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\"報告委員我們現在納保法的規定都是要做稅制支出評估那像這個法案的稅制支出評估我們也會送立法院這邊參考另外我們會要求他必須要去定期揭露他整個實施的成效\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 594.914, \"end\": 595.054, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 595.054, \"end\": 595.334, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 595.334, \"end\": 596.115, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 596.115, \"end\": 596.535, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"納\"}, {\"word\": \"保\", \"start\": 596.535, \"end\": 596.715, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 596.715, \"end\": 596.875, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 596.875, \"end\": 597.195, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"規\"}, {\"word\": \"定\", \"start\": 597.195, \"end\": 597.355, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 597.355, \"end\": 597.535, \"score\": 0.961}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 597.535, \"end\": 597.635, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 597.635, \"end\": 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{\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 669.835, \"end\": 670.236, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 670.236, \"end\": 670.436, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 670.436, \"end\": 670.656, \"score\": 0.822}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 670.656, \"end\": 670.836, \"score\": 0.828}, {\"word\": \"示\", \"start\": 670.836, \"end\": 671.536, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 671.536, \"end\": 671.656, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 671.656, \"end\": 671.696, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"席\", \"start\": 671.696, \"end\": 671.836, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 671.836, \"end\": 671.896, \"score\": 0.66}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"賴\"}, {\"word\": \"慧\", \"start\": 671.896, \"end\": 671.916, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"雲\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 671.916, \"end\": 672.176, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 672.176, \"end\": 672.216, \"score\": 0.498}, {\"word\": \"質\"}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}, {\"word\": \"接\", \"start\": 672.216, \"end\": 672.356, \"score\": 0.81}, {\"word\": \"下\", \"start\": 672.356, \"end\": 672.376, \"score\": 0.001}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 672.376, \"end\": 672.676, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"李\", \"start\": 672.676, \"end\": 673.376, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"彥\"}, {\"word\": \"秀\", \"start\": 673.376, \"end\": 674.057, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 674.057, \"end\": 674.077, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"質\"}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:01,371 --> 00:00:08,239\n財稅局專門委員台南市的莊委員好李文文\n\n2\n00:00:13,632 --> 00:00:39,464\n部長首先本席要肯定這一次使用牌照稅的那個第五條修正草案就肯定可是這樣的一個修法當然我們目的是要讓電動車就是可以把它那個整個運具把它電動化那甚至我們也支持就是說2050近年排碳的一個國家的一個目的那事實上就是說\n\n3\n00:00:40,504 --> 00:01:04,493\n全國的地方政府已經減少90億的地方稅收了這減少了90億的地方稅收然後我們來支持就是說在延長5年在延長5年的這一個法的一個修正那首先我想我先請教一下那個台南市政府那個財稅局那個李專委\n\n4\n00:01:05,433 --> 00:01:29,232\n因為你們的支持支持中央的一個這樣的政策所以你每一年台南市少收了多少錢我們今年的話少了6億14年那整個今年少了2億那整個政策下來是少了6億不好意思今年少2億然後\n\n5\n00:01:33,956 --> 00:01:53,447\n一年少兩億對來那個專委你看一下那個我的那個投影片裡頭這個是你們台南市政府的一個稅務局稅務局的一個公文是那你們講了就是在這個說明裡頭就是說\n\n6\n00:01:56,287 --> 00:02:09,830\n稅收的損失累計將達二十億九千萬那是說未來五年未來的五年嘛對所以你一年少收了兩億嘛是好謝謝來那個李專委你請回部長是這個我們你知道一台那個油車大概多少錢起跳用牌照稅啊\n\n7\n00:02:23,959 --> 00:02:37,513\n一台油車賣了多少錢基本上還是要看它是哪一種車款或者是就大概1500cc的大概要百萬吧那這個電動車大概就是150萬以上的電動車\n\n8\n00:02:44,997 --> 00:03:12,288\n那150萬以上的電動車跟500萬的電動車我們有沒有分級去扣他的這個那個牌照稅在電動車沒有應該是沒有所以免就是就沒有分級了就是我們是一致性的嘛一致性的那好今天要跟部長探討的就是說這個有錢的人不用繳稅一般的人要繳稅\n\n9\n00:03:14,570 --> 00:03:27,197\n這個顯然好像不是非常的合理部長每一年我們花了這麼多的錢地方政府就是在這5年我們可能會少收掉我們少收掉那個300\n\n10\n00:03:31,353 --> 00:03:51,742\n376億的稅收流失掉了在全國的地方政府然後我們拿來補貼這一些就是配合我們的政策就是說要減能減碳然後這一些電動車那這樣子的一個方式那你有沒有算到就是說他每一年二氧化碳的那個排放量減少了多少\n\n11\n00:03:53,482 --> 00:04:16,377\n這個部分應該環境部或經濟部都有計算對它的統計裡面一下請組長補充一下是我們覺得根據經濟部所做的碎屍支柱評估它可以未來5年可以減少310萬公餅的燃油消耗量還有739萬公噸的二氧化碳排放量好的第二頁了第二頁了好\n\n12\n00:04:18,398 --> 00:04:46,873\n這個好像是邏輯性其實我聽了不太懂那事實上就是說差了多少你二氧化碳的排放量你少了多少這個數據應該是要很明確的讓我們知道那這樣子我們持續一直5年5年的來修法這個才有意思因為所有現在在全國的這個地方政府的財稅局都在這個地方他們少收了\n\n13\n00:04:47,313 --> 00:05:08,190\n因為要負擔了配合中央的一個政策少收了很多的一個地方稅這地方稅是壓榨到他們的長照他們的教育還有他們的零零總總就像你看台南這五年少收了20.6億那有沒有一個就是比較公平的一個方式呢\n\n14\n00:05:09,091 --> 00:05:25,439\n是不是應該要有一個分級式的一個減稅的制度不然你只要是買電動車不管是1000cc1500cc3000cc減的稅都是一樣的嘛這樣有道理嗎我想聽聽你們的一個建議啊\n\n15\n00:05:26,315 --> 00:05:54,894\n是謝謝委員的提示我想這個部分您認為說應該要有一個更公平的也就是說你買的更高價的其實你有享受更高的一個減稅的利益那這個部分委員的建議也許我們可以再遵循經濟部以及環境部這方面的一個意見那看要怎麼樣的方式更為合理你看你這個稅務是倒退你買電動車你可以享受免貨物稅免牌照稅免燃料稅的多重優惠\n\n16\n00:05:55,374 --> 00:06:07,822\n那這樣子的一個政策的設計就是在一個框框環保我們要追求環保這個也都有道理可是如果長期一直這樣下去的話我覺得\n\n17\n00:06:08,905 --> 00:06:36,588\n不是非常的合理所以我們的租稅優惠都定有一定的期限就是期限到什麼時間然後在這個期限屆滿前可以做一些檢討跟調整你如果每年每年都有一個當然你每年都會有一個檢討嘛每五年就是一個檢討每五年就是一個檢討那你講他就是說電動車的成長率每年是30他的成長率是30%在成長\n\n18\n00:06:38,169 --> 00:07:05,741\n那现在到底电动车它所占的市场的那个%有多少这个你们也要跟我们报告啊我们在那个税市支出评估里面都提出来那我们大概统计的结果到今年的9月电动车大概有12万0834辆而电动机车大概有79万4000辆你这个电动车占的比例这个成长的比例到底占了几%对成长占了几%\n\n19\n00:07:07,113 --> 00:07:23,588\n我看你寫說是每年30%嘛那你一年30%那是不是到了第二年的時候會不會有60%也就是說他成長的比例那我為什麼要同意讓你延到2030年啊這沒有道理啊你保障有錢人啊\n\n20\n00:07:25,592 --> 00:07:44,208\n委員就是說成長的比例因為你知道所有的人大概都是買一百萬的電油車你要跳到電動車的話就是要一百五十萬起跳剛才我在跟你陳述的溝通的就是這樣的一個道理委員的理念是\n\n21\n00:07:46,034 --> 00:07:51,439\n你了解我的理念是不是有一個比較好的一個建議方式第一個電動車我們不管在貨物稅也好在牌照稅以後給予免徵這個確實達到的一個效果就希望能夠趕快增加的就是說汰換這個\n\n22\n00:08:04,190 --> 00:08:24,084\n燃油車然後改用電動車的一個目的同時我們也希望國內的電動車的產業能夠持續的發展鼓勵消費者買那我們的產業也能夠發展起來我覺得這也是一個很同樣的一個目的在裡面其實政策修正我是建議就是說你要延長授權給地方政府免徵這個電動車量的使用牌照稅\n\n23\n00:08:28,137 --> 00:08:38,283\n是授權的因為他是地方稅所以地方政府得他是地方稅可是他撿不到這些錢他沒有受益到\n\n24\n00:08:44,898 --> 00:09:05,994\n我的意思是说地方政府没有收到这些钱那没关系部长我们可以那个会后我们再一起探讨一下其实在这里还是建议你就是说你必须要你刚才就有特别讲到跨部会的一个合作我们是不是可以那个设置一个电动车免税的一个补助基金\n\n25\n00:09:06,835 --> 00:09:25,868\n那這個基金其實我們可以用來調整免稅的範圍跟對象還有你的逐步的退場機制其實你現在推動的非常好你的退場機制要出來啊是了解我想委員這個建議很好我們再跟相關的部會然後再來討論也跟委員請教\n\n26\n00:09:28,610 --> 00:09:45,359\n那再請教妳妳有沒有建立一個成效的評估的制度這個部分都會有的因為我們在提出稅法的優惠的時候都要目的事業主管機關他的稅是支出評估講一個比較具體的好不好每一年也會來署長妳來做補充一下就是說成效評估\n\n27\n00:09:54,914 --> 00:10:08,661\n報告委員我們現在納保法的規定都是要做稅制支出評估那像這個法案的稅制支出評估我們也會送立法院這邊參考另外我們會要求他必須要去定期揭露他整個實施的成效\n\n28\n00:10:10,086 --> 00:10:36,205\n所以我還是要再回到一句話再請問你們就是說部長跟署長你們對於這個稅制你們是滿意的雖然它減碳的成效基本上我們看起來我們看起來就是說其實我一直找不到就是一個比較具體的一個數目所有的官方的資料裡頭找不到不知道是環保局那個環境部他們\n\n29\n00:10:37,026 --> 00:10:59,453\n用的方式其實是我們不了解的還是剛才署長你回答的這個我也聽不懂你要告訴我說啊這個有幾千輛的這個什麼電動車這個都太籠統了到底你的排放量你到底減少了多少我們希望有一個正確的一個數字給我們做參考好不好我們再提送報告給委員同時\n\n30\n00:11:00,833 --> 00:11:14,077\n也看在哪應該要揭露這樣的一個成果讓全國民眾了解是嘛這樣子我們支持你的這個修法那個正當性會更強好不好謝謝委員提示謝謝部長謝謝主席好謝謝賴慧雲委員的質詢接下來我們請李彥秀委員質詢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n1371\t8239\t財稅局專門委員台南市的莊委員好李文文\n13632\t39464\t部長 首先本席要肯定這一次使用牌照稅的那個第五條修正草案就肯定 可是這樣的一個修法當然我們目的是要讓電動車就是可以把它那個整個運具把它電動化那甚至我們也支持就是說2050近年排碳的一個國家的一個目的那事實上就是說\n40504\t64493\t全國的地方政府已經減少90億的地方稅收了這減少了90億的地方稅收然後我們來支持就是說在延長5年在延長5年的這一個法的一個修正那首先我想我先請教一下那個台南市政府那個財稅局那個李專委\n65433\t89232\t因為你們的支持支持中央的一個這樣的政策所以你每一年台南市少收了多少錢我們今年的話少了6億14年那整個今年少了2億那整個政策下來是少了6億不好意思今年少2億然後\n93956\t113447\t一年少兩億對來那個專委你看一下那個我的那個投影片裡頭這個是你們台南市政府的一個稅務局稅務局的一個公文是那你們講了就是在這個說明裡頭就是說\n116287\t129830\t稅收的損失累計將達二十億九千萬那是說未來五年未來的五年嘛對所以你一年少收了兩億嘛是好 謝謝來 那個李專委你請回部長是這個我們你知道一台那個油車大概多少錢起跳用牌照稅啊\n143959\t157513\t一台油車賣了多少錢基本上還是要看它是哪一種車款或者是就大概1500cc的大概要百萬吧那這個電動車大概就是150萬以上的電動車\n164997\t192288\t那150萬以上的電動車跟500萬的電動車我們有沒有分級去扣他的這個那個牌照稅在電動車沒有應該是沒有所以免就是就沒有分級了就是我們是一致性的嘛一致性的那好今天要跟部長探討的就是說這個有錢的人不用繳稅一般的人要繳稅\n194570\t207197\t這個顯然好像不是非常的合理部長每一年我們花了這麼多的錢地方政府就是在這5年我們可能會少收掉我們少收掉那個300\n211353\t231742\t376億的稅收流失掉了在全國的地方政府然後我們拿來補貼這一些就是配合我們的政策就是說要減能減碳然後這一些電動車那這樣子的一個方式那你有沒有算到就是說他每一年二氧化碳的那個排放量減少了多少\n233482\t256377\t這個部分應該環境部或經濟部都有計算對 它的統計裡面一下請組長補充一下是 我們覺得根據經濟部所做的碎屍支柱評估它可以未來5年可以減少310萬公餅的燃油消耗量還有739萬公噸的二氧化碳排放量好的 第二頁了 第二頁了好\n258398\t286873\t這個好像是邏輯性其實我聽了不太懂那事實上就是說差了多少你二氧化碳的排放量你少了多少這個數據應該是要很明確的讓我們知道那這樣子我們持續一直5年5年的來修法這個才有意思因為所有現在在全國的這個地方政府的財稅局都在這個地方他們少收了\n287313\t308190\t因為要負擔了配合中央的一個政策少收了很多的一個地方稅這地方稅是壓榨到他們的長照他們的教育還有他們的零零總總就像你看台南這五年少收了20.6億那有沒有一個就是比較公平的一個方式呢\n309091\t325439\t是不是應該要有一個分級式的一個減稅的制度不然你只要是買電動車不管是1000cc 1500cc 3000cc減的稅都是一樣的嘛這樣有道理嗎我想聽聽你們的一個建議啊\n326315\t354894\t是謝謝委員的提示我想這個部分您認為說應該要有一個更公平的也就是說你買的更高價的其實你有享受更高的一個減稅的利益那這個部分委員的建議也許我們可以再遵循經濟部以及環境部這方面的一個意見那看要怎麼樣的方式更為合理你看你這個稅務是倒退你買電動車你可以享受免貨物稅免牌照稅免燃料稅的多重優惠\n355374\t367822\t那這樣子的一個政策的設計就是在一個框框環保我們要追求環保這個也都有道理可是如果長期一直這樣下去的話我覺得\n368905\t396588\t不是非常的合理所以我們的租稅優惠都定有一定的期限就是期限到什麼時間然後在這個期限屆滿前可以做一些檢討跟調整你如果每年每年都有一個當然你每年都會有一個檢討嘛每五年就是一個檢討每五年就是一個檢討那你講他就是說電動車的成長率每年是30他的成長率是30%在成長\n398169\t425741\t那现在到底电动车它所占的市场的那个%有多少这个你们也要跟我们报告啊我们在那个税市支出评估里面都提出来那我们大概统计的结果到今年的9月电动车大概有12万0834辆而电动机车大概有79万4000辆你这个电动车占的比例这个成长的比例到底占了几%对成长占了几%\n427113\t443588\t我看你寫說是每年30%嘛那你一年30%那是不是到了第二年的時候會不會有60%也就是說他成長的比例那我為什麼要同意讓你延到2030年啊這沒有道理啊你保障有錢人啊\n445592\t464208\t委員就是說成長的比例因為你知道所有的人大概都是買一百萬的電油車你要跳到電動車的話就是要一百五十萬起跳剛才我在跟你陳述的溝通的就是這樣的一個道理委員的理念是\n466034\t471439\t你了解我的理念是不是有一個比較好的一個建議方式第一個電動車我們不管在貨物稅也好在牌照稅以後給予免徵這個確實達到的一個效果就希望能夠趕快增加的就是說汰換這個\n484190\t504084\t燃油車然後改用電動車的一個目的同時我們也希望國內的電動車的產業能夠持續的發展鼓勵消費者買那我們的產業也能夠發展起來我覺得這也是一個很同樣的一個目的在裡面其實政策修正我是建議就是說你要延長授權給地方政府免徵這個電動車量的使用牌照稅\n508137\t518283\t是授權的因為他是地方稅所以地方政府得他是地方稅可是他撿不到這些錢他沒有受益到\n524898\t545994\t我的意思是说地方政府没有收到这些钱那没关系部长我们可以那个会后我们再一起探讨一下其实在这里还是建议你就是说你必须要你刚才就有特别讲到跨部会的一个合作我们是不是可以那个设置一个电动车免税的一个补助基金\n546835\t565868\t那這個基金其實我們可以用來調整免稅的範圍跟對象還有你的逐步的退場機制其實你現在推動的非常好你的退場機制要出來啊是了解我想委員這個建議很好我們再跟相關的部會然後再來討論也跟委員請教\n568610\t585359\t那再請教妳 妳有沒有建立一個成效的評估的制度這個部分都會有的 因為我們在提出稅法的優惠的時候都要目的事業主管機關 他的稅是支出評估講一個比較具體的好不好 每一年也會來 署長妳來做補充一下 就是說成效評估\n594914\t608661\t報告委員我們現在納保法的規定都是要做稅制支出評估那像這個法案的稅制支出評估我們也會送立法院這邊參考另外我們會要求他必須要去定期揭露他整個實施的成效\n610086\t636205\t所以我還是要再回到一句話再請問你們就是說部長跟署長你們對於這個稅制你們是滿意的雖然它減碳的成效基本上我們看起來我們看起來就是說其實我一直找不到就是一個比較具體的一個數目所有的官方的資料裡頭找不到不知道是環保局那個環境部他們\n637026\t659453\t用的方式其實是我們不了解的還是剛才署長你回答的這個我也聽不懂你要告訴我說啊這個有幾千輛的這個什麼電動車這個都太籠統了到底你的排放量你到底減少了多少我們希望有一個正確的一個數字給我們做參考好不好我們再提送報告給委員同時\n660833\t674077\t也看在哪應該要揭露這樣的一個成果讓全國民眾了解是嘛這樣子我們支持你的這個修法那個正當性會更強好不好謝謝委員提示謝謝部長謝謝主席好謝謝賴慧雲委員的質詢接下來我們請李彥秀委員質詢\n","txt":"財稅局專門委員台南市的莊委員好李文文\n部長 首先本席要肯定這一次使用牌照稅的那個第五條修正草案就肯定 可是這樣的一個修法當然我們目的是要讓電動車就是可以把它那個整個運具把它電動化那甚至我們也支持就是說2050近年排碳的一個國家的一個目的那事實上就是說\n全國的地方政府已經減少90億的地方稅收了這減少了90億的地方稅收然後我們來支持就是說在延長5年在延長5年的這一個法的一個修正那首先我想我先請教一下那個台南市政府那個財稅局那個李專委\n因為你們的支持支持中央的一個這樣的政策所以你每一年台南市少收了多少錢我們今年的話少了6億14年那整個今年少了2億那整個政策下來是少了6億不好意思今年少2億然後\n一年少兩億對來那個專委你看一下那個我的那個投影片裡頭這個是你們台南市政府的一個稅務局稅務局的一個公文是那你們講了就是在這個說明裡頭就是說\n稅收的損失累計將達二十億九千萬那是說未來五年未來的五年嘛對所以你一年少收了兩億嘛是好 謝謝來 那個李專委你請回部長是這個我們你知道一台那個油車大概多少錢起跳用牌照稅啊\n一台油車賣了多少錢基本上還是要看它是哪一種車款或者是就大概1500cc的大概要百萬吧那這個電動車大概就是150萬以上的電動車\n那150萬以上的電動車跟500萬的電動車我們有沒有分級去扣他的這個那個牌照稅在電動車沒有應該是沒有所以免就是就沒有分級了就是我們是一致性的嘛一致性的那好今天要跟部長探討的就是說這個有錢的人不用繳稅一般的人要繳稅\n這個顯然好像不是非常的合理部長每一年我們花了這麼多的錢地方政府就是在這5年我們可能會少收掉我們少收掉那個300\n376億的稅收流失掉了在全國的地方政府然後我們拿來補貼這一些就是配合我們的政策就是說要減能減碳然後這一些電動車那這樣子的一個方式那你有沒有算到就是說他每一年二氧化碳的那個排放量減少了多少\n這個部分應該環境部或經濟部都有計算對 它的統計裡面一下請組長補充一下是 我們覺得根據經濟部所做的碎屍支柱評估它可以未來5年可以減少310萬公餅的燃油消耗量還有739萬公噸的二氧化碳排放量好的 第二頁了 第二頁了好\n這個好像是邏輯性其實我聽了不太懂那事實上就是說差了多少你二氧化碳的排放量你少了多少這個數據應該是要很明確的讓我們知道那這樣子我們持續一直5年5年的來修法這個才有意思因為所有現在在全國的這個地方政府的財稅局都在這個地方他們少收了\n因為要負擔了配合中央的一個政策少收了很多的一個地方稅這地方稅是壓榨到他們的長照他們的教育還有他們的零零總總就像你看台南這五年少收了20.6億那有沒有一個就是比較公平的一個方式呢\n是不是應該要有一個分級式的一個減稅的制度不然你只要是買電動車不管是1000cc 1500cc 3000cc減的稅都是一樣的嘛這樣有道理嗎我想聽聽你們的一個建議啊\n是謝謝委員的提示我想這個部分您認為說應該要有一個更公平的也就是說你買的更高價的其實你有享受更高的一個減稅的利益那這個部分委員的建議也許我們可以再遵循經濟部以及環境部這方面的一個意見那看要怎麼樣的方式更為合理你看你這個稅務是倒退你買電動車你可以享受免貨物稅免牌照稅免燃料稅的多重優惠\n那這樣子的一個政策的設計就是在一個框框環保我們要追求環保這個也都有道理可是如果長期一直這樣下去的話我覺得\n不是非常的合理所以我們的租稅優惠都定有一定的期限就是期限到什麼時間然後在這個期限屆滿前可以做一些檢討跟調整你如果每年每年都有一個當然你每年都會有一個檢討嘛每五年就是一個檢討每五年就是一個檢討那你講他就是說電動車的成長率每年是30他的成長率是30%在成長\n那现在到底电动车它所占的市场的那个%有多少这个你们也要跟我们报告啊我们在那个税市支出评估里面都提出来那我们大概统计的结果到今年的9月电动车大概有12万0834辆而电动机车大概有79万4000辆你这个电动车占的比例这个成长的比例到底占了几%对成长占了几%\n我看你寫說是每年30%嘛那你一年30%那是不是到了第二年的時候會不會有60%也就是說他成長的比例那我為什麼要同意讓你延到2030年啊這沒有道理啊你保障有錢人啊\n委員就是說成長的比例因為你知道所有的人大概都是買一百萬的電油車你要跳到電動車的話就是要一百五十萬起跳剛才我在跟你陳述的溝通的就是這樣的一個道理委員的理念是\n你了解我的理念是不是有一個比較好的一個建議方式第一個電動車我們不管在貨物稅也好在牌照稅以後給予免徵這個確實達到的一個效果就希望能夠趕快增加的就是說汰換這個\n燃油車然後改用電動車的一個目的同時我們也希望國內的電動車的產業能夠持續的發展鼓勵消費者買那我們的產業也能夠發展起來我覺得這也是一個很同樣的一個目的在裡面其實政策修正我是建議就是說你要延長授權給地方政府免徵這個電動車量的使用牌照稅\n是授權的因為他是地方稅所以地方政府得他是地方稅可是他撿不到這些錢他沒有受益到\n我的意思是说地方政府没有收到这些钱那没关系部长我们可以那个会后我们再一起探讨一下其实在这里还是建议你就是说你必须要你刚才就有特别讲到跨部会的一个合作我们是不是可以那个设置一个电动车免税的一个补助基金\n那這個基金其實我們可以用來調整免稅的範圍跟對象還有你的逐步的退場機制其實你現在推動的非常好你的退場機制要出來啊是了解我想委員這個建議很好我們再跟相關的部會然後再來討論也跟委員請教\n那再請教妳 妳有沒有建立一個成效的評估的制度這個部分都會有的 因為我們在提出稅法的優惠的時候都要目的事業主管機關 他的稅是支出評估講一個比較具體的好不好 每一年也會來 署長妳來做補充一下 就是說成效評估\n報告委員我們現在納保法的規定都是要做稅制支出評估那像這個法案的稅制支出評估我們也會送立法院這邊參考另外我們會要求他必須要去定期揭露他整個實施的成效\n所以我還是要再回到一句話再請問你們就是說部長跟署長你們對於這個稅制你們是滿意的雖然它減碳的成效基本上我們看起來我們看起來就是說其實我一直找不到就是一個比較具體的一個數目所有的官方的資料裡頭找不到不知道是環保局那個環境部他們\n用的方式其實是我們不了解的還是剛才署長你回答的這個我也聽不懂你要告訴我說啊這個有幾千輛的這個什麼電動車這個都太籠統了到底你的排放量你到底減少了多少我們希望有一個正確的一個數字給我們做參考好不好我們再提送報告給委員同時\n也看在哪應該要揭露這樣的一個成果讓全國民眾了解是嘛這樣子我們支持你的這個修法那個正當性會更強好不好謝謝委員提示謝謝部長謝謝主席好謝謝賴慧雲委員的質詢接下來我們請李彥秀委員質詢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:01.371 --> 00:08.239\n財稅局專門委員台南市的莊委員好李文文\n\n00:13.632 --> 00:39.464\n部長首先本席要肯定這一次使用牌照稅的那個第五條修正草案就肯定可是這樣的一個修法當然我們目的是要讓電動車就是可以把它那個整個運具把它電動化那甚至我們也支持就是說2050近年排碳的一個國家的一個目的那事實上就是說\n\n00:40.504 --> 01:04.493\n全國的地方政府已經減少90億的地方稅收了這減少了90億的地方稅收然後我們來支持就是說在延長5年在延長5年的這一個法的一個修正那首先我想我先請教一下那個台南市政府那個財稅局那個李專委\n\n01:05.433 --> 01:29.232\n因為你們的支持支持中央的一個這樣的政策所以你每一年台南市少收了多少錢我們今年的話少了6億14年那整個今年少了2億那整個政策下來是少了6億不好意思今年少2億然後\n\n01:33.956 --> 01:53.447\n一年少兩億對來那個專委你看一下那個我的那個投影片裡頭這個是你們台南市政府的一個稅務局稅務局的一個公文是那你們講了就是在這個說明裡頭就是說\n\n01:56.287 --> 02:09.830\n稅收的損失累計將達二十億九千萬那是說未來五年未來的五年嘛對所以你一年少收了兩億嘛是好謝謝來那個李專委你請回部長是這個我們你知道一台那個油車大概多少錢起跳用牌照稅啊\n\n02:23.959 --> 02:37.513\n一台油車賣了多少錢基本上還是要看它是哪一種車款或者是就大概1500cc的大概要百萬吧那這個電動車大概就是150萬以上的電動車\n\n02:44.997 --> 03:12.288\n那150萬以上的電動車跟500萬的電動車我們有沒有分級去扣他的這個那個牌照稅在電動車沒有應該是沒有所以免就是就沒有分級了就是我們是一致性的嘛一致性的那好今天要跟部長探討的就是說這個有錢的人不用繳稅一般的人要繳稅\n\n03:14.570 --> 03:27.197\n這個顯然好像不是非常的合理部長每一年我們花了這麼多的錢地方政府就是在這5年我們可能會少收掉我們少收掉那個300\n\n03:31.353 --> 03:51.742\n376億的稅收流失掉了在全國的地方政府然後我們拿來補貼這一些就是配合我們的政策就是說要減能減碳然後這一些電動車那這樣子的一個方式那你有沒有算到就是說他每一年二氧化碳的那個排放量減少了多少\n\n03:53.482 --> 04:16.377\n這個部分應該環境部或經濟部都有計算對它的統計裡面一下請組長補充一下是我們覺得根據經濟部所做的碎屍支柱評估它可以未來5年可以減少310萬公餅的燃油消耗量還有739萬公噸的二氧化碳排放量好的第二頁了第二頁了好\n\n04:18.398 --> 04:46.873\n這個好像是邏輯性其實我聽了不太懂那事實上就是說差了多少你二氧化碳的排放量你少了多少這個數據應該是要很明確的讓我們知道那這樣子我們持續一直5年5年的來修法這個才有意思因為所有現在在全國的這個地方政府的財稅局都在這個地方他們少收了\n\n04:47.313 --> 05:08.190\n因為要負擔了配合中央的一個政策少收了很多的一個地方稅這地方稅是壓榨到他們的長照他們的教育還有他們的零零總總就像你看台南這五年少收了20.6億那有沒有一個就是比較公平的一個方式呢\n\n05:09.091 --> 05:25.439\n是不是應該要有一個分級式的一個減稅的制度不然你只要是買電動車不管是1000cc1500cc3000cc減的稅都是一樣的嘛這樣有道理嗎我想聽聽你們的一個建議啊\n\n05:26.315 --> 05:54.894\n是謝謝委員的提示我想這個部分您認為說應該要有一個更公平的也就是說你買的更高價的其實你有享受更高的一個減稅的利益那這個部分委員的建議也許我們可以再遵循經濟部以及環境部這方面的一個意見那看要怎麼樣的方式更為合理你看你這個稅務是倒退你買電動車你可以享受免貨物稅免牌照稅免燃料稅的多重優惠\n\n05:55.374 --> 06:07.822\n那這樣子的一個政策的設計就是在一個框框環保我們要追求環保這個也都有道理可是如果長期一直這樣下去的話我覺得\n\n06:08.905 --> 06:36.588\n不是非常的合理所以我們的租稅優惠都定有一定的期限就是期限到什麼時間然後在這個期限屆滿前可以做一些檢討跟調整你如果每年每年都有一個當然你每年都會有一個檢討嘛每五年就是一個檢討每五年就是一個檢討那你講他就是說電動車的成長率每年是30他的成長率是30%在成長\n\n06:38.169 --> 07:05.741\n那现在到底电动车它所占的市场的那个%有多少这个你们也要跟我们报告啊我们在那个税市支出评估里面都提出来那我们大概统计的结果到今年的9月电动车大概有12万0834辆而电动机车大概有79万4000辆你这个电动车占的比例这个成长的比例到底占了几%对成长占了几%\n\n07:07.113 --> 07:23.588\n我看你寫說是每年30%嘛那你一年30%那是不是到了第二年的時候會不會有60%也就是說他成長的比例那我為什麼要同意讓你延到2030年啊這沒有道理啊你保障有錢人啊\n\n07:25.592 --> 07:44.208\n委員就是說成長的比例因為你知道所有的人大概都是買一百萬的電油車你要跳到電動車的話就是要一百五十萬起跳剛才我在跟你陳述的溝通的就是這樣的一個道理委員的理念是\n\n07:46.034 --> 07:51.439\n你了解我的理念是不是有一個比較好的一個建議方式第一個電動車我們不管在貨物稅也好在牌照稅以後給予免徵這個確實達到的一個效果就希望能夠趕快增加的就是說汰換這個\n\n08:04.190 --> 08:24.084\n燃油車然後改用電動車的一個目的同時我們也希望國內的電動車的產業能夠持續的發展鼓勵消費者買那我們的產業也能夠發展起來我覺得這也是一個很同樣的一個目的在裡面其實政策修正我是建議就是說你要延長授權給地方政府免徵這個電動車量的使用牌照稅\n\n08:28.137 --> 08:38.283\n是授權的因為他是地方稅所以地方政府得他是地方稅可是他撿不到這些錢他沒有受益到\n\n08:44.898 --> 09:05.994\n我的意思是说地方政府没有收到这些钱那没关系部长我们可以那个会后我们再一起探讨一下其实在这里还是建议你就是说你必须要你刚才就有特别讲到跨部会的一个合作我们是不是可以那个设置一个电动车免税的一个补助基金\n\n09:06.835 --> 09:25.868\n那這個基金其實我們可以用來調整免稅的範圍跟對象還有你的逐步的退場機制其實你現在推動的非常好你的退場機制要出來啊是了解我想委員這個建議很好我們再跟相關的部會然後再來討論也跟委員請教\n\n09:28.610 --> 09:45.359\n那再請教妳妳有沒有建立一個成效的評估的制度這個部分都會有的因為我們在提出稅法的優惠的時候都要目的事業主管機關他的稅是支出評估講一個比較具體的好不好每一年也會來署長妳來做補充一下就是說成效評估\n\n09:54.914 --> 10:08.661\n報告委員我們現在納保法的規定都是要做稅制支出評估那像這個法案的稅制支出評估我們也會送立法院這邊參考另外我們會要求他必須要去定期揭露他整個實施的成效\n\n10:10.086 --> 10:36.205\n所以我還是要再回到一句話再請問你們就是說部長跟署長你們對於這個稅制你們是滿意的雖然它減碳的成效基本上我們看起來我們看起來就是說其實我一直找不到就是一個比較具體的一個數目所有的官方的資料裡頭找不到不知道是環保局那個環境部他們\n\n10:37.026 --> 10:59.453\n用的方式其實是我們不了解的還是剛才署長你回答的這個我也聽不懂你要告訴我說啊這個有幾千輛的這個什麼電動車這個都太籠統了到底你的排放量你到底減少了多少我們希望有一個正確的一個數字給我們做參考好不好我們再提送報告給委員同時\n\n11:00.833 --> 11:14.077\n也看在哪應該要揭露這樣的一個成果讓全國民眾了解是嘛這樣子我們支持你的這個修法那個正當性會更強好不好謝謝委員提示謝謝部長謝謝主席好謝謝賴慧雲委員的質詢接下來我們請李彥秀委員質詢\n\n","segments":[{"start":1.371,"end":8.239,"text":"財稅局專門委員台南市的莊委員好李文文"},{"start":13.632,"end":39.464,"text":"部長 首先本席要肯定這一次使用牌照稅的那個第五條修正草案就肯定 可是這樣的一個修法當然我們目的是要讓電動車就是可以把它那個整個運具把它電動化那甚至我們也支持就是說2050近年排碳的一個國家的一個目的那事實上就是說"},{"start":40.504,"end":64.493,"text":"全國的地方政府已經減少90億的地方稅收了這減少了90億的地方稅收然後我們來支持就是說在延長5年在延長5年的這一個法的一個修正那首先我想我先請教一下那個台南市政府那個財稅局那個李專委"},{"start":65.433,"end":89.232,"text":"因為你們的支持支持中央的一個這樣的政策所以你每一年台南市少收了多少錢我們今年的話少了6億14年那整個今年少了2億那整個政策下來是少了6億不好意思今年少2億然後"},{"start":93.956,"end":113.447,"text":"一年少兩億對來那個專委你看一下那個我的那個投影片裡頭這個是你們台南市政府的一個稅務局稅務局的一個公文是那你們講了就是在這個說明裡頭就是說"},{"start":116.287,"end":129.83,"text":"稅收的損失累計將達二十億九千萬那是說未來五年未來的五年嘛對所以你一年少收了兩億嘛是好 謝謝來 那個李專委你請回部長是這個我們你知道一台那個油車大概多少錢起跳用牌照稅啊"},{"start":143.959,"end":157.513,"text":"一台油車賣了多少錢基本上還是要看它是哪一種車款或者是就大概1500cc的大概要百萬吧那這個電動車大概就是150萬以上的電動車"},{"start":164.997,"end":192.288,"text":"那150萬以上的電動車跟500萬的電動車我們有沒有分級去扣他的這個那個牌照稅在電動車沒有應該是沒有所以免就是就沒有分級了就是我們是一致性的嘛一致性的那好今天要跟部長探討的就是說這個有錢的人不用繳稅一般的人要繳稅"},{"start":194.57,"end":207.197,"text":"這個顯然好像不是非常的合理部長每一年我們花了這麼多的錢地方政府就是在這5年我們可能會少收掉我們少收掉那個300"},{"start":211.353,"end":231.742,"text":"376億的稅收流失掉了在全國的地方政府然後我們拿來補貼這一些就是配合我們的政策就是說要減能減碳然後這一些電動車那這樣子的一個方式那你有沒有算到就是說他每一年二氧化碳的那個排放量減少了多少"},{"start":233.482,"end":256.377,"text":"這個部分應該環境部或經濟部都有計算對 它的統計裡面一下請組長補充一下是 我們覺得根據經濟部所做的碎屍支柱評估它可以未來5年可以減少310萬公餅的燃油消耗量還有739萬公噸的二氧化碳排放量好的 第二頁了 第二頁了好"},{"start":258.398,"end":286.873,"text":"這個好像是邏輯性其實我聽了不太懂那事實上就是說差了多少你二氧化碳的排放量你少了多少這個數據應該是要很明確的讓我們知道那這樣子我們持續一直5年5年的來修法這個才有意思因為所有現在在全國的這個地方政府的財稅局都在這個地方他們少收了"},{"start":287.313,"end":308.19,"text":"因為要負擔了配合中央的一個政策少收了很多的一個地方稅這地方稅是壓榨到他們的長照他們的教育還有他們的零零總總就像你看台南這五年少收了20.6億那有沒有一個就是比較公平的一個方式呢"},{"start":309.091,"end":325.439,"text":"是不是應該要有一個分級式的一個減稅的制度不然你只要是買電動車不管是1000cc 1500cc 3000cc減的稅都是一樣的嘛這樣有道理嗎我想聽聽你們的一個建議啊"},{"start":326.315,"end":354.894,"text":"是謝謝委員的提示我想這個部分您認為說應該要有一個更公平的也就是說你買的更高價的其實你有享受更高的一個減稅的利益那這個部分委員的建議也許我們可以再遵循經濟部以及環境部這方面的一個意見那看要怎麼樣的方式更為合理你看你這個稅務是倒退你買電動車你可以享受免貨物稅免牌照稅免燃料稅的多重優惠"},{"start":355.374,"end":367.822,"text":"那這樣子的一個政策的設計就是在一個框框環保我們要追求環保這個也都有道理可是如果長期一直這樣下去的話我覺得"},{"start":368.905,"end":396.588,"text":"不是非常的合理所以我們的租稅優惠都定有一定的期限就是期限到什麼時間然後在這個期限屆滿前可以做一些檢討跟調整你如果每年每年都有一個當然你每年都會有一個檢討嘛每五年就是一個檢討每五年就是一個檢討那你講他就是說電動車的成長率每年是30他的成長率是30%在成長"},{"start":398.169,"end":425.741,"text":"那现在到底电动车它所占的市场的那个%有多少这个你们也要跟我们报告啊我们在那个税市支出评估里面都提出来那我们大概统计的结果到今年的9月电动车大概有12万0834辆而电动机车大概有79万4000辆你这个电动车占的比例这个成长的比例到底占了几%对成长占了几%"},{"start":427.113,"end":443.588,"text":"我看你寫說是每年30%嘛那你一年30%那是不是到了第二年的時候會不會有60%也就是說他成長的比例那我為什麼要同意讓你延到2030年啊這沒有道理啊你保障有錢人啊"},{"start":445.592,"end":464.208,"text":"委員就是說成長的比例因為你知道所有的人大概都是買一百萬的電油車你要跳到電動車的話就是要一百五十萬起跳剛才我在跟你陳述的溝通的就是這樣的一個道理委員的理念是"},{"start":466.034,"end":471.439,"text":"你了解我的理念是不是有一個比較好的一個建議方式第一個電動車我們不管在貨物稅也好在牌照稅以後給予免徵這個確實達到的一個效果就希望能夠趕快增加的就是說汰換這個"},{"start":484.19,"end":504.084,"text":"燃油車然後改用電動車的一個目的同時我們也希望國內的電動車的產業能夠持續的發展鼓勵消費者買那我們的產業也能夠發展起來我覺得這也是一個很同樣的一個目的在裡面其實政策修正我是建議就是說你要延長授權給地方政府免徵這個電動車量的使用牌照稅"},{"start":508.137,"end":518.283,"text":"是授權的因為他是地方稅所以地方政府得他是地方稅可是他撿不到這些錢他沒有受益到"},{"start":524.898,"end":545.994,"text":"我的意思是说地方政府没有收到这些钱那没关系部长我们可以那个会后我们再一起探讨一下其实在这里还是建议你就是说你必须要你刚才就有特别讲到跨部会的一个合作我们是不是可以那个设置一个电动车免税的一个补助基金"},{"start":546.835,"end":565.868,"text":"那這個基金其實我們可以用來調整免稅的範圍跟對象還有你的逐步的退場機制其實你現在推動的非常好你的退場機制要出來啊是了解我想委員這個建議很好我們再跟相關的部會然後再來討論也跟委員請教"},{"start":568.61,"end":585.359,"text":"那再請教妳 妳有沒有建立一個成效的評估的制度這個部分都會有的 因為我們在提出稅法的優惠的時候都要目的事業主管機關 他的稅是支出評估講一個比較具體的好不好 每一年也會來 署長妳來做補充一下 就是說成效評估"},{"start":594.914,"end":608.661,"text":"報告委員我們現在納保法的規定都是要做稅制支出評估那像這個法案的稅制支出評估我們也會送立法院這邊參考另外我們會要求他必須要去定期揭露他整個實施的成效"},{"start":610.086,"end":636.205,"text":"所以我還是要再回到一句話再請問你們就是說部長跟署長你們對於這個稅制你們是滿意的雖然它減碳的成效基本上我們看起來我們看起來就是說其實我一直找不到就是一個比較具體的一個數目所有的官方的資料裡頭找不到不知道是環保局那個環境部他們"},{"start":637.026,"end":659.453,"text":"用的方式其實是我們不了解的還是剛才署長你回答的這個我也聽不懂你要告訴我說啊這個有幾千輛的這個什麼電動車這個都太籠統了到底你的排放量你到底減少了多少我們希望有一個正確的一個數字給我們做參考好不好我們再提送報告給委員同時"},{"start":660.833,"end":674.077,"text":"也看在哪應該要揭露這樣的一個成果讓全國民眾了解是嘛這樣子我們支持你的這個修法那個正當性會更強好不好謝謝委員提示謝謝部長謝謝主席好謝謝賴慧雲委員的質詢接下來我們請李彥秀委員質詢"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":348,"blocks":[["賴委員惠員：（10時10分）謝謝主席。有請財政部莊部長。"],["主席：請莊部長。"],["賴委員惠員：還有臺南市財稅局專門委員。"],["主席：是，臺南市的李玟玟專委。"],["莊部長翠雲：委員好。"],["賴委員惠員：部長，首先本席要肯定這一次有關使用牌照稅第五條條文修正草案。"],["莊部長翠雲：謝謝委員支持。"],["賴委員惠員：可是這樣的修法，當然我們目的是要讓整個運具電動化，甚至我們也支持2050淨零排碳的一個國家的目的，事實上全國的地方政府已經減少90億的地方稅收了，減少90億的地方稅收，然後我們來支持再延長5年這一個法的修正。首先我先請教一下臺南市政府財稅局李專委，因為你們支持中央這樣的政策，所以每一年臺南市少收了多少錢？"],["李專門委員玟玟：我們今年少了6億，這是114年，整個……"],["賴委員惠員：對。"],["李專門委員玟玟：今年少了兩億，整個政策下來是少了6億，不好意思。"],["賴委員惠員：今年少兩億？"],["李專門委員玟玟：對。"],["賴委員惠員：一年少兩億？"],["李專門委員玟玟：對。"],["賴委員惠員：專委，你看一下我的投影片，這是你們臺南市政府稅務局的公文，你們講了，就是在說明裡提到稅收的損失累計將達20億9,000萬……"],["李專門委員玟玟：那是說未來5年。"],["賴委員惠員：未來的5年嘛！"],["李專門委員玟玟：對。"],["賴委員惠員：所以你一年少收了兩億嘛！"],["李專門委員玟玟：是。"],["賴委員惠員：好，謝謝。李專委，你請回。","部長，你知道1臺油車大概多少錢起跳？"],["莊部長翠雲：使用牌照稅嗎？"],["賴委員惠員：不是，1臺油車賣了多少錢？80萬、100萬？"],["莊部長翠雲：基本上還是要看它是哪一種車款或者是……"],["賴委員惠員：對，大概1,500cc的。"],["莊部長翠雲：大概要百萬吧！"],["賴委員惠員：電動車大概就是150萬以上，150萬以上的電動車跟500萬的電動車，我們有沒有分級去扣牌照稅？"],["莊部長翠雲：在電動車沒有，應該是沒有。"],["賴委員惠員：沒有嘛？"],["莊部長翠雲：因為是「免」，免就沒有分級了。"],["賴委員惠員：我們是一致性的嘛。今天要跟部長探討，有錢的人不用繳稅，一般的人要繳稅，這個顯然好像不是非常的合理。部長，每一年我們花了這麼多的錢，地方政府就是在這5年，我們可能會少收376億的稅收，在全國地方政府有376億的稅收流失掉了，然後我們拿來補貼這一些電動車，為了配合我們的政策，達到節能減碳，這樣的方式，你有沒有算到它每一年二氧化碳的排放量減少了多少？"],["莊部長翠雲：這個部分應該環境部或經濟部都有計算，我請請署長補充。"],["宋署長秀玲：是，根據經濟部所做的稅式支出評估，未來5年可以減少310萬公秉的燃油消耗量及739萬公噸的二氧化碳排放量。"],["賴委員惠員：這邏輯其實我是聽得不太懂啦！事實上，是差了多少？二氧化碳的排放量少了多少？這個數據應該是要很明確地讓我們知道，才可持續每5年來修法，這才有意義啊！現在全國地方政府的財稅局代表都在這裡，他們為配合中央的政策，少收了很多地方稅，進而增加財政負擔，這地方稅是壓榨到他們的長照、教育，還有其他林林總總，就像臺南這5年少收了20.6億，有沒有一個比較公平的方式呢？是不是應該要有分級式的減稅制度？不然，只要是買電動車，不管是1,000cc、1,500cc或是3,000cc減的稅都是一樣的嘛！這樣有道理嗎？我想聽聽你們的建議。"],["莊部長翠雲：是，謝謝委員的提示。針對這個部分，您認為應該要有一個更公平的制度，也就是你買更高價的貨物，有享受更高的減稅利益，就委員的建議，也許我們可以再徵詢經濟部以及環境部這方面的意見，看要怎麼樣的方式更為合理。"],["賴委員惠員：部長，你看這稅賦是倒退啊！你買電動車可以享受免貨物稅、免牌照稅、免燃料稅的多重優惠，這樣一個政策的設計，就在一個環保的框框裡，我們要追求環保也是有道理，可是如果長期一直這樣下去的話，我覺得不是非常的合理啦！"],["莊部長翠雲：所以我們的租稅優惠都訂有一定的期限，就是實施到什麼時間，並且在這期限屆滿前，可以再做一些檢討跟調整。"],["賴委員惠員：當然你每5年都會有一個檢討嘛！每5年就會檢討，電動車每年的成長率是30%，它的成長率是30%在成長耶！現在到底電動車占整個市場的百分比有多少？這你們也要跟我們報告啊！"],["莊部長翠雲：我們在稅式支出評估裡都有提出來，到今年9月統計的結果，電動車大概有12萬834輛，而電動機車大概有79萬4,000輛，占的比例……"],["賴委員惠員：不是。這電動車的成長比例到底占了多少百分比？我看你們寫是每年30%嘛！"],["莊部長翠雲：是。"],["賴委員惠員：一年是30%，是不是到了第二年的時候，會不會有60%？"],["莊部長翠雲：也就是它成長的比例。"],["賴委員惠員：到第三年是90%，我為什麼要同意讓你們延到2030年？這沒有道理，你們保障有錢人啊！"],["莊部長翠雲：委員，成長的比例……"],["賴委員惠員：因為你知道所有人買電油車大概都是100萬的價位，但要買到電動車的話，就是要150萬起跳啊！剛才我在跟你陳述及溝通的，就是這樣的道理。"],["莊部長翠雲：是的，我了解委員的理念。"],["賴委員惠員：你了解我的理念？"],["莊部長翠雲：是。"],["賴委員惠員：好，謝謝。"],["莊部長翠雲：謝謝。"],["賴委員惠員：是不是有比較好的建議方式？"],["莊部長翠雲：對於電動車，我們不管在貨物稅也好、在牌照稅也好，都有給予免徵，這確實達到的一個效果是希望能夠趕快增加燃油車的汰換並能改用電動車的目的；同時，我們也希望國內電動車的產業能夠持續的發展，並鼓勵消費者買，我們的產業也才能夠發展起來，我覺得這也是有同樣的目的。"],["賴委員惠員：有關政策修正，我是建議你們要延長授權給地方政府免徵電動車輛的使用牌照稅。"],["莊部長翠雲：我們目前是授權的，因為它是地方稅，所以地方政府「得」……"],["賴委員惠員：雖然是地方稅，可是他們拿不到這些錢，沒有受益到啊！"],["莊部長翠雲：所謂地方政府沒有受益到是什麼意思？"],["賴委員惠員：我的意思是地方政府沒有收到這些錢。沒關係！部長，我們可以會後再一起探討一下。"],["莊部長翠雲：好的。"],["賴委員惠員：我還是建議你，剛才你就有特別提到要跨部會的合作，是不是可以設置電動車免稅的補助基金？而這個基金可以用來調整免稅的範圍跟對象，還有逐步的退場機制，其實你現在推動的非常好，但你的退場機制要出來啊！"],["莊部長翠雲：是，了解。我想委員這項建議很好，我們會跟相關的部會再來討論，也會跟委員請教。"],["賴委員惠員：好。再請教你，你們有沒有建立成效評估的制度？"],["莊部長翠雲：這個部分都會有的，因為我們在提出稅法優惠的時候，都要請目的事業主管機關作稅式支出的評估，而每一年也會提……"],["賴委員惠員：請說明一個比較具體的，好不好？請署長來補充一下成效評估。"],["宋署長秀玲：報告委員，現在納保法的規定都是要做稅式支出評估，像這個法案的稅式支出評估，我們也會送立法院來參考。另外，我們會要求他必須要定期揭露整個實施的成效。"],["賴委員惠員：我還是要繞回來再請教部長跟署長，對於這個稅制，你們是滿意的，但是它減碳的成效，基本上我一直找不到一個比較具體的數目，所有官方的資料裡都找不到，可能是環境部、環保局用的方式是我們不了解的，或是剛才署長回答的，我也聽不懂，你告訴我有幾千輛的電動車，這些都太籠統了，到底排放量是減少了多少？我們希望有一個正確的數字給我們作參考，好不好？"],["莊部長翠雲：我們會後再提供報告給委員，同時會評估可以在哪裡揭露這些成果，讓全國民眾了解。"],["賴委員惠員：是嘛！這樣我們支持你們修法的正當性才會更強，好不好？"],["莊部長翠雲：謝謝委員的提示，謝謝。"],["賴委員惠員：謝謝部長、謝謝主席。"],["主席：謝謝賴惠員委員的質詢。","接下來請李彥秀委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":92,"meet_id":"委員會-11-4-20-6","speakers":["林思銘","王鴻薇","李彥秀","徐欣瑩","羅廷瑋","陳超明","許宇甄","林德福","吳秉叡","賴士葆","郭國文","賴惠員","顏寬恒","鍾佳濱","李坤城","王世堅","陳玉珍","黃國昌","羅明才","黃珊珊","楊瓊瓔"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-11-05"],"gazette_id":"1149201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1149201_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第4會期財政委員會第6次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"審查「使用牌照稅法」29案：（僅詢答）一、行政院函請審議、本院委員邱鎮軍等19人、委員陳\n超明等18人、委員羅明才等20人、委員廖偉翔等19人、委員楊瓊瓔等27人、委員許宇甄等22人、\n委員邱若華等17人、委員林俊憲等26人、委員王鴻薇等19人、委員李彥秀等16人、委員蘇清泉等\n18人、委員徐欣瑩等24人、委員郭昱晴等19人、委員王美惠等19人、委員李坤城等18人、委員羅\n廷瑋等17人、委員郭國文等18人、委員吳沛憶等17人、委員葛如鈞等16人、委員沈發惠等17人、\n委員林思銘等22人、委員賴士葆等25人、委員黃健豪等20人分別擬具「使用牌照稅法第五條條文\n修正草案」等24 案；二、本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「使用牌照稅法第五條及第七條條文修正草\n案」案；三、本院委員廖先翔等17 人擬具「使用牌照稅法第五條及第三十八條條文修正草案」\n案；四、本院委員牛煦庭等17人、委員鍾佳濱等16人分別擬具「使用牌照稅法第七條條文修正草\n案」等 2 案；五、本院委員廖偉翔等 17 人擬具「使用牌照稅法第七條及第三十八條條文修正草\n案」案","agenda_id":"1149201_00001"}}}