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\"中部地區的民眾已經承受夠了他九月份的時候解約了九月份的時候解約那怎麼辦\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 394.785, \"end\": 395.165, \"score\": 0.764}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 395.165, \"end\": 395.306, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 395.306, \"end\": 395.606, \"score\": 0.754}, {\"word\": \"區\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 395.606, \"end\": 395.746, \"score\": 0.602}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 395.746, \"end\": 396.126, \"score\": 0.737}, {\"word\": \"眾\"}, {\"word\": \"已\", \"start\": 396.126, \"end\": 396.406, \"score\": 0.743}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"承\", \"start\": 396.406, \"end\": 396.647, \"score\": 0.675}, {\"word\": \"受\", \"start\": 396.647, \"end\": 397.207, \"score\": 0.825}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 397.207, \"end\": 397.607, \"score\": 0.725}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 397.607, \"end\": 397.767, \"score\": 0.557}, {\"word\": \"九\", \"start\": 397.767, \"end\": 397.947, \"score\": 0.763}, {\"word\": \"月\", \"start\": 397.947, \"end\": 398.148, \"score\": 0.906}, {\"word\": \"份\", \"start\": 398.148, \"end\": 398.288, \"score\": 0.844}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 398.288, \"end\": 398.648, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 398.648, \"end\": 398.948, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 398.948, \"end\": 399.369, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"約\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 399.369, \"end\": 400.089, \"score\": 0.862}, {\"word\": \"九\", \"start\": 400.089, \"end\": 400.269, \"score\": 0.823}, {\"word\": \"月\", \"start\": 400.269, \"end\": 400.429, \"score\": 0.683}, {\"word\": \"份\", \"start\": 400.429, \"end\": 400.589, \"score\": 0.806}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 400.589, \"end\": 400.87, \"score\": 0.841}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 400.87, \"end\": 401.11, \"score\": 0.844}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 401.11, \"end\": 401.13, \"score\": 0.192}, {\"word\": \"約\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 401.13, \"end\": 401.25, \"score\": 0.83}, {\"word\": \"怎\", \"start\": 401.25, \"end\": 401.27, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"辦\"}]}, {\"start\": 404.42, \"end\": 426.536, \"text\": \"所以我們就是盡量還是會趕啊什麼叫做盡量就是委員跟我們的想法一樣盡快把這個氣起來以後煤可以降下來這是我們共同的願望但是如果有實質上的困難政府口口聲聲告訴我們不管綠能不管這個天然氣我們都全力的支持你現在告訴我們這個\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 404.42, \"end\": 404.52, \"score\": 0.836}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 404.52, \"end\": 404.6, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 404.6, \"end\": 405.04, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 405.04, \"end\": 405.181, \"score\": 0.867}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 405.181, \"end\": 405.461, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"盡\"}, {\"word\": \"量\", \"start\": 405.461, \"end\": 405.801, \"score\": 0.905}, {\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 405.801, \"end\": 406.121, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"趕\"}, {\"word\": \"啊\", \"start\": 406.121, \"end\": 406.682, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 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\"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:06,971 --> 00:00:08,733\n謝謝謝謝主席陽俊發言我們邀請部長我們請部長\n\n2\n00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:44,229\n谢谢部长今天本席也提出修正动议这个目的也就是在整个能源的安全事前的防范事后的处罚这个加重希望能够在能源方面可以达到一个安全我希望得到行政部门的一个支持重点在于除了我们事后的罚则之外最重要的现在是以\n\n3\n00:00:45,210 --> 00:00:59,332\n就是故意達成傷害者那但是在整個過程當中如果行為者他達成傷害那也必須要有所處置你同不同意這樣的一個原則是是是現在就是\n\n4\n00:01:00,529 --> 00:01:23,789\n即便他不是故意的也有罚词是过失的好非常的感谢终于今天本席提了三个修正动力的目的也就是这个精神所以待会我们如果在逐条审查的时候也敬请我们同仁以及行政部门来支持我们真正目的也就是需要能够真正的安全这是非常重要防堵\n\n5\n00:01:24,429 --> 00:01:40,455\n那同時在電越法跟天然氣施越法以及自來水這個三法修法的當中我們就是剛剛所說的為了要加重對海底電纜輸氣與送水管線遭破壞的一個行者所以我們說如果事後追陳\n\n6\n00:01:41,275 --> 00:01:48,959\n當然他雖然有二組作用但是他缺乏了一個及時的一個監測機制一旦損傷造成了全民的斷電斷氣斷水這個連鎖危機那麼有鑒於此所以我們呢必須要建立一個什麼呢事前防護的一個體系讓能源輸配網具備有\n\n7\n00:02:05,306 --> 00:02:27,970\n預警以及快速的應變能力我們今天主要的修法的目的是不是以這樣子的一個精神為目標而執行之呢是的我們方向是這樣那我們會跟海巡署事實上是配合搭配因為他們這個海上作業是這個巡查是他們在處理那我們一旦他們也會針對船隻上\n\n8\n00:02:30,891 --> 00:02:45,404\n他要開AIS然後定位他然後看他的意圖等等一些情況那我們會把我們所有的管線的相關資料提供給海巡讓他們知道說這個地方事實上是我們很重要的一個區域是跨部會的一個\n\n9\n00:02:47,506 --> 00:03:05,854\n合縱聯合這是非常的重要所以我也謝謝部長剛剛我們在討論當中也就是針對今天所修的這個三個法本席提出三個修正動議更明確的來說明更明確的能夠讓執行者有所依歸也就是強化與\n\n10\n00:03:08,216 --> 00:03:13,901\n這個執行的這個效能來穩定能源的安全我們的目標就是以這兩個為基準是不是是的那所以我們面對於整個海底設施的安全的威脅我們必須要設置可即使偵測異常\n\n11\n00:03:27,273 --> 00:03:38,461\n來作為預警的功能的防護系統是不是如此是我們對一旦有發生異樣的時候我們就會資訊會回饋給我們我們馬上會跟海巡來通聯\n\n12\n00:03:40,030 --> 00:03:59,640\n這個非常的重要所以本行要說明的是說能源的安全我們不是只有事後有罰我們還要事前可防是不是如此是好那我們也希望再一次的說明到時候我們審查法案的時候那目標都一致那也希望得到\n\n13\n00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:26,637\n修正動議得到這三個得到行政部門以及國會同仁大家的支持接下來本席要跟你討論的是6月3號立法院通過了2028年無煤中火的這個案子那但是呢您經濟部一直說您有困難當時你不是部長因為你現在是部長所以本席要跟你討論這個問題你的理由是說中火的二期燃氣呢必須要55個月\n\n14\n00:04:28,118 --> 00:04:36,604\n但是事實上中國的一期它的燃氣兩部機組會在於2025跟2026年來完工裝置的容量是2600MW裝置的容量讓它足以太舊4.7部的燃煤機組那不僅如此到現在2024年中國減煤630萬公噸\n\n15\n00:04:52,595 --> 00:05:10,070\n2025年一起上線它可以再淘汰432.5萬公噸2026年它可以再增加民營的中央這一個燃氣的電廠跟中火燃氣一起的第二個機組它可以再減多少呢636萬公噸\n\n16\n00:05:13,684 --> 00:05:33,695\n6306萬公噸所以換句話說在2028年如果依照這樣的數字你們的規劃達成2028年中火無煤他是沒有問題的他是沒有問題的那請教部長因為你們現在一直以中火二期未完工來做藉口那民眾的聲音您聽到嗎請教部長\n\n17\n00:05:35,816 --> 00:06:05,462\n部長你先打一下吧因為總經理有跟我講因為你新任的部長啊如果真的可以達成我們當然是希望這樣但是中間這個數字是你們告訴我們的啊而且你們還告訴我們啊要找一天蒸氣你就要找一天撿煤啊找一天蒸氣找一天撿煤啊這是我們大家的共識啊對不對但是您剛才比如說您剛才提到的資料中加的部分基本上他已經不會做了就是說就解約了啦\n\n18\n00:06:06,053 --> 00:06:13,496\n所以說類似這樣的情況你們從頭到尾都跟我們說這個數字到現在潘朵拉的盒子打開你說宗家解約了對因為他是民間的不是我們台電沒有人不知道他是民間的當時你們都把他的量數都計算在內啊你怎麼會現在才跟我們說這個潘朵拉的盒子掀開是這樣不可看呢難怪我們的民眾這麼痛苦啊\n\n19\n00:06:34,785 --> 00:06:41,270\n中部地區的民眾已經承受夠了他九月份的時候解約了九月份的時候解約那怎麼辦\n\n20\n00:06:44,420 --> 00:07:06,536\n所以我們就是盡量還是會趕啊什麼叫做盡量就是委員跟我們的想法一樣盡快把這個氣起來以後煤可以降下來這是我們共同的願望但是如果有實質上的困難政府口口聲聲告訴我們不管綠能不管這個天然氣我們都全力的支持你現在告訴我們這個\n\n21\n00:07:08,257 --> 00:07:18,216\n九月份的事件我都不忍心講出來那我們中部地區該怎麼辦你一直告訴我們說要爭氣就減煤我們全力的支持\n\n22\n00:07:20,583 --> 00:07:37,037\n那你們現在告訴我你現在說你們有困難那你的困難我告訴你們你至少要告訴我們你們要怎麼樣逐年減煤請告訴我時辰請告訴我時辰我絕對不同意只有到2034年才無煤這個我們絕對抗議到底\n\n23\n00:07:39,016 --> 00:08:03,541\n跟委員報告整個電力系統的要穩定供電其實要考慮到供電的發電的高度跟我們運轉電廠的時間總經理這個是你們之前要爭氣你們都說過了如果你們沒有這些KPI你怎麼去執行呢你現在告訴我這些論述本席具體要求你告訴我\n\n24\n00:08:04,341 --> 00:08:06,522\n你們現在告訴我們是2031年2034年這個區間你才要5枚那你們這段時間都不減煤嗎那你告訴我沒關係你告訴我你告訴我你現在有困難你要怎麼樣逐年去減煤告訴我時程告訴我數據我們同意逐年減煤然後把數據會後會\n\n25\n00:08:27,048 --> 00:08:35,211\n你現在就可以告訴我啦你已經告訴我們2031年2034年我是不同意的當那個時間才無美你現在有增加這些設備本席剛剛已經告訴過你囉本席告訴過你囉你的2025、2026年完工運轉你可以增加2600MW你可以拆除了4.7部的燃煤機組耶\n\n26\n00:08:52,717 --> 00:09:18,748\n跟委員報告你已經失去餘名你說你的政績上路你就要給我們的煙囪這個這個這個摘除跟委員報告那你現在還要保留運轉你為什麼要這麼欺負我們中部人呢跟委員報告最近這幾天天氣比較涼我們中火本來是10部機組也其實都運轉到大概4部或5部的機組在運轉而已其實就是在照顧中部的\n\n27\n00:09:18,848 --> 00:09:36,639\n你能不能告訴我在你一起燃氣機組20252026陸續上線之後我們有所本有所本你們的預估就是如此你上線之後你要告訴我們你的逐步減煤時程\n\n28\n00:09:37,912 --> 00:09:59,660\n跟委員報告告訴我們怎麼樣減你會不會逐步去減電力的運轉跟調度是需要彈性的當然彈性所以我本期問你你會不會逐步逐年去減我們會逐步去做盡量去做但是我們不敢承諾一個數字給你們因為只要承諾一個數字我們就一定要努力必須要做到\n\n29\n00:10:00,580 --> 00:10:20,325\n全國的民眾聽到中部地區的民眾聽到政府告訴我們你蒸汽要給我們減煤你現在不敢告訴我時程不敢告訴我數字因為不敢說的原因是有太多的變數包括像再生能源上來的進度怎麼樣這個都影響到我們電力運轉的所以政府一場騙\n\n30\n00:10:21,485 --> 00:10:28,650\n沒有騙之前告訴我們你們的能源占比有多少你的綠能有多少你現在告訴我你什麼都沒有穩定供電還是我們第一要務那我們中部機器人的健康怎麼辦呢怎麼辦呢我至少一個卑微的要求我們不同意到2031到2034年才是無煤所以我們卑微的要求你告訴我逐年\n\n31\n00:10:49,605 --> 00:11:11,530\n你的減煤到底是多少這樣子的卑微的說的要求你都沒有幫我告訴我們數字台電一定會盡量去做到盡量做到但是總經理我對你是非常的尊敬因為你是非常務實但是你今天告訴我這些內容我真的是嚇一跳\n\n32\n00:11:12,887 --> 00:11:30,875\n原來之前所說的都是一場騙時間到了你這樣我只有卑微的要求你告訴我你逐年沒關係你逐年減煤的數量告訴本席可不可以總經理不是你不可以說數字我絕對不接受台電公司告訴我減煤的時程跟減煤的量數不可以坦白說數字\n\n33\n00:11:43,444 --> 00:12:01,775\n我們請我們經濟部還有我們台電我們找我們瓊益委員把這些我們可以瞭解的可以告知的這些相關的數字跟我們瓊益委員瞭解一下好不好好謝謝你多點時間可以將你的時程告訴本席你的時程跟你的減煤計畫\n\n34\n00:12:03,663 --> 00:12:24,834\n告訴我們不是找時間報告我具體要求在經濟委員會要求行政部門台電公司請你將你們的燃氣機組上了20252026你可以有2600MW的增加我沒有理由不要求你要減煤\n\n35\n00:12:26,335 --> 00:12:30,018\n你告訴我們正氣就要減煤我很卑微的要求行政部門請你把我的時間要求你逐年減煤的時間跟量數\n\n36\n00:12:40,918 --> 00:12:56,144\n給本席請委員給我們一點運轉的空間什麼時候告訴本席沒關係你告訴我什麼時間你的時程跟你的減煤數量告訴本席我們下禮拜去找瓊英委員報告一下好不好不是不是主席\n\n37\n00:12:56,864 --> 00:13:07,911\n我們質詢有要求時間的權利告訴我們內容我不敢你講不出來我沒有辦法要求你現在講但是我們還為選民負責我們替選民來問你什麼時間你告訴我們你們逐年遞減的時間跟\n\n38\n00:13:14,054 --> 00:13:21,700\n減煤的量數我們可以提出我們怎麼樣盡量做到的對你什麼時候可以告訴本席你給我一個時間就好你下個禮拜去找不是不是你告訴我你們去討論嘛\n\n39\n00:13:29,266 --> 00:13:55,636\n一個月的時間我們把我們盡量怎麼做到的方式或怎樣再跟委員就教就是我們會寫出書面報告來請你們好好告訴我們民眾需要指導中部地區民眾真的辛苦了而且我們有條件也有權利要求我們付出的夠了我們希望我們也全力支持政府的政策爭氣減煤要講到做到啊\n\n40\n00:13:57,250 --> 00:13:57,591\n好謝謝謝謝趙偉的質詢謝謝謝謝部長謝謝總經理謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n6971\t8733\t謝謝謝謝主席 陽俊發言我們邀請部長我們請部長\n18000\t44229\t谢谢部长今天本席也提出修正动议这个目的也就是在整个能源的安全事前的防范事后的处罚这个加重希望能够在能源方面可以达到一个安全我希望得到行政部门的一个支持重点在于除了我们事后的罚则之外最重要的现在是以\n45210\t59332\t就是故意達成傷害者那但是在整個過程當中如果行為者他達成傷害那也必須要有所處置你同不同意這樣的一個原則是是是現在就是\n60529\t83789\t即便他不是故意的也有罚词是过失的好 非常的感谢终于今天本席提了三个修正动力的目的也就是这个精神所以待会我们如果在逐条审查的时候也敬请我们同仁以及行政部门来支持我们真正目的也就是需要能够真正的安全这是非常重要防堵\n84429\t100455\t那同時在電越法跟天然氣施越法以及自來水這個三法修法的當中我們就是剛剛所說的為了要加重對海底電纜輸氣與送水管線遭破壞的一個行者所以我們說如果事後追陳\n101275\t108959\t當然他雖然有二組作用但是他缺乏了一個及時的一個監測機制一旦損傷造成了全民的斷電斷氣斷水這個連鎖危機那麼有鑒於此所以我們呢必須要建立一個什麼呢事前防護的一個體系讓能源輸配網具備有\n125306\t147970\t預警以及快速的應變能力我們今天主要的修法的目的是不是以這樣子的一個精神為目標而執行之呢是的 我們方向是這樣那我們會跟海巡署事實上是配合搭配因為他們這個海上作業是這個巡查是他們在處理那我們一旦他們也會針對船隻上\n150891\t165404\t他要開AIS然後定位他然後看他的意圖等等一些情況那我們會把我們所有的管線的相關資料提供給海巡讓他們知道說這個地方事實上是我們很重要的一個區域是跨部會的一個\n167506\t185854\t合縱聯合這是非常的重要所以我也謝謝部長剛剛我們在討論當中也就是針對今天所修的這個三個法本席提出三個修正動議更明確的來說明更明確的能夠讓執行者有所依歸也就是強化與\n188216\t193901\t這個執行的這個效能來穩定能源的安全我們的目標就是以這兩個為基準是不是 是的那所以我們面對於整個海底設施的安全的威脅我們必須要設置可即使偵測異常\n207273\t218461\t來作為預警的功能的防護系統 是不是如此是 我們 對 一旦有發生異樣的時候我們就會 資訊會回饋給我們我們馬上會跟海巡來通聯\n220030\t239640\t這個非常的重要所以本行要說明的是說能源的安全我們不是只有事後有罰我們還要事前可防是不是如此是好那我們也希望再一次的說明到時候我們審查法案的時候那目標都一致那也希望得到\n240000\t266637\t修正動議得到這三個得到行政部門以及國會同仁大家的支持接下來本席要跟你討論的是6月3號立法院通過了2028年無煤中火的這個案子那但是呢您經濟部一直說您有困難當時你不是部長因為你現在是部長所以本席要跟你討論這個問題你的理由是說中火的二期燃氣呢必須要55個月\n268118\t276604\t但是事實上中國的一期它的燃氣兩部機組會在於2025跟2026年來完工裝置的容量是2600MW裝置的容量讓它足以太舊4.7部的燃煤機組那不僅如此到現在2024年中國減煤630萬公噸\n292595\t310070\t2025年一起上線它可以再淘汰432.5萬公噸2026年它可以再增加民營的中央這一個燃氣的電廠跟中火燃氣一起的第二個機組它可以再減多少呢 636萬公噸\n313684\t333695\t630 6萬公噸所以換句話說在2028年如果依照這樣的數字你們的規劃達成2028年中火無煤他是沒有問題的他是沒有問題的那請教部長因為你們現在一直以中火二期未完工來做藉口那民眾的聲音您聽到嗎請教部長\n335816\t365462\t部長你先打一下吧因為總經理有跟我講因為你新任的部長啊如果真的可以達成我們當然是希望這樣但是中間這個數字是你們告訴我們的啊而且你們還告訴我們啊要找一天蒸氣你就要找一天撿煤啊找一天蒸氣找一天撿煤啊這是我們大家的共識啊對不對但是您剛才比如說您剛才提到的資料中加的部分基本上他已經不會做了就是說就解約了啦\n366053\t373496\t所以說類似這樣的情況你們從頭到尾都跟我們說這個數字到現在潘朵拉的盒子打開你說宗家解約了對 因為他是民間的不是我們台電沒有人不知道他是民間的當時你們都把他的量數都計算在內啊你怎麼會現在才跟我們說這個潘朵拉的盒子掀開是這樣不可看呢難怪我們的民眾這麼痛苦啊\n394785\t401270\t中部地區的民眾已經承受夠了他九月份的時候解約了九月份的時候解約那怎麼辦\n404420\t426536\t所以我們就是盡量還是會趕啊什麼叫做盡量就是委員跟我們的想法一樣盡快把這個氣起來以後煤可以降下來這是我們共同的願望但是如果有實質上的困難政府口口聲聲告訴我們不管綠能不管這個天然氣我們都全力的支持你現在告訴我們這個\n428257\t438216\t九月份的事件我都不忍心講出來那我們中部地區該怎麼辦你一直告訴我們說要爭氣就減煤我們全力的支持\n440583\t457037\t那你們現在告訴我你現在說你們有困難那你的困難我告訴你們你至少要告訴我們你們要怎麼樣逐年減煤請告訴我時辰請告訴我時辰 我絕對不同意只有到2034年才無煤這個我們絕對抗議到底\n459016\t483541\t跟委員報告整個電力系統的要穩定供電其實要考慮到供電的發電的高度跟我們運轉電廠的時間總經理這個是你們之前要爭氣你們都說過了如果你們沒有這些KPI你怎麼去執行呢你現在告訴我這些論述本席具體要求你告訴我\n484341\t486522\t你們現在告訴我們是2031年2034年這個區間你才要5枚那你們這段時間都不減煤嗎那你告訴我沒關係你告訴我你告訴我你現在有困難你要怎麼樣逐年去減煤告訴我時程告訴我數據我們同意逐年減煤然後把數據會後會\n507048\t515211\t你現在就可以告訴我啦你已經告訴我們2031年2034年我是不同意的當那個時間才無美你現在有增加這些設備本席剛剛已經告訴過你囉本席告訴過你囉你的2025、2026年完工運轉你可以增加2600MW你可以拆除了4.7部的燃煤機組耶\n532717\t558748\t跟委員報告你已經失去餘名你說你的政績上路你就要給我們的煙囪這個這個這個摘除跟委員報告那你現在還要保留運轉你為什麼要這麼欺負我們中部人呢跟委員報告最近這幾天天氣比較涼我們中火本來是10部機組也其實都運轉到大概4部或5部的機組在運轉而已其實就是在照顧中部的\n558848\t576639\t你能不能告訴我在你一起燃氣機組2025 2026陸續上線之後我們有所本有所本你們的預估就是如此你上線之後你要告訴我們你的逐步減煤時程\n577912\t599660\t跟委員報告告訴我們怎麼樣減你會不會逐步去減電力的運轉跟調度是需要彈性的當然彈性所以我本期問你你會不會逐步逐年去減我們會逐步去做盡量去做但是我們不敢承諾一個數字給你們因為只要承諾一個數字我們就一定要努力必須要做到\n600580\t620325\t全國的民眾聽到中部地區的民眾聽到政府告訴我們你蒸汽要給我們減煤你現在不敢告訴我時程不敢告訴我數字因為不敢說的原因是有太多的變數包括像再生能源上來的進度怎麼樣這個都影響到我們電力運轉的所以政府一場騙\n621485\t628650\t沒有騙之前告訴我們你們的能源占比有多少你的綠能有多少你現在告訴我你什麼都沒有穩定供電還是我們第一要務那我們中部機器人的健康怎麼辦呢怎麼辦呢我至少一個卑微的要求我們不同意到2031到2034年才是無煤所以我們卑微的要求你告訴我逐年\n649605\t671530\t你的減煤到底是多少這樣子的卑微的說的要求你都沒有幫我告訴我們數字台電一定會盡量去做到盡量做到但是總經理我對你是非常的尊敬因為你是非常務實但是你今天告訴我這些內容我真的是嚇一跳\n672887\t690875\t原來之前所說的都是一場騙時間到了你這樣我只有卑微的要求你告訴我你逐年沒關係你逐年減煤的數量告訴本席可不可以總經理不是你不可以說數字我絕對不接受台電公司告訴我減煤的時程跟減煤的量數不可以坦白說數字\n703444\t721775\t我們請我們經濟部還有我們台電我們找我們瓊益委員把這些我們可以瞭解的可以告知的這些相關的數字跟我們瓊益委員瞭解一下好不好好謝謝你多點時間可以將你的時程告訴本席你的時程跟你的減煤計畫\n723663\t744834\t告訴我們不是找時間報告我具體要求在經濟委員會要求行政部門台電公司請你將你們的燃氣機組上了2025 2026你可以有2600MW的增加我沒有理由不要求你要減煤\n746335\t750018\t你告訴我們正氣就要減煤我很卑微的要求行政部門請你把我的時間要求你逐年減煤的時間跟量數\n760918\t776144\t給本席請委員給我們一點運轉的空間什麼時候告訴本席 沒關係你告訴我什麼時間你的時程跟你的減煤數量告訴本席我們下禮拜去找瓊英委員報告一下好不好不是不是 主席\n776864\t787911\t我們質詢有要求時間的權利告訴我們內容我不敢你講不出來我沒有辦法要求你現在講但是我們還為選民負責我們替選民來問你什麼時間你告訴我們你們逐年遞減的時間跟\n794054\t801700\t減煤的量數我們可以提出我們怎麼樣盡量做到的對你什麼時候可以告訴本席你給我一個時間就好你下個禮拜去找不是不是你告訴我你們去討論嘛\n809266\t835636\t一個月的時間我們把我們盡量怎麼做到的方式或怎樣再跟委員就教就是我們會寫出書面報告來請你們好好告訴我們民眾需要指導中部地區民眾真的辛苦了而且我們有條件也有權利要求我們付出的夠了我們希望我們也全力支持政府的政策爭氣減煤要講到做到啊\n837250\t837591\t好 謝謝 謝謝趙偉的質詢謝謝 謝謝部長 謝謝總經理 謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝謝謝主席 陽俊發言我們邀請部長我們請部長\n谢谢部长今天本席也提出修正动议这个目的也就是在整个能源的安全事前的防范事后的处罚这个加重希望能够在能源方面可以达到一个安全我希望得到行政部门的一个支持重点在于除了我们事后的罚则之外最重要的现在是以\n就是故意達成傷害者那但是在整個過程當中如果行為者他達成傷害那也必須要有所處置你同不同意這樣的一個原則是是是現在就是\n即便他不是故意的也有罚词是过失的好 非常的感谢终于今天本席提了三个修正动力的目的也就是这个精神所以待会我们如果在逐条审查的时候也敬请我们同仁以及行政部门来支持我们真正目的也就是需要能够真正的安全这是非常重要防堵\n那同時在電越法跟天然氣施越法以及自來水這個三法修法的當中我們就是剛剛所說的為了要加重對海底電纜輸氣與送水管線遭破壞的一個行者所以我們說如果事後追陳\n當然他雖然有二組作用但是他缺乏了一個及時的一個監測機制一旦損傷造成了全民的斷電斷氣斷水這個連鎖危機那麼有鑒於此所以我們呢必須要建立一個什麼呢事前防護的一個體系讓能源輸配網具備有\n預警以及快速的應變能力我們今天主要的修法的目的是不是以這樣子的一個精神為目標而執行之呢是的 我們方向是這樣那我們會跟海巡署事實上是配合搭配因為他們這個海上作業是這個巡查是他們在處理那我們一旦他們也會針對船隻上\n他要開AIS然後定位他然後看他的意圖等等一些情況那我們會把我們所有的管線的相關資料提供給海巡讓他們知道說這個地方事實上是我們很重要的一個區域是跨部會的一個\n合縱聯合這是非常的重要所以我也謝謝部長剛剛我們在討論當中也就是針對今天所修的這個三個法本席提出三個修正動議更明確的來說明更明確的能夠讓執行者有所依歸也就是強化與\n這個執行的這個效能來穩定能源的安全我們的目標就是以這兩個為基準是不是 是的那所以我們面對於整個海底設施的安全的威脅我們必須要設置可即使偵測異常\n來作為預警的功能的防護系統 是不是如此是 我們 對 一旦有發生異樣的時候我們就會 資訊會回饋給我們我們馬上會跟海巡來通聯\n這個非常的重要所以本行要說明的是說能源的安全我們不是只有事後有罰我們還要事前可防是不是如此是好那我們也希望再一次的說明到時候我們審查法案的時候那目標都一致那也希望得到\n修正動議得到這三個得到行政部門以及國會同仁大家的支持接下來本席要跟你討論的是6月3號立法院通過了2028年無煤中火的這個案子那但是呢您經濟部一直說您有困難當時你不是部長因為你現在是部長所以本席要跟你討論這個問題你的理由是說中火的二期燃氣呢必須要55個月\n但是事實上中國的一期它的燃氣兩部機組會在於2025跟2026年來完工裝置的容量是2600MW裝置的容量讓它足以太舊4.7部的燃煤機組那不僅如此到現在2024年中國減煤630萬公噸\n2025年一起上線它可以再淘汰432.5萬公噸2026年它可以再增加民營的中央這一個燃氣的電廠跟中火燃氣一起的第二個機組它可以再減多少呢 636萬公噸\n630 6萬公噸所以換句話說在2028年如果依照這樣的數字你們的規劃達成2028年中火無煤他是沒有問題的他是沒有問題的那請教部長因為你們現在一直以中火二期未完工來做藉口那民眾的聲音您聽到嗎請教部長\n部長你先打一下吧因為總經理有跟我講因為你新任的部長啊如果真的可以達成我們當然是希望這樣但是中間這個數字是你們告訴我們的啊而且你們還告訴我們啊要找一天蒸氣你就要找一天撿煤啊找一天蒸氣找一天撿煤啊這是我們大家的共識啊對不對但是您剛才比如說您剛才提到的資料中加的部分基本上他已經不會做了就是說就解約了啦\n所以說類似這樣的情況你們從頭到尾都跟我們說這個數字到現在潘朵拉的盒子打開你說宗家解約了對 因為他是民間的不是我們台電沒有人不知道他是民間的當時你們都把他的量數都計算在內啊你怎麼會現在才跟我們說這個潘朵拉的盒子掀開是這樣不可看呢難怪我們的民眾這麼痛苦啊\n中部地區的民眾已經承受夠了他九月份的時候解約了九月份的時候解約那怎麼辦\n所以我們就是盡量還是會趕啊什麼叫做盡量就是委員跟我們的想法一樣盡快把這個氣起來以後煤可以降下來這是我們共同的願望但是如果有實質上的困難政府口口聲聲告訴我們不管綠能不管這個天然氣我們都全力的支持你現在告訴我們這個\n九月份的事件我都不忍心講出來那我們中部地區該怎麼辦你一直告訴我們說要爭氣就減煤我們全力的支持\n那你們現在告訴我你現在說你們有困難那你的困難我告訴你們你至少要告訴我們你們要怎麼樣逐年減煤請告訴我時辰請告訴我時辰 我絕對不同意只有到2034年才無煤這個我們絕對抗議到底\n跟委員報告整個電力系統的要穩定供電其實要考慮到供電的發電的高度跟我們運轉電廠的時間總經理這個是你們之前要爭氣你們都說過了如果你們沒有這些KPI你怎麼去執行呢你現在告訴我這些論述本席具體要求你告訴我\n你們現在告訴我們是2031年2034年這個區間你才要5枚那你們這段時間都不減煤嗎那你告訴我沒關係你告訴我你告訴我你現在有困難你要怎麼樣逐年去減煤告訴我時程告訴我數據我們同意逐年減煤然後把數據會後會\n你現在就可以告訴我啦你已經告訴我們2031年2034年我是不同意的當那個時間才無美你現在有增加這些設備本席剛剛已經告訴過你囉本席告訴過你囉你的2025、2026年完工運轉你可以增加2600MW你可以拆除了4.7部的燃煤機組耶\n跟委員報告你已經失去餘名你說你的政績上路你就要給我們的煙囪這個這個這個摘除跟委員報告那你現在還要保留運轉你為什麼要這麼欺負我們中部人呢跟委員報告最近這幾天天氣比較涼我們中火本來是10部機組也其實都運轉到大概4部或5部的機組在運轉而已其實就是在照顧中部的\n你能不能告訴我在你一起燃氣機組2025 2026陸續上線之後我們有所本有所本你們的預估就是如此你上線之後你要告訴我們你的逐步減煤時程\n跟委員報告告訴我們怎麼樣減你會不會逐步去減電力的運轉跟調度是需要彈性的當然彈性所以我本期問你你會不會逐步逐年去減我們會逐步去做盡量去做但是我們不敢承諾一個數字給你們因為只要承諾一個數字我們就一定要努力必須要做到\n全國的民眾聽到中部地區的民眾聽到政府告訴我們你蒸汽要給我們減煤你現在不敢告訴我時程不敢告訴我數字因為不敢說的原因是有太多的變數包括像再生能源上來的進度怎麼樣這個都影響到我們電力運轉的所以政府一場騙\n沒有騙之前告訴我們你們的能源占比有多少你的綠能有多少你現在告訴我你什麼都沒有穩定供電還是我們第一要務那我們中部機器人的健康怎麼辦呢怎麼辦呢我至少一個卑微的要求我們不同意到2031到2034年才是無煤所以我們卑微的要求你告訴我逐年\n你的減煤到底是多少這樣子的卑微的說的要求你都沒有幫我告訴我們數字台電一定會盡量去做到盡量做到但是總經理我對你是非常的尊敬因為你是非常務實但是你今天告訴我這些內容我真的是嚇一跳\n原來之前所說的都是一場騙時間到了你這樣我只有卑微的要求你告訴我你逐年沒關係你逐年減煤的數量告訴本席可不可以總經理不是你不可以說數字我絕對不接受台電公司告訴我減煤的時程跟減煤的量數不可以坦白說數字\n我們請我們經濟部還有我們台電我們找我們瓊益委員把這些我們可以瞭解的可以告知的這些相關的數字跟我們瓊益委員瞭解一下好不好好謝謝你多點時間可以將你的時程告訴本席你的時程跟你的減煤計畫\n告訴我們不是找時間報告我具體要求在經濟委員會要求行政部門台電公司請你將你們的燃氣機組上了2025 2026你可以有2600MW的增加我沒有理由不要求你要減煤\n你告訴我們正氣就要減煤我很卑微的要求行政部門請你把我的時間要求你逐年減煤的時間跟量數\n給本席請委員給我們一點運轉的空間什麼時候告訴本席 沒關係你告訴我什麼時間你的時程跟你的減煤數量告訴本席我們下禮拜去找瓊英委員報告一下好不好不是不是 主席\n我們質詢有要求時間的權利告訴我們內容我不敢你講不出來我沒有辦法要求你現在講但是我們還為選民負責我們替選民來問你什麼時間你告訴我們你們逐年遞減的時間跟\n減煤的量數我們可以提出我們怎麼樣盡量做到的對你什麼時候可以告訴本席你給我一個時間就好你下個禮拜去找不是不是你告訴我你們去討論嘛\n一個月的時間我們把我們盡量怎麼做到的方式或怎樣再跟委員就教就是我們會寫出書面報告來請你們好好告訴我們民眾需要指導中部地區民眾真的辛苦了而且我們有條件也有權利要求我們付出的夠了我們希望我們也全力支持政府的政策爭氣減煤要講到做到啊\n好 謝謝 謝謝趙偉的質詢謝謝 謝謝部長 謝謝總經理 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:06.971 --> 00:08.733\n謝謝謝謝主席陽俊發言我們邀請部長我們請部長\n\n00:18.000 --> 00:44.229\n谢谢部长今天本席也提出修正动议这个目的也就是在整个能源的安全事前的防范事后的处罚这个加重希望能够在能源方面可以达到一个安全我希望得到行政部门的一个支持重点在于除了我们事后的罚则之外最重要的现在是以\n\n00:45.210 --> 00:59.332\n就是故意達成傷害者那但是在整個過程當中如果行為者他達成傷害那也必須要有所處置你同不同意這樣的一個原則是是是現在就是\n\n01:00.529 --> 01:23.789\n即便他不是故意的也有罚词是过失的好非常的感谢终于今天本席提了三个修正动力的目的也就是这个精神所以待会我们如果在逐条审查的时候也敬请我们同仁以及行政部门来支持我们真正目的也就是需要能够真正的安全这是非常重要防堵\n\n01:24.429 --> 01:40.455\n那同時在電越法跟天然氣施越法以及自來水這個三法修法的當中我們就是剛剛所說的為了要加重對海底電纜輸氣與送水管線遭破壞的一個行者所以我們說如果事後追陳\n\n01:41.275 --> 01:48.959\n當然他雖然有二組作用但是他缺乏了一個及時的一個監測機制一旦損傷造成了全民的斷電斷氣斷水這個連鎖危機那麼有鑒於此所以我們呢必須要建立一個什麼呢事前防護的一個體系讓能源輸配網具備有\n\n02:05.306 --> 02:27.970\n預警以及快速的應變能力我們今天主要的修法的目的是不是以這樣子的一個精神為目標而執行之呢是的我們方向是這樣那我們會跟海巡署事實上是配合搭配因為他們這個海上作業是這個巡查是他們在處理那我們一旦他們也會針對船隻上\n\n02:30.891 --> 02:45.404\n他要開AIS然後定位他然後看他的意圖等等一些情況那我們會把我們所有的管線的相關資料提供給海巡讓他們知道說這個地方事實上是我們很重要的一個區域是跨部會的一個\n\n02:47.506 --> 03:05.854\n合縱聯合這是非常的重要所以我也謝謝部長剛剛我們在討論當中也就是針對今天所修的這個三個法本席提出三個修正動議更明確的來說明更明確的能夠讓執行者有所依歸也就是強化與\n\n03:08.216 --> 03:13.901\n這個執行的這個效能來穩定能源的安全我們的目標就是以這兩個為基準是不是是的那所以我們面對於整個海底設施的安全的威脅我們必須要設置可即使偵測異常\n\n03:27.273 --> 03:38.461\n來作為預警的功能的防護系統是不是如此是我們對一旦有發生異樣的時候我們就會資訊會回饋給我們我們馬上會跟海巡來通聯\n\n03:40.030 --> 03:59.640\n這個非常的重要所以本行要說明的是說能源的安全我們不是只有事後有罰我們還要事前可防是不是如此是好那我們也希望再一次的說明到時候我們審查法案的時候那目標都一致那也希望得到\n\n04:00.000 --> 04:26.637\n修正動議得到這三個得到行政部門以及國會同仁大家的支持接下來本席要跟你討論的是6月3號立法院通過了2028年無煤中火的這個案子那但是呢您經濟部一直說您有困難當時你不是部長因為你現在是部長所以本席要跟你討論這個問題你的理由是說中火的二期燃氣呢必須要55個月\n\n04:28.118 --> 04:36.604\n但是事實上中國的一期它的燃氣兩部機組會在於2025跟2026年來完工裝置的容量是2600MW裝置的容量讓它足以太舊4.7部的燃煤機組那不僅如此到現在2024年中國減煤630萬公噸\n\n04:52.595 --> 05:10.070\n2025年一起上線它可以再淘汰432.5萬公噸2026年它可以再增加民營的中央這一個燃氣的電廠跟中火燃氣一起的第二個機組它可以再減多少呢636萬公噸\n\n05:13.684 --> 05:33.695\n6306萬公噸所以換句話說在2028年如果依照這樣的數字你們的規劃達成2028年中火無煤他是沒有問題的他是沒有問題的那請教部長因為你們現在一直以中火二期未完工來做藉口那民眾的聲音您聽到嗎請教部長\n\n05:35.816 --> 06:05.462\n部長你先打一下吧因為總經理有跟我講因為你新任的部長啊如果真的可以達成我們當然是希望這樣但是中間這個數字是你們告訴我們的啊而且你們還告訴我們啊要找一天蒸氣你就要找一天撿煤啊找一天蒸氣找一天撿煤啊這是我們大家的共識啊對不對但是您剛才比如說您剛才提到的資料中加的部分基本上他已經不會做了就是說就解約了啦\n\n06:06.053 --> 06:13.496\n所以說類似這樣的情況你們從頭到尾都跟我們說這個數字到現在潘朵拉的盒子打開你說宗家解約了對因為他是民間的不是我們台電沒有人不知道他是民間的當時你們都把他的量數都計算在內啊你怎麼會現在才跟我們說這個潘朵拉的盒子掀開是這樣不可看呢難怪我們的民眾這麼痛苦啊\n\n06:34.785 --> 06:41.270\n中部地區的民眾已經承受夠了他九月份的時候解約了九月份的時候解約那怎麼辦\n\n06:44.420 --> 07:06.536\n所以我們就是盡量還是會趕啊什麼叫做盡量就是委員跟我們的想法一樣盡快把這個氣起來以後煤可以降下來這是我們共同的願望但是如果有實質上的困難政府口口聲聲告訴我們不管綠能不管這個天然氣我們都全力的支持你現在告訴我們這個\n\n07:08.257 --> 07:18.216\n九月份的事件我都不忍心講出來那我們中部地區該怎麼辦你一直告訴我們說要爭氣就減煤我們全力的支持\n\n07:20.583 --> 07:37.037\n那你們現在告訴我你現在說你們有困難那你的困難我告訴你們你至少要告訴我們你們要怎麼樣逐年減煤請告訴我時辰請告訴我時辰我絕對不同意只有到2034年才無煤這個我們絕對抗議到底\n\n07:39.016 --> 08:03.541\n跟委員報告整個電力系統的要穩定供電其實要考慮到供電的發電的高度跟我們運轉電廠的時間總經理這個是你們之前要爭氣你們都說過了如果你們沒有這些KPI你怎麼去執行呢你現在告訴我這些論述本席具體要求你告訴我\n\n08:04.341 --> 08:06.522\n你們現在告訴我們是2031年2034年這個區間你才要5枚那你們這段時間都不減煤嗎那你告訴我沒關係你告訴我你告訴我你現在有困難你要怎麼樣逐年去減煤告訴我時程告訴我數據我們同意逐年減煤然後把數據會後會\n\n08:27.048 --> 08:35.211\n你現在就可以告訴我啦你已經告訴我們2031年2034年我是不同意的當那個時間才無美你現在有增加這些設備本席剛剛已經告訴過你囉本席告訴過你囉你的2025、2026年完工運轉你可以增加2600MW你可以拆除了4.7部的燃煤機組耶\n\n08:52.717 --> 09:18.748\n跟委員報告你已經失去餘名你說你的政績上路你就要給我們的煙囪這個這個這個摘除跟委員報告那你現在還要保留運轉你為什麼要這麼欺負我們中部人呢跟委員報告最近這幾天天氣比較涼我們中火本來是10部機組也其實都運轉到大概4部或5部的機組在運轉而已其實就是在照顧中部的\n\n09:18.848 --> 09:36.639\n你能不能告訴我在你一起燃氣機組20252026陸續上線之後我們有所本有所本你們的預估就是如此你上線之後你要告訴我們你的逐步減煤時程\n\n09:37.912 --> 09:59.660\n跟委員報告告訴我們怎麼樣減你會不會逐步去減電力的運轉跟調度是需要彈性的當然彈性所以我本期問你你會不會逐步逐年去減我們會逐步去做盡量去做但是我們不敢承諾一個數字給你們因為只要承諾一個數字我們就一定要努力必須要做到\n\n10:00.580 --> 10:20.325\n全國的民眾聽到中部地區的民眾聽到政府告訴我們你蒸汽要給我們減煤你現在不敢告訴我時程不敢告訴我數字因為不敢說的原因是有太多的變數包括像再生能源上來的進度怎麼樣這個都影響到我們電力運轉的所以政府一場騙\n\n10:21.485 --> 10:28.650\n沒有騙之前告訴我們你們的能源占比有多少你的綠能有多少你現在告訴我你什麼都沒有穩定供電還是我們第一要務那我們中部機器人的健康怎麼辦呢怎麼辦呢我至少一個卑微的要求我們不同意到2031到2034年才是無煤所以我們卑微的要求你告訴我逐年\n\n10:49.605 --> 11:11.530\n你的減煤到底是多少這樣子的卑微的說的要求你都沒有幫我告訴我們數字台電一定會盡量去做到盡量做到但是總經理我對你是非常的尊敬因為你是非常務實但是你今天告訴我這些內容我真的是嚇一跳\n\n11:12.887 --> 11:30.875\n原來之前所說的都是一場騙時間到了你這樣我只有卑微的要求你告訴我你逐年沒關係你逐年減煤的數量告訴本席可不可以總經理不是你不可以說數字我絕對不接受台電公司告訴我減煤的時程跟減煤的量數不可以坦白說數字\n\n11:43.444 --> 12:01.775\n我們請我們經濟部還有我們台電我們找我們瓊益委員把這些我們可以瞭解的可以告知的這些相關的數字跟我們瓊益委員瞭解一下好不好好謝謝你多點時間可以將你的時程告訴本席你的時程跟你的減煤計畫\n\n12:03.663 --> 12:24.834\n告訴我們不是找時間報告我具體要求在經濟委員會要求行政部門台電公司請你將你們的燃氣機組上了20252026你可以有2600MW的增加我沒有理由不要求你要減煤\n\n12:26.335 --> 12:30.018\n你告訴我們正氣就要減煤我很卑微的要求行政部門請你把我的時間要求你逐年減煤的時間跟量數\n\n12:40.918 --> 12:56.144\n給本席請委員給我們一點運轉的空間什麼時候告訴本席沒關係你告訴我什麼時間你的時程跟你的減煤數量告訴本席我們下禮拜去找瓊英委員報告一下好不好不是不是主席\n\n12:56.864 --> 13:07.911\n我們質詢有要求時間的權利告訴我們內容我不敢你講不出來我沒有辦法要求你現在講但是我們還為選民負責我們替選民來問你什麼時間你告訴我們你們逐年遞減的時間跟\n\n13:14.054 --> 13:21.700\n減煤的量數我們可以提出我們怎麼樣盡量做到的對你什麼時候可以告訴本席你給我一個時間就好你下個禮拜去找不是不是你告訴我你們去討論嘛\n\n13:29.266 --> 13:55.636\n一個月的時間我們把我們盡量怎麼做到的方式或怎樣再跟委員就教就是我們會寫出書面報告來請你們好好告訴我們民眾需要指導中部地區民眾真的辛苦了而且我們有條件也有權利要求我們付出的夠了我們希望我們也全力支持政府的政策爭氣減煤要講到做到啊\n\n13:57.250 --> 13:57.591\n好謝謝謝謝趙偉的質詢謝謝謝謝部長謝謝總經理謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":6.971,"end":8.733,"text":"謝謝謝謝主席 陽俊發言我們邀請部長我們請部長"},{"start":18,"end":44.229,"text":"谢谢部长今天本席也提出修正动议这个目的也就是在整个能源的安全事前的防范事后的处罚这个加重希望能够在能源方面可以达到一个安全我希望得到行政部门的一个支持重点在于除了我们事后的罚则之外最重要的现在是以"},{"start":45.21,"end":59.332,"text":"就是故意達成傷害者那但是在整個過程當中如果行為者他達成傷害那也必須要有所處置你同不同意這樣的一個原則是是是現在就是"},{"start":60.529,"end":83.789,"text":"即便他不是故意的也有罚词是过失的好 非常的感谢终于今天本席提了三个修正动力的目的也就是这个精神所以待会我们如果在逐条审查的时候也敬请我们同仁以及行政部门来支持我们真正目的也就是需要能够真正的安全这是非常重要防堵"},{"start":84.429,"end":100.455,"text":"那同時在電越法跟天然氣施越法以及自來水這個三法修法的當中我們就是剛剛所說的為了要加重對海底電纜輸氣與送水管線遭破壞的一個行者所以我們說如果事後追陳"},{"start":101.275,"end":108.959,"text":"當然他雖然有二組作用但是他缺乏了一個及時的一個監測機制一旦損傷造成了全民的斷電斷氣斷水這個連鎖危機那麼有鑒於此所以我們呢必須要建立一個什麼呢事前防護的一個體系讓能源輸配網具備有"},{"start":125.306,"end":147.97,"text":"預警以及快速的應變能力我們今天主要的修法的目的是不是以這樣子的一個精神為目標而執行之呢是的 我們方向是這樣那我們會跟海巡署事實上是配合搭配因為他們這個海上作業是這個巡查是他們在處理那我們一旦他們也會針對船隻上"},{"start":150.891,"end":165.404,"text":"他要開AIS然後定位他然後看他的意圖等等一些情況那我們會把我們所有的管線的相關資料提供給海巡讓他們知道說這個地方事實上是我們很重要的一個區域是跨部會的一個"},{"start":167.506,"end":185.854,"text":"合縱聯合這是非常的重要所以我也謝謝部長剛剛我們在討論當中也就是針對今天所修的這個三個法本席提出三個修正動議更明確的來說明更明確的能夠讓執行者有所依歸也就是強化與"},{"start":188.216,"end":193.901,"text":"這個執行的這個效能來穩定能源的安全我們的目標就是以這兩個為基準是不是 是的那所以我們面對於整個海底設施的安全的威脅我們必須要設置可即使偵測異常"},{"start":207.273,"end":218.461,"text":"來作為預警的功能的防護系統 是不是如此是 我們 對 一旦有發生異樣的時候我們就會 資訊會回饋給我們我們馬上會跟海巡來通聯"},{"start":220.03,"end":239.64,"text":"這個非常的重要所以本行要說明的是說能源的安全我們不是只有事後有罰我們還要事前可防是不是如此是好那我們也希望再一次的說明到時候我們審查法案的時候那目標都一致那也希望得到"},{"start":240,"end":266.637,"text":"修正動議得到這三個得到行政部門以及國會同仁大家的支持接下來本席要跟你討論的是6月3號立法院通過了2028年無煤中火的這個案子那但是呢您經濟部一直說您有困難當時你不是部長因為你現在是部長所以本席要跟你討論這個問題你的理由是說中火的二期燃氣呢必須要55個月"},{"start":268.118,"end":276.604,"text":"但是事實上中國的一期它的燃氣兩部機組會在於2025跟2026年來完工裝置的容量是2600MW裝置的容量讓它足以太舊4.7部的燃煤機組那不僅如此到現在2024年中國減煤630萬公噸"},{"start":292.595,"end":310.07,"text":"2025年一起上線它可以再淘汰432.5萬公噸2026年它可以再增加民營的中央這一個燃氣的電廠跟中火燃氣一起的第二個機組它可以再減多少呢 636萬公噸"},{"start":313.684,"end":333.695,"text":"630 6萬公噸所以換句話說在2028年如果依照這樣的數字你們的規劃達成2028年中火無煤他是沒有問題的他是沒有問題的那請教部長因為你們現在一直以中火二期未完工來做藉口那民眾的聲音您聽到嗎請教部長"},{"start":335.816,"end":365.462,"text":"部長你先打一下吧因為總經理有跟我講因為你新任的部長啊如果真的可以達成我們當然是希望這樣但是中間這個數字是你們告訴我們的啊而且你們還告訴我們啊要找一天蒸氣你就要找一天撿煤啊找一天蒸氣找一天撿煤啊這是我們大家的共識啊對不對但是您剛才比如說您剛才提到的資料中加的部分基本上他已經不會做了就是說就解約了啦"},{"start":366.053,"end":373.496,"text":"所以說類似這樣的情況你們從頭到尾都跟我們說這個數字到現在潘朵拉的盒子打開你說宗家解約了對 因為他是民間的不是我們台電沒有人不知道他是民間的當時你們都把他的量數都計算在內啊你怎麼會現在才跟我們說這個潘朵拉的盒子掀開是這樣不可看呢難怪我們的民眾這麼痛苦啊"},{"start":394.785,"end":401.27,"text":"中部地區的民眾已經承受夠了他九月份的時候解約了九月份的時候解約那怎麼辦"},{"start":404.42,"end":426.536,"text":"所以我們就是盡量還是會趕啊什麼叫做盡量就是委員跟我們的想法一樣盡快把這個氣起來以後煤可以降下來這是我們共同的願望但是如果有實質上的困難政府口口聲聲告訴我們不管綠能不管這個天然氣我們都全力的支持你現在告訴我們這個"},{"start":428.257,"end":438.216,"text":"九月份的事件我都不忍心講出來那我們中部地區該怎麼辦你一直告訴我們說要爭氣就減煤我們全力的支持"},{"start":440.583,"end":457.037,"text":"那你們現在告訴我你現在說你們有困難那你的困難我告訴你們你至少要告訴我們你們要怎麼樣逐年減煤請告訴我時辰請告訴我時辰 我絕對不同意只有到2034年才無煤這個我們絕對抗議到底"},{"start":459.016,"end":483.541,"text":"跟委員報告整個電力系統的要穩定供電其實要考慮到供電的發電的高度跟我們運轉電廠的時間總經理這個是你們之前要爭氣你們都說過了如果你們沒有這些KPI你怎麼去執行呢你現在告訴我這些論述本席具體要求你告訴我"},{"start":484.341,"end":486.522,"text":"你們現在告訴我們是2031年2034年這個區間你才要5枚那你們這段時間都不減煤嗎那你告訴我沒關係你告訴我你告訴我你現在有困難你要怎麼樣逐年去減煤告訴我時程告訴我數據我們同意逐年減煤然後把數據會後會"},{"start":507.048,"end":515.211,"text":"你現在就可以告訴我啦你已經告訴我們2031年2034年我是不同意的當那個時間才無美你現在有增加這些設備本席剛剛已經告訴過你囉本席告訴過你囉你的2025、2026年完工運轉你可以增加2600MW你可以拆除了4.7部的燃煤機組耶"},{"start":532.717,"end":558.748,"text":"跟委員報告你已經失去餘名你說你的政績上路你就要給我們的煙囪這個這個這個摘除跟委員報告那你現在還要保留運轉你為什麼要這麼欺負我們中部人呢跟委員報告最近這幾天天氣比較涼我們中火本來是10部機組也其實都運轉到大概4部或5部的機組在運轉而已其實就是在照顧中部的"},{"start":558.848,"end":576.639,"text":"你能不能告訴我在你一起燃氣機組2025 2026陸續上線之後我們有所本有所本你們的預估就是如此你上線之後你要告訴我們你的逐步減煤時程"},{"start":577.912,"end":599.66,"text":"跟委員報告告訴我們怎麼樣減你會不會逐步去減電力的運轉跟調度是需要彈性的當然彈性所以我本期問你你會不會逐步逐年去減我們會逐步去做盡量去做但是我們不敢承諾一個數字給你們因為只要承諾一個數字我們就一定要努力必須要做到"},{"start":600.58,"end":620.325,"text":"全國的民眾聽到中部地區的民眾聽到政府告訴我們你蒸汽要給我們減煤你現在不敢告訴我時程不敢告訴我數字因為不敢說的原因是有太多的變數包括像再生能源上來的進度怎麼樣這個都影響到我們電力運轉的所以政府一場騙"},{"start":621.485,"end":628.65,"text":"沒有騙之前告訴我們你們的能源占比有多少你的綠能有多少你現在告訴我你什麼都沒有穩定供電還是我們第一要務那我們中部機器人的健康怎麼辦呢怎麼辦呢我至少一個卑微的要求我們不同意到2031到2034年才是無煤所以我們卑微的要求你告訴我逐年"},{"start":649.605,"end":671.53,"text":"你的減煤到底是多少這樣子的卑微的說的要求你都沒有幫我告訴我們數字台電一定會盡量去做到盡量做到但是總經理我對你是非常的尊敬因為你是非常務實但是你今天告訴我這些內容我真的是嚇一跳"},{"start":672.887,"end":690.875,"text":"原來之前所說的都是一場騙時間到了你這樣我只有卑微的要求你告訴我你逐年沒關係你逐年減煤的數量告訴本席可不可以總經理不是你不可以說數字我絕對不接受台電公司告訴我減煤的時程跟減煤的量數不可以坦白說數字"},{"start":703.444,"end":721.775,"text":"我們請我們經濟部還有我們台電我們找我們瓊益委員把這些我們可以瞭解的可以告知的這些相關的數字跟我們瓊益委員瞭解一下好不好好謝謝你多點時間可以將你的時程告訴本席你的時程跟你的減煤計畫"},{"start":723.663,"end":744.834,"text":"告訴我們不是找時間報告我具體要求在經濟委員會要求行政部門台電公司請你將你們的燃氣機組上了2025 2026你可以有2600MW的增加我沒有理由不要求你要減煤"},{"start":746.335,"end":750.018,"text":"你告訴我們正氣就要減煤我很卑微的要求行政部門請你把我的時間要求你逐年減煤的時間跟量數"},{"start":760.918,"end":776.144,"text":"給本席請委員給我們一點運轉的空間什麼時候告訴本席 沒關係你告訴我什麼時間你的時程跟你的減煤數量告訴本席我們下禮拜去找瓊英委員報告一下好不好不是不是 主席"},{"start":776.864,"end":787.911,"text":"我們質詢有要求時間的權利告訴我們內容我不敢你講不出來我沒有辦法要求你現在講但是我們還為選民負責我們替選民來問你什麼時間你告訴我們你們逐年遞減的時間跟"},{"start":794.054,"end":801.7,"text":"減煤的量數我們可以提出我們怎麼樣盡量做到的對你什麼時候可以告訴本席你給我一個時間就好你下個禮拜去找不是不是你告訴我你們去討論嘛"},{"start":809.266,"end":835.636,"text":"一個月的時間我們把我們盡量怎麼做到的方式或怎樣再跟委員就教就是我們會寫出書面報告來請你們好好告訴我們民眾需要指導中部地區民眾真的辛苦了而且我們有條件也有權利要求我們付出的夠了我們希望我們也全力支持政府的政策爭氣減煤要講到做到啊"},{"start":837.25,"end":837.591,"text":"好 謝謝 謝謝趙偉的質詢謝謝 謝謝部長 謝謝總經理 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":676,"blocks":[["楊委員瓊瓔：（10時58分）謝謝主席，楊瓊瓔發言，我們邀請部長。"],["主席：請部長。"],["龔部長明鑫：楊委員好。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：謝謝部長。今天本席也提出修正動議，這個目的也就是在整個能源安全的事前防範、事後處罰的加重，希望能夠在能源方面可以達到安全，我希望得到行政部門的支持，重點在於除了我們事後的罰則之外，重要的現在是以故意達成傷害者，但是在整個過程當中如果行為者達成傷害，也必須要有所處置，你同不同意這樣的原則？"],["龔部長明鑫：是，現在即便他不是故意的也有罰則，就是過失的。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：好，非常地感謝。今天本席提了3個修正動議的目的也就是這個精神，所以待會我們如果在逐條審查的時候，也敬請我們同仁以及行政部門來支持。"],["龔部長明鑫：是。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：我們真正目的也就是需要能夠真正的安全、防堵，這是非常重要。同時在電業法、天然氣事業法以及自來水法三法修法的當中，就是我們剛剛所說的，為了要加重對海底電纜輸氣與送水管線遭破壞的刑責。事後追懲雖然有遏止作用，但是缺乏即時的監測機制，一旦損傷，造成了全民斷電、斷氣、斷水的連鎖危機，有鑑於此，我們必須要建立什麼呢？要建立事前防護體系，讓能源輸配網具備預警以及快速應變能力。我們今天主要的修法目的，是不是以這樣子的精神為目標而執行呢？"],["龔部長明鑫：是的，我們方向是這樣。我們會跟海巡署配合及搭配，因為海上巡察作業是他們在處理，他們也會開啓AIS針對船隻來定位並觀察它的意圖等等，我們會把所有管線相關的資料提供給海巡單位，讓他們知道這個地方是很重要的區域。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：是跨部會的合縱、聯合，這非常的重要，所以我也謝謝部長，在剛剛我們討論當中，也就是針對今天所修的這三個法，本席提出3個修正動議，更明確地說明、更明確地能夠讓執行者有所依歸，也就是強化執行的效能，來穩定能源的安全，我們的目標就是以這兩個為基準，是不是？"],["龔部長明鑫：是的。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：面對整個海底設施的安全威脅，我們必須設置可即時偵測異常以發揮預警功能的防護系統，是不是如此？"],["龔部長明鑫：是，一旦有發生異樣的時候，資訊就會回饋給我們，我們馬上會跟海巡通聯。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：這個非常的重要，所以本席要說明的是，能源的安全不只是事後有罰，還要事前可防，是不是如此？"],["龔部長明鑫：是。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：我們也希望……再一次的說明，審查法案的時候目標都一致……"],["龔部長明鑫：對，目標一致。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：也希望這三個修正動議得到行政部門以及各位同仁的支持。","接下來本席要跟你討論的是，6月3日立法院通過了2028年無煤中火的案子，但是經濟部一直說有困難，雖然當時你不是部長，但是現在你是部長，所以本席要跟你討論這個問題。你的理由是說中火的二期燃氣必須要55個月，但事實上中火一期的兩部燃氣機組會在2025年跟2026年完工，裝置的容量是2,600MW，足以汰舊4.7部燃煤機組。不僅如此，到2024年中火減煤630萬公噸，2025年一期上線可以再淘汰432.5萬公噸，2026年再增加民營中佳的燃氣電廠跟中火燃氣一期的第二個機組，可以再減多少呢？636萬公噸。所以換句話說，如果依照這樣的數字，規劃達成2028年無煤中火是沒有問題的。請教部長，因為你們現在一直以中火二期未完工作為藉口，那民眾的聲音，您聽到嗎？請教部長。"],["龔部長明鑫：是不是請總經理說明？"],["楊委員瓊瓔：部長，你先答一下吧！"],["龔部長明鑫：因為總經理有跟我講……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：因為你是新任的部長啊！"],["龔部長明鑫：如果真的可以達成，我們當然希望是這樣，但是中間的確有一些困難，像……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：這個數字是你們告訴我們的啊！而且你們還告訴我們，要早一天增氣就早一天減煤啊！這是我們大家的共識啊，對不對？"],["龔部長明鑫：對，所以我們一定要趕，但是您剛剛提到的資料關於中佳的部分，基本上它已經解約不會做了，所以類似這樣的情況，我們……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：你們從頭到尾都跟我們說這個數字，到現在潘朵拉的盒子打開，你說中佳解約了！"],["龔部長明鑫：對，因為它是民間的，不是我們台電的。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：沒有人不知道它是民間的！當時你們把它的量數都計算在內啊！你怎麼會現在才跟我們說這個潘朵拉的盒子掀開是這樣不可看！難怪我們的民眾這麼痛苦，中部地區的民眾已經承受夠了！"],["龔部長明鑫：它在9月份解約了，所以……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：9月份的時候解約！"],["龔部長明鑫：對。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：那怎麼辦？"],["龔部長明鑫：所以我們還是會儘量趕啊！"],["楊委員瓊瓔：什麼叫做儘量？"],["龔部長明鑫：委員跟我們的想法一樣，儘快把燃氣部分提升起來以後，燃煤部分可以降下來，這是我們共同的願望嘛！但是如果有實質上的困難……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：政府口口聲聲告訴我們，不管綠能、不管天然氣，我們都全力支持，你現在告訴我們這個9月份的事件，我都不忍心講出來，那中部地區該怎麼辦？你一直告訴我們，要增氣就減煤，我們全力地支持。"],["龔部長明鑫：我們也儘量往這個方向來做……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：你們現在告訴我，你說你們有困難，你們至少要告訴我們要怎麼樣逐年減煤？請告訴我時程！我絕對不同意到2034年才無煤，這個我們絕對抗議到底！"],["王總經理耀庭：跟委員報告，整個電力系統要穩定供電，其實要考慮到發電的高度跟運轉電廠的時間，所以一定要……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：總經理，這個是你們之前說要增氣，你們都說過了！如果你們沒有這些KPI，要怎麼去執行呢？你現在告訴我這些論述，本席具體要求，你們現在告訴我們是2031年、2034年這個區間才無煤，那你們在這段時間都不減煤嗎？"],["王總經理耀庭：我們會儘量做。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：你告訴我沒關係，你告訴我現在有困難，你要怎麼樣逐年去減煤？告訴我時程！告訴我數據！"],["龔部長明鑫：我們同意逐年減煤，然後數據會後會……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：你現在就可以告訴我了啊！你已經告訴我們到2031年、2034年才無煤，這部分我是不同意的！"],["王總經理耀庭：跟委員報告……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：到那個時間才無煤，但是你現在有增加這些設備，本席剛剛已經告訴過你了，在2025、2026年設備完工運轉後可以增加2,600MW，可以汰除了4.7部的燃煤機組。"],["王總經理耀庭：跟委員報告……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：你已經失信於民，你說增氣上路後就要把我們的煙囪摘除……"],["王總經理耀庭：跟委員報告……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：那你現在還要保留運轉，為什麼要這麼欺負我們中部人呢？"],["王總經理耀庭：跟委員報告，最近這幾天天氣比較涼，我們中火本來是10部機組，目前大概是4部或5部在運轉而已，其實就是在照顧中部的空氣……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：你能不能告訴我……"],["王總經理耀庭：然後我們的天然氣機組……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：在你預期燃氣機組在2025、2026年陸續上線之後，我們有所本，你們的預估就是如此，上線之後你要告訴我們逐步減煤的時程。"],["王總經理耀庭：跟委員報告，我們電力的運轉和調度……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：告訴我們怎麼樣減？會不會逐步去減啦？"],["王總經理耀庭：電力的運轉跟調度是需要彈性的，所以我們不能……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：當然是彈性！所以本席問你，你會不會逐步逐年去減煤嘛！"],["王總經理耀庭：我們會逐年逐步儘量去做，但是我們不敢承諾一個數字給你們，因為只要承諾一個數字，我們就一定要戮力、必須要做到，所以我們儘量去減……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：全國的民眾聽到！中部地區的民眾聽到！政府告訴我們，增氣要給我們減煤，你現在不敢告訴我時程、不敢告訴我數字！"],["王總經理耀庭：不敢說的原因是有太多的變數，包括像再生能源上來的進度怎麼樣，這個都影響到我們電力運轉的成效。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：所以政府一場騙！"],["王總經理耀庭：沒有騙，事實上只是因為我們需要這個韌性跟彈性。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：之前告訴我們能源占比有多少？綠能有多少？你現在告訴我，你什麼都沒有！"],["龔部長明鑫：報告委員，穩定供電還是我們的第一要務。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：那我們中部地區的人的健康怎麼辦呢？怎麼辦呢？"],["龔部長明鑫：也會照顧啊，我們可以逐年減煤。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：我至少有一個卑微的要求，我們不同意到2031、2034年才是無煤，所以我們卑微的要求你告訴我逐年減煤到底是多少？我們這樣子卑微的要求，你都沒有辦法告訴我們數字！"],["王總經理耀庭：台電一定會儘量去做到，但是沒有辦法每一個實際地去做。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：總經理，我對你是非常地尊敬，因為你是非常務實……"],["主席：時間到了。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：但是你今天告訴我的這些內容，我真的是嚇一跳，原來之前所說的都是一場騙！"],["龔部長明鑫：因為2028的確是沒有辦法做到。"],["主席：時間到了。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：我這樣卑微的要求，逐年減煤的數量告訴本席可不可以？"],["龔部長明鑫：但是我們承諾會……"],["主席：部長、台電總經理再找瓊瓔委員溝通一下，謝謝。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：總經理，不是你不可以說數字！"],["主席：讓他更了解，好不好？"],["楊委員瓊瓔：我絕對不接受台電公司告訴我減煤的時程跟減煤的量數不可以坦白說數字！"],["主席：請經濟部還有台電找瓊瓔委員，這些可以了解、可以告知的相關數字，讓我們瓊瓔委員了解一下，好不好？謝謝。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：你多久時間可以將時程告訴本席？你的時程跟你的減煤計畫告訴我們。"],["王總經理耀庭：我們找時間跟委員報告。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：不是找時間報告！我具體要求，在經濟委員會要求行政部門、台電公司，你們的燃氣機組在2025、2026年可以有2,600MW的容量增加，我沒有理由不要求你減煤。你告訴我們增氣就要減煤，我很卑微地要求行政部門，請把逐年減煤的時間跟數量給本席。"],["王總經理耀庭：請委員給我們一點運轉的空間……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：什麼時候告訴本席？沒關係，告訴我什麼時間，把你的時程跟你的減煤數量告訴本席。"],["主席：下個禮拜去找瓊瓔召委報告一下，好不好？"],["楊委員瓊瓔：不是，主席，我們質詢有要求時間的權利，告訴我們內容。你講不出來，我沒有辦法要求你現在講，但是我們要為選民負責，我們替選民來問什麼時間，你告訴我們，你們逐年遞減的時間跟減煤的數量。"],["龔部長明鑫：我們可以提出我們怎麼樣儘量做到的……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：對、對、對，什麼時候可以告訴本席？"],["主席：召委，是不是下個禮拜去找您？"],["楊委員瓊瓔：你給我一個時間就好。"],["主席：你下個禮拜去找召委，我們再正式……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：不是，你告訴我，你們去討論嘛。"],["龔部長明鑫：一個月的時間，我們把我們儘量怎麼做到的方式或怎樣再跟委員就教，我們會寫書面報告。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：請你們好好告訴我們，民眾需要知道，中部地區的民眾真的辛苦了，而且我們有條件也有權力要求，我們付出的夠了。我們希望、我們也全力支持政府的政策「增氣減煤」，要講到做到啊！"],["龔部長明鑫：是。"],["主席：好，謝謝召委的質詢。謝謝部長、謝謝總經理。我們現在休息10分鐘，謝謝。","休息（11時12分）","繼續開會（11時22分）"],["主席：我們繼續開會。","現在請伍麗華委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":412,"meet_id":"委員會-11-4-19-8","speakers":["陳亭妃","羅美玲","邱議瑩","林岱樺","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","張啓楷","呂玉玲","邱志偉","謝衣鳯","賴瑞隆","楊瓊瓔","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","黃國昌","賴士葆","葉元之","徐欣瑩","王鴻薇","鄭正鈐","黃捷","張嘉郡","林楚茵","陳超明"],"page_start":333,"meetingDate":["2025-10-29"],"gazette_id":"1148901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1148901_00008"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期經濟委員會第8次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查：(一)行政院函請審議「電業法第七十一條之一條文修正草案」案、(二)本院委員王美\n惠等20人擬具「電業法第七十一條之一條文修正草案」案、(三)本院委員李坤城等18人擬具「電\n業法第七十一條之一條文修正草案」案、(四)本院委員伍麗華 Saidhai Tahovecahe 等16人擬具\n「電業法第七十一條之一條文修正草案」案、(五)本院委員賴瑞隆等16人擬具「電業法第七十一\n條之一條文修正草案」案、(六)本院委員羅美玲等19人擬具「電業法第七十一條之一條文修正草\n案」案、(七)本院委員賴惠員等21人擬具「電業法第七十一條之一條文修正草案」案、(八)本院\n委員黃捷等22人擬具「電業法第七十一條之一條文修正草案」案、(九)本院委員陳亭妃等17人擬\n具「電業法第七十一條之一條文修正草案」案、(十)本院委員邱鎮軍等21人擬具「電業法第七十\n一條之一條文修正草案」案、(十一)本院委員吳沛憶等16人擬具「電業法第七十一條之一條文修\n正草案」案；二、審查： ( 一) 行政院函請審議「天然氣事業法第五十五條之一條文修正草案」\n案、(二)本院委員王美惠等20人擬具「天然氣事業法第五十五條之一條文修正草案」案、(三)本\n院委員李坤城等18人擬具「天然氣事業法第五十五條之一條文修正草案」案、(四)本院委員伍麗\n華 Saidhai Tahovecahe 等16人擬具「天然氣事業法第五十五條之一條文修正草案」案、(五)本\n院委員賴瑞隆等16人擬具「天然氣事業法第五十五條之一條文修正草案」案、(六)本院委員羅美\n玲等19人擬具「天然氣事業法第五十五條之一條文修正草案」案、(七)本院委員賴惠員等21人擬\n具「天然氣事業法第五十五條之一條文修正草案」案、(八)本院委員黃捷等22人擬具「天然氣事\n業法第五十五條之一條文修正草案」案、(九)本院委員陳亭妃等17人擬具「天然氣事業法第五十\n五條之一條文修正草案」案、(十)本院委員邱鎮軍等24人擬具「天然氣事業法第五十五條之一條文\n修正草案」案、(十一)本院委員吳沛憶等16人擬具「天然氣事業法第五十五條之一條文修正草案」\n案；三、審查：(一)行政院函請審議「自來水法第九十七條之一條文修正草案」案、(二)本院委\n員王美惠等19人擬具「自來水法第九十七條之一條文修正草案」案、(三)本院委員李坤城等18人\n擬具「自來水法第九十七條之一條文修正草案」案、(四)本院委員伍麗華 Saidhai Tahovecahe 等\n16人擬具「自來水法第九十七條之一條文修正草案」案、(五)本院委員賴瑞隆等16人擬具「自來\n水法第三條、第十六條之一及第九十七條之一條文修正草案」案、(六)本院委員羅美玲等19人擬\n具「自來水法第九十七條之一條文修正草案」案、(七)本院委員賴惠員等21人擬具「自來水法第\n九十七條之一條文修正草案」案、(八)本院委員黃捷等22人擬具「自來水法第九十七條之一條文\n修正草案」案、(九)本院委員陳亭妃等17人擬具「自來水法第九十七條之一條文修正草案」案、\n(十)本院委員吳沛憶等16人擬具「自來水法第九十七條之一條文修正草案」案（合併詢答）","agenda_id":"1148901_00007"}}}