{"error":false,"id":["154042"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":154042,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/154042","日期":"2024-06-14","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"院會-11-1-18","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第1會期第18次會議","屆":11,"會期":1,"會次":18,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"院會","標題":"立法院第11屆第1會期第18次會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2024-06-14T11:38:26+08:00","結束時間":"2024-06-14T11:55:02+08:00","影片長度":"00:16:36","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/5066363fcb0c018506cc5bfe0f1da8eb5b353bd30599155422287167d06ffe8d38f9d5c79002bdd25ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"陳亭妃","委員發言時間":"11:38:26 - 11:55:02","會議時間":"2024-06-14T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"第11屆第1會期第18次會議（事由：一、對行政院院長報告施政方針繼續質詢。\n二、6月14日上午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。\n三、6月18日下午1時50分至2時30分為處理臨時提案時間。）","gazette":{"lineno":996,"blocks":[["陳委員亭妃：（11時38分）謝謝主席，我們請卓榮泰院長，還有文化部部長，還有財政部部長。"],["主席：再請卓院長、兩位部長備詢。"],["卓院長榮泰：委員好！"],["陳委員亭妃：謝謝院長，還有兩位部長。我想最近有人挑起了一個所謂天馬電台的議題，這是我們地方的痛，因為在102年我用了很多的心力，透過質詢，好不容易把我們中央電台的天馬電台移到褒忠電台，這塊土地就完全歸我們國產署所有，所以這盡了很多的力量，在102年正式遷臺到褒忠，然後開始了所謂的招商，最開始我們期待魏導在這裡做一個所謂影城的規劃，他也有來做說明，我們滿心期待，但是最後不見了；然後我們有所謂的沙崙影城也不見了；然後魏導要移到後壁，也不見了，都不見了；再來又有所謂的明華園要來，也不見了。也就是說，當時招商他們必須負擔相對價值，他們要做文化，因為這一塊就是文創產業專用園區，所以文化產業本身必須投注很多心力，但是收到的效益不一定是高的，相關單位卻要求必須對等回饋，所以沒有辦法達到。光是到天馬電台做說明會，在本淵寮朝興宮普庵祖師前面開公聽會、說明會就有三次了，結果最後都不見了。從102年正式遷台到現在就是一片荒蕪，這是我們的痛，但是最近有人故意挑起說延宕13年。延宕13年是誰延宕？是地方政府跟中央政府，因為是地方政府跟中央政府一起開發、一起合作，但是放給我們地方的是荒蕪一片。我們不斷地說服地方，畢竟地方跟中央都是民進黨執政，我也是民進黨的立委，我們不斷地說服他們給地方、給政府時間，但是拖延到現在，也有人用延宕13年的說法，所以是誰延宕？地方政府跟中央政府。","再來，我們必須說，現在經過這一段時間，土地原本是臺南市政府管理，現在又歸還財政部。我們看到的是，106年魏德聖這麼大亮點不見了，不斷這樣子拖延，明華園也是亮點，也不見了，到了107年，最後由臺南市政府管理，現在又歸還財政部。好，現在問題來了，現在我們要透過市政府安南區的六通做土地變更，我要拜託部長全力配合，我們希望是整體開發，沒有整體開發就沒有辦法有亮點。如何規劃土地，不論是商業區未來怎麼做亮點經營，然後土地有部分來到市政府做一些回饋？我相信都應該全力配合市政府。這個拜託部長，OK吧？"],["莊部長翠雲：謝謝委員，確實天馬電台這一塊土地有29公頃，相當大，國產署也曾經跟臺南市政府合作，就如同委員講的，我們合作開發，但是後來因為一直都沒有招到適合的做這樣的用途，所以現在約已經解了，交回國產署。目前臺南市政府正在通盤檢討，看看這一塊土地的都市計畫要做怎麼樣的變更。"],["陳委員亭妃：它要做113年的六通。"],["莊部長翠雲：是，就國產署來說，只要這一塊土地能夠更好地運用，而且對地方的發展有助益，我們一定會全力協助配合。"],["陳委員亭妃：我們希望財政部全力配合，因為這時間實在拖延太久了，我們不斷催促。我要拜託部長，現在荒蕪一片，現在雜草一堆，因為六通到底要到什麼時候才能有結果不知道，在還沒有開發之前是不是可以先委由市政府，我們絕對會把所有環境整理一下，讓社區可以使用，這太大了，你知道嗎？這邊實在是有夠髒亂，你們要趕快處理。"],["莊部長翠雲：好，這個部分……"],["陳委員亭妃：這個部分再拜託。"],["莊部長翠雲：在還沒有運用之前先做怎麼樣的短期運用，我們再跟市政府一起討論。"],["陳委員亭妃：好，這個再拜託一下部長。","另外，我們要再談到另外一個議題，國家語言發展法在2018年12月25日三讀通過，這也是我們一直在推的，要講臺語──我們自己的母語，所以國家語言發展法在2018年12月25日三讀通過，2019年7月1日台語台在公視正式成立。","我們現在要推的就是台語文化園區，這在過去我們都有進展、有一個步調，因為彰化剛好在它建縣三百年的時候設立了台語創意園區，相對的今年剛好是臺南建城四百年，而且臺南縣市合併就是透過文化。過去我們都一直在推動，一步一步地從國家語言發展法通過、台語台通過，現在時間已經到了，我們應該要成立自己的文化園區。","現在我要跟部長拜託，因為對於臺南，沒有人比我更瞭解它整個地理環境，我跟你報告，第一，有人說天馬電台，但現在天馬電台的土地還是未知數，它未來要怎麼開發，不知道；市府要怎麼規劃，不知道！土地是未知數，因為這是國有財產局的。第二，臺南文化創意產業園區，剛好在火車站旁邊，這塊目前是由南臺科技大學委外，到118年9月30日委外才到期，但是它還有優先營運權。所以這塊雖然是文化部的土地，但還是未知數。","現在我把整個適合設置的地方跟部長報告，第三個地方，有一個地方叫「臺灣歷史博物館」，臺灣歷史博物館總共有幾公頃？20公頃，扣除滯洪池、綠帶及二期擴建所需，實質土地建坪也只有5.5公頃，20公頃只有做5.5公頃。但是這個部分如果做為台語文化園區，能夠結合歷史、文化、文學，它變成人家說的會「結市」，喜歡歷史的、喜歡文化的、喜歡文學的都來到這裡，土地又是文化部的，我們馬上編經費就可以做了，這樣是不是很適當？這個部分我也跟市政府討論過，我們不能去說一個無法掌控的東西，因為未來六通之後，土地、都市計畫要怎麼計畫我們不知道，而且最快的速度，我們如果看通盤檢討，這個院長就很瞭解了，院長也從基層上來，通盤檢討若要有結論，3、4年，5、6年，那算是有夠快了。所以你今天要用一個需要通盤檢討的來做這個部分，未知數、遙遙無期！","因此我跟部長建議，因為我過去在教育及文化委員會，我們就一步一步從國家語言發展法到台語台，現在時間到了，台語文化園區在彰化是中部，南部也要一個，這樣才會串連，改天北部也要一個，北、中、南都有台語文化園區。尤其彰化使用的就是成功砲校的營區，如果是用我們自己既有的土地，這樣的話文化部剛剛好，所以部長，我覺得這是我們可以考量的地方。尤其台語文化園區若跟臺灣歷史博物館結合在一起，是不是很好？而且它是我們的門面喔！國道一下來，然後剛好是這個門面，能夠再接到山海圳綠道，這樣串連起來，說我們臺灣的歷史、說我們臺南的歷史，我們有台江，尤其安南區的十六寮、台江的文化，內海、外海串聯起來，我們可以因此說一個我們臺灣人的故事。部長，這才有意義啦！對不對？部長，你覺得呢？"],["李部長遠：謝謝委員剛才講的那幾個點，其實我個人就在安南區做千里步道，剛才講的山海圳就是我們發起做為千里步道的一個起點。你剛才講的那幾個點，我會在最快時間內去看，因為剛才講的天馬電台那一區我沒有看過，另外這幾個地方我再……"],["陳委員亭妃：因為天馬電台現在就是荒蕪一大片，30公頃，荒蕪一片！"],["李部長遠：我承諾委員，我會在最快時間去這幾個點看過以後，把它構想出一個未來我們做得到的……"],["陳委員亭妃：因為土地最重要嘛！土地沒有問題你才有辦法提經費，你絕對不能拿一塊完全不能掌控的地方，等規劃做好了，最後卻無法付諸實施。所以土地如果是文化部的，我們就可以馬上編經費啊！如果院長支持，就可以立刻編經費啊！北、中、南各有一個台語文化園區是不是很漂亮？院長，OK不OK？"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員對文化的用心跟設想了這麼多的地點，剛剛李部長已經表示，他會在近期內去看看哪一個地方將來適合做怎麼樣的使用。另外，關於天馬電台現在如果土地這麼大，在我們沒有辦法即刻活化使用的情況底下，我也要求財政部國有財產署一定要把環境整理好，不要成為地方人民的嫌惡設施。"],["陳委員亭妃：對於天馬電台現在的髒亂，我拜託一個月給我們答復，看要怎麼處理。地方今天有人把這個痛再挖起來，那我們就直球對決了啊！再拜託我們的部長！","另外一個議題就是台61線、曾文溪跨海大橋如何銜接到86號快速道路的部分。院長，這個部分一定非常重要，因為曾文溪大橋好不容易在林全院長任內，我當時就在這個地方質詢他，那是蔡英文總統第一任的時候，林全院長在這裡，他馬上答應曾文溪大橋OK，現在曾文溪大橋也在進行當中了。現在曾文溪大橋要銜接86號快速道路，要拜託我們的院長啊，一定要加速！現在確實也在規劃，因為這太重要了！如果可以從外環道銜接，這一條比什麼都還重要啊！這樣子根本就不用再把車輛引流到濱海，濱海都塞車啊！如果可以從曾文溪大橋直接銜接到86號快速道路，我相信這樣一個便捷，還有未來我們要發展所有的科技甚至產業就絕對都沒有問題。我們這裡有臺南科工區，還有新吉工業區，未來七股工業區還有南科，這一段對於曾文溪大橋銜接86號快速道路期待非常高啊！這部分我們有什麼計畫要快速處理？"],["卓院長榮泰：報告委員，有關這一條長達47公里的重要延伸道路，現在正在聽取各方面最後的綜整意見，交通部……"],["陳委員亭妃：現在在做可行性研究？"],["卓院長榮泰：交通部已經有一個初步的構想，我請交通部再跟委員做報告。"],["陳委員亭妃：我們知道現在在做可行性，可是中間有很多關卡。"],["卓院長榮泰：是。"],["陳委員亭妃：光是安平港這個環帶當中要怎麼突破很多包括我們過去的嫌惡設施，我們為了要綠能發電那裡有很多的設施，可是這些現在要怎麼突破？就是我們過去都沒有一體性的研究嘛！這邊怎麼辦？現在在做可行性沒錯啊！預計113年底要完成，好，我們會如同現在所做的？這個是我們地方一直在追的！可以完成嗎？"],["李部長孟諺：這個部分目前是8月份就會提方案出來。"],["陳委員亭妃：8月份提出方案？"],["李部長孟諺：我們也會希望先跟地方政府妥為溝通，以靠海邊的最適方案來提出。"],["陳委員亭妃：8月份就會提出來了？"],["李部長孟諺：嗯。"],["陳委員亭妃：因為你們預計的綜合規劃時程是2年，二階環評是4到5年，然後建設計畫又1年喔！光是這個，你知道……"],["李部長孟諺：就是路線在8月份先提，要有共識……"],["陳委員亭妃：沒錯啊！所以……"],["李部長孟諺：如果有共識，就會繼續……"],["陳委員亭妃：所以你前面路線如果拖的話，後面就一直拖了喔！這樣你們的時程表可能10年都看不到喔！我覺得要加速啦！這個時間點大家沒有辦法接受，因為這一條太重要了！對於所有產業的發展，太重要了！謝謝。"],["李部長孟諺：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝陳亭妃委員的質詢，也謝謝卓院長的備詢。","接下來我們請張嘉郡委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":29,"meet_id":"院會-11-1-18","speakers":["韓國瑜"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-06-14"],"gazette_id":"1135701","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1135701_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期第18次會議紀錄","content":"報告事項","agenda_id":"1135701_00001"}},"transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":1.26284375,"end":7.9790937500000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":8.333468750000002,"end":10.25721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":21.59721875,"end":24.719093750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":21.74909375,"end":22.778468750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":25.02284375,"end":27.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底已經關三百年時﹐設立了《台藝文創意恆久》。"},{"start":405.251,"end":423.397,"text":"相對定的．年多乎咱台南四百當更是四百當．且台南官司合併就是用文化。對過去其實咱們一直在推搪一步一步對咱國家議員發電話通過、台議代通過．現在已經夠時間應該咱要上一次咱自己的一個文化恆久。好,我現在要給咱部長拜託"},{"start":433.752,"end":449.976,"text":"部長,我給你報告,因為台南沒有人比我更了解他的地理環境。我給你報告,第一,有人說天馬電台,但是現在天馬電台,土地還是未成熟。他未來要怎麼開發不知道,市府要怎麼規劃不知道,土地未成熟,因為這是國有財產局的。"},{"start":459.899,"end":463.942,"text":"臺南文化創意三逆分枯．大地火車站的旁邊．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．"},{"start":486.038,"end":490.242,"text":"我現在把整個所在社會可以設的 給我們部長報告。"},{"start":491.923,"end":513.849,"text":"第三個地方,有一個地方叫臺灣列宿博物館。臺灣列宿博物館總共有幾公頃?20公頃。20公頃依靠著我們的志鴻池,還有我們的綠帶,還有日記、科研的需要。其實在我們的土地建培,建培也只有5.5公頃。20公頃只有做5.5公頃。"},{"start":518.51,"end":540.874,"text":"但是這個部分我們如果要把它做為臺語文化分割﹖可以把它結合﹖律師文化文化的結合﹖它會變成人家說的結詞﹖加以律師﹖加以文化﹖加以文學﹖都來到這﹖土地跟我們文化保衛﹖我們馬上變經濟就可以做這樣﹖這樣是不是很失動﹖因為這個部分我也跟市政府討論過﹖"},{"start":548.496,"end":551.204,"text":"我們不能說一個我們沒辦法講的東西,因為在土地、未來、"},{"start":557.379,"end":558.94,"text":"﹚陳亭妃﹚陳亭妃"},{"start":583.905,"end":596.358,"text":"遙遙無期所以我跟部長建議臺語文化園區因為我過去在教文化園我們就一步一步從我們的國家語言發展法到台語臺現在時間夠了"},{"start":600.461,"end":602.642,"text":"部長,我覺得這是我們可以考量的地方"},{"start":627.641,"end":627.941,"text":"﹚陳亭妃﹚"},{"start":643.986,"end":659.414,"text":"這串連,講咱的臺灣的歷史,講咱台南的歷史,咱有臺港有幾安南過的16條,臺港的文化,來海外海,串連起來,咱可以因此講一個咱台南的故事。"},{"start":661.36,"end":684.573,"text":"部長這才有意義啦對不對部長你覺得呢這個其實謝謝委員剛才講的那幾個點其實我個人就在安南區做千里步道剛才講山海郡就是我們發起作為一個千里步道的起點那你剛才講那幾個點我會在最快時間去看因為剛才講那個天馬天海那一區我沒有看過那另外這個"},{"start":686.427,"end":703.517,"text":"因為天馬電台現在就是荒蕪一大片,30公頃的荒蕪一片。我承諾委員我會在最快時間去這幾個點看過以後,把它構想出來。因為土地最重要嘛,土地要沒問題,你跟我說做經費嘛。你絕對不可以蓋一塊,我們完全不可以將空的地方,這樣整個做好了,搞不好不可以走。"},{"start":712.202,"end":713.042,"text":"委員長：陳亭妃"},{"start":728.428,"end":751.627,"text":"謝謝委員對文化的用心跟設想了這麼多的地點那剛剛李部長已經表示他會近期內去看看哪一個地方將來適合做什麼樣的使用那另外關於天馬電台現在如果這個土地這麼大那我們沒有辦法能夠即刻的活化使用情況底下我也要求財政部國有財產署"},{"start":752.829,"end":757.91,"text":"環境一定要整理好,不要成為地方人民對他產生嫌惡的錯誤的地方。"},{"start":758.41,"end":787.536,"text":"我拜託這個天馬電台現在的髒亂一個月給我們答覆看怎麼處理。等一下有人把這個桶再挖起來那我們就直球對決啦我們再拜託再拜託我們的部長那我現在另外一個議題就是我們台61線台61線我們的曾文熙快速大橋如何銜接到86快速道路的部分我想院長這個部分"},{"start":788.496,"end":809.968,"text":"一定非常重要因為我們的專門家大橋曾文熙大橋好不容易在林全院長我當時有質詢他也是就在這個地方當蔡英文總統第一任的時候林全部長在這裡他馬上答應了曾文熙大橋OK現在曾文熙大橋也在進行當中"},{"start":810.848,"end":811.509,"text":"﹚陳亭妃﹚陳亭妃﹚陳亭妃"},{"start":830.582,"end":858.95,"text":"這樣子根本就不用再把所謂的車子引流到我們的濱海那些濱海都太扯了如果可以從我們的曾文熙直接到86我相信這樣的一個變節還有未來我們要發展所有的科技甚至產業絕對就都沒問題了我們這裡有說有台南科工區還有新集工業區未來七股工業區還有南科"},{"start":860.01,"end":877.884,"text":"這一段對於這一條所謂的曾文熙大橋銜接86攜帶非常高啊。這部分我們有怎麼計畫要快速處理。報告委員這條長有47公里的重要的延伸道路現在正在聽取各方面"},{"start":878.82,"end":885.283,"text":"現在在做可行性研究。現在我們知道現在在做可行性,可是中間有很多的關卡。光在岸邊港,我們這個環台當中,要怎麼突破很多,包括我們過去的嫌惡設施。"},{"start":904.053,"end":905.854,"text":"﹚陳亭妃﹚陳亭妃﹚陳亭妃﹚陳亭妃﹚陳亭妃﹚陳亭妃﹚"},{"start":935.984,"end":938.107,"text":"這個部分目前從8月份會提出方案,也會希望這次提出方案,地方政府可以公投方案,靠海淺比較最適合。"},{"start":945.978,"end":973.611,"text":"八月份就會提出來了我們期待因為你們現在預計你們預計是在這個綜合規劃的時程是兩年然後二屆環評是四到五年喔然後建設計劃又一年喔你光這個你知道沒錯啊所以你前面路線如果拖的話後面就一直拖囉這個如果你們的時程表可能早上就看不到了"},{"start":986.996,"end":991.757,"text":"謝謝陳亭妃委員的質詢,也謝謝卓院長的備詢。接下來我們請張家俊委員質詢。"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}