善的方針"},{"start":266.115,"end":281.051,"text":"那第二點我想問的就是當承辦人員他沒有受訓或承辦過所謂的重大情節的案件他影響到了所謂的這個調查的一個結果那這個部分我們有沒有追責的一個機制那第三點我想要問的就是"},{"start":282.116,"end":310.704,"text":"目前最大的一個問題是沒有一個先篩選的制度任何的檢舉都可能會進到所謂的校事會議那基於學校本身他是當事人他又有可能成為所謂的調查的單位我們真的不免擔心球員兼裁判在整個所有的所謂的部長你可能會說會有所謂的複查的一個機制但是這個複查的機制如果還是有體系內的人在審"},{"start":311.744,"end":325.907,"text":"那麼難免在有權力結構的校園當中那這個權力結構的環境裡頭副省的制度本身就缺乏被信任的空間這第三點我們怎麼樣來克服請教一下部長"},{"start":326.55,"end":346.817,"text":"那謝謝委員的一個提醒確實委員當時的一個對校事會議的一個制度上的一些期待我們確實也在分區座談裡面委員對問題的掌握是非常的精準的所以我們大概整個陳委員所提我們怎麼樣去分流行政務談其實是溝通這些的"},{"start":347.637,"end":367.96,"text":"我们在未来的新的办法我们会有一些包含例证的一些提示让第一线上的一些学校在整个在运作里边能够有一些实例的一些参考跟有一些依循的这我们都会来做包含刚才委员提到说当一个老师被误告然后到最后"},{"start":368.661,"end":389.039,"text":"甚至我們講說法院或者校會判他這個不成立也結案了那對於老師所遭受的權益上的一些受損我們只會去回憶 回復他這個我們大概都是朝這個方向因為自從有效式會議以來我們知道其實在所有的769件當中目前只有成案的只有3.38%是"},{"start":391.061,"end":416.039,"text":"所以相對的來講就是這些其實教師會議都是成本喔都是費用喔所以我們這個部分包含老師我們就第一個要杜絕這個爛數第二個就是對老師遭受到不名譽的一個指控然後沒有成立的時候所造成的一些甚至在我們要讓他有回復名譽的機制啦我們都有一套的機制希望能夠回復到他原來的一個"},{"start":416.579,"end":441.918,"text":"如果有家長對於這個調查的結果是不滿意的他如果要重複的這個再申請避免重複的申訴這個部分我們可以避免嗎因為我們如果沒有新的市政我們基本上就列入不受理也有這樣的一個機制出來好那我想呢就是不管是在行政務談那親事溝通我們要有一個一致性的SOP因為包含"},{"start":442.378,"end":465.043,"text":"包含我們法院也有一些實際的一個判例對學生 誣告老師法院也做成實際的這個裁判的一個動作我們希望累積有更多的一個案例讓學校在裡面對學生的宣導或者對家長或者學校裡面的運作有一些更多的一些彼此在一個民主法治的社會裡面有一個更適宜的一個"},{"start":465.763,"end":493.273,"text":"我想其实我们都不希望造成学校行政人力或者是教师他们在教学在被调查的期间这一两个月当中他们可能一方面要准备教材二方面要应付所谓的校师会议这样子的调查造成他们其实身心俱疲那我想这影响到的还是学生们受教的一个权益我们还是让教学回归专业让学校能够变成更良善的一个我完全认同委员的一个"},{"start":493.553,"end":514.893,"text":"好 那么往这个方向走那我想校师会议有很多细腻的部分很多细节的部分我们可能再找时间再来好好地沟通跟讨论好 那第二个我想呢就是在昨天其实我们也跟培育委员特别有开了一个座谈会那也就是相对的来讲我们非常关心所谓的特教生他们的一些权益的一些问题了"},{"start":515.433,"end":539.564,"text":"那我想給特教生一個比較完整的運動學習的一個環境那教育部跟國教署其實近幾年來也都非常非常的重視也投入了相當的的心力那展現了我們的政府對所謂的生長生的這個權益的一個正式的一個問題但是隨著體育署升格為運動部那接著下來我們過去體育署所負責的不管是他的課程的設計"},{"start":541.005,"end":560.367,"text":"師資的培育或者是特教生的支持現在有沒有明確承接的單位如果沒有明確承接的單位我們也很擔心在校園當中尤其是高中以下他們是有體育課的但是他們的權益到底是誰來接手會不會因為我們的組織改革了"},{"start":560.928,"end":579.57,"text":"我们可能这些所谓的特教生他们的适应体育的这个部分变成被边缘化了反而他们的权益被忽视了这个部分我们是不是也请教育部这边来回应一下对委员关心我们特殊教育这一个对象的学生在整个视讯体育事实上运动部"},{"start":580.311,"end":597.912,"text":"有私信體育師我想這一個對銜接這一個我們這個特殊教育的學生我們在當然未來是一定是跨部會合作的那另外也跟我們報告對特殊教育的一個學生我們本來就有一個IEP的這樣的一個個別化的"},{"start":598.7,"end":614.57,"text":"的一個教學計畫那個別化的教學計畫除了有特教老師有學科老師他還有特別為這一個學生所這一個個別化的一個教育的這個體育的這樣一個訓練但是因為現在我們知道這個適應體育它有分課程內"},{"start":615.59,"end":638.34,"text":"跟課程外這兩塊的業務是被切割的喔那這兩塊的業務現在到底是由哪一個單位接手課程內的部分特教學生一定當然是教育部要優先但屬於教育專業私信這一個部分我們當然也跟運動部會合作但教育部對銜接這個接觸每一個特殊教育的學生我想我們則後旁待"},{"start":638.9,"end":658.556,"text":"這個是12年以下也就是高中以下我們有體育班我們體育課那麼他們還是原班在就是在原班上課對於所謂的這個特教生來說但是如果到了大專院校的階段我們怎麼樣來給他們具體的課程跟教學的支持這個部分有考慮嗎因為到了大專以上喔"},{"start":660.042,"end":679.727,"text":"因為剛剛講的其實都是我們的12年國教以下對不對那大專以上的怎麼辦跟委員說明我們的特教中層計畫裡面的這些措施運動部成立之後他會接手體育署原本在做的工作有具體的時程嗎有有有有他們委託了台師大有成立的這個適應體育的那個"},{"start":682.228,"end":708.156,"text":"所以有具体的时程跟方式是的那事后可以提供给我们办公室吗因为其实我们最担心的就是我们的适应体育其实应该要放在非常重要的位置上不管我们的这个运动部当然运动部成立是一个好事是大家都很期待的这代表我们其实是很关心全民运动但是我们也担心就是所谓的这些特效生他们的一些权益被受损了那这个部分事后再提供给我们办公室可以吗"},{"start":708.676,"end":725.608,"text":"沒問題好那第三個問題其實今天不要讓這個舒冰主席站那麼久我快速我一點點就好了那這個去年其實我們一直在我的辦公室一直在關心所謂特交助理員他們的薪資待遇那我想這個教育部也聽取了我們的意見"},{"start":726.408,"end":749.182,"text":"那在這個特教教師助理員的部分我們可以來調整他們加薪的條件同時呢這個教育部也承諾可以回溯到這個113年的8月1號開始生效那這點其實我們非常的感恩也非常的開心教育部真的聽到了但是還是有特教助理員向我們來反映學生助理員已經獲得了全國統一的加薪"},{"start":749.582,"end":766.461,"text":"但是教師助理員的待遇因為現在地方政府他們的財政狀況不一政策上也有差異所以沒有辦法一致就有這樣子的這個特交助理員他告訴我說雖然名為加薪但是我的時數被減了"},{"start":768.243,"end":784.258,"text":"我的時數被減了我的工資相對來講被變相的減薪這個部分我們怎麼樣來建立讓他們整個所有的這些助理員他們的保障能夠跟全國一致這個部分我們有沒有解方"},{"start":785.865,"end":813.49,"text":"我想這個我們當然希望說所有的這個教師助理員學生助理員的薪水能夠受到一定的一個保障那如果我們現在會後我們來收集各縣市在實際的情況怎麼樣然後我們來看怎麼樣來協助讓這些的助理員的一個薪資所以快速的盤點什麼時間點之前可以盤點結束然後由統一的一個月"},{"start":815.41,"end":824.929,"text":"好好謝謝部長的回應好謝謝部長謝謝署長謝謝主席謝謝謝謝疫情委員的質詢那官員請回座"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":631,"blocks":[["郭委員昱晴：（11時29分）謝謝主席，有請教育部部長。"],["主席：有請鄭部長。"],["鄭部長英耀：委員好。"],["郭委員昱晴：部長，早安！我今天要就剛剛萬美玲委員提到，他要跟國防部講一下的那個水的問題，其實那天在審特別預算的時候我人也在場，所謂的常備用水、軍備用的儲水，它跟一般的礦泉水看似都是水，但是魔鬼藏在細節裡。我先呼應一下，其實這個也不用跟國防部說，因為國防部講的這個戰備用水一瓶120元，其實這個普遍在軍事專家的眼中，它的市價就是這麼高，為什麼？因為5年以上的保存水，它的保存期限比較久，瓶身加厚，為了降低透氧率，生產的成本比較高。同時，這個水還經過3次的RO逆滲透，瓶口在封蓋之前還有臭氧殺菌，整瓶水都要是無菌的狀態，所以這個預算必須要在國防部這一次的特別預算中特別編列，這也是因應我們的國防需求，軍事戰備用水的確是需要的，我在這裡希望有解決萬美玲委員的疑問。"],["鄭部長英耀：謝謝委員的指導。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，部長，你還記得校事會議嗎？其實5月28日的時候，我是委員會中第一個提出來的委員，當初校事會議在學校端引起很多老師的寒蟬效應，親師間的溝通出現了一些裂痕，這是我們當時提醒教育部要注意的。8月7日我再次向教育部提及五大建議，我想，這五大建議包含，第一點：建立分級處理，提高校事會議啟動的門檻。第二點：要保障老師知情跟答辯權。第三點：要建全調查委員的選任跟培訓制度，甚至是人才庫的部分。第四點：我們要有第三方公正、公平的審議單位。第五點：我們要如何建立這些曾經被校事會議調查過後，但是也查無實證，就像法官判決不起訴一樣，像這樣的老師要怎麼樣回復他的名譽？在他的心裡層面跟所有的法律支持，我們要怎麼樣實質的幫助這些老師們？對於我所提出的這五大要點，我們也很高興在9月16日的時候，鄭部長也承諾了，年底之前我們的校事會議會有很大的改善空間和調整的空間。","同時，你也說要刪除現行匿名檢舉但書的規定，我想就這個部分來講、就校事會議來講，我們是有往正向的方向去走。但是最重要的，我們希望能夠減少更多的衝突和濫訴。我想這個初步的溝通我們也得到了一些正面的回應，同時也符合教師們的期待，這是我們最希望能夠看到的。但是細節的部分，我想可能還不是那麼的清楚跟明瞭，所以我在這裡要再次的請教部長，我們剛剛有講事前要分流，就是不要那麼的急，把被投訴的老師直接送到所謂的校事會議中，就是那個門檻要稍微提高，但是在進入校事會議之前，我們的行政晤談、親師溝通，不管這個結果成功與否，後續應該怎麼處置，有沒有一個一致性的SOP處置方式，或者還是依照各校自己的方式去處理？但是如果這個結果，比方說：家長不夠滿意，他甚至要再回頭重覆一直申訴，這有可能也會造成行政耗損，在這樣的狀況下，我們可不可以針對這個部分也提出改善的方針？","第二點我想要問的就是，當承辦人未經受訓或是沒有承辦過所謂的重大情節案件時，他會影響到所謂的調查結果，這個部分我們有沒有追責的機制？","第三點我想要問的就是，目前最大的問題是沒有一個先篩選的制度，任何的檢舉都有可能會進到校事會議。基於學校本身就是當事人，它又有可能會成為所謂的調查單位，我們真的不免擔心球員兼裁判。部長，你可能會說會有複查機制，但是這個複查機制如果還是由體系內的人在審，那麼難免在這個有權力結構的校園中，在這個權力結構的環境裡頭，複審的制度本身就缺乏被信任的空間，這個第三點我們要怎麼樣來克服？請教一下部長。"],["鄭部長英耀：謝謝委員的提醒，委員當時對校事會議制度上的期待，我們確實也在分區座談裡面……委員對問題的掌握非常精準，誠如委員所提的，我們要怎麼樣去分流、行政晤談、親師溝通？未來新的辦法會包含例證的提示，讓第一線的學校在運作上能夠有一些實例的參考跟依循，這個我們都會來做。包含委員剛才提到的，當一個老師被誣告，然後到最後，就像我們講的法院或是校事會議判他不成立，也結案了，那對於老師權益上所遭受的損害，我們要怎麼樣去回應和回復？我們會朝這個方向。"],["郭委員昱晴：因為自從有校事會議以來，我們都知道，其實在這769件中，目前成案的只有3.38%。"],["鄭部長英耀：是。"],["郭委員昱晴：所以相對來講，其實校事會議都是有成本和費用的哦。"],["鄭部長英耀：所以這個部分，包含老師，第一個，我們要杜絕濫訴。第二個，對於老師遭受到不名譽的指控，然後沒有成立時所造成的一些損失，甚至在薪水……"],["郭委員昱晴：我們要讓他們有回復名譽的機制。"],["鄭部長英耀：這個我們都有一套機制，我們希望能夠回復他原來、既有的權益。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，如果有家長對這個調查結果不滿意，他要重覆的申訴，我們要如何避免他重覆申訴？這個時候我們可以避免嗎？"],["鄭部長英耀：如果沒有新的事證，基本上，我們就會列為不受理，我們會有這樣的機制。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，我想不管是行政晤談、親師溝通，我們要有一個一致性的SOP，因為……"],["鄭部長英耀：包含法院也有一些實際的判例，對於學生誣告老師，法院也有作成實際的裁罰動作。我們希望能夠累積更多的案例，讓學校在對學生的宣導或是對家長、或是校園裡的運作，希望彼此可以在民主法治的社會裡面，學校可以有一個更適宜的……"],["郭委員昱晴：好，其實我們都不希望造成學校行政人力或是教師在教學及在被調查的期間，在這一、二個月中，他們可能一方面要準備教材，二方面要應付校事會議這樣子的調查，這會造成他們身心俱疲，我想這影響到的還是孩子們的受教權益。我們還是讓教學回歸專業，讓學校能夠變成更良善的親師……"],["鄭部長英耀：我完全認同委員的觀點。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，那麼就往這個方向走，我想校事會議還有很多細膩的部分、細節的部分，我們可能再找時間好好的溝通跟討論。"],["鄭部長英耀：謝謝委員。"],["郭委員昱晴：第二個，其實昨天我們也跟培瑜委員特別召開座談會，也就是相對來講，我們非常關心特教生的權益問題，我想給特教生一個比較完整的運動學習環境。其實教育部跟國教署近幾年來也都非常非常的重視，也投入了相當多的心力，展現我們政府正視身障生的權益問題，但是隨著體育署升格為運動部，接下來，過去體育署所負責的，不管是課程的設計、師資的培育，或者是特教生的支持，現在有沒有明確的承接單位？如果沒有明確的承接單位，我們也很擔心在校園當中，尤其是高中以下，因為他們是有體育課的，但是他們的權益到底是誰來接手？會不會因為我們的組織改革了，這些特教生適應體育的這個部分就被邊緣化了，他們的權益反而被忽視了？這個部分是不是也請教育部這邊回應一下？"],["鄭部長英耀：感謝委員關心特殊教育的學生，在整個適應體育上，運動部有適應體育司，我想這個對於銜接特殊教育的學生，當然，未來這個一定是跨部會合作。另外也跟委員報告，對於特殊教育的學生，我們本來就有一個IEP、個別化的教學計畫。個別化的教學計畫除了有特教老師、學科老師，它還有特別的為這個學生設計的個別化體育訓練課程。"],["郭委員昱晴：但是我們現在都知道，這個適應體育有分課程內跟課程外，這兩塊的業務是被切割的哦！現在這兩塊的業務到底是由哪一個單位來接手課程內的部分？"],["鄭部長英耀：基本上，在IEP裡面，這個特教學生當然是教育部要優先，但是屬於教育專業、適性的這個部分，我們當然也會跟運動部合作。教育部對於銜接、接住每一個特殊教育的學生，我想我們責無旁貸。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，這個是12年以下，也就是高中以下有體育課，他們還是在原班上課，對於所謂的特教生來說……"],["鄭部長英耀：我們會針對每一個學生做不同的……"],["郭委員昱晴：但是到了大專院校的階段，我們要怎麼樣給他們具體的課程跟教學的支持，這個部分有考慮嗎？因為到了大專以上哦！因為剛剛講的都是12年國教以下，對不對？那大專以上的怎麼辦？"],["吳司長林輝：跟委員說明，特教中長程計畫裡面的這些措施，運動部成立之後，它會接手體育署原本就在做的工作。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，有具體的時程嗎？"],["吳司長林輝：有、有，他們有委託臺師大成立適應體育的……"],["郭委員昱晴：所以有具體的時程跟方式？"],["吳司長林輝：是的。"],["郭委員昱晴：那事後可以提供給我的辦公室嗎？"],["吳司長林輝：好，沒問題。"],["郭委員昱晴：其實我們最擔心的就是，我們的適應體育其實應該是要放在非常重要的位置上。"],["吳司長林輝：是。"],["郭委員昱晴：不管是我們的運動部，當然，運動部成立是一件好事，是大家都很期待的，這也代表我們都很關心全民運動，但是我們也擔心這些所謂的特教生的權益受損了。這個部分事後再提供給我的辦公室，可以嗎？"],["吳司長林輝：好，沒問題。"],["郭委員昱晴：第三個問題……今天不要讓書彬主席站那麼久，我快速，再給我一點點時間就好了。其實去年我的辦公室就有一直在關心特教助理員的薪資待遇，我想教育部也聽取了我們的意見，在特教助理員的部分，我們可以來調整他們的加薪條件，同時，教育部也承諾可以回溯到113年8月1日開始生效，這點我們非常的感恩，也非常的開心教育部真的聽到了。但是還是有特教助理員向我們反映，學生助理員已經獲得了全國統一的加薪，但是教師助理員的待遇因為現在地方政府的財政狀況不一，政策上也有所差異，所以沒有辦法一致。就有特教助理員告訴我說，雖然名為加薪，但是他的時數被減了，他的工資相對來講被變相減薪。這個部分我們要怎麼樣來建立，讓所有助理員的保障能夠全國一致？這個部分我們有沒有解方？"],["鄭部長英耀：我們當然希望所有的教師助理員、學生助理員的薪水能夠受到一定的保障，會後我們會來蒐集各縣市的實際情況，我們再看要怎麼樣來協助，讓這些助理員的薪資能夠一致。"],["郭委員昱晴：所以快速的盤點，什麼時間點之前可以盤點結束，然後有統一的……"],["鄭部長英耀：1個月內我們跟委員報告。"],["郭委員昱晴：1個月內，好，謝謝部長的回應。謝謝部長、謝謝署長、謝謝主席。"],["鄭部長英耀：謝謝委員指正。"],["郭委員昱晴：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝昱晴委員的質詢。官員請回座。","現在請謝龍介委員進行質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":252,"meet_id":"委員會-11-4-22-3","speakers":["劉書彬","柯志恩","吳沛憶","范雲","林沛祥","葛如鈞","葉元之","羅廷瑋","萬美玲","郭昱晴","謝龍介","陳秀寳","陳瑩","林宜瑾","賴惠員","徐欣瑩","陳培瑜","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","徐富癸","邱志偉","楊瓊瓔","張雅琳","林月琴","洪孟楷","林德福","高金素梅","翁曉玲"],"page_start":175,"meetingDate":["2025-10-15"],"gazette_id":"1148302","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1148302_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期教育及文化委員會第3次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請教育部部長鄭英耀列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1148302_00005"}}}