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Kacaw委員：要加油爭取。"],["杜張處長梅莊：原住民族土地的定義其實就是原保地與傳統領域，至於委員所擔心的，我們也有跟國土署協調，原則上我們會以目前所調查並公告在網路上的範圍來做原住民土地的認定。所以委員擔心的部分，原則上不太會發生，因為部落一定範圍內的土地，像花東地區，都是在傳統領域土地裡，我們目前大概是朝這樣的方向去協調。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：現在是這樣講，但那個都放在說明，我看了，你們放在說明裡面，所以實際上要執行的時候就完了，就慘了！如果是這樣，那乾脆把部落放進去，因為你們調查的也都在裡面，部落也在裡面。把部落二個字放進去，好不好？謝謝。"],["林部長右昌：我們再研究，謝謝。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：拜託，部長，這個很重要。"],["主席：謝謝鄭天財委員的質詢，謝謝部長跟署長。","接下來我們請黃仁委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":146,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-15-7","speakers":["高金素梅","張宏陸","牛煦庭","許宇甄","王美惠","李柏毅","黃捷","徐欣瑩","黃建賓","張智倫","吳琪銘","鍾佳濱","張雅琳","蘇巧慧","徐巧芯","黃珊珊","鄭天財Sra 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委好部長我已經這個圖引用了很多次部長也看過然後你也更熟悉這個地方都是山坡地但是都可以蓋大樓基隆市中央區也是山坡地都蓋大樓"},{"start":37.568,"end":55.794,"text":"﹗"},{"start":57.04,"end":80.522,"text":"我們現在看這個非都市土地使用管制規則第45條這是現行的條文本席一再的希望把這個原住民保留地另外再增加原住民族部落但是這個到現在內政部都沒有修理由都是說因為國土計畫法要實施了"},{"start":82.68,"end":98.321,"text":"內政部的報告裏面為解決原住民族既有基柱用地不足問題原住民基柱但是你們要分階段的來去實施然後要原定什麼原住民"},{"start":99.929,"end":127.95,"text":"主土地使用管制規則然後這個希望第一個就是說105年5月1號以前既有建物資合法機制要訂定這個部分為什麼既有建物資合法機制要以105年5月1號為時間點我認為是不合理當然你們是以國土計畫法公佈實施的時間"},{"start":130.367,"end":154.424,"text":"好我們看這個非都市土地使用管制規則是現行的且以本規則中華民國108年2月26日修正生肖前實際以作住宅使用者這都還比較寬所以好我們來看國土計畫法雖然105年5月1號施行但是"},{"start":155.97,"end":167.577,"text":"全國的國土計畫是在兩年後然後呢直轄市縣市政府直轄市縣市的國土計畫我們剛剛講的全國國土計畫是107年4月30號才公告然後呢直轄市縣市的國土計畫是在110年4月30號公告"},{"start":181.22,"end":182.301,"text":"我們看這個執法 這個執法你們議定今年"},{"start":202.312,"end":214.925,"text":"今年年底要完成 都某是希望能夠趕快但是要符合要解決原住民族的問題 所以這個部分請部長還有國土署尤其菸米會你們絕對不要同意用105年5月1號"},{"start":225.489,"end":231.694,"text":"因調整既有介入合法機制的時間點就剛才談的那個部分那個部長這個部分還可以討論嗎這個請吳署長說明一下跟委員報告"},{"start":241.36,"end":241.7,"text":"7.1計畫法的公佈實施"},{"start":262.728,"end":280.758,"text":"跟非都市土地使用管制規則也有很大的落差所以你可以看參考過去的好不好是可以討論的這個不是沒有法律明定沒有法律明定部長我是寫法律的老公務員不會隨便那個"},{"start":283.224,"end":309.796,"text":"這個管理規則原住民族土地使用管理規則你們稱為管制規則還是管理規則這裡面第二章原住民族部落基柱基柱原住民族部落這邊都寫部落但是跑到裡面的條文全部限收在原住民族土地限收在原住民族土地限收在第5條也是限收在原住民族土地"},{"start":311.67,"end":333.378,"text":"第6條也是限收在原住民族土地甚至第7條限收在原住民保留地我們看這個國土計畫法23條23條裏面特別提到涉及原住民族土地及海域之使用管制者因依原住民族基本法第21條規定辦理"},{"start":336.215,"end":341.146,"text":"原積法21條他有部落而原住民族土地有部落"},{"start":342.29,"end":368.653,"text":"還有桌邊一定範圍部落的桌邊一定範圍所以這個部分是要再做檢討啊不然的話沒辦法解決我們的問題啊為什麼呢因為原住民族土地啊只有傳統領域啊跟那個既有的原住民保留地啊那傳統領域到現在只有公告一個地方啊只有公告烏來契啊原住民傳統領域啊人民會現在已經8年了只有公告一個地方啊"},{"start":369.58,"end":385.488,"text":"所以這個部分沒辦法落實沒辦法解決我們的問題我也在希望去修非都市土地使用管制規則現在到這邊更慘了所以這個部分是一定要做修正的這個你看"},{"start":387.381,"end":405.649,"text":"畫設辦法嚮明會依延期法21條所定的畫設辦法就包含部落範圍土地所以這個部分是可以把它納入的所以包含這個土地的建壁率、容積率像這樣的我們先談這個我們先談這個管制規則裡面的管制規則好"},{"start":419.352,"end":425.455,"text":"主席這個是不是不要限收在原住民族土地這個好 我來說原住民族土地按照原基法的規定我剛剛有講了一個是傳統禮儀那傳統禮儀現在只有公告那個只有污染器第二個"},{"start":446.502,"end":450.965,"text":"原住民保留地那就回到非都市土用管制規則了對不對沒有更好啊完全沒有辦法解決原住民族現在的狀況"},{"start":461.133,"end":487.925,"text":"所以這個部分我都有立法律的依據所以你們就把它檢討修正反正你們趕快再開會就把它回歸到回歸到延期法包含部落包括部落範圍周邊一定範圍然後這個延期法依延期法訂定的這個劃設辦法也要提到部落範圍的土地"},{"start":490.121,"end":493.624,"text":"部落裡面尤其是平地原住民的部落"},{"start":517.924,"end":536.304,"text":"有很多不是保留地啦這個可以這個我都不行尤其是平地原住民的部落保留地在部落裡面很少所以這個可以的我就不行所以才會要把部落放為土地納入進去好不好"},{"start":542.469,"end":552.639,"text":"原住民族的土地他定義其實就是原保地跟那個傳統領域的部分那其實原則上剛委員擔心的那個我們也有跟那個國土署去協調"},{"start":553.86,"end":571.8,"text":"原則上我們會以我們目前所調查的這個所公告在網路上的那個範圍來做我們所謂原住民土地的認定所以原則上應該委員擔心的這部分是不太會發生因為這些部落一定範圍內像花東地區都是在傳統靈異土地裡面所以我們大概目前是朝這樣的方向協調"},{"start":574.006,"end":601.379,"text":"現在是這樣講,因為那個都是放在說明啊我看啊,你們放在說明裡面啊實際上要執行的時候就完了,就慘了那就乾脆,如果是這樣,乾脆把部落放進去啊因為你們調查的也都在那裡面啊部落也都在那裡面啊把部落這兩個字也拿進去啊好不好好,謝謝拜託部長,這個很重要"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}