{"error":false,"id":["150292"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":150292,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150292","日期":"2024-03-22","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"院會-11-1-6","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第1會期第6次會議","屆":11,"會期":1,"會次":6,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"院會","標題":"立法院第11屆第1會期第6次會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2024-03-22T15:02:13+08:00","結束時間":"2024-03-22T15:17:44+08:00","影片長度":"00:15:31","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/7c8e4f03b048d09e5af4889f4e3f154afd9d093a04e30914f8ba9b0039caa7a6bb90f9f2942976765ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"游顥","委員發言時間":"15:02:13 - 15:17:44","會議時間":"2024-03-22T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"第11屆第1會期第6次會議（事由：一、對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢。\n二、3月22日上午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。\n三、3月26日下午1時50分至2時30分為處理臨時提案時間。）","gazette":{"lineno":125,"blocks":[["游委員顥：（15時2分）謝謝院長，有請行政院長。"],["主席：再請陳院長備詢。"],["陳院長建仁：游委員，午安。"],["游委員顥：院長，午安。本席想要就教一下院長，在目前我們看到許多新聞大概都是民生的新聞，民生同樣的也影響到交通的各種成本，在去年的時候，有個年度的代表字，你還記得是什麼字嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：我不太記得耶。"],["游委員顥：好，沒關係。去年的話是「缺」，缺電、缺員工、缺勞工，包括連醫院也在缺護理師，那時候缺電，大家都非常的清楚。在今年的話，自從電價預計要調漲11%以後，今年許多相關物品的物價會隨之上漲，請問一下你認同嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：不一定啦，因為我們在電價調漲過程中，我一再強調的是，我們會用很細緻的方式來調漲，我舉一個例子來看，像民生用電，在700度以下的將近1,300萬戶的人只漲5%，5%的意思是什麼？就是平均1天7毛錢，1個月是漲21塊……"],["游委員顥：所以就教院長……"],["陳院長建仁：所以我是覺得在我們很精緻的調整的情況下，大部分漲的價錢大概都是那些比較像是產業大戶所漲的價格比較多。"],["游委員顥：所以你認為漲的部分，其他民生相關的都不會再漲？"],["陳院長建仁：基本上因為漲幅不大，而且小商店的漲幅也是小。"],["游委員顥：其實11%算很大耶！好，沒關係……"],["陳院長建仁：現在還在審議當中，今天等一下才會公布。"],["游委員顥：所以就不會調了嗎？還是會調吧？"],["陳院長建仁：什麼東西？"],["游委員顥：電價還是會調漲吧？"],["陳院長建仁：這要看審議委員會，中華民國行之有年都是由電價審議委員會來調整的。"],["游委員顥：沒關係，院長，我直接跟你問，其實電價的調漲會帶動許多民生物價的上漲，這是一定的，也是大家可以預期的，所以今年從電價開始調整之後，我們可以預期今年大致上就是朝向一個「漲」字，這個「漲」字來講的話，不管結果怎麼樣，大家要去因應、去面對，所以就算今年的代表字是「漲」，大家還是要嚴陣以待的去面對，你認不認同？"],["陳院長建仁：我想我個人不認為「漲」字一定會啦，因為按照中央銀行的估計，我們今年CPI的成長情況會比去年的2.49要來得低很多啦，所以這是個人……"],["游委員顥：我們就拭目以待！"],["陳院長建仁：所以這是個人的見解不一樣，我尊重委員的見解，但是會不會漲，我想……"],["游委員顥：好，我就直接告訴院長好了，那個帶動的漲其實就是不斷的，像西門町有間水煎包店，一個水煎包，以目前來講，你預計在西門町買一個水煎包大概要多少錢？"],["陳院長建仁：我很少到西門町去，但是我了解有人吃水煎包是28塊錢，也有人吃12塊錢的，都有，要看它的成分啊、內容啊……"],["游委員顥：對，沒有錯，就是漲到28塊，你偶爾去表示你有吃到28塊的水煎包……"],["陳院長建仁：我沒有吃到過。"],["游委員顥：那臺鐵的便當是不是也要調漲？"],["陳院長建仁：臺鐵的便當，臺鐵現在已經民營化了，臺鐵對於他們自己的便當要不要漲價，我們尊重市場機制。"],["游委員顥：部長可以來幫您說明一下沒關係……"],["陳院長建仁：我們尊重市場機制啦！"],["游委員顥：市場機制，那是不是要調漲？"],["王部長國材：目前是高鐵啦，高鐵有提到要漲，臺鐵還沒有。"],["游委員顥：那高鐵的便當現在一個多少？以及預計要調到多少？"],["王部長國材：好像增加10塊錢。"],["游委員顥：所以現在一個是多少？"],["王部長國材：要110吧。"],["游委員顥：110塊的便當啊！其實我坦白說，以民生來講，這整個都會連著一起帶動的。","我接著就教，像目前來講，這整個帶動調漲的話，未來臺鐵的票價也會調漲了，是吧？"],["陳院長建仁：臺鐵是這樣子，委員你可能比我還清楚，臺鐵29年沒有調票價，最主要的原因是它有其政策任務，而且要讓大家能夠有很好的通勤便捷性。但是我們剛才講過，臺鐵已經變成一家民營化的公司，我們會尊重民營化公司自己對於票價的調整，當然，它的票價要調整的時候，要報到費率委員會來審議，我們也會來看看它是否有必要性。但是為了讓大家通學、通勤能夠得到很好的保障，中央政府這邊一定會繼續推動TPASS，這個TPASS的1,200塊是不會漲的，所以大家在通學、通勤所需要的大眾運輸費用是不會漲的。"],["游委員顥：因為TPASS的部分，它會進行一些補貼，我清楚，至於臺鐵的部分，我跟院長說，這個「漲」會不會成為今年的年度關鍵字，其實取決也是在於行政院，如何能夠穩定物價？物價穩定得好，「漲」就不會是今年的關鍵字、代表字，如果穩定得不好，「漲」就是今年的代表字，沒有錯吧？"],["陳院長建仁：對，見仁見智，但我個人是認為，按照中央銀行長期趨勢的估計，還有全球經濟發展的狀況，我們大家預期在今年度全球和臺灣物價CPI的增加情況會比去年要來得好……"],["游委員顥：所以說國家的角色、中央政府的角色所要扮演的就是穩定物價啊！"],["陳院長建仁：對，當然，我們穩定物價一直在進行。"],["游委員顥：那沒關係，院長，我直接接著請教，因為部長也在您的旁邊。因為調漲的部分會影響公共運輸的交通成本，公車、計程車以及油價這三類會不會調漲？"],["陳院長建仁：剛才我已經講過，公車的部分如果是買TPASS的話，那是不會調漲的，剛才我有講過……"],["游委員顥：你說不會調漲嘛！"],["陳院長建仁：剛才我已經講過了。"],["游委員顥：有信心穩住嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：油價的部分，到目前為止，它有一個浮動的費率，你也知道油價……"],["游委員顥：我知道、我知道！"],["陳院長建仁：我們一直有在做相關的……"],["游委員顥：計程車呢？"],["陳院長建仁：計程車的部分，目前……"],["王部長國材：最重要的是用電的影響比較大啦！"],["陳院長建仁：對啦，燃油……"],["王部長國材：燃油是隨著油價的，用電的比較……"],["陳院長建仁：我想大家都很清楚，當調整電費的時候，燃油的交通工具基本上是沒有漲價的基礎啦！"],["游委員顥：那我這樣子講好了，本席在這裡也希望院長、部長，在所謂民生物價上漲的時候，因為今天是交通組的質詢，公共交通運輸的成本，希望行政院跟交通部能夠確保剛才所提的這幾個，還有關於民生的部分，能夠特別不要去漲，因為包括客運的部分，能夠補貼的部分，也不要因為這樣而去減少班次，因為這是非常重要的，同樣的，那個……"],["陳院長建仁：我在這裡也要呼籲民眾盡可能的使用TPASS的系統，這樣的話，在使用大眾運輸工具的時候就不會受到影響。"],["游委員顥：這個我知道。但是我同樣地要問一下，就目前來講，穩定物價小組是多久開一次會？"],["陳院長建仁：穩定物價小組是由我們行政院的副院長來召開相關的會議。"],["游委員顥：所以是一個月召開一次嘛？原本三個月改為一個月召開一次？"],["陳院長建仁：是。"],["游委員顥：我想問一下，民眾對於這個穩定物價小組沒有信心的原因，目前來講連它的會議紀錄，在網路上面公布的還停留在去年12月，就連新聞稿也還是停留在1月，如果像這樣的進度、這樣的討論，如何能夠讓民眾對於穩定物價是有信心的？"],["陳院長建仁：相關的新聞稿還有網頁的部分，我回去瞭解一下，再跟委員做報告。"],["游委員顥：好。接著就是在目前來講，我記得院長你上任的時候曾經做的第一個重大措施，你記得是什麼政策嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：當時有一個紓困特別條例，你指的是這個嗎？"],["游委員顥：不是，我指的是那時候超徵稅收3,800億嘛……"],["陳院長建仁：對啊……疫後特別條例……"],["游委員顥：那時候有進行一個現金券的部分嘛。我想問一下……"],["陳院長建仁：對，委員，是這樣子，這是因為疫後特別條例完了以後就有疫後特別預算，那裡面就有普發現金6,000元……"],["游委員顥：疫後特別條例這個部分我知道，那今年的部分就不發了嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：通常是這樣，政府如果要普發現金的時候就要看歲入歲出的盈餘有多少，那在前前一年的時候，我們歲入歲出的盈餘高達將近5,000億，我們再扣掉政府應該要還的借債的部分，我們還有3,800億的剩餘，所以我們有能力。那今年歲入歲出的盈餘大概在……"],["游委員顥：3,860億。"],["陳院長建仁：2,800多億，2,800多億再扣掉5%要來還債，剩下來的部分大概只有1,000到1,500億左右，所以沒有能力，因為我們普發一次6,000元的話就要有1,440億的經費。"],["游委員顥：本席是建議，因為去年發的時間點是敏感的，因為去年的話是選舉年嘛，所以說……"],["陳院長建仁：這個跟選舉沒有關係啦，要有足夠的錢才能夠發……"],["游委員顥：你說跟選舉沒有關係，但是我坦白講，因為今天來講在疫情的話，它這種景氣循環以及包括它的乘數效果來講，其實還是需要持續地去做這些刺激市場的措施，所以說在今年，你剛才講的，目前需要花費的金額跟超徵之後扣掉的金額其實是可以打平的情況之下，那你們今年就不打算去進行？"],["陳院長建仁：我想我剛才已經講過，因為今年的歲入歲出盈餘大概在2,760億，再扣掉1,200億用於還債的情形下只剩下1,500億，我們最主要的目標就是讓台電能夠得到補貼，要不然的話，電價就會像你講的一樣漲得更厲害，那當然物價就更不能夠控制，所以補貼台電很重要。第二個很重要的情形就是勞保，我想您也很知道勞保現在需要政府補貼的部分相當地大，如果這二個合在一起，可能1,500億就已經用完了。"],["游委員顥：沒關係，勞保跟國庫撥補的事，我會趁衛環組質詢的時候再跟您就教。","我就接著問我們地方的建設，一樣有請部長。其實今天來講我們不僅是代表南投的鄉親來進行質詢，反映我們的意見，在所謂的中捷來南投的這個議題上，我想請教一下院長，你上任到現在一年多將近兩年的時間，你有到過南投會勘或考察幾次？"],["陳院長建仁：南投的部分我已經有好幾次了。"],["游委員顥：有好幾次？"],["陳院長建仁：對。"],["游委員顥：那有針對中捷這個議題有特別……"],["陳院長建仁：中捷的議題是這樣子，捷運就我們的分工上來說是由地方政府提出相關的計畫，然後送到中央來審議，中央會按照它非自償的部分再給補助，所以中捷捷運延伸到南投這個議題，我想臺中市政府跟南投縣政府首先要做很好的溝通……"],["游委員顥：今天顏寬恒委員也有提出中捷的議題，所以我要呼應顏寬恒委員所提，目前來講我記得蔡英文在8年前他其實就開出這個政見，在4年前他同樣再提；在上一次賴清德他來南投中興新村的時候，他也再次提出這個問題。我們看這個資料，過去蔡總統提了許多部分，有很多都沒有兌現，那我就不一一列舉，我直接就教院長，對中捷的部分有沒有辦法做一個宣示？"],["陳院長建仁：好，關於中捷的部分，我剛才講得很清楚，捷運的發展是由地方政府提出來，我們也很希望地方政府儘快地提出來它的構想，我剛才講過，要提出這個構想，當然要跟南投縣來溝通、跟委員來溝通一樣。所以我們也很盼望，如果覺得中捷延伸到南投有必要，請臺中市政府趕快提出計畫，我們會加速審查。"],["游委員顥：我相信計畫會送過去，也希望院長到時候全力的支持中捷到南投，可以嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：委員，我跟您報告一下，這個計畫送來的時候，首先就是地方政府做可行性評估，在可行性評估以後才有細部……"],["游委員顥：院長，我知道這些過程，我都有參與，所以你就承諾可以的話會全力支持就好了。"],["陳院長建仁：那當然，如果可行性評估過了，是好的，當然就支持，這個計畫地方政府扮演很重要的角色，我舉一個例子，像中捷藍線就是拖了一段時間……"],["游委員顥：我只要確定院長你願意全力支持中捷到南投就可以，就沒有問題了。"],["陳院長建仁：地方政府要提出計畫。"],["游委員顥：地方政府一定提出，這一定會提出。"],["陳院長建仁：沒有喔！上次臺中藍線拖了一段時間。"],["游委員顥：南投縣政府會提出來。"],["陳院長建仁：我得要講事實。"],["游委員顥：院長，我剩下一點時間，我要問你，國道6號要打通南投、花蓮這個案子你支不支持？"],["陳院長建仁：對這個案子實際上我們有做過相關的評估，它的經費相當地可觀，高達八千多億元……"],["游委員顥：但是這個是非常……"],["陳院長建仁：我還沒有講完，這裡面還有兩個很重要的關鍵，第一個就是地質的穩定性，第二個就是生態環境的保護，所以在做相關的評估以後，我們才能夠去看，如果可行了，未來做完環境影響評估了，就要做投資效益，所以剛才我要跟你講的就是一步一步來的原因就是這樣。"],["游委員顥：這個我知道，部長，這個案子在技術上是可行的嘛？"],["王部長國材：現在我們在啟動一個地質地貌的調查，在115年會有結果，到那時候才知道剛才院長所提的那些環境敏感地帶能不能克服。"],["游委員顥：如果在技術上可行的話，院長願不願意正向支持此案？"],["陳院長建仁：這是一個假設的語氣，那如果是假設的話，就是可行性評估嘛！那就看可行性評估的結果，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝游顥委員的質詢，謝謝陳院長的備詢。","接下來我們請登記第14號林委員倩綺發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":132,"meet_id":"院會-11-1-6","speakers":["韓國瑜","陳超明","涂權吉","顏寬恒","廖先翔","吳琪銘","吳沛憶","游顥","林倩綺","葉元之","徐巧芯","陳冠廷","陳亭妃","羅明才","賴瑞隆","郭國文","黃捷","楊曜","王美惠","魯明哲","賴惠員","林楚茵","王世堅"],"page_start":38,"meetingDate":["2024-03-22"],"gazette_id":"1131401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1131401_00002","1131401_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期第6次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢─ 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我直接跟您問,其實這個電價的調漲啊,它帶動許多民生的一些物價的上漲,這是一定的,這是大家可以預期的。"},{"start":143.277,"end":158.549,"text":"所以說今年的話從一開始的話店家開始調漲之後我們可以預期今年的話大致上就是炒算一個漲字啦但是這個漲字來講的話不管結果怎麼樣大家要去迎迎要去面對所以就算今年的代表制是漲但是大家還是要嚴正以下來去面對你認不認同"},{"start":160.3,"end":180.43,"text":"我想我個人不認為漲勢一定會啦因為按照這個中央銀行的這個估計我們今年的CPI的成長的情況會比去年的2.49要來的低很多啦所以這是個人的見解不一樣我有尊重委員的見解但是證實間會不會漲我告訴院長好了就是說"},{"start":183.872,"end":199.604,"text":"那個帶動的漲其實就是不斷的那西門町有一家水煎包店你看一個水煎包目前來講你預計在西門町帶一個水煎包大概多少錢?我很少到西門町去但是我了解有人吃水煎包是28塊錢也有人吃12塊錢的"},{"start":200.845,"end":203.367,"text":"臺鐵的便當是不是也要調漲?臺鐵對於他自己的便當要不要漲價?我們尊重市場機制。"},{"start":228.945,"end":257.594,"text":"目前是高鐵啦,高鐵他提到要漲那高鐵的便當現在一個多少以及預計要調到多少他好像增加10塊錢所以現在一個多少110塊的便當所以說其實我坦白說以民生來講這個整個都會連著一起帶動那我接著就叫好了就是說像目前來講這整個帶動的調漲的話未來在所謂的台鐵的票價也會調漲是吧"},{"start":259.175,"end":285.401,"text":"台鐵是這樣子委員你可能比我還清楚台鐵29年沒有調這個票價最主要的原因他也是有他的政策的任務而且要讓大家能夠有很好的這一個通勤的便捷性但是台鐵我們剛才講過已經變成一個民營化的一個公司那我們會尊重這個民營化公司自己對於票價的調整當然他票價要調整的時候還要報到這一個"},{"start":287.481,"end":287.501,"text":"拜訪會議員"},{"start":311.837,"end":337.922,"text":"因為TPS的部分他會進行一些補貼那我清楚那台鐵的部分因為我跟院長說啊這個漲會不會成為今年的年度關鍵字啊其實取決也是在於行政院那如何能夠穩定物價穩定物價穩定的好那今年漲就不會是關鍵字代表字那如果穩定的不好那今年漲就是代表字沒有錯吧"},{"start":339.002,"end":359.01,"text":"對,見仁見智。我個人是認為按照中央銀行的長期趨勢的估計還有全球的經濟發展的狀況,我們大家的預期在今年度全球和台灣它的這個物價的CPI的增加的情況會比去年要好很多。所以說國家的角色,中央政府的角色他就扮演中央就是穩定物價。"},{"start":360.355,"end":373.039,"text":"對,當然我們穩定物價一直在進行。院長我直接接著請教,因為部長也在您的旁邊。因為這個調漲的部分它影響著公共運輸的交通成本。那在於公車以及計程車以及油價那這三類的話會不會調漲?"},{"start":378.89,"end":398.338,"text":"剛才已經講過公車的話,如果他是買TPAS的時候呢,那是不會調漲的嘛。那這個油價的部分,到目前為止,我們並沒有調漲的這個,他有一個浮動的匯率,你也知道這個油價,我們有一直有在做相關的這樣的"},{"start":399.258,"end":402.401,"text":"我想大家都很清楚,當調整電費的時候,燃油的這些交通工具基本上沒有漲價的基礎。"},{"start":423.678,"end":442.015,"text":"那我這樣子講好了就是本席在這裡也希望院長跟部長因為在這個所謂的民生的這個物價上漲的時候公共因為是今天交通組的質詢那公共交通運輸的成本那希望就是行政院這邊跟交通部能夠確保該所提的這幾個"},{"start":442.976,"end":443.276,"text":"這我知道。"},{"start":472.3,"end":484.029,"text":"但是我同樣的要問一下因為像目前來講穩定物價的小組是多久開始會?穩定物價小組是由我們行政院的副院長來召開相關的會議"},{"start":487.669,"end":514.365,"text":"所以說是一個月召開一次嘛。原本三個月改為一個月召開一次。是。那我想問一下,因為為什麼民眾對於這個穩定物價是沒有信心的原因是目前來講連他的會議記錄在網路上面公布的還在去年12月。就連新聞稿也還是停留在1月。那如果像是這樣子的一個進度,這樣子一個討論,如何能夠讓民眾他們對於穩定物價是有信心的。"},{"start":515.186,"end":536.944,"text":"這一個相關的新聞稿還有網頁的部分我可以去了解一下再跟委員做報告目前來講我記得院長你上任的時候曾經做了一個第一個重大措施你覺得是什麼政策當時有一個紓困特別條例"},{"start":537.881,"end":560.75,"text":"你指的是這個嗎?是,我指的是,那時候超收稅收,超徵稅收3800億嘛。對啊,那時候有進行的一個現金券的部分嘛。對,都是委員是這樣子。那我想問一下,那時候易厚特別條例,完了以後就易厚特別預算,那裡面就有這一個普發現金6000億。易厚特別條例的這個部分我知道。"},{"start":561.77,"end":575.736,"text":"今年的部分就不發了嗎?通常是這樣政府如果要普發現金的時候就要看稅入稅出的盈餘有多少那在前前一年的時候我們稅入稅出的盈餘高達到將近5000億"},{"start":577.697,"end":604.338,"text":"那我們在扣掉這個政府的應該要還的這個借債的這個部分我們還有3800億的剩餘所以我們有能力那今年呢稅率稅數盈餘大概在2800多那2800多再扣掉5%要來還債所以呢剩下來的部分大概只剩下1000到1500億左右那沒有能力因為我們花一次6000元的話就要有1440億的經費"},{"start":607.08,"end":632.368,"text":"我本席是建議啊,因為去年的時候發的時間點是敏感,因為去年的話是選舉年嘛。我說跟選舉沒有關係,但是我坦白講,因為今天來講在疫情的話他這種景氣循環以及包括他這個陳述來講,他其實還是需要持續的來去做這些刺激市場的一個措施啊。"},{"start":632.912,"end":645.46,"text":"那所以說在今年你剛才講的目前需要花費的這個金額跟剛才超徵之後扣掉的金額其實是可以打平的情況之下那你們今年就不打算來去進行"},{"start":646.805,"end":673.438,"text":"我想我剛才已經講過因為今年的稅入稅出盈餘大概在2760億再扣掉1200億的這一個還債的情形剩下1500億我們最主要的目標就是來讓臺電能夠得到補貼要不的話電價就會像你講的一樣漲得更厲害那當然這個物價就更不能夠控制所以這個補貼這個臺電很重要第二個很重要的情形就是勞保我想您也很知道這一個勞保現在的這一個"},{"start":675.179,"end":699.393,"text":"我也需要政府補貼的部分相當的大那如果這樣兩個合在一起可能1500億就已經用完了沒關係老保跟那個國庫撥補的事我政府未完的時候會再跟您就教那我就接著問我們地方的建設那一樣是有請部長那其實今天來講我們不僅是代表著南投的鄉親還來進行這個質詢還反映我們的意見"},{"start":704.394,"end":719.097,"text":"在這個所謂的終結來南投的這個議題,那我想請教一下院長,在你上任到現在1年多將近2年的時間,那你有到過南投會刊或考察幾次?"},{"start":719.497,"end":744.988,"text":"我去南投好幾次。好幾次?南投針對終結的這個議題有特別?終結的議題是這樣子,捷運在我們的分工上來說是由地方政府來提出相關的計畫,然後送到中央來審議。中央會按照他的這個非自償的部分再給補助。所以這個終結捷運的延伸到南投我想"},{"start":746.229,"end":774.631,"text":"台中市政府跟南龍蟹政府呢?今天在嚴寬恆委員他也有提出終結的部分那所以在呼籲嚴寬恆委員所提那目前來講我記得蔡英文她在8年前她其實就開出這個政見那在4年前她同樣在提那在上一次賴清德她來南投中興青春的時候她也再次提出這個問題那本席也知道說我們看這個資料"},{"start":775.732,"end":798.418,"text":"過去許多蔡總統他提的部分沒有兌現的有很多,那我就不一列舉,那我直接就叫院長,終結的部分有沒有辦法做一個宣示。好,終結的部分我剛才講的很清楚,捷運的發展是由地方政府提出來,我們也很希望這個地方政府盡快的提出來他的這個構想。"},{"start":800.019,"end":815.132,"text":"我剛才講過提出這個構想當然要跟南投縣來溝通跟委員來溝通一樣所以我們也很盼望如果覺得終結延伸到南投有必要請台中市政府趕快提出計畫我們會加速審查"},{"start":816.311,"end":842.473,"text":"那我相信計畫算過去也希望那個院長到時候是全力的支持終結到南投,可以嗎?如果計畫審查可信,這個委員我跟您報告一下,這個計畫來的時候首先呢就是地方政府做可信性評估,可信性評估以後才有參與。那所以說你就承諾說可以的話全力支持就好。那當然如果可信性評估過好,當然就支持。"},{"start":843.593,"end":864.561,"text":"這個計畫地方政府扮演很重要的角色。舉個例子,像中間南線就是拖了幾段...我只要確定院長你願意全力支持終結到南頭就可以,沒有問題。地方政府要提出計畫?地方政府一定提出啦,這一定提出啦。上次台中南線...我得要講事實。院長,那我覺得剩下一點時間,我要認明"},{"start":871.763,"end":890.619,"text":"國道6號要打通南投花蓮,這案你支持不支持?這一個案子實際上我們有做過相關的評估,它的經費相當的可觀。但是還沒有講完,這裡面還有兩個很重要的關鍵,第一個就是地質的穩定性,第二個就是生態環境的保護。"},{"start":891.34,"end":917.304,"text":"那在所以呢在做相關的評估以後我們才能夠去看說好可行了那未來要做這個環境影響評估完了要做投資效益所以剛才我要跟你講說一步一步來對我知道但是這一個案子在技術上部長是可行的嘛那個現在我們在啟動一個地質地貿的調查在115會有結果那時候才知道說剛才院長所提的那些環境敏感地帶"},{"start":917.904,"end":926.349,"text":"但是是能夠技術上可行的話,院長也不會正向支持此案?這個是一個假設語氣啦齁,那如果假設的話...謝謝"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}