{"error":false,"id":["150498"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":150498,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150498","日期":"2024-03-27","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-1-35-9","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第9次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":1,"會次":9,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[35],"委員會代碼:str":["外交及國防委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第9次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2024-03-27T11:36:50+08:00","結束時間":"2024-03-27T11:42:42+08:00","影片長度":"00:05:52","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/9baf490faf5eb4d5d79a993f0577cea4f9597c3f3f044368f8ba9b0039caa7a6849987ba386f8b6b5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"林德福","委員發言時間":"11:36:50 - 11:42:42","會議時間":"2024-03-27T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第9次全體委員會議（事由：邀請國防部部長報告「國軍無人機運用的現況及發展」，併請行政院國土安全辦公室列席，並備質詢。）","gazette":{"lineno":566,"blocks":[["林委員德福：（11時36分）謝謝主席。請邱部長。"],["主席：請邱國正部長。"],["邱部長國正：林委員好。"],["林委員德福：部長你好。根據媒體報導，南韓為了國防需求，另外成立無人機作戰司令部，直屬單位就是南韓國防部，由陸海空軍以及海軍陸戰隊構成，為南韓首支協同作戰部隊。本席認同備戰而不啟戰，本席也支持發展、運用無人機防禦作戰，請問部長，關於作戰編制，是否會因為未來擴大運用無人機而成立無人機指揮部？會不會啊？"],["邱部長國正：我跟委員報告，我們大概沒有打算另外再作一個編制，但是這項任務一定要有單位執行，所以我們從任務方面考量，至於既有編制要執行這個任務的是哪幾個單位就要再作考慮，會比較周延一點。"],["林委員德福：是這樣喔？"],["邱部長國正：是。"],["林委員德福：媒體報導，未來可能面臨沒有足夠飛官駕駛F-16戰機的情況。情況若沒有改善，為了避免攔截防衛任務造成飛官過勞，請問部長，除了應用防空飛彈對應攔截外，騰雲無人機是否有能力因應攔截敵機任務？"],["邱部長國正：騰雲將來也是選項之一，但不能取代。就跟我們作兵棋推演一樣，就算兵推半天，也不是兵推完就代表作戰完了，當然不能！所以同樣的，無人機的運用是多功能選項之一，可以取代某一部分、彌補其不足，但不能完全取代任務，這是不可改變的。"],["林委員德福：部長，無人機跟電子戰兩者互相影響，臺灣縱深不足，一旦開戰，如何突破電子干擾？如何避免無人機地面控制站被鎖定攻擊？對於這些相關防禦措施，請部長要好好規劃，規劃好以後再作簡要說明。部長？"],["邱部長國正：好，我了解。對於整體防衛問題，從偵蒐上要怎樣防止偵蒐被破壞，到最後戰力發揮上要怎樣防止對方阻斷我們的戰力發揮的全面規劃，我可以派員跟委員作很詳盡的說明。"],["林委員德福：我國阿帕契攻擊直升機俗稱坦克殺手，如今在俄烏戰爭中，無人機運用也重創許多坦克，請問部長，阿帕契攻擊直升機的防禦任務未來是否會被無人機所取代？會不會？"],["邱部長國正：我剛才有跟委員報告，很多東西論取代不可能完全取代，而是彌補不足。若要講完全取代，有一定的商榷餘地，我不能承諾啦！"],["林委員德福：另外，我國向美國採購艾布蘭坦克，2024年將接裝首批38輛，請問邱部長，艾布蘭坦克有能力單獨應對無人機的威脅嗎？"],["邱部長國正：我本身是裝甲兵，所以很清楚防空是任何部隊都要做的。戰車防空比一般野戰防空稍微好一點，就是可以自己掌控火力等等，但是防空方面的作為再怎麼強，畢竟也是消極性的，所以戰車還是有它的弱點。"],["林委員德福：那未來這些戰車有沒有相關防禦、反制措施？"],["邱部長國正：委員是針對防空方面嗎？"],["林委員德福：對。"],["邱部長國正：它有雷達嗎？沒有吧？"],["陳參謀長建義：報告委員，戰車方面的防空還是要靠整個情資的掌握，並結合戰力保存、地勤運用還有隊形變換。基本上，每種武器都有其強項，也有需要克服的地方。以上報告。"],["林委員德福：部長，如果義務役男具有無人機等操作證，入營後選兵時，義務役役男是否可以藉此參加專長甄選，發揮其無人機操作專長，以延續其民間專業職能？"],["邱部長國正：是，我跟委員報告，上回改為1年役期當中附帶講到過，原則上，對於他要分到哪一個部隊，若因為他具備某些專長、也有意願，我們可以看看，經過驗測以後，可以如願做他在專業方面能充分發揮的工作。"],["林委員德福：邱部長，本席再建議，教召訓練除了打靶、急救訓練外，也應該增加無人機課程的訓練，是否能請國防部思考其可行性？"],["邱部長國正：可以啊！這類課程安排本來就是看到目前有什麼狀況、有欠缺的，把它加進來的吧！"],["林委員德福：對啊！"],["邱部長國正：當然時間方面也要考量嘛！當初為什麼要強化打靶這些技能？就是因為不足嘛！所以要加強。雖然那邊也要加強，但時間就只有這麼多，若那邊要增加，這邊就一定要減少，我們會全盤考量。"],["林委員德福：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝林德福委員，部長與各位請回。","接下來進行詢答的委員是羅智強委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":150,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-35-9","speakers":["王定宇","黃仁","羅美玲","徐巧芯","林楚茵","沈伯洋","洪申翰","陳永康","陳冠廷","馬文君","林德福","羅智強","鍾佳濱","賴士葆","楊瓊瓔","林憶君","張啓楷","王鴻薇"],"page_start":95,"meetingDate":["2024-03-27"],"gazette_id":"1132001","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1132001_00007"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第9次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請國防部部長報告「國軍無人機運用的現況及發展」，併請行政院國土安全辦公室列席，並備\n質詢","agenda_id":"1132001_00016"}},"transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":0.63846875,"end":3.00096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":3.1697187500000004,"end":4.26659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":12.72096875,"end":13.379093750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":13.227218750000002,"end":27.469718750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":27.85784375,"end":31.739093750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":32.127218750000004,"end":35.94096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":35.99159375,"end":36.53159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":36.88596875,"end":42.40409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":42.775343750000005,"end":43.197218750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":44.07471875,"end":44.766593750000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":45.711593750000006,"end":54.469718750000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":54.469718750000006,"end":61.219718750000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":61.59096875,"end":70.09596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":70.09596875,"end":70.77096875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":70.77096875000001,"end":71.12534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":71.12534375,"end":71.96909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":72.45846875000001,"end":87.15659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":87.49409375,"end":90.04221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":90.29534375,"end":91.83096875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":92.57346875,"end":100.60596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":100.60596875,"end":100.70721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":101.36534375000001,"end":124.55159375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":123.08346875000001,"end":123.55596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":124.14659375000001,"end":126.18846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":126.99846875000001,"end":149.17221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":150.23534375,"end":150.77534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":150.77534375000002,"end":150.82596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":150.97784375,"end":158.85846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":159.31409375,"end":169.86096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":169.57409375,"end":170.06346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":170.83971875,"end":175.93596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":176.30721875,"end":181.31909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":182.23034375,"end":182.68596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":183.14159375,"end":189.26721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":189.90846875000003,"end":190.49909375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":189.99284375000002,"end":190.68471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":190.71846875,"end":190.73534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":190.75221875000003,"end":203.54346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":203.54346875000002,"en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