{"error":false,"id":["153710"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":153710,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153710","日期":"2024-06-06","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-1-20-16","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第1會期財政委員會第16次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":1,"會次":16,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[20],"委員會代碼:str":["財政委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第1會期財政委員會第16次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2024-06-06T10:38:30+08:00","結束時間":"2024-06-06T10:48:25+08:00","影片長度":"00:09:55","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/0d7b1f4370c473d5017be4707fe43fbf2248f66a23a11b538282b1d5b897dd1c106eb39dfaeef8f05ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"李坤城","委員發言時間":"10:38:30 - 10:48:25","會議時間":"2024-06-06T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第16次全體委員會議（事由：邀請中央銀行楊總裁金龍就「日圓貶值效應會否導致亞洲貨幣競貶，及對台灣經濟影響」進行專題報告，並備質詢；另邀請經濟部列席備詢。\n【6月3日及6日二天一次會】）","gazette":{"lineno":558,"blocks":[["李委員坤城：（10時38分）謝謝主席，我們請總裁。"],["主席：請楊總裁。"],["楊總裁金龍：委員早。"],["李委員坤城：總裁好。接續剛剛好幾位委員的話題，因為現在日幣是貶值，當然很多人都希望，也有這個能力、意願到日本去玩，但是相對的日系產品到臺灣來，其實價格還是維持在年初前的高檔，也不用到譴責啦，有時候道德勸說一下，因為他們已經貶值了，日系產品進來臺灣的價格是不是也能夠再稍微優惠一點啦？"],["楊總裁金龍：對，委員講的沒有錯。對啦，這個用道德勸說的方式會比較妥當。"],["李委員坤城：其實你們只要道德勸說，或是跟業者稍微講一下、喝個咖啡，業者都知道意思啦。"],["楊總裁金龍：是、是。"],["李委員坤城：今天的題目現在日本維持匯率是比較弱勢，當然他們也吸引觀光客到日本旅遊，也讓服務業的輸出繼續成長，一方面吸引外資、刺激出口，日本近期的經濟也有成長，形成良性循環。但是匯率弱勢對臺灣出口也有幫助，亞洲國家經濟都是以製造業跟出口為主，考量規模經濟、出口需求等等，因此各國也傾向維持匯率弱勢，臺灣跟其他國家在產業上有競爭關係，所以臺幣維持弱勢當然也有其必要性，可是維持臺幣弱勢的代價就是進口物價上漲的通膨壓力。我請教一下總裁，以今年來講，新臺幣匯率開高走低，我看了一下全年最高價可能是在1月2號的30.866元，最低價有可能是落在4月22號的32.651元。"],["楊總裁金龍：對！"],["李委員坤城：收盤價如果貶破了32.5元，市場有所謂的楊金龍防線，請教總裁有所謂的楊金龍防線嗎？32.5元是您的防線嗎？貶到多少算是超貶呢？"],["楊總裁金龍：是。我也趁這個機會來跟委員報告，基本上應該是沒有所謂的防線啦。"],["李委員坤城：沒有楊金龍的防線？"],["楊總裁金龍：沒有、沒有。因為說實在匯率是一個指標、價格，它是隨供需在決定的，剛好我們才公布外資在臺灣外匯存底的比重，現在都131%了，你看很顯然的，基本上，外資現在在我們的外匯市場是扮演非常重要的一個角色，所謂的扮演重要角色就是它的進跟出，第一個很難去掌握，這是第一個；第二個，它進來或是出去的時候都非常集中，而且非常大量，不僅是進來或出去，這個是隨時的，你很難去掌握，你要manage它不大容易，但是中央銀行要關注它，所以……"],["李委員坤城：對！我的意思是因為央行對匯率還是可以稍微管一下。"],["楊總裁金龍：對，我們還是要注意它，所以我們的報告裡面也有談到，第一個，我們不能讓匯率波動得太大。"],["李委員坤城：對！"],["楊總裁金龍：因為匯率波動如果太大的話，我們的廠商要怎麼報價，它就不容易報價。"],["李委員坤城：好，那是不是有維持一個range？"],["楊總裁金龍：當然你要維持一個range，只能說是它的volatility、它的波動度，但你也不能把它設定新臺幣匯率是32到32.5元，我們也沒辦法做這樣的一個……"],["李委員坤城：所以它會是一個range啦！"],["楊總裁金龍：對！只能說讓波動幅度能夠穩定，這是第一個；第二個，剛剛委員講得也沒有錯啦，說實在匯率是相對性的，人家在貶值的時候，你硬要讓新臺幣升值，但是新臺幣的供需也是朝貶的方向走時，你有可能讓它升值嗎？也沒辦法嘛，也就是大家都在貶的時候，你來看看其他的情況是怎麼樣，如果我也貶，但是對我一籃子中其他的貨幣，相較之下我還升值耶！"],["李委員坤城：也有升。"],["楊總裁金龍：也有可能是升值啊！對不對？所以我們就必須要來注意這些的動態，不要讓它的副作用產生。"],["李委員坤城：所以也沒有所謂一個多少價錢的匯率是屬於一個防線，超過那個防線你就要稍微注意？"],["楊總裁金龍：對啦！當然我們也沒有所謂的防線，基本上，第一個要讓它穩定；第二個，也就是說……"],["李委員坤城：介於多少到多少是比較穩定的呢？"],["楊總裁金龍：我剛剛才在講它的波動度。"],["李委員坤城：但是波動也不能太大啊！"],["楊總裁金龍：對、對！最主要的就是說……"],["李委員坤城：所以我才說有一個區間嘛！"],["楊總裁金龍：對、對！它的波動度，所以波動度……"],["李委員坤城：所以我才認為大概多少到多少是屬於安全值。"],["楊總裁金龍：而且你看看我們的報告裡面，在第幾頁我們就有畫出波動度出來，委員，你也可以參考一下，事實上我們的波動度跟其他亞洲國家來比較，我們的波動度算是很穩定的，它有一定的穩定度。"],["李委員坤城：對，我當然知道對於央行來講，維持匯率的穩定是相當的重要啦！"],["楊總裁金龍：是，非常重要，這是中央銀行法裡面規定我們要維持匯率的穩定。"],["李委員坤城：好，那我再請教總裁，弱勢的日幣跟弱勢臺幣其實有利於兩國的外銷產業，就像你們的報告所講出來的，臺日兩國貿易競爭的關係不大，但是互補性大，所以弱勢的日幣對臺灣的產業是利大於弊，政府也可以利用這個機會，鼓勵我們產業赴日投資。美國早期是比較擔心說臺日兩國匯率的貶值會影響到外銷的貿易競爭力，但是近年來對於臺幣、日幣的貶值，他們也沒有什麼樣的反對意見，顯然這個國際的局勢，美、日、臺友好，聯合抗中的新局勢成為全球的新秩序。請教一下總裁的看法。"],["楊總裁金龍：是，基本上對於後面的sentence，就是與國際局勢有關，美日臺友好，聯合抗中的新局勢已成為全球新秩序，這個是屬於政治的層面，但是匯率的升貶是另外一個層面，基本上它的匯率報告是比較偏向這個層面來講，它不會說我們政治是哥倆好，所以經濟方面……"],["李委員坤城：沒有，政治的意涵是我賦予的，另外，過去美國對於臺灣、日本如果是貨幣貶值，他們會比較在意啦！但是現在對於臺日兩國的貨幣貶值，它比較沒有大的反對意見。"],["楊總裁金龍：對，委員是講的沒有錯啦！不過我跟委員報告，這次幾乎所有的貨幣都對美元貶值，那為什麼對美元貶值，因為美國的經濟在所有的經濟體裡面，它是一枝獨秀，而且它的利率又很高，它的經濟強，所以這是當然，它也知道……所以我們在報告裡面也講，事實上大家沒有競貶，主要還是在阻貶，那阻貶的話就比較合美國的意思啦！事實上美國對於這個議題比較在意的是競貶，這樣的話會產生……"],["李委員坤城：但是我們沒有競貶嘛？"],["楊總裁金龍：沒有啊！沒有競貶，我們的分析認為事實上現在亞洲的國家大部分的幣別都是在阻貶，而不是在競貶。"],["李委員坤城：好，最後30秒，請教一下總裁，6月13號央行要召開第二季的理監事會議了，媒體在猜上次理監事會議召開之後有給我們一個surprise，升息半碼，那這次會有surprise嗎？"],["楊總裁金龍：我也不大好意思講，這個是題外話，不好意思，不過時常surprise是不好啦！不過這個不是結果啦！"],["李委員坤城：是，那我知道你的意思，謝謝總裁、謝謝主席。"],["楊總裁金龍：謝謝。"],["主席：休息5分鐘。","休息（10時48分）","繼續開會（10時55分）"],["主席：繼續開會。下一位質詢請黃珊珊委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":274,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-20-16","speakers":["羅明才","林德福","吳秉叡","賴士葆","郭國文","賴惠員","顏寬恒","李彥秀","王鴻薇","李坤城","黃珊珊","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","王世堅","羅明才","林楚茵","廖先翔","謝衣鳯","葉元之","陳玉珍"],"page_start":229,"meetingDate":["2024-06-06"],"gazette_id":"1135801","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1135801_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第16次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀邀請中央銀行楊總裁金龍就「日圓貶值效應會否導致亞洲貨幣競貶，及對台灣經濟影響」進行\n專題報告，並備質詢；另邀請經濟部列席備詢","agenda_id":"1135801_00003"}},"transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":0.19971875,"end":2.14034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":3.1697187500000004,"end":3.8109687500000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":13.14284375,"end":13.68284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":13.800968750000003,"end":15.724718750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":15.910343750000003,"end":22.508468750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":22.57596875,"end":29.89971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":30.152843750000002,"end":47.02784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":47.095343750000005,"end":53.38971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":53.47409375,"end":53.727218750000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":53.727218750000006,"end":53.744093750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":53.744093750000005,"end":53.91284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":54.284093750000004,"end":60.51096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":61.101593750000006,"end":64.96596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":63.83534375000001,"end":71.00721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":70.53471875000001,"end":70.55159375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":70.55159375000001,"end":71.47971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":71.47971875,"end":73.48784375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":73.72409375000001,"end":91.05471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":89.73846875000001,"end":89.82284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":91.20659375000001,"end":92.01659375000001},{"speaker"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我們請總裁楊總裁"},{"start":14.816,"end":36.915,"text":"總裁好這個接續剛剛好幾位委員的話題因為現在日幣是貶值當然很多人都希望也有這個能力意願到日本去玩但是相對的日系的產品到台灣來其實價格還是維持它在年初前的高檔我是希望說"},{"start":37.996,"end":38.737,"text":"李坤城議員"},{"start":54.838,"end":60.021,"text":"今天的題目就是說現在日本維持會市的弱勢當然還沒吸引觀光客到日本去旅遊"},{"start":80.911,"end":81.212,"text":"﹚李坤城"},{"start":97.432,"end":97.592,"text":"以今年來講"},{"start":125.853,"end":130.355,"text":"新台幣匯率開高走低,全年最高價1月2日30.866元,最低價4月22日32.651元,收盤價"},{"start":142.179,"end":143.64,"text":"沒有楊金龍的防線．沒有沒有沒有"},{"start":169.173,"end":197.963,"text":"因為匯率說實在它是一個這個指標這個價格它是隨供需在決定的那特別是我跟委員報告特別是現在外資剛剛我們才公布那個外資在我們台灣的那個所佔的對外貨存底的比重你看現在說131%你看很顯然的就是說基本上"},{"start":199.286,"end":222.932,"text":"外資現在在我們的外匯市場呢他是很扮演非常重要的一個角色所謂的扮演重要角色就是說他的進跟出啊第一個很難去掌握這是第一個第二個呢他進來的時候或是出去的時候他都非常的集中而且非常的大量不僅是進來或是出去"},{"start":223.652,"end":251.786,"text":"那這個隨時你就很難去你就很你要manage他不大容易但是呢中央銀行要關注他所以呢對我意思是說央行還是這個匯率還是可以稍微我們還是要注意他然後呢做一個所以我們的報告裡面也有談到就是說我們第一個我們不能讓這個匯率波動得太大因為你的匯率波動得太大的話呢我們的廠商他要報價他要怎麼報價"},{"start":252.807,"end":253.087,"text":"李坤城議員"},{"start":277.424,"end":299.01,"text":"第二個呢剛剛委員你也講的沒有錯啦就是說你的匯率說實在的匯率是相對性的啦人家在貶值的時候呢那你硬著就是說要讓新台幣升值但是呢新台幣它的供需呢它也是朝貶的方向走的時候那你有可能去讓它升值嗎也沒辦法嘛所以就是說"},{"start":300.03,"end":319.472,"text":"大家都在貶的時候呢那你來看看其他的情況是怎麼樣如果說我會貶但是呢對我的一籃子其他的貨幣呢相較之下我還升值了有可能是升值啊對不對所以呢我們就必須要來注意這些的一個不要讓他的副作用產生"},{"start":320.373,"end":339.143,"text":"所以也沒有所謂一個多少價錢這個匯率就是屬於一個防線然後超過那個防線你就稍微要注意我們對啦當然我們也沒有所謂的防線但是基本上第一個要讓它穩定那第二個呢也就是說那介於多少到多少是比較穩定的勒"},{"start":340.663,"end":359.268,"text":"我剛剛才在講就是說,它的波動度...它的波動也不能太大啊!對對對!最主要的就是...我才說有一個曲線嘛!對對對!它的波動度所以...所以波動度齁,而且你看看齁,你看看我們的報告裡面齁我們的報告裡面我們第幾頁我們就有畫出我們的波動度出來"},{"start":360.188,"end":382.799,"text":"我們的波動度跟其他亞洲國家來比較的話我們的波動度算是很穩定的它有一定的穩定度我當然知道說對於央行來講維持匯率的穩定是相當的重要這是我們的中央銀行法裡面規定我們就是說要維持匯率的穩定"},{"start":384.12,"end":402.934,"text":"我再請教總裁就是說其實弱勢的日幣跟弱勢的台幣其實有利於兩國的外銷產業就像你們的報告所講出來的臺日兩國的貿易競爭的關係不大但是互補性大所以弱勢的日幣對台灣的產業是利大於弊政府也可以利用這個機會鼓勵我們產業赴日投資"},{"start":406.457,"end":406.677,"text":"總裁的看法"},{"start":431.91,"end":444.837,"text":"基本上對於這個後面的先天是就是說國際局勢有關美日台有聯合抗衝的信誓以成為全球信誓這個是屬於這個層面這是屬於這個政治的一個層面"},{"start":450.7,"end":475.821,"text":"但是呢就是說匯率的申辯這是另外一個層面這是另外一個層面那基本上他的他的匯率報告呢他是比較偏向這個層面來講他不會就是說我們政治我們是所以經濟方面那另外的就是說我是我是提到說就是說過去美國對於這個台灣日本人這個"},{"start":476.742,"end":477.644,"text":"不過我跟委員報告這一次"},{"start":493.073,"end":514.071,"text":"幾乎所有的貨幣都對美元貶值那為什麼對美元貶值因為美國的經濟在所有的先進經濟體裡面它是一枝獨秀而且它的利率又很高它的經濟強所以這當然大家他也知道"},{"start":514.451,"end":534.902,"text":"他也知道就是說所以我們在報告裡面也講事實上大家沒有競貶主要的還是大家在竹貶那竹貶的話這個就比較合他的意思比較合美國的意思事實上美國是比較在意的就是說在這個議題裡面講的就是說你競貶你這樣的話會產生就是說競爭力但是我們沒有競貶嗎"},{"start":538.544,"end":542.227,"text":"最後30秒請教一下總裁6月13日央行要召開第二季的禮監事會議了媒體在猜上次禮監事會議召開之後有給我們一個驚喜生息辦這次會有驚喜嗎?"},{"start":564.544,"end":564.604,"text":"謝謝總裁 謝謝主席"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}