{"error":false,"id":["152618"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":152618,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/152618","日期":"2024-05-16","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-1-19-12","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第12次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":1,"會次":12,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[19],"委員會代碼:str":["經濟委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第12次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2024-05-16T10:48:56+08:00","結束時間":"2024-05-16T10:57:11+08:00","影片長度":"00:08:15","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/069b0cf7e017bc30030ce7f5f9fa8b91974d6013279311fbe01ba30ddb4afe0fb34386f0e31270a05ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"林德福","委員發言時間":"10:48:56 - 10:57:11","會議時間":"2024-05-16T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第12次全體委員會議（事由：審查：\n一、本院委員黃仁等18人擬具「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案」案。\n二、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具「離島建設條例第三條、第七條及第七條之一條文修正草案」案。\n三、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具「離島建設條例第五條條文修正草案」案。\n四、本院委員陳玉珍等17人擬具「離島建設條例第十條條文修正草案」案。\n五、本院委員蔡易餘等21人擬具「離島建設條例第十條之一條文修正草案」案。\n【5月15日及16日兩天一次會】）","gazette":{"lineno":557,"blocks":[["林委員德福：（10時49分）感謝主席，請高副主委。"],["主席：我們再請高副主委。","不好意思，因為我們中場沒有休息，如果要生理管理的，請自行處理。謝謝。"],["林委員德福：財政部李次長有來吧？我先問國發會，等一下再請您上來。"],["高副主任委員仙桂：委員好。"],["林委員德福：請教高副主委，金馬澎離島居民後代移居至臺灣本島的人口，粗估差不多180萬人左右，本席選區雖然是在永和、中和，但其實很多人是從金門、馬祖、澎湖移居過來。本席關心整個離島建設的發展，財政為庶政之母，112年度離島建設條例的基金只剩3.89億元，113年度國庫雖然撥補了9億元，但是離島鄉親擔心基金用完後，後續無以為繼。對此國發會跟財政部未來是否會有新的財源注入，改善離島建設基金的體質，讓基金能夠永續的運作？高副主委，你有什麼看法？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：我想離島基金事實上對離島人民的產業、生活等發展，其實都發揮一定的效果，所以我們一定會確保，就算離島建設基金已經用完，每年國庫一定會撥補。"],["林委員德福：會撥補？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：絕對沒有問題。"],["林委員德福：李次長，你的看法呢？是不是會撥補？"],["李次長慶華：報告委員，撥補這個部分，基本上如果政府的財政非常充裕，主計總處一定會配合國發會這邊來作相關的處理。"],["林委員德福：這樣喔。"],["李次長慶華：是。"],["林委員德福：我希望不要斷炊。","其次，馬祖、金門有藍眼淚，是不是請交通部的代表也上來。"],["主席：請交通部。"],["林委員德福：通常在每年4月到6月之間是藍眼淚最佳的觀賞期，許多民眾前往觀光，但是每年3到5月又剛好遇到金門、馬祖的霧季，飛機有時候沒辦法起降，民眾受困機場。本席一直認為，既然藍眼淚被當作離島觀光的一個賣點，鼓勵民眾來玩，不要因為霧季的問題讓民眾敗興而歸。有民眾建議改善離島整個機場航管的設備，以增加霧季起降的時間點，能提升飛航安全，也可以降低濃霧起降的標準。國發會跟交通部有什麼看法？技術上可行嗎？"],["盧代理副司長清泉：報告委員，其實我們對馬祖地區有特別的關注，最近承蒙院裡面核定，相關的機場改善計畫也在進行中。"],["林委員德福：只有馬祖，那金門呢？"],["盧代理副司長清泉：金門也是一樣。"],["林委員德福：也是一樣喔？"],["盧代理副司長清泉：是。"],["林委員德福：我是希望在最短時間解決這個問題啦，可行嗎？"],["盧代理副司長清泉：我們會來處理。"],["林委員德福：航管的問題啦，因為每年霧季的時候，那裡剛好有藍眼淚，對不對？既然是這樣，要發展觀光，就是一定要做，好不好？"],["盧代理副司長清泉：好。"],["林委員德福：你請回。","日前行政院金馬聯合服務中心以及金馬澎聯盟舉辦離島建設條例研討會，希望爭取制定金馬澎基本法，並修訂離島建設條例，編列預算，挹注離島建設基金，協助金馬澎的建設發展；在中央成立金馬澎委員會，專責金馬澎發展事務，來扶持金馬澎在地的產業，保存在地的文化，輔導青年創業與促進觀光發展等。對金門、馬祖、澎湖離島鄉親們上述的主張，國發會有沒有什麼看法？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：針對離島事項，事實上有一個離島建設指導委員會，是在院裡面，由院長擔任召集人。"],["林委員德福：你是贊成還是反對？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：因為離島不只金、馬、澎，還有綠島、蘭嶼、小琉球。就離島來說，已經有院層級的指導委員會，現在是院長擔任召集人，所以如果再有其他單位，有點疊床架屋……"],["林委員德福：好，我是希望多關注、多關心，要支持啦，好不好？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：是、是！"],["林委員德福：最後一個議題，中國大陸宣布要推動福建民眾組團赴馬祖來旅遊，本席認為這是一個好的開始，兩岸多互動交流，總是能帶來一些轉機。本席希望政府各機關要好好的把握，促成大陸全面恢復團客觀光旅遊，以下建議也希望國發會帶回去，給現任副總統賴清德參考。賴清德副總統過去在金門當過兵，也視察過金門大橋，若能在八二三砲戰66週年的時候，以總統的身分再次前往金門視察，了解金門相關建設的進度，傾聽所有金門在地鄉親的心聲，甚至於發表兩岸的談話，或許能加速兩岸重啟交流。副主委你有什麼看法？"],["高副主任委員仙桂：這是我這個層級沒有辦法置喙的部分。"],["林委員德福：你可不可以建議？反映啊，說立法院有這樣的聲音。"],["高副主任委員仙桂：好，我想我會把委員的意見帶去給我們新主委。"],["林委員德福：講實在話，兩岸本來就應該要交流，但是從蔡政府開始就斷掉，而且越來越糟糕，越來越僵。因為我在立法院算是資深委員，我跟你講最後一段。","有一天對岸社科院的院長余克禮來這裡，我跟他面對面怎麼談？我說兩岸是兄弟，你們是大哥，我們是你們的弟弟，我們在這裡生活久了，希望維持現在這種生活的狀況，希望維持這種制度，我們只要不講臺獨、不搞臺獨，兩岸應該要和平共處、相互尊重。他馬上跟我說，其實這樣就夠了。因為大陸有疆獨、有藏獨，我們希望兩岸要和平，老百姓要的是什麼？安居樂業！不是要你每天都聽美國，搞到最後兵凶戰危，老百姓要的是這樣子嗎？但是現在的蔡英文政府就是全部都聽美國的，搞到美國叫你東你不敢西，叫你西你不敢北、不敢南，這很糟糕呢。","講實在話，我們希望現在的政府官員跟馬上要接任總統的賴清德好好反映、建議，老百姓要的就是安居樂業，不希望兵凶戰危，也不希望全部都聽一面的，只有導向美國，結果跟對岸整個疏離，什麼都搞不來，這很糟糕啦！因為在一個三角中，最好站中間，跟美國、跟日本、跟對岸都保持等距，然後你跟我好，我就拉近一點，跟我不好，我就跟你保持距離，這是最聰明的方式。以上，謝謝。"],["高副主任委員仙桂：好，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝。"],["主席（陳委員超明代）：現在請楊瓊瓔委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":114,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-19-12","speakers":["楊瓊瓔","黃仁","陳玉珍","蔡易餘","陳亭妃","賴瑞隆","謝衣鳯","張啓楷","鄭天財Sra 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人擬具\n「離島建設條例第十條條文修正草案」案；五、本院委員蔡易餘等21人擬具「離島建設條例第十\n條之一條文修正草案」案","agenda_id":"1134601_00002"}},"transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":0.03096875,"end":2.30909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":5.43096875,"end":5.599718750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":6.03846875,"end":6.17346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":6.443468750000001,"end":6.814718750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":7.3209687500000005,"end":8.637218750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":8.89034375,"end":10.52721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":10.864718750000002,"end":12.029093750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":12.855968750000002,"end":13.058468750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":13.615343750000001,"end":15.31971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":15.62346875,"end":19.01534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":20.11221875,"end":21.17534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":21.816593750000003,"end":23.75721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":22.94721875,"end":29.106593750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":27.942218750000002,"end":35.73846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":36.025343750000005,"end":60.88221875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":36.05909375,"end":38.96159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":40.986593750000004,"end":41.03721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":41.03721875,"end":41.087843750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":41.307218750000004,"end":41.32409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":61.017218750000005,"end":62.65409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":62.83971875,"end":66.95721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":67.29471875,"end":71.42909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":71.76659375,"end":81.92534375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":82.17846875000001,"end":84.81096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":84.86159375000001,"end":84.87846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":85.01346875,"end":86.39721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":86.63346875,"end":95.84721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":96.21846875,"end":97.50096875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":97.50096875000001,"end":109.81971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":110.24159375,"end":116.97471875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":116.97471875000001,"end":119.15159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":117.56534375000001,"end":118.66221875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":119.60721875,"end":121.02471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":121.61534375000001,"end":122.88096875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":124.09596875000001,"end":135.04784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":135.04784375,"end":135.06471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":135.06471875,"end":135.13221875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":135.13221875000002,"end":135.18284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":135.18284375000002,"end":135.19971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":135.19971875000002,"end":135.21659375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":135.21659375000002,"end":135.50346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":135.50346875,"end":135.53721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":135.95909375000002,"end":159.17909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":147.13034375,"end":148.04159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":159.60096875000002,"end":169.10159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":169.32096875000002,"end":190.48221875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":191.07284375,"end":195.30846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":196.10159375,"end":208.26846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":207.67784375000002,"end":209.31471875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":209.43284375000002,"end":210.22596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":210.22596875000002,"end":216.38534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":211.23846875,"end":211.81221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":217.80284375000002,"end":224.21534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":224.26596875,"end":229.90221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":230.44221875000002,"end":232.12971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":232.65284375000002,"end":233.80034375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":234.30659375000002,"end":263.78721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":263.98971875,"end":267.75284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":267.92159375,"end":275.58284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":275.58284375,"end":275.59971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":277.59096875,"end":287.39534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":286.09596875,"end":287.34471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":287.39534375,"end":287.96909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":287.96909375,"end":288.00284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":288.15471875000003,"end":309.68721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":290.60159375,"end":290.95596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":298.04346875000005,"end":298.44846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":306.58221875000004,"end":338.54346875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":310.19346875,"end":310.86846875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_04","start":338.88096875,"end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等一下那個也請那個財政部那個李次長有來吧等一下財政部我先問一下再請你上來那個"},{"start":37.479,"end":58.534,"text":"議員好,高主委我請教因為金馬盆離島居民後代移居至臺灣本島的人口出估差不多有180萬人左右那本席選區雖然是在永和中和但其實很多人是從金門、馬祖、澎湖移居過來本席關心整個離島建設的一個發展"},{"start":61.892,"end":75.758,"text":"財政為數證之母,一百一十二年度離島基金建設條例的基金只剩三點八九億元。一百一十三年度國庫雖然撥補了九億,但是離島鄉親擔心基金用完後後續無以為繼。"},{"start":83.255,"end":97.314,"text":"對此國安會跟財政部未來是我會有新的財源來注入來改善整個離島這個建設基金的體質讓基金能夠永續的這些運作。高組委你有什麼看法?"},{"start":97.995,"end":98.115,"text":"桑田博士"},{"start":124.144,"end":137.637,"text":"報告委員,因為撥補這個部分,基本上當然我們如果說是政府的財政非常充裕的話,那在主席總書那邊一定會配合國防會這邊來做相關的處理啊。這樣齁,我希望不要斷吹啦。"},{"start":139.599,"end":155.829,"text":"案 、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案 、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案 、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案 、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案 、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案 、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案 、本院委員陳"},{"start":170.317,"end":178.96,"text":"案：立法院第十三條條文修正草案：立法院第十三條條文修正草案：立法院第十三條條文修正草案：立法院第十三條條文修正草案：立法院第十三條條文修正草案"},{"start":196.141,"end":196.161,"text":"案。"},{"start":217.867,"end":245.765,"text":"我們會來處理。」行管的問題啦因為你每年喔誤記的時候其實那裡剛好就是有藍眼淚嘛對不對那既然是這樣要發展觀光就是一定要做好不好那你請回來那個日前喔行政院金馬聯合服務中心與金馬盆聯盟啊舉辦離島建設條例研討會希望爭取制定金馬盆的基本法並修訂離島建設條例"},{"start":247.726,"end":275.359,"text":"編列預算來益助離島建設基金協助金馬盆的建設發展。在中央成立金馬盆委員會專責金馬盆發展的事務來扶持金馬盆在地的產業保存在地的文化、輔導青年創業與促進觀光發展等。對於金門、馬祖、澎湖、離島的鄉親們上述的主張,國安會裡面有沒有什麼看法?"},{"start":277.605,"end":294.334,"text":"案。」關於離島,其實就是有一個那個離島建設的指導委員會是在院裡面由院長來當院長。對啊,你是贊成還是反對?基本上其實如果剛才說的因為離島不只是金馬鵬還有另外那個"},{"start":295.274,"end":315.363,"text":"還有綠島藍玉等等的小琉球所以其實就離島來說其實已經有院層級的指導委員會現在已經是院長來擔任召集人了我是希望多關注多關心啦要支持啦好不好最後一個議題中國大陸宣布要推動福建民眾組團戶馬祖來旅遊"},{"start":317.244,"end":318.365,"text":"案 、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具"},{"start":339.002,"end":356.871,"text":"案﹑一、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案﹑一、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案﹑一、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案﹑一、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案﹑一、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第十三條條文修正草案﹑一、本院委員陳玉珍等18人擬具:「離島建設條例第"},{"start":368.778,"end":371.875,"text":"那個副主委你什麼看法?"},{"start":373.462,"end":397.923,"text":"對,這個是我這個層級沒有辦法製作的部分那你可不可以建議嘛反映啊所以立法院有這樣的一個聲音啊我想會把委員的意見我想會帶去給我們新竹委員講實在話兩岸本來就應該要交流但是從蔡政府開始就斷掉而且越來越糟糕越來越僵因為我在立法院算是自身委員我們希望我跟你講最後一段有一天那個對岸"},{"start":399.591,"end":427.977,"text":"就是社科院的院長他叫做于克里來這裡我面對面我跟他怎麼談我說齁兩岸是兄弟啦你們是大哥我們是你的弟弟啦我們在這裡生活久了希望維持現在這種生活的狀況希望維持這種制度我們只要不講台獨不搞台獨兩岸應該要和平共處相互尊重他馬上跟我說其實這樣就夠了因為大陸有疆獨有藏獨"},{"start":428.897,"end":450.78,"text":"我們是希望說兩岸要和平老百姓要的是什麼安居樂業不是要你每天都聽美國搞到最後兵兇戰危老百姓要的是這樣子嗎但是現在的蔡英文政府就是全部都聽美國的搞到你看美國叫你東你不敢西叫你西你不敢北不敢南這很糟糕捏"},{"start":451.761,"end":452.721,"text":"案﹚事由：審查：事由：審查："},{"start":473.769,"end":473.789,"text":"案。」"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}