{"error":false,"id":["149086"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":149086,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149086","日期":"2024-01-09","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"臨時會院會-10-8-1-1","會議代碼:str":"第10屆第8會期第1次臨時會第1次會議","屆":10,"會期":8,"會次":1,"臨時會會次":1,"種類":"院會","標題":"立法院第10屆第8會期第1次臨時會第1次會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2024-01-09T14:30:35+08:00","結束時間":"2024-01-09T14:46:07+08:00","影片長度":"00:15:32","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/7594f10b9bbee6899895c0b83a3fc809826b98f121effac12be4303bcf228b50caa74d82ca9087435ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"游毓蘭","委員發言時間":"14:30:35 - 14:46:07","會議時間":"2024-01-09T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"第10屆第8會期第1次臨時會第1次會議（事由：行政院院長提出「是否公布高端合約？是否圖利廠商及危害全民健康權益？」等相關事宜專案報告並備質詢）","gazette":{"lineno":34,"blocks":[["游委員毓蘭：（14時30分）謝謝院長，有請行政院陳院長。"],["主席：陳院長，請。"],["陳院長建仁：游委員午安。"],["游委員毓蘭：院長午安。"],["陳院長建仁：午安。"],["游委員毓蘭：院長辛苦了！因為早上您一再強調說，因為契約有保密條款的要求，所以不能夠公開高端的採購合約。可不可以請你告訴我們這個保密條款的文字內容？因為保密條款本身的文字內容是不必保密的。"],["陳院長建仁：保密條款的文字內容等一下，我看一下。"],["游委員毓蘭：時間可以暫停一下，要不然請薛部長幫忙講一下好嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：好。"],["游委員毓蘭：保密條款的文字內容，請。"],["陳院長建仁：好，我先唸第一個：雙方同意訂定本保密合約為雙方遵循之依據。這是合約的起頭。然後是機密資料的部分：本合約所謂機密性資料計包括採購單價、原物料價格等商業採購相關訊息、取得方式，包括（不限於）口頭、文字、書寫、錄音等等。接下來還有：機密性資料取得之日期不論其為本合約簽署日之前或之後均屬之。"],["游委員毓蘭：OK，好。"],["陳院長建仁：在開始的時候就訂定這是一個保密……"],["游委員毓蘭：所以這個就是我們的保密條款嘛？"],["陳院長建仁：對，這是保密的。"],["游委員毓蘭：所以您是有依據的。"],["陳院長建仁：是。"],["游委員毓蘭：好，謝謝。請薛部長回座。","我不知道院長你有沒有看到最近蔡總統拍了一部小電影，還滿好看的？"],["陳院長建仁：有。"],["游委員毓蘭：有看了嘛？"],["陳院長建仁：是。"],["游委員毓蘭：因為現在蔡總統不是只有在路上，蔡總統還在錄音帶上，所以我接下來要請教一下，其實法務部在去年年底就已經講了，說最高檢從去年12月11日到今年1月5日止，全權處理全國性重大假訊息案件，而且會指派主任檢察官跟檢察官來負責偵辦，針對影響選舉的假訊息，執法部門法務部、地檢署、調查局要立即澄清、迅速下架、溯源追查主嫌。我剛剛唸的都沒錯嘛？蔡部長已經上來了，沒錯嘛？"],["蔡部長清祥：是。"],["游委員毓蘭：這是為了要避免中共介選啦！所以我剛才講說蔡總統的小電影叫做「在路上」，可是現在變成「在錄音帶上」啦！因為最近我們看到我們的同事羅致政委員被公布了各種不同的影音資料，有A片，也有影射可能是跟蔡總統的對話等等，我覺得茲事體大。不管是真是假，部長，這不是符合我剛剛唸的，你們一開始說的要有一個打擊假訊息的迅速偵辦中心的重要意旨嗎？"],["蔡部長清祥：是。"],["游委員毓蘭：沒錯吧！對不對？所以你就不可以說這是個人隱私、這是私德問題，這已經不是了！雖然我跟蔡總統不屬同一個黨派，但他是我的國家元首，我覺得當他被人家錄音，我現在還搞不清楚這個錄音帶內容的真假等等，可是因為裡面有一些內容我知道也是我們在外交及國防委員會常常聽到，比如說羅致政委員有時候也會談起的，但是我會擔心羅致政委員當過國防及外交委員會的召委，這會不會是一個國安的漏洞？我覺得法務部或最高檢都不可以等閒視之，不是嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：這一件事情當然是相當的重要，所以我今天早上已經講得很清楚了，這一件事情我們完全支持檢調單位積極查辦，並且很快的掌握相關報導，那語音檔的內容是不是有偷錄、深偽或涉及介選，都要由鑑識機關來進行相關的鑑識。這一件事情是相當的重要，我相信部長也有這樣的一個看法。"],["游委員毓蘭：對，我是建議絕對不可以像破唱盤一樣跳針說中共介選，用中共介選遮掩掉很多我們政府該作為而不作為，我們自己不認真辦案，這是我再怎麼樣都無法忍受的。"],["陳院長建仁：沒有，我覺得他們沒有不認真辦案，我是支持他們要儘快查明真相，好好的來偵辦這件事情。"],["游委員毓蘭：是，包括剛剛沒有出現的洪申翰委員最近也深陷這種風暴，我覺得對他們來講，他們也都很需要一個真相，如果這件事情對他們是謠言的話，要趕快查明，千萬不要像過去吳敦義的錄音帶風波，等到查出來之後，都說是假的時候，他都已經落選，都已經變成既定的現實了。"],["陳院長建仁：現在深偽的作法相當的多，五花八門，所以在鑑識的工作上我們也會積極來努力，那更重要的就是我們在打詐行動綱領1.5有購置一些儀器設備，能夠作更精準的鑑識，還有追查訊息來源，所以這部分我相信檢調單位還有刑事警察局也會來好好的偵辦。"],["游委員毓蘭：是的，剛剛院長講到重點，深偽的技術雖然不斷升高，可是道高一尺魔高一丈，我們希望現在是魔高一尺，道要高好幾丈才可以。"],["陳院長建仁：沒有錯，這就是我們努力的方向。"],["游委員毓蘭：所以一定要支持包括第一線的檢調警都要有足夠的工具。其實我剛剛秀給大家看的，你們去年年底說有一個專責小組，我看到裡面有一個主任檢察官，就是我們鑑識系的校友，他也是鑑識專家，但是不可以讓這群精兵去打一個沒有工具的仗，所以一定要請院長、部長支持第一線的員警，要讓有責任的人也要有權力，而不要因為有太多政治的考量，譬如現在因為選舉期間暫時不要辦。有的時候就是要神速，就是要很快的把這個事情，如果它是假訊息，馬上公布的話至少不會繼續擴大，否則，我覺得我的同事羅致政現在也一定很頭痛，因為一下子錄音帶，一下子A片，現在聽說又有20支高清的帶子，我覺得檢調應該要勇敢的負起責任。"],["陳院長建仁：好，我們會加強來做，而且我要在這裡跟委員報告，我們鑑識的設備，基本上很多媒體都錯誤報導說我們打詐1.5行動綱領花了27億是去做裝潢，這完全是錯誤的，實際上我們就是精進儀器設備。然後像那個Linbay好油這些案子，還有一些黨工有1,000個帳號，我們都能夠查出來，所以我們絕對會積極來偵辦這件事情，查個水落石出，盡早讓真相能夠解凍。"],["游委員毓蘭：我們也要請院長跟部長承諾，因為我們現在聽到的是都已經查出那個A片不是深偽製造，但是現在因為偵查不公開，不對外公布，或者是因為當事人，那你既然要說那A片的當事人，那你就是直接影射羅致政就是當事人。我要跟部長、院長唸出一段，這是在網路間流傳的，我的同學傳給我，內容是高端合約要業者同意才能公布，立委的性愛光碟也要當事人同意才能公布，這個政府的公權力是睡死了嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：我想……"],["游委員毓蘭：高端是全民買單，立委是外交及國防委員會，包括趙天麟委員的那個小三風波也是一樣的，政府跟司法單位不可以明目張膽地去護短，這個我是完全同意的。"],["陳院長建仁：我們完全沒有護短，而且我在這裡再跟委員報告，政府的誠信很重要、政府的威信很重要，但是政府威信的建立，不是像在威權獨裁國家那樣子地壓迫經濟……"],["游委員毓蘭：沒錯、沒錯，是。"],["陳院長建仁：各個企業，這樣的話沒有辦法。政府有簽約，就要維持自己的誠信，那政府當然也來勸這一個企業來發表……"],["游委員毓蘭：院長，我百分之三百同意我們一定要有捍衛我們民主法治這樣的決心跟能力，但是我們絕對不可以用中國介選為藉口，然後進行司法介選之實，因為昨天……"],["陳院長建仁：中國有沒有介選的話還需要偵查。"],["游委員毓蘭：還要去偵查？"],["陳院長建仁：當然。"],["游委員毓蘭：但是有些偵查的就很奇怪了，因為……"],["陳院長建仁：所有的深偽製造，我們如果查到這個來源，也許是從境外進來的，那當然就要……就像我剛才講的那個Linbay好油，就是這樣查，查到境外去再查回來的，還有那個黨工的1,000個帳號也是這樣查出來的。"],["游委員毓蘭：好好地查。"],["蔡部長清祥：好。"],["游委員毓蘭：好好地辦。"],["陳院長建仁：好，一定。"],["游委員毓蘭：但是絕對不可以動用檢調、司法來介選，讓他們……"],["陳院長建仁：沒有這回事。"],["游委員毓蘭：產生寒蟬效應。比如我的PPT上面右邊的這位劉佳昇警官，他只不過講了「兩岸一家親」、「子子孫孫要和平」，就用反滲透法去辦他。我覺得我們警察，我這麼多年來在警察大學，我都告訴我的學生們，我們是行政中立，但是我們捍衛和平，我們不是戰爭的工具，所以和平沒有什麼不對的，好不好？謝謝。"],["陳院長建仁：好。"],["蔡部長清祥：我們是一定毋枉毋縱。"],["游委員毓蘭：是。"],["蔡部長清祥：絕對沒有司法介選這回事。我們都是因為有涉嫌犯罪，檢調才會啟動偵查的，所以絕對不是司法介選這一回事。"],["游委員毓蘭：但是所有的里長一回來，只要到中國大陸回來的，馬上……"],["蔡部長清祥：因為他有涉嫌刑責，所以才會接受到約詢或是調查，所以這些不是針對什麼特定的團體或人。"],["游委員毓蘭：大家最近在辦這個也未免太積極了，好像其他的詐騙案都不存在一樣。","不過，接下來我比較關心的倒是我們的退休金問題，因為本席即將卸任，要回去領退休金。到底我們要不要漲這4%？"],["陳院長建仁：我想退休金的調漲有法律上的規定，如果是經過4年或者物價指數累積超過5%的時候……"],["游委員毓蘭：超過5%。"],["陳院長建仁：就應該檢討。"],["游委員毓蘭：就應該要嘛！"],["陳院長建仁：我們主計總處已經做一個估算。"],["游委員毓蘭：是，因為本席已經多次提出質詢。"],["陳院長建仁：已經……看起來是超過5%。"],["游委員毓蘭：是。"],["陳院長建仁：所以我們現在啟動一個討論的機制，由考試院跟……"],["游委員毓蘭：只不過剛剛好在選前才去講這件事，大家認為這是選舉的……"],["陳院長建仁：不，這個本來……"],["游委員毓蘭：其實不是。"],["陳院長建仁：不是喔！不是。"],["游委員毓蘭：因為我們法律上……"],["陳院長建仁：對。"],["游委員毓蘭：法律上就規定，因為本席其實在蘇貞昌院長的時候也提過，甚至於……"],["朱主計長澤民：跟委員報告一下，我們去年7、8月在預算書送到大院的時候……"],["游委員毓蘭：對，就已經……"],["朱主計長澤民：就有編列這筆預算，所以跟選舉完全無關。"],["游委員毓蘭：對，預估了、預估了。"],["朱主計長澤民：對。"],["游委員毓蘭：因為預估了，因為這個……"],["陳院長建仁：……是預估。"],["游委員毓蘭：也不用再講說我們的德政，因為事實上累積就已經超過了，2.95%加2.50%是5.45%，早就超過了，也就是理論上你們在……"],["陳院長建仁：最後的精算。"],["游委員毓蘭：你們在那個時候，今年元月1日就應該要開始了。"],["陳院長建仁：我們預估啦！我們預估可能會超過5%。"],["游委員毓蘭：主計長你剛好上來，我也提過很多次，我希望對於高齡的家庭的CPI，不應該是……"],["朱主計長澤民：我們已經有公布了，相關單位可以參考。"],["游委員毓蘭：是，我這邊也有弄出來，這也是你們公布的，因為高齡的CPI遠高於全國平均的CPI，所以這是一個……"],["朱主計長澤民：沒有遠高於，大概0.2%啦！"],["游委員毓蘭：不止啊！原來那邊是5.45%，這邊是5.92%，5.92%比5.45%不是只有高0.2%……"],["朱主計長澤民：不，我說兩年、兩年。"],["游委員毓蘭：抱歉……"],["朱主計長澤民：一年大概0.2%。"],["游委員毓蘭：主計長，我是要愛惜你的羽毛，我怕你到時候又變成那個蚵仔麵線20塊一樣，這個對於我們……"],["陳院長建仁：沒有，他是講一年。"],["朱主計長澤民：一年，一年0.2%。"],["游委員毓蘭：沒有，我們的法律文字上是累積喔！我們本來就是累積的。所以對我們的CPI，我很希望要修就把它修得比較好，應該有針對高齡家庭的CPI，這樣會更早達到可以調整的標準，所以在這個部分其實……"],["陳院長建仁：法律不是這樣寫的啦！法律沒有分年齡，CPI在那個原來的法律裡面是寫物價指數累計……"],["游委員毓蘭：所以我們可以修法嘛！我們可以修法，因為退休族群就是屬於高齡……"],["陳院長建仁：修法我們……"],["朱主計長澤民：修法要尊重大院。"],["陳院長建仁：對。"],["游委員毓蘭：既然要修，本席本來也希望你們能夠稍微更敏感一點，這些都是我們當時在立法院裡面……"],["陳院長建仁：這是年改本來就有的法，用來照顧退休的軍公教人員。"],["游委員毓蘭：我的時間已經快要用完了，最後我還是很關心在死刑存廢上的相關爭論，因為我們看到新北那個國中生被狂砍十幾刀之後送醫，第一天輸血就達6萬cc，我希望我們的少年事件處理法一定要有配套措施，要讓孩子們能夠在臺灣平安長大，好嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：好，我們來檢討。"],["主席：好，謝謝游委員。","接下來請莊委員瑞雄質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":86,"meet_id":"臨時會院會-10-8-1-1","speakers":["游錫堃","邱顯智","邱臣遠","曾銘宗","林俊憲","賴士葆","邱泰源","王鴻薇","蔡適應","吳斯懷","洪申翰","游毓蘭","莊瑞雄","李德維","吳玉琴","林為洲"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-01-09"],"gazette_id":"1130301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1130301_00002","1130301_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第10屆第8會期第1次臨時會第1次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n行政院院長提出「是否公布高端合約？是否圖利廠商及危害全民健康權益？」等相關事宜專案報\n告並備質詢─ 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有請行政院陳院長陳院長請"},{"start":20.302,"end":22.943,"text":"保密條款的文字內容我等一下的看一下"},{"start":50.538,"end":51.098,"text":"法密條款的文字內容請"},{"start":72.127,"end":81.291,"text":"雙方同意訂定本保密合約為雙方遵循之依據本合約所謂機密性資料據包括採購的單價、原物料價格等商業採購相關訊息取得的方式"},{"start":90.646,"end":100.597,"text":"包括不限於口頭、文字、書寫、錄音等等那機密性資料取得之日期﹐不論其為本合約簽署日之前或之後均屬之"},{"start":101.875,"end":103.457,"text":"蔡總統拍了一部小電影還蠻好看的有"},{"start":125.693,"end":152.479,"text":"因為現在不是只有蔡總統在路上蔡總統還在錄音帶上所以我才會接下來要請教一下因為我們法務部其實在去年年底就已經講了說他依照這個他們最高檢就從去年的12月11日到今年1月5日子全權處理全國性重大假訊息案件而且會指派主任檢察官"},{"start":153.475,"end":167.827,"text":"與檢察官負責偵辦,針對影響選舉的假訊息,執法部門、法務部、地檢署、調查局,要立即澄清,迅速下架,溯源追查主權。"},{"start":177.235,"end":184.963,"text":"蔡總統的小電影叫《在路上》可是現在變成《在路應帶上》因為最近我們看到我們"},{"start":186.26,"end":208.466,"text":"的同事羅智政委員他被公布的有各種不同的不同的資料影音資料有A片的也有裡面就是影射可能是跟蔡總統的對話這些我覺得這個是知識體大不管是真是假"},{"start":210.147,"end":231.607,"text":"這不符合我剛剛念的你們在一開始的時候要有一個打假的假訊息的這個迅速偵辦中心的你們重要的意志不是嗎?是沒錯吧 對不對所以你就不可以說這個是個人隱私啦這是私德問題這已經不是因為"},{"start":233.696,"end":240.725,"text":"雖然我跟蔡總統不屬於同一個黨派但是他是我的國家元首"},{"start":241.414,"end":265.513,"text":"我覺得當他被人家錄音我現在還搞不清楚我還搞不清楚這個錄音帶的內容的真假等等的可是因為裡面有一些內容我知道這也是我們在國防外交委員會常常聽到比如說羅智政委員有時候也會談起的但是我會擔心啊羅智政委員他是當過國防外交委員會的"},{"start":267.443,"end":274.388,"text":"這件事情當然是相當的重要所以我今天早上已經講得很清楚這一件事情的話我們完全支持我們檢調單位要來的積極查辦"},{"start":295.499,"end":312.036,"text":"並且很快的來掌握相關的報導與殷黨的內容是不是有透露身為或者涉及藉選都要由鑑識機關來進行相關的鑑識這件事情是相當的重要我相信部長也有這樣的一個看法"},{"start":312.786,"end":334.129,"text":"對 我是建議絕對不可以就是因為我們說就像破唱盤一樣跳針一樣說中共借血你用一個中共借血你就遮掩掉很多我們政府該作為而不作為我們自己不認真辦案這個是我再怎麼樣我都無法忍受的沒有 我覺得他們沒有不認真辦案我是支持他們要"},{"start":334.639,"end":336.16,"text":"對他們來講他們也都很需要一個真相如果"},{"start":353.01,"end":381.805,"text":"這件事情對他們是謠言的話我們趕快把千萬不要像過去吳敦義的這個錄音帶風波等到這個查出來之後都說這個是假的時候他都已經落選都已經變成制定的現實現在的這個身為的做法相當的多五發八門所以在建設的工作上我們也會積極來努力那更重要的就是"},{"start":382.318,"end":399.866,"text":"我們在打造這個行動方案行動綱領1.5的時候有構置了一些儀器設備能夠做更精準的這樣的一個鑑識的工作那還有追查這個訊息來源所以這個部分我相信"},{"start":400.287,"end":425.376,"text":"我們檢調單位還有這個新市警察局也會來好好的來偵辦所以剛剛院長講到重點身為的技術雖然不斷升高可是道高一尺磨高一丈但是我們希望現在是磨高一尺我們道要高好幾丈才可以所以一定要支持包括我們第一線的檢調警都要有足夠的工具"},{"start":425.976,"end":452.432,"text":"其實我看到剛剛我就給大家看了你們去年年底說我們有個專責小組我看到裡面有一個檢察官有主任檢察官就是我們建市我們自己建市系的校友他也是建市專家但是不可以讓這一群精兵去打一個沒有工具的戰所以一定要請這個院長部長你們要支持第一線的員警要讓"},{"start":453.413,"end":478.713,"text":"有責任的人也要有權利而不要因為有太多政治的考量現在因為這個選舉期間暫時不要有的時候就是要神速我們就是很快的把這個事情他是假訊息馬上公布的話至少不會繼續擴大否則其實我的同事羅志正我覺得他現在也一定很頭痛因為我"},{"start":479.974,"end":499.606,"text":"一下子錄音帶 一下子A片然後現在聽說又有20支高清的袋子我覺得對他來講 這我們應該減掉要勇敢的負起我們會加強來做而且我要在這裡跟委員報告就是說我們這個建設的這個設備基本上在很多媒體上都錯誤報導說我們打仗"},{"start":502.087,"end":523.215,"text":"1.5的行動綱領花了27億去做裝潢這完全錯誤的啦實際上我們就是來精進這個儀器設備然後像那個林北好遊這些案子還有一些黨工有1000個帳號我們都是能夠這樣查出來所以我們絕對會積極來偵辦這件事情查個水落石出盡早讓真相能夠"},{"start":523.735,"end":523.895,"text":"主席"},{"start":536.377,"end":537.258,"text":"政府的公權力是碎死了嗎?"},{"start":564.759,"end":582.758,"text":"高端是全民買單立委是國防外交委員會包括趙天寧委員的那個小三豐富也是一樣的政府跟司法單位不可以明目張膽的去互短這個我是完全同意的我們完全沒有互短而且我在這裡在跟委員報告"},{"start":583.759,"end":594.112,"text":"政府的誠信很重要政府的威信很重要但是政府威信的建立不是像在威權獨裁國家那樣子的壓迫軍機各個企業這樣的話沒有辦法政府有簽約就要維持自己的誠信"},{"start":603.383,"end":619.899,"text":"院長我300%同意我們一定要有捍衛我們民主法治的這樣的決心跟能力但是我們絕對不可以用中國界選為藉口然後進行司法界選之時中國有沒有界選的話還需要偵查啦"},{"start":622.725,"end":643.531,"text":"還要去偵查當然啦但是有些偵查的就很奇怪啦因為所有的身為的製造我們如果查到這個來源也許是從境外進來的那當然就要跟就像我剛才講的那個林北好遊就是這樣查到境外去再查回來的還有那個黨工的一千個帳號也是這樣查出來的"},{"start":643.951,"end":644.031,"text":"李慧琼議員"},{"start":661.562,"end":683.019,"text":"他只不過講了兩岸一家親子子孫孫要和平就用反滲透法去辦它我覺得我們警察我這麼多年來在警察大學我都告訴我的學生們我們是行政中立但是我們捍衛和平我們不是戰爭的工具所以和平沒有什麼不對的好不好謝謝我們是一定勿忘勿重"},{"start":685.181,"end":705.035,"text":"絕對沒有司法借選這回事我們都是因為有涉嫌犯罪檢調才會啟動偵查的所以絕對不是司法借選這一回事所有的里長一回來只要到中國大陸回來因為他有涉嫌刑責所以才會接受到約詢或是調查所以這不是針對什麼特定的法律問題"},{"start":706.896,"end":709.418,"text":"本席即將卸任 要回去領退休金 到底我們要不要漲4%"},{"start":724.445,"end":724.825,"text":"主席主席主席"},{"start":746.289,"end":746.729,"text":"因為預估了"},{"start":773.303,"end":773.984,"text":"最後的精算"},{"start":790.703,"end":791.724,"text":"我們已經有公布了相關單位可以參考"},{"start":809.508,"end":811.751,"text":"沒有遠高於大概0.2個百分點"},{"start":824.5,"end":842.776,"text":"不只啊 原來那邊是5.45這邊是5.925.92比5.45不是只有高0.2我這兩年 兩年抱歉齁 主席長我是要愛惜你的羽毛我怕你到時候又變成那個歐阿米索20塊一樣沒有啦 它是早1年 1年2.5"},{"start":847.841,"end":853.308,"text":"法律文字上是累積的所以CPI應該針對高齡家庭的CPI更早達到可以調整的"},{"start":868.822,"end":891.606,"text":"法律不是這樣寫的啦法律沒有分年齡GPI在那個原來的法律裡面是寫說所以我們可以修法嘛我們可以修法因為你退休退休期就是屬於高竟然要修嘛因為本席本來也希望說你們能夠更稍微更敏感一點這些都是我們當時在在這個立法院裡面"},{"start":892.606,"end":910.265,"text":"這是年改本來就有的法案 修的法來照顧退休的軍公教人員最後當然我時間已經快要用完我還是很關心在死刑存廢上的這些爭論因為我們看到了新北的那個國中生"},{"start":910.865,"end":924.741,"text":"他在被狂砍十幾刀之後他那天第一天他送到醫院就出血就是6萬CC我希望我們的少年事件處理法一定要有配套措施要讓孩子們能夠在"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}