{"error":false,"id":["151012"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":151012,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151012","日期":"2024-04-10","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-1-22-7","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第7次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":1,"會次":7,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[22],"委員會代碼:str":["教育及文化委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第7次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2024-04-10T13:13:43+08:00","結束時間":"2024-04-10T13:20:12+08:00","影片長度":"00:06:29","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/871d5246fb87948ea056144bd8b89fef2d211db49933aca9f8ba9b0039caa7a6560d3afac99f33c35ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"黃國昌","委員發言時間":"13:13:43 - 13:20:12","會議時間":"2024-04-10T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第7次全體委員會議（事由：邀請教育部列席就「『擴大幼兒教保公共化』成效及未來策略」進行專題報告，並備質詢。（4月10日及11日二天一次會））","gazette":{"lineno":1536,"blocks":[["黃委員國昌：（13時13分）謝謝主席，麻煩有請次長以及體育署的副署長。"],["主席：好。有請林次長跟體育署房副署長。"],["林次長明裕：委員好。"],["黃委員國昌：兩位好。因為時間的關係，等一下如果有問題次長不熟的話，請副署長代為回答，沒有問題。"],["林次長明裕：好，是。"],["黃委員國昌：我對於我們的政府大力獎助迷你足協，推廣足球這件事，我是贊成的，我自己的老大，小時候都有在踢足球，這對小朋友是好事，對我們國家發展足球，也是好事，所以體育署每年補助迷你足協，每年都上千萬，每年都上千萬，但我有一個原則，國家的補助是要用在小朋友的身上，是要用在這個運動身上，而不是說，反正花的是納稅人的錢，又不是我的錢，愛怎麼胡搞瞎搞都可以。我接到檢舉說迷你足協很誇張，每一年從政府拿那麼多的錢，結果都是同一批人在把持，背後有政治人物當靠山。我接到檢舉以後，我一定要實事求是，所以我請體育署去調資料，調出來的資料，讓我大驚失色，請副署長仔細地看一下，你們體育署提供的資料，光同一個年度迷你足協核銷的資料，可以前後不一致。你們的核銷表是怎麼樣？先做一份給我。你們發現3月26日做給我的核銷表有問題，一個便當要250元，就趕快在4月2日再給我另外一份資料，然後寫一個便當單價250元的部分沒了，只有寫便當乙式，副署長，這是怎麼回事？公文書還可以這樣子隨便變造內容喔？我全部都框起來了啦。請副署長解釋。體育署的人做的公文書是怎麼樣？在遮掩什麼？可以這樣變造喔？請說明。"],["房副署長瑞文：報告委員，這應該是迷你足球協會函報體育署來核銷的資料，我們可以核銷的便當費餐費，按照規定的話就是100元，其他如果有多出來的，可能就是要麻煩協會自籌。"],["黃委員國昌：你沒有回答我的問題。你們提供給我的資料是兩份，同一個比賽，同一個年度，補助上千萬，結果核銷表的內容還可以不一致，還可以自己調整，怎麼回事？要不要查？副署長。"],["房副署長瑞文：右手邊這個應該是總價的部分，我們會針對這個案子進一步再查、進一步再查證。"],["黃委員國昌：你不要再拗了，可以不要再拗了嗎？我進一步看，上面很奇怪，寫單價250元，結果我去看收據，只有80元，怎麼寫的？可以這樣搞嗎？副署長。"],["房副署長瑞文：沒有，這個東西可能還是要核實來做核銷的動作。"],["黃委員國昌：如果沒有核實，要不要移送法辦？"],["房副署長瑞文：這個我們會深入來查。"],["黃委員國昌：需要多久？不要講空話啦。深入來查要多久？兩個禮拜夠不夠？可以吧？"],["房副署長瑞文：這個案子我們來做專案的查核。"],["黃委員國昌：兩個禮拜查清楚。"],["房副署長瑞文：我們專案來查核，我們請會計師一併陪同。"],["黃委員國昌：接下來請你一樣一樣看清楚。結果我就覺得這個迷你足球協會太厲害了，在全國各地，從北到南，從以前到現在，便當均一價80元，沒有別的價格。真的，我查了每一張收據，從北到南，從以前到現在，只有一個價格──80元，好像全臺灣都是統一，便當不可以賣60，不可以賣100，全國均一價，所以我就一家店、一家店去查，我就看說，奇怪，這不是豆漿店嗎？怎麼會有便當？所以我就派了同仁去現場看，去現場看完了以後，他說：「老師，我買不到便當。」我說：「為什麼買不到便當？」他說：「這是豆漿店，中午根本就沒有開。」這是怎麼回事啊？這是拿發票來報帳嗎？這是拿發票來報帳嗎？可以這樣做嗎？更離譜的事情是什麼？看一下，我查了跟他們往來的廠商，全部幾乎都是迷你足協的自己人，自己在外面開公司，迷你足協拿國家的補助款，自己再接迷你足協的生意，副署長，可以這樣幹嗎？國家的補助款可以這樣花嗎？請回答。"],["房副署長瑞文：我們這個還是要利益迴避，還是要利益迴避，針對這個個案……"],["黃委員國昌：這樣有利益迴避嗎？"],["房副署長瑞文：所以針對這個案子，我們會再深入來查。"],["黃委員國昌：該追回來的錢追回來。"],["房副署長瑞文：是。"],["黃委員國昌：主席站出來了。我只是要你調查要澈底。"],["房副署長瑞文：是。"],["黃委員國昌：我最後再給你看，這很奇怪，除了全部都是自己人，這個臺北足球工作室很厲害，我看了發票，這個臺北足球工作室從運費到發電機，統統都有賣，不僅從運費到發電機統統都有賣，從場地費到舞台費，統統都可以包，這個是一個全能的廠商，什麼都有賣啊。結果我去查臺北足球工作室核銷的廠商負責人，跟迷你足協的經手人竟然是同一個人，這個有做到利益迴避嗎？可以這樣幹嗎？單據上面的經手人，就是臺北足球工作室的負責人，這個有做到利益迴避嗎？2個禮拜徹查清楚。"],["房副署長瑞文：委員，我們會對這個案子進行專案查核。"],["黃委員國昌：胡搞瞎搞，納稅人的錢不是這樣搞的。"],["主席：謝謝黃國昌委員。","接下來請羅智強委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":320,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-22-7","speakers":["林宜瑾","洪孟楷","柯志恩","萬美玲","葛如鈞","羅廷瑋","吳沛憶","郭昱晴","陳培瑜","葉元之","陳秀寳","張雅琳","吳春城","林倩綺","范雲","李坤城","鍾佳濱","鄭天財Sra 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可以這樣幹嗎?國家的補助款可以這樣花嗎?"},{"start":311.591,"end":327.516,"text":"請回答我們這個還是要有那個利益迴避啦還是要利益迴避阿這個針對這個個案是要有利益迴避嗎所以針對這個案子我們會再深度來查該做回來的全做回來主席站出來了我只要讓你調查要徹底我最後再給你看"},{"start":328.596,"end":353.881,"text":"這很奇怪除了全部都自己人喔這個臺北足球工作室很厲害我看了發票這個臺北足球工作室喔從運費到發電機通通都有賣不僅從運費到發電機通通都有賣從場地費到舞台費他通通都可以包這個是個全能的廠商啊什麼都有賣啊結果我去查臺北足球工作室合宵"},{"start":354.761,"end":377.775,"text":"的廠商負責人．跟迷你足協的經手人．竟然是同一個人．這個有做到利益迴避嗎．可以這樣幹嗎．他自己上面的單據的經手人．就是臺北足球工作室的負責人．這個有做到利益迴避嗎．兩個禮拜側查清楚．胡搞瞎搞．納稅的錢不是這樣搞的．"},{"start":386.447,"end":386.707,"text":"謝謝黃國昌委員"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}