{"error":false,"id":["150319"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":150319,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150319","日期":"2024-03-25","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-1-19-5","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":1,"會次":5,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[19],"委員會代碼:str":["經濟委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2024-03-25T09:51:10+08:00","結束時間":"2024-03-25T09:59:35+08:00","影片長度":"00:08:25","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3b2b855ee35a005b998ac4892a0a0b420ea6c444258f7e78f8ba9b0039caa7a60fcb2c0d88e7dc125ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw","委員發言時間":"09:51:10 - 09:59:35","會議時間":"2024-03-25T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查113年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於行政院主管：行政院國家發展基金、離島建設基金、花東地區永續發展基金及促進轉型正義基金。(詢答)\n二、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關國家發展委員會及所屬主管預算凍結案等7案。\n【3月25日及27日二天一次會】）","gazette":{"lineno":289,"blocks":[["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：（9時51分）主席、各位委員。有請主委。"],["主席：請龔主委。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：鄭委員好。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：主委好。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：早安，鄭委員。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：花東基金是今天審查的預算之一，花東地區發展條例第三條規定：「本條例主管機關，在中央為行政院」，花東基金的管理機關是國家發展委員會。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：對，管理機關是國發會。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：然後這個條例的主管機關，在縣為花蓮縣政府及臺東縣政府，因為主要是這兩個縣。花東地區發展條例第四條特別規定，中央主管機關也就是行政院，主要的任務就是訂定花東地區永續發展的策略計畫，在中央其實就是國發會主責。我們看花東地區發展條例第五條，縣主管機關應分別或共同依行政院所訂的花東地區永續發展策略計畫，擬訂四年一期之綜合發展實施方案，也就是說花蓮縣政府跟臺東縣政府要依這個行政院所訂的策略計畫訂綜合發展實施方案，而這個發展方案就是要考量到整個花蓮、臺東，之所以要依這個花東地區發展條例，就是因為花蓮、臺東跟西部有非常大的差距，所以要去加強這些很多需要建設、改善的地方。","我們看到國發會訂了一個簡化花東地區永續發展基金補助計畫運作機制，提供給鄉鎮市公所提案的一個機制，當然這個給鄉鎮市公所提案的機制，本席是支持的，但是如果按照這個機制，行動計畫及全期工作計畫書提案、審查、核定、修正、管考及經費撥付等程序，皆由行政院東部聯合服務中心主政及訂定。這個部分要請國發會再檢討，因為這個部分就剛才講的幾個花東地區發展條例的條文，中央跟縣的一個分際……","然後我們看這個，行政院東部聯合服務中心設置要點規定，該中心的任務是協調各部會、協調地方政府，它只有協調，協調各部會宣導相關政策、計畫及施政成果，因為它不是一個正式的組織，在整個行政院裡面，它只不過是一個臨時性的，不是正式的組織，所以這個部分給它這樣的一個權責，我認為從花東地區發展條例而言、從行政院東部聯合服務中心的職掌而言，都是逾越了，因為畢竟花蓮縣政府、臺東縣政府要整體去看整個狀況，不管是從權責或者是從行政機關的組織體系來看，都應該要去檢討、要去改善，可以嗎？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：委員，我可以說明一下嗎？"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：好，請。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：這個的確是這樣，因為它的服務能量真的是有限，所以我們在109年的時候已經改變了這個提案機制，這個審議的過程或是核定的過程已經回到行政院，就是由我們國發會來處理了。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：所以這個要改了？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：對，109年已經改了。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：不是，我是上你們的網站看到的。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：實際的運作已經改掉。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：已經改了喔？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：是。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：因為從網站上看還是這個。好，我們看這個作業手冊，這個我也常提到，在前年跟去年都分別提了，就是花東基金要落實「公務為主、基金為輔」的原則。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：是。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：謝謝國發會有聽進去了，為了這個在去年7月10號召開了會議，花蓮縣及臺東縣的部落聚會所興建經費，改由原民會的宜居部落建設計畫及花東基金來負擔支應，而且你們因應這個，也特別給宜居部落建設計畫增加了1億的經費，要謝謝國發會！","現在原民會根據這個提出了花東地區原住民族部落聚會所興建行動計畫，但現在已經是3月下旬了，還沒有核定，後面整個因應、整個執行會受到很大的影響。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：是，報告委員，因為我們已經復院了，就是我們國發會的部分已經復院了，院那邊可能還是要做行政作業，我們來詢問行政院那邊看看，因為我們是3月14號就已經復院了，當然行政院……"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：3月14號已經送到行政院了？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：對。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：好。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：行政院當然有它的行政程序，可能還要一段時間，但是很快就會核定。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：好的，那我瞭解，謝謝國發會。","再來，主委要看一下，今天在樓上，交通委員會在審查花東快速公路的一個法律案。交通部的報告裡面提到，「現行花東地區發展條例規定，花東地區綜合發展實施方案內容涵蓋交通建設，並已設置花東地區永續發展基金推動相關發展事項，爰本案相關交通建設需求，可納入既有的花東地區發展條例辦理，無需另行設置花東快速公路建設發展基金。」這個主委可以支持嗎？有跟你們討論嗎？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：報告委員，您剛才提到花東基金主要是公務為主，花東基金為輔嘛。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：對。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：所以它沒有辦法容納這麼大的案子，主要還是以交通部自己的這個大案子，它要在那邊……"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：所以這個……"],["龔主任委員明鑫：我們這個基金可能沒有辦法容納。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：交通部寫這個意見的時候，沒有先跟你們討論？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：我們事後有看到，但是我們有表達，因為我們現在才兩百多億，主要是以公務為主，基金為輔，而且我們要容納的項目有十幾、二十項，不單單只是教育一項而已。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：好，不是教育，是快速公路，花東快速公路。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：對，花東快速公路。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：好，那我瞭解國發會的意見了，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝鄭天財委員。","接下來我們請羅明才委員發言，羅明才委員、羅明才委員不在。","請呂玉玲委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":242,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-19-5","speakers":["邱議瑩","邱志偉","張啓楷","謝衣鳯","鄭天財Sra 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