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404.73, \"end\": 404.89, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"采\", \"start\": 404.89, \"end\": 405.091, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 405.091, \"end\": 405.111, \"score\": 0.984}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 410.763, \"end\": 410.869, \"score\": 0.838}, {\"word\": \"席\", \"start\": 410.869, \"end\": 410.974, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"各\", \"start\": 410.974, \"end\": 411.144, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"位\", \"start\": 411.144, \"end\": 411.165, \"score\": 0.001}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:02,413 --> 00:00:02,654\n等一下\n\n2\n00:00:12,910 --> 00:00:33,219\n好那我現在直接開始主委我在這邊跟您說明一件事情就當人民的錢被騙走的時候人民只在乎一件事就是錢拿不拿得回來只要沒有辦法幫他拿回來錢拿回來的話那他就會覺得政府就是廢物在人民的眼中他只在乎錢拿不拿得回來\n\n3\n00:00:34,384 --> 00:01:01,092\n我想有沒有好的管理這就是您的責任這您應該非常的清楚我想請問一下因為我去年我就有質詢相關的議題了我想軍管會從去年說要打造亞洲的資產管理中心一個最簡單的問題請問虛擬資產是不是也在管理的範圍內虛擬資產在目前沒有目前沒有\n\n4\n00:01:03,038 --> 00:01:04,760\n我去年的時候去年我去年我有跟你提到就是說台灣目前投資虛擬市場大概有八成的交易都在境外交易所這個您知道吧知道那這個部分現在在您有什麼積極作為可以請您現在告訴我嗎\n\n5\n00:01:24,178 --> 00:01:40,993\n我想這個就是我們要訂定專訪一個很重要的過程因為現在大部分因為它透過進化的時候其實我們的轄管是沒辦法對這個做任何的這樣一個比如說管理但是我跟你說我看到你們的那個草案但你們那個草案還是管不到這八成的市場\n\n6\n00:01:42,193 --> 00:02:00,499\n對不對我想這不是只有台灣會面臨到的問題啦你不能這樣講啊我們也在努力但是我們要先解決國內的這些我們業者民眾更容易接觸到的市場那你至少要讓國人知道嘛有80%國人的投資是我幫不了你的\n\n7\n00:02:01,059 --> 00:02:24,759\n其实不是这样看我跟你说我不喜欢政府干一件事情政府常干一件事情就是说他常告诉国人说没问题有政府都可以值得信任结果事情发生之后又做不到那我今天很担心的一个就是说会不会我们告诉国人让国人误以为他今天去投资这些虚拟货币虚拟资产就到最后他认为被骗了以后政府也会帮他忙但是几乎都拿不回来\n\n8\n00:02:25,379 --> 00:02:52,520\n他到那一刻才發現原來我的政府沒有辦法幫我我是希望說這個在宣傳的時候你必須要告訴國人你不要讓國人誤以為你有這個能力所有投資教育金融教育這個都是要同步來進行所以現在我看到了你們草案第一個是管不到那個國人80%投資的那個市場你管不到那再來您的草案裡面雖然有提到一些未來如果他是境外納管的話我們就會管理得到\n\n9\n00:02:53,400 --> 00:03:22,199\n當然啦但是問題是你有沒有辦法納管他嘛他如果來申請落地剛才像那個也有委員提到就是說境外的這些的VASP他願意在台灣來納管他當然就會受到這樣的不是那你就是被動我今天講的主軸是被動好不好他願意來我才有辦法管他他不願意來人民繼續被騙所以我們在那個第四條裡面有加上一個叫國際合作這是我們希望預留的空間因為確實這件事情是全世界共同來面對的問題\n\n10\n00:03:23,500 --> 00:03:47,698\n好那沒關係啦你再推謝謝謝謝委員的提醒那我跟你講那你就直接告訴人民直接告訴人民那80%真的不是我們能夠幫你的忙請不要投資你就只能這樣做啦你不能一方面講你要做什麼管理中心另外一方面什麼都做不到我跟你講啦你剛剛講的那個沒有錯啦他願意來納管的話但是呢現在那80%的這些境外交易所他也沒有主動向我們這邊台灣這邊來招攬或打廣告\n\n11\n00:03:50,180 --> 00:04:11,879\n是我們這裡台灣人自己上網去搜尋去那邊從事交易的所以你們也管不了你也說如果他願意來你被動的才能夠納管假設因為假設我們當我們開始納管台灣已經有非常安全的交易平台他購買是相同的標的相同的服務我想這也是導引我們現在國人走向合規化\n\n12\n00:04:12,520 --> 00:04:37,056\n那就該講說委員所關心的問題就會被縮小但是我聽來聽去還是沒有辦法管理嘛你要他主動來嘛那你只能消極的被動看他要不要來嘛除此之外你完全沒有你對他沒有辦法那你有沒有辦法凍結那80%的這些投資的境外交易所我想委員是法律專家非常清楚這個是有困難的啦\n\n13\n00:04:37,216 --> 00:05:02,914\n对就是有困难所以你要告诉国人嘛这才是重点我跟你说我这边看到的114年9月18号的那个你们会后的一些记者会的资料现在台湾虚拟交易已经到550亿美金了尤其20236月到20246月这一年的期间已经达到这么高那我们投资那个人的比例也从去年的12%上升到今年的24%也就是说\n\n14\n00:05:03,374 --> 00:05:30,931\n这个投资的数字一直在往上飙那我再跟你说因为时间的关系我直接跟你讲我现在还是认为这80%还是是境外之地无从管理但是你看一下我们邻近的一些对手日本韩国新加坡他们都有设专法在管理所以我现在看到的是每天我们国人被骗有3亿元但是呢我们什么都做不了我们对国外的一些韩巡也都石沉大海这我很清楚我以前韩巡国外也都石沉大海\n\n15\n00:05:31,391 --> 00:05:58,904\n所以这个没有办法落地替捐款的这个东西你还是得要让国人知道我管不了但是我要让国人知道我真的是管不了那像日本他之前就那个2022年的那个FTX那个破产那件事你一定很清楚日本政府就有帮他们国人争取到而且要回很多钱我们国家有没有办法做到当然我知道国际很困境但是这不是构成理由就回到我刚刚第一句话\n\n16\n00:06:00,184 --> 00:06:15,172\n人民被騙錢他只在乎政府有沒有幫他拿回錢拿了回錢你就是好政府拿不回錢他只會罵你是笨蛋罵你是廢物他不會在乎你到底問題出在哪裡好不好所以這個部分還是要麻煩你們要對這些\n\n17\n00:06:16,431 --> 00:06:45,111\n能夠有在台灣能夠可用可查可凍結的這加密貨幣市場秩序麻煩你們還是要建立起來這個不行的話就告訴國人我做不到不要讓國人以為政府管得了他投資了被騙那一天才知道原來政府管不了這是我在辦公室整天聽到的訊息好不好好謝謝我想保護那個消費者是我們的職責沒有什麼麻煩我們會來朝這方向努力那就要納管啦好謝謝謝謝吳委員接下來我們請羅明采委員\n\n18\n00:06:50,763 --> 00:06:51,165\n主席各位\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n2413\t2654\t等一下\n12910\t33219\t好 那我現在直接開始主委我在這邊跟您說明一件事情就當人民的錢被騙走的時候人民只在乎一件事就是錢拿不拿得回來只要沒有辦法幫他拿回來錢拿回來的話那他就會覺得政府就是廢物在人民的眼中他只在乎錢拿不拿得回來\n34384\t61092\t我想有沒有好的管理這就是您的責任這您應該非常的清楚我想請問一下因為我去年我就有質詢相關的議題了我想軍管會從去年說要打造亞洲的資產管理中心一個最簡單的問題請問虛擬資產是不是也在管理的範圍內虛擬資產在目前沒有目前沒有\n63038\t64760\t我去年的時候去年我去年我有跟你提到就是說台灣目前投資虛擬市場大概有八成的交易都在境外交易所這個您知道吧知道那這個部分現在在您有什麼積極作為可以請您現在告訴我嗎\n84178\t100993\t我想這個就是我們要訂定專訪一個很重要的過程因為現在大部分因為它透過進化的時候其實我們的轄管是沒辦法對這個做任何的這樣一個比如說管理但是我跟你說我看到你們的那個草案但你們那個草案還是管不到這八成的市場\n102193\t120499\t對不對我想這不是只有台灣會面臨到的問題啦你不能這樣講啊我們也在努力但是我們要先解決國內的這些我們業者民眾更容易接觸到的市場那你至少要讓國人知道嘛有80%國人的投資是我幫不了你的\n121059\t144759\t其实不是这样看我跟你说我不喜欢政府干一件事情政府常干一件事情就是说他常告诉国人说没问题有政府都可以值得信任结果事情发生之后又做不到那我今天很担心的一个就是说会不会我们告诉国人让国人误以为他今天去投资这些虚拟货币虚拟资产就到最后他认为被骗了以后政府也会帮他忙但是几乎都拿不回来\n145379\t172520\t他到那一刻才發現原來我的政府沒有辦法幫我我是希望說這個在宣傳的時候你必須要告訴國人你不要讓國人誤以為你有這個能力所有投資教育 金融教育這個都是要同步來進行所以現在我看到了你們草案第一個是管不到那個國人80%投資的那個市場你管不到那再來您的草案裡面雖然有提到一些未來如果他是境外納管的話我們就會管理得到\n173400\t202199\t當然啦 但是問題是你有沒有辦法納管他嘛他如果來申請落地剛才像那個也有委員提到就是說境外的這些的VASP他願意在台灣來納管他當然就會受到這樣的不是 那你就是被動我今天講的主軸是被動好不好 他願意來我才有辦法管他他不願意來 人民繼續被騙所以我們在那個第四條裡面有加上一個叫國際合作這是我們希望預留的空間因為確實這件事情是全世界共同來面對的問題\n203500\t227698\t好 那沒關係啦你再推謝謝 謝謝委員的提醒那我跟你講那你就直接告訴人民直接告訴人民那80%真的不是我們能夠幫你的忙請不要投資你就只能這樣做啦你不能一方面講你要做什麼管理中心另外一方面什麼都做不到我跟你講啦你剛剛講的那個沒有錯啦他願意來納管的話但是呢現在那80%的這些境外交易所他也沒有主動向我們這邊台灣這邊來招攬或打廣告\n230180\t251879\t是我們這裡台灣人自己上網去搜尋去那邊從事交易的所以你們也管不了你也說如果他願意來你被動的才能夠納管假設因為假設我們當我們開始納管台灣已經有非常安全的交易平台他購買是相同的標的 相同的服務我想這也是導引我們現在國人走向合規化\n252520\t277056\t那就該講說委員所關心的問題就會被縮小但是我聽來聽去還是沒有辦法管理嘛你要他主動來嘛那你只能消極的被動看他要不要來嘛除此之外你完全沒有你對他沒有辦法那你有沒有辦法凍結那80%的這些投資的境外交易所我想委員是法律專家非常清楚這個是有困難的啦\n277216\t302914\t对 就是有困难所以你要告诉国人嘛这才是重点我跟你说我这边看到的114年9月18号的那个你们会后的一些记者会的资料现在台湾虚拟交易已经到550亿美金了尤其2023 6月到2024 6月这一年的期间已经达到这么高那我们投资那个人的比例也从去年的12%上升到今年的24%也就是说\n303374\t330931\t这个投资的数字一直在往上飙那我再跟你说因为时间的关系我直接跟你讲我现在还是认为这80%还是是境外之地无从管理但是你看一下我们邻近的一些对手日本韩国新加坡他们都有设专法在管理所以我现在看到的是每天我们国人被骗有3亿元但是呢我们什么都做不了我们对国外的一些韩巡也都石沉大海这我很清楚我以前韩巡国外也都石沉大海\n331391\t358904\t所以这个没有办法落地替捐款的这个东西你还是得要让国人知道我管不了但是我要让国人知道我真的是管不了那像日本他之前就那个2022年的那个FTX那个破产那件事你一定很清楚日本政府就有帮他们国人争取到而且要回很多钱我们国家有没有办法做到当然我知道国际很困境但是这不是构成理由就回到我刚刚第一句话\n360184\t375172\t人民被騙錢他只在乎政府有沒有幫他拿回錢拿了回錢你就是好政府拿不回錢他只會罵你是笨蛋罵你是廢物他不會在乎你到底問題出在哪裡好不好所以這個部分還是要麻煩你們要對這些\n376431\t405111\t能夠有在台灣能夠可用可查可凍結的這加密貨幣市場秩序麻煩你們還是要建立起來這個不行的話就告訴國人我做不到不要讓國人以為政府管得了他投資了被騙那一天才知道原來政府管不了這是我在辦公室整天聽到的訊息好不好好謝謝我想保護那個消費者是我們的職責沒有什麼麻煩我們會來朝這方向努力那就要納管啦好謝謝謝謝吳委員接下來我們請羅明采委員\n410763\t411165\t主席各位\n","txt":"等一下\n好 那我現在直接開始主委我在這邊跟您說明一件事情就當人民的錢被騙走的時候人民只在乎一件事就是錢拿不拿得回來只要沒有辦法幫他拿回來錢拿回來的話那他就會覺得政府就是廢物在人民的眼中他只在乎錢拿不拿得回來\n我想有沒有好的管理這就是您的責任這您應該非常的清楚我想請問一下因為我去年我就有質詢相關的議題了我想軍管會從去年說要打造亞洲的資產管理中心一個最簡單的問題請問虛擬資產是不是也在管理的範圍內虛擬資產在目前沒有目前沒有\n我去年的時候去年我去年我有跟你提到就是說台灣目前投資虛擬市場大概有八成的交易都在境外交易所這個您知道吧知道那這個部分現在在您有什麼積極作為可以請您現在告訴我嗎\n我想這個就是我們要訂定專訪一個很重要的過程因為現在大部分因為它透過進化的時候其實我們的轄管是沒辦法對這個做任何的這樣一個比如說管理但是我跟你說我看到你們的那個草案但你們那個草案還是管不到這八成的市場\n對不對我想這不是只有台灣會面臨到的問題啦你不能這樣講啊我們也在努力但是我們要先解決國內的這些我們業者民眾更容易接觸到的市場那你至少要讓國人知道嘛有80%國人的投資是我幫不了你的\n其实不是这样看我跟你说我不喜欢政府干一件事情政府常干一件事情就是说他常告诉国人说没问题有政府都可以值得信任结果事情发生之后又做不到那我今天很担心的一个就是说会不会我们告诉国人让国人误以为他今天去投资这些虚拟货币虚拟资产就到最后他认为被骗了以后政府也会帮他忙但是几乎都拿不回来\n他到那一刻才發現原來我的政府沒有辦法幫我我是希望說這個在宣傳的時候你必須要告訴國人你不要讓國人誤以為你有這個能力所有投資教育 金融教育這個都是要同步來進行所以現在我看到了你們草案第一個是管不到那個國人80%投資的那個市場你管不到那再來您的草案裡面雖然有提到一些未來如果他是境外納管的話我們就會管理得到\n當然啦 但是問題是你有沒有辦法納管他嘛他如果來申請落地剛才像那個也有委員提到就是說境外的這些的VASP他願意在台灣來納管他當然就會受到這樣的不是 那你就是被動我今天講的主軸是被動好不好 他願意來我才有辦法管他他不願意來 人民繼續被騙所以我們在那個第四條裡面有加上一個叫國際合作這是我們希望預留的空間因為確實這件事情是全世界共同來面對的問題\n好 那沒關係啦你再推謝謝 謝謝委員的提醒那我跟你講那你就直接告訴人民直接告訴人民那80%真的不是我們能夠幫你的忙請不要投資你就只能這樣做啦你不能一方面講你要做什麼管理中心另外一方面什麼都做不到我跟你講啦你剛剛講的那個沒有錯啦他願意來納管的話但是呢現在那80%的這些境外交易所他也沒有主動向我們這邊台灣這邊來招攬或打廣告\n是我們這裡台灣人自己上網去搜尋去那邊從事交易的所以你們也管不了你也說如果他願意來你被動的才能夠納管假設因為假設我們當我們開始納管台灣已經有非常安全的交易平台他購買是相同的標的 相同的服務我想這也是導引我們現在國人走向合規化\n那就該講說委員所關心的問題就會被縮小但是我聽來聽去還是沒有辦法管理嘛你要他主動來嘛那你只能消極的被動看他要不要來嘛除此之外你完全沒有你對他沒有辦法那你有沒有辦法凍結那80%的這些投資的境外交易所我想委員是法律專家非常清楚這個是有困難的啦\n对 就是有困难所以你要告诉国人嘛这才是重点我跟你说我这边看到的114年9月18号的那个你们会后的一些记者会的资料现在台湾虚拟交易已经到550亿美金了尤其2023 6月到2024 6月这一年的期间已经达到这么高那我们投资那个人的比例也从去年的12%上升到今年的24%也就是说\n这个投资的数字一直在往上飙那我再跟你说因为时间的关系我直接跟你讲我现在还是认为这80%还是是境外之地无从管理但是你看一下我们邻近的一些对手日本韩国新加坡他们都有设专法在管理所以我现在看到的是每天我们国人被骗有3亿元但是呢我们什么都做不了我们对国外的一些韩巡也都石沉大海这我很清楚我以前韩巡国外也都石沉大海\n所以这个没有办法落地替捐款的这个东西你还是得要让国人知道我管不了但是我要让国人知道我真的是管不了那像日本他之前就那个2022年的那个FTX那个破产那件事你一定很清楚日本政府就有帮他们国人争取到而且要回很多钱我们国家有没有办法做到当然我知道国际很困境但是这不是构成理由就回到我刚刚第一句话\n人民被騙錢他只在乎政府有沒有幫他拿回錢拿了回錢你就是好政府拿不回錢他只會罵你是笨蛋罵你是廢物他不會在乎你到底問題出在哪裡好不好所以這個部分還是要麻煩你們要對這些\n能夠有在台灣能夠可用可查可凍結的這加密貨幣市場秩序麻煩你們還是要建立起來這個不行的話就告訴國人我做不到不要讓國人以為政府管得了他投資了被騙那一天才知道原來政府管不了這是我在辦公室整天聽到的訊息好不好好謝謝我想保護那個消費者是我們的職責沒有什麼麻煩我們會來朝這方向努力那就要納管啦好謝謝謝謝吳委員接下來我們請羅明采委員\n主席各位\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:02.413 --> 00:02.654\n等一下\n\n00:12.910 --> 00:33.219\n好那我現在直接開始主委我在這邊跟您說明一件事情就當人民的錢被騙走的時候人民只在乎一件事就是錢拿不拿得回來只要沒有辦法幫他拿回來錢拿回來的話那他就會覺得政府就是廢物在人民的眼中他只在乎錢拿不拿得回來\n\n00:34.384 --> 01:01.092\n我想有沒有好的管理這就是您的責任這您應該非常的清楚我想請問一下因為我去年我就有質詢相關的議題了我想軍管會從去年說要打造亞洲的資產管理中心一個最簡單的問題請問虛擬資產是不是也在管理的範圍內虛擬資產在目前沒有目前沒有\n\n01:03.038 --> 01:04.760\n我去年的時候去年我去年我有跟你提到就是說台灣目前投資虛擬市場大概有八成的交易都在境外交易所這個您知道吧知道那這個部分現在在您有什麼積極作為可以請您現在告訴我嗎\n\n01:24.178 --> 01:40.993\n我想這個就是我們要訂定專訪一個很重要的過程因為現在大部分因為它透過進化的時候其實我們的轄管是沒辦法對這個做任何的這樣一個比如說管理但是我跟你說我看到你們的那個草案但你們那個草案還是管不到這八成的市場\n\n01:42.193 --> 02:00.499\n對不對我想這不是只有台灣會面臨到的問題啦你不能這樣講啊我們也在努力但是我們要先解決國內的這些我們業者民眾更容易接觸到的市場那你至少要讓國人知道嘛有80%國人的投資是我幫不了你的\n\n02:01.059 --> 02:24.759\n其实不是这样看我跟你说我不喜欢政府干一件事情政府常干一件事情就是说他常告诉国人说没问题有政府都可以值得信任结果事情发生之后又做不到那我今天很担心的一个就是说会不会我们告诉国人让国人误以为他今天去投资这些虚拟货币虚拟资产就到最后他认为被骗了以后政府也会帮他忙但是几乎都拿不回来\n\n02:25.379 --> 02:52.520\n他到那一刻才發現原來我的政府沒有辦法幫我我是希望說這個在宣傳的時候你必須要告訴國人你不要讓國人誤以為你有這個能力所有投資教育金融教育這個都是要同步來進行所以現在我看到了你們草案第一個是管不到那個國人80%投資的那個市場你管不到那再來您的草案裡面雖然有提到一些未來如果他是境外納管的話我們就會管理得到\n\n02:53.400 --> 03:22.199\n當然啦但是問題是你有沒有辦法納管他嘛他如果來申請落地剛才像那個也有委員提到就是說境外的這些的VASP他願意在台灣來納管他當然就會受到這樣的不是那你就是被動我今天講的主軸是被動好不好他願意來我才有辦法管他他不願意來人民繼續被騙所以我們在那個第四條裡面有加上一個叫國際合作這是我們希望預留的空間因為確實這件事情是全世界共同來面對的問題\n\n03:23.500 --> 03:47.698\n好那沒關係啦你再推謝謝謝謝委員的提醒那我跟你講那你就直接告訴人民直接告訴人民那80%真的不是我們能夠幫你的忙請不要投資你就只能這樣做啦你不能一方面講你要做什麼管理中心另外一方面什麼都做不到我跟你講啦你剛剛講的那個沒有錯啦他願意來納管的話但是呢現在那80%的這些境外交易所他也沒有主動向我們這邊台灣這邊來招攬或打廣告\n\n03:50.180 --> 04:11.879\n是我們這裡台灣人自己上網去搜尋去那邊從事交易的所以你們也管不了你也說如果他願意來你被動的才能夠納管假設因為假設我們當我們開始納管台灣已經有非常安全的交易平台他購買是相同的標的相同的服務我想這也是導引我們現在國人走向合規化\n\n04:12.520 --> 04:37.056\n那就該講說委員所關心的問題就會被縮小但是我聽來聽去還是沒有辦法管理嘛你要他主動來嘛那你只能消極的被動看他要不要來嘛除此之外你完全沒有你對他沒有辦法那你有沒有辦法凍結那80%的這些投資的境外交易所我想委員是法律專家非常清楚這個是有困難的啦\n\n04:37.216 --> 05:02.914\n对就是有困难所以你要告诉国人嘛这才是重点我跟你说我这边看到的114年9月18号的那个你们会后的一些记者会的资料现在台湾虚拟交易已经到550亿美金了尤其20236月到20246月这一年的期间已经达到这么高那我们投资那个人的比例也从去年的12%上升到今年的24%也就是说\n\n05:03.374 --> 05:30.931\n这个投资的数字一直在往上飙那我再跟你说因为时间的关系我直接跟你讲我现在还是认为这80%还是是境外之地无从管理但是你看一下我们邻近的一些对手日本韩国新加坡他们都有设专法在管理所以我现在看到的是每天我们国人被骗有3亿元但是呢我们什么都做不了我们对国外的一些韩巡也都石沉大海这我很清楚我以前韩巡国外也都石沉大海\n\n05:31.391 --> 05:58.904\n所以这个没有办法落地替捐款的这个东西你还是得要让国人知道我管不了但是我要让国人知道我真的是管不了那像日本他之前就那个2022年的那个FTX那个破产那件事你一定很清楚日本政府就有帮他们国人争取到而且要回很多钱我们国家有没有办法做到当然我知道国际很困境但是这不是构成理由就回到我刚刚第一句话\n\n06:00.184 --> 06:15.172\n人民被騙錢他只在乎政府有沒有幫他拿回錢拿了回錢你就是好政府拿不回錢他只會罵你是笨蛋罵你是廢物他不會在乎你到底問題出在哪裡好不好所以這個部分還是要麻煩你們要對這些\n\n06:16.431 --> 06:45.111\n能夠有在台灣能夠可用可查可凍結的這加密貨幣市場秩序麻煩你們還是要建立起來這個不行的話就告訴國人我做不到不要讓國人以為政府管得了他投資了被騙那一天才知道原來政府管不了這是我在辦公室整天聽到的訊息好不好好謝謝我想保護那個消費者是我們的職責沒有什麼麻煩我們會來朝這方向努力那就要納管啦好謝謝謝謝吳委員接下來我們請羅明采委員\n\n06:50.763 --> 06:51.165\n主席各位\n\n","segments":[{"start":2.413,"end":2.654,"text":"等一下"},{"start":12.91,"end":33.219,"text":"好 那我現在直接開始主委我在這邊跟您說明一件事情就當人民的錢被騙走的時候人民只在乎一件事就是錢拿不拿得回來只要沒有辦法幫他拿回來錢拿回來的話那他就會覺得政府就是廢物在人民的眼中他只在乎錢拿不拿得回來"},{"start":34.384,"end":61.092,"text":"我想有沒有好的管理這就是您的責任這您應該非常的清楚我想請問一下因為我去年我就有質詢相關的議題了我想軍管會從去年說要打造亞洲的資產管理中心一個最簡單的問題請問虛擬資產是不是也在管理的範圍內虛擬資產在目前沒有目前沒有"},{"start":63.038,"end":64.76,"text":"我去年的時候去年我去年我有跟你提到就是說台灣目前投資虛擬市場大概有八成的交易都在境外交易所這個您知道吧知道那這個部分現在在您有什麼積極作為可以請您現在告訴我嗎"},{"start":84.178,"end":100.993,"text":"我想這個就是我們要訂定專訪一個很重要的過程因為現在大部分因為它透過進化的時候其實我們的轄管是沒辦法對這個做任何的這樣一個比如說管理但是我跟你說我看到你們的那個草案但你們那個草案還是管不到這八成的市場"},{"start":102.193,"end":120.499,"text":"對不對我想這不是只有台灣會面臨到的問題啦你不能這樣講啊我們也在努力但是我們要先解決國內的這些我們業者民眾更容易接觸到的市場那你至少要讓國人知道嘛有80%國人的投資是我幫不了你的"},{"start":121.059,"end":144.759,"text":"其实不是这样看我跟你说我不喜欢政府干一件事情政府常干一件事情就是说他常告诉国人说没问题有政府都可以值得信任结果事情发生之后又做不到那我今天很担心的一个就是说会不会我们告诉国人让国人误以为他今天去投资这些虚拟货币虚拟资产就到最后他认为被骗了以后政府也会帮他忙但是几乎都拿不回来"},{"start":145.379,"end":172.52,"text":"他到那一刻才發現原來我的政府沒有辦法幫我我是希望說這個在宣傳的時候你必須要告訴國人你不要讓國人誤以為你有這個能力所有投資教育 金融教育這個都是要同步來進行所以現在我看到了你們草案第一個是管不到那個國人80%投資的那個市場你管不到那再來您的草案裡面雖然有提到一些未來如果他是境外納管的話我們就會管理得到"},{"start":173.4,"end":202.199,"text":"當然啦 但是問題是你有沒有辦法納管他嘛他如果來申請落地剛才像那個也有委員提到就是說境外的這些的VASP他願意在台灣來納管他當然就會受到這樣的不是 那你就是被動我今天講的主軸是被動好不好 他願意來我才有辦法管他他不願意來 人民繼續被騙所以我們在那個第四條裡面有加上一個叫國際合作這是我們希望預留的空間因為確實這件事情是全世界共同來面對的問題"},{"start":203.5,"end":227.698,"text":"好 那沒關係啦你再推謝謝 謝謝委員的提醒那我跟你講那你就直接告訴人民直接告訴人民那80%真的不是我們能夠幫你的忙請不要投資你就只能這樣做啦你不能一方面講你要做什麼管理中心另外一方面什麼都做不到我跟你講啦你剛剛講的那個沒有錯啦他願意來納管的話但是呢現在那80%的這些境外交易所他也沒有主動向我們這邊台灣這邊來招攬或打廣告"},{"start":230.18,"end":251.879,"text":"是我們這裡台灣人自己上網去搜尋去那邊從事交易的所以你們也管不了你也說如果他願意來你被動的才能夠納管假設因為假設我們當我們開始納管台灣已經有非常安全的交易平台他購買是相同的標的 相同的服務我想這也是導引我們現在國人走向合規化"},{"start":252.52,"end":277.056,"text":"那就該講說委員所關心的問題就會被縮小但是我聽來聽去還是沒有辦法管理嘛你要他主動來嘛那你只能消極的被動看他要不要來嘛除此之外你完全沒有你對他沒有辦法那你有沒有辦法凍結那80%的這些投資的境外交易所我想委員是法律專家非常清楚這個是有困難的啦"},{"start":277.216,"end":302.914,"text":"对 就是有困难所以你要告诉国人嘛这才是重点我跟你说我这边看到的114年9月18号的那个你们会后的一些记者会的资料现在台湾虚拟交易已经到550亿美金了尤其2023 6月到2024 6月这一年的期间已经达到这么高那我们投资那个人的比例也从去年的12%上升到今年的24%也就是说"},{"start":303.374,"end":330.931,"text":"这个投资的数字一直在往上飙那我再跟你说因为时间的关系我直接跟你讲我现在还是认为这80%还是是境外之地无从管理但是你看一下我们邻近的一些对手日本韩国新加坡他们都有设专法在管理所以我现在看到的是每天我们国人被骗有3亿元但是呢我们什么都做不了我们对国外的一些韩巡也都石沉大海这我很清楚我以前韩巡国外也都石沉大海"},{"start":331.391,"end":358.904,"text":"所以这个没有办法落地替捐款的这个东西你还是得要让国人知道我管不了但是我要让国人知道我真的是管不了那像日本他之前就那个2022年的那个FTX那个破产那件事你一定很清楚日本政府就有帮他们国人争取到而且要回很多钱我们国家有没有办法做到当然我知道国际很困境但是这不是构成理由就回到我刚刚第一句话"},{"start":360.184,"end":375.172,"text":"人民被騙錢他只在乎政府有沒有幫他拿回錢拿了回錢你就是好政府拿不回錢他只會罵你是笨蛋罵你是廢物他不會在乎你到底問題出在哪裡好不好所以這個部分還是要麻煩你們要對這些"},{"start":376.431,"end":405.111,"text":"能夠有在台灣能夠可用可查可凍結的這加密貨幣市場秩序麻煩你們還是要建立起來這個不行的話就告訴國人我做不到不要讓國人以為政府管得了他投資了被騙那一天才知道原來政府管不了這是我在辦公室整天聽到的訊息好不好好謝謝我想保護那個消費者是我們的職責沒有什麼麻煩我們會來朝這方向努力那就要納管啦好謝謝謝謝吳委員接下來我們請羅明采委員"},{"start":410.763,"end":411.165,"text":"主席各位"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":827,"blocks":[["吳委員宗憲：（11時20分）麻煩主委。"],["主席：我們請彭主委。"],["彭主任委員金隆：委員好。"],["吳委員宗憲：主委，我跟您說明一件事情，當人民的錢被騙走的時候，人民只在乎一件事就是錢拿不拿得回來，只要沒有辦法幫他把錢拿回來，他就會覺得政府就是廢物，在人民的眼中，他只在乎錢拿不拿得回來，我想有沒有好的管理，這就是您的責任，你應該非常地清楚。我想請問一下，因為我去年就有質詢相關的議題，金管會從去年說要打造亞洲資產管理中心，一個最簡單的問題，請問虛擬資產是不是也在管理的範圍內？"],["彭主任委員金隆：虛擬資產在目前沒有。"],["吳委員宗憲：目前沒有，好。去年我有跟你提到，臺灣目前投資虛擬市場大概有8成的交易都在境外交易所，這個您知道吧？"],["彭主任委員金隆：知道。"],["吳委員宗憲：好。在這個部分，現在您有什麼積極作為，可以請您現在告訴我嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這個就是我們要訂定專法一個很重要的過程，因為現在大部分交易透過境外的時候，我們的轄管是沒辦法對此做任何管理。"],["吳委員宗憲：但是我跟你說，我看到你們的草案，你們的草案還是管不到這8成的市場，對不對？"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，我想這不是只有臺灣會面臨到的問題。"],["吳委員宗憲：你不能這樣講啊！"],["彭主任委員金隆：我們也在努力，但是我們要先解決國內的這些業者、民眾更容易接觸到的市場。"],["吳委員宗憲：你至少要讓國人知道，有80%國人的投資是政府幫不了你的。"],["彭主任委員金隆：其實不是這樣看啦！"],["吳委員宗憲：我跟你說，我不喜歡政府幹一件事情，政府常常幹一件事情就是告訴國人沒問題，有政府都可以值得信任，結果事情發生之後又做不到。我今天很擔心的一點，會不會我們告訴國人，讓國人誤以為今天去投資這些虛擬貨幣、虛擬資產，到最後他認為被騙了以後，政府也會幫他忙，但是幾乎都拿不回來，他到那一刻才發現，原來政府沒有辦法幫忙。我是希望這個在宣傳的時候，你必須要告訴國人，不要讓國人誤以為你有這個能力，對不對？"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，這個在金融教育確實是需要，因為所有的投資教育、金融教育都是要同步來進行。"],["吳委員宗憲：現在我看到了你們的草案，第一個是國人80%的投資市場，你管不到。再來，您的草案裡面雖然有提到一些……"],["彭主任委員金隆：未來如果是境外納管的話，我們就會管理得到啊！"],["吳委員宗憲：當然啊！但問題是你有沒有辦法納管，重點在這個地方。"],["彭主任委員金隆：如果他來申請落地，像剛才有委員提到境外的VASP願意在臺灣納管，當然就會受到這樣的約束。"],["吳委員宗憲：不是，那你就是被動，我今天講的主軸是被動，好不好？他願意來，我才有辦法管他；他不願意來，人民繼續被騙，錢也拿不回來。"],["彭主任委員金隆：所以我們在第四條裡面有加上一個叫國際合作，我們希望預留個空間，因為確實這件事情是全世界要共同面對的問題。"],["吳委員宗憲：沒關係啦，你再推給全世界。"],["彭主任委員金隆：謝謝委員的提醒。"],["吳委員宗憲：我跟你講，你就直接告訴人民那80%，真的不是我們能夠幫你的忙，請不要投資，就只能這樣做了，你不能一方面講你要做什麼管理中心，另外一方面什麼都做不到。我跟你講，你剛剛講的那個沒有錯，他願意來納管的話，但是現在80%的這些境外交易所，它也沒有主動向臺灣來招攬或打廣告，是我們臺灣人自己上網去搜尋、去那邊從事交易的，所以你們也管不了，你也說如果他願意來，被動的才能夠納管，對不對？"],["彭主任委員金隆：跟委員報告，當我們開始納管，臺灣已經有非常安全的交易平台，他購買的是相同的標的、相同的服務，我想這也是導引我們現在國人走向合規化，就如我剛才講說委員所關心的問題就會被縮小。"],["吳委員宗憲：不是，但是我聽來聽去，還是沒有辦法管理，對不對？"],["彭主任委員金隆：我們會努力跟他講……"],["吳委員宗憲：你要他主動來嘛！"],["彭主任委員金隆：對。"],["吳委員宗憲：你只能消極被動的看他要不要來，除此之外，你對他完全沒有辦法……"],["彭主任委員金隆：如果他看中臺灣的市場……"],["吳委員宗憲：我問你有沒有辦法凍結那80%投資的這些境外交易所得，有沒有辦法？"],["彭主任委員金隆：我想委員是法律專家，非常清楚這個是有困難的。"],["吳委員宗憲：對，就是有困難，所以你要告訴國人，這才是重點。我跟你說我看到114年9月18號你們會後記者會的一些資料，現在臺灣虛擬交易已經到550億美金了，尤其2023年6月到2024年6月這一年的期間已經達到這麼高，投資人比例也從去年12%上升到今年的24%，也就是說投資的數字一直在往上飆。因為時間的關係，我直接跟你講，我現在還是認為這80%還是境外之地，無從管理。但是你看一下我們鄰近的一些對手，日本、韓國、新加坡他們都有設專法在管理。所以我現在看到的是，每天我們國人被騙的有3億元，但是我們什麼都做不了，我們對國外的一些函詢也都石沉大海，這我很清楚，我以前函詢國外也都石沉大海，所以這個沒有辦法落地監管的東西，你還是得要讓國人知道，我管不了，但是我要讓國人知道我真的是管不了，那像日本之前就2022年FTX破產的那件事，你一定很清楚。"],["彭主任委員金隆：是。"],["吳委員宗憲：日本政府就有幫他們國人爭取到，而且要回很多錢，我們國家有沒有辦法做到？當然我知道國際上的困境，但是這不構成理由，回到我剛剛第一句話，人民被騙錢，他只在乎政府有沒有幫他拿回錢，拿得回錢，你就是好政府；拿不回錢，他只會罵你是笨蛋、罵你是廢物，他不會在乎你到底問題出在哪裡，好不好？所以這個部分還是要麻煩你們對這些在臺灣能夠可用、可查、可凍結的加密貨幣市場秩序還是要建立起來……"],["彭主任委員金隆：這個不麻煩。"],["吳委員宗憲：不行的話，就告訴國人你做不到，不要讓國人以為政府管得了，他投資了，被騙的那一天才知道原來政府管不了，這是我在辦公室整天聽到的訊息，好不好？好，謝謝。"],["彭主任委員金隆：我想保護消費者是我們的職責，沒有什麼麻煩，我們會朝這方向來努力。"],["吳委員宗憲：那就要納管。"],["彭主任委員金隆：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝吳委員。","接下來我們請羅明才委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":314,"meet_id":"委員會-11-4-20-5","speakers":["李坤城","林德福","賴士葆","郭國文","賴惠員","吳秉叡","鍾佳濱","顏寬恒","黃珊珊","王世堅","葛如鈞","吳宗憲","羅明才","王鴻薇","林思銘","李彥秀","林楚茵"],"page_start":263,"meetingDate":["2025-10-30"],"gazette_id":"1149101","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1149101_00011"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期財政委員會第5次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請金融監督管理委員會彭主任委員金隆、中央銀行、法務部、內政部警政署就「虛擬資產服務\n法草案及其相關子法修訂暨建立完善監理架構之進程」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1149101_00011"}}}