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\"end\": 105.788, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 105.788, \"end\": 106.108, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 106.108, \"end\": 106.289, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 106.289, \"end\": 106.429, \"score\": 0.935}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 106.429, \"end\": 107.349, \"score\": 0.844}, {\"word\": \"2\"}, {\"word\": \"5\"}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"求\", \"start\": 107.349, \"end\": 107.53, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"警\", \"start\": 107.53, \"end\": 107.71, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 107.71, \"end\": 107.89, \"score\": 0.823}, {\"word\": \"教\", \"start\": 107.89, \"end\": 108.07, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"育\", \"start\": 108.07, \"end\": 108.57, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"醫\"}, {\"word\": \"療\"}, {\"word\": \"等\", \"start\": 108.57, \"end\": 108.83, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"系\", \"start\": 108.83, \"end\": 109.271, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 109.271, \"end\": 109.391, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 109.391, \"end\": 109.811, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"協\"}, {\"word\": \"助\", \"start\": 109.811, \"end\": 110.332, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"或\", \"start\": 110.332, \"end\": 110.472, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"者\", \"start\": 110.472, \"end\": 110.592, \"score\": 0.848}, {\"word\": \"依\", \"start\": 110.592, \"end\": 110.732, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"照\", \"start\": 110.732, \"end\": 110.972, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"4\"}, {\"word\": \"2\"}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"開\"}, {\"word\": \"整\", \"start\": 110.972, \"end\": 111.072, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"合\", \"start\": 111.072, \"end\": 111.092, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"協\"}, {\"word\": \"調\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 111.092, \"end\": 111.112, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"但\", \"start\": 111.112, \"end\": 111.212, \"score\": 0.799}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"際\"}, {\"word\": \"運\"}, {\"word\": \"作\", \"start\": 111.212, \"end\": 111.352, \"score\": 0.799}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 111.352, \"end\": 111.553, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"範\"}, {\"word\": \"圍\"}, {\"word\": \"目\", \"start\": 111.553, \"end\": 111.833, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"前\", \"start\": 111.833, \"end\": 111.953, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 111.953, \"end\": 112.093, \"score\": 0.85}, {\"word\": \"局\", \"start\": 112.093, \"end\": 112.333, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"限\", \"start\": 112.333, \"end\": 112.553, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 112.553, \"end\": 112.613, \"score\": 0.66}, {\"word\": \"處\"}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 112.613, \"end\": 112.633, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 117.697, \"end\": 138.513, \"text\": \"或曝險少年那麼對於偏差行為還沒有觸發的高風險的少年那整個的介入的能量依本席的觀察有點不足所以根據現行少年偏差行為預防及這個輔導的辦法第二條的這個規定少年的偏差行為包含了逃家離家還有幫派結交深夜會外出暴力行為\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"或\", 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\"一些這個十多種的情形那這些行為如果早期能夠早一點介入來有效的引導可能會讓未來走向形式化的處遇的情形變少那本席發現實務上這些少年往往在管轄模糊帶那有些教育機構呢認為少府會會處理少府會呢又會認為不符開案條件那設政機關呢又認為保護個案為由大家都不介入\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 139.053, \"end\": 139.193, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 139.193, \"end\": 140.273, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"十\", \"start\": 140.273, \"end\": 140.373, \"score\": 0.732}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 140.373, \"end\": 140.693, \"score\": 0.851}, {\"word\": \"種\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 140.693, \"end\": 140.793, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 140.793, \"end\": 141.013, \"score\": 0.984}, {\"word\": \"形\", \"start\": 141.013, \"end\": 141.674, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 141.674, \"end\": 141.894, \"score\": 0.741}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 141.894, \"end\": 142.014, \"score\": 0.764}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 142.014, \"end\": 142.274, \"score\": 0.896}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": 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{\"word\": \"機\"}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 161.098, \"end\": 161.318, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"又\", \"start\": 161.318, \"end\": 161.978, \"score\": 0.924}, {\"word\": \"認\"}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"保\", \"start\": 161.978, \"end\": 162.639, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"護\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 162.639, \"end\": 162.999, \"score\": 0.836}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"由\", \"start\": 162.999, \"end\": 163.639, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 163.639, \"end\": 163.759, \"score\": 0.959}, {\"word\": \"家\", \"start\": 163.759, \"end\": 163.899, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 163.899, \"end\": 164.019, \"score\": 0.743}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 164.019, \"end\": 164.139, \"score\": 0.766}, {\"word\": \"介\", \"start\": 164.139, \"end\": 164.319, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"入\", \"start\": 164.319, \"end\": 164.339, \"score\": 0.103}]}, {\"start\": 164.779, \"end\": 183.307, \"text\": \"結果最後最關鍵的時機就因此而延誤了所以我們希望能夠正視這個制度性的一個落差那麼司法院你們有權來召開跨機關的協調會議那麼根據現行的法制行政院跟司法院有定期召開相關的會議嗎\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"結\"}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 164.779, \"end\": 165.079, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"最\", \"start\": 165.079, \"end\": 165.279, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 165.279, \"end\": 165.639, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"最\", \"start\": 165.639, \"end\": 166.2, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"鍵\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 166.2, \"end\": 166.92, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"機\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 166.92, \"end\": 167.16, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 167.16, \"end\": 167.44, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"此\", \"start\": 167.44, \"end\": 167.56, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"而\", \"start\": 167.56, \"end\": 167.68, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"延\", \"start\": 167.68, \"end\": 168.001, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"誤\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 168.001, 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\"end\": 172.883, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"落\", \"start\": 172.883, \"end\": 173.083, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"差\", \"start\": 173.083, \"end\": 173.703, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 173.703, \"end\": 174.063, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"司\", \"start\": 174.063, \"end\": 174.183, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 174.183, \"end\": 174.343, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 174.343, \"end\": 174.724, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 174.724, \"end\": 174.904, \"score\": 0.803}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 174.904, \"end\": 175.664, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"權\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"召\", \"start\": 175.664, \"end\": 176.364, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"開\"}, {\"word\": \"跨\", \"start\": 176.364, \"end\": 177.125, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"機\"}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 177.125, \"end\": 178.405, \"score\": 0.905}, {\"word\": \"協\"}, {\"word\": \"調\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 178.405, \"end\": 178.585, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"根\", \"start\": 178.585, \"end\": 179.106, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"據\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 179.106, \"end\": 179.246, \"score\": 0.854}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 179.246, \"end\": 179.406, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 179.406, \"end\": 179.646, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"制\", \"start\": 179.646, \"end\": 180.066, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 180.066, \"end\": 180.206, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 180.206, \"end\": 180.346, \"score\": 0.86}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 180.346, \"end\": 180.606, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 180.606, \"end\": 180.766, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"司\", \"start\": 180.766, \"end\": 180.886, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 180.886, \"end\": 181.066, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 181.066, \"end\": 181.607, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 181.607, \"end\": 182.047, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"定\", \"start\": 182.047, \"end\": 182.327, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"期\", \"start\": 182.327, \"end\": 182.567, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"召\", \"start\": 182.567, \"end\": 182.987, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"開\"}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 182.987, \"end\": 183.287, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 183.287, \"end\": 183.307, \"score\": 0.924}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"嗎\"}]}, {\"start\": 184.992, \"end\": 207.799, \"text\": \"有嗎有好那但是呢相關的這個規定是法律上只說得召開那麼沒有說應召開那也沒有相關的單位來負責追蹤所以本席幾個問題第一個是司法院跟行政院那過去幾年總共召開多少跨院級的少年事件政策協商平台會議那就頻率上有多少\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 184.992, \"end\": 185.512, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"嗎\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 185.512, \"end\": 185.692, 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\"多\", \"start\": 201.577, \"end\": 201.717, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"少\", \"start\": 201.717, \"end\": 201.997, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"跨\", \"start\": 201.997, \"end\": 202.217, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 202.217, \"end\": 202.577, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"級\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 202.577, \"end\": 202.737, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"少\", \"start\": 202.737, \"end\": 202.937, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 202.937, \"end\": 203.137, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 203.137, \"end\": 203.298, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"件\", \"start\": 203.298, \"end\": 203.878, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 203.878, \"end\": 204.198, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"策\", \"start\": 204.198, \"end\": 204.818, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"協\"}, {\"word\": \"商\", \"start\": 204.818, \"end\": 205.138, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"平\", \"start\": 205.138, \"end\": 205.378, \"score\": 0.935}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 205.378, \"end\": 206.298, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 206.298, \"end\": 206.438, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 206.438, \"end\": 207.239, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"頻\"}, {\"word\": \"率\", \"start\": 207.239, \"end\": 207.339, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 207.339, \"end\": 207.479, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 207.479, \"end\": 207.579, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 207.579, \"end\": 207.779, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"少\", \"start\": 207.779, \"end\": 207.799, \"score\": 1.0}]}, {\"start\": 208.579, \"end\": 224.319, \"text\": \"就這一點 司法院和行政院的政策平台會議是一年兩次都有固定在進行一年兩次嘛 是是不是針對過去五年相關的追蹤相關會議裡面的追蹤報告提供給本席\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 208.579, \"end\": 208.88, \"score\": 0.924}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 208.88, \"end\": 209.561, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"點\"}, {\"word\": \"司\", 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{\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 213.145, \"end\": 213.265, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 213.265, \"end\": 213.826, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"兩\"}, {\"word\": \"次\", \"start\": 213.826, \"end\": 214.366, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 214.366, \"end\": 214.467, \"score\": 0.831}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 214.467, \"end\": 214.607, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"固\", \"start\": 214.607, \"end\": 214.747, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"定\", \"start\": 214.747, \"end\": 214.907, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 214.907, \"end\": 215.308, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 215.308, \"end\": 215.768, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 215.768, \"end\": 215.868, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 215.868, \"end\": 216.309, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"兩\"}, {\"word\": \"次\", \"start\": 216.309, \"end\": 216.429, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"嘛\", \"start\": 216.429, \"end\": 216.97, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 216.97, \"end\": 217.39, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 217.39, \"end\": 217.51, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 217.51, \"end\": 217.59, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 217.59, \"end\": 218.371, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"針\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"過\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 218.371, \"end\": 218.512, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"五\", \"start\": 218.512, \"end\": 218.692, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 218.692, \"end\": 218.972, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 218.972, \"end\": 219.313, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 219.313, \"end\": 219.613, \"score\": 0.861}, {\"word\": \"追\", \"start\": 219.613, \"end\": 221.135, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"蹤\"}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 221.135, \"end\": 222.376, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"裡\"}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 222.376, \"end\": 222.556, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 222.556, \"end\": 222.877, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"追\", \"start\": 222.877, \"end\": 223.398, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"蹤\"}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 223.398, \"end\": 223.658, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 223.658, \"end\": 223.798, \"score\": 0.861}, {\"word\": \"供\", \"start\": 223.798, \"end\": 224.098, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"給\"}, {\"word\": \"本\", \"start\": 224.098, \"end\": 224.299, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"席\", \"start\": 224.299, \"end\": 224.319, \"score\": 0.401}]}, {\"start\": 224.659, \"end\": 239.354, \"text\": \"可以好那第二部分呢是目前少年法院跟地方少府會的協作有沒有明確的通報機制那麼少年法院呢不付審理或轉向處分的時候少府會是不是及時接手確保不中斷的輔導鏈\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 224.659, \"end\": 224.839, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 224.839, \"end\": 225.12, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 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{\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 227.782, \"end\": 227.982, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 227.982, \"end\": 228.123, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 228.123, \"end\": 228.383, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"少\", \"start\": 228.383, \"end\": 228.663, \"score\": 0.985}, {\"word\": \"府\", \"start\": 228.663, \"end\": 229.043, \"score\": 0.881}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 229.043, \"end\": 229.584, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"協\"}, {\"word\": \"作\", \"start\": 229.584, \"end\": 230.064, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 230.064, \"end\": 230.165, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 230.165, \"end\": 230.265, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 230.265, \"end\": 230.385, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 230.385, \"end\": 230.905, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"確\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 230.905, \"end\": 231.005, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"通\", \"start\": 231.005, \"end\": 231.606, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"機\"}, {\"word\": \"制\", \"start\": 231.606, \"end\": 232.207, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 232.207, \"end\": 232.407, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"少\", \"start\": 232.407, \"end\": 232.607, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 232.607, \"end\": 232.807, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 232.807, \"end\": 232.967, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 232.967, \"end\": 233.168, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 233.168, \"end\": 233.388, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 233.388, \"end\": 233.568, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"付\", \"start\": 233.568, \"end\": 234.048, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"審\"}, {\"word\": \"理\", \"start\": 234.048, \"end\": 234.229, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"或\", \"start\": 234.229, \"end\": 234.789, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"轉\"}, {\"word\": \"向\", \"start\": 234.789, \"end\": 235.33, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"處\"}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 235.33, \"end\": 235.45, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 235.45, \"end\": 235.69, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 235.69, \"end\": 236.171, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"少\", \"start\": 236.171, \"end\": 236.451, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"府\", \"start\": 236.451, \"end\": 236.991, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 236.991, \"end\": 237.132, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 237.132, \"end\": 237.212, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 237.212, \"end\": 237.472, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"及\", \"start\": 237.472, \"end\": 237.912, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"接\", \"start\": 237.912, \"end\": 238.093, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"手\", \"start\": 238.093, \"end\": 238.773, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"確\"}, {\"word\": \"保\", \"start\": 238.773, \"end\": 239.053, \"score\": 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{\"word\": \"望\", \"start\": 708.348, \"end\": 708.528, \"score\": 0.842}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 708.528, \"end\": 708.828, \"score\": 0.858}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 708.828, \"end\": 708.928, \"score\": 0.844}, {\"word\": \"供\", \"start\": 708.928, \"end\": 708.948, \"score\": 0.766}, {\"word\": \"幾\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"具\", \"start\": 708.948, \"end\": 709.029, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"體\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 709.029, \"end\": 709.049, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 709.049, \"end\": 709.069, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"資\"}, {\"word\": \"料\", \"start\": 709.069, \"end\": 709.089, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 712.071, \"end\": 729.331, \"text\": \"那麼你們今年是不是有在針對案件暴增跟審理負荷進行全面性的分析有沒有相關的資料因為你現在回答大概時間上也不夠了目前各地方法院平均每個法案法官跟書記官的案量是多少\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 712.071, \"end\": 712.351, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 712.351, \"end\": 712.572, \"score\": 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848.863, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"複\"}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 848.863, \"end\": 849.023, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"署\", \"start\": 849.023, \"end\": 849.303, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 849.303, \"end\": 849.323, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:06,687 --> 00:00:12,210\n好那我們現在繼續進行會議接下來我們請林倩琦委員發言好謝謝我們主席翁朝偉我們請司法院的副秘書長\n\n2\n00:00:26,960 --> 00:00:50,454\n好有請王富密委員早早安早上聽到很多同仁在這邊的一個討論我覺得也蠻正面蠻有效度的所以也很謝謝那個司法院對於那個剛才翁委員講的那個報告我也是非常期待你們的一些看法所以你們應該在不同的一個面向可以提出一些讓大家\n\n3\n00:00:50,894 --> 00:01:19,913\n比较能够正面来思考更缜密的从一个司法的观点上来看法官不语跟法官要语的这件事情好谢谢本席今天针对几个长期有在关注的事情来跟你们做个讨论本席长期关注有关于少年司法的问题今天要谈的是本席的观察少年司法跟行政辅导体系之间有一些割裂的现象\n\n4\n00:01:21,054 --> 00:01:34,520\n我們整個少年偏差的行為常常家庭學校社會很多從壓力交織而產生了某一些結果但是司法跟行政體系如果銜接沒有那麼有效度的話再多的制度也其實會變成一種空談\n\n5\n00:01:36,141 --> 00:01:52,633\n所以依據少年事件處理法的第三條的規定那麼符合一定偏差行為的少年由少年法院來處理那麼法院可以依同法的第25條來請求警政教育醫療等系統的一個協助或者依照42條開整合協調的會議但實際運作的範圍目前多局限在處法\n\n6\n00:01:57,697 --> 00:02:18,513\n或曝險少年那麼對於偏差行為還沒有觸發的高風險的少年那整個的介入的能量依本席的觀察有點不足所以根據現行少年偏差行為預防及這個輔導的辦法第二條的這個規定少年的偏差行為包含了逃家離家還有幫派結交深夜會外出暴力行為\n\n7\n00:02:19,053 --> 00:02:44,339\n一些這個十多種的情形那這些行為如果早期能夠早一點介入來有效的引導可能會讓未來走向形式化的處遇的情形變少那本席發現實務上這些少年往往在管轄模糊帶那有些教育機構呢認為少府會會處理少府會呢又會認為不符開案條件那設政機關呢又認為保護個案為由大家都不介入\n\n8\n00:02:44,779 --> 00:03:03,307\n結果最後最關鍵的時機就因此而延誤了所以我們希望能夠正視這個制度性的一個落差那麼司法院你們有權來召開跨機關的協調會議那麼根據現行的法制行政院跟司法院有定期召開相關的會議嗎\n\n9\n00:03:04,992 --> 00:03:27,799\n有嗎有好那但是呢相關的這個規定是法律上只說得召開那麼沒有說應召開那也沒有相關的單位來負責追蹤所以本席幾個問題第一個是司法院跟行政院那過去幾年總共召開多少跨院級的少年事件政策協商平台會議那就頻率上有多少\n\n10\n00:03:28,579 --> 00:03:44,319\n就這一點司法院和行政院的政策平台會議是一年兩次都有固定在進行一年兩次嘛是是不是針對過去五年相關的追蹤相關會議裡面的追蹤報告提供給本席\n\n11\n00:03:44,659 --> 00:03:59,354\n可以好那第二部分呢是目前少年法院跟地方少府會的協作有沒有明確的通報機制那麼少年法院呢不付審理或轉向處分的時候少府會是不是及時接手確保不中斷的輔導鏈\n\n12\n00:04:01,015 --> 00:04:04,077\n這個部分容我請那個廳長來那廳長很簡短的精準的回應好嗎謝謝委員那這一部分原則上都有做這樣的一個所謂的連結的會議那不務審理的或者是所謂的交嚴管或告誡也會轉介過去那聽起來你們是有嗎\n\n13\n00:04:23,312 --> 00:04:51,090\n要不然就把相关的这个比较细节性本席这边比较强调你们的频率还有结果是什么那是不是把相关资料提供给本席因为您这边说有嘛好不好那第三个部分是呢司法院是不是要研拟的一个修法的方向然后来将跨院级协商的平台制度化常态化那么并设置专职的单位跟跨机关的这个资源整合的这个平台来做政策追踪\n\n14\n00:04:52,856 --> 00:05:21,329\n是不是可以研議然後來實行呢是委員剛剛委員的說明的槌尋那其中有一個部分比較難克服就是因為在CRC就是這個兒權公約裡面落實在內國法化以後我國少年司法必須是最小化來約束這個所謂的非行少年處罰少年或偏差但是你們有沒有去觀察到那自從這樣子之後呢\n\n15\n00:05:22,449 --> 00:05:29,536\n那整個的這個在邵氏的這個處理上是不是有效度嗎還是現在變成一個三不管地帶原則上在108年修法以後把邵氏法有關剛剛委員說的曝險偏差等都移到這個所謂的這個邵府會\n\n16\n00:05:43,168 --> 00:05:57,623\n那你們有沒有追蹤呢少府會那這樣子對於整個後來的這個犯罪處意還有到最後犯罪化的一個路徑是不是到最後是那個在這段過程裡面問題可能比較沒有看得到可是問題在後面發生了你們\n\n17\n00:05:58,504 --> 00:06:21,764\n你們的看法呢少府會這一端我們各縣市各少年法庭這個本席在先前問過很多次就是少府會各縣市政府都有但是本席這邊提到就是說那你們真正了解少府會在執行的一個狀況嗎還有少府會的這個困難你們知不知道本席很快的講啦因為在這樣繼續本席是很有階段性的來追蹤這件事情是不是這樣啦這整個\n\n18\n00:06:24,847 --> 00:06:53,010\n整個是社會結構性的一個問題那麼如果這個部分現在把它推往後面也就是犯罪化的這個部分會越來越多那我們看到的少府會其實他們很多時候是叫不動人的所以教育社政司法就變成各自為政很重要的一個狀況是本席在先前其實有提到中央是不是應該設立一個專職的少府會的平台來研議不僅固定召開的機制\n\n19\n00:06:53,430 --> 00:07:00,206\n然後還要專責單位的追蹤跟成效的評估那至少這個部分你們可以給本席一個專業的報告吧\n\n20\n00:07:02,324 --> 00:07:21,639\n本席已經提過很多次上次上次是上次的質詢那我已經提過這個概念了那你們對於這個部分的研議你知道本席講的問題嗎就是說當你覺得少府會現在以最小程度去影響的話呢那是不是他問題是往後推了我不知道你們沒有追蹤這個部分還有少府會實際執行的狀況他們叫得動其他相關單位嗎\n\n21\n00:07:25,842 --> 00:07:37,688\n那如果中央沒有相關的錢跟相關的人那地方的這個可能很多時候在施政的前後順序上就會被影響了你了解我講的意思嗎\n\n22\n00:07:39,295 --> 00:08:02,339\n如果不了解麻煩你們會後再來跟本席確定好嗎那最重要是本席提出來一個中央的少婦會的這個平台那這樣子的延期報告希望你們能夠在兩個月之內給本席好嗎這個本席其實之前有講過相關的議題這個是本席一直在關心的但是現在只是做階段性的確認你們目前的進度可以嗎\n\n23\n00:08:06,401 --> 00:08:25,807\n接下來本席要跟您討論的是司法人力的問題我想人力不足還有負擔太重一直是本席先前也一直關心的問題整個司法品質跟人權的課題會跟基層司法人力過勞會有很大的影響\n\n24\n00:08:26,867 --> 00:08:50,972\n所以根據你們的統計在111年度到今天法院的案量逐漸攀升其實這跟本席剛才在講的概念有點接近你們現在不是哪一個階段問題在這邊沒有發生後面就不會發生了所以你們看全國法院的案量逐年在攀升111年新收的案件大概有45萬件\n\n25\n00:08:53,233 --> 00:09:16,292\n45万多件后面零头本席就先省略112年度又增加到了48万多件然后113年度增加到了51万多件每年的成长幅度都超过一成其实是114年度7月底新收案件跟上年度的同期相比增幅已经达到了8.1这样的趋势其实没有减缓\n\n26\n00:09:17,557 --> 00:09:33,015\n但是在這個同時呢平均結案的日數卻拉長111年度平均結案的時間大概在99天左右112年度上升到了100天左右那麼113年就直接上升到106天那麼\n\n27\n00:09:35,177 --> 00:10:02,542\n沒有結案的也從這個八萬一千多件呢達到了十萬多件那後面這個數字是不是後面代表的是法官書記官法官助理長期會過勞所以在去年四月社會發生了一件痛心的事情士林地院這個法官自殺那傳訊給妻子的內容是壓力大很累那各位你們覺得這樣子的事情應該發生嗎\n\n28\n00:10:05,807 --> 00:10:22,558\n這其實不是一個單純的工作分配的問題司法整個長期人力負荷還有績效比跟心理上的一個負擔這個問題在司法改革裡面我相信你們應該有討論但是法條制度跟資訊化的建設\n\n29\n00:10:24,739 --> 00:10:37,527\n比不上好好來關係承載這一切的人那麼如果人沒有被當成主體來照顧的話那久了之後也是會失去靈魂的不知道您的看法是如何\n\n30\n00:10:38,633 --> 00:10:54,048\n謝謝委員關心槌尋這個問題確實就是說我們法院的案件每年事實上收案都是一直在逐步增加的是啊收案增加然後結案日也延長特別是刑事案件我們的統計數字從111年到113年\n\n31\n00:10:58,712 --> 00:11:22,847\n那個地方法院都平均都已經有成長到百分之十二到那個十五之間那高院跟最高法院都是這樣子一個趨向但是我們相對的我們每年那個人力沒有辦法增加那我們也面臨了就是我們總緣額法就是全部在司法體系的總緣額法是一萬五千的那個上限所以你們怎麼克服本席剛才講的那個問題呢所以就是我們現在那個\n\n32\n00:11:23,647 --> 00:11:49,089\n我們現在也是很積極的就是去跟相關單位去跟他們反映我們的問題就是說第一個看總融合法能不能突破這是一點那第二個我們司法院就是也採取了各種措施就是說怎麼樣去優化這一些程序讓程序上面可不可以就是比較精簡那這樣本席希望你提供幾個具體的相關資料\n\n33\n00:11:52,071 --> 00:12:09,331\n那麼你們今年是不是有在針對案件暴增跟審理負荷進行全面性的分析有沒有相關的資料因為你現在回答大概時間上也不夠了目前各地方法院平均每個法案法官跟書記官的案量是多少\n\n34\n00:12:09,952 --> 00:12:24,974\n然後第二個部分呢是第一線心理人第一線人員的這個心理健康跟過勞的防治目前正式的支持跟申訴的機制是如何那麼你們如何健全健治健康檢測跟心理輔導的制度\n\n35\n00:12:25,655 --> 00:12:50,734\n那第三個部分是目前你們針對案件分流方面有些什麼改革那麼像輕微的案件的處理還有電子調節AI輔助等等目前做到哪裡那麼針對即將達到的進度落實的情形是如何那你可不可以簡短回應有做的或者是還沒有做的或者是您要怎麼樣提供給本席相關的這個資料可不可以簡單的回應\n\n36\n00:12:51,354 --> 00:13:07,711\n委員時間的關係我們可以提出一份報告那就有關於第三點那個案件分流的部分這個也是我們現在司法行政在倡導的就是說希望那個案件來的時候可以先有一個審查的機制就是讓它分流所以現在有了嗎你們在倡導但是開始做了嗎\n\n37\n00:13:08,771 --> 00:13:27,560\n這是其中一部分就是我們採取的措施很多那另外也在這個地方藉在這裡那個呼籲就是說希望在那個司法預算方面的那個立法委員能夠大家都希望有更多的錢來做更多的事只要你們提出來的合理國民黨是一定支持的好嗎但是針對本席剛才所講的\n\n38\n00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:43,586\n不要把現階段的問題挪後了然後就當成這個部分績效是很好的可是我們可以在別的部分看到延遲處理的結果是導致更大的社會成本請記得本席的這句話\n\n39\n00:13:44,466 --> 00:14:09,323\n那本席今天關心的都是長期以來在關心的那請給本席一個具體的從本席開始關心到現在你們所做的措施然後從現在開始那到未來你們定的期程點本席要很清楚的看到時間跟做法可以嗎我們會提出報告那我們的困境也會在上面反映希望那個委員能夠支持好的那謝謝複民署長好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n6687\t12210\t好 那我們現在繼續進行會議接下來我們請林倩琦委員發言好 謝謝我們主席翁朝偉我們請司法院的副秘書長\n26960\t50454\t好有請王富密委員早早安早上聽到很多同仁在這邊的一個討論我覺得也蠻正面蠻有效度的所以也很謝謝那個司法院對於那個剛才翁委員講的那個報告我也是非常期待你們的一些看法所以你們應該在不同的一個面向可以提出一些讓大家\n50894\t79913\t比较能够正面来思考更缜密的从一个司法的观点上来看法官不语跟法官要语的这件事情好谢谢本席今天针对几个长期有在关注的事情来跟你们做个讨论本席长期关注有关于少年司法的问题今天要谈的是本席的观察少年司法跟行政辅导体系之间有一些割裂的现象\n81054\t94520\t我們整個少年偏差的行為常常家庭 學校 社會很多從壓力交織而產生了某一些結果但是司法跟行政體系如果銜接沒有那麼有效度的話再多的制度也其實會變成一種空談\n96141\t112633\t所以依據少年事件處理法的第三條的規定那麼符合一定偏差行為的少年由少年法院來處理那麼法院可以依同法的第25條來請求警政教育醫療等系統的一個協助或者依照42條開整合協調的會議但實際運作的範圍目前多局限在處法\n117697\t138513\t或曝險少年那麼對於偏差行為還沒有觸發的高風險的少年那整個的介入的能量依本席的觀察有點不足所以根據現行少年偏差行為預防及這個輔導的辦法第二條的這個規定少年的偏差行為包含了逃家離家還有幫派結交深夜會外出暴力行為\n139053\t164339\t一些這個十多種的情形那這些行為如果早期能夠早一點介入來有效的引導可能會讓未來走向形式化的處遇的情形變少那本席發現實務上這些少年往往在管轄模糊帶那有些教育機構呢認為少府會會處理少府會呢又會認為不符開案條件那設政機關呢又認為保護個案為由大家都不介入\n164779\t183307\t結果最後最關鍵的時機就因此而延誤了所以我們希望能夠正視這個制度性的一個落差那麼司法院你們有權來召開跨機關的協調會議那麼根據現行的法制行政院跟司法院有定期召開相關的會議嗎\n184992\t207799\t有嗎有好那但是呢相關的這個規定是法律上只說得召開那麼沒有說應召開那也沒有相關的單位來負責追蹤所以本席幾個問題第一個是司法院跟行政院那過去幾年總共召開多少跨院級的少年事件政策協商平台會議那就頻率上有多少\n208579\t224319\t就這一點 司法院和行政院的政策平台會議是一年兩次都有固定在進行一年兩次嘛 是是不是針對過去五年相關的追蹤相關會議裡面的追蹤報告提供給本席\n224659\t239354\t可以好那第二部分呢是目前少年法院跟地方少府會的協作有沒有明確的通報機制那麼少年法院呢不付審理或轉向處分的時候少府會是不是及時接手確保不中斷的輔導鏈\n241015\t244077\t這個部分容我請那個廳長來那廳長很簡短的精準的回應好嗎謝謝委員那這一部分原則上都有做這樣的一個所謂的連結的會議那不務審理的或者是所謂的交嚴管或告誡也會轉介過去那聽起來你們是有嗎\n263312\t291090\t要不然就把相关的这个比较细节性本席这边比较强调你们的频率还有结果是什么那是不是把相关资料提供给本席因为您这边说有嘛好不好那第三个部分是呢司法院是不是要研拟的一个修法的方向然后来将跨院级协商的平台制度化常态化那么并设置专职的单位跟跨机关的这个资源整合的这个平台来做政策追踪\n292856\t321329\t是不是可以研議然後來實行呢是 委員剛剛委員的說明的槌尋那其中有一個部分比較難克服就是因為在CRC就是這個兒權公約裡面落實在內國法化以後我國少年司法必須是最小化來約束這個所謂的非行少年處罰少年或偏差但是你們有沒有去觀察到那自從這樣子之後呢\n322449\t329536\t那整個的這個在邵氏的這個處理上是不是有效度嗎還是現在變成一個三不管地帶原則上在108年修法以後把邵氏法有關剛剛委員說的曝險偏差等都移到這個所謂的這個邵府會\n343168\t357623\t那你們有沒有追蹤呢 少府會那這樣子對於整個後來的這個犯罪處意還有到最後犯罪化的一個路徑是不是到最後是那個在這段過程裡面問題可能比較沒有看得到可是問題在後面發生了 你們\n358504\t381764\t你們的看法呢少府會這一端我們各縣市各少年法庭這個本席在先前問過很多次就是少府會各縣市政府都有但是本席這邊提到就是說那你們真正了解少府會在執行的一個狀況嗎還有少府會的這個困難你們知不知道本席很快的講啦因為在這樣繼續本席是很有階段性的來追蹤這件事情是不是這樣啦這整個\n384847\t413010\t整個是社會結構性的一個問題那麼如果這個部分現在把它推往後面也就是犯罪化的這個部分會越來越多那我們看到的少府會其實他們很多時候是叫不動人的所以教育 社政 司法就變成各自為政很重要的一個狀況是本席在先前其實有提到中央是不是應該設立一個專職的少府會的平台來研議不僅固定召開的機制\n413430\t420206\t然後還要專責單位的追蹤跟成效的評估那至少這個部分你們可以給本席一個專業的報告吧\n422324\t441639\t本席已經提過很多次上次上次是上次的質詢那我已經提過這個概念了那你們對於這個部分的研議你知道本席講的問題嗎就是說當你覺得少府會現在以最小程度去影響的話呢那是不是他問題是往後推了我不知道你們沒有追蹤這個部分還有少府會實際執行的狀況他們叫得動其他相關單位嗎\n445842\t457688\t那如果中央沒有相關的錢跟相關的人那地方的這個可能很多時候在施政的前後順序上就會被影響了你了解我講的意思嗎\n459295\t482339\t如果不了解麻煩你們會後再來跟本席確定好嗎那最重要是本席提出來一個中央的少婦會的這個平台那這樣子的延期報告希望你們能夠在兩個月之內給本席好嗎這個本席其實之前有講過相關的議題這個是本席一直在關心的但是現在只是做階段性的確認你們目前的進度可以嗎\n486401\t505807\t接下來本席要跟您討論的是司法人力的問題我想人力不足還有負擔太重一直是本席先前也一直關心的問題整個司法品質跟人權的課題會跟基層司法人力過勞會有很大的影響\n506867\t530972\t所以根據你們的統計在111年度到今天法院的案量逐漸攀升其實這跟本席剛才在講的概念有點接近你們現在不是哪一個階段問題在這邊沒有發生後面就不會發生了所以你們看全國法院的案量逐年在攀升111年新收的案件大概有45萬件\n533233\t556292\t45万多件后面零头本席就先省略112年度又增加到了48万多件然后113年度增加到了51万多件每年的成长幅度都超过一成其实是114年度7月底新收案件跟上年度的同期相比增幅已经达到了8.1这样的趋势其实没有减缓\n557557\t573015\t但是在這個同時呢平均結案的日數卻拉長111年度平均結案的時間大概在99天左右112年度上升到了100天左右那麼113年就直接上升到106天那麼\n575177\t602542\t沒有結案的也從這個八萬一千多件呢達到了十萬多件那後面這個數字是不是後面代表的是法官書記官法官助理長期會過勞所以在去年四月社會發生了一件痛心的事情士林地院這個法官自殺那傳訊給妻子的內容是壓力大很累那各位你們覺得這樣子的事情應該發生嗎\n605807\t622558\t這其實不是一個單純的工作分配的問題司法整個長期人力負荷還有績效比跟心理上的一個負擔這個問題在司法改革裡面我相信你們應該有討論但是法條制度跟資訊化的建設\n624739\t637527\t比不上好好來關係承載這一切的人那麼如果人沒有被當成主體來照顧的話那久了之後也是會失去靈魂的不知道您的看法是如何\n638633\t654048\t謝謝委員關心槌尋這個問題確實就是說 我們法院的案件每年事實上 收案都是一直在逐步增加的是啊 收案增加 然後結案日也延長特別是刑事案件 我們的統計數字從111年到113年\n658712\t682847\t那個地方法院都平均都已經有成長到百分之十二到那個十五之間那高院跟最高法院都是這樣子一個趨向但是我們相對的我們每年那個人力沒有辦法增加那我們也面臨了就是我們總緣額法就是全部在司法體系的總緣額法是一萬五千的那個上限所以你們怎麼克服本席剛才講的那個問題呢所以就是我們現在那個\n683647\t709089\t我們現在也是很積極的就是去跟相關單位去跟他們反映我們的問題就是說第一個看總融合法能不能突破這是一點那第二個我們司法院就是也採取了各種措施就是說怎麼樣去優化這一些程序讓程序上面可不可以就是比較精簡那這樣本席希望你提供幾個具體的相關資料\n712071\t729331\t那麼你們今年是不是有在針對案件暴增跟審理負荷進行全面性的分析有沒有相關的資料因為你現在回答大概時間上也不夠了目前各地方法院平均每個法案法官跟書記官的案量是多少\n729952\t744974\t然後第二個部分呢是第一線心理人第一線人員的這個心理健康跟過勞的防治目前正式的支持跟申訴的機制是如何那麼你們如何健全健治健康檢測跟心理輔導的制度\n745655\t770734\t那第三個部分是目前你們針對案件分流方面有些什麼改革那麼像輕微的案件的處理還有電子調節AI輔助等等目前做到哪裡那麼針對即將達到的進度落實的情形是如何那你可不可以簡短回應有做的或者是還沒有做的或者是您要怎麼樣提供給本席相關的這個資料可不可以簡單的回應\n771354\t787711\t委員時間的關係我們可以提出一份報告那就有關於第三點那個案件分流的部分這個也是我們現在司法行政在倡導的就是說希望那個案件來的時候可以先有一個審查的機制就是讓它分流所以現在有了嗎你們在倡導但是開始做了嗎\n788771\t807560\t這是其中一部分 就是我們採取的措施很多那另外也在這個地方 藉在這裡那個呼籲就是說希望在那個司法預算方面的那個立法委員能夠大家都希望有更多的錢來做更多的事只要你們提出來的合理 國民黨是一定支持的好嗎 但是針對本席剛才所講的\n808600\t823586\t不要把現階段的問題挪後了然後就當成這個部分績效是很好的可是我們可以在別的部分看到延遲處理的結果是導致更大的社會成本請記得本席的這句話\n824466\t849323\t那本席今天關心的都是長期以來在關心的那請給本席一個具體的從本席開始關心到現在你們所做的措施然後從現在開始那到未來你們定的期程點本席要很清楚的看到時間跟做法可以嗎我們會提出報告那我們的困境也會在上面反映希望那個委員能夠支持好的那謝謝複民署長好 謝謝\n","txt":"好 那我們現在繼續進行會議接下來我們請林倩琦委員發言好 謝謝我們主席翁朝偉我們請司法院的副秘書長\n好有請王富密委員早早安早上聽到很多同仁在這邊的一個討論我覺得也蠻正面蠻有效度的所以也很謝謝那個司法院對於那個剛才翁委員講的那個報告我也是非常期待你們的一些看法所以你們應該在不同的一個面向可以提出一些讓大家\n比较能够正面来思考更缜密的从一个司法的观点上来看法官不语跟法官要语的这件事情好谢谢本席今天针对几个长期有在关注的事情来跟你们做个讨论本席长期关注有关于少年司法的问题今天要谈的是本席的观察少年司法跟行政辅导体系之间有一些割裂的现象\n我們整個少年偏差的行為常常家庭 學校 社會很多從壓力交織而產生了某一些結果但是司法跟行政體系如果銜接沒有那麼有效度的話再多的制度也其實會變成一種空談\n所以依據少年事件處理法的第三條的規定那麼符合一定偏差行為的少年由少年法院來處理那麼法院可以依同法的第25條來請求警政教育醫療等系統的一個協助或者依照42條開整合協調的會議但實際運作的範圍目前多局限在處法\n或曝險少年那麼對於偏差行為還沒有觸發的高風險的少年那整個的介入的能量依本席的觀察有點不足所以根據現行少年偏差行為預防及這個輔導的辦法第二條的這個規定少年的偏差行為包含了逃家離家還有幫派結交深夜會外出暴力行為\n一些這個十多種的情形那這些行為如果早期能夠早一點介入來有效的引導可能會讓未來走向形式化的處遇的情形變少那本席發現實務上這些少年往往在管轄模糊帶那有些教育機構呢認為少府會會處理少府會呢又會認為不符開案條件那設政機關呢又認為保護個案為由大家都不介入\n結果最後最關鍵的時機就因此而延誤了所以我們希望能夠正視這個制度性的一個落差那麼司法院你們有權來召開跨機關的協調會議那麼根據現行的法制行政院跟司法院有定期召開相關的會議嗎\n有嗎有好那但是呢相關的這個規定是法律上只說得召開那麼沒有說應召開那也沒有相關的單位來負責追蹤所以本席幾個問題第一個是司法院跟行政院那過去幾年總共召開多少跨院級的少年事件政策協商平台會議那就頻率上有多少\n就這一點 司法院和行政院的政策平台會議是一年兩次都有固定在進行一年兩次嘛 是是不是針對過去五年相關的追蹤相關會議裡面的追蹤報告提供給本席\n可以好那第二部分呢是目前少年法院跟地方少府會的協作有沒有明確的通報機制那麼少年法院呢不付審理或轉向處分的時候少府會是不是及時接手確保不中斷的輔導鏈\n這個部分容我請那個廳長來那廳長很簡短的精準的回應好嗎謝謝委員那這一部分原則上都有做這樣的一個所謂的連結的會議那不務審理的或者是所謂的交嚴管或告誡也會轉介過去那聽起來你們是有嗎\n要不然就把相关的这个比较细节性本席这边比较强调你们的频率还有结果是什么那是不是把相关资料提供给本席因为您这边说有嘛好不好那第三个部分是呢司法院是不是要研拟的一个修法的方向然后来将跨院级协商的平台制度化常态化那么并设置专职的单位跟跨机关的这个资源整合的这个平台来做政策追踪\n是不是可以研議然後來實行呢是 委員剛剛委員的說明的槌尋那其中有一個部分比較難克服就是因為在CRC就是這個兒權公約裡面落實在內國法化以後我國少年司法必須是最小化來約束這個所謂的非行少年處罰少年或偏差但是你們有沒有去觀察到那自從這樣子之後呢\n那整個的這個在邵氏的這個處理上是不是有效度嗎還是現在變成一個三不管地帶原則上在108年修法以後把邵氏法有關剛剛委員說的曝險偏差等都移到這個所謂的這個邵府會\n那你們有沒有追蹤呢 少府會那這樣子對於整個後來的這個犯罪處意還有到最後犯罪化的一個路徑是不是到最後是那個在這段過程裡面問題可能比較沒有看得到可是問題在後面發生了 你們\n你們的看法呢少府會這一端我們各縣市各少年法庭這個本席在先前問過很多次就是少府會各縣市政府都有但是本席這邊提到就是說那你們真正了解少府會在執行的一個狀況嗎還有少府會的這個困難你們知不知道本席很快的講啦因為在這樣繼續本席是很有階段性的來追蹤這件事情是不是這樣啦這整個\n整個是社會結構性的一個問題那麼如果這個部分現在把它推往後面也就是犯罪化的這個部分會越來越多那我們看到的少府會其實他們很多時候是叫不動人的所以教育 社政 司法就變成各自為政很重要的一個狀況是本席在先前其實有提到中央是不是應該設立一個專職的少府會的平台來研議不僅固定召開的機制\n然後還要專責單位的追蹤跟成效的評估那至少這個部分你們可以給本席一個專業的報告吧\n本席已經提過很多次上次上次是上次的質詢那我已經提過這個概念了那你們對於這個部分的研議你知道本席講的問題嗎就是說當你覺得少府會現在以最小程度去影響的話呢那是不是他問題是往後推了我不知道你們沒有追蹤這個部分還有少府會實際執行的狀況他們叫得動其他相關單位嗎\n那如果中央沒有相關的錢跟相關的人那地方的這個可能很多時候在施政的前後順序上就會被影響了你了解我講的意思嗎\n如果不了解麻煩你們會後再來跟本席確定好嗎那最重要是本席提出來一個中央的少婦會的這個平台那這樣子的延期報告希望你們能夠在兩個月之內給本席好嗎這個本席其實之前有講過相關的議題這個是本席一直在關心的但是現在只是做階段性的確認你們目前的進度可以嗎\n接下來本席要跟您討論的是司法人力的問題我想人力不足還有負擔太重一直是本席先前也一直關心的問題整個司法品質跟人權的課題會跟基層司法人力過勞會有很大的影響\n所以根據你們的統計在111年度到今天法院的案量逐漸攀升其實這跟本席剛才在講的概念有點接近你們現在不是哪一個階段問題在這邊沒有發生後面就不會發生了所以你們看全國法院的案量逐年在攀升111年新收的案件大概有45萬件\n45万多件后面零头本席就先省略112年度又增加到了48万多件然后113年度增加到了51万多件每年的成长幅度都超过一成其实是114年度7月底新收案件跟上年度的同期相比增幅已经达到了8.1这样的趋势其实没有减缓\n但是在這個同時呢平均結案的日數卻拉長111年度平均結案的時間大概在99天左右112年度上升到了100天左右那麼113年就直接上升到106天那麼\n沒有結案的也從這個八萬一千多件呢達到了十萬多件那後面這個數字是不是後面代表的是法官書記官法官助理長期會過勞所以在去年四月社會發生了一件痛心的事情士林地院這個法官自殺那傳訊給妻子的內容是壓力大很累那各位你們覺得這樣子的事情應該發生嗎\n這其實不是一個單純的工作分配的問題司法整個長期人力負荷還有績效比跟心理上的一個負擔這個問題在司法改革裡面我相信你們應該有討論但是法條制度跟資訊化的建設\n比不上好好來關係承載這一切的人那麼如果人沒有被當成主體來照顧的話那久了之後也是會失去靈魂的不知道您的看法是如何\n謝謝委員關心槌尋這個問題確實就是說 我們法院的案件每年事實上 收案都是一直在逐步增加的是啊 收案增加 然後結案日也延長特別是刑事案件 我們的統計數字從111年到113年\n那個地方法院都平均都已經有成長到百分之十二到那個十五之間那高院跟最高法院都是這樣子一個趨向但是我們相對的我們每年那個人力沒有辦法增加那我們也面臨了就是我們總緣額法就是全部在司法體系的總緣額法是一萬五千的那個上限所以你們怎麼克服本席剛才講的那個問題呢所以就是我們現在那個\n我們現在也是很積極的就是去跟相關單位去跟他們反映我們的問題就是說第一個看總融合法能不能突破這是一點那第二個我們司法院就是也採取了各種措施就是說怎麼樣去優化這一些程序讓程序上面可不可以就是比較精簡那這樣本席希望你提供幾個具體的相關資料\n那麼你們今年是不是有在針對案件暴增跟審理負荷進行全面性的分析有沒有相關的資料因為你現在回答大概時間上也不夠了目前各地方法院平均每個法案法官跟書記官的案量是多少\n然後第二個部分呢是第一線心理人第一線人員的這個心理健康跟過勞的防治目前正式的支持跟申訴的機制是如何那麼你們如何健全健治健康檢測跟心理輔導的制度\n那第三個部分是目前你們針對案件分流方面有些什麼改革那麼像輕微的案件的處理還有電子調節AI輔助等等目前做到哪裡那麼針對即將達到的進度落實的情形是如何那你可不可以簡短回應有做的或者是還沒有做的或者是您要怎麼樣提供給本席相關的這個資料可不可以簡單的回應\n委員時間的關係我們可以提出一份報告那就有關於第三點那個案件分流的部分這個也是我們現在司法行政在倡導的就是說希望那個案件來的時候可以先有一個審查的機制就是讓它分流所以現在有了嗎你們在倡導但是開始做了嗎\n這是其中一部分 就是我們採取的措施很多那另外也在這個地方 藉在這裡那個呼籲就是說希望在那個司法預算方面的那個立法委員能夠大家都希望有更多的錢來做更多的事只要你們提出來的合理 國民黨是一定支持的好嗎 但是針對本席剛才所講的\n不要把現階段的問題挪後了然後就當成這個部分績效是很好的可是我們可以在別的部分看到延遲處理的結果是導致更大的社會成本請記得本席的這句話\n那本席今天關心的都是長期以來在關心的那請給本席一個具體的從本席開始關心到現在你們所做的措施然後從現在開始那到未來你們定的期程點本席要很清楚的看到時間跟做法可以嗎我們會提出報告那我們的困境也會在上面反映希望那個委員能夠支持好的那謝謝複民署長好 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:06.687 --> 00:12.210\n好那我們現在繼續進行會議接下來我們請林倩琦委員發言好謝謝我們主席翁朝偉我們請司法院的副秘書長\n\n00:26.960 --> 00:50.454\n好有請王富密委員早早安早上聽到很多同仁在這邊的一個討論我覺得也蠻正面蠻有效度的所以也很謝謝那個司法院對於那個剛才翁委員講的那個報告我也是非常期待你們的一些看法所以你們應該在不同的一個面向可以提出一些讓大家\n\n00:50.894 --> 01:19.913\n比较能够正面来思考更缜密的从一个司法的观点上来看法官不语跟法官要语的这件事情好谢谢本席今天针对几个长期有在关注的事情来跟你们做个讨论本席长期关注有关于少年司法的问题今天要谈的是本席的观察少年司法跟行政辅导体系之间有一些割裂的现象\n\n01:21.054 --> 01:34.520\n我們整個少年偏差的行為常常家庭學校社會很多從壓力交織而產生了某一些結果但是司法跟行政體系如果銜接沒有那麼有效度的話再多的制度也其實會變成一種空談\n\n01:36.141 --> 01:52.633\n所以依據少年事件處理法的第三條的規定那麼符合一定偏差行為的少年由少年法院來處理那麼法院可以依同法的第25條來請求警政教育醫療等系統的一個協助或者依照42條開整合協調的會議但實際運作的範圍目前多局限在處法\n\n01:57.697 --> 02:18.513\n或曝險少年那麼對於偏差行為還沒有觸發的高風險的少年那整個的介入的能量依本席的觀察有點不足所以根據現行少年偏差行為預防及這個輔導的辦法第二條的這個規定少年的偏差行為包含了逃家離家還有幫派結交深夜會外出暴力行為\n\n02:19.053 --> 02:44.339\n一些這個十多種的情形那這些行為如果早期能夠早一點介入來有效的引導可能會讓未來走向形式化的處遇的情形變少那本席發現實務上這些少年往往在管轄模糊帶那有些教育機構呢認為少府會會處理少府會呢又會認為不符開案條件那設政機關呢又認為保護個案為由大家都不介入\n\n02:44.779 --> 03:03.307\n結果最後最關鍵的時機就因此而延誤了所以我們希望能夠正視這個制度性的一個落差那麼司法院你們有權來召開跨機關的協調會議那麼根據現行的法制行政院跟司法院有定期召開相關的會議嗎\n\n03:04.992 --> 03:27.799\n有嗎有好那但是呢相關的這個規定是法律上只說得召開那麼沒有說應召開那也沒有相關的單位來負責追蹤所以本席幾個問題第一個是司法院跟行政院那過去幾年總共召開多少跨院級的少年事件政策協商平台會議那就頻率上有多少\n\n03:28.579 --> 03:44.319\n就這一點司法院和行政院的政策平台會議是一年兩次都有固定在進行一年兩次嘛是是不是針對過去五年相關的追蹤相關會議裡面的追蹤報告提供給本席\n\n03:44.659 --> 03:59.354\n可以好那第二部分呢是目前少年法院跟地方少府會的協作有沒有明確的通報機制那麼少年法院呢不付審理或轉向處分的時候少府會是不是及時接手確保不中斷的輔導鏈\n\n04:01.015 --> 04:04.077\n這個部分容我請那個廳長來那廳長很簡短的精準的回應好嗎謝謝委員那這一部分原則上都有做這樣的一個所謂的連結的會議那不務審理的或者是所謂的交嚴管或告誡也會轉介過去那聽起來你們是有嗎\n\n04:23.312 --> 04:51.090\n要不然就把相关的这个比较细节性本席这边比较强调你们的频率还有结果是什么那是不是把相关资料提供给本席因为您这边说有嘛好不好那第三个部分是呢司法院是不是要研拟的一个修法的方向然后来将跨院级协商的平台制度化常态化那么并设置专职的单位跟跨机关的这个资源整合的这个平台来做政策追踪\n\n04:52.856 --> 05:21.329\n是不是可以研議然後來實行呢是委員剛剛委員的說明的槌尋那其中有一個部分比較難克服就是因為在CRC就是這個兒權公約裡面落實在內國法化以後我國少年司法必須是最小化來約束這個所謂的非行少年處罰少年或偏差但是你們有沒有去觀察到那自從這樣子之後呢\n\n05:22.449 --> 05:29.536\n那整個的這個在邵氏的這個處理上是不是有效度嗎還是現在變成一個三不管地帶原則上在108年修法以後把邵氏法有關剛剛委員說的曝險偏差等都移到這個所謂的這個邵府會\n\n05:43.168 --> 05:57.623\n那你們有沒有追蹤呢少府會那這樣子對於整個後來的這個犯罪處意還有到最後犯罪化的一個路徑是不是到最後是那個在這段過程裡面問題可能比較沒有看得到可是問題在後面發生了你們\n\n05:58.504 --> 06:21.764\n你們的看法呢少府會這一端我們各縣市各少年法庭這個本席在先前問過很多次就是少府會各縣市政府都有但是本席這邊提到就是說那你們真正了解少府會在執行的一個狀況嗎還有少府會的這個困難你們知不知道本席很快的講啦因為在這樣繼續本席是很有階段性的來追蹤這件事情是不是這樣啦這整個\n\n06:24.847 --> 06:53.010\n整個是社會結構性的一個問題那麼如果這個部分現在把它推往後面也就是犯罪化的這個部分會越來越多那我們看到的少府會其實他們很多時候是叫不動人的所以教育社政司法就變成各自為政很重要的一個狀況是本席在先前其實有提到中央是不是應該設立一個專職的少府會的平台來研議不僅固定召開的機制\n\n06:53.430 --> 07:00.206\n然後還要專責單位的追蹤跟成效的評估那至少這個部分你們可以給本席一個專業的報告吧\n\n07:02.324 --> 07:21.639\n本席已經提過很多次上次上次是上次的質詢那我已經提過這個概念了那你們對於這個部分的研議你知道本席講的問題嗎就是說當你覺得少府會現在以最小程度去影響的話呢那是不是他問題是往後推了我不知道你們沒有追蹤這個部分還有少府會實際執行的狀況他們叫得動其他相關單位嗎\n\n07:25.842 --> 07:37.688\n那如果中央沒有相關的錢跟相關的人那地方的這個可能很多時候在施政的前後順序上就會被影響了你了解我講的意思嗎\n\n07:39.295 --> 08:02.339\n如果不了解麻煩你們會後再來跟本席確定好嗎那最重要是本席提出來一個中央的少婦會的這個平台那這樣子的延期報告希望你們能夠在兩個月之內給本席好嗎這個本席其實之前有講過相關的議題這個是本席一直在關心的但是現在只是做階段性的確認你們目前的進度可以嗎\n\n08:06.401 --> 08:25.807\n接下來本席要跟您討論的是司法人力的問題我想人力不足還有負擔太重一直是本席先前也一直關心的問題整個司法品質跟人權的課題會跟基層司法人力過勞會有很大的影響\n\n08:26.867 --> 08:50.972\n所以根據你們的統計在111年度到今天法院的案量逐漸攀升其實這跟本席剛才在講的概念有點接近你們現在不是哪一個階段問題在這邊沒有發生後面就不會發生了所以你們看全國法院的案量逐年在攀升111年新收的案件大概有45萬件\n\n08:53.233 --> 09:16.292\n45万多件后面零头本席就先省略112年度又增加到了48万多件然后113年度增加到了51万多件每年的成长幅度都超过一成其实是114年度7月底新收案件跟上年度的同期相比增幅已经达到了8.1这样的趋势其实没有减缓\n\n09:17.557 --> 09:33.015\n但是在這個同時呢平均結案的日數卻拉長111年度平均結案的時間大概在99天左右112年度上升到了100天左右那麼113年就直接上升到106天那麼\n\n09:35.177 --> 10:02.542\n沒有結案的也從這個八萬一千多件呢達到了十萬多件那後面這個數字是不是後面代表的是法官書記官法官助理長期會過勞所以在去年四月社會發生了一件痛心的事情士林地院這個法官自殺那傳訊給妻子的內容是壓力大很累那各位你們覺得這樣子的事情應該發生嗎\n\n10:05.807 --> 10:22.558\n這其實不是一個單純的工作分配的問題司法整個長期人力負荷還有績效比跟心理上的一個負擔這個問題在司法改革裡面我相信你們應該有討論但是法條制度跟資訊化的建設\n\n10:24.739 --> 10:37.527\n比不上好好來關係承載這一切的人那麼如果人沒有被當成主體來照顧的話那久了之後也是會失去靈魂的不知道您的看法是如何\n\n10:38.633 --> 10:54.048\n謝謝委員關心槌尋這個問題確實就是說我們法院的案件每年事實上收案都是一直在逐步增加的是啊收案增加然後結案日也延長特別是刑事案件我們的統計數字從111年到113年\n\n10:58.712 --> 11:22.847\n那個地方法院都平均都已經有成長到百分之十二到那個十五之間那高院跟最高法院都是這樣子一個趨向但是我們相對的我們每年那個人力沒有辦法增加那我們也面臨了就是我們總緣額法就是全部在司法體系的總緣額法是一萬五千的那個上限所以你們怎麼克服本席剛才講的那個問題呢所以就是我們現在那個\n\n11:23.647 --> 11:49.089\n我們現在也是很積極的就是去跟相關單位去跟他們反映我們的問題就是說第一個看總融合法能不能突破這是一點那第二個我們司法院就是也採取了各種措施就是說怎麼樣去優化這一些程序讓程序上面可不可以就是比較精簡那這樣本席希望你提供幾個具體的相關資料\n\n11:52.071 --> 12:09.331\n那麼你們今年是不是有在針對案件暴增跟審理負荷進行全面性的分析有沒有相關的資料因為你現在回答大概時間上也不夠了目前各地方法院平均每個法案法官跟書記官的案量是多少\n\n12:09.952 --> 12:24.974\n然後第二個部分呢是第一線心理人第一線人員的這個心理健康跟過勞的防治目前正式的支持跟申訴的機制是如何那麼你們如何健全健治健康檢測跟心理輔導的制度\n\n12:25.655 --> 12:50.734\n那第三個部分是目前你們針對案件分流方面有些什麼改革那麼像輕微的案件的處理還有電子調節AI輔助等等目前做到哪裡那麼針對即將達到的進度落實的情形是如何那你可不可以簡短回應有做的或者是還沒有做的或者是您要怎麼樣提供給本席相關的這個資料可不可以簡單的回應\n\n12:51.354 --> 13:07.711\n委員時間的關係我們可以提出一份報告那就有關於第三點那個案件分流的部分這個也是我們現在司法行政在倡導的就是說希望那個案件來的時候可以先有一個審查的機制就是讓它分流所以現在有了嗎你們在倡導但是開始做了嗎\n\n13:08.771 --> 13:27.560\n這是其中一部分就是我們採取的措施很多那另外也在這個地方藉在這裡那個呼籲就是說希望在那個司法預算方面的那個立法委員能夠大家都希望有更多的錢來做更多的事只要你們提出來的合理國民黨是一定支持的好嗎但是針對本席剛才所講的\n\n13:28.600 --> 13:43.586\n不要把現階段的問題挪後了然後就當成這個部分績效是很好的可是我們可以在別的部分看到延遲處理的結果是導致更大的社會成本請記得本席的這句話\n\n13:44.466 --> 14:09.323\n那本席今天關心的都是長期以來在關心的那請給本席一個具體的從本席開始關心到現在你們所做的措施然後從現在開始那到未來你們定的期程點本席要很清楚的看到時間跟做法可以嗎我們會提出報告那我們的困境也會在上面反映希望那個委員能夠支持好的那謝謝複民署長好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":6.687,"end":12.21,"text":"好 那我們現在繼續進行會議接下來我們請林倩琦委員發言好 謝謝我們主席翁朝偉我們請司法院的副秘書長"},{"start":26.96,"end":50.454,"text":"好有請王富密委員早早安早上聽到很多同仁在這邊的一個討論我覺得也蠻正面蠻有效度的所以也很謝謝那個司法院對於那個剛才翁委員講的那個報告我也是非常期待你們的一些看法所以你們應該在不同的一個面向可以提出一些讓大家"},{"start":50.894,"end":79.913,"text":"比较能够正面来思考更缜密的从一个司法的观点上来看法官不语跟法官要语的这件事情好谢谢本席今天针对几个长期有在关注的事情来跟你们做个讨论本席长期关注有关于少年司法的问题今天要谈的是本席的观察少年司法跟行政辅导体系之间有一些割裂的现象"},{"start":81.054,"end":94.52,"text":"我們整個少年偏差的行為常常家庭 學校 社會很多從壓力交織而產生了某一些結果但是司法跟行政體系如果銜接沒有那麼有效度的話再多的制度也其實會變成一種空談"},{"start":96.141,"end":112.633,"text":"所以依據少年事件處理法的第三條的規定那麼符合一定偏差行為的少年由少年法院來處理那麼法院可以依同法的第25條來請求警政教育醫療等系統的一個協助或者依照42條開整合協調的會議但實際運作的範圍目前多局限在處法"},{"start":117.697,"end":138.513,"text":"或曝險少年那麼對於偏差行為還沒有觸發的高風險的少年那整個的介入的能量依本席的觀察有點不足所以根據現行少年偏差行為預防及這個輔導的辦法第二條的這個規定少年的偏差行為包含了逃家離家還有幫派結交深夜會外出暴力行為"},{"start":139.053,"end":164.339,"text":"一些這個十多種的情形那這些行為如果早期能夠早一點介入來有效的引導可能會讓未來走向形式化的處遇的情形變少那本席發現實務上這些少年往往在管轄模糊帶那有些教育機構呢認為少府會會處理少府會呢又會認為不符開案條件那設政機關呢又認為保護個案為由大家都不介入"},{"start":164.779,"end":183.307,"text":"結果最後最關鍵的時機就因此而延誤了所以我們希望能夠正視這個制度性的一個落差那麼司法院你們有權來召開跨機關的協調會議那麼根據現行的法制行政院跟司法院有定期召開相關的會議嗎"},{"start":184.992,"end":207.799,"text":"有嗎有好那但是呢相關的這個規定是法律上只說得召開那麼沒有說應召開那也沒有相關的單位來負責追蹤所以本席幾個問題第一個是司法院跟行政院那過去幾年總共召開多少跨院級的少年事件政策協商平台會議那就頻率上有多少"},{"start":208.579,"end":224.319,"text":"就這一點 司法院和行政院的政策平台會議是一年兩次都有固定在進行一年兩次嘛 是是不是針對過去五年相關的追蹤相關會議裡面的追蹤報告提供給本席"},{"start":224.659,"end":239.354,"text":"可以好那第二部分呢是目前少年法院跟地方少府會的協作有沒有明確的通報機制那麼少年法院呢不付審理或轉向處分的時候少府會是不是及時接手確保不中斷的輔導鏈"},{"start":241.015,"end":244.077,"text":"這個部分容我請那個廳長來那廳長很簡短的精準的回應好嗎謝謝委員那這一部分原則上都有做這樣的一個所謂的連結的會議那不務審理的或者是所謂的交嚴管或告誡也會轉介過去那聽起來你們是有嗎"},{"start":263.312,"end":291.09,"text":"要不然就把相关的这个比较细节性本席这边比较强调你们的频率还有结果是什么那是不是把相关资料提供给本席因为您这边说有嘛好不好那第三个部分是呢司法院是不是要研拟的一个修法的方向然后来将跨院级协商的平台制度化常态化那么并设置专职的单位跟跨机关的这个资源整合的这个平台来做政策追踪"},{"start":292.856,"end":321.329,"text":"是不是可以研議然後來實行呢是 委員剛剛委員的說明的槌尋那其中有一個部分比較難克服就是因為在CRC就是這個兒權公約裡面落實在內國法化以後我國少年司法必須是最小化來約束這個所謂的非行少年處罰少年或偏差但是你們有沒有去觀察到那自從這樣子之後呢"},{"start":322.449,"end":329.536,"text":"那整個的這個在邵氏的這個處理上是不是有效度嗎還是現在變成一個三不管地帶原則上在108年修法以後把邵氏法有關剛剛委員說的曝險偏差等都移到這個所謂的這個邵府會"},{"start":343.168,"end":357.623,"text":"那你們有沒有追蹤呢 少府會那這樣子對於整個後來的這個犯罪處意還有到最後犯罪化的一個路徑是不是到最後是那個在這段過程裡面問題可能比較沒有看得到可是問題在後面發生了 你們"},{"start":358.504,"end":381.764,"text":"你們的看法呢少府會這一端我們各縣市各少年法庭這個本席在先前問過很多次就是少府會各縣市政府都有但是本席這邊提到就是說那你們真正了解少府會在執行的一個狀況嗎還有少府會的這個困難你們知不知道本席很快的講啦因為在這樣繼續本席是很有階段性的來追蹤這件事情是不是這樣啦這整個"},{"start":384.847,"end":413.01,"text":"整個是社會結構性的一個問題那麼如果這個部分現在把它推往後面也就是犯罪化的這個部分會越來越多那我們看到的少府會其實他們很多時候是叫不動人的所以教育 社政 司法就變成各自為政很重要的一個狀況是本席在先前其實有提到中央是不是應該設立一個專職的少府會的平台來研議不僅固定召開的機制"},{"start":413.43,"end":420.206,"text":"然後還要專責單位的追蹤跟成效的評估那至少這個部分你們可以給本席一個專業的報告吧"},{"start":422.324,"end":441.639,"text":"本席已經提過很多次上次上次是上次的質詢那我已經提過這個概念了那你們對於這個部分的研議你知道本席講的問題嗎就是說當你覺得少府會現在以最小程度去影響的話呢那是不是他問題是往後推了我不知道你們沒有追蹤這個部分還有少府會實際執行的狀況他們叫得動其他相關單位嗎"},{"start":445.842,"end":457.688,"text":"那如果中央沒有相關的錢跟相關的人那地方的這個可能很多時候在施政的前後順序上就會被影響了你了解我講的意思嗎"},{"start":459.295,"end":482.339,"text":"如果不了解麻煩你們會後再來跟本席確定好嗎那最重要是本席提出來一個中央的少婦會的這個平台那這樣子的延期報告希望你們能夠在兩個月之內給本席好嗎這個本席其實之前有講過相關的議題這個是本席一直在關心的但是現在只是做階段性的確認你們目前的進度可以嗎"},{"start":486.401,"end":505.807,"text":"接下來本席要跟您討論的是司法人力的問題我想人力不足還有負擔太重一直是本席先前也一直關心的問題整個司法品質跟人權的課題會跟基層司法人力過勞會有很大的影響"},{"start":506.867,"end":530.972,"text":"所以根據你們的統計在111年度到今天法院的案量逐漸攀升其實這跟本席剛才在講的概念有點接近你們現在不是哪一個階段問題在這邊沒有發生後面就不會發生了所以你們看全國法院的案量逐年在攀升111年新收的案件大概有45萬件"},{"start":533.233,"end":556.292,"text":"45万多件后面零头本席就先省略112年度又增加到了48万多件然后113年度增加到了51万多件每年的成长幅度都超过一成其实是114年度7月底新收案件跟上年度的同期相比增幅已经达到了8.1这样的趋势其实没有减缓"},{"start":557.557,"end":573.015,"text":"但是在這個同時呢平均結案的日數卻拉長111年度平均結案的時間大概在99天左右112年度上升到了100天左右那麼113年就直接上升到106天那麼"},{"start":575.177,"end":602.542,"text":"沒有結案的也從這個八萬一千多件呢達到了十萬多件那後面這個數字是不是後面代表的是法官書記官法官助理長期會過勞所以在去年四月社會發生了一件痛心的事情士林地院這個法官自殺那傳訊給妻子的內容是壓力大很累那各位你們覺得這樣子的事情應該發生嗎"},{"start":605.807,"end":622.558,"text":"這其實不是一個單純的工作分配的問題司法整個長期人力負荷還有績效比跟心理上的一個負擔這個問題在司法改革裡面我相信你們應該有討論但是法條制度跟資訊化的建設"},{"start":624.739,"end":637.527,"text":"比不上好好來關係承載這一切的人那麼如果人沒有被當成主體來照顧的話那久了之後也是會失去靈魂的不知道您的看法是如何"},{"start":638.633,"end":654.048,"text":"謝謝委員關心槌尋這個問題確實就是說 我們法院的案件每年事實上 收案都是一直在逐步增加的是啊 收案增加 然後結案日也延長特別是刑事案件 我們的統計數字從111年到113年"},{"start":658.712,"end":682.847,"text":"那個地方法院都平均都已經有成長到百分之十二到那個十五之間那高院跟最高法院都是這樣子一個趨向但是我們相對的我們每年那個人力沒有辦法增加那我們也面臨了就是我們總緣額法就是全部在司法體系的總緣額法是一萬五千的那個上限所以你們怎麼克服本席剛才講的那個問題呢所以就是我們現在那個"},{"start":683.647,"end":709.089,"text":"我們現在也是很積極的就是去跟相關單位去跟他們反映我們的問題就是說第一個看總融合法能不能突破這是一點那第二個我們司法院就是也採取了各種措施就是說怎麼樣去優化這一些程序讓程序上面可不可以就是比較精簡那這樣本席希望你提供幾個具體的相關資料"},{"start":712.071,"end":729.331,"text":"那麼你們今年是不是有在針對案件暴增跟審理負荷進行全面性的分析有沒有相關的資料因為你現在回答大概時間上也不夠了目前各地方法院平均每個法案法官跟書記官的案量是多少"},{"start":729.952,"end":744.974,"text":"然後第二個部分呢是第一線心理人第一線人員的這個心理健康跟過勞的防治目前正式的支持跟申訴的機制是如何那麼你們如何健全健治健康檢測跟心理輔導的制度"},{"start":745.655,"end":770.734,"text":"那第三個部分是目前你們針對案件分流方面有些什麼改革那麼像輕微的案件的處理還有電子調節AI輔助等等目前做到哪裡那麼針對即將達到的進度落實的情形是如何那你可不可以簡短回應有做的或者是還沒有做的或者是您要怎麼樣提供給本席相關的這個資料可不可以簡單的回應"},{"start":771.354,"end":787.711,"text":"委員時間的關係我們可以提出一份報告那就有關於第三點那個案件分流的部分這個也是我們現在司法行政在倡導的就是說希望那個案件來的時候可以先有一個審查的機制就是讓它分流所以現在有了嗎你們在倡導但是開始做了嗎"},{"start":788.771,"end":807.56,"text":"這是其中一部分 就是我們採取的措施很多那另外也在這個地方 藉在這裡那個呼籲就是說希望在那個司法預算方面的那個立法委員能夠大家都希望有更多的錢來做更多的事只要你們提出來的合理 國民黨是一定支持的好嗎 但是針對本席剛才所講的"},{"start":808.6,"end":823.586,"text":"不要把現階段的問題挪後了然後就當成這個部分績效是很好的可是我們可以在別的部分看到延遲處理的結果是導致更大的社會成本請記得本席的這句話"},{"start":824.466,"end":849.323,"text":"那本席今天關心的都是長期以來在關心的那請給本席一個具體的從本席開始關心到現在你們所做的措施然後從現在開始那到未來你們定的期程點本席要很清楚的看到時間跟做法可以嗎我們會提出報告那我們的困境也會在上面反映希望那個委員能夠支持好的那謝謝複民署長好 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":584,"blocks":[["林委員倩綺：（11時23分）謝謝主席翁召委。先請司法院副秘書長。"],["主席：有請王副祕。"],["王副秘書長梅英：委員早。"],["林委員倩綺：好，早安。早上聽到很多同仁在這邊的討論，我覺得也滿正面，滿有效度的。也謝謝司法院，對於剛才翁委員講的那個報告，我也是非常期待你們的一些看法，所以你們應該在不同的面向提出一些看法，讓大家比較能夠正面來思考，更縝密地從司法的觀點上來看法官不語跟法官要語這件事情。"],["王副秘書長梅英：是。"],["林委員倩綺：好，謝謝。","本席今天針對幾個長期有在關注的事情來跟你們討論。本席長期關注有關於少年司法的問題，今天要談的是，依本席的觀察，少年司法跟行政輔導體系之間有一些割裂的現象。少年偏差的行為，常常是家庭、學校、社會等很多重壓力交織，而產生了某一些結果，但是司法跟行政體系如果銜接沒有那麼有效度的話，再多的制度也會變成一種空談。所以依據少年事件處理法第三條的規定，符合一定偏差行為的少年，由少年法院來處理，法院可以依同法的第二十五條來請求警政、教育、醫療等系統的協助，或者依照第四十二條，開整合協調的會議。但實際運作的範圍目前多局限在觸法或曝險少年，對於偏差行為還沒有觸法的高風險的少年，整個介入的能量，依本席的觀察，有點不足。根據現行少年偏差行為預防及輔導辦法第二條的規定，少年的偏差行為包含了逃家、離家、幫派結交、深夜外出、暴力行為等等十多種情形。這些行為如果早期能夠早一點介入，有效引導，可能會讓未來走向形式化的處遇的情形變少。本席發現，實務上這些少年往往處在管轄模糊帶，有些教育機構認為少輔會會處理；少輔會又會認為不符開案條件；社政機關又會以保護個案為由不介入，大家都不介入，結果最後最關鍵的時機就因此而延誤了。所以我們希望能夠正視這個制度性的落差，司法院有權來召開跨機關的協調會議，根據現行的法制，行政院跟司法院有定期召開相關的會議嗎？有嗎？"],["王副秘書長梅英：有。"],["林委員倩綺：好。但是相關的規定是，法律上只說「得召開」，沒有說「應召開」，也沒有相關的單位來負責追蹤。所以本席要問幾個問題：第一個是，司法院跟行政院過去幾年總共召開多少跨院際的少年事件政策性協商平台會議？頻率上有多少？"],["王副秘書長梅英：就這一點，司法院和行政院的政策平台會議是一年兩次，都有固定在進行。"],["林委員倩綺：一年兩次嘛？"],["王副秘書長梅英：是。"],["林委員倩綺：是不是把過去五年會議裡面的追蹤報告提供給本席？"],["王副秘書長梅英：可以。"],["林委員倩綺：好。","第二個部分是，目前少年法院跟地方少輔會的協作，有沒有明確的通報機制？那麼少年法院不付審理或轉向處分的時候，少輔會是不是及時接手，確保不中斷的輔導鏈？"],["王副秘書長梅英：這個部分容我請廳長來說明。"],["林委員倩綺：好。廳長來簡短地、精準地回應，好嗎？"],["鍾廳長宗霖：謝謝委員。這一部分原則上都有做連結的會議，不付審理的或交嚴管或告誡的案子也會轉介過去。"],["林委員倩綺：聽起來你們是有嘛，要不然就把相關的比較細節性的相關資料提供給本席。本席比較強調的是你們的頻率還有結果是什麼，那是不是把相關資料提供給本席？因為您說有嘛，好不好？"],["鍾廳長宗霖：可以。"],["林委員倩綺：好。那第三個部分是，司法院是不是要研擬一個修法的方向，來將跨院際協商的平台制度化、常態化，並設置專職的單位跟跨機關資源整合的平台，來做政策追蹤？是不是可以研議然後實行呢？"],["鍾廳長宗霖：是。剛剛委員的垂詢，其中有一個部分比較難克服，因為在CRC（兒權公約）落實為國內法化以後，我國少年司法必須是最小化來約束非行少年、觸法少年或偏差行為少年，所以才會……"],["林委員倩綺：但是你們有沒有去觀察，自從這樣子之後，少事的處理是不是有效度，還是現在變成三不管地帶？"],["鍾廳長宗霖：原則上，在108年修法以後，把少事法中有關剛剛委員說曝險、偏差等部分都移到少輔會，少輔會……"],["林委員倩綺：你們有沒有追蹤這樣子對於後來的犯罪處遇及到最後犯罪化的路徑有何影響？在這段過程裡面，問題可能比較沒有看得到，可是問題在後面發生了，你們的看法呢？"],["鍾廳長宗霖：少輔會這一端，各縣市各少年法庭……"],["林委員倩綺：這個問題本席在先前問過很多次，就是少輔會各縣市政府都有，但是本席要提的就是，那你們真正了解少輔會在執行的狀況嗎？還有少輔會的困難，你們知不知道？本席很快地講，本席是很有階段性地來追蹤這件事情。"],["鍾廳長宗霖：了解，了解。"],["林委員倩綺：這整個是社會結構性的問題，如果這個部分現在把它推往後面，也就是犯罪化的部分會越來越多，那我們看到的少輔會，其實他們很多時候是叫不動人的，所以教育、社政、司法就變成各自為政。很重要的一個狀況是，本席在先前其實有提到，中央是不是應該設立一個專職的少輔會的平台來研議？不僅要有固定召開的機制，還要有專責單位的追蹤跟成效的評估，至少這個部分，你們可以給本席一個專業的報告吧？本席已經提過很多次，上一次是上次的質詢，我已經提過這個概念了，那你們對於這個部分的研議，你知道本席講的問題嗎？就是說，當你覺得少輔會現在以最小程度去影響的話，那是不是把問題往後推了？我不知道你們有沒有追蹤這個部分。還有少輔會實際執行的狀況，他們叫得動其他相關單位嗎？如果中央沒有相關的錢跟相關的人，而地方在施政的前後順序上，可能很多時候就會被影響，你了解我講的意思嗎？如果不了解，麻煩你們會後再來跟本席確定，好嗎？最重要的是，關於中央少輔會平台的研析報告，希望你們能夠在兩個月之內給本席，好嗎？本席其實之前有講過相關的議題，這個是本席一直在關心的，但是現在只是做階段性的確認你們目前的進度，可以嗎？"],["鍾廳長宗霖：可以。"],["林委員倩綺：好，謝謝。","接下來本席要跟您討論的是司法人力的問題。人力不足和負擔太重一直是本席關心的問題，整個司法品質跟人權的課題對基層司法人力過勞有很大的影響。根據你們的統計，從111年度到今天，法院的案量逐漸攀升，這跟本席剛才在講的概念有一點接近，你們現在不是哪一個階段問題沒有發生，後面就不會發生了。所以你們看，全國法院的案量逐年攀升，111年新收的案件大概有四十五萬多件，112年度又增加到了四十八萬多件，然後113年度增加到了五十一萬多件，每一年的成長幅度都超過一成。截至114年度7月底，新收案件跟上年度的同期相比，增幅已經達到了8.1%，這樣的趨勢其實沒有減緩，但是同時平均結案的日數卻拉長！111年度平均結案的時間大概在99天左右，112年度上升到了100天左右，113年就直接上升到106天，沒有結案的案件，也從這個八萬一千多件達到了十萬多件！這個數字後面代表的是法官、書記官、法官助理長期過勞，所以在去年4月社會發生了一件令人痛心的事情，就是士林地院有法官自殺，他傳訊給妻子的內容是說他壓力大，很累。各位，你們覺得這樣子的事情應該發生嗎？這其實不是一個單純的工作分配的問題，司法長期人力負荷、績效評比及心理負擔的問題，在司法改革過程裡面，我相信你們應該有討論。但是法條制度跟資訊化的建設比不上好好來關心承載這一切的人！如果人沒有被當成主體來照顧的話，久了之後也是會失去靈魂的，我不知道您的看法是如何。"],["王副秘書長梅英：謝謝委員關心垂詢這個問題，事實上法院收案每年都是一直在逐步增加。"],["林委員倩綺：是啊。收案增加，然後結案日也延長。"],["王副秘書長梅英：特別是刑事案件，根據我們的統計數字，從111年到113年，地方法院的刑事案件平均都已經成長到12%到15%之間，高院跟最高法院也都是這樣子的趨向。但是相對地，我們每年人力沒有辦法增加，我們也面臨了總員額法的限制，依照總員額法，司法體系總員額的上限是1萬5,000人，馬上已經要到頂……"],["林委員倩綺：所以你們怎麼克服本席剛才講的那個問題呢？"],["王副秘書長梅英：所以我們現在也是很積極地去跟相關單位反映我們的問題：第一個，看總員額法能不能突破；第二個，司法院也採取了各種措施，設法去優化程序，讓程序比較精簡。"],["林委員倩綺：本席希望你提供幾個具體的相關資料：第一個部分，你們今年是不是有針對案件暴增跟審理負荷進行全面性的分析？有沒有相關的資料？就算你現在回答，大概時間也不夠了。目前各地方法院平均每個法官跟書記官的案量是多少？","第二個部分是，第一線人員的心理健康跟過勞的防治，目前正式的支持跟申訴的機制是如何？你們如何健全建置健康檢測跟心理輔導的制度？","第三個部分是，目前你們針對案件分流方面，有些什麼改革？像輕微的案件的處理，還有電子調節、AI輔助等等，目前做到哪裡？針對即將達到的進度，落實的情形是如何？你可不可以簡短回應有做或還沒有做的，或者是您要怎麼樣提供給本席相關資料，可不可以簡單回應？"],["王副秘書長梅英：委員，因為時間的關係，我們可以提出一份報告，有關於第三點案件分流的部分，這個也是我們現在司法行政在倡導的，希望案件來的時候，可以先有一個審查的機制。"],["林委員倩綺：現在有了嗎？你們在倡導，但是開始做了嗎？"],["王副秘書長梅英：這只是其中一部分，我們採取的措施很多。另外，也借機會在這裡呼籲，希望在司法預算審查上，立法委員能夠……"],["林委員倩綺：大家都希望有更多的錢來做更多的事，只要你們提出來的合理，國民黨是一定支持的，好嗎？"],["王副秘書長梅英：是。"],["林委員倩綺：但是針對本席剛才所講的，不要把現階段的問題挪後了，然後就當成這個部分的績效是很好的，因為我們可以在別的部分看到，延遲處理的結果是導致更大的社會成本，請記得本席的這句話。"],["王副秘書長梅英：是。"],["林委員倩綺：本席今天關心的都是長期以來在關心的，請給本席一個具體的報告，內容是從本席開始關心到現在你們所做的措施。然後從現在開始，到未來你們訂的期程點，本席要很清楚地看到時間跟做法，可以嗎？"],["王副秘書長梅英：我們會提出報告，我們的困境也會在上面反映，希望委員能夠支持我們改善。"],["林委員倩綺：好的。謝謝副秘書長。"],["王副秘書長梅英：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝林委員。","接下來請張啓楷委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":110,"meet_id":"委員會-11-4-36-4","speakers":["翁曉玲","黃國昌","羅智強","吳宗憲","王鴻薇","沈發惠","王義川","陳培瑜","吳思瑤","林倩綺","張啓楷","林國成","莊瑞雄","賴惠員","傅崐萁"],"page_start":59,"meetingDate":["2025-10-22"],"gazette_id":"1148801","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1148801_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期司法及法制委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請司法院秘書長列席說明立法計畫，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1148801_00002"}}}