{"error":false,"id":["153784"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":153784,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153784","日期":"2024-06-11","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"院會-11-1-17","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第1會期第17次會議","屆":11,"會期":1,"會次":17,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"院會","標題":"立法院第11屆第1會期第17次會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2024-06-11T10:19:16+08:00","結束時間":"2024-06-11T10:35:15+08:00","影片長度":"00:15:59","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/065bcaf30f002e2b69fa31cbf60aa5d7eab218bf194c20658a5486dbe25062a1e1707ee27fc0a2835ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"劉建國","委員發言時間":"10:19:16 - 10:35:15","會議時間":"2024-06-11T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"第11屆第1會期第17次會議（事由：一、對行政院院長報告施政方針繼續質詢。 \n二、6月7日上午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。\n三、6月11日下午1時50分至2時30分為處理臨時提案時間。）","gazette":{"lineno":314,"blocks":[["劉委員建國：（10時19分）謝謝主席，有請卓院長。"],["主席：請卓院長備詢。"],["卓院長榮泰：劉委員好。"],["劉委員建國：院長好，院長辛苦。"],["卓院長榮泰：不會。"],["劉委員建國：院長，當院長很有挑戰喔？"],["卓院長榮泰：什麼？"],["劉委員建國：院長，當院長很有挑戰喔？","我先讓院長看一支影片，讓臺灣未來有更多的挑戰。","（播放影片）"],["劉委員建國：讓世界看見臺灣，在卓院長的帶領之下，我們要再次讓世界看到臺灣。我想有很多的面向要來跟院長就教，這一次AI教父黃仁勳來到臺灣參加臺北國際電腦展，這個過程非常轟動，相關的媒體報導幾乎從不間斷，不管是他在演講、還是在夜市、還是在宴請這些科技大老，幾乎都是焦點。","在這個過程裡面，到底我們在辦臺北國際電腦展，AI教父黃仁勳來到臺灣，到底給臺灣什麼啟示？我在這幾點裡面要特別來跟院長做一些相關的建議，第一個，臺灣有這麼先進的醫療實力，甚至是防疫的模範生，但是連續八年我們未獲得WHA的邀請，甚至都是我們主動叩關，但結果就是毫無進展。","但如果用WHA來對比今年的臺北國際電腦展，我不曉得可以給院長什麼樣的啟發，我要表達的是，當我們登門拜訪世界衛生組織的時候，我們得到的結果是這樣，但是當我們辦了一個臺北國際電腦展的時候，卻有這麼多的科技人才，如三巨頭蘇姿丰、黃仁勳還有Intel相關的，這些主要的科技人才都到臺灣來，臺灣整個跟這些產業鏈相關的大老闆也都齊聚一堂。","曾經中國的媒體嘲笑我們辦這個臺北國際電腦展是叫什麼？自娛娛人的遊戲，在2015年的時候，而且了無新意，甚至比不上中國辦的世界互聯網大會，但我們臺灣一直堅持至今，迎接了第43年的展覽，不只如此，今年這個展覽也創下4天8.51萬的人次，這是破了紀錄的，同時，包含所有相關產業鏈的巨頭也通通到位，來到我們臺灣。","臺灣不管是醫療、科技還是現在的AI，臺灣在全世界扮演舉足輕重的地位，我們怎麼樣讓AI跟醫療可以做快速的連結？現在民間的企業已經有在做了，那政府要怎麼去引導？我們是不是可以在未來，甚至以最快的速度，明年就由國家主導，舉辦一個AI醫療展？也讓全世界的這些醫療人才、科技人才再度齊聚到臺灣來，讓臺灣可以再度被世界看見。","邱部長，我在衛環質詢的時候也特別提醒相關的事情，他也非常認可，他從當醫師全聯會的理事長，甚至於世界醫師會的理事，甚至不分區立委，持續了八年，包含到現在當了部長，持續八年向WHA叩關，他在委員會的時候也特別請求國人不能放棄、我們要努力不懈，但是我們必須在不放棄、努力不懈的過程中想出更好的方式、更好的一個方法、更光明的一條道路，所以我才會具體建議臺灣是不是由政府來快速地應變、因應，因為院長要做的是行動創新AI內閣，院長能不能認可？"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員，這是COMPUTEX在臺灣的展覽，吸引了那麼多世界知名而且最重要的產業界來，國內的產業也做了產業鏈相關的整合，他們也在現場，更重要的是我們國人參與的這種熱度出乎大家意料，我們媒體的討論度、國際社會的重視，都是遠遠超過大家意料的，但是我們做到了！表示臺灣是有能力成為國際社會的一份子，我們也善盡這個責任。","但是對於WHA，我們覺得遺憾，我們不能夠進去，只有做一些努力，但也有很多友邦在裡面仗義直言，我們從我們的公共醫療體系當中，證明臺灣也有能力做好世界在這方面的貢獻者。所以剛剛您提到AI進到醫療，這就是包括賴總統一直在推的精準醫療，它將來可以協助醫療系統，把一個病患做更精準而且更前進的一些照顧，這個絕對是人類未來之幸福啊！如果我們能夠傾國家之力，像COMPUTEX一樣，我們也有一個國際醫療展，我認為、我也相信一定會再引起世界上極大的重視，對臺灣的國力能見度、我們的醫療水準絕對是有幫忙的，所以我相信我們的部會首長都會朝向更國際化的臺灣去做努力。"],["劉委員建國：所以院長就是認可嘛，對不對？"],["卓院長榮泰：我非常……"],["劉委員建國：對，因為我那天也特別跟邱部長講，邱部長雖然認可，但是這絕對不是單一部會可以去完成的，包含經濟部、包含國科會、包含國發會，相關的部會都必須要傾全力參與院長所帶領的創新行動、創新的AI內閣，我們是不是可以在明年就來籌辦AI醫療國際展？"],["卓院長榮泰：我們努力朝這個方向，但是我再次強調，中華民國臺灣所有成功的例子都不會是行政院的，我也很希望立法院大院也能夠來支持、國人一起來支持，我們一起朝向一個更高遠的目標來前進。"],["劉委員建國：好，院長，我的時間有限，反正院長就是認可，那我們就朝這個方向來努力打拚啦，好不好？院長可以吧？"],["卓院長榮泰：我們一起努力。"],["劉委員建國：好，謝謝。第二件事情，再請院長看一支影片。","（播放影片）"],["劉委員建國：我擷取裡面的簡單重點，就是黃仁勳表示在這10到15年，我們的教育體系都是教學生如何寫程式，有AI之後，這不用了啦！靠人工智慧來協助我們如何把這樣的程式灌輸在我們的思維裡面，變成我們可以使用的一個程式，這個是一個非常非常大的變革，在這個變革過程裡面，我們院長自詡的行動創新AI內閣裡面，從教育的體系、從相關面向，我們怎麼去做因應？我在這邊要用幾個例子給院長做參考，像韓國在2025年的時候，國民教育就將推行AI數位教科書，而日本高中也有AI輔助老師教學，在基礎教育上，他們就很熟悉AI，並且培養AI素養，同時避免過去城鄉之間所出現的數位落差再重蹈覆轍。過去蘇前院長任內推動班班有冷氣、生生有平板，院長認可這個事情，我們要應變、我們要行動，在你的任內什麼時候，第一年或是第二年能校校有AI？"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員，我始終認為任何創新都要被學習才有價值，所有的科技都要讓大眾使用才能改變人類的生活，所以我們跟郭部長的討論過程當中，我們曾經談過一句話，叫做「創新驅動，普惠大眾」，就是把這個創新帶來驅動整個社會的進步、科技的進步，讓人民能夠享受得到。現在我們也一直希望，我們自己知道AI內閣、行動創新內閣的責任，就是要把這些AI技術導入到政府部門、公共領域及人民生活當中，我們希望能夠儘速做到這個事情，所以我們已經責成包括國科會、包括經濟部、包括數發部等等相關部會，已經就這個部分來提出他們管轄業務當中所必須做到的，再來進行跨部會的整合。"],["劉委員建國：是，導入人民的生活，其實它的一個擴建基本上就是要導入教育啦！因為基礎教育非常重要，所以我特別引用韓國跟日本的例子給院長做參考，因此我才會用這樣的字眼，最快速地讓人民最清楚、讓家長更加瞭解、讓學生也準備進入這樣的學習，校校有AI，院長，你還是要導入……"],["卓院長榮泰：這個目標非常好，但是郭部長提到，我覺得他的這個先做，他希望我們的各部會裡面，部部都有AI的人士、AI的工程師去把部會裡面的先做好，政府部門做到了，我們更容易往外接著做，我覺得教育部也要朝這個方向去做。"],["劉委員建國：好，新部長已經上來了，教育部長能不能簡單答復何時能校校有AI？"],["鄭部長英耀：跟委員報告，我們現在從小學的部分，事實上都是融入課程主題式的，而且我們在酷英網跟因材網裡面事實上都已經融入AI，讓學生在學習上包括數位的學習都能應用。從今年我上任以後，原本是10月，但我希望8月提供所有的資訊給家長參考、給老師參考，跟校長參考，我們這個指導手冊在8月之前都會發展出來。"],["劉委員建國：從小學開始，對不對？"],["鄭部長英耀：是。"],["劉委員建國：所以你的第二階段是進入小學，那國中、高中、大專院校？"],["鄭部長英耀：國中本來就有資訊科技的……"],["劉委員建國：國中已經有了？"],["鄭部長英耀：都有。"],["劉委員建國：是校校均有，還是沒有？"],["鄭部長英耀：是，因為它的課程裡邊就已經有資訊的……"],["劉委員建國：校校均有，還是沒有？"],["鄭部長英耀：師資的部分，我們還在努力。"],["劉委員建國：到目前為止還有城鄉落差。"],["鄭部長英耀：是，當然是。"],["劉委員建國：對，既然已經在做，所以我才特別要求院長何時校校有AI？要具體。"],["卓院長榮泰：我們知道有城鄉的落差，也有數位的落差，很多的條件都還不足，所以像我們推班班有冷氣一樣，在全面地檢查之後，包括它的線路等等要做改善，我們也希望有一個環境是讓他能夠進去的，我覺得AI要先有觀念，再來有訓練，再來有條件，再來才進行實驗，最後我們才做全民的檢驗。"],["劉委員建國：OK，所以8月已經開始要啟動，對不對？既然我們要行動就要趕速度嘛，所以是不是在今年年底前可以達到校校有AI這個目標？"],["卓院長榮泰：我請部長今年年底前達到一種程度、一種階段，一定要向委員來提出報告，我們持續地做更精進的計畫。"],["劉委員建國：對不起，院長，我不是刻意要去要求這樣的時間，因為確實變革太快，這樣的速度太快，行動的內閣就必須要做這相關的應變，所以要加緊腳步，即便在今年年底沒有辦法達到100%，最少要90%，應該可以做到吧？"],["鄭部長英耀：跟委員報告，事實上從課程、師資這個部分，我們都一直在持續努力，會朝委員的目標再精進，而且……"],["劉委員建國：最少一年內吧！現在開始起算，一年內應該可以吧？"],["鄭部長英耀：因為城鄉的落差，我們事實上也都有發展相關的線上課程。"],["劉委員建國：好啦，院長，我就這樣具體要求了，好不好？謝謝！第二件事情就這樣。其實我們要因應新興科技這樣的浪潮，教育部要打造20座人才培育的基地，現在已經有18座，它也在趕速度，我很敬佩也很肯定，但是到目前為止，沒有相關的AI智能產業人才培育基地，到目前為止沒有，我提供一個地點，就在雲林的環球科大，這個土地是經濟部台糖的，前副院長要卸任之前還特別為這件事情在相關的琢磨，甚至開了會，決議快速的……","就誠如院長所講的，賴總統希望產業均衡，希望地區均衡，中部、北部都有人才培育的基地，但雲嘉沒有，環科剛好就到一個階段，然後所有校舍、硬體基本上都籌備了，我們只要中央主導，就可以快速地讓AI產業培訓基地來建置完成。院長、部長，是不是可以快速來做這樣的一個評估？"],["卓院長榮泰：我請郭部長跟你答復相關的後續和現在在處理的進度。"],["劉委員建國：好。"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，現在我們的進度是這樣子，環球科技大學要捐贈給經濟部，所以我們現在跟教育部還在談，如果它捐贈給經濟部以後，我們會落實委員所指教的，AI科技人才的培育就在環球科技大學。"],["劉委員建國：我自己本身有在追了，就整個規劃的方向，還有相關的興辦計畫，它都必須要啟動了。院長、部長，但到現在是完全沒有，如果完全沒有的話，這個行動是會被挑戰的。我想整個均衡的人才培育，雲嘉不能沒有，剛好有這個腹地，土地又是台糖的，由經濟部來主導、相關的科技法人來主政，我想我們馬上就可以在這個地方產生這樣一個AI人才培訓的基地，請院長思考，請部長快馬加鞭。","最後，因為時間真的很有限，我剛剛特別提到了AI跟醫療要去做這樣的一個連結，我在任內的時候跟蘇前院長、蔡前總統特別爭取到國家級的高齡醫學暨健康福祉研究中心，今年年底會完工，邱部長當立委的時候也積極在協助，然後還有臺大虎尾二期的擴建。如果今天要讓AI跟醫療直接有連結，相關的病症有test、相關的測試，那個地方絕對是最重中之重的地方，所以中科管理局虎尾園區在蘇院長的時候也願意要來擴編，這三個面向是不是可以連結在一塊，我們可以快速地打造一個AI醫療的產業鏈，甚至也有產業園區？所以我也提供這樣一個地點、這樣的訊息，給院長、給部長來做參考，但這個如果你們認可，可能相關的可行性評估都要用最快的速度提出來，是不是……"],["卓院長榮泰：我們再請部長跟委員做請教，謝謝。"],["劉委員建國：好，是不是院長也可以答應我1個月內把相關的可行性評估提出來，讓我們做參考？"],["卓院長榮泰：我會來瞭解，那時間上再跟委員報告，好不好？"],["劉委員建國：好，謝謝院長。"],["主席：謝謝劉委員，也謝謝卓院長。","報告院會，休息10分鐘，現在休息。","休息（10時35分）","繼續開會（10時46分）"]],"agenda":{"page_end":173,"meet_id":"院會-11-1-17","speakers":["江啟臣","陳秀寳","葛如鈞","黃建賓","劉建國","柯志恩","沈伯洋","萬美玲","吳沛憶","王鴻薇","范雲","王育敏","李坤城","林憶君","王美惠","邱志偉"],"page_start":89,"meetingDate":["2024-06-11"],"gazette_id":"1135401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1135401_00003","1135401_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期第17次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長報告施政方針繼續質詢─ 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LEG裡面,"},{"start":490.537,"end":519.053,"text":"從教育的體系從相關面向我們從事做運營我這邊在這邊要用幾個例子給院長做參考你像韓國在2025年的時候國民教育就將推行AI數位教科書然後日本高中也有AI輔助老師教學在基礎教育上他們就能熟悉AI喔然後培養AI的素養同時避免過去這種城鄉之間出現數位落差來重蹈覆轍所以"},{"start":520.373,"end":535.729,"text":"過去蘇前院長的任內推動斑斑扭扭器,生生有平板。 院長,認可這個事情,我們要應變,我們要行動。 什麼時候在你的任內,第一年或是第二年,笑笑有AI。"},{"start":537.47,"end":562.312,"text":"謝謝委員我始終認為任何創新都要被學習才有價值所有的科技都要讓大眾來使用他才能改變人類的生活所以我們跟郭部長討論的過程當中我們曾經談過一句話叫做創新驅動普惠大眾就是把這個創新帶來的驅動整個社會的進步科技的進步讓人民能夠享受得到那現在我們也一直希望說我們自己"},{"start":563.032,"end":587.405,"text":"知道自己AI內閣,行動創新內閣的責任,就是要把這些AI的技術導入到政府部門、公共領域跟人民的生活當中。我們希望能夠盡速地做到這個事情,所以我們已經責任包括國科會、包括經濟部、包括書發部等等相關的部會,已經就這個部分來提出他們所管轄業務當中必須做到的,再來進行跨部會的整合。"},{"start":587.585,"end":590.286,"text":"這個目標非常好但是郭部長提到我覺得他的這個先做他希望說我們的各部會裡面"},{"start":618.086,"end":627.297,"text":"部部都有AI的人士AI的工程師去把部會的理念先做好政府部門做到了我們更容易往外接我覺得教育部也要朝這個方向去做"},{"start":627.779,"end":651.759,"text":"好,新部長已經上來了,部長能不能簡單答覆,何時有校校有AI?跟委員報告,我們現在從小學這個部分事實上都融入課程主題式的,而且我們在酷英網跟這個英才網裡面事實上我們都已經融入AI,讓學生在學習上,包括這個數位的一個學習,從今年的,原來10月我上任以後,8月我希望所有的這個給家長的參考,"},{"start":653.681,"end":661.064,"text":"給老師的參考跟這一個校長的參考,我們這個指導所說都在8月之前都會發展出來。 從小學開始嘛,對不對?"},{"start":661.064,"end":663.204,"text":"是。 所以你的第二屆是進入小學嘛?"},{"start":663.204,"end":664.485,"text":"那國中、高中?"},{"start":664.485,"end":668.806,"text":"國中本來就有資助科技的都有。 是校校軍流?"},{"start":668.806,"end":673.148,"text":"沒有。 因為他的課程裡面就已經有這個資助。 校校軍流?"},{"start":673.148,"end":673.328,"text":"沒有。"},{"start":674.784,"end":675.927,"text":"施政方針繼續質詢。．第11屆第1會期第17次會議"},{"start":684.841,"end":713.775,"text":"我們知道有城鄉的落差有數位的落差很多的條件都還不足所以我們像推這個半班用冷氣一樣全面的檢查之後包括他的線路等等叫做改善我們也希望他有一個環境是讓他能夠進去的我覺得AI要先有觀念再來有訓練再來有條件再來再進行實驗最後我們才做全面的檢驗所以8月竟然已經開始要啟動對不對那是不是因為我們就是行動嘛我們就是行動要趕速度嘛所以是不是在今年年底前就是"},{"start":717.697,"end":742.871,"text":"我請部長今年年底前達到一種程度一種階段一定要向委員提出報告讓我們持續的做更精進的計畫。對不起委員長我不是刻意要去要求這樣的時間但是因為確實變革太快這樣的速度太快那行動的內閣他就必須要做這相關的應變所以要加緊腳步即便在今年的年底沒有辦法達到百分之一百那最少要百分之九十嘛應該可以做到吧"},{"start":744.512,"end":766.807,"text":"跟委員報告這事實上從課程老師是這個部分我們事實上都一直在持續努力會朝委員的一個目標在精進最少一年內吧現在開始計算一年內應該可以吧我們事實上也都有發展相關的一個現場的一個課程院長我就這樣具體要求了好不好謝謝那第二件事情就這樣其實我們要因應新興的科技的這樣的浪潮"},{"start":767.387,"end":788.339,"text":"第二部要打造20座這人才培育的基地現在已經有18座他也在很趕速度啊我也敬佩我也肯定但是到目前為止沒有相關AI智能產業人才培育基地啊到目前為止沒有我提供一個地點就在雲林的環球科大這土地是經濟部台堂的"},{"start":789.892,"end":807.093,"text":"前副院長要現任之前還特別為了這事情在相關的琢磨甚至開了會決議快速的就成為院長所長的賴總統希望產業均衡希望地區均衡中部北部都有人才培養基地雲加沒有"},{"start":807.853,"end":823.327,"text":"所以雲科剛好他就到一個階段環科剛好就到一個階段然後所有校舍硬體基本上都籌備我們只要中央主導就可以快速的讓AI產業培訓基地來建制完成"},{"start":824.872,"end":848.028,"text":"議員長、部長是不是可以快速來做這樣的一個評估?現在我們的進度是這樣子,環球科技大學他要捐贈給經濟部,所以我們現在跟教育部還在談,那如果他捐贈給經濟部以後,我們會落實委員所指教的這個AI科技人才的培育,就在環球科技大學。"},{"start":855.182,"end":883.399,"text":"院長部長到現在是完全沒有那如果完全沒有的話這個行動是會被挑戰的那我想整個均衡的人才的培育人家不能沒有剛好有這個戶地土地又是台南的經濟部來主導相關的科技法人來主政我想我們馬上的就可以在這個地方產生這樣一個AI人才培訓的基地請院長思考請部長快馬加鞭最後因為時間真的很有限"},{"start":884.161,"end":908.095,"text":"我剛剛特別提到了AI跟醫療要去做這樣的一個連結。我在任內的時候跟蘇協院長、蔡前總統特別申請到國家級高齡醫學基金和福祉研究中心。今年年底會完工。邱部長當立委的時候也積極的在協助。然後還有虎尾台大二期的擴建。那如果今天要讓AI跟醫療直接有連結、相關的病證有TEST、相關的測試。"},{"start":909.025,"end":938.637,"text":"那個地方絕對是最重重之重的地方所以中科管理局湖北園區在蘇院長的時候也願意要來擴編是不是這三個鏈像可以連結在一塊我們可以快速打造一個AI醫療的產業鏈甚至一個產業園區所以我也提供這樣一個定點這樣的訊息給院長、給部長來做參考但這個如果你們認可可能相關的可行"},{"start":946.208,"end":946.228,"text":"謝謝劉委員,謝謝總統。"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}