{"error":false,"id":["151729"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":151729,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151729","日期":"2024-04-25","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-1-26-13","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":1,"會次":13,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[26],"委員會代碼:str":["社會福利及衛生環境委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2024-04-25T09:52:11+08:00","結束時間":"2024-04-25T10:02:38+08:00","影片長度":"00:10:27","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/37a05b44d500ce155f5cd8d7d7b8f7e4c97d93183120460dc68e374cd8c4bed0092caf3064e3a5735ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"邱鎮軍","委員發言時間":"09:52:11 - 10:02:38","會議時間":"2024-04-25T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議（事由：邀請勞動部部長、法務部、原住民族委員會、內政部、衛生福利部就「就業服務法上路逾三十年，針對就業促進、歧視禁止、外國勞動力權益保障等面向進行全面檢視」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n【4月22日、24日及25日三天一次會】）","gazette":{"lineno":385,"blocks":[["邱委員鎮軍：（9時52分）主席好，請勞動部許部長。"],["主席：請許部長。"],["許部長銘春：邱委員好。"],["邱委員鎮軍：部長好。部長，你作為史上任期最長的勞動部長，當然我很遺憾你沒有留任，你上次說到我們最急迫需要推動的重大政策，包括勞保年金改革、失聯移工、低薪等問題。我想請問部長，520之後，對於新任的部長你有什麼看法，有沒有什麼期待？"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，我在勞動部長任內有針對很多的法案跟政策，不管在跟行政院討論或者跟立法院討論，其實現在的何副秘、未來的何準部長都有參與，而且在過程中……"],["邱委員鎮軍：所以你對他有信心嗎？"],["許部長銘春：我對他是有信心的，他對勞動政策並不陌生，而且他會站在勞工的立場來維護勞工的權益，所以我期許他能夠秉持這樣的一個態度來為我們勞方站出立場。"],["邱委員鎮軍：這樣子啦！我們勞團的印象都停留在賴清德準總統在擔任行政院長任內二度修正勞基法的強勢態度，你認為他上任之後的當務之急是什麼？"],["許部長銘春：這個……"],["邱委員鎮軍：有沒有必要修補與勞團間的不同聲音或意見？"],["許部長銘春：對，我覺得這是很重要的一件事情，現在當然大家可能對他過去因為角色或職務的關係，有一些認為或許不符合大家的期待……"],["邱委員鎮軍：所以部長覺得……"],["許部長銘春：我覺得他應該去跟大家做一些面對面的溝通，說明他未來……"],["邱委員鎮軍：你覺得我剛剛提的那些重大政策，他會繼續延續嗎？"],["許部長銘春：我想勞動部的政策都會有一貫的規劃，新部長上來當然……"],["邱委員鎮軍：會不會因為你離開之後，這些都不動了？"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，因為這個部分都是現在最迫切的問題，我想新的部長上來，他也會邀集相關的業務單位主管來瞭解，然後也會去做一些看未來要怎麼來解決，會有他自己的想法。"],["邱委員鎮軍：你看勞保年金的改革已經拖了8年，當然部長也認為這是很需要推動的業務，那麼新的部長會不會真心推動勞保年金的改革，還是繼續財務的撥補？"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，我想撥補是一定要持續啦！撥補這個問題……"],["邱委員鎮軍：問題是已經拖了8年啊！"],["許部長銘春：改革也一定要去面對，這個我一直在說明，其實不是願意這樣子拖，而是這個涉及的勞工人數已經達到千萬人，然後包括事業單位60萬，而且各階層的勞工都不同……"],["邱委員鎮軍：對，這個事情是比較複雜，沒錯，但不能因為它複雜而一直拖啊！對不對？"],["許部長銘春：就因為複雜，所以大家必須多去溝通，然後去求取最大的共識後再來處理。"],["邱委員鎮軍：所以要幾年？一年、兩年、三年、四年？"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，這個我恐怕沒辦法代替他來回答啦！"],["邱委員鎮軍：對嘛！我們當然不是喊口號，我不希望勞保年金的改革是用喊口號的方式來拖，我也希望部長能夠把這樣一個重要的政策繼續交接下去，讓新的部長能夠繼續完成，你可以做到嗎？"],["許部長銘春：可以。"],["邱委員鎮軍：好。再來請問部長，基層農民非常關心的農務移工辦理進度，上次你有跟本席談到是採外展模式，由農會代農民提出申請，請問一下目前辦理的情形是如何？"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，我這邊手上的資料是1萬2農業部已經核准了5,700人。"],["邱委員鎮軍：總共5,700人？"],["許部長銘春：對，大概有將近一半，我們現在開放1萬2，它現在核准5,700。"],["邱委員鎮軍：差不多啦！我調閱資料，發現到3月底的實際農業移工只有6,194人，其中外展農務移工只較去年6月底增加750人，我請問一下部長，外展農務移工新增申請數為什麼會這麼少？實際增加為什麼這麼緩慢？是不是因為我們的申請方式讓這些農民覺得不方便？"],["許部長銘春：沒有、沒有，因為現在是透過農會或合作社來擔任雇主……"],["邱委員鎮軍：因為農會……"],["許部長銘春：他們意願比較不高啦！"],["邱委員鎮軍：是農會意願不高，而不是農民意願不高，你懂我的意思嗎？"],["許部長銘春：是，是農會意願不高。"],["邱委員鎮軍：對，因為農會是多一事不如少一事啦！"],["許部長銘春：是啦！"],["邱委員鎮軍：所以我覺得部長是不是有必要調整這樣的政策？"],["許部長銘春：跟委員報告，我也跟農業部部長反映過，就是……"],["邱委員鎮軍：這個政策的宗旨、目的就是為了要照顧我們的農民，對不對？"],["許部長銘春：對。"],["邱委員鎮軍：如果轉嫁到農會，等於農會多了一個業務，所以沒有人要去負擔這個責任，你懂我的意思嗎？尤其現在不管是移工也好，或是農事移工也好，幾乎都會面臨移工逃跑的問題，都會有吧，對不對？所以沒有人要去承擔這個責任，是不是你們要再調整一下這個作法，讓真正需要的農民能夠更方便、更便捷地爭取到農事移工？"],["許部長銘春：我們再來跟農業部討論，針對它在推動上可能遇到的一些困難或瓶頸，大家再來檢討看看，看怎麼樣讓農民能夠……"],["邱委員鎮軍：希望部長針對這個事情能夠多用心一點，好不好？"],["許部長銘春：是。"],["邱委員鎮軍：另外，開放印度移工的部分，勞動部昨天也透露4月底將召開國內諮詢會議，會邀請相關的團體、部會及臺印學者，討論未來將開放的行業與名額。現在要開會了，請問勞動部預計提報多少名額到會議上討論？"],["許部長銘春：不是，報告委員，那個名額是各部會去評估其需求，因為我們是負責去跟印度談判，但是需求是各個目的事業主管機關……"],["邱委員鎮軍：我知道，除了營造業、製造業，還有家事工……"],["許部長銘春：去認為它有多少需求，所以這個需求不是我來決定，而是各部會……"],["邱委員鎮軍：你會邀請哪些單位來？"],["許部長銘春：各部會啊！包括內政部、農業部、衛福部、經濟部都會邀請。"],["邱委員鎮軍：增加勞工的對象是營造業、製造業，還是家事工業？"],["許部長銘春：現行開放的都是我們的對象，我們……"],["邱委員鎮軍：像觀光的一些產業呢？如飯店。"],["許部長銘春：那個目前不是開放的對象，服務業沒有開放喔！"],["邱委員鎮軍：服務業都沒有開放？"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，現在服務業沒有開放。"],["邱委員鎮軍：為什麼沒有開放？"],["許部長銘春：基本上是以本國人就業為優先，而不足的部分再引進外籍移工來填補，目前以國內服務業來講，歷來都是國人最常就業的工作，像中高齡或者婦女，我們必須保障他們的工作機會，所以服務業沒有開放。"],["邱委員鎮軍：對，我們當然知道啦！有很多服務業，其實有一些像我們開放外籍學生打工，他們也有很多都跑到服務業嘛！"],["許部長銘春：工讀可以啊！"],["邱委員鎮軍：對嘛！"],["許部長銘春：那是工讀，工讀是沒有限制，但……"],["邱委員鎮軍：對於開放印度勞工的政策，外界還有許多疑慮，希望勞動部儘速地對外說明……"],["許部長銘春：對，所以我們要透過諮詢會嘛！"],["邱委員鎮軍：讓外界安心……"],["許部長銘春：讓大家來對話。"],["邱委員鎮軍：所以這個會議儘早開啦，好不好？"],["許部長銘春：下禮拜就要開啦！"],["邱委員鎮軍：也要能夠實際改善我們國內的缺工情形。"],["許部長銘春：對，報告委員，我們下個禮拜就要開諮詢會了，我們也是透過社會對話來化解大家的疑慮。"],["邱委員鎮軍：因為時間不太夠，我再問下一個，我們國內15到24歲的青年失業率居高不下，相較於其他OECD的國家，在疫情期間飆升到15.2%，疫情後就大幅改善，降到10%左右，我國前幾年的失業率，幾乎都是11%或12%……"],["許部長銘春：沒有！沒有！我們的青年失業率沒有這麼高。"],["邱委員鎮軍：沒有嗎？"],["許部長銘春：沒有！沒有！報告委員……"],["邱委員鎮軍：我們查到的資料是這樣子。"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，我們的青年失業率在去年降到8.01%，這是歷年來的最低。"],["邱委員鎮軍：已經到最低了。"],["許部長銘春：對，這是金融海嘯以來最低的。"],["邱委員鎮軍：好。我想請問一下，青年就業投資方案第1期我們投入了95億，目標是讓青年的失業率降到2倍以下，目前的狀況是怎麼樣呢？"],["許部長銘春：大概是2.28。"],["邱委員鎮軍：還有一段距離要努力。"],["許部長銘春：當然要再努力，報告委員，其實我們經歷了3年的疫情，我們的青年失業率不但沒有飆高還降低，這其實也是要給勞動部鼓勵一下，我們真的很努力啦！"],["邱委員鎮軍：好啦！你們第2期馬上就要開始了。"],["許部長銘春：對啊！"],["邱委員鎮軍：希望你們能夠更積極，尤其是我們青年失業的問題，一定要儘快來解決，好不好？"],["許部長銘春：好。"],["邱委員鎮軍：謝謝部長。"],["許部長銘春：謝謝。"],["主席（王委員正旭代）：謝謝邱委員的發言。下一位我們請黃秀芳委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":424,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-26-13","speakers":["黃秀芳","陳昭姿","林月琴","王育敏","陳菁徽","邱鎮軍","涂權吉","王正旭","蘇清泉","鄭天財Sra 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要照顧我們的農民,對不對?如果你轉嫁到農會,等於農會多了一個業務,所以沒有人要去負擔這個責任,你懂我意思嗎?尤其現在,我們的移工也好,不管是農事移工也好,幾乎都會面臨移工逃跑的問題。"},{"start":352.594,"end":367.319,"text":"都會有吧?對不對?所以沒有人要去承擔這個責任。那是不是我們要再調整一下這個做法,讓我們真正需要的農民能夠更方便、更便捷,能夠爭取到我們的農事的移工?"},{"start":367.884,"end":370.026,"text":"另外,我們開放印度移工的部分,"},{"start":385.339,"end":406.321,"text":"勞動部昨天也透露4月底將召開國內諮詢的會議會邀請我們相關的團體、部會以及台印的學者討論未來開放的行業與名額那現在要開會了請問勞動部預計提報多少名額到會議討論不是,報告委員那個名額是各"},{"start":407.489,"end":423.567,"text":"好各部會他去評估他的需求因為這個我們是負責去跟這個印度這邊來談判但是需求是各個主管單位那我知道除了營造業嘛他去認為他有多少需求所以這個需求不是我來決定"},{"start":425.068,"end":453.943,"text":"您會邀請哪些單位來?部會啊,包括你看內政部、農業部、衛福部、經濟部都會邀請。增加勞工的這個對象是我們的營造業還是製造業還是家事、工業?我們現行開放的都是我們的對象。像我們的一些觀光的一些產業?沒有,那個目前不是開放的對象。我們服務業沒有開放喔。我們現在服務業沒有開放。為什麼沒有開放?"},{"start":455.774,"end":473.39,"text":"呃基本上我我我們是這樣就是說你的開放就本國人就業優先嗎那不足的部分再再引進那個外籍移工來填補嗎那目前以國內服務來講歷來都是國人最最"},{"start":475.43,"end":496.198,"text":"經常去就業的一個工作,中高齡啊,或者婦女啊,那我們必須保障他的工作機會啊。所以我們服務業沒有可以開放。當然知道啦,有很多服務業其實有一些像學校,像學校他們這些交換學生,那個我們開放外籍學生的部分他們打工,也很多都跑到服務業嘛。"},{"start":497.859,"end":505.162,"text":"我們開放印度勞工的政策,外界還有許多疑慮。我想勞動部這邊希望能夠進行...所以我們要透過諮詢會,大家來對話。所以我們這個會議儘早開。"},{"start":518.528,"end":541.741,"text":"我也要能夠實際改善我們國內的缺工的情形。對,我們下個禮拜就要開諮詢會了。那我們也是透過這個社會對話來化解大家的疑慮。因為時間不太夠,我們這個問題就,我再問下一個。就是說,我們國內15到24歲的青年失業率居高不下。相較於其他OECD的國家,在疫情期間飆升到15.2%。"},{"start":544.582,"end":562.694,"text":"疫情後就大幅降、改善了,降到10%左右。我國去年的、前幾年的失業率幾乎都是到11到或12。那比國內的全體……新年失業率我們沒有這麼高啊。沒有嗎?沒有沒有。那我們的資料查到是這樣子啊。"},{"start":563.908,"end":565.789,"text":"現在目前看到這個狀況是怎麼樣?"},{"start":595.247,"end":623.265,"text":"大概2.28啦。那還有一段距離要...還有,當然要再努力,但是有...各位,那是其實我們經歷了三年的疫情耶。我們的青年的失業率不但沒有飆高,還降低。這個其實也是要給勞動部鼓勵一下啦,我們真的很努力啦。好啦,我希望說你們馬上第二期要開始。對啊。能夠更積極的,尤其是我們青年失業的問題啊,能夠一定要盡快的來解決。這樣好不好?好,謝謝部長,謝謝。"},{"start":625.232,"end":625.554,"text":"謝謝邱委員"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}