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現中華民國113年5月3日 星期五 七日 星期二上午9時至下午6時 地點本院一場 報告事項一宣讀本院第11屆第1會期第11次會議議事錄二至五委員陳一貞登記公務委員退休自檢撫恤法 將司法及法治委員審查 公務學校教職員退休自檢撫恤條例將司法及法治交易及文化兩委員審查財政收支劃分法 整件交易法加財政委員審查 六至七"},{"start":8976.861,"end":9006.181,"text":"委員 王鴻薇等局 監察院處置法 交司法及法治委員審查若有空間缺關需關服役條例 交外交及國防委員審查大委員 張家俊等局 兒童及少年性剝削防治條例交社會福利及衛生環境 司法及法治委員審查9 委員廖信長等局 鐵路法交交通委員審查10至11委員吳佩儀等局 兒童及少年性剝削防治條例 員工生殖法交社會福利及衛生環境 司法及法治委員審查12至14委員 羅志強等局 中華民國刑法國家賠償法交司法及法治委員審"},{"start":9006.981,"end":9016.054,"text":"學生輔導法教教育文化委員審查委員楊承英委員公司法教經濟委員審查委員林月琴委員醫療法教社會福利及衛生環境委員審查"},{"start":9018.877,"end":9043.373,"text":"委員 王美惠 等局 地方公益代表費用知己及村里長 事務補助費補助條例 新住民權益保障法 交內政委員審查 野生動物保育法 交經濟委員審查 二十委員 高精素美 等局 社會秩序維護法 交內政委員審查 二十一委員 鄭天才 等局 公害糾紛處理法 交社會福利及危險環境委員審查 二十二至二十六委員 徐欣英 等局 公立學校教職員退休此前輔助條例 交司法及法制教育及文化 兩委員審查"},{"start":9044.794,"end":9061.322,"text":"中央選舉委員會組織法﹚內政部組織法﹚司法及法制內政兩院審查公職委員選舉罷免﹚法制內政兩院審查陸海空軍軍官室﹚官府與條例交外交及國防委員審查二七至二十八委員﹚無私藥等局﹚兒童及少年性剝削防治條例交社會福利及衛生環境﹚司法及法制兩院審查"},{"start":9062.342,"end":9090.901,"text":"中華民國刑法教私法及法治委員審查29委員有號等一句導動基準法教社會福利及維生環境委員審查30委員李彥秀等一句兒童期少年性剝削防治條例教社會福利及維生環境私法及法治兩委員審查31委員何欣淳等一句中小企業犯條例教經濟委員審查30委員羅廷偉等一句兒童期少年性剝削防治條例教社會福利及維生環境私法及法治兩委員審查33委員謝王介等一句警察人員士條例教私法及法治內政兩委員審查34至36"},{"start":9092.302,"end":9119.633,"text":"委員徐曉欣等於據藥塞堡壘地帶法交外交機構方委員審查工廠管理輔導法交經濟委員審查產業照顧保險法交社會福利機會審環境委員審查37委員蔡易宇等於據銀行法交財政委員審查38委員林德富等於據發展大規模運輸條例交交通委員審查39委員吳宗憲等於據公益階壁酒保護法交司法及法治委員審查40至42委員翁曉琳等委員黃秀芳等委員洪龍海等分別於據"},{"start":9120.553,"end":9146.88,"text":"兒童及少年性剝削防治條例交稅為福利及衛生環境司法及法資料委員審查第43委員陳俊宇登議具電信管理法及交通委員審查第44至45委員荒街登議具青年基本法教教育及文化委員審查個人資料保護法教經紀委員審查第46委員陳廷飛已撤回前提之公務委員退休事件撫恤反應請願會統一撤回第47行政環境審議再生醫療法再生醫療秩序條例交稅為福利及衛生環境委員審查第48至221"},{"start":9148.996,"end":9160.488,"text":"教育部﹑內政部﹑陸委會﹑海委會﹑農業部﹑經濟部﹑司法院﹑考試員﹑衛福部﹑財政部﹑金管會﹑交通部﹑勞動部﹑環境部等含送書面資料交相關委員會222至227﹑民生交通等委員會韓國運會交付適量業績處理省長文俊請查詐案"},{"start":9166.595,"end":9180.858,"text":"228至229本院議事處會報各黨團參加第11屆第1會期經費機構委員會委員名單推薦學者專家擔任國家金融安聯基金管理委員會委員名單公民黨黨團體議政令一致三委員協議奉承區域全民健康保險法"},{"start":9181.158,"end":9181.198,"text":"第12屆第13屆會議"},{"start":9201.71,"end":9226.929,"text":"交社會福利及衛生環境委員審查9至10委員：求弱化等局：大宗節約法及交通委員審查中高齡者及高齡者．月促進法交社會福利及衛生環境委員審查11至13委員．愛世法等局．財政受支劃分法所得稅法交財政委員審查國家通訊傳播委員會組織法交司法及法治交通兩位委員審查14委員．王燕營等局．地方民代表分辨之籍及村里長事務補助費補助條例交內政委員審查15至19委員．楊江英等局．"},{"start":9229.811,"end":9255.559,"text":"動議發言條例．多層次傳銷管理法．經濟委員審查再生醫療法．再生醫療支援條例．全民健康保險法．社會福利及衛生環境委員審查20至21委員零四年等區．貨物稅條例．所得稅法．財政委員審查22至23委員旅運等區．國土計劃法．內政委員審查海關進口稅則．財政委員審查24委員政天財等區．陸海空軍懲罰法．外交及國防司法及法資料委員審查民黨黨團第一增列"},{"start":9256.383,"end":9283.135,"text":"二十五至二十六委員聯署分證局﹐人工生殖法﹐兒童及少年性剝削防治條例交受惡福利及衛生環境﹐司法及法治兩位審查二十七至二十八委員﹐蔡其章等委員﹐丁楚穎等分分引據﹐兒童及少年性剝削防治條例交受惡福利及衛生環境﹐司法及法治兩位審查二十九至三十委員賴若鴻等引據﹐兒童及少年性剝削防治條例交受惡福利及衛生環境﹐司法及法治兩位審查中小企業發行條例交近幾位審查"},{"start":9285.736,"end":9303.07,"text":"臺灣地區與大陸地區人民關係條例將內政委員審查 三十二委員承受保等局 兒童及少年性剝削防禦條例 交受委員及衛生環境司法及法治兩位審查臺灣民眾黨黨團體一整列三十三至四十 臺灣民眾黨黨團委區 性培平等工作法 就業保險法 交受委員及衛生環境委員審查"},{"start":9304.211,"end":9305.832,"text":"國際合作發展法 國際合作發展法 國際合作發展法 國際合作發展法"},{"start":9320.04,"end":9338.79,"text":"主持法 交司法及法制財政兩委員審查金融消費者保護法 交財政委員審查委員泛民提議整列41至42委員泛民等領據 公寓學校教職員退休之前撫恤條例學校法案及其所屬私立學校教職員退休撫恤離職之前條例交司法及法制教育及文化兩委員審查"},{"start":9347.637,"end":9360.956,"text":"好 報告委員會 程序草案報告事項第三期案 提案委員 蔡議員來函撤回予以刪除現在請登記委員發言 第一位請張志倫委員發言"},{"start":9376.973,"end":9405.692,"text":"主席好 各位委員午安案由本院中國國民黨立法院黨團針對第11屆第一會期第12次會議報告事項執行事項建議案建議照原列草案及針列報告事項通過是否有當進行公決提案人中國國民黨立法院黨團好接下來我們請第二位沈博洋委員發言"},{"start":9414.313,"end":9427.974,"text":"謝謝主席那這邊按由針對第11屆第一次會期第12次會議議程報告事項執行事項建請照議事日程草案及針列的報告事項通過那提案人民主進步黨立法院黨團謝謝"},{"start":9429.531,"end":9457.782,"text":"好謝謝沈委員登記法院委員均已發言完畢現在進行處理兩位委員提案是相同的所以一併處理除第37案撤回予以刪除之外請問其餘照兩位委員提議有無異議無異議的話那通過報告事項修正通過執行事項通過接下來請宣讀討論事項"},{"start":9459.722,"end":9475.085,"text":"法院事項一403正在重建條例草案二環島高速鐵路建設特別條例草案三國道6號東沿花蓮建設特別條例草案四花東快速公路建設特別條例草案五院會通過予以刪除"},{"start":9475.946,"end":9497.987,"text":"6.本院臺灣民眾黨黨團建期委員會作成決議,邀請行政院長率團相關部會所長就一,如何改善跨部會址的食品營系統登載率極低之問題二,如何有效解決近期系統性食安問題等相關事宜,進行專案報告並備諮詢,是否容納警工決案。749 委員會通過予以刪除。宣讀完畢"},{"start":9506.465,"end":9510.769,"text":"好那現在請登記委員發言第一位張委員致論發言"},{"start":9524.946,"end":9545.339,"text":"好謝謝主席各位委員大家午安案由本院中國國民黨立法院黨團針對第11屆第一會期第12次院會議程討論事項你請編列如下表等下委由這個議事人員宣讀是否有當進行公決提案人中國國民黨立法院黨團謝謝好請議事人員待會宣讀"},{"start":9550.219,"end":9577.253,"text":"本院中國國民黨立法院黨團針對第11屆第1會期第12次院會議程討論事項,你請編列如下表1.403政災重建條例草案2.環島高速鐵路建設特別條例草案3.花東快速公路建設特別條例草案4.國道6號東延花蓮建設特別條例草案5.本院台灣民眾黨黨團建議院會作成決議,邀請行政院院長率同相關部會首長就1.如何改善跨部會的食品雲系統登載率及第一支問題"},{"start":9578.755,"end":9592.453,"text":"2.如何有效解決近期系統性食安問題以確保國人安全健康等相關事宜進行專案報告並備以諮詢請供決案宣讀完畢謝謝那我們下一位請沈博洋委員發言"},{"start":9600.253,"end":9617.737,"text":"好謝謝主席那這邊按由針對第11屆第1會期第12次會議議事日程討論事項你請針列下面三案是否有當盡情公決提案人民主進步黨立法院黨團那請議事委員待會先讀謝謝請待會先讀"},{"start":9623.168,"end":9632.899,"text":"本院民主進步黨ﷺ立法院黨團針對第11屆第1會期第12次會議議事日程討論實相你請針列下表三案1.本院民進黨黨團建請院會決議如下"},{"start":9636.161,"end":9656.884,"text":"一對於中國大陸及香港政府律律假借國安之名侵犯民主人權之行徑本院予以最嚴厲譴責二多年來香港各界及民主國家對於相關迫害人權之立法反對聲浪不止各種負面效應亦浮現的顯示對於香港政府種種侵害人權之擔憂並非無地方使香港政府不該在"},{"start":9658.145,"end":9675.239,"text":"繳辭掩飾中國大陸及香港政府應即刻廢除相關侵害人權之法令並釋放所有政治犯重新建立具有透明度、相稱度及問責性的法制才有可能使香港人及世界各國重拾對香港的信心本院要求大陸委員會持續關注香港局勢發展"},{"start":9676.059,"end":9703.069,"text":"對於追求香港民主自由受到迫害的香港人依法應給予必要之協助以具體行動給予香港人民支持關懷與協助並承諾在香港人權情形改善前不會停止是否有當進行公決二工廠管理輔導法修正案三國籍法部分條件修正案宣讀完畢接下來我們請第三位的莊瑞雄委員發言"},{"start":9710.219,"end":9728.676,"text":"好謝謝主席在場所有的委員跟媒體朋友我們立法院對於整個香港局勢我相信這個過去不分黨派大家如果說基於香港民眾的這種人權跟自由我們大家都過去也都是沒有什麼任何意見大家一併在做一個支持"},{"start":9729.156,"end":9747.907,"text":"那針對香港政府在這一次在今年就2023月8號去通過香港基本法第23條的立法的維護國家安全條例的部分我們也看到了歐盟看到歐洲議會看到其他工業組織還有美國英國加拿大日本這些國家相處相繼的一個發出聲音來聲明香港的民眾反對這個威權所以我們在這個地方我們看到來自各界對於相關破壞人權的立法反對聲音那麼不止"},{"start":9758.493,"end":9777.764,"text":"那我相信我們立法院也應該來要求大陸委員會持續來關注這個香港的一個局勢的一個發展對於追求香港民主自由尤其是受到迫害的民眾香港人應該給予必要的一個協助我相信這個值得各黨各派大家一併大家一起來關注"},{"start":9778.704,"end":9801.574,"text":"另外就是說過去大家所關注我看這個整個功夫法的部分各個政黨裡面也這麼多人來提出這樣的一個議案還有包括在內政委員會排審的部分國籍法的部分這確實都有迫切去做一個處理所以我們也請今天這三個案子讓各位來做一個爭略 謝謝"},{"start":9808.004,"end":9834.186,"text":"好包委員會因為張惠雄委員沒有提案所以我們就不予處理那我們現在依據提案先後進行處理處理的順序為一張志倫委員提議編列5案二沈柏洋委員提議甄列3案依照本會處理慣例如通過議案後討論事項總內容及順序確定其他提"},{"start":9837.561,"end":9865.609,"text":"提案提案或內容或順序有互相抵觸就不再處理如果沒有互相抵觸然後會重疊列案順序也可以授權調整那就繼續處理好那有意義好沒有意義好那我們現在進行處理好先提案先處理請問對張志倫委員提議有無意義沒有好那無意義通過"},{"start":9868.147,"end":9895.689,"text":"繼續處理沈博洋委員提議請問有無異議無異議通過那討論事項修正通過議案順序授權調整好那請宣讀人民請願案人民請願案11請願法第4條規定系審理訴訟之事項議案21立法院執行刑事法第65條第二項規定判斷權的機關處理者共期案宣讀完"},{"start":9898.554,"end":9908.844,"text":"請問有無異議沒有異議通過有無臨時提案臨時動議沒有臨時動議那今天會議到此結束散會"}]}},{"id":"151913","url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151913","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/57aba3c8ecdd3070a5f7b05663645bfd5e55d62141dea4d7474e4e539bb54819ef72e06f3d3953b45ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"莊瑞雄","委員發言時間":"14:11:46 - 14:13:30","影片長度":"00:01:44","會議時間":"2024-04-30T12:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期程序委員會第9次會議（事由：審定本院第11屆第1會期第12次會議議事日程及人民請願案）","date":"2024-04-30","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期程序委員會第9次會議","type":"委員會","term":11,"sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":9,"committees":[27],"id":"委員會-11-1-27-9"},"duration":104,"end_time":"2024-04-30T14:13:30+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-30T14:11:46+08:00","features":["ai-transcript"],"type":"Clip","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":5.549093750000001,"end":97.97346875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":101.50034375000001,"end":102.61409375000001}],"whisperx":[{"start":5.558,"end":33.275,"text":"好,謝謝主席,在場所有的委員跟媒體朋友我們立法院對於整個香港局勢我相信這個過去不分黨派大家如果說基於香港民眾的這種人權跟自由我們大家都過去也都是沒有什麼任何意見大家一併在做一個支持那針對香港政府在這一次在今年就2023月8號去通過香港基本法第23條的立法的維護國家安全條例的部分"},{"start":33.735,"end":35.836,"text":"歐盟、歐洲議會、其他工業組織、美國、英國、加拿大、日本這些國家相繼發出聲音聲明香港的民眾反對威權來自各界對於相關破壞人權的立法反對聲音不止"},{"start":53.843,"end":79.645,"text":"那我相信我們立法院也應該來要求大陸委員會持續來關注這個香港的一個局勢的一個發展對於追求香港民主自由尤其是受到迫害的民眾香港人應該給予必要的一個協助我相信這個值得各黨各派大家一併大家一起來關注另外就是說過去大家所關注我看這個整個功夫法的部分各個政黨裡面"},{"start":80.566,"end":80.586,"text":"好 呃"}]}},{"id":"151912","url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151912","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/57aba3c8ecdd307057b2f6be703c15bd5e55d62141dea4d7474e4e539bb548198f71899636db0cb35ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"沈伯洋","委員發言時間":"14:09:56 - 14:10:26","影片長度":"00:00:30","會議時間":"2024-04-30T12:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期程序委員會第9次會議（事由：審定本院第11屆第1會期第12次會議議事日程及人民請願案）","date":"2024-04-30","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期程序委員會第9次會議","type":"委員會","term":11,"sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":9,"committees":[27],"id":"委員會-11-1-27-9"},"duration":30,"end_time":"2024-04-30T14:10:26+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-30T14:09:56+08:00","features":["ai-transcript"],"type":"Clip","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":5.650343750000001,"end":23.504093750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":24.75284375,"end":25.79909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":28.566593750000003,"end":29.410343750000003}],"whisperx":[{"start":5.94,"end":7.061,"text":"民主進步黨立法院黨團"}]}},{"id":"151911","url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151911","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/57aba3c8ecdd30703051cfcc8d2bdadc5e55d62141dea4d7474e4e539bb54819f28e73f90c575f8f5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"張智倫","委員發言時間":"14:08:36 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14:09:12","影片長度":"00:00:36","會議時間":"2024-04-30T12:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期程序委員會第9次會議（事由：審定本院第11屆第1會期第12次會議議事日程及人民請願案）","date":"2024-04-30","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期程序委員會第9次會議","type":"委員會","term":11,"sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":9,"committees":[27],"id":"委員會-11-1-27-9"},"duration":36,"end_time":"2024-04-30T14:09:12+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-30T14:08:36+08:00","features":["ai-transcript"],"type":"Clip","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":11.438468750000002,"end":30.69284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":31.519718750000003,"end":33.274718750000005}],"whisperx":[{"start":11.482,"end":31.875,"text":"好謝謝主席各位委員大家午安案由本院中國國民黨立法院黨團針對第11屆第1會期第12次院會議程討論事項你請編列如下表等下委由這個議事人員宣讀是否有當進行公決提案人中國國民黨立法院黨團謝謝好請議事人員待會宣讀"}]}},{"id":"151910","url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151910","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/57aba3c8ecdd3070e6f897a7771696455e55d62141dea4d7474e4e539bb54819c617dc67021d5f925ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"沈伯洋","委員發言時間":"14:06:50 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啊"},{"start":284.298,"end":306.425,"text":"發言要取消發言要取消"},{"start":314.409,"end":315.089,"text":"發言取消因為這樣他們會"},{"start":389.727,"end":395.602,"text":"法定人數不足"},{"start":2370.827,"end":2385.339,"text":"好 謝謝大家 謝謝大家今天通知大家來開會 大家都比較忙碌本院的江副院長 周秘書長各黨團的黨團幹部 各部會的列席代表"},{"start":2386.701,"end":2395.227,"text":"各位辛苦的工作夥伴我們協商主題第一案本院國民黨黨團提案有關電價動漲的議題我們現在協商國民黨黨團的提案是為避免物價因為電價的調漲"},{"start":2408.817,"end":2417.106,"text":"明聲痛苦指數的飆升以此反對臺電公司調漲電價建請院會作成決議立即停止調漲電價"},{"start":2420,"end":2444.251,"text":"以及要求行政院責成相關部會即刻檢討現行能源政策並提出因應對策與配套措施以兼顧人民生計維持供電穩定及台電公司之正常營運本案經113年3月29日立法院第十一屆第一會期第七次院會決議交付黨團協商並由國民黨黨團負責召集協商"},{"start":2448.593,"end":2476.75,"text":"協商會議請各黨團指派代表參加令今113年4月24日由楊瓊英召委召集黨團協商會議中由於民進黨未派員出席主席做成決論本案保留 送請院長協商協商會議之前我想先請經濟部王部長說明好嗎謝謝"},{"start":2480.179,"end":2506.999,"text":"好謝謝主席各位委員那電價的這個部分事實上我們現在目前是按照電業法49條那也因為這個考量到各項的這個俄烏戰爭之後的電價的成本那確實是高漲那各個國家事實上漲的幅度都遠遠高於臺灣漲的幅度"},{"start":2507.557,"end":2518.476,"text":"那臺電也因為這樣的一個國際原料的高漲所以原料的採購呢幾乎是六千億的這樣的一個金額跟惡霧戰爭前的"},{"start":2520.1,"end":2520.12,"text":"照顧"},{"start":2544.929,"end":2545.729,"text":"法定人數不足"},{"start":2567.779,"end":2568.319,"text":"調到增加25%最大的用戶的部分"},{"start":2584.961,"end":2611.011,"text":"大概也是接近我們成本了只有這樣那其他的其實都還是遠低於臺電的這個相關的發電的成本那所以因此這個我們在即使這樣調漲之後呢仍舊需要行政院給我們相關的經費來補助讓臺電的虧損不要再持續的惡化跟擴大那以上我先就這個部分簡單做說明"},{"start":2612.947,"end":2631.045,"text":"謝謝王部長的說明接下來我介紹一下補充介紹一下我們今天到期的所有列席的官員我們王部長大家都已經聽到他的發言了接下來能源署的吳志偉吳副署長再來台電的董事長曾董事長文森歡迎列席現在我們請各黨團來發表意見國民黨團是協商代表請國民黨團先發言"},{"start":2639.554,"end":2663.929,"text":"好 感謝院長召集協商我想今天針對我們這個3月29號所提出來的這個案件不管是剛剛經濟部王美花部長所講或是之前我們在4月24號的時候我們已經有召開過協商其實都還是一樣的一個論點而剛剛透過這個直播我想大家都看到都聽到王美花部長的講法我這裡心裡只有一個結論好像王美花部長講的還是一樣"},{"start":2665.45,"end":2687.067,"text":"就是一句話總結又是要講說民進黨政府主政之下世界怎麼跟得上台灣把台灣講得好棒棒但是我們現在真的是這樣嗎錯誤的能源政策不檢討不調整不改變有什麼臉或是有什麼意思來對全民講說是什麼世界原物料調漲惡霧戰爭惡霧戰爭幾年了"},{"start":2690.782,"end":2708.055,"text":"我們看一下世界原油的趨勢或說世界的相關的原物料的話2021年來到最高點價格最高到現在2024年已經相對來講回到比2021年差不多已經回到這個之前的一個基準點了"},{"start":2709.389,"end":2728.764,"text":"所以說我們現在看到的一個狀況是原物料的價格其實已經比之前的高點來的趨緩很多而且看的趨勢是往下的那反而我們的電價是持續往上所以在推到世界的這種原物料的調漲然後又推到惡物戰爭我覺得這是不負責任的一個講法"},{"start":2730.421,"end":2751.855,"text":"回過頭來我們在這一次特別提到因為這個電價調漲會造成所有的物價的整個大幅調漲而不管是我們國內很多的這些經濟研究相關的機構都沒有算到今年2024年要電價再調漲也因此我們的通貨膨脹會有什麼樣的一個影響"},{"start":2753.456,"end":2774.912,"text":"所以我們才會特別提案認為說現在應該是要折成相關部會尤其在520這個新隔壞的就任前後現在的部長也沒有辦法為之後的政策再來做背書應該是要現行立即調漲現行人員政策並且來做相關的一個配套以及對策才能夠真真正正維護穩定的供電"},{"start":2777.29,"end":2793.358,"text":"最後我們還是再次強調自始至終從頭到尾我們都感謝臺電第一線的公務人員我們自己是選區出身我們非常理解臺電的基層人員非常辛苦刮風下雨打雷他們都是出動我們由衷感謝"},{"start":2794.338,"end":2821.468,"text":"但如果說錯誤能源政策不調整的話換一百個總經理都無濟於事所以不要再拿台電的總經理、台電的人員來當地線去轉換概念你們上位者的頭腦不換政治意識形態頭腦不換什麼都沒有用那我最後也必須要再說一下今天感謝院長召開協商否則的話我們的執政黨黨團"},{"start":2823.274,"end":2842.228,"text":"在過去我們4月24號上個禮拜三國民黨團召開協商枯坐半小時執政黨的民進黨團沒有派人出席4月26號禮拜五民眾黨團召開兩次朝野協商民進黨團沒有派人出席"},{"start":2842.998,"end":2865.009,"text":"我想如果說我們要求一個議事 要求一個立院的朝野和諧的話最基本的出席尊重這是必要的所以今天特別感謝院長也讓我們三個黨團能夠坐下來一起開會我想等一下的一個結論我們也希望民進黨團他們當初應該在4.24 4.26就可以表達意見了"},{"start":2865.529,"end":2881.796,"text":"沒有想到要在這個時候才能表達但是我們還是堅持我們的立場認為台電認為現在民進黨政府應該面對錯誤的能源政策先檢討再來跟全民做後續的一個政策謝謝謝謝國民黨團黃孟凱書記長的發言接下來我們請同時提案的民眾黨黃國昌總召發言請"},{"start":2891.761,"end":2906.617,"text":"謝謝院長 台灣聯盟黨團所提出來要求經濟部針對整體的能源政策、電價費率結構以及台電相關各項支出還有遵節的措施向本院經濟委員會提出全面檢討報告"},{"start":2908.738,"end":2934.947,"text":"經過審議通過以前電價全面還漲的這個議案當初在提案的時候我們黨團的張啟改委員已經在院會當中做了清楚的說明了那一天因為是民主進步黨黨團把他拉了要求要交付協商同時要求臺灣民眾黨的黨團來負責召集協商我們也按照院會"},{"start":2936.187,"end":2958.855,"text":"院長當中所做的才事我們也召集了協商不過很遺憾的我們發出了會議通知也召集了協商行政部門也非常感謝我們的經濟部政事曾文森跟相關台電的總經理都有來參與協商也做了口頭的說明因此"},{"start":2960.034,"end":2980.409,"text":"那次的協商包括了前半小時是第二案那後半小時是第三案那也見醒了院長那個時候所在主席台上面宣告要求臺灣民眾黨黨團召集協商這樣子的一個議事的程序那當然"},{"start":2985.072,"end":3000.35,"text":"早起協商的時候各個黨團之所以出席或不出席有他們各自的考慮這個我們都理解那只不過說那天因為協商沒有成立"},{"start":3001.929,"end":3024.518,"text":"那因此要做協商最後協商不成立的結論之前我們大概有稍微猶豫了一下那不過後來看到其他黨的黨團在做相同的提案的時候是建請院長再度召集協商那我在想說為了以後整個議事進行的順暢"},{"start":3028.699,"end":3053.592,"text":"避免沒有意義程序上的浪費跟時間的耗損所以我想利用這個機會等一下是不是也可以請院長麻煩或者是請秘書長稍微說明一下要說明的事情是什麼呢?因為我們現在立法院裡面"},{"start":3055.774,"end":3075.055,"text":"當黨團有要求交付草野協商的時候那我們就必須要進去草野協商草野協商有一個月所謂的冷凍期在這個冷凍期當中被要求要召集協商的黨團他必須要召集協商那我的問題是當這個程序進行完了以後"},{"start":3075.996,"end":3078.68,"text":"若無法達成協商結論,應沒有必要再請院長再召集一次協商"},{"start":3091.192,"end":3108.284,"text":"不是對院長有什麼不敬的意思不願意你來組織協商但我覺得這個程序總是把它理清楚一點比較好那未來才有助於整個議事能夠比較有效率的進展所以我想要確定的事情是說當"},{"start":3110.56,"end":3128.709,"text":"被要求負責召集協商的黨團那也依照我們的程序召集完協商沒有辦法獲知協商結論這個時候依照議事規則我的理解應該是沒有必要再麻煩院長"},{"start":3129.87,"end":3156.846,"text":"再召集一支協商就可以直接送院會依照議事程序來加以處理那如果等一下方便的話是不是也可以麻煩院長請秘書長跟各個黨團把這個基本的遊戲規則大家再清楚的確認一次謝謝謝謝黃國昌總召的發言等一下下一位是民進黨發言之前我請秘書長簡短扼要的說明一下 民進黨請"},{"start":3160.747,"end":3187.464,"text":"報告各位委員因為在職權刑事法第12章的黨團協商那黨團協商大概68條大概它是有分的三項三項裡面當然第一項裡面就是第一項跟第三項有關聯性第一項就是說在協商議案或解決爭議事項可以由院長或是各黨團向院長請求一個主動一個被動這裡請求協商"},{"start":3190.225,"end":3211.032,"text":"委員會 第三項 委員會 各委員在審查議案 如果在有爭議的時候 委員會的主席 也可以當時才是來協商那如果這一協商 以後送到院會來 就按照那個表裡面 如果不需要協商的 那當然就送院會 像今天的電子簽商網那樣的處理"},{"start":3212.612,"end":3214.473,"text":"議案自交黨團協商予逾一個月"},{"start":3234.093,"end":3235.574,"text":"謝謝周秘書長的說明接下來我們請民進黨黨團請說明"},{"start":3259.364,"end":3273.94,"text":"針對剛才黃國昌委員所談的 我想黃國昌也不是今天來當立委 都很清楚另外執行審查就剛才周秘書講得很清楚 不會搖桿 他已經講得很清楚了因為黨團協商的時候是黨團協商後事有這一事項 院長要來"},{"start":3279.898,"end":3308.789,"text":"要來主持另外有人拉下來協商也有委員會協商委員會協商當然這個大家知道這個案子也經過這樣的程序也走完了委員協商沒有結論就是交給院長這個再清楚不夠這是因為時間刑事法68條到71條大家看清楚就如此這個還有解釋更改空間除非你去修法就如此"},{"start":3314.023,"end":3322.311,"text":"我想程序上還是釐清一下 也替黃總召也再複習一下議事規則剛剛68條就講得很清楚 誠如祕書長跟柯總召講的 我想我不需要再贅述那今天我們坐在這個場域 就是由立法院院長 不論誰擔任院長 他就是任何的議案或是未解的爭議"},{"start":3334.304,"end":3361.989,"text":"那最終各黨團好好坐下來協商最重要的場域所以任何在院會如果要表決的議案最終都會在這個場域大家來做最後的對話希望能夠匯聚共識那我們來看看那國民黨跟民眾黨確實在上週有召開今天要表決的議案協商的議案的兩個案子第七案第八案的協商其實如果這個黃總召您看一下這個協商結論就寫得很清楚"},{"start":3362.589,"end":3379.481,"text":"國民黨黨團的這個電價條帳的這個案子在立法院朝野協商是4月24號禮拜三的12點到12點18分那協商結論就寫得很清楚本案保留請韓院長召集黨團協商所以這是當天的協商結論這就是為什麼我們今天要韓院長召集協商"},{"start":3384.354,"end":3407.128,"text":"民眾黨在4月26日禮拜五12點半到1點鐘民眾黨所召集的也是台電動漲電價的這個案子當天也是那天的協商結論就寫得非常清楚本案保留送請院長協商所以這是兩個黨團協商都很清楚的記錄這就是為什麼沒有辦法在黨團協商獲得共識的就在提請韓院長的協商"},{"start":3412.111,"end":3412.131,"text":"韓國瑜議員"},{"start":3435.135,"end":3448.684,"text":"柯建民、柯總週,二次發言我再要補充說明,我們6月開始的時候1993年1993年到1991年說國會無法通過,這經過6年的時間那時候我相信海運長那時候也在議法院,也就是說完成國會無法修正"},{"start":3456.969,"end":3481.852,"text":"那韓日國會委員法修正以前立法院的議事規則就照一種民間團體的開會規則所以很容易發生一個人可以擋住所有的案子所以1990年1月公告的時候國會委員法公告黨團協商立法院執行刑事法就是非常重要的那這個我現在說依法行事但是這個法有一個很重要的精神就是說尊重少數"},{"start":3483.053,"end":3500.631,"text":"換言之實際上現在五十五或三十五不管怎麼樣你的黨團協商一定因為要成立一個黨團要有三個人所以三個人你和八十九九十個一樣的權益所以立法院的議案都是要經過常委協商大家都簽名以後就沒事"},{"start":3501.744,"end":3512.549,"text":"所以才創設出來這個最有利於小組黨今天黃昌偉你不要以為你現在義務在國民黨上面你們加起來就過半這個你不再懷疑他"},{"start":3514.267,"end":3537.108,"text":"你這個是在把小黨的權力把它放棄掉啊否則的話你小黨永遠三個五個就表決永遠輸嘛過去我們草野黨乃至於我們只要二七個的時候一個招也沒有我們也是用草野槍來解決很多紛爭啊這個是御法院一個最民主程序而且依法行事"},{"start":3538.174,"end":3560.846,"text":"我想市長身為一個法律博士然後不遵守法律然後在這裡自己也進行這麼久了同時你也要求要來增加這個程序市長今天是單純一個結議案法律案的時候法律案有時候八九十條整個大法修正那你沒有寫成你這個法總處理沒條來表決沒條來發言嗎"},{"start":3564.943,"end":3585.699,"text":"而且現在大家所對爭執的就是執行刑罰,就是我講的執行刑罰你要把執行刑罰裡面要做一些並跟文案刑處包括請總統、包括國務、國情報告等等那兩次國務就等等這些都是要在憲法法律上來進行的"},{"start":3588.669,"end":3609.92,"text":"直接刑事法你以後有意見你舉說我們小黨這個自由利益武器不要了你以後都會依附在某一個大黨上面讓他過判這是你的民主原則嗎?我想這是很諷刺的嘛我知不知道法律案整了這麼多的時候要怎麼表決你直接刑事法我們常常強要修正的"},{"start":3611.229,"end":3629.572,"text":"每一條都上來發言 團委商有結論 沒有結論就大家先領就表決表決還要談幾個人發言 發言順序 幾張顧問章這樣才有 立法院才走得下去阿你用從雲法則回應 回應到執行新聞法廢掉然後你能夠廢 我也沒人信阿"},{"start":3631.857,"end":3658.989,"text":"謝謝柯建民總統二次發言接下來還有沒有其他黨團要發言沒有我們現在主席我嘗試性的來做一個結論就較於各位黨團看看大家的意見現在協商各黨團沒有辦法達成共識所以本案這個院會進行是還沒有我們現在先討論程序那發言部分等一下廣泛討論時由"},{"start":3662.551,"end":3667.734,"text":"黃文峰手機程序問題完全不存在違法主要現在各黨團請發言副總召你還沒發言"},{"start":3693.174,"end":3720.42,"text":"那個院長今天謝謝你來解決院內的紛爭那既然這個在野黨都提出一樣的提案那執政黨表示他有意見所以今天也請求院長協商那是不是執政黨把他們為什麼要反對動漲電價請他們講清楚嘛請他們講清楚嘛好不好"},{"start":3721.934,"end":3722.536,"text":"來吳思友幹事長請發言"},{"start":3726.431,"end":3754.06,"text":"好 完成了程序問題的釐清我們就進入這個案子的實質的討論電價是專業 能源政策是專業那切莫是政治來操作這個開宗明義先請大家要能夠回歸公正專業的這個電價審議的程序那在過去2015年 立法院做成的決議要求台電如果要做任何電價的調漲或調降"},{"start":3756.341,"end":3757.262,"text":"立法院黨協商．事由．議案協商．事由．議案協商．"},{"start":3776.075,"end":3788.446,"text":"：立法院黨團協商．事由：立法院黨團協商．事由．立法院黨團協商．事由．立法院黨團協商．事由．立法院黨團協商．事由．立法院黨團協商．事由．立法院黨團協商．事由．立法院黨團協商．"},{"start":3804.179,"end":3810.303,"text":"所以現在電業法的法律授權規範非常清楚臺電的調漲調降任何的電價要經過公式的計算審議委員會的審議然後"},{"start":3818.451,"end":3838.49,"text":"這就是一個合法的程序那現在呢在野黨的提案就是推翻了立法院自己在2017年修的電業法我們不能夠我們是立法委員自己立的法國家的法治要遵守如果今天要用院會的決議的方式"},{"start":3839.411,"end":3839.711,"text":"法定人數不足"},{"start":3858.346,"end":3870.592,"text":"立委提案就可以推翻這是萬萬不可的第二個回到實質我們經過很多次的討論也再一次的予以澄清整個電價的調漲是國際的客觀環境"},{"start":3873.874,"end":3874.014,"text":"國際燃料的調生﹐"},{"start":3893.91,"end":3904.983,"text":"繼續說下去,我也不知道好不好所以我今天推而求其次國際都在面對這一番辛苦的燃料的調漲各國都反映在國內的電價的調漲臺灣的條幅相對是穩健的"},{"start":3909.088,"end":3935.626,"text":"而且呢就這個臺大風險中心2023年做了一個民調臺灣的人民是非常的理性看待臺電的永續經營跟國際節能減碳的趨勢就這個民調裡頭有八成的民眾他們也認為只要是符合節能減碳只要是經過合理的試算八成的民眾願意支付合理的電價來減少"},{"start":3938.588,"end":3964.721,"text":"人類對於未來氣候災害的損失而這樣一個民調21歲到30歲的青年支持合理調漲電價的意願是最高的所以新興的世代他們都非常理性的看待臺灣的電價合理化臺灣需要進行電價收費的結構性的改革讓用電大戶承擔更大的付費"},{"start":3965.721,"end":3993.213,"text":"而不是一再用國家的預算來撥補用納稅錢來去補貼這些高污染高耗能的產業用電這是大開改革的倒車啦所以這些就論理上我很努力民進黨團很努力的在國際的大環境的因應調控我們很努力的在法制作業的健全面我們也很努力的在民意的反應我們也很努力的在"},{"start":3994.573,"end":4011.366,"text":"對於這個國際未來節能減碳的時代使命我們都不厭其煩的再三論述所以再一次懇求請求不要用政治來凌駕了法治不要用政治來凌駕了專業的用點"},{"start":4017.151,"end":4037.96,"text":"我再一次說我也希望這樣的聲音透過直播讓更多的公民朋友能夠來予以支持正確的政策 謝謝好 謝謝吳世堯幹事長再次發言我先處理一下針對七八兩 對不起針對七八兩案各黨團既無共識我們就急交院會處理"},{"start":4040.289,"end":4046.515,"text":"約會處理可否比照下列進行的方式發言部分我們廣泛討論時由臺灣民眾黨推派一人民進黨推派兩人國民黨推派兩人輪流交叉發言順序授權議事處理每人發言時間三分鐘"},{"start":4061.058,"end":4084.128,"text":"第二,發言完畢,依各黨團所送修正動議先後順序,進行各黨團版本之處理。我們只處理修正動議,就不再處理再修正動議。請問各黨團對主席宣告的方式可否接受?你現在馬上要處理了?不要再討論?切開?因為差不多了"},{"start":4088.11,"end":4112.12,"text":"因為吳世耀擔任長講的也很清楚實質部分沒有共識沒有關係院長等一下好既然有舉手發言完畢以後要怎麼處理我沒有意見曹雷霄沒有所謂的一輪二輪的曹雷霄可以講到一整天也沒有關係但是我們知道這個大概"},{"start":4113.82,"end":4128.584,"text":"竟未分明,但是大家都說有新政了,讓我們把話講完,這是民主程序竟然洪森有舉手我建議這樣,因為上一次我們才寫上次,我們已經講得很清楚是"},{"start":4136.086,"end":4143.268,"text":"黨團三長所以我也很為難所以我剛才出去嘛,我也是三個你現在是四位啊?他是下一案,他是下一案我不是不尊敬,我也不是不尊敬"},{"start":4154.412,"end":4181.07,"text":"都不行了啦因為我覺得你們的三長到底是誰嘛你們自己要求 你們黨團三長到底是誰嘛我問你就回答等一下我問你 我可以回答我本來說 那我們維持三個嘛那我就出去嘛那假如你這個有意見你這個有意見 我們可以 他可以出去他不發言 沒有問題沒有問題這樣可以吧這裡是去搞亂子嘛"},{"start":4182.929,"end":4187.436,"text":"好,這沒問題,但是韓議長,沒有啦,我們要出去,我們出去啦"},{"start":4194.488,"end":4223.007,"text":"我本來是維持三個嘛然後你叫這個不要三長啦 什麼叫維持三個你聽我講 因為我剛才叫你先協商我本來就是三長啦好 沒有問題喔 兩個字喔 好不好我以後 那以後喔那是你要求的耶你上次一直在這裡講一定要三長 通通都是民進黨講的上次反應團講出來的你說民眾黨不能帶人進來 對三長才能進來 是不是你講的所以我剛才出現 我剛才協商他說好啊是這樣的嘛 好 我們"},{"start":4224.318,"end":4226.101,"text":"就算人身上,以後黨要公安行政"},{"start":4230.08,"end":4258.739,"text":"對不起我補充一下因為我們第一次朝野協商就建立一個共識好沒有問題是黨團三長來列席參與討論因為那一次你還記得陳昭之進來陳委員進來後來你就質疑陳委員的代表什麼身份所以我為什麼不讓紅委員發言並不是說不尊重他是因為我們好不容易建立這個慣例如果各黨團都沒有意見的話我們再一次重申以後我們朝野協商就是黨團三長萬一三長有事情對不起"},{"start":4259.912,"end":4278.346,"text":"本席不接受任何人代理我們先確定這樣子就定下來那我可以會議詢問一下嗎因為過去有很多的法案或預算案那當然是委員會中心主義嘛召委必須來這裡啊所以這個要怎麼處理呢是在三個緣合裡面我們來調派嗎還是只規範三長因為這個齁我跟議長報告這個不是人數"},{"start":4285.231,"end":4306.33,"text":"也不是黨團的代表性我們坐在這裡都希望是最了解該議案的委員可以來發言這會有助於我們協商討論的品質跟效率那基於委員會中心主義任何的法案它必須有召委至少是召委或是該委員會對於推動該法案最熱忱的那位委員來列席"},{"start":4306.87,"end":4320.722,"text":"所以如果都只是限於三長,那這樣子我覺得不是委員會中心主義的實踐,也不是委員會自身制的實踐喔這對於國會的運作是有漢格的好不好,主席秘書長說明一下各位委員,要這樣說明啦"},{"start":4330.793,"end":4341.719,"text":"委員會的黨團當時因為在第一次會有這樣的一個規範所以變成黨團三長剛才吳委員所提的如果委員會在協商當時的設計當時那個圖表的設計很簡單就是第七十條的規範"},{"start":4347.842,"end":4377.191,"text":"那是因為大概一定是這一個法案是到底在院會的哪一個這一個說明的那一個黨團負責召集協商那協商的時候一定是按照70條規定通知各黨團書面簽名指派兩人參加這兩人當中一個一定是審查會的委員一定有審查會的一個是大概黨團的代表"},{"start":4377.95,"end":4401.409,"text":"但另外一個狀況有可能因為這一次大概很好每一個委員會大概各黨團都有人以前可能就只有以上一屆來講是沒有的所以沒有的話可能這個黨團在這個委員會根本沒有人那這兩個人就不受這個限制這在第七四條寫得很清楚當時我在設計那個圖表裡面約會跟委員會接軌所設計的一個圖表是這樣的設計"},{"start":4406.733,"end":4408.536,"text":"委員會在實務上怎麼做我不太理解法條規定是這樣的"},{"start":4422.791,"end":4428.717,"text":"市長,您剛講的可以由該委員或審查委員或的委員是在委員會的黨團協商的那個level嗎?"},{"start":4439.508,"end":4460.874,"text":"我這個要提出這個嚴重的挑戰跟討論我雖然擔任立委比較之前現在是第九年第三任但我過去推動的法案或是重要的預算我沒有常常來但是我也會來這樣一個院長交集的委員會數次或數十次前提是我負責的委員會的議案"},{"start":4462.294,"end":4488.154,"text":"我主推的法案或是我擔任召委的時候我再次強調吳思瑤過去九年坐在這裡的時間不是人頭我坐在這裡是有功能的我最了解的法案或是我最了解的預算我必須在這裡做攻防做說明有助於討論的品質跟效率這是負責任的國會監督所以過去九年"},{"start":4489.594,"end":4513.152,"text":"我三任立委 從蘇嘉晨院長到游錫堃院長 坐在這裡的場域我說的這裡的場域 就是院長召集的朝野協商我過去不是三長 因為我是第一次擔任三長 所以我過去可以被允許坐在這裡對於我清楚掌握的法案 我推動的預算 我必須在這裡說明"},{"start":4514.933,"end":4531.581,"text":"那為什麼現在就推翻了那是推翻了過去幾任的我相信在王金平院長的時候那時候我是行政院的秘書我也都會陪來這裡協商所以不是只有三長可以坐在這裡不要做這個過當的宣示"},{"start":4532.967,"end":4552.658,"text":"不是人頭一二三不是比力量比表決不是我們是要推派什麼樣子的代表在這裡有利於議案的效能跟品質的討論所以大家反而應當是好人數要約制可以比如說三長再加一加二是該委員會的召委或什麼大家可以講好"},{"start":4554.018,"end":4570.823,"text":"絕對沒有剝奪了非三長的委員參與朝野協商的權利我從以前年輕二十幾歲擔任國會助理到行政院的秘書到我成為立委的九年從來沒有發生這樣的事情不能過當的做這樣的解釋"},{"start":4572.023,"end":4587.329,"text":"院長我要請求 坐在這裡的人 不是求表現 不是作秀 不是比人頭 不是比舉手他是比他對於這個專業議案的瞭解 他能夠協助協商的效能跟品質 這才是有助於未來您主持的協商"},{"start":4588.609,"end":4611.988,"text":"時間!時間!時間!時間!"},{"start":4612.208,"end":4613.87,"text":"我還在發言所以我希望遊戲規則是這樣那回歸一下過去"},{"start":4630.39,"end":4649.148,"text":"任何的討論都有意義 任何的議案的討論都有需要 這不是浪費人民的時間這絕對不是 除非只是作秀 除非只是做小朋友同課的人 才是浪費時間在立法院開議時間 不在立法院開議去中國 在王滬寧面前"},{"start":4650.089,"end":4677.797,"text":"坑都不敢坑醫生的人在這裡好那我們是要遊戲規則這樣子院長我再一次請求上一次確實柯總召有提出說就是三位代表三長優先那個時候討論協商的主題是什麼那時候討論協商的主題是程序性的開議的日期專案的報告是什麼那個不涉及議案的實質所以在那一類的協商是由三長代表沒有問題可是對於議案的協商"},{"start":4678.897,"end":4681.378,"text":"各位委員各位去看69條68 6970大概裡面都有規範的"},{"start":4701.485,"end":4703.125,"text":"立法院黨團協商．事由．議案協商．事由．議案協商．事由．議案協商．事由．議案協商．"},{"start":4727.91,"end":4750.845,"text":"所以變成從那個以後大概幾乎現在的所有在黨團協商一定是山長坐在這邊在協商那各位也可以看到69條69條寫得很清楚那我也不要再練這個條文那各位可能就可以參佐去看那大概是我整個這樣做報告那69條很清楚啦69條裡面我幫你解釋69條好沒關係"},{"start":4757.509,"end":4773.889,"text":"第69條寫很清楚：黨團協商會議由院長、副院長及各黨團負責人或黨兵出席參加並由院長主持 院長因故不能主持時由副院長主持這是第一項 很清楚的 請在這邊各位可以去參考 以上"},{"start":4774.827,"end":4802.652,"text":"那我再堅持一遍因為我們第一次朝野協商就界定得非常清楚為了怕整個我們在朝野協商各方面變得不對稱或者太分雜所以我們就訂下黨團三長可以參與黨團三長萬一有請假其他的列席的黨團幹部一樣有代表性我想我們今天再重申一遍這個沒有對哪個黨團公平或不公平通通都沒有我們就建立一個慣例所以"},{"start":4803.345,"end":4822.579,"text":"可不可以請教其他代表嗎你現在的意思都不行我們現在確定你就是黨團三長你剛剛講的是這樣的意思我的意思是說就是黨團三長我們恢復到第一次因為我們運行得非常好我們就黨團三長列席我想我再問一遍國民黨團有沒有意見黨團三長列席民眾黨團有沒有意見"},{"start":4832.729,"end":4857.451,"text":"民進黨團也沒有意見沒有意見那以後我們就定下來除了黨團上練習發言其他委員敬請就不要參與了好確定了那在接下來我剛才所念的協商各黨團沒有辦法達成共識的時候等一下我們第七案第八案是不是做剛才我所陳述的這樣的方式來處理好那我們就定下來"},{"start":4860.19,"end":4868.133,"text":"我再說一遍好不好等一下你怎麼才說沒問題但是我們把話講清楚就好了因為我在這裡30年當黨兵23年我參加過至少700場以上的壞事都講得很清楚"},{"start":4875.836,"end":4889.659,"text":"國務院院長在組織協商的時候有不同風格那有的會合協為主比如說那時候前瞻紀錄電視預算的時候來這裡草原協商那時候蘇家瓊院長從頭到尾都會說委員會在審查的時候國務黨破壞那整個國務院會沒有辦法進行都直接到院會去"},{"start":4900.191,"end":4918.405,"text":"所以他還自己要求,他在這個地方,要有特定的時間,兩天前去海域,讓民進黨的人來,然後做執行,把各位找來做執行他把草野鄉當作委會執行"},{"start":4919.665,"end":4930.93,"text":"當初我們是非常有意見但為何協議竟然院長這樣我們算了能夠大家能夠溝通其實那也不是溝通他就在做表演舞台這個黃國昌也應該還記得你這份歷史吧"},{"start":4935.712,"end":4954.025,"text":"所以曹偉強有人這種樣態那今天我要講的就是說曹偉院長我非常尊重你但是不要急著裁決反正你今天很需要表情每一個心理我很清楚當然很難達到共識嘛當然達到共識以前你要讓他盡情的發言不是發言一輪以後就結束"},{"start":4955.526,"end":4967.032,"text":"我引述過去王院長在所兩次議 蘇院長王院長在所最有名的案子就是實名安全管理法朝委選上二十次還是在談要把道理講清楚嗎"},{"start":4968.072,"end":4973.016,"text":"那刑法控告沒收的時候﹖事由．議案協商．議案協商．議案協商．議案協商．議案協商．議案協商．議案"},{"start":4991.912,"end":5016.645,"text":"那是現在副委員會所期待的那這乃至於上禮拜五我們都很清楚上禮拜五所有的執行循序法民黨案子全部被封殺在委會封殺甚至封殺委會委員會沒收黃國昌也是共犯結果嘛你都舉手站在那邊嘛你去黃國昌看一下你現在一路黃民黨也會過半所以你要改變一切"},{"start":5017.825,"end":5018.706,"text":"主席主席主席你要制裁這個人"},{"start":5034.762,"end":5056.674,"text":"你要把它稍微大義所以人家想說他現在怎麼做,他怎麼去控制你院長之院長的合意,他今天甚至主張不適用來表決,這樣也可以存在所以這要講清楚,大家要把道理講清楚,要後勤以後要怎麼後勤我都沒有意見但是呢"},{"start":5058.089,"end":5066.642,"text":"要一致那學長要把話講出去我一直罰案罰案不講理 罰案單 罰案的時候 坦白有過一次罰案是來一二十個 我們都忍受"},{"start":5067.915,"end":5095.336,"text":"一段審查 國民黨來一段審查 我一人在 也是這樣都連受拉北時期的時候 超級海大 整一缸子國民黨都來在野黨都來 但是我們都很受啊 院長所以 所以 院長你只要維持一個 根本是你在做的不是分期給 直接就叫你怎麼做了 過程就給你排棄了所以 你要 你自己的分寸 你的誠信要維持著"},{"start":5101.174,"end":5119.745,"text":"講好幾年講不行的話,你可以裁釋或怎麼回聲,照講一下不要裁釋下去,超出國企好像不好,有生理的跌倒成分,我就這樣表示謝謝柯總召,接下來請吳世豪跟蔣麗玲多次歡迎,請稍待一下"},{"start":5121.277,"end":5143.458,"text":"那我剛才柯總召講了兩個重點一個A一個B就是A我們將來建立一個慣例我想我們好不容易建立這個慣例朝野協商就是黨團三長這個不要再變了第二個如果各位針對七案八案沒有實質的發言就請不要再發言了就請不要發言因為不管是情緒性或者意脫離我們七八案本案的"},{"start":5144.732,"end":5167.677,"text":"我想我們暫時不要再講這樣我們今天就準備送院會處理等一下最好委員有意見請大家聽一下我們發言只有十分鐘沒有前瞬性等一下你說我已經有說短了不要以為有衝浪線大家注意聽曹海祥過去大家都在這裡走過那還是"},{"start":5168.877,"end":5196.554,"text":"委員會的召委他負責處理法案那審查委員會召委是 召委不知道是誰啦齁 召委 僅頭兩個嘛齁 那個法案 那組織那個法案的召委齁應該可以來列席 因為他將來在議會做報告也是他這個部分 因為新法有漏列 但是大家講清楚因為他將來要到議會去做報告的人嘛 他不知道你們想怎麼樣嘛"},{"start":5197.815,"end":5199.156,"text":"委員會需要協商﹖那個主席一定是這一個人"},{"start":5225.083,"end":5244.573,"text":"所以他一定不會有問題存在 因為今天是一個人我知道 那你院會召集的這個 因為我們沒有把他納進來在這裡面因為他不是在 各委員會有八個委員會的 我們沒有列在這邊"},{"start":5245.441,"end":5265.547,"text":"那因為有委員會的專業幕僚 比如舉個例來講今天是經濟委員會 他的專門委員一定會在列在這邊在委員會在處理的過程 幕僚一定會提供給這一個主席所以在院會送到院長協商 一定是這樣的處理方式"},{"start":5266.227,"end":5276.541,"text":"所以那個專業人員一定是由委員會的專門委員在處理所以那一個主席就沒有到這邊來我今天真的跟你談一句大家這個地方前面走過過去潮流潮濕的情況"},{"start":5283.47,"end":5309.237,"text":"你又可以把查為商當委員執行,黃國昌自己執行因為出差了,大家亂來亂去這個時候有一點表現不太對,大家很認真在談事情我們任何事情都能夠,因為要遇事何且法案能夠順利進行所以過去我講清楚,今天以後要怎麼樣我都放心,沒有問題"},{"start":5310.457,"end":5333.695,"text":"包括坐在後面的助理 要不要指定多少人只要我是中方會議委員講說 那我就坐在後面就好了 我在旁邊我不發言總可以吧你這個要大家講清楚喔那中方會議不能發言阿 助理都可以在那 我為什麼不能做安排我召委 召委我申請這個法案我主持的"},{"start":5335.432,"end":5351.497,"text":"委員會有朝夕協商我正在聽你們大概講什麼將來再要跟他做報告他也知道他稍微掌控整個法案的審查所以今天你法案呢坦白講我不喜歡一直講這個我參加過七百場當然是各個"},{"start":5353.201,"end":5379.101,"text":"因為院長風格就是 大家說得好 說得順就好 大家說得好說得好 沒辦法就不要管這是一個民主程序嘛 幾乎是把委員會都沒收了前面那一排的人在上上禮拜10月15號 17號是把我們提案在委員會都沒收 不讓你審了幾乎上禮拜五也是 因為沒收啊所以今天副院長的揚謀我很清楚啊"},{"start":5380.066,"end":5397.922,"text":"因為我們今天已經我們大家都在上禮拜都發文給你那我也告訴你說各黨團都發文給你要來主持朝夕協商但是你都沒有處理就今天才要處理也沒有關係那黑人起義來的時候說沒有沒有什麼朝夕協商就直接表決"},{"start":5399.298,"end":5425.525,"text":"它現在暫時是國會多數但是呢這個已經違法本來就是有院長主席曹雷霄檢議嘛好 允許曹雷霄越檢決沒有問題但是呢請注意一個民主程序以後這個是一個檢議案以後法案是非常複雜法案哪一條和哪一條有相連其他法案有沒有判格這要談得很清楚所以法案的談判不是這麼簡單的事情"},{"start":5427.405,"end":5455.864,"text":"那叫封禁的意思是說委員我卸責我職業新法出了委會以後然後民進黨所有的版本全部給封殺因為不應該出來進入惡徒那是第五反案三十年期發現的然後到五月十七號也不要操著槍直接表決表決民進黨發言就清楚發言就如此蓋還走下去嗎這是封禁的陽謀嘛這國會可以不能如此嗎所以今天我要講清楚很多話"},{"start":5462.867,"end":5483.775,"text":"我先講實質的部分為了要讓農漁民可以安心生產教育機構能夠專心培養學子社福工作者能夠穩定的提供關懷的服務所以這一次即使電價調漲那行政部門在顧弱勢顧公益的部分呢針對農漁業學校社福團體是全面的電價動漲"},{"start":5485.255,"end":5496.742,"text":"這就是兼顧了民生第一跟弱勢優先讓他們不會在這一次的電價調漲裡頭受到波及那我手上也有一份是由29個民間組織有49個學者專家所提出的一個聯署聲明"},{"start":5502.185,"end":5509.129,"text":"他們都呼籲立法院由國民黨：立法院黨團總召副坤祺提案來修正定業法49條將電價調漲交由立法院審議那這樣的話會讓電價淪為政治操作讓政黨的惡鬥"},{"start":5517.173,"end":5544.398,"text":"取代應符合公正與專業性的電價審議機制徒利企業並讓全民買單這是嚴重違反了使用者跟污染者付費來促進淨零的全球趨勢這都是我要在這裡藉由協商時間在表達人民的聲音民間的聲音那我要回到一個重點我跟主席說我雖然之前我坐在這裡立法院佔了我二分之一的生命時間在這裡"},{"start":5546.518,"end":5566.657,"text":"我們今天每一次的院會開會時間是早上九點到晚上的六點鐘必要時可以再延長開會我不希望也不樂見在任何討論議案的過程有人動輒以時間到了快點講要不就是浪費全民的時間錯在我們的上班時間好好開會好好協商好好討論議案這是國會議員的職責"},{"start":5570,"end":5570.32,"text":"民主的原則是什麼?"},{"start":5586.315,"end":5608.264,"text":"我們都是學政治學出身的民主的原則就是溝通、討論沒有辦法獲制共識再予以表決所以在溝通跟討論的過程是不能快轉、不能跳過的我們現在的立法院在民主值的立法院其實創下了很多的惡例我不好意思這樣講"},{"start":5609.898,"end":5627.34,"text":"我們的程序委員會八年不檔案現在國民黨多數藍白聯手程序委員會檔案了一個病人要開醫生連掛號的資格都不給一個球員要參加比賽你給他報名的資格都剝奪就是現在的立法院"},{"start":5627.961,"end":5631.644,"text":"委員會審查的權利委員會中心主義委員會資深制都是要讓委員會相關的議案充分討論為人民發聲讓專業說話但是在委員會實踐的時候也沒收了討論的權限現在進入協商也是坐在這裡我看我對面的幾位"},{"start":5656.909,"end":5682.241,"text":"同仁們 恐怕都好想趕快下班或是好像開完會不要再講了 不要再講了這也是在形同閹割我們在協商的時候進行任何議案表決前最後的論理最後的政策辯論的機會我們都是國會議員我再一次說民主的原則是什麼溝通 討論 最後表決是最終的手段"},{"start":5683.061,"end":5697.739,"text":"可是在韓國瑜院長主持的立法院才上路三個月我們閹割了溝通、沒收了討論動輒萬事都表決就行這是民主嗎?"},{"start":5699.249,"end":5718.679,"text":"好,民主是多數決定但是民主另外一個原則多數也要尊重少數福爾泰的名言大家都聽過我縱使不同意你的觀點但我誓死捍衛你說話的權利我們在台灣最高的民主殿堂"},{"start":5720.08,"end":5745.698,"text":"我作為一個國會議員：這個會期作為黨編我多少次試圖的要努力說話為人民說話為政策討論我的權利都被你們無情的沒收了這不是人民期待的國會更何況這個會期我們在討論國會改革台灣的國會不能香港化台灣的國會不能沒收我們討論的機制請尊重我的發言"},{"start":5746.727,"end":5775.623,"text":"所以不要急著下班好嗎副總召我們開會的時間到晚上六點不要急著不要指著手錶不要急著下班的時間好嗎我們坐在這裡好好討論請尊重我發言的時間所以我再一次只差沒有跪求韓院長了立法院不能創下更多的惡力不要逼著人民上街頭台灣不能成為香港台灣的國會民主被沒收"},{"start":5777.439,"end":5789.518,"text":"最重的話就是這樣請大家要自制好嗎?開會的時間是到晚上六點在急什麼?急著下班嗎?急著去跟習近平摩西摩西嗎?"},{"start":5791.302,"end":5814.5,"text":"請尊重開會的紀律委員在開會為什麼有人可以拍桌委員的權利互相尊重韓院長您主持的院長您獲得人民的聲望也相對的高您領導的立法院要是什麼樣的立法院是民主被沒收的立法院嗎萬萬不可啊"},{"start":5815.179,"end":5816.561,"text":"感謝院長我想如果說真的要開會那上禮拜草野協商黨團召開就不要不來"},{"start":5833.314,"end":5850.824,"text":"上禮拜召開黨團協商不來然後現在跟我們講要開會是看到院長在看到媒體在拍看到現在直播所以說就興奮討論看到很多人討論所以說就一直講欲罷不能戲金上升言很大沒有必要"},{"start":5851.738,"end":5868.884,"text":"每一個人都是一百一十三十年其中之一每一個人都是中央民意代表每一個人都代表民意沒有像悲觀悲大沒有像人比較大所以一樣講民主講溝通講討論過去八年民進黨怎麼輾壓民進黨怎麼一黨獨大民進黨怎麼蠻漢民進黨怎麼不講理為什麼不講過去八年所作所為"},{"start":5874.773,"end":5893.038,"text":"院長我很快一分鐘其實剛剛柯總召明明就很了解但故意要模糊今天的焦點一般提案討論當然是三長代表因為可以代表黨團來做協商沒有問題但如果說有法律提案或者是說有相關我們要立專法新創法"},{"start":5895.785,"end":5914.779,"text":"院長在召開草野協商的時候也會有開會通知開會通知的時候可以授權幕僚單位能夠邀請相關人士共同與會所以這明明白白過去現在就可以處理的作業不用說故意照現在拿特例當通例來混淆焦點"},{"start":5915.6,"end":5916.38,"text":"好,謝謝各位,我現在"},{"start":5944.87,"end":5970.333,"text":"副總召集會議請我覺得院長現在開已經三個月了那為什麼一個最基本的我們朝野協商的制度的建立有這麼困難為什麼在立法院委員會的職群要有會議主席確認每一次開會時候"},{"start":5972.253,"end":5998.252,"text":"八個委員會他的質詢時間是幾分鐘會議一開始就有公告大家要按照這個規則時間到的時候有按鈴你的發言應該截止在運會的質詢也有明確的規範30分鐘還是15分鐘時間到了你的時間就結束就消音了但是反而"},{"start":5999.031,"end":6022.097,"text":"最基本的委員會 院會質詢都是按照這個方式來進行但是竟然代表黨團的負責人來到院長這裡協商連一個基本的制度都沒有而且我們不斷地在這裡聽到魔音穿腦不斷地一直在repeat repeat不斷地跳針"},{"start":6023.633,"end":6049.479,"text":"還有人把這裡當養老院不再講30年前20年前10年前我們從2月1號聽到現在一直在講養老院的回憶錄立法院永遠沒有辦法往前邁進嗎永遠不能往前邁進嗎院長你的制度制度必須制度必須要建立"},{"start":6055.655,"end":6078.509,"text":"到底是幾分鐘這要清楚第二我們院長召集的協商在第一次的時候民進黨柯總召赫赤民眾黨也赫赤主席不能進來的人為什麼可以進來今天立法院不是民進黨開的"},{"start":6080.475,"end":6104.307,"text":"今天法院是民進黨開的連這個買票 台南市議會買票但是呢在這裡可以滿口胡說八道 浪費全民的時間所以院長 我覺得今天就要您 我希望因為他們講話都十分鐘八分鐘我才講一分多鐘"},{"start":6106.601,"end":6134.383,"text":"不能厭擱國民黨發言時間我們再次的表達議長我們要照制度走制度是什麼你願意建立制度我們全力支持你不能任由他們每次這樣開會在這裡不斷的咆哮跳針人聲攻擊不斷的一直重複一直重複而我們該談的事情到底怎麼樣剛剛講得很清楚嘛在這裡呼天搶地鬼哭神號說"},{"start":6136.772,"end":6142.435,"text":"院長要給他們講話的時間4月24號、4月26號兩次為了電價的召集協商民進黨全部缺席然後到這裡呼天搶地誰應該有他的發言權"},{"start":6160.359,"end":6164.663,"text":"民進黨採用這種傲慢的態度我們接下來會要求我們來查詢4月24號4月26號為什麼誰可以缺席誰是薪水的小偷偷了全民的錢"},{"start":6184.343,"end":6190.084,"text":"有問題,你不要以為臺北六八聯盟,你根本搞不清楚狀況,毫無法律才能嘗試接受人政公局院長不是在你指揮科技局下行事的吧?"},{"start":7001.614,"end":7017.591,"text":"再次感謝大家,謝謝我想第七案、第八案顯然沒有辦法大家都達成共識我們現在先進入第九案因為我們環境部的省次長列席了請省次長來說明好嗎?謝謝"},{"start":7024.449,"end":7051.238,"text":"院長副院長還有各位黨團的總召幹部大家好那我想這一題那個經濟部他為了處理這個各工業區的這個污水處理廠的污泥那透過這樣的一個合約的一個進行來處理那確實有這個一個需要那以所在地彰化縣來看"},{"start":7053.151,"end":7053.171,"text":"委員長"},{"start":7083.849,"end":7102.915,"text":"張化縣的失業廢棄物的處理是可以紓解他的壓力對全國的廢棄物的處理也是有這樣的一個幫助不過我們要說明的是這個案子是在111年的時候已經通過了環境影響評估他有他的程序"},{"start":7104.226,"end":7104.246,"text":"謝謝委員長"},{"start":7129.344,"end":7142.933,"text":"關於這個提案我們在當初院會的時候已經由我們的未還委員會的委員陳昭之委員跟院會做了清楚的說明因為這件事情"},{"start":7144.98,"end":7166.991,"text":"姑且不論在彰化當地在鹿港當地有非常多的環保團體跟當地的民眾站出來抗議那更重要的事情是在去年的時候總統府的秘書長林佳龍以及行政院的副院長鄭文燦"},{"start":7169.025,"end":7193.335,"text":"到彰化的時候跟彰化人清楚的表明說要在這邊再繼續蓋焚化爐這件事情是徹底的抹黑是假消息絕對沒有要出力那沒想到在選舉結束了以後180度的大轉彎在選前做了沉默"},{"start":7194.505,"end":7213.663,"text":"在選後開始找各式各樣的理由我相信這絕對不是在台灣的民主政治當中大家樂見的狀況針對這件事情在上一次交付院會要處理的時候也是由民主經部黨"},{"start":7214.98,"end":7243.42,"text":"拉了協商要求臺灣民眾黨召集協商我們也按照當時院長的才事召集了協商那只不過說非常遺憾的民主進步黨並沒有派任何人來參與這個委員會的協商那也正是因為這個樣子所以我一開始的時候針對有關於我們接下來要進行的程序我請教了秘書長"},{"start":7245.439,"end":7270.972,"text":"秘書長可能是講話比較客氣一點沒有正面的來加以回應我本來以為我聽得應該是蠻清楚的但好像有人聽不懂所以我就再度的確認依照立法院職權行使法的規定交付協商以後基本上冷凍一個月超過一個月就可以處理"},{"start":7272.267,"end":7280.705,"text":"那在這個期限當中那負責召集協商的黨團 召集的協商如果有黨團代表不來的話"},{"start":7281.806,"end":7303.932,"text":"那等於是他們不願意參與這個協商那我們法定的程序也都進行完畢了嘛那因此在這個法定程序進行完畢了以後再由院長召集協商這件事情就不是法律上面的要求我想我的理解應該沒有錯誤"},{"start":7306.593,"end":7323.055,"text":"我們那個時候 之所以在那個時候是希望說要不要再讓院長召集一次協商因為立法院執行刑事法裡面的規定黨團可以請求院長召集協商因此我們也是本於善意做了這樣子"},{"start":7324.156,"end":7350.791,"text":"的建議請院長再召集協商不過我相信剛剛秘書長對於我們運作規則的解釋應該已經解釋得非常清楚了我再重複一次第一個在一個月裡面我們就依照院長的裁示召集了協商那民主進步黨不願意派人來參與我們也尊重因為你不能強迫人家一定要來嘛但"},{"start":7352.27,"end":7368.01,"text":"當進行完了這個法定程序了以後依照立法院職權刑事法的規定過了一個月我們就可以交由院會來交由處理我想這個理解應該是不會有什麼樣子的錯誤以上說明院長"},{"start":7370.011,"end":7383.62,"text":"好 請柯建銘總統發言時間三分鐘 謝謝我今天沒有什麼所謂時間三分鐘他在講你沒有講時間三分鐘我們都不要正面這個事情我們把事情講清楚就好針對黃國昌委員剛才的發言"},{"start":7386.109,"end":7406.435,"text":"我剛才一直在講 你是坐在立法院 你是法醫博士 你今天把法醫視為無誤你認為你今天和國盟加起來 衣服在國盟身上加起來 你還會不會兩人可以轉動台灣 為所欲為你沒有看到 你直接清楚 等六十八條講七十一條"},{"start":7407.935,"end":7423.658,"text":"首先他講說他們及禁貨圖禁貨圖的時候假如各黨都沒有意見簽名以後當然是馬上出議有人有意見他能交文找我協商這是再清楚不過的事情"},{"start":7425.32,"end":7441.716,"text":"這麼清楚的事情竟然你也可以取決說是民進黨法是罪可以復仇至於案子就是說大家都同意那才清明你也可以用這個法案來解釋這個事情以後說法案就法案你委員會了"},{"start":7442.797,"end":7445.799,"text":"所有案子來參與協商８立法院黨團協商．議案協商．議案協商．議案協商．議案協商．議案協商"},{"start":7466.813,"end":7477.263,"text":"我說好像民進黨是民進黨最有貨手把交易炒到協商這一定要炒到協商不然按大家意料的委員會不必了嘛所以要充分這一個第二個就是說"},{"start":7479.594,"end":7508.705,"text":"那 院長有職權 在時間刑事法院 歸議 歸議很幾乎而且最重要一條就是68條 黨團協商這是 這是一個規定 是院長所有職權是分在這裡所以法院長你要看清楚 你當院長有什麼權利 你能夠做什麼事情雖然我們都知道 有所謂立法院 立法院組織法在我們過去在一二零六以後修了就是說院長必須推出政黨"},{"start":7510.031,"end":7520.323,"text":"因為院長必須一時中旅但是我的院長如果刑處之前呢所以有這些刑事法所以刑事法在規定所有委員怎麼刑處之前"},{"start":7522.344,"end":7544.735,"text":"所以在68條 最重要是在給院長用的一個 院長的條款68條怎麼可以 黨團協商 或是議案協商 或是有爭議處理的時候是要院長可以自己召集 或是你們可以要求院長自己召集所以相對這個記憶是存在的 可是這個院長從前面都沒有做到"},{"start":7547.497,"end":7560.386,"text":"連什麼全部都沒有功能是不可能的事情嘛所以他要問為什麼 為什麼院長是很重要因為他是必須意識跟中立那立法院能夠一輪就下來但是反而當了立法院院長當了17年副院長當了6年"},{"start":7564.188,"end":7585.709,"text":"我們都一起走過這樣的時光但是以後來的蘇貞全或游委員長 大家都秉持很多事情就是說以後一定就是要把大家的爭競事件處理掉 意識能夠存立法案能夠好好討論 議案也可以好好討論 這才是立法院"},{"start":7586.73,"end":7606.747,"text":"但是呢 很一樣的 洪昌偉在過去二零一回合 我在選舉的時候一直攻擊我秘書協商 要違背中心主義但是 因為那時候 因為我還沒有直播這是自律史人 好像是我 我和王議長兩人就是秘書協商僑王"},{"start":7608.248,"end":7627.902,"text":"這就是法院法律法律國際法院直播者的直播法所以你一直在做我觀察你很久我一直看著你一任的轉變然後你今天這個樣子大家都不開會這樣罰手機什麼都沒有人的時間這應該是一個很重要的時刻為什麼 韓英隆比較對不起"},{"start":7632.625,"end":7637.76,"text":"等一下,還沒講完,對不起,我幫我把話講清楚,今天大家把話講清楚"},{"start":7639.525,"end":7667.228,"text":"你的正義處理正義解決在你三十年來議員會沒有發生的事情我對不起那個委員會跳號至於說有人能夠隔空投票這些都是要改進的部分但今天裡面的常常人的關頭的時候你要特別謹慎我一直需要跟你講說議員長你是很重要的因為議員的自信維持你是一個重材質而且直接性的把你規定得這麼清楚"},{"start":7668.129,"end":7669.173,"text":"好,我們看黃國昌,議員委員都很注意,我看他出來黑一腳"},{"start":7674.127,"end":7700.524,"text":"那你記得4月20號發生什麼事情大家都會注意4月22號民進黨的國會改革方案在委員會裏面你們一排你洪汪汪叫國民黨把他撒廢掉就當你委會也不能審到委員會的時候照過去一條沒有審的話就照委員會金融組沒有協商不用討論也把你轟炸掉你那天還要罵換你那天就是這樣你在演一個什麼你在演一個國民黨維持的角色"},{"start":7701.545,"end":7713.264,"text":"你製作會的嘛所以今天我要談黃國昌運動與球這很嚴肅的問題我希望你出來打球變成洛湖所謂我今天要談的就是說好你今天所謂就提到本案"},{"start":7714.329,"end":7740.782,"text":"本來是僅僅 張嬅僅僅嘛那我知道張嬅好 應該 我也不熟 聽很多文化族一個對質要搞準 能夠企圖 當地經濟反彈非常厲害反正是所有的 所有的 政府 公共建設 或是BOT 乃至BOT哪會排除經營抗爭 都很能走得下去所以大家都很清楚 包括民進黨的所有立委我們張嬅所有立委 包括吳云林 包括"},{"start":7742.903,"end":7749.911,"text":"每一個人的立委都很清楚,這大致民國沒有好處,我們走不下去,這很清楚所以你剛才講的說,今天副委員長承諾這不會去,這朝鮮有方向,就是說大家都知道"},{"start":7763.123,"end":7783.232,"text":"這要如何發動企業起來,雖然環保已經通過,但環保已經通過以後有很多程序要進行,但是在抗爭的時候,那程序沒有效性合法性的走來的話,當然這個東西一定會發生衝突,一定是起不來"},{"start":7784.773,"end":7795.022,"text":"我今天講的一個事情說﹖這是中華﹖所有人都知道的﹖這個不值得去﹖而且市民都反對﹖在這時候﹖我們要講國家潛力分裂原則"},{"start":7800.449,"end":7814.199,"text":"這停下來誰會把他停下來他也可以走通告程序啊這個程序可以走的你如果停下來你如果停下來你要給他蓋了所以這裡面又很重要一個潛力分立原則"},{"start":7815.02,"end":7840.737,"text":"假如你有反應對於所有任何政策或任何工程你下次也可以說把這個台中南線停下來這個風雲旗 風雲快停下來所有公共公園都停下來 立法院做個檢疫停下來這個是依法行事的政府而且這個是潛力分立原則假如說你要把它停不具理由的話當然要國賠這要當公共情策"},{"start":7842.208,"end":7852.573,"text":"往回頭過來你以為可以做個決議引起到行政權的裁決嗎大家都知道有些人把財政結果沒有辦法可以走下去將來這個責任歸屬在什麼地方"},{"start":7856.109,"end":7866.031,"text":"那有沒有行為訴訟 乃至於司法訴訟 這是國會問題 這個一定要國外上做但是橫空跑出一個立法院跳出來說你把他停下來 現在就把他停下來 做個結議這種結議就跟剛才一樣 那個三個結議一樣 排電依法"},{"start":7879.256,"end":7892.232,"text":"因為1961年的時候有這個公式但是五十五年沒有改所以到1961年的時候1964年的時候沒有公式來批凡審議沒有人審因為在審議的時候"},{"start":7895.496,"end":7905.42,"text":"來自一套一百零六的時候 第二條法把他放不上去了 作之法 但是今天行政部門依法來處理的時候必須漲電價 當然漲電價他必須 財務有問題嘛 這個補貼 還是要漲電價 還有台灣的政治 等種方式來拯救台電嘛"},{"start":7917.627,"end":7930.401,"text":"所以他是依法在處理的,對於法規很清楚結果立法院跳脫法律,你給我停下來就停下來,沒有這個東西,存在的今天也是一樣,我們共同的看法"},{"start":7935.066,"end":7959.514,"text":"但後續處理應該是主要處理這個有行政程序的問題也有國安法的問題責任規則的問題可是這是屬於行政權憲法上的權力分裂原則你一晚可以做任何決議去停止很多東西的話你找不到法條過去有幸好有七條立法院可以對於國家重要政策予以變更之我曾經用這個法條來去把合適廢掉"},{"start":7962.535,"end":7986.769,"text":"當然是後來李德威修正把五七角已經凍結掉了你如果說立法院這個權利也沒有了所以對策要衝上去 這樣政策也要凍結掉但是有那個合適五二一事件的時候是這樣你就是行為主動我這個政策沒有辦法處理下去的時候要預言做報告這是一個憲法規定"},{"start":7988.85,"end":8005.918,"text":"憲法以前沒有五七九立法院的這個權利已經被修正斷絕掉所以今天我們面對的說行政部門他依法行事的時候你立法委員他依照法律你依照法律可以做任何決議說你不要有關法律你給他停下來再說"},{"start":8008.827,"end":8008.847,"text":"黃國昌議員"},{"start":8025.294,"end":8041.185,"text":"立法院只要你加起來多數 每個禮拜五都同一個結議 什麼事情都不能做 行政局只要依法行事 你做這個結議都是無效的 這個要很清楚"},{"start":8042.226,"end":8065.297,"text":"今天兩個人都變成同樣窮勁就是說要停下來要如何有秩序的出場然後這責任規則弄清楚這才是行政部門要的要做的我們都有一個公平的看法這五花都去 要把它填起來如果有問題你投資這個是你投資的你反正說停下來就停下來沒有一定相信國賠嘛"},{"start":8067.486,"end":8089.88,"text":"所以在這個法律程式上 公法程式上 大家要想清楚我們要看法會一致的 反正沒有法律程式就沒有法律了 這個應該是這樣嘛但是呢 這個是依法形式的 所以希望大家談事情都要理性來談不是說違法 定義法這樣做 比這樣檢疫 加違法 都不能這樣 都不可能"},{"start":8091.301,"end":8092.602,"text":"現在我們請洪孟楷署長舉手"},{"start":8112.183,"end":8112.343,"text":"李慧琼議員"},{"start":8131.952,"end":8132.112,"text":"張嬅焚化爐新建案"},{"start":8153.191,"end":8181.241,"text":"那現在發生的事情是什麼就是金鼎這個公司他違反了雙方的合約包括他沒有辦開工前的說明會包括他沒有取得建造前就提早開工然後還有什麼黑衣人來說明會現場我們也都難以容忍也不可接受那當然也包括他沒有依據合約的規定在新建期後的六個月他還是沒有辦法動工所以金鼎確實是有違約"},{"start":8182.742,"end":8209.778,"text":"但是違約解約有兩種方式對方違約要解約但是該負責任的是金鼎今天如果用民眾黨提案的文字這種所謂這種非常不明不白的政治承諾的說法就逼迫變成是經濟部來主動解約這造成的後果是什麼變成民眾黨在幫金鼎的忙"},{"start":8210.758,"end":8233.655,"text":"幫金鼎卸責幫金鼎這家公司規避了他的責任所以方向不能搞錯這個案子要解約就依據合約來做違約方金鼎他應當來進行他的解約的事項而經濟部的立場就是來檢視終止契約的這個做法"},{"start":8234.435,"end":8243.827,"text":"這是循程序,這是依法制,這也是依合約但是呢,不要用這種很寒酷的政治攻擊式的提案這沒有辦法解決這個個案,只會讓它政治化了"},{"start":8249.634,"end":8253.1,"text":"所以站在彰化鄉親的角度民進黨也支持其實方向我們跟民眾黨是一樣的違約的廠商該解約就解約只是不要幫他卸責不要幫金鼎解套我相信這應當也不是民眾黨的原意啦"},{"start":8264.798,"end":8264.918,"text":"周萬蘭秘書長"},{"start":8286.875,"end":8312.794,"text":"然後呢國民黨的委員跟你講話你馬上就approach上去這不是秘書長應當有的態度秘書長是立法院的秘書長您剛剛這樣的做法就是非常清楚請不要有這樣子的秘書長的作為好不好我跟您討論的議案的內容我們都有大家都是立法委員沒有誰那麼大誰那麼小沒有因為他是國民黨"},{"start":8314.835,"end":8317.155,"text":"請莊瑞雄幹事長發言我是第一次發言我早上這樣冷眼旁觀"},{"start":8342.932,"end":8357.745,"text":"院長其實以你的高度來看這個朝野協商都希望它更有效率政黨之間各言各字也都很正常但是我也不認為說就像副根基總統所講的民進黨對於落敗沒關係"},{"start":8362.622,"end":8373.318,"text":"院長你何其聰明啊看那個眼神你就知道了要講話大聲每個人都會大聲啊我講的話超級大聲的時候你會覺得說我對你充滿了善意眼神你分辨得出來啊他都在給你下打指令勒"},{"start":8377.754,"end":8388.637,"text":"這樣比較好,你做議長,你不是副總編寫案的你像今天民眾黨這種案子,我倒這樣認為你像譬如說,在一個地方的一個重大建設裡面我們剛剛為什麼在談到說,在黨團協商裡面"},{"start":8396.884,"end":8418.223,"text":"那個其實從過去慣例來看,我們那天講的是在程序上是三藏實質上或者說牽扯到法案的時候,這個案子你就看得出來,各委員會的召委,它就有必要出席的重要性不然你知道說我們退回不夠嗎?慣例也都是如此啊,憲政都可以創造慣例的,何況是立法院過去的慣例如果是好的"},{"start":8419.909,"end":8436.058,"text":"何必別人大小聲 院長你這個案子看起來好像叫做退縮啊以民政黨這個案子我來看的話各個政黨之間我看沒有什麼不同的一個意見哪有什麼一個地方的一個重大的一個建設你違反法令然後你就說"},{"start":8438.254,"end":8465.888,"text":"馬上就是先行去做動工該召開的一個公聽會裡面什麼你刻意去排除不同意見的人這個每一個政黨都沒有辦法容忍這一些啦只是說我們立法院在做成一個決定的時候是我們不是說做一個決定然後就去害經濟部說我們做一個決議馬上就停就好像不付任何理由在講他就一定馬上就去做一個停工這也不對"},{"start":8467.728,"end":8478.866,"text":"我們做出一個決議去衍生後面的讓整個國家立法院也算是一個憲政機關都是一個國家裡面的分官設置不同的一個憲政的一個機構"},{"start":8480.307,"end":8498.152,"text":"那我們做出來的是說 喔 立法院做一個決議說經濟部立刻馬上把它終止掉 然後讓廠商跟你要求國賠這那個決議也不對 所以我倒會覺得說 大家看法都一樣的時候 這件事也可以再修正就可以嘛"},{"start":8499.482,"end":8525.984,"text":"民眾黨這個我也支持啊但問題是說我們倒不是說立即停止章兵工業區去興建不是用這樣的一個方式啊是我們是怎麼樣讓經濟部這個地方欸!不要說這個案子你做一個廣義料衍生到最後那大家會覺得說欸!立法院在幹什麼我最擔心的是到最後是讓廠商該負的責任那變成立法院做成一個決議讓他脫免了這個責任"},{"start":8528.489,"end":8533.958,"text":"這個我是覺得這個才是一個重點,這個以上第一次很誠懇的這樣的一個發言"},{"start":8540.783,"end":8564.223,"text":"現在大家已經進入到一個很重要的這個比較依法行事這個蓋不下來蓋不下來是依照企業來行事你一直沒有動工是不可抗議是規則已遂這個動作當然很清楚你像黃國昌委員每次你笑都看不到黃國昌你生意很難都把你填起來"},{"start":8565.604,"end":8581.296,"text":"這沒什麼賠當然一黨合約可以終止一黨合約法可以終止嘛這法是非常認定的你這些成績都不要那是誰起的頭回到水這兩面大家都看得出來嘛"},{"start":8582.854,"end":8598.986,"text":"你不要以為你有道德官方你的道德官方已經做出了嚴重的挑戰我們都在看實質上內容是怎麼樣一回事政府一定要議會的行為議會會來真的有問題的話行政法院還有行政法院還有仲裁的行政法院等著要做"},{"start":8599.847,"end":8617.805,"text":"政府可以說立法院叫我停,那以後政府很好搞,叫立法院幫我停什麼停什麼,這樣就結束了吧這是前面的原則嗎?這個是有法律嗎?後面的故事,把大家想像,這故事講起來可以帶很多想像空間的"},{"start":8620.976,"end":8635.973,"text":"報告各位查理協商各黨團幹部還有各行政部門的列席官員非常感謝大家一個早上跟各黨團報告第九案各黨團也沒有辦法達成共識院會處理方式就依照前兩案宣告方式處理二我們等一下就院會繼續開會處理上開議案"},{"start":8638.92,"end":8640.702,"text":"現在黨團朝野協商 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475.131,"text":"照審查會條文通過,請宣讀第14條。第15條"},{"start":2479.178,"end":2505.012,"text":"第15條依外國法律組織登記之憑證機構在安全條件相當且符合國際外國技術對接合作原則下經主管機關許可其簽發之憑證與本國憑證機構所簽發憑證具有相同之效力前項許可之申請程序、審核方式、許可條件、廢止許可之適由及其他相關事項之分法由主管機關定之"},{"start":2505.612,"end":2523.101,"text":"主管請問應公告經第一項許可持憑證機構名單。宣讀完畢。照審查會條文通過,請宣讀第四章。第四章法則宣讀完畢。照審查會章名通過,請宣讀第16條。"},{"start":2524.79,"end":2553.245,"text":"第十六條,憑證機構違反第十二條第一項前段規定,憑證實務作業基準未經主管機關許可而提供簽發憑證服務者,主管機關應令其限期改正,並得處新台幣一百萬元以上五百萬元相分還,藉其為改正者的案次處罰其情節重大者,並得庭審其一部或全部業務。宣讀完畢。照審查會條文通過,請宣讀第十七條。"},{"start":2554.11,"end":2578.611,"text":"第17條,憑證機構有下列情形之一者﹐主管機關應令其限期改正﹐並得除新台幣5萬元以上50萬元下發婚﹐藉其為改正者按次處罰﹐一,為依許可之憑證實務作業基準提供服務﹐二,違反第12條第一項後段規定﹐變更憑證實務作業基準未送許可﹐為依變更後事內容提供簽發憑證服務﹐宣讀完畢"},{"start":2581.877,"end":2585.803,"text":"照審查會條文通過請宣讀第18條"},{"start":2587.284,"end":2616.3,"text":"第18條,憑證機構有下令其行之一者﹐主管機關應令其限期改正﹐並得儲新台幣2萬元以上20萬元加分還﹐藉其為改正責案此處罰。一、違反第12條第二項規定﹐未於其機構網站公布經許可﹐或許可變更之憑證實務作業基準。二、違反第13條第一項第一款第三款或第四款規定﹐終止服務前未一線通知或未移交。"},{"start":2616.92,"end":2646.101,"text":"宣讀完畢。照審查會條文通過請宣讀第五章。第五章負責宣讀完畢。照審查會章名通過請宣讀第十九條。第十九條主管機會應定其搜集我國電子簽證之應用情形那裡國際法規與市場需求等相關調查或研究並每年公布之宣讀完畢。照審查會條文通過"},{"start":2647.217,"end":2671.454,"text":"請宣讀第二十條。第二十條。本法修正施行前,行政機關依原第四條、第三項、第六條、第三項或第九條、第二項規定公告排除適用本法者。各該公告自本法修正施行之日起算一年後停止適用。但經主管機關同意者得轉言一次,轉言期間二年為限。宣讀完畢。"},{"start":2673.379,"end":2694.55,"text":"照審查會條文通過：請宣讀第21條本法適行系則由中委員請問定之：宣讀完畢照審查會條文通過：請宣讀第22條本法自公布日施行：宣讀完畢報院會全案"},{"start":2696.57,"end":2703.158,"text":"照審查會條文通過,報告院會全案經過二讀。現有民進黨黨團提議繼續進行三讀。請問院會有無異議?沒有異議,請宣讀經過二讀之條文。"},{"start":2715.612,"end":2733.178,"text":"第一章總則第一條為推動電子簽裝之普及運用﹐確保電子簽裝之安全﹐促進數位經濟、智慧政府及數位服務之發展﹐特制定本法。司法程序不適用本法之規定者﹐由司法院或法務部公告之。"},{"start":2735.049,"end":2752.904,"text":"第二條本法用詞定義如下﹐依電子文件﹐指文字、聲音、圖片、影像﹐符號或其他資料﹐以電子或其他以人知知覺﹐無法直接認識之方式﹐所製成足以表示其用意之記錄﹐而供電子處理之用者。"},{"start":2753.504,"end":2773.589,"text":"二、電子簽章：指依附於電子文件並與其相關聯：用以辨識及確認電子文件簽署人身份：資格及電子文件證位者。三、數位簽章：屬於電子簽章這一種：只將電子文件以數學遠算法或其他方式運算為一定程度之數位資料："},{"start":2774.469,"end":2792.153,"text":"以簽署人之私密經要對其加密．形成電子簽證．得以公開經要加以驗證．並據憑證機構簽發之憑證者．此加密．只利用數學演算法或其他方法．將電子文件以亂碼方式處理．五、憑證機構．只簽發憑證之機關法人．"},{"start":2795.914,"end":2823.447,"text":"六、憑證：指在有簽章驗證資料：用以確認簽署人身份資格之電子形式證明。七、憑證實務作業基準：指由憑證機構對外公告：用以陳述憑證機構具以簽發憑證及處理其他認證業務之作業準則。八、資訊系統：指產生、送出、收受、儲存或其他處理電子形式訊息資料之系統："},{"start":2824.267,"end":2852.157,"text":"主管機關的公告具電子簽章效力之電子簽章技術並事實檢討。第三條本法主管機關為數位發展部第二章電子文件及電子簽章第四條電子文件及電子簽章符合本法規定者在功能上等同於實體文件及簽章不得僅因其電子形式而否認其法律效力。"},{"start":2854.059,"end":2877.063,"text":"第五條,文件及簽章之使用﹐得以電子文件及電子簽章為之﹐依法令規定因引書面為之者﹐其內容可完整呈現﹐並可於日後取出公查驗者﹐得以電子文件為之﹐依法令規定因簽名或蓋章者﹐得以電子簽章為之﹐前三項文件或簽章之使用﹐有相對忍者﹐"},{"start":2877.603,"end":2902.219,"text":"除相對人已同意採用電子形式外﹐應於採用電子形式之前﹐以合理期限及方式給予相對人反對之機會﹐並告知相對人為反對者推定同意採用電子形式﹐其向之相對人得隨時表示停止採用電子形式﹐但其表示停止前﹐以依電子形式所為之法律行為﹐其效力不受影響。"},{"start":2904.844,"end":2922.538,"text":"第六條,以數位簽章簽署電子文件符合下列各款規定者推定為本人親自簽名或蓋章。一、使用經主管機關一第十二條或第十五條許可之憑證機構揭發之憑證。二、憑證位於有效期間及其使用範圍。"},{"start":2925.936,"end":2953.527,"text":"第7條依法令規定應提出文書原本的或正版者﹐其內容可完全呈現﹐並敢於之後取出供查驗者﹐能以電子文件為之﹐但應何對筆記印記或其他未便是文書證位之必要﹐或法令另有規定者不在此限。前項所稱內容可完全呈現﹐不含以電子方式﹐發送、收受、儲存及顯示作業附加之資料訊息。"},{"start":2955.578,"end":2978.879,"text":"第8條,文書依法令規定應以書面保存者﹐如其內容可完整呈現﹐並可於日後取出公查驗者﹐得以電子文件為之。前項電子文件﹐得並同保存其方文地﹐修文地﹐網路協定位置﹐簽署歷程﹐日期﹐時間及其他足以驗證﹐鑑別電子文件內容徵位之資料訊息。"},{"start":2982.973,"end":3002.693,"text":"第9條電子文件以其進入發文者無法控制資訊系統之時間為發文時間,但當事人另有約定或行政機關另有公告者,從其約定或公告。電子文件以下列時間為其收文時間,但當事人另有約定或行政機關另有公告者,從其約定或公告。"},{"start":3003.314,"end":3021.588,"text":"一、如收文者已指定收受電子文件之資訊系統者﹐以電子文件進入該資訊系統之時間為收文時間﹐電子文件如送至非收文者指定之資訊系統者﹐以收文者取出電子文件之時間為收文時間。"},{"start":3023.049,"end":3045.56,"text":"二、收文者為指定收受電子文件之資訊系統者﹐以電子文件進入收文者資訊系統之時間為收文時間。第10條﹐電子文件以發文者執行業務之地為發文地﹐收文者執行業務之地為收文地﹐但當事人利用約定或行政機關利用公告者﹐從其約定或公告。"},{"start":3046.64,"end":3071.361,"text":"發文者或收文者有二個以上執行業務之地,一域主要交易或通信行為最密切相關之業務地為發文地或收文地,主要交易或通信行為不明者以執行業務之主要地為發文地或收文地。發文者或收文者未有執行業務地者以其住所為發文地或收文地。"},{"start":3073.755,"end":3092.228,"text":"第11條、第5條、第1項之第3項及第8條、第1項規定得依法律排除其適用。請證機關得出第5條與第8條之應用技術及程序定為公告,其公告應公平合理,並不得為無正當理由之差別待遇。"},{"start":3095.851,"end":3113.875,"text":"第三章數位簽章憑證機構之管理第十二條憑證機構應檢據憑證實務作業基準﹐在名憑證機構經營或提供認證服務之相關作業程序﹐送經主管機關許可後﹐使得提供簽發憑證服務﹐其憑證實務作業基準變更時一同。憑證機構應將其經許可之憑證實務作業基準﹐"},{"start":3121.576,"end":3132.69,"text":"公布在其機構之網站供公眾查詢,其憑證實務作業基準便跟誰異同。主管機關應公告憑證實務作業基準經許可之憑證機構名單與其憑證實務作業基準本次及許可文號,"},{"start":3139.077,"end":3166.468,"text":"第一項憑證實務作業基準應在明下列事項：其各款具體內容由主管機關公告之：一、足以影響憑證機構所簽發憑證之可靠性或其業務執行之重要資訊：二、憑證機構進行廢止憑證之事由：三、驗證憑證內容相關資料之留存：四、保護當事人個人資料之方法及程序：五、其他重要事項"},{"start":3168.871,"end":3195.43,"text":"第13條,憑證機構於終止服務前應完全下列措施。一、於終止服務之日30日前通報主管機關。二、對終止當時人具下列之憑證安排其他憑證機構承接其業務。三、於終止服務之日30日前將終止服務及由其他憑證機構承接其業務之事時通知當事人。"},{"start":3196.15,"end":3222.502,"text":"此將檔案記錄以交承接其業務之憑證機構﹐任務憑證機構依第一項第二款規定﹐承接該憑證機構之業務﹐主管機關等安排其他憑證機構承接﹐主管機關與必要時﹐得公告廢止當時人具效率之憑證﹐前項規定與憑證機構依本法或其他法律﹐受落令停業處分者亦是永之。"},{"start":3223.823,"end":3245.238,"text":"第14條,憑證機構對應其經營或提供認證服務﹚至相關作業程序﹚至當事人受有損害﹚或至善意第三人應信賴該憑證﹚而受有損害者應負賠償責任﹚但能證明其行為無故使者不在此限﹚憑證機構就憑證之使用範圍﹚順有明確限制時﹚對逾約該使用範圍所生之損害﹚不負賠償責任。"},{"start":3252.743,"end":3279.17,"text":"第15條依外國法律組織單期制憑證機構在安全條件相當﹐且符合國際戶外或技術對接合作原則下﹐經主管機關許可﹐其簽發制憑證與本國憑證機構所簽發憑證具有相同之效力﹐傾向許可之申請程序審核方式﹐許可條件廢止許可之適由﹐及其他相關事成之辦法由主管機關定之﹐"},{"start":3279.83,"end":3282.757,"text":"主管機關應公告經第一項許可知憑證機構名單"},{"start":3286.448,"end":3310.655,"text":"第四章 法則 第十六條 憑證機構違反第十二條第一項前段規定﹐憑證實務作業精準﹐為經主管機關許可﹐而提供簽發憑證服務者﹐主管機關應令其限期改正﹐並得處心台幣一百萬元以上五百萬元相反還﹐藉其為改正準案次處罰﹐其請結註納者﹐並得停止其一幕或全部業務。"},{"start":3312.515,"end":3337.197,"text":"第17條,憑證機構有下令執行之一者﹐主管機關應領其限期改正﹐並得處新台幣5萬元以上50萬元相反還﹐藉其為改正者按次處罰﹐一、為依許可知憑證實務作業基準提供服務﹐二、為本第12條第一項後段規定﹐變更憑證實務作業基準未送許可﹐而依變更後制內容提供簽發憑證服務﹐"},{"start":3340.512,"end":3358.338,"text":"第18條 評審機構有項鍊其嫌之一者﹐主管機關應令其限期改正﹐並得處新台幣2萬元以上20萬元相反還﹐藉其為改正者按次處罰﹐以違反第12條第二項規定﹐未於其機構網站公布經時刻﹐"},{"start":3359.338,"end":3387.434,"text":"或許可變更之評證實務作業基準．二、違反第13條第一項第一管第三委或第四管規定．終止服務前為一線通報．為一線通知或問營銷。第五章 負責．第19條主管機關應定其搜集我國電子簽證之應用情形．分離國際返回與市場需求等相關調查或研究．並每年公佈之。"},{"start":3388.634,"end":3410.983,"text":"第20條,本法修正施行前,行政機關依原第4條、第3項、第6條、第3項或第9條、第2項規定公告排除生用本法者﹐該公告自本法修正施行之日起算一年或停止生用﹐但經主管機關同意者得轉延一次﹐轉延期間二年為限。"},{"start":3413.649,"end":3437.88,"text":"第21條本法設計系則由主管機關定制。第22條本法自公佈日施行。宣讀完畢。報告院會。三讀條文已宣讀完畢。請問院會有無文字修正。沒有文字修正。決議。電子簽章法。修正通過。"},{"start":3443.482,"end":3463.608,"text":"現在我們處理附帶決議。請議事人員宣讀附帶決議之內容。通過附帶決議三項。一、司法院及法務部於電子簽章法三讀通過後兩個月內提出司法程序適用電子簽章之可行性評估報告並請數位發展部協助。"},{"start":3466.693,"end":3493.686,"text":"數位發展部應積極協助與輔導各機關應應應電子簽章法修正之數位相關資源以利電子化政府之實現。三、針對偏鄉政府機關數位資源經費能力或條件不足請數位發展部予以協助。宣讀完畢請問議員會有無異議無異議我們決定照案通過請"},{"start":3496.598,"end":3500.791,"text":"登記的立法委員一號葛如軍委員發言時間兩分鐘。"},{"start":3534.427,"end":3548.773,"text":"還記得Nokia 3310嗎?那是台灣領先世界推出電子簽章法的年代。22年過去了,我們竟然成為世界上最後一個珍愛實體印章、重視實體簽名的地方。"},{"start":3549.933,"end":3578.287,"text":"這一次電子簽章法能夠順利的在時隔22年以後第一次大幅的修正最後三讀通過非常感謝跨部會跨黨派的合作。2023年的12月當時我邀請我的好朋友鄉上農先生來錄製podcast他提到在臺灣要開公司必須要闖好多的關卡而且一定要本人實體闖關像玩大地遊戲一樣"},{"start":3579.528,"end":3597.436,"text":"我們當時就有一個浪漫的想像阿宅能不能在國會裡頭稍微的改變現況能不能推動電子簽章盡快修法讓各部會一體適用改變政府繁瑣的行政流程也減輕公務人員的負擔"},{"start":3598.456,"end":3627.676,"text":"我特別感動的是在法案審查的過程當中不只國民黨交通委員會的全體委員甚至包含了民進黨、民眾黨的委員也都列席發言大家不分藍綠白的共同合作通過我的修正動議本法修正後的緩沖期以一年為原則必要時經主管機關同意得展延兩年更加速扶國立民政策的推展"},{"start":3628.656,"end":3651.375,"text":"接下來民眾一定就可以享受到智慧化政府導入電子簽章以後的便利,也期待藉由資通安全的提升能夠大幅的減少詐騙訊息的廣告以及他們帶來的危害,跨部會共同打詐防詐。回想4個月前這件事情是不可能的,"},{"start":3652.236,"end":3658.438,"text":"四個月後我們達成了期待未來共同努力推動更多扶國立民的法案。"},{"start":3668.342,"end":3694.075,"text":"報告委員會,現在我們繼續進行討論事項第六案。本院台灣民眾黨黨團建請越會決議,邀請行政院院長就如何改善食品雲系統以及有效解決系統性食安問題等相關事宜進行專案報告並備詢議案。本案經第一會期第十次會議決議,"},{"start":3695.68,"end":3711.67,"text":"本案及修正動議並同交付黨團協商,並由臺灣民眾黨黨團負責召集協商,因上代協商作以下決議,協商後再行處理。"},{"start":3712.976,"end":3723.65,"text":"報言會：現在討論事項第7案：到第9案：由黨團提出：請本席召集協商：現在請各黨團幹部：至議場3樓進行協商：現在休息。"},{"start":13617.646,"end":13635.671,"text":"報告委員會現在繼續開會。本日程旭委員會召集委員吳委員忠憲表示今日程旭委員會開會時間延後至中午院會休息10分鐘後。"},{"start":13637.257,"end":13647.113,"text":"於紅樓2014會議室召開。特此告知委員會。現在我們先處理朝野黨團協商結論。請議事人員宣讀。"},{"start":13652.151,"end":13659.054,"text":"議法院黨團協商結論協商主題第11次院會討論事項第7案至第9案時間113年4月30日星期二上午9時30分地點一場三樓會議室協商結論一討論事項第7案至第9案院會進行處理時"},{"start":13673.598,"end":13687.944,"text":"各案廣泛討論時由臺灣民眾黨黨團推派一人,民進黨黨團推派二人,國民黨黨團推派二人,輪流交叉發言,順序授權議事處處理,每人發言時間為三分鐘,"},{"start":13690.005,"end":13715.502,"text":"發言後依黨團所送修正動議版本先後順序進行各黨團版本之處理。僅處理修正動議並不處理再修正動議。主持人韓國瑜、江啟臣、協商代表、柯建銘、吳思堯、林思銘、吳春城、莊瑞雄、黃國昌、傅坤祺、侯孟凱、黃珊珊。宣讀完畢。報告院會,現在進行討論事項第七案。"},{"start":13716.601,"end":13735.832,"text":"本院國民黨黨團建請院會決議立即停止調漲電價,並要求行政院責成相關部會即刻檢討現行能源政策,並提出因應對策與配套措施議案。本案"},{"start":13736.873,"end":13754.428,"text":"經第一會期第十次會議決議、協商後再行處理,現在進行廣泛討論。由各黨團、各推派代表發言。每位委員發言時間3分鐘。第一位,我們請臺灣民眾黨黨團張委員齊凱發言。"},{"start":13785.021,"end":13787.102,"text":"謝謝議長﹚各位日本人的同仁"},{"start":13802.008,"end":13826.796,"text":"當天的拜五晚．台南的地檢署起訴立陽光電案．起訴15個人．包括．台南經發局的局長．就前置鬧得沸沸揚揚．接受性招待．喝花酒的陳凱玲．等15個人．更驚人的．起訴書高達600頁．"},{"start":13831.377,"end":13859.817,"text":"不法的利益不法的這個所得臺南地檢署出估超過91億2600萬涉案的人員從行政院的顧問一直到經濟部能源署的模範公務員一直到臺南的經發局的局長一條邊今天本席要請大家特別重視這個弊案的嚴重性"},{"start":13861.257,"end":13880.785,"text":"以一個個案不法利益高達91億2600萬是檢察官估算的。更嚴重的光電案被起訴的案子已經超過60案。大家手上有電子計算機嗎?一個案子91億你超過60個案子乘下來5460億"},{"start":13888.834,"end":13916.153,"text":"大家沒有聽錯不法所得如果是超過60個案子五千四百六十億好有些案子比較少稍微降一下不法所得至少超過一千億大家記得嗎這邊為什麼要漲電價經濟部跟行政要怎麼說漲完大家的電價物價跟著漲人民痛苦他說要補多少的電價六百億"},{"start":13919.861,"end":13943.687,"text":"所以政府是買了太貴的光電買出一堆的弊案導致臺電的虧損還要占人民的價格所以從這個個案我們要好好的檢討好好的檢討為什麼政府去買了這麼多太貴而且是弊案的光電所以今天民眾黨團特別提案我們現在要求前面緩帳"},{"start":13945.612,"end":13972.429,"text":"要求政府救整個能源的結構要求電價這個費率更重要的臺電到底買了多少電他的理由是什麼有沒有適度的節流為什麼買這麼多有弊案的光電把這些錢省下來人民根本不需要受到漲電之苦產業也不需要受到衝擊所以請各位委員能夠支持把"},{"start":13973.61,"end":13994.228,"text":"台電漲價這個案子暫時返帳,送到經濟委員會,由經濟委員會前面來審查。審查通過...謝謝張祺凱委員的發言。接下來,請登記第二號,邱委員議員發言。"},{"start":14011.24,"end":14032.066,"text":"主席、各位立法院的同仁我們今天要來討論國民黨團跟民眾黨團分別起案的動漲電價的案子那我在這裡要提醒大家在野黨反對電價調漲在法律上是站不住腳的因為經濟部電價調整的程序"},{"start":14032.706,"end":14044.272,"text":"完全是依循立法院之前的決議跟修訂的法律來制定。2015年1月20日立法院決議由電價倍率審議會來決定電價的調漲。兩年後電業法修訂的第49條明定電價調定的程序電價審議會於電價審議時必須評估多重的因素"},{"start":14058.94,"end":14077.411,"text":"除了考量電價的成本以外﹚也要考量社會經濟狀況﹚物價穩定的情形﹚民生產業承受的程度﹚以及臺電虧損狀況等因素﹚省慎評估電價調整事宜。由於臺電在今年4月1號起實施電價調漲﹚也是依法來由電費審議會來決定經濟部的核定﹚"},{"start":14085.396,"end":14101.372,"text":"如果臺電不遵照這樣的一個決議的內容進行,請問我們是不是反而會讓臺電造成違法?大家都知道這幾年來因為受到俄烏戰爭、國際燃料價格暴漲的影響,"},{"start":14103.014,"end":14119.124,"text":"發購電燃料成本大幅提高臺電雖然是國營事業藉由吸收燃料成本飆漲的這個費用來減緩民間通膨的壓力臺電連續兩年燃料成本高達6000億以上累計虧損已經增加到3826億元財務狀況已經日益嚴峻所以合理的電價調整"},{"start":14128.071,"end":14137.888,"text":"只是反映成本。剛剛民眾黨的委員在臺上說臺電到底買了多少電?花了多少錢來買電?"},{"start":14140.1,"end":14144.322,"text":"而且臺電的綠電政策是錯誤的我必須在這裡告訴大家2023年臺電在綠電的支出上是905億元僅佔他的總支出不到10%這些東西都在經濟委員會裡頭經過完整的報告以及完整的討論"},{"start":14161.428,"end":14181.07,"text":"所以我不曉得民眾黨的委員還要經濟部來說明什麼如果您現在還不清楚表示你在經濟委員會裡頭你根本沒有在開會如果你不了解臺電嚴重的虧損是因為燃料成本的上漲很顯然你對於整個臺灣的運作完全的不清楚"},{"start":14181.65,"end":14210.748,"text":"我懇請大院支持讓臺電適時的調漲電價﹖穩定民生的物資﹖甚至民進黨也照顧民生﹖我們對於農漁學校攝補團體的電價﹖我們是緩漲的﹖也請大家支持民進黨的提案。謝謝。謝謝邱毅英委員的發言。接下來我們請登記第三號副委員昆齊發言。"},{"start":14236.264,"end":14243.353,"text":"團結國民黨不要在這裡見風插針"},{"start":14247.301,"end":14272.455,"text":"院長、各位同仁、全國的各位鄉親我們今天站在這裡就是要為全民來把關一個貪污腐敗的政府在台南開了88槍接著再開10槍接著在當街槍殺所有不法的原因就是因為官商勾結的綠電在昨天正式來起訴"},{"start":14274.728,"end":14295.444,"text":"臺南市政府不法圖利廠商近百億光一個政府而且是民進黨賴清德的故鄉圖利了將近百億給廠商這就是為什麼短短兩年期間各位全國的鄉親行政院從大家的口袋裡面拿了4500億"},{"start":14298.129,"end":14300.312,"text":"﹚三、4月30日下午5時至6時至6時至6時。﹚"},{"start":14314.571,"end":14332.009,"text":"民進黨所提出的全面漲價案．電價漲．電價漲．所有的物價跟著漲．人民要怎麼過生活．多少人在生活線以下．但是呢．民進黨天天大魚大肉．官商勾結．動輒圖利百億．何謂綠電．綠電就是"},{"start":14337.274,"end":14349.709,"text":"幫財團打開跟全民偷錢的荷包我們再一次的表達連330度電以下的最基本的民生用電現在都要全面的漲價未來物價大漲"},{"start":14352.432,"end":14377.665,"text":"要如何讓基層的百姓來生活民進黨不斷說因為二五戰爭全世界物價大漲各位看一下這一張現在大家看到全世界國際的天然氣早就回到2021年的價格國際的再看到我們下面一張煤的價格也通通回到了2021年"},{"start":14379.52,"end":14406.571,"text":"大漲之前你說因為這兩年惡霧戰爭臺電累歸3800億現在由人民的錢百姓的錢添補了4500億接下來你漲價的理由是什麼漲價理由就是為了準備未來關掉核電再跟全民基層的小小百姓來拿來圖利重大的財團來圖利民進黨這不法的政府"},{"start":14407.151,"end":14432.402,"text":"所以我們再一次表達第三章現在到底從人民的荷包裡面偷走了多少錢第三章到現在為止已經向全國國人偷走了4500億就是為了民進黨的貪污我們再一次表達我們完全反對這個錯誤的政策危害全民電價不能漲就是不能漲"},{"start":14439.875,"end":14448.723,"text":"謝謝傅坤祺委員的發言。接下來,我們請登記第4號,紅委員申翰發言。"},{"start":14470.819,"end":14474.414,"text":"好,那個戈壢白人同仁吼"},{"start":14475.983,"end":14500.852,"text":"在這一個月的期間其實有超過30個環境的專業的NGO包括能源相關的團體還有超過50位以上專業的專家學者提出了連署這連署的內容是希望立法院可以要用公正跟專業的態度來處理電價的問題希望避免政治上面的操作所以"},{"start":14502.314,"end":14526.055,"text":"這些來自民間來自學界的聲音是支持現在經濟部跟台電依法很重要我們是依法來調整來調漲電價我想大家都知道在無二戰爭之後其實全世界的能源價格燃料價格都在大漲這不是只是台灣面對的問題這是全世界都面對的問題"},{"start":14528.254,"end":14551.85,"text":"很多大幅使用核電的國家﹖他的帳幅不好意思還是比臺灣來得高得多得多所以如果調整能源價格﹖如果調漲電價就代表能源政策錯誤的話那我要說那代表全世界的能源政策都錯了每一個國家的能源政策都錯了是這樣嗎?"},{"start":14553.431,"end":14579.949,"text":"當然不是那現在在野黨不斷開口閉口錯誤的能源政策我要跟大家說其實經過試算就算我們用2015馬政府那時候的能源配比來套上現在的燃料價格一樣發電成本是大幅的高於現在售價的定價的也就是一樣在2015年的時候即便核電的用"},{"start":14580.629,"end":14583.15,"text":"我還要跟大家說按照現在如果按照在黨的提案"},{"start":14604.42,"end":14628.28,"text":"不可以漲電價的話,誰最得利?對不起,用電大戶最得利。我們是用全民的台電的資產來補貼用電大戶。這根本就是劫貧濟富。難道這是在一檔希望的嗎?所以今天立法院我們在這個地方表決這案,我還是要強調,我們應該移持著公正跟專業的態度。如果"},{"start":14629.701,"end":14649.948,"text":"該調整就調整但重點是我們依法調整但我們當然要照顧弱勢所以包括這些濃郁弱勢包括需要特別照顧的人我們可以朝野一起來要求台電要求經濟部要求相關的部會來給予協助這件事情我們朝野可以一起做但不要在店家議題上再做政治操作了謝謝"},{"start":14657.59,"end":14664.176,"text":"謝謝洪森翰委員的發言。接下來,我們請登記第5號,洪委員孟凱發言。"},{"start":14677.723,"end":14702.463,"text":"錯誤的能源政策難道不應該有人負責嗎?民進黨代表剛剛口口聲聲講說要用專業專業專業我們就是要專業就是要好好的請現在執政的民進黨政府檢討一下過去錯誤的能源政策調整錯誤的能源政策把過去你們口口聲聲所講台電的長電給找出來十年了"},{"start":14703.223,"end":14720.38,"text":"我們要問一下從2013年民進黨在野時候就宣稱臺電有長電到現在找到了沒有為什麼每一次在電價調漲的時候都故意的把這樣相關的成本給轉嫁全國民眾"},{"start":14721.241,"end":14736.11,"text":"再者今天民進黨提出了再修正動議就是這個再修正動議恰恰說明了過去沒有秉持專業沒有尊重電價審議委員會是誰就是政治力介入的民進黨政府"},{"start":14737.148,"end":14748.393,"text":"你們的說明就寫得很清楚在11年跟12年臺電平穩物價而吸收燃料價格趨漲承受巨額虧損所以過去為什麼在選舉時間選舉前就可以不漲電價"},{"start":14753.855,"end":14778.295,"text":"選完了不用再選票了就馬上要轉嫁電價尤其在現在這個時候剛好又是物價全面要上漲的時候現在再把電價加上去不就是讓全國人民受苦受害受累受傷嗎所以我們要問到底誰不尊重專業就是過去執政8年的民進黨政府再者"},{"start":14779.116,"end":14804.355,"text":"如果說今天這個議案那麼重要的話我們在4月24號上個禮拜三4月26號上個禮拜五都有黨團召開的草野協商憑什麼國民黨團派代表出席民眾黨團派代表出席就只有你民進黨團沒有任何人出席這不是傲慢什麼才是傲慢這不是不關心人民什麼才是不關心人民所以"},{"start":14805.055,"end":14815.097,"text":"今天我們很務實的提出來就是要求現在執政的民進黨政府面對你們錯誤的能源政策好好的向國人說明清楚"},{"start":14816.206,"end":14839.214,"text":"二零二一年是國際油價最高的時候二零二二年是國際天然氣價格最高的時候現在二零二四年趨勢已經趨緩趨勢已經下降拿明朝的劍來找清朝的官拿以前的上漲價格在講說現在要調漲電價根本就是本末倒置邏輯不同所以我們更要說"},{"start":14840.923,"end":14858.314,"text":"現在要說節能減碳但是民進黨的策略就是火力全開八成的發電都是火力發電這不是開倒車什麼是還是開倒車呼籲等一下表決的時候請全國人看清楚誰不支持動長誰就是全民的公敵謝謝"},{"start":14866.847,"end":14877.847,"text":"謝謝洪孟楷委員的發言。報告院會現在依朝野協商結論進行處理。請議事人員宣讀各黨團版本。"},{"start":14879.912,"end":14891.578,"text":"民進黨黨團修正動議．本月民進黨黨團針對本次會議討論事項第7案．擬具修正動議如下．建請院會作成決議．電價調整系依電業法鎖定．由電價費率審議會決議予以調整．並決議動長濃於學校及社福團體電價．"},{"start":14900.522,"end":14928.33,"text":"行政院應責全相關部會﹐滾動檢討現行能源政策﹐並提出因應對策與配套措施﹐以兼顧人民生計﹐維持供電穩定﹐及臺電公司之正常營運。國民黨黨團提案本院國民黨黨團為避免物價因電價調整﹐民生痛苦指數飆升﹐因此反對臺電公司調整電價﹐建請院會作成決議﹐立即停止調整電價﹐"},{"start":14929.89,"end":14950.394,"text":"並要求行政院責全相關部會即可檢討現行能源政策並提出因應對策與配套措施以兼顧人民生計維持供電穩定及臺電公司之正常營運是否有當進行公決。宣讀完畢報告委員會現在按鈴7分鐘並分發表決卡請議事人員分發表決卡現在開始按鈴"},{"start":15388.462,"end":15409.241,"text":"報告委員會本案表決順序為一、民進黨黨團修正動議。二、國民黨黨團提案。依序進行表決後,如果其中有任何一案通過,即不再進行處理其他案。"},{"start":15410.638,"end":15417.947,"text":"現在表決民進黨黨團修正動議現有民進黨黨團要求記名表決記名表決時間一分鐘現在開始"},{"start":15436.032,"end":15463.852,"text":"五、六、七、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、八、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、"},{"start":15479.64,"end":15485.382,"text":"韓國瑜主席"},{"start":15500.11,"end":15503.914,"text":"民進黨黨團表決結果出席108人、贊成50人、反對58人、贊成者少數。民進黨黨團修正動議不通過。"},{"start":15521.324,"end":15528.486,"text":"報告委員會現有民進黨黨團提議重複表決現在進行重複表決時間一分鐘現在開始"},{"start":15561.616,"end":15576.288,"text":"三、4月30日下午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。）請審議案等9時至10時為國是論壇時間。）請審議案等9時至10時為國是論壇時間。"},{"start":15608.273,"end":15617.435,"text":"報告委員會現在宣布重複表決投票結果出席108人贊成50人反對58人贊成者少數民進黨黨團修正動議案不通過"},{"start":15629.093,"end":15641.696,"text":"報告院會現在進行國民黨黨團提案現有民進黨黨團要求記名表決記名表決時間一分鐘現在開始"},{"start":15662.381,"end":15668.029,"text":"響鐘"},{"start":15699.112,"end":15714.037,"text":"五零零零零零零零零零零零零零零零"},{"start":15717.93,"end":15742.815,"text":"報告院會現在出席人數109位贊成59位反對50位報告院會贊成者多數報告院會現由民進黨黨團提議要求重複表決現在進行重複表決時間一分鐘現在開始"},{"start":15761.552,"end":15781.081,"text":"五、六、七、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、八、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、"},{"start":15794.292,"end":15820.896,"text":"國會議員會"},{"start":15821.497,"end":15848.866,"text":"現在宣布重複表決結果出席109人贊成59人反對50人贊成者多數本案照案通過做如下決議立即停止條帳電價並要求行政院責成相關部會"},{"start":15850.225,"end":15877.31,"text":"即刻檢討現行能源政策．並提出因應對策與配套措施．以兼顧人民生計．維持供電穩定．及臺電公司之正常營運。報告院會現在討論事項第八案"},{"start":15878.43,"end":15889.448,"text":"本院台灣民眾黨黨團建請院會決議,要求經濟部針對台灣整體能源政策,"},{"start":15892.83,"end":15911.369,"text":"電價匯率調整結構及臺電相關各項支出及尊潔措施．向本院經濟委員會提出全面檢討報告以案．本案經第一會期第10次會議決議協商後再行處理．"},{"start":15923.278,"end":15948.31,"text":"現在進行廣泛討論由各黨團推派代表發言每位委員發言時間3分鐘首先請張委員齊凱發言請各位委員就位維持議場次序謝謝請張委員齊凱發言"},{"start":15963.192,"end":15991.158,"text":"主席各位同仁因為我們剛好漂亮的經濟委員會的召委沒有苦民所苦沒有感受到4月1號電價上漲以後帶動的物價上漲帶來的問題還有衝擊到我們的產業我們要問人民的苦民進黨立委沒有感受到嗎所以本席第二次上臺發言"},{"start":15993.322,"end":16018.83,"text":"台灣民眾黨不是反對綠電民眾黨反對的是買的太貴還買出一堆弊案的綠電一個台南八十八槍的利養案不法所得不利所得超過九十一億我們要問民進黨的立法委員民進黨的立法委員你們沒有想要知道真相嗎"},{"start":16020.39,"end":16042.747,"text":"你們沒有想要把這個不利守得、不好守得把它降低,讓台電不要賠錢,讓人民不要漲電價嗎?民進黨的同仁們,你們有感受到人民的痛苦,產業受到衝擊,你們真的不想知道立洋案的真相嗎?不想把錢省下來,讓台電不要虧損,不要漲人民的電價嗎?"},{"start":16045.197,"end":16072.865,"text":"現在人民從剩下的、從脫口是什麼?四月一號漲完電價以後到處停電、跳電光是4月16日開始的6天桃園市有10個地區跳電跟停電戶數超過3萬戶大家想過他們生活上帶來的不便嗎?臺北市、東區、南港停電、跳電"},{"start":16074.542,"end":16093.413,"text":"新版的本局跳電停電,連台南因為松鼠,不曉得第二號還是第三號,會跳電停電。被你佔的電價,你的韌性電網到哪裡去了?不應該在經濟委員會報告嗎?所以民眾黨,苦民所苦。"},{"start":16095.046,"end":16122.837,"text":"明確的提案,要求經濟部到經濟委員會來,針對立洋案還有所有的弊案,包括臺電為什麼虧損累累,進行一個經濟模,每年都可以交給國庫,一百億、兩百億,為什麼現在漲電價的同時讓人民虧損這麼多,連弊案都不查清楚呢?剛剛我們美麗的召集委員,經濟委員召集委員,"},{"start":16125.199,"end":16147.282,"text":"說民眾黨不知道真相我們現在要問的是民進黨的立法委員知道立行案的真相了嗎知道了60個光電案起訴以後真相你們不想知道嗎不想把錢省下來嗎所以我們明確的要求請經濟部到經濟委員會來做報告沒有把真相"},{"start":16164.63,"end":16170.36,"text":"謝謝張祺凱委員的發言。接下來我們請登記第二號賴委員瑞龍發言。"},{"start":16179.542,"end":16199.275,"text":"謝謝主席、各位委員。我想自2019年新冠肺炎爆發以來,那全球的經濟都經歷了一波波的衝擊。包括疫情後所產生的生產跟獲益的壓力,包括二屋戰爭導致的全球的糧食跟能源的價格飆漲,還有以壓衝突跟進一步的推升了整個全球能源供應。"},{"start":16202.237,"end":16223.189,"text":"台灣在這樣的狀況下其實表現還是非常的亮麗不僅頂住了主要國家所面臨的通膨上的問題同時間經濟還逆勢成長四年來台灣的經濟成長率居亞洲四小龍之首同時間有亮麗的成績當世界各國電力都調漲都在面對到國際能源價格上漲的問題的同時"},{"start":16224.07,"end":16239.394,"text":"⋯⋯"},{"start":16239.494,"end":16253.401,"text":"短短的兩三年來的這樣累積的巨額虧損也導致了臺電重大的一個危機啦齁臺電的虧損就是國家的虧損就是人民的虧損齁所以我想負責任的國會負責任的政府一定要來面對這個問題來解決這個問題"},{"start":16255.402,"end":16271.557,"text":"台電有1500萬戶,其中700萬戶是用電的大戶,占了全部電力的三分之一。那如果按照現行的電價調整方案的話,耗電的產業的大戶能夠負擔的更多,他們也有能力負擔的比較多。所以我們認為應該支持這些專業的方案,來讓台電讓國家永續發展。"},{"start":16276.661,"end":16282.946,"text":"那相對的在民生用電我們只微微的調漲了908萬戶占68%條幅3%這也是希望能夠維繫住排電的營運下能夠減低對民生的衝擊對物價的波動那我們還是要強調"},{"start":16293.214,"end":16307.048,"text":"政府全力的來顧弱勢顧公益顧農民顧漁民所以我們的弱勢的不調漲我們的農漁業的也不調漲我們的學校的也不調漲就是希望秉持的照顧弱勢的這樣原則"},{"start":16308.61,"end":16325.905,"text":"那過去以來電力調不調漲常常形成政治的問題所以我們在了104年也通過希望專業考量減少政治干預104年通過電價調漲機制在106年也入法這就希望朝野各政黨不要為了電力調不調電價而為了這邊政治紛擾"},{"start":16329.508,"end":16329.928,"text":"謝謝各位,拜託各位。"},{"start":16360.445,"end":16385.137,"text":"謝謝賴瑞隆委員的發言接下來我們請登記第三號林委員私名發言主席各位委員我想今天在這邊真的要鄭重的呼籲民進黨政府"},{"start":16387.547,"end":16388.809,"text":"電價上漲萬物齊漲,動漲電價苦民所苦。"},{"start":16392.816,"end":16419.841,"text":"我想蔡政府執政8年以來．電價的漲幅比例高達35%．事實上電價漲幅最高的政府．諷刺的是在2016年．當時還是總統候選人的蔡英文．強調民進黨的電價策略．是以基本的度數不漲價為原則．就算要調整電價．也會考慮物價和一般人的負擔能力．"},{"start":16420.481,"end":16434.714,"text":"尤其對我們民生用電的小戶絕對沒有調漲的計畫。現在看起來蔡政府完全是私信於民毫無誠信的欺騙我們臺灣人民。"},{"start":16436.512,"end":16458.458,"text":"經濟部的電價審議委員會決議4月起調漲我們的平均電價條幅大約11%．而我們國民黨在4月2日立即在程序委員會提出要動漲電價．並要求行政院檢討現行的能源政策．並提出配套的措施。"},{"start":16459.485,"end":16478.668,"text":"但是我們看到民進黨的委員竟然全體一致的反對。連將此案列入院會討論都反對。再也說一套執政做一套。民服其實的就是執政就換了腦袋。"},{"start":16480.413,"end":16505.178,"text":"蔡政府固守非核家園的省主牌卻提不出良好的能源政策,錯誤的能源政策造成牌店的虧損連連。人民以及我們產業界人心惶惶,這種情況到底何時能夠結束?民進黨政府何時能夠讓人民以及我們的企業界安心的用電?"},{"start":16506.482,"end":16530.961,"text":"我想剛剛民進黨表示說他們會對於弱勢的這個用電戶會動漲但是我們要告訴民進黨政府的是電價上漲會導致萬物起漲不是說你動漲弱勢戶就不會造成我們整個臺灣人民生活痛苦指數的增加"},{"start":16531.721,"end":16554.275,"text":"我講我們央行的升息房貸增加,餐飲業的小吃店的成本增加,甚至油價也蠢蠢欲動。而我們國內產業界包含即將宣布兩座先進封裝廠落腳在嘉義科學園區的台積電,以及相關的科技產業都已經提早開始部署相關的"},{"start":16554.935,"end":16556.435,"text":"謝謝林思明委員的發言接下來我們請登記第5號第4號蔡委員議員發言"},{"start":16597.793,"end":16613.598,"text":"主席、各位同仁那我們在這裡討論電價的問題我們知道這是一個不得不為的一個決定因為整個烏俄戰爭的影響我們的購煤的成本所謂所有的成本提高"},{"start":16614.538,"end":16638.523,"text":"現在每一年都高達了6000萬以上所以這麼高的一個成本之外我們要面對的如何穩定物價這個都是整體的通盤考量如果以這幾年來購買的成本高達了這麼高的一個金額換算到了2015年的時候當時的火力發電大概佔了八成一樣要到"},{"start":16639.063,"end":16665.334,"text":"一樣的購煤成本是5800億一樣是超出臺電的整體預算所以我們面對的成本的提高我們面對的這樣的狀況才去做了電價的一個調漲而且這個調漲我們充分的去考量到了不管是住宅他在700度以下的他的條幅不到5%在5%以下所以他的月增金額也不到100塊80八塊"},{"start":16667.415,"end":16696.475,"text":"如果是小店家,他的用電的度數在1500度以下,這個比例差不多84%,他的調幅也不到5%。所以他的用電增加的金額大概在200塊左右。真正會去調漲的是這個正在成長的用電大戶。所以你如果用5億度以上的,他就15%。你到了150億度的,大概就是像台積電,這個是25%。那同樣的,針對使用的人比較少的,"},{"start":16696.715,"end":16723.225,"text":"它的網路資料中心就是這個機器在運算的它大概是在0.5億度的時候才會到15%在3億度的時候才會到25%所以這充分的證明說未來我們台灣要有充足的電力因為電力就是我們國力的一個展現而且我們最好的能源政策就是綠電的一個政策我們知道全世界已經通過了RE100"},{"start":16724.285,"end":16730.81,"text":"對於全世界產業的全球佈局他們都要用100%的綠電所以台積電他也宣誓了從2050年要達到R1-100的要求他提早10年"},{"start":16739.497,"end":16765.12,"text":"包括紅海公司也跟進要在2040年一樣要到達R1-100的一個要求所以我們事實上都很清楚的知道包括國民黨包括民眾黨你們很推崇的郭台銘董事長也對外說現在韓國晉升的一個比較劣勢的地方就是他們沒有辦法符合到R1-100的要求"},{"start":16765.94,"end":16784.402,"text":"這個是郭台銘董事長所對外講的所以如果這樣講的話民進黨我們走向綠電是完全符合全世界淨零碳排的趨勢我們是走在一條正確的路上所以請大家在電力調漲的時候我們有所犧牲但是我們台灣會得到更多謝謝"},{"start":16788.665,"end":16795.333,"text":"謝謝蔡易瑜委員的發言。接下來我們請登記第5號王委員宏威發言。"},{"start":16807.33,"end":16825.116,"text":"主席還有各位同仁今天我們討論非常重大的問題就是我們必須要幫我們人民發聲在昨天主計處公布了最新的財富差距報告前20%跟後20%的財富差距竟然高達66.9倍"},{"start":16831.678,"end":16860.958,"text":"大家想想看我們現在有多少的民眾他們事實上他們的所得收入他們的財富收入遠遠不足今天我們在現場大家因為過了午餐時間大家在吃便當但是大家想到了嗎有多少在做便當的餐飲業服務業還有我們的很多的小老百姓在想著當電價上升的時候他們多麼的辛苦"},{"start":16861.858,"end":16879.577,"text":"如果今天我們身為民意代表﹖我們只有黨意﹖但是我們忽略民意﹖這絕對是人民不能接受的。剛才特別談到我們的能源政策有沒有錯誤﹖我想請問大家"},{"start":16880.558,"end":16900.139,"text":"因為我們現在的執政黨死抱住反核神主牌,死抱住2025一定要達到非核家園,所以台電他一度電發電成本3塊5,結果我們現在用了很多的光電一度電超過4塊,"},{"start":16901.48,"end":16917.941,"text":"我們很多的風電一度電超過6塊請問一下這樣子的一個發電成本結構臺電不虧損才怪而錯誤的能源政策為什麼要讓我們老百姓付出代價呢?"},{"start":16918.982,"end":16941.302,"text":"我想請問一下在這樣的能源政策之下臺電竟然在調度電的時候一度電要用12塊來跟民間買電請問一下這不是錯誤的能源政策什麼是錯誤的能源政策我沒有想到到現在民進黨的立委繼續在這邊狡辯說錯能源政策沒有錯誤"},{"start":16942.623,"end":16967.664,"text":"另外,我們發展一個風電光電的過程裏面有沒有弊案呢?剛才很多委員都提到最近被起訴的麗陽能源它的暴力是多少?它的暴力是超過90多億元。想想看一般老百姓90幾億是什麼樣的天文數字?然後我請教一下"},{"start":16968.365,"end":16990.391,"text":"立陽能源的負責人谷聖輝﹖他是不是民進黨員﹖他是不是小英之友會的成員幹部﹖是啊﹖所以當你談能源政策﹖當你要調民眾的店家的時候﹖請問一下﹖民進黨有道歉嗎﹖有為能源政策道歉嗎﹖有為你的黨員﹖你的幹部﹖涉入這樣的光電弊暗﹖"},{"start":17005.164,"end":17016.071,"text":"謝謝王宏威委員的發言。報告委員會現在我們進行處理。請議事人員宣讀各黨團版本。"},{"start":17016.98,"end":17041.626,"text":"民進黨黨團修正動議本院民進黨黨團針對本次會議討論事項第一方案．具修正動議如下．建請院會作審決議．要求經濟部針對臺灣整體能源政策．電價費率結構及臺電公司相關各項支出及尊嚴措施．向本院經濟委員會提出全面檢討報告．電價調整應依照電業法所定之電價費率審議會決議辦理"},{"start":17045.71,"end":17054.361,"text":"臺灣民眾黨立法院黨團修正動議,照原提案文字通過。選舉完畢。報告委員會本案表決的順序為一"},{"start":17058.854,"end":17076.127,"text":"民進黨黨團修正動議。二、台灣民眾黨黨團修正動議。依序進行表決後,如果其中有任何一案通過,我們即不再處理其他案件。"},{"start":17077.428,"end":17083.133,"text":"現在表決民進黨黨團修正動議現有民進黨黨團及臺灣民眾黨黨團要求記名表決我們記名表決時間一分鐘現在開始"},{"start":17109.565,"end":17110.316,"text":"響鐘"},{"start":17168.021,"end":17192.432,"text":"報告委員會現在報告表決結果出席108人贊成50人反對58人贊成者少數民進黨黨團修正動議不通過報告委員會現有民進黨黨團提議重複表決現在進行重複表決時間一分鐘現在開始"},{"start":17201.971,"end":17202.637,"text":"響鐘"},{"start":17269.397,"end":17276.78,"text":"報告院會現在宣布重複表決結果出席108人贊成50人反對58人贊成者少數民進黨黨團修正動議不通過"},{"start":17286.425,"end":17289.786,"text":"報告委員會現在表決臺灣民眾黨黨團修正動議。現有民進黨黨團、臺灣民眾黨黨團要求記名表決。記名表決時間一分鐘。現在開始。"},{"start":17376.752,"end":17398.861,"text":"報告院會現在宣布表決結果出席108人贊成58人反對50人贊成者多數報告院會現有民進黨黨團提議要求重複表決現在我們進行重複表決時間一分鐘現在開始"},{"start":17472.998,"end":17498.614,"text":"報告委員會現在報告重複表決結果出席108人贊成58人反對50人贊成者多數照台灣民眾黨黨團提議通過做如下決議要求經濟部針對台灣整體能源政策電價費率"},{"start":17500.881,"end":17509.447,"text":"結構及臺電相關各項支出及遵截措施．向本院經濟委員會提出全面檢討報告．並經本院經濟委員會審議通過前．電價全面緩漲．"},{"start":17521.391,"end":17526.357,"text":"現在我們進行討論事項第9案本院臺灣民眾黨黨團建請月會決議"},{"start":17531.178,"end":17549.513,"text":"要求民進黨執政的行政院履行政治承諾立即停止在章濱工業區新建金鼎焚化爐以案。本案經第一會期第十次會議決議協商後再行處理。現在"},{"start":17553.456,"end":17566.741,"text":"我們進行廣泛討論由各黨團派代表發言每位委員發言時間3分鐘首先我們請黃委員國昌發言"},{"start":17584.707,"end":17613.371,"text":"院長、本院委員去年台灣民眾黨黨團接到了來自非常多彰化鄉親的陳情他們反對在彰化這個農業大縣當中目前已經有了9座焚化爐他們沒有辦法接受在全國焚化爐密度最高的農業大縣彰化縣竟然"},{"start":17614.976,"end":17636.515,"text":"還要再設置焚化爐。去年台灣民眾黨黨團接下了這份陳情。這份陳情書也到了我們的主席柯文哲主席的手上。我們那個時候簽署了對於彰化環團莊嚴的承諾。"},{"start":17641.189,"end":17668.202,"text":"我們不會同意我們絕對反對在彰化繼續搞焚化爐而也正是在去年的時候民主進步黨總統府秘書長林佳龍跑去彰化參加百工百業的信賴之友會的時候說說要在彰化"},{"start":17669.946,"end":17698.285,"text":"蓋焚化爐這件事情是抹黑要在彰化蓋焚化爐這件事情是假訊息要求大家不要再傳遞這個假訊息不要再抹黑同樣的行政院的副院長鄭文燦也跑到彰化去說要蓋焚化爐是抹黑"},{"start":17699.741,"end":17728.221,"text":"沒有要蓋行政院不會蓋結果投票結束了以後有關於金鼎焚化爐新建的立場在經濟委員會當中我請教經濟部部長王美花根本沒有跟動過還是繼續的在往前進展這個叫做什麼這個叫做選前騙票"},{"start":17729.801,"end":17753.202,"text":"選後跳票選前騙票選後跳票而民進黨在面對自己的行政官員自己的行政院副院長所做出來承諾的時候指控台灣民眾黨是用戰機力介入行政程序手段我完全聽不懂"},{"start":17754.401,"end":17781.753,"text":"這件事情不算是你們行政院副院長鄭文燦承諾的嗎?四月22日環團進去總統府以後出來發表一樣的聲明請民進黨政府履行承諾謝謝謝謝黃國昌委員的發言接下來我們請登記第二號陳委員秀寶發言"},{"start":17785.196,"end":17788.08,"text":"響鐘"},{"start":17796.038,"end":17814.188,"text":"金鼎焚化爐案是彰化縣政府從108年開始就多次表達處理事業廢棄物的困境而經濟部為了協助彰化縣來妥善處理事業廢棄物及污泥因此規劃在彰濱工業區來新建焚化爐以避免廢棄物無法去化造成環境污染的問題本案在109年由金鼎綠能科技公司得標"},{"start":17824.913,"end":17841.552,"text":"經典縫號爐設置是依法律規定的與程序來處理．並且通過環評並無異議．為其施工前說明會辦理的方式並未符合規範．使有違程序正義也引起了民眾的爭議．"},{"start":17843.191,"end":17865.161,"text":"本席也一直都要求金鼎公司應該積極與民眾溝通並依法重新召開說明會讓在地的民眾有表達意見的機會來取得共識本案目前處於停工狀態彰化縣環保局也曾公開說金鼎設置焚化爐對彰化縣來說並無設置的必要性"},{"start":17868.482,"end":17895.974,"text":"章化縣政府對本案持反對的立場﹚也不歡迎為依法執行及欠缺程序正義的開發行為﹚因此本席呼籲經景公司一定要依法執行與完善相關的程序﹚而章化縣政府合法建造與施工許可時﹚也應該依法依程序來辦理不能放水﹚另外"},{"start":17897.055,"end":17916.597,"text":"經濟部後續也應該依照合約的要件檢討本案是否有繼續推動的必要性並處理後續的工作。最後本席認為金鼎案在兼顧地方與環境的議題,絕不能以政治手段由立法院來表決。"},{"start":17918.139,"end":17928.249,"text":"應該將由在地的民意與專業來決定。今頂案一定要依法行政,依正當的法律程序來處理。以上,謝謝。謝謝陳秀寶委員的發言。接下來,我們請登記第三號羅委員志強發言。"},{"start":17954.797,"end":17966.343,"text":"誠信政治就從今天開始我支持民眾黨今天的提案除了環保因素之外更重要的是鄭文燦踹共"},{"start":17968.191,"end":17989.403,"text":"你憑什麼當初選前你代表民進黨中央政府信誓旦旦承諾這個彰化的金頂焚化爐不會蓋現在怎麼樣選完就跑啦我知道啦民進黨說謊當飯吃啦騙票當飯吃啦所以沒有關係啦"},{"start":17992.004,"end":18007.492,"text":"選舉說一套選後說一套所以沒關係今天就從民眾黨的提案開始啊我們來落實誠信政治啊不要把選舉講的話都當空氣一樣講完就結束了誠信政治就從今天開始"},{"start":18008.598,"end":18021.703,"text":"我也要請我們蔡英文總統說要卸任了十年不大漲電價的承諾怎麼樣?買到棺材去啊?搞一堆護航的民進黨在這邊幹什麼?要不要出來解釋一下什麼叫十年不大漲電價?"},{"start":18023.915,"end":18039.82,"text":"馬英九八年漲價二十幾趴被你們民進黨罵到豬狗不如蔡英文八年漲了三十幾趴你們就是英明神武話都民進黨講的啦我今天要告訴大家前面兩項表決"},{"start":18042.185,"end":18061.877,"text":"不管是國民黨、民眾黨都是代表全國深受漲電價之苦、物價沸騰之苦、貧富差距之苦、貪官污吏、圖利之苦的所有民眾狠狠地刪了民進黨八個耳光、表決八次全部讓你們輸"},{"start":18063.238,"end":18086.088,"text":"更重要的是,民進黨,你們今天自己要去做修正動議,要來搞突襲,準備也充足一點嘛,搞了半天還跑一票,上次跑一個吳秉瑞,對不對,是倒戈,今天好一點點啦,是跑得要不見蛋而已啦。我要跟各位講,今天在野黨在這裡展現決心,就是我們選擇站在民眾這一邊。"},{"start":18087.128,"end":18113.55,"text":"民進黨要漲可以你把台南光電案那90億民進黨給吐出來人家說錯誤的政策比貪污更可怕你們民進黨是錯誤的政策包括貪污開路啦因為你們用的所謂非核家人政策平除掉一度電一塊錢的核能然後呢搞到今天全台大學店還要用12塊來去買電"},{"start":18115.683,"end":18135.202,"text":"一塊到十二塊搞成這個德性,電價能不漲嗎?然後台電不關的虧錢政府撥補四千多億,雲報賺飽飽啊,綠油有賺飽飽啊,不要當民眾是笨蛋。今天我們站在這邊就是為民眾把關,創作政策,民進黨你自己買單,謝謝。"},{"start":18141.018,"end":18147.445,"text":"謝謝羅志強委員的發言。接下來我們請登記第4號侯委員生漢發言。"},{"start":18161.565,"end":18183.059,"text":"各位立法院的同仁我們現在在第9案討論章濱工業區的金鼎的焚化爐案我想我們先回到事實面金鼎公司在依照環評召開施工說明取得建造前其實就已經違法施工了所以這也是為什麼引發章化地區居民抗議跟反對很重要的原因"},{"start":18183.559,"end":18204.06,"text":"再來後來在召開的說明會上面經理公司也找了黑衣人來佔據會議室然後沒有提供地方居民公平的發言的機會這也被環境部認知為這說明會不具合法的效力也因為這樣所以目前為止其實經理公司是違反合約的"},{"start":18204.921,"end":18224.445,"text":"再來經營公司也沒有依照合約要在新建期的滿6個月之內能夠開工能夠成功的開工這個部分經營公司也是違反合約的所以我想民進黨的態度很清楚我們一樣要處理經營這一案但我們是希望依照在合約內經營具體違反合約的事由來去處理來去檢討"},{"start":18229.446,"end":18249.294,"text":"中止合約而不是用政治的語言政治的做法我想這反而是在幫金鼎過去一段時間的違法事實來卸責我想這是很清楚的在這個部分我們其實跟民眾黨要處理金鼎的態度是一致的但在做法上面"},{"start":18250.84,"end":18264.693,"text":"經鼎過去的作為就是違法違約他本來有他該承擔的責任如果現在反而我們按照民眾黨的做法來終止合約的話這反而可能幫經鼎"},{"start":18267.255,"end":18286.725,"text":"謝責反而讓金鼎不用承擔責任反而變成是經濟部要來承擔國賠造成後續更大訴訟上面的風險所以在這邊我認為在金鼎這一案不用陷入政治攻防我們一樣要處理我們一樣認同在彰化這個地方不應該再承擔這麼多的焚化爐只是我們能夠依合約"},{"start":18287.865,"end":18291.346,"text":"謝謝洪森漢委員的發言接下來我們請登記第5號羅委員庭委發言"},{"start":18322.466,"end":18341.106,"text":"好 謝謝我想剛剛聽到有立法委員特別有提到金鼎宜案有違法違約就所有的百姓來知道既然有違法違約為什麼不當機立斷趕緊終止合約這是人民所恐慌所擔憂的如果民進黨擔心"},{"start":18343.268,"end":18365.753,"text":"他自己的錯誤政策應該要趕快亡羊補牢而不是等到民眾黨來提這樣子的相關案由國民黨來一起支持的時候這時候才來表態說要來支持民眾黨我想已經太慢人民已經沒辦法信任才會交由我們這些立法委員在立法院來為他們發聲來為彰化來努力"},{"start":18369.494,"end":18387.239,"text":"我是彰化女婿。我住在台中。我更擔心彰化的空氣汙染影響的不只是在地人,更會影響著我們居住在旁邊的台中市。所以我們今天站出來為這個案子一起來發聲。"},{"start":18388.519,"end":18412.908,"text":"另外我也一定要特別提到第7案錯誤的能源政策還有所謂的動漲電價這是全民所托我們今天來到立法院發聲我們也一再的呼籲現在的執政黨不要再一直說國際的燃料上漲我們再一次舉出以一個月以前的資料可以看到煤價為例"},{"start":18414.849,"end":18423.616,"text":"2022年3月煤價每公噸因為惡霧戰爭漲到422美元而一個月前的資料現在每公噸約134美元以天然氣惡霧戰爭最高每單位要價42.39元現在一個月前的資料是8.15美元"},{"start":18437.808,"end":18460.894,"text":"原有也都一樣所以事實擺在眼前而如今我們卻看到民進黨不斷的說謊今天我要跟大家說民進黨在野的時候會告訴大家官逼民反而民進黨執政的時候會告訴大家依法行政我更要在這邊特別幫這一家公司工商一下"},{"start":18462.895,"end":18470.825,"text":"雲報已經申請上市了。 2024年3月15日申請上市。 2024年3月21台股上漲最高20199點。"},{"start":18475.458,"end":18502.883,"text":"股市上萬點上兩萬點你不喜歡嗎我想問問全國的百姓有多少人購入了雲豹的股市股價更有多少人因為這一波漲價而受害我來自基層我們家裡是小吃業不要再告訴我們這些小吃業者漲價沒漲多少要漲去漲工業大戶我們絕對支持但是我們一定要為民發聲"},{"start":18511.94,"end":18537.548,"text":"方院會現在進行處理。請議事人員宣讀各黨團版本。民進黨黨團修正動議本院民進黨黨團針對本次會議討論事項第9案,理據修正動議如下,建請院會作成決議,經頂焚化爐之興建,以因違反提前動工及施工前說明會辦理方式違反環評法令規定,"},{"start":18539.489,"end":18557.781,"text":"．引發民眾抗爭不斷．致以於其為興建．可能構成重大違約情勢．經濟部應應契約違約條款規定．檢討終止契約。臺灣民眾黨立法院黨團修正動議．照原提案文字通過。宣讀完畢。"},{"start":18561.721,"end":18578.793,"text":"本案表決順序為一、民進黨黨團提出修正動議。二、臺灣民眾黨黨團修正動議。依序進行表決後,如果其中有任何一案通過,其不再處理其他案子。"},{"start":18579.854,"end":18586.077,"text":"現在表決民主進步黨所提修正動議現有民進黨黨團臺灣民眾黨黨團要求記名表決記名表決時間一分鐘現在開始"},{"start":18665.425,"end":18667.526,"text":"現在進行重複表決時間一分鐘現在開始"},{"start":18765.643,"end":18770.166,"text":"報告委員會現在宣布重複表決結果出席107人贊成49人反對58人"},{"start":18776.345,"end":18782.948,"text":"因此贊成者少數。民進黨黨團修正動議不通過。現在表決臺灣民眾黨黨團修正動議。現有民進黨黨團、臺灣民眾黨黨團要求記名表決。記名表決時間一分鐘。現在開始。"},{"start":18827.858,"end":18847.005,"text":"議員議員議員"},{"start":18871.462,"end":18879.146,"text":"報告院會現在報告表決結果出席106人贊成58人反對48人報告院會現有民進黨黨團提議重複表決現在進行重複表決時間一分鐘現在開始"},{"start":18902.483,"end":18931.8,"text":"響鐘響鐘響鐘響鐘響鐘響鐘"},{"start":18933.37,"end":18957.368,"text":"三、4月30日下午5時至10時為處理臨時提案時間。．三、4月30日下午5時至10時為處理臨時提案時間。．三、4月30日下午5時至10時為處理臨時提案時間。．三、4月30日下午5時為處理臨時提案時間。．"},{"start":18973.029,"end":18998.385,"text":"報告院會現在報告重複表決結果出席106人贊成58人反對48人贊成者多數照台灣民眾黨黨團提議通過做如下決議要求民眾黨政府的行政院"},{"start":19000.171,"end":19019.8,"text":"旅行政治承諾立即停止在章濱工業區新建金鼎焚化爐。報告委員會現在繼續開會。由於本次會議未有委員提出臨時提案,就不進行臨時提案之處理。"},{"start":19029.284,"end":19040.369,"text":"現在等一下報告委員會"},{"start":19042.028,"end":19066.688,"text":"我們繼續處理復議案。本院民進黨黨團針對第10次會議．報告事項第109案之決定提出復議請公決案。現作如下決定令定期處理。報告院會本次會議進行到此為止。現在散會。"}]}},{"id":"151908","url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151908","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/57aba3c8ecdd307084d3f7882c3601e9c53ee61f366ed07a474e4e539bb54819abb4f772ab4ab96a5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"羅廷瑋","委員發言時間":"13:35:29 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謝謝我想剛剛聽到有立法委員特別有提到金鼎宜案有違法違約就所有的百姓來知道既然有違法違約為什麼不當機立斷趕緊終止合約這是人民所恐慌所擔憂的如果民進黨擔心"},{"start":32.023,"end":55.001,"text":"他自己的錯誤政策應該要趕快亡羊補牢而不是等到民眾黨來提這樣子的相關案由國民黨來一起支持的時候這時候才來表態說要來支持民眾黨我想已經太慢人民已經沒辦法信任才會交由我們這些立法委員在立法院來為他們發聲來為彰化來努力"},{"start":58.243,"end":75.992,"text":"我是彰化女婿。我住在台中。我更擔心彰化的空氣污染影響的不只是在地人,更會影響著我們居住在旁邊的台中市。所以我們今天站出來為這個案子一起來發聲。"},{"start":77.273,"end":96.103,"text":"另外我也一定要特別提到第7案錯誤的能源政策還有所謂的動漲電價這是全民所托我們今天來到立法院發聲我們也一再的呼籲現在的執政黨不要再一直說國際的燃料上漲"},{"start":96.923,"end":112.373,"text":"我們再一次舉出以一個月以前的資料可以看到煤價為例2022年3月煤價每公噸因為惡霧戰爭漲到422美元而一個月前的資料現在每公噸約134美元以天然氣惡霧戰爭最高每單位要價42.39元現在一個月前的資料是8.15美元"},{"start":126.562,"end":149.632,"text":"原有也都一樣：所以事實擺在眼前：而如今我們卻看到民進黨不斷的說謊：今天我要跟大家說：民進黨在野的時候會告訴大家關逼民反：而民進黨執政的時候會告訴大家依法行政：我更要在這邊特別幫這一家公司工商一下："},{"start":151.653,"end":159.579,"text":"雲報已經申請上市了。 2024年3月15日申請上市。 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