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\"end\": 336.706, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"何\", \"start\": 336.706, \"end\": 336.966, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"新\", \"start\": 336.966, \"end\": 337.247, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"淳\", \"start\": 337.247, \"end\": 337.407, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 337.407, \"end\": 337.848, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 337.848, \"end\": 337.968, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 337.968, \"end\": 338.689, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"場\"}, {\"word\": \"下\", \"start\": 338.689, \"end\": 338.869, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 338.869, \"end\": 338.95, \"score\": 0.98}, {\"word\": \"位\", \"start\": 338.95, \"end\": 339.53, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"邱\", \"start\": 339.53, \"end\": 339.971, \"score\": 0.961}, {\"word\": \"志\", \"start\": 339.971, \"end\": 340.292, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"維\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 340.292, \"end\": 341.794, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"邱\", \"start\": 341.794, \"end\": 342.195, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"志\", \"start\": 342.195, \"end\": 342.415, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"維\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 342.415, \"end\": 342.435, \"score\": 0.04}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,329 --> 00:00:26,828\n政院版的修法什麼時候會提出來跟委員報告我們目前下個禮拜二財政部會再邀請地方政府來開會那我們會希望在年底以前就可以把政院版提給你希望是年底以前把政院版提出來對對對我們禮拜二會再請地方政府來開會那9月13號院長也邀請了22縣市長在行政院那縣市首長們也都有提相關的意見我們就把它匯集\n\n2\n00:00:27,670 --> 00:00:34,167\n因为我也知道说你有找地方政府来开会但目前的状况是财政部好像现在已经有一个公示了对不对\n\n3\n00:00:35,953 --> 00:00:58,600\n這部分我們跟地方政府一直都在討論包括指標等等我知道說你現在有跟地方政府有提公示出來但是我希望說你提公示的同時也可以把試算的數字一併提出來因為目前大家好像地方政府只有看到公示指標的調整並沒有看到數字其實對地方政府來說他也很難做評估\n\n4\n00:00:59,460 --> 00:01:19,643\n所以我覺得政院在跟地方討論的時候至少資訊公開透明讓大家詳細了解大家比較能夠做出對自己縣市比較有利的判斷我覺得這件事情要有善意啦好不好可以在下一次開會的時候把你們所訂出來的公示的數字一併提給地方政府嗎可以嗎\n\n5\n00:01:20,576 --> 00:01:44,057\n我們下次討論的時候第一個指標之前討論過下次可能會遇到權重那權重要確認才能算得出來因為你只有指標沒有數字人家也很難討論所以你一併要把試算出來的數字提供給地方政府來討論第一件事情第二個是我聽說你現在很多指標跟我們立法院通過的版本有很大的落差\n\n6\n00:01:44,878 --> 00:01:47,700\n好比如說像人口部分現在是從45調降到30是不是\n\n7\n00:01:52,009 --> 00:02:20,231\n報告第一個在權重的部分我們之前也提過因為人口跟營利事業的營業額它兩者是正相關的因為那個佔了75%的比例相當高所以這一次可以看到工商發達的縣市它所獲配的金額比較高這是我們要提到那第二個部分我們這一次的調整在人口的部分會更細緻的劃分人口現在因為我們只有我在這邊沒有辦法給你詳細討論你就回答我問題就好你現在人口是降到多少\n\n8\n00:02:20,971 --> 00:02:36,577\n人口降到多少目前我們可能還是在禮拜二會跟我聽說是30是不是你都開兩次會了你還講不出來上一次開會沒有談到權重的比例只是說人口要更細緻的話你這邊已經有公視了嘛人口是不是降到30%\n\n9\n00:02:38,520 --> 00:03:06,884\n然後土地是不是拉到30%我們會再跟地方政府再確認不是這個是你提出來的公式我說你提出來的公式嘛你自己台政部連自己提出來公式權重多少都不知道我知道您講的是我們提出去的會議資料所以你有提出公式要地方政府來討論嘛那你如果資訊不公開人家也不知道怎麼討論嘛沒有啊我們在會議資料有附啊沒有不公開你現在人口是要強到30是不是是不是啊\n\n10\n00:03:08,134 --> 00:03:10,272\n因為我也沒有記那麼清楚\n\n11\n00:03:11,889 --> 00:03:39,532\n我們會後是不是提供我們會議資料也有付沒關係部長我請你把所有的詳細資料包括我剛剛講的試算書提供給地方政府因為我們要來看一下到底對各件事是有利還是算出來狀況是怎麼樣然後還有一個就是部長你有提到說你們修法版本裡面你認為營業稅的權重太高這是指水平分配還是垂直分配\n\n12\n00:03:40,448 --> 00:03:48,155\n我們是在講盈利事業營業額它的權重它佔了應該是百分之三十是水平分配的部分所以營業額的權重這塊也會做調整\n\n13\n00:03:53,376 --> 00:04:15,331\n因為我希望說加快你們政院版本提出來的速度那如果這樣以現在的做法的話我覺得大家會吵很久啦好不好盡快完整數字提供給地方政府大家來討論那我有看到院長講說什麼政院版出來之後會先去跟民進黨黨團討論\n\n14\n00:04:18,124 --> 00:04:37,962\n我也是覺得非常奇怪啦行政院不是版本應該應該要跟大家討論嘛為什麼是跟民進黨黨團討論什麼時候民進黨黨團變成行政院的什麼時候我就覺得超奇怪的然後剩一點時間問一下您今天早上有提到說普發現金最快是11月上旬就可以發是不是\n\n15\n00:04:38,864 --> 00:05:06,455\n是的那為什麼上次我問卓鴻泰院長的時候他說最快是11月中你們後來是有發現民意的壓力是不是不是終於覺得要快了是不是不是那為什麼第一時間都是在講要很久現在才發現說要快一點不是我跟委員說明因為第一個很確定的是明天欸不對明天嘛明天會三讀通過那我相信立法是確定會三讀通過嘛那這個是確定的我們才能往下推時間那接下來就是會很快的送給總統\n\n16\n00:05:07,495 --> 00:05:22,930\n來公告那我們這個部分就會當天公告當天就會來開記者會議我上次問左院長也是講說以明天三讀通過當作一個前提到底什麼時候會發他說最快是11月中部長你說11月上旬所以你的速度比院長講的還快你不要接地氣我們加快腳步來做準備謝謝謝謝葉委員\n\n17\n00:05:31,698 --> 00:05:42,435\n接下來我們請何新淳委員何新淳委員何新淳委員不在場下一位邱志維委員邱志維委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n329\t26828\t政院版的修法什麼時候會提出來跟委員報告我們目前下個禮拜二財政部會再邀請地方政府來開會那我們會希望在年底以前就可以把政院版提給你希望是年底以前把政院版提出來對對對我們禮拜二會再請地方政府來開會那9月13號院長也邀請了22縣市長在行政院那縣市首長們也都有提相關的意見我們就把它匯集\n27670\t34167\t因为我也知道说你有找地方政府来开会但目前的状况是财政部好像现在已经有一个公示了对不对\n35953\t58600\t這部分我們跟地方政府一直都在討論包括指標等等我知道說你現在有跟地方政府有提公示出來但是我希望說你提公示的同時也可以把試算的數字一併提出來因為目前大家好像地方政府只有看到公示指標的調整並沒有看到數字其實對地方政府來說他也很難做評估\n59460\t79643\t所以我覺得政院在跟地方討論的時候至少資訊公開透明讓大家詳細了解大家比較能夠做出對自己縣市比較有利的判斷我覺得這件事情要有善意啦好不好可以在下一次開會的時候把你們所訂出來的公示的數字一併提給地方政府嗎可以嗎\n80576\t104057\t我們下次討論的時候第一個指標之前討論過下次可能會遇到權重那權重要確認才能算得出來因為你只有指標沒有數字人家也很難討論所以你一併要把試算出來的數字提供給地方政府來討論第一件事情第二個是我聽說你現在很多指標跟我們立法院通過的版本有很大的落差\n104878\t107700\t好比如說像人口部分現在是從45調降到30是不是\n112009\t140231\t報告第一個在權重的部分我們之前也提過因為人口跟營利事業的營業額它兩者是正相關的因為那個佔了75%的比例相當高所以這一次可以看到工商發達的縣市它所獲配的金額比較高這是我們要提到那第二個部分我們這一次的調整在人口的部分會更細緻的劃分人口現在因為我們只有我在這邊沒有辦法給你詳細討論你就回答我問題就好你現在人口是降到多少\n140971\t156577\t人口降到多少目前我們可能還是在禮拜二會跟我聽說是30是不是你都開兩次會了你還講不出來上一次開會沒有談到權重的比例只是說人口要更細緻的話你這邊已經有公視了嘛人口是不是降到30%\n158520\t186884\t然後土地是不是拉到30%我們會再跟地方政府再確認不是 這個是你提出來的公式我說你提出來的公式嘛你自己台政部連自己提出來公式權重多少都不知道我知道您講的是我們提出去的會議資料所以你有提出公式要地方政府來討論嘛那你如果資訊不公開人家也不知道怎麼討論嘛沒有啊 我們在會議資料有附啊沒有不公開你現在人口是要強到30是不是是不是啊\n188134\t190272\t因為我也沒有記那麼清楚\n191889\t219532\t我們會後是不是提供我們會議資料也有付沒關係部長我請你把所有的詳細資料包括我剛剛講的試算書提供給地方政府因為我們要來看一下到底對各件事是有利還是算出來狀況是怎麼樣然後還有一個就是部長你有提到說你們修法版本裡面你認為營業稅的權重太高這是指水平分配還是垂直分配\n220448\t228155\t我們是在講盈利事業營業額它的權重它佔了應該是百分之三十是水平分配的部分所以營業額的權重這塊也會做調整\n233376\t255331\t因為我希望說加快你們政院版本提出來的速度那如果這樣以現在的做法的話我覺得大家會吵很久啦好不好盡快完整數字提供給地方政府大家來討論那我有看到院長講說什麼政院版出來之後會先去跟民進黨黨團討論\n258124\t277962\t我也是覺得非常奇怪啦行政院不是版本應該應該要跟大家討論嘛為什麼是跟民進黨黨團討論什麼時候民進黨黨團變成行政院的什麼時候我就覺得超奇怪的然後剩一點時間問一下您今天早上有提到說普發現金最快是11月上旬就可以發是不是\n278864\t306455\t是的那為什麼上次我問卓鴻泰院長的時候他說最快是11月中你們後來是有發現民意的壓力是不是不是終於覺得要快了是不是不是那為什麼第一時間都是在講要很久現在才發現說要快一點不是 我跟委員說明因為第一個很確定的是明天欸 不對明天嘛 明天會三讀通過那我相信立法是確定會三讀通過嘛那這個是確定的我們才能往下推時間那接下來就是會很快的送給總統\n307495\t322930\t來公告那我們這個部分就會當天公告當天就會來開記者會議我上次問左院長也是講說以明天三讀通過當作一個前提到底什麼時候會發他說最快是11月中部長你說11月上旬所以你的速度比院長講的還快你不要接地氣我們加快腳步來做準備謝謝謝謝葉委員\n331698\t342435\t接下來我們請何新淳委員何新淳委員何新淳委員不在場下一位邱志維委員邱志維委員\n","txt":"政院版的修法什麼時候會提出來跟委員報告我們目前下個禮拜二財政部會再邀請地方政府來開會那我們會希望在年底以前就可以把政院版提給你希望是年底以前把政院版提出來對對對我們禮拜二會再請地方政府來開會那9月13號院長也邀請了22縣市長在行政院那縣市首長們也都有提相關的意見我們就把它匯集\n因为我也知道说你有找地方政府来开会但目前的状况是财政部好像现在已经有一个公示了对不对\n這部分我們跟地方政府一直都在討論包括指標等等我知道說你現在有跟地方政府有提公示出來但是我希望說你提公示的同時也可以把試算的數字一併提出來因為目前大家好像地方政府只有看到公示指標的調整並沒有看到數字其實對地方政府來說他也很難做評估\n所以我覺得政院在跟地方討論的時候至少資訊公開透明讓大家詳細了解大家比較能夠做出對自己縣市比較有利的判斷我覺得這件事情要有善意啦好不好可以在下一次開會的時候把你們所訂出來的公示的數字一併提給地方政府嗎可以嗎\n我們下次討論的時候第一個指標之前討論過下次可能會遇到權重那權重要確認才能算得出來因為你只有指標沒有數字人家也很難討論所以你一併要把試算出來的數字提供給地方政府來討論第一件事情第二個是我聽說你現在很多指標跟我們立法院通過的版本有很大的落差\n好比如說像人口部分現在是從45調降到30是不是\n報告第一個在權重的部分我們之前也提過因為人口跟營利事業的營業額它兩者是正相關的因為那個佔了75%的比例相當高所以這一次可以看到工商發達的縣市它所獲配的金額比較高這是我們要提到那第二個部分我們這一次的調整在人口的部分會更細緻的劃分人口現在因為我們只有我在這邊沒有辦法給你詳細討論你就回答我問題就好你現在人口是降到多少\n人口降到多少目前我們可能還是在禮拜二會跟我聽說是30是不是你都開兩次會了你還講不出來上一次開會沒有談到權重的比例只是說人口要更細緻的話你這邊已經有公視了嘛人口是不是降到30%\n然後土地是不是拉到30%我們會再跟地方政府再確認不是 這個是你提出來的公式我說你提出來的公式嘛你自己台政部連自己提出來公式權重多少都不知道我知道您講的是我們提出去的會議資料所以你有提出公式要地方政府來討論嘛那你如果資訊不公開人家也不知道怎麼討論嘛沒有啊 我們在會議資料有附啊沒有不公開你現在人口是要強到30是不是是不是啊\n因為我也沒有記那麼清楚\n我們會後是不是提供我們會議資料也有付沒關係部長我請你把所有的詳細資料包括我剛剛講的試算書提供給地方政府因為我們要來看一下到底對各件事是有利還是算出來狀況是怎麼樣然後還有一個就是部長你有提到說你們修法版本裡面你認為營業稅的權重太高這是指水平分配還是垂直分配\n我們是在講盈利事業營業額它的權重它佔了應該是百分之三十是水平分配的部分所以營業額的權重這塊也會做調整\n因為我希望說加快你們政院版本提出來的速度那如果這樣以現在的做法的話我覺得大家會吵很久啦好不好盡快完整數字提供給地方政府大家來討論那我有看到院長講說什麼政院版出來之後會先去跟民進黨黨團討論\n我也是覺得非常奇怪啦行政院不是版本應該應該要跟大家討論嘛為什麼是跟民進黨黨團討論什麼時候民進黨黨團變成行政院的什麼時候我就覺得超奇怪的然後剩一點時間問一下您今天早上有提到說普發現金最快是11月上旬就可以發是不是\n是的那為什麼上次我問卓鴻泰院長的時候他說最快是11月中你們後來是有發現民意的壓力是不是不是終於覺得要快了是不是不是那為什麼第一時間都是在講要很久現在才發現說要快一點不是 我跟委員說明因為第一個很確定的是明天欸 不對明天嘛 明天會三讀通過那我相信立法是確定會三讀通過嘛那這個是確定的我們才能往下推時間那接下來就是會很快的送給總統\n來公告那我們這個部分就會當天公告當天就會來開記者會議我上次問左院長也是講說以明天三讀通過當作一個前提到底什麼時候會發他說最快是11月中部長你說11月上旬所以你的速度比院長講的還快你不要接地氣我們加快腳步來做準備謝謝謝謝葉委員\n接下來我們請何新淳委員何新淳委員何新淳委員不在場下一位邱志維委員邱志維委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.329 --> 00:26.828\n政院版的修法什麼時候會提出來跟委員報告我們目前下個禮拜二財政部會再邀請地方政府來開會那我們會希望在年底以前就可以把政院版提給你希望是年底以前把政院版提出來對對對我們禮拜二會再請地方政府來開會那9月13號院長也邀請了22縣市長在行政院那縣市首長們也都有提相關的意見我們就把它匯集\n\n00:27.670 --> 00:34.167\n因为我也知道说你有找地方政府来开会但目前的状况是财政部好像现在已经有一个公示了对不对\n\n00:35.953 --> 00:58.600\n這部分我們跟地方政府一直都在討論包括指標等等我知道說你現在有跟地方政府有提公示出來但是我希望說你提公示的同時也可以把試算的數字一併提出來因為目前大家好像地方政府只有看到公示指標的調整並沒有看到數字其實對地方政府來說他也很難做評估\n\n00:59.460 --> 01:19.643\n所以我覺得政院在跟地方討論的時候至少資訊公開透明讓大家詳細了解大家比較能夠做出對自己縣市比較有利的判斷我覺得這件事情要有善意啦好不好可以在下一次開會的時候把你們所訂出來的公示的數字一併提給地方政府嗎可以嗎\n\n01:20.576 --> 01:44.057\n我們下次討論的時候第一個指標之前討論過下次可能會遇到權重那權重要確認才能算得出來因為你只有指標沒有數字人家也很難討論所以你一併要把試算出來的數字提供給地方政府來討論第一件事情第二個是我聽說你現在很多指標跟我們立法院通過的版本有很大的落差\n\n01:44.878 --> 01:47.700\n好比如說像人口部分現在是從45調降到30是不是\n\n01:52.009 --> 02:20.231\n報告第一個在權重的部分我們之前也提過因為人口跟營利事業的營業額它兩者是正相關的因為那個佔了75%的比例相當高所以這一次可以看到工商發達的縣市它所獲配的金額比較高這是我們要提到那第二個部分我們這一次的調整在人口的部分會更細緻的劃分人口現在因為我們只有我在這邊沒有辦法給你詳細討論你就回答我問題就好你現在人口是降到多少\n\n02:20.971 --> 02:36.577\n人口降到多少目前我們可能還是在禮拜二會跟我聽說是30是不是你都開兩次會了你還講不出來上一次開會沒有談到權重的比例只是說人口要更細緻的話你這邊已經有公視了嘛人口是不是降到30%\n\n02:38.520 --> 03:06.884\n然後土地是不是拉到30%我們會再跟地方政府再確認不是這個是你提出來的公式我說你提出來的公式嘛你自己台政部連自己提出來公式權重多少都不知道我知道您講的是我們提出去的會議資料所以你有提出公式要地方政府來討論嘛那你如果資訊不公開人家也不知道怎麼討論嘛沒有啊我們在會議資料有附啊沒有不公開你現在人口是要強到30是不是是不是啊\n\n03:08.134 --> 03:10.272\n因為我也沒有記那麼清楚\n\n03:11.889 --> 03:39.532\n我們會後是不是提供我們會議資料也有付沒關係部長我請你把所有的詳細資料包括我剛剛講的試算書提供給地方政府因為我們要來看一下到底對各件事是有利還是算出來狀況是怎麼樣然後還有一個就是部長你有提到說你們修法版本裡面你認為營業稅的權重太高這是指水平分配還是垂直分配\n\n03:40.448 --> 03:48.155\n我們是在講盈利事業營業額它的權重它佔了應該是百分之三十是水平分配的部分所以營業額的權重這塊也會做調整\n\n03:53.376 --> 04:15.331\n因為我希望說加快你們政院版本提出來的速度那如果這樣以現在的做法的話我覺得大家會吵很久啦好不好盡快完整數字提供給地方政府大家來討論那我有看到院長講說什麼政院版出來之後會先去跟民進黨黨團討論\n\n04:18.124 --> 04:37.962\n我也是覺得非常奇怪啦行政院不是版本應該應該要跟大家討論嘛為什麼是跟民進黨黨團討論什麼時候民進黨黨團變成行政院的什麼時候我就覺得超奇怪的然後剩一點時間問一下您今天早上有提到說普發現金最快是11月上旬就可以發是不是\n\n04:38.864 --> 05:06.455\n是的那為什麼上次我問卓鴻泰院長的時候他說最快是11月中你們後來是有發現民意的壓力是不是不是終於覺得要快了是不是不是那為什麼第一時間都是在講要很久現在才發現說要快一點不是我跟委員說明因為第一個很確定的是明天欸不對明天嘛明天會三讀通過那我相信立法是確定會三讀通過嘛那這個是確定的我們才能往下推時間那接下來就是會很快的送給總統\n\n05:07.495 --> 05:22.930\n來公告那我們這個部分就會當天公告當天就會來開記者會議我上次問左院長也是講說以明天三讀通過當作一個前提到底什麼時候會發他說最快是11月中部長你說11月上旬所以你的速度比院長講的還快你不要接地氣我們加快腳步來做準備謝謝謝謝葉委員\n\n05:31.698 --> 05:42.435\n接下來我們請何新淳委員何新淳委員何新淳委員不在場下一位邱志維委員邱志維委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.329,"end":26.828,"text":"政院版的修法什麼時候會提出來跟委員報告我們目前下個禮拜二財政部會再邀請地方政府來開會那我們會希望在年底以前就可以把政院版提給你希望是年底以前把政院版提出來對對對我們禮拜二會再請地方政府來開會那9月13號院長也邀請了22縣市長在行政院那縣市首長們也都有提相關的意見我們就把它匯集"},{"start":27.67,"end":34.167,"text":"因为我也知道说你有找地方政府来开会但目前的状况是财政部好像现在已经有一个公示了对不对"},{"start":35.953,"end":58.6,"text":"這部分我們跟地方政府一直都在討論包括指標等等我知道說你現在有跟地方政府有提公示出來但是我希望說你提公示的同時也可以把試算的數字一併提出來因為目前大家好像地方政府只有看到公示指標的調整並沒有看到數字其實對地方政府來說他也很難做評估"},{"start":59.46,"end":79.643,"text":"所以我覺得政院在跟地方討論的時候至少資訊公開透明讓大家詳細了解大家比較能夠做出對自己縣市比較有利的判斷我覺得這件事情要有善意啦好不好可以在下一次開會的時候把你們所訂出來的公示的數字一併提給地方政府嗎可以嗎"},{"start":80.576,"end":104.057,"text":"我們下次討論的時候第一個指標之前討論過下次可能會遇到權重那權重要確認才能算得出來因為你只有指標沒有數字人家也很難討論所以你一併要把試算出來的數字提供給地方政府來討論第一件事情第二個是我聽說你現在很多指標跟我們立法院通過的版本有很大的落差"},{"start":104.878,"end":107.7,"text":"好比如說像人口部分現在是從45調降到30是不是"},{"start":112.009,"end":140.231,"text":"報告第一個在權重的部分我們之前也提過因為人口跟營利事業的營業額它兩者是正相關的因為那個佔了75%的比例相當高所以這一次可以看到工商發達的縣市它所獲配的金額比較高這是我們要提到那第二個部分我們這一次的調整在人口的部分會更細緻的劃分人口現在因為我們只有我在這邊沒有辦法給你詳細討論你就回答我問題就好你現在人口是降到多少"},{"start":140.971,"end":156.577,"text":"人口降到多少目前我們可能還是在禮拜二會跟我聽說是30是不是你都開兩次會了你還講不出來上一次開會沒有談到權重的比例只是說人口要更細緻的話你這邊已經有公視了嘛人口是不是降到30%"},{"start":158.52,"end":186.884,"text":"然後土地是不是拉到30%我們會再跟地方政府再確認不是 這個是你提出來的公式我說你提出來的公式嘛你自己台政部連自己提出來公式權重多少都不知道我知道您講的是我們提出去的會議資料所以你有提出公式要地方政府來討論嘛那你如果資訊不公開人家也不知道怎麼討論嘛沒有啊 我們在會議資料有附啊沒有不公開你現在人口是要強到30是不是是不是啊"},{"start":188.134,"end":190.272,"text":"因為我也沒有記那麼清楚"},{"start":191.889,"end":219.532,"text":"我們會後是不是提供我們會議資料也有付沒關係部長我請你把所有的詳細資料包括我剛剛講的試算書提供給地方政府因為我們要來看一下到底對各件事是有利還是算出來狀況是怎麼樣然後還有一個就是部長你有提到說你們修法版本裡面你認為營業稅的權重太高這是指水平分配還是垂直分配"},{"start":220.448,"end":228.155,"text":"我們是在講盈利事業營業額它的權重它佔了應該是百分之三十是水平分配的部分所以營業額的權重這塊也會做調整"},{"start":233.376,"end":255.331,"text":"因為我希望說加快你們政院版本提出來的速度那如果這樣以現在的做法的話我覺得大家會吵很久啦好不好盡快完整數字提供給地方政府大家來討論那我有看到院長講說什麼政院版出來之後會先去跟民進黨黨團討論"},{"start":258.124,"end":277.962,"text":"我也是覺得非常奇怪啦行政院不是版本應該應該要跟大家討論嘛為什麼是跟民進黨黨團討論什麼時候民進黨黨團變成行政院的什麼時候我就覺得超奇怪的然後剩一點時間問一下您今天早上有提到說普發現金最快是11月上旬就可以發是不是"},{"start":278.864,"end":306.455,"text":"是的那為什麼上次我問卓鴻泰院長的時候他說最快是11月中你們後來是有發現民意的壓力是不是不是終於覺得要快了是不是不是那為什麼第一時間都是在講要很久現在才發現說要快一點不是 我跟委員說明因為第一個很確定的是明天欸 不對明天嘛 明天會三讀通過那我相信立法是確定會三讀通過嘛那這個是確定的我們才能往下推時間那接下來就是會很快的送給總統"},{"start":307.495,"end":322.93,"text":"來公告那我們這個部分就會當天公告當天就會來開記者會議我上次問左院長也是講說以明天三讀通過當作一個前提到底什麼時候會發他說最快是11月中部長你說11月上旬所以你的速度比院長講的還快你不要接地氣我們加快腳步來做準備謝謝謝謝葉委員"},{"start":331.698,"end":342.435,"text":"接下來我們請何新淳委員何新淳委員何新淳委員不在場下一位邱志維委員邱志維委員"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":823,"blocks":[["葉委員元之：（11時34分）麻煩請財政部長。"],["主席：請莊部長。"],["莊部長翠雲：委員好。"],["葉委員元之：部長好。請問財劃法政院版的修法草案什麼時候會提出來？"],["莊部長翠雲：跟委員報告，下個禮拜二財政部會再邀集地方政府來開會，希望在年底以前就可以把政院版提給行政院。"],["葉委員元之：你希望在年底以前把政院版提出來？"],["莊部長翠雲：對、對、對，我們禮拜二會再請地方政府來開會。9月13號院長也邀請了22位縣市長到行政院開會，縣市首長也都有提出相關的意見，我們會予以彙集。"],["葉委員元之：我也知道部長有找地方政府來開會，但目前的狀況是財政部好像已經有一個公式了，對不對？"],["莊部長翠雲：這部分我們跟地方政府一直都在討論，包含指標等等……"],["葉委員元之：我知道你現在有跟地方政府提一個公式出來，但是我希望你在提公式的同時，也可以把試算的數字一併提出來，因為目前地方政府好像只有看到公式、指標的調整，並沒有看到數字，其實對地方政府來說，他們也很難做評估。所以我覺得行政院在跟地方討論的時候，至少資訊要公開透明，讓大家詳細瞭解，這樣大家比較能夠做出對自己縣市有利的判斷。我覺得這件事情要有善意啦！下次開會的時候可以把根據你們所訂公式的數字一併提給地方政府嗎？可以嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：指標之前有討論過，下次可能會討論權重，權重確認才算得出來。"],["葉委員元之：部長，因為你們只有指標，沒有數字，人家也很難討論啦！"],["莊部長翠雲：對、對、對。"],["葉委員元之：所以你要一併把試算出來的數字提供給地方政府討論。這是第一件事情。","第二個是我聽說你現在很多指標跟我們立法院通過的版本有很大的落差，比如說人口權重的部分要從45%調降到30%，是不是這樣？"],["莊部長翠雲：跟委員報告，第一，在權重的部分，我們之前也提過，因為人口跟營利事業的營業額兩者是正相關的，因為那占了75%，比例相當高，所以這次可以看到，工商發達的縣市所獲配的金額比較高，這是我們要提到的。第二，我們這次調整會在人口的部分做更細緻的劃分……"],["葉委員元之：時間有限，我在這邊沒有辦法跟你詳細討論，你回答我問題就好。你現在人口的權重是降到多少？"],["莊部長翠雲：目前我們可能還是……禮拜二會跟……"],["葉委員元之：我聽說是30%，是不是？"],["莊部長翠雲：禮拜二會跟……"],["葉委員元之：你都開2次會了，還講不出來！"],["莊部長翠雲：上一次開會沒有談到權重的比例，只是說人口部分要做更細緻的劃分。"],["葉委員元之：可是你們已經有公式了嘛！人口是不是降到30%？然後土地是不是拉到30%？"],["莊部長翠雲：我們會跟地方政府再確認、再討論……"],["葉委員元之：這是你們提出來的公式，你跟地方……我說你提出來的公式嘛！財政部連自己提出來的公式權重多少都不知道喔！"],["莊部長翠雲：我知道您講的是我們提出的會議資料上面所列的。"],["葉委員元之：對嘛！你們有提出公式要地方政府來討論嘛！"],["莊部長翠雲：對、對、對。"],["葉委員元之：如果你們資訊不公開，人家也不知道怎麼討論嘛！"],["莊部長翠雲：沒有啊！我們在會議資料有附，沒有不公開啊！"],["葉委員元之：好啦！你現在人口部分要調到30%，是不是？"],["莊部長翠雲：我也沒有記那麼清楚，是不是會後再提供給委員？因為我們的會議資料中也有附……"],["葉委員元之：沒關係，部長，我請你……"],["莊部長翠雲：不好意思。"],["葉委員元之：我請你把所有的詳細資料，包括我剛剛講的那個試算數都提供給地方政府，因為我們要來看一下到底對各縣市是不是有利，瞭解算出來的狀況是怎麼樣。","還有一個就是，部長有提到你們的修法版本裡面，你認為營業稅的權重太高，這是指水平分配還是垂直分配？"],["莊部長翠雲：我們是在講營利事業營業額的權重占的應該是30%……"],["葉委員元之：所以是水平分配的部分？"],["莊部長翠雲：水平分配，對。"],["葉委員元之：所以營業額的權重這一塊也會做調整？"],["莊部長翠雲：對，在營利事業營業額的部分。"],["葉委員元之：我希望加快政院版提出的速度，以你現在的做法，我覺得大家會吵很久啦！好不好？儘快把完整的數字提供給地方政府，大家來討論。","我有看到院長說政院版出來之後，會先去跟民進黨黨團討論，這點我覺得非常奇怪。行政院提出來的版本不是應該要跟大家討論嗎？為什麼是跟民進黨黨團討論？什麼時候民進黨黨團變成行政院的……我是覺得超奇怪的！","還剩下一點時間，我要問一下部長，您今天早上有提到普發現金最快11月上旬就可以發，是不是？"],["莊部長翠雲：是的。如果……"],["葉委員元之：為什麼我上次問卓榮泰院長的時候，他說最快是11月中？你們後來是有發現民意的壓力嗎？終於覺得要快了，是不是？"],["莊部長翠雲：不是，因為……"],["葉委員元之：為什麼第一時間都說要很久，現在才發現要快？"],["莊部長翠雲：不是，我跟委員說明，第一個，很確定的是明天會三讀通過，我相信……"],["葉委員元之：本來就確定了。"],["莊部長翠雲：是確定會三讀通過嘛，這個是確定的，我們才能往下推時間。接下來就是會很快地送給總統公告，這個部分我們會當天公告，當天就開記者會把日期確認。"],["葉委員元之：我上次問卓院長也是說，以明天三讀通過當作前提，到底什麼時候會發？他說最快是11月中。部長，你說11月上旬……"],["莊部長翠雲：我們儘快。"],["葉委員元之：所以你的速度比院長講得還快。"],["莊部長翠雲：沒有，我們都在加快。"],["葉委員元之：你比較接地氣啦！謝謝。"],["莊部長翠雲：不是，我們有加快腳步來做準備，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝葉委員。","接下來請何欣純委員、何欣純委員、何欣純委員不在場。","下一位請邱志偉委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":238,"meet_id":"委員會-11-4-20-2","speakers":["李坤城","林德福","吳秉叡","賴士葆","郭國文","賴惠員","李彥秀","鍾佳濱","顏寬恒","林思銘","王世堅","楊瓊瓔","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","葉元之","邱志偉","黃珊珊","蔡易餘","林楚茵","羅明才","陳玉珍"],"page_start":183,"meetingDate":["2025-10-16"],"gazette_id":"1148401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1148401_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期財政委員會第2次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請財政部莊部長翠雲率所屬機關首長暨國營事業董事長、總經理（含各轉投資事業機構公股代\n表之董、監事）列席業務報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1148401_00004"}}}