{"error":false,"id":["152796"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":152796,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/152796","日期":"2024-05-22","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-1-20-13","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第1會期財政委員會第13次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":1,"會次":13,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[20],"委員會代碼:str":["財政委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第1會期財政委員會第13次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2024-05-22T10:59:32+08:00","結束時間":"2024-05-22T11:10:23+08:00","影片長度":"00:10:51","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/ec526bb9f1bdce9d8adb5971b21c31be88b406ffa24a3d763b43bbf2d64d2017ddfe245c046034395ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"黃珊珊","委員發言時間":"10:59:32 - 11:10:23","會議時間":"2024-05-22T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第13次全體委員會議（事由：邀請金融監督管理委員會彭主任委員金隆率所屬機關首長暨中央存款保險股份有限公司、監管相關機構有關之財團法人、臺灣證券交易所股份有限公司、臺灣期貨交易所股份有限公司、臺灣集中保管結算所股份有限公司等董事長、總經理列席業務報告，並備質詢。\n【5月20日及22日二天一次會】）","gazette":{"lineno":597,"blocks":[["黃委員珊珊：（10時59分）謝謝主席，我請彭主委。"],["主席：請彭主委。"],["黃委員珊珊：主委好，也歡迎您到金管會來，我想接下去金管會跟我們財政委員會有非常非常多的互動。"],["彭主任委員金隆：謝謝！"],["黃委員珊珊：首先我想就前一陣子我們2月1日上任之後跟黃天牧主委一直在討論的事，也是本委員會大家非常關心的融資租賃業。融資租賃業現在已經成為臺灣的三大影子銀行，這三大影子銀行數千億元的融資，造就臺灣非常多年青人成為所謂的山道猴子，主委都理解嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：知道。"],["黃委員珊珊：山道猴子讓很多年青人背負了數百萬的債，一輛3、5萬元的摩托車可以借到幾十萬元，甚至現在已經嚴重到拍張冰箱的照片就可以借個20萬元，完全不需要徵信，更不需要說明利率。本黨團已經擬好融資公司法相關的草案，融資公司專法在民國97年金管會也曾經提出院版，主委剛上任，我想請教一下，你對融資公司設立專法的立場是什麼？"],["彭主任委員金隆：剛剛也有很多委員關注，在我上任之前，我們同仁也都跟我提到這些內容，現階段金管會的作法大概是以現況進行管理，例如我們希望先針對大型的資融公司，透過一些像上市櫃公司……"],["黃委員珊珊：我想問你對專法的方式有沒有什麼意見，目前還沒有想法？"],["彭主任委員金隆：我剛提到就是目前我們還在蒐集各國對於融資公司是否由金融監理機關來管理這一塊，我剛才也跟其他委員報告，我們也不排除做這樣的研究。"],["黃委員珊珊：沒錯，其實我們在質詢的時候有提出來，像美國就是用金融監管單位，甚至連中國大陸都是，而且我們的公股銀行在中國大陸也有設置同樣的公司，也受當地法律的監管。也就是說，融資公司我們要的不多，第一，利率要明確。第二，不可以有暴力討債的狀況。第三，你要借他能力負擔得起的債務。只有這麼簡單的要求，但是97年到現在將近16年，當年是因為有非常嚴重的卡債問題，那時候做的是銀行，現在幾乎叫什麼公司都可以融資，完全用賣東西的方法，假買賣真融資，所以融資專法我們會開公聽會，我們也希望主委能夠聽聽財委會各個委員的意見、各界的意見，就這個法案，我相信不管金管會要不要提版本，財政委員會、立法院這邊一定會有版本，而且一定會審查，也麻煩主委做好準備。"],["彭主任委員金隆：是。"],["黃委員珊珊：第二個問題是我們現在有非常多的詐騙案件，金管會是最前端的，在詐騙案的偵查上，我常說重點是民眾不在乎有沒有抓到詐欺犯，民眾在乎的是他的錢追不追得回來，我們現在都抓得到詐欺犯，但是都找不回錢。現在問題就在於資訊的交換速度夠不夠快，資訊交換不夠快，錢就轉出去了，抓到那個人頭戶，就算警示了也沒有用，所以我們現在要比賽的就是誰比較快。主委，在打詐的效能上面，現在提了打詐專法，但是有很多的部分其實在金管會前端就要做好處理。目前的虛幣市場、虛幣業者，我們都讓它們自律，沒有納入管理，接下去他們現在碰到的問題是一樣的，他們跟調查局、刑事局各自都有聯絡，但是沒有任何一個平臺跟銀行聯絡；他們跟警察165也要靠傳真才能聯絡，接下去可能跟法務部、高檢署有聯絡，但是也是個別的聯絡。我要做的事、需要主委協助的是怎樣把這些前端和後端，尤其是法務部最後追蹤的部分，大家一起做一個打詐平臺，而這個平臺需要金管會作前端最重要的連結和串連，包括現在沒有納管的虛幣市場，你可以了解一下這件事情嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這點沒問題，這個從我還沒上任就非常密切的關注，而且金管會也被賦予滿多的任務。"],["黃委員珊珊：現在很多在國外的虛幣業者想在臺灣申請，目前為止有25家合法申請、有洗錢聲明的，很多很多都是沒有的，可是它們怎樣納入我們的管理、納入我們的平臺，進入我們的平臺可以協助政府一起來打詐，我相信這是金管會接下來很重要的任務，不是放任它在外面，它想幫忙幫不上，有警示帳戶利用這些虛幣相關的平臺洗錢，甚至來做詐騙，會越來越多。"],["彭主任委員金隆：擴大納管我們也在努力中。"],["黃委員珊珊：我希望這個打詐平臺不是單一讓民眾或業者自己來，前端的金管會和後端的法務部大家必須要合作，而且要連結。"],["彭主任委員金隆：這個沒問題。"],["黃委員珊珊：最後簡單問一下，金管會5月15日發了一個公文，它說現在因為太多的網紅在銷售或從事廣告營業行為，包括賣ETF、鼓勵大家投資這個、投資那個，所以投信投顧公會要對網紅進行管理，是吧！"],["彭主任委員金隆：現在由公會訂了一個行為規範。"],["黃委員珊珊：我想問一下，什麼叫作網紅？主委不知道？它的定義是什麼？常態性於網路上發表資訊內容供大眾閱覽並以此營利者，就叫網紅，就是要賺錢的啦！有很多人、很多新聞媒體、很多相關的報導其實都在報導股票最近多好多好，這樣算不算網紅？不算？"],["彭主任委員金隆：抱歉，我還要再研究一下。"],["黃委員珊珊：局長要不要回答？我是說你們這個東西的定義，怎麼管？管誰？"],["張局長振山：如果涉及到投資有價證券，這是我們在規範的。"],["黃委員珊珊：都要規範？"],["張局長振山：所以我們會要求業者跟網紅簽約。"],["彭主任委員金隆：如果他沒有營利呢？他就一直在說這個很不錯這樣而已呢？算不算網紅？"],["張局長振山：這個很不錯其實就有點鼓勵的概念。"],["黃委員珊珊：如果說最近買ETF很不錯，然後怎樣怎樣，這種人算不算？我的意思是如果要規範，就要清楚的規範，但是你現在的定義有點怪怪的。我的意思是要管，因為太多人在做，而且每一個都說他是投資專家，我們投信投顧是要有證照的，是要申請廣告字號的。"],["張局長振山：所以先前我們請投信公會要自力研究一個規範方式、自律方式報到局裡面來，我們上個禮拜核備它們了。"],["黃委員珊珊：主委，我們希望導正國內的投資市場，但是一樣還是要管得到、管得有道理，然後能夠管得住，而不是訂出來說你這樣就是網紅，這樣子有點可怕啦！很可能會讓很多人覺得我一下子就落到這裡面而受罰，好嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：明確有效，對。謝謝。"],["黃委員珊珊：最後一個問題是剛剛很多委員問到有關當沖降稅的延長，我剛剛聽到主委說繼續延5年，是嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：過去我們已經發函給財政部表達這樣的看法。"],["黃委員珊珊：財政部的回函同意了嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：沒有。"],["黃委員珊珊：沒有同意？"],["彭主任委員金隆：還沒。"],["黃委員珊珊：接下去會是什麼樣的結果？"],["彭主任委員金隆：接下來我們還會再跟財政部討論。"],["黃委員珊珊：所以行政院還會作政策性的決定？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這要行政院來決定。"],["黃委員珊珊：我對於當沖降稅沒有個人的意見，但是我們看到以前的主委、你在政大的同事王儷玲教授她主張，如果長期投資的，要不要給他一些優惠。我們現在當沖證交稅減半，但是我們對於長期投資反而沒有鼓勵，這不是很奇怪嗎？主委理解我的意思嗎？如果我持有這個股票3年、5年，是不是反而可以給他一些優惠？這可能是金管會可以去思考的，也就是說，鼓勵當沖減半好像鼓勵投機，對於長期持有的，反而沒有任何的優惠，這個可能是接下去金管會在決定當沖是否減半或常態化減半，很多人主張常態化減半、鼓勵臺灣的投資市場，但也有人說這是鼓勵投機，相對的是，我想問對長期投資反而是不是應該有些態度？"],["彭主任委員金隆：是，我請局長把現有的狀況跟委員報告一下。"],["張局長振山：跟委員報告，現在業者其實有提出TISA的概念，我們也在研究中，也看看財政部的態度，就是長期投資在租稅上要給他優惠鼓勵。"],["黃委員珊珊：是的，所以不是只有當沖降稅，而是長期投資給他租稅優惠也是政府的一種態度，最重要的是我們希望他長期持有，對於國內的金融體系反而比較穩定。最重要的是我希望新的主委有新的氣象，過去可能有一些我認為比較保守的地方，我希望新主委到任之後，我們可以從業界的角度、從比較不是那麼官方的角度來重新看我們將來金融管理的制度，最重要的是希望主委能夠順利推展業務，我們希望為臺灣做點事。謝謝。"],["彭主任委員金隆：謝謝黃委員。"],["主席：請伍麗華委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":332,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-20-13","speakers":["羅明才","林德福","吳秉叡","顏寬恒","賴惠員","賴士葆","王鴻薇","郭國文","李彥秀","黃珊珊","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","李坤城","王世堅","楊瓊瓔","黃國昌","葛如鈞","陳玉珍","林楚茵","吳春城","鍾佳濱","謝衣鳯","張嘉郡"],"page_start":263,"meetingDate":["2024-05-22"],"gazette_id":"1134901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1134901_00008"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第13次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請金融監督管理委員會彭主任委員金隆率所屬機關首長暨中央存款保險股份有限公司、監管相\n關機構有關之財團法人、臺灣證券交易所股份有限公司、臺灣期貨交易所股份有限公司、臺灣集\n中保管結算所股份有限公司等董事長、總經理列席業務報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1134901_00005"}},"transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":1.51596875,"end":3.2372187500000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":3.8278437500000004,"end":3.8615937500000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":3.8615937500000004,"end":3.8953437500000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":3.8953437500000003,"end":4.283468750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":4.283468750000001,"end":4.519718750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":8.333468750000002,"end":8.974718750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":9.26159375,"end":16.29846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":16.29846875,"end":16.500968750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":16.500968750000002,"end":18.289718750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":18.89721875,"end":28.54971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":29.039093750000003,"end":42.454718750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","sta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抱歉我還要再研究一下局長要不要回答有沒有我們請我們局長來我的意思是說你這個東西的定義網紅怎麼管管誰管怎麼管這個剛講如果是涉及到投資有價證件這個是我們要規範的都要規範對所以我們會要求業者你要跟網紅簽約但如果他沒有盈利呢他就一直在說這個很不錯這樣子而已呢"},{"start":436.252,"end":450.853,"text":"算不算網紅?這個人不錯其實就有點鼓勵的概念了我最近買那個ETF很不錯喔然後怎麼樣怎麼樣那這種人算不算我的意思是如果要規範就清楚的規範但是如果你現在這樣的定義有點怪怪的啦"},{"start":451.867,"end":476.313,"text":"我的意思是說要管因為太多人在做而且每一個都說他是投資專家我們投信投顧是要有證照的是要申請廣告字號的跟委員報告所以先前我們請投信工會他要致力研究一個規範方式致力方式報到局裡面來我們在上個禮拜核配他們的對我們希望導正國內的投資市場但是一樣還是要管得到"},{"start":477.973,"end":478.754,"text":"我剛剛聽到主委是說繼續延誤年是嗎?"},{"start":503.35,"end":513.764,"text":"過去我們已經發函給財政部表達這樣的看法那財政部的回函同意了嗎?沒有同意那接下去會是什麼樣的結果?"},{"start":515.677,"end":538.005,"text":"接下來我們還會再跟財政部再做一些討論所以行政院還會做政策性的決定這要行政院來決定我對於當沖降稅沒有個人的意見但是我們看到以前的主委您在政大的同事王立寧教授他主張如果長期投資的要不要給他一些優惠"},{"start":539.585,"end":546.157,"text":"我們現在當天不用證交稅減半但是我們對於長期投資反而沒有鼓勵這不是很奇怪嗎?"},{"start":548.086,"end":569.562,"text":"主委理解我的意思嗎?如果我持有了這個股票三年五年是不是反而可以給他一些優惠這個可能是金管會可以去思考的也就是說我鼓勵當沖減半好像我們鼓勵投機我們對於長期持有的反而沒有任何的優惠這個可能是接下去金管會在你決定當沖不當沖減半的部分"},{"start":571.704,"end":572.625,"text":"可以請局長把現有的狀況跟您說明一下嗎?"},{"start":590.123,"end":590.383,"text":"市局長"},{"start":620.203,"end":620.363,"text":"謝謝王委員 謝謝謝謝"},{"start":647.422,"end":649.616,"text":"現在請吳立法 吳委員"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}